Jocko Podcast - 40: Avoid Conflict Without Being a Weakling, Dealing w/ Random Threatening People, Was Jocko Disciplined as a Kid?

Episode Date: September 14, 2016

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=GaZ-RrNeRYg 0:00:00 -  Opening 0:02:14 - Tips for Complimentary exercises for BJJ & Frustrating Moments in BJJ 0:39:19 - What to do if Others get into adversarial relationships with you without being a weakling. 0:52:58 - Tips for making the change to Wake up earlier wile keeping the peace at home. 1:14:02 - How to deal with Random Threatening People in Public. 1:34:23 - Was Jocko disciplined as a kid? 1:53:22 - Can you train instinct?  And can you trust it wholly in fighting and leadership? 2:02:10 - Cool Internet/Onnit Stuff, Jocko Store Stuff, etc.  Support this podcast at — https://redcircle.com/jocko-podcast/exclusive-content

This is Jocko podcast number 40 with Echo Charles and me, Jocko Willink. Good evening, Echo. Good evening. And the last podcast that we did, I went a little long with the book. The book was Brave Men by a guy named Ernie Pyle. And there was just some incredible writing in there that I just went deep with. I read it all And so we had to

Postpone the Q&A So That's okay Gave us some time here to give us some time here to go a little deep on some Q&A This is podcast number 40 by the way 40 weeks straight who wants some 40 weeks straight is where we're at And that's apparently

That's the battle rhythm here We put out podcasts and we do it weekly and we've been doing it for 40 straight weeks. And I dig that. Yeah, it's good. And it's not always easy. You know, because if you think about the times, think about the times when you're not doing anything. Well, when you're not doing anything or when I would normally not be doing anything for 40 weeks, I've been doing something. I've been reading.

I've been prepping. I've been researching. So 40 weeks is legit. And I'm stoked that we're at number 40. Me too. And now we get to talk about some questions from the interweb. So thanks to everybody for giving us the awesome questions through Twitter, through Facebook. It's pretty much where they come from, Twitter and Facebook.

Yeah. I guess I get a couple emails. I get texts too from like some of my buddies in the SEAL teams. They'll hit me up with a question. here and there. A lot of times I just respond to them. Keep it real. Sometimes I use them. Sure.

But anyways, yeah, let's get to it. Let's do it. Okay. Jocco. First question. From the vault. And from the vault. I've got a lot of questions. Got a big vault. Got a big vote.

And so I was just trying to go through and make sure there wasn't any questions or just reviewing questions that might be good that I missed the first time. around so this one right here is from the vault it's from the old school it's a old question yeah one that you always intended to maybe revisit yes here we go revisiting it yes yeah let the revisit begin started jiu jitsu thanks to you any tips for complementary exercises especially especially for non-athletic civilian what's the hardest stage of your and what's the hardest stage of your jiu jitsu journey yeah and that's actually for that's actually it was two questions yeah combined them into one because they're they're kind of

of a similar and okay so jiu jih Tzu one thing that's cool about Jiu Jitsu is it's a it's a very well-rounded physical activity right you got to have flexibility you got to have strength you got to have endurance you got to be able to recover quickly when from fatigue you got to have some agility speed balance coordination proprioception You know what proprioception is? It's knowing where your body is in space. Sure.

And it's a talent that gymnasts have very well. Yes, yes. Maybe a dancer has very well. They know where their body is in space. And Jiu Jitsu demands that you know where your body is at all times. So that's the stuff that you need to work on all those, all those things. because jujitsu is a unique test of all those things it's a test of your strength it's a test of your flexibility it's a test of your endurance it's a test of your ability to recover it's a test of your

agility it's a test of your speed of your coordination the test of all those things and so that makes it that makes it um a really good sport to practice in my opinion so uh what do you need to do Well, what you need to do to train them is you need to train all those things, you know? So for flexibility, I like, I personally like the mobility wad. I think that's excellent, you know, but you know, get some kind of stretching protocol. Gymnastics types movements. There's gymnastic bodies, which is a ridiculously good protocol you can go on. it's an internet thing gymnastics bodies.com and what's that like a workout yeah it's a workout

flexibility yeah it's it's it's hardcore it's hardcore um but that's really good you know you'll get your flexibility you get all kinds of stuff from that but so you got to be flexible you've got to work on your flexibility so what are you going to do like i said you're going to do mobility water some kind of stretching protocol so you get limber you got to work on your strength so what do you work on strength. Olympic lifting. What is that? Clean and jerk.

Snatches. That brings in things like cleans by themselves, you know, presses and hang cleans and all that. And then on top of that for strength, you also have the simple movements, the deadlift, the squat, the front squat, the overhead squat. And also for strength, you can go back to gymnastics again. Go back to those gymnastics movements and, basic calisthenics

pull-ups push-ups dips squats flutter kicks that whole nine yards now you got to have endurance right so what do you do for endurance you can see where this is heading

for endurance what do you got to do run swam bike some kind of metcon I like the metcon personally for my for my cardiovascular endurance and recovery and what not

you know so yes you You can add running and sprinting into those. You can sprint swimming. You can sprint on a bike. You can use kettlebells to work your metcom scenario. You can actually use barbells to do metconns. You know, do a bunch of cleans, and you will get tired.

And then with that, when you work on your endurance, that thereby improves your recovery. And so that's going to help you there. then you have agility and for agility what do you do do some sports some cross training of sports I personally like to surf but you know

it's not just that it's basketball it's go play soccer go huck a baseball whatever set you work on your agility then you get your speed and I already talked about this you got your running you're sprinting the air bike or whatever the proprioception

the gymnastics the movements type things or you're holding your body in space. So that's a lot of stuff. That's a lot of stuff. And you pile all that together and you got a lot of varied, varied activity. And what's nice about that is when people talk about getting burnt out, I'm like, I never get burnt out on working out. I got 97 different base exercises that I can use.

I'm not going to get burned out. So and what's fun is you jump into these challenges Or you find something that's challenging that you can't do And you go, okay, well, I'm going to try and do that I'm going to see what I can get my weight up to on this. I'm going to see if I can do this movement in gymnastics. I'm going to see if I can do this many pull-ups or whatever. You keep continually varying and heading in a different direction.

And I think when you combine all those things together and you become a well-rounded athlete, that is what will help you the most with the jiu-jitsu. But I don't think there's one aspect. exercise like hey this won't help you in jiu-jitsu although the clean and jerk is pretty good yeah and anything with um

like your body weight so because like in jiu jitza when you're doing jiu jitsu that's mainly what it is sure there are elements where you're trying to control someone else's body but it's mainly what you're doing with your body so like when you do you know you know like those when you climb up oh the pegboard yes yeah like that kind of stuff bars all the gymnastic stuff

and then as far as like being strong in these weird ways because that's essentially what you're going to be doing in jiu-jitsu you know there is there is though there is in jiu-jitsu you're oftentimes you're moving someone else's weight too yeah in guys that are super explosive that's a different thing to deal with and it's yeah it's a good trait to have to be super explosive yes for sure so that so you combine that with what like when you shrimp out in someone right sure something's going to be be strong holding you, but when you shrimp, you're pushing your own body weight. That's your own body weight. Sure. You add his own. That's the, you're with the guy. That's just kind of part of the game. But if you can control your own body in these stronger ways, that's going to give such a big benefit. So then to your Olympic lifting, to me, that's, in my opinion, that's probably one of the best ones. Olympic. And this is why. Not only do you get that little explosive movements in there but when you

when you put Olympic lifting to make up your METCON when you do like a clean like a clean impress right you your muscle work is just for a second and then for a second

it's almost kind of relaxed and then boom again and then it's kind of relaxed and then you hold and boom and it's just repetitive that feels like Jiu Jitsu to you that's kind of what Jiu Jitsu can be depending on your game

it can be very much that yeah yeah so and if you're in shape in that way where you can go hard, rest for just a, you know, a little bit and then go hard again. If that's kind of, if you can do that, if you're in that kind of shape, that's going to help.

So when you do a Metcon or circuit training, something like that, where if you can do the exercise, dynamic rest, like active rest, you know, where you're walking or even jogging kind of, that's what jujitsu is. It's like work, because you're never really just laying there, you know. Do that kind of thing. And do it in, like, rounds.

If you're into like a 10-minute round, in judithu and that's really your thing then do your circuit train 10 minute rounds you know it'll like it'll help it'll get you kind of aware of like okay i'm this tired i got to manage you know all this stuff but yeah i agree i think metcon swimming oh swimming but if you do swimming sprints because it's like your whole body you know especially the less the least the less comfortable you are in the water the more of those swimming things are gonna are going to be challenging for you yeah but hey speaking of the olympic live you know do you know mo mo the wall Yeah.

Have you trained with him? No. So, Mo Llewal, if, for those you listening that don't know who Mo is, he's a really incredibly good wrestler. He wrestled in college, and he is a, he didn't make the Olympic teams, but he was like in second. He almost made the Olympic team, but he's a big guy, so he's, you know, like 205 pounds. And he is, I think he is the most.

explosive person I've ever trained with when I've trained with some unbelievably incredibly explosive people and you'll find that if anybody wrestled on a high high level like if they were a if they were a high level college wrestler well there's a likely chance that they're very explosive yeah they're very explosive and mo is explosive to a crazy level but the reason that I thought when you said Olympic lifts is one time he was just trying to help me with some takedowns and he was the way he was exploding into him right and he he was all fired up he's like you know it's like when you do a clean and jerk he goes this right here is the beginning of it and he's you could see that he's developing so much explosiveness the first time i ever trained with him

uh dean dean i can never read dean with when he sets me to train with somebody he doesn't give me a heads up like if i were going to tell you if there was like let's say there was a guy that was a really good wrestler. And I go, hey, echo, train with this guy over here. Hey, he's a really good wrestler. And if he's, I might even say, I mean, say, hey, man, he's a really good wrestler. And he's got a sick guillotine. So you're like thinking about it, right?

I'll give you a little heads up. Dean just goes, hey, you should train with him. Right? That's what Dean does. And so anyways, he did tell me on this occasion. He goes, hey, Mo's coming down. You got to train with him. He's a really sick wrestler.

And I go, awesome. I think to myself, oh, cool. You know, I actually, for a guy that didn't wrestle in high school, I have decent takedown defense because I've been defending takedowns for a long time. And I utilize Jiu-Jitsu to defend my takedowns. So I'm sprawling and guillotining and going for commures. I'm doing active, aggressive jiu-jitsu moves to people when they're trying to take me down. So I'm no, I'm not trying to say I have any major skills there, but I'm not a slouch to take down. So I figured, hey, I got a good wrestler, cool.

And he wasn't that experience in jitza, which tells you, okay, cool, you know, you're going to guillotine this guy. This isn't, you know, or you least have a good chance, whatever. That's what you're thinking. Sure. Yeah, I'm thinking that. So I meet Mo and good dude, you know, or going over some moves, and then it's like time to train. And Dean's like, okay, yeah, you train with him, Chaco. And I go, okay, cool.

So, you know, we slap hands and we're doing the, and Mo was getting ready for a fight, but we weren't fighting at all. We were just... And just to kind of put in context. I mean, you say Mo's a good wrestler. Mo also happens to be the Bellator 205 champ. Was he the champ? He wasn't at this time.

This was like as he was getting into MMA. Oh, okay. Yeah. So he was really actually probably sharper at wrestling at this time because he was coming out of, you know, trying to be on the Olympics. Yeah, yeah. And yeah, he wrestled. I want to say he wrestled at Oklahoma.

But anyways, King Moe is what he's known as. King Mo. and so anyway so we slap hands we're getting ready you know we kind of square off and I'm you know okay doing my thing boom he

he does this take down to me his his face his face hits me in the chest and this is in the less than the blink of an eye his face hits me in the chest and his hands they don't even grab my legs they just tap my legs

like a double leg and it's a blast double and I'm in the air I mean, I mean, he knocked me into the air with his face. Yeah, that's saying a lot because you're huge. Yeah, he knocked me into the air with his face. I, I fall down to the ground. And the funny thing was, it was, I got back up immediately. Like, he didn't even, he took me down so fast, he couldn't even chase me to the ground because I was already, I was back up really quickly.

But that was the fastest takedown that, you know, that I'd felt. That is probably the fastest takedown. Now we have one more guy. There's a guy coming up right now at the gym. Another sick wrestler. But, you know, he wrestled. He's a really good wrestler, a sick wrestler, a collegiate wrestler, and all that. Taylor, Taylor, you know, Taylor Johnson.

So Taylor is another guy who has mutant strength. He has mutant strength. It's not normal. I was on Taylor And I was going for like a guillotine or I think I was actually going for a crucifix So I was but so for those of you that don't know what this is Taylor picture picture a guy on all fours on the ground And someone else is trying to rip their head off. Okay, so that's Taylor he's on all fours on the ground

And I'm trying to guillotine him rip his head off With one hand He he goes up to his knees and lifts me into the air and shot puts me through the air onto the ground and is and then gets a cross side and I started laughing I'm like brogue you just shot put me and he didn't even do it from his from his hips like he didn't get the strength from his hips he got it from his upper torso he didn't use his legs at all no legs because he was on his knees yep and so he just has this Massive explosiveness, but then the thing that's really scary about Taylor is that he's adapting.

Just because you're a good wrestler doesn't mean you automatically adapt well to Jiu-Jitsu. Some people never adapt really well to Jiu-Jitsu. And you can see, I mean, in MMA, in the UFC, there's plenty of wrestlers that you look at and you go, yeah, that guy never really transitioned into become a comprehensive ground fighter that was as comfortable on his back as he is on cross-stretched. side as he is going for submissions. There are some guys that would have been extremely successful that never made that transition, but they stay on top, ground and pound. Taylor, if you watch him roll, you might not even know he was a wrestler until you roll

with him and then you're going to feel that you can't move him. But if you just watch him rolling, you're like, oh, wow, he's going for, you know, advanced jiu-jitsu moves. By the way, been training for less than a year. Yeah, very surprising with him in regards to that. Like, you look at him. if you look at him you're like okay I'm about to roll with this guy and then you roll with him you're going to be like okay I'm not surprised at this guy's like this guy's strong his balance it's just like magical balance kind of thing so when you look at I mean on on the on the surface but if you know that he's such an accomplished wrestler you would think given his experience you'd think okay his his jiu jitsu or even his like when he's training his jiu jiu jitsu you know you wouldn't expect it to be that fluid like when I rolled with him I was like I thought When you were like, yeah, Taylor's, he's getting this new guy, you know, you, you, you haven't rolled with him.

What he should roll with him because, you know, he gives good training. Yeah. He's really good. So what I'm thinking is good, but I'm thinking this is going to be real wrestling intensive. Yeah. Training scenario. Then he pulled guard on you. No, he didn't pull guard, but his whole thing.

Yeah. Yeah. He was in the guard. He doesn't care. Yeah, he was like, I'm here to train. I'm here to, you know, get good or whatever. Man, and he's, and that kind of attitude, it gets you so good. And he's, yeah, man, it wasn't, he wasn't trying to like,

okay another big guy let me like wrestle this guy he's we're doing straight up jiu jitsu and and he's he was it was clean it was good yeah but anyways he's got that super explosiveness to that's that's mutant level and also is striking yeah it's ridiculous and he hasn't been no he's just a natural athlete because he's been just anyways so that's him and we got a bunch of other pipe pit bulls too i mean you got big andy who's awesome uh justin don't forget about justin jordan just and jordan just showed up so we got some got some good training in there. Yeah.

But back to this deal. So I was talking to Taylor about and I go, bro, did you ever like Olympic lift? And he goes, yeah,

yeah, I got into CrossFit for like a month. And that was right before I got an MMA. And I was doing pretty good. And I was like, oh, what does that mean? He's like,

oh, I was snatching like 300. I was like, what? And they invited me to the CrossFit games. He did CrossFit for a month. And never snatched. Before an all of a sudden he's snatched almost 300 pounds. That's that's insane.

Yeah. So but that and that's what it feels like when you roll with somebody that has that kind of explosive strength It's a very very it's it's a very good tool to have now there's other we could go through the entire list of body types Strengths and weaknesses because you know you get you get the lanky people that are strong and wiry like higgs you rolled with higgs before right no yeah Higgs is lanky wiry, skinny. When he puts the triangle on you, it starts to cut into your body because he's all, you know, compritos like that. Compritos like that's like in the length.

Like you, how can you sweep him when his arm is, is basing like four, like eight feet over there is where he's basing. So you get that kind of body. Then you get the real, like the stocky people with no limbs sticking out. Right. You know? Yeah, you can't. It's hard to choke them.

So anyways, we can go through everybody style. but and each one of them has a has an advantage but the thing that's cool about explosiveness is something you can somewhat train right you can somewhat train now you can't you're not going to be able to naturally get as explosive as mow the wall or as taylor johnson but you can get stronger yeah right you can get stronger so but but the other thing is where can you defeat them where can you where can you be better than them maybe you can be more flexible than them Maybe you can be faster on a scramble. Maybe you can be heavier and tighter.

So there's some athletic things that you could try and do, trying to improve to overcome and negate some of their advantages. Hard to do. You get some people that are mutants. Yeah. Dean's big and flexible, right? Dean is big and strong. It's shockingly flexible.

Glover is so flexible that, you know, you have to negate that. And Glover, you know, he loves training with big muscle-bound guys. that's like an easy day for him that's what he likes to you know that's what that's he that's the the easiest matchup body style for him as someone that's just super super strong and muscle bound

yeah and the you get mutants like and I'd say that's kind of a good way of putting it mutant like Taylor where he has a wrestling background so he's no stranger to like functioning while he's tired you know so I'd say if you're big explosive strong or whatever

typically your endurance is not that good, typically. So if you get all those factors and they're flexible and stuff and they have endurance, there's your bad day right there if this guy has that. Other than that,

if you take one or two different attributes, you can always find, it's like rock paper, scissors. You can always find one that can, if you just employ this strategy, it'll give you more of an advantage. And because I always like to tie this together to leadership.

So it's the same thing with leadership and what, because people will ask me all the time, are leaders born or made, You know, can you, can you develop a leader? Everybody is born with certain leadership characteristics. It's just like a video game where they rank your strength and your intelligence and your agility and all the stuff that we just talked about. People have that for their leadership capability as well, right?

Are they articulate? You know, because that's some people are articulate and that is a good advantage to have. Can you read people well? Well, that's another thing that some people are naturally good at. Can you simplify things? things. That's a talent that some people have. Now, you could go on this list, but what you find is that people, some people are gifted and they have really strong leadership characteristics, leadership traits. And that's great. And then you get some people that don't have those. And so what are you going to do? It's the same thing that I have to do in my jiu-jitsu game. How do you develop those things? How do you become more articulate? How do you simplify things? How do you recognize that you are a person that makes things more complex and how do you focus on making things simplified. So you just go right down the list.

So yes, you can be born with some natural leadership characteristics, but if you're not born with them, how do you develop them? Usually these things aren't that hard to develop either. Yeah. You know? So when you have weaknesses, identify them, be humble enough to identify them, and then see how you can improve upon them. And although they may never become your staple of your game, either as a leader or a jih Tzu

player or anything else, they can become, it's not something you have to protect. It's not something you have to worry about. Yeah, you can kind of function in those little regards now. Yes, you can become functional. Yeah. And for instance, if you're not the most articulate person, well, number one, you can study, you can listen to people. speak you can record yourself speaking you can video yourself so you can be practice and become more more articulate and you can that means oh guess what I'm not

very articulate so guess what I'm gonna do I'm gonna plan more before I go and brief people I'm gonna go through exactly what I'm gonna say I might even rehearse it two times then I'm gonna sound articulate so you gonna make up for those those problems and that's all you have to do is figure out how you can how you can make up or how you can get rid of or how you can mitigate some of those weaknesses that you have the other thing you could do is you surround yourself with somebody that's super articulate. Echo, you're more articulate than me.

Cool, I want you to put out the word to the troops. Boom, done. Even though I might be in charge, I'll say, all right, hey, Echo is going to brief this operation or Echo is going to brief this strategy and then, boom, Mr. Articulate Echo gets up there and does it. Yeah. Maybe not the best example. But that's what you do.

That's how you want to, that's how you fill in the holes in your leadership game. And the, by the way, you'll never have the ability to do that if you're not. humble enough to admit where you have weaknesses and that they're there yeah totally true and and I know you you back to the jiu jitsu real quick I know you're saying all these things kind of with it with given that really the main thing to train is how much you know jiu jitsu that's really kind of the main that is the main thing yeah the number one thing so that's all it's like I said a given because the question is supplemental stuff for sure um so yeah so let's say these all these little comparisons like you know the the

To me, aside from knowing Jiu-Jitsu, that's the main strength or whatever, if everyone's even, to me, the taller guy has the advantage. To me, that's the most effective advantage that I've seen. It's interesting that you think that. I don't think I necessarily agree with you. What a very tall, very lanky guy will have is a body type that you come across the least. So since you are coming across this body type, the least, you get the less train. the least training against it. And since you have less training against it,

you don't have to react to it. And by the way, they constantly work on their strange body style because you are correct in the fact that the lanky body style is gives you more moves, more unique moves than any other body

style. So there's unique moves, there's more unique moves that only are utilized or can be utilized by a tall lanky person, then there are than any other body style. Right. And also, you can pretty, I mean, I'm not saying he's seven feet tall. I'm saying like the whole six one up to, yeah, like six one doesn't do it. To me, well, six one can do it if the person's like, that's like the beginning of it.

But how tall is like we have stilts appropriately named at the gym. And he has, he's tall and I think he's six five. but he has really developed the lanky guy style that people aren't used to. And it's a challenge for anybody. Yeah. So Stiltz a good example where, in this case, where he's a little bit different because Stilts has the lanky body style, but he went pretty, he's going pretty hard in that direction where he's practicing moves that only he can do kind of thing.

Absolutely. That's exactly the point I'm making. Right, right. Whereas most normal body styles, everybody that's, you know, five, three to you know six oh they all have

pretty much the same moves right right you know yeah so what I'm talking about I'm not talking about them I think I think there's that but those are the kind of the outliers I think overall

I mean everyone plays their strengths in one way or another but I'm saying just all things being equal so like let's say all three Gracie brothers Hodger Gracie these guys who are

tall these are like 636 four six you know five type guys we'll take Hodger for example he doesn't really do any kind of crazy I am tall so I can only do this true you know he doesn't do that he does like you know but his like just mount for example yes or his arm bar set up from the bottom or try from the bottom stuff um is just way harder to deal with because he

developed such a good base on top of the fact that physically he's made for such a good base you know yeah and he and okay and here's the thing about tall guys in general they're not limited to the moves they can do they can do more or less all the moves so like the guy who's five three two 50 or not 5. We'll say 5.3, 220. He's going to have hard time. He can just say 5.8. Sure. 2.30, whatever. We'll just say that's a stocky buff guy.

He's going to have hard time doing triangle chokes on guys. His own size. In his weight division, he probably transferred. Yeah. That's a triangle. It's a benchmark move. Yes. You can't do it. Yeah, tall guys don't have that problem. They can do all the moves. They can do chokes, arm bars, whatever, and they can do it pretty easy.

You know, so like I said, that's why I think and I and of course the the flexible tall lanky guys they do have that but I think we all do I think I'll do what have like our body style yeah give us special moves only we can do yeah even if you're short in stock the list of moves the list of special moves that I can do with my body style is like two yeah and the list that stilts can do with his body style is infinite still says two things though he is tall and lanky and he has flexible okay so yeah So that's like he has double the thing. But I think the tall has the most in their bucket, I think.

They definitely have the most options of moves that other humans can't do. But again, the main thing is to know. The main thing is to know Jiu-Jitsu, for sure. Yeah. For sure. That is the amazing thing. The number. And then the other part of this question is,

what was the hardest stage of your Jiu-Jitsu journey? Me, I would say the whole thing just in completely different ways. Like the first part. part is like dang you get tired way too quick and guys who you know are way smaller than you way you know whatever than you are are beating you up you know and that kind of thing beating you up with no factor whatsoever yeah and they're like teaching you hey this is what you did wrong and you're sitting there all but i mean in my case i was like 225 when i started and i'm like sitting there in this little guy um i don't know if you remember george but he um he was a little purple belt that was

I was rolling with a lot. He taught me butterfly guard. Oh, yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah. He's teaching me stuff. I'm still seeing it with my big muscles, and he's like teaching me stuff.

So that can be hard, I guess, um, and getting tired, but I think, and then yeah, you go out, Blue Belt,

in my particular experience, Blue Belt was the easiest, I think, because nothing really was expected of me. Oh, yeah, and Blue Belt's a good place to hide. At the same time,

in a way, some people, it's the most frustrating. Yeah. But if you're like, Blue Belt, you're good, you're a blue belt so people know that you know jih Tzu a little bit yeah but you're not expected to tap anybody no yeah and if you get tapped out by another blue belt or a purple belt or a brown bottle of black but it's no big deal yeah you're a blue belt and even a white belt taps you and you're like yeah you know that you know so much to learn yeah yeah totally and yeah that you know that you know how you know when you learn something from the point of not knowing anything and then you start to learn you learn the most quantity wise at the bottom when you start for sure you know so and that's a philil

philosophical way of putting it's a specific way of putting it I don't know I think there's some stages in the mid levels where you where your mind starts to fill up and you start to be able to really absorb stuff to big giant things right but in as far as jit's totally true and that's what I mean by like that's a that's a way of putting it maybe philosophically yeah maybe but it's because when you're I mean quantity wise meaning learning the moves in jiu jiu jitsu you know at like black belt unless there's these weird special moves that are coming out or whatever you know all the moves you know all this stuff it's now it's about other stuff you got to learn other stuff timing yeah well you know approaches and all this more like interstitial stuff but from a blue belt you still like there's moves you just don't know for sure so sure so you learn away quicker if you're interested you know so you're like oh i have no answer to this guard pass i have no answer i'm a blue belt literally no answer to this guard pass someone can show you oh this is how you do you just just just block the wrist here and you're oh i automatically

So you just learn more in my experience. So I didn't think Blue Belt was very frustrating at all. And I didn't spend much time of Blue Belt. And then when you hit Purple Belt, that's when the learning frustration hits. Because you're good enough and you kind of have this weird confidence that's developed. And then you're doing so well against all these guys. And you just hit that one level up where you can't do nothing against nobody. And you're just there for a long time.

Because it's almost like you've got to switch over to learning different types of things now. Yeah, you've got to open your brain up, open your mind. up and open your game up and you gotta be vulnerable you're not gonna learn without making yourself vulnerable from time to time yeah and you know and again there's a good parallel here with learning about leadership I think it's the same thing you know you come into a leadership position for the first time and it doesn't take long before you're like okay I kind of got this and that's like your bluebell phase where you start feeling like and then the more people you get to command or the

senior leadership positions you get put into or the harder situations you get put into, you realize that all you got to continue to exercise your mind, you've got to continue to grow, you've got to continue to try and absorb new information and try new strategies and tactics and still stick with the fundamentals. Because that's one thing that, you know, the fundamentals of Jiu-Jitsu, they're fundamentally the same from white belt to black belt.

And yet, they change, and there's sometimes you break those rules and they're nuanced and it's the same thing with being in a leadership position. The fundamentals don't change, but then how are those how are those fundamental principles nuanced to handle these different situations yeah very challenging yeah yeah and then yeah it's true and brown belt to me is more the same as purple belt but just more like refined you know so it's it's like less of the frustration but the frustration becomes like more concentrated you know what's crazy for me and i don't know if this is

just, you know, when you remember back in the past, like you forget the bad stuff of the past? Sure. You know what I mean? Does everyone do that? Depends all bad, but yeah, yeah. I mean, I know that. Oh, yeah. When we were in high school, everything was great, right?

Or, hey, when we went to college, everything was great. Or, you know, in the SEAL teams, you go, oh, yeah, that deployment was great. We forget about all the hard stuff on a deployment or anyone that was bad or whatever didn't work out the way we wanted to. I don't know if it's that. But when I talk about the hardest stage of my Jiu-Jitsu jury, Journey it's one big blur of fun. It's like there's nothing where I think back.

Wow, I was frustrated at this time. No, man, I never had that feeling. I go home from the gym every time, kind of like, good day of training. But that was fun. That was cool that I learned this. Man, I can't believe I got caught by that guy. He's getting good or whatever, you know? You just kind of, I don't have like these hard stages to me.

Maybe I'm just a person that really enjoys it a lot, I guess. Yeah, and I would say that that's most people. I think so, too. I think I'm the same boat and, you know. But you use the term frustration a lot. And I've actually, you know, I don't, I don't want to bring this out in the public audience, but I factually have seen you get frustrated from time to time. Well, those are like micro.

You have a funny way of getting frustrated too. Whatever. Then I've seen the same thing with you. When? Oh, you want me? Okay. One time you were rolling with Dean. And Dean had you, you know how like Dean will get ahead of you psychologically?

And he'll be like, oh, yeah. And he'll like be baiting you and laughing and stuff. And then the more he laughs, less. less you left so you're getting really mad and I remember he was doing this thing where you guys stood up and you were like you were just tired of what's going on you're tired of it and you're turning up the heat and Dean was just like okay and then he like Lee this is what he did he leaned

against the wall kind of like oh you can't take me out of me against the wall and you engaged or whatever you guys went down and he got you I think he got you with armbar and I remember it was arm bar because I remember thinking I don't think I've ever seen Jakku A get tapped out B with an armbar I can see like a footlock someone like jumped in kind but he got you with an arm bar And you were like, ah, you were frustrated. Yeah.

Nonetheless, that was like a what we could call a micro frustration. Overall, these are more like little challenges. So that frustration, though, is it possible for it to be called frustration if it brings me joy? Is it possible? Because even in the depths of like frustration, man, I feel good, even getting tapped out. Yeah. Especially when you can reflect on it. And that's why I think you said, or when you said you forget about the bad things, you forget about the bad things in a certain kind of discourse.

If you regard that overall discourse as being a good thing, then you'll start to forget the bad thing. And vice versa. But I never go home and say, like, oh, man, I can't believe that I couldn't get out of there. I just couldn't do anything. At least it's, I don't remember. Yeah. Man, I got to have that feeling in there somewhere. Yeah, yeah, it has to be.

really what they are are just the the challenges that are specific to certain stages and these are just these are real general things that probably apply to you know to everybody in one way or another on the stages yeah and it's the same thing with leadership like most of the time even though i've been some situations where i was like man i didn't do a good job there i could done better normally i'm not frustrated or i was working for somebody that wasn't letting me do what i wanted to do and I had more maneuvering to do to get where I needed to be. Didn't get frustrated. I enjoy that game.

I enjoy that game. Yeah. Micro frustrations. They're like micro tears in your muscle. You feel them, but they're all for like benefit for overall muscle growth. Yeah. They're not injuries. Exactly.

Awesome. Next question. Next question. Jocco. You've talked about how getting into adversarial relationship. is pointless, but people always get into adversarial relationships with me. I've been told I'm scary before, but never understood why. My question is, how do I maneuver on this without acting like a little weakling,

bitch, for lack of the better term, to appear less threatening? Do I just accept that I rub people the wrong way? So, this is a question that I'll do my best. to answer because it's time for definitely time for some self-awareness here for the individual asking this question. It sounds like you are, you know, a big, abrasive person that is aggressive and intimidates people. And I know what it's like to be that person because I could be, I could come across as intimidating. I know that. I can definitely come across as aggressive. I can be aggressive. I am aggressive in many ways. Abrasive, I don't know that necessarily

categorizes me because I'm very cautious about not being abrasive because if I'm being abrasive with people, am I building a relationship under making any progress? The answers obviously no. So something, the thing is, when I hear this type of question, I think that there's some little bit of insecurity going on here, right? Some little bit of, hey, that's not an insult. That's what I sense, because everyone's got insecurities. I do. Everybody does. And, but, but the fact that you ask this question, I'm hoping that that means you want to make some kind of improvement, right?

You want to get better. And, you know, I'm a little worried that you might just be looking for, like, reinforcement because people think, Jock was big and aggressive. So if I say, I'm big and aggressive, you know, Jock was just going to say, hey, those people are just scared of you and they don't deserve your mercy. Or, you know, you know what you knew? you use your intimidation factor to overrun those people, right? That might be what you're looking for, but you're not going to get that here. And the reason you're not going to get that here is because that's not going to help you.

It's not going to help you achieve your goals. And you talk about people being scared of you, but the fact likely is that you're the one that's scared. And you actually said it yourself that you don't want to appear. to be weak. You don't want to appear to be a bitch, right? That is that feeling. That's fear. It's fear of looking weak.

It's fear of looking wrong. It's fear of failure and it's fear of vulnerability. And those are real. Those are real. And if you're, you know, everybody should be feeling those fears at some level. but you have to overcome those fears. If you don't, then how are you ever going to step up? If you're too afraid to be wrong, how are you ever going to answer a question?

If you're too afraid to look weak, how are you ever going to expose any weaknesses? If you don't expose any weaknesses, well, just build a bunker around yourself and sit in there by yourself. So as a leader, we know that up and down the chain of command, you need to develop relationships. Right? That's what you're supposed to do. That means you need to communicate with people. That means you need to talk and you need to listen and you need to develop trust. And one of the best ways to develop trust with other people is by exposing some vulnerability. By saying, hey, echo, I'm not quite sure how to do this.

Or hey, echo, can you help me with this issue I have going on here? I don't know how to solve it. That's ways that you build trust. and thereby build relationships. And it's hard to do that because you don't want to look stupid, you don't want to look weak, you don't want to admit, you don't know something,

because you want to be Mr. Strong and know everything. And so you're probably putting up a front, an aggressive front and abrasive front. It's a wall to keep people intimidated. And then in your mind, you think it's not my fault it's their fault because they're scared of me it's their fault because i'm so intimidating so that is not good and then you get the your kind of closing statement should you just accept that i rub people the wrong way you can you can accept that you rub people

the wrong way but then you might as well accept right then and there that you're never going to be a true leader that you're never going to build any relationships that you're never going to inspire anybody and you're never going to be the leader of a badass, unified, high-performing team. Probably not earth it. And the better thing to do is to humble yourself, is to open yourself up to the pain and the discomfort of displaying weakness and error and failure. and open yourself up to try and be nice to other people. Instead of being scared of what's going to happen if you expose yourself, go ahead and throw

it out there. Pleasant to them so they talk to you without fear. And in doing those things, you can overcome whatever these insecurities are. And I don't know what insecurities you have. It could be any number of things. Maybe you don't think you're as smart as they are. Maybe you don't think you're as well educated as they are. Maybe you don't think that they have, you have the strategic vision that they have, whatever those insecurities are.

It's all good. We all got them. No big deal. But if you stop hiding them and you own them, you will become not only a better leader, but to become a better man. So, take a breath and get humble and take another crack at this gig. I think losing your temper is a huge red flag Like I've always said and always will say If you ever lose your temper

And I'm not saying screaming yell I'm just saying you're getting mad at displaying that anger Well what's really what's really What's really bad is when people Utilize their temper as a tool To scare and intimidate people So they go oh man I don't want to say anything to jocco on this Because he's going to lose his temper

Lose his mind go crazy Like that's that's me using it as a tool Which is not good Because you're not building any relationships You're not getting any input from people You're not respected by the way People might fear you if you have a bad temper But they don't respect you

They're not calling you up and asking you for advice They're not wanting you to run their Their project No And they're not motivated to do good by you when you're not around they are definitely not motivated to do good by you and you're not around in fact the only reason they do anything is out of fear yeah whereas if you have a relationship with them you could leave for six months and the people that know you and respect you and care about you and have

relations they're still busting their ass to do the best they can for you yep glad when you come back to yeah yeah and in a lot of times like so the adversarial relationship thing a way to look at it is it kind of takes both you to kind of cultivate an adversarial relationship goes for any kind of relationship by the yes and no well okay so here um you you keep being a dick to me we'll say and if i just keep being nice to you even though you're being a dick to me even though we have a job to do with yes all that and we're maintaining the integrity of that but i'm keep being nice to you you keep being a dick to me i keep being nice to you keep being a dick to me i keep being nice to you after a while the way that shakes itself out is

I'm being nice I just become the dominator Yeah no well here's the thing We're still getting the job done or whatever But my response to you if you be a dick to me Is not be a dick back or defend you know It's it's just be nice oh you know So where are you going to say it shakes out

As it shakes out The one guy who's a dick stands out So everyone's being cool And when all is said and done We're just dealing with one guy who's a dick so if you if if you cultivate the adversarial relationship it's like okay you have this competitive situation now two people you know are dick and two guys that are jerks yeah which you end up with yeah and let's say you were a nice guy to begin with don't become a jerk now you know

it's true so and i say that because a lot of times when if you're like hey people are creating adversary relationships with me you're going to play a part in that relationship you know Yeah, and the thing with this question, and, you know, I mean, even the terminology used, which is, you know, how do I maneuver on this without acting like a little bitch? Yeah, yeah. Literally, so you got to figure not, not, you know, not the most mature person. So I'm guessing, hey, man, you're probably 22, you know, 24, something like that, or you haven't matured a lot and you're 27, but you're still caught in that in that game. and I think a lot of times, you know, people when they, when they meet me or they, they learn about me or I show up at their business, they think I'm going to be that guy. That's like, we're going to just come in here.

And it's always really cool when people go, man, yeah, I didn't think of that. It's, oh, you have this approach that we didn't expect. And I'm like, yeah, you know, and by now, most people kind of, you know, at this stage and, at, When I show up somewhere, people have listened to the podcast. They know where I'm coming from now. But, you know, two years ago, you know, they expected this big sergeant slaughter type thing to go down. And whip these folks in the shape. Yeah, I'm going to whip these people in a shape.

And my guess is that the individual that asked this question was kind of thinking he would get some moral support for me. And I'm trying to give him moral support because I want him to be successful because I want him to go out and dominate in the world. But to go out and dominate in the world, you have to be a chess player. Not a checkers player. You got to think. You got to use the relationships. You got to use indirect warfare. To go out there and be blunt force trauma on everybody, it'll get you, it'll get you,

you know, it'll get you a quarter of the way there if you're lucky. And then it won't get you the rest of the way. So just, it's no big deal, man. You're young. You got some learning to do. That's awesome. I wish I would have been smart enough to ask this question when I was a young, stupid, 23-year-old. You got some, you're thinking, you recognize that you're in a situation.

So all you got to do is just start taking a different approach, a little bit more of an indirect approach, a little bit more of an open mind, a little bit more humility. Don't worry about looking weak. The people that are scared to look weak are the people that are weak. The people that are okay being exposed are the people that are strong. I'm totally comfortable with my leadership capabilities. So when I have an issue, I'm like, hey, I don't feel comfortable about this. I'm not worried that somebody's not going to say like, oh, well, we don't think you can handle this.

No, no, no, I actually, I know I can. I've been a worse situation, so what do you got? So if you're paranoid about looking weak, it means you probably are weak. If you don't care about being looking weak, it probably means that you're coming along. You're doing pretty good. Pretty solid.

Yeah. Check. So you don't need a hard shell if you have a hard core, but you need a hard shell if you have a soft core. Yes, that is true. Kind of thing. Yeah. Did you just make that up?

Yeah, but I mean, I'm not looking at it like, dang, that was deep. I'm not, I'm not thinking that. But that is a true statement. If you're fundamentally sound on the internal and the meaningful structure of your being, then you can withstand a tax. So you don't need to put up a big wall. Right, right. You know, but if you're fundamentally weak internally and the fundamentals of your,

of your being are weak, then you need to put up a big wall of protection. You need to go around and bow up to people and get aggressive. You may even need some weapons out there to really keep them away, you know? Some guns, some heavies or something. Nice. All right. Good. Next question.

We'd love to hear tips from moving to wake up earlier. Alarms and not disturbing your spouse. Keep an alert throughout the day. you know, when you wake up early, these are things. So tips for managing the implications around making that change to get up earlier while keeping the space, or keeping the piece at home and work and worky. Did you put that? I did not put that.

He had some, he either made a typo or he's on the inside. What that is, is that's an homage to the Portuguese accent. Yes. Well, no, it's a homage to the fake Portuguese accent. No. It's the real one. Worky? Yeah, well, anything adding like E at the end, like it'll come out. Oh, yeah, yeah. Yeah. It can be exaggerated though by certain people.

Right, right. Myself included. Okay, so, so how to wake up in the morning? Number one, let's talk about one important piece of this. How do you do it without disturbing a spouse? Because we don't want to, we don't want to make the spouse angry. No, no, adversarial relationships with the spouse at 430. No, not at 430. So one of the things, real, real easy one out of the gate, get an escalating alarm.

So what that means is it starts off quiet. Sure. And it gets louder. It gets progressively louder. I am a much lighter sleeper than my wife. So this is not that big of a deal to me. And I can't answer. I've slept with roommates that wanted to sleep, you know, like in the military, you know, you got bunk together or whatever.

So I've dealt with this a little bit. But it's really no factor. Get an escalating alarm. And then when that thing goes off, you wake up before it gets too loud to wake your spouse. It should be on your side of the bed so you can make it happen. Or you can pick a song that starts off nice and mellow and that kind of builds. And for a long time, for this particular reason, I used to have, there's a band called The Sword. Sure.

And they have a song called Iron Swan. And it starts off nice and mellow And if you don't get up in time It's coming So you got to So it's like a kind of like a game Within the game right there Where you got to beat the clock

Yes You got to beat the clock You gotta get up and turn that thing Because otherwise it's And then you're too late What is it? Black Swan? No Iron Swan

It's the sword By the sword Yeah Yeah Yeah Because there's times in my life where I will put like the ultimate shocker of a tune in my um playlist that if I need to get up and I need to get up and get on it like there's a song

called repeat process by 100 demons that song will get you out of bed it will get you out of bed when it kicks in it just comes it comes it's like it's like getting it's it's like an explosion happens in your room And it's a great song By a great band But anyways So if But in this case

You don't want to go with 100 demons No You don't want to go with Repeat Pop Process You want to go with The sword Iron Soan or

An escalating alarm Now Once you do that You gotta have the gear Pre-staged The gear has The morning gear Has to be pre-staged

So we're not in the dressing We're not pulling open drawers We're not flipping on lights We're not searching for stuff No We get up We walk out of the room quietly

stealth mode then you get to either the bathroom now if you have the bathroom on suite maybe you have some stuff staged in the other bathroom in the house

so you just walk right out of the room shut the door and you're good you made your escape you know oh and I'll tell you another thing a little heads up make sure that you set off your secondary

I mean that you turn off your secondary and your tertiary alarms so if you're like me and you sleep with multiple alarm clocks if you leave because they go off sequentially, right? You know, you got your first one, iPhone, then you got your second one, battery powered,

then you get your third one wind up. The wind up is the gnarly last one with the br-h-ha-r-r-r-hr-r-r-r-r-r-right. If you leave that thing, if you forget to shut that thing off before you walk out, you can hear about it. You can hear about it, because now when it goes off, it's a startler. Because it doesn't go off.

I mean, most, you know, 50% of the time I'm up before the alarms. But if you leave that one on there, it's a startler. And then you're spoutal. is waking up in a panic mode because now they don't know where it is there's effort they're being attacked it's it's a gnarly situation so shut off the secondary and tertiary alarms and then get out of the room and then you know maybe even have your toothbrush and your toothpaste staged in another in the another bathroom or in the kitchen or whatever got your workout gears not in a drawer by the bed where you're pulling that open making that racket no you just get up and you leave

So then that's how you do it. That's how I do it. And again, I have an advantage because my wife is a pretty heavy sleeper. She gets mad that when I come home from a trip late at night, I do some unpacking in the night. That can be a little frustrating for her. But anyways, that's what you do. Now, the next piece of this question was for alertness throughout the day. What do you do to stay alert throughout the day?

I think one of the things you've got to do is check your diet, right? Check the diet. Make sure, in my opinion, make sure you're not ingesting a ton of carbohydrates because those are going to make you tired. They're going to make you excited or make you fired up for about 20 minutes. I don't know. Haven't had them in a long time. 20 minutes before you eat them.

Like right when you actually, that's really what they're for. Yeah, yeah. Instant energy, yeah. Yeah. Yeah, well, and they put you to sleep. So when you, when you eat it, it's basically the really basic sequence is I'm going to do some output. You know, in the wild, I'm going to go hunting, whatever. You know, I'm going to gather, whatever.

Do some output that expended some energy. I'm going to need some energy and I'm going to need some rest. When you get the energy, carbohydrates, food, in any way, serotonin, all these other chemicals, that induce you to go rest. that's the sequence. That's the process. Don't forget about insulin. Yeah.

Because the insulin also gets you. The insulin is going to make you tired too. So check your diet. Check your diet. I just had a guy on Twitter. Oh, man. He's like, hey man, I'm tired during the day. I'm dragging.

I'm like, well, check your diet. He's like, well, I think it's okay. I'm drinking a lot of energy drinks. No, not good. The energy drinks are addictive. Yeah. They're tasty. They're addictive.

and they're filled with sugar most of the time. So you're going to get a major sugar rush and then you're going to crash. So you've got to be careful of that. Also, you don't want to be on the crazy amount of caffeine all day and that's going to mess up your system as well. Does the same thing as the sugar, the caffeine rush and then the crash. That's the same thing. Oh, yeah. Even more than sugar.

Yeah. And I'll tell you right now, people ask me all the time. surprise that I work out without caffeine in the morning. But I'm telling you, give it a try. Yeah. Because it'll be harder. Maybe it's harder for you to get out of bed. Maybe it's harder for you to get ready. Maybe it's harder for you to get into the gym with no caffeine. And maybe it's harder for you to start your workout with no caffeine. But once you start the workout, I don't think it's going to be that big of a deal. Yeah. And if it is, good. Make your workout harder. You know, I don't think it's that big of a deal.

So don't become addicted to the caffeine, and that's going to be, because that can get problematic. And then, power nap, talked about this before. If you need to, you take a little power nap. You take six to eight minutes. You set your alarm clock. You elevate your feet above your heart. You lay down, and you black out. If you're really tired, six to eight minutes, you feel like, you feel like a rock star after one of those.

You don't agree. And another thing you can do if you're tired during the day? No big deal. Just find a little corner somewhere. Go bang some push-ups out. Go bang out. 10 burpees. Yeah, yeah.

Get the blood flowing back. Just get the blood flowing. Yeah. There's no way. It's, it's, it's, it's, physiologically impossible to do burpees and, and remain tired. Whatever burpees, you can tell you, since you turned into a physiology major over here tonight, if you want to tell me what that does physiologically, I don't know, but I do know this.

If you knock out 10 burpees. This is a small prescription? You will not be tired for at least a half an hour. You're not going to be 10 burpees and then feel tired. You can't do it. I can tell you why physiologically. Endorphins get released. Other stuff.

Adrenaline. Like when you know you're going to do physical activity, when you know it, you have a, I'm not saying a huge adrenaline rush. Just a little bit. You get an adrenaline rush, yeah. A little bit. It's still going. It's part of it.

So that's, those are some tips, I guess, for alertness throughout the day. that I use. Yeah, there you go. And for getting out of bed early in the morning. Hey, and by the way, go to bed earlier at night. Yeah. Go to bed earlier at night. I go to bed like usually around 11.

I don't recommend that. I don't recommend going to bed at 11 and getting up at 4.30. No, I don't recommend that. I recommend going to bed when you get tired. Shut your computer off. Stop looking at the interwebs. Yeah. And go to sleep.

You know what? Go read an actual book because that make you tired. Yeah. That will make you tired. That's like the opposite of burp. piece. Go read a book, you know, and just sit there and you will get more tired. Yeah.

Unless it's like a real exciting or interesting book. Yeah. Whoa. I want to read some more. Of course. Of course. Don't read Blood Meridian before you go to bed. And you're a, because you're a fast sleeper, fast sleeper.

Yeah. You know that thing. Or you don't need that much sleep. But yeah. Yeah. Yeah. Yeah. Then no sleep thing, that'll get you so quick.

It'll promptly put you into a crash the next day. Yeah. I don't know, you can power through, well, I don't know. If I can go the next, man, even when you had the latest little baby, you came in here on a couple hours sleep, you were like rolled in here, ready to record, you sat here, you got after it. Yeah, it's true. And there's all these different little things you can do.

Doesn't that make you realize? Yeah. It makes you realize how much more you can do. I think a lot of people, it's like this. And I don't want to go into this full subject right now, but the other day I did a 72-hour fast, right? No food for 72 hours. and there's a bunch of reasons we could talk about it.

Maybe we'll do it on a later podcast. I will say this, though, one small thing. If you go 72 hours without eating, it recalibrates your hunger meter. Because we just think, oh, I haven't had a donut in two hours. I'm starving. No, you're not starving. You're not even hungry, not even close to hungry. So recalibrate that thing, do a fast.

even if you just don't eat for 24 hours, you realize that most of your hunger signals that are coming to your brain are lies. And I'm not saying there are lies like, oh, don't eat, but I'm saying you don't need to eat. And how liberating is it? I was having so much fun,

I was on this fast, and I'm just like, don't even need food. I don't need food. I don't need to eat. That's the ultimate control, right? I don't need food. Food is if you're weak. You know what I mean?

It's that type of, you get that mental. mentality going and then guess what now you go on a travel day and you go oh man I'm going to be in the airport all day today and I don't know what I'm going to eat don't eat don't eat anything you're capable you're capable you can go 72 hours as a matter of fact you can go like 30 days without food so going three days is not that big of a deal it's not even that big of a deal yeah I did when I just did this 72 hour fast it was just not like I did everything normal I went to jiu jitzu I worked out I did squats it did pull-ups everything was normal

everything was normal it's not that big crazy deal just we just get so accustomed to to just feed in the machine all the time and you gotta have a you know you got to have a meal every six hours and it's so at our fingertips yeah it's so but it's also you this is what i realize it's so inconvenient to have to have to have to work to eat all the time i know man you know it's whack you're right so it's kind of nice to just eat i know once a day just have put a big old steak on and get after it yeah i mean and again i hate there's all kinds of people and there's people that there's people that know this is one of the reasons I don't like talking about this particular topic um it's because there's a lot of people that like study this and know a bunch about this and they'll pull all these facts so me if I go and do the research well I know the facts too but I don't I can't I'm not considering quote them right I don't have the in-depth knowledge that Peter Atia has on fasting you know what I mean yeah or Dom Daghastino those guys they're ph their doctors I'm not a doctor I'm a knucklehead

That was and in other things people What you know what did you do to prepare for your fast? I was like I didn't eat Yeah I was I was with Laif and we were on a trip and we had like a lunch And then we did a gig that night And I like to eat before I do a gig And then after that

We stayed up a little bit and did some work And then woke up in the morning at an early flight And then I came home and I wanted to train So I worked out and I got done with that And I went and did something else And the next thing I knew it was 24 hours Like oh you know what The next day I didn't feel too hungry

So I just held on. So it wasn't no preparation. Just got after it. Again, people, don't do this. This is anecdotal. Check with a physician or whatever you got to do. Don't listen to me. Yeah, as far as like a recommendation you should do.

Because, you know, you are different. And 72 are fast. I dig it, man. But I think really kind of the point that you're making, or one of them anyway, I think is absolutely true. So you're, you know, a lot of it is like habitual hunger. but it goes beyond just like psychological habit. It's like physiological.

It's like, okay, I'm used to getting food every four hours. So when the four hour mark comes around physiologically, your stomach can be like, where's my food? You're mounting me, where am I food? And then after a while, if you're like, hey, you don't get food this time, your stomach's is going to go, okay, sometimes we don't get food. Yeah. So let's kind of act right, you know.

And then when the food comes, okay, we'll do that when that happens. The recalibration is real, though, because then after I started eating again and then the next day, I go, oh, I'm feeling hungry. I'm going to eat something. I'm actually not hungry. So why am I eating? Why am I eating if I'm not hungry? Yeah.

My mind is controlling me when I should be controlling my mind. Yeah. So and that's another thing where you're, there's nothing new, right? Your mind is so strong or whatever. So you can trick yourself and this goes for sleep too. So if you think that you got nine hours of sleep, you'll be way less tired. Then, okay, let's say two people, exact people. They're identical to him.

Identical life experience, whatever. One guy believes the next morning, okay, they both got. eight hours sleep one guy believes he only got four hours sleep and one guy believes he got 10 hour sleep typical placebo scenario yeah but that's how your mind it knows like basically it's your mind accommodating what it thinks the stimulus is so so the other twin the four hour sleep believer he's going to be way more tired and he's going to be like dang where's that nap i was looking for and i need or whatever the other guy imagine if you woke up every day and you were like i only got four hours of sleep and i'm going to crush today exactly right i actually believe i work better

on less sleep how you like them apples exactly exactly and that's really that's what was going to be my point there where you're like you told you i've told you that before yeah i've so so i've told echo before that when we're getting ready to record the podcast the day before i record the podcast that night i like to sleep less like four hours because i feel like it sharpens i'll tell you what To be quite honest, what I think it does, it brings my emotions a little closer to the surface. So, like, you feel like, I'm kind of under attack, so I better, like, I better, like, harden up right now. I better, like, get my troops ready. No, it's not that.

It's like, no, this is what it is. I can get more, like, when I'm reading something, I'm more focused on it. I'm more into it. Like actively? Yeah, because I think when I'm well-rested, I'm like a rock solid, right? Oh, yeah. When I'm a little, when I sleep less, I'm a little bit more exposed. I'm a little bit more vulnerable, right?

Mentally. Right. And I need that. Right, right. Because otherwise, I just become very detached. I become very detached. And it's, you know, so I want it. When I come in here, I want to be on the, I want to be on the fringe of life.

little bit. You know what I mean? I want to be exposed. I want to be walking in here being like, man, this is going to be, this is an intense thing. This is not a walk in the park today. No. This is going to be hard. So I want to, yes, I want to be stressed a little bit when I come in here. Yeah, I can dig it. And I feel, I always feel like, like, like, it's the same thing in jihitsu. I feel better when I'm stressed and when I'm a little bit more, yeah, a little bit more stressed, a little bit more tension, a little bit more pressure on myself. I want to be there. I don't want to be there all the time. And I'll tell you what, just so everybody knows there's some days where I'm tired

where I'm just tired and I just sometimes I just need a power nap so bad I'm gonna I'm literally falling asleep you know and I hate that that's a horrible feeling but you you know what elevate your feet set of the long o'clock for eight minutes boom you're gonna wake up feeling like super bad it's kind of like when people hit themselves before they go lift because it wages you mean they like slap themselves

yeah for sure so it on the surface looks like oh he's getting fired up but yeah why is he getting fired up for the exact same reason that you're talking about because if it's like like i'm getting these things where i got to kind of bounce back from right i'm under attack you're a legitimate adrenaline rush too right so physiologic it's the same exact sequence right there but you're just doing it consciously and instead of slaps it's lack of sleep yes or what have you there you go that's um the answer and everyone that's going to attack me on social media for not sleeping, not eating, and all that.

Yeah. Yeah. Well, sorry. I don't know. I don't know what to tell you. Do it. Hey, Chocco. I appreciate your advice.

I know I should, I do know I should sleep more. I do know I should eat, you know, better. I'm sorry. What does that even mean? I don't even know. Should. The word should. What does that even mean?

You should. It's, yeah. Anyway, that's the whole night. A, Jocco, don't be you anymore. Well, that's true. A, be different than you. That's what that. Well, actually, actually,

Actually, the point out, what I was going to say earlier is just like what you're saying, like, you're not citing all this science and making claims about, like, how this is going to benefit you or nothing like that. That's not what you're doing. It is anecdotal. And I think the point is that if you push yourself through certain situations and you prove it to yourself that you can function just fine with, I don't know, five hours sleep rather than eight, one or two times or whatever, or however many,

you know that you can do that. Like, you know, we talked about this before where you get, it kind of depend on certain things. And then to the point where you believe that you can't function without it, whether it be sleep, whether it be coffee in the morning, you know, whatever, or eating every four hours. Like when I was really into like weightlifting and bodybuilding type stuff, I remember thinking, man, I got to, I got to hurry up and eat. It's four hours or whatever.

And then kind of later on in life, man, I've got like, I haven't eaten yet today. And it's late in the day. I'm fine. You're not. I'm not losing my games. Yeah. whatever games but gains game whatever yeah so once you prove it to yourself it's like if you stay up all night when you have worked the next day and you do your work when you go to bed you can be like hey

if i had to i could do that again that is another thing that i enjoy about pushing those envelopes is it feels really good to go to bed when you've been awake for a long time it feels really good to eat a meal once you haven't eaten for for a while you you appreciate it more yeah that's that's good that's true but that's kind of a psycho way of of of invoked appreciation. Okay. In my opinion. Understood.

Next question. Oh, back to the Iron Swan. That's it. Yeah. That's the song. Just a reminder. Give it a try. The sword.

The sword. Next question. What's the best way to handle awful random people? Say, a bunch of intimidating thugs on a bus or a violent, scary drunk person. Well, and there's even more awful random people out there that you, might need to look out for. I think this is a, you know, obviously you've got people that are pointed criminals that are coming after you. You've got terrorists that might be coming after you or just trying to do random acts of mass violence. So those are, those are a particular type.

I think that this is a question directed for more of, of something that could easily happen to people, right? Random people that are being jerks or thugs or people that are drunk or higher or whatever else. Okay. So obviously, what do we want to do? We want to be prepared. So to start with, you want to be in really good physical condition. So that means you want to work out.

You want to be ready to handle yourself physically. You want to know how to fight. That means you need to train, Jiu-Jitsu, boxing, Muay, wrestling. You, if you're in a high crime area, you're in a high threat area, and you think this stuff is really going to happen out there, then guess what? You need to get a firearm. You need to learn how to shoot a firearm. You need to train with the firearm.

You need to understand the ramifications of utilizing a firearm, and then you need to carry it so you can protect yourself. And those same things go if you decide you're going to carry any kind of weapon. Whether it's pepper spray or a mace or an asp or a knife, anything that you're going to carry, you better know what you're doing. You need to prepare with it. So that's what you need to do to be prepared. Okay? That's what, and you know, I've said this before. I said it on the Sam Harris podcast. If you, if you do these things, if you work on your physical condition, if you work on your fighting, if you work on your shooting, if you work on your, your weapon skills,

and you never have to use them, great. I will still say it has not been waiting. You know, wasted time. It has been time that has made you a better person. It's imposed discipline on you. It's gotten you better physical conditioning. It's just good for you. So regardless, you should be training in these type of situations. Now, once you get to this type of situation, first of all, how did you get there? Because we need to have situational awareness, right? How are you not paying attention to what's going on around you? You need to pay attention to what's going on around you. and then you watch for these scenarios that could unfold and you avoid them, period. So how are you getting stuck on a bus with a bunch of maniacs, right?

There's something, when they got on, you got off. That's real simple, right? Or you go to get on and you see these knuckleheads, you walk right back off. I mean, that's pretty easy handle. Oh, there's a bunch of knuckleheads walking down the street towards you. Cool, cross the street, walk down the other side. Situational awareness. Oh, you hear them coming up behind you?

Cool. Step off. Cross the street. avoid we want to be have situation awareness that's going to solve that should solve 99% of your problems is being aware of your surroundings understanding your situation planning what about just simple planning like where are you going when are you going to come home you know if you took a subway into the city at night and you know you're going to coming home late at night and you're alone and you are suspect of what's happening

maybe you get an Uber instead of ride in the subway. It's just planning that comes into play as well to avoid these situations. Now, if you do get caught in these situations, here's a couple recommendations. Okay, my number one is to kind of do your best to detach from the scenario. Right? So you got, let's say you're on a bus, and there's a bunch of people acting crazy, and they jumped on right after you got on and you couldn't get off in time. So now you're on the bus with them.

I want you to detach from them. So that means you're not looking at them. You're not staring at them. You're not being all intimidated. You want to just detach. Just do what you would normally do. You know, everyone carries a phone these days. Break out your phone.

Start looking at your phone. Pull out your paper. Start looking at your paper. Study if you don't have either one of those two, you know, look outside, look at the passing. Just don't. enter their world. Don't become a part of their thing that they have going on. Because what they want you to do is they want you to make eye contact.

What they want you to do is glance over at them. What they want you to do is enter their world. Because a lot of times these knuckleheads, they're in their own world. And you actually have to penetrate their world if you want to get in there. So what you want, so what I'm going to do is I'm just going to remain. I'm not going to, I'm not going to cower, though. There's a difference. Okay.

Because if you give the impression of you're just like cowering and scared, well, then that's entering their world. And they're going to recognize that. But if you're just, hey, sitting here just doing what you normally doing, it's not a big deal. You do this all the time. You don't care about them. Don't care about me. Leave me alone.

That's where I'm going. Now, if, for whatever reason, I make some kind of eye contact, right? Now I made the eye contact. I've entered their world. I'm going to go ahead and give them just a little head nod. You know, just a little regular head nod like I would do with you. If I saw you on the street, hey, you know, just a little respectful, little head nod. And then I'm going to go right back to what I was.

doing. I'm go right back out of their world. I acknowledge their world. I'm not going to give a bunch of I'm not going to look scared, but I'm not going to look aggressive. I'm just going to be respectful. A little head nod, you know, hopefully you're having a good night. It's good. And then go back to your business. Again, I just want to detach from them. That's my attitudes I want to detach from them. And this avoids them saying, you know, like if they're looking at you and you don't look back or they're just like bearing down on you, hey, what do you? You know, Hey, why aren't you? Why are you ignoring me or whatever?

You too cool for me or something like that. So sometimes you get, you know, look, a little head nod. It's all good. If, now if they do start, now see, I'm escalating this. So they're escalating this. So now if they do start to escalate this thing in like, like, you know, what are you looking at? Are one of those things? It's just, again, what you're trying to do is you're trying to de-escalate without being appearing vulnerable.

You know? So maybe it's just, you know, Hey, no issue here. You know, just something simple like that. No, I'm good. Like, what are you doing? Just riding the bus home. You know what I mean?

Just real matter of fact. Just didn't go try and get back. You know, you might want to just even try and connect a little connection instead of I'm trying to go home because that might piss some people off because they don't have a home or their home is a bad place. So what might be better than saying that is, you know, I just got done with work. Now you're just a working man. right of course you might be dealing with someone that doesn't have a job or lost their job so I'm saying

you're not going to come up with a great but my point here is just you're just going to try and make simple non-confrontational statements that don't give them anything to grab onto because that's what they want they want something they just want something to grab onto you know uh that's what they're looking for so you don't want to let that happen now things can still continue to escalate You know, you get someone that's determined to be a jerk or determined to be hostile or determine to be aggressive. Now, I'll tell you that if you train and you work out and you do jiu-jitsu and you have skills, people know it. People that are belligerents generally can tell. Even in a drunken state, when you square off with someone or you look at someone and they have an added.

of like, look, I do this all the time. I'm good. You want to fight? I'm here. Not saying that, but just a look. And people can tell. If they're real troublemakers, they can tell. Now, sometimes that's not a good thing,

because that means they're going to do the challenge, you know? So you got to watch out for that. So I think that that's right. Even though on the internet, it might seem like it's telling a different story. You know, it's like, oh, guy confronts the wrong. wrong guy, you know, the guy street thug confronts Jiu-Jitsu master or something, and then it shows that they actually fought. So it kind of seems like, oh, no, they don't know, obviously out there.

No, they, but that's rare, man. And that's why it makes the internet. So it's rare. Typically, yeah. And this is no guarantee. But I'm just saying, I could tell, even before I started doing Jiu-Jitsu, I could tell if somebody was ready to rumble. I have acted like I was ready to rumble, no-fight training to a guy who was belligerent

to me directly. Right. Terry was there. We were working. And all I did was act like I knew. Yeah. I didn't know, by the way. Act like I knew.

And in front of everybody, I was like, oh, hey, I'm sorry, man. It's my bad. There is. A little bit bigger than me, too. And he just said, but I was ready to, I was ready to do the best fighting I could because it was kind of go time at that point. Yeah. He was like, you know the kind of guy where he's talking?

He's like, yeah, man, I'm from Chicago. And he's like rubbing against me in my face kind. Not like, I want to fight you, but just like, like, almost like, a dog would, you know, and rubbing against me. And then whatever, you know, I made like, okay, we're about to fight. Took on my jacket like real quick or whatever. And, um, and it was like, all right. Like, just go, just like how you're saying, though, just real matter of fact. Real matter of fact. You know, yeah. You do this all the time. Yep. And, and the thing, I understand that it is on right now. Understand. And then the guy and he surprisingly, it's not surprising. Hey,

hey, my bad, my bad, my bad. My bad. My bad. In front of everybody. It's not surprising because people that act like that are weak and they're insecure and they're acting on that and so when somebody stands up to them and they look at them and think this guy might actually know how to fight then that's what happens and by the way

when you do train all the time you do know how to and then it is matter of fact you're like yeah I'll fight you yeah hold on it's a best feeling in the world it's a good feeling to know that you can handle yourself now okay so now this continues to escalate and

you know, you just try and keep your distance from people. You don't want to let them get close. You don't know they got a knife. You don't know what kind of disease they just want to keep away from them. Yeah. But eventually you might not be able to back up anymore. You might not be able to keep any distance. Watch their hands.

Keep as much distance as you can. Eventually, you've got to put your hands up in kind of a non-confrontational way to protect your face, to protect the soccer punch that's coming. You know, you put your hands up just in a non-confrontational way, up around your head, and continue to de-escalate. Hey man, I'm not here. Don't want to have any problems. You know, I'm not looking for an issue.

I don't know what your issue is, but I don't have any issue with you. I'm just trying to head home from work. You know, one of those things. And finally, if you get to a point where you have no choice, well, then you utilize the skills that you have. You hit hard, hit fast. You don't stop hiding until the threat is neutralized. And then you get away. And that's...

in order to be able to do that, you know, go to step one, prepare. Yeah, that's, you're, the 99% of situations

will be avoided if you're just aware. Most important thing. Man, that's, most important thing. Yeah, that's a huge deal.

So true. Yeah, we would much rather have you do that because any of these situations, I could go out, I'm pretty well prepared for anything. I could go out tonight and have some guy

square off with me. And as I'm getting ready to fight him, his buddy cracks me in the head with a, with a bottle and kills me. That could happen tonight. Yeah. You know, that could happen at a restaurant tonight. That could happen. So what am I going to try and do? I'm trying to avoid it.

The minute you square off with somebody, you're now, you're now a target for all his friends. By the way, I've been in some bar fights where the idiot that is being belligerent doesn't have the common sense or doesn't have the sense that he's surrounding. Yeah, yeah. By, you know, by my friends. Yeah. And you're just thinking, you don't even, you're doomed. Yeah. So, luckily, the guys that I hang out with are pretty honorable people that aren't just

going to, you know, crush somebody's skull. But you don't always, that's no guarantee. That's no guarantee. There's murders every day in America. Yeah, man. And they're not planned, all of them. Seldom are they planned? This guy on Facebook, I want to say.

I think I always get confused with the name because like a lot of people will be like hey echoes you know and ask me questions in in regards to this podcast so I want to be the other podcast oh this podcast I don't want to be like okay he asked me but no it was yeah anyway so a guy asked me like this scenario was he was at a bar or party or something and and guys were being disrespectful to him and his wife or a girlfriend or something and then he's like I know the high road I know the right thing to do, quote unquote, is to be done with it, you know, to leave the situation. But when you leave, you feel like a little, you know, like you worst out. And that's a really powerful feeling that you don't want. So like, what do you do, man? How do you just, how do you reconcile it? Or should I fight or under certain circumstances? Should I just fight for the honor kind of thing? Like, what's the thing? And so I've always really looked at it this way, especially if you're kind of like, if you have mental kind of control over the situation where you can be like, okay am I going to fight like fight this guy or what so when you choose to engage you want to fight

the guy you're going to say you know what you said the wrong thing to me and I'm going to square off or to my wife or whatever you know so I'm going to choose to square off now all you did you did use you took on all the potential results of that you took all that on even if you win the fight you get arrested like everything as opposed to taking on all the potential results probably you know it would that come with not engaging which includes going home safe, your wife's safe, everybody's safe, wake up tomorrow just like you would the other day

and then compare that to jail. I'm injured in some way. I can't, you know, I can function less tomorrow, if I even make it home tomorrow, you know, death, all this stuff. When you kind of consider the outcomes that you want and the reason you're going to make one decision

over the other, it kind of, it comes real clear, even though at the time it's so powerful because you're like, oh man, I don't want to what's out in front of everybody. or my wife, you know, it's my honor in front of my wife. But your wife wants you to leave. Your wife doesn't want you to be like, hey, my husband got in a bar fight.

Woo-hoo. Like, I'm so proud of him, you know? No, your kids are like, I'm glad you're home, dad. Yeah. I'm glad you're not in the hospital. That's another thing that comes with, I think, with training all the time is we all know where we stand. Yeah.

Like, I mean, if there's a person that's going to beat me in a bar fight, I know him. Like, it's a famous fighter. It's a famous jiu-jitsu player. It's someone that is a known public figure. gear that is known for fighting that's like who's going to give if it's a civilian that doesn't train i mean they don't they're they're not going to stand a chance now if four of their friends jump in of course you're not some issues well but yes yes the uh the best thing to do is

avoid but does your wife when your wife knows that you train every day that you get after it every day that you're physically fit physically strong and knows that you could destroy that person, does she look down on you when you walk out of there? No, she's like, well, I'm glad I married an actual man instead of an idiot. Right. And it's not, do that big of people, like, hey, bro, if you want to fight, here, come to this gym. I'll be there tomorrow at 10 o'clock. We'll go, but I'm not going to fight out here and get arrested by, you know, and sued by you after I put you to sleep. And then I make it so you can't use your arms anymore. Yeah. Forever. Yeah. And even that, I mean, really, let's really admit it, even,

doing that like hey you want to fight I do want to fight you right but I you know I'm a smart fighter so even that that's like that's a little boy move yeah exactly as far as moves go although hey look I'm not if someone does that and post it on the internet or something like that come on let's face it we all want to see that a part of us wants to see that I'm saying yeah you know see the bully get beat up yeah yeah it's pretty common but really at the end of the day that's not the decision the decision isn't you're right because it goes back when I said that earlier question. If you're secure in your manhood,

then it's not that big of a deal to go, dude, you're drunk, carry on, I'm out of here with my wife, we're going to go back to our house and carry on with our lives like normal people. You can find another person to get in a drunk fight with and end up in jail. Let me ask you this. You can be honest. Even as

a full-grown, secure man, if you found yourself in that scenario and you're like, not me and my wife were going to go home. There's still a small party. Of course.

Oh, I'm sure what I just. Well, especially when you enjoy fighting. Yeah. You know what I mean? When fighting is fun. And actually,

you know, one of the guys at the gym who's, um, brown about Mike, he doesn't train much when you're there. Anyways. Yeah. Mike.

Yeah. Dude, he's, he usually goes in the morning. Yeah. He's usually there. But anyway, anyways,

um, he had somebody like say something to, no, somebody somebody like smacked his girlfriend's ass like what like he brought his girlfriend into the bar yeah and he does moitai of course he's jih Tiber he's a badass dude um he walks in the bar and this guy just straight up just bam slaps his girlfriend's ass and he like turned around boom one two to the head drop the guy knee to the face out was like yep boom got arrested He paid $8,000 or something and did like 72 hours in jail.

I mean, it was, it was legit. Like, and he, and he talks about it. I mean, just to show you like a different, and that's why, like, his attitude, you know, I talked to him about it. He's like, yeah, you know, the guy crossed the line and then I had to put him down. Yeah. And I was like, yeah, okay. Yeah, and that's an awesome story. By the way, it gives me like a, for real, like, fuck, Mike, you're the man.

But, but let's face it, though, that wasn't the right move as far as before you do it. Yeah. I mean, you're right, because we don't know what could have happened. Yes. We know what the actual outcome was, and it was like $8,000. You know. And his wife, girlfriend. Girlfriend.

Okay. Just his girlfriend. Don't mess with Mike's girl, man. Well, I'm just saying if you have a wife and then on top of it, if you have like a kid's, the $8,000 scenario seems more detrimental. Yeah, that's true. But, you know, so I'm saying this is why you treat people with respect. Yeah. You know?

Because otherwise, you never know who you're messing with. And Mike doesn't look like he's a big, intimidating guy by any chance. What does he weigh? 170? I'm thinking of a different guy. I realize it. Mike's 170. He's a tough bastard, too.

I mean, on the mat, he's tough. But he's, he's like 170. And you know what? He's a brown mountain jit-to, really good with a ghee, and he wrestled. Like, he wrested in high school. So, yeah, and he trained more tight. So he's just a tough dude. Yeah.

And you don't know who you're messing with. And boom. But the interesting thing is. is and you know this I know this when you make eye contact with another person in a situation like that you already know if they train or not you're like oh this guy trains for sure I'm in for it you know this is going to be it's going to be on you know that's awareness from the training yeah but still awesome story don't do that yeah yeah I know don't do what Mike did yeah but Mike keep it up though just kidding just kidding yeah no Mike don't do it again yeah don't mess with Mike's girl

Jocko, were you very disciplined as a kid? And was there a set day or moment when you saw how important discipline was and decided to do it? Well, as a kid, I think I was, for the most part, a kid. I was not some extremely disciplined kid. I was I was pretty stubborn when it came to certain things, which may be some kind of an early immature form of discipline, you know, just being hard-headed. But I think as I got older, I saw the first thing I remember along these lines

is seeing a lack of discipline around me. I didn't identify it as people having discipline. I saw like a lack of discipline. I saw weakness. I saw drugs. I saw alcohol. I saw laziness. And I started to get after it a little bit, right?

A little bit, a little tiny bit. But there was no role models. There was no internet. There was no guidance. And I didn't have the sense to go to the library and find Bob Hoffman's book, how to be happy, healthy, and strong. Like, I didn't know to do it. I didn't have sense to do that.

And so we did some basic things. You know what I mean? Some push-ups. You know, and the push-up workouts that I did when I was 13 years old are laughable. Laffable. I mean, I think if I did, you know, a set of 50 push-ups, I was corner, you know, boom, I'm the man, right? No, you are the man, 13. Yeah.

And we did some silly little, like, kind of barbell, dumbbell circuit training kind of thing. Now, I always liked the military. I recognize that as a, some kind of. of a trade of discipline in there and I looked up to military veterans I knew one Marine Corps drill instructor and if you know anything about Marine Corps drill instructors so now we're talking 85 86 87 there wasn't any wars going on but you know when you're a kid you're just like oh he's a Marine Corps drill instructor he fit the part he was like just perfect Marine Corps boat drill instructor which

most Marine Corps drill instructors are pretty damn perfect it's incredibly incredibly honed job that's very well choreographed and very and very structured and it's a very fine

um it's real tight it's a real tight situation if you could Marine Corps drill and I knew one right when I was a kid and I just looked he was like a god right this guy is a Marine Corpser and and of course he had

I think he had like a 68 Camaro so he had a muscle car so you know he was just Like just the man and so now so I got that going on and then Then there was the hardcore bands that I started listening to and they seemed to have some kind of There was something there right I recognized something there I recognized something with black flag I recognized something with Band called Slapshot, I recognized something with the chrome mags and I saw there was something in there and I and I I didn't know what it was, but it was some kind of strength, right?

Some kind of discipline was in there. I didn't put it all together, though. And there was no sort of unified way to go down this path. I didn't, I didn't find that. And I don't know if I found it, what it would look like to me. You know, maybe you could say that that path was the voice. Scouts, right? The Boy Scouts are a disciplined group of individuals that learn how to hike and hunt and I mean, so was that it? I don't know. Maybe I didn't identify that or I didn't have the right personality because I was kind of nonconformist, right? A little bit, you know, a little bit of a rebel. So I didn't put it all together.

And I had some little flashes of like being hardcore with some of the things I did that would be like, you know, kind of getting after. in some really minor way, some minimalistic level of discipline. But it wasn't until I started training in earnest to join the Navy that I started to what we could recognize now as getting after it a little bit. You know, and again, it's nothing compared to what people do now. What definitely not, but you know, now we're talking 1989. I was running through marshes and being covered. mud and I was swimming in the ocean and I was doing pull-ups and push-ups and dips and sit-ups.

And again, it's nothing compared to what I do now or even what everybody does now. But I was doing what I could with what I knew at the time. And I didn't really have any idea of what I or really what people in general were capable of. Like I just didn't know. I didn't know I never would have thought. a good pull-up workout is 500,000 pull-ups. I wouldn't have fought that. You know, for me, I did three sets of pull-ups,

and I was kind of a man, you know. So I just, I just didn't, didn't know. And I guess, I guess you could say I didn't even have, I didn't know to even explore those, those outer limits of what I was capable of, you know, which is a bummer. um now i don't see you gotta remember i didn't even know another person that did pull-ups like

there wasn't like pull-up bars around it wasn't uh you know i'm out in the woods somewhere in the woods in new england there's no pull-ups people people aren't like hey how many pulps can do i never heard that question oh and i didn't know anybody that swam in the open ocean i didn't know anybody that did push up workouts right i don't know i was just in the sticks. And so when I joined the military, I was a blank slate, really, for all practical purposes. And it was really easy. They say, you do this.

This is what you do. And you get advanced. This is what you do to be ready. This is what you do. And I realized very quickly that the harder you worked, that the more disciplined you were, the easier your life was. The easier your job was, the easier your physical activities would get. And when I got to the teams, and really going through buds, when you're going through buds,

and when I finally met guys that were going to buds, and we started doing 100 pull-ups, and we started doing 150 pull-ups. We started doing 200 pull-ups to work out. And then it was like, oh, wow, you can do a lot of stuff. That was getting ready to go to buds, and then you go to buds. And, you know, you realize that people, it's not just this individual, like, spiritual awakening. Like, no, you just realize, hey, you can do a lot of pull-ups. People can't.

It's not that big of a deal. And everybody knows. You can find that out on the, you don't need to go to buds to figure that out. You can figure that out. Just I'm telling you right now. You know what I mean? And all you need is to have that knowledge. But I continue to realize that being disciplined,

all these things waking up earlier and working hard and training hard and keeping your gear squared away and studying the material that we were supposed to know, I realize that that work, that discipline made life easier. And it made us freer. Made me freer. And the more. time I spent in the teams, the more this came embedded in my head

and not only as an individual did I realize this, but I realized this very quickly. Not very quickly, but as soon as I started moving in the leadership positions, I realized that the more disciplined a squad was, or the more disciplined a platoon was the better that

squad or that platoon was going to be. And that's kind of the evolution. The evolution of it. You know, man, it's that whole process that I'm finally, I don't want to say finally, but right now it's starting to become clear where the whole, you know, you're going to pay the price. At some point, you're going to pay the price for your actions. So if you're going to prepare, like let's say, I'm going to get in shape, right?

you committing to working out every day, that's you paying a certain price. Having the discipline to do it, you're going to pay the price. Waking early, it's not comfortable. Working out hard every day, it's not comfortable. You're going to pay a little price right there. The next day or in regards to the results of that workout,

you're not paying the price. You're reaping kind of rewards. Or you cannot pay the price early with the workout and stuff. You still got a, that tab is still outstanding. So when you balance due. Yeah. So when it comes results time, that's when you're going to pay your little price there. Your body, your health, whatever.

At some point, you're going to have to pay a price. Pay now or pay later. Yeah, man. So. I vote pay now. Pay now? You get way more benefit. Because like no one remembers.

Well, we do. Some of us do. I don't remember and take pleasure in remembering the time I skip that workout. because I wasn't feeling like doing it, you know? Like that doesn't provide a sense of pleasure in my life to think back on those days, you know? Yeah, it's not good. And at the same time, when I think of like the detriment of doing the workout when I didn't feel like it, that doesn't, that's not a bad memory to me, you know, when I do think back of like,

or think even now of like the result of being in better shape than the, you know, the average person or going to judicious and not gassing or whatever, bringing in all the groceries at one time. Let's face it, that's something. That is a sense of pleasure that I have the freedom to be able to do that when I want, you know? Yeah. And you know what else is interesting about this? And sometimes I hear this. And you did this a couple times tonight, right?

People go, well, yeah, but you're jock. Like, as if I'm not a normal person. But I'm not, but, yeah, but I'm saying, like, you know, I just kind of went through, like, the story. And it paints a pretty clear picture that I'm a pretty normal person. Yeah. Right? Yeah. It's pretty normal.

But I made decisions along the way that maybe weren't normal. And that maybe opened the doors to being a little bit not normal. Yeah. But there are choices that you can make. So I'll have this with my kids too. Or you know who else? Sometimes I'll have them. I would have friends.

will say sure that would say you know well yeah you're that's you you know like I'd say no if you want to win this fight for instance you want to win this fight man you gotta you gotta do this you gotta get after this

you got any of it well you know it's not that easy and and that's that's what you would do but you're you're you and that's you know it's almost like it's unachievable yeah it doesn't apply to me

and my kids will say that to me you know my kids and I think it's actually a pretty big detriment that they think that I'm not that that oh I do it but but that's because I'm me and I'm you know it's like not true it's not true and so you know occasionally I have I hear people say that and I go man this isn't like I guess it's kind of like what we were talking about the other day with someone saying oh oh that's a good picture you took what kind of camera did you use? Well, it's kind of like that. I'm like, you know, oh, I wake up early. It doesn't,

it's not just because I just gifted that way. Yeah, yeah, yeah. Or I work out a lot. Oh, just because you're super motivated. Right. Like that was gifted to you at some point. I just am born motivated, right? No, actually, I'm a person. And I grew up, no person. Yeah. And so, but it makes it very clear that these are just choices you can make and you can get after it. Totally true. And I would say that it does when I say one, well, anytime I would say consciously and meaningfully say, well, that's you is if I would be talking about a way of achieving like the same thing.

Like you would do it this way. I would try to do it this way kind of thing. If I was confidence that I could get the results, you know, like whatever that is. But when did I say today about you're sleeping? You can do the four hour sleeping thing. So more so than you can do the four hour sleep and still function. I meant you're into the four. hours five hours sleep thing yeah which is cool but and I realize there are some genetic points in

there I believe right yeah I believe that there are some genetic points in there I believe there are some genetic points in in everything right and I've told you this I have one of my daughters who is most similar to me both physically and mentally sleeps about the same as I do if not less. One of my other daughters, who is most physically and mentally, well, physically more like my wife, she sleeps a lot.

And so there is a gen- and my wife sleeps more than I do. And so there is a genetic component to it. I believe it I've read articles and people send me Twitter articles all the time, oh, you're one of these, you know, fast sleepers, that 2% of the population, all this stuff.

And I'm just saying, okay, yeah, that's great. But then people say, oh, well, you just work out every day because you're super motivated. Right. And that's just good. Or you just train jihitsu all the time because you're just super motivated. It's like, okay. Right. Yeah.

Well, you know what? Great. Great. Great. Yeah. I think you're absolutely correct. And even with the sleeping thing, that is like, because, okay, ultimately, yeah, if you don't have to sleep as much as the next person, sure, that's an advantage.

just because you have more time. That's it. It's not like, you know, someone would be like, hey, other than that reason, be like, hey, it's cooler or it's somehow more beneficial for me to sleep five hours rather than my normal eight. Like so, I mean, put it this way. If someone wants to choose to sleep four hours just because you do it, that's kind of weird. Yeah. Now, that being said, what's awesome is there are a bunch of people on the interoperable. webs a bunch of badass troopers that have are our I retweet almost all of these because people go

hey you know I'm I lost 32 pounds. Hey I lost 42 pounds. Hey, I you know did my first squat today with 300 pounds. So and there's no difference in what they were doing before and what they're doing now fundamentally in their in their genes or their or their physiology. what they did is they decided to make these decisions. They decided that they were going to go out. They decided they were going to step up their game.

They decided they're going to wake up early. They decide they were going to clean up their diet. They decided they were going to get after it. And when they do that, all of a sudden, boom. And you know what? You fast forward like six months and people go, well, you just do that because you're super motivated. And they'll be thinking, you know what? No, I'm not.

I'm a person. And I choose to get after it. Yep. I recommend you all choose to get after it. And I encourage that. You know what? It's not easy. It's not easy.

There's the nagging weakness that is pulling you down. You got to shut that thing down. You're thinking I was talking to my friend Anthony about this yesterday. And I always mentioned this. Okay. So decision making, right? We're wired. This environment right now.

we're wired to not get after it in our brain. We're wired for the short-term payoff right now in times of scarcity, you know, I don't know if I mentioned it, but you're wired to, you better get it while you can. Food, mate, rest, everything, you better get it when you, when you, and your body starts to adapt to that environment because it's been going on for so long. So it's like, man, if you're tired, that's your body telling you something, you've got to get that rest. You see some food, some fat, a lot of calories, you know, fat, you know, fat. sugar, a lot of energy, you better get that, you better eat it. Now, now physiologically you're like that and mentally you're like that. You're wired that way.

So my point, hyperbolic discounting, all that is is choosing the short-term payoff over the long-term payoff. Oftentimes, when the long-term comes, you regret your short-term payoff decision. Most of the time. Right, yeah. So it's a spectrum. You know, there's some things are more or less detrimental. So discounting is when you choose that short-term payoff. You can trace back all your success and failures to making that short-term payoff decision over the long-term payoff.

But here's the thing. Here's my point. The odds are kind of, when you say it's not easy, this is a fact. It's not easy because you're not. Why, you have to learn. You have to be trained out of discounting, hyperbolic discount. You've got to be trained out of it in one way or another, whether it's from somebody. from your environment you're in, you know?

Like if everyone's, if everyone's eating healthy around you, it's very unlikely that you're going to be like, oh, this is how you do it? Okay, I'm going to not do it. You know, it's really unlikely. So you can get trained by that way, but the point is you have to be trained out of this way of thinking because you're wired for it.

And all it is is the short-term payoff versus the long-term payoff. Like I said, you got to pay that price somewhere. You might as well pay the price short-term now. and get the benefits for the long term, you know, rather than discount. But we're wired against it, so that's why it's not easy. But train yourself out of it, man.

You know how you train yourself out of it? Do yourself plan. Get after it. Get after it, yeah. All right. It's true, though. It's absolutely true. Speaking of instinct,

is it possible to train instinct? And can we trust it wholly in fighting and in leadership? Well, first of all, instinct is is it's like a voice and it's a voice that you can listen to and it's a voice that you should listen to and you have to get to know your instincts right you have to get to know them you have to know how accurate they are and which ones you should listen to and which ones you shouldn't listen to and it's real like with fighting it's very obvious with fighting you train to a point

that your instinct knows what to do so if someone gets in digging for an underhook on you you You swim to defend that underhook. If someone gets the underhook, boom, you put on the wizard, right? Those are just instincts, and it's good. And it's good to have those instincts. It's perfect. Now, sometimes, even in fighting, your instincts are actually wrong. And I'll give you a very good example of this is rolling with a guy by the name of James

Nielsen. Have you rolled the James before? Many, many, many, many. Okay. So James, black belt's been training forever. He's got a different jujitsu, a different jujitsu, weird jitsu. It's weird. It's different.

And the thing that you have to remember when you're rolling with James is that your instincts are likely wrong. It's crazy, but your instincts are likely wrong. And I know that it's a blanket statement and it's actually true. for instance he wants you to pass guard and get a cross side he wants you across side which is crazy in jiu jitzu so your instinct to get past his guard and get across side and digging deep with your with with head control on him and having his arm he that's what he wants you to do because he has a whole series of moves that he does from there now much like we were talking earlier about a long lanky guy that does moves that no one's used to james does moves that he does moves that

people are not used to and the moves that he does capitalize on your instinct yeah so for instance when you trap his head from a cross side and you want to put your arm there and you put it there that's your instinct he wants you to put his arm there because he's going to get a hold of it trap it and he's got a sweep or an arm lock he's going to set up from there so that's the thing you have to recognize and you have you can't just blanket obey your instincts all the time because sometimes your instincts are going to be wrong. That's the way it is. And it is definitely the same thing in leadership.

And when using instincts in leadership, the first thing that you kind of have to do is you have to become aware of your instincts. And you have to pay attention to them and pay attention to what you're thinking and paying attention to what your instinct is and note your instinct. And then look at the after the... post-mortem and see if your instinct was correct or incorrect. And then you've got to see how often you were right with your instinct and how often your instincts were wrong or what your natural biases are.

For instance, you've got some people that are, their instinct is too positive, right? Oh, you know, we'll be able to get this done. And how often are you right about getting it done? And then you've got some people that are too negative. Their instinct is too negative. Like, we'll never be able to get this done. We shouldn't even go. No, maybe you're wrong there.

There's some people instinctively, they trust people too much. They go, oh, Echo, I know he's going to handle it. I'm just going to give him the project. He's going to run with it. He's got it. And there's some people that instinctively don't trust enough. And they go, man, I'm not going to, Echo is not going to be able to handle this. I got to, I got to micromanage him.

And so those two, those are examples of learning what your personal instinctive biases are so that you can calibrate them. correctly and that way you can adjust your biases and you can mitigate their impact and you can utilize them and give credence to them and understand them and utilize them to the best of your ability and both leadership and fighting both of them as the more you do and the more you pay attention to your instincts, the better they're going to both become. Now, that being said, there's another kind of instinct that you need to be on the lookout for. And this one is a liar.

This one is a saboteur. This one is a backpiter. And like the devil himself, he's a shapeshifter. He's going to disguise himself and make you think he's got your best interest in mind, but he doesn't. This is the instinct that says you've had enough. This is the instinct that says you've given it your best shot. You can stand down. You can back off.

You can take a knee. This is the instinct that says, you can rest now. Do not listen to that instinct. Do not listen. That instinct is a liar and wants to bring you down. That's the instinct that's a defense mechanism. It wants to give you an out, a place to run to.

A little place of sympathy, an amnesty, a little place of amnesty where everything is, forgiven where all these failures can gather together in comfort and drown their sorrows in lies and in deception and they tell each other

and they'll tell you you did the best you could they'll say the deck the deck was stacked against you and they'll say it's not your fault and they'll tell you it's okay to stop it's okay to settle

it's okay to give up and that is the instinct you need to fight you need to push back to smash into the ground do not take the easy way out

do not give up based on instinct if you are forced to stand down to retreat so that you can rebuild and re-attack, so be it. But make that decision based on logic. Not on the instinct of surrender and defeat. And you need to train that instinct.

Your instinct. Train it to say, get up. go fight on and if that is what you become if that becomes your fundamental reaction to adversity if that becomes your gut instinct then you will overcome just about anything that stands in your path and i think that's about all i've got for tonight so thanks to all of you for listening to this podcast and for supporting the podcast. Then now Echo is going to tell you how to do that in the most efficient way. Yes, the most efficient way.

Yes. Well, we'll start with an efficient way. We'll say that. Okay. Anyway, Amazon, click through. Anytime you shop at Amazon, try to remember. remember if you can go through the website click on the amazon link then do your shopping yeah and and by the way it may seem small we get a little tiny percentage but it is true where you add all those

little small uh percentages together it it provides us with something to help us out with the podcast very supportive so it's very supportive it may not seem like a big deal but as a group it's very supportive and it's very helpful. So you don't feel like you're not doing anything. You are absolutely supporting the podcast. Yep. Agree. And that is, yeah, factually true. Indeed.

A thing to help you with that. Kind of make it even more, I guess, more official. It's a cool. It's a cool little way. Trooper tool. Amazon. Drop a podcast. Trooper tool. Chrome extension for Amazon. Just go on the website. It'll say a little thing. Trooper tool, Chrome extension. Click on that

kind of downloads. It's This little extension goes on your browser. It automatically supports the podcast when you shop through Amazon. So you don't even have to remember to click through the website. You don't have to go to the website anymore after that. It does automatically. And you got the tool, too. It's pretty cool.

It's official. And it helps. It helps. Yeah. Helps is what we're doing right here. Yep. Very much. And then, of course, you got to support yourself.

I think some good supplements, which is. saying a lot because there's, you know, there's a lot of not good supplements up there. On it supplements. The best. It's like, it's not even really a debate anymore. Really? No, I don't think it's a debate anymore. Given, like, what we're trying to do, what all of us are trying to do here in the group.

If you're in the game, there's no real. Yeah. So it's not like you're not going to find a power gainer 5,000 chocolate protein tub of powder. It's not that. it's like legit supplements. Alpha brain, neutropics, proven.

They got all the literature on there too, by the way. Crill oil, the best quality, eco-friendly, produce. Anyway, it's the best supplements by far.

Onet.com slash jocco. You can get 10% off, so you support yourself as well. Shroom tech. Shroom tech, yes. Recommended. Highly recommended.

Highly recommended. I told a story last time about the, about the cruel oil and joints, about my person. Bro, I'm telling you the krill oil, even if you don't even realize it, I didn't even realize it.

But after a while, when you take you're like, man, it's, yeah. I feel good. I feel, yeah, I feel real good. Shroom tech for, yeah, if you're getting after it, high intensity stuff for, you know, any kind of prolonged period,

that's going to help you notably. You feel it. You help you utilize, like, oxygen better in your muscles, something like that. I'm not the scientist behind it, obviously. You can't read about it. about it if you want but that one's a good one anyway check out all the supplements are 10% off and they're all legit and I don't know if a warrior bar is even a supplement but it's a

bar it's a food yeah it's like a food it's good though um check that one out check that one out rest assured you'll like how it tastes do yourself that favor that favor yes yes um those some ways also subscribe subscribe to the podcast on iTunes of course if you feel like leaving a review, don't like hesitate to leave the review, just leave the review. Just do it. Like, if you feel like doing it, you know, you're like, eh, like, I could say this about this, whatever thing.

You're like, yeah, I won't. And you might be thinking, well, those guys aren't going to read it. No. You know, I'll read it. Oh, yeah. And I'm going to take some input and be fired up. It's motivating when people are fired up and leaving reviews. It's a connection. Yep. And it makes me go, you know what? We're going to get this thing a little bit harder. Yep.

When he's like, yeah, Jacco's very articulate. Makes Jocco want to be even more articulate, right? Yes, it does indeed. I mean, do that. And, you know, if you're... And it helps. It actually helps the ratings or something with iTunes when there's more reviews. So why do we want to have good readings, ratings?

So then it gets bumped up. Why do we want it bumped up? Some more people listen to it. Why do we want more people to listen to it? Because we want more people getting after it. We want more people to do better. Yeah. I want more people in the game.

Yeah. I want to get more feedback. I want to talk to more people. Yep. When I see Brady Lanter at his jiu-jitsu class saying, I just got after, told me he lost 30 pounds. Takes Jiu-Jitsu now. That's what we want more of.

That's what I want more of. That's it. And I'm assuming you want that's it. That's why. So ultimately, it really comes down to that. I definitely, I hate to use the word motivated, but I guess there is no other word. I am definitely motivated by the people that are making their lives better,

the people that are getting better physically, by the people that are getting better mentally, that write me an email or send me a note that says, oh, had to use some flanking on my boss today. Got him. Yep. That is good to go.

Thousand percent. That's what I like to hear. When someone says, Hey, Echo, can I use your and Jocco's likeness in a thing on my bulletin board for my students? To employ extreme ownership, can I do that? Just the fact that that's a question he wants to ask makes it. That's what we're going for.

You know what's interesting, so I talked about today. I didn't know about getting after it when I was 13 years old. Imagine somebody being in the classroom and being like, hey, you want to get after it? Here's what you got to do. Here's this. Here's a couple guys. They're getting after it. You know what?

Why don't you get after it, 13-year-old boy, 13-year-old girl? Why don't you make something happen? You know what? You know there's people that do 500 pull-ups of workout? They don't do 28. Tony ain't done anything around here. Step up your game. So exposing the world so that people can do better, do more, be more.

That's good to go. Yeah, if you had more people being less abrasive, losing their temperate left, or less exercising extreme ownership and discipline in all things, pursuing freedom through discipline, that is a better place across the board. You might even go so far as to say unmitigated daily discipline in all things. Yep. So that's the ultimate goal. Also, subscribe to YouTube if you want.

We'll add some more videos on there. Aside from just the podcast video, add some more videos on there. And we have been. And I think that we, not you, Echo, but we, the rest of us. Yeah, yeah. I think we can motivate. you more to make more videos because every time you make a video

like when you not just a clip of the podcast but when you make a legit video I'm always like yeah and I think a lot of people say the same thing and there's actually a lot of troopers out there that are that are making badass videos too what is that Gene

Roderick Gene Roderick makes some killer videos can we put his videos on the Jocko podcast page I think I did dang I haven't put videos on there in a while but yes we can we should do that we will we should do that so that everybody can see all the trooper work that goes out there you know what it does too in this small little way where

you know okay you'll say some words you'll say you'll say what you say and i take it a certain way i'm like dang that really hit me it resonated with me other people other words might hit them harder or less harder or whatever so if people have like video editing skills you know or they know how to video edit and stuff like that and put tracks and do that stuff when they put it out it's it's kind of it is a representation of how those words hit them yeah you know like you make a decision to put a certain type of track behind what you're saying for a reason so it's so interesting to say dang that's how that hit him you know in this feel this feeling is how it hit him and it's like Dang, you kind of get a different dimension of it.

It's cool, too, because for me, I don't hear my words, right? I don't hear my words. Right. Then I hear my words with, with the same thing you're saying, like, the way it's entering their brain. Because when you make a video, right? When you make a video, it's a reflection of what's going on in your mind. Yeah. And so, like, some of those videos that Gene made, I was like, oh.

Yeah, like, yeah. Like, it's going, it's taking me inside his head and what it appears to be from inside his head, which is awesome to hear and awesome to see. So, yeah, we should get those. And he had a couple that didn't go through the copyrighted material. I don't know if he took the wrong songs or something, but it was a bummer. Because some of those were awesome. Yeah, that's part of the battle right there, I think.

But hey, hey, you know, whichever. But anyways, what I was going to say is, I think the more people that are YouTube subscribers, I think the more motivated that you will personally get, that's my opinion, to make even more badass videos. That's my opinion. Well, like you think it might get like a competition. Who can make the better one? No, no, no, no. I don't think that.

I think you're inspired by this video is the same way I am that other people make. But I'm saying I think you will just be motivated more. The more people, like you know when you say a video has just been uploaded by Jocko podcast and you know that it's going to 50,000 people, you'll be like, boom, click. Boom, click. You'll start getting after a little bit more. Yeah. And personally, I want you to get after it more. That's my method is.

The direct approach. You dig it. The pro, there's one, it was like one of the original ones that someone else made. I hate that I can't remember, like, the names of the people did it,

but it's the one. It was to, um, the Pacific soundtrack. Oh, yeah, yeah. It was one of the original ones.

Oh, I'll admit, bro, I was drinking one night. Back in front of them. Yeah. It was, yeah,

it was a long time ago. And you made drinking, that made you drink even more. bro i was drinking some i was playing i was like bro i'm feeling this so deeply right now i played like literally like eight to 12 times just in a row like dang this is so like just because you see they're clips from movies there are clips from this and it's it's it's a it's a mashup and you know the music and here's the thing it's not like hardcore music it's not it's just it's like man it's it's really good um and i think like i said that's like such a good way to see not only just

your words, but how someone else heard them, interpreted them, and put them back out there. It's awesome. You're like, dang, it's like a whole other dimension. Anyway, um, yes, I'll get more on the YouTube for sure. I'm already more on the YouTube. Yeah, you are. But I'll keep it up. I'll keep it up. I'll do even more. We'll do some different. I'll probably start making some videos.

Yeah. Yeah. Yeah. No, I won't. No, I won't. I can't do it. Also. To support this podcast in the event of you being in the mood to support this podcast. You can get some cool stuff. I think it's cool at jocco store.com. T-shirts, they have multiple layers to them, not physically, psychologically, philosophically.

They have multiple layers to them, all of them. Some Easter eggs, too. Shirts, travel mugs, and bumper stickers. Now, new stuff that's available right now. Well, may not be available. It might be sold out. But they could be on back on. You can order it.

You can order it, yes. New stuff. rash guards I thought it was for Jiu-Jitsu but therefore lifting like CrossFit especially

running is a good one like biking basically everything that Rashguards you know spandex type shirts are for surfing I think primarily really but lifting whatever and of course

Jiu Jitsu Rashgars are cool check them out if you like them boom get one of those or two or whatever to support and stickers and then Jiu Jitsu patches and just patches You know, you can sew them on.

They're iron on, but you sew them on as well for, you know, you know, put on your bag, what have you, jiu-suituites for your ghee, that stuff. New things coming within the next, what, week or two. Women's tank tops. I think it actually live pretty soon. I think so, too. But yeah, there it is. All good support that way.

Yep, and that's all awesome. We appreciate that support. That is a cool way. you know to help us out with what we're doing also another thing just came out is a little something um a little jocco white tea if you want to get some of that it's pomegranate and it's somebody i don't know where it came from i don't know when i started utilizing it but i've utilized it for quite some time now it's live on amazon it is like it's live on amazon so go ahead get on there, order it, and get your white tea on.

That's what I'm, when you see me drinking in here, if I'm not drinking alpha brain, I'm drinking white tea. And white tea is definitely what I'm drinking during the show. So give it a try. You might dig it. It's available on Amazon. You could probably click through unless you have the trooper tool, then you can just hit it and get some of that jocco white tea, which we've been, you've heard me talk about

for a long time now. here it is so also oh yeah by the way wrote a book with my brother Laif Babin if you want to check that out actually y'all brought it back on to the bestseller list which is awesome

and we appreciate it go ahead pick up a copy if you don't have one if you got people in your life that you want to help them get in the game there you go just a little something them for you. Cost you 20 bucks.

And you get your, you help somebody. So that's good. And of course, if you haven't heard yet, October 20th and 21st in San Diego, California, we're having the extreme

ownership muster. Two days of get some. With Laif and me live going deep on combat leadership. on the battlefield, in business, and in life, come and get it.

The amount of troopers that are signed up, it's going to be killer to have everybody together. All different industries, companies, businesses, firefighters, police officers, the whole gamut of people that are in leadership positions that, Want to learn that want to share that want to get better. So come on out to the muster. Extreme ownership. Come and get it.

And as always, if you want to keep on kind of kicking it with Echo Charles and myself, we are all up on the interwebs. Twitter, boom, Instagram, yep. Facebooky. We're there. Echo is at Echo Charles, and I am at Jocka Willink. And finally, to you. First, those in uniform, military, police, fire.

Those of you holding the line, train hard. Be vigilant. Be aggressive. And be balanced in your approach. And also, to those of you that are out there working, and I travel the country and I spend time with you folks as well, you folks that are out there working, that are building, that are making things from construction workers building roads and bridges and buildings to those of you building or remanufacturing. engines or building cars or trucks to those of you that are out there building the next generation of technology hardware and software that's going to make life better i meet with you all the time i see what you're doing the builders the makers thank you for

working your ass off to build the world and everything in it. And to all you troopers out there living life, driving and grinding and doing the work. Give it everything you got. Put your head down, grit your teeth, and get after it. So until next time, this is Echo and Jocko out.