It Could Happen Here - The Curious Case of Nazi Catboys: Part 2

Episode Date: April 1, 2022

In part 2 we discuss how fascists/reactionaries view the aesthetics of femininity and Nick Fuentes’ catboy fetish.See omnystudio.com/listener for privacy information.

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Listen to Better Offline on the iHeartRadio app, Apple Podcasts, wherever else you get your podcasts from. Recording? In progress. All right. Well, that's my opening. Garrison? Welcome to part two of Why There Are Nazi Catboys.

What is this podcast, Garrison? It could happen here. I'm talking about the that the shit together the the cat boys of nazis which did which did actually happen here they're actually we'll talk about how they actually happened um uh but before we before we get into the topic of fascists becoming femboys via exposure because i i do we're going to start off by talking about kind of, well, generally the bulk of the episodes can be talking about people who are fascists who then get into femboy aesthetics, right? Last episode, we talked about the femfash, people who are femboys who then get into fascism.

Now we're talking about the fascists who now get into femboys. But before we get real into that, I think it's going to, I think it'd be helpful to get a bit more into what these online communities were like in the 20-teens. Now, all this info is like a combination of what I've gleaned from interviews, direct messages, my own pulling up of old 4chan and Reddit threads. It may not necessarily reflect your own experiences perfectly, but it's the most in-depth I can do on an audio-only medium. Some won't be thrilled about this, but we do need to discuss traps and their place within the online community at the time. Okay. Which means we must define, which means we first must define another term for the blissfully unaware.

It's really heartbreaking, Gary, because when I was a child, Garrison, trap was just a house where you hid your drugs. It is not a trap house. This is a different type of trap. This is before trap house turned into a podcast. Yeah. And a bunch of New Yorker people didn't know what a trap house was. This is great.

Heartbreaking. But the term trap as we're using it here, at least on the internet, originates in the early 2000s on image boards, specifically 4chan. And it got to be, as it got more popular as a term, got more kind of widely recognized as a slur. Specifically, usually a slur against trans women, or a slur for any feminine presenting person who was assigned male at birth. So its use and origins, at least on the internet,

comes from people posting pictures, usually from anime, of very feminine-looking boys, alongside the meme of Admiral Ackbar saying, it's a trap, right? So this is how this idea of the trap kind of started, at least online. I talked with some other trans friends of mine. They say that it definitely, in their opinion, they remember it being a term even before the 2000s on the internet of being kind of more of a slur towards trans women. I can't find any kind of stuff online about that specific angle, but the term may be older than that offline, but at least the online

use of it, uh, really comes from the Admiral Ackbar meme. Um, so of course the, it's a trap idea kind of implies some form of deceptions at play, right? With these drawings that appear feminine, but may actually be depicting adolescent males or, you know, worse transsexuals, right? Woo. Very scary. Um, so this, this soon got transferred over from being applied to anime drawings to being applied to pictures and then in-person encounters of real femboys or trans people um so you know it's as in like if you found someone that looks female enough as the meme would go um if to be attractive and later found out that they were actually a boy or they were a trans

woman the idea was like you were deceived thus you must be on the lookout for any kind of potential attractiveness of femboys or trans women or else you too might be trapped um so this again this is it's it's often it's a very transphobic and it's like it's comparing femboys to trans women because these are not the same thing um obviously there's is very very hashtag problematic for a lot of reasons um but there's also the uh the the meme of the of our traps gay which is referring to a kind of like satirical debate around whether or not it's gay to find a femboy a male crossdresser or even a trans woman attractive um now the meme does riff on the whole like fellas is it gay thing um and gee whiz am i glad the fellas meme has surpassed the r traps gay meme uh yeah obviously obviously not only is the

r traps gay thing pretty homophobic and transphobic, it's also tied to a lot of real-world violence against trans women by men, a la the trans panic defense. The whole trap idea kind of does tie into the trans panic defense a lot of men who claim they simply had to attack or kill trans women once they found out that she had a dick, right? Or maybe used to have a dick not even anymore right it doesn't even matter it's more commonly or commonly called the trans panic defense yeah yeah so and like the mere thought of that was so scary that they just they use the trans panic defense in court when violence against trans women is enacted now obvious this is also much more uh attacks against trans women in this vein are much more common on, uh, trans women of color, uh, than, than, than white trans women. That's another, that's another important thing

to mention. Um, but circling back to, to 4chan, Nazis and femboys in, in the 2000s and 2010s, trap was almost like a badge of honor and self-descriptor for many femboys as well. Like being able to trap or, like, you know, pass for a woman while having a dick was, like, the highest level of femboyness. It was, like, top-shelf femboy was being able to achieve this feat. Usually this was, you know, for the purposes of taking, like, lewd pictures of yourself and then having them be, you know, well-liked or spread across online forums. In my interviews with people from these online spaces longer than I've been around, it was

it was like described to me by them, them being like, femboys are just trying to look feminine, whereas traps are really trying to look like girls. And that is kind of like the distinction in these places at the time. Now, you know, all while calling yourself trans was heavily discouraged and ridiculed, in 2011, you know, 4chan, it was hard to even be openly gay, like let alone transgender. But being self-described as a trap was much more accepted. So a lot of these people would actually self-describe as this or want to be self--described as this like want to be at the point where they feel like they could say this um and it's it's interesting it's like a lot of a lot of the attraction to traps um was in in a lot of ways genuine but also all wrapped in this like joking ironic kind of

exterior being like oh it's all like it's all like a bit that we're all that we're all in on the joke for right that that's kind of how this was explained away um another quote from my interviews is like quote if you actually admitted to being actually actually romantically attracted to traps or femboys you would be heavily ostracized people would say things like oh my god you actually did it like you actually did the thing um because it is it is it was like wrapped in this sense of of of of like irony and and any hint of sincere attraction was masked in this like ironic joke like facade so at this point 4chan is basically an amateur porn filled cesspool of anime uh gaming edgy jokes and increasingly bad politics with pole really taking the shape of like the nazi machine that it is today so close proximity and probability

is all it's necessary to make these racist and femboys have this you know uncomfortable awakening uh once they start seeing a whole bunch of pictures with people with dicks wearing like maid outfits um so with with all these like ed ironic, and not-so-ironic jokes, the racists populating these chans, forums, and online spaces, it's only a matter of time before they get exposed to boys posing in Japanese tennis skirts and pink wigs, which helps create this infinity loop idea of femboys who get into racism, and then fascism,

and then fascists who discover they like dick girls and when boys wear dresses and then it's it's because they're because these things are happening right next to each other it's this whole phenomenon of self-contradiction that just keeps itself going so i we're now we're now done this section thankfully um i did not want to get into having to talk about all that stuff, because I know it's not... People don't like talking about it. It plays on a whole bunch of extremely transphobic tropes, but

it is a big part of this kind of phenomenon. So now we're going to the next part, which is incels, Gamergate, and anti-feminism. So I'm not going to focus a lot on the idea of repressed queerness here, right? The idea of like raging homophobes being secretly

gay, because I think that idea gets a little too much attention when we talk about this sort of thing. Now, don't get me wrong, this absolutely does happen. But I generally view sexuality, gender identity, and gender expression as much more fluid attributes, even among people who consider themselves cis and straight. So I don't like defaulting to this explainer of being like, oh, they're homophobic, that means they're secretly gay. I think that's kind of lazy and stupid. But when we're talking about the curious case of Nazi Catboys, most individuals involved not only identify as straight and cisgender, but are also very homophobic and very transphobic, despite their overly, like, queer behavior.

Because it is, like, queer in, like, the original sense of the word. And I think there's much more interesting ways to analyze this beyond the repressed gay trope. We've already talked about some femboys and femboy appreciators adopting reactionary and conservative social beliefs to fit into the larger culture around 4chan and parts of the online gaming community to find this sense of belonging and, you know, shared community among other people. But in order for the fascist femboy to be such a lasting meme and trope in and of itself, in my mind, there needs to be a bit of a stronger justification for the inherent contradictions beyond just finding community itself.

And we will talk about that when we come back from our break. Here's some ads that are hopefully about how you too can go on Amazon.com and buy a maid outfit. Welcome. I'm Danny Thrill. Won't you join me at the fire and dare enter Nocturnal Tales from the Shadows, presented by iHeart and Sonora. An anthology of modern-day horror stories inspired by the legends of Latin America. From ghastly encounters with shapeshifters to bone-chilling brushes with supernatural creatures. I know you.

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and what could be done to make things better. Listen to Better Offline on the iHeartRadio app, Apple Podcasts, wherever else you get your podcasts. Check out betteroffline.com. And we're back. Okay. We're going to talk about incels.

What am I... Oh, good. Yeah, yeah. It's... Incels or involuntarily celibate people, yeah. It's, uh... Incells or, like, involuntarily celibate people, whatever. I assume people who are listening to this know what incels are. But the incel movement gained traction in the mid-20-teens alongside Gamergate and the growing kind of anti-feminist movement.

And alongside a mass shooting. It's probably worth acknowledging. Of multiple mass shootings. Yeah, many. There was also the Toronto attack uh the incel ran over people in that van there's been multiple mass acts of violence tied to the incel idea and how they why a lot of us just call them horny isis i've never heard anyone call them that before well they are i mean admittedly also this is this is also the same

period where just isis is on twitter so they sure were oh those were the days it was a i would i would really want isis to chime in on the will smith debate no you don't like i would love that shit sucked no i'm waiting for the Taliban's take. No. No. No. No. The internet sucks enough. Is violence against comedians justified? The Taliban weighs in at six.

Yeah. You could get the Taliban arguing with ISIS-K. By God, it could be done. What a better world that would be. Especially if Trump was still on twitter and could mediate oh god that would have been so funny oh if trump had been around on twitter it's the only time i've missed him just like oh yeah yeah that would have been that would have been the good shit anyway um yeah incels there it's a pretty like ostensibly violent movement because it's it's all about making young men disenfranchised about their future right it's this fatalistic idea

that they were promised things and now those promises are no longer being kept by society so you are kind of doomed to live a pathetic life forever, right? So it is a very fatalist idea that really kind of encourages acts of violence. But the incel movement was gaining traction around this whole time, right beside Gamergate and the growing anti-feminist movement. And I think the key to putting this puzzle together is in the hatred and resentment of women itself as like a thing. I think this is actually a key part of why the femboy and femboy fascist thing kind of caught on. Most of the loose organizing of these movements were happening on 4chan and Reddit, right? Eventually Discord as well. These were the same places that were home to the anime posting femboy amateur porn community. And one of the most common viewpoints

at the time was that feminism is ruining women, right? It's disrupting the natural patriarchal order that many boys were taught existed with promises of girlfriends and wives that are like rightfully theirs as some kind of obligation. men being promised women, we're generally talking about like the way in which fiction kind of implicitly promises women as a, as a reward for heroics or just being good. Yeah. It's like, it's, it's specifically like a cultural idea that is the best example of this star

wars. Luke Skywalker becomes a hero and gets to, gets to kiss his sister, you know, which is the driving motivation of many incels. Instead, they too can one day kiss their sister.

Thank you, Robert, for that succinct analysis. I used to be a films reviewer, Garrison. So, like, if you're taught and raised thinking that something like this exists right like this this this this correct patriarchal order like it's like it's it's almost it's almost like this

like righteous truth um and you if you then discover that like that's kind of a lie and that like women are actually individuals with value not tied to the ownership by a man um some men have a very unhealthy, often volatile reaction to this realization or confrontation. So some people then decide to do mass shootings. Some people kill people. Some people just do, you know,

some people might just do, you know, like intimate partner violence, right? Say that they do get a partner at some point and it's not going the way they want and they just become abusive. There's a whole bunch of ways this type of thing can manifest. So faced with the work of not being a dick

and trying to combat this ingrained misogyny and then having to actually put effort into being attractive and desired a lot of men instead opt to either attack outwards or withdraw inwards. And sometimes a mix of both. So with the fascist femboy thing, a lot of this is withdrawing inwards, right?

A lot of these people are too introverted and too kind of cowardly to actually do a mass shooting, which is like, that's probably good. But then with them and drawing inwards, it kind of manifests in this different way. So when dealing with this almost misogynistic nihilism, a lot of dudes really lost hope in the prospect of a future romance with women. So instead of putting in effort to adjust their personality, adjust their behavior, change their patriarchal outlook, and improve their physical appearance, many guys instead will retreat to their online communities full of other guys facing similar issues, right? It's easier to live in front of a screen and not have to face other humans in person. These people don't really have much substantial experience in real life interacting with the opposite gender. So these, perhaps, you know, these so-called straight guys that were drawn to femboys also may have had just had like bad experiences with women they may have faced rejection and that rejection may have really

brought them down um and then they assume that they're always going to be rejected by women because of like a few bad experiences and the kind of guys who are on these chans forums and reddit online gaming they tend to be generally more socially outcast people who aren't necessarily super physically naturally like attractive and masculine right you have like people everyone almost everyone can be attractive you just have to like put in work if you if you just never do that like a lot of boys are never taught how to actually make themselves look good so they're just kind of like just like well that like attractive is, is a much like they, if you go on these incel forums,

they'll focus a lot on like, well, I have, you know, there's these folds in the creases of my eyes or like the way that my nose is built makes it impossible, physically impossible for a woman to be into me. And it's like, no,

like more than people, like there's all sorts of different preferences people have for physical things but overall like the number one thing you can do to be attractive is is to be a person that people like be confident and be like their life yeah like have like a good personality like learn how to do a variety of things and yeah just like have have a life i mean a lot of these other people are like oh that seems neat they think that they can achieve, you know, they think that women should flock to them

even if they put in like no effort at all, right? If they just do what they're doing, they feel like, why is this not working? Or the effort they put in is like, again, Elliot Rodgers, the perfect example of these kind of people,

like the effort that he put in was he like made his dad buy him a really nice car and he dressed in expensive clothing. And it's like, well, that's actually very few people are attracted to that. And yes, the people who are attracted solely to someone having a nice car and

clothing probably have really weird specific, like physical things. They're also only looking for. Yeah. But that's because you were like, like that, that's not making yourself attractive as opposed to, I don't know,

learning how to cook or, or learning, you know, a foreign language or, you know, being an emotionally available person who's not purely viewing relationships in a transactional nature where you're paying for sex by being friendly, you know? But, you know, what's easier than doing all that is just hating women or that is that's a much easier thing for these people to do so they often default to this so the internet's taught me one thing it's that it's quite easy to hate women so while these like alt-right hellholes like 4chan um and you know reddit online gaming right online gaming is full of misogyny. All these places, like, really hate, like, actual women. They still heavily fetishize femininity, right?

It's still viewed as this, like, glorious, like, thing that's put on a pedestal, even though they hate, like, actual women themselves. So feminine dudes can be femboys or cosplay anime to garner attention or social praise, you know, amidst some, you know, standard, you know, like people like, oh, you're faggots, you're disgusting comments. But you can, they can still like cosplay and dress up and post pictures without being totally shunned by their fellow edgy alt writers, because it's kind of funny. And some of them may actually find it cute even though even though they may not admit it uh femboys often do have they you know i generally think cute and effeminate features they can in for these people

a big part of the goal is to like trick the brain into thinking that you're just looking at a girl um that might just so happen to have a penis. So, therefore, when, like, viewing these pictures, these guys are also, like, getting a sense of familiarity with girl-like imagery, while thinking that, like, they also might have a shot with interacting with this individual because they don't have a vagina, so that makes interacting with them, like, easier,

because there's, like, more things to relate to, I guess. You would see a lot of like role playing and like role playing of sexting and like role playing of dating girls through this femboy framework uh just actually a really common occurrence as like and it was it was explained as like as like a sort of practice for imagining their future of dating women it was like it was like they're doing this to like practice interacting with women um so they're just gonna be role-playing dating femboys while being nazis but they're doing it so that it's like a practice so that they'll be better at dating women in the future it's like so that that's

that's actually a really common thing um or like yeah like sexting as as like yeah i'm just doing this for practice like i'm doing this so that i will be good at sexting in the future just doing it with these femboys on you know discord on 4chan whatever um because like all of like the whole femboy thing is still dealing with the patriarchal views of beauty right it's it's femininity as this sort of performance put on for the enjoyment of others. And because it's about that, like, appreciating femininity itself, it's seen as a lot safer than full-on homosexual attraction, right? Because it's allowed, if you can appreciate the femininity, then that's allowed to propagate, despite also kind of being degenerate, because the person

generally, femboys, usually self-idea is male, but because it's wrapped in this feminine package, it's allowed to be appreciated. And for the people that did eventually come to terms with their queerness, the 4chan femboy thing allowed them to safely dip their toes into exploring homosexuality, bisexuality, exploring gender bending, without abandoning the typical masculine-feminine roles that we're kind of raised to be comfortable with, right?

It's still in the regular masculine-feminine role sets, but it's approachable because it's allowed to be done through this, both this ironic joke, but then also it's still based off these patriarchal views of feminine beauty so it's it's it's it's a weird thing um it's it's that's a it's the other part of it that i i like to explain to people because you're like oh that is like trying to picture fascists fake dating each other online so that they'll be better at dating women in the future is just a very absurd idea it's i it's very i'm actually fine with this but like it makes like it makes sense like it like it like i understand it and you can like yeah i i i get it um and it did help a lot of people

eventually realize maybe i'm not the straightest uh stick in the shed or maybe i'm not the straightest stick in the shed or maybe I'm not the straightest stick in the fascists. Yeah, I mean, everyone needs a safe space to figure out what they are. And I guess that even includes fascists. Maybe because like not because I want fascists to be fascists, but because maybe some of them through this weird role-playing role will like get over some stuff and just like recognize that like oh maybe maybe i'm just like gay and i need to not be like work on myself and like i i'm maybe i've been barking up the wrong tree with all this nazi stuff yeah no because like amidst like Gamergate and the height of the incel era, these guys felt more comfortable exploring their burgeoning sexuality

in these male-dominated online spaces, right? It's easier to relate to other males when they're all like growing up, coming of age, dealing with these like feelings of like abandonment, loneliness, right? If they do this in these male spaces, they feel a lot safer to express themselves.

You know, whether or not they're full of fascists or like other people who are like very like reactionary because at least they can understand male desire um and that's and they can relate to that and interact with people who are you know they can interact easier with people with dicks while wrapped in this feminine package which is so much easier than the much more scary and much more elusive like females out there right it's it's that's kind of the framework that this was propagated through it's it's really interesting that it's like you have these people who like they're they're like they're they're transmisogyny is such that like they oh yes if they've escalated to a point where it circles back around yes it is it is so intense it is such a it's

if there's so much going on yeah yeah it's like it's like it becomes this like like i don't know it it becomes like the the the fact that it's like conceptually impossible for them for just like a woman to have a dick like that has like circled back around and just completely come to define how they have gender in such a way that someone who is like just is performing gender like as a woman, like to the extent that like they're trying to like they're trying to have people use anti-trans slurs against them. Yeah. Yeah, it's an interesting. a whole bunch of it's people exploring gender in this weird way while also like relying on heavily like misogynistic uh trans misogynistic homophobic kind of ideas but it's it's also it's like it's

very queer in this in like the way in the way they're going about it uh because it's a whole bunch of like self it's a whole bunch of like self-justification it's a it's a whole bunch of like stuff around like what they view as feminine what they view as masculine what what they view like being a woman means um it is it is it is uh it's it's a lot yeah because like as as like a more as like a genderqueer trans person i like i like look at them go through all this work i'm like wow i they could have bypassed a whole bunch of bullshit if they just were like less of a dick like if they're just less of if they weren't as horrible people they could have experienced these same things but again like they were they're in their own isolated communities they're they're dealing

with these same ingredients just from this weird backwards way so like it's it's obviously very transphobic in a lot of senses but a lot of a lot of these people eventually realized oh maybe i'm actually trans so it's this it's like i don't know it's obviously not great in a lot of ways but i don't know how to discuss it when saying like yes it's obviously not great for how like trans misogynistic it is but they're all working through some stuff yeah well you know one thing i will say about this is like yeah like if kids were actually allowed to be queer normally like this shit mostly would not happen like you you wouldn't get so many people who get locked in these like who are queer who get locked into these spaces but then also like the only way that they could express themselves in these like narrow isolated right-wing spaces is to like this shit or they're into the like just let people

express themselves normally and this this you can deny the fascist recruiting ground like yeah i mean it's it's interesting like it's like when all these people are looking at interacting with femboys i think a lot of a lot of the reason why they were able to play with these ingredients is that they did not experience the same like anxiety or like heightened stakes or negative or like negative connotations in their mind that they normally do when thinking about women because women are just so other so especially like if you can rationalize this attraction to femboys as simply a prelude to dating like quote-unquote like real women in whatever like fantasy cottagecore future they

might imagine then this idea is way more approachable garrison you're gonna need to explain cottagecore for the i am not i already i we have i we we are having an ad break i still in in brief it is this like return to tradition obsession you see among like chunks of the far right who are obsessed with the idea that if they if culture was the way it was in the 50s or in like the the 1850s they would live on they would live on a small farm with their wife and children who would be utterly submissive to them and everything would be perfect but like the only thing in between them and happiness is that they're not able to live in a in a in a small like farm with

a woman who they essentially own that's the gist i will say a lot of cottagecore cynics are also used by liberals and people on the left as well just as like an aesthetic thing we all want to live on a small farm in the woods yeah okay it makes it the cottage core that we're talking about is specifically the idea of i want to own a woman and and own my children and have like no no power capable of like stopping me from yeah whatever because like cottage corn tiktok is pretty sanitized and pretty much like more of an aesthetic thing less tied to those patriarchal kind of structures but anyway like everything we're talking about there's the version that's nazis and there's the version that's like boy

it sucks living in a four thousand dollar a a month apartment in New York City that I share with nine people. I sure would like to live on a cottage in the woods. Anyway, speaking of living in a cottage in these woods, if you buy these products, it'll get you closer to your cottage core lifestyle. So here, give it a listen. We are sponsored entirely by the concept of living in the woods. By Big Cottage. Yeah,, big cottage. Yes. The cottage industrial complex. Welcome. I'm Danny Thrill. Won't you join me at the fire and dare enter?

Nocturnal Tales from the Shadows, presented by iHeart and Sonora. Tales from the Shadows, presented by iHeart and Sonora. An anthology of modern-day horror stories inspired by the legends of Latin America. From ghastly encounters with shapeshifters to bone-chilling brushes with supernatural creatures. I know you. Chilling brushes with supernatural creatures. I know you. Take a trip and experience the horrors that have haunted Latin America since the beginning of time.

Listen to Nocturnal Tales from the Shadows. As part of My Cultura podcast network. Available on the iHeartRadio app, Apple Podcasts, or wherever you get your podcasts. On Thanksgiving Day, 1999, a five-year-old boy floated alone in the ocean. He had lost his mother trying to reach Florida from Cuba. He looked like a little angel. I mean, he looked so fresh. And his name, Elian Gonzalez, will make headlines everywhere. Elian Gonzalez.

Elian. Elian. Elian. Elian. Elian. Elian Gonzalez. At the heart of the story is a young boy and the question of who he belongs with. His father in Cuba. Mr. Gonzalez wanted to go home and he wanted to take his son

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And now we're talking about the point of the Nazi cat boy debate that everyone, I think, who is familiar with the topic knew was coming. No, no breakdown of Nazi cat boys and the Nazi cat boy phenomenon is complete without talking about Nick Fuentes and Catboy Cammy. Ugh, Nick Fuentes. Yeah, this is probably the part of the show that everyone's been waiting for. I don't know that most people would know to be waiting for this, but Nick Fuentes is broadly recognized by our audience. In short, if George Lincoln Rockwell

has the permanent body of a 17 year old boy um that would that's nick fuentes uh as many of you know nick fuentes is a white nationalist live streamer political activist that runs the fascist america first organization uh he's known for fostering a farther right conservative base than say ben shapiro or Turning Point USA and has pulled stunts like sending his fans called Groypers to Turning Point USA events to take over the Q&A sections and basically ask

Charlie Kirk why he isn't more fascist yeah so he runs this organization mostly known by doing his daily live streams he's been doing this since he's like 16 or 17 years old. Fucking nonsense. And it's kind of a running joke or widely acknowledged secret that Nick is kind of gay. Based on the way he talks about women and based on what he said about his own dating history

and snide comments from fellow homophobic Nazii friends has led a lot of people has led a lot of people to to this conclusion that nick may not be again the straightest stick in the fascists um nice thank you thank you you did good there garrison thank you proud of you proud of you for that one um and as a significant contributing factor to this like questioning of nick's sexuality um is due to his 2018 to 2020 cat boy arc um so so this this arc begins in january 2018 um finally giving our audience the important important news this is what you need to know people that month uh nick created a catboy themed channel in his own america first discord server hell yeah he did uh with nick with nick messaging post catboys in here please with weird with weird capitalizations throughout the throughout the thing so nick

cheered on along with other people posting pictures of various Catboys from pop culture and Catboy edits of Nick Fuentes himself. One America First server user posted Catboys are trad. Which means

like traditionalist in kind of the sense that like nazis are traditionalist that's that's what that person is saying he also posted which is very funny he also posted cat boys more like cath boys oh god so like again yeah so that's that's that's the that's the joke sorry i'm losing it i know this is so funny you're you're out of control right now this is it is so i've i've looked through this nobody's arguing this isn't very funny i've looked through this discord server multiple times for the for the screenshots of i know you have when you have the catboy channel and it always makes me happy it is it's one of the most funny things i've ever said

yeah i am i as as your friend i'm always warring between wanting you to be happy and worried that this is a cry for help but please continue eventually nick faced some pushback from inside the server for fostering degeneracy with others defending the Catboy channel by saying, brotherly love is Christian amazing, outstanding see, this is the good shit this is what we've been building towards as a civilization

right here, baby other people defended the catboy channel by saying women don't respect christianity your tribe's thottery always leaks out eventually good god yes uh that's that's that's the good stuff i got i got no comment. Just perfect. Thank you. But because Nick is fundamentally a coward, he did cave under pressure and deleted the Catboy channel. And we lost...

I think the America First movement today could be so different. This is why the cause of Americanism is doomed. This kind of cowardice. But as we will see see we'll cuck shit from nick oh absolutely this this whole this whole section's about nick fuentes being thoroughly cucked but as as we will see uh nick continued to use um the exact rhetoric i laid out in my

incels gamergate and anti-feminism section while defending what he calls attraction to traps um and we can of course we can apply this this defense broadly to cat boys and femme boys as nick does um i'm going to try to i'm going to try to play a video um about about nick fuentes. Are traps gay? Yeah, traps are gay. I've always maintained traps are gay. Of course. You have sex with a man, it's gay.

There's no getting around that. Now, that said, look, it's gay. I get it 100%. I agree. Now, that said, we're in times where women are not really meeting their obligations. So I'm not saying you're not. Look, if you have sex with a trap you're gay no doubt about that you should be ridiculed you should be made fun of but it's a little bit different than if you did it like 20 years ago that's all i'm saying if you in the 1960s in the 1960s were banging a trap i would say

what's wrong with you like i would say that now. I would say that now. I would say, well, you're some kind of sick freak. We have all these beautiful girls, and they're normal, you know, and you have sex with a trap. What's wrong with you? But in 2019, it's like, well, it's a different circumstance, different options. I'm still disavowed. I disavow.

It's condemned. It's gay. It's all that. But, you know, it's just different. I think everybody understands that. Oh, my God. But I'm still disavowed. It's all that. But, you know, it's just different. I think everybody understands that. Oh, my God. But I'm still this is out. I hate this human.

We just have to have a little nuance, all right? A little nuance? Different times, different circumstances. I maintain strong disavowal. Strong disavowal. Do not. Do not do that. It's gay.

It's immoral. You're going to hell. And it's weird and it's gross oh my god what's wrong with you what's wrong with you what the female the femoid race yeah i haven't heard that one in a minute pearson i'm upset that was horrible you're i haven't heard femoid since the davis arini days which i know at home if you home, if you missed Davis-Sarini, you missed the one brief moment where the far right was purely funny. That was bad. So, yes, being attracted to traps makes you gay, according to him. But not really, because the femoid race isn't carrying their burden like it once did back in the 60s it's like it's like they've back in back in back

in the old days of the 1960s it's like they've like almost gotten back to the like the the i mean i guess it probably still exists somewhere but like the the the the thing you got with fascist sometimes where they were like yeah like i fuck dudes but i'm a top so it's not gay it's like they're like so close to getting back there sure but they're so close and it's like oh it's not like roy cone kind of yeah yeah it's like i think i think like i think once we get like just slightly like maybe like 20 more years out from like the evangelical evangelicalism as i don't know i mean maybe maybe maybe it's research is gonna be like a big enough heyday thing but it's like i think i think if you had like 20 years with a right wasn't completely dominated by sort of evangelical homophobia like i think you would just get back there and well we oh we're already on that way Like, I think you would just get back there. Well, we're already on that way. Yeah.

But the Nick Fuentes Catboy saga does not stop here. No, no, no, no, no, no. I am. It is funny, maybe the wrong word, but fascinating that we are heading inevitably barreling towards this future where simultaneously homophobia is still a massive part of conservative politics and conservatives are gay as hell like yeah that's absolutely something where we are speeding towards like a drunken family on the back of a four-wheeler about to break all of their necks at once in a crash in the woods so nick Nick Fuentes loved tweeting about catboys. He did it a lot. He sure did. And for a while, Nick's catboy jokes and like memery was tolerated

under his banner of like irony poisoned reactionary comedy. But every ironic joke has its tipping point. That makes enough people wonder, is this actually ironic? And for Fuentes, that moment came when he livestreamed a 10-hour date with a fellow fascist livestreamer who went by the name Catboy Cammy. Now, first, let me explain who Catboy Cammy was at the time.

Then we'll get into the date. Thanks, Garrison. Glad we're doing this. Then we'll get into Nick Fuentes' brief alt-right cancellation. So, Tor Brooks, a.k.a. Catboy Cammy, formerly going under the username Lollysocks, so that's fun, is an Australian fascist livestreamer who first came to prominence by uploading clips of himself

harassing users on the popular video chatting site Omogly? Ogly? I never know how to say this one a mogul a mogli i if people don't know yeah i have no help for you here people people will know what i'm talking about it's this it's this randomized chatting app uh that does video chatting uh with the randomized users oh yeah i it's o-m-e-g-l-E I never know how to say it but he would upload himself, videos of him harassing people

via this chatting app in one of them he dresses up in blackface while brandishing guns he was trying to find black kids to taunt on this platform another one he dressed up as a policeman and kneels on an

effigy he made in likeness of George Floyd. He is pretty gross. He's a pretty horrible person. But for a long time, his bit was dressing up in anime costumes and dressing up as a

cat boy to then talk about neo-Nazi rhetoric while dressed as a cat boy and this this was his funny bit that he would do um at one point he was streaming like 24 hours a day uh for 10 days for like for the days and days on end um and he was earning thousands of followers in places like us and russia uh and he became the seventh highest earning streamer on d live and d live was the popular live streaming platform used by fascists. So in late 2019 was when Catboy Cammy

popped up in America, initially catching the attention of Nick Fuentes. Over the course of a few months, he kind of made friends with various people in the American far-right internet sphere, like Milo, Richard Spencer, Baked Alaska. But Nick Fuentes was his original kind of entry point into this. Nick saw his videos online and was interested in what he was doing.

Nick said that he had a good sense of humor and he's good-looking and demonstrated his repeatability that he's able to achieve viral moments and retain a streaming audience. So Nick became friends with him because he thought Catboy Cammy would be a growing internet presence and wanted to kind of move his type of pretty racist and horrible joke pranks and try to give them more of a platform to kind of frontline reactionary ideologies. more of a platform to kind of front-line reactionary ideologies.

So when Nick was getting familiar with Catboy Cammy, Cammy's online activities were mainly consisting of dressing up as an anime catboy to do random political debates or live streams or show up at anime conventions to harass people and doing various gags and pranks. One of the most

infamous incidents was when he was deep deep throating a massive horse cock dildo hooked up to a bucket of fake semen um good okay yeah so in december in december of 2019 great uh cat boy cammy flew from australia to go visit where did they get the horse semen garrison no i i the semen was fake it was it was oh oh okay gotcha got it was it was a massive horse cock dildo hooked up to a bucket of like fake semen right okay so just like cornstarch and i'm happy yeah if we want to go over recipes later i'm sure we can make it a whole episode but no i know how to make fake cum in uh december of 2019, Catboy Cammy flew from Australia to go visit Nick Fuentes.

And then proceeded to livestream the 10-hour totally straight hangout session with Catboy Cammy dressed up as a catboy the entire time. I mean, this does sound very straight to me, Garrison. They go to an arcade. They play games together. They get food and milkshakes. They go clothing shopping and try on matching outfits. All while laughing and giggling the entire

time. While driving and listening to extremely gay pop music, Catboy Cammy says to Nick that he reminds him of an ex. It's great. And by the end of the 10-hour stream, it's implied that they... They end the an ex it's great and by the end of the 10 hour stream it's implied that they it's it's the end of stream and it's implied that they share a room

uh for the night um sure i'm sure they did and it's 10 hours of pure uh horrible uh nazi flirting and it's pretty it's it's a thing it exists um but as So as news and details of the livestream started to circulate, a wave of infighting among the alt-right and the groopers spawned some amazing articles and headlines from neo-Nazi news sites. There's a headline from the Daily Stormer called The Groiper Revolution is Cancelled After canceled after nick fuentes reveals to be a cat boy and gay faggot which is pretty pretty astonishing yeah um that sounds that sounds about right okay other other great headlines we have uh fuentes disavows cat boy after pressure

from trad news if you. If you're sitting down and for your movement that you want to take over the government, typing down Fuentes disavows Catboy, perhaps you need to think about some things. We got another headline as Catboy Cammy versus Richard Spencer

because Richard Spencer tried to cancel Nick for this because Nick was getting more popular than him and we have another great headline Nick Fuentes' cat boy BFF is a mockery to his sexuality anyway

it's pretty good there's this great bit from one of these articles which I I'll quote. It starts off by saying, Is Nick Fuentes attracted to women? If you trusted the plan, you wouldn't ask such questions. I will say that I don't think the 10-hour livestream helps King Nick of the Gropers at the moment. moment. He had a good thing going by trying to promote a more Christian and normal-presenting nationalist movement, and was gaining a lot of traction until he ruined his image by associating it with this.

None of his various enemies did this to him either. He did it entirely to himself. So, yeah. But, like, obviously, the point of this is not to, like, not to, like, put Nick Fuentes's sexuality on blast

like i do do not care one way or the other um it's not a problem the problem isn't is that the problem isn't that nick may uh find catboys incredibly hot uh but the problem is that he's like a nazi and stuff and calls for the extermination of gay people while also doing all of this shit um and you know nick nick still maintains that he isn't gay and gay people should be exiled from society and he would never associate with homosexuals blah blah blah blah blah um all while doing all this incredibly straight behavior um uh for an update on catboy cammy uh later in 2020 catboy cammy made multiple appearances at trump rallies and various other political events uh going viral multiple times for screaming incredibly

racist anti-semitic and openly fascist rants um you probably saw footage of cat boy cammy in 2020 um he was just just he was just he was just dressed as like regular person. But there was a few clips of him at Trump rallies that went very, very viral. And Nick even disowned and disavowed Catboy Cammy for bad optics during these incredibly racist rants he would go on at Trump rallies. And then, of course, we have America First and Nick Fuentes then being, you know, an escalating part of the protests in D.C. leading to January 6th.

We have the person alleged to have stolen Nancy Pelosi's laptop being in those America First Discord servers and grooming young boys by dressing up as a cat girl um so all part of this all part of i we this will get talked about later in like news articles and stuff this has not been talked about some people already know about it but but yes um so it's all part of this same like nick fuentes cat boy sect of things of these people who call themselves trad cats who then do all this weird cat boy shit and yes the person who stole a Nazi police laptop who was like an open Nazi was grooming

like minors on Discord by dressing up as a cat girl by dressing up as a cat girl yeah so there's a whole bunch of this whole sphere of stuff you can find some incredibly dark corners but nowadays

in 2021 in the year of our lord 2021 femboys are way more of like generally acknowledged to be kind of like a leftist communist thing almost and I think the reason why this debate got so i think the reason why the

fascist like the fascist femboy debate got so kind of heightened in the past few years like ever since like tumblr banned porn uh there's been a migration of tumblr users onto twitter and a part of a part of this migration is not safe for work users and content um including femboys and people who fetishize femboys and even fetishize racist femboys. Moving on to Twitter, right? Twitter has become the new de facto Tumblr in a lot of senses. So the past few years, more normies have been

exposed to these types of off-the-cuff people. Then, of course, TikTok has sent femboys into the mainstream, because TikTok is also, it's not an image board, but it is a visual medium, right? Where you're posting small videos of yourselves. of a lot of cat boy and femboy content on tiktok there's even this horrible article from to from august to 2020 by vice called introducing femboys the most wholesome trend on tiktok as if femboys were invented in 2020 just my god mind-boggling article um

but yeah femboys are now much more if if you take the vice article as an example femboys are now fully mainstreamed right femboys used to be a small subculture but among gen z kind of culture as a whole now femboys are very popular they are they are kind of they are one of one of like one of like the hot new pokemons to collect um and i'm gonna garrison that's cultural appropriation from millennials you're not allowed to talk about pokemons i don't i don't care um we we own those now so just to talk about like scale of memes here i have some i've seen like google trends um on like nazi cat boys and Nazi Cat Boys and Nazi Fem Boys. And we see the biggest spike in Nazi Fem Boy

is January of 2021. Which makes sense. That's when I started writing this script, actually. So yeah, for Google Trends, we had a massive spike in January of 2021, and it's kind of been decreasing since then. But still,

it was like, you would see blips every once in a while. There was a small blip a massive spike in january 2021 and it's kind of been decreasing since then but still still like if it was a it was like you would see blips every once in a while like there's a small blip of nazi femboys in 2017 a small blip in 2018 and then a small blip at the start of the pandemic in march of 2020 because people are alone and isolated so they're doing this instead um and then yeah january of 2021 massive massive spike um same thing with a very similar to racist femboy it's basically the same exact trajectory uh we do get a pretty big spike in racist femboy in june of 2020 um and then another big spike of actually of november 2021 is the highest is the highest uh searches for racist femboy so it's still very much an ongoing

meme of like a thing of being like yeah femboys are pretty racist it's still completely completely ongoing oh thank god yeah it is don't worry this is not this is not a closed case and that's good garrison i was really worried for a second no people people and this like i think i think if you're not extremely online you probably even you, you might not know about this, but this is an actual discourse on Twitter. There will be a week where the only thing people argue about is whether femboys

are inherently racist. Obviously, they're not. It's awful. The last thing I'm going to mention here is in the is in the unicorn riot uh discord leaks when they leaked a whole bunch of information from lots of different fascist channels we have over a thousand mentions of cat boys inside the unicorn riot fascist discord

leaks garrison i have a question for you. Yes. Do you think God stays in heaven because he, too, lives in fear of what he's created here on Earth? So, if you want to have a fun time, you can go to discordleaks.unicornriot.ninja slash discord slash search, then put in Catboy. You don't need to do this.

It's not going to make you happier. Scroll through thousands of posts from these nazi channels it is not mentioning cat voice we got stuff from like sargon of a cod the we have the discord channel domestic terrorism planning discord we got a cat boy channel we of course have uh we of course have nick fuentes we We got whatever you would look for, you can find it here. And that is the Curious Case of Nazi Catboys. So there you go. Any questions, class?

Garrison, why did you do this to us? Because I thought it would be funny. It is. On the inside, it's funny. I'm happy. Well, that is... So yeah, now I hope you all have a better look into why the fascist femboy meme exists

and how people can have the cognitive dissonance in their own heads in terms of, you know, fetishizing feminine attributes while still hating women and then leading into the Nick Fuentes catboy craze that has swept the nation as a whole so just okay just

be queer and a leftist you don't have to do this shit you do not have to wrap your brain in fucking 17 layers of bullshit of like weird misogyny and trans misogyny you can just be gay and a leftist no and as as we as we showed you can you can you can be a leftist you can love stalin

and be a cat boy it's totally fine i think you can be anything and be a cat boy that's that's the the main message of the 21st century vladimir putin is going to come out as a cat boy when he releases his next unhinged rant in support of JK Rowling that's where the discourse is headed it's inevitable, it can't be stopped I wanted the meme of Nick Fuentes and Vladimir Putin holding hands being a cat boy that's where we're going

that does it for us today, everybody. If you want to follow the show, you can follow us on Twitter and Instagram at HappenHerePod and CoolZoneMedia. You can follow my cat boy posting at HungryBotai. Nya. Nya. Nya.

Ooh, ooh. It Could Happen Here is a production of Cool Zone Media. For more podcasts from Cool Zone Media, visit our website, coolzonemedia.com, or check us out on the iHeartRadio app, Apple Podcasts, or wherever you listen to podcasts. You can find sources for It Could Happen Here updated monthly at coolzonemedia.com. Thanks for listening. You should probably keep your lights on for Nocturnal Tales from the Shadow Broth. Thanks for listening. by the most terrifying legends and lords of Latin America. Listen to Nocturno on the iHeartRadio app,

Apple Podcasts, or wherever you get your podcasts. The 2025 iHeart Podcast Awards are coming. This is the chance to nominate your podcast for the industry's biggest award. Submit your podcast for nomination now at iHeart.com slash podcast awards. But hurry, submissions close on December 8th. Hey, you've been doing all that talking. It's time to get rewarded for it. Submit your podcast today at iHeart.com slash podcast awards. That's iHeart.com slash podcast awards. Welcome to Gracias Come Again, a podcast by Honey German,

where we get real and dive straight into todo lo actual y viral. We're talking musica, los premios, el chisme, and all things trending in my cultura. I'm bringing you all the latest happening in our entertainment world and some fun and impactful interviews with your favorite Latin artists, comedians, actors, and influencers.

Each week, we get deep and raw life stories, combos on the issues that matter to us, and it's all packed with gems, fun, straight-up comedia, and that's a song that only Nuestra Gente can sprinkle. Listen to Gracias Come Again on the iHeartRadio app, Apple Podcasts, or wherever you get your podcasts. Hi, I'm Ed Zitron, host of the Better Offline podcast, and we're kicking off our second season digging into tech's elite

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