It Could Happen Here - The CZM Guide to Touching Grass This Summer

Episode Date: May 31, 2024

James and Shereen discuss the benefits of touching grass, and how to get outside this summer.   Picking your route - keep it short at first. If you’re having fun, you can always loop back.   All Trails (www.alltrails.com )is a great app and has a wheelchair friendly filter. You can search for a local route that is the right length and pretty flat. Try to leave a review so that other trail users can get recent info on conditions. Avoid too much elevation gain – if you have a paper map this means avoiding crossing too many contours. If you can’t avoid elevation gain, opt for a shorter hike. Going down an be taxing as well, so make sure to keep some energy in reserve. Lots of modern smartphones have a built-in step counter. Use this to estimate your daily walking right now and shoot for a trail that isn’t more than that in length Try and set off early, it’s less hot and the animals are more active. If you’re in front country on groomed trails just bring some water and a snack and a well-charged phone. Any supportive comfy shoes are going to be great, don’t overthink it.  All trails will help you navigate and there will probably be a big sign at the trailhead advising of any specifics. For example, some parks might suggest bear spray or warn you about snakes, which can be a risk even in urban areas. You can check online as well to prepare for any specific requirements of being in a given area.   Meetup and REI (https://www.rei.com/events/a/camping-and-hiking-hiking?s_kwcid=PS_CAE_Google%7C416_&s_kwcid=PS_CAE_Google%7C21700000001699351_43700072373470246%7C58700007954053469%7CCAE_PB%7C71700000098564971&gad_source=1&gclsrc=ds)  are great places to meet people to hike with. REI offers WTF hiking events as well.   Equipment: Some hats I like - felted wool hat (I got mine for 15 bucks at one of those REI garage sales, don’t pay $60 for a hat https://tinyurl.com/ymfvc5e7) , legionnaire hat   Shirt I look for wicking, pockets, and a loose fit.  Here is my Backpacker story on shirts https://www.backpacker.com/gear/apparel/best-collared-shirts-hiking/   T-shirts I like include the Gore contest (https://www.gorewear.com/us/en-us/contest-20-tee-mens-101075?variant=9049) and this Patagonia Tropic Comfort hoodie (https://www.patagonia.com/product/mens-tropic-comfort-natural-sun-upf-hoody/41930.html?dwvar_41930_color=BUGR&cgid=mens-tops-long-sleeve)     Trousers – The main focus here is breathing well and having good flexibility to move as you move. One or two extra pockets is nice, as is a waist that doesn’t cut into you. I don’t prefer to wear a belt if I can avoid it when hiking. I have about five pairs of these Prana Stretch Zion trousers, which can often be found on sale. https://www.prana.com/p/stretch-zion-pant/2056941.html?dwvar_2056941_color=Mud   For climbing, buy stretchy jeans at a second-hand shop and cut them between the knee and the ankle.     Socks - Thin Merino socks are great, and you can wear them a long time before they get smelly. I tried the warranty, and both Feetures (https://feetures.com/ ) and darn tough(https://darntough.com/)  will replace your socks for free.   Wind layer  for chilly alpine starts, or runs that go into the night, or just when it is windy, I have been really enjoying the OR men’s shadow wind hoodie - I like the peaked hood. I see these marked down below $100 all the time, so don’t pay MSRP (https://www.outdoorresearch.com/products/mens-shadow-wind-hoodie-300899)   Other clothes Look at outdoor vitals for good value https://outdoorvitals.com/  . If it’s still chilly where you are you can’t beat their Vario hoodie (https://outdoorvitals.com/products/vario-jacket ). It was my only warm item for a few weeks in Colorado and Utah and it saved my ass.   You might also want a light waterproof but if it’s warm I don’t mind being wet   Boots vs shoes Most people will be more comfortable in shoes. If you don’t wear boots for work or casually, and you’re not carrying much weight, don’t go spending money on a hiking boot. Getting a stable shoe option gives you some of the benefits of the boot, without as much weight or rubbing. I lie to trail run, and so all the shoes I use are double-duty for hiking or trail running. I don’t like shoes with stiff, hard midsoles which rules a lot of “hiking” shoes out. My trail running shoe rotation right now is  Salomon Genesis https://tinyurl.com/yz5krn36 -I love how light these are, and they have side walls which make them very stable. They have enough stack to protect my feet, but not so much that I eat shit because I can’t feel the trail. Saucony Xodus ultra 2, https://www.saucony.com/en/xodus-ultra-2 . These have really nice foam in the midsole that I love for running. They’re also very stable, and well cushioned. I run in these all the time, and they’ve been pretty durable and very comfy. They are a little tall, so if you are really worried about turning an ankle they may not be the best. merrel agility peak (https://www.merrell.com/US/en/agility-peak-5/58229M.html?dwvar_58229M_color=J068117#cgid=men-footwear-trail-running&start=1 ) and long sky (https://www.merrell.com/US/en/mtl-long-sky-2/ ) .The Agility Peak is a solid, well-cushioned and well-ventilated trail shoe that works really well with gaiters. It’s great value and comes in cool colours. The Longsky is what I go to when I want a more precise shoe, I like to mess about off trail and these are great on rocky trails and very well-ventilated. Shereen also says these are “cute” Under heavy load, I do like boots. Salomon quest 4 (https://www.salomon.com/en-us/shop/product/quest-4-gore-tex.html#color=77341 ) is my go to, and I have stockpiled spare pairs in case they change it,  but I’ve enjoyed Vasque boots a lot in the past and they are often overlooked. It’s really important to try on any boots you want to buy. Chacos are the best sandals = https://www.chacos.com Backpack You’ll have to choose between frameless ultralight bags, internal frame bags (The majority of the market, and external frame bags) The lighter you get the less structure and organization you get.  A nice option that is pretty light, but still very comfy, is the radix from Mystery Ranch https://www.mysteryranch.com/radix-47-pack You can often find MR gear on sale, and their equipment lasts forever. I have taken other MR bags literally all over the world filled with camera and audio gear and they’re still looking great. I like packs that have a running vesttype front. I’m going to mention some running specific stuff in another episode but the camelbak octane 25 is a nice bag for a day hike https://www.camelbak.com/shop/deals/octane-25-70-oz-hydration-pack/CB-2205.html . I carried someone’s dog in it once. I like HydraPak reservoirs https://hydrapak.com/ Poles  make hiking easier on your knees. I have a pair of One Way poles that I have been using on and off trail recently and have yet to break, I normally massacre hiking poles so these get my seal of approval. Make sure they are sized appropriately for your height.  https://www.onewaysport.com/us_en/trekking-poles-highlights We will cover what goes in your pack in another episode but I do want to say don’t ever hike in the backcountry without a means of communication (which is not your phone if there’s not signal where you’re going), navigation, water, clothing appropriate for the next 24 hours where you are (which might mean packing for overnight lows), any meds you need that day, a small first aid kit, and some snacksSee omnystudio.com/listener for privacy information.

Hey guys, I'm Kate Max. You might know me from my popular online series, The Running Interview Show, where I run with celebrities, athletes, entrepreneurs, and more. After those runs, the conversations keep going. That's what my podcast, Post Run High, is all about. It's a chance to sit down with my guests and dive even deeper into their stories, their journeys, and the thoughts that arise once we've hit the pavement together. Listen to Post Run High on the iHeartRadio app, Apple Podcasts, or wherever you get your podcasts. Curious about queer sexuality, cruising, and

expanding your horizons? Hit play on the sex-positive and deeply entertaining podcast, Sniffy's Cruising Confessions. Join hosts Gabe Gonzalez and Chris Patterson Rosso as they explore queer sex, cruising, relationships, and culture in the new iHeart podcast, Sniffy's Cruising Confessions. Sniffy's Cruising Confessions will broaden minds and help you pursue your true goals. You can listen to Sniffy's Cruising Confessions, sponsored by Gilead, now on the iHeartRadio app or wherever you get your podcasts. New episodes every Thursday. Welcome to Gracias Come Again, a podcast by Honey German, where we get real and dive straight into todo lo actual y viral. We're talking

musica, los premios, el chisme, and all things trending in my cultura. I'm bringing you all the latest happening in our entertainment world and some fun and impactful interviews with your favorite Latin artists, comedians, actors, and influencers. Each week, we get deep and raw life stories, combos on the issues that matter to us,

and it's all packed with gems, fun, straight-up comedia, and that's a song that only nuestra gente can sprinkle. Listen to Gracias Come Again on the iHeartRadio app, Apple Podcasts, or wherever you get your podcasts. Callsone Media. Hi everyone, it's me, James, and I'm joined by Shireen today.

And in a rare instance, we are not discussing something terrible and sad. It seems like most of the things Shireen and I talk about. It's a fun episode today, isn't it, Shireen? Yeah, I'm in a good mood, which is crazy to say these days, but I'm happy to be here. I love to be the podcast dummy. I love to have things talked to me at, and I listen to. Yeah. Exactly. That's an intro. You've crushed it. No, we won't be taking that again let's go from there i don't want everyone

to think shireen is dummy shireen is very intelligent but we are making a podcast today about touching grass a thing that some people need to do it's become apparent i've been on the internet i think some people need to go outside yeah and even if you're not saying the stupidest shit imaginable on twitter i still think it's actually really good for you to go outside. Like I know this seems to be an episode I do every couple of months, but every single time I have to go and do something traumatic or scary or upsetting for work, I just book a few days afterwards to be by myself in the mountains and camp and sort of just not particularly like trying to do massive miles on a trail just being outside and i find it's the most healing thing for me it's how i process all the things that i have to see and hear about for work and i want you to do that too podcast listeners yeah and shereen i want shereen to do

it nature is healing it is and that makes sense that that's where you go it makes total sense yeah i think you have to be comfortable like you know if you're scared sleeping alone outside in a tent by yourself right yeah it's not going to be healing for you and i can see that i'm a white dude right and i go through the outdoors just like i go through everywhere else is a white dude you know that means that we have different experiences yes yes yeah we have that's why sociology is a thing anyway i want to talk today just about hiking or walking or rambling or hill walking or uh you know you could call it any of the things that you want just because i think it's probably the most accessible way to get outside for most people

right like i could talk about cycling it's been a lot of my life cycling it's expensive and confusing for people so you need equipment you know hiking you just need to get outside yeah exactly like you probably if you're able to move under your own power now then you can probably go for a walk I'm going to talk about equipment in the back half but I think if you're a lot of people seem to have a lot of questions about backpacking equipment so we'll cover that but yeah I think for most people just like setting the intention of going for a walk would be a massively beneficial thing so I want to encourage you to do that start of summer if you're in the northern

hemisphere if you're in the southern hemisphere it's the start of winter but you know you can still get out there and so to start off with I wanted to talk about finding a route finding a place picking a route to go hiking did you go go hiking very much? I actually do. I do like a hike. I like a hike. I've gone backpacking once and I really liked it. Where did you go backpacking? In Ojai. Oh, yeah.

Wow. Yeah, it was a cute little place, but it was so hot and I almost passed out. I should have done it a different day. We should have done it a different day. But I do love to hike. I like to be outside. I'm not like the most outdoorsy person i wish i knew how to make a fire or something or like i wish i was like a scout there's lots of shit that you don't want to be involved with in the scouting movement shireen oh really okay i take that back yeah

yeah i probably do some behind the bastard searches for the scouts okay i will do that i did not but what i mean is like i really like being outside and i have like the bare minimum of like equipment that i need for that kind of stuff i used to get really intimidated that i didn't know as much as i thought other people did but i don't think anyone knows as much as they think they do absolutely not yeah so that made me feel better yeah and like the outdoors are super humbling in that sense right like if you think you know it all you don't and at some point you'll get humbled or hurt so it's good to always have a bit of respect yeah for the outdoors and mother nature

i've seen some people who do not that it can end messily seen some people who learn to climb on youtube really get to grips with youtube not being the same as going outside i guess if i'm starting off if you're picking a route and I think probably the best way to do it is I discovered this recently lots of these modern smartphones have a step counter in them even if you don't have a fancy watch that counts your steps your phone does it for you I think that's a really good way of ascertaining like how far you walk in a regular day right I was thinking about like how far do most people walk regular day right I was thinking about like how far do most people walk I don't know I know a fun fact about me I would love to Shireen I purposely

have never ever opened that app or activated it to know how many steps I walk because I know myself and I know I would get like hyper fixated on it and I did not want to be confronted with the days that I just sit on my ass all day, you know? And so I have never, ever activated the app. That's great, Shreen. I'm proud of you for knowing that that wouldn't be good for you. I mean, I just know myself. It wouldn't be a good thing for me. I think it's a good thing for a lot of people to like, get them motivated and stuff. But sometimes it's also like a negative to being too focused on the numbers. Yeah, totally. Especially if you're someone who's had a relationship with exercise that wasn't healthy for you before. Yeah, I guess that's also part of it too. That was my experience.

I'm sorry. Why are you... It's not something sad. It just happened. Yeah. Okay. I'm glad that you have a good relationship with it now. Thanks.

But yeah, for people who... If that's not for you, that's yeah for people who you know if that's not for you that's not for you i'll say that but i just think it's a fun fact i don't know anyone else that has not like i'm terrified of the app i have not even opened it when you go to my health app it says welcome like it doesn't even you know what i mean like it's not yeah it thinks you've got a brand new phone i was going to suggest all trails because a it's got a very complete list of trails and b i noticed i had a wheelchair friendly which i thought was cool yeah i was looking for wheelchair accessible trails for someone the other day you can just filter on all trails like you can find the ones

that don't have steps or excessive rocks or something so like if that's something you're looking for i think that could be really handy um other little tips for picking your route if you try and set off early a you're gonna not deal with big crowds of people b animals are almost always more active at dawn and dusk i've been trail running a lot recently and i love to trail run right when the sun's coming up it just feels like it's nice when i see little animals i don't see as many snakes i like to see a snake the weather is probably like the best it's going to be that day yeah yeah exactly especially as it gets hotter right like uh if you're not necessarily doing a lot of exercise right now and then you go for you know even a short hike in the

middle of the day on a hot day you can put yourself in the box and like i think i've heard before that like the vast majority of trail rescues are like on front country trails well like five or ten miles i believe that yeah and people get confident i guess with that in mind if you're heading out on a little front country hike i would say some things to bring would be we'll go over like equipment boots stuff like that if you're like getting more into it but you're heading out on a little first hike if as long as you have a bag with some water and a phone and some shoes that you like to wear that are comfortable for you I think you'll be fine and I think they bring a snack snack is always a good thing to have it's nice to have a little trail snack look at the view and have a snack

yeah I love a good rectangular food but yeah if you don't have, that's like 4th of July last year, someone didn't bring water for their dog. And I remember the dog was in like severe distress. Yeah, no, it was one of the stupider things. But I can't think of a year here where I haven't been running or riding on trails and seen someone forget to bring water for their dog. That's terrible. I hate that. Yeah, don't do that. In LA, I see like sometimes sometimes there's communal stops for pets, but you can't count on those, you know?

Yeah, totally. I don't really count on any of those things working. Like water fountains. Don't be reliant upon a water fountain. Just take a little water bottle. You'll be so much happier. If you want to find people to hike with, I've had pretty good luck with the Meetup app.

I used to climb with some people from meetup here in san diego and like climbing's a fairly like high trust endeavor if someone's belaying you right i definitely met some people there who were very capable and we had a great time climbing outside meetup seems to be pretty good for that kind of stuff rei also often has free like they'll just take you out for a hike oh really? hiking sessions and I know they have like yeah

I like REI yeah they seem nice they have like femme ones that are women trans femme people can go and cis dudes can't go which is fine you know like

it's probably a nice thing for some people they feel a little safer and more comfortable there and they have ones that are just open for everyone I don't think there's a dudes only hike which is also fine so those are some places to meet people i think it's always nice to go with someone especially if you don't feel

confident or you don't feel like the outdoors are a place where you're like comfortable it's nice to go with even if it's someone who has the same degree of knowledge and background in it as you like they can help you rationalize your fears yeah when you're alone and like you get lost or you feel panic it's so much worse uh than if you had like a friend with you it only happened to me once and i was on shrooms so but i don't get into that but it was scary yeah then maybe you'd leave those at home if you're going out for your first hike maybe uh yeah no you don't need those if you're by yourself especially just take it from me please don't yeah go on a mountain and take too many things and then panic the whole way home.

I want to hear this story afterwards. It was my 30th birthday in 2020. So everything was closed. I tried to go and touch grass, James. And I had a spiral. You nearly touched it with your face as you fell down the mountain on your shroom trip. Yeah, your 30th birthday is an existential crisis, was crisis i suppose anyway sorry yeah i'm derailing yeah that's okay you know shereen do you know what will not make you have an existential crisis on top of the

mountain on your own in the middle of a pandemic please tell me it is the products and services that support this show unless we get a shroomsroom's ad. Ooh, I would love that. Sign me up. Shreem will read your Shroom's ad if you're in the industry. Please reach out. Her Twitter is at I write okay. Hey guys, I'm Kate Max. You might know me from my popular online series,

The Running Interview Show, where I run with celebrities, athletes, entrepreneurs, and more. After those runs, the conversations keep going. That's what my podcast, Post Run High, is all about. It's a chance to sit down with my guests and dive even deeper into their stories, their journeys, and the thoughts that arise

once we've hit the pavement together. You know that rush of endorphins you feel after a great workout? Well, that's when the real magic happens. So if you love hearing real, inspiring stories from the people you know, follow, and admire, join me every week for Post Run High. It's where we take the conversation beyond the run and get into the heart of it all. It's lighthearted, pretty crazy, and very fun. Listen to Post Run High on the iHeartRadio app, Apple Podcasts, or wherever you get your podcasts.

Hey, I'm Jack Peace Thomas, the host of a brand new Black Effect original series, Black Lit, the podcast for diving deep into the rich world of Black literature. I'm Jack Peace Thomas, and I'm inviting you to join me and a vibrant community of literary enthusiasts dedicated to protecting and celebrating our stories. Black Lit is for the page turners, for those who listen to audio books while commuting or running errands, for those who find themselves seeking solace, wisdom, and refuge between the chapters. From thought-provoking novels to powerful poetry, we'll explore the stories that shape our culture. Together, we'll dissect classics and contemporary works while uncovering the stories of the

brilliant writers behind them. Blacklit is here to amplify the voices of Black writers and to bring their words to life. Listen to Black Lit on the iHeartRadio app, Apple Podcasts, or wherever you get your podcasts. Hi, I'm Ed Zitron, host of the Better Offline podcast, and we're kicking off our second season digging into how tech's elite has turned Silicon Valley into a playground for billionaires. Valley into a playground for billionaires. From the chaotic world of generative AI to the destruction of Google search, better offline is your unvarnished and at times unhinged look at the underbelly of tech from an industry veteran with nothing to lose. This season I'm going to be joined by everyone from Nobel winning economists to leading journalists in the field and I'll be digging into why the products you love keep getting worse and naming and shaming those responsible. Don't get me wrong,

though. I love technology. I just hate the people in charge and want them to get back to building things that actually do things to help real people. I swear to God things can change if we're loud enough. So join me every week to understand what's happening in the tech industry and what could be done to make things better. Listen to Better Offline on the iHeartRadio app, Apple Podcasts, wherever else you get your podcasts. Check out betteroffline.com. All right, we're back. That was an advert for psilocybin. Maybe. It's still illegal. I don't think they are yet. In Oregon, they are.

Yeah. Well, there you go. All right. So I'm interested to know what questions you had before you decided to embark on your hiking lifestyle. Or is it something you've always done? I mean, my family and I, we never really did outdoorsy stuff. So something I did when I was like finishing high school, I started to be like, wow, I live in a place where I can go hiking. And I've never done this before. I live in a place where I can go hiking and I've never done this before. So it was a learning curve. But I started when I was like 17 and I got my entire family to go hiking with me for the first time.

Yeah. My mom and my sister. It was also when I was introducing my mom to like Zumba. That was the vibe back then. So I was trying to get active. But I think the most important things are, I mean, I'm a big skincare person. I think sun protection cannot be understated, especially if you are hiking in the middle of the day, like when the sun is at its highest point, you need sunscreen and a hat. There is like some protective clothing even that could come in handy.

But at the bare minimum, you need a good hat. Like not even a cap. I like those those fishermen looking hats. You got to get the hat yes like not even a cap i like those those fishermen looking hats you gotta get the whole circumference but a cap is fine a cap will do i think that's the most important little accessory for me it's a hat i have one of those like felted wool hats nice don't they get hot no not really the wool breathes pretty well like it was what i was out at the border yesterday helping out and it was like a 90 and i well. Like it was what, I was out at the border yesterday helping out and it was like a 90 and I was wearing it and it was fine.

And it's wool, so you can like dip in the water and it gets wet. I like one of those. Yeah, I actually have a little list of equipment or clothing stuff, which maybe I could go over. It seems like the vast majority of the questions I get, people like to DM me their questions, which is great, by the way.

I do like it when people ask me for like, how can I do this outside thing? There are no bad questions. No, there aren't. And like a lot of my career as a journalist, like earlier on was doing outdoor media. And like, yeah, the outdoor media has gone to complete shit.

And you know, you can't write anything that isn't advertorial now. Just actually like, just to, if you are looking to buy something and it is basically any product review you read on the internet understand that the vast majority of those will only be products that pay a certain percentage back to the website that refers you to them and so that inherently causes a bias against products don't do that an editor at a big men's magazine suggested that i write reviews about stuff that I'd never seen they weren't going to even send them to you well the company would have done but the editor

wanted the piece in like 15 minutes which like I know I used to do lots of reviews of bikes and stuff and I take it pretty seriously and because it's a lot of someone's money I look at those reviews all the time I have to weed out the ones I think are like sponsored but I really I really like reviews I go on reddit a lot to see what people think like their own experience reddit's a great place i've said that like universally but i do mean with respect to yeah it's a place where you can find more anecdotal experience with stuff versus i don't know amazon review yeah there are some whoppers on reddit who in any aspect who overestimate their insight into things

but you'll find anyone on the internet and so yeah i'm going to go through some different clothing items stuff i like and stuff that i think you can probably find cheap and hopefully that will help people kind of especially if you're thinking of backpacking it can be very intimidating and expensive i think i'm at the start of the pct almost once a week right helping out theping out at the border. That's one of the areas where people cross and I see people with thousands of dollars of gear that is all brand new. And I know it can be pretty intimidating, but like you don't have to start there. So there's always stuff you have at home. Maybe we'll do one on camping later in the summer. So yeah, get a hat. Any particular hat preferences, Shireen? I don't know the brands, honestly.

I don't, unless like someone recommended this brand, use this. Like my shoes are, I think we talked about this before. Solomon. No.

Yes. Is that a brand? Yeah. Yeah. It's a brand, Shireen. I was going to say Salmon.

And I was like, that's not it. That's not it, Shireen. Yeah. Yeah. I think you can find really cheap hats that are protective you

know i don't think you need a big brand for a hat as long as it like covers your head and your face yeah yeah totally i trail run all the time in a hat i got free like five years ago if anything i think it's better to have things you don't care about getting dirty or ruined you know because you're in nature i've noticed a lot of outdoor stuff really kind of moving towards streetwear there's this thing that i learned about recently called gorp core which is my nemesis okay i fucking detest i think it's cute okay this is going to be the uh the point of disagreement people like it when the hosts disagree on podcasts how do you define corp core it's people wearing hiking stuff to go around town which is fine i do that all the time i dress like a man in rei catalog but like why are you making

it fashion and then why have you stolen my brands who used to make reliable outdoor gear and now it costs three times as much. I agree with that assessment. I will say I don't think wearing hiking stuff is necessary but I do like to look like I'm going on a safari you know I like that character for me. Do you have like a pith helmet and like a no it's just more just like like shorts that are meant to be hiked in are longer usually. And I just think they look better than other shorts. And you can just wear that and like a button down shirt with some leaves on it. I look like I'm going on a safari, but I'm just walking around town.

I have this vision of 1920s Shireen, you know, like in a carriage going on a safari, seeing a lion. But yeah, Gorpcore is, Core is becoming more and more trendy. And I will say that you're right about things being more expensive because of it. Because it shouldn't be so expensive to be prepared to go on a hike. Yeah. So for most of the stuff I look for when I'm hiking, a lot of brands I go to are outdoor research, mountain hardware. I'll list some other stuff as we go through but

like Arcteryx and Patagonia seem to have like taken off in price and like decoupled from other stuff which literally uses the same materials right one of the things I would suggest if you're trying to buy outdoor gear is look at the materials used because you know you might find the same material used in another piece somewhere else and it might cost less right if it doesn't have that like like gorp core appeal if i just go through some stuff i like really quickly i like to wear button-up shirts when i hike wow i've written a whole piece about this it's like 2000 words so what's the reason a very shortened version of the reason they're nice they cover your neck a bit better they have buttons so you can vent your chest if you need to like you need to get some extra ventilation yeah you can roll up the sleeves you can roll down the sleeves

that they're also very practical when i met the president of the marshall islands i had one of my little hiking button-up shirts because i hadn't been expected to be formal and i put on a little tie that they gave me and i went i will say I have worn my button down hiking shirts out and about town because I think they look cute. So, oops. Yeah. No, I agree with you, Shreen.

I think they look cute. You can look cute in them. If you're looking to buy some shirts, Outdoor Research has one called the Astro Man, which is amazing. Like it feels like you're not wearing a shirt, which is always the goal with shirts. Kuyu, the hunting brand, has one called the Tiburonon which is very are these going to be listed somewhere yes like i did last time i will make a 2000 word show description with links in it for

people i also like those t-shirts like running shirts i don't really buy like hiking t-shirts i think often they're just cotton t-shirts with a picture of a river on but running shirts are nice gore wear so that the people who make gore tex also make their own clothing there's also really good value stuff actually it's worth looking at obviously like they're like in house so they have all gore tex waterproof stuff but they have a shirt called the contest which i was trail running this morning and it's a pretty nice shirt and gets hot here in san diego and like i don't want to be the guy running with his shirt off and so and also i'm british so like me and the sun are in a constant state of disagreement i'm not a skin wear person like shireen i didn't

believe in sunscreen you don't believe it wait you cannot say that to me no i do now i do now until my early 30s i thought that it was stopping my skin breathing and affecting my performance as a bike racer. I'm glad you've changed. I'm glad you've changed. Yeah, I never had skin on my nose. Wow. Like most of my life.

And you thought sunscreen was bad? When? You have to understand that everything about pro cycling is like lies that older people tell you. So like when I was coming up in cycling, it was like the very end of the like people who had trained in East Germany, like before the fall of the Berlin Wall, right? And they had all these bullshit things.

Like I had a team director who would make us eat fast animals because he thought that would turn us into fast animals. Like, yeah. That's a good one. No, I mean, even now there is a little subculture of like don't wear sunscreen the sun is good for you you should just like vitamin d but y'all know wear sunscreen reapply the sunscreen i should make a skincare episode i'm obsessed with this stuff and sunscreen is so important it is you get much better sunscreen outside the u.s

yeah i do i use korean sunscreen korean sunscreen is great okay great okay i get european sunscreen when i'm in the airport but also both the european sunscreens and asian sunscreens they're formulated so much differently than the ones in the u.s i feel like there are certain things that are different. I don't know. America's fucking up. It's because the active ingredients, the FDA. Okay, yeah. All right, sunscreen conspiracy diversion over.

Shireen, maybe we should take an advertising break here in case we land the Korean sunscreen advertising. Yeah, let's do it. I want to get shrooms and Korean sunscreen under my advertising belt. That would be great. That's my entire personality. and more. After those runs, the conversations keep going. That's what my podcast Post Run High is all about. It's a chance to sit down with my guests and dive even deeper into their stories, their journeys, and the thoughts that arise once we've hit the pavement together.

You know that rush of endorphins you feel after a great workout? Well, that's when the real magic happens. So if you love hearing real, inspiring stories from the people you know, follow, and admire, join me every week for Post Run High. It's where we take the conversation beyond the run and get into the heart of it all. It's lighthearted, pretty crazy, and very fun. Listen to Post Run High on the iHeartRadio app, Apple Podcasts, or wherever you get your podcasts. of Black Literature. I'm Jack Peace Thomas, and I'm inviting you to join me and a vibrant community of literary enthusiasts dedicated to protecting and celebrating our stories. Black Lit is for the page turners, for those who listen to audiobooks while commuting or running errands, for those who find themselves seeking solace, wisdom, and refuge between the

chapters. From thought-provoking novels to powerful poetry, we'll explore the stories that shape our Thank you. and to bring their nothing to lose. This season, I'm going to be joined by everyone from Nobel-winning economists to leading journalists in the field, and I'll be digging into why the products you love keep getting worse and naming and shaming those responsible. Don't get me wrong, though. I love technology. I just hate the people in charge and want them to get back to building things that actually do things to help real people. I swear to God things can change if we're loud enough. So join me every week to understand what's happening in the tech industry and what could be done to make things better.

Listen to Better Offline on the iHot Radio app, Apple Podcasts, wherever else you get your podcasts. Check out betteroffline.com. All right, we're back. We hope you enjoyed that advert for sunscreen. I want to talk about trousers, just in general, but also with reference to hiking. Sometimes I go out and I drop water for people so that they don't die in the desert. And that's something that I think is one of the coolest fucking things that you can do if you live near the border and everyone who does it is a massive legend in my opinion and even if you just come out once you could save someone's life and that's pretty fucking cool and i want you if you live near here to feel like you can do that if what's holding you back if you don't know what to wear or what backpack to get just like dm me on twitter but sometimes folks come

out in jeans i would not suggest hiking in jeans i would make jeans are great i love jeans i like to climb in jeans i know ian the producer of this show has some opinions about people who work out in jeans but i you haven't seen this yeah because ian doesn't tweet very much so i only found his twitter like six months ago one of his tweets was about why do people work out in jeans? Because it's cool, Ian. No, no, no, it's not. Because you have to climb in jeans because you have to remind people that you were climbing

before the fucking Alex Honnold film came out. And the way to do that is to be a dirtbag. And the way to do that is to go to a secondhand shop and buy the ladies jeans that are stretchy. The ones that are worn in. Because new jeans seem so uncomfortable to do that is to go to a second hand shop and buy the ladies jeans sort of stretchy ones that are worn in because like new jeans seem so uncomfortable to do anything in in my opinion no yeah you want the stretchy fabric jeans you know the ones it's okay like if they're normal jeans yeah they've got to be worn in and then you cut them off a couple of inches above the ankle so you can see your feet and you go climbing in those and a cut of t-shirt and you keep climbing grungy because

that's important you can't be letting all the have you seen this film free solo people change it so yeah oh gosh yeah that's one of the things that i will never back down someone asked you that run yeah they used the easiest route in my climbing gym for years was called hey dude have you seen this film it's called free solo which i thought was great wow yeah you can go climbing in jeans but don't go hiking in jeans they don't breathe very well they don't move very well they do chafe very well and if they get wet they suck so you can get good like nico or polyester or like even some with like spandex or lycra in so they stretch trousers pretty quickly i really like prana trousers they're like the yoga brand i'm wearing some right now they have a one called the stretch zion they have a men's model and a women's model i think

and they're really cheap they're always on sale i really like those for like a cheap go-to trouser for hiking also there's a brand called True Work who make like technical work clothes, which I like to wear if I'm like, when we were constructing shelters a lot in Hukumba before the border patrol tore them down, it's nice to have the little like extra pockets for your tools and for your pencil and your tape measure and stuff like that.

I wear those for hiking as well. And they're kind of dual purpose. Generally, if you have trousers that are lightweight, that breathe well and have good flexibility, you're good to go. The next thing I have here is socks. People really fuck up with socks. And it seems like socks and footwear

are areas where people really get themselves into trouble. Tried this out recently in the interest of journalism, actually. There are a couple of brands. The things that I do just on a whim. Darn Tough. You know Darn Tough socks, Shireen? No.

Okay. Now you do. They're a company in Vermont who make good socks. Wool socks. Okay. I do want, I need new hiking socks. Okay. Good.

I want a list. Yeah. Sit down. Okay. Two brands that I'd recommend are Features and Darn Tough. I like them because they fit well. They're wool. So wool still insulates when it's wet and it breathes well.

It doesn't burn, but it's not a big concern for most of us hiking here. Unless you're in a forest fire, I guess, but they'll find your feet. That'll be great. They also have lifetime warranties, which I think is really cool. For a sock? For socks. Yeah. That's cool.

Yeah. I, so I tested these out in the interest of journalism and features. And science. And science. Yeah. I did a little double blind test. And I contacted Features and Darn Tough and said, Hi, I've worn holes through the front of my socks.

And they said, No problem. Send them back. And I sent them back. And Features got me the socks. So what they do is they send you a coupon. And you go on their website and you order whatever socks you want. And it took me about a week. And I had new socks.

Darn Tough took a little bit longer, but I had new socks. So like if you're a person who doesn't want to spend a lot of money, you can spend your money once and have socks for life, which I thought was pretty cool. Yeah, that's awesome. Yeah, it's cool. I heard that they had a good warranty, but then I was like, you know what? Lots of brands say lots of bullshit, so let me test it.

And tested I did. It turned out to be true in in both cases I will say for the inexperienced person I think when you hear wool socks you're like okay I'll wear those when it's cold but no you have to wear them for like it's like temperature regulation right it's like yeah you want to let your foot breathe right so you don't get like blisters you get your feet doesn't swell you wear them any weather it's my point I feel like when I hear wool as someone that grew up in SoCal, I'm like, okay, it's going to be cold. No, it's not. Just put them on your feet and your shoe will be more comfy.

Also a comfortable shoe, essential. Yeah. I'm sure you're going to get there. But yeah, there are different thicknesses. You have wool socks for cold weather, but I also have wool socks for hot weather, right? But they're all wool, you know? They're all wool. Yeah, they're just thin. Actually, i wore a wool shirt when i did a couple of years ago there was a heat advisory so i figured that would be a good time to go

backpacking on the pct because no one else would be there yeah good idea it's great i had a wonderful time it was not molested by people you saw some snakes it was nice rescued a dude did you wear sunscreen yeah i did in that instance. And a hat, actually. Yeah. This was after my sunscreen awakening. Oh, great. I'm so glad. Don't go out without water. This dude was out looking for Kitchen Creek Falls, which if you're not familiar is a seasonal waterfall in East County, San Diego. And he was probably about three or four months late or early, depending on how you look at it. And so had gone out without water, which don't be

relying on that kind of stuff if it says water on the map that's cool still bring water especially if you're in the desert yeah let's talk about shoes um i think people want to go hiking in boots because that's what like you think of when you think of like rambling or hiking but like if you don't wear boots for work or habitually you know for just like cross-punk reasons then you might be really uncomfortable in boots like you're not used to hard things rubbing your ankles so it would not suggest and unless you're putting on load like I wear boots if I'm backpacking certainly if I'm like pack rafting or something where I've got like the raft and everything else and I'm going to do a

long hike in right so I've got all my camping stuff and the raft I'm going to wear boots or if I'm off trails when we drop water we're not going on trails right we're just sort of out and about climbing up mountains so I'll wear boots for that but for almost everyone especially if you're hiking on trails you're going to be just fine with shoes I think the big thing boots give you more stability right they stop your ankle from twisting that's what i wear them i have weak ankles yeah it's genetic i wear boots yeah you can work on their little ankle strength stuff you can do but uh that's not happening i'll just wear the strength of boots boots maximalist uh for me like um finding shoes that are stable that like you know like inherently stabilize my foot without clamping

my ankle has been really good i feel more stable in a boot though you don't think so yeah but then you're just sort of transferring to me like sometimes i like to have the like ability to move my ankles especially like i like to trail run as well if i'm to be honest i'm just going out i'm probably running at the minute and like overnight, it's really fun to just run until it gets dark and then sleep and then run again. That's a fun thing to do. Well, I'd be curious about your hiking shoe recommendations versus boot. So I got three. They're all like they have little kind of your foot like sitting in the insole, not on the insole, if that makes sense.

So it's like cupped a little bit and that keeps the most ability one is the salamander genesis it's the cheapest one they make in that line i think it's a really good shoe i try running them all the time too the other one is a sockany exodus ultra 2 which is really cool it has like a softer foam in the middle and then a stiffer foam around the outside of your heel i can talk about the shit for hours but uh it feels very comfortable and soft but also you're very stable and they're about to be phased out so you can find them really cheap why are they about to be phased out running shoe companies make a new shoe every year because they feel like they need to human foot has been the same i would argue for a while yeah it's not changing technology advances right like shoe foams have come out even in the past five or six years like if you haven't bought running shoes for

the past five or six years and you have the means to buy some more running shoes peber foams and things like that like these like high energy return foams make running a lot more pleasant but often it's just like a different color scheme or you know slightly different upper yeah and i think in that case you're just fine the other ones that merrill kind of had a reputation for making like old man hiking boots for a while but their trail running shoes are really great that's cool yeah my friend has merrill shoes and they're cute see they didn't used to be cute they used to be very like dad coded yeah i think they've turned a corner yeah they have i'm a big fan now i'm wearing some right

now actually i like to wear merrill the agility peak one it's good the long sky is one I like when I'm like trail running in burlier terrain if you're gonna buy boots or shoes please try them on or at least order them from a website that lets you send them back yeah I really think that's essential I messed up the first time I really invested in expensive boots. I got them after reading all these reviews and I hated them. I walked around my house and I was like, these are terrible. But I was able to return them to my REI that was local and I tried on the other shoe I wanted to try on that they had. And that was great. I walked around REI and I was like, this is the one. You have to try them on. Yeah. Take the socks you're going to wear when you're hiking as well.

Don't just take socks that don't feel the same. And then, yeah, walk around. And the next thing I had was backpacks, actually. And I'm going to say the same thing. Like, the most important thing for a backpack is that it fits your body and that it is fitted to your body. REI will do that for free, which is great. Lots of other outdoor shops like San Diego used

to have Adventure 16 decided it closed RIP but anyone who's trying to sell you a backpack in person and won't fit it to you is probably someone you shouldn't buy a backpack from so if you google around uh enough and you have enough google for you will find a video of me teaching you how to wear your backpack someone will find that james yes i know and yeah it's uh i've got a broken arm in that video which you can't tell i haven't sought medical attention at the time of the video i got hit by a car and then i knew i had to do the video the next day so i went to do the video it's your life dude i have to make money it was broke i will say that as someone who isn't the most knowledgeable about this stuff,

but I like it and I would consider myself like a, I don't know, intermediate, not advanced. Yeah. But going to REI and getting a backpack fitted, that's what I did. Don't shy away from asking questions. They're there to help. And I think as soon as you get over that, you'll be fine. I feel like as soon as you just like accept that these people are there to help you and not to shame you hopefully that's great and like yeah they're trying to sell you things but i don't know just go in with a smart head on your shoulders

yeah expect people to be well-meaning like we all just want you to be happy and enjoying the outdoors with us it's not a competition with With backpacks, real quickly, you've got basically three distinct types. You have ultralight backpacks, which don't have a frame at all. Imagine a bucket made of fabric with two straps attached to your back. I wouldn't suggest starting there. You have external frame. That's where the frame is external and the bag is clipped onto the frame. And you have internal frame where the frame is integral to the bag, right? most of the bags you're probably going to look at their internal frame to start with

the heavier the bag gets the more structure you get and the more little pockets and organization you get those can seem super tempting especially when you're looking online and you're seeing like different specs and trying to compare them if you're a person who has access to ziploc bags you don't need all the pockets right like yeah what i do every single time i go backpacking so i put a bin bag in it that waterproofs it right yeah it's cool if your bag says it's waterproof i don't trust it to be waterproof and it doesn't need to be because i'm going to put a bin bag in there anyway and i put everything in stuff sacks or ziplock bags in there likewise you'll find lots of bags with like 75 ways to access the main pocket most of the time you're going to have your

stuff inside a waterproof bag anyway it's not such a big deal i think the most important aspect of a bag that you should look at first is just the weight yeah you can fuck yourself up with a heavy bag although that said like one of the bags that i use the most for water drop stuff is a mystery ranch blackjack it's a military bag. It's heavy. It's like, I think it's 5.7 pounds for the bag. But I'm not trying to be light. What I'm trying to do is fill it with gallons of water and then haul them up and down about it. So I might as well make the bag comfortable because it's a negligible percentage of the overall weight of shit I'm carrying. That's fair. There's a bag called the Radix, the Mystery Ranch make

that I've been using a lot recently. And it's made of like very lightweight material, like an ultralight bag. But I like their frames. They have like a yoke that kind of wraps around your body as opposed to a frame that sits on top of your body.

And that works really well for me. Their warranty is good. Their products are good. I've used their bags in like every continent apart from the Antarctic and never had anything break. Especially like if you're a person who gets anxious about your shit breaking then you can't go wrong with them they also have incredible discount if you want one but you think it's too expensive take your time and you'll find them way cheaper that's a

good bag to get i like gregory bags osprey are a good brand. Osprey bags can tend to be like... That's the one I have. My backpacking backpack is an Osprey. Yeah. They're very comfortable. They have a lot going on sometimes. And they have that mesh. Do you have the one with the mesh?

Like, yeah. They are very comfortable. I have an Osprey bag that I really like. I took it packrafting in Alaska and it was great. It was a bummer. If you're just going on a day hike, you don't need very much backpack, right? 20 liters or whatever is fine.

Even 10. I really like those running vest style backpacks where you have like going on a day hike, you don't need very much backpack, right? 20 liters or whatever is fine, even 10. I really like those running vest style backpacks where you have like pockets on the front. Have you seen those? You don't have to take it off. No, I haven't seen that. Oh, it's cool. Yeah. Do I have one?

Send you a picture later, Shereen. Great, thanks. Yeah, I mean, you're looking forward to it. When I run, I like to have a little water flask down there and then... That makes sense. Yeah. And then I was like, why do I have this on my normal backpack? why am I having to like reach around for my snacks I'm all about efficiency so running vest style backpacks are cool camelback has some good ones everyone called the octane

that I use a lot and then when you're buying a backpack you'll want to buy a little water reservoir to go in it one of the reasons you're going to waterproof everything in your bag is because every single water reservoir that you put in your backpack will break at some point and when it does it will send its contents into your bag and it will be a bad day unless you've waterproofed everything this will happen to you especially if you like sit down and lean back and then you crush it so that's where you're going to waterproof everything but i think hydropack make the best ones i really like their insulated ones. Even if you don't get an insulated bladder,

get an insulated sucky tube. That's the word, Shireen. Thank you. Last podcast of the day here, guys. Yeah, get an insulated straw because when it's really cold, otherwise your straw will freeze. It's like a small amount of water

right wait it freezes more quickly i never thought of that i've only backpacked and hiked in really hot weather yeah when it's below freezing like even like i was out on palomar in october after i returned from kurdistan it said it was you know below freezing top of the mountain and you know my water froze you can blow your water back out again but you're just going to forget to do that realistically and then yeah the last thing i had was hiking poles hiking poles great i've never had a pole you never had a pole you ever had a stick i mean if i find ones and i guess i don't hike on the things i might need a pole for i guess i don't know yeah they're great if you're someone who's who maybe has some injuries Or you're worried about your knees Just because they hurt

In general life They're a great way to take the strain off your knees I'm trying to convince my mom to get a pair of poles Because I think she would really benefit from them Because she wants to go on all these hikes And just needs help So there's no shame in getting a pole or two I will

Donate your mom Some poles, Shireen It's i will donate your mom some poles shireen oh that's my gift it's my gift to your mom shireen's mom helped me translate for some migrants the other day my mom's the best big fan i'll send your mom some poles shireen don't be afraid of using them don't be thinking that like anyone's going to judge you for using them like if that makes you feel more stable and comfortable go for it don't buy the ones that telescope you know what i mean by telescoping like yeah yeah because they collapse and uh i remember i was up in the sierras six or seven years ago now and it was fucking snowier than i'd expected then my stupid hiking pole

collapsed into itself and like it just just made the day like less fun yeah i could imagine that but otherwise a stick is great right find a nice stick find one with a nice notch for your thumb get it get from a nice type of wood i used to love making sticks when i was little you can get a stick topper you can order them online you know it's got like a head of a dog or a pheasant or a deer it's like a cane it's like a fancy little cane yeah we had crooks you know a crook? No. For like when you're catching your sheep. James, why?

You mean like the hook looking thing? Yes. Yeah, it's called a crook. I did not know that. I know what you're talking. Now that you mentioned sheep, I know what that is, but I've never known the name. Yeah, because you're sheep eggs. But yeah, it's called a crook uh we said

those are great for walking i can see that yeah yeah so we used to use those a lot when i was a kid but yeah having one is great and i think especially like if you're nervous about falling you know you're a person who worries about their knees if you're picking your first route keep it pretty flat if you're going up and down a lot of elevation and you're worried about how that's going to feel the poles are a good way to mitigate so i'm worried that i'm going to fall on my knees but yeah don't feel afraid of using that stuff oh i forgot to say one thing in my shoes thing charcos are the best sandals fuck all other sandals that's what i have to say about that you know when you're cool because you have the z from the charcos burned

onto your feet well unless you practice foot skincare, which I've not upgraded to that level yet. I was thinking about getting those. I remember I was deciding between those and something else and I got the something else, but now I have to go back and get those. A couple of years ago, I rafted with some people who listen to the podcast.

They invited me and I went and we did a week on the Colorado River. Oh, that's so cool. You're so trusting. A little IRLirl i like to go outside it was cool i like people um so some of them reached out and i said yeah let's go for a rafting trip so we went on a rafting trip on the colorado river and i wore my chacos the whole time wore sun cream none of the time feet were just roasted just red but with the little zed from

the channel for the whole summer anyways they are very comfortable sandals one of my friends another podcast listener is hugging the pct and his chacos right now from mexico to canada so yeah i hope you're doing well they know who they are surprisingly enough i've gone long talking about outdoor things but no i'm glad you took the time to make this little list i I realized I don't have to be as big of a dummy as I thought. I thought I was going to come in here and be a huge dummy. I know more than I think I do, you know, and I know what to do outside most of the time. Yeah, Shireen, yes, you do. Thank you for listening to me talking about going outside.

If you have any questions, you can DM me me on twitter that's the only way i communicate with anyone now don't have a dm me and i'll send you my email but really like i just want people to feel that the outdoors is for them and uh feel safe and feel comfortable and feel like they know all the things they need to know and to not buy stuff because someone's getting three percent back on it, even though they've never touched it in their whole lives. Like, and also like, I know that we're all fucking poor and spending your money is hard.

So I've tried to suggest stuff that's not crazy expensive or that you can find on sale. But if you have questions, oh, one more thing. There's a company called Outdoor Vitals, which has a subscription. You can be a member and then you can get a lot of their stuff cheap. So backpacking, it's a good company and they make some good stuff and they do some good stuff for the outdoors as well but yeah if you have questions you can message me we will do one about what to put in

your bag when you go backpacking eventually yeah go outside send us your photos of you going outside if they're not weird we would like that it could happen here as a production of cool zone media for more podcasts from cool zone media visit our website coolzonemedia.com, or check us out on the iHeart Radio app, Apple Podcasts, or wherever you listen to podcasts. You can find sources for It Could Happen Here updated monthly at coolzonemedia.com slash sources. Thanks for listening. Hey guys, I'm Kate Max. You might know me from my popular online series, The Running Interview Show, where I run with celebrities, athletes, entrepreneurs, and more. After those runs, the conversations keep going. That's what my podcast, Post Run High, is all about. It's a

chance to sit down with my guests and dive even deeper into their stories, their journeys, and the thoughts that arise once we've hit the pavement together. Listen to Post Run High on the iHeartRadio app, Apple Podcasts, or wherever you get your podcasts. Curious about queer sexuality, cruising, and expanding your horizons? Hit play on the sex-positive and deeply entertaining podcast Sniffy's Cruising Confessions. Join hosts Gabe Gonzalez and Chris Patterson Rosso as they explore queer sex, cruising, relationships, and culture in the new iHeart podcast, Sniffy's Cruising Confessions. Sniffy's Cruising Confessions will broaden minds and help you pursue your true goals. You can listen to Sniffy's Cruising Confessions, sponsored by Gilead. of Google search. Better Offline is your unvarnished and at times unhinged look at the underbelly of tech brought to you by an industry veteran

with nothing to lose. Listen to Better Offline on the iHeartRadio app, Apple Podcasts, wherever else you get your podcasts from.