It Could Happen Here - The iHeart Podcast Union Episode

Episode Date: May 24, 2024

Mia talks with Tracey Wilson and Gnomes Griffin, two members of the iHeart Podcast Union's bargaining committee, about organizing media unions and getting through difficult contract negotiations.See omnystudio.com/listener for privacy information.

Hey guys, I'm Kate Max. You might know me from my popular online series, The Running Interview Show, where I run with celebrities, athletes, entrepreneurs, and more. After those runs, the conversations keep going. That's what my podcast, Post Run High, is all about. It's a chance to sit down with my guests and dive even deeper into their stories, their journeys, and the thoughts that arise once we've hit the pavement together. Listen to Post Run High on the iHeartRadio app, Apple Podcasts, or wherever you get your podcasts. Curious about queer sexuality, cruising, and

expanding your horizons? Hit play on the sex-positive and deeply entertaining podcast, Sniffy's Cruising Confessions. Join hosts Gabe Gonzalez and Chris Patterson Rosso as they explore queer sex, cruising, relationships, and culture in the new iHeart podcast, Sniffy's Cruising Confessions. Sniffy's Cruising Confessions will broaden minds and help you pursue your true goals. You can listen to Sniffy's Cruising Confessions, sponsored by Gilead, now on the iHeartRadio app or wherever you get your podcasts. New episodes every Thursday. The 2025 iHeart Podcast Awards are coming. This is the chance to nominate your podcast for the industry's biggest award. Submit your podcast for nomination now at iHeart.com slash podcast awards. But hurry, submissions close on December 8th. Hey, you've been doing all that talking.

It's time to get rewarded for it. Submit your podcast today at iHeart.com slash podcast awards. That's iHeart.com slash podcast awards. Welcome to It Could Happen Here, a podcast about things falling apart apart how to put it back together again made by iheart media i am your host mia wong so we have been you know we're this is this is our this is going to be our first union double header we have two union episodes in a row and part of why we're doing this is that we've we've been covering a lot of very sort of

is that we've been covering a lot of very sort of very fast drives, very low to the ground drives in small shops recently. And today we are going to be covering a shop that is not like that. It is very large. It is quite geographically diverse, and it has been organizing for a very long time. And that union is the iHeart Podcast Union. And with me to talk about this is Tracy Wilson from Stuff You Miss in History Class and Gnomes Griffin, who is a producer on many staggeringly too many shows. And yeah, they are both on the bargaining committee of the iHeart Podcast Union. So yeah, Tracy, Gnomes, welcome to the show.

Oh, thank you. We're glad to be here. Yeah, I'm excited to talk to you too. So, all right. First thing about this iHeart Podcast Union, we haven't covered many media unions on this podcast. We probably should do more, but it's been a sort of product of what kind,

I don't know. There are certain kinds of stuff that we've been focusing on, but now we're doing media unions. So the place I wanted to start talking about the iHeart Podcast union is the sort of scale of it. I mean, there's people everywhere. There are people where there's one union member in the entire city. And it's also been going on for a very, very long time. So I wanted to sort of ask, can you talk about how this whole process started

and kind of how long it's been going on? So long, so long. I was scrolling through my phone today trying to remember when was the first time that I was contacted about unionizing because the first thing that happened for me was being organized into the union before i heart recognized us and that was in the fall of 2020 the fall from 2020 i got a text from my friend Lauren that was like, can I talk to you about a kind of a work thing? It's a kind of work. And I said, sure. And the question that Lauren had to ask me was,

some of us are talking about unionizing. How would you feel about that? And I said, okay, I need to check my agreement that I already have with iHeart because a lot of us at iHeart have individual agreements with a company. I have worked in the job that I have now in some capacity for almost 19 years. So I've been here forever and I already had this. I was like, I need to find out, does this agreement prohibit me from doing this?

It did not. And so I said, all right, if I'm eligible to be in the union, I'm on board. If I'm not eligible to be in the union, you have my full support. And that was in like November of 2020, which is eons ago at this point. Yeah, it's been, I came on to the company and the union was already in negotiations. Like it had been a union already. I started in January of 2023

and I came like straight into the, we're in bargaining sessions process. Yeah. So the organizing process took definitely more than a year. And that was more than a year of people talking to all of their colleagues about whether they wanted to form a union, what would be the benefits of forming a union, all of that stuff. And so we have three main

offices at I heart there's New York, LA and Atlanta. So there were people who were doing things on the ground with people locally to them. But then also I think it's something like a third of our unit is not actually local to one of these offices. I'm not local to an office. I live north of Boston. We have like three unit members in the entire Commonwealth of Massachusetts. So this is like a really long process of getting everybody on board and getting everybody to commit to saying they wanted to be in the union and then eventually to sign union cards. After all of that that took more than a year, we informed management of our intent to unionize in December of 2021. And they recognized us about six weeks later in February of 2022. That took longer than we would have wanted.

There was some back and forth about exactly what roles would be included in the union. And then also the winter holidays happened in the middle of that, which is like those weeks don't exist for business purposes in a lot of ways. We still got to do podcasts for them, but nobody's at work. And so, you know, we were recognized without having to go through an election with the NLRB, which was great, but it did sort of feel like it took a little bit to finally get the recognition. And then we started bargaining in may so a couple of months after that and that was two years ago that we started bargaining oh my god yeah it's may now it is may now it is almost june today yeah yeah it has been a really quite long bargaining process which i think i mean this is something we've talked about on the show before, that this is a

pretty, this is a thing that happens a lot for, especially for first contracts, is that companies will try to sort of just wait the union out, and try to, because, you know, if you look at, like, the places where unions fail, it's they either fail in sort of

like, okay, there's the failures where, like, nothing ever gets Okay, there's the failures where nothing ever gets started. There's the failures where they lose an election or they don't have enough people to sign cards. And then the third place that they fail is the first contract. And so this is a situation that I guess is not unexpected, but is also, I don't know, negotiating a contract for two years

just is not very fun. Yeah. No, it's not. Our colleagues at WGAE, when we got ready to start bargaining, tried to prepare us for the fact that 18 months to two years is fairly normal in the world of media to bargain a first contract.

I will readily acknowledge that I was overly optimistic when we started. I would not go so far as to say naive, but like I thought it was a really good sign that the company had voluntarily recognized us. I thought it was a really good sign that WGAE had successfully negotiated other contracts and that we were sort of drawing from a lot of that contract language as our starting point. And I feel like when you have all of the unionized podcast shops having similar language, to me, that language is now becoming industry standard. So I expected less of a fight over a lot of that

than what we actually got. And then also management hired an attorney that has negotiated a lot of other contracts with WGAE. It was just all stuff that I thought seemed favorable. And then when we actually got into the bargaining process, it has gone on for so long. And there have been so many things that it has felt like we're just going around in circles at the table yeah so before we get into kind of what what issues are being circled around and what management has been doing i wanted to talk about what bargaining a contract is actually like because i think most of the people listening to this have never done it and only kind of have a vague idea of what that means.

So can you sort of walk us through the, I don't know. So there's a week that has a bargaining session. Can you walk through the process of what goes into that? Yeah, definitely. So in a week where we might have a bargaining session, say we have a bargaining session on Wednesday and Thursday, session on Wednesday and Thursday. As a committee, we'll meet probably the Monday, the Tuesday to prepare whatever our counter proposals will be. So whether or not that's on economics. So we're getting back and we're adjusting our salary proposals that are going to go across the table, or we're adjusting what we're asking for in severance, how many weeks of severance we're asking for. So we'll

spend some time as a committee going through those proposals and basing our decisions off of like, this is where we have an intention of landing. This is where management is right now. This is what in our conversations with the other unit members we've figured out is most important to people. So we'll make counters based on that. Lately, those sessions have looked like preparing to who in the committee is going to be presenting that contract language across the table. So we'll divvy up those presentations and Tracy might present on diversity. I might present about the salary minimums. We might have another committee member present on severance and things like that. So we'll sort out who is going to say what,

and we'll also plan out any other sort of editorializing that we're going to do across the table. Like this is why we're making a move here because it's important to our unit for this reason. We've also planned out actions that we're going to do across the table and having unit members read testimonials about certain contract items. So those are all of the things that we might prepare for ahead of the bargaining session. And then on the actual day of bargaining session, we'll go in and we'll meet as a committee in the morning. We're either presenting first our proposals or management is presenting to us. We, as a bargaining committee, will be there to hear the proposals. There may be some sessions that are more important

than others. So we'll invite the whole unit to hear those proposals. And we will, over those two days, sort of go back and forth presenting across the table what our proposals are and the counter proposals. And with the idea of like getting closer to a contract that is fair and like Tracy said earlier, industry standard. That sums it up. Yeah. And I guess this leads us to the second part of contract negotiations, which is management's counter-proposals. So, you know, something I think is kind of surprising when you do this for the first time is the extent to which management simply will not show up on time. Yeah. yeah yeah so how has it actually been sitting across the table from management and you know

hearing their kind of proposals and dealing with whenever they show up um i all of my bargaining so far has been happening on the other side of a zoom or a Teams screen since I'm remote to everybody else, which is a blessing and a curse, right? I have kind of a buffer. I'm not having to directly look at the faces of the people who are coming in with salary proposals that are dramatically less than what we proposed and what we feel is industry standard at this point. proposed and what we feel is industry standard at this point. But it also means that like I'm by myself. I don't have somebody near me to when like management leaves the room personally

react with. We kind of go around the circle in the whoever's in the room and on the screen to sort of say our reactions. But like it's lonely sometimes to do it from afar i do definitely have to practice keeping my expression neutral because sometimes what we are hearing is not neutral expression territory and i also really was not totally prepared to hear management justify their positions on things. Like I will feel strongly that the correct and most ethical thing to do is a particular thing. And then management will explain their position on something. And I'll sort of be like, that's not the decision I would like you to be making at all. And I'm a little upset that I just heard you say that just now. Yeah. Yeah. And I'm in Atlanta. So most of our bargaining sessions have happened

in Atlanta. We have also have them in New York or LA, but so I have been in person for most of the sitting down across from management and like waiting a few hours after when they said they would be ready to present their proposals. And it is like tense and frustrating to sit in that. And to Tracy's point, like it is nice that we have the rest of the committee with us to, or whoever's in Atlanta with us to sort of share in that together. But the energy does get really tense at times, especially in those situations where we've presented, hey, we would like however many days of bereavement leave so we can grieve our family members. And then management comes back with an offer that's like,

well, what about just a couple of days to grieve your dead family member? And so in those situations where it's like, well, what about just a couple of days to grieve your dead family member? And so in those situations where it's like, do you think of me as a fellow human being deserving of these very basic things to make my life livable? And then their answer sort of feels like a no, and you kind of just have to sit in that in person while they say it to your face. like a no and you kind of just have to like sit in that in person while they say it to your face yeah and i mean especially when it's something that personal or it's that or if it's something like parental leave where you know it is this is your child right and yeah you're sitting across the table from someone being like oh yeah no you actually you should get like two days to deal with this it's just really brutal

we had it was a few months ago we had a session where we had a lot of testimonials that were accompanying our actual contract proposals and some of them were read by the person who had written the testimonial and some of them were read by a different bargaining committee member because somebody was just more comfortable remaining anonymous and having somebody do that for them. And we had testimonials that were all over the map in terms of things that we were still in the process of bargaining. So we had diversity testimonials. We had testimonials about parental leave, all of this stuff. And one of the things that wound up being just enormously frustrating was that it felt like we went through all that

and we presented so many things about why this matters so much to all of us. And the next round of counter proposals that we got were like the same negligible movements as from before we had all read all of the testimonials. And that was not my favorite day of bargaining by far no yeah that one was not not fun to be in on hey guys i'm kate max you might know me from my popular online series, The Running Interview Show, where I run with celebrities, athletes, entrepreneurs, and more. After those runs,

the conversations keep going. That's what my podcast, Post Run High, is all about. It's a chance to sit down with my guests and dive even deeper into their stories, their journeys, and the thoughts that arise once we've hit the pavement together. You know that rush of endorphins you feel after a great workout? Well, that's when the real magic happens. So if you love hearing real, inspiring stories from the people you know, follow, and admire, join me every week for Post Run High.

It's where we take the conversation beyond the run and get into the heart of it all. It's lighthearted, pretty crazy, and very fun. Listen to Post Run High on the iHeartRadio app, Apple Podcasts, or wherever you get your podcasts. Hi, I'm Ed Zitron, host of the Better Offline podcast, and we're kicking off our second season digging into how tech's elite

has turned Silicon Valley into a playground for billionaires. From the chaotic world of generative AI to the destruction of Google search, Better Offline is your unvarnished and at times unhinged look at the underbelly of tech from an industry veteran with nothing to lose. This season, I'm going to be joined by everyone from Nobel-winning economists to leading journalists in the field and I'll be digging into why the products you love keep getting worse and naming and shaming those responsible

Don't get me wrong though, I love technology I just hate the people in charge and want them to get back to building things that actually do things to help real people I swear to God things can change if we're loud enough so join me every week to understand what's happening in the tech industry and what could be done to make things better. Listen to Better Offline on the iHeartRadio app, Apple Podcasts, or wherever else you get your podcasts.

Check out betteroffline.com. Hola mi gente, it's Honey German and I'm bringing you Gracias, Come Again, the podcast where we dive deep into the world of Latin culture, musica, peliculas, and entertainment with some of the biggest names in the game. If you love hearing real conversations with your favorite Latin celebrities, artists, and culture shifters, this is the podcast for you. We're talking real conversations with our Latin stars,

from actors and artists to musicians and creators, sharing their stories, struggles, and successes. You know it's going to be filled with chisme laughs and all the vibes that you love. Each week, we'll explore everything from music and pop culture to deeper topics like identity, community, and breaking down barriers in all sorts of industries.

Don't miss out on the fun, el té caliente, and life stories. Join me for Gracias Come Again, a podcast by Honey German, where we get into todo lo actual y viral. Listen to Gracias Come Again on the iHeartRadio app, Apple Podcasts, or wherever you get your podcasts. And we are back. So, I mean, we've talked a little bit about kind of bereavement stuff.

back so i mean we've talked a little bit about kind of brief stuff um and you know something like we've talked a little bit about some of the issues that that have been stuck in negotiations for two years but yeah i wanted to sort of see you know talk talk about sort of the specifics of of where of where the contract negotiations are right now and how far apart the company and the union is. And also just, and this is something that I think has been a theme of these negotiations, is the extent to which management is below industry standard. So yeah, I guess we could start with sort of wages there because that's one of the places where they're very much below standard.

Yeah, I think we only have a TA on one, a TA being a tentative agreement on one title and only for the rate that they're proposing in New York City, in LA. Another big thing with our minimums is that they're different for producers and other titles living in New York City and LA than they are for people in those roles in other cities. So yeah, we are very far apart still on our salary minimums. Yeah. When we put together our proposals on salary minimums, like we didn't make them up out of nowhere. We did a lot of research on pay rates at other unionized podcast shops and other podcast businesses. We came up with numbers that felt fair and industry standard based on all of that research. And then management just came in so much lower than all that. And then as Gnomes just said, there's this differential they're proposing between New York and LA and everywhere else. Most of our unit is not in New York or LA. A big chunk of the unit is in Atlanta specifically, and the cost of living in Atlanta is just not that much lower than New York or LA at this point. We've also been way apart on annual increases. Originally, management was proposing not to have annual increases in the contract at all.

And they've moved past that, but the current proposals are still way, way less than the rate of inflation. I mean, it's about half of what inflation is. Yeah. It's not even inflation amount. And I will say that like for many of the job titles they're so far below what industry standard is with the like very little

incremental movement that they make every bargaining session it's like clear that they the company doesn't have any interest in getting to industry standard despite the fact that it is like a large and well-ranked podcasting company yeah yeah we just got the webby award as podcast company of the year and we continue to be like when rankings come out of the biggest podcast networks, like we're always at or right near the top of the rankings, all of that. We have a lot of shows that are really well respected in whatever subject matter they are discussing, whatever broadly speaking genre of podcasts. whatever broadly speaking genre of podcasts and so it sucks to then look at pay scales that just don't line up with that in terms of like the minimum of what the company will commit to offering people yeah and i think the percent increase thing is really frustrating too because again the way this works out with inflation and remember,

so, you know, we started bargaining in 2022, right? Inflation in 2022 was like three, like twice what it is now. And if, if you're getting,

if you're not getting, and this is something I think that's important for everyone to understand is that if you're not getting, so for inflation right now is about 3.4%. If you're not getting a 3.4% pay increase this year, that means you are taking a pay cut every single year. And the fact that this is what, like management's proposal is you take a pay cut every single year and you're supposed to be fine with this is incredibly frustrating. And I don't, I don't think it's, it's,

it's, it's not really understood in, in terms of you literally taking a pay cut very much. It's, it's just talked of like, it's, it's, it's,

it's something that's talked about as just like another benefit, but like, no, we're trying not to take a pay cut. Yeah. Yeah. I would like to, if my salary is going to not take me any further,

at least not take me any farther back. Yeah. I don't need to lose money every year. Like I've done this year and starting my second year at the company. Right. There've been a lot of people who have not had a raise since like before the pandemic started and like I'm incredibly lucky I have been at my job forever I'm on one of the biggest shows that we have in the network

like I'm I'm doing okay right but my call a lot of my colleagues who work on shows that don't have as much power, don't have as big of an audience, like don't have as much of an ad budget, people who have been with the company less time, people who are like earlier on in their careers, especially like I've watched these folks go through the last four years with no increase in their pay. And like, I can see people struggling now financially in a way that they weren't struggling financially in 2019 because their pay has not changed at all. But the, how much it costs to exist in the world is so much more expensive. Yeah.

We have some members right now who like would receive a pay increase with what's being proposed currently but it is nowhere near the majority most people are going to lose money with the numbers as they are right now Hey guys, I'm Kate Max. You might know me from my popular online series, The Running Interview Show, where I run with celebrities, athletes, entrepreneurs, and more. After those runs, the conversations keep going. That's what my podcast, Post Run High High is all about. It's a chance to sit down with my guests and dive even deeper into their stories, their journeys, and the thoughts that arise once we've hit the pavement together. You know that rush of endorphins you feel after a great workout? Well, that's when the real magic happens. So if you love hearing real, inspiring stories from the people you know, follow, and admire,

join me every week for Post Run High. It's where we take the conversation beyond the run and get into the heart of it all. It's lighthearted, pretty crazy, and very fun. Listen to Post Run High on the iHeartRadio app, Apple Podcasts, or wherever you get your podcasts. Hola, mi gente. It's Honey German, and I'm bringing you Gracias, Come Again, the podcast where we dive deep into the world of Latin culture, musica, peliculas, and entertainment with some of the biggest names in the game. If you love hearing real conversations with your favorite Latin celebrities,

artists, and culture shifters, this is the podcast for you. We're talking real conversations with our Latin stars, from actors and artists to musicians and creators, sharing their stories, struggles, and successes. You know it's going to be filled with chisme laughs and all the vibes that you love. Each week, we'll explore everything, from music and pop culture,

to deeper topics like identity, community, and breaking down barriers in all sorts of industries. Don't miss out on the fun, El Te Caliente and life stories. Join me for Gracias Come Again, a podcast by Honey German, where we get into todo lo actual y viral. Listen to Gracias Come Again on the iHeartRadio app, Apple Podcasts, or wherever you get your podcasts. Hi, I'm Ed Zitron, host of the Better Offline podcast, and we're kicking off our second season digging into how tech's elite has turned Silicon Valley into a playground for billionaires. From the chaotic world of generative AI to the destruction of Google search,

Better Offline is your unvarnished and at times unhinged look at the underbelly of tech from an industry veteran with nothing to lose. This season, I'm going to be joined by everyone from Nobel winning economists to leading journalists in. This season, I'm going to be joined by everyone from Nobel-winning economists to leading journalists in the field, and I'll be digging into why the products you love keep getting worse and naming and shaming those responsible. Don't get me wrong, though. I love technology.

I just hate the people in charge and want them to get back to building things that actually do things to help real people. I swear to God things can change if we're loud enough, so join me every week to understand what's happening in the tech industry and what could be done to make things better. Listen to Better Offline on the iHeartRadio app, Apple Podcasts, or wherever else you get your podcasts.

Check out betteroffline.com. Yeah, and that's one of the things that's just you know i mean and even even the sort of industry standard in podcasting isn't great but that's one of these things that's you know very much below industry standard there's been another one of these things that i wanted to talk about that's kind of baffling that i i think everyone involved thought that this this would be something that there wouldn't be a huge fight over but that's at will employment you talk about that yeah yeah i'd love to so just cause employment means your employer has to have just cause to terminate your employment. Your employer cannot just do it willy-nilly.

And it's a core part of the rights that unions bargain for, is to have a process for somebody to be disciplined and lose their job. It's a very basic thing, basic union protection. And the management has held firm that they basically want to not only have at-will employment standards but like enshrine that in the contract yeah meaning that they want to be able to fire us for any reason at any time regardless of whether or not we've done something actually warrant that loss of our income. Yeah. And that's something I think is really important that I don't think people think about

it this way, but both for if you're doing work that's politically sensitive or also if you are marginalized, having your boss not be able to fire you for literally any reason is, it's a necessary piece of protection. And if you don't have that, you can have a situation where, I don't know, you have one boss who's racist and one boss who's transphobic and, you know, it's, it's incredibly, it's incredibly dangerous for like for marginalized people to, you know, I mean, even just like to be able to speak up about things that are happening to you, right? see the entire history of labor in America and explain to me whether or not it still actually happens, especially when you can just fire someone for some other reason. Or again, in this case, you can fire them for no reason. Yeah. Yeah, and it's a thing that is so baffling

because there's no union contract without just cause. There's a number of reasons why people unionize. Obviously we want better salaries. Obviously we want better healthcare, but there's, you don't form a union and then still allow a contract that says, yeah, and also though we can fire you at any reason because that is sort of the antithesis

of like what we're about here which is that there's like due process and structures in place that like people who provide the labor for this company can't just like at a moment's notice be out of health care and income and all of that comes with that yeah i mean politically like it's it and you know if you look at this as a political system it's the difference between pure dictatorial rule where everything is just done purely by fiat right where you know like the person who rules you can do whatever they want to you and there being something like a functional legal process which constrains the power of of rulers to just sort of enact their will on you and that's you know an incredibly fundamental basic part of what a union is is is the democratization of the workplace yeah yeah that's um that's one of the things that i think is so important about just the right to unionize in general that i think a lot of people who have never been part of a union don't fully understand.

I'm basing some of this based on comments I continually see on REI ads, which I am served all the time as a person who hikes a lot because currently their comments on their ads are a whole lot of people saying, stop union busting REI. And then there are always people who are like, it's retail. If you don't like it, get a better job. Or they're saying something like REI has always voted one of the greatest employers. Like you should just be thankful for what you have. And I'm like, the thing is though, an employer has so much more power than an individual employee. Your employer

has a whole HR structure and lawyers and way more money than any individual person working for them. And that's why employees have the right to come together collectively to just balance that out a little bit. Like a union is still going to have a power differential between themselves and the company. and the company we have a whole lot more equity and a whole lot more access to that power together than as one individual person going to their manager asking nicely to have a couple extra days off because their parent died or whatever yeah as the old as the as the old song goes what force on earth is weaker than the feeble strength of one but the union makes us strong yeah i think i think that's a good sort of place to end on um yeah negotiations are still ongoing fly into atlanta next week to be there in person next week already yeah yeah it's a little scary i don't know what

to wear to an office anymore oh Oh, see, and me either. I actually just show up how I am always in my normal life. So I encourage you to do the same. Can I get a union shirt from you when I get there? Oh, please. They're literally clogging my home and I would love to give you one. So I have one. All right. to give you one so i have one all right so where where can people go to find the union and to

support us we are on twitter at iheartpodunion uh we're on instagram also at iheartpodunion yeah that's where you can find us on social media we're on blue sky at iheartpodcastunion um i have the keys to that one right now and i have not been really active with it i'm sorry yeah we many an update goes out on the twitter so you can stay in touch there yeah and in in the in the meantime between now and bargaining this has been it Could Happen Here. Thank you two so much for coming on. And yeah, let's get ourselves a good contract. Yeah, we are going to get a good contract. And it is such a pleasure to work with the both of you.

Oh, yes, you too, Gnomes. Thank you so much, Mia, for having us on. Yeah, for sure. Always happy to. All right. And this is also your daily Union episode reminder that you too can do this. You too can spend an enormous amount of time going through a spreadsheet. Yeah.

There's a lot of spreadsheets. Look, Unionization is the process of turning a spreadsheet into a fighting organization. You too can get lost in a sea of Google Docs. But I promise you all as as much as this episode has been about you know the sort of stubbornness of management and how you know and how kind of demoralizing that process can be it is worth it i promise you all it is and you can you can do it too.

It Could Happen Here is a production of Cool Zone Media. For more podcasts from Cool Zone Media, visit our website, coolzonemedia.com, or check us out on the iHeartRadio app, Apple Podcasts, or wherever you listen to podcasts. You can find sources for It Could Happen Here updated monthly at coolzonemedia.com slash sources. Thanks for listening. Hey guys, I'm Kate Max. You might know me from my popular online series, The Running Interview Show, where I run with celebrities, athletes, entrepreneurs, and more. After those runs, the conversations keep going.

That's what my podcast, Run High is all about. It's a chance to sit down with my guests and dive even deeper into their stories, their journeys, and the thoughts that arise once we've hit the pavement together. Listen to Post Run High on the iHeartRadio app, Apple Podcasts, or wherever you get your podcasts. Curious about queer sexuality, cruising, and expanding your horizons? Hit play on the sex-positive and deeply entertaining podcast, Sniffy's Cruising Confessions. Join hosts Gabe Gonzalez and Chris Patterson Rosso as they explore queer sex, cruising, relationships, and culture

in the new iHeart podcast, Sniffy's Cruising Confessions. Sniffy's Cruising Confessions will broaden minds and help you pursue your true goals. You can listen to Sniffy's cruising confessions sponsored by Gilead now on the iHeartRadio app or wherever you get your podcasts. New episodes every Thursday. The 2025 iHeart podcast awards are coming. This is the chance to nominate your podcast for the industry's biggest award. Submit your podcast for nomination now at iHeart.com slash podcast awards. But hurry, submissions close on December 8th. Hey, you've been doing all that talking.

It's time to get rewarded for it. Submit your podcast today at iHeart.com slash podcast awards. That's iHeart.com slash podcast awards.