It Could Happen Here - How Different is Kamala’s Border Policy

Episode Date: August 7, 2024

James and Shereen discuss Kamala Harris and Donald Trump’s proposed border and immigration policies and what each of them would mean for migrants.See omnystudio.com/listener for privacy information.

Hey guys, I'm Kate Max. You might know me from my popular online series, The Running Interview Show, where I run with celebrities, athletes, entrepreneurs, and more. After those runs, the conversations keep going. That's what my podcast, Post Run High, is all about. It's a chance to sit down with my guests and dive even deeper into their stories, their journeys, and the thoughts that arise once we've hit the pavement together. Listen to Post Run High on the iHeartRadio app, Apple Podcasts, or wherever you get your podcasts.

Hey, I'm Jacqueline Thomas, the host of a brand new Black Effect original series, Black Lit, the podcast for diving deep, for those who listen to audiobooks while running errands or at the end of a busy day. From thought-provoking novels to powerful poetry, we'll explore the stories that shape our culture. Listen to Black Lit on the Black Effect Podcast Network, iHeartRadio app, Apple Podcasts, or wherever you get your podcasts. AT&T. Connecting changes everything. Curious about queer sexuality, cruising, and expanding your horizons? Hit play on the sex-positive and deeply entertaining podcast, Sniffy's Cruising Confessions. We'll see you next time. on the iHeartRadio app or wherever you get your podcasts. New episodes every Thursday. Call Zone Media. Hello, podcast fans. It's me, James, and my friend Shireen, and also Shireen's cat, Bunny.

Yes. Yeah. She is here. She is here. And ready to pod. Yeah, she loves to cast a pod, and so do we. Today, Shireen, we have the great pleasure of talking about the border again uh which is something i talk about a lot something that politicians also talk about a lot today what i want to talk about is the difference between

kamala harris and donald trump when it comes to the border because shockingly there has been a lot of crap reporting on her border stance. There has been some good reporting. And like there's always going to be right wing disinformation any time you talk about the border. Just today, Border Patrol released video of a woman falling to her death from the border wall. Border Patrol agents stood there for 24 minutes watching her struggle. There was a ladder and they decided to watch her struggle until she died as she fell and then she died well watching this like objectively tragic thing right like when we think about how we get to fascism we get to fascism when my taxes pay people to stand there and watch a woman

die rather than do a single thing to help her and then a bunch of fuckwits on the internet immediately start excusing this like it's it's so predictable that was going to happen and i don't know i'm just once again disgusted by the whole fucking apparatus that is the border i guess yeah so i want to talk about the things that have changed right and i want to talk we'll sort of start by outlining who kamala is with respect to the border so everything she took over from biden kamala has been sort of start by outlining who Kamala is with respect to the border. So everything she took over from Biden, Kamala has been sort of offering more platitudes than specifics, right? Like her campaign is mostly based on vibes. Like I went to her campaign website to see what her stances were on the border.

It is not mentioned. I think that's notable. But recently in some speeches, she did offer some concrete ideas of what her border policy might look like. So I'm going to start with her campaign ad. This ad, incidentally, opens with what I'm pretty sure is a drone shot from Campo, California. I've taken pictures in reverse of that shot hundreds of times. You can find them on my website. Slate bought some of them off me maybe a month or two ago.

No, not even. Maybe two or three weeks ago, I guess. I watched a mother breastfeed her five-month-old child. Maybe a couple of miles from there. It was 105 degrees. We were able to give them water. I saw someone in severe hypothermia. Very hot.

We were able to cool them off. I spoke to a Sudan news family who were really struggling with making this long walk they have to make out there none of that shit made it into the kamala border advert right no of course not so i'm just gonna play this advert for you shireen on the border the choice is simple kamala harris supports increasing the number of border patrol agents donald trump blocked a bill to increase the number of border patrol agents. Donald Trump blocked a bill to increase the number of border patrol agents. Kamala Harris supports investing in new technology to block fentanyl from entering the country. Donald Trump blocked funding for technology to block fentanyl from entering the country.

Kamala Harris supports spending more money to stop human traffickers. Donald Trump blocked money to stop human traffickers. Donald Trump blocked money to stop human traffickers. Kamala Harris prosecuted transnational gang members and got them sentenced to prison. Trump is trying to avoid being sentenced to prison. There's two choices in this election. The one who will fix our broken immigration system and the one who's trying to stop her. A cop or a clown? who should we vote for president that's exactly it right she's leaning really heavily on this like i am a cop thing and like we have spent and continue to spend billions of dollars on border cops

that is not the fucking solution it never will be the solution we cannot make this giant border so full of cops that it's impossible for people to cross it people will still cross it because cops ain't going to go to the middle of the desert because you know inherent in being a cop is also being lazy so i want to play some stuff that she said, in Atlanta this week. So here is my pledge to you. As president, I will bring back the border security bill that Donald Trump killed, and I will sign it into law and show Donald Trump what real leadership looks like. Oh, fuck off. Yeah, so I'm going gonna subject you to some kamala and some trump

today that's okay i signed up for this okay so here's another one of her and this i think is really telling right where she is bragging about the most conservative republican supporting her bill donald trump on the other hand has been talking a big game about securing our border, but he does not walk the walk. Or as my friend Quavo would say, he does not walk it like he talks it. So look, our administration worked on the most significant border security bill in decades. Some of the most conservative Republicans in Washington, D.C. supported the bill. Even the Border Patrol endorsed it. So I'm going to read some transcripts from that speech as well. This is pretty much the only point of data we have on her proposed border policy. So we're going heavy on this speech that she gave in Atlanta at a rally, right? i went after transnational gangs drug cartels and human traffickers that came

into our country illegally i prosecuted them in case after case and i won harris said donald trump on the other hand has been talking a big game about securing our border but he does not walk the walk that's what you just heard right and then she goes on to reference Quavo, which is cool and normal. So let's talk about that leadership and let's talk about the bill she's proposing. This is a bipartisan bill that was proposed last year and that didn't succeed. Right. It's the one that Democrats are making a big fuss about Republicans getting the border bill. a big fuss about Republicans killing the border bill. It's one of the only good things they've ever done, actually,

because it represented a massive rightward swing from where Democrats had previously been on immigration. In the bill, DHS could close the border if Border Patrol encountered 4,000 or more migrants on average over a seven-day period. The border would then have to be shut down if encounters reached a seven-day average of 5,000 or if they exceeded 8 500 in a single day does that happen are these numbers like realistic yes well a really important thing to remember when

we talk about these numbers is did you notice that it was phrased as encounters not people so this is a thing that is apparently impossible if you write for a fucking broadsheet corporate legacy newspaper to understand. An encounter does not represent a unique individual. Border Patrol do not give us data on unique individuals. They give us data on encounters. This is important because under Title 42, which I made a series about last year that you can listen to. I would like it if you did.

People can be returned to Mexico. And as you'll see under this proposal. People can be returned to Mexico. And as you'll see under this proposal, people can be returned to Mexico. And then they will try and come back because most of the people coming to our border are not from Mexico, nor do they have roots in Mexico, nor can they be safe in Mexico. So they will try and come back and they will try and come back in a different place, in a more remote place. And that will result in a higher risk to their lives making that journey right so 8 500 individuals across the whole border doesn't mean 8 500 people but yes those numbers are reachable that's just so that's so disingenuous to word it that way yeah border patrol just had like i don't know they had so much success with

doing this under title 42 like we're flooded with migrants and like i've spoken to people who have tried seven times to cross you know it's extremely disingenuous and i think we're going to get onto this but this is a debate about the border happening by people who never go to the border and don't understand what it's like here both in the media and in politics and i think that that is a problem so when it's closed quote unquote now we can't close the border right like a physically we cannot be we're not going to close the border and be like okay mexico no tomatoes okay no tourists can come into orlando now right that that is not what it's about it is open to capital and it's open to wealthy people all we're doing is closing it to the people who most

need our help that being people seeking asylum right so when it's quote unquote closed they would still process 1400 migrants through ports of entry that would presumably be people arriving using cbp1 which is a fatally flawed app which doesn't work for black folks which has been hacked all the appointments are sold booked up month in advance you can only use it north of mexico city it's a complete mess every single migrant i have encountered has tried to use cbp1 and given up it's not even available in that many languages right i think it's english spanish and haitian creole right now well it's it's ludicrous to suggest that this is accessible. And it doesn't work very well on Samsung phones.

I have a PRA, a FOIL, I guess, a FOIA out to CBP about that. But maybe in six years after like several court cases, I'll get it back. But I know that people are buying iPhones. Migrant advocates, both in Mexico City and north of there to allow migrants to access the app. They're trying to help them overcome these hurdles, right? But like, fucking come on. You know, we've got the entire US government here

and it's my friends trying to get five bucks from, you know, whoever to buy an iPhone so migrants can share it. Like, it's obscene. Only unaccompanied minors will be processed if they entered between ports of entry right so that's people under the age of 18 without their folks anyone who tried to cross between ports of entry so port of entry is when you cross the border with your passport and you go through an office that's support of entry right so if you cross in another fashion over a river over a wall around a wall under a wall through a wall just across the

desert where there isn't a wall. That's between ports of entries. If anyone tries two or more times, then during a border emergency, they will be barred from the United States for a period. I think it's a year. I should note that this bill didn't pass, but Biden did write an executive order setting an arbitrary cap at 2,500 encounters per day, which you will notice is lower. And it removed the requirement the border patrol ask migrants if they fear persecution so this is really important it's called a shout test and the difference here is between me saying shireen you've just come across the border are you here because you fear persecution can you not safely go home and me just saying get in the fucking van and you having to articulate that you fear persecution right which is that requires them to know that they have to articulate that you fear persecution right which is that

requires them to know that they have to articulate it it requires them to be able to articulate it in a language that's intelligible to the officer or whoever's interviewing them right it's a much higher barrier and in both cases right you could have the same person and they could be rejected because they didn't pass this so-called shout test that's ridiculous it's a really bullshit workaround for someone who is clearly eligible for asylum right yeah and like any good faith actor wants to find out if that person is going to be persecuted when they go home and so moving to a shout test like you are consciously saying some people we're going to send home they will fucking die or they will be

tortured or they will face persecution of other means right because they didn't articulate in the right words their fear of persecution and it's just there is not a good faith argument for this it's just getting numbers down at the cost of human suffering yeah so in this case right i have met migrants with pretty rock solid claims i don't want to go into the details of their cases too much. I will in the future. But like, you know, I'm out of the border a lot. And I'm out in the back country there a lot. And I try and help people whenever I can.

I talk to them about their claims. And I'm not going to ask someone to justify their trauma to me with 17 documents. But some of them have shown me things which I do believe would be a very cast iron asylum claim. And they seem to be, since Biden's executive order, just getting booted back across the border. So he kind of worked around that part of the bill failing. But let's look at what else is in it. So if the bill that Harris is saying she will reintroduce, of course, she herself can't. It's a legislative act, so or however the house would the bill

would limit border closures to 270 days 225 days and 180 days for the first three years which there's no there's no limit in the biden executive order so i guess that's that's better i guess i mean fucking 270 days when you can't claim asylum yeah that's a lot of days there's also funding a lot of funding for more border patrol agents of course and more asylum officers as well as more than 100 judges we do need to move people through the immigration system but a lot more pressingly we need to open legal pathways that are not walking across the desert and passing a shout test it would mandate detaining migrants if they try to enter the u.s outside of ports of entry pending their asylum claim so this is really big

actually it's going to result in a massive increase in the amount of asylum detention beds we need So they try to enter the US outside of ports of entry pending their asylum claim. So this is really big, actually. It's going to result in a massive increase in the amount of asylum detention beds we need. The bill contains funding for another 10,000 more beds. We'll probably end up needing more than that. But all of these beds are not in state-run facilities, right? They're in private facilities that ICE coordinates with. It's core civic. It's people who, when Biden first came into office, he wrote an executive order about getting rid of private prisons.

These are the private prisons. This is how we reallocated money to those same people doing this terrible thing, right, which is locking people up for profit. I've heard terrible stories about the conditions in some of these detention centers. these detention centers and this is the guy who ran on and bragged about closing down private prisons sending more money to private prisons just for migrants not citizens because apparently their rights don't matter as much their lives don't matter as much talking of things that don't matter shireen should we take an ab break that was beautiful james thank you That was beautiful, James. Thank you. Hey guys, I'm Kate Max.

You might know me from my popular online series, The Running Interview Show, where I run with celebrities, athletes, entrepreneurs, and more. After those runs, the conversations keep going. That's what my podcast, Post Run High, is all about. It's a chance to sit down with my guests and dive even deeper into their stories, their journeys, and the thoughts that arise

once we've hit the pavement together. You know that rush of endorphins you feel after a great workout? Well, that's when the real magic happens. So if you love hearing real, inspiring stories from the people you know, follow, and admire, join me every week for Post Run High. It's where we take the conversation beyond the run

and get into the heart of it all. It's lighthearted, pretty crazy, and very fun. Listen to Post Run High on the iHeartRadio app, Apple Podcasts, or wherever you get your podcasts. I found out I was related to the guy that I was dating. I don't feel emotions correctly. I am talking to a felon right now, and I cannot decide if I like him or not. Those were some callers from my call-in podcast, Therapy Gecko. It's a show where I take real phone calls from anonymous strangers all over the world as a fake gecko therapist and try to dig into their brains and learn a little bit about

their lives. I know that's a weird concept, but I promise it's pretty interesting if you give it a shot. Matter of fact, here's a few more examples of the kinds of calls we get on this show. I live with my boyfriend and I found his piss jar in our apartment. I collect my roommate's toenails and fingernails. I have very overbearing parents. Even at the age of 29, they won't let me move out of their house. So if you want an excuse to get out of your own head and see what's going on in someone else's head, search for Therapy Gecko on the iHeartRadio app, Apple Podcasts, or wherever you get your podcasts. It's the one with the green guy on it. world of Black literature. I'm Jack Peace Thomas, and I'm inviting you to join me and a vibrant

community of literary enthusiasts dedicated to protecting and celebrating our stories. Black Lit is for the page turners, for those who listen to audiobooks while commuting or running errands, for those who find themselves seeking solace, wisdom, and refuge between the chapters. From thought-provoking novels to powerful poetry, we'll explore the stories that shape our culture. Together, we'll dissect classics and contemporary works while uncovering the stories of the brilliant writers behind them. Black Lit is here to amplify the voices of Black writers

and to bring their words to life. Listen to Black Lit on the iheart radio app apple podcast or wherever you get your podcast so we're back and i want to talk about like what harris has done as vp which is they put her on this root causes beat right where she's supposed to go after the root causes of migration. So I want to start with this message that she sent to the people of Guatemala. I want to be clear to folks in this region who are thinking about making that dangerous trek to the United States-Mexico border. Do not come. Do not come. Do not come. The United States will continue to enforce our laws and

secure our border. There are legal methods by which migration can and should occur. But we, as one of our priorities, will discourage illegal migration. And I believe if you come to our border, you will be turned back. Do not come. Yeah. I think I've seen that before. Yeah. She took a lot of shit for that one.

Rightly. Understandably. Yeah. Yeah. This is not the only time the Biden administration said this, by the way. They were tweeting do not come in Haitian Creole in 2021 from the embassy of the United States in Haiti. This has been their message and continues to be their message. Now to the ongoing crisis down at the southern border, the focus of Vice President Kamala Harris's first overseas trip since taking office. She heads to Mexico today after spending yesterday in Guatemala, where she announced several initiatives and delivered a message to potential

migrants there. Do not come to the United States. The vice president also sat down exclusively with NBC's Lester Holt, who began by asking her about that warning in the news conference here in Guatemala City. You had a message for would-be migrants, don't come. Why should they believe you when they know that people are getting in? I've been working on this issue for a very long time. And the kind of violence and danger that is associated with that track, especially when we're talking about from Guatemala through Mexico to the United States. It is extremely dangerous. We are looking at a situation where people are fleeing because of hunger, because of the hurricanes, because of the pandemic. So the reason I am here is to address

those issues, knowing that the people who are here for generations, they want to stay. They don't want to leave, but they need opportunity. They need assistance. They need support. Americans don't see a lot of that on a daily basis. What they do see at their own border, children being lowered over fences, children coming in with phone numbers stenciled on their hand. And so the question has come up, and you heard it here, and you'll hear it again, I'm sure, is why not visit the border?

Why not see what Americans are seeing in this crisis? Well, we are going to the border. We have to deal with what's happening at the border. There's no question about that. That's not a debatable point. But we have to understand that there's a reason people are arriving at our border and ask, what is that reason? And then identify the problem so we can fix it. Okay, so all of this was while the Biden administration continued to defend and

enforce Title 42. If people haven't listened to the series I made about Title 42, I know I've said that twice, but like, that's like two or three hours of me explaining Title 42. So that would explain it better than I counted 20 seconds here. Title 42 is a public health law. And the idea of Title 42 is to prevent people with tuberculosis coming into the United States. An element of Title 42 of the United States Code contains this. The idea was never to use it as a de facto block on asylum, which is what the Trump administration did for a year and the Biden administration did for nearly three years. The Bideniden administration did it for much much longer this ended in may of 2023 and it was used uh they called it catch and release right it was used to bounce people straight back as we spoke about before catch and release it's like you're just literally like an animal practice you know like right yeah like these people are

fucking fish yeah um and i don't like doing that to fish personally. Like I shouldn't stress out a fish. It's just vibing down there. Don't ruin its day. So later in that same interview, she was very defensive about her failing to visit the border. But I think there are very reasonable questions. Sometimes these criticisms are used in bad faith by Republicans. So is everything is everything right like it doesn't mean that we shouldn't talk about this we should i didn't see a single elected official from the democrat party i guess fucking jim desmond turned up but i wish he wouldn't uh he turned up told lies about who paid for the aid and then uh forced his intern to apologize for it when a bunch of people turned up at his office. Really great integrity. I didn't see a single Democrat for the months that Border Patrol held thousands of people in open air detention without food, water or shelter. And for the months that my friends and I took care of them. Instead, what Harris was doing was trying to connect business leaders with economies in Central America to, quote, create jobs. Right. She had some success with a Japanese car factory in Guatemala and a Swiss coffee processor buying more beans and committing to more more coffee purchases.

Right. But this shit does not work and it has never worked. Right. Obviously, my position on global economics is not the same as as hers but we can't trickle down the causes of migration we can't do this with like a rising tide levels or boats gdp stuff even if we do buy this kind of freakonomics tier bullshit it doesn't matter because the change is going to take decades to come right you can't just just change a national economy change deals with unemployment with violence with state violence with non-state violence overnight and it's very likely that the pace of climate change alone will outstrip any benefits that these programs provide right because we are seeing increasingly people coming from countries that are the most impacted by climate change.

Two countries like the United States, one of the countries that has made the largest contribution to the climate change. But this idea of trickle-down economics to stop migration, it doesn't address the issue that most of our migrants are no longer coming from the places she's going. So she's worked pretty extensively in the Northern Tri guatemala honduras and el salvador these are places which sent a lot of migrants maybe in the early obama administration but that's not the case anymore right those are not typically places i see migrants from right i see migrants from venezuela and we're going to get a lot more of those i see migrants from turkey many of them but not all of them kurdish i see migrants from north africa i see migrants from turkey many of them but not all of them kurdish i see migrants from north africa i see migrants from the sahel i see migrants from india i don't

particularly see people from the northern triangle so the idea that like lifting the economy the northern triangle is gonna it's gonna move the needle it's just not yeah even if we buy the idea that it's possible i don't think it is. So that's Kamala. Let's take a look at Donald Trump. I guess I should give people a trigger warning. I'm only going to include a little bit of Donald Trump audio here, but you can tap the skip button if you don't want to hear Donald Trump talking. So Donald Trump's policies largely are in response to things that are not real or proposing things that the

president or congress cannot do or that the president cannot do without the support of congress so his first thing is talking about ending birthright citizenship this is not a thing that he can do by executive order right this is an amendment to the constitution that requires an amendment to the constitution to pass it back now you can amend the constitution but i don't think you'd ever get support for ending birthright citizenship right this has been the case since after the civil war and it exists to stop people disenfranchising the children of formerly enslaved people under biden's current policies even though these millions of illegal border crossers have entered the country unlawfully, all of their future children will become automatic U.S. citizens. Can you imagine? They'll be eligible for welfare, taxpayer funded health care, the right to vote, chain migration and countless other government benefits, many of which will also profit the illegal alien parents.

many of which will also profit the illegal alien parents. This policy is a reward for breaking the laws of the United States and is obviously a magnet helping draw the flood of illegals across our borders. They come by the millions and millions and millions. So another thing that Donald Trump wants to do is do away with the diversity visa program. Are you familiar with the diversity visa um no i'm gonna say no okay well i guess i'm familiar with it but not enough to like know what it is in detail so please tell me james okay i would love to tell you shireen the dv program i will avoid using that acronym actually because uh it could be an unfortunate misunderstanding yeah we're just sending cops all over the world uh that's what yeah no the diversity visa program better known as the green

card lottery allows about 55 000 or exactly 55 000 in theory immigrant visas a year for individuals from countries that are underrepresented in the u.s immigration system i remember that wait that sounds familiar yes okay yeah so like you'll meet people almost everywhere i go i tend not to go to countries that are highly represented in the u.s immigration system right those being countries that find it easier for people to get visas like h1bs right because they are more economically maybe close to the united states and have educational credentials that translate across so the trump administration had made the diversity visa program it's such a massive clusterfuck that it effectively didn't work and the way that this happened was

because you don't just win the green card lottery and they mail a green card to your house so like come on over bud you win the lottery and that gives you the right to go to the embassy to do an interview and then you make the application right then they check check you off on any checklists you might be on all the stuff that would normally apply to a migrant it's not like an amnesty visa and what the trump administration did was make it very hard for people to get these appointments especially during covid and this has been the case with the administration as well they get the lowest priority now. They can book an appointment, but other people's stuff gets to sort of overtake them in the line. Because you only have a year from receiving it to claiming it.

De facto, this means that people don't get it. So 55,000 people are not coming because of the diversity visa. Even if they were, this is not very many people. It's just trump i don't maybe he saw the phrase diversity and became triggered but it's a weird little bug bear like which i guess if you can focus on weird little things but still the diversity visa is great the people i know who often most deserve visas people who can't even afford to make the trip right to walk here or you know if you're not in the continental americas it it's a lot more expensive you have to fly i guess you could take a boat but some of those people i mean my friend who drove me all around iraq is applying for a

diversity visa and like i really hope he gets it lovely man trump also has this bug there about dhs paying benefits to, quote, illegal aliens. Crooked Joe Biden is running a nonstop conveyor belt, importing illegal aliens from all over the world into our country. And the Biden Department of Homeland Security is abusing its so-called parole authority to give them more governmental benefits than many law-abiding citizens, including our vets. Our vets are being taken advantage of. Our citizens are being taken advantage of. It's very unfair, and it's not going to stand. The Department of Homeland Security doesn't pay any benefits to anyone. I guess it pays like border patrol agents and people who work for it, but it's not giving anyone public benefits right undocumented people are normally ineligible for most benefits even people who do have legal status

and he consistently conflates asylum seekers with undocumented people right maybe because he genuinely doesn't know the difference and it doesn't care to learn the difference even people who have legal status face a range of hurdles like sometimes they have a 40 quarter work bar for example right so that means you have to have been working for 40 periods of three months consecutively again this is kind of he might be talking about something called the public charge rule which can interfere with your citizenship or visa application if you've taken certain times of benefit so maybe he's looking to make that a little bit broader. But again, it's really unclear and it's kind of a lot of identity politics grifting. The next thing is we're getting towards QAnon territory now. Great.

I will use Title 42 to end the child trafficking crisis by returning all trafficked children to their families in their home countries and without delay. And I will urge Congress to ensure that anyone caught trafficking children across our border receives the death penalty immediately. And that includes also for women, because women, as you know, are number one in trafficking. Children are actually number two. This is some weird shit, first of all, right? But he talks about using Title 42. This is not, as I've talked about three times now,

what Title 42 is for. It's very obvious that he thinks Title 42 is immigration law because he very obviously used it as that, right? He was not using Title 42 to stop people getting COVID because he did square root fuck all to stop people getting COVID getting covid right and there were not exemptions for vaccinated people it's very obvious that they use title 42 cynically as an immigration law that is not what it is also deporting someone back to the situation they were trafficked from maybe not smart like maybe maybe especially a minor who is trafficked here maybe we could help them. You know, one of the richest countries humanity has ever seen.

Maybe not just bumping them straight back to that country. Yeah. Maybe showing a little bit of compassion. Human trafficking is a problem. But this is not the solution. So Harris kind of touts her prosecutorial experience when she talks about human trafficking. She's actually been better than some not punishing people who were trafficked right so i was reading that one point she asked prosecutors not to use the term teenage prostitute because like that's not really a thing what we're seeing

there is somebody who is being trafficked right or somebody who has been victimized taken advantage of manipulated and seeing them as perpetrators is fundamentally missing the fucking problem and this is what the legal system does far too often right is it goes after the people who are the victims not the criminals she twice bought criminal charges against backpage.com which is a website i guess where people can like find escorts I'm not familiar with these things, but I know that some sex workers were opposed to that because they felt it drove them kind of onto more underground platforms, which were even more risky to them.

But obviously, people were also being trafficked on this platform. So her record, I guess, is somewhat mixed. You know what else is somewhat mixed, Shireen? What, James? It's the products and services that we get to support this show. You know, sometimes it's the cops. Sometimes it's terrible coffee. Sometimes it's gold.

You never know what you're going to get. Ooh. Hey, guys. I'm Kate Max. You might know me from my popular online series, The Running Interview Show, where I run with celebrities, athletes, entrepreneurs, and more. After those runs, the conversations keep going. That's what my podcast, Post Run High, is all about. sit down with my guests and dive even deeper into their stories, their journeys, and the thoughts that arise once we've hit the pavement together. You know that rush of endorphins you feel after a great workout? Well, that's when the real magic happens. So if you love hearing real, inspiring stories from the people you know, follow, and admire, join me every week for Post Run High.

It's where we take the conversation beyond the run and get into the heart of it all. It's lighthearted, pretty crazy, and very fun. Listen to Post Run High on the iHeartRadio app, Apple Podcasts, or wherever you get your podcasts. I found out I was related to the guy that I was dating. I don't feel emotions correctly. I am talking to a felon right now, and I cannot decide if I like him or not. Those were some callers from my call-in podcast, Therapy Gecko. It's a show where I take real phone calls from anonymous strangers all over the world as a fake gecko therapist and try to dig into their brains and learn a little bit about their lives.

I know that's a weird concept, but I promise it's pretty interesting if you give it a shot. Matter of fact, here's a few more examples of the kinds of calls we get on this show. I live with my boyfriend and I found his piss jar in our apartment. I collect my roommate's toenails and fingernails. I have very overbearing parents. Even at the age of 29, they won't let me move out of their house. So if you want an excuse to get out of your own head and see what's going on in someone else's head, search for Therapy Gecko on the iHeartRadio app, Apple Podcasts, or wherever you get your podcasts.

It's the one with the green guy on it. Hey, I'm Jacquise Thomas, the host of a brand new Black Effect original series, Black Lit, the podcast for diving deep into the rich world of Black literature. I'm Jack Peace Thomas, and I'm inviting you to join me and a vibrant community of literary enthusiasts dedicated to protecting and celebrating our stories. Blacklit is for the page turners, for those who listen to audiobooks while commuting or running errands, for those who find themselves seeking solace, wisdom, and refuge between the chapters. From thought-provoking novels to powerful poetry,

we'll explore the stories that shape our culture. Together, we'll dissect classics and contemporary works while uncovering the stories of the brilliant writers behind them. Black Lit is here to amplify the voices of Black writers and to bring their words to life. Listen to Black Lit on the iHeartRadio app, Apple Podcasts, or wherever you get your podcasts.

We are back. You get your podcast. We are back. And we are back to one of Donald Trump's oldest chestnuts. And that would be his stupid wall, right, that he wants to build. We created the most secure border in U.S. history by far, dealing a major blow to the cartels and traffickers. We built hundreds of miles of wall. We renovated hundreds of miles of wall. We renovated hundreds of miles of wall. We never had anything like it. And then I got Mexico free of charge to give us 28,000

soldiers to protect us from people coming into our country illegally. He talks about building hundreds of miles of wall. He says that a couple of times, right? We've renovated hundreds of miles of wall. You know, did they build hundreds? Maybe just technically that they really fudged the numbers. I filed a lot of freedom of information requests for that. I guess what's more relevant is that Biden also built the wall, right? Kamala's not talking about it, but as we've documented numerous times, Biden has continued to build the wall he's continued to build the barrier which is a wall he has repaired other sections of wall he has upgraded sections of fence to wall they're both doing this right there's maybe donald trump would do more of it

but sometimes i feel like his general incompetence might prevent him from doing any more than biden's like competent migrant if they call it deterrence right deterrence through death is probably a better way of phrasing it trump also talks about a total ban on taxpayer dollars to give legal aid to undocumented people again i'm not sure if he knows what he's talking about i don't know what he's talking about um he might be referring to that we have a program in san diego county where san diego county pays for some people to defend migrants who are detained by ICE, right? So they can have access to a lawyer. ICE has responded to that by moving those people to Texas. Oh, that makes sense. Yeah. Yeah. Totally normal. Good. I'm glad we voted for

the anti-fascist guy. Everything's going great. Exactly. You can listen to my episode about that if you want to know more about that. But I don't know if he means they don't get public defenders if they're accused of a crime. Certainly. Isn't it just true that he can also just use these trigger words to make people mad? Yes. Yes. That is what he's doing. Yeah.

Yeah. It's not necessarily something that has to be based in fact. No. As we found with Donald Trump, this doesn't matter. And then finally, talking of stuff that doesn't have to be real his absolutely bat shit insane idea of fucking invading mexico to kill members of cartels which that's yeah unhinged yeah that is unhinged uh that will result in more violence it will result in more instability it will result in more death i think calm is pretty much in the clear when it comes to that one like

she is not proposing uh invading mexico so much of what donald trump says is insane and it doesn't make sense so i wanted to look at some of the people who kind of lean on trump some of the people who might be a little bit more coherent right when it comes to crafting that policy right couldn't get steven miller on the podcast sad but we did get these people from the texas public policy foundation who robert and gare spoke to at the republican national convention so here's them talking about visas and immigration i've tried to hire people from other countries it takes months and months and months uh to to get that done uh usually spend a lot of money doing it as well and uh so the the system is disincentivized to do that so So, you know,

actually during the last Trump administration, they started looking at like, let's reduce the number of visas and have broader categories, right? So I think they were trying to get down to about 17 visas, get to a more merit-based program to fit the needs that we have and make sure that you can, you know, it's not about like, what is the total number, but if we are needing labor, we need people in these areas, you can kind of like, it's a dial like what is the total number but if we are needing labor we need people in these areas you can you can kind of like it's a dial you can turn up and down in certain areas and certain visas and so i think if you do have to first like stop the problem and then you also have to make systemic changes that that will overhaul the system and make a lot easier so

that people are incentivized to actually do it the right way yeah so these people aren't stupid right they won't just spew hate yeah they're much more competent in their fascism so i think what we're seeing here right is this undoubtedly is a way to reduce what they see as undesirable migration which is to say poor people and brown people you can phrase it however you want right but i mean in in the republicans eyes and maybe a lot of people's eyes all migration is undesirable migration i feel like yeah well people will talk to me i'm for those of you who have just listened to me i guess a white person british you're not white you're british yeah which is more like a kind of translucent uh really you think about it yeah so yeah just i

am a british person which is important i guess because people will talk to me about immigration like i'm one of the good migrants and they can't go fuck themselves yeah that position right that like it's a like implicit white people are okay yeah no absolutely that's all that means it's like oh yeah you speak english and you're you look like me great come out come on into my racist country yeah exactly yeah i'm like funny foreign as opposed to like evil foreign i guess i think it's also just like they don't see you in whatever in their mind is a threat right like to i don't know it makes no sense logically but yeah it does if you understand it through a lens of race yes yeah but i mean their perspective

makes no sense to me no yeah same people who are barking about my fellow british people being a threat because they happen to be muslim right or brown or seeking people that understand that so what we actually need is more legal pathways. He is correct that the visa system needs changing and we need ways that people can apply and come here safely and not have to be trafficked and not have to take massive risks, right? I wanted to see what Robert and Gare had asked about this mass deportation thing because I'd seen some people holding like mass deportation to now sign at the RNC

and that's always a good sign that we're not sort of sidestepping into fascism. So let's hear what's said about that. Is that plan kind of the mass detention and expulsion of undocumented migrants in the U.S., something that you think is a good idea, something you support as the Heritage Foundation? Yeah, generally, you know, obviously, you got to look at implementation, right? And how you actually go about doing that in the right way. But yeah, absolutely. Generally, you know, obviously you got to look at implementation, right? And how you actually go about doing that in the right way. But yeah, absolutely. Generally, yeah.

And in what kind of time frame then? Because you just said this is something you have to like lay some groundwork on. And what time frame do you see it being feasible to carry out something like that? You know, I actually don't have a good answer for that because you have to first get your arms around the problem. We don't even know how many people are here and you know you don't know where they come from and so it's not like you're just trying to deport them all just to mexico or something like that southern border right like you you you have to first get your arms around the problem that's the first step

and then i think from there you can actually understand figure out what a reasonable time frame to do that is yeah so this is pretty fucked like i should point out that the bill that harris is proposing also proposes bumping people back to mexico without the permission of mexico right i think so many of these policies just rely on mexico being kind of a sponge for u.s policy like oh they'll they'll be fine like god forbid mexico act as a sovereign country yeah but this one seems different right we had i feel like pretty good liberal support on abolish ice under trump uh that has completely evaporated under biden but because we solved we solved racism and everything right yeah yeah we we fixed it i've forgotten about that. Yeah, that was the big crunch point. So what this means is taking people who have homes, lives, jobs and families and tearing them away from all of those things and sending them back to a country that they may not have been to in decades, that they may never have been to at all. undoubtedly face hardship if not persecution right and certainly having lived here having family here will make them more likely to be ransomed or blackmailed or any of these

things that happen to migrants when they're deported right and this is pretty bleak like i guess harris hasn't advocated for this which seeing the amount of the amount of people who fucking respond to my tweets with you're going home too like i am a u.s citizen and b fuck you uh yeah all the time all the time yeah it's so funny but yeah it does seem that there is a wing of the trump and like i talked to trump people i was in the mountains this weekend like i was in Wyoming, mincing about in the mountains. It was lovely. And talked to some people. And I've never really come across anyone who can, in the flesh,

maybe it's just because those people are so repulsive, I wouldn't talk to them. And it's probably quite likely. But advocated for this, right? This idea of mass deportations, like I said at the start of this show, how does a country get into full-on fascism? It is this.

It is my taxes and your taxes and some of the people who are listening taxes paying for people who have done nothing wrong. Right. Who have lived here, who haven't done any crimes, who haven't hurt anyone to be at our expense, expelled from their home, detained in a private prison whose owner company makes massive donations to politicians and then flown across the world at our expense and then dumped into a country where they no longer belong. And that is as close as we get, I think, to like someone saying, like, send them to the camps without saying that. Like, yeah, look, what was the Armenian genocide? The Armenian genocide was a mass deportation, right?

People forced to walk across the desert and die on the way. Like, if you don't think this Trump shit is fascist, like, I really don't know what it doesn't matter if it's fascist or not, right? Like, this is the kind of rhetoric that's genocidal. Like, I don't want to argue about like Robert Preston and like different definitions definitions because that doesn't matter. Like this shit is, it is genocidal. It is dehumanizing migrants, which has been a project of the right wing news media and increasingly the liberal news media and also the Democrat party now, apparently as well as the Republicans. But this is a market step to the right. Both of these are right.

The Overton window has moved so far right on migration in the last eight years that it's almost an unrecognizable place and i guess what i want to end up by saying what i always say about this is like the solution is not within the argument about who to vote for yeah like these are state policies um these are also often set by the legislature as we saw when b Biden's border bill failed, right? And that would require a change of the legislature. There isn't a third party that can get a majority in the legislature right now. Yeah.

So the way we fix this is ourselves, right? We are seeing in the UK right now violence towards Muslim people, violence towards mosques, violence towards mosques violence towards islamic cultural centers and people stepping up to defend them like that is the only way we fix this is by stepping up and shouldering our responsibility to our communities and people did that in the trump administration to a degree like when i in 2018 when i was down in in tijuana looking after folks who were part of the caravan that Trump made a big spectacle in the midterms, people showed up. Churches showed up.

A soccer mom showed up in minivans and helped us. And it was cool. The thing was fucked. But I respect that we look after those people. And that hasn't happened to as much of a degree since. And we've had more people than we had in 2018 in the open air detention sites. And so I guess where i want to end is whoever wins it's still our responsibility to take care of migrants because neither of them

is going to and we are continuing with policies that will accelerate climate change we are continuing with policies that will impoverish people all over the world and enrich people who are already super wealthy. And those things will continue to drive migration. We can't change those things in an actionable amount of time. But what we can do is try our best to meet people who come here with kindness. And so, yeah, I would urge you to do that, I guess. If you want to volunteer, you can email alotrolado it's alotrolado.org border kindness always need your money borderlands relief collective always need your money and those are always things that you can volunteer with or places you can sell your

money if you don't have your time but you can also organize in your own neighborhood i'm speaking to some people today who are organizing in maryland to take care of some kurdish refugees who i know like and they weren't doing anything a year ago right they saw a need and they saw it being unmet and they realized that they could meet it and they've made a huge difference to people's lives so like wherever you are there are migrants in your community and you can do that too it could Could Happen Here is a production of Cool Zone Media. For more podcasts from Cool Zone Media, visit our website, coolzonemedia.com or check us out on the iHeartRadio app,

Apple Podcasts, or wherever you listen to podcasts. You can find sources for It Could Happen Here updated monthly at coolzonemedia.com slash sources. Thanks for listening. Hey guys, I'm Kate Max. You might know me from my popular online series, The Running Interview Show, where I run with celebrities, athletes, entrepreneurs, and more. After those runs, the conversations keep going. That's what my podcast Post Run High is all about. It's a chance to sit down with my guests and dive even deeper into their stories, their journeys, and the thoughts that arise once we've hit the pavement together. Listen to Post Run High on the iHeartRadio app, Apple Podcasts, or wherever you get your podcasts.

Hey, I'm Jacqueline Thomas, the host of a brand new Black Effect original series, Black Lit, the podcast for diving deep into the rich world of Black literature. Black Lit is for the page turners, for those who listen to audiobooks while running errands or at the end of a busy day. From thought-provoking novels to powerful poetry, we'll explore the stories that shape our culture. Listen to Black Lit on the Black Effect Podcast Network, iHeartRadio app, Apple Podcasts, or wherever you get your podcasts. AT&T, connecting changes everything. Curious about queer sexuality, cruising, and expanding your horizons?

Hit play on the sex-positive and deeply entertaining podcast, Sniffy's Cruising Confessions. Join hosts Gabe Gonzalez and Chris Patterson Rosso Thank you.