IT IS WHAT IT IS - KNICKS FINALLY WON A TITLE, THE TERM G.O.A.T IS PLAYED OUT & HIP-HOP STORIES FROM MA$E & CAM'RON!

Episode Date: December 17, 2025

Ma$e, Cam’ron & Treasure "Stat Baby" Wilson are back with another one!! Please rate, review, and follow the podcast for more content.  Sign up with promo code IIWII and play $5 to get $75 in bonus funds: https://play.underdogfantasy.com/p-itiswhatitis #UDpartner Follow the show and our hosts on social media: ⁠It Is What It Is⁠, ⁠Cam'Ron⁠, ⁠Ma$e⁠, and ⁠Treasure "Stat Baby" Wilson⁠ , ⁠Producer Ayooo Nick⁠ Learn more about your ad choices. Visit megaphone.fm/adchoices

It's like, whoa. presented by Underdog. So the NFL's rolling, the NBA's underway, and Underdog has got you guys covered. If you're new to Underdog, make sure y'all use code, it is what it is, and get $75 in bonus entries when you play your first $5 entry, win or lose. So for the holiday season, Underdog Unwrapped is here,

giving you tons of promo throughout the holidays. They're kicking things off with the boost for Jake Paul's big fight on Friday night. So make sure you all support the show, hit that subscribe button, lock in your bonus and start playing today with code it is what it is i'm treasure wilson aka stat baby along with your host mace and cam killer was good man murder was good how you doing yeah it's good to have you back man thank you man appreciate it man yes a lot of good things going on stat it's too early stat is it why do you have on a new york hat why don't you not have on a

New York hat. I got the blue. I got the blue, but you wearing a Knicks hat is crazy. I don't even know if you should be on the show with that hat, Statt. Why?

Because. I think you can wear the hat. It was too predictable. It's not really even the Knicks hat. Just New York hat. She got blue diamonds on it. It's actually wild corny to wear that today. No, it's not.

It really is. No, it's not. That's why I didn't even acknowledge it. It's not corny. It's a New York hat. Okay. It's stylish. I think it's cute.

You know. It's wrong sports stack. And that's like, if you want to be honest with you, you're going to ask PT. PT's here today. That's just like breathing to have everybody's mandatory to have the hat. You didn't do nothing special with the hat. Like, if you're from New York, you have to have three of those. It's mandatory.

It's like having your wallet. But I'm not from New York. But that's why I'm saying I wasn't impressed. That's why. Maybe Delf ain't been there in a while. He was impressed. I just ignored it. Because that's like, it's not, like, if you had a Nick hat

or I've been like, come on. But that's like, Timberlands and those hats are mandatory in New York City. That's just like, I didn't see nothing that was special about that. This is my first piece. I don't even own Tim's. This is my first little piece. We got to get there too. I'm just saying that.

you got to have the right, Thames. You can't just wear any kind. Double soul, butters. Yeah, y'all gave me the lesson on that. I don't, you know. They give you a lesson on Instagram. Yes. I'm saying.

I get taught something every day. So, yes, this is just my little hat. It's not Nix, but it's New York. It's just a little bit of solidarity because I know sin, like we said, we would start with the top of the show if they won. And here we are. That's actually your Bronx hat and the next up from their hat. Mm.

Specifics. I'm just saying. But that right there, that hat, it doesn't matter what burrow you from. That's like a mandatory. I got like seven of them hats in my closet. None of them were good neither. I'd be looking like they fucked up like I get new ones. Not new ones.

It's just bent up and shit. I was thinking about that. I wanted to wear my neck, not neck hat, my Yankee hat was an outfit I wore it over there and all my shit just is fucked up. I don't want it like three of three of those at a time. Dang. Well, in the comments, let me know if y'all like my hat because I like it. This is my first New York piece, so I'm going to go with it. But we're going to

start with the Knicks. They are your 2025 NBA Cup champions after beating the Spurs, 124 to 113. We're going to start just like this, Mace. Is this the Knicks year? Oh, man. I mean, the Knicks, they pulled it off, so we got to put some respect on the Knicks, you know, on their name. Shout out to Sin City. We got to start the show off. Shout and sent out. you know, the Knicks did what they were supposed to do. I mean, I was thinking with Wimby on the floor, it should have been a foregone conclusion that the Spurs should win. But it seemed like OG had other plans, man.

OJ just came out. He had a hell of a game. I didn't expect him to be the one to go that crazy. But he did. And I thought Jailen Brunson would have at least about five more points than what he had. But everybody on the Knicks team played exceptionally. well to me um i was surprised by harper on on um san antonio doing doing so well this early in this career but you know when it comes down to it the nix that won a championship it hasn't

been this lit since may of i mean 19703 so you know you know this this is i don't know how this Capel, maybe you guys are watching. If you was there in 173, May 6th, May 8th, or May 10th, get in the comment section and let us know how you feel about this and how it compares to those days. But I would really say, I'm really happy for the Knicks. I'm really happy for Mike Brown. It would be a black head coach that get them to a championship. So I'm thankful about that as well. whatever it's fucking December

and they are the championship I'm happy the next one I'm really happy for the next but this is what I'm saying this is kind of why I didn't want the next to win because if the Knicks need to win they need the one in June that's the real thing

and if they don't win in June they're going to run with this while we the Emirates Cups champions We won the average cup this year And that's the real problem with winning Yesterday for me If you're at Nick Fair now

I really think this is the next year At least to get to the championship We talked about this This season This is the next year to get to the championship Hallibur is hurt Fucking What's my light skin thing? I don't know why I'm doing

Tatum is hurt And I don't think anybody else compares to the Knicks in the east. We see Milwaukee scrambling. Orlando is not there yet. Detroit, to me, is one of the best teams, if not the best team in the East Coast at the moment. But they don't have the experience just yet in the playoffs.

The Sixers are all over the place. I don't know who I'm watching when I see Joelle and B or Paul George playing. I have no idea who these people are. They're not the players that I'm accustomed to see it. Of course, Max, he's doing well and Edgecombe is doing while the rookie. But the Knicks, they kept their team together

and they played well together last year. This should be their year at least to get to the championship. So I'm not excited about the Emeralds Cup. I want to see them get to the championship. Now, back to the Emirates Cup. Well-deserved win last night. I was at the game. And the Knicks wanted it more.

It looked like, to be totally honest, which you position outside of the United States, Castle, Castle's a dog. That nigga Castle is a fucking dog, yeah. He's a hustler. He's dying for loose balls, paws, offensive rebounds, defense. He's a dog, bro.

And he's 21 years old. He has a really, really, really, really bright future. Outside of him, I saw a bunch of niggas that looked like they didn't need the 100,000. The nicks looked like they needed the 100,000 towards the end of the game. They're like, you know, those niggas like, yo, I need that $100,000.

It's a scene that set it off when the girls said, I need that money. That's what the Knicks looked like. When that girl said, I need that money. And they were really... Sorry, just want to make it clear because it's half a mill. Okay. Each player gets out of me.

Yeah. So they get $530,000. A piece? Yes. Okay, yeah. That's what, pardon me. That's what the Knicks look like. That's what they look like.

They need that money as opposed to the spurs it. Outside of castle, I didn't see it. Deerrin Fox was smooth. He wasn't going. Like to me, he was lackadaisical in certain points to the game. I'm going to give Wemby's credit because Wimby didn't start the game and he was on a minute's restriction time with his coach and everything. To me, he's shooting too many jump shots.

And he had too many open shots in the lane where he's just not dunking it. I was sitting next to Boogie Cousins. And we're just like, why won't you dunk the ball? You're sitting there trying to shoot layers missing and lay up, so on and so forth. And he's shooting too many threes. Now, he went on a little tears,

a couple jump shots, back to back, couple threes. And it didn't look like, oh shit, wouldn't be seen up. But it didn't last. They were up double digits, the spurs I'm talking about. and opportunities where they could put the Knicks away, they just didn't take advantage of that. It was actually times they could have, they was up 10 instead of getting the defensive rebound,

going up the board and pushing it to 12, 14 points, they let the Knicks get wild offensive rebounds. I believe the Knicks had 23 offensive rebounds. I was watching it like, yo, this is crazy. And it wasn't just the big man. Everybody was getting off. Two, three opportunities every time they were. were down the floor when the Knicks missed.

And to me, that was the real difference to open up the lead for the Knicks, their offensive rebounding or the lack of the Spurs defensive rebounding. But the Knicks warned it outright more than Spurs. You don't go, you're not up by 10 in the end of the third and then lose by more than 10 in the fourth, 20-point turnaround. So congratulations to the Knicks, well-deserved, and they wanted it way more. And like I said, I was sitting right there and I seen it who wanted them more. The Spurs didn't want that game.

Yeah, I hate the fact that they let the Knicks win by this much. I think if they was going to play like this, you guys could have let SGA and them win in San Antonio because that's the game I really wanted to see. I really, I'm dying to see Jalen Brunson against SGA. You know, what better place to see that right here in Vegas. But, you know, next time SGA, y'all got to handle it. business so we can make sure we get the game that we really want to see so i just want to get some clarification because i know you guys are talking about like the time like obviously now is december

we want to see what's going to happen in june do you all see this as a statement game or it's just kind of like this is what they're supposed to be doing for me i think it was a statement game um when you come out of new york every every every situation counts it adds to the legacy it adds to the confidence. You know, New York, being from New York, you already walk around with a certain air about yourself. So when they beat somebody like San Antonio, especially with them having Wembe, it doesn't matter if his menace was monitored or what. In their minds, we beat them with Wembe. So if we could beat them with Wembe, there's nobody else that we got to really be afraid of or even think we can't beat because they beat SGA them and we beat them. You know, that's just

the whole mentality of a New Yorker. So, you know, I can only imagine how New York is feeling right now. If I was in New York last night, I think they probably were shooting off the roof or something. It's something crazy going on. They're loving this right now. They're ready to make streets. If last week they was ready to make streets after the players, I don't know where they at this week.

And the exact question? Yeah, did you see this as a statement game for them or like this is what they should be doing? this is both to me it's definitely a statement game 100% look you get down played all you want and I know it's a lot of other older players like they didn't have that shit when I was playing wasn't no emmerence cup when I was coming up but they got it now and whether you like it or not we've seen a couple years ago LeBron James in the locker room where Anthony Davis popping champagne after they won in the Emirates Cup so if it's good enough for LeBron James

and them to win the Cup is good enough for the Knicks to celebrate to win the Cup and it is a statement game what I say is this but let's just remember what the bigger gold is and I'm not going to say to me personally if the Knicks don't win the title I'm not mad at them but getting to the title

this is the year in the East to get to the title, and this is one step moving forward. What I will say is this, just briefly, that I just, I don't fucking know how coaching goes anymore when it comes to just minutes or whatever the fuck they're doing as far as coaching is concerned, because you got fucking De Aaron Fox and Wemby sitting out on the bench until, like, it's four minutes and 20 seconds left. and then you subcastle in but take Deerrin Fox out

and you got all these different lineups you know the five best players need to be on the floor period all this mixed match and the minutes and everything else you know your combos Mitch Johnson was not working you know

Pop Bortchard you know what I'm saying Popvin's bullshit your combination shit was whack it wasn't working and it was even to a point where you had Nick fans yelling than Mike Brown because Cat was on the bench so long.

Cat was on the bench for like to the end of the fourth quarter like yo bro, people come to see the stars play and I'm not going to get, you can't fault Mike Brown because whatever strategy he was using worked. So when it

works you look like a genius and when it doesn't work you look like you're fucking crazy. And to me the combinations Mitch Johnson was putting on the floor was just crazy. Oh, And I'm thinking to myself, are they really this big or analytics when it comes to minute restriction? Oh, Deerring Fox, he played 29 minutes. Let's take him out for four minutes and then put him back with three minutes left in the game so we can make sure he monitors his minutes.

It's a championship. It's a championship, bro. The best players need to be on the floor. But even though Kat sat out, whatever Mike Brown had cooked up, it worked for them so he looked good. But everybody was on the sideline like, Kat need to be. Y'all and Nick fans was pissed that cat need to be in the game. But the answer to the question overall, it was both to me a statement game and what they should be, though.

Yeah, that's also, oh, you go ahead, Mason. Yeah, for the basketball conspiracies, I just need to know where do we hold this championship? When you got, you got the Cup, you got the NBA Cup, you got the Bubble, and you got the Lockout Championship. Can you rank those one, two, three for me, Killer? I count the bubble, you don't. No, I'm saying, rank of one, two, three, like in importance.

Like, which one is higher? The thing to me, the bubble's the highest. Okay. Because the bubble still, it's still, like, they took a break because things like COVID, but they picked up from where teams were at before COVID hit. So it wasn't a 482 games. I think it was 70 games. Whatever it was.

It's a moral story, just to rank it. The bubble's first. The lockout to me is second and the cup is third because the lockout was 70 games. This is like an in-season tournament where you're going to play games anyway. So it's like seven, eight games or whatever. This is like the lockout was a whole 70 game season and then the real playoffs after that. So that's my order of importance or however you're ranking the bubble, the lockout, and then the cup because the cup is in season to me what's your ranking i would i would i would

mine's were similar i would just put i would put the lockout then the bubble and then um the emeralds championship see that's interesting and in the comments down below let us know what y'all think about that and i did have a point you made a really good point about even just the rotation on the spurs because you're totally right when cat was sitting i actually thought he was injured because he was sitting for a while but it's like at least the The Knicks had like Mitchell Robison, even Jordan Clarksons, what they were doing was working, where they could constantly put up points even when Kat was out. So I don't know. It was interesting, but of course it worked out in their favor.

So again, congrats to the Knicks. So moving along, Terrence Crawford has announced his retirement from boxing. So he retires with a 42 and no record, 31 knockouts, five division world championships, and a three-time undisputed champ Mace. What do you think of his decision to retire? I'm really excited about the fact that he would do this now. But it's just, I hold him up there like with the rest of the goats, right? So FD's Conello the way he did a few times staggering Canello, fighting him with no hydration clause, you know, just being a dog of dogs.

That's how I look at Terrence Crockett, you know. I don't put them over Floyd, but I put them right there with Floyd. and that's a very hard statement for me to make because Florida is just like on a whole other stratosphere, but, you know, when a new young hotness do something and they begin to get to that level, you got to respect people that are making the way for what they're doing today. I would also say that he must just have something special coming up because it just seemed like last week they was trying to make them buy the belt. and this week he's retired.

So I'm not sure how much to plan to this. I hope, hopefully he's not retired because there is still one more fight that he can prove something. I know he's texting and says certain things like there's nothing else to prove. But there's always more to prove, you know. As long as you're living, there's more to prove, even though sometimes as competitors we don't think so. There is one, I would like to see him fight the winner.

of um what's the guy named boots in us and and what's the it's Ortiz Ortiz if the one of them two I would like to see him fight that person but he ain't got time to wait around for them so if this is his closing I put him up there with the goals I don't believe he's retiring I ain't jacking that niggins trying to make him pay sanction fees for the belt they told him I'll pay this fee pay that fee bad I'm retiring how How about that? I'm out.

How about that? I put it on Graham and put sad music behind it and all that shit. Y'all not going to tax me every year or every six months, $300,000, $200,000 to pay a fee to say that I'm the WBA. Whatever belt it is, that be taxing niggas to say that you're the champion. Like May said, it was two weeks ago because they asked us about it when we were in San Antonio what I thought. And I saw it some bullshit.

I wouldn't pay for the shit neither. Because at the end of the day, why do I got to pay a fee? Because I beat up niggas. Like, ain't that the sport we in? We're supposed to beat niggins. I'm supposed to beat niggas up. I beat niggas up, and then I got to pay a fee for doing what I'm supposed to do. Nah, I'm not with it.

I'm retired. But I bet you one thing, let the right money fight come along. Let it be, like Canelo say they want a rematch. I bet you he won't be retired then. I bet you that. I don't think people like Ennis Ortiz bringing the money that he wants to fight. He just had a bigger fight with Canello. Probably made 20 million, maybe more than that.

I have no idea. You're not going to get that money fighting anybody. And I love Ennis. I wanted to see that fight between him and Boots. But, you know, once it's kind of like, once you make a certain amount of money, some people don't want to go backwards and be like, man, I made 30 million.

$30 million for this? Why would I fight for $3 billion? Yeah, so I had to get motivated for a little bit of money. So, the point being is, I just don't think, I think that he's doing this because it's not another big fight

just as of yet. But trust me, if it's another fight, and I don't know, I don't know this for a fact I haven't spoken to terms of Crawford to say this is just my opinion. Not a lot of $50 million joint come up. Like one of them, Jake Paul,

60 millions. pop up talking about he'll fight Jake Paul or one of these people like you fuck him with turkey out of sheet let him get the right back

I think he'll come out of retirement but being that he is retired congratulations champ illustrious career and I think you did everything that you need to do this for but I do think he has a lot left in the tank especially the way we've seen

the fight last fights but I just think if the right fight comes along he'll be unretired We've seen Floyd retire nine times. Floyd always retired. And then they go, Marquez or call him out. Oh, I'll come out of retirement. Riggie had.

Oh, I'll come out of retirement. They'll be retiring, but that money come along. They'll come right out of retirement. Definitely will change things. So, Mace, I know that you say you don't put him over Floyd. So where does he rank in the goat conversation for you? I mean, you got, I got Floyd right? after Muhammad Ali so that's that's saying a lot i got i got i got floyd second i got i got i got

i got him like tied like number three it's like right there i got them tied number no it's a few there's a few people pausing number three like sugar ray sugar ray linnett you know i'm saying he's tied up there with them okay then cam what about you it's it's a lot like i you know i put Floyd, number one, all time when it comes to boxing. Like, the name of the game is boxing. And I always specify that. They be like, Floyd ain't getting no rugged matches. And I'm like, niggas always forget.

Floyd was really, before he was money-made, pretty boy Floyd, and he had over a 50% knockout rate. I put Floyd at the top when it comes to boxing. The name of the game is boxing. But it's so many boxers that we lose. track of history to where we don't realize what boxers were dealing with outside

of boxing, when the mafia was running boxing. Or to Mace's point, I don't know his reasoning, but when you think about Muhammad Ali, somebody who's a world champion who gets stripped of his championship because he doesn't want to go fight in the war and willing to go to jail behind

not going to war, then come back out and then out of fight again to get your championship back that you already had. It was just so much shit with Muhammad Ali to where he should be a lot of people's number one. But if we're just talking about boxing, I put Floyd, then I put Muhammad Ali, but the stuff that Muhammad Ali had to endure outside of boxing is just ridiculous.

You know what I'm saying? Like, when I sit there thinking about the shit Muhammad Ali did, I had to go through, kind of pisses me off. Imagine being a champion, don't want to go to the war, and then lose your belt, then got to go to jail, and then, you know, It's just a whole lot. You got Sugar Ray Robinson where, you know, these are people from the 19, over 100 years ago

to where they had to deal with a lot of shit. So to me, I can't rank Terrence Crawford in the top five, six boxers. The way I think it should be done, my personal opinion, is that we've ranked boxes by errors. And then whoever you have and that error is their top, then you can peak them, can put them in whatever order you want.

So you may have the Sugar Ray Robinson era, the Muhammad Ali era, the Cassius Clay era. A lot of people don't even know, Miami Ali is Cassius Clay. Then you may have, like Mates said, the Marvin Hagler, Sugar Ray era, you know what I'm saying? That was the best era. Yeah, you know what I'm saying,

to where Tommy Hernes is in all, like, you know what I'm saying? Like maybe it'd be you do some shit from 1970 to 1980, 1980, 1990, it's just too. many, but of this era, Terence Crawford is the best. And his record says so. You know, but I just think it's so many people, not just boxers, a lot of shit, it's a lot of history we're going to lose moving forward in life.

You know what I'm saying? Sin gets mad at younger people because when he asked him who Babe Ruth is and he said, and they say the candy bar, he gets the attitude. But I'm saying, you have to realize this, Mace, at the same time, we're older to where, to where we never seen Bay Roof play. But it's niggins to be like, yo, Bay Roof, the best baseball player. Bay Roof, the best baseball player. How if he didn't play against no black people?

Yeah. He ain't playing against no black people. Even like when, you know what I'm saying? but you lose this history. You sit here. Hank Aaron, the first black baseball player, right? Yeah. No, not Hank Aaron.

I'm sorry. Hank Aaron hit the most home runs. Yeah, home runs. Hank, it wasn't Hank Aaron, the niggins. Jackie Robinson, thank you. My apologies, Hank Aaron and Jackie Robertson for disrespecting. These be like Jackie Robinson, the best baseball player, right?

He ain't played against no black player. He the best baseball player. If he ain't playing against no black baseball player, And I shouldn't know Jackie Robbins to the legacy. Oh, it's disrespectful, Kim. Yo, how are you going to do that just about it? You wild. But he did.

He was out there. He was the first black nigger to be killing man, white niggas. And poor playing baseball. So it'd be like. He's like saying Pete Rose was a nice. He was paying for it. He was paying for it. Well, I ain't going to do that to Pete Rose

because Pete Rose ain't do nothing wrong to me, but bet that his team was going to win. Yeah. So my thing with Pete Rose is like, I get it betting's illegal to know that, but I ain't bet on us to lose. I'm bad we're going to win. So I just think it's...

They should overthrow that. Just like, you know how people got charges of marijuana and now marijuana is legal. The charge shouldn't be as strong. Just like, you know, Babe Ruth, they're betting on games now. But I guess the difference is when you're a player. But that's how I felt looking at the San Antonio game.

Somebody might have got paid. I don't know. There's no way they were supposed to go that coal in the fourth quarter. That's all I kept thinking. I had to turn it all. I said, man, I hope ain't nobody getting paid in San Antonio. This would be wow. But, you know.

Yeah, but it's a bunch of boxes that Joe Loo. It's a lot of history is going to get lost, man. And it's just the way it is. It's people. Yeah, because we didn't even bring up Mike Tyson. Yeah, it's an era, though. I didn't forget about Mike Tyson. it all, shout out to Mike.

Mike is definitely. It just, is he one of the best heavyweights ever? You know what I'm saying? In his era, he was, but do you put him on top ahead of Muhammad Ali? That's what I said need to be errors. Like I was, to finish up where I was going to say a lot of history is going to be lost

because we're just getting older and certain shit is not going to be remembered because it just gets older and older and older. It's like when we call Staddenmill knife, she doesn't know Alf, how's you going to get mad, and because she doesn't know Alf. You know what I'm saying? How are you going to get mad

because she doesn't know Rudy from the Cosby show? Like, Stad, you don't know Rudy? No. That's a wow. Why was I supposed to know? That's what I'm saying? I got your black girl. A little black girl.

How do you not know the little black girl? Stad, what happened to girl power and all of it? Could you name Mace all the little rascals right now? Some of them. But that's the point. That's my point. You can't name them. It was like kind of old enough, but kind of not really old enough.

But that's the difference, though. I would say that that is kind of the difference, though. At least we knew we had some recollection of this, of that time, you know, like it's kind of different. Like if somebody was to bring up Reggie Jackson, I know Reggie Jackson was a baseball player. I don't think the L.A. clipper. So, you know what I'm saying?

And some people whose history in sports don't go back further enough to be in the positions that they're in, I mean, you got to somehow be an historian of what you're talking about. The whole thing about it is this. Statt knows who Bill Cosby is. That's who Rudy comes from. You don't know Rudy without Bill Cosby.

So if she knows Bill Cosby, she does know roundabout. Secondly, what I will say is this, and I'm not disagreeing with you, is this. When we grew up, you had 13 channels. And if you was had cable, you was lucky. You

to turn shit, if you had to antenna on your TV, and sometimes you have to stand by TV, make it work. Yeah. You had 13 channels. You had to be home at a certain time to watch what you wanted to watch. There was no DVR to tape it. Then luckily, later on, you get VCR.

Stack grew up, if you, ever she grew up, it's a thousand channels. If you want to watch cable, you might just want to watch apps. You might just want to sit there and say, yo, I'm looking at my app. So the options from when she's growing up, She's growing up from the options when we grow up are totally different. You know what I'm saying?

You had to slap our TV. Yeah, that's what I'm saying. You had to slap it on the side. That's a flat. Then you had to have aluminum for you. Yeah, ordinary antennae on tape. I remember my grandmother said, I went to change the antenna. She's like, stay there.

Because if you walk away from the TV, you don't even know what I'm talking about. Like, this TV gets fuzzy. If you walk away from this shit, like, so their options is, different even growing up as far as radio is concerned you had to turn on the radio i have a tape deck yo turn to kiss fm yo turn to 107.5 this before a hot 97 even got there then you have to put the little two pieces in the tape if you want to record it two little tissues in your tape so i can record yeah so you can record now niggas got Spotify digger's got apple music nigga you ain't not the way on no line to go to HMV to get the album.

You want an album, you go right now on your phone and be like, yeah, I want the album. I remember I went on tour. Last time right before the pandemic, I went on tour. And I was doing a meeting, greet backstage. There's like, y'all, I said, I see you singing word for word. He said, yeah, we copped the album last night and just listened to it all day to day who we got here.

Because they just get on their phone. Y'all don't got physically go get it. So I was a little long-winded, but it's mad different shit that they got that we don't have for their age. My son didn't know Ice Q was a rapper or Will Smith. He was shocked. He's bugging. I will say, though, no, because I think this is a great conversation, but there's also so much information to consume. Because I know, Mace, you're saying, like, you should somewhat be a historian for things that you're interested in, which is also true.

But there's so many different sections of things to go back and, like, learn about that sometimes. sometimes it's harder to keep up and you can only go based off of kind of what you've seen. That's why even just like I know we were talking about boxing, but even when you go to basketball, like there's still that difference in debate when it talks about like Jordan versus LeBron because a lot of people in my age, I mean, Jordan retired 2003. I'm born in 2001. Like I wasn't watching that era of basketball. I'm watching the LeBron era basketball and even just down to wrestling like more people.

I mean, I know the Undertaker retired later on, but like that wasn't what a string of people were watching especially if you grew up younger like me more people are like more prone to like watching john sina and then seeing his retirement tour and things like that so it's hard to kind to kind of go back and we learn even though you should but even just like like even example like even documentaries now like there of people like who are around like y'all's age like those are dogs and i know for y'all y'all are just like but we're still young like we're still doing this and that but for us like that's considered history because it wasn't our time so I just think going back and learning things, everybody should do it, but it's hard.

And so you kind of have to go off of a lot of things that you saw and add that to your decisions that you make. Oh, yeah. I'm in agreement with you. I'm just saying, like, you shouldn't see Bo Jackson and go, who, Bo Bo? Like, you got to know who Bo Jackson is. You got to know who Rick Flares. You ain't got to know all of niggas, but it's certain pieces.

You got to know this person. But see, that's the other thing, because even Rick Flair, you, like, there's the songs. We got Rick Flair, drip phone. And you would ask somebody, they'd be like, who Rick Flair? Be like, the song? Like, and that's why every time. You see how that name is still in the songs. Yeah.

It's like certain people, I'm saying. Not everybody. But she's right, because niggas, but you'll sing that song and don't know Rick play is. You got a song, teach me out of Dougie. Niggas don't know who Dougie fresh is. Niggas do the dancing and all that and have no idea who, Who the fuck, Dougie? It's fucked up.

It is, but it's the truth. What I do is this. This is what I tell us something when we argue, right? You got to know who Doug is. I promise you, teach me out of Dougie. Diggas will do the dance and have no idea who Duggy. You got to realize. Dougie's out in 86.

Yeah, I know. I'm saying it's certain things you got to know. Like, L.L. You ain't got to know all of niggas. You ain't got to know everybody. Like, we know Dodger Faxonics. We go all the way back, you know. I'm going to keep it 100.

If I ain't not a country of, if I see Cadillac Records, I wouldn't know money waters. I just wouldn't. And that's how I relate it, right? For instance, right? And I want you to finish. You can finish all. I'll just tell you I'll relate to because I'm going to agree with you

certain shit you should know. Right now, right? Let's just use Doug E. Fresh for an example, right? Dougie Fresh come out 85. So let's just, that's when Lottie Dottie came out, 1985. That's literally 40 years ago, right? Wow. Literally, not even figuratively.

Wow. Lottie came out 40 years ago with him and Slick Rick. So now let's say when we're growing up, right? Mm-hmm. Let's just say 95, like when we like, you know, officially out of not be teenage, out of school, so like 95, we're rapping or whatever. So, 95, we should know what was going on in 1955. When you do the math, that's what I'm saying.

When you do the math, you'd be like, yo, y'all, when your uncle would be like, y'all being wild disrespectful. Frankie Beverly. Frankie Beverly even, the 70. I didn't do Frankie Lee, Frankie Beverly, but muddy waters. Yeah. The rat pack. Sammy Davis, Jr., them, niggas.

Like, I'm not saying we shouldn't. Like I said, I want your opinion this thing, but I'm just saying, sometime you got to think of the frame, the time frame. And this is why I be telling you, I'd be telling sin this shit. Yo, it's 40 years since Lottie came out. And you mad at the stat for not knowing Lottie.

But if you were in 1995, well, let's go 85, because he's outside at 10. Yeah. What was going on in 1945? music league and who won the championship that year. As a matter of fact. Please. Yeah, I hear what you're saying, but 30 years from now,

Stad will be asking people, how do you not know Drake? Yeah, and that's life. That's how that sounds does. How do you not know Tyler the creator? And that's what I said, history. Right? History. It would be like that.

I'm just letting you know how it sounds us. But that's history, that's what's going on. That's what I said, history will be. will be lost. Because imagine when them asking about Tyler the creator and a nigga

trying to bring up Kumo D. Nobody's going to be around. Kumo D. You're right, Mason. History will be lost, man,

a lot of them. But at least you got the internet. We have to go to the library. Yes, that. It's also crazy. It'll be like you're talking to a black

kid from California and he says he doesn't know Tyler the Creator. You're from L.A. You don't know how the creator it sounds so crazy yeah so i think that this is the perfect question before we go to break because this is all a great conversation as a whole so then how do you describe greatness do you bring it to rings longevity impact like what makes somebody great i think for every every person

is something different for me it encompasses it at all like the rings the impact um the legacy you know Sometimes it's sad because when I was younger, I didn't notice that you can do great all the way to the end and do something stupid. And it's like people don't see you on goat level no more. When really you were one of those, you were a really special talent and a rarity and there will never be another one. But when it comes to me, I think of whoever is going to be like the, you said a goat, the greatest. Yes. It got to be the person who did it, did it the best. To me, I would just sum it up to that.

Because people often like to bring money into it. They bring other things into it. But when it comes down to it, it's who performed at the highest level for me. Who, which is exactly how do you actually question? Yeah, so how do you describe greatness? Because we talked about it in different forms where music, wrestling, boxing. Like, do you think it's longevity, rings? It depends on what you're talking about sports.

We can do sports. Because it'll be a great doctor. Yeah. Be a great lawyer. But we're talking about sports. There's different things. Like sports a lot has to go right. Outside to me, outside of tennis, golf, boxing and swimming,

it takes other people to help you be great. Those sports are by yourself. It's no help. Nobody can sub in for you in tennis. In tennis, nobody can sub in for you for boxing, swimming neither, and golf either. So those sports I take, I give my hat off. Like, you know, on the hood,

I've really become a really big tennis fan over like the last 10 years probably, because I didn't realize how much skill it takes, how much you have to be on your own to win. Like, tennis match, a good tennis match, like it can go six, seven hours. I see them stop a tennis match after eight, nine hours, and pick it up the next day

because you can hit the... Like, that shit is a lot of skill. I'm a really big tennis fan because you can shake niggas in that shit, pause. Look, like I said, a lot of people like, tennis should watch some good tennis one day and appreciate it. But when you come into team sports,

it takes a lot to be great because when you think, of course, Michael Jordan, he's the greatest to me. But he couldn't win without Scotty Pippen. So does not make Scottie Pippen great too? It's just levels of great. So Scotty Pippen can have the argument with as great as Joy was, he couldn't win without me.

You know what I'm saying? Same thing where you could say Kobe was the greatest. And yeah, and depending on wherever you grew up in. But you sit there and say, he ain't win-win without Derek Fisher. You can bring Paul Gasol and Shaq and all that, Derek Fisher, like don't act like, I wasn't there for every last one of them joints.

You know what I'm saying? So when you're in a team sport, you just can't be great by yourself. You have people to me, Charles Barkley was great. He's not a champion. You know what I mean? The word goat, I hate it.

I just hate the word goat. Because they'd be like, I think it's a goat. What up, goat? What up goat? The word goat stands for the greatest of all time. Not everybody's great. It's a hundred goats.

How's a hundred goats if the actual abbreviation is for greatest of all time. Not all these great niggins. Shout out the L.L.L. Yeah, L.L.O. coined it. Yeah, exactly. 100%. Absolutely.

So I just hate to be like, yo, that niggas a goat. You look at all these goats in the room. This thing is a goat. Yo, how many goats? I thought there's only one goat. That's what the abbreviation stands for. The abbreviation is of all time.

How many, how many, yeah, if goats isn't. But team sports, I don't know what defines it because in team sports, you need a lot of help to be great. Tom, last thing, I'm sorry, Mace. Tom Grady's great, the great issue, say. But he ain't passed to himself.

Niggas had to catch the ball. You know what I'm saying? As much as we give these quarterbacks a lot of credit, it's a lot of receivers or tight ends pores that don't get as much credit for making these niggas look great. I don't know how to answer that question because it takes a lot in team sports to be great.

Sorry, Mason. Yeah, and another good question I wanted to ask you was, and even people out there that's watching, feel free to answer this in the comment section. You know, what do you think about when it comes to rap? Do you see that as an individual sport, or would you consider it like a team sport? Rap?

Yeah, like when you're a rap or is it individual or a team? to me it depends on the errors like when you're sitting there talking about 90s rap if you've heard the way you have to have the skill let's start there you have to have the skill that's what it starts with but then you have to be around the right shit the right situation right let's say for instance right

I'll just use us for an example Mace got in a great situation for us he had the skill but you're moving You get into a growing label, a bad boy label to where you have this aspiring young CEO and you have this big time rapper that just fucking everybody started loving and Biggie Smalls and there you got an R&B group and 112 and it's the hip thing and not only that you have a great staff behind you but you have to have the talent so you have the machine to help you move your talent to where

me and God bless the dead my cousin bloodshed we were talented but we wanted to rush and do a deal because Mace did a deal and we signed with some bozos and we didn't have a machine behind us and we didn't have the help

and not saying we had the songs that Mace had but we didn't have no type of push whatsoever because this label was not it so when you say a team sport in an era of the

90s my opinion when you got a machine to help you it looks good you have death row you have cash money you have no limit you have um bad boy Tupac was a solo artist he did decent when he was a solo artist but when he got with death row yeah he became he he became he he exactly he became an icon he was already on endoscope he had decent records but when he was part of a movement and a team it looked it looked good to me The reason I even started the diplomats is because I always felt movements worked or teams worked.

When you sat there and we talk about shit, like you talk about native tongue, pause. Starr would never know who native tongues is. Poor rights, just teachers. You got Queen Latifah Dres and there's some niggas, black sheep, jungle brothers, you know, dayline. Yeah, you know what I'm saying?

I'm like even the native tongues had a movement you know what I'm saying and then you got cash money and don't lemon and murder ink and rough riders and I'm like people like movements and you have arguments amongst each other about

who you like better like I said I told this story about eight nine times different times but I started when I was thinking about diplomats I was on 40 if the niggas was arguing about who was the best nigger in no I like, I like Fiend. Like, I like Mr. Servorn.

Now, they're about to get mystical, mystical crate. I bet. It's all in the same shit, though. Yeah. It's all, y'all, y'all arguing about niggas who in the same shit. So that used to be my to, okay, you don't like Jim, but you liked you else.

You don't like you else, but you like Jim. You don't like Jim, but you like Kim. Okay, you ain't fucking with nine three of the things. You got the, I like the real spit. It's the underground, the 40 cows, and the J.R. right. Right. As long as you arguing about what's under the umbrella, I didn't give a fuck. You know what I'm saying? So I think it is team to be really successful publicly and behind the scenes to help out.

But nowadays, you just put a TikTok out. A good dance. Yeah, TikTok and the dancing. Who do you really meet? Stad, do you know goodie mob is? Goody mob? No, I don't. No, I just figured they're from the south. I don't. Before you go to break, got to ask you, do you see it as solo or as a team thing?

I definitely see the 90s as a team sport. Even the early 2000, it was still a team sport. I think you don't get to individuals to TikTok come out. But even before that, even Young Money is a team. You know, and everybody's success make the next person goes. Great answer. And I do know the song, South. I had to search it up because sometimes I don't be knowing the names. Okay, we're going to go to break. We return. We will discuss Jake Paul versus Anthony Joshua.

Don't go anywhere. Okay. Put the light on it. DJ, the dime life brand is serious. I love that shirt you got on. Like this and your bank account is that much? You say whatever the fuck you want a second. Rally around him with that.

you know, the picture of his daughter sitting on the lap, the LSU player. Will we have it as you can join us? Man, thank you for having me. Look, I tell you. Okay, let me tell you like this. I got too much money to be fighting. We ain't got that no more. And we've taken that song a long time and made it our anthem.

Paul A. Jenkins. I even put your bullshit-ass book up here on my, on my, uh, You know what I mean? Welcome to start with the facts. Welcome back. Now let's get into our underdog picks of the day. Tonight, the Timberwolves will play the Grizzlies. Underdog has Anthony Edwards at 27 and a half points.

Do you have them higher, lower Mace? I'm going higher, man. Anthony Edwards turn up. You know, you got Castle turning up. All of the players from Atlanta. from the inner city is going crazy in the NBA. So I'm looking forward to them getting higher. Who they play?

They're playing the Grizzlies. Yeah, I'm going to go high. Yeah, they don't got nobody that could guard Anthony Edwards on the Grizzlies. Okay. John Morant is at 18 and a half points. Do you have them higher, lower cam? Who knows? I'm going to go higher, hopefully.

Hopefully him and Amman will put a show on. man yeah um i'm definitely going high for jah okay are you starting up like lose hope is a strong word i don't think i don't think he wants to i don't know if he play there yeah i don't think he wants to play there or he doesn't like coaching or he doesn't like something that's going on that he does not like in his situation situation in memphis i'm not saying he doesn't want to be in memphis i'm not saying he's not nice anymore. I just think it's a bad situation, whatever it is. I don't know what it is.

I have no information on it. But you can tell he's not happy with what's going on in Memphis currently. Yeah. Okay. And Jaron Jackson Jr. is at 19.5 points. Do you have higher or lower Mace? I'm going to go higher because they're definitely going to need somebody else to put up points against this Minnesota team.

So he's going to have to get higher. I'm going higher. Hi. Okay, make sure y'all down on the Underdog app and you can make your picks too. So let's get into this Jake Paul versus Anthony Joshua fight. They will fight this Friday.

So before we get into our predictions, Cam, seeing that you hosted the face-to-face interaction, how was that experience? And then I want you guys to give your prediction for who you think will win. Yes, shout out to Jake Paul, shout to Anthony Joshua, shout to Netflix for,

let me host a joint. I had hosted Jake Paul's joint against Mike Tyson, too. But it was dope. It seemed like from the face off, look, forget the faceoff. Face it was really good.

It's out now, too. I didn't even know it was out until last night. But when I got there, they're ready to fight. And what I would say is this. And I ask these questions as well. It's a lot of speculation when they like, yo, it was clauses in the Mike Tyson contract with Jake Paul saying

Mike Tyson couldn't hit him here, he couldn't do this, this, that, and third. Jake Paul is actually suing niggas who pumped that. We're not pumping that Jake Paul. I'm just saying that's what people in boxing were saying. And they're saying that if Jake Paul beats people, and this is not a faceoff. I'm just going from people whose boxing fans or casual boxing fans, if Jake Paul wins this fight, it's like another setup. I think this was the perfect fight

when lose a draw for Jake Paul to get some credit. The reason being is this. Anthony Joshua has some big plans for 2026 as far as making a comeback in the heavyweight division. He lost to Yucic. He wants to fight Yusick again. He wants to set up something with Tyson Fury. so him losing this fight or throwing his fight or some shit like that

it just wouldn't look good for him pursuing his career back in the championship conversation secondly Eddie Hearn who's his promotion set promoter said he doesn't put on exhibition fights this he's taking this absolutely as a real fight so what I will say to the general public this is not an exhibition fight this is a 12 round sanctioned heavyweight fight that's about to happen. So as far as the fight concern, who should win? Anthony Joshua should win. He's an Olympic gold medalist.

But Jake Paul, what was the word of it? A puncher's chance. Yeah. He has a punches chance. Anthony Joshua's last fight, we've seen him get knocked out in the fifth round. He has a fourth since 13 months ago. So we see Jake Paul fight.

and knock people out. I don't think he knocked anybody out to Anthony Joshua's caliber. But that's with some of the people that's rooting for Jake Paul is saying that he could knock him out. Actually, Tyson Fury picked Jake Paul to knock out Anthony Joshua.

Jake Paul believes that Anthony Joshua doesn't have any boxing skills. He has punching power, and he's big, and Paul's, and he knocks things out. Jake Paul actually says, Thanks to his boxing skills are way better, way better part of me than Anthony Joshua. So we'll see what happens this Friday. Yeah, this fight is very interesting because when I'm thinking about Jake Paul and his fight in style,

even though Jake Paul shouldn't beat Anthony Joshua, he has a right hand that could help him win, Not just a punch his chance. I remember when I first saw Anthony Joshua lose to Andy Ruiz. That same looping over the head right hand is the same punch that I know Jake Paul is thinking about. Because every time he comes in, flat-footed and just think he's walking somebody's down, he's always susceptible to that over-the-top right hand. It's the same punch that caught him against Daniel Du Bois, the same punch that put him on.

on his back, paused three times against Andy Ruiz. So this is actually the perfect fight for him that he could win against somebody credible. He shouldn't beat Anthony Joshua. Anthony Joshua should beat him the same way he beat Andy Ruiz. It's kind of the same height, not built, but around the same height. So I look forward to this. This is a very interesting fight. Like Killer said, he got to make his way back if he want to fight.

um you sick but this this can turn bad really fast and this will put jake paul right way he needs to be so i'm looking forward to it okay and last thing before we wrap so we got an interesting comment from joe burrow after the bangles laws he said if i want to keep doing this i have to have fun doing it i've been through a lot and if it's not fun then what am i doing it for so that's the mindset i'm trying to bring to the table so as we know joe bro just turned 29 he also said I think I've been through more than most, certainly not easy on the brain or the body, so just trying to have fun doing it again. Mace, hearing those comments from Joe Burrow, does that concern you? And like, what exactly do you think he mean? I think when it comes to Joe Burrow,

Joe Burrow is in one of those interesting positions, pause that when it comes down to it, when you know your history in sports, he'll be remembered if everything was to stop today like Penny Hardaway. Penny Hardaway was exceptional. He had all the goods. He had all the talent. But just his body wouldn't hold up to give him the vehicle to take him to the top. He had the mindset. He had the wherewithal.

He had everything but a body that would take him there. So I look at Joe Burrow the same way. It's not just the team. It's when your body won't allow you to do what your brain is telling you could do. It's one of the most frustrating things to do. and positions to be in. Yeah, this is concerning, man. He's 29.

And what happens is this. I think Joe Burrough, because his injuries, Mace made a great analogy with using Penny Hardaway. That was actually a really, really good analogy. You say having fun and you're not having fun, and I know that they got shut out the other day by Baltimore, and that's never fun. But you're not there a lot of the time, Joe Burroughs.

And, you know, I'm a big advocate for you. But how do you think Jamar Chase feels or T. Higgins feels when they can't get a lot of chemistry with you because you're not available? And then you sit there like, it's not fun because y'all got smacked. You wasn't there this season for half the season. So this fall half the season. And we know that you came back because you weren't to play.

and you're showing your resilience and your toughness. But you can't say it ain't fun. Like, you can't get $275 million say, shit ain't fun. How does that make me feel as an owner giving you that money? And then you be like, I'm just not having fun. Well, I didn't pay you to have fun. I paid you to win for this organization. If you're having fun while you're doing it, it's a plus.

But I need you to win for 270. $25 million. That's just that. But yeah, this is concerning, but I get what he's saying. We're losing. I'm tired of losing. But Joe Burrow, you have to be available.

Chemistry and it means a lot in football. You have to be available. The one season that you, one of the two seasons that you play the full season, you went to the Super Bowl. So I understand where you're coming from, you're like, when I play a full season, we go to the Super Bowl.

What about the other four seasons that you have? I haven't been able to play full seasons. I'm a fan of the Bengals. I'm a fan of Joe Burrow. But these comments are alarming. And I wouldn't know how to take them if I was a teammate, a coach, a general manager, or owner. I would definitely have a meeting and say maybe rephrase that, possibly. And I know you say rephrase it, but it's like, if that's truly how he feels, like,

what do you all think that next step should be? Just curious, because it's like if something you love, kind of. just doesn't become fun anymore than what are you supposed to do, you know? I think that's a motion coming off a 24-point loss. Like, yo, he didn't say that's after they won or anything. The other day when they went on Thanksgiving, he's up there with the niggas eating turkey and all that shit. You know what I'm saying?

It was all peachy keen that day. You get smacked by division rival by 24 points. You throw two interceptions. Shinn ain't fun. I think it was emotional, but still even emotional as a professional, you can't say that as the leader of the team. Yeah, that's kind of, it's definitely alarming. In some cases, it could be seen as weird because to be great, you've got to have an

obsession about what you're doing. If you're not obsessed with what you're doing, you're probably not going to be great at it. So when you get to the level of talking about, is it fun, you're not even on the level to compete with great players. That will be my tape. Yeah. Well, I hope he finds his mojo back, but y'all, that is all the time that we have for today. Thank y'all for watching. And as always, it is what it is. You know,