James Bonding - Casino of Solace Part 1 with Amanda Lund and Maria Blasucci

Episode Date: April 17, 2024

Maria and Amanda are back! And this time it's to tackle Casino Royale and Quantum of Solace the way they were meant to be tackled, back to back and with Matt and Matt. Tune in for part two next week. Hosted on Acast. See acast.com/privacy for more information.

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Get out of the field and behind a desk and start sending mail like an anti-bond. Think of the Pitney Bowes C200 as your own personal money penny. Or Walter PPPK. And you know what? You can save three money pennies a letter. Now we're talking. If you've seen Weird Al Yankovic play live, well, then you know he puts on an incredible show. Well, Matt, he just wrapped up his ridiculously self-indulgent, ill-advised vanity. tour where for the first time he played

just his original songs. There were 77 performances on this tour and every show is unique with a different set list. The entire tour is available now on Stitcher Premium. Oh my God, that's amazing. And for a free month of Stitcher Premium, you can go to Stitcher Premium.com forward slash

Weird Al. That's Stitcher Premium.com forward slash Weird Al. Use the promo code. Bond. Bond end. Man. Man. Man. Jet Bonnie Pocket. Whoa, hold everything. Before we even begin, did you know that James Bonding is coming to the London podcast festival? Oh, boy.

That's right. Sunday, September 16th at 7 p.m. Google all about it. I would list the ticket link here, but it looks long and gibberish. But I'm confident you'll find it if you look for it. If you live anywhere near the London, England, United Kingdom, Ireland, continental Europe, United States, want to fly area come out and see us sunday september 16th 7 p.m. James bonding at the london podcast festival you can also see some other shows like i was there to super ego complete woman

spontaneous nation it's going to be a real party good morning everyone looks like we're all chipper and raring to go welcome James bonding I'm mad I'm mad as well it's the moment you've all been waiting for we're going to cover the first two entries in the Daniel Craig franchise called James Bond. We're here with Amanda Blasucci and Maria Lund. Hey, guys. How's it going? Happy Saturday.

I think I know I'm married to both of them. Wow. Guys, thanks so much for taking time out of your schedules to sit through these movies. Yes, of course. We're so happy to be here on a Saturday morning here in sunny Pasadena. Okay, they're being facetious because when everybody came in the door today, all three of them were a little bit like, oh, what a slog. And I'm like, are you kidding?

This is a luxury and a privilege. Yes, yes, yes. Well, I'm so happy to be here. I can't believe it. I can't believe it. I can't believe it. I can't believe you would try to Matt Splain this to us. Matt Splean it.

It was excruciating. Are you kidding? Matt, I'm sorry. I'm sorry. I love these movies on their own. But when you're forced to watch them in a 24-hour period, quite frankly. First of all, you're not forced to watch them. You had a week.

Second of all, I think you mean get to watch them. I'm sorry, I do mean get to watch them. You're right, you're right. I had a lot of fun at some parts, and I had a lot of not fun at other parts. Interesting, interesting. Yeah, and I know, Maria, you were texting me that this quantum didn't really do it for you. Well, I can't believe this is the first time you've seen Quantum of Silverberg. No, I had seen it when it first came out.

Oh, you did? Yeah, I've never seen Spector. Oh, okay. Oh, wait, which one? Is Spector the most recent one? Yeah. Oh, why haven't you seen that? It's great.

I don't have an answer. I don't know. Did you like Skyfall? I did like Skyfall, yeah. Okay. For someone who loves Casino Royale so much, I thought you'd kind of eat these movies up. Well, you'd think, but then when, you know, someone comes back for seconds and they get Quantum of Solace, you can see where maybe my... We'll talk about that.

I bet differ. You think Maria knows when to push away from the table. Yeah. You know, when I got what I needed and I don't need anything else. Thank you so much. Yeah, that doesn't taste like the first bite. Okay, take it easy. This bite has sad hair.

Yeah. He has sad hair throughout this. Oh, I think he looks the best in this movie of any of his life. He's looking fine to me, but I will say I'm going to go on a bang tirade, so just prepare yourself. I understand. I don't love when he has his bangs. And not his bangs. There's a lot of bangs going on.

Maybe his bangs are included as well, but there's a lot of bang work happening in this movie. And I don't mean like bang, bang, shoot him up. I know, get ready for Amanda Lund's new James bonding segment, Miss Miss Bang Bang. Yeah, there were a couple of miss bangs in this movie. Okay, here's what we're going to do. We decided that we're going to cover Casino Royale and Quantum of Solas as if it was one movie, but do it in two parts.

So you'll get part one today, as you hear this, and part two in two weeks. Wow, they got to wait two weeks for the end of the conversation. An exciting conclusion because, quite frankly, I wish we had had to wait two weeks before we had to watch Quantum of Sell us. Wait, what? I thought you liked this film. I do. Okay. I do, but back to back, it's an interesting pill to swallow.

But that's your whole theory. My whole theory. I know. And I said, let's try it. And we tried it. And three out of four of us. I thought your theory was because you had done this and that's why you liked it. I had, we had watched it right after at some point, right?

Yeah. Like, it was like the week after? I forget when this happened. You can't help it. A little betrayed. Well, wait, what was your theory, Matt? I want you to know. That you're, it was better watching them back to back.

Well, I think Quantum Sal is certainly better with Casino Royale fresh in your mind. I think if you're going to pop into the Bond franchise and you're like, like trying to pick out a library book and you pull Quantum and just watch it out of nowhere, it's like, what is this movie? It's like a half done movie. Yeah, we should cover that if you're just listening to this episode, we covered Casino Royale before with Maria and Amanda. And I think it's no understatement to say that it was a probably a two-hour love fest.

We all deeply love this movie. And then Quantum, as everyone knows, has a complicated and troubled history and reception and past. So we thought we would tie the two together as they are meant to be the only two direct sequels in the Bond franchise and see what we get with them. So this whole thing will cover both movies almost as if they were one. We're not going to go casino and quantum. I think it's the best-looking James Bond movie. Even more than Skyfall? The color, a palette of it, I think, is just...

A Quantum. A Quantum Salas, I think, is just... just like perfect. The whole like land sea and air situation. Yeah now that's something you're aware of so the action set pieces in this are based on the four elements.

You've got land at the core. I'm sorry. Go ahead. I'm sorry. Why did you respond that way? Do you hate the four elements? No, it just seems like something like a director would like be like, like, okay, how about this?

Try this on for size. Let's do the four elements. It's like a Cirque de Soleil thing. I want to say right out of the gate that the Bond movies I tend to love the most other than the undisputable bond grates like Casino Royale or let's say, you know, like Goldfinger or something that just stand on their own as great Bond films. I love the outliers, the ones that take risk and do something new. So I love that they try some crazy shit in this movie. So land would be the desert? No, the car chase through the quarry.

That's in the opening scene? Yeah. Okay, that's land, sure. The desert. Well, you're not going to have a car chase on water, that's for sure. But you're going to have a boat chase on water. Okay, and the boat chase on water. Okay, and then there's air.

That's the one he's in the plane. The sky chase. I'd watch that. Sky chase. It's a sky chase. So that's when he's in the plane with his banged friend. Yeah. And then fire at the hotel. Oh, that combustible hotel.

Yeah. Yes. Okay. Yeah, I'm getting that. Okay. That's coming through loud and clear. Okay. I'll be the stand-in for the listener here today as they all.

Because I feel like you guys, I'm going to have to defend this. You think there's going to be enough people that need it to be defended? Yeah, I do. I think that I personally, maybe it's my own bias, feel like quantum of solace is on the rise. So what was the reception? Oh, I agree. Yeah. What was the reception when it came out?

It was lukewarm, but it's also, it was a troubled production. It was right when the writer strike hit. In fact, it hit right as they started shooting, I believe. So Daniel Craig and Mark Forrester were forced to kind of like come up with dialogue that couldn't be written down, but just say like, I'm going to say this. Oh my God. That's tricky with Bond when everything is so, you know, it doesn't really have a loose improv feel. Exactly. But they weren't improvising.

They were kind of formulating on set. And that combined with what I think, Marie, you mentioned in a text. I agree with is probably gone too far in the frenetic editing way. Yeah. But if you scaled that back and then had another draft of this script. And maybe some character development or no, or you weren't missing that at all? What character development? Just anything where any character grew in any way or any character mattered.

What are you talking about? You don't think James grew? Camille, James, Mathis, you've got some development for all those characters. Well, they Yeah, I mean, they were both out for revenge But it was, well, I don't know It was muddy to me Exactly what the arcs were

For everyone. It was just, I don't know But maybe we're diving too much into quantum Yeah, let's go back to the beginning And know that we're going to fight later. All right, well, here's my first thing With Casino Royale, right? Yeah, beautiful movie.

We love it. It's gorgeous. It's the mess movie we ever made. one of the greatest entries into the franchise, if not the greatest entry into this franchise that has 24 movies in it. I think the beginning of this movie, when it's black and white,

and he's going to get his second kill, I feel like he should have let that guy finish his sentence. When he starts to say, and the second is, what if he was going to say, is my son's birthday, please don't kill me until then? Or what if he says,

very difficult, and it will change your life's trajectory forever. Yes, I want you to understand this, James, before you... I know you have to kill me, but I need to tell you a few things. Yeah. Like, let the man finish his sentence. Although that was... That's a pretty great moment.

Yeah. I have to say, when this film starts, even before you get to the movie, and it's just the logo, is it... Columbia? It's an MGM logo. No, but then there's the woman with the tour. That's Columbia. That's in black and white. And that, this time watching, gave me so much nostalgia for seeing it the first time,

even at that moment in a theater going black and white, Columbia logo, what are we doing? It's like when I saw Mulan Rouge, and remember they do the, but then it turns into the sound of music. Oh. And that really, like the main title to sound like?

Oh, yeah. And then seeing something like that can really go, wow, this is something. I've never seen before. Yeah. It's like when they do the Warner Brothers logo and green for the Matrix. Yeah. You're like, wait, what's this all about?

Did you know, do you guys see the nice guys that they used the vintage Warner, like 70s Warner Brothers logo for that? Oh, no, I didn't see. But Mamanters says good things. I love that. Yeah, Matt and I both really liked it. Yeah. So this opening scene, Black and White, I caught something I never caught before, which I know Bond has always said, I know where you keep your gun. But I didn't realize that was an answer to the thing that Dryden had said.

said before of shame we barely got to know each other and he's saying well I know you enough to know where you keep your gun yeah actually that's the first time I caught that too wow did you only catch that because he thinks that he caught that and said it out loud and then because I would never catch that you didn't catch that it's not totally clear yeah yeah I guess like the 10th time you you watch a movie there's certain things that jump out I feel the heaviness in your voice when you say that I do want to thank you for going through all I love because you You know, Royale so much that I'll watch that anytime. Great.

The beauty of that movie, my God. It's perfection. Perfection. Yes. Speaking of when Dryden does say, like, the second kill, he says, first he says, you needn't worry, the second kill. And do you think at that point, because he's kind of pompous and, like, doesn't think Bond's a double-O, but when he says you needn't worry, is he basically saying to Bonn,

like, I know you're going to kill me, don't worry. I'm absolving you. That's something I never really caught before. I always thought he was kind of going like, whatever your second kill is after this. But maybe he's saying like, I know now I'm going to die. And here's a little advice for you,

which makes it pretty interesting. Well, I think it's like you needn't worry. The second I walked in here, I took some cyanide. Right? He never finishes a sentence. You don't know. Maybe James didn't have to kill him.

That's all I'm saying. He needed to kill him to get his double O status. I feel like he. he was issued it already, right? Oh, he was. No, no, no. This is what gets him. Yeah, so he needed, no matter what self,

you know, you know what I'm talking about. I don't, but I think it's okay to let it go. But does he get to like pick up the phone and go, hey guys, guess what, I did it. Kill that there's a second guy. Yeah. Congratulations.

So he needs two kills to be double O. Apparently. And like kills, do you think he killed before becoming an agent? No, no, no way. He might have because he was in, I think he was fought in Afghanistan through the SAS or something. So he may have been military series. Oh, and he probably went rogue there too. They never keep track of them probably.

Third movie in a row that he goes rogue is the quantum. I mean, but he's just rogue, rogue, rogue. That's an annoying thing to me. Yeah. Yeah. Yeah. Yeah. And it's like M is always going like, get him.

Somebody get a hold of him. Get him. But don't really get it. Yeah, don't really get him. And then at the end, she's like, I misjudged you. Maria's rolling her eyes. Well, just at that quote, because it works so well in Casino Royale that when they do the exact same story in Quorum Solace,

you go, well, yeah, this just, like literally M just had this talk with him if we're going in like the chronological order of the movie, like a week ago. This is a problem. That and then in Skyfall also how they're dealing with. It's like, oh, you're at the end of your career. And it just doesn't track. You know, it really should be, it almost should go Casino Royale, Specter, quantum of solace, skyfall, in terms of the thematic elements of these movies, you know?

Well, you know, my theory. Everything that happened in the James Bond franchise happens between Quantum of Salas and Skyfall. All right. Thank you. You know what I'm just realizing? And, oh, my God, a mic stand just almost fell over. Oh, my God. Is happening again?

What's happening? I'm just realizing now, because this is a continuation of Casinoa, Quana of Salas, that none of the fun stuff happens that usually happens in a Bond movie, which is him getting stuff from Q or like any of that stuff, is just completely not even part of it because he's not even doing his job, really. He's just rogue. Yeah. Same with Casino Royale, though.

But he has this... He doesn't have a Q. Yeah, he gets his little hard thing. Oh, but that's not Q. Oh, well, where is that? He gets the car with the special things, with the special heart palpitation thing or whatever it is. He's given a defibrillator in a glove compartment.

And we get to see some of the gadgets. Yeah. Q's not in Casino Royale? No. Or quantum. I think he is in quantum, by the way. How so? I think they were, I think they were,

that guy that comes to them about the money. And then Tanner says it's not in the mood or not the time. Yeah. I feel like they were trying to insinuate that that was cute. Well, it is interesting that they like casino reaal gets rid of everyone but em and bond and then in quantum you get tanner back yeah and then skyfall you get cue and money penny right right no money penny either but tanner's serving as money penny in this movie right and yeah yeah you like to see him

kind of following orders not following you like to see him get an order and not follow the order you don't want to just see him off the rails and i think that's what happens he's very off the rails i think Yeah, I think that's sort of always been an issue with my viewing of the movie. And the fact that like the rogue 007, for that to be the third time in a row that they did that really was annoying to me. It's the second time in a row. Dying another day, he goes rogue. But that doesn't count. Jesus.

What do you literally mean that doesn't count? I'm going to ask you as a friend. I put my podcast co-hostness aside. We're rebooting. Yeah, I'm with you. I don't like the rogue thing as much either. but I don't think quantum is the big... I think quantum handles it better than most.

So you're saying because it's a reboot, they're okay to repeat themselves immediately after... I'm not saying it's okay. I'm saying it isn't as big a sin as I think... I just want to hear what you're saying. Other Bond movies have done with it. Like, I don't know, maybe you're right. I guess that doesn't bother me, but...

Well, what was the time... How many years before Quantum came out? after Casino Royale. Just two. Hmm. Yeah. I mean, I understand what they were thinking because in Casino Royale, it was like Daniel Craig is this like edgy, darker version of Bond.

And so they were like, let's take that. We did that did so well. Let's take it even further. Yeah. And like his arc, I think I understand of him becoming kind of bitter and heartless after trusting no one. Yeah. Yeah.

I think we should, well, let's get through Casino Rao bit. Which makes the events. But I want to talk about character arcs and then you're right. It does take a step farther into like darker territory. And I feel like they correct to the other side of Casino Royale with Skyfall and then with Spector especially. Interesting. And I prefer them. I think I like this direction.

And maybe if Quantum is as far as they go, that would be fine. It doesn't have a lot of humor. But I think it suits Daniel Craig's style better. casino royal and quantum than the other two It's interesting that you say that I'm wondering I wonder what it would be like for Daniel Craig To play a more Traditional bond

Well Specter was that I wonder what it would be like skyfall and Spector are pretty close to that As close as they can get for his bond I think I think you're not giving Daniel Craig enough credit as an actor Wow I think I'm giving Daniel Craig a lot of credit To say that he's the only one that could pull off these full-on dramas like where Roger Moore, his best movies for us are the ones that are the wackiest. Yeah.

I think Daniel Craig's best films are kind of the ones where he get, like he has some good acting scenes with Mathis and with M and Camille in this, I think. Well, we'll get to it. Yeah, we will. But so Casino Royale, post-credit sequence. The, oh, the song's grown on me. Grown on you. You didn't like it at first?

Not really. Oh my God Is there any And rest in peace Chris Cornell Very nice He died This is the first time we've handled this movie since He passed

Oh right, that's right yeah Rest in peace Chris I like when he does that then Oh and I love right after that when they do that like double drum hit, which is right when the graphic of the gun goes off, but it feels like the gun is firing and you get a little echo reverb. It's done very well. This is the first time I've like truly appreciated how cool those opening credits are.

And I think part of it is because I think since the last time I watched Casino Royale, I've seen a few other bonds, the old ones, you know. And these credits are like so good. You see how they're the exception to the rule. Yeah, definitely. Exception to, what do you mean the exception to the role? Like the naked ladies. I know, but those really are, it's like watching the Apple iTunes.

Like, I love watching Bond openings because it mesmerizes me. Yeah, I mean, those are all good in their own. Yeah, yeah. This one is just so cool. And something about Castina Royale feels like so timeless, like the way that everyone looks. And I know there's some sort of, what year was that? 2006. So there's some odes to the time, like in the fashion choices and stuff,

but it feels so much more timeless and somehow Quantum feels so much more dated. Really? To me. I think his fashion is best in Quantum, actually. He's got a couple good moments, but nothing stands out. I think his clothes fit better. Oh, yeah. Well, when he's at the opera, that suit fits him like a glove.

The one that he finds. It's not even his. But by the way, by the way, I like that guy that is looking for his tuxedo is like pretty much jacked just like Dana. Yeah. So you buy it. There are two Craig lookalikes in Quantum. One is the first guy he kills on that balcony.

Yeah. He doesn't kill him. Or he doesn't know. The guy he pushes off the building. No, the guy he kills on the balcony when he gets to Haiti. Both. There's really three. Yeah.

I think Craig, when they do the final attack on the hotel at the end, what he's wearing is so cool. He looks like Steve Bacquine. He's got that kind of like motorcycle jacket on. We'll get it. We'll get to the end. I think that's a Tom Ford jacket. I'm sure.

Because they switched to Tom Ford for Quantum from what? From Brioni. Yeah. How come? I think they just wanted to update the cut of the suit, et cetera. Wow. How much does a nice suit like that cost? Like one of bonds?

Yeah. Oh, God. A Tom Ford, like if we went to a great-fitted one, yeah, probably between $6,000 and $8,000. But I mean, it looks great. It looks great. It looks like every penny? Yes, it does. It really.

really, really does. A nicely fitting suit. But here's where it's better to be a guy who can wear suits.

Like a $6,000 $8,000 gray suit as a man, you can wear that 250 times with a different shirt and tie. Yep.

That's true. If you're going to spend $6 or $8,000 on a dress, you're like, I can wear it here. If no one takes my picture, I might be able to get by

with a second time. Well, you can wear it again as long as you have different shoes and a different face. Yeah, if you wear one of your masks. Different face.

I have a question. What do you think happens to Carter, who is the guy in the Madagascar, his like little Protégé partner. Oh, stop touching your ear. Yeah, and he falls into that pit, and that's the last we see him. Are we meant to think he gets eaten by the snake? I don't think so. No, he doesn't get eaten by that snake.

Eat, not bit, eaten. Snakes can open their mouths really wide. I don't think cobras can, though. I don't. Well, you'll have to show me your facts on that. I didn't realize. It's another Matt spleening. Snakes don't eat people.

People eat people. Yeah, I was wondering about Carter as well. Like, he just falls after shooting his gun and then it's just left there. Everyone spreads away. He did it to himself. Can we blame whatever happens to him? I mean, he did all of that training with, you know, am I, he was British? Was he British or America?

Yeah. He's all the training. He's a secret agent. He's out on the field, and he still doesn't know that he's not supposed to touch his ear piece in his ear. I know.

But that does seem like something I would do. You know, I'm going to have to say, we're going to pass Agent Carter. The one thing he couldn't get, though, was that you shouldn't touch your ear. I'm sure he'll figure it out in the field. Yeah, that's a thing. That's no big deal.

And because this parkour chase is so amazing, I like to go back to 2006. and I don't know if you two remember this, but there was a huge uproar against Daniel Craig being Bond. For one, it was like, he can't have a blonde bond. They're also like, he's not good looking enough and all this nonsense.

So when this movie came out, those guys quickly basically shut up. There were a few that held to their guns. What point in this movie do you think people were sitting there going, okay, I'm in? Like, even though I was against this, like they're seeing something they'd never seen in a Bond movie before.

First scene. Yeah, I agree. Yeah, you think it's the black and white scene. I think for those resistors, it was that parkour sequence where you kind of, like, he just barrels his way through that, culminating with the gun being thrown on top of the crane. That they, I don't know at least at that point, if you haven't, like, given up, given over to that, you're never going to. There's nothing better than that parkour sequence. It was so, it was nothing you've ever seen before.

Also, parkour was this, like, new, hot. trend, but it was just like, I mean, that's what's great about Bond, right? Is that they normally like take kind of what's new or they usually are trying to show you something you haven't seen done before. And I think that's why that is also so cool. But it's also so timeless and it holds up so well, that whole sequence. I think the thing that's great about it is that what really works about that parkour is Bond's contrast to it because in past Bond movies, they probably would have kind of like

tried to make Bond do the park core or something. like a brazen sort of thing. Oh God, how sad to think about Brosnan and doing parkour?

Oh, he has to go to like a gym with a trainer for a month to learn to get over a wall. They put him on soft blocks

so it doesn't hurt himself. I don't like thinking about that. Over a ball pit. Loves paddle surfing. A ball pit. They just put

them in a ball pit to have him practice. I think you're unfair to Pierce Bros. I know you'd think that but that's another story. I haven't seen a Pierce-Mrotson-Bond since

it came out, I don't think. I'm really blind to his greatness. I don't know. I don't know what to think. Yeah. Well, maybe we should have you back for a prize. I disagree though that they would have had the other bonds do parkour because none of the other bonds in your brain could possibly do parkour. Yeah, but but I'm saying the smart thing was to juxtapose what bonds doing to the parkour. Well, like I like what Daniel Craig is doing. I also feel like Connery's bond would have watched him jump up the building and like elbowed a pin out of like a steel girder and the whole thing would have come down.

Or he would have just like taken a stairway kind of jonesily jogging down. Yeah. He would have just looked and guessed where he was going to come out and just gone up an elevator. And the elevator would have opened and he would have been standing there with his arms folded. Let me just say this really quickly because we would have. are talking about the two movies together, that the difference between the greatness of that action sequence and Casino Royale of the parkour

and being able to see what's going on and just the coolness of the stunts, I didn't get any of that in quantum solace. Yeah, it's troubling in quantum solace. Because everything so quickly cut away from that you don't even know what you're watching, it just looks like a blur. Well, they kept doing that thing too

where they cut from the fight to like, you know, the horse race or the fight to something else that is happening simultaneously, which I think was obviously a deliberate choice because they did it more than one in one action sequence. But it's kind of like, it's all that cool. It's a problem. And I think part of it too is they had this rushed editing schedule too. The director has talked about that saying, like, I normally have, he said something like three or four times as much time to edit a film. And for a movie, this like just tall order of a movie, he had so little time to edit. and I think the editor was working

with this assumption that it's got to be like a born movie and it does kind of cost a little takes from the movie It's the shortest one ever Yeah, shortest born movie ever What do you think if Martin Campbell did Quantum A Solis?

Who's that? He also made the Green Lantern. I can't tell. Honestly, that's what I can't tell about Martin Campbell. Well, I think he's proven his medal with Casino Royale that, yeah, maybe he can do some flubs. I mean, of course, like, it's like, but that movie's amazing.

You just wonder. But, right, so if he had stepped in and done Quantum, and Martin Campbell was given the short shrift schedule also, I don't know that he would have helped it. Why didn't he do Quantum of Salas? He didn't want to repeat anything. So he did Golden Eye and Casino Royale, and he felt fascinated by rebooting the Bond twice,

but didn't want to follow that with the same thing. Do you think they get him for the next one? For, oh. The next Bond? I don't wonder. I don't know. Oh. I did. The one thing that did kind of catch me during the parkour sequence this time is when the guy pulls out his gun and he's out of bullets. Because you did just see that in the opening scene, even though I know it was a different circumstance of the other guy shooting him.

And it just felt a little coincidental to me that that would happen twice. And it's interesting on a technical note, when you run out of bullets on a pistol, your gun stays, the slide stays back. and so he should theoretically have known that he was out of bullets because his gun would be in a weird position. How many bullets are in a gun like that? I don't know. Something like that is like seven or eight. No, it's more than that. Those magazines have this like diagonal zigzag thing where they can hold like 12 or 16.

Oh, did he have a long mag? No, it's not a long mag. They have their like side by side bullets that rest kind of like diagonal to each other. So like a Walter PPPK goes in vertical, but these, kind of go like this. Matt's a gun expert. He's our major booth, right, because I had no idea.

Yeah, that's great. After the parkour scene, when he blows up the embassy, listen to me. Listen to me. By the way, that's not what he's saying. I know. It's French.

We covered this. It's unbelievable. Listen to me. Every time. Every time I see it, I'm like, can you believe he's not saying listen to me? Because it's clearly saying listen to me.

Yes, thank you. Why would they make him speak French and say something that clearly sounds English? Sounds exactly like, listen to me. And that's exactly, he's going, listen to me. Listen to me. I have to tell you about the second. Let him go. Second, my son's birthday.

My son's birthday, don't blow me up. Something things going to happen on the second. Everyone's trying to tell you this, James. I just love that moment. And Matt even said, like, the editing is so. seamless in the sequence when you see the embassy sign, like cuts perfectly out of the action, you see the embassy sign. And then when James Bond goes in, that guy's like in the office, like signing paperwork thinking he's safe. Yeah. It's just such a great moment. And it says the

character development is so, so spot on. Like you just get, you don't need to hear James Bond even saying anything. You totally get it. Get it. Get it. It does the best type of character development where it is giving you a really satisfying action sequence while developing character. So you don't even know that you're watching character development half the time. You know? Yeah. It's like the better way to handle exposition is in something like that.

And I could see where you say that with Quantum where it's like when they do their character development, they're taking breaks to do it as opposed to being fully integrated into the story. There's a lot of downbeats in Quantum. Yeah. Yeah. Yeah. Well, I'll save my thoughts.

Heavy lies the head that wears the disdain for quantum of course. Yes, yes, yes. Don't you think they'd pull him out of the field immediately after that? I know that she tries. She tries to get him to come back in to be debriefed. After the embassy blow up? Yeah, she sends him away. Yeah, it's just like...

And also, I mean, the breaking into M's... Why is he doing that? Because he's showing, he's trying to have the power. It's a power struggle between the two of them. Well, he also snooping on her computer. Yeah, he needs the information on her computer. He has to get where that text message. So he's like, I know, but he wants to show her that he can do what he can do.

That's like the two things. Again, it's doing the same thing. Yeah. Yeah. I just think it's foolish. What do you think it's rude? I do. Well, it is rude.

It is rude. Yeah, but that's Bond. His whole arc though is he's so cocky, you know, and he's, he's, he's, reckless. He's too cocky. Here's the thing, though. He's so cocky, it never fucking comes back to bite him. Oh, it does. And it does. And it does. It does in the sunken elevator, I'll tell you. And it does in Quantum of Solace. This is an argument that I'm going to make for the character development of this film. Okay. Strawberry Fields. Forever. Anyway. Yeah, but also that, that beautiful Persian queen dies in the hammock, too.

Demetrius's wife. Yes, exactly. But he doesn't care about that. In quantum, M. digs him and says, oh, you've got this charm, and you don't even, you don't even, like, use it cautiously. Look what you've done.

And he kind of registers a look like, like a moment of humanity where he kind of, you can tell he has an ounce of guilt for Fields' death, I think. I would argue that the humanity of James Bond is disassembled. bit by bit over these two movies. Disassembled. Yeah. Yeah, I think they were trying to teach him to learn him a lesson.

But I didn't, I think it went to, it was just unpleasant to watch in Quantum sometimes. Like I get what they're trying to do is like he comes out of Casino Royale kind of hardened. And so he's going down a bad path. And so I don't know, but it was just not fun. It's like a revenge. Quantum Sol is just a pure. revenge movie. What's wrong with that? It just isn't very bond,

is it? No, it isn't. And that's kind of why maybe that's why it appeals to me because I have this like knowledge of all these films and I kind of like, I love one that goes off track a little bit. I don't mean plot-wise, but just like I wouldn't mind a revenge movie. Like, I like

that they were doing that and I kind of like the relationship of him and that girl, his friend. Camille. Camille. Which one is she? She's the The Bolivian-Russian one. Yeah, who was out for revenge too? I mean, but it just wasn't taken,

it just wasn't clear and it wasn't taken far enough. Like, it would have been cool if they were literally like helping each other get revenge. And I know that's what they were going for and what was kind of happening, but I was,

could not follow the plot. No, I have not either. This movie definitely, uh, gets better with rewatches. And that's, that's a fault against it. I'm sure that you can't kind of like

get all this the first time. I remember feeling that way, the first time I've seen it, but every time I watch it, it gets a little clearer to me. It's simpler. Why the producers were like, let's release this.

Because by the time they released the movie, they've probably seen it seven times. Yeah, this is very clear. You know, I didn't like it the first time, but I have seen it a couple times since. Let's put it out. I think it's, you know, I do find the,

I don't know, I found this experience in watching them both this time around. You know how we're talking about like, oh, I really, enjoyed Dr. Nomore this time. I found that watching Casino Royale and Quantu Sal's back-to-back have sort of, they've soured me a little bit on Daniel Craig. What?

It's not his fault for the record. Okay, thank God, but why? He's so handsome, so great. We're going to get Daniel Craig on the podcast and you can have fun of it. I've had him on. I've talked to him. Yeah, but now that you don't like him, now that you don't like him, I'm going to do a little Pierce Brosnan revenge on you. you always want to get brought up.

Craig's here. I'll bring Craig in. Now, Cateka's performance. He lets me wear his watches. Oh, no, it's not his fault. When was Daniel Craig on the podcast? Not this one on my other show. The late grade nerdist.

The late late nerdist. So long, farewell, Alveda, saying good. Anyway, so, yeah, but I found that this, I don't know, you just, was I sympathizing with the character more? and just sad for him? I was sympathizing. Oh, sympathize it. What did you think?

Yeah, I thought he goes sympathize. No, I said this before and he goes sympathize. I thought he said sympathize it. I always thought he said unsympathizers. Like he's talking about the lambs. I didn't realize until I saw the script that she says, how's your lamb? He says skewered and he goes, one sympathizes.

I've just been skewered by you. We talked about this, I think, I never got that from before. I thought he just said sympathize it. And what did you think that meant? Sympathized it like he's doing a Shakespeare? Yes. Wait, so we've got in a well.

Yes. Listen to me and sympathize it. Sympathize it. But none of it makes, is that crazy when you think about it. Sympathize it is pretty crazy. Yeah, In a well doesn't make sense. Yes, it does. It does in a bathroom.

Okay, okay. It's still a weird thing to say. You need a well to, you know. a bathroom, it's all water. You don't need a well? He meant a well of water because the sink was full of water. And he drowned him. He drowned him.

A wall is a hole. No, I know it's a hole, but why is there water in it? It's a spring. Because you know when you dig, you hit water and you can drink it? So someone digs a hole, puts a little brick thing around it and then... You don't always have to put the brick in the pale in a well. But that is... Oh.

That's like a classic well, yeah. And why do they put the bricks around it? Sorry, the hole doesn't collapse. Oh, okay. The brick theoretically goes all the way down. No, they line the entire well with brick. Like in your, I think in the well you're thinking of, the traditional well where you roll up like a well like baby Jessica would be found in. Yeah, yeah, yeah.

Yeah, Jessica was not in a, in a, surrounded by dirt. But wait, but did those brick wells with the little arched roof and the pale, do those really, I mean, I'm sure they exist because they come from somewhere, but those are not what a regular well looks like. Well, I think so. I would like, if I, someone were to say, here's a well, I would hope it looked like that. Like Snow White's wishing well. Yeah. At Disney. Yeah.

And, you know, the voice of Snow White, she lived on Larchmont and in front of her house was the wishing well. Like she had a wishing well in her yard. Oh, that's, did it have real water in it? I don't know. Probably still water. I think those are more like front yard decorations now, those quaint little wells. Well, then what is a well that you're talking about look like? Well, a well is just, I don't know.

mean to Matt Splain again. I'm very... No, I would love to hear what your thoughts are on wells. A well is just a hole in... Any hole in the ground that has gotten down far enough to reach a spring

that can eternally bring up water for drinking. Yeah, a hole... But how deep is... It doesn't... It depends on how deep it is. And it's just like a hole of dirt, like a hole... Or I guess you could line it with bricks

or cement or wood or something. Yeah, that's what a wall is. Yeah, it's a hole. It's a hole. lined with bricks or cement with a little arch in a bucket. Yeah. But that's not how that guy does. We had a pump.

We had a well pump in the backyard. Ooh, I love those things. I love those. That's usually what a well is. Like on a farm is just a pump. And how does the water come out of that pump? What's the pipe? So they have just a pipe that goes down to the well, down to where the water is.

And I think isn't when you're handling that crank, it's like a plug piston in the pipe that is siphoning up the water. or something. Wow. Guys. I just, it's crazy how the world works. Yeah. Welcome to Well Talk.

You know well with Maria Blusucci. Mad end. If you're an Earwolf fan, you should definitely be listening to Paul F. Tompkins and his podcast Spontanea Nation. On the show, PFT and his comedy pals perform narrative-based improv, inspired by an interview with an amazing celebrity guest like LeVar, or Bert and Alison Brie or even John Hamm. I'm sure you know Paul F. Tompkins, if not from his many performances and appearances,

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Get Zipa now. Mad and! Mad and! Mad and! Did you know, guys, let's get, let's get back to being friends. We are all friends here. I'm feeling alone.

I'm feeling... You shouldn't? We're talking about Casino Royale right now. Have you ever felt more together? I don't know, there's an energy in the room. Also, the three of you are seated in this seated configuration, just staring at me. We are forced to join... I feel vulnerable.

Seat forces. Well, we can talk more about Casino Royale. That's something fun to talk about. Well, it's interesting on this viewing for me. I don't know what it was. Was my attitude poor going into it? On Casino Royale, you weren't enjoying it? Because of the, I think it was because I knew Quantum had to come afterwards.

And I was like, this is five hours of my life. You didn't give yourself enough time. It's probably what it was. Maybe. Did you literally watch them back to back? No, I couldn't. Well, that's not true. I did it in the same day.

Oh, wow. We did it morning and night. Two days. We did... Two and a half days. Yeah, we did two thirds of Casino Real, then the last act yesterday afternoon. Boy, that movie is so long.

A little bit of quantum. Oh, no, we did it last night, and then a little bit of quantum last night, and then the rest this morning. May I just say that quantum took Vesper's theme and ran with it? Yeah. They were using that to put in,

a lot of heart that they weren't getting through the dialogue. No, it was nice, but no, no, no, but it was very apparent to me that they were putting that in there to pull it your heart strings. I just, I like the tie-ins of the two movies. That's another thing is you just, we've never had a sequel before, so. Boy, did he luck out that Demetrius was outside when that text message came. Yeah, I know. There's a couple things plot-wise in both of these films that don't really got very lucky. They spent too much time.

as great as an action scene that it is. I think they spend too much time at the Miami airport. It's so good, though. It's great. But I think it takes... This movie takes too long. I'm now, like, anti-the-running time

with Casino-Royale. How long is it? It's two hours and 40 minutes? That's a long movie. Is it the longest? Yes. Or did Skypala Specter? There are such distinct parts to Casino Royale.

Set pieces. Yeah. Set pieces are... And it's almost like three different movies. It's like there's the last part of the movie with Vesper. And then there's the middle part at the casino. And then there's the before part at Miami Airport. Body Works.

And then there's the whole beginning part. So it's like four movies. Yeah, I think it is three pretty clear distinct acts. And it does. I understand it's a long movie, but the poker is terrible too. No, that's not true. It's bad poker. It's the worst poker I've ever seen in my life in a movie.

Like these hands are insane. Do they have four people all in on a fucking wet board with a flush like that? Because they're all confident. They're all male cares. I do. Just as a poker player, it's just crazy. But how about as a movie enjoyer and a human being? Yeah, and not everything can be rounders, Matt.

Someday. Everything will be rounders. You'll see. You'll see. But that's the same thing is saying like at that point when he's driving on in his Ford rental car, he wouldn't have had a smartphone that could track that kind of thing. I had one back then. Suspension of disbelief.

That was not out of the realm of possibility. Suspension of disbelief is what I'm saying. I mean, I get it from your perspective where you would, it would have been nice for it to have been really nuanced and accurate. It's not something I noticed. Yeah, I didn't need to have, I guess what I want to say out loud to everyone is I didn't need to have a four-way all-in pot for the last hand of poker. where each person is in succession beats the other person around the table. Did you really feel that way the first time you saw it? I didn't play poker enough to know.

But do you remember the feeling of him winning? Because I would argue that you're in a special class because you know poker well, but that is set up to create an escalation of tension that I think delivers. If you take the poker part out of it and just look at telling a story. Yeah, I would have enjoyed much more a heads-up pot with the two of them. like if it was just heads up with those two I didn't need the other guys going all in for it that's just like the craziness but they have like three times where a pot has to be

tense and they do do a heads up pot the first time when he lose yes when it's aces over queens and aces over kings and he had pocket kings he had quads right he had quads Bond had a full house and this is maybe one of the most extensive and long poker sequences in any film and the fact that they can sustain it and kind of make it

interesting that long as a feat. It's notorious when you have discussions with other poker players. Like it's notoriously the worst poker in a movie. Isn't that? Mark McCondell has said that too. And he said that the first night we saw it, he came out of it saying that, and I was like, this is your takeaway?

I mean, I guess it's like saying, you know, that second world series game in a league of their own doesn't, you know, it really doesn't play that that they'd have to put Dotty in. It's just like then you get to be crazy about baseball.

This poker game is there solely to serve as a battle of the minds between Leshif and Bond. And I think it does an excellent job of that. It is not there to entertain you with a poker game. It's there to make

their showdown. Honestly, no, it's because it makes Lechief look stupid. Because if that was a real poker game and Lechief only had the boat, he would look at that board and go, would James Bond be playing 5-7 suited in this pot?

Yes, look at the turn. Like, for a poker player of Lechief's quote-unquote caliber to have shoved all in with not possibly the best hand in the scenario where three people before him have gone all in, he does not have the best possible hand. If three people are going all in before it gets to, it's like... Well, no one has the best possible hand. And Bond got his on a...

No, Bond does. He's a straight flush. Yeah, but there's a royal flush. Like, he doesn't have the best part. Not out on that board. It's impossible to have a royal flush with what was on the table. So, like, that is the best possible hand. Mark McConavel once explained it to me that the reason he didn't like it is because

Bond's hand in the end turns out to be a lucky draw, not a, like a... Oh, he hangs in. Yeah, but I don't mind that. So the sheaf wouldn't have expected that to happen. Well, I don't mind that. But that was part of it, wasn't it? that he was being reckless with the way he was playing cards.

So like that fact that he got that at the end was like a few type like, whew. Yeah. Well, it was like how Leshief beat Bond by getting that king on the river and then having quads. Yeah. You know, that was similar and I didn't mind that, but just I didn't, what I didn't buy, and I'd

love to talk to Mark about this next time. He's on. But like the whole idea that Lechief... Because Bond Bond only shows shoves all in after the river card. I'm going to say, why do you seek the cup of Christ for his glory or for yours? Does this bother you because it's insulting your knowledge of poker or it's a good scene?

No, no, no, no, it's not a good scene because, let me say this correct. Like, you're fixating on things. It is a good scene, I think, if you don't know, like, if this was Baccarat, I wouldn't know what was happening. So I'd be like, oh, cool. Exactly. Yes. So in that sense, yes. But you're mad that they're treating the audience as stupid and saying...

Now, it's that if you actually watch poker, what they're going for and how they've been battling brains throughout the game doesn't make sense for the characterization of Le Schiff. Like, Lechief being such a numbers guy and so aware of what's going on at the poker table, he's not bluffing. But they have to make this also playable to, a lay person's I've played poker.

That's why you have Mathis there. He must go, oh, I know, but if he's to explain what you just explained all of that,

we're done. Well, I think, that's what she's doing. Yeah, she's like, I got it. Yeah.

I think that they're taking liberties, which movies always do. I mean, ideally they would have made it as good of a scene and been very accurate

in the gameplay. And like, maybe they could have done that if they had done a couple more passes, but I didn't bother me. Yeah, I'd like to also stress

that I'm like going into the minutia of this because this is the, we've covered this movie three times. So I feel like I can now, all right guys. Let out your true feelings. Well, let out just like a little bit of like more detailed nuance in the movie. The other thing that I found interesting this time, it's weird when you watch this movie analytically for a third time where you're like, I have to talk about this on a podcast.

What am I going to talk about? You start to look for things, right? Yeah. So I was watching it and I just like, I don't buy their love. Oh, this is weird. What are you talking about? It's too quick.

Wow. First of all, the whole plan... Is this where we split and do different James Bond? This might be the end. Oh, my God. Let me just warn you. See us each in London. They're doing Rosanne without Roseanne.

You've got to be careful. I know. Yeah. I am the Connors. Oh, my. No, you're Roseanne. No, I'm the Connors. You're Roseanne.

I'm the Connors. Well, let's hear them out and then we'll decide. Okay, guys, follow my logic here. And I'm so sorry if I'm offending. I apologize. It's not offensive. It's just wrong. We're just sad for you.

I can be wrong. How would it like to have lost that in your life? I mean, I think about that daily, the love between Vesper and Bond. It's all I've got sometimes. You know, I think it's so manufactured. It's crazy. Just plot-wise.

Here's the thing. And back me up here. Who? I don't think you're going to get this for many. I actually didn't mean to say back me up. Correct me if I'm wrong. It's what I actually meant to say. No, we'll all do that.

Please. This poker game is. organized by LeSheif when his when the put on the stock fails and he loses $110 million

of a terrorist organization's money. After 9-11 someone made a fortune. Okay. Now he sets up the game. What is the distance between daywise

him setting up this poker game and him losing all that money on the stocks? Conservatively. Let's say it's a week A week. Okay. So a week goes by and he has that. So he has Vesper in the treasury. Why? Just because Quantum is everywhere and has a bunch of people everywhere. So he's always had Vesper ready to go. The Sheaf hasn't. Quantum has. What's quantum? Wait, wait. Quantum. Quantum is Mr. White's group, though. You don't find that out until Quantum is. I thought that it was that she just was working for the Treasury and then when this all went down, they could. kidnapped your boyfriend.

They don't say when this happened. Yeah, I think it happened probably right when this whole thing came about, like after the plain thing. Well, here's the crazy. But I think they've already, he's already been implanted as her boyfriend for whatever contingency they're going to need to use. Oh, they implanted him as her boyfriend. Her boyfriend was part of quantum.

He's the guy at the very last. Yeah. With the Canadian. But he's a quantum guy. Yes. And so he's. So he was not really captured. and blackmailed.

She was blackmailed, but he was fake captured. They lied to her. Why? He was in on it. He's part of Quantum's falling in love with these women, and then they set it up. They talk about this in Quantum with the Canadian girl. Like, he's going to now leave. You've got the same necklace.

He's going to disappear and make you believe that he's been captured. Oh, and they're going to use you. To get secret. Oh, see, that wasn't clear. Yes, it wasn't. I would love someone to draw this up for me so I could really see visually. Yeah. Oh, so essentially.

Okay. I see what you're saying. Vesper's boyfriend was not truly in love with her. He was pretending to be in love with her so that she would do whatever was needed to get him back. It's wrong. Okay? So the planting of the boyfriend and Vesper,

this timeline for me is just so funky. Again, once you watch this movie for the 19th time and you try to analyze it on a podcast for the third time. It's a good movie, everyone. It's a great movie, one of the best bond movies. You can keep making excuses, but what I'm hearing at the center is Vesper and Bond don't love each other?

Yeah, here's why. They don't know each other long enough for this scenario to happen. I also, I find her appearance. Hold on. Wait, wait, let him finish. I find her appearance in the movie, the timing-wise, just crazily convenient. As convenient is Demetrius getting a text message outside when he's dropping on his ass tomorrow. She's being given her assignment through the Department of the Treasury.

Right, her assignment now. So she's specifically assigned to this mission. Here's what I don't understand. Where, at what point do they go, does Quantum sit down and go, man, LeSheef lost all that money? We better get him. You think he's going to organize a poker game? No, no, hold on. Probably.

Should we get someone in the treasury? Stop. Stop. You're embarrassing yourself. Please. Please. Please help. Presumably.

She's been with Yousef for a while. Yes. And he's always been a sleeper agent. Yes. Then she's assigned to this mission. and or possibly even assigned by someone in quantum because we know that they're high up. But either way, if she's just assigned, then they activate Yousef with this plan because of this mission. So to your other point, there is a passage of time.

We talked about this last night after Bond's balls are beaten and they escape. There is, who knows how long he's recuperating a month or two maybe. Plus there's a time after that where they're traveling around the world. they've already said like Well, it doesn't even matter. They're in love the first time they meet. And they've saved each other's lives. Because they both have similar,

I believe they both have similar pasts and they're both broken people and they see something in each other that no one else can quite understand. Also, he's never met a woman like her. And she's never met a man like him. She's, yes, that's right. They've saved each other's lives.

And yet they can describe each other perfectly. Yes, they can. Because they're two sides of the same coin. And you also say, see them truly begin their affair after he's recuperated. We talked about this, too, that they kissed in character in their cover fields. But I believe that wheelchair kisses their first kiss. Oh, when he just smite when that Switzerland man comes and then he smiles.

Oh, that's the best moment in the entire movie. Almost like it, they're still rolling and someone made a joke. Yeah, it's the most real. I think that was his honest reaction to that man's loud. That is so nice. She warmed his cold heart. Look, if you're falling in love with James Bond. Yeah.

And you're in the middle of this. Yeah. Yeah. When you're falling in love. When you already have fun. When you're in Montenegro and you're falling in love with a man is charismatic and wonderful and broken as James Bond. I don't think she's even fully falling in love with him at that point. I don't know.

Okay. So you're telling me that the love of Vesper, her falling in love with him is happening off screen while he's in a coma? No. It's happening for the entire process. That's why they take all that time. But here's my question. She could have saved everything if she had just let him know

prior to him going down there for that last round of poker. James, you have to know. I just saved your life. I just plugged this lead in. I have to tell you everything. Not yet. They're still falling in love with each other. I think it's that thing where you know when you meet someone and you're like, I love you, but I might

hate you. Do I hate you or do I love you? And then after they lick the blood off your fingers, you realize I, well, you realize I love you, but you're still torn. That's before. I know, she's still torn. Okay, so she's fighting with her own, her own feeling.

Yeah, what's your problem? What do you mean? Why should she warn him? What do you mean? No, no. Oh, I'm saying like, she's still, she bargains with her, with quantum for her, for his life. Yeah. Which happens.

It's so sweet. Which happens between Aston Martin rolling over 14 times and him in a chair with his ball. It happens after both of those. No, it happens before. What is she barter for? She barters with quantum. When Mr. White comes in with the gun. Yeah.

The barter has been done. I think she doesn't know. No, I think the barter has been done because otherwise he'd just pull the trigger and kill Bond. I know that they eventually need that password. No, but he comes in and sees Vesper first and that's presumably when she says,

save his life, I'll give you what you want. And what is she giving them? The money. But I thought that's what she was already giving them. Exactly. That's what I'm wondering. Exactly. What does she barter with?

What does she give them that she wasn't already giving them? Well, I don't think they were ever going to have to get it from Vesper. That's the thing. Oh, she steals it. She has, she had a plan to, I'm lucky to give it to. She was just there. Wait a minute. No, she was there to withhold money.

She was there to withhold money. Yes, she was there to. that's her role as the treasury, but what she's really there is to actually, I think she's conflicted. She's trying to make Bond lose so she doesn't have to deal with this, right? Well, that's what they want her to do

so that if he loses, they get the money. Yeah, but he wins so now they're out of money and now they have to get this money and the only way to get this money is through Vesper. And she says, I'm not going to give it to you unless you let Bond live. Yes. And so that's why she has to go to Venice and give them the thing? Yeah, so she's both falling in love,

with him and having to do this thing she's dreading doing. Yes. What do you mean? No. That's exactly what it is. My reaction is not that you're wrong. It's just that I'm just like, no, on her part. Why?

Why? What do you wish you would have done? That's what's so good about this movie. It's like, it's really. It's a big one. It's very convoluted. You're absolutely right. No, Matt.

It's not convoluted. The only that's convoluted is some of the stuff that goes down at the end. And that always has bothered. I know that they needed her to kill herself, but it's always. Who's the they? Qua did her to that? No, that's the they is the movie makers. Oh, right.

But it's always, always, always tears me up inside, like that, all that motivation at the end of, like, because then Judy Dynch says, well, I'm sure she thought they'd let her live. And then someone else says, she knew she was going to her death. But then why did she, I just don't understand. So, here's what I think it is. So she, she does assume she's going to her death. So she, when Bond, well, I think she thought she might be able to live if she gives them the money. But when Bond follows them, she feels

so guilty, he's caught her and she can't just disappear. She wants to kill herself out of guilt. Just because he found out. So she thought, is she thinking she's still going back to Yousef? No, I don't think at that point. She took off her necklace.

Her Algerian love not. But that's an interesting thing too. She says, to learn you can't forget the past. That's a weird thing to say, too. What does she say? Sorry. She says, Bond says something like you've moved on and she says, no, I've learned that I can't forget the past. No, I think she says I've learned, I've finally forgotten the past. She says that you can't forget the past. Are you sure? She says Akunamata, I think. I don't know if that's what she says for the rest of your days.

It's a problem free philosophy. Is that what she says? Do you guys remember her saying that? I thought she says, I don't remember. I forgot the past. In quantum of solace, though, someone says, she loved you enough to not tell or to something about how she saved his life in some way that's when she negotiates for the money they're like why didn't quantum kill James and it's because she negotiated the money no it because he had the password and she had to get it from him it was Vesper well yes

he's not in my mind this whole time and each of the ten times I've watched this movie Bond is not shot in the head by White because Bond has the password and they need that password. It's because she negotiated for his life. Yeah, they say it in the movie. That's what M says. She says, you know,

did you wonder why they didn't kill you? Well, here's what I thought was happening. I thought they were like, oh, this is a wash. Here's what I thought Quantum was saying. Oh, damn, the British government won the poker tournament. We don't have the money anymore. I better go clean up all these loose ends and start killing everyone.

Well, then he would kill Bond. Right, but I thought that he doesn't kill Bond because to your point, I thought that Vesper was like, he has the password. Let him live. I'll get the password from him. It could be both. I think it's maybe those things aren't usually exclusive. Like that makes sense that it's both. But the thing that I'm always confused about is that she, the only reason she doesn't think she's going to her death, she thinks they're going to let her go and then she gets to go be with James Bond.

But why does she leave her phone? behind for in case she does die right yes because it's she because then she has the number to mr white in the phone so that's she's leaving him a clue so she thinks she might die she hopes she doesn't but when he does find her she then wants to die yeah because she sees his face and realizes she's betrayed him but she would have found out saved his life but also he would have found out anyway because that if even if they had let her live that money would have been gone and I think it's just too much for her to see him and after what she's done. But what has she done?

What do you mean what she's done? She was having a pillow fight with him not 10 minutes prior. Yeah, and she was planning to go back there to him. She was? Well, yeah. I don't think so. I'm sure she hoped they would let her live. She means quantum.

Yeah. I think, but I don't know that she was necessarily going to go back because he would then soon enough know that she's betrayed him. Oh, so she was going to, if they let her live, she wasn't going to go back to James Bond. necessarily. I don't know if she was going to go back to Yusuf either. I think she knows her. I think she's like having the pillow fight all this time is finite for her. I think she knows it can't last forever and knows at some point she's going to have to give this money to them. Why didn't she just tell him like after while they were sailing around and stuff? It's a good question. But I guess that's a character thing though. It's true. The reason we're all talking about it is because it isn't 100% clear.

Well, she probably knew he would never. The only reason I can justify that is, is by the fact that she did kill herself after he found out. Maybe she knew that if he found out, he wouldn't love her anymore. So that's why she doesn't tell him, and that's why she kills herself. I think you're right. Yeah. It's her pride.

She's got pride, just like he has. It's also, she takes his hand, puts it up to her, and kind of kisses his hand like he does hers in the shower. It's, it's let me take all of this burden on and die. But why? She could have just lived. She can't deal with having done that to him. I don't think she can live with herself.

Maybe she could deal with the fact that she had fallen in love with James Bond while she still loved Yusuf. No. She did not still love Yusuf. No one still loved Yusuf. No one loved Yusuf. And also they probably weren't ever even in love. I'm sure he was like gaslighting her.

Well, but the way he was treating that Canadian at the end of Quantum of Salas made it seem like he really put the moves on. Yeah, let's walk to the convenience store and buy something and go back to my I love that. I love that very slight from the Canadian agent. Thank you. Yeah, I know. I know.

Thank you. Can you imagine? She's actually, I was watching that pretty intently. And she's really good when he talks about the neck, shows the necklace. She just does a little blink. Like, the whole motivation she's playing is, I'm so embarrassed. Yeah. Like I have failed as an intelligence person.

And I am. Thank you. But back to. Thank you. That's funny. As someone's going to kill her boyfriend, thank you. Thank you.

And she runs out of there, goes to get it, calls her best friend. Yeah. Me at the bar, I need a glass of wine. Yeah, you are not going to believe what I just hurt.

Also, there's a hell of a sale at a convenience store. You got two bags of stuff for seven bucks. Two for one bottles of Kim Crawford. Sauvignon Blanc. Okay. So back to, well, I guess sort of my problem again now is with this,

I guess I find so little logic in the actions of this couple in love Matt you're just you're not really being real with yourself yeah is that what it is I think you're confused I think quantum of solace may have confused you to a point where now you don't know what's up and what's down I do think you're actually watching it I don't know like through the cracks in a way that it's not meant to be watched I will admit that because again Why I'm having to preface this I don't know

This is the 900th time I've seen this movie This is the third time I've had to talk critically about it So I'm looking for things that I haven't seen before And I understand the questions behind the motivations Because it is not super clear And if you really care to know You have to kind of do a lot of work And you have to do some interpretation I think too

And that's valid But is it deliberate? Or is it poor story-time? No, I actually, because I am with you, I hate when movies leave questions as more of an ease of not happening to answer questions. What do you think? I think the evidence is there. I think that while we're watching the movie, Hagus and Wade and everyone who had a hand in the script

should just do like, remember when you would watch Fox and they would be promoting like Joe Millionaire and he would pop up from the bottom and be like, Joe Millionaire, Wednesdays at 5. You want like a pop-up video. pop up of the writer going like, what do you think? No, it just goes away. The reason I love this movie, I think, is because there is room for a certain amount of interpretation, and it does, like, lend to discussions about it, but I don't think that that's because it's, it's not there.

I think it's, you can actually say, I think it's this, I think it's this, and there's there's evidence to be made for different cases, and that's what's intriguing about it. Quantum complicates it in its attempt to simplify it, but if you just take Casino Royale, I think it's really there. I agree. And that's what I like about it. That's the other thing is you don't get that kind of like moral ambiguity in a Bond film prior to this. Well, I just find that the relationship between the two of them,

I get that they fall in love. But I wonder how much of Vesper's love is real love. Well, at the beginning, it's not real. she's putting on a face but I think it's just a slow they start to understand each other and they realize they like he takes care of her like he protects

her you know she really does get spooked downstairs or with the thing and he like you know comforts her and she may have never felt real affection like that before even from Yusef because Yusuf was a lying piece of shit he wore like a

black leather demi trench coat I think the movie takes Canada. I think the movie takes pains to answer that by doing what would otherwise be. And so complaint the film often receives is that section where it is almost a scene after scene showing of them just on the beach, making love in an hospital room. And they always dissolve out of those things. So it's to show you passage of time.

My wonder really is, would it be any different? Would we look back on this movie? you can't look back on it in a more positive light because it's already great. But wouldn't it be interesting if they ended the movie with him waking up in the hospital and you do that little wheelchair scene? And that's the end of the movie. That's funny. My last movie is what if this movie had a happy ending, which most versions of this film that kind of exist in their own right as a

film would have a happy ending. He would savor in that elevator. Yeah. How different would this film be? Well, my wonder is like, what if this film is as it is, but it ends after that smile from the Swiss guy, right? Like they consider doing with the Honor Majesty's Secret Service. But in Quantum of Solace, we see the rest of the movie.

I think it's way better this way. Same thing with Honor Majesty's Secret Service. Because, you know, remember, they shot that ending to consider using as the opening of the next film. Yes. Yeah. Yeah, I think Honor Majesty's Secret Service is better because of that. Yeah.

Yeah. But also because this is the novel, too, and I think that's a big reason why the novel works is she kills herself. And it formulates who Bond is. She is the single biggest reason, even more than being an orphan and all that stuff, as to why he becomes the character he becomes. And it's why they do what they do with him in Quantum of Solace, I think. That is what I find interesting. I know it has to happen, but it's so upsetting when she does that thing where she screams

underwater. Oh, yeah. It's so upsetting. It sucks her to the back of the elevator. Yes. I don't know how she shot that. It looks like she's actually letting water into her lung. It's crazy.

It's so horrible. Did they film that underwater underwater? Oh, yeah. I thought they might have pulled a for your eyes only on that. This is all practical, baby. Practical drowning. Wow. Yeah, it is so great.

I wonder if there's any maybe Vesper James fan fiction out there online. I'd read that. I would too. Yeah, maybe just because I'm just thinking maybe there is some nice. Well, you should read Casino Royale. Yeah, but I want them to be living in the suburbs maybe and just having like a little life together. Like a Mr. and Mrs. Smith. What do you think?

Let's pretend. The English countryside. No, I think they're going to keep moving around the world on that boat. So you think they stay up forever? We're going to settle down eventually and have a baby and they're going to live in the countryside. British countryside. Yeah, just somewhere. Bond and Vesper fan fiction. Yes.

Do you know what I think they do? I think they wind up back at Skyfall. And it becomes a happy home again. God, can you imagine? It becomes a happy home again. Oh my gosh. And they have two kids. And Albert Finney shows their tiny kids how to use shotgun.

And then they go rock climbing in the Swiss Alps. No, James. What are their kids like? They're innocent You know how there's like erotic fiction? Let's do emotional. Matt's never looked happier. The kids are.

It would be nice. That's the life James could have had. Yeah, but do you think you would have ever been truly happy in that life or would he have itch for... What would he have done? You know what? I think...

Oh, I guess he wouldn't have to do anything. Oh, no, Matt. What are you seeing? Okay, this isn't that long. Should I read it? It is fiction as if he gets her out of the elevator. Yes, please. Is this going to end in some sort of weird pornographic?

God, I hope that's how. A lot of fan fiction ends. I'm sorry, James. Well, that's because it's written right. Vesper pulled the lever that sent the elevator plummeting to churning waters below. Bond's heart stopped in horror as he watched the machine disappear below the surface. Despite the building failing in around him, he jumped in the water after it, desperate to save the woman inside. The woman he couldn't live without.

He swam frantically toward the elevator and upon reaching it began prying the door open. Vesper's hair flowed out around her in the water, giving her an almost angelic appearance. Bon never... Almost. Bon never faltered in trying to break through the Iron Gate, which is capitalized like Trump. Door, as he noticed this, he couldn't let her die.

He wouldn't let her. Despite the fact that they were underneath the water, it was obvious that Vesper was sobbing. I don't mean, I hope, whoever wrote this, we're not laughing at you, we're laughing with it. She swam over to where James was prying the doors apart and took his hands away from the bars.

She kissed them, hard and pressed them to her cheek and looked mournfully at him. So this is all that's in the, this is all in the movie. Knowing that this would be her last time to see him, she motioned for her to leave, him for her to, she motioned for him to leave her to get himself out, but he shook his head and relentlessly shook the bars of the elevator, two shooks. He saw her body shiver slightly, and he shook the bars even harder, knowing that time was running out.

Finally, the doors broke apart. Fesper was weak, and her eyes barely fluttered by this point. James grabbed her arm and swam as hard as he could to the search. surface. As he swam, he felt her body go limp in his arms. He only kicked his legs faster. They broke the surface of the water, and Bond took a grateful gulp of air. He pulled himself in Vesper's limp form up to the remaining roof of the now submerged building. He began CPR, desperately trying to get her to cough up water she had swallowed, desperately trying to get her to breathe, desperately trying to open her eyes to do anything. Vespa, come on, please breathe. He kept

trying to bring her back and continued failing. He was giving up hope. When he saw a twitch of movement in her mouth, he wasn't sure whether or not his eyes had deceived him, but he would take anything as a sign. He tried even harder, pushing down on her chest, harder than before, breathing more air into her lungs than before, his repeat of these words,

until he heard a faint cough from her pale form. Oh, she, yay! And that's where we're going to break for two weeks until the next episode. We will open up with the fan fiction of Vennessee, of Vesper Lives Quantum of Royale Casino of Salus

You son of a bitch I have to wait two weeks for this Now let's quickly give our rankings Oh guess what everybody Maria Amanda You've been on the show before you You know how this new phase

of James Bonding works We like to give each movie a ranking from 000 to 007 007 of course being the best So I guess over to you guys guys first. 007.

Double 100,000. I love it. I love it. I love it. It's beautiful. Everyone is perfection in it. It's extraordinary. The casting is amazing.

It's beautiful. It's a beautiful movie. Everyone is doing what needs to be done. Vesperlin is like unlike any other bond girl. She's so exceptional. Although I do agree what we've said before that they put too much makeup on her. And the dress in the casino is, It's...

No, the black dress is better. And also, the way they overdo her hair and the setting. It's just too much. I agree with the makeup stuff. It's too much. And she looks so beautiful when she's natural. I think it was a deliberate choice

as her shell hardens. The makeup comes off, but still... Her armor is removed. Both of their armors are removed. It's the... Oh, it's so... And there are, believe me, they don't need armor because those...

Beautiful faces. And then, hello, all of a sudden, by the end of the third act, we're in the notebook. Yes. Yes, we are. Perfect. I am a hard and heavy 007.

This is the only one I'm given for any of the movies. I'd give it a 0020 if I could. And I think this is not only my favorite Bond movie, but maybe my favorite movie of all time, certainly up there. Wow. Yeah. 007 for me as well.

Wait a minute, but you had so many questions. I watched it 95 times. I had to look for something. Yeah, and you know what it makes for an interesting conversation. Yeah. So tune in in two weeks. for the conclusion of Casino of Salas and James Bonding will return. James Bonding Podcast.

Hey, this is Arnie Neacamp from the Improft Fantasy podcast. Hello from the Magic Tavern. I fell through a dimensional portal behind a Burger King in Chicago into the magical land of food, and I started a podcast. Season three has just begun with a brand new adventure to defeat the Dark Lord. If you're a new listener or you've fallen behind season three is a great jumping on point. And we've got great guests like, Justin McElroy.

I sat like a fancy college professor. Fake Nats. Rachel Bloom. You all see my collection of men corpses and one woman. Felicia Day and Colton Dunn. You've seen me have intercourse with a variety of species. It's a bummer. Andy Daly.

You have the members of Genesis listed, but Phil Collins has crossed out and then circled it crossed out again. Yes, I have killed Phil Collins twice. Thomas Middletch. Jesus, I mean, Jarzos. Ruler of the eighth circle. And that's just the beginning. Season three, A Below from the Magic Tavern is out now. Listen in Stitcher, Apple Podcasts, or wherever you get your podcasts.