It Could Happen Here - The History of the General Strike: Shanghai 1925, A Chinese Minneapolis

Episode Date: February 19, 2026

Mia discusses the history of general strikes starting with another strike over armed occupiers killing unarmed protesters: the Shanghai general strike of 1925. Sources: Shanghai on Strike: The Politics of Chinese Labor: https://libcom.org/article/shanghai-strike-politics-chinese-laborFrom War to Nationalism - China’s Turning Point, 1924-1925See omnystudio.com/listener for privacy information.

This is an I-Heart podcast. Guaranteed Human. Over the last couple years, didn't we learn that the folding chair was invented by black people? Because of what happened in Alabama? This Black History Month, the podcast, Selective Ignorance with Mandy B, unpacked black history and culture with comedy, clarity, and conversations that shake the status quo. The Crown Act in New York was signed in July of 2019, and that is a bill that was passed to prohibit discrimination based on hairstyles associated with race. To hear this and more.

Listen to Selective Ignorance with Mandy B from the Black Effect Podcast Network on the IHeartRadio app, Apple Podcasts, or wherever you get your podcast. 1969, Malcolm and Martin are gone. America is in crisis. And at Morehouse College, the students make their move. These students, including a young Samuel L. Jackson,

locked up the members of the Board of Trustees, including Martin Luther King's Senior. It's the true story of protests and rebellion in black American history that you'll never forget. I'm Hans Charles. I'm in the Mnalec Lamouba. Listen to the A-building on the I-Heart Radio app, Apple Podcasts, or wherever you get your podcasts.

I'm Bowen-Yin. And I'm Matt Rogers. During this season of the Two Guys Five Rings podcast, in the lead-up to the Milan-Cortina-26 Winter Olympic Games, we've been joined by some of our friends. Hi, Boone, hi, Matt, hi, hey, Elmo. Hey, Matt, hey, Bowen. Hi, hi, Cookie.

Hi. Now, the Winter Olympic Games are underway, and we are in Italy to give you experience. experiences from our hearts to your ears. Listen to two guys, five rings on the Iheart radio app, Apple Podcasts, or wherever you get your podcast. You know Roll Doll. He thought up Willie Wonka and the BFG. But did you know he was a spy?

In the new podcast, The Secret World of Roll Doll, I'll tell you that story, and much, much more. What? You probably won't believe it either. Was this before he wrote his stories? It must have been. Okay, I don't think that's true. I'm telling you. The guy was a spy.

Listen to the secret world of Roll Doll on the IHeart Radio app, Apple Podcasts, or wherever you get your podcasts. AllZone Media. Welcome to It Could Happen here, a podcast about things falling apart, and how to put them back together again. I'm your host, Mia Wong. Over the course of about a month, the general strike went from a pipe dream that even,

the most optimistic organizers didn't think could happen until potentially maybe 2028 to something that happened here. We saw a one-day general strike in Minneapolis, and everything is different now. People from SEIU are calling for general strikes. It's become a demand, it's become a tactic, and it's become a term, That is on the tongues of people who never would dare speak of it before. And on this show, we are going to talk about the history of General Strikes, how they happen, how they're organized, how they succeed, how they fail, and what the contemporary history of the tactic looks like. Now, when I originally planned this first episode, I was going to do a overview of a overview,

view of about a hundred years of history of general strikes to try to get us roughly to the modern era. And then as soon as I started, well, not as soon as I started writing that, deeper into the process than it should have been, I realized there was absolutely no way I could cover 100 years of general strikes in one episode. What I kept coming back to was one specific strike, a strike that most of you have never heard of. So the general strike in Shanghai in 1925, what became known as the May 30th movement. I want to begin here because intellectually,

most of you have never heard of it. Emotionally, you already know everything about it. Now, I have written about this strike before. It was, in fact, the first thing I ever wrote about for Behind the Bastards, an episode about a Chinese warlord named Zhang Zhong Chong. But about a quarter of those episodes were about what became the May the 30th movement.

And so I am going to recap a little bit of what I talked about in that episode and talk about so different stuff. And yeah, we're going to get you introduced to how you get a general strike and, you know, how the course of these things can go with a strike that will look shockingly familiar to anyone who has lived through this year, which is to say this is a strike that starts when an occupying army has taken over a city and starts fucking killing

people. So a little bit of background about what is going on in China in the 1920s. 1925 is in the middle of what is called the warlord period in China, which is a period where go listen to the bastards episodes. The short version of this is that after the 1911 revolution, that had overthrown the Chinese imperial system, China became split between a bunch of warlords composed out of different parts of the armies. Now, also in this period, large parts of China are all over. under the direct control of foreign occupiers.

These are countries like Japan, the UK, France, Russia. I think there's an American concession sort of in there somewhere. And these countries just own parts of China. And for our purposes, they also own parts of Shanghai. And these things, both the territories they occupy, and sometimes literally, you know, the occupation is they own a rail line. when I say they own a rail line, it's not just a company

or even the country owning the rail line, they physically own the territory. So it's theirs. Like this rail line belongs to Japan. So the land around the rail line belongs to Japan and they can enforce their laws in it.

And this is how it works also in Shanghai. Inside of these concessions, there is an armed occupation. And in Shanghai, there are British or friends or Japanese police and military personnel there who do law enforcement and will just kill you.

Where, my dear listener, have we seen this before I leave that as an exercise to the reader? Listener? Yes, I guess you're the listener. Now, this state of affairs came to a head in May 1925, when a Japanese foreman was meeting with Chinese union organizers and what was basically supposed to be a contract negotiation session, There's a team of Japanese foreman and business people there and a group of Chinese union organizers. And the details of what exactly happened are very, very sketchy. But a brawl broke out, and the conclusion of the brawl was that a Japanese foreman killed a fairly well-known local union leader.

Now, the police had also arrested several of the workers who had been in the negotiations. and continued to hold them even after a massive demonstration for the Chinese union organizer who had been killed's funeral. So on May the 30th, protesters gathered outside of a police station run by the British to demand the release of their comrades. This set off a climactic confrontation that changed the face of Chinese history forever. The British open fire on the crowd killed 10 people and wounded 50 more.

Now, half a decade ago, when I first wrote about this for Cool Zone, I read a quote from the great Chinese author and anarchist Ba Jin. This is quoted from author Waldron's book from Warden Nationalism, China's turning point 1924, 1925. And I want to return to it now for reasons that I think will immediately become apparent. This is about a student who would, witnessed the killings. At the entrance to Yunnan Road, he saw the child who had been killed a short while before. He thought, about half an hour ago, the crowd was marching peacefully towards the police station to ask the police to set free students who had been unjustly arrested.

They thought the police were human beings endowed with reason and human sympathy, that human blood flowed in their veins. They thought that uniforms and weapons could not have to be. destroyed their human nature. But reality proved they were bloodthirsty beasts. On the most crowded street of the city they deliberately slaughtered unarmed people. For this, there was no precedent in Chinese history.

The imperialist oppression that had endured for so many years ached like a deep wound in his heart. He struggled inwardly. He felt the time for patience was over. He felt he wanted to spill his blood, to sacrifice his young life that he might show that not all among his people

were lambs, that allowed themselves to be led without resistance to slaughter. He looked again at the corpse of the murdered child. His eyes shone with fire. His whole body began to burn as though on fire. His heart

be violently. You, dear listener, understand this. When I first first quoted this passage in 2021. It was about George Floyd. Now, it's about Renee Good

and Alex Pretty. You understand the horror, the suffering, the rage, the overwhelming fire to do something. You understand that they are like us. And you understand

why they fought. Canadian women are looking for more. More to themselves, their businesses, their elected leaders, and the world around them. And that's why we're thrilled to introduce the Honest Talk podcast. I'm Jennifer Stewart. And I'm Catherine Clark. And in this podcast, we interview Canada's most inspiring women. Entrepreneurs, artists, athletes, politicians, and newsmakers, all at different stages of their journey.

So if you're looking to connect, then we hope you'll join us. Listen to the Honest Talk podcast on IHeart Radio or wherever you listen to your podcasts. Welcome to the A building. I'm Hans Charles. I'm Inalick Lamouba. It's 1969. Malcolm X and Martin Luther King Jr. Have both been assassinated.

And Black America was out of breaking point. Writing and protests broke out on an unprecedented scale. In Atlanta, Georgia, at Martin's Al-Mermata, Morehouse College, the students had their own protest. It featured two prominent figures in black history, Martin Luther King's senior and a young student, Samuel L. To be in what we really thought was a revolution. I mean, people would die. 1968, the murder of Dr. King, which traumatized everyone. The FBI had a role in the murder of a Black Panther leader in Chicago.

This story is about protest. It echoes in today's world far more than it should, and it will blow your mind. Listen to the A-building on the I-Heart Radio app, Apple Podcasts, or wherever you're you get your podcasts. China's Ministry of State Security is one of the most mysterious and powerful spy agencies in the world. But in 2017, the FBI got inside. This is Special Agent Regal, Special Agent Bradley Hall. This MSS officer has no idea the U.S. government is on to him.

But the FBI has his chats, texts, emails, even his personal diary. Hear how they got it on the Sixth Bureau podcast. I now have several terabytes of an MSS officer, no doubt, no question, of his life. And that's the unicorn. No one had ever seen anything like that. It was unbelievable. This is a story of the inner workings of the MSS and how one man's ambition and mistakes opened its fault of secrets. Listen to the Sixth Bureau on the IHeart Radio app, Apple Podcasts, or wherever you get your podcasts.

I'm Bowen-Yang. And I'm Matt Rogers. During this season of the Two Guys Five Rings podcast, in the lead-up to the Milan-Cortina-2026 Winter Olympic Games, we've been joined by some of our friends. Hi, Boen, hi, Matt, hi, hello. Hey, Matt, hey, Bowen. Hi, Cookie.

Hi. Now, the Winter Olympic Games are underway, and we are in Italy to give you experiences from our hearts to your ears. Listen to Two Guys Five Rings on the I-Heart Radio app, Apple Podcasts, or wherever you get your podcasts. What followed was the largest to that point, General Strike, in the history of Shanghai. 200,000 people walked off the job

almost immediately in the first wave of strikes. The strikes spread to almost every major city in China, in some form or another. Massive student protests began. Tire cities rose as one. 250,000 people went on strike in Hong Kong. Students, workers, business owners, and gangsters stood precariously as one to drive out the armed men occupying their cities.

In an instant, the world changed. Things that were impossible the day before suddenly began commonplace. People flooded the streets. They were attacked by cops. They fought back. And for three months, they held on. Now, this was a much rougher time than even contemporary 2026 America. We are in a little bit going to get to the part where a bunch of people's heads get put on spikes by the government.

And, you know, unlike 1925 Shanghai, for example, American cities are not contrary to the beliefs of a significant portion of the American conservative population run by networks of organized crime who control every facet of political life and also economic life and also social life to the extent that if you're a union organizer in 1920 Shanghai, you are effectively a mob organizer, both in the sense that you probably have to belong to one of the organizations and to the extent that the people you are actually organizing this time are like you're organizing the mob guys who bring in workers to serve as the migrant worker population. This is also actually an important aspect of the strikes in 1925, which is that much of the labor population in Shanghai are

migrant workers. They've been brought in from other parts of the country by organized crime. Now, obviously, that's not, that is not really how migrant labor works in the United States. But, you know, to some extent, the pressures of the labor discipline are very similar in that, right, the threat that has held over the heads of migrant workers is that armed men will come in the night for you. And right now what we are witnessing is the armed men coming into the night. But, you know, as much as I talk about sort of the differences between these movements, I think the immediate question for our purposes is, are there things that? that we can learn from this movement. And I think the answer is yes. But in order to get to the, what can we learn from this,

we have to talk a bit about how the movement collapsed. So I said that the movement held on for about three months. That was in Shanghai. The history of some of the other cities is different, and we kind of don't have time to, for example, divert talk about General Strike in Hong Kong, where the primary method that people used was they simply left the city

and went back home, which solved some of the problems that we're going to be talking about in a little bit. But, okay, in Shanghai, what happened to this movement and why did it fall apart? So I think there are roughly three factors, and I think the first two are actually more important

than the third one, which might be surprising. when we get to them. But the first two factors were people being able to eat and the pressure that that put on the unions and secondarily betrayal from the business elites that they had allied with to get the strikes to work. And the third is pure repression.

And the scale of the peer repression here is astonishing. I mean, some of the, like, one of the guys who runs this strike is just executed by the state. Again, I'm promising we're going to get to the heads on pikes in a bit. But the repression isn't what killed the strike. It was the problem of how do people eat, and it was the pressure from the business elite. So we're going to talk about the business elite first.

Now, when I say the business elite here, in the early days of the movement, and this is a tension that's going to sort of haunt the Chinese Nationalist Party for its entire existence until it splits from the communist completely, and even later than that, they're in a very, very uneasy alliance with left-wing students, workers who are rapidly becoming left-wing, because this is also a city that was not enormously politicized until now and suddenly becomes politicized in ways that seemed impossible like a few years before.

But there's a tension between them because initially these sort of patriotic business owners are really, really pissed off that the foreign occupiers are murdering people in their city. and sort of nationalist and communist leaders are able to sort of broker alliances with them and they're able to broker alliances with organized crime which is less important for our purposes. I cannot emphasize enough how important organized crime people are in the history to the extent that like Chiang Kai Shek,

who you may know as like the leader of the nationalist party and the guy who's eventually going to run Taiwan after losing the civil war, Chianghai Shek was an organized crime guy. Like he was in the Green Gang. So like, you know, very important to their story, less important to our story, but they act in a very similar way to the business owners, which is that in the beginning, and this is something that we saw in Minneapolis, too, between their one day general strike, which is that a lot of business owners, either out of, you know, just actual genuine rage and grief over just the raw fucking horror of these monsters grabbing people from their homes and she's, shooting people in the streets. Cooperated to shut their businesses down for the day.

Now, obviously, there are other business owners who do this because they are, uh, producers, am I allowed to say that they looked outside and we're like, it doesn't take a weatherman to see which way the winds are blowing, right? You know, they saw what was going on and were like, okay, maybe my workers aren't going to show up or if I don't publicly support this, it's going to get real fucked for me because everyone else around does and that meant that there was a lot of cooperation

from businesses. But we also saw very quickly after like a whole bunch of businesses and like sports organizations too signed a thing that was like we need to restore order maybe end the occupation but also please stop causing disruptions protesters.

Canadian women are looking for more, more out of themselves, their businesses, their elected leaders, and the world are out of them. And that's why we're thrilled to introduce the Honest Talk podcast. I'm Jennifer Stewart. And I'm Catherine Clark. And in this podcast, we interview Canada's most inspiring women. Entrepreneurs, artists, athletes, politicians, and newsmakers, all at different stages of their journey. So if you're looking to connect, then we hope you'll join us. Listen to the Honest Talk podcast on IHeart Radio or wherever you listen to your podcasts. Welcome to the A building.

I'm Hans Charles. I'm Minnick Lamouba. It's 1969. Malcolm X and Martin Luther King Jr. had both been assassinated. And Black America was out of breaking point. Writing and protests broke out on an unprecedented scale. In Atlanta, Georgia, at Martin's Almermata, Morehouse College, the students had their own protest.

It featured two prominent figures in black history, Martin Luther King Sr., and a young student, Samuel L. Jackson. To be in what we really thought was a revolution. I mean, people would die. 1968, the murder of Dr. King, which traumatized everyone. The FBI had a role in the murder of a Black Panther leader in Chicago. This story is about protest. It echoes in today's world far more than it should, and it will blow your mind. Listen to the A-building on the I-Heart Radio app, Apple Podcasts, or wherever you

You get your podcasts. China's Ministry of State Security is one of the most mysterious and powerful spy agencies in the world. But in 2017, the FBI got inside. This is Special Agent Regal, Special Agent Bradley Hall. This MSS officer has no idea the U.S. government is on to him. But the FBI has his chats, texts, emails, even his personal diary. Hear how they got it on the Sixth Bureau podcast. I now have several terabytes of an MSS officer, no doubt, no question of his life.

And that's a unicorn. No one had ever seen anything like that. It was unbelievable. This is a story of the inner workings of the MSS and how one man's ambition and mistakes opened its vault of secrets. Listen to the Sixth Bureau on the IHeart Radio app, Apple Podcasts, or wherever you get your podcasts. I'm Bowen-Yang. And I'm Matt Rogers.

During this season of the Two Guys Five Rings podcast, in the lead-up to the Milan-Cortina-26 Winter Olympic Games, we've been joined by some of our friends. Hi, Boen, hi, Matt, hi, Elmo. Hey, Matt, hey, Bowen. Hi, Cookie. Hi. Now, the Winter Olympic Games are underway,

and we are in Italy to give you experiences from our hearts to your ears. Listen to Two Guys Five Rings on the I-Heart Radio app, Apple Podcasts, you get your podcast. Now, in the Chinese case, what we see as the strike goes on is that the business elites began to see the strikes themselves and the marches and the fighting with the police, and particularly the fact that they were also not making money and they were also putting their own money into keeping the strikes going as a problem because they are business people and the only thing that they really care about fundamentally is making money. There's a Mark's line I wish I had here

about what the national character of Britain was, and it turned out that its only fundamental principle was land rent. And that's like this, right? Like at some point, these people are like, okay, well, given the choice between imperialist occupation and me losing money and my workers gaining power, I will choose imperialist occupation. And this is something that in cross-class movements like this,

specifically, if you are trying to do a general strike, you're eventually going to have to deal with this, which is that a lot of particularly, large businesses. And, you know, some small business owners will fall in line with this too, right? We'll eventually get to a point where they're like, I would rather keep making money than, you know, not have my neighbors taken away. And that is unbelievably fucking bleak.

But that's, you know, like, that's one of the things that killed this general strike in China. And eventually in the face of this, right? we come to the second problem, which is that people needed to eat. So the Union Federation that's set up had been just sort of giving people money so that they could eat, but they eventually start to run out of money and they don't really have a way to organize the sort of production movement and logistics of providing everyone with food without relying on the bankrolling of those business owners. You know, this becomes a problem because it means that they're suddenly getting attacked

by portions of the workers who aren't supposed to be their base because they don't have food. And those people also just start, like, walking up the Chamber of Commerce meetings and walking in and beating up the Chamber of Commerce people for not paying them and then, like, eating the banquet food for the Chamber of Commerce is a great story in the book called Shanghai on strike by Elizabeth Ferry, who's a renowned scholar of Chinese labor history about this. Very funny. There's lots of absolutely wild stories from this strike.

one of the sort of recurring themes of this period of union organizing. And again, this is a really rough time, right? Imagine like gangster movies, 19, like, 20s, New York and, like, that's Shanghai. But, like, the gangs are way, way, way, way stronger. So, like, the way politics works to a large extent is that people beat the shit out of each other and, like, whole hits on each other. And the city is, technically speaking, it's run by, like, what is a warlord army. And then beneath the World Army, there are all of these organized criminal organizations. But, like, you know, the unions have this thing called dog beating brigades where,

um, dog beating brigades. Like, if you, like, publicly started scabbing or you very publicly were standing against a strike, like the dog beating brigade would show up in the middle of the night. And it was just like a bunch of guys with hatchets. And it would just, like, beat the shit out of you. And this was just like a normal thing that was happening between these strikes. So this whole period of Chinese history is nuts. It's wild.

There's so much shit going on. That's just, I don't know. They had the dog beating brigades. I guess in the American context, we'd call them like the scabby beating brigades or whatever. But, you know, it's a rough time for everyone. But what they kind of don't have without sort of business owners, they're never really able to sort of seize control of production. and repurpose it towards, you know, keeping everyone fed.

And I will say this is something that actually, I think we are better at than they were, in the sense of we are better at running the logistics of getting a bunch of people food and the stuff that they need to survive. This is something we can look at in Minneapolis where, and this is obviously coming from people's money, but a lot of the organizing in Minneapolis

is about getting people who can't leave their homes food. we've also seen in the last day or so tenant and labor union leaders are talking about a rent strike in Minneapolis, which can help people, you know, not get evicted because they can't go to work. But it's also something that if you're going to do a general strike, yeah, you probably also have to do a rent strike. But if you want to keep a general strike going, and this is something that we're going to get to a lot more in later episodes, the Seattle General Strike is a very large example of this. If you want to keep this thing going, you have to take control of the places where you're working and, you know, have them provide the food for people and have them provide the resources that people need.

But in this sort of context, almost everyone who's involved in this, this is their first general strike. What really happens here, right, is that the unions are forced to call off the strike. They get minor concessions in exchange from the foreign bosses. But what it does is politicize the entire city. and it politicizes all of China in a way that is going to shape all of the politics in the country forever, I guess.

Like, it's the thing that creates modern China is the politicization that comes out of this period. You know, it's what sort of transforms Chinese politics or something that was purely that almost purely the domain of warlords into something that's now the domain of the nationalists and the communist. And obviously, you know,

the military conflict is a large thing in this that we don't really have time to get into. But, you know, this period, transforms the entire politics of China, right? People who had never thought about politics before, people who had never, you know, who had never, like, heard the words imperialism or, like, heard the words like militarism, right,

are suddenly in the streets talking about it, and they're talking about General Strikes, and they're talking about how can we run these occupying armies out. And I want to sort of mention how this whole thing ends, right, which is that people keep organizing and they keep fighting. And one year later, in 1926, the first of the uprisings begins. Now, the first uprising, and these three uprisings were all sort of, like, hauled by the Chinese Communist Party and their unions.

The first one fails horribly, and the warlords put the heads of workers they'd killed on pikes. They have these squads where there's two guys had broadswords and a guy with, like, a sheriff's badge effectively who'd go door to door. And if they find someone who they think had, like, handed out leaflets, they would exit. them on the spot. This is the kind of repression they're dealing with. And they did it again.

They tried again in 1927. And that one failed. And the second time, by the way, it's worth mentioning, was supposed to be a general strike coordinated with an uprising and they fucked up the coordination of it.

But it did also. The second one was a 300,000 strong general strike. And the third try was an 800,000 strong general strike. And they staged the interaction and they run the warlord armies out of the city. And for a sort of brief, glorious moment,

Shanghai is in the hands of its workers. And their subsequent betrayal and slaughtered by the USSR and Chiang Kai Shek, mostly Shanghai Shek, the USSR is also at fault here for telling them to keep allying with Shankai Shek and the Nationalists. That's a story for another time. But I think to close, we are used to thinking that the times that we live in are unprecedented, and in some ways they are.

But people have fought our struggles before. People have fought and died and won to stop the reign of men with guns over our cities. And if we learn the lessons of both their time and ours, if we use that knowledge to act in the moment of crisis, we can win. Conscience, history, and the cries of the suffering demand it. So let's go win the war. We have a world to win and nothing to lose but our chains.

It Could Happen Here is a production of Cool Zone Media. For more podcasts from Coolzone Media, visit our website, coolzonemedia.com, or check us out on the IHeart Radio app, Apple Podcasts, or wherever you listen to podcasts. You can now find sources for It Could Happen here listed directly in episode descriptions. Thanks for listening. Over the last couple years, didn't we learn that the folding chair was invented by black people because of what happened in Alabama? This Black History Month, the podcast, Selective Ignorance with Mandy B, unpacked black history and culture with comedy, clarity, and conversations that shake the status quo.

The Crown Act in New York was signed in July of 2019, and that is a bill that was passed to prohibit discrimination based on hairstyles associated with race. hear this and more. Listen to Selective Ignorance with Mandy B from the Black Effect Podcast Network on the IHeartRadio app, Apple Podcasts, or wherever you get your podcast. 1969, Malcolm and Martin are gone. America is in crisis. At a Morehouse college, the students make their move. These students, including a young Samuel L. Jackson, locked up the members of the board of trustees, including Martin Luther King's senior. It's the true story of protests and rebellion in black American history that you'll never forget. I'm Hans Charles.

I'm in a Licklamoombo. Listen to the A-building on the I-Heart Radio app, Apple Podcasts, or wherever you get your podcasts. I'm Bowen-Yang. And I'm Matt Rogers. During this season of the Two Guys Five Rings podcast, in the lead-up to the Milan Quartina-26 Winter Olympic Games, we've been joined by some of our friends.

Hi, Boone, hi, hi, Matt, hi, Hey, Elmo. Hey, Matt, hey, Bowen. Hi, hi, Cookie. Hi. Now, the Winter Olympic Games are underway, and we are in, in Italy to give you experiences from our hearts to your ears. Listen to two guys, five rings on the Iheart Radio app, Apple Podcasts, or wherever you get your

podcast. You know Roald Dahl. He thought up Willie Wonka and the BFG. But did you know he was a spy? In the new podcast, The Secret World of Roll Dahl, I'll tell you that story, and much, much more. What? You probably won't believe it either. Was this before he wrote his stories?

It must have been. Okay. I don't think that's true. I'm telling you. I was a spy. Listen to the secret world of Roll Dahl on the IHeart Radio app, Apple Podcasts, wherever you get your podcasts.

This is an IHeart podcast. Guaranteed human.