It Could Happen Here - Leaving Gaza

Episode Date: October 18, 2023

Ahmed Matar and Abdallah AlQassab talk about their experiences leaving Gaza before this latest war.  https://www.instagram.com/matargaza/  https://www.instagram.com/abdallahalqassab23/ See omnystudio.com/listener for privacy information.

Hey guys, I'm Kate Max. You might know me from my popular online series, The Running Interview Show, where I run with celebrities, athletes, entrepreneurs, and more. After those runs, the conversations keep going. That's what my podcast, Post Run High, is all about. It's a chance to sit down with my guests and dive even deeper into their stories, their journeys, and the thoughts that arise once we've hit the pavement together. Listen to Post Run High on the iHeartRadio app, Apple Podcasts, or wherever you get your podcasts. You should probably keep your lights on for

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As mass bombing continues across Gaza, 2.3 million Palestinians remain trapped in the strip as the Israeli military conducts a total blockade. Israel has cut off water, electricity, and fuel, while intentionally restricting humanitarian aid from being sent into Gaza. intentionally restricting humanitarian aid from being sent into Gaza. This is It Could Happen Here. I'm Garrison Davis. On October 7th, Israeli Prime Minister Benjamin Netanyahu gave a speech addressing Palestinians inside Gaza. A part of the official English translation of the speech reads, quote, all of the places which Ham untranslated, but it roughly read, quote, but it roughly read, quote, we will target each and every corner of the strip, unquote. According to the UN, by last Thursday, October 12th, about 423,000 people had been displaced from their homes by Israeli airstrikes. That's about 25% of the Palestinian population.

Many sought refuge in crowded United Nations shelters set up in schools, but even those shelters and hospitals were attacked by air. Last Friday, October 13th, Israel issued a military order for all citizens in northern Gaza, including Gaza City, to evacuate their homes within a 24-hour period, in apparent preparation of a major ground assault on the besieged enclave. Over 1 million Palestinians live in this area. It's almost half the population of Gaza. In between bombings, Israeli military aircraft dropped thousands of leaflets into Gaza City, advising civilians to immediately leave their homes and the UN shelters, but not to actually try and leave Gaza, as the leaflet

warned that if anyone approached the Israel-Gaza security wall, they would, quote, expose themselves to death, unquote. Israel laid out just a few roads that it was supposed to be, quote-unquote, safe to travel southbound. Thousands of people in northern Gaza began to flee towards the strip's southern half on Friday morning. But as they were following Israel's orders, civilian convoys transporting Palestinian families out of Gaza City were bombed by the Israeli military at three different points along the evacuation route. killed, with hundreds more injured by the Israeli airstrikes as they were trying to follow Israel's impossible order to evacuate everyone from their homes in just 24 hours. Between Netanyahu's speech and the evacuation order of northern Gaza, this leaves people questioning, where exactly are these people supposed to go? A Palestinian in Gaza told the Associated Press, quote, we can't flee because anywhere you go, you are bombed, unquote. Gaza isn't that big. It's only

25 miles long, and it's completely surrounded by Israel and the Mediterranean Sea, save for a small section on the southern tip, which borders Egypt. With Israel sealing off access to Gaza, the only way in or out is the Rafah border crossing located at the southern end of the strip, bordering Egypt's Sinai Peninsula. The Rafah crossing is a critical passage for humanitarian aid and serves as a vital gateway between Gaza and the outside world. One of the very first targets of Israeli bombing this month was the Rafah border crossing between Gaza and Egypt. It was targeted by three air raids in a 24-hour period, severely damaging the crossing, preventing it from operating, and resulting in fatalities. There's video and audio of the bombings where you hear hundreds of people make a singular scream. It's pretty gruesome.

With Israel undergoing a quote-unquote complete siege of Gaza, this crossing was the only way to send humanitarian supplies into the Strip and to let willing refugees flee the assault. The Egyptian foreign minister has said that Israel has yet to allow the reopening of the crossing. Egypt is expected to assist in delivering humanitarian aid to Palestinians in the enclave, but it has rejected proposals to accept fleeing Palestinians into its borders. Both Egypt and Israel operate a blockade of Gaza to strictly control the passage of people and supplies going in and out of the Strip. There's no freedom of movement to enter or leave Gaza, even when there's not a declared war. One can't simply leave Gaza. There is no Gaza airport, at least not since 2002. Historically,

the Rafah border crossing into the Egyptian peninsula was only open to the public very sporadically, and often for very narrowly defined categories such as medical patients, religious pilgrims, foreign residents, or residents of Gaza with foreign visas or passports. But I don't have to tell you how hard it is to leave Gaza, even when there's not a war, because late last year, we interviewed two Palestinians for a still upcoming episode that's being worked on. During the interview, they touched on their own experiences escaping Gaza. So we're going to play some of that interview for this episode.

And I'll jump in occasionally to add some context. So here is Ahmed Matar and Abdullah Al-Khassab, athletes from PK Gaza, one of the most recognized parkour teams in the world. My name is Ahmed Matar. I'm 26 years old. I'm from Gaza, Palestine, and I do parkour. I live at the moment in Sweden because I moved to Sweden six years ago

after I got invited for the airwaves challenge it's a parkour competition that was organized in sweden in helsingborg and yes since that time i just live in sweden because i just did not want to go back for so many reasons that we can just talk about it later in this episode. Hey guys, I'm Abdullah. I'm 25 years old. I'm also a Barcour athlete. And I'm also right now in Italy. I got the chance to travel to Italy because I participated in a movie or in a film in a movie or in a film, which is the director is Emanuele Girosa. He's an Italian movie. It's called Mojamba.

My friend, he was the main character. I was one of the characters in the film. So we got a chance to participate in a festival in Sishia. And it wasn't really easy. It was really hard to do it because, you know, having a visa, Ahmed also knows that. Getting a visa as a Palestinian, especially from Gaza City, is something really, really hard. And even though it's not so bad having the visa, it's about traveling outside Gaza.

This is also a completely different story. But we could manage that. And I've been here in italy i came to participate in sicilia first of all me and my friend we managed to get shingen visa and it was just for five days and now i'm i'm here in italy for almost 11 months in dallas city you when you were there it is not you don't really feel free as as free you know because uh you're surrounded all the time by so many obstacles you know which is which is really crazy and it drives by even though because we were really kids and the the we we didn't have a really good childhood somehow

yeah i remember since we were we were kids we were seeing the uh tanks or what is it called? Yeah, the tanks that bombed something. We were seeing it in front of the street and we were hearing bombs and shootings. And that was before 2005. That was like, since I was four years, I could remember all of that moments where the tanks are crossing our road and we were seeing that attacks happening between people together and bombs and flights and drones and and that's something that for sure affects us as a kid that we we we get the fear whenever we we see some bombs and just we want to hide from the bones and we want to be close to the family.

For me, all of these things that happened around me affected me that I wanted to be that guy who would like to enjoy life. In the same time, Gaza was a place that we had the situation where are the psychologically or how is it called like when you are affected by the situation where we you know that you are you can be dead any moment or you can get a bump close to you any moment or someone close to you who die i kids, the most important for the kids is just safety. And we didn't have safety. Safety is what kids really want, you know, all the time. I mean, when you're a kid, you just need your mom or your dad next to you because you really feel this kind of safety. But when we were kids, we couldn't have this kind of feeling

because even our parents, they were not really sure what might happen to us or to them. So how they will protect us. So it's not really easy for anyone to protect the others, you know. No one able to, you know, to do that. That's something affected us for sure. Like, because we grown up in such things like that. Maybe for me now, if we were talking about this, it's maybe something usual, which is something normal

because I really got used to it somehow, which is not normal. I mean, it shouldn't be normal for anyone, but for us, we call it kind of normal because we used to. And now when I really, because before I was really a kid, so I didn't know what is really going on. I was really terrified and I was really scared and I didn't know what is really going to happen. But now when I'm kind of, you know, adult

and I know what is really going on and I see the kids when, because for example, the last war, especially when I'm even outside Gaza, it's completely different, you know, because when you're inside Gaza, you're with your family and with your friends, blah, blah, blah.

It's really different. But now when I can see how the kids, they are screaming, how the kids, they have this kind of feeling, you know, that, you know, they are really terrified of the bombs because it's next to them. So I can really remember myself and I just go through back, you know, the stories that really happened. We have the memories,

a lot of memories before about that. It was really crazy. We're going to go on a quick ad break, but when we get back, Ahmed will talk about his long experience trying to leave Gaza. and more. After those runs, the conversations keep going. That's what my podcast Post Run High is all about. It's a chance to sit down with my guests and dive even deeper into their stories, their journeys, and the thoughts that arise once we've hit the pavement together.

You know that rush of endorphins you feel after a great workout? Well, that's when the real magic happens. So if you love hearing real inspiring stories from the people, you know, follow and admire join me every week for post run high. It's where we take the conversation beyond the run and get into the heart of it all. It's lighthearted, pretty crazy, and very fun. Listen to post run high on the IHeartRadio app, Apple Podcasts, or wherever you get your podcasts. Welcome. I'm Danny Thrill. Won't you join me at the fire and dare enter? Nocturnal Tales from the Shadows, presented by iHeart and Sonora. from the shadows presented by I heart and Sonora an anthology of modern-day horror stories inspired by the legends of Latin America gasoline counters with

shape-shifters to bone-chilling brushes with supernatural creatures. I know you. Take a trip and experience the horrors that have haunted Latin America since the beginning of time. Listen to Nocturnal Tales from the Shadows as part of My Cultura podcast network, available on the iHeartRadio app, Apple Podcasts, or wherever you get your podcasts.

Hi, I'm Ed Zitron, host of the Better Offline podcast, and we're kicking off our second season digging into how tech's elite has turned Silicon Valley into a playground for billionaires. From the chaotic world of generative AI to the destruction of Google search,

Better Offline is your unvarnished and at times unhinged look at the underbelly of tech from an industry veteran with nothing to lose. This season I'm going to be joined by everyone from Nobel-winning economists to leading journalists in the field, and I'll be digging into why the products you love keep getting worse and naming and shaming those responsible. Don't get me wrong, though. I love technology. I just hate the people in charge

and want them to get back to building things that actually do things to help real people. I swear to God things can change if we're loud enough. So join me every week to understand what's happening in the tech industry and what could be done to make things better. Listen to Better Offline on the iHeartRadio app, Apple Podcasts,

wherever else you get your podcasts. Check out betteroffline.com. When Ahmed was younger, he began to share videos online of his athletic skills, slowly gaining notoriety around the world for his pretty impressive parkour ability. Soon, both himself and PK Gaza were being invited around the world for his pretty impressive parkour ability. Soon, both himself and P.K. Gaza were being invited around the world to perform parkour or to enter into parkour competitions. P.K. Gaza was invited to the Arabian TV show Arabs Got Talent, but they were unable to go on the program due to difficulties traveling outside Gaza. During this time period, the Rafah

border crossing into Egypt was only open around six times a year and for only a few days. To catch a flight out of Egypt, you need to have all of your proper paperwork, tickets, and a valid visa, which lines up perfectly for when the Rafah border crossing happens to be open. And you have to also hope that you're not in the back of the line to get through the border crossing because they only let a certain number of people through each day. Ahmed was invited to participate in the Red Bull Parkour Challenge in China and even successfully got a visa to travel, but wasn't able to leave Gaza because the Rafah border crossing was closed during the time frame when the visa was valid. The U.S.-based World Freerunning and Parkour

Federation tried to help Ahmed travel to the United States to participate in the WFPF's 2016 competition in Las Vegas, but Ahmed was unable to get an American travel visa due to long wait times to use the northern border crossing into Jerusalem, and even if you did manage to get into Israel, it was quite difficult to receive a U.S. travel visa, as applicants were frequently denied. A parkour gym in Italy frequently invited Ahmed to participate in their summer and winter events, but the Italian embassy denied requests for a travel visa three times. In late 2016, Ahmed got invited to the Airwhip Parkour Challenge in Sweden, and with the help of some Swedish friends, he was able to secure a travel visa in just two

weeks. Unfortunately, when Ahmed got the visa, the Rafah Crossing was closed. But by pure luck, just one day later, it was announced that the crossing would be reopening. When he went to the crossing, he learned that there were 30,000 people in line in front of him. With the crossing only set to be open briefly and the temporary visa set to expire, it was not looking great. After a very challenging series of events that Ahmed is about to explain, he was able to get to Sweden. And just last year, he starred in a play about

his own life and his journey traveling from Gaza to Sweden. Tell us a little bit about this. Is this going to be a play about your life that they're doing in Sweden? So we have had the premiere for the play on the 29th of May. So we have been doing the show for a while now. We have had eight performances at the moment and

the play is about me, my family and my friends from Piki,. Also, it talks about the journey from Gaza to Sweden, which was the biggest part of the play that, yeah, talking exactly about how it is to face the visa embassy, Egyptian control, Egyptian security

when we get out of Gaza that they have to, also Palestinian side that they have to interview was every, like if I had the visa, let's say I got the visa after some tries, then I have to apply for the travel, which I have to stand in the queue behind all of that people who already applied before me, which is imagine I'm 30,000, my queue number is 30,000 and I have to wait. And okay, let's say I got in front of all of that people.

And today I am here in the Palestinian side. And this Palestinian side in Rafah border have to interview me and check all, why do I need to travel? Show me your documents. If I have any mistake in my documents, then I go back to Gaza. Even if all my documents,

I have the visa and everything. And then if he don't want me to travel, then I have to stay in Gaza. Okay, let's say I did pass the Palestinian side. I am in the Egyptian security side. And there, one time, the Egyptian security sent me back to Gaza. After waiting, I had the visa and I was like, no, what are you going to do? I'm going to do parkour. I have a

parkour competition. What is parkour? You jump. Oh, then you go jump back in Gaza. I had to go back. My family did not expect I would be back in Gaza because I was at home around 5 a.m in the morning and I was a whole day like waiting to get to the Egyptian side and then from there he sent me back. And yeah in the end I mean without the help I get, I would not have traveled because 30,000 people in front of me, I have the queue number, but I am behind them. And I have the visa that will expire in two days. Or like, let's say that starts in two days and it will expire in 20 days. And if I don't travel in this 20 days, my visa will expire and then I cannot travel to Sweden. And if I don't travel in this 20 days, my visa will expire and then I cannot travel to Sweden.

And the only thing I had to do was like going to the crossing the first day with my father. He went with me and we just stand there in front of the crossing. It's, you know, there is a control. There is a list with names that you cannot really cross if you don't get any help. So I go there and then we just waited around six hours, me and my father. Then the sunset came and good dark. And then he was like, I cannot do anything. We have to go back. And then we went back home.

The day after, I tell my father, please, can we go? I have to travel. I have the visa. I just will expire. And then he was like, well, I I cannot do anything he don't know what he will do my father so I told him okay I will go for the guy we we have a guy close to us like let's say my neighbor but he's a far neighbor and he was the manager of the crossings between us, like the managing of coordinating the visas or like the list between us and Egypt.

So he can really do whatever he wants. He can enter Egypt whenever he wants. He's a very friend between Egyptians. He's the manager of the crossings. He's the boss. So I go to him and I wait for him outside his car. I was close to his car waiting him to get out of his home I know he go to his work around eight in the morning

then I wake up at seven in the morning and I go there waiting him to come to his car I see his car then I was really happy that he did not leave to his work and I knew that he's still there and I was waiting waiting And then he came. And then I showed him my visa. And I really have to travel today. I have the competition. And I have to join this competition. And then he was like, okay.

But do you have the queue number? Yes, but I am the last in the list. Okay, but how will we do? I cannot tell you. But I have already, I told him, i have already i told him i have already been into egypt before but the egyptian security sent me back to gaza and he told me do you have the registration of that uh the time you travel and i told him yes and did have at that time and it was okay follow me to the crossing i told him yeah but i can I go with you in your car so you don't forget me when

you go there because he he's very like people just run after him in the crossing area and then there I had to tell him I want to go with you and he said yes okay you can come with me and then he told me but you cannot stop I told him can I stop her and say goodbye to my family first because they did not know that I will travel I just took a very small bag with me in case I really had like a backpack with me and he said yeah but you cannot stop I have to go now and then I was okay I called my mom mom he's going to help me and I but I cannot stop saying goodbye and then yeah I went to the crossing and he put me into like a VIP list that I had to go like in a very special bus that was just five people in it and I was very like respected by the control there and it was like I

got all the way to Egypt. And in Egypt, I really met the same guy that he also asked me about parkour. And he was like, oh, you? And then my friend, the guy, the manager of the crossing told me, show him what parkour is. I really had to do a flip for him.

I did a workster in that room where he the control check and I was oh wow so cool okay here is the stamp enter to Egypt but in Egypt I had to go into that airport he did not know you know the Egyptian don't understand the visa like if it's in the visa it says that it's gonna be valid in this says that it's going to be valid in this day. If it's valid in this, like imagine I get the visa today, but it's not valid yet. But the crossing is open today and tomorrow and the day after. I have to travel in this three days, then the crossing will close for another six months. So I had to travel in that days, otherwise I will lose my visa. So my visa was not valid at that time I traveled from Gaza. So he thought that it's valid.

So he was, oh, go to the airport now and travel from there. He thought that I can travel to Europe directly. But if my visa is not valid, Europe would not let me in. So I had to stay in the airport that time that my visa was not valid, which was five days. And then in the end, I traveled, but I had to wait in the airport because he did not understand my visa. No one should have to do a Webster front flip to cross a border. Because there was still one week left until the visa became valid, Egyptian security sent Ahmed straight to the airport to wait for the week.

While in limbo at the airport, the Egyptian authorities locked him in a small room without his phone or his belongings until the visa became valid. After many harsh difficulties and compounding inconveniences, Ahmed boarded his plane for Europe. where I run with celebrities, athletes, entrepreneurs, and more. After those runs, the conversations keep going. That's what my podcast, Post Run High, is all about. It's a chance to sit down with my guests and dive even deeper into their stories, their journeys, and the thoughts that arise once we've hit the pavement together.

You know that rush of endorphins you feel after a great workout? Well, that's when the real magic happens. So if you love hearing real, inspiring stories from the people you know, follow, and admire, join me every week for Post Run High. It's where we take the conversation beyond the run and get into the heart of it all. It's lighthearted, pretty crazy, and very fun. Listen to Post Run High on the iHeartRadio app, Apple Podcasts, or wherever you get your podcasts. Welcome, I'm Danny Thrill. Won't you join me at the fire and dare enter? Nocturnal Tales from the Shadows,

presented by iHeart and Sonoro. An anthology of modern-day horror stories inspired by the legends of Latin America. From ghastly encounters with shapeshifters to bone-chilling brushes with supernatural creatures. I know you. Take a trip and experience the horrors that have haunted Latin America since the beginning of time. Listen to Nocturnal Tales from the Shadows

as part of My Cultura podcast network, available on the iHeartRadio app, Apple Podcasts, or wherever you get your podcasts. Hi, I'm Ed Zitron, host of the Better Offline podcast, and we're kicking off our second season digging into how Tex Elite has turned Silicon Valley into a playground for billionaires. elite has turned Silicon Valley into a playground for billionaires. From the chaotic world of generative AI to the destruction of Google search, better offline is your unvarnished and at times unhinged look at the underbelly of tech from an industry veteran with nothing to lose. This season, I'm going to be joined by everyone from Nobel winning economists to leading journalists in the field. And I'll be digging into why the products you love keep getting worse and naming and shaming those responsible. Don't get me wrong, though.

I love technology. I just hate the people in charge and want them to get back to building things that actually do things to help real people. I swear to God things can change if we're loud enough. So join me every week to understand what's happening in the tech industry and what could be done to make things better. Listen to Better Offline on the iHeartRadio app,

Apple Podcasts, or wherever else you get your podcasts. Check out betteroffline.com. Ahmed has built a life for himself in Sweden. He's been teaching parkour classes there for years now. In fact, that's how the play came about. The mother of one of his students is a theater director, and she became interested in his story. By his account, life is much better for him now.

But he still is not free to see his own family or to go back to his original home. Getting into Gaza is almost as hard as getting out of Gaza. And hopefully you guys can get back into your families too, because I know that must be really difficult, being separated, not being able to get back. Yeah, it's been six years almost. Jesus, man. Yeah, that's really hard.

But you know, Dramaten, the theater, I've invited my brother and luckily he got the visa from first time. He got help from the same guy that helped me. He went to him and asked him and he put him into a special place. He traveled from Gaza without having to wait and now he's here. Oh wow, he didn't have to do a backflip in the visa. No, he did not because he's an artist and he had the visa and everything. So he got the visa because in Dramaten, the theatre center invited him to be a part of the show

with his piece of fabric that he drew. And Abdullah the same way with the travel. through yeah and abdullah the same way with the travel and so everyone was like you know if you don't have someone to help you you will not travel right yeah it shouldn't be that way abdullah had to get it also held because his visa also was also one week and one week and he had to travel in that week and his he's named the last of the days. Unfortunately, Abdullah had some internet issues, and some of the audio isn't usable. But he similarly only made it out of Gaza because he had a friend who had a contact at the Italian consulate. When Abdullah tried to apply for the visa, the office wasn't taking any more applications. But this friend was able to explain Abdullah's situation to the consulate and they decided to give him a travel visa.

Abdullah also had to travel through Egypt and was forced to stay in a small prison cell for three days without food or water. Once he got to the Cairo airport, the German airline he was booked on refused to accept his paperwork because they didn't want the responsibility of stamping his passport. With the alternative of just going back to Gaza, Abdullah was able to find a manager of sorts and explain his situation with the travel visa and needing to go to this film premiere for this parkour thing. You know, it's not the easiest thing to explain. Not everyone knows what parkour is, but the manager was sympathetic. And then just like what happened with Ahmed, they requested a parkour demonstration to see if this guy was actually telling the truth.

So the already exhausted Abdullah did a backflip in the airport as he was recovering from the COVID vaccine. And then the manager, seemingly satisfied, transferred him from this German airline to an Egyptian airline. And he was able to make it to Italy and escape the prison of Gaza. When you're, or anyone who's in prison, the only thing that he thinks about, I mean, when you're in prison for the whole life, I mean, the only thing they think about is just how to escape, no? I mean, that's normally. Because you just to to be free because you're in prison i've never been

into the prison i mean i've never no we both say we i mean i've been to the prison of gaza but not the real one is that that's exactly what i mean so we, we were in a prison, which is open, big prison. And the only way that we were thinking about is how to get out of that. And the only way that was really possible was just to use Percur as an opportunity for us so we can get our freedom. And somehow, now you're in Sweden, I'm in Italy. We have this kind of freedom. But at the same time, it's really hard because our families, our friends and everyone, we're still connected. Not the full freedom.

Exactly. So it's like we're still connected. Like, I mean, I was trying to meet my family this summer and I applied for the Egyptian visa because I still don't have the Swedish passport. So I have to apply as a Palestinian to go back or to visit Egypt so I applied for the Egyptian visa to visit my family because my mother was in Egypt and she was there to attend the marriage of my uncle but she was there in Egypt with my sister. I applied for the visa, I never got the visa so I had to stay in Sydney. It's like I'm not free yet.

I will get the Swedish passport soon, I don't know when, but I'm sure it's not more than six months from now because I have been applying. I have applied six months ago and it's usually not more than a year to get the decision. And usually it's accepted if you have everything correct in the country, like if you're legal and you pay the tax and you're working, you're studying and you know the language. I'm good there, I is just like i have to wait so in the end i will be able to meet them i would not be able i would not say i will be free to enter gaza whenever i want because yeah to enter gaza at the moment i hear from people it takes like three to four days and you suffer in the way, just like you have to stay in the car these three days.

And every thousand kilometers, a thousand meters, you get stopped by a control, like a road control that they need to check everything you have, every bag you have, take it out in the road and you have to put it back by yourself. And then the car continues another thousand kilometers, another control. And then in the end you arrive like Gaza and you have to put it back by yourself and then the car continues another thousand kilo another control and then in the end you arrive like Gaza and you say this is the worst

part of my travel to Gaza because they don't want to do it again they don't want to get to Gaza and suffer the same way again and the same to get out of Gaza to To get out of Gaza, I mean, if I have the Swedish passport, for sure I will have the ability to travel from Gaza without worrying about getting a visa or not. But in the same time, yeah, I need to wait on a queue. When will I travel? When will I be able to travel from Gaza? Is it going to be one month, two months, three months?

Because it's like thousands of people who want to travel and they just allow 500 people a day. That's maximum. And then they don't allow any more of that people. And then also they close the crossing at any moment. And I remember the time I traveled from Gaza, the crossing was closed for six months, three, six months, and it was not open at all. And there was 31,000 people in front of

me in the queue, 31,000. So imagine like I was the last person in the queue and I have to wait all of these people to travel and the crossing was open just three days every three months that means like in this three days it's 1500 when is the rest gonna travel when will i have to travel and imagine you have a visa that is valid for like 10 days if you get the visa just for an event in Europe, that is just three days, and then you get the visa for 10 days. And then if you don't travel in that 10 days,

your visa gets expired, and then you have to apply for a new visa. And then after that, you have to wait, because if you get the refused visa, you cannot apply directly. You have to wait three to six months, and then you can apply for the new visa so it's really terrible like i don't want to go through all of that process again that's why i decide to stay in sweden and work in sweden and get a swedish citizenship where i can

travel freely without worrying about getting a visa or not. Because till now, because I'm not Swedish, I have to think about getting a visa or not. Will I be refused visa or not? And even Egyptian embassy refused my visa. And they did not even answer. I call them every day. Did I get the visa? When will you give me the visa?

I go to their officer in Stockholm. They're like, like oh you have to call us send us an email and I call and send the email oh we will call you when you get the visa but will you call me back if I don't get the visa no we will call you when you get the visa they were calling okay and then they said I'm not coming to Egypt. Yeah, that sounds rough. And I know for a long time, Abdullah was in Gaza when you were in Sweden, right? And Abdullah was trying to get the visa to travel. Last time we spoke, you hadn't been able to get one.

So I'm glad you did. I'm glad you're now a film star. He has been a plane many times also. I remember we went together many times and Sweden also invited him and Jihad also and they got refused visa and I'm sure he applied before also to Italy and he applied for England. I also applied Italy. I I got a visa around four times. And I got a visa from Oslo. I went there in 2013. And USA invited me for Las Vegas and WFPF invited me for an event in Las Vegas that I could not make. And also Germany, Hamburg and Hanover invited me and there was many events that I could not make.

In the end I could make it to the airwaves but the first year of the Airwaves, they invited me to 2015 and I applied for the visa. I did not get it. And then the year after 2016, I got the visa because I had the help also from another private invitation. So I got double invitations that it made it stronger for the consulate, the embassy in Jerusalem to accept the visa. And it was like, yeah, it was a 21-day visa. And directly when I arrived in Sweden, I was like, my friend knew I don't want to go back. So they took me to the immigration office in Helsingborg in Malmo.

And there I extended my visa for six months first and in that six months I wanted to work and stay here so I started to look for a job and I started my own job actually like start to work with parkour myself like making classes that I was teaching in English and I had one of the students translating to the kids in Swedish and so he was getting three classes and it was tough at that time I was like it was hard for him also to translate because he was not more than 13 years old he was so shy and everything and I was forced to learn the Swedish language because of that. I wanted to work and I just started to know hands, head and feet, knees. And it was easy because it was similar to English.

And by the time the kids had taught me to speak Swedish at the moment, because it was the only way I learned Swedish. It was my way to learn Swedish. I was with the kids all the time. The kids' language was the easiest to take, like to pick out, because the kids have a simple language that you can really learn much faster than talking with an adult that talks really fast and talking very advanced Swedish. I dreamed to travel from Gaza Gaza and then I made it. I did travel from Gaza and then you think,

okay, what do I want to make next? And then I want to work with parkour. Then I started working with parkour. I never expected that I would be in the biggest theatre stage in Sweden. And then I am here in the biggest theater stage in Sweden. And then I am here in the biggest theater stage in Sweden. That's just like being able to come and watch my story and watch me performing parkour and telling my story. It's like, I never thought about it. I just, parkour brought that to me. As an extra note, earlier this week,

James spoke with Ahmed and Abdullah. And as of a few days ago, at least, both of their families were okay. Obviously, this is an ongoing situation, but I just wanted to add that in here because that's the most up-to-date information we have. parkour. You can find him at Matar Gaza on Instagram or his website matargaza.com. That's M-A-T-A-R gaza.com. Abdullah is still in Italy and is studying to become an English teacher. And just last February, Ahmed and Abdullah were able to see each other in person for the first time in quite a while. The documentary that Abdullah is in is called One More Jump. It's about very similar questions on whether it's worth it to stay and fight for your country

or try to escape and fulfill your dreams. Thank you once again to Abdullah and Ahmed for talking with us. I'll link their social medias in the show notes below. See you on the other side. It Could Happen Here is a production of Cool Zone Media. For more podcasts from Cool Zone Media,

visit our website, coolzonemedia.com or check us out on the iHeartRadio app, Apple Podcasts, or wherever you listen to podcasts. You can find sources for It Could Happen Here updated monthly at coolzonemedia.com slash sources. Thanks for listening. Hey guys, I'm Kate Max. You might know me from my popular online series, The Running Interview Show, where I run with

celebrities, athletes, entrepreneurs, and more. After those runs, the conversations keep going. That's what my podcast, Post Run High, is all about. keep going. That's what my podcast Post Run High is all about. It's a chance to sit down with my guests and dive even deeper into their stories, their journeys, and the thoughts that arise once we've hit the pavement together. Listen to Post Run High on the iHeartRadio app, Apple Podcasts, or wherever you get your podcasts. You should probably keep your lights on for Nocturnal Tales from the Shadow. Join me, Danny Trejo, and step into the flames of right. An anthology podcast of modern day horror stories inspired by the most terrifying legends

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