IT IS WHAT IT IS - THE JALEN DUREN DILEMMA, ANTHONY EDWARDS HANDSHAKE INCIDENT, SGA MVP & AYO CAM WHAT YOU MEAN BY THAT LYRIC?!

Episode Date: May 18, 2026

Cam’ron & Treasure "Stat Baby" Wilson are back with another one!! Please rate, review, and follow the podcast for more content.  Listen to the show on Spotify!  https://open.spotify.com/show/4Brb7BgCw4f4jwgS5v3sXQ?si=811988ecff7b416a Listen to the show on Apple Podcasts! https://podcasts.apple.com/us/podcast/it-is-what-it-is/id1719695401 Keep up with us on social media! https://www.instagram.com/itiswhatitis_talk/ Snap:  https://www.snapchat.com/add/iiwii_talk2023  Facebook:  https://www.facebook.com/ItIsWhatItIsTalk TikTok: https://www.tiktok.com/@maseandcam Twitter:  https://www.x.com/iiwiitalk Follow Our Hosts! https://www.instagram.com/masonbetha/ https://www.instagram.com/mr_camron/ https://www.instagram.com/treasurewilsxn/ Follow the show and our hosts on social media: ⁠⁠⁠It Is What It Is⁠⁠⁠, ⁠⁠⁠Cam'Ron⁠⁠⁠, ⁠⁠⁠Ma$e⁠⁠⁠, and ⁠⁠⁠Treasure "Stat Baby" Wilson⁠⁠⁠ , ⁠⁠⁠Producer Ayooo Nick⁠⁠⁠ Learn more about your ad choices. Visit megaphone.fm/adchoices

Welcome back to It Is What It is. I'm Tresor Wilson, aka Stab Baby, along with your host, Cam. Mace will be back, and y'all, today we got Nick joining the show. We back again. I mean, I'm back. I'm here all the time, but back on the show. Thank you for the call up. Thank you for the intro.

Nice. Cam, how you feeling? How you doing? I'm good. How are you doing, man? Everything all right? Yes, great. Can I just say, the vlog you posted.

on Instagram was so tough. If y'all are watching and haven't checked it out, make sure you all go check it out because big business. That's all I'm going to say. Big business. That's what it gave. Yeah, that's like that. That's real, thanks for people like that's my life like all the time.

I can't do that shit every day though. I ain't going to lie. I don't, you got to realize, tell it tape some of it, but I take most of that shit and I edit it myself. Like all that shit. Like, I added it, record tail and tape about 20% of it. But still, like, yeah, put it like that. I do that at least twice a week, man.

I'm getting a little more rest. People are concerned about my rest. Please go to sleep. Yeah, I got to do the same shit tomorrow. Same exact shit. Crazy. Grind out stop. But it's definitely cool to see the process.

Rather tonight into tomorrow. Crazy. Yeah, you got them vlogging now, is that. He's down with Gen Z. You're Jan Zian. He's like, he'd been vlogging. It was called something else. Yeah, it was called some other shit.

It wasn't called vlogging. And then the crazy shit is I was reading some comments. Somebody said, I'm old for still calling their vlogging. That's like, I don't know it. I don't know what to me. I can't keep up, man. But yeah, thanks for recommending that. But people loved it.

So check it out. So on the OnD. Your Welcome Network and this on my Instagram as well. Yeah, super, super dope. And then just last thing about vlogging. It is a lot. Because like you said, you edited it too.

Like, that's why people stream now because you don't have to do all that stuff. But it's like both sides are good. I like both sides of them. Yeah. You look like that? Yeah, the whole thing is, yeah, I mean, don't get me wrong.

Some of it, some of them, like, you don't want to. I get streaming too, but like the 25-minute car rides or the three-and-a-half-hour car rides is like, you gotta cut some of that shit out, for me, anyway. Yeah. Unless you're going to be entertaining the whole time. Right.

Yeah, you ain't kidding. because I went to Power Slap on Friday for the first time. Every other person had a camera guy with them. Like, that shit was crazy. Like, overwhelming. Like, literally, there's an influencer and then they got the camera guy. Some people had, like, three of them. You're like, yo, what the fuck is going on?

You can't do nothing. Yeah, no, that's the main thing. And all the cameras are on all the time for hours. Because I know Cam was like, why would somebody want to sit and watch a three-hour car ride? They do. People be entertained. Like, that's why there's something for everybody to watch. I will say that.

Okay, so let's get into these games. So the Cavs advanced the Eastern Conference Finals after beating the Pistons, 125-294 in game seven. So, Cam, what statement did the Cavs make with this game? The Cavs actually made a great statement. I think the difference in this game actually was, well, you know, it seemed like from second quarter on, Detroit just didn't have any momentum, and the Cavs didn't really live.

let them back in the game. But Jared Allen, to me, you know, they didn't, don't give me one, James Hardin, Donovan, Mitchell, doing things, but Evan Mobley and Jared Allen is the difference makers that actually made the difference. It was time they made Derren look too little. When you got Mowgli on the same thing, even with Jared Allen. Tobias Harris looked way too little, guarded him. and I think they really wanted to prove that they can make it.

Because you got to think about this. This is a young Pistons team. Don't get it wrong, they came in first in the league this year, finishing the regular season, top of the Eastern Conference. But James Hardin and Donovan Mitchell reputation kind of was on the line. It was one of the situations where we say Donovan Mitchell never gets past the, second round. It was one of the situations we say

James Hart never performs in games six and sevens. But they have an opportunity to go and play against a pack of dogs because the Knicks are looking like a wild pack of dogs right now. And just the matchup that I wanted to see, I remember you asked us last week, Stath, who you rather

see. And I know that people say Detroit gave the Knicks a hard time during the regular season. I actually didn't want to see that matchup. That's why I picked Cleveland because I really believed that the Knicks wanted Detroit, for people who do believe, oh, Detroit can give them a hard time. Detroit can give them a hard time.

Knicks probably wanted revenge to say, don't let the regular season confuse you with the postseason because it's two totally different things. But I do want to see Donovan Mitchell against Jalen Brunson. I want to see what James Harton does, but the rest of them, and I think they have some reasonable big men, not saying that Evan Mowgli is bad than Kat. But I think it's a great matchup. You got Jared Allen against O. OG. I think it's a great, great matchup. Spruce is kind of like heart, intensity, a lot of energy.

So I got the matchup that I wanted to see. And I think Detroit still has some time to get it together. I know J.B. Bickerstaff really wanted to win because, you know, Darwin Mitchell is not a secret. Actually, he got fired. He's not going to say that. We have no proof of that out loud. But he signed his contract soon as J.B. Bickerstaff got five. So I know J.B. Biggers Sapp is more hurt than anybody else. But congratulations to the Cleveland Cavaliers. And I look forward to this matchup with them against the next. You know what I'd be thinking, Statt? Anytime a team gets their shit punched open in game seven at home, pause. Okay. Think about how much money those Pistons fans spent to buy a ticket to that shit.

And then just to have the game over by halftime. It's like, yo, you just, they put you out the misery, right? 31 point blowout, eighth largest margin of victory in a game seven in NBA history. And by the middle of the third quarter, it's like, yo, beat the traffic, get out of there. And I think the fallout from this to Cam's point, Donovan Mitchell first time making it to the conference finals, James Hardin, I said it last time I was on the show. This dude in big games, just there's something about them. And even tonight, two or ten from the field, O for six. So think about that shit,

that he played so bad. He gave you a vintage prime James Hardin in a big spot game, and they still blew the pistons out by 30. That goes to show you how bad Detroit was. Tobias Harris, five points. Jalen Duren, who, I mean, this guy, from an all-MBA, either second or 13 this year,

due for a supermax extension this offseason, to now it's like, yo, I know he's 22 years old. What the fuck do you do with him? Do you, is, is this who he really is? Is it, yo, it's the first time he's in the playoffs. And also it's the first time this, well, they made the playoffs last year. But this year they had expectations, you know? Like we talked about it last week with Cam and his team with the Spurs.

It's like, all right, at the start of the season, you're happy if you make the playoffs because they overachieve. But now it's like, yo, you're a 61 team. I feel like I'm someone that I think expectations change as you get more information and you see how shit plays out. So, Cam, I got a question for you, bro. When it comes to Jalen Duren, how do you feel about him? He's 22 coming off of all-N-B-A season, made the All-Star. He might get an extension this summer. Is that something that you think might hinder the Pistons?

See, the thing about it is this, right? And I didn't say his name before because I was like, I don't want to say his name. When I was like, it's a lot of All-Stars, that shouldn't be All-Stars. But what happens is when you're... I had said that a couple weeks ago. And he's one of the people I was referring to. And I don't mean in a bad way because you have to think about this. The reason why it's probably an all-star, when you have the best record going into the

all-star break, you have at least two all-stars. You've got to give him another all-star. Because when you have the best record, sometimes even like last year, right, I believe the, I let's not believe I know the Cavaliers had the best record. Then they had three all-stars, Evan Mobley, Darius Garry's Garland, and Mitchell. Are they all really all-stars? I'm not saying they didn't deserve it that year,

but it's like they have a ridiculous great record. You have to piss him out there. So I'm not saying that he shouldn't be an all-star, but it's about he's going to work on his game. He really needs to work on his game. And I believe he's young enough to get good. Like, we want results right away. Like, Cade had a terrible game too.

You know, Tate only had 13 points, so you can't put it all on Duren. but at the end of the day, Kay needs help. A lot of double teams coming his way, et cetera. It's a tough call to make. Do I give him the extension? I mean, I have to talk with him and see how dedicated he is or getting better because I believe it's a lot of upside when it comes to Durham.

But right now, when you look at other players, his age, you know, it's just you're looking at Stephon Castle who's younger than him. You're looking at Dylan Harper, who's younger than him. And when you see him the Spurs do right now, now. It's like, yo, this niggas his age right now. There's ready. So it's hard to say when I invest in him. Yeah, he's 22 years old.

I just don't know. It's a great question. If I'm the Pistons organization, I'm having to talk with him because at the end of the day, what else do you have and you don't know who else you can attract into all season? So yeah, I'm giving it to him. Same way that we thought a couple years, they may

not should have gave Cade, the extension that they gave Cade. they came to extension a couple of years now they're like yo what are you what are those niggins paying them all this fucking money he's a number one pick he boasts to be doing number one pick shit and it took him a little longer to develop than we had probably liked to see but he's a perennial all-star right now um so to answer your question i know it's a little bit long minute uh nick but i would give it to him yeah and stat if he does make all mb a this year you're looking at 49 million next year 53 million in year two 61 and

and then 65. Yeah, it's crazy. And then for more context, that's about 60% of the cap to Cade and Duren. So like if that's your one, two points, that's why the Supermax is such a big deal because it's not like baseball. Like if you look at the Dodgers and the Yankees, they got, like the Dodgers got eight guys that make over $250 million. You can't do that in the NBA.

So if you're given two dudes 60% of your cap, you got to be like that. And, you know, being harsh to Kemp's one, that's a good ass point. about Cade, how everyone was like, yo, you're bugging giving them that money at the time. But now you're looking at it like, you kind of got them cheap because if you would have waited to extend them later on. So I think that's a big, big question for the Pistons this offseason stat. Yeah. I would go ahead, Kim.

Yeah, real quick, before you go stat, you got to realize this. Who are they attracting them? And I'm not dissimacy. I love to say in Detroit. And I don't know Kay's personality, but who's, who's going to be free agent like, y'all, I'm thinking about going to the pistons. You might have some people who think like that.

You might have a LeBron James who might think like that, but I'm just saying as far as city-wise. Yeah. I want to go to Detroit. You know what I'm saying? And that's no disrespect to Detroit. I think Detroit's a beautiful city is super dope. You know, I've been there several times.

I'm just saying when you have options as, you're a free agent, I can probably make close to what I'm making. in Miami and New York or Los Angeles or California or the state of Texas. I'm just naming, I don't even know players. I'm just saying as a city, you have to also want to attract players there. And not only that it has to be a player that you want to play with and your living conditions if the ball's in your court.

So you may not have another option outside of Durham. Yeah, I would just hate to be the one making those decisions because I understand, yes, there's upside. Yes, you might not have other options. but when we're just looking at the dollar amount, like kind of Nick was breaking down, just 287 million, I think the biggest thing is still timing because we know that that's a decision that they have to make right now. It would be nice even if they had another year because just the way that he has played in the playoffs alone, even though like we know there is upside.

It's like he played his way out of that contract because it just was not what the expectations were at all. And I know it's like, don't have expectations because then you can't be upset. If it doesn't go that way, I understand that part. But it's looking at this point, it's like for the Pistons even get this part and it even looking as if K didn't even really have that much help, it's like there is something there. And I understand what you're saying about Detroit as well. But even the prior conversations that we've had about like Utah and a lot of different other cities, I just think that sometimes there's a little bit more that could sell people to coming, especially considering where they've gotten given what they've got. So that's my little two cents there. But Jalen Dorgan is a big question mark to me just because all around, I just think. he played very subpar, even though that I know he has the capabilities to play a lot better from what we see in the regular season. No, for sure. Kim said it before in passing.

I was like, yo, who are you bringing in to replace them? And then also, like, what's the alternative too, right? Like, I used to always, I used to always defend teams. It's like when Miami paid Tua in the NFL, right? It's like, damn, you're giving them 200 plus million? It's like, bro, they've been looking for a quarterback to be competent since Marino. So they got a guy, he had two good years with McDaniel and the offense that they had. And they're like, all right, cool, because we've been dealing with shit for 30 years.

So it's kind of like Detroit, right? Two years ago, they won 14 games. We've talked about it on the show so many times that, what was it, Buffalo Wing stat and beers for like 25 cents and shit to get people in the venue. And now they won 60 games. They had the best record in the East. So, yeah, it's easier said than done. But to your point, too, like, you know, he's 22.

Like, I was defending him on my social media. Like, yeah, I know he's getting dragged right now through Twitter and NBA Twitter and social media. But like, dude is 22. And did he get exposed? Yeah, but you look at the east. Yeah, but it happens, though, right? Drake May with the Super Bowl. The whole year we're like, y'all, Drake May the next time Brady, he can't complete a first down in the Super Bowl.

Like, man, he trash. He ain't shit. Yeah. Gotta remember sometimes. These dudes are like, man, young, like he said. Yeah. Cam, I know you have one more point before we move on. no no i was just agreeing like you got everybody's not going to develop

overnight what happens is we're so used to players being one and done or no maximum two years they i'm talking about coming out of college that you sit there and say okay even if you're in college like your third year you're like this dude ain't in the NBA yet he should have been the NBA because we're so used to one and done yeah but realistically if we're looking at perspective from when you know in the 90s when people had to do the

four years or if you, you know, at least two years people like Chris Weber might have done like two years Jaylen Rose three years. You know, you have people, even the grades were still at least two, three years. This dude is really supposed to be a senior in college right now.

You know what I'm saying? We just want people to be one and done so you get the maximum potential that you can get out of them as a professional. But I think he'll be all right. In the regular season, he has 20.5 points per game, 10.5 rebounds, a double double shoot or 65%

from the field. Do they got some growing, going through some growing pains in the playoffs? Yeah, the second year in the playoffs, got bumped the first round, now they're getting bumped in the second round. Took Michael Jordan seven years to get there. It takes time

sometimes. Yeah. And then just getting that confidence back, too, because, like, we're seeing the social media aspect of things because they were dragging him. But as long as he can kind of maintain and remember who he is, there is a lot more upside. But it depends what you do with that. Okay. Moving on to the next game. So the Timberwolves were eliminated from the playoffs after losing to the Spurs 139 to 109.

So, Cam, how did you feel about the energy from the Timberwolves in this game? And how do you feel about your Spurs advancing? I'm being cool about shit. I'm actually being cool about the whole shit. You know what happens? There's no reason to get excited when your team is usually winning. We've been on a little drought for like 10 years. But we're used to winning.

There's no reason to get excited about this. Because when you won this century, five times already, this is what we used to do. But as far as the game that just passed, game six. come on, I mean, we smack them, you know, we got a great cast

all the way around. I'm talking about from the coach, Ms. Johnson, and then, no, I can't remember

the stats off top of my head, and I'm not even going to sit here and going through my computer and get the box score. But I remember out the gate, Stefan Castle coming out,

setting the tone for that game. The Aaron Fox setting the tone, and they went in the Timberwood, chess early and often. Now, the Timberwell was held on for a while. They were sticking around because when I was watching the game, I'm like, yo, get these niggas out of here.

That's the one thing that the Knicks have done this postseason after losing those two games to Atlanta is that once they jump on you force, they're not letting up. There's no coming back. You know, we've seen a couple games of 50 points. And it's been a couple games this season outside of that. games. With teams up 15, 20, 20 points, 29 points. Even like that game with San Antonio's, the time,

he's up 29 points against Tim Wolves, and they cut it to 12, 11 points. I'm like, you got to stay on niggers next when you're up. Stay on their neck. But I'm excited. I think the showdown is the showdown. I know I mentioned before how, you know, She is the head of the snake,

but I think when we got unfinished business with Chet, And he's excited for this Western Conference final that's about to come up. But listen, man, Dillon Harp off the bench, Johnson off the bench. We got the six men of the year, which is Johnson, of course, the starting five, Shempunny, a fucking castle, the Aaron Fox, of course, the Alien. Look, we look really, really, really good. And I'm excited for this series. I'm curious to see if J. Dub is coming back.

But, you know, when I look at San Antonio and even at their home games, they have a lot of experience to teach these young fellas. When we're talking about Dylan Harper being 20 and stuff on Castle being 21 and when we being 22, the people in the building that they show when they're in the commercials or write-off commercial or before the commercial, whatever, when you're looking at Genobley being there. I don't know how. Go Google Genobey. Nashville invented the Euro step. First nigga to invent the Euro step, like he not even from Europe. Then you got David Robertson around.

Then you got Tim Duncan hang around. Then they showed a picture of a Popovich around. The shit did, the basketball knowledge in that building relating to these young fellas is crazy. Even Wembe, you know, I didn't have no idea that Wembe was training with Akeem-Alajewan. You know how dope that is for Wendy to be trained with Akeem Olajuwon, how dope that Akeem Olajuwon moves is still effective in 2026 over 30 years ago

since he won an NBA title. But that's how advanced Akeem Olajuwon was. So I'm looking forward to the next round. Isn't it funny? He kept saying we, we, we, we? I mean, you would say we too. No, I know. I know you actually are.

Spurs favor, but I just found that funny. That's all. I don't know what's funny about it. Actually, we. Look, I can come up here and be obnoxious. I really could. Change when he wore a Celtics jacket. You're like, uh-uh.

If you want me to be obnoxious about my team, I'm trying to be humble about this shit because nothing to be saying. I could be like a Knicks fair right now. I'd be going crazy, losing my mind. But I'm not a Knicks. I don't treat the Spurs like the Knicks. This is what we do.

You act like this, you act like Nick Trans, when that's not what y'all do. That's what I'm saying. There's no reason to be crazy about some shit. But yeah, we, we. I don't speak of French, Niva, we, man. Yo, so I think this game, right, the craziest thing is, to Cam's point, and this is why I think it makes the spurs great.

It makes the thunder great. It's why I've become more cautiously optimistic, stat about the Knicks, they're blowing teams out. You're not playing with your food. You're not letting it come down to one possession with like two minutes left and then some dumb shit happen. Referees call a bad foul or whatever it might be. The review don't go your way. This is what great teams do. They put you out your misery. We saw it game four with the thunder when they did that to the Lakers. It was a close game and then you look back up and they're up 15 again. And this is what the spurs do. I just can't get over the fact that they're Dylan Harper. The craziest thing about Dylan Harper is he looked like he's a

seven-year vet and he's a rookie. Crazy. Castle looks like he's been in the league for 10 years. Wembe is doing Wembe things and we all know about that. And then even the Aaron Fox, I think, gets lost in the shuffle because he's like the old head, but he's not even in his 30s yet. And this team is just complete everywhere. And this is the matchup I've been looking forward to Cam all year. I really think that the winner of this conference finals, is going to go on to win the finals. And it's just, it's been the two best teams all year. The matchups are great.

We'll talk about that in just a little bit. But I think the biggest takeaway from this game is what happened with Anthony Edwards that. Yeah. We'll get there now. But I'm just going to make a quick point. Just even looking at the Timberwolves, Rudy Gobert, Julius Randall, Rudy Gobert has zero points, which is crazy. Because we were just praising him in the last games about what he had been going on,

what he'd been doing. He might be looking like this and that. He was looking like nothing. And Julie's Randall, three points, crazy. I have to call that out when I see it just because it's so frustrating because I feel like Ant Man is always the one doing what he's supposed to do. And I don't know what they're going to have to shake up for the Timberwolves, but that's a solution that's going to have to be met because that's not going to work, especially in these games that are important. But we're seeing the energy kind of shifting and players kind of giving up because there was a viral moment that you guys both referenced. So there's a point in the fourth quarter with eight minutes left where Ant Man went to the bench and he dapped up the spurs.

So his reasoning, he said, at that point, you know you ain't going back in. So I was trying to give them the respect that they deserve. So, Cam, do you see that as good sportsmanship? Or is that just something that you do not want to see? I thought that I didn't hear that quote until you just said it just now. At first, I was like, you don't do it that early. Pause. You sit there and say,

All right, let me wait until the game is over to give him a file. But I think, Antman, if he said that, you know you're not going back in, that he's going to do it. And I kind of understand where he's coming from. But I just think that there was a lot of time left on the clock. We've seen crazier things happen with teams could come back. But I think for Ant Man, he probably, you know, we're not in the court, but he's seen him right on the war.

And then not only that, he knows how he feels. He knows he's this hyperstander. Knee, his other knee was messed up. he was playing on probably 60% doing as much as he can. But like you just says that, when you have nobody helping you literally, Julius Randall with three points. You talk about Rudy Gobert, no points.

Three rebounds is crazy. Give me 16 rebounds if you're not going to have no points. Three rebounds are just out of pocket for a big man. He's like, you niggas ain't doing nothing tonight. This shit is over. So I get what he did. I would have just waited a little later. Because it's one of them things, too,

he didn't give him a five he's a sucker. You can't win for losing out here. Now, I guess, handshakes are on the time clock. You do it right after the game, or you don't do it at all. But I just think Ant Man felt that he gave all he could give this series. If he said he knew he wasn't going back in, he knows his health better than we do. We know you got to give him credit for even coming back to play in the series. A lot of niggins was tapping out.

We talk about, you know, even Jason Tatum not playing that game seven against the Sixers. You know, we can't tell his health neither. I'm proud of him for coming back as soon as he did too. But these are things that we talk about. So for him to come back, even to play in the series, because you know Devin Chenzo was out, give him a lot of credit. But I think he's seen the writing on the wall and he's seen how bad his team was playing that day. What I've done it?

No, I would have waited till closer. But I'm not, you know, Ant-Man is Ant-Man. That's what makes him him. people go be mad regardless yo you can't do nothing without people criticizing it at that point the game was over you're not going to get a crazy miraculous comeback and what happens if what happens if he gets hurt there we've been seeing dudes dropping like flies with achilles his own teammate went down with an achilles what happens if some dumb shit go down and then he blows out of knee and then he's out all the next year i'm a fan yo where if my team is down like 30 at half time

I'm like, yo, pack that shit up, man, pull the starters. Or if you're up 30, like the Knicks in game four with the Sixers, they were up like 40 points. And they still had Jalen Brunson out there, bridges, all these. It's like, yeah, what are you doing? Get the Cam's boy Landry Shammon in there. Get like Colic. Get the other guys in because you don't want some dumb shit to go down. So I just think people are going to, if people want to be mad, they're going to be mad about something.

They'll find a reason to criticize it. If he didn't do that, like Cam said, It was like when Isaiah Thomas back in the, with the bad boys' pistons, they walked off the court. They didn't shake hands with the Bulls. He didn't make the dream team, right? Like, people were going to hate on that anyway. So to me, it's like, yo, you got to be mad about something regardless. I thought it was cool.

I thought it was just like, yo, listen, we're not going to come back. Randall and Rudy gave me three points combined in a must win at home. And it's like, yo, what you want me to do? It's pack that shit up and let's just hope nothing bad happens. I agree. Real quick, sorry, I agree with you, Nick, to a certain extent. What I disagree is on is if Airman, like I said, he's hurt, so that's why I agree with you. But this is for the season.

If I'm down 30 and let's just say Airman wasn't, let's say he's 85% 90%, and my brain is always a chance to win. This shit ain't over until maybe, I'd be down 30 and a minute 30. I'm talking about what I used to play. and I've never been played on a professional level. I get it, risked injury and everything else. But shit, man, we don't see Reggie Miller, motherfucker score eight points in nine seconds

or some crazy shit like that. Not saying that's going to happen every game. But if this is a close-out game, let me play, bro. Not Ant-Man, because he's hurt. I'm just talking about the average niggum, because there's niggas who sit in out for left. So that's the only part I'm saying, don't take me out if I'm healthy

and we're down 30 with eight minutes left. time to do something. But if you're winning up 30, hell yeah, I definitely agree with you. Get niggas out of there. Because if done shit happens, you're going to get blamed as a coach for still having them niggins in there. So absolutely. I'm 50-50 on what you just said. Yeah. I don't know, man.

They're up, they're up 30. Spurs are up 30 with eight minutes left. Like if he did that, sad, if he did that in the third quarter, I feel way different. But fourth quarter, it's I don't know. I feel like it's a damned if you do, damn if you don't situation. And he's better

than me, because if I'm him, I'm still pissed. Like, I'm not dapping nobody up. Like, I would just wait till the end. But if that's what he felt compelled to do in that moment, so be it. Me personally, if I had to put myself in his shoes, I'm not doing it. But that's just what I would think. Because I know then, and it shouldn't be a comparison, but people were like, well, if the roles were reversed and it was Wembe, do you think Wembe's going to go do that? No. So, that's one of those situations to me. I'm not doing it. I'm not dapping nobody. up if I'm losing by 30. I don't care. Oh yeah. Me playing. At the end?

Yes. Cool. Great game. Y'all did it. Eight minutes left. Still. Nah, I'm not doing it. I'm not. I don't know. They got packed up, man. It's not like, and I know Cam said the Reggie Miller, the Reggie Miller thing. We saw it last year with the Knicks in that game one against the Pacers where,

damn, I'm blanking on his name. But he hit the, he had like seven threes in the fourth quarter. also when they were playing the Knicks and it's like yeah that shit happens once in literally a generation right because Reggie Miller did that in the 90s and then that happened with the Knicks last year it's and even so like eight it happened

it happened two times with the Knicks last year they're down 18 points up 18 points and gave up two leads where 18 points happened twice 18 ain't 30 but it happened yeah with the Celtics where they came back on Boston yeah but 18 and 30 30 is, I don't know.

I think it was, it was a rap. Like, he just knew it. He knew that if the team was playing bad too. And he was just like, yo, to Cam's point also, the last thing I think is really important, where he was hurt. He was hurt coming into the series, coming into the playoffs. And him playing, he probably was like, yo, listen, 30, we're down 30. There's eight minutes left. We're not having it.

I'm not at 100%. Let me just take myself out. He also knows he wasn't the cause. Go ahead, Cam. No, it's just good to know about Nick. You play him one-on-one and game is 30 and you beat him 20 to 2. And his brain, he already lost.

It's over, bro. G-G. It's over. I'm also. So if you already losing 20 to 2 and game is 30, I already know mentally you're going for the next 10 points. Thanks for letting me know that's the type of nigger you is. Yeah, I can't fun.

I'm a sore-ass loser, too. I don't be doing handshapes if I lose. Clearly not sore enough. I'm one of them, too. Can't be sore enough. Yeah, but like, you gotta be realistic too, though. Yeah, but you don't, I don't know.

I think I'm, maybe I'm delusional because I, even if I'm not good, I played in Larry's 50 plus league. I wasn't the best, but I'm going to tell you I am. I want to win. I want them niggas too until the 0 clock hit zero. It's a chance. You got to think about this.

We was talking about football earlier. Imagine Caleb Williams had that attitude towards the end of the season. all the miracles he ran across for fucking two seconds left for having many seconds left. It was a miracle every fucking game with Kayla Williams.

It's about leading up into the playoffs, man. They were down. If you're counting, I understand what you're saying, but the chances, if I understand you're saying it was a chance. I don't know what you're about to say. You know, it's a chance. They was damn this. They could score it. It's not 30 points. But imagine you at the

mentality that where, man, is somebody going to catch a Hail Mary? They're throwing Hail Marys and shit. I bet you the odds. If you went to the odds, one minute left before the game was over, who's going to win this game? The odds were probably crazy

that the Bears were going to win that game. So I get what you saying. It's still a chance no matter what what you're about to say. It's not 30 points. But you just never know, man. I'm not mad at your opinion. I'm just giving you my opinion.

No, for sure. And yeah, that's exactly what I was going to say. He's down two. possessions with four minutes left. They're not down nine possessions. Yeah. You know, and a sport like football where these guys are getting beat up, like, you know, take, take the starters out. And even in the NBA, too, like, you know, we've seen it. We've seen it happen time and time again where a guy gets hurt on some dumb shit. And then Cam mentioned it in passing how the coach is like, well, why did you do that? Why did you leave them in? Didn't you know the game was over? But then

if he pulls them, it's like, why didn't you leave them in? Yeah. You've given up on your team. So That's what I was saying when I started this whole point. Like, yo, you're not going to win. People are going to find some shit to be mad about anyway. Udana's Haslam said that he wouldn't want to play for an Ant Man because he's shown weakness as a leader. I don't know about all that. He's clearly the alpha on the team.

And I don't think his leadership has ever been in question. I think he was a realist. He's like, yo, I got three combined points from the guys that I needed to get 30 combined points. Like, Randall's supposed to be the Robin to my Batman. and I'm getting three points from them. Pack that shit up. Let's go home. Get this vacation started early. And we'll be back next year.

Let's get this vacation. Yeah, let's get this vacation going, though. Two different mentality still, but I see what you're saying. Yeah. And I got to go with your Don and Sassum, because I want to want you on my team. You tapped out with eight minutes left to go, man. You're talking about vacation.

And it's still time 1 o'clock, man. bro if you if you if you if you if you if i'm batman and you robin and you got me three points yeah bro i'm thinking about columbia that's what i'm thinking about with eight minutes to go i want to get out of here think about this right so thinking about the game today right and james hard he's supposed to be robin what kind of game did he have yeah but they were up 30 man but i'm just saying how what kind of did he contribute no he gave you real factor no he didn't he he he gave you what he always gives you in a big game You got what you expect.

All right. So if Donovan Mitchell had that attitude, if Donovan Mitchell had that attitude, like, look at my robin. I'm packing it up. This niggas's not doing nothing. You can't, just because you got a robin, that I mean you can't be super. You got to go extra, extra Batman.

And like, yo, nigger Robin, they show up to work today, man. This thing I get crazy. Let me go Batman 2.0, whatever you want to call it. You can't be blaming than all niggas when you're that type of nigger. my opinion. But I do get what you're getting saying. I understand. I'm just being devil's advocate.

I understand what you're saying, but I can't blame a nigga because they're not having a good game and I'm not a nigga. But I will say, Ant Man knew he was hurt, bro. I've seen game two and three, him going in the tunnel to get oxygen. I think he gave more than he could get.

He was tapped out. Yeah. Okay. Well, let us know what y'all think in the comments down below. I'm going to still give Ant Man his credit because he did what he was supposed to do, but the rest of the team, they'll have to figure that out.

But we're going to get into some conference finals game predictions. We will discuss after the break. She called this thing about toxic. Four years and counting. Got you feeling like an option. Yeah, my own problem, babe. She's tired of him, clubbing in with this thing called trust. But she really thinking about it.

She's going to be free to walk away. I wish somebody told me the rules. Disagreements let her win. And it's cool. Welcome back, y'all. Now it's time to get into some prediction. So on Tuesday, the Cavs will play the Knicks. Cam, who do you think wins this game?

And then give us a guess on how many games? The next should win the series. This game, I'm going to go in the limb and say that. Cleveland wins this first game just because the Knicks may have a lot. little bit of rush. Even though Cleveland just won the seven-game series, and they can be tired from that. The Knicks last time we've seen them, like I told you, they was looking like some wild dogs. I'm going to give this first game to Cleveland, but I think overall the next one the series and they advance to the championship, or they should. I'm just giving my expert opinion.

The Black Cat's still in Madison Square going until they get it out. It's still in there. But if we're being realistic and we're looking at the head-to-head matchup, Cavs just went seven games with Detroit. They're tired as far. The Knicks have a bunch of energy. And like I said, they've been playing very cohesive. It's looking like they really, really know each other. We understand that McCall Bridges, Josh Hart, Jalen Brunson,

I want the college together, won championships together, etc. Katz getting in the four OGs already a champion. The bench is looking very good, even though I make fun of his name. Sham is looking decent. Deuce McBride is looking really good. They're playing 9-10 players. Mike Brown, playing getting in rotation. They're looking phenomenal.

But this is how bad if the Cavaliers want it. You know, we've talked about it already. We just talked about last segment, James Hard and Donald Mitchell's reputation. James Harden hasn't been to championship since his first second year, whichever year it was when he played with the Oklahoma City Thunder, and he was actually coming off the bench. Stunk it up just last game last night. in game seven again,

he's going to have to step up really, really bad if they want to win this championship. We know Donovan Mitchell's coming to play. I'm very, right, excited to see that matchup between Jalen Brunson and Donald McHill. I think Evan Mobley causes some problems for Kat. Kaki could cause the problem for Evan Mobley. I think,

OG, he had a lot of us because he's coming off an injury as well. This would be an exciting, exciting series. I got a guess, I'm not going off the bad luck of the Knicks. The Knicks should win the series in six games, man, and go to the Eastern Conference and go to the championship. Stad amongst Knicks fans, there's a saying that everybody is better than Brunson until it's time to be better than Brunson.

Nicks are winning in five. Nicks have home court advantage. Nicks have been peaking. I was on the show last week or the week before, and I said, yo, Mikhail Bridges, can you just give me over eight points? Because he was averaging seven points a game through the first five. And Sin, I know you give me heat because I pick Kate Cunningham to win MVP, but you're welcome because Bridges has been dropping 18 or more in the last five games with the Knicks.

And he's really the X-Factor stat. Like, you know what you're getting from Brunson. You know where you're getting from Kat. OG's health is going to be a big question mark. It's really interesting in both conferences. You got really big question marks on two guys coming back. OG with the Knicks and then if J. Dub is going to be playing with the Thunder. If those guys are 100%, I think it alters the series for both teams.

But they haven't played in eight days. They've had eight days off. Cam said that the Cavs and the Pistons played seven games. Well, the Cavs also played seven against Toronto as well. So they're coming off back-to-back seven game series. The Knicks have been off, like I said, for eight days. And they're hosting the conference finals. Like they have home court advantage in the conference finals.

I think game one is really important because, to Cam's point, is it the old debate, right, Statt? Rest versus Rust. What is better to have? Because they played on Sunday, the Cavs did. They'll be playing on Tuesday. Nix, it'll be about 10 days since they last played, right? But I think right now this version of the NICs team is better than the NICs team from years past. And they're just peaking at the right time.

We talk about it in other sports how you want to be hot and healthy around playoff time. A lot of people are like, yo, it's the hottest team. It's the hottest team. Well, not really. It's really the healthiest team, too, that plays a big role in it. And right now the Knicks are just peaking. And I think Brunson is on a tear right now. And the Knicks, they beat them twice in the regular season to the one loss that they had.

But it is also important that the one win that the Cavs had was after they acquired James Hardin, too. so the Knicks really haven't seen this iteration of the Cavs with James Hardin in it. But I'm going back to what I've known for James Harden his whole career. In a big spot, he's going to fold. And that's why I think the Knicks could pack him up in five. Okay, good predictions from both. We'll see what happens. I think the Knicks should win.

This is exactly why they're going to fuck up. The Knicks fans blame Knicks. I'm telling you that's right now. Just what he said is why they won't win. And what happens when they win in five? to win. When they win in fire. What happens when the Giants win the 12 games,

you've been predicting for three years. No, it hasn't been three years. Don't go off next. Don't go off next. Don't go off next predictions, bro. I'm telling you, I'm telling them that. Yeah, that's a fact, big fact. If I'm a New York fan, I would tell Nick, shut up.

I'd do no good with his prediction for New York teams. I'm telling you that right now. This doesn't go down. With today's date, save it. Save it right now. Nah, no, I never be going into the, no, I'm calling Cap. I got to defend myself here, Kill it.

I got to, I'm putting my foot down. And also I can edit this too, so I'm going to make sure that it's seen. Okay? I haven't, I don't go into, I'm literally, I, the most logical fan when it comes to his teams. I don't go into the seasons being like, yo, 12 wins.

I'm thinking this year coming up for the Giants, they're going to get 12 wins, because you see this shit happen. How many wins you predicted last year? So how many wins you predicted last year? Last year I thought they were a six-win team. I need to see the video. I need to see the video that you said that Giants are going to pick.

When they put Darden, I was thinking they would make the playoffs. And then they lost that game to Denver, which, of course, you fucking invite me on the show when my team gets embarrassed. That's all so dope. You know, thank you for that. You're like, yo, Nick, what happened? And then they say, I got to explain why they give it. up 30 points in the fucking fourth quarter. But I don't be coming into the seasons, Cam,

thinking that they're going to win championships and shit. I just think, like, with the Giants, 12 wins next year, I think it's really realistic. You saw the Jaguars do it. You saw the Bears do it. You saw the pads do it. And they kind of check the same boxes that the Giants do. Second year quarterback.

They got a new head coach. They got an adult as a head coach. Thank you. Thank you, Jerry, for the thumbs up. Whoever's in the trouble room. I see the thumbs up on the street. Thank you. You lined me up, bro.

That's foul. Yo. You know what you're talking about. shaking his head. I don't know what you're talking about. And then this year with the Knicks, like that was kind of the consensus, though. They're like, yo, no Halliburton, no Tatum. The bucks are going to be regressing.

Who the fuck knows what's happening where your team in Miami? What was happening with the Sixers? My bad. I'm just fired up right now. deserve that said i apologize uh but like you didn't know what was happening to be honest we all we listen we all picked the nicks to go to the championship when the season started like i don't know i don't know if you remember or not making because you was in the control we all said what you're saying right now the nicks should be going to the championship this year and which you what you just said yeah we

said this though at the very beginning just when nick is saying we said this and not even not you don't have to be a Nick fan that should know that. Like you just said, we all knew this. So don't act like you're taking credit for something that everybody said, even not even being a Nick fan, nigga said that. Halliburts her, box regressers. We didn't even know if Jason Tatum was going to come back at all. Yeah, they were two games away because they lost six last year to Indiana.

We're like they two games away to get into the championship. They're not saying that. And Nick, like, oh, like this year with the Knicks, you know what I'm saying? No, Nick, we all said that. You said the Giants. All right, the Giants supposed to win six games. How many they won last year?

Four. All right. Still didn't even make it to six. That's what I'm saying, man. Don't go with this guy, y'all. I guess. I'm telling you, but do not go with this guy? Not too far, man.

Go with this guy, man. Go ahead, Nick. My bad, I ain't mean to cut you off. Go ahead. My four. No, you're good, man. Just, no. I'm making note at all this because if they win 12 games this year.

12? Yeah, the Giants are going to be what the Bears were this year and New England. Yeah, 100%. Yeah. Dart is winning MVP. I know he's going to say to me like seven, eight, 12. Just wait. All right.

Just wait. It's a waiting game. Nick's in five and Nixon five. I'm not going to swear it was more than six games, you guess, but I'm going to go with him. I would take his word. I think he did say six. I don't fully remember, but that sounds about right.

No, I really don't, on some real shit. I don't go into, I don't go into the year being like, like, Cowboy fans or Raider fans out here in Vegas. That's what you sound like now, though. Yeah, but I'm laying out. I'm giving you reasons why. They're just like, yo, it's our year. I'm telling you. Yeah, reasons that makes sense to you.

Not. Same way reasons makes sense to Cowboys fan. No, no, no. This is, this is legit. It's, it's NFL history. It's shit that happens all the time. I'm just telling you what you. sound like. I know, but they went, they won like two games in one score games, right? That's a,

that's a really important fact, right? Okay. If a team, if a team goes eight and no and one score games, you can't account for that to happen next year. There's always regression. And the Giants lost a ton of games by one score. They had a lot of guys injured. They didn't have, they fired their head coach. But now they got a second year quarterback who showed that he's a 2026 quarterback, right? You're not an old school pocket passer. He's part of the new era of quarterbacks. They got a young core defensively. They got a great defensive line. They had two picks in the top 10. They got John Harbaugh. You saw what he was doing in Pittsburgh all those years. We're back, yo. That's what I'm saying. But let's not turn this into a football thing.

But I'm just, I'm telling you what you sound like. I love the optimism. 12 is a lot. I'm just saying 12 is a lot because I was on the scatible that train too, but 12 was a lot. So we'll see what happens. I'm just going to say regarding this next game, Nick should win the series. But I do think if it goes to game seven, don't let it go to game seven. The Cavs are going to win. That's what I'll put out there. So don't let it get to game seven. That's all I'm saying. Okay. This next series, OKC versus the Spurs. This is, this is the series. Cam, who do you think wins? And they are saying that Jalen Williams is supposed to return. He's elicited available. We'll see what happens tonight. But what do we think, Cam?

going with the spurs man listen man he's still nonchalant no not because it's a hard it's a very very hard to decide to be totally honest with you I think jay dutt returning could fuck them up to be totally honest with you

he might throw the chemistry off these niggas is 8 and no to me they only had one close game with the lakers that final game sGA wasn't even scoring 20 until that last game against the lakers that Cloddard game when he had 35. He was scoring 17, 18, 19 points.

And they still was winning by double digits. I think they had great chemistry going in, coming into this series. Jay Dub coming back, am I saying they don't need them? No, I'm not saying that at all. But him sitting out so long, and I know they're not just going to throw him in there,

and they're going to monitor his minutes, so on and so forth. This might disturb the chemistry. He hasn't played a lot this year, and he hasn't played it all in the playoff. Does he know each other? Do they know each of them? I'm talking about OKC? Yeah, they won a championship together.

But I'm not sure how this is coming back, but I know one thing. The Spurs look like a well-oiled machine right now, and Wembe looks like he wants them more than anybody. You got to realize, though, when you're dealing with SGA, you just don't know. He keeps a poker face on. You know, I've really already been a fan,

but I really, really became a bigger SGA fan when he's clowning Dylan Brooks. and clowning Devin Booker. And you just, you like this niggas clowning niggas. He's having that much fun with it. This is just to be an outstanding series. I want the referees to let them play because we know that SGA, he shoots more freethos than anybody.

And I'm not saying, I'm not one of the niggas to say he doesn't get foul because a lot of niggas be like, yo, this niggas foul being. The referees are wearing SGA sneakers, et cetera, et cetera, et cetera. But this would be an outstanding match. up man and I think the experience goes I'm not even think you know the experience goes to okay C but it just looks like wimby wants it more than anybody else and he gives everybody else a lot done with that you can see the toughness on de Aaron Fox's face you see the toughness on Stefan Kassel's face but when you got somebody 7 4 who wants revenge or check for the junior

Olympic championship that he did win they lost by two points in 2020 or whichever year it was I believe Wimby's on a different mission, man. So I'm going with the Spurs. I think it's going to take seven games, though. I think game one, the winner of Game One wins this series. And I know it's crazy because it might go seven to Cam's point, but I really think it sets the tone because the Spurs have been calling out the Thunder

all year. They're four and one against them in the regular season. They just have their number. They match up really well with them. And I think if they go and they win that, it sets the tone for the rest of the series. But if the Thunder win, they could carry themselves like, yo, let's playoff time now. That shit don't matter in the regular season. But if the spurs go into OKC and they win game one, and especially if they could beat them by double digits and kind of like pause, put it on them, I think that sets the tone like, yo, that regular season shit wasn't a flu.

Because Kim, you notice we talk about this shit all the time. somehow like, yeah, we don't really care about the regular season. The players don't even care about the regular season. So the Thunder might be saying to themselves, like, y'all can have that one and that four-and-one record against us. Now it matters. So that's why I think I'm putting a big emphasis on game one. And if you look at conference finals history,

78% of the time the team that wins game one goes on to win the series. And I really think for this matchup in particular, the winner, I don't feel that way about the East. Whoever wins game one. But I think for the West, the winner of game one goes on to win the series because the perspective of both teams and how they're going to go about the rest of the series, I think it's going to dictate everything. Okay.

We will see if it sets the tone. So game one tonight, obviously we know it's going to be a good one. We'll see who wins. And if your stat is right, but we'll come back and be able to revisit that to see if you're in alignment with what you said. Now, let's get into SGA. So he has won his second consecutive NBA MVP award. He became the 14th player to win back to back. Do you think he deserved it?

And what do you think about him winning this award? Yeah, I really do believe that he should have won. Absolutely. You got to think about this. This fourth straight year of average 30 points or more, 31.1 point for games, 6.6 assists, shooting on 55% from the field as a guard. Broke Will Chamberlain's record this year as well.

Shot the most, made the most free throws. SGA is a real problem. Not only that, as much as, you know, we have to give the whole OKC under a lot of credit, but they maintain that number one spot for the whole year. It wasn't anybody close after probably November. So does he deserve it? Absolutely he deserves it. But that's why I believe, and I know I'm going backtrack it to our last topic,

that's why I believe Wembe and these guys should win because Wembe was lobbying for himself to get MVP as well. Joker came in second, Wembe came in third, as far as voting is concerned. But SGA, absolutely. I think as long as Wembe stays healthy, next couple years,

the MVPs are going to be his. But this year, I think She deserved it, so congratulations to Shea. Yeah, it's hard to argue against it. Back-to-back, rightfully so, best record in the league.

Also, back-to-back years, too, they he barely plays in the fourth quarters because they're up 20 30 points so everything that he's doing he's really doing it in 28 minutes 30 minutes i think that gets facted into it too where like kade kade we talked about it a couple weeks ago where yeah if he gets subbed out the whole team fucking collapses right and with the thunder yeah they're loaded but it it's all on him and he he just carries them and he sits so often in the in the second half fourth quarters.

And I just think even with the foul baiting, people call him a foul baiter. You know how I feel about that stat. I feel like, yo, he just mastered the art. You can get away with it. Yeah, if you can get away with it. And also, like, there's an art form to that. Why can't other players draw the files like he can?

You know, he just knows how to position himself and get the right calls. So it's hard to disagree with it. I think the right guy won it. Yeah. No argument there. And definitely congrats to him. But that is all the time that we have for today, Nick.

Hold on, can I ask, I want to ask Kim something. Yeah, go ahead. Because you know I was fired up. Yo, you had a lyric. My grandfather got me mad and I peed inside his orange juice. Ask him if it's tangy when I'm angry. Why'd you do that, bro? Like, this is, I can't remember where my brain was out at that time.

I'm not sure. Honestly, I don't know. I don't remember, man. I don't even remember that lyric, but probably it was it on my first album? It was on Confessions. It was on Confessions. So far. That's my first album, exactly.

They had me being creative in that album, doing a bunch of creative shit. So, I didn't, I don't know if I, why I wrote that, I didn't do that to him. All right, cool. Just wanted to make sure, bro. There was a lot of, there was a lot of, a lot of fucking creativity from the people I was working with.

And my second album, Inore, my second album in on, you got to ask me anything about any lyric, you're over there's a pause or whatever. My first album, it's just a classic album, but it wasn't all my creative process. I was working with other people. I had to kind of follow some ideas that they had as well. All right, no accountability.

That's cool. I mean, it was new. You're like, you know, I don't know. I've never heard a response like that from you ever. Let's go. I know it was my first album and shit, but I don't know. I can't even respond to that. I don't know.

I didn't do it, though, if y'all. I didn't do it. I didn't do it. Okay. Got it. Nick, thanks for joining us. Thank you, as always. Okay.

Thank you, y'all for watching. and as always, it is what it is.