It Could Happen Here - Dual Power Gathering Midwest

Episode Date: July 12, 2023

Mia talks with Mira and Korrin, two organizers of the upcoming Dual Power Gathering Midwest, about what they learned from the previous event and what to expect from the next one. https://dpgmidwest.org/ See omnystudio.com/listener for privacy information.

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That's not why we called it that, but, you know, such is the world. And today I'm going to be talking about one of our, I don't want to say rare, but we're doing one of our How Do We Put the World Back Together episodes. And in order to do that, I'm going to be talking with Mira and Corin, who are two organizers for the Dual Power Gathering Midwest. That's happening in, what, like two months-ish? Yeah. Corin, Mira, welcome to the show. Hi, thanks. It's great to be on.

Yeah, it's great to have you two um okay so i guess i should i guess we should start with so this is this is well i don't know if second's the right term the the first of these happens uh last year in indiana um is it last year yeah it was last year i had to i had to make it i had to do a quick checking my memory to make sure that 2022 was in fact last year, and we haven't somehow skipped into 2024 already. Oh boy, things are going great here. But yeah, I wanted to, I guess, start with talking about what the dual power gathering is, and yeah, like, what happened at the first one and how did it go? Yeah, like what happened at the first one and how did it go? Yeah, so dual power gathering, I guess maybe a thing to start with is what is dual power.

Yeah, we haven't talked about that in a bit. Yeah, I get it. Can you explain it for new people? Maybe the best way to put it is something that maybe a lot lot of people have heard before which is building a new world in the shell of the old so we live in a society right uh unfortunately so there's a lot of institutions that we have to deal with and for a lot of people it's essential to rely on these institutions because there's not other options. And as anarchists, it's kind of our goal to build those other options. And dual power is that building a second power in opposition to the state powers. So, you know, like tech stuff,

so internet mesh networks, just alternative infrastructures, alternative medical care, though I'm sure that specific phrasing can imply something else, which I did not mean. But just working with communities to try to not rely on the state. with communities to try to not rely on the state. And so dual power gathering is bringing together, you know, a bunch of people from orgs and independent activists and honestly, people who just want to get involved and don't know a lot to help build those counter structures. And honestly, this cool zone media brought a lot of people to the podcast from last year. cool zone media brought a lot of people the one to the podcast from last year uh so it seems like your audience really really likes this stuff i'm sad i'm sad i wasn't able to go to last year's i was in the process of like setting up for and then i had a covid scare it had to like lock down for

like an entire week and it turned out that i didn't have it but uh yeah i'm very sad i preferred that you didn't spread covid yeah i was like you know okay let's let's not like endanger people's lives that seems better than uh in fact doing that and on that note since there's been questions both other events uh we will be having mass requirements and um at the event to make sure that immunocompromised people are not being excluded. I want to make that clear. Yeah, and this is – so the last one, from my understanding, it was a bunch of people camping in the dunes basically. And is this one also going to be sort of like mostly an outdoor thing? Yeah, so it's going to be um we're not just going to say

location here you can find that out through uh registering but the uh location is uh just near chicago and it's similarly outside it's a big open space not a lot of trees which is sad this year uh but yeah it'll be mostly camping but there's cabins and people can stay in hotels nearby also yeah so i guess okay we've talked we've talked a bit about what dual power is and sort of building this kind of counter power and building you know i mean like and like i i guess i just want to say a little bit like these are like dual power institutions are just a lot of the things that you know just we talk about building or like people you know or we've been involved in building these are these these can be things like tenants

unions like uh different like different well different like regular unions like caucuses and unions uh like mutual aid networks like worker centers so there's you know there's all sorts of things that can be involved in this but so now now having gotten we've gotten through dual power we've sort of gotten through gathering but we should yeah i want to ask a bit more about like what what okay what what happens at the thing when you go to it yeah so it's built on the unconference model of doing things which in essence is aiming to kind of counteract the idea that we need to have a sort of structured event that's you know you do this at this point you do this at this point you do this at this point it instead is meant to be built more towards libertarian

socialist principles and it is where people are able to kind of build their own agenda from the start of the event and kind of structure their day how they want to so you can talk to these people to go to a skill sharing event on um a stop the bleed training you can talk to these people to go to a Skillshare event on how to facilitate meetings. You can talk to these folk to learn a bit about anarchist history, just all these different things that can be formatted however you may so choose and that are all kind of happening at the discretion of people who are involved um so it's very much so just up to you to build your own day and of course you can also talk to other people there if you need some help um plenty of the organizers involved are more than willing to

help out and you know lend people a hand in figuring out where everything is and what they might want to do and what other people are doing to structure their day around but at the core you know it's built around individual choice autonomy and just a non-hierarchical method of going about it so i can talk a little bit more about how that looked practically from last year. So the first night, I wasn't there, so I can't talk much about that, but it was just mostly getting to know everybody. People were coming in throughout the night because work and all that on a Friday. But then that Saturday, after breakfast, which I don't even remember, it was like oatmeal or something, we got together in this assembly area and brought out whiteboards and marked out days and people like just stuck up what they wanted to talk about in a session on the board in a time slot. And then we got everyone to figure out, you know, which ones of these can be condensed. Do two people have similar ideas? Can they talk about how they might want to have a session together? And then people just chose which sessions to go to. We kept the whiteboards up so people could see what was going on and where. where and that worked out pretty well i think the biggest concern from that was people wanted to go to everything uh we simply did not have time they were like can we make this a week and i think

that's pushing it uh money wise uh it's expensive enough to rent a campsite for a weekend hey if anyone has like just a bunch of land they have sitting around they want to give to us for this if you can make whatever ranch or farm you have like accessible for people then yes please reach out for future gatherings but the

most important part I think was that the gathering model allowed all different groups there who had similar interests. For example, there was a POC caucus to self-organize. There was also like a sex workers group. They were able to come together on their own, figure out what's going on. And it wasn't based on what organizers thought was important. It't based on what organizers thought was important. It was

based on what participants thought was important. And I think that also facilitated a lot of networking. You were able to see, hey, there's a DIY medicine circle going on in this campsite. Well, I'm going to go maybe stop by. I might not stay the whole time, but I'm going to go maybe stop by i might not say the whole time but i'm going to check it out see if i'm interested see if i like i like the people there and it allowed for especially newer folks to interact with veterans veteran activists and just engage with stuff they might have only felt interested in slightly and actually get involved and contribute. So, yeah, that's how it practically went for the unconference. And we didn't hear that many complaints about it, except that maybe sometimes sessions were not timed,

like the time was too short or too long, or that it wasn't like a week or two yeah i mean you know and then that that's stuff that like it's especially the first time you're running an event like stuff stuff like that happens and you know we can okay this is i i have not an enormous amount of experience running like panels and stuff but like i've done it and it's like god getting the timing right is really hard and very annoying but it's you know this is this is a this is a thing that subsequent events will can and will sort of iterate on and get better at because you know i guess what what what one of

one of the things that we are in fact learning at these is how to do these things that you know i guess in this way hasn't been done before yeah and it's not i mean not technically not been done before but not done in this way yeah yeah like like there's crime think convergences or like the bashback but yeah yeah well i think it's an interesting thing too on a sort of like i don't know i i think i think there's a way in which this is in some sense kind of getting back to like older like models of anarchist organizing that kind of like i'm not gonna say they disappeared but there'd been sort of less of them due to like you know just sort of like political shifts

and just like shifts the way people organized and like just what kinds of stuff were happening at any given time and so you know and i think like the the consequence of this is a lot of people sort of relearning or you know relearning and inventing things that like had been known but you know every every every everyone's working through it together and it turns out we're pretty good at building things. Yeah, like

one thing that I think is really cool about DPG that kind of shines through is seeing how something like building an event like this, like when I first got involved you know I pictured building an event like this is a huge ordeal you know it was you needed all these big connections you needed to know a guy who knows guy who knows a guy you needed so many

different resources at your disposal it never really hit me that this could be something that just regular people could just up and decide to do. It's not to say it doesn't take a lot of effort and work, it does, but it's still ultimately something that is in the power of people to do if they really set themselves onto it and are able to find enough helping hands both physically and in terms of the actual event so it's like it's really cool to see just everyone coming together in the organizing process and it just being a very organic natural thing it's like i don't know you see see it a lot with other specific events. I've done Food Not Bomb stuff, and I've seen it there too. But it's different, but it's something that you typically foresee, at least I did, foresee as like, oh, building a whole weekend long event, you know, you need, you gotta have corporate big shots doing that. You know, how can you expect the little guys to do that?

And yeah, it's also cool to see people just jump in and help who might not even have other organizing experience. um they saw this last year to near the end of the planning for the gathering there were so many people joining little circles on planning food and transportation logistics and how can i contribute and i think the resounding result was people finding political hope that was a term i heard a lot from from individuals who both went and helped organize the last one and we're hoping to create a similar similar thing this time yeah and that's something that like i don't know i think i think everyone can use a bit more of right now in a sort of in a very sort of depressing and bleak like there's a lot of bad there's a lot of bad stuff happening and the ability to generate hope

and you know you can even think of it in sort of in just terms of like morale right like it's it's really really really hard to actually achieve or change anything if everyone has just sort of given up already and you know like being around other people and being in like planning events with people and doing stuff with people like is a very very good way to you know just sort of break the kind of like existential dread and like depression of like living in and you know sort of hopelessness of like living in in in this like disaster that we've all been thrown into yeah something that um somebody had mentioned at the last gathering that really stuck with me was that because of the uprising and COVID most leftist

organizing was formed through trauma bonding. And it was really nice to form relationships outside of traumatic incidents. And they felt longer lasting and much safer than relationships built during crisis yeah and i think you know i mean i think like i think that's just sort of important along those lines to remember is that like like building relationships there's a decent extent to which that's just all organizing is yeah yeah i mean it's it's not all organizing is but it's it's a really important part of it and

the way that people are able to do this especially in the wake of a bunch of like you know i mean really sort of traumatic and horrible experiences people went through like yeah glad we have a better way to do this. Welcome. I'm Danny Threl. Won't you join me at the fire and dare enter? Nocturnum, Tales from the Shadows, presented by iHeart and Sonora. An anthology of modern day horror stories inspired by the legends of Latin America. From ghastly encounters with shapeshifters to bone-chilling brushes with supernatural

creatures. I know you. Take a trip and experience the horrors that have haunted Latin America since the beginning of time. Listen to Nocturnal Tales from the Shadows as part of my Cultura podcast network, available on the iHeartRadio app, Apple Podcasts, or wherever you get your podcasts. Hi, I'm Ed Zitron, host of the Better Offline podcast, and we're kicking off our second season digging into how tech's elite has turned Silicon Valley into a playground for billionaires. From the chaotic world of generative AI to the destruction of Google search, Better Offline is your unvarnished and at times unhinged

look at the underbelly of tech from an industry veteran with nothing to lose. This season, I'm going to be joined by everyone from Nobel winning economists to leading journalists in the field. And I'll be digging into why the products you love keep getting worse and naming and shaming those responsible. Don't get me wrong, though. I love technology. I just hate the people in charge and want them to get back to building things that actually do things to help real people. I swear to God things can change if we're loud enough. So join me every week to understand

what's happening in the tech industry and what could be done to make things better. Listen to Better Offline on the iHeartRadio app, Apple Podcasts, wherever else you get your podcasts. Check out betteroffline.com. On Thanksgiving Day, 1999, a five-year-old boy floated alone in the ocean. He had lost his mother trying to reach Florida from Cuba.

He looked like a little angel. I mean, he looked so fresh. And his name, Elian Gonzalez, will make headlines everywhere. Elian Gonzalez. Elian. Elian. Elian. Elian. Elian. Elian Gonzalez, will make headlines everywhere. At the heart of the story is a young boy and the question of who he belongs with. His father in Cuba. Mr. Gonzalez wanted to go home and he wanted to take his son with him. Or his relatives in Miami. Imagine that your mother died trying to get you to freedom. At the heart of it all is still this painful family separation. Something

that as a Cuban, I know all too well. Listen to Chess Peace, the Elian Gonzalez story, as part of the My Cultura podcast network, available on the iHeart Radio app, Apple Podcasts, or wherever you get your podcasts. Yeah, like stuff like this is essentially some of the only things that give me a sense of optimism for the future because those who know me know i tend to be a very pessimistic person um i i don't look at current events uh to put it concisely and say

oh wow things are going pretty topsy-turvy out there um so but when we have stuff like this going on, that's just built at the level of, hey, we're people trying to make things better and prevent the chaos from the outside world and the world around us from just consuming everything. It's like it gives a nice sense of community and a nice sense of, hey, we're not alone in this and that maybe tomorrow things will be a little bit better than they were today. It's especially important in my opinion. The first gathering, I was

not living in a city as I do now. I was living in, not a city that people in big cities would call a city. I was in Nebraska. I was going to make a joke about Davenport or something. That's kind of unfair to Davenport. Yeah. So being able to meet other rural organizers in various places, especially, honestly, the Appalachian region, which I did not realize was so related in their struggles, was important because no matter how much I wanted to network, it wasn't really that opportunity as much as there is in cities and in cities there's a doesn't mean

you're necessarily meeting more people or people that you necessarily would like to organize with um there's just there's often more need and not necessarily more anarchists yeah yeah and i mean you know this is something we've talked about before, but we've basically built it. Well, OK, I say we. We didn't really build this, but the social system we lived in, the social system that we live in has been built sort of very specifically and very deliberately to isolate people. And yeah, and, you know, this sort of functions in different ways depending on sort of geography and like regional stuff. But yeah, like I think this is, you know, an important tool to sort of geography and like regional stuff but yeah like i think i think this is you know an important tool to sort of break that and to bring people together and to bring like

i don't know like i i think i think like another part of this we haven't talked about as much as like just like really incredible things happen when you bring people together from struggles that like turn out to be very similar but like aren't like aren't usually involved with each other or like aren't sort of like not like haven't been able to sort of like

link up before you get very sort of like I don't know you get a lot of really interesting sort of like ideas and strategic stuff from it yeah like one thing that i've noticed um especially and because i've done a lot of small town rural organizing is that you can kind of easily develop like very isolated communities and isolated radical cultures in like specific regions and it's not a great pitfall to fall into because you miss out on a lot of developments that might

happen elsewhere, you miss out on a lot of other things that might be happening in other regions and even beyond just regions going into specific um intersectional issues like different different organizers who might focus specifically on racism versus queerphobia versus ableism there's all things to learn from each other there's all interconnectedness and when you tie that into interconnectedness of different regions there's just a big need for things to be

kind of like a large web of connectivity instead of just you know oh things are kept separate and now we're stuck developing on our own and that's that's never fun yeah and you know and i guess circling this sort of back around to the specific event the the thing that y'all are doing to combat this is the is the dual power gathering midwest so i wanted to talk a little bit about like, well, okay,

when is this happening? And also, what are the plans so far for what it's going to look like and what people are going to be doing? So it's August 17th through 20th and this year is going to be pretty similar to last

year. And you can also look at Dual Power West, which had their gathering earlier this summer. If you go to Sabo Media, I think it's sabomedia.noblogs.org or whatever the NoBlogs address is, you can look it up. They did a good report back on how that went um and we'll also have a documentary up if people want to learn more sorry that's sidetracked but we'll put we'll put links to that in the description so right now we're soliciting a lot of people to come and bring what they have to offer to the table. We are in the end stages of setting everything up and getting everything connected. And part of that is we want people to bring over what they want to share, you know, skills they

want to share, cool things they've learned about leftist history, things that are important to know for modern day society, intersectional issues, discussions, basically anything that people could think of that might be worthwhile. Come on over, bring it in. We'd love to talk to people and hear more about it. So in terms of specifics that we might have planned, that is where we're currently at we're aiming for it to be like last year in that it's a skill share event and a discussion it's like a set of discussions and just a way for people to share what they know with each other and a few of us currently involved you know we all have our

own ideas i personally want to talk about unions and kind of be like hey unionize your workplace but that's more so just mean that it could be up to anyone but what they want to do, kind of building off the unconference model of it. If people want it, and it's not like how to be a fascist 101, then it's welcome. Some things we predict that will happen at the gathering will probably be circles on trans healthcare and abortion care, given recent events. Well, it's not really recent feeling anymore but uh that plus uh i think much more community defense is coming up because of those uh and i think as always there's all the DIY folks who come in last year. Pretty cool.

And I might overemphasize how much that's a part because I'm also one of those DIY people. It's a problem and an addiction at this point. But like, you know, people who wanted to just build their own car. It's cool stuff. Yeah. The random expertise of people coming was wonderful. And that all came together in ways I don't think anyone could have predicted. That's so cool.

Like literally the showing how to use batteries and how to like in a correct way, chaining them. Education. I have an engineering degree. A lot of this stuff was so new to me in a very good way. I hope that similar people come back. We can never predict.

Leftists are wild. You never know if they're going to take to something. We don't even know if certain people liked it because they just dropped off the map because they were just walking to Denver or something after the gathering.

But I think the gathering is, our focus has been on getting people to network. food which um i think we can talk about in a second is just making sure people come away with like the relationships we've talked so much about already um and trying to give people the opportunities explicitly to socialize because we also know that people tend to be not very friendly when approached in maybe everyday organizing, even though you say they should be maybe. But life's stressful and I don't blame people. So we're trying to make it a very friendly environment for talking to other people and trying to maybe make that the only other structured thing in the day besides meals. Yeah, well, I guess I should also say that, like,

if you can do something cool and you want to go show people how to do something cool, you should, in fact, do this because it rips. Please. Just for me like please come and show us some cool stuff like there is so much

opportunity for amazing things yeah and I guess you know speaking of amazing things yeah we should talk about food a little bit because you know food important part of all human societies. So for food, we're aiming for it to be catered vegan food from local restaurants along with various cooked meals as well is what we're kind of shooting for. So we're going to be covering three meals a day, breakfast, lunch, and dinner, and aiming to have enough to cover everyone for the three days of the gathering.

Yeah, and if food we have doesn't work we also have plans to make sure that we can accommodate people this is not far from other it's not like out in the middle of nowhere we'll be able to access various like stores and stuff um a lot of the gatherings would rely on the typical way of just having, I don't know. Some gatherings just have the food happen. They just say, well, food's on the group. And that's fun and all, but we also want to ensure that there is food. Yeah, and that there's like vegan options for people, which is.

Absolutely. Yeah. And stuff like that. Welcome. I'm Danny Thrill. Won't you join me at the fire and dare enter. Nocturnal Tales from the Shadows, presented by iHeart and Sonora. An anthology of modern-day horror stories inspired by the legends of Latin America.

From ghastly encounters with shapeshifters to bone-chilling brushes with supernatural creatures. I know you. with supernatural creatures. I know you. Take a trip and experience the horrors that have haunted Latin America since the beginning of time. Listen to Nocturnal Tales from the Shadows as part of My Cultura podcast network,

available on the iHeartRadio app, Apple Podcasts, or wherever you get your podcasts. Hi, I'm Ed Zitron, host of the Better Offline podcast. And we're kicking off our second season digging into how tech's elite has turned Silicon Valley into a playground for billionaires. From the chaotic world of generative AI to the destruction of Google search, better offline is your unvarnished and at times unhinged look at the underbelly of tech from an industry veteran with nothing to lose. This season I'm going to be joined by everyone from Nobel-winning economists to leading journalists in the field, and I'll be digging into why the products you love keep getting worse

and naming and shaming those responsible. Don't get me wrong, though. I love technology. I just hate the people in charge and want them to get back to building things that actually do things to help real people. I swear to God things can change if we're loud enough. So join me every week to understand what's happening in the tech industry

and what could be done to make things better. Listen to Better Offline on the iHeartRadio app, Apple Podcasts, wherever else you get your podcasts. Check out betteroffline.com. On Thanksgiving Day, 1999, a five-year-old boy floated alone in the ocean. He had lost his mother trying to reach Florida from Cuba. He looked like a little angel. I mean, he looked so fresh.

And his name, Elian Gonzalez, will make headlines everywhere. Elian Gonzalez. Elian, Elian. Elian Gonzalez. Elian, Elian. Elian Gonzalez. At the heart of the story is a young boy and the question of who he belongs with. His father in Cuba.

Mr. Gonzalez wanted to go home and he wanted to take his son with him. Or his relatives in Miami. Imagine that your mother died trying to get you to freedom. At the heart of it all is still this painful family separation. Something that as a Cuban, I know all too well. Listen to Chess Peace, the Elian Gonzalez story, as part of the My Cultura podcast network, available on the iHeartRadio app, Apple Podcasts, or wherever you get your podcasts.

Do you have anything else that you want to talk about the event before we close out? Yeah, I'll just say, too, that we are aiming for this event to be accessible for folk with disabilities, folk with children. Essentially to anyone and everyone who would be interested we want this to be accessible. On our website we talk a bit more in detail about the specific ways in which the site itself is disability accessible. And we also invite folk to if there's any suggestions, concerns, anything of the sort for how we can make this more accessible for people, more welcoming, more open. We invite people to come and let us know. We're still learning and still trying to do this better.

So anything we can improve upon, please let us know because we want to do right by folk. And on the note of families and kids, youth are absolutely welcome. We have some families and some parents specifically in the organizing right now. We hope we want kids to be able to be as involved as they want to be. Last year, I think that it ended up working out with the kids that were there, and they're amazing, and you can see that in the documentary too. But we want to make sure that's something we actually plan for this time to make sure that they don't feel excluded and also that parents are able to fully participate.

And yeah, you can see more on our website, which is dpgmidwest.org. Yeah, we'll have links to that in the description too. Yeah, and on there you'll see linked is our open collective, where if you go there, you can, there's a variety of options on there, which might be overwhelming. There's a donation option if you can't come but would like to donate. And then there's tickets. They don't, you can use pseudonyms. It's pretty anonymous. It's fine.

And you don't have to pay necessarily. And you don't have to pay necessarily, but there's a suggested donation listed on there so that we are able to afford the campsite and people don't have to pay too much up front to buy the campsite. I guess rent the campsite for the days and get food and stuff. And then there's options to reserve, reserve a spot in a cabin. If there's still spots left, we don't need to have a reservation, but we're trying to make sure that we're prioritizing people

with those access needs. And of course, our email's also listed on both the Open Collective and the website. So that'll probably be the main source for info. We also have a Collective account, despite the problems happening right now. Learn Opsec, do that, people. It's good.

You will go far. Come learn Opsec at the DPG. Yeah. I'm thinking about making. Tumblr and I'm stuck at the DPG. Yeah. I'm thinking about making a Tumblr because what's happening? But yeah, it's also at DPG Midwest

at collectiva.social. Yeah. And once again, this is running from August 17th to the 20th. And yeah, if it sounds interesting, go sign up. And yeah. Yeah, thank you two so much for joining us. Why am I saying us?

Sorry. I just reflexively do the us, and then I'm like, wait, hold on. Hold on. There's the royal we and the anarchist us. Yeah, and I'm excited I I don't know I I may be there I may not be it depends on a bunch of scheduling stuff that I have very little control over but

yeah other people should go it's gonna be a good event and yeah thank you two again thank you thank you yeah and this has you to you again thank you thank you yeah this has been it could happen here you can find us in the usual places if they still exist by the time this episode

comes out oh yeah we have we now have the cooler zone media thing if you don't want to listen to the Reagan ads or like I don't know a bunch of other ads for podcasts or whatever weird things playing right now i think i've been getting casino ads lately which is kind of interesting but if you don't listen to that we have a subscription service from apple that you can buy uh and then you don't

want to have ads for all of our shows uh we're working we're still working on the android one that hopefully will be happening soon but that's never a thing that's we're doing our we're doing our best we're not we we unfortunately are not apple like we don't own all the stuff so we have to do a bunch of stuff to work through it but yeah uh go go out into the world build dual power and have a good time while you do it. It Could Happen Here is a production of Cool Zone Media. For more podcasts from Cool Zone Media, visit our website, coolzonemedia.com, or check us out on the iHeartRadio app, Apple Podcasts, or wherever you listen to podcasts. You can find sources for It Could Happen Here updated monthly at coolzonemedia.com slash

sources. Thanks for listening. You should probably keep your lights on for Nocturnal Tales from the Shadow Broth. Join me, Danny Trejo, and step into the flames of right. An anthology podcast of modern day horror stories inspired by the most terrifying legends and lore of Latin America. Listen to Nocturno on the iHeartRadio app, Apple Podcasts, or wherever you get your podcasts. Curious about queer sexuality, cruising, and expanding your horizons? Hit play on the sex positive and deeply entertaining podcast, Sniffy's Cruising Confessions. Join hosts Gabe Gonzalez and Chris Patterson Rosso as they explore queer sex, cruising, relationships, and culture in the new iHeart podcast, Sniffy's Cruising Confessions.

Sniffy's Cruising Confessions will broaden minds and help you pursue your true goals. You can listen to Sniffy's Cruising Confessions, sponsored by Gilead, now on the iHeartRadio app or wherever you get your podcasts. New episodes every Thursday. Hi, I'm Ed Zitron, host of the Better Offline podcast. And we're kicking off our second season digging into tech's elite and how they've turned Silicon Valley into a playground for billionaires. From the chaotic world of generative AI to the destruction of Google search, Better Offline is your unvarnished and at times unhinged look at the underbelly of tech

brought to you by an industry veteran with nothing to lose. Listen to Better Offline on the iHeartRadio app, Apple Podcasts, wherever else you get your podcasts from.