Jocko Podcast - 215: You'll Never Be Free Unless You Tell Yourself The Truth. Taking Control Of Your Destiny At Work. Brown-nosing Team Members. Passed Over For Promotion.

Episode Date: February 5, 2020

0:00:00 - Opening: Sun Tzu 0:02:37 - What to do if a team mate is brown-nosing and putting in extra work to get a promotion. 0:31:43 - What to do when you get passed over for a promotion. 1:02:07 - What to do when you think you're in a rut, or in a loop of failure. 1:10:23 - Know the difference. "Yes" Man VS Willing to smash all tasks., big or small. 1:13:43 - How to take control of your destiny at work. 1:17:51 - Are you happy where you are, REALLY? 1:23:46 - How to stay on THE PATH. 1:51:39 - Closing Gratitude.  Support this podcast at — https://redcircle.com/jocko-podcast/exclusive-content

This is Jocko podcast number 215 with Echo Charles and me Jocco Willink. Good evening, Echo. Good evening. Got a little quote, kick things off today. The general who does not advance to seek glory or does not withdraw to avoid punishment, but cares for only the people's security and promotes the people's interest is the nation's treasure. That's a little Sun Su coming at you. And of course, we covered Sun Su on podcast number 23.

And it's just always interesting how you can find the same themes throughout time from a leadership perspective. I know I talk about this point a lot in leadership strategy and tactics book. This statement right here is this 2,500 years old. and he's saying the same thing that I say in leadership strategy and tactics that many of the problems that come about for a leader are from their ego. And so we have to learn to keep our ego in check. Now this is, you know, we talk about it in extreme ownership, the very first book. This isn't like, hey, I just thought of this yesterday.

And it's not like I just thought of this anyway. Like I said, somebody was jumping on, somebody was making some comments on social media platform that it said he's acting like he, like me, I'm acting like I invented cover and move. You know, of course I said, hey, no, it's actually, I say all the time, I didn't invent this or much of anything. So I didn't invent this idea of ego. I didn't just think of it whatever But it is a theme that we see over and over again from people that Pay attention Not just from a leadership perspective either. I mean we're talking life

Problems so this was interesting so we just wrapped up the Jocko live tour. It was awesome. Thanks for when it came Got some really good questions along the way and A lot of times the questions sometimes the questions are about ego even though the person doesn't even know that the question's about ego but when you start to dig in you start to realize that it's about ego but the so this first question is one of those questions and the question was something along the lines of this it was something like what should I do if a peer of mine is working hard putting an extra effort and trying to shine so that they get promoted that was the question and that's a good question

Right? Because, right, what do you do? And the instinct is, like, you know what I'm saying? You can even feel that instinct. I can see the look on your face right now. Yes. You have the look on your face of like, you can see that that's a little bit offensive, right? When you go, oh, this person's trying to work hard, trying to put that extra effort in. Trying to shine so that they can get promoted.

Yeah. Right. No one likes that person, by the way, right? No one likes the brown noser. Yeah. So we get it. So then the question was what should this person do what you know the guy asked me what do I do when that's happening and the instinct Which is the instinct you had which is the instinct my first instinct

Even me mr. keep your ego in check My very first instinct is like a little bit of like a pushback like that guy and I want to lash out of him Right, but that's not the right answer you know because because what's what you say is you say who they think they are Yeah, so you know what that is that's those attacks that's your own personal ego that's my own ego my own ego going well that person just wants so if you can take a second you can take a step back you can detach you can put your ego in check and if you do that then you say to yourself okay here's what's here's the situation if we remove the ego here's the

situation this person is working extra hard by the way this person's a peer so we're on the same team this person is working extra hard they're putting in extra effort they are trying to shine and all those things all those things are actually good for your team right I got someone that's trying to do a great job that's working harder I'm actually happy I'm actually happy if there's a person working harder on my team that's good if there's a person that's trying to outwork me and do a better job than me that's actually awesome because now we're going to be a better team. Now mind you, any moment you let your ego slip into this, it turns into a nightmare. It's not good. You don't like it. You're offended

that someone's trying to work harder than you. But if you keep your ego in check, then that's good. You realize that it's good. And I'll tell you something else. And this is what I answered this question. I said, for this person, to outwork me, he's going to have a hard time. He's going to have a hard time outworking me because I'm here to win too. And that is a little bit of my ego. But that ego is being a positive thing

because I'm, oh, you're going to step up your game. Guess what I'm going to do? Step up my game. I'm not going to undermine you. That would be negative. That would be my ego causing a problem. But if I go, oh, you're echo stepping up his game. Echo's showing up at 6 o'clock in the morning instead of 610.

Oh, and I'm coming in at 6.05. Guess what? Guess what time I'm coming in tomorrow? Six. No, 4.30. But you're right. So I do a little bit more. So now we're both a little bit more prepared.

Now we got some good competitiveness going on. That's good. It's good for the team. So you, this other person that's stepping up the game, trying to do a good job is actually awesome because it's going to make me step up my game. And I'm going to tell you right now, that person is going to have a hard time outworking me.

They're going to have a hard time. Bring it. I'm actually fired up. I'm actually getting fired up right now. I'm getting I'm starting like I'm thinking I might attack you right now just to see what's up So that's good now here's here's where the second Ego scenario that you have to get under control What if that person steps up their game? I step up my game They end up they actually do end up out shining me. They actually do end up getting the big promotion then what do I do? Do I get bitter?

Do I get jealous? Do I get mad? Do I now start to undermine them and spread rumors about? No, actually. If somebody outworked me and outperformed me and then got promoted good for them. That is awesome. Credit. They get a credit.

You're done good, son. You done good. And there's nothing wrong with that. And what I am going to do is instead of being bitter and mad and jealous and all those things, instead I'm actually going to put my ego out of the picture and say what actually happened. Where did this person perform better than me and how can I support them? How can I learn some lessons from this?

And how can I become better? So the next time there is an opportunity, I do get promoted. You wouldn't think that that question is about your own personal ego from the beginning. Now it's easy to see looking back. Yeah. But from the beginning, it's like, hey, what do you do? How do you handle this situation when someone's trying to outwork you and outshine you? And they're trying to get promoted.

Yeah. That sounds like an interpersonal relationship question. It's not. It's a question about ego, which is something we always need to pay attention to. So as I was thinking again, once again, Jocco Live was kind of like you went to two Jocko Lives. Is that correct? Yes. They weren't really a podcast.

They weren't really a Q&A. They weren't, they were just sort of a, they were a little bit of everything, right? A little bit of, a little bit of stories, a little bit of lessons, a little bit of everything. So I did get some questions, though. That first one was one of those general questions. And now as I started thinking about the questions

and how a lot of them related to ego, another question that I got, that was actually another important. question. The question was, again, something along the lines of, and I'm sure we can go back and pull the recording. But here's the other thing is some of these questions that I got asked. I got asked like the same similar question. So I'm paraphrasing what this other question was. But this one, the question was something along the lines of, hey, listen, Jocko, I know that keeping the ego in check is an important principle. I read about it extreme ownership.

You talk about it all the time. You've got to be humble. But at my company, ego is a huge problem. How do I get my company to start promoting the ideal of humility? And how do I get them to recognize that ego is such a big problem? Now, this is a really good question. Once again, because you can imagine what this individual is right. Like, you know, you're at a company where there's a lot of egos going on.

And all of a sudden, you have a little moment of enlightenment. you realize that ego is causing you a lot of problems. So you start putting your own ego in check. And then you go, wow, this is working. I'm doing better. I'm coordinating better. I'm working my interpersonal relationships with other people on the team are better.

My relationships with people on other teams are better. We're getting more done because our relationships are better. I'm putting the team and the mission above myself. That means the team and the mission are doing better. That's great. So you realize all this stuff. And then you say, okay, well, how do I start to spread the word? How do I get other people to do this?

And this is a tricky question, right? It's a tricky thing because if some, if like let's say your team has, you see that ego is a problem and you sit them down and go, listen, guys, you're all, you all got big egos and that's the problem. I mean, you're going to run into level nine defensiveness. You're actually going to, it's actually going to be on defensiveness. They're going to start attacking you. That's what's going to happen.

When you got all these crazy egos, they're going to gang up. They'll like unite. They'll put their egos aside for a split seconds that can unite against you. So you can't confront them. And once again, are there certain relationships that you could have with someone where I go, let's say you and me and you had an ego, but you and I were really tight. And I said, hey, man, you're letting your ego get in the way of this. Sure.

That is a possibility. That is a very rare occurrence. Most of the people that you work with on a regular basis, you don't have that. that type of a relationship. The other thing is, when someone has a big ego, that's not the type of person that's open to those kind of criticisms anyways. So it's like there's two hurdles that you have to overcome. Number one, your relationship isn't usually that good.

And number two, they have a big ego, which is part of the problem. And that's what makes the problem hard to attack. So what are you going to do? And I've got to throw this one more little thing. When people talk about the you know how if someone say but wouldn't it be better if you could just talk to him Wouldn't it be better if you just you know put down on some bulletized list and said hey here's the things that your ego There's the problems that your ego's problem causing look I get it and isn't it great to have direct conversations isn't it great if I can just sit you down if echo if you and I have this Mind meld where you just know I'm 100% looking out for you and you're over

Open a, like if we have that that's in an ideal world. That's great. That's great. Golf clap. It's great. The problem is it doesn't exist very often. And confronting someone that has an ego about their ego can often just exacerbate the problem. So here's what you do.

Instead of self-identifying the problem and pointing the fingers at other people, which by the way is placing blame, which is a problem. So instead of doing that, what we're gonna do is start pulling the thread on some of the problems that we're having on the team. So for instance, this group over here needs some help on their part of the project,

but no one's helping them. What's going on? If you start to pull the thread on that, you'll find, at the end of that thread, they'll be hanging some egos. Whether it's the ego of the person that doesn't want to ask for help, or whether it's the ego of the other person that doesn't want to give help because they think, they need to do their own job.

That's how I'm not doing that. So you pull the thread, and at the end, you'll find these little egos hanging, and then what you do is you just expose them? And you say, well, what do you think the root of the problem is? You start pulling that thread, you get to a point where someone says, you can finally have an open conversation, where you say, where someone finally says, Well, you know, I guess I could use some help.

You just discovered it. So that's like a cover and move situation, right? If cover and move isn't happening and it isn't happening because of egos, if you pull the thread, you'll get to the end of the thread and it will be attached to someone ego in most cases. Is there a possibility that it's like, hey, this group doesn't know what the other group's doing? Yeah, absolutely. Those are, but those are easy problems to solve because we can just pull the thread.

We find at the end, oh, we need to, we need to, we need, better coordination between these two teams. Cool, there it is. When you pull the thread, it comes out, the little ego's dangling on the end of it. Then you go, okay, let's expose these and let's try and ask questions to figure out and get people to realize what they're looking at.

You want them to come to that conclusion. That's the trick. That's the maneuver, is to get them to come to conclusion. And they might never verbalize it, but they go, yeah, in their mind, they're like, I guess I didn't want to ask for help because my ego is in the way.

So there's one You know if you got people that aren't taking Aren't keeping things simple Just go through the laws of combat simple make people are making the plans too complex And yet they keep doing it and they're when it when you go and say you know these plans seem like they're really complex And of course they say something like Hey the I don't think everyone understood the plan It seemed it seemed kind of complex and the person says

people need to pay more attention when I'm briefing. And you pull on that, right? The frontline troops, they need more detail because otherwise they're going to screw up. That's why it's so complex. It's like, okay, let's look at what's really happening. What's really happening is I've created a plan that I won't give up because my ego's too big.

Right? When you pull that thread and you go, listen, hey, the front line troops, don't understand what to do. It seems like that could be a real problem. And maybe, and there's nothing, you give them a little out. You give them a little out, like, you know,

maybe we just need to back it off a little bit so that they can understand it. Maybe they're not as smart as you. Get a little eagle massage and goes, you know what, fine, I'll simplify it, boom. And in the meantime, you've given them a little indication. Look, if you confront them, that's what I'm saying,

it's hard for people to want to play the long game here. Because the short game is, you think you're so smart, your plans are too complex and you're sticking with them because you've got a big ego. How's that going to work out? It's not going to work out good. Can it work out 4% of the time? Yes. The other 96% of the time, you get a defensive person that's now accusing other people. Take the indirect and play the long game.

Take the indirect attack and play the long game. Prioritize and execute, right? Why is that failing? Because again, this question is ego is a problem. So where does ego manifest as a problem? It can manifest as a problem in prioritize and execute. Because if someone's got a big ego and they're not getting things done and they go, I can get it done because their ego thinks they can do anything, right?

Or prioritize, execute ego can be a problem. If you have a project and I have a project and you need help and your project is actually more important and I should give you resources but instead I'm like my initiative is just as important as echoes is which is just my ego I should look at it and say okay you know what

you should be the priority and another good one is well it's just what I just said like hey I'm not going to give up why should I have to give my resources to echo those are mine those are mine no actually what's the biggest priority

okay put my ego aside Echo's priority is actually bigger than mine. I'm going to give him four of my people so that he can get the job done. So when you pull the thread on this and you say, well, hey, hey, why is it, Johnca, why is it you don't want to give people to echo? And I'm like, well, you know, what if something else comes up? Well, if something else comes up, you can get back. Well, you know, they got to learn to respect the chain of command. Well, they'll still work for you.

They'll just be loaned over to Echo. Whoa. You see what I'm saying? Yes, they do. It's just ego, ego, ego, ego. So these are the kind of problems that manifest themselves inside of a company wrapped around ego. Mm-hmm. And decentralized command.

You can have the same thing happen with decentralized command. How does ego cause a problem with decentralized command? It's like this. Hey, I noticed that, you know, you seem to be making all the decisions. And the folks out in the field don't really have the opportunity to kind of make calls. Why is that? I'm the only one that has the experience to do this. They don't have the skill that I have.

Right? So there's all these reasons that that's, one of those are ego problems, right? And by the way, if it's, if it's not an ego problem, then I, then I say, oh, you know what? Because I haven't really trained the guys well enough.

And I'm gonna, you know what? You're right. I've been making way too many detailed decisions for the guys out in the field. I need to get down there, make sure they know what's going on, train them better so that I can back off. Cool.

That's a person that's got their ego in check. The person that's like, I'm the only one that can do, this like no you can't you know you're not and if you are you're wrong because right now you got three people working for you what happens when you have eight you're gonna go around the field in all these different locations to make every single decision no you can't so get your ego under control realize that you're not the only one that can do this job and train your people properly again that's a direct assault probably going to cause problems instead if we just

pull the thread on it hey what's going on It seems like you're folks down the field don't have a lot of authority. Well, you know, they don't experience. Oh, okay. It's kind of cumbersome, though, like them reaching back to you all the time to make these decisions. It is, but, you know, I'm the one that really knows how to do it. Oh. I mean, what happens if, you know, you're sick or, you know, someone's got to, you know, have communications with them?

What, what? Do you think it would be a good idea, you know, since you have so much knowledge and experience to maybe pass that on to some of the other people? Well, yeah. Okay, cool. Let's make that happen. And then obviously, ego can absolutely manifest itself when it comes to taking ownership. I mean, all day long, right?

Oh, that project failed. What happened? My supportants don't want to step up. Oh, so it's their fault. Dude. Why aren't your subordinate? it's taking ownership. Because they don't even know what ownership is.

They don't want to take ownership. Okay. So it's not your fault. No. Okay. Well, what can we do to help them? Pull the string. And you, at the bottom, the person will see it's their ego.

They might not admit it, but they'll see it. And then they can start to make adjustments. Now, look, can any of these situations escalate in a point where indirect, indirect, indirect, indirect, indirect doesn't, work and eventually you say you know what I got to I got to sit echo down and say listen here's what I think is the root of the problem the root of the problem is you think you're the only one that knows how to do this and in thinking that you're not training to be like I might have to get that direct it does happen we

prefer to use the minimum force required when it comes to leadership just like being a bouncer yes sir right it's not hey the guy's a little out of line hit him in the head with a blackjack. No, it's like, hey, you're, hey, sir, you know, I think you've had enough for tonight. Can you come with me? That's minimum force required. If the guy says, okay, cool, it's problem solved. If he's, if he says, I'm not going anywhere.

Okay, well, we have to escalate. It's the same thing here. But don't start with the direct attack. Just like you don't club the person out of the gate. I think it's a slap jack. I'm not sure. Okay. That's what you're talking about that leather thing with, yeah, a blackjack, yeah.

Blackjack? Yeah. All right. Did you guys not use those? I think those are illegal. That's illegal. Yeah, yeah, the slapjack. One guy had one.

But, yeah, I think they're illegal. So we don't want to escalate straight to the blackjack. Or even a slap jack. Or even a slap jack. If anyone's using a slap jack. I think it's called a slap jack. I'm not sure. Point remains, I dig it.

Fairly confident you're wrong. but not 100%. You know when you're pretty confident about something that somebody just throws a little randomness into the soup and it makes you question yourself? That's how I feel right now. Real confident with a little bit of questions. If it makes you feel any better, that's my everyday life.

Whatever. So that's the answer to this question. Is really pulling the thread on the problem to reveal the root of the problem, which you're going to see as ego, and then it's there for the people, hopefully to see it, to recognize it, to possibly admit it,

maybe not give them an out where they can actually make an adjustment without taking the ownership of the eagle, because that's okay. We're trying to win, right? We're trying to let the team win. We're not trying to, my goal is not to make you admit it.

Because you know what that is? That's my ego. I'm going to show with him, he's got a big ego. Get him to admit it. Get him to admit it. That's not what my goal is. My goal is to make you make better decisions as a leader so that we win as a team.

So that's what we're trying to do here. It's real interesting that, how you laid that out. Because you used to do that to me. Uh-oh. Probably still do. But it was less about the ego, I think, anyway. Maybe it's all the same. Maybe at the end of the day, it's all the same.

It's possible. Because skating or trying to dance. So explain to me how I would do this to you. You do it with excuses. Okay. So like if something didn't get done or can't get done or I think it's too hard. And really most of the time, if I'm remembering correctly, it was at the end of the day, this is what it was. It was like, I'm too lazy or whatever.

So it always be like this excuse like, well, you know, that's this or that's that. And then you'd have all these, just like how you're saying. And it made me remember this because of your tone, how you were like kind of saying those little answers. there. Like, ooh, that's the same to me. Like, real simple. Just like, well, just here. Here's the solution to that problem right here.

Because there's all these little excuses that you make, you know, like, oh, I didn't really have time because I had to do this. And you'd be like, oh, okay, then you just do this, you know. And that'll solve that particular problem. You didn't have this big comprehensive plan to solve my life problem. You're like, okay, for every excuse I own make, you just have the little solve, you know, the problem or the solution to it. And I'd be like, oh, man.

And meanwhile, you're getting backed into this corner. The string is just getting pulled like every pull is like to sense what's down there in your case. It was laziness. Oh, yeah. Like, I just was too lazy. Or I'm just like stuck in this routine or whatever. And then so it could in a way be like, okay, that's just my ego, just thinking that the way, that's not the way I do things kind of thing. And think if I would have used a different tone.

Well, think if I would have just said that's because you're lazy. Oh, yeah. Yeah. You're just being lazy, Echo. Yeah. You'd have been like, you don't even know what it takes to make one of these things. Oh, you know what a sudden? And what does that do to our relationship?

Yeah. And what does that do to the final product? Yeah. Right now you're doing something against your will. Oh, yeah. With some disdain a little bit. With some disdain on it. Yeah, fully.

And yeah, if you would have just been like, hey, you're lazy, this is what my mind would have went to, this belief. This actually, and in a way, it's true, but it doesn't, like, get anyone anywhere. Where if you would be like, you're lazy, I would have thought, and maybe even said that it's not that I'm lazy. It's just you're just this crazy hard worker who have these standards that are unreasonable for a normal person.

And I'm just a normal person, excuse me, you know, kind of an attitude. That's what I would go to rather than if you like, the way how you always do it is like you pull a string or you just sort of. You know what's interesting too is when I'm doing that, I'm not doing that like, okay, I got here's my next move on Echo. Yeah.

Actually what I'm doing is like, well, you know, when you say, well, we can't, I can't make a video because it's going to take me too long to get through the, the raw edits. And I go, you know, say, like, well, hey, you know, if you want, just get, you, you know, hire someone to do those raw edits for you. Right. Would that work? Yeah. You know what I mean? I'm asking you a legitimate question. Oh, yeah.

Maybe I kind of know the answer. I mean, I suspect I know the answer, but it's not, it's not just, hey, I, I'm setting you up. I'm legitimately pulling the thread. Yeah. And the answer might be it is impossible to get this project done. But when I say, well, you could hire someone to do those raw. And then you go, okay, well, even if I hire someone, how am I going to transfer all this data? And I go, well, if you want, couldn't you get an external hard drive and just physically give it to him?

And you'd say, well, these aren't actual situations. No, no, no, I know. Just for the, I don't know the realm of video well enough to go down those roads. The main, the one that I remember, the easiest is like with training. Like you'll be, hey, we're training at 430, but I train during the day and mostly, right? Oh, not in the evening. Then you'll be like, oh, yeah, train at 430. I'm like, well, you know, and I have all these reasons.

And then you're like, you kind of just chip away at all these reasons. Like, oh, here's a solution to that. Here's a solution to that. It's like, man, I just, I look, that's just like my routine. I just got to admit it, you know, like, all right. But I don't get to train with you guys as often, you know, kind of thing. But it's like, yeah, you expose, you pull the string to expose just like the little, the little excuses. Check.

So pull the thread, reveal the problem. Don't confront if you can help it. And people will start to recognize what the problem is. I mean, this is assuming you're working with this. Well, there's one problem with this. And that is, if the person has a giant ego, this is the hardest thing for them to admit, right? So they might not admit it, but they'll see it, they'll behave differently. And by the way, one of the good ways to use someone's ego against themselves is when you say something along the lines of, you know, man, it's going to look good if this gets done right.

You know what I'm saying? And they think, oh, cool, I'm going to do this. I'm going to make this adjustment. just so it gets done, just so my ego can get just so I can win. Yeah, that was going to say that. Use the word win. Because every time like you use the word win. And anytime would I be thinking like, okay, if I didn't win, what else, you know, what's left?

You lost. Yeah. No matter what excuse you make, you lost. So if you put shed light on, like, use that word and be like, hey, this will make you win. And you're like, hell yeah. But at the same time, the back of your mind, like, basically, if we. We don't solve these problems or whatever. I lose.

I don't want that. So it's like extra motivated. It's the winning at all costs thing. And so the winning at all costs, I wrote like a little section. And it was part of one of the special releases on Barnes & Noble's version of dichotomy of leadership was this thing, winning at all costs. And then someone posted, and I had said it before, right? And someone posted a clip of me saying this idea of winning at all costs. And it's the way that I talk about it, it's kind of a trick anyways, because I go through this thing about what is leadership and leadership is this, leadership to that.

And then I say, what leadership is to me is winning at all costs. And somebody put, probably you put a clip up of me saying that. And somebody said, of course, someone's like, that's the kind of person that will run people over and blah blah blah. Like it gave it negative things, right? But what they don't realize is what the rest of that clip says. And what the rest of that whole idea of winning at all costs is what I'll do to win at all costs is totally subordinate my ego Help other people support them give them what they need And put my put put put the team and the mission above myself

Because the most that's how I'm going to win at all costs so winning at all cost doesn't mean I'm stepping on other people It means I'm actually lifting other people up Yeah, that's what it means So if you can use that you know if I say hey echo man Look we need to win and If we're going to win, the only way to win is if you can learn how to work with Jim. Otherwise, we lose. And you're like, you know what?

Because I'm a winner, I'll work with Jim. Cool. It's a first step. Check. And this was kind of related to a question that, and we haven't done a Q&A in a long time. And this is kind of a partial Q&A? Sure. I don't know.

It's just some topics. But anyways, we got one of these questions. Hit it. Yes, Jocko, what do you tell someone who has been passed over for a military promotion they deserved? Could you address this? Yeah, so part of it is what we just talked about. What do you do when you get passed over? Cool.

And it's also covered in, I think there's a, well, I know, there's a literal chapter inside leadership strategy and tactics, which is what to do when you don't get promoted. That's the actual name of the chapter. When you're not chosen, page 160, boom, there it is. When you are not chosen. And we covered it on the podcast. So what you do is you go and you say, hey, boss, I know there's opportunities to get promoted. I know I didn't get promoted. I know there must be some shortfalls that I have.

Can you help me indicate what those shortfalls are? Cool. So that's, and I'll just give a factual. There's the officer commissioning program. that I got picked up for. It was called the Seaman to Admiral program. It was a highly selective program. They took 50 sailors from the entire Navy.

And there's, I don't know, 250,000 something sailors in the Navy. They took 50. And the first year that I put in for it, I did not get selected. I got, actually, I got selected as an alternate, which was, as they say, almost worse. Yeah.

I see it because you don't like you get nothing you get to smell it yeah you get to smell it you don't get to touch it you don't get to taste it so it was not good well it was good because I was like okay I'm close but so but I didn't get it I didn't get it and what did I do assessed and said what can I do better and worked harder and the next year I got it so if you don't get promoted because you deserved it maybe you didn't deserve it and if you did deserve it you'll get it next time and instead of saying you deserved it why not look at it and say okay what did I not do to make myself the best absolute best candidate that they could not question needed to get

this promotion instead we're saying I deserved it someone else got what is that doing blaming the boss blaming the selection process blaming all these other things that you cannot control but if you take ownership of it and say you know what okay I didn't get promoted there must be some things that I can do better There's the answer. Own it. Ask. Give me some feedback, please.

What do I need to make this happen? And then implement. Now, there was this other topic that I kind of wanted to bring up that was from, once again, it was from Jocko Live. And there was a young woman. And again, this goes to the kind of variety of different people that were coming to the Jocko Lives, We're all over the place. So this young woman asked a question that was kind of like, how do you, and I can't, when you're at the live events, there's light shining in your eyes.

So you're not really 100% sure. You don't get it. It's not like you're not seeing the person face to face. So I'm kind of looking out into the light. I'm seeing this frame of a young woman. And she asked something along the lines of, you know, how do you handle when there's people that are trying to pull you down and, and, and, you. you know, pick you apart.

And I said, well, what do you do? And she's like, I'm in school. And I said, what school? And she's in high school. And I said, what grade? And she said, I'm a freshman. And I said, okay, so you're getting bullied. Right?

Because essentially that's what she was saying, right? I'm getting picked on. I got people trying to drag me down. You know what that's called? That's called bullying. I said, so you're getting bullied. And she said, yeah. getting bullied so I said you know I thought about it for a second I said well I've got some

bad news and I've got some good news and I'm gonna start with the bad news the bad news is that people can be mean and they can be mean for a variety of reasons they can be mean because they're insecure they can be mean because they're bullied themselves they can be mean because they're unhappy they can be mean because they're scared to be vulnerable so they put up that front they might be suffering and jealous and have no self-esteem it's the way some people are and there's some people that are just evil that get joy out of putting other people down so there's all those kind of people exist and they especially exist inside of immature people in high school.

So that's the bad news. And then I said, but the good news is high school is not life. And when I said that, it was actually funny. When I said that, people started clapping because everyone in that room knew that it was true. And that reminded me of another conversation that I've been having with people

lately about about some about ecosystems something I've called ecosystems so little ecosystems in the world that people get caught up in and they get caught trying to get to the top hierarchy of some little ecosystem somewhere and look I get it you know I get it Jordan Peterson we're trying to ascend the top of our dominance hierarchy be the best you can. I totally get that. Absolutely. But there can be a problem with this from multiple angles.

The world is filled with these little ecosystems. And high school is one of them. Remember the little high school ecosystem? There's someone that's popular. There's someone that's, you know, there's all these little, there's this ecosystem there. And high school, this is something. You know, you look at a high school kid and you,

you try and explain to them that once you left high school, no one really cares. Right. Correct. If you care about it, deeply, you're actually Uncle Rico. Right?

If you're the one that's running around saying, when I was in high school this and when I was in high school that. But here's the problem. And this is one of the reasons when I wrote Way the Warrior Kid, the first one, one of the things that triggered me to write it was, you know, here I was at work, war going on,

big real legitimate, crazy problems. and dynasties and dynamics to figure out, like things are going on. And I'd come home and like one of my kids would be sad that they got called the name. Mm-hmm. Or sad that they got a low grade on a test or whatever.

And I would be thinking, like I had a moment of clarity where I thought, I can't believe they're, I can't believe they're sad about this, who cares? And then I realized, oh, yeah, idiot, Jocko. that thing that's going on in their world is their whole world. It's their entire, their entire world is in that one ecosystem. So it's hard for people to realize that their ecosystem that they're in

is not the whole world. It's the same thing with when you start getting to college. And I've got two kids in college now, you know, this whole ecosystem around first getting into college. And once you get to college, where are you going to get your MBA? Where are you doing your internship? There's this whole thing, right? And once again, if you step outside that ecosystem into just the normal world, no one actually cares about where you got your degree.

Not no one, because there's a group of people inside that ecosystem that they go, where'd you get your MBA? Oh, where'd you study? And there's people that care about that. There's other people that literally do not care at all. Yeah. And I meet incredibly, like from that perspective, I meet incredibly successful business leaders all the time that don't have. their MBA and went to some state school in Iowa. I got props the other day from someone from Iowa that said,

whenever you think of that state, I'm like, yes, from Iowa. Some state school and I, whatever, some little community college in Nebraska, and they go out and world and dominate. So, but that's not important. We know that that happens. Look, and there's people that go to Ivy League schools and they do great too. But what I'm saying is they get in this little ecosystem where what they're actually trying to do is climb to the top of that ecosystem.

Only for the sake of climbing to the top of that ecosystem not how it measures into the greater world What kind of car do you have? There's an ecosystem you can get wrapped up in You know I've got odd my Porsche is better than your Porsche right? There's people that are into that and there's other people that I do not care At all at all What about our little ecosystems we're in right? Jiu Jitsu has a own little ecosystem Yep. You know what I'm saying?

There's a little ecosystem, who's who? The podcast world has an ecosystem. So all these things, and those are just things that you and I are actually actively in, right? We do Jiu-Jitsu and we have a podcast. So we could jump into like where are you at on the hierarchy of these ecosystems. And again, Jordan, I get it. We're trying to go up the hierarchy. I get it, but you have to be able to put that in check because why are you doing that?

What is driving you? If what's driving you to ascend that hierarchy is because it's going to make a you better and the people around you better, that's good. If you're doing it for your own ego though, that's a problem. That's where it becomes a problem. Guess what? The jobs, the companies, the industries, they get created. They're sort of the jobs that get created by companies and industries. They have their own little ecosystem, right?

About, I worked here, I worked there. I ran this region like you can see it. It's an ecosystem that exists. The SEAL teams is a freaking ecosystem. And everyone's in there going, you're like, okay, where are you at on the ecosystem? Where did you? How many deployments have you done? Where did you deploy to?

What schools have you been to? There's a little ecosystem that people are trying to get up. And I get it. There's some positive to that, right? Because you're trying to do better, trying to work harder. That's good. Then there's the bar scene. You probably can relate to this better than me.

Sure. There's an ecosystem of the clubs. Yes. And who's the owner and who's the manager and who's the GM? Yeah. And who's the head door guy? Yeah. And who comes in your club?

Oh, who you're going to let in the club? Yeah. Music scene. Real estate. There's just ecosystems everywhere. And so this is the point that I guess I'm getting to and where it ties back into this young female that asks this question. What you have to do is realize that in most of these cases, when you step outside of that little ecosystem, no one cares about that ecosystem. No one cares.

No one cares. if I was to tell my mom Hey mom I got my black belt in Jiu-Jitsu 2005 Hey mom I got my black belt in Jiu-Jitsu She what you know what she would say Oh congratulations you know what she's thinking

That I'm in a strip mall doing karate somewhere You know what I mean That's what she's thinking She doesn't care at all She doesn't care at all Your Porsche that you told me about I can introduce you to many people that think if you spent more than $5,000 on a vehicle,

you're an idiot. Never mind, $150,000. In fact, if you ever hear me brag about a vehicle, the vehicle that I brag about probably the most is my 1997 Dodge Grand Caravan. That's the one I brag about the most. So when you step outside the ecosystem of cool cars people literally don't do not care the the music scene oh I I know this

recording artist I know oh I'm going to this studio it's like no one cares so my point in saying this is if you find yourself distraught about your failure inside some random ecosystem then remember that if you can detach and you can step outside that ecosystem you're gonna realize that that ecosystem in most cases doesn't even matter at all. It doesn't matter at all. Detach. This is something that once again at Jocko Live shows this came up.

We talk about detachment. I talk about detachment. One of the things, look, detachment is a great tool as a leader to have because it allows you to take a step back and see what's going on, right? Clearly, it's a powerful tool. But you combine that aspect of detachment to this other aspect of detachment, when you, you aspect of detachment when we've talked about people that get caught in a bad mental headspace. And I don't know if I want to use the word depression because I'm not a psychologist and I've

never really had this depression. So I can't really speak about it from that angle. But to say that people get caught in a rut, that happens. And I've talked about that idea. Like let's say, okay, when you, when, if you lose someone, right, someone that you know dies. And you get put into that rut. And the way I've described it before is like there's a storm cloud all around your head. And no matter which direction you look, you see storm cloud.

And anyone that's on the outside, and this is what I've said, anyone that's on the outside, look at you and go, oh man, you're just surrounded by the storm. If you step over here, you're going to get away from that. There's a light at the end of the tunnel. But from their perspective, they don't see it at all. if you can detach, if you can take a step back from your own head, you can actually see the end of the storm clouds and you can see that you can get your way out of this rut that you're in. Now, people ask me about how to detach. And I talk about it, leadership strategy and tactics, but I'm going to take a little bit further.

Think about this. So here's a couple things. And actually, the reason that I started, I used to kind of look at it, like, hey, it's real simple, right? Hey, take a step back. Just take a step back, take a breath, right, you know, look around. In fact, relax, look around and make a call. It was what I wrote about extreme ownership when it comes to detach.

Like, relax, look around, make a call. That's detachment. The first time I really broke it down to try and give people some more specific instructions, was on the Warrior Kid podcast. Because you know, a little kid would say, when I get mad, I start to lose my temper when I'm wrestling or I start to lose my temper

when I'm in class and little billies keeps poking me in the back of the head. How do I not lose my temper? Well, what they need to do is detach. So I said, listen, take a step back. So I thought about what I kind of do. Take a step back. And one of the things I said was

lift your chin up. Lift your chin up. And now when you start to think, because I'm talking about why do I even do that, what benefit does that have? Well, if you think about it, when you take a step back and you actually lift up your chin,

think about what it does to your vision. All of a sudden, your vision is elevated. It's elevated one inch, but it's elevated. And you now have a physical new perspective. You have a physically new perspective of what's going on. By taking a step back, lifting your chin up. The other thing it makes you do is if you put your head back,

it like makes you open up your chest and open up your lungs and it makes you take a breath. Which I used to attribute this to when you're on the radio. Look, one of the reasons that I thought about detaching and something that I got realized was a good tool is you never want to sound panicked on the radio and the seal teams. So before you key up that microphone,

something you go when you say all right guys we need to move towards that north building instead of no you don't do that so when you when you lift your chin up you you know you kind of take a breath it forces you to kind of take a breath and the other this is the coolest thing that I kind of connected this at Jocko Live and the reason I connected it because I was up like right now we're sitting down and we're kind of we're kind of stuck in in this position. So at Jock Alive, I had like a lavalier microphone on.

So I was up and moving around and getting crazy. So as I was going through this, I was acting out the process of detaching. So I take a step back. I lift up my chin and I made this connection. I was like, think about the posture that you have when you're getting ready to get into a fight. It's literally the opposite. You lift up your hands, you duck, you tuck your chin down, you roll your shoulders forward to protect yourself, and you are getting in this defensive posture, which is not an open posture for seeing what's going on, right?

It's a focused posture. When you take a step back, you lift up your chin. You're actually making yourself physically vulnerable. And what you're also doing is you're, so you're opening yourself up the threats, but you're opening up your mind to see a different problem. perspective. So that is incredibly important. It's an incredibly important first step in training yourself how to detach from all this chaos that's going on from the mayhem of a leadership situation to detaching from your own ecosystem that you're wrapped up in that you think is

important that no one cares about. No one cares about outside that stupid club you're in. No one cares. No one cares. Outside the 38 people that are involved in your glee club, they've got you paranoid and freaking out. No one cares. So if you can take a step back and you can see that, and finally, if you can take a step back from your own brain and you can kind of assess that cloud that you're caught in, you'll see that that cloud is non-infinite, and you'll see that there's a way out.

Which is... Very important. Yeah, and that can get more strong and powerful, that lure, that sucking, like keeping you in your ecosystem when it's like part of your routine, you know, because it kind of feeds into your identity a lot of times. Like, in jih Tjitsu, super strong. Like, where you, you know, if you get tapped out,

by a guy who never taps you out or some, Brad, that'll follow you all the way home with your family. You're thinking, man, they can tap me out today. It can, you know, if your mind is just sucked in, because it's kind of part of your identity or whatever. But yeah, if you can just step back, look around, kind of detach

from that, you're like, Brad, no one cares. Like, literally every other environment that you go in life, nobody cares that guy tap. No one cares that. You'd even do Jiu-Jitsu. No one cares at all. Unless you've got to spring into action at the store or something. Then they're stoked. Yeah, yeah.

And they're like, what was that? Yeah. This dude just worked magic. This dude's a ninja. Yeah, exactly. He put that guy to sleep. Exactly. Yeah.

Which is probably never going to happen, by the way, as far as probability goes. I think, and I think when you're younger, I mean, obviously when you're younger, you get caught up in these ecosystems much more. And this, what's scary is, this can be the downfall of a kid, right? You get caught up in the drug ecosystem. You get caught up in the booze ecosystem. You get caught up in the, uh, you get caught up in the, uh, in the, what is it, delinquency, like, hey, I'm gonna cause problems.

Hey, you know, what do boys do? Boy, this is another thing that came out of Jockal Life. Like, boys are trying to prove themselves to their friends and to themselves. How tough they are, how cool they are. So when whatever little ecosystem has their own little cool meters in it, right? And sometimes that cool meter is, you know,

I'm getting so, I'm going to drink this fifth of jack. Yeah. Or I'm going to smoke this or whatever. Like that's, they want to move up in that ecosystem. And so they do stuff that outside, outside that ecosystem, people go, hey, that's actually one of the dumbest things I've ever heard.

Yeah. But you can't see that. Yeah, the party scene is a big one. I mean, there's a difference between, like, getting caught in the ecosystem of the party scene and then going down the spiral of, like, drugs and addiction. Because a lot of times the addiction is,

is like that's just like a chemical payoff you get. And then that chemical payoff you want so much. It's just more of a payoff than literally anything else in life. And then it just compounds. But it's the ecosystem that introduces you to the payoff that ends up being an addiction that ends up ruining your life. Yes. So yeah, like the party scene, for example, it's like, yeah, okay, did you go to this party?

Oh, you didn't go to there. You're kind of less than kind of thing. You know, oh, I'm at all the parties. You're the kind of up, you know, up there in that little ecosystem. Then you go to those parties and you've got to function at the party, right? So you can't just go to the party and be like, no, I'm not drinking. And whatever. They're like, oh, you're lame.

You know, you're not fitting in the party at all. So you're going to fit in. So you're going to do the, you know, you're obviously going to drink. And then what if they're doing some other drugs in the back room, the cool room, the VIP room, the secret room or whatever? If you're not part of that, you're sort of, you're the minion. You're not one of the VIPs. So you're going to function there. Yeah, there's a whole peer pressure thing wrapped up inside the ecosystem.

Oh, yeah. That's like the primary driver of the ecosystem. Oh, yeah. Because even the positive things like, where you get, where you get. Where are you getting your MBA? Yeah. Like so they got all these 18, well, no, 19, whatever, 20, 21 year old college kids that are like, where are you going to get your MBA?

Where are you going to get your MBA? Where are you going? Where are you applying? Where are you applying? Where are you applying? Oh, yeah. And if you're not applying to the whatever, then you're a little bit down on the ecosystem. And you know what?

No one cares. Well, I can't say no one cares because there are people that are going, hey, we want to get someone from this school. Cool. Fine. that's a little tiny subset of the same ecosystem. Yeah, but if you're talking about like, yeah, if you're talking about people outside the ecosystem, no, they don't care.

They don't care. People care if you're capable. And then so a lot of times if you're like, oh, you got your MBA from here, okay, that's an established, you know, capable. They're going to put out some good students or some good trained people or whatever. Then there's that.

But it's not like, they don't care about what you care about right now. You know, the fact that you got it from here, it doesn't mean you're like awesome. The thing that's so hard for kids, is they just can't see outside the ecosystem is their world. Yeah. And so introducing people to this concept that there are in fact these random ecosystems that actually no one cares about is a positive thing. Yeah.

Don't get caught up in them. Yeah. Don't get caught up in trying. Especially not negative ones. But there's also people take positive ecosystems and turn them negative because they start getting the ego involved. Like that's right. Jiu-Jitsu is totally positive ecosystem. Hey, we're just here to train.

We're here to have fun. And all of a sudden, it turns into drama. Because we haven't talked too much about the Jiu-Tzu drama. And I'll be honest with you, one of the reasons that we don't talk a lot about the Jiu-Jitsu is probably because we don't deal with it a lot because we have a very open-door policy at our gym. And we're just kind of cool. And we just want to train J-J-J-Tu and want everyone else to train J-J-J-Tu.

And I think San Diego at large is very similar to that because there's just J-J-2 everywhere. So we all just kind of. of know each other and so I think that has something to do with it and I also think there's less Jiu-jitsu drama now than there was 10 years ago yeah for sure you know 10 years ago is like that's my student yeah you went to my other you went to someone else's academy cool you're out of my academy forever I banish you right that was that kind of drama is there still that kind of drama there probably is some but not as bad as it used to be yeah but they took a positive ecosystem and turned it into negative ecosystem yeah

yeah And that's kind of everything. Like even, okay, so my nephew gets good grades, really good grades. But he takes it, you know how like certain students, they take their grades like super seriously? They get one bag or they're late for school? Like, bro, to me, if, let's say my mom brought me to school. Brought, if you have to explain to me that you weren't worried about being late when you were 10, it's unnecessary. But go on.

Wildly unnecessary. For the people, we'll let you explain how much you didn't care about being late, Even as a child, go ahead. Especially for school. Put it this way. If I was late, had to get a tardy slip. Bro, the connection between that and like grades and success in life was literally non-existent.

So let's say the bus was late. I would say maybe that's how you ended up. Showed up late all the time. But go ahead. It's possible. Continue. It's very possible. So if my parents or my mom or dad or whatever, if they were driving me to school and

they were running late, bro. Me caring was literally at a zero. I didn't care at all. In fact, I was like, cool. I don't have to spend as much time, you know, at school. And not that I was bad at school or anything. I'm just saying, like, I didn't care about that stuff at all. Anyway, my point is some people are the opposite.

Some people are like, I can be late for school. It's like school is like everything in their grades and stuff like that. That's positive. That's really good, actually. But it can get out of hand. That's a thing. It can get out of hand. Yeah.

Where you get kids freaking out. You get kids cheating. Cheating. Freaking out. Taking weird drugs to like study like a lot. like a lot or whatever. Yeah, all those things. All those things are bad

and all of them are related to the fact that they think that that ecosystem is the whole world. Everything. And let's be honest. I mean, how much did that ecosystem affect you? You didn't even show up to school a long time or do any homework.

You seem to be doing all right? Well, now you're here, King of the podcast ecosystem, Echo Charles. Well, yeah. So everyone should do that, right? No, man. Yeah, crazy.

Yeah, I think if, If you take, and not that I'm like the epitome of or the poster child for great parenting advice, nothing like this, but I think like the more you take your kids and see other stuff outside of school, kind of their mind is going to not just be attached to like the school scenario, you know? Well, that's a whole debate, you know, that you could have. Like, but here's a real simple question. Is your kid, if your kid goes, is your kid 10 years old during fifth grade? And they don't want to miss school so they don't go with you to Calli whatever, Kauai. They don't go experience something.

Like, yeah, I guarantee you that the experience in Kauai is way more beneficial, educationally, spiritually, athletically, then, hey, they missed three days of math. Yeah. Bring the math book. Bring it. Yeah. Yeah, for sure. It's not just Kauai either.

Like, you know, I mean, even just going to see what you do at work or whatever. Yeah. Like, I used to take my kid to, you know, go in training sites. Yeah. Are you kidding me? Best thing ever. Oh, yeah. And I'm not even necessarily saying have a miss school to see this stuff.

I'm not necessarily saying that. But I'm just saying like everything isn't like, okay, go home, do homework. It's like everything. If you create this idea that school. school is everything in their head, then, you know, they're going to tend to think that, I think. But, you know, if you see, you know, let them see other places where you work or whatever, whether it be on the weekends or summertime, whatever, you know, so you just see other things, they realize, okay, school isn't everything, you know.

And what you're really showing them is this is one ecosystem in the world. It's called school. It's an important one. Yeah. But there's no reason to get crazy. There's other ecosystems out there that are also cool and good. All right Keep detached

Don't get stuck in ecosystems Next question I am stuck in a prolonged period of things Not going my way professionally or socially All that really is going on Well is my time management Still even after having owned up to my part In getting here

I still seem stuck in a failure loop Okay So what's being addressed here is the prolonged period of things not going away and we know that a key part of getting out of a rut like this or a failure loop is taking ownership of those failures of those problems that's very important but guess what that alone doesn't solve them at all Just saying I didn't get promoted. Okay, it was my fault. Period. That doesn't solve the fact that you didn't get promoted.

I'm not getting called back to do this other contracting job. It's my fault. Does that mean you get called back? No, it doesn't mean anything. Taking ownership means that you actually have to identify the problem. You know you're responsible for it. And then you actually have to solve the problem. That's what you have to do.

Just taking ownership of the problem. problem doesn't make it go away. You have to take ownership of the problem. You have to take ownership of finding a solution and then you have to take ownership of implementing that solution. So this is real straightforward. Now, there's one little tiny part that I want to point out, which you may or may not have noticed Echo Charles and I'm going to point it out. So pay attention to this last sentence in the question. Still, even after having owned up to my part, in getting here, I still seem stuck in a failure loop. What did you notice about that, Echo Charles?

As if there's another part that, you know, maybe even parts. Yeah. Right? There's multiple facets of the world that are conspiring. Yeah. To keep you in this failure loop. Yeah, it's like that tone of when someone's like, hey, I did my part. I did my job, hands up, you know, kind of thing.

Totally. I did my job. That's not my job. the other parts that are more implied, I guess, now that you're kind of uncovering them. It's like there's this other job that someone else is sort of part. So this is the thing.

And this is what makes this very challenging is this idea that like, but how could I possibly control this or that? How can I possibly take ownership of the fact? Now, this is a weak one. How can I possibly take ownership but the fact that my boss is an idiot and fired me. How can that be my fault?

That he didn't see how good I was, right? Okay, we see what's going on there. You obviously aren't being introspective and taking a look and saying, okay, this is obviously my fault. Here's what I need to change. So there's things like that where you go, look, you're just not, same thing with relationships, right? She broke up with me.

How can I own that? Well, maybe you look at yourself and you see how you, you acted as a partner in that relationship. And if you just want to look at that person, say it was her fault, she was crazy. And she was, it was her fault, she didn't understand how awesome I was.

That's not, that you need to take ownership of your own behavior. Why did she think that? Now, you do get to these things where you have no control. So, got asked a question, a guy said

my I lost my girlfriend to opiate overdose dead she died how do I take ownership of that and so I expanded that question because that's one of those things

where you look at you know when you look at it you go how can you take ownership of that this person did so much drugs and it wasn't like I like I like Okay, I don't know the specifics of the situation, but if you know, I'm doing everything I can to help my girlfriend and then one day I come home and She's OD'd she kicked she's dead. Okay

How can I tell? I wasn't even there right and I I Let's just say I'd done everything taken her to rehab done all this stuff and as far as I could tell She was clean and then behind my back without telling me she did this right? So it's almost like, okay, That's as much separation as I can get. How do you take ownership in a situation like that? And so here's what I went on to say to this guy. I said this might seem like a unique situation, but it's not because there's things that occur in our lives

that we actually don't have any control over. For instance, most horrible, you, your family member, someone gets cancer, gets a horrible terminal disease. How do you take ownership of that? And the answer is in these cases, when things that are truly beyond your control occur, what you take ownership of is how you respond to them. That's what you take ownership. How do you respond to you lose your girlfriend to drugs?

Your kid gets cancer. You get cancer, something, you get this horrible disease. How do you respond to that? That's what you can take ownership of. And that's what you have to take ownership of. So my point in saying that is, yes, there are absolutely things that you cannot control, and what you can control is your reaction to them when they unfold. That makes sense.

What scares me about this guy is he's saying he's owned up to his part, but that means he's blaming someone else. And I can, the amount of things that we have zero control over is very small. So many things if we look at ourselves and say, what could I do better? What could I do different? How can I make an adjustment here? How can I adapt to the way this boss is?

How can I adapt to the way this girl is that I'm trying to have a relationship? And by the way, that might not be the best relationship. Maybe that's part of what you need to do. Is take ownership of the fact that you're addicted to this. That's what he's saying. This guy here is saying he's social. I'm assuming he's got some problems with his. female friends, right?

Or friends in general. Hey, did anyone want to come watch UFC? Well, not really. I'm buying, guys. Oh, that's okay. We're going to go to, you know. I'm just there watching it by myself. I can't believe that, you know?

What's wrong with everyone else? No, actually, what's wrong with me? Now, truth be told, I don't want to watch the UFC with anybody else generally. I just want to sit alone and watch the fight. commentary, no questions. When ask me a question. Sure. What was that move?

No, I'm watching the fight. That's interesting. Everyone just be quiet. A lot of times some of us, we like to demonstrate our professional knowledge of the subject, you know? So, answer here, you need to look at the reason that you're probably stuck in this loop continually is because the things that you're blaming on other people, take ownership of them, get them fixed.

Take ownership of them and get them fixed. Take ownership of them, make some moves. Take ownership of them. Look what you can do different. That's what you have to do. Next question. In your recent book, Leadership Strategy and Tactics,

mentioned establishing trustworthy relationships with superiors. You speak of performance and compelling tasks. Completing tasks. Oh, completing tasks, yes. performance and completing test. You stated, Boss wants me to fill out some extra paperwork. I'll do it.

Boss needs me to cover a shift for someone else on the team. I've got it. Boss has a nasty, low reward mission that needs executing. I'm all over it, page 49.50. How does this separate you from being a yes man, especially when being a yes man is looked upon so negatively these days? What are your thoughts? Yeah, so there's actually, maybe he hasn't gotten there,

but there's a whole section in the book that's called yes man. and why you don't want to be a yes man because if you're a yes man you don't push back when a situation requires there to be pushback so so read a little bit more but to make it quite simple

being a yes man is saying yes to everything regardless of whether it's a good idea or not building relationships and establishing a good communication and a good rapport with your superior is totally different than being a yes man. Part of it is saying yes, because if you resist everything that they say to you, they don't really think, they don't really value your opinion.

They just know that you're just a no man. No, we can't do. No, we can't. You're Mr. Negative. A yes man is just going to do whatever. So what you do is you say yes when you can. Some menial tasks.

That's what we're talking about. Some extra paperwork. Cool. I'll do it. Some. some cover a shift for someone else. Cool. I got it.

I can do those things. Those are easy. They're not impacting my team. We're good. Nasty, low reward project that needs to get done. Cool. I got it. Let's go.

Bring it. Bring it. I'm here. It's going to help the team? Awesome. Oh, you want me to do something that's going to negatively affect the team and put massive amounts of capital at jeopardy or put people in risk or put safety at risk? Do you want me to do that?

Hold on, boss. No. boss and I wouldn't be just no boss I'm not doing it but I go through the book how you actually approach those situations so that you're not a yes man so when when it when there comes a situation that unfolds that you actually need to say no you can say no and it gets listened to that's the difference leadership strategy and tactics get some it's all in there kind of you know so many of the questions in leadership Strategy and tactics with so many of the answers that I give in there are based on the questions that I get asked all the time Yeah, and so really so many of the questions that I'm hearing now

I have the answer in leadership strategy and tactics I'm trying not to just say well refer to the book page 98 oh refer to the book page 64 I'm trying not to do that but just FYI for anyone that's out there It's in there read more about it All right next question I was hoping for some guidance. Kind of a similar question, too, but go on. Yes.

I was hoping for some guidance. I'm going to cut you off again. No, I just did that for fun. Yeah. I dig it. Anyway, I was hoping for some guidance on how to play the game with a situation at work. I work in an aerospace machine shop. I'm doing this apprenticeship to be a machinist.

Mechanist? Machinist, right? Machinist. This means that I'm supposed to get specific types of, of on the job training with a set number of hours each with a set numbers of hours each. Okay. I go to school once week. I can tell we're going to re-roll this thing, huh?

No, no, no, no. Are you going to roll with it? No, yeah. Cool. Humble man. A humble man. I think we can discern kind of what he's asking at the end of the day. Anyway, set numbers are.

Normally you get a little sensitive. If you make some mistakes, you know, I'm just going to take this from the top. My whole life isn't one big mistake. So whatever. Come on. It's an expression. Anyway, I go to school once a week to supplement. it. The problem is they won't give me any work that fills those designations. I'm doing my best

at the menial paperwork they've had had me on for a while without complaint. It's a real problem, though, when I'm paying out of pocket for the tuition that comes with the program. Every month spent, not getting required training adds to the five years it takes to complete the OJT on the shop training. How do I get them to move me where I'm supposed to be? Do I just continue to do the, best at what they give me and accept the loss of time and money. Yeah. So you're going to remember the book The Dicotomy of Leadership, Humble, Not Passive. So this guy is being humble playing the game.

Hey, I'll do the menial paperwork. I'll work these extra hours. I'll do these things that don't really help me. He's playing the game and he's being humble, right? But he's also, it sounds like being passive, meaning he needs to up his assertiveness to say, hey, listen. Hey, hey, boss. I just want to let you know.

I put together this spreadsheet of what I've actually going to, get accomplished and here's the things that I want to get done and I know I'm trying to knock out all the stuff and I'm here to support the team but I also need to get these things done. Can you help me get these things scheduled so that I can be more value to you and the team? So yeah, you build the relationship through playing the game. You build a relationship by giving support wherever you can. But at the same time, that doesn't mean that you just roll over and never stand up for yourself. That's not what we're talking about here.

The difference is you're not building a relationship just so you can take care of yourself, right? That's different. That means I'm just looking out for me. You're building a relationship so that you can move down the right path, which, by the way, is going to make you more a bigger asset to the team. So it's a win-win situation. Make sure you build that relationship and then talk to them about what is you're trying to get done, why you're trying to get it done. And that way, we move forward down the path. And by the way, if they're like shut up and just do this paperwork or shut up, we're not going to help you.

Cool. Maybe we need to find a place that has a little bit better opportunity for me. And I'll start to float that out there. Humble, not passive. I remember a long time ago you'd say, use this word efficient, be more efficient rather than make it easier for me. You know, like even though they're essentially the same thing in certain circumstances where it's like, oh yeah, this will make it easier for me. to become an asset kind of thing. But for whatever reason, maybe just the way that sounds.

Well, yeah, it sounds like you're looking out for yourself. And yeah, yeah. But if you say it'll get me to be a more valuable asset in a more efficient way, who can say no to that? Who could say no that? Because of what company doesn't want efficiency. No, we want to take the hard road. Yeah.

We want to do things that don't make any sense. Yeah. We want to do things inefficiently. No. Yes, efficiency is important. Not only in jiu-jitsu. Not only in judo. But in business and in life.

Yes, too. All right. So there's one more little topic that I wanted to bring up. And really, it's another question that I got at Jockle Live. And I got this question or a version of this question a couple of different times. And they all, they all, couple different versions of this question, but the same question. And the question is, it's something like this, something along the lines of,

I've been pretty successful at this point in my life. And I'm having trouble finding the motivation to take it to the next level. So, you know, it's like people I say, oh, so you, you know, you make decent money, yep, but yeah, we're doing really well and you're working out. Yep, I'm healthy, yep, I'm good. And your family's taking care of you. I'm good, good time with my family. But you're not able to, like, get the extra workout.

You're not, you know, you're skipping some days. You're not eating great. You're not making the calls that you need to make. You're not expanding your eyes. And that's what's going on, right? And so that's what we're getting at. We get someone that's sort of in a good spot, kind of across the board, right? Kind of in a good spot across the board.

And so I'd kind of establish that fact that they're in a good spot across the board. And then I'd say, well, sounds like you're in a good spot across the board. Are you happy with that and are you comfortable with where you're at? And the answer would be no. And then I'd say, are you sure? And then they'd say, yeah, I'm sure. I'm, you know, I want to do more. And then I said, that's a lie.

That's a lie. That's a lie. because if you really weren't happy and you really wanted to improve your health even more and you really wanted to improve your financial situation more and you really wanted to just broadly improve your life then you wouldn't have any problem at all finding the discipline the discipline would actually find you that's where I'm at that you want to know why people like go you don't sleep very much you want to know why because this one finds me Because I know I can do more and I want to do more and I know I'm not happy where I'm at and comfortable where I'm at

So if you're telling yourself, no, I'm not happy where you're at then I'm going to tell you that's actually a lie You are comfortable you are comfortable because if you weren't comfortable then it would drive you the discipline would show up Now this is where I kind of I kind of have to go a little bit deeper so what I just said if you tell yourself the truth then you'll find discipline the framework of discipline is the truth the framework of discipline is the truth and I didn't do a good job when I got to ask this question I didn't do a good job of connecting all the dots because it actually is a one level deeper it's one level deeper and it looks like this if you're saying that you can't find discipline and I'm telling you it's because that's because you are comfortable where you're at.

That is also a lie. That is also a lie. Look, telling yourself that you don't need to get out of bed in the morning. Telling yourself that you don't really need to work out or you don't need to go harder or you don't need to do more in your job or be more discipline in the way that you live. if you tell yourself those things because the fact of the matter is think about this the fact of the matter is that you're not comfortable you're not happy you're not okay with where you're out because that's why you're asking this question right now you're asking this question because you know you can do more you know you can be more and that's the truth that's the truth and it eats you up and it makes

you ask these questions, ask the question to me and ask the question to yourself. And the answer is the truth. You know it. I know it. We all know it that the framework of discipline is the truth. If you tell yourself the truth, the real truth, the absolute categorical, unconditional, unabated, unmerciful truth, if you do that, you will feel. Find discipline. Discipline equals freedom. Discipline is rooted in the truth. The truth will set you free.

And what does that calculus work out to? Discipline equals freedom. That's all I've got for tonight. So, Echo Charles. Yes. Seems like we want the truth over here. Yes. So that we can do more and we can be more.

Be more. 100%. Is there anything that you know of that helps reveal the truth to us? Yes, jiu-jitsu. The mats never lie.

The mats do not, my friend. No, they do not. No, man. When you're, when you make eye contact with that guy who's a little bit better than you, maybe bigger, maybe we'll give you

a scenario where you got to put out more effort than maybe you want to do that day when you make eye contact, and then you like, look away right. Everyone sees that. that?

Oh, you mean pre-roll? Pre-roll, yes. Oh, there's like a scenario that could unfold, but we haven't connected eye contact for the role. Yeah. It's like, it's like avoidance. Avoidance. Yeah.

Everybody knows. That's one of the many attempted lies that we sort of try to, you know, perpetuate in ourselves. Like, oh, yeah, like, I'm good, right? That's what people kind of, they want to be good at. Jiu-jitsu, I think, you know, on the mats. You know Akbar? Sure, of course I do.

Yeah. He's really sick, jihitsu. And he's super, like, hard to roll with. Yeah. Just because he's strong and wiry and athletic and freaking good. It doesn't stop. Yeah. But I have, like, an unwritten rule with him, no matter what, 100%.

If either one of us wants to roll, we roll. Yeah. It doesn't matter what's going on. If one of us wants to roll, we roll. Yeah. And most of the time, he wants to roll. I don't and I roll them every time. Yeah.

Yeah. That's how. And that kind, I mean, let's face it, that, like you have mixed emotions about those kind of, because you see them and you're like, because you have it in your head. Like, you can't not roll with that person. I have that with Noah where if he's there, it's like. It's on. And him, he's like, I don't know if, man, he's been kind of working me recently.

Yeah. So it's like, oh, man, I see him. I'm like, I know this is going to be like a hard roll. But I can't not roll with him. Like that would defeat the whole. purpose of my existence here right now. If I like, don't roll with them,

you know? Roll with Noah for sure. Oh, yeah. And he's the same way. He's coming at you the whole time. Yeah. He's freaking awesome at Jiu-Jitsu.

Yeah. He's in good shape. He's strong. He's got it. He's just got to bring it. Yeah. You just got to be, you're like,

that's the way it is. Yeah. We're gonna roll. Yeah. So Noah, Akbar, like these guys that it's like, okay, if they weren't here,

it would be an easier day regardless. 100%. Yeah, but not everyone's like that, you know? And actually there can be guys who are like even actually better than you, but you roll with them. And it's like it's not this huge, like, it's not that like hard of a roll. You know, it's like there's just different dynamics.

Yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah. But the lie that we can tell ourselves, even though you're the only one you're lying to, everyone ever can see what you're doing when you like do when you like do avoid that. Yeah. Now, there are situations that unfold, then this is one that I do. So let's say I have an injury. Yes. Right? Legitimate injury.

I will, let's say a normal day for me is like, okay, I'm going to do eight rounds, you know, eight, six minute rounds. Cool. That's normal. Like, that's a good role for me. I had a good time, you know, whatever. It takes an hour, whatever. Because it's a minute rest or whatever.

So maybe not. But anyways, if I'm injured, sometimes I got to be like, okay, I can only do four rounds because then it's just odds. Yeah. That I'm going to re-inch or something stupid. And I just, I'm like, hey. What I try to do is tell people beforehand So that way I'm not being that guy

Like if you want to roll with me now is the time Because in four rolls Right maybe five Then I'm gonna then I'm gonna call it Yeah so it does happen and I guess the reason that I'm saying that is Just to be like well I'm gonna roll no matter what if you're injured And like you know the deal like when you're injured you have you can you can you can get lucky for like three, four rolls and like, okay, I didn't tweak anything. We're good. It didn't get worse.

That fourth, fifth roll, now you're sixth roll. You're tired. You're giving up a little bit more. And all of a sudden, that's when you get hurt. So just a little tale of caution. Yes, big time. And, you know, one, it's easy kind of like when we're just sitting here, you know, not in the situation. It's easy to be like, oh, yeah, you just work around the injury. And if you got to get caught in a submission, That's how, you know. No, it's not a submission that you're going to get. That's easy. You hope that someone, if you've got a sore elbow,

you hope that what hurts you is, oh, someone puts an arm lock and you go, oh, tap early, right? That's what you hope it is. Yeah. What you don't hope it is, is you're rolling and turning and your arm gets caught in a bad spot, and now you re-injure it. Yeah. There's no tapping from that. That's just another injury.

Yeah. So, I mean, what I had in my head was like, you know, your knee or whatever, whatever, rib, whatever. And you're like, I'm just going to go, like, kind of little, lighter, you know, right? Exactly. You roll one round, and then you roll one round with like no or something. Go light, no way, man.

And you can consciously be going, oh, yeah, I'm going to go light. But start rolling. Yeah, just see how much you can remember to go light when you're, you know, things get competitive, whatever, whatever. What do you always say to me, like when you do a good move to me and you say, yeah, you sense of urgency. Yeah, you just escalates. That's a big victory for you.

You get my sense of urgency to increase and it's like the biggest W. Oh, yeah, because you're just so good. And you say it to me too. Well, I don't say that it's a big W, but I do say. I recognize you. A little sense of urgency. You're all happy. Anyway, when you're in the moment, whether you can control it fully or not or whatever,

I would say you just decrease the chance of you staying safe as time goes on. Yes. That's just like the numbers. Just odds. The odds are. Yeah. I made it through four rounds. I'm okay

I'm walking off the mat right now Right so that's like the opposite of a lie You're like being so so truthful With yourself you're like hey you know And you're doing the right thing The lie comes when you're like You're not injured You're just maybe not feeling up to it

Maybe you're hungover I don't know Maybe you put a person And then you say well You know I'm this or I'm sick or I'm this And you say that excuse or whatever To yourself and then like you have the heart rolls. Yeah, I had Wes.

Like, I was training, I was deep into some rounds. And Wes is, and Wes was on the other mat. And he comes over, and Wes is a beast too. Like, I mean, he's just strong. It's jihitsu. It's awesome. And every time, it's going to be a gut check. And I'm like, sit up against the wall.

I'm done. And he's like, hey, you want to get one? And I was like, and I said no. You know? I was like, no. And then I was like, bro. And then like 30 seconds went by and I was like, all right, bro. I'm sorry.

That's just a week. Like, because I wasn't done yet. Yeah. I knew I wasn't done. There's times where I've been like, hey, no, I can't roll. Like I've got to, I'm, no, I'm done for the night. It's not smart for me to roll. I need to have discipline.

More than anything else, right? Yeah. Because you know, when you're injured, you're there, it's like you want to roll so bad. Yeah. You feel like a caged animal. Just wanted to get on the mats of justice. Yeah, pretty much any time you're there. there and you're not ruling injured it's the worst man working uh in my case you know filming or

whatever yeah not many you kind of that's just how but yeah but again that's like the opposite of the lie like your your your truth is is very uh how should I say strong like you don't like the lie like hits you hard when you begin to lie to yourself you know but some people they can just roll with it, but everyone sees what you're doing. Everybody, you know, or the guy who's tying his belt every 10 seconds, you know, like, oh, you know, I see what you're doing. Yeah. You're trying to perpetuate someone.

Yeah. But the mats, they don't lie. So that's why. That's why. We think jihitsu is a positive thing. Sure. I think so. It does expose our truth or maintain our truth. It's a good ecosystem to be in. I think so. You've got to be careful, like all ecosystems. But in that ecosystem, this is what we do care about.

What can ghee we have? You see what I'm saying? Yeah. Come on, we all check it out. Like, well, what, put it this way. We don't want to be walking around with a second-rate ghee that's made in wherever, not here. Yeah. Yes.

No, we don't. What do you want your ghee to say, look, I train Jiu-Jitsu, I work hard, and I support this country, and its workers. That's what I want my ghee to say. There's only one ghee that says that. There's only one ghee that says that. Yeah, and that's the origin ghee. And I think we all know that, you know.

So, yes, the question, what ghee do I get? When I do Jiu-Jitsu, when I start Jiu-Jitsu, when I compete in J-J-Jitsu, you get an origin glee. Yes. You get an origin rash guard for the no-gi scenarios that unfold. And then, since you can't wear a ghee and a rash-guard, in public unless you're John Donaheher, because he's just representing that rash.

Is he still representing the rash card? Super hardcore? As far as I know, but no, he's definitely so legit. We need to send him some rash cards. Anyways, if you're not John Donaheher and you're going to go out, you don't really want to wear ghee pants. Sure.

And a rash guard, you can get other clothing from origin Maine, such as T-shirts, jeans, sweatshirts, hoodies, Hiddies. What were you going to say? I think sweatshirts and hoodies kind of.

Covers it. Covers it. Okay. What were you going to say? You were you going to say jeans? Yeah. Jeans. Delta 68.

Delta 68's. Are those out yet? We're working on it. We're working on it. Hey, working on it. Hey, if you're working on it, you're working on it. All good. I actually told Pete, and I don't like to do this, but let's do the pre-order thing.

So we can actually get the demand signal because people are demanding the Delta 68's. Yes. Because I talked them up because they are truly the greatest things I've ever put on my legs There you go Also joggers Those are not the greatest things I put on my legs But they're not really for me

I'm not a joggers kind of guy Because you don't well yeah I mean you know fashionably speaking Yeah that's not you Comfort you know that's kind of down there on your list of priorities so I get it right now those are just two things that I'm not really super concerned Although, oddly enough, the comfort of the Delta 68's is one of the things that makes them very epic. Yeah. It's just like the cherry on top. If you came to Jocko Live, I was wearing Delta 68's.

Yes. If you see me in public and I'm wearing jeans, they're Delta 68's. Take it. There you go. OriginMane.com is where also supplements. These are important supplements. Joints for your joints. Supplements for your joints.

That's important. Try lift. You can be the strongest guy in the world. Your shoulders is not working? Let me ask you this. Is this jacked up? So a guy hit me up on social media and was like, hey, you're old. How do you maintain?

Like, how do you do this? And, you know, I is one of those things where I was like, well, do I just tell them like, straight up, man. If you're not on joint warfare and krill oil, you're just wrong. Like, step number one, get on joint warfare and krill oil. Seriously, super krill, joint warfare, that's what you want to do. Now, the thing that I told him also is very consistent, right? I'm not one of those guys that takes three weeks off from doing anything and then jumps back into the, to squat. Like, no, I'm working out for all practical purposes, I'm working out every single day.

now is there occasions where life gets in the way sure yep that's what it's called a day off that's why i don't take voluntary days off but i'm telling you if you want to maintain like the activity at a high level and you're an older person i mean i'm only 48 i feel like i'm 21 or 22 maybe I'm saying 27 how about that sure but joint warfare and krill oil those are the supplements that you're specifically talking about right now so I can't recommend them strongly enough and I should have just told that guy listen be consistent workout do a good job warm up and take krill oil and joint warfare but then you feel like oh I'm just you know you know I'm just selling this guy and stuff like bro this is it yeah so I actually did him a disservice yeah because that's

That's true. When you go like every day and consistent, your body's sorted, you know, for lack of a better way of putting it in as far as details go. But your body's just used to it. But at the same time, yeah, you know, like your joints are taking a beating if you're pushing hard. Which I am. Which, yeah, I mean, why wouldn't you push? I mean, I guess maybe under some circumstances that's okay. But if you're pushing hard, yeah, your joints are going to be like kind of taking some of the brunt. Yeah, for sure. You know? So yeah, if your joints can stay in the game, but it's like, yeah. Well, no, more important, if you're joining. can't stay in the game, you're out of the game. Yes. That's the problem. Yeah, that's the whole. It's like, hey, you can be big and strong, and your joints don't work. It doesn't matter. You're only as strong as your weakest link.

Make your weakest link, your strongest link, joint warfare and cruel oil. Discipline go. Discipline, powder form, awesome. If you need a can of a tasty beverage that's actually good for you. Yep. Get yourself some discipline. Go. Ready to deploy yes or drink without yeah we we prefer to play over here I think I understand

Also milk protein in the form of a dessert additional protein I know we're eating steak I get it's true It's good but you want the dessert with some additional protein some to increase and improve your protein synthesis Just got hit to that one it's like when there's protein okay so I was one of the guys who uh who uh who who, one of the many of us who, you know what, you know what anabolic window is? Yeah, it's like after you work out, you got a certain amount of time you gotta eat within. Yeah, you got to eat the protein and take it in

because that's when your body, like, kind of wants to take it in. If you miss that window, it doesn't take as much in. So apparently, that's not as much of a thing. Apparently, from what I'm... Bro science has been disproven from 1994. There's been controversy in the bro science world. I know, man.

just a shift, really, a shift paradigm. A paradigm shift in the bro science world. So interesting. Especially come from someone that has a doctorate in bro science, echo Charles. You know, I'm always staying on the cutting. So what is the point? So we can drink milk anytime and it's so beneficial. There's nothing wrong with me having milk at 948 at night when I'm like, you know what?

I want dessert right now. Cool. I'm going to have some milk. Yeah. Yeah. Basically. Yeah. So it's more about the protein rolling around.

in your system, generally speaking. And, you know, when your body needs protein to rebuild muscle, boom, you got some protein already in there. Whether you take it in 20 minutes after you lift or if, you know, you're just sort of taking it in throughout the day. There you go. Same thing goes for your children. They can take in protein at any time.

They can also take in poison, sugar. But don't give them that. Give them the protein, the good stuff. Warrior kid milk. And then get yourself some jocco white tea, by the way. Which is, as excellent. what Charles likes to point out, organic.

It is certified. Certified. Hi, I'm Jocko Willink. Organic certified T salesman. Yep. Definitely. Who would have thought? Look, it's not about the organic.

It's about having an 8,000 pound deadlift, which is 100% guaranteed. Double blind placebo. Yeah. Get some. And by the way, all these items are available right now at the vitamin shop.

So you probably, hopefully have a vitamin shop near you. You can just go down there and pick up any of these items that you want, which is pretty awesome. Go check it out. By the way, this Friday, February 8th in San Diego, California at the vitamin shop, we're going to be there. Is it Friday or Saturday? Sorry, Saturday. Saturday, February 8th. Yeah, it's Saturday, February 8th.

We're going to be there. We're going to be there. It is Saturday. We're going to be there live. Me, you. JP and Dakota Meyer. Dak Savage. Jack Savage is actual.

We'll be there. Come on down and hang out. And people are like, will you sign books? Yeah, I'll sign whatever you want. I mean, within reason.

Within reason. I mean, and by that I only mean like I'm not signing, you know, body parts. Body parts. Yeah. Well,

what if like someone's forehead. Certain body parts, I'm not going to sign. Yeah, yeah, I dig it. I dig it. Good news. So there you go. It's good.

Orjimae.com. Yes, Orjimane.com for all this stuff. Good stuff, by the way. Also, Jocko has a store. It's called Jocko store. That's where you can get the DefCore stuff. The discipline equals freedom stuff. The good, quote, unquote, good stuff.

And when I mean stuff, that's T-shirts, hoodies, lightweight and heavy. Rash guards. More rash guards. Representative of the path directly. while you're doing the jiu-jitsu. I saw some people on the podium. Representing.

Yeah. I saw that too. Recently. Oh, yeah. Yeah, way to represent on that one. Appreciate everyone that represents the path. The path.

Big time. And the podcast. Oh, yeah. The deaf core. Yes. So yeah. Competition. Oh, yeah.

Big time. But yeah, hats on there as well. Cool stuff on there. If you like something, get something. Represent while you're on the path. Jocco store.

Dot. Also, subscribe to the podcast. If you haven't already, we don't know if that's important. Is it important? It's important. It's not not important. Overall, we're saying, yes, it's important. So do it.

Do it. Subscribe. If you want. It's beneficial. If you're listening to this, you should subscribe. Yeah. That's my opinion. Yeah.

Very beneficial. And don't forget that we also have the grounded podcast. Yes. Where we talk about life jiu-jitsu. We're looking like we're probably going to make some more. of those in the very near future. Warrior Kid Podcasts. That is the best podcast that a child could listen to.

Am I biased? Maybe. Am I right? Absolutely. And don't forget about Warrior Kid soap. And I am overjoyed to inform you that we have a new soap out from Irish OaksRanch.com. It's got anti-bacterial, anti-bacterial, anti-exam. microbial microbeal

almost well anyways it's got really good stuff if you're dirty especially dirty in the tents of jiu jitsu where you've got little

creepy crawlies trying to get into your skin then you can get something that we made young Aden and it's called killer soap

go to Irish otter rants.com so you can get yourself some killer soap and stay clean stay clean also YouTube channel

we have a YouTube channel for the video version of this podcast and some excerpts on there you want to share these excerpts go ahead do it if your boss needs to hear this

don't do it like that I'm just saying if you sort of just shit anyway good stuff on there I think enhanced the stuff as well

you can see Jocko and his things are exploding things are catching on fire Sometimes. Yeah. Things are cracking open. Sometimes.

Yeah. In synchronization with my words. Yep. And music, cellos and whatnot. Yes. If you haven't heard Echo's enhanced videos, you may not know it. Echo is a cello enthusiast. I, well, you know.

Every time he plays me one of his videos, when the cello kicks in, I give him a look. Anyway, videos on there. Yes. to the YouTube channel. Yeah. What's it called? Jocko podcast. Jocko podcast.

That's the one. We also have something called psychological warfare, and I got a great piece of information, a great suggestion from someone, some trooper out there just made a great suggestion. The suggestion was when you talk about psychological warfare, you should describe it as a little psychological hitter. As soon as I said it,

I was like you get credit credit so yes if you need a little psychological hitter to help you get over some moment of weakness Well guess what we got something for you it's called psychological warfare it's on iTunes Google play other MP3 platforms if you need a visual hitter then go to flipside canvas.com where Dakota Meyer speaking of is making visual representations of the path that you can hang on your wall on your ceiling if in your doorway. That's what you need to do. Got some books, leadership strategy and tactics, the most recent, the answer to,

the answer to every leadership question that I've been asked on this podcast that I get asked all the time. So leadership strategy and tactics field manual, everyone that got it, thank you, made it number one on a bunch of different lists, which was awesome, and I was super stoked. It was especially awesome

if you're in the literary ecosystem. Then you go, oh, number one, everyone else doesn't care. So I'm kind of got one foot in that door because there's a bunch of people that I work with that are in the literary world because that's what it is, right? You write a book, you're in the literary world. Yes.

So that ecosystem, so you guys, even though none of you care, you all propelled me to the number one in that ecosystem that anyone that's outside the literary world doesn't care about. people say how do you stay humble guess what no one cares about this stuff that's how leadership strategy and tactics got a bunch of kids books weigh the warrior kid one two and three Mikey and the dragons for that littler kid discipline equals freedom field manual which people just take pictures of that and just post just a picture of the cover of the book

yeah which I'm always like credit so leadership strategy and tactics is field manual too the first field manual was discipline equals freedom field manual the audio version of that is on iTunes Amazon music Google play and other MP3 platforms and then of course it all started with extreme ownership and the dichotomy of leadership which I wrote with my brother Laif Babin about the lessons that we learned in combat and how you can use them in business in life we got EF online which is leadership training online and what this is is is a supplement actually doesn't even have to be a supplement it could be the whole meal if this is what you can do then you want leadership training go to eF online if you need it inside

your company inside your business inside your team you can contact echelonfront.com that's my leadership consultancy echelonfront.com what we do is solve problems through leadership we got some musters coming out up we got well all the ones that we've done have sold out. The ones that are coming up on deck are Orlando, Florida, Dallas, Texas, Phoenix, Arizona, and Phoenix, Arizona. Go to Extreme Ownership.com for those, all the events that we've ever done have sold out. So if you want to come, go to Extreme Ownership.com early so that you can get some. And last thing, we now have EF. Overwatch and EF Legion. EF. Overwatch aimed at executive leadership taking folks that were in the military leaders senior leaders in the military

and placing them into civilian companies so that they can help that company move forward that's our executive leadership placement firm we also have eF legion which is frontline troops and frontline leaders so if you've been in the military if you're a veteran and you want to find your next mission if you're a senior leader cool go to eF overwatch if you're a junior Junior leader go to EF Legion and companies that are looking for junior leaders or executive leaders you can do the same thing EFlegeon.com or EFoverwatch.com These are people that understand the principles that we teach and can apply them inside your business and If you have not heard enough of my

exceedingly slow talking and Ludacrously serious tone and you haven't Had enough of echoes, marginally, marginally applicable metaphors. If you can't get enough of those two things, well, guess what? You can get more. We are available on the interwebs on Twitter, Instagram, and on da face a book. Echo, is that Echo Charles? And I am at Jaka Willink.

And to final word here, thank you all for listening to the podcast. A podcast that exists thanks to your sa porch. Thanks for listening, spreading the word, telling your friends, thanks for getting some deafcore or some origin gear, all of which supports this podcast. And of course, thanks to all the service members out there in uniform who protect the very freedoms that make this podcast possible.

Also to our police and law enforcement, firefighters, paramedics, EMTs, dispatchers, correctional officers, border patrol, secret service, all the first responders. And I saw a bunch of military members. I saw a bunch of first responders at all the Jocko lives. And I appreciate you coming out. And I want to say thank you for providing an environment where we can live our lives as we see fit.

And to everyone else out there, remember to tell yourself the truth. Remember to tell yourself the truth. You know what that means. The truth is you need to do more. The truth is you need to be more to reach your fullest maximum capacity and capability as a human being. And if you tell yourself that truth, you will find discipline. And if you find discipline, you will find freedom. So do not lie to yourself.

And instead, get out there. and get after it and until next time this is echo and jocco out