It Could Happen Here - New Wall Construction and Borderlands Resistance

Episode Date: October 23, 2025

James is joined by Erick Meza to discuss the plans for new border walls in San Diego and elsewhere, and how people are resisting the destruction of sacred spaces, wildlife habitat, and wilderness. Sources: https://www.sierraclub.org/arizona/blog/2025/10/no-more-walls-san-diego-county https://givebutter.com/borderlandsresistance  https://www.sierraclub.org/borderlands https://borderwallresistance.com/See omnystudio.com/listener for privacy information.

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until a local housewife, a journalist, and a handful of girls came forward with a story. America, y'all better work the hell up. Bad things happens to good people in small towns. Listen to Graves County on the IHeartRadio app, Apple Podcasts, or wherever you get your podcasts. And to binge the entire season ad-free, subscribe to Lava for Good Plus on Apple Podcasts. Podcasts. CallZone Media Hi everyone and welcome to the show.

It's me, James, today and I'm very lucky to be joined again by Eric Mesa, who's the borderlands coordinator for the Sierra Club. Eric, how are you doing? I'm doing okay, James. Thanks so much for the invitation. Yeah, thank you for joining us. Sadly, we don't have a lot of good stuff to talk about right now. It's a pretty difficult time in the borderlands.

But maybe we could start off with something that I've reported on briefly in our weekly new show. The Border Patrol is currently soliciting comment for its plans to build border wall through the Otai Mountain Wilderness and other areas west of Ticate, right? Could you explain a little bit about what they're proposing and what the consequences of that will be? Yeah, well, hi everybody. So happy to be here and not so happy to be sharing this news, but, you know, so what the announcement, was recently by the border patrol, especially on the San Diego area, is the announcement of the approximately 9.7 miles of new border barrier system. And on top of that, over 51 miles of what they call now system attributes. Yeah. And this is going to have a huge impact on the

area. This is going to be about 2.9 miles west. of the tecate port of entry going through an area that it is very remote mountain region and yeah some of people here in this are more familiar that I am I'm actually never been but I've been talking to some of the local organizations that do humanitarian aid in the region and I know that they got the peak is in that area and then you start going west into these beautiful mountains that are also the birthplace of the Tijuana River. That's exactly the area where it's going to go. So right now, CBP is accepting comments and asking people in the community,

what kind of concerns do they have? Concerns in regards of the environmental impacts of a project like this, what kind of social and economical impacts. So they open up this section on their website with an email address where people can share some of these concerns. As you mentioned, I'm part of an environmental organization, but we also have all kinds of concerns for a project like this, including the border barrier and the system attributes,

which are very poorly described of what they mean. Some of the things that they mention as system attributes is the increase of lighting infrastructure, surveillance equipment, roads for access for border patrol vehicles. Yeah. So one of the things that we're going to expect that we have seen in other areas is more blasting through the mountain, especially on areas where the mountain is so uneven

that the terrain, there is a lot of heavy machinery. It has to come into those places to start bulldozing to level the terrain so they can start building this border wall. So we can expect some of that. And with that come a lot of issues because there is going to be the need to start drilling wells at the border to extract this water for mixing the concrete for the foundation. If there was any road out there, they're going to probably widen the road two or three times to allow this having machinery to access these remote areas. And this is just going to be the beginning, just setting up the panels. But whenever you go to these places and start disturbing the native soil, you can expect all kinds of consequences in regards of invasive species of plants.

You can also expect some flooding and removal of native vegetation. In some cases, there are some species that are rare on the area. Yeah. That having this impacts, you know, can be long-lasting for them to be able to recover if they're able. to do so. The area on the south side of the border is also an area where animals need to be moving back of course. So species like the native mule deer colony that lives there, there is a mountain lion and other species of mammals and pretty much everything that is four inches wide that it's not going to be able to make it through that border wall.

Yeah. So yeah, we're just raising these concerns and sharing with the communities of they're able to also as well in an email to CBP because of some border patrol and express these concerns. And also to remember that these areas have been sacred sites for the indigenous communities since timing

memorial. So we might lose some very sacred sites for the tribes forever. Yeah, like I know the topic of Tecate Mountain has been sacred to Kumiyai people. I believe it's Kuchama in Kumai, but it's been sacred to them

for, as you say, much longer than this has been the United States. That's correct. You and I have both seen it in different places, right? The damage that the border wall does, not just to people, I've seen mule deer running along it. Like, they're clearly trying to find a way through right at this is their habitual pathway. There are some areas near, very, very near the border, like within 100 yards of the border, where there are naturally occurring creeks and little ponds, which will hold water at a time when water can be very hard to come across here.

And so I've seen deer kind of distraught almost trying to get to this place where they've obviously learned that they can get water, but now they can't. It's really heartbreaking on top of all the other cruelty that it does. I suppose we should address, like I'm not sure how much we can accomplish by the comment period, right? But it has value nonetheless, like trying to do something. I think it has value.

It shows that we didn't let this just happen. Yeah, that's right. I honestly am not very helpful from these common periods because this is not the first time they're asking the community to provide input. And with past experiences that we have organized in other areas, other segments of the wall, even in other states, we haven't get a response even or an acknowledgement of these concerns. So that by itself is really concerning. But I think it is important that the communities around these areas are aware about this and they get involved and that there is this community sentiment against this abuse of power that the administration continues to do in the borderlands and using them at this sacrifice zone as these testing grounds for what can potentially continue to happen or expand to not only on the

border, but in other series, like, we are seeing with the span of militarization nowadays. Yeah, definitely. Like, all the stuff that is really bad in America right now, like, it started at the border. That's right. People are seeing it in their communities now, but like, we've been seeing it where we live for a long time. Can we talk a little bit about, there's been some other construction, right? Then San Diego is not the only place right now. There's a significant budgetary allocation to construction a border barrier and there's more construction east of San Diego, right? Yeah, that's right. Most of the construction that is happening right now, it was with all funding that was from the 2021 funds that were available in the first Trump administration. So we were

hoping that that was going to be like the end of the funding. But since the proposal and passing of the quote-unquote big, beautiful bill, we've got to remind ourselves that now the administration has allocated $46.5 billion for border security, and that includes border barriers and system attributes. So pretty much anything related to border security right now, they have the funding to do it. They pretty much have the funding to put a double wall across the whole U.S.-Mexico border. Yeah. So that's huge, you know.

In recent days, we got a new wave of contracts that were awarded in October 10. We got this announcement that out of these funding, the $46.5 billion, they allocated a little bit over $4 billion. And this will fund them 230 miles of new physical barriers and 400 miles of surveillance technology across the U.S.-Mexico border from California to Texas. That's, and they put up a new section on their website where there is a map that you can navigate. It's an interactive map that shows every single section of the border and what they're

planning to do with. And as surreal as it sounds, they are planning to double up the wall. So in some places, in remote areas in the desert, like in Organ Pipe, National Monument, or Cabeza Prieta in Arizona. In those areas, there is plans to build a secondary wall. So in top of the 30-foot barrier that they have, they're planning to do a second one. Yeah, we have that in San Ysidro, right?

We have a double 30-foot barrier. Yeah. The Biden administration used it to corral people seeking asylum, right? that they kept them in between the two walls and then denied that they were in detention. I don't know if we'll see that again. But I guess just from my own experience, you know, participating in mutual aid along the border, like those remote desert areas are where people go when we build wall in Otai, right? When we continue to detain and turn people back in less remote areas,

they will take the risk of going to a more remote area and forcing people into those remote areas and then constructing barriers there too is just going to cause more deaths. It's not going to stop people trying to come because there are things that they are leaving which are terrible, but it will mean that they get stuck out there in the heat without water for longer, right?

That's correct, James. So exactly what you said. People in San Diego, like the border in Otai, you already have the double wall. So you know, like having this hyper-militarized area and how that is going to expand. And the consequences of that is, as you mentioned, you push people out further, more remote areas.

And two things happen by doing that. First, the most important, more people die. But also remember that these areas, like these remote areas, were also like semi-pristine wildlife environments that you never had humans moving through before. Now, as people has been pushed to these remote areas, you have this human traffic and not only migrants moving through

but you also have the Border Patrol chasing these migrants and now you have border patrol wanting to build new roads to these wilderness areas and all of these just keeps building up into what's already a very fragmented landscape.

So by adding all these quote unquote system attributes because you're pushing and pushing people further and building these double walls it's just going to end the last of the remaining wildlife remote migration corridors as well. So the impacts that this is going to have are huge. Yeah, yeah, for all living creatures, as you said.

Let's take a break, Eric. We'll come back and talk about it some more. Hey there, I'm Kyle McLaughlin. You might know me as that guy from Twitter. in peaks, sex in the city, or just the internet's dad. I have a new podcast called What Are We Even Doing, where I embark on a noble quest to understand the brilliant chaos of youth culture. Daddy's looking good. Each week, I invite someone fascinating to join me, actors, musicians, creatives, highly evolved digital life forms, and we talk about what they love.

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staffer, and as of like 15 seconds ago, a podcast host. Along the way, I've made some friends who are experts in science, politics, and pop culture. And each week, one of them will be joining me to answer my burning questions. Like, are we heading towards another financial crash like in 08? Is non-monogamy back in style? And how come there's never a gate ready for your flight when it lands like two minutes early? We've got guests like Pete Buttigieg, Stacey Abrams, Lili Singh, and Bill Nye. When you start weaponizing outer space, things can potentially go really wrong. Look, the world can seem pretty scary right now because it is. But my goal here is for you to listen and feel a little better about the future.

Listen and subscribe to Here We Go again with Cal Penn on the IHeart Radio app, Apple Podcasts, or wherever you get your podcasts. All I know is what I've been told, and that's a half-truth is a whole lie. For almost a decade, the murder of an 18-year-old girl from a small town in Graves County, Kentucky,

went unsolved, until a local homemaker, a journalist, and a handful of girls came forward with a story. I'm telling you, we know Quincy Kilder, we know. A story that law enforcement used to convict six people, and that got the citizen investigator on national TV. Through sheer persistence and nerve, this Kentucky housewife helped give justice to Jessica Curran. My name is Maggie Freeling. I'm a Pulitzer Prize-winning journalist, producer, And I wouldn't be here if the truth were that easy to find.

I did not know her and I did not kill her, or rape or burn or any of that other stuff that y'all said. They literally made me say that I took a match and struck and threw it on her. They made me say that I poured gas on her. From Lava for Good, this is Graves County, a show about just how far our legal system will go in order to find someone to blame. America, y'all better work the hell up. Bad things happens to good people in small towns. Listen to Graves County in the Bone Valley feed on the IHeart Radio app, Apple Podcasts, or wherever you get your podcasts. And to binge the entire season ad free, subscribe to Lava for Good Plus on Apple Podcasts.

In early 1988, federal agents raced to track down the gang they suspect of importing millions of dollars worth of heroin into New York from Asia. We had 30 agents ready to go with shotguns and rifles and you name it. But what they find is not what they expected. Basically, your stay-at-home moms were picking up these large amounts of heroin. They go, is this your daughter? I said yes. They go, oh, you may not see her for like 25 years. Caught between a federal investigation and the violent gang who recruited them,

the women must decide who they're willing to protect and who they dare to betray. Once I saw the gun, I tried to take his hand and I saw the flash of light. Listen to the Chinatown Stang on the IHeart Radio app, Apple Podcasts, or anywhere you get your podcasts. all right we are back let's talk about like how people are organizing right like at this time when it does seem really bleak at the borderlands like the trump administration didn't really construct

very much war in its first iteration it did construct a bit but not as much as it wanted to and you and I are both very familiar with the consequences that has had, right? Like, it has caused more people to die. The Biden administration continue constructing and, quote, unquote, repairing border barriers. They also pioneered outdoor detention. And, like, it just seems like things with whoever gets elected, but more rapidly under Republicans, get worse. What are people able to do when we've spoken about this a lot on this show, but I'd love

to hear your perspective, too. It's being hard, honestly, as a person working on environmental issues in the border because definitely the looses are much more than the wind sometimes. So that can be this hard thing. Yeah. But there has been some glimpses of hope. I think one of the things that we did here in Arizona that definitely felt really good and gave us some hope is when the governor of Arizona,

decided to put some chipping containers and make its own makeshift wall. So a bunch of people really came together on the community outrage because this was just some really dumb idea in one of the most remote, beautiful areas where there is not even people moving through, and it was just going to destroy the environment. And the governor went out there and spent $200 million of tax pay. money to buy these shipping containers and build this border wall. So we were actually, all the community came together.

We showed up out there into the desert and stopped the machines. And we say, no, you're not going to move any further. And because what they were doing was actually illegal, we were able to get away with it. And those shipping containers are gone right now. Still, Arizona taxpayer paid $200 million to destroy their own environment. Just let that sink in. We can't be using that money for much better things. So I think that precedent and that movement,

that sense of community that was built after that resistance, it has continued. After that, like there is a lot of self-organized, grassroots efforts going on for border resistance, you know, and that encompasses humanitarian aid groups, environmental groups. And we are also organizing nowadays here in Arizona to do some direct action on try to show up to the San Rafael Valley, which is where the border construction is going and started raising some national attention to this issue, trying to invite our politicians, starting by our native communities to speak out and using different methods such

as art, performance, bring up some different strategies together. You know, now with the technology that we have available is that how can we make this more mainstream and tell people across the nation what's going on on these remote areas. You know, a lot of people has a lot of connection to this valley and this is the heavy waters of the Santa Cruz River, the lifeblood of many communities across the southern Arizona. And at the same time, on the other side of the coin, you know, there is all this oppression by the government to anything that is against their will. So a lot of people feel a little bit afraid of showing up to direct action. Yeah. So it is just walking that fine line

You know, what can we get away with and still be able to make a bold statement and show opposition without putting people in danger? Yeah, yeah. I think that is something a lot of people are really worried about. But it is important within the realm of things that we can do to show our opposition to this, like to understand in solidarity with the animals and the indigenous people whose sacred spaces are being defiled, right, and with migrants. whose lives are being put in danger by this.

I wonder, like, I find it so strange, I guess, that, like, we're at a time when reporting on migration is becoming, like, like, a major growth industry, I guess. Editors who I could not get to respond to an email or pick up the phone for the last four years and now commissioning pieces on migration. But there still seems to be, like, a blind spot about the border in the American news media.

I don't know why that is I don't know if you have ideas about why there is but the borderlands are such a special place for me anyway you know I've spent nearly 20 years of my life here some of my favorite places

in the world are near the border I think people think of the border as like Sanisiro but it contains some wonderfully remote and special places and I wonder if you have thoughts on why like

the border isn't something that gets talked about that much on a national level oh I think I think it does get talked about, but unfortunately, the narrative that is usually built around it is really negative. Yeah, that's fair. And of course, that's with an intention, right? You'll continue to build up this militarized state or sacrifice zone.

And so whenever I talk with the people that is here for the first time, you know, I do this group presentations for delegations that come from all over the, the country to experience the borderlands region and they're like they have all this perspective, you know, for what they hear on the news about how horrible this is. And then they come here and they're like, wow, people here is like really nice. And we have had a great experience and I really inspire. And it's like coming with this prefabricated narrative on their minds of these wasteland sacrifice song you know like and then going out after experience and yes some of that and of course if you go out to the to the border and experience the wall and the rolls and rolls

of concert you know wire the make it look like you're on a war song yeah plus the plus what you already have in your mind you know it just keeps building up the intensity and then you hear the stories from people, the struggle from migrants and stories from back in 2023 when we had the search of migrants coming and all these things, you know, but at the end, people leave with the glimpse also like, wow, this place is really beautiful and a lot of wonderful things are happening, a lot of movements of people trying to organize and make it a better place and trying really hard to shift this narrative. You know, the borderlands provide us a good opportunity, you know,

because what we see today, like a friend of mine said, it can get worse and it's going into that direction. Yeah, yeah. It's going into that direction. But at the same time, it gives us an opportunity as a society, you know, because whatever happens at the border is definitely going to have a ripple effect in the rest of the country. So we are able to figure out a way to shift that narrative and look at the border like people that lives and experience the border and the culture and the beautiful things that the border has to offer, then we hope that that's going to help change a lot of the things that are happening in this country, you know.

But we need to start, I think, organizing from the bottom up. A lot of grassroots effort need to be happening. And I think a lot of media needs to cover this. You know, we usually don't cover the good stories. Yeah, yeah, you're right. Like, it's funny. The right does cover the border, you're right? Or the, you know, the Fox News kind of cadre does cover the border.

Like, I don't like the way they cover it. But, like, the only national network guy I will see down there is the Fox guy for the most part. Hey there, I'm Kyle McLaughlin. You might know me as that guy from Twin Peaks, Sex in the City, or just the Internet stand. I have a new podcast called What Are We Even Doing, where I embark on a noble quest to understand the brilliant chaos of youth culture. Daddy's looking good. Each week I invite someone fascinating to join me, actors, musicians, creatives, highly evolved digital life forms, and we talk about what they love. Sometimes I'll jerse a little honey in there, too, from feeling sexy in the morning.

What keeps them going? And you're maybe my biggest competition on social media. Like when a kid says, bra to me. And how they're navigating this high-speed roller coaster we call reality. In Australia, you're looking out for snakes, spiders, and f***is. Right. Hey, he's no trade McDougal. This is like the comment section of my Instagram.

Join me and my delightful guests every Thursday. And let's get weird together in a good way. Listen to what are we even doing on the IHeart Radio app, Apple Podcasts, or wherever you get your podcasts. Here we go. Hey, I'm Cal Penn. And on my new podcast, Here We Go Again, we'll take today's trends and headlines and ask, why does history keep repeating itself? You may know me as the second hottest actor from the Harold and Kumar movies, but I'm also an author, a White House staffer, and as of like 15 seconds ago, a podcast host. Along the way, I've made some friends who are experts in science, politics, and pop culture.

And each week, one of them will be joining me to answer my burning questions. Like, are we heading towards another financial crash, like in 08? Is non-monogamy back in style? And how come there's never a gate ready for your flight when it lands like two minutes early? We've got guests like Pete Buttigieg, Stacey Abrams, Lili Singh, and Bill Nye. When you start weaponizing outer space, things can potentially, go really wrong. Look, the world can seem pretty scary right now, because it is.

But my goal here is for you to listen and feel a little better about the future. Listen and subscribe to Here We Go Again with Cal Penn on the IHeart Radio app, Apple Podcasts, or wherever you get your podcasts. All I know is what I've been told, and that's a half-truth is a whole lie. For almost a decade, the murder of an 18-19. year old girl from a small town in Graves County, Kentucky, went unsolved, until a local homemaker, a journalist, and a handful of girls came forward with a story. I'm telling you, we know Quincy Kilder, we know. A story that law enforcement used to convict six people, and that got the citizen investigator

on national TV. Through sheer persistence and nerve, this Kentucky housewife helped give justice to Jessica My name is Maggie Freeling. I'm a Pulitzer Prize-winning journalist, producer, and I wouldn't be here if the truth were that easy to find. I did not know her and I did not kill her, or rape or burn, or any of that other stuff that y'all said it. They literally made me say that I took a match and struck and threw it on her. They made me say that I poured gas on her. From Lava for Good, this is Graves County, a show about just how far our legal system will go in order to find someone to blame. America, y'all better work the hell up. Bad things happens to good people in small towns.

Listen to Graves County in the Bone Valley feed on the IHeart Radio app, Apple Podcasts, or wherever you get your podcasts. And to binge the entire season ad free, subscribe to Lava for Good Plus on Apple Podcasts. What's up, everybody? This is Snacks from the Trabner's podcast, and we're bringing you the horror every week all October long. Kicking off this month, I'll be bringing you all my greatest fear-inducing horror games

from Resident Evil to Silent Hill, me and Tony bringing back fire team on Left for Dead 2. And we're just going to be going over some of the greats. Also in October, we'll be talking about our favorite horror. and Halloween movies and figure out why black people always gotta die further. The umbral reliquary invites any and all fooling, brave enough, to peruse its

many curiosities. But take heed. All sales are final. Weekly horror side quest written and narrated by yours truly. With a full episode read and a commentary special. And we will cap it off with horror movie battle royale. Jason versus Freddie. Michael Myers versus the 80 thing with the little tongue must. October, we're doing it Halloween style.

Listen to the Trapner's podcast from the Black Effect Podcast Network on the IHartRadio app, Apple Podcasts, or wherever you get your podcast. I know one thing I like to do with my friends, or like if someone come to visit, you know, sometimes I have other independent journalists come visit to walk down to the border wall. And it seems very bleak, right? Because there's this big wall and it's covered in Constitina Way, as you say,

and maybe they're Marines or National Guard. or Border Patrol or any other, like, it's people with guns, right, in different uniforms. But then if you turn around, you're in this really special place where you don't see the people and you just, you can appreciate how beautiful it is. It's also very beautiful that, like you say, there's so much bottom up organizing,

that there's so much people helping people of all different kinds. And that's something we also are in 2023 when Title 42 ended and subsequently the Biden administration detained people outdoors. We saw an incredible community response of all different kinds of people, different political persuasions, different faith groups, which was a really beautiful thing. Like it's a thing that a lot of the rest of America right now could learn from. The government was brutalizing people and people made that less bad.

They kept them safe. There'd have been a lot more people who didn't make it through outdoor detention if it wasn't for community support. I want people to see that. I wonder, like, if people want to support, right? Let's say they're not in the borderlands. Can you think of good ways for them to be in solidarity, for them to even to experience, like,

I know a lot of people who listen to this have come. Like, it's really wonderful for me to meet people when I'm not working, when I'm just out there in my capacity of someone who cares about other people, right, doing water drops, doing mutual aid with, with migrants or helping people at street release to hear of people who listened to this and then decided to come from wherever they were

and spend some time here and help. That's a really a special thing. But do you have other ideas on how people can be in solidarity and can come and help? Yeah, definitely. I get this question very often from different people that comes to busy. I usually recommend people to start where they are

in their own communities because there is, reflections of border issues in your own community. There are people that are migrating that might need some help. There's people that shelters and all these or just kind of like get involved with your local. Whatever you're passionate about, you know, it doesn't really have to be an environmental issue.

But we got to remember that social justice and environmental justice is the same thing. You know, we got really, like, whatever you're passionate about, just getting involved. But I think the worst thing that we can do right now is just to ignore the fact that we are in a bad spot, you know. I think a lot of people just want to continue writing their comfort song wave, and it's, that's going to end, you know. And I think we need to not only think about ourselves, but we need to think about the generation's coming ahead of us. And I think it's especially for the people that has already had the opportunity to somehow live a life, you know, but there's some that are about to start that

journey. And I think it's our responsibility to make it the best as we can for them as well. So whatever you're passionate about, and you really want to, and you're passionate about all the related issues, and you're not able to come, try to support, you know, like financial help is, you know, we like it or not, we're in a capitalist society and we move with financial support. Yeah. So a lot of these events that we're creating, a lot of these outreach that we're doing, a lot of the people like new generations that need jobs that are wanting to join, like maybe a non-profit work or create their own movement or doing something related that's going to help the community. Yeah, support those. If you are able, those are really good ways to get

involved and make some change. Yeah, definitely. Like, there's a lot of things you can do, as you say. And I think it does help to build up networks of caring for people everywhere. Like, we want to live in a world where people take care of one another. And to do that, we have to start it everywhere. It's not like the border is the only place where bad things are happening. I know we draw a lot of strengths as people who live at the border from that solidarity, but also from seeing people do their own things wherever they're at. Like that is how we build a world where systems of oppression are less able to oppress people.

Yeah. And one of the things we see here, most of the decisions taken for the border are not taken by people from the border. You know, a lot of these big policy decisions. Like, for example, a senator of Utah right now is putting up a bill for the border to sacrifice a lot of public lands for new roads and, like, new military installation. So it's like people from Utah are not directly on the border, but they can also send letters and comments or both these senators out, you know, and somebody that really, like,

cares for the environment. Yeah, if you're in Utah, your senator has been advocating to sell off the public lands that you own that are safe. I mean, they're native land. It's all native land. It should be returned to it. It's original custodians. But in the meantime, you own it, and at least all of us can access it until Mike Lee gets

his chance to sell it all off to his buddies in real estate. And like, you could be an extremely conservative person, and we could disagree on a lot of shit. And I think we could find unity on that. Like, I do not understand how there is a constituency that wants to take land from the public domain and turn it into, I don't know, military bases and oil fields and, McMansions for rich people to have as their second home. Like, that should be a thing that everyone agrees on.

And like, he didn't stick the landing on it the first time in the reconciliation, the quote-unquote big, beautiful bill. But I think that's a really good area between engaged people, folks who might not be like, yeah, I will show up for migrants. I think a lot of people, they could be people who enjoy the outdoors, people who just care about the environment, the hook and bullet crowd. Like, like, there are a lot of people, even if they don't, quote, quite use public lands, like we all benefit from being there and future generation to benefit

from them remaining undeveloped in a substantial way. That's right. Sorry, I just went off on when that guy really pissed me off. She makes me so mad. Coming from a country that it's entirely private land is to see someone being like, yeah, that's a good idea. It's just fucking asinine. Eric, I wonder if people want to keep up with the Sierra Club, keep up with, like, how they can

submit opposition comments. If they want to know more about this new border construction and the impact would have, where can they follow along? Is there a website or social media? Yes, James. Thank you. Yeah, we do have all of it. We've tried to engage people where they are. And we know social media is a powerful tool. We have a website, Sierra Club borderlands. People can look up some of the work that we do there. We are also active on social media. We are Florida lands. However you look at it, you're going to find us. We're based out of Arizona, but we do organize in different states. We're in collaboration with other organizations as part of a larger coalition. So even if you are in Texas or New Mexico, you're pretty to reach out

And if you have any concerns, ideas, things that come up to your mind that you can make the border a better place, feel free to reach out. And we can collaborate, work together on this, or at least connect you with some of the local people that are part of the network. Because we're always looking to make this network bigger. You know, I think there's strange numbers and get more and more people to join this coalition. in the different states. So even if you're not on the border states, if you're in D.C. and you do a lobbying and you're into policy change.

But yeah, come reach out. And you can find us like a center website or we have an Instagram account. We also have like a grassroots video for right now called Raleigh for the Valley. And that's what we're trying to do for the San Rafael Valley. Over there, you're going to be able to find

updates and we created a decentralized website right now that is called border wall resistance. I invite everybody to take a look at it. It's full of beautiful pictures of the border. When James and I were talking about how beautiful this place is, got to that website and you understand what we're talking about. Because it's so diverse, you know, the border is so unique on each area. You know, the border is not defined by Juana San Diego. no godless, you know, it is just 2,000 miles of Wonderlands. So unfortunately separated by, in many cases, but it's huge metal very good structure. Yeah.

Anyways, so that's the website, the social media for Sierra Club borderlands and Bradley for the Balin and the border resistance. Yeah, definitely reach out if you recently found out that you live within a border enforcement zone and weren't aware of that because I know a lot of people in Chicago and other places have very recently found out that as far as the state is concerned that they too are in the borderlands, it would be good to build some solidarity there. That's right. Two-thirds of the population of this country lives on the borderlands region, because that includes

coastlines. And the Great Lakes. In the Great Lakes. So we're talking about a lot of communities. Well, thank you very much for your time, Eric. We really appreciate it. That was a good discussion. Thank you, James.

and hoping that continue to be in touch and continue organizing, I guess, all these things. And thanks so much for the space and thanks for all the listeners. Yeah, you're welcome. It Could Happen Here is a production of Cool Zone Media. For more podcasts from Cool Zone Media, visit our website, coolzonemedia.com,

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