Jocko Podcast - 86: How to Develop "Man Skills". Thoughts on Online Jiu Jitsu Training. Install Pride Into a Team. Shifting Your Mindset from Individual to Leader.

Episode Date: August 2, 2017

0:00:00 - Opening 0:04:52 - How to hold workout discipline when you have a hard physical job and kids, facing burn-out. 0:20:00 - How to install pride into a team/battalion/individual. 0:23:51 - How to develop "man skills" in an intellectual environment. 0:42:17 - Should you always be detached? 0:47:53 - Thoughts on The Gracie Academy online school and other Online Jiu Jitsu training. 0:55:06 - What to do when you have an egomaniac boss but you seek to LEAD. 1:02:34 - How to shift your mindset from individual contributor to manager. 1:14:25 - Why have Jiu Jitsu belts/ranking if they are not to be strived for? 1:33:57 - How to step into a manager role when everyone else has more experience than you. 1:40:49 - Training tips for LEO and Security Forces.  And should we attack insurgents?  Or the ideology itself? 1:46:47 - Is it unrealistic to train Jiu Jitsu with many many past and existing injuries? 1:58:53 - How to successfully deal with suicidal thoughts. 2:08:25 - Support, Cool Onnit, JockoStore stuff, with Jocko White Tea and Psychological Warfare (on iTunes). Extreme Ownership (book), The Discipline Equals Freedom Field Manual. Origin Brand, Origin Jiu Jitsu Immersion Camp.  Origin Brand.  2:31:33 - Closing Gratitude.   Support this podcast at — https://redcircle.com/jocko-podcast/exclusive-content

This is Jocko podcast number 86 with Echo Charles and me Jocker Willink. Good evening, Echo. Good evening. And it has been a little while since we got down to some Q&A. Sure. And on top of that, on the social media, I have not been as responsive as I normally am. I've had to prioritize and execute a bunch of other things. things like muster things like books that are due things like that

so and a bunch of travel and a bunch of work with echelon front etc etc so but I do get the questions I read the questions I read the I read if you post something and you tag me in it on Twitter or you put a comment on Instagram I read it a hundred percent yeah I read it but lately and normally I would like everything that I see Sure I would like it just just so you know hey I saw I got you yeah I'm here I heard you But lately I haven't even able to do that Dang so so I've just been I read it move read it move read it move but if there's a good question comes up I copy it I paste it I put it in the in the question bank

And then when we get to do a Q and a we answer the questions that I think either they get asked a bunched a You know, so I've seen a question four or five times that type of question. Yeah Or just a unique question that I think a lot of people can benefit from and that's where we end up with. So today Q and A and let's rock and roll first quest I do want to add that on Twitter also proceed Also, you know you say you like everything, you know? Yes, certain things sometimes They don't necessarily warrant like you liking them. They require a answer you know like you can't like so like let's say someone has this like really trying

time or something and they say something or whatever and it's a question like hey how do I get through this you can't just like it and move on okay can't do that so what what I do in those situations is I like it I copy the question and I put it in the question back okay so your like is my like has various meanings my like does not mean like yeah my like means received gotcha yes yeah makes and it and it and it and And and it is a heart Yeah, which I vehemently Disapprove of and disagree with you don't like hearts? No

No no no hearts. Oh, go on bro, come on. No no hearts All right there you go go's world. All right. Yes, sir. So But I do it's my way of saying I read it but what I'm saying is It's saying that I'm read it. I'm telling you that right at this the past like week I've read everything. I always read everything but I haven't even liked them because I haven't had time to start liking them.

Dang, yeah. Because if I like it, that tells me that I've gone through it and if I had to pull something from it it's how I keep track of what I've read and what I've read. It's how I keep track of

what I have extracted pertinent information from. Yeah. I might have to start doing the opposite. Only like something if I want to go back to it. Oh yeah, like a bookmark. Yeah.

Maybe I'll start doing that. Yeah, maybe. But anyways, if you're out there, I'm reading your messages, your tweets, your posts. Right. And I appreciate it. It's all good feedback. It's awesome. Yeah.

But sometimes you get your, you're in the initial post, we'll say. And maybe I'm in there, maybe some other people, and then other people chime in. Then it starts to morph into this conversation between two other people. You can't really like those necessarily. I mean, you can. I usually do. But just to keep track of words. I am just like like oh yeah see like the bookmark it's a bookmark so this you talking

right now is just one big mass like yes saying hey guys are ready here it is here's all you yes yes I like you like you all right or not even I like you all because some of your comments I don't like yeah I still like them though yeah verb like yeah I like a press like even though you said something I don't agree with so I still I like the fact that you expressed yourself yeah kind of it so even if I hate with You said you still get a little heart for me. There you go. They should have one that's an eye like a picture of an eye like I've seen this. That's what it means All right right right an eyeball. I saw this. I saw this. I saw this and then you could say like and you should have a thumbs down dislike

Yeah like on YouTube. Yeah, yeah either way. There you go. All right first question. Hey jaco. I'm a 35 year old and have a physical demanding job. I've been a drywaller for about 14 years. Work about eight to 10 hours a day. When it comes to working out, I'm finding it really hard to maintain discipline to continue as it seems. As it seems I burn out. I also have two boys under the age of four. So I sleep like you do. I can relate, man. I'm wondering if I'm just being a pussy and need to push through the burnout or take a different approach to working out. When I burn out, my body just feels weird. As well as my head. I tend to get depressed and find it hard to even go to work Just throwing this out there for maybe some tips to get over this so I can stay focused and consistent

Thanks cool. Okay, so hang in drywall have you ever hung drywall before? No, yes, no, but yes, okay I've been I don't know what the answer means I've been in a drywall hanging Scenario work scenario, yes, but I didn't do the hang of the drywall. Okay, that does not qualify A little bit, though. I've seen it done before. No, bro, you do not get qualified for hanging drywall if you've seen it being hung. I appreciate what you're trying to say, but that doesn't work. Hanging drywall is hard work.

Yes, sir. It uses a bunch of different muscles in your body. And, of course, when you get better at it, because I'm not good at it when I hung drywall, when I hang drywall, if I'm doing a project, I'm not good at it. If you see someone that's good at, like this guy that's been hanging drywall for 14 years, he's a master. Yeah. He's holding it with one hand slapping nails him. He's your drywall screw. He's on stilts

Guys work on stilts. You ever seen that before? No, no so good drywallers. They're on stilts Because they don't they're just boom slapping it up there so but it's hard you're doing you're basically doing a clean Kind of pull the the drywall up you're pushing it up you're using your grip strength on the drywall Then you're doing overhead presses because you drywall ceilings Oh, dang it. Yes, yes. So and it's eight to ten hours Plus, not to mention you're bending down, picking stuff up all day. So it's eight to ten hours of squats, cleans, and overhead presses with grip work. So you're doing that eight to ten hours a day.

So you're getting good physical work throughout the day. Now, look, man, if you're that drained, then first of all, let's check the diet. Let's make sure that we're not on the job site and the donut truck arrives and you're going belly up to the donut truck. with a monster for monster energy drinks Like to keep you going through the day That's gonna hurt you So check the diet It's the good thing is

Check the diet And then if you have to you just bring your food Don't let you know Your bro that's gonna run down to Mickey D's to grab lunch Because you didn't pack anything That's gonna jack you up So all that stuff will make you feel weak And out of sorts and all that

That being said still you're working hard all day You're doing hard physical labor all day. You also, I mean, you can see construction workers or drywallers. You can see people that do that hard labor all day and they don't look like they're in shape, right? They're maybe they're fat. Maybe they're just, they don't look like they're in shape. Well, that's because their diet sucks generally. They're coming home and they're getting on their 12 pack of beer and pizza.

So get your diet. Make sure your diet's good to go. And then what I would do is, I know, have work construction before and or even big projects on my house where I'm working all day long remodeling pulling down drywall putting up drywall demo in rooms whatever I still do a workout now what you're going to do though is do something that is going to complement what you've done during the day so you're getting some pretty good strength work at this point you're getting you know you're getting cleaned your grip work you're doing all this this

hard work all throughout the day so maybe what you need to do is do some more cardiovascular at night or maybe it's just like a really good stretching routine because you got your strength and you got your cardio during the day like if I think about how much I sweat when I'm working on a house project I'm gonna full athletic sweat so that means I'm working hard so find what can you do that's gonna complement the the conditioning that you're getting from your actual labor And maybe in your case it might just be like straight up mobility It might be straight up mobility like hey you're just doing some good stretching you're doing some mobility wad

That's mobility workout of the day you can go to that website they got really good stuff on there to to loosen up and make sure you're staying Limber because another thing you find with construction guys is they end up with some you know with a bad back With a bad they get you know tendinitis from swinging a hammer all day or holding so you can get those kind of use overuse injuries And yeah, so I would look at what you can do that's gonna compliment that also Maybe you feel like you maybe you just need to do some heavy lifting because you're lifting something little all day You know you're lifting drywall all day so you're getting some good endurance muscular endurance But maybe just come home and do a couple sets of heavy dead lifts or a couple sets of heavy squats And the other thing here is like when we're on deployment when I was back in the in when I was in the military

When we're on deployment we wouldn't be doing workouts that are gonna give you the four days of delayed onset muscular soreness right you're not gonna gonna hurt lockers you're not gonna put you in the pain locker yeah yeah where hey I did squats yesterday oh echo just got shot I can't help him right right too tired I mean too sore bro can someone grab echo because my legs are super sore my quads are hurting from front squats yesterday yeah yeah so that's not what I'm talking about I'm talking about doing some something that's heavy but it's quick and you're not you know you're not going crazy and doing so many

sets that you're gonna build up all kind of lactic acid and make your legs all sore so maybe it's something that but I would say explore all that look what you can find that's gonna make you That's gonna compliment you what you do work and also you could look at some jiu jitsu You know look at some jiu jitzu Although at first it's a crazy muscular workout a full body workout like you've never had before Yeah because you're resisting every part of your movement and you'll be sore in your entire body But then as you get better at it You can relax more that takes like a year year and a half maybe even two years before you can really start to relax

The thing that's cool about that for you is you got two kids under the age of four so maybe in two or three years They're ready to start training too now you got a little something to share with them a little bit of the jiu jitsu So yeah don't kill yourself find something that complements your work and If that's just stretching man just stretch yeah and maybe you know what I used to at a when I was at team two Team T we used to do we used to run all the time it was every day it was like oh Monday PT and a run Tuesday swim in a run Wednesday obstacle course and a run yeah Thursday Thursday I forget what it was and then Friday was a long run it was like a 12 mile run or 10 mile run on Fridays so what I would do is I would get done with work on Friday or get done with a PT on Friday and usually would be like half half day Frogman Friday

Sure. Frogman Friday gets some pre-war. No war going on. Guess what you do on Friday afternoon in the dreams? You're going to go, you know, get after it with your boys. In the bar. In the bar, sure. Frogman Friday?

Frogman Friday. Again, Frogman Friday kind of went away once September 11th happened. So this is pre-September 11th. Frogman Friday. So we'd get done with work at, you know, noon. And I would Friday go down and hit my squats. And then, so Friday, I'd heal up Saturday. and Sunday back to work on Sunday ready to rock and roll yeah so maybe you hit just do a good

workout on Friday yeah good hard workout on Friday heal up over the weekend you're feeling good Monday back in the game but yeah hard labor yeah requires something a little bit different yeah than those of you that are sitting at a desk looking at a computer screen like echo Charles yes sir yeah you can do a different kind of workout when you do that all day for sure you mentioned the diet, I would say with 99% certainty, I would say, I don't know everybody, right, I understand that, 99% certainty that if you have a good diet, not even a immaculate diet, a good diet, and you're working drywall construction, moving as, you know, I used to be a mover for a little bit. Yeah. If you have a good diet.

Did that mean you watched moving? Because apparently in your mind that qualifies for, you know, just total victory. Yeah, I'll do. Anyway, oh, yeah. I know you're an actual movement. Yeah, but I wasn't the best mover. I was one. Anyway, that's another thing.

Anyway, if you have a good diet and you're doing this kind of work, that is your workout, essentially. And it's a long one. It's probably a harder workout than most people's normal workout. Yes. You do, and that's the thing. You're so right, because when you're working eight, ten hours a day, there's a lot of work to be done.

So your lunch break is like, dang, this is, I'm going to go to get some delicious. You know, to this food truck right here or this, you know, McDonald's, wherever, wherever. It's not, you know, but you get a good diet with this kind of stuff. You essentially have a great workout along with a good diet. You're going to get results just that. And in a way, you won't even really have to do these supplemental workouts unless you have different goals. So if you're like, okay, I'm just going to do my work.

I'm going to have a good diet. And then I stretch afterwards, which is such a good idea when you work all day. Same motion all day. stretch you know get all that but you'll be way better you'll feel way better too and you'll be surprised how how much easier the work becomes with that diet and also maybe there's like I said you need to look for what complements it yeah so with drywall I don't I don't know you know you know it's probably not deadlifting because you're left lifting stuff all day but maybe it's just like some hardcore uh like ab core strength that you're gonna work you're gonna you know and that's

gonna strengthen your lower back it's gonna offset all the pressure that you put in your back all day so maybe it's that Maybe it's You know pull-ups because you're not really pulling yourself up so so maybe you're doing two workouts Maybe you're doing like one workout on Fridays you're doing abs and pull-ups Yeah, and then during the week you're doing a 20-minute stretch session Yeah to really make sure your hips are opened up Right sure of course like them guys from 10th planet Juzits

Yeah, yeah they're flexible. They're flexible That's that you have to be you have to be able to do loadings to get your black belt from Eddie brav I can't do the lotus I can't get my black belt from Eddie Bravo no no no you can't no sorry bro I should be able to do that at some point

depends on what you mean by should but yeah man cool do the lotus and work on that and you know report back but yeah the diet thing I think the diet thing that's gonna be 75 if not more percent yeah well people hit me up that too they say oh you don't sleep enough and how do you not sleep don't eat crap you don't need as much

sleep yeah check that out give that one to try yeah and and listen let's face it there's people can be different with yes requirements you're obviously you know like if I said hey jaco you're in prison for I don't know whatever and you have eight hours of sleep yeah sleep for eight hours we tried that I don't know if you can do that I deployed on a ship multiple times three shipboard deployments as a seal and when you're a seal on a ship you have no job you're like the guys that are the guys that are in the regular Navy that are driving the ship and maintaining the ship and steering the ship and all that they have a job we have no job yeah yeah and so what we we could either sleep eat

or lift and that's what we used to say seal stood for sleep eat and lift but some guys would sleep a lot yeah I wouldn't sleep a lot we had some guys that had sleep disorders there was a guy that slept for like 29 hours But they need to wake up and stay awake for 32 hours and then he'd go back to bed Yeah, it was kind of weird Where they cut his his circadian rhythm was way off Yeah, and then that happens too on a ship

Because you can stay inside the ship with no sun for Forever if you want to That's jamming you up We used to go out as much as we could on the deck of the ship Yeah, get a son tan No, do PT Sure, that too But yeah, I think you

Yeah, you sleep different and you know some eight hour And actually I've done this thing where I got used to only getting like six six and a half and it it started to work like I started to only need that you know I didn't like that thing I tried to go back to actually I only get six maybe seven now anyway because the kids think anyway the diet I think will I for real thing I believe this to be a fact 75% or more solution to the whole problem yeah the diet eat good bring your lunch yeah stay away from the Mickey D's yeah Ste-away from all that stuff.

But again, man, that's, that is hard, though. Consider it. Yeah, yeah. It's hard, too, because you were tired. It's a cycle that you start going down. Yeah. Because you were tired when you got home, so you didn't make any food for the next day.

So that means you brought something crappy or you bought fast food and now you ate the fast food, which makes you feel bad, which means you get home of your tires, which means you don't make lunch for the next day, which means you're home in this bad cycle. Yeah. And that's not to mention the pleasure part of it,

because, again, this hard work, I need some relief from this hard work on my lunch break. Bring some dark chocolate. Yeah, maybe. Right? Bring some chocolate milk. Yeah. Stuff tastes good and it's good for you.

Well. Arguably. We'll say arguably. It's not as bad for you as a mountain dew. Yeah, or a pizza by the slice from the truck, the food truck. Yeah, and that's usually what it is, man. Take it from me, I know. All right.

Cool. Next question. By the way, that was one question. We're 20 minutes deep. All right. Hey, man. We've got to get to the bottom of these things. I think that'll help, though.

They will. I think so. Because look, if you, if you think, oh, yeah, maybe I'll change my diet, but you know what? Okay, I'll maybe I will. Maybe I won't. I'll just kind of focus on the workout part of it. Yeah. Bro, you can work out.

Man, one time I was like, uh, I didn't do any cardio. I just kind of lifted and whatever my diet was not all that. And sure, I was, I was big and strong. I went to the doctor. They said, you're, your cholesterol or thing, you know, some stuff. On the inside, I was super unhealthy. He was like, you're unhealthy. I'm all big and strong.

I was like, wait, sir, but I can bench a lot. I'm like, bro, that doesn't matter. So you can hang. drywall all day all day and dang that's some good endurance if you can do that all day every day for 14 years by the way and be like oh unhealthy because you ate wrong it'll jam me up that bad clean up the diet yeah good news clean up the diet next question next question how do you how do you install pride back into an individual and ultimately a battalion I'm on my 17th year serving in the british army I've been in my role for about a

decade and I'm about to move on to a different job recently I've came out of my platoon bubble and noticed there are numerous issues I've identified and I'm looking to help my COC in fixing it all right so you aren't still pride back into a battalion into a unit into an individual in my opinion pride comes from hard work pride comes from discipline pride comes from Performance and pride comes from winning and how do you win you win? You win from hard work You win from discipline so that's the cycle you work hard you stay disciplined That makes you start to perform that makes you start to win when you start to win

You get pride and of course there's a dichotomy there too because you can work your guys too hard right you can do that So you have to balance it then it's funny actually Leif was talking about this I think I don't know if it was a we were with a company And he was saying when we formed up task unit bruiser We worked hard we worked a lot harder than normal task units worked we stayed later at work we came in earlier And you know he was saying hey when we first the first like month we were together and and Jockels got everyone coming in early and all this stuff and people are Grumbling about it and why do we got to do this extra stuff and he's today's like yeah, there's people are grumbling about But then once we started going through training and our performance was

Above our peers then all of a sudden it turned from grumbling to like pride Yeah, yeah, so that's thing then the guys they stopped complaining and they start bragging Yeah, yeah, because you know what where to you bruiser? Yeah, of course you're not at work because you're you're you're tasking It is weak. We are strong. You are weak. Get away from us. We don't want to be associated with you.

So you start getting that, which is, you know, pride. Yeah. So I think that's what you got to do. You've got to instill the hard work, the discipline in your team. It'll hurt a little bit at first. You got to make sure you don't go overboard with it. And that'll get you what you want. If you need further references on that, read a book called Steal My Soldier's Heart.

By Colonel David Hackworth. Or read about face by Colonel David Hackworth. He talks about this. He takes battalion, his battalion in Vietnam with no pride and turns them into people with a ton of pride. How does he do it? Makes them work hard. Makes them have discipline. And then they take pride in what they're doing.

Lead by example? Yes. Yes. Always. And Hackworth, he doesn't change everything at once. He doesn't come in and just go crazy. He starts changing important small things, a couple a day. I think literally he says two a day.

We'll change two things a day. It's good But he did start off with a big thing If you remember this he checked in this battalion Guys have radios guys have guitars Guys have little bars set up They got all this crap He goes hey everything that you can't fit in a rucksack

Tomorrow morning in the middle of the compound here And we're getting rid of it So that was a big wake-up call for everyone But it was a it was a wake-up call And also it was why are we doing this? Well we're doing this So that we can move when we move we won't get hit at night We won't get hit at night we won't get at night We won't lose anybody.

So. Good stuff. Makes sense. Next question. Sorry for the English. I'm French. That's a disclaimer. How can a man that has not grown up with the confidence and trusting male role models and mentors sort of anti-uncle Jake persons, only intellectual?

I'm saying this without disrespect to these people. How can they become a confident man and develop the necessary man's skills? I'm quote unquote okay it's interesting you can say man skills in quotes Yeah, and I think we pretty much know what that means right yes like we know what that means so so How do you do that you don't have any positive role model around you that's like an uncle Jake Which by the way most people don't have an uncle Jake yeah right that's not normal to have uncle Jake Most people you got what you got and in this case he's saying he's got likes the intellectual So you know, oh my parents were college professors and they don't have any of these skills and they sit around and talk about

Philosophy right now I ended up I can talk about philosophy well But I can't fix my car yeah or I can't defend myself yeah in a combat scenario in the streets So what are you gonna do okay this is real simple go do things Go do things lift start lifting weights Learn how to deadlift learn how to squat That's a that's part about being a man right sure physically strong yeah physically strong Learn some jiu jitzu I recommend that probably could have guessed that one yeah learning how to fight Learning how to defend yourself I just got to ask this the other day kid came up to me he's like

What should I do if I get intimidated by other people and I or I don't know how to react when people like get in my face And I said do you train jihitsu? No Start training a jih Tjitsu But then what? I'm gonna fight everyone no no no you don't have to because you already know you can beat them up Right now if they attack you yeah you can beat them up But if they are just getting in your face and trying to punk you and you look at him and go hey if you want to do this Let's do this but I don't care yeah I know you can come to my gym. I'll choke you out Train some jiu jitsu

So we got that one run hike Sprint climb build things Start building things rewire things do some plumbing these things are not They're not impossible to do now it's gonna take you longer right like I've rewired my parts of my house I've replumbed parts of my house have done all the plumbing and parts of my house now if you watch a skilled electrician do what I'm doing it would literally take him one eighth of the time maybe one one quarter of the time because or like the drywaller we were talking about earlier a good drywaller

They're like masters a good electrician masters a good plumber They're smooth me it's gonna take a while sure so but but what I'm saying is it's not impossible Yeah, it's not impossible to do and it'll take you more time but you're learning how to do it And that gives you what does I give you it gives you the self-reliance right hey I can fix my electrical outlet if I need to yeah so those are good things work on your car change your oil whatever do those things and and again those things like I so I took electricity class in high school sure where we learned how to wire rooms and everything is that what it's called electric it was called electricity class right on

I took electricity with Scotty was the teacher's name sure wait you called them Scottie he was an older guy his name was Scotty we all I'll call them Scotty. So Scottie, but we learn how to wire houses and all that. Well, I didn't remember any of that. When I was now 20 years later or 15 years later, I'm rewiring my kitchen, which I ripped out of my house. Okay, so what did I do?

You know what I did? Went down to Home Depot. I bought a book called electrical wiring. And I read through it and I followed the directions. Same thing with plumbing. Go down, buy a book called How to? to do plumbing and you do it and it and the good thing about this stuff is it's very satisfying to do that kind of work yeah it's very satisfying yeah to do it

and you can over engineer things you make things super solid in your own house secure yeah super yeah you can just kind of go the extra distance because it's your own your own house so that's cool so those are all physical things and some kind of knowledge things that you can start working on what the hardest thing to overcome here is like a level of of embarrassment yeah right so like I don't know anything about wiring oh yeah yeah you know I don't I'm embarrassed to say I don't know anything about wiring yeah that's true and so people don't want to say anything so they'd rather just say hey

well it's getting electrician in here to figure this one out yeah or hey I was good yeah so they're too embarrassed but if you have time do it yourself yeah and don't be embarrassed about it be like hey I'm more I'm rewired my kitchen I have no idea what I'm doing yeah give me this book yeah what I need to get oh give me some tools it's good to have good tools Yeah Also so that's that's like I said Those are things that you can do

You know um Learn to shoot You know learn to shoot That's a good good skill to have Also read Right read About history Read about

survival Read about the world Read about human beings Under duress Read read books good books about good stuff about challenges

it's and then just like Mark in Way of the Warrior Kid he doesn't know his time stables he has to learn them you have to go learn all this stuff I'm talking about you have to go learn and with with time your confidence is going to grow and from humility

you'll grow into being more confident now you also say don't have any mentors or role models around you that's okay because those mentors mentors and role models are in books and you can find them you can I just talked about David Hackworth good mentor to have imagine you can have a guy a guy wrote you a 1,000 page book on how to lead and is for you that's pretty awesome awesome beyond band of brothers by dick winners guess what here's a guy that was that in charge of the band of brothers in Normandy and he wrote a book for you to learn how to lead so those are some examples and

Like I said most of the books that we've covered on this or many of the books that we cover on this podcast and give you a mentor better than anyone could possibly hope for Yeah, so you can get it there but and and we mostly cover war books but there's books about all kinds of People that can be virtual Mentors So read study do do that's my advice on that one. Yeah that physically strong thing is a in my opinion a big deal because especially what with you know intellectual types and that kind of environment since that's not really a priority a lot of the time You tend to you know how like you're not into something so you kind of shun it as a result you know like and I've seen this I'm not saying all the time But you know sometimes the in I don't like take downs so I'm not gonna do them. Yeah and then you think of all the reasons why you don't need to do it And how guys focus you know or whatever so in an intellectual circle

We'll say yeah those circles sometimes You'd be like oh yeah those meatheads or whatever you know they just they'll shun it are you sensitive about that issue Oh no No yeah maybe no I don't think so actually But they'll do that yeah and then they'll be these for physically frail people but since they they're in their mind smarter than everyone. They feel like they have the one up and they're kind of, there's an element of satisfaction there.

Yeah. But at the end of the day, you're physically weak. Yeah. When it comes down to it. And I think most of the time, I think, I don't know, but it seems like most of the time they'll have these feelings like this guy asked right here. Like, man, how can I develop?

Because I feel it. Yeah. Yeah. Unless they just want to be in denial. Right. That's what exactly. But when you're in denial, you feel it. And by the way,

the same thing happens in the reverse right yeah yes a guy that's just a meat head he shuns and and disrespects or disregards the intellectual side of things and that is this that is equally as bad because they're not they don't know what's going on they're not knowledgeable they're not learning they don't understand the world in a clear way so find the balance between those two things yeah I think what's great is those things are not mutually exclusive like you don't have to just be a meathead or Just have to be a bookworm right you can do both there's plenty of time of the day to do both be a

A smart ass guy with a big deadlift That's a good thing I'm trying to be that guy yeah, yeah not there yet but I'm working on it Yeah, and then that one level up which is the jiu jihitsu part of it Jiu jih Tijuana here's the thing too I was thinking about jiu jih Tzu yeah Jitsu combines the intellectual piece with the physical piece yeah and in a way you can kind of I would I'm not recommending this at all in fact I'm against this but this is the nature of jujitsu you don't have to be that like you don't have to have a big deadlift to to dominate in jiu jihad so you don't have to do any of that so

you can essentially overcome the physical part of it even though jiu jih Tzu is physical but it's a you don't have to you can overcome the physical part of it for it to a point yeah but in everyday life I mean you you you you're trying to you're trying to you're trying to be the guy like if someone's better than you at jiu jihitsu in the training room it really bothers you are you talking about you everyone or you're just talking about me you jocco it doesn't bother me well let's say it motivates? I don't know.

Like, it doesn't bother me. Right, right, right. I mean, like, for instance, I train with Dean Lister all the time. Yeah. He's better at me than Jiu-Jitsu. Right. I, every day, want to train with him. Right. So it doesn't bother me. Yes, yes, it's not bother, but like, what I know, compels you. Like, you know, well, maybe it does, like, I hate it.

At the end of the day, deep down, depends on what you mean by bother. It's funny. I hate it. I do. I hate it, and I love it. And we were just joking about it the other day, because we got into a little scrap yesterday. Yeah. You know, kind of end of training, and all of a sudden things got Escalated and there was some shouting going on and Shouting shouting shouting yeah yeah, yeah, you know he was saying what he says and I was saying what I say And but we had a you know we had a mutual truce at the end

Sure, we've I think he didn't really want anymore I didn't really want anymore So we just kind of let's let's laugh and call it good Because you're rolling the dice when I'm rolling with Dean there's a there's a dice roll happening Because if he ends up in a good position on me there's going to be pain there's going to be pain if I end up a good position on him there's going to be pain

so I think both of us we got away a little bit unscathed neither one of us got a really good position and we got back up to my feet and then we both kind of just had a mutual agreement an unspoken agreement that we were done for the day

yeah I know that feeling yeah I can dig it see how that happened but the point there being is almost like in this weird way you know how like intellectually you can excel so you can kind of find it justifiable to avoid the physical part of it It's almost like you could almost say the same thing about jiu jitza you could still be effective in defending yourself without be physically strong necessarily, but but my point is that there's a limitation to that

Yeah, ultimately if you you can be you can be unbelievable at jiu jitsu But if you're really really weak and you go against someone that's really good at jiu jihitsu but they're a hell of a lot stronger than you yeah You're gonna have some issues right right yeah and that goes for everything you gotta be both yeah ideally and that's ultimately the main point is just like how intellectually you can be you know a black belt and you can sort of in a way get away with not necessarily being this physically opposed to and vice versa and then jiu jih Tzu is like that third element you didn't sort of get away with not being super strong but still be effective in jih Tzu you know what I mean so ideally just like somewhere in the middle yeah get get that

balance I hear what you're saying but being able to defend yourself is a whole other thing than being physically strong you know seems obvious But when you go through life, I think it's not because you get these like big jacked guys and it's like no one wants to mess with him Well bro this medium to small guy who knows Jiu Jitsu or knows these you know for real fighting stuff is way more of a I don't want to say dangerous, but yeah Ultimately way more dangerous than this big jack guy who can lift a lot for sure So it's that third element that are kind of like isn't it weird when you roll with somebody that's super jacked? And they don't know Jiu Jitsu. Yes, and it's amazing it was it's it's it's it's it's a

It's like amazing. Yeah. You just think yourself, how is this happening? Yeah. This is the magical power. Yeah. Because you look at a big jack guy. Your human instincts tell you, look out.

Yeah, he's going to see. That person is stronger than you. Yeah. You know, watch out. The instinct of fear. Yeah, that instinct of fear. Although you're still, you know, my first thought when I look at someone was like, do they train or not? Yeah.

Do they train or not? If they train, we may have issues. This could be a problem. If they don't train, no factor. Yeah. No train, no factor. Yeah. If they train, may have a factor.

That's why I got to work out hard. It's why I can be strong. Yeah. Yeah, you know. Because they might be coming to take my lunch money. Maybe. Right? You never know.

Don't want that. Oh, how's this? Last night. Literally last night I didn't see do you train last night I did not train last oh this is a real world So you know the five gallon jugs of water you know those being you put in the water cooler or whatever So there's like a little refilling thing that I went to late it was like night You've told this story before no there's another this happened last night So hazardous duty I know water refilling the jugs yeah I know okay I mentioned I do that okay

So last night when I was doing that I was refilling the jugs you know I go in the story I'm coming out walking to my truck to get the empty jugs to go to the little thing as I'm walking to my truck a car pulls up right next to the water filling thing There's a what's called a red box. You know what that is it's a DVD rental thing? Yeah, so Car pulls up a kid maybe 12 years old jumps out of the car he starts like you know was he yoked doing no normal kid whatever and From in the car this thing male probably is dad someone maybe a stepdad Really. And immediately the dad starts yelling at him. Like, just put it in the thing.

And just to the point where I thought it was kind of joking. Where, because I'll joke with my daughter like that. I'll be like, kind of like how you'll do sometimes. I do that. Yeah. You'll get a, but it sounded like a joke. But I was like, wow, this guy's serious. And the kid is like, you could tell he was kind of used to it.

You know, he was like, I am, I'm doing, I'm trying, you know, whatever, whatever. And that kind of the whole parking lot could hear. Yeah. And this is at nighttime. I'm going to you a setting So I'm walking to my truck I'm like bro if I get to this place And this guy's still there

Not even yell at him's there I'm gonna have to say something Not be a dick not be like hey Don't talk to it like that I'm gonna try to solve this problem Be like hey this kid you know whatever I had this little thing Before I knew Jiu Jitsu or anything like that

I wouldn't have messed with it I would even being like big or whatever and strong I would have been like oh man that sucks You never know what that guy's got going on yeah yeah you know But man I was like man I'm gonna do this So I grabbed and they left, so I didn't get the opportunity. But I'm just saying these are things that can happen on varying levels every day. And if you're in intellectual, I'm not saying if you're an intellectual,

but if you don't have these elements of whether it be skill or knowledge or whatever, like those things mess with you. You know, you're like, dang, I can't do it. I mean capable. And when I figured out what jihidzu was, when Master Chief Steve Bailey choked me and he was, he was an old man at the time, probably three years. I'm younger than I am now. And I was thinking to myself,

how this guy just do this to me? That's insane, that's completely insane. I need to learn whatever he knows. Teach to me whatever you know, because I don't wanna feel that way ever. And then you're training it, like let's say you train for five years. For five years, you're training not against people who don't know. You're training against people who do know, dangerous people

who do know like how to defend your shit. And then you go in the real world, bra. Yeah, you have, this guy has no idea how much control you have over him. And you didn't even touch him. Yeah. I see, yeah. That's, it's totally true. So, yeah, this whole thing where, I mean,

you're a, your thing about some guy was, the guy was, his problem was like when people get in his face or whatever, his problem wasn't getting beat up. It was when people get in your face and how you react and how you feel and stuff. Right, right. That feeling gone. Yeah, because you're right. You're 100% right, because he said he wasn't scared of fighting.

He was saying, like, I might get in trouble. He was, he didn't like how he felt. Right. felt like he should do something and he felt like a wimp basically when you know that you can destroy someone then it doesn't matter you just think they're an idiot yeah you beat them you get the strength and the skills and you actually beat them on an intellectual level so it's like a dang double gravitational effect on that one all right so yeah yeah if you can get those three in an intellectual psychological whatever mental physical and skill wise defending yourself

Bro, that's the three right there. It's good stuff. Now it's just how hard you want to hit it, really. You want to hit it hard. I think so, too. You know, it's very beneficial to hit it hard. Next question, Joko. Should someone always be detached?

Okay, straightforward question. The answer is no. Someone shouldn't always be detached because otherwise you aren't enjoying anything in your life. So don't always be. detached detached no but at the same time that being said you should be aware all the time if you are getting sucked into the emotional vortex right you've got to be

aware of that once you have that awareness you don't need to be attached all the time at all you can I'm not always detached at all but but I've got clear warning signs when things start going sideways and I start going down some vortex I know immediately and I just attach so it's really easy It's but it does take practice and eventually you realize that you know when you're feeling overwhelmed When you're feeling emotional and you're feeling angry or you're feeling frustrated When you start feeling those things and you've sent them really quickly and you recognize them You just detach boom you're done yeah so that's what you got to do start recognizing those red flags so that you can enjoy the good things and

And when something starts getting crazy, you can detach. Yeah, so it's like an overall skill of being able to control when to detach and when you don't have to. Being able to identify when you need to detach, then being able to detach, then you're good. Yeah, so it's like a matter of being capable of making an accurate beneficial choice. Yeah, but the identification is the hard part. Yes, people, what happens to people when they talk to me is they go the after the fact they realize I lost my temper and I did this Yeah, okay, you didn't detach in time and that's why you ended up there Yeah, so or I said some things to my you know my ex-girlfriend that I shouldn't have said because I got too emotional

Exactly. You didn't detach in time. Yeah, you got crazy and emotional So the skill that you're missing is identifying when you're starting to get too emotional whatever that emotion might be Once you identify it boom detach Yeah It's kind of like control Then you can take control Yes And make tactical moves

Yeah Not emotional moves That's ultimately the art You know To make the move You know how like Jiu-Jitsu guys If they never take it

Actually no you know what The moves When you're emotionally detached The moves Actually aren't that hard They're actually usually Pretty obvious Yeah

Like you're in a fight With your girlfriend And and you're starting To go down the wrong lane As soon as you detach You go Oh I know what I need to do I should say I'm sorry

And tell her that we can the restaurant that she wants to go to or whatever you know what I mean you the the moves are not actually that hard but we never make good moves when we're being emotional right instead we just go no I don't want to go that restaurant we went there three weeks to row and I don't care if I said that to you you deserve me to say that to you yeah yeah yeah that's you go down the wrong path but what if somebody's like detached the whole time even one problems don't know right you know like then we don't have a relationship right that's what I mean that's what I'm

saying so this you're not being detached all the time that's what that's the answer to the question right so it's like you've reiterated it for every Yeah, man, that's what I'm here for I think a lot of time You know how guys will ask you hey I want to learn jiu jitsu I want to learn to mess people up So bro that's not really what it is Jiu Jitsu is having the skills to quote unquote mess people up But what you learn ultimately is you put yourself in a position where you can make that decision Is it time to mess someone up or not you know and you just have control the situation

So that's really what it is most people that start with the vision of I want to build a mess people up Most people continue that that do continue on the journey of jiu jitzu arrive at a point where they realize that they don't want to abuse this power that they didn't have most people Yeah, there's a small percentage of people that don't that are bullies Yeah, bullies when they started and they become more effective bullies yeah more fearful more more more fear in Posing bullies yeah which sucks yeah, but jihitsu is power. That's why you gotta have some of it. Yeah, agree but compared to like a I don't know Anything where it's like striking based or whatever it's like you it like I've said this before I'm not gonna go deep in it But you go from zero to 10 when you throw a strike that's already at 10 You know you can't just throw a light one and be like okay are we cool now? You know kind of thing goes through not cool no

You just slap me in the face we ain't cool at all you brought it to 10 whether you knocked him out or not It's funny because like I see I see my kids And and what you're talking about can happen very easily when other people are in the group with my kids I mean Because they've been training Jiu-Jitsu. So even like against any normal kid There's no factor. Yeah Like I see me to my son will be wrestling around with some kid. It's no factor. Yeah And it's you know, it's kind of cool. Yeah, kind of cool. Yeah, it's real cool. Yeah, I see a little

You know my kids aren't like jiu-jitsu like there's kids out there that are sick Competitive jiu jitsu all the time. Yeah, right? Yeah That's not what I'm talking about like just knowing jiu jiu-jitsu. A hundred percent Correct, yes. And, bro, when I see kids doing jiu-jitsu, especially, like, I'm not saying in necessarily even in a tournament, I'm just saying in jiu-jitsu in class, even at the beach or whatever, when I see him, but I'm like, man, I wish I could have done jih Tzu when I was a little kid. You know how fun that would be? Yeah. Man, yeah. It's make up for it now. Trying. Next question. Jocko, I've been offered a job as a deputy sheriff. I have a few months before the position is actually open. I really want slash need to get into some. Jiu-jitsu due to the nature of the job the closest place to me is over an hour drive away Yeah harsh financial finances are an issue when it comes to that kind of drive plus fees to attend My main question is how do you feel about Gracie's online school? That's an option

If I were to find others who want to learn would this be effective? Yes, so here's what you need to do Get some mats you can make mats You can get a piece of canvas from Home Depot or a piece of vinyl and string it between trees on the ground You just have mats you just made them all over grass that works I've done it I've trained on with there's a truck called a six by in the military It's a big giant like a truck and it has you've seen this in like your typical war movie the truck with the canvas tarp over the back Yeah, yeah Rambo I've taken that thing off and that was my Matt on top of the truck no no no taking it off the top of the truck you took that

canvas took that canvas on put it on the ground guess what I got now jiu jitzu Matt strung put on stakes in the ground we're good to go it's canvas but it's good to go so you do that then you get on YouTube you get on YouTube you know Gracie Academy uh Marcelo Garcia online those are really good I would actually start with YouTube just like get some basics down get some fundamentals get you need two three four friends if you got a friend that wrestled get him in there. Oh yeah. If you got a friend that did judo get him in there Um, and then you just start looking at the moves and fighting each other and trying to see what works and don't go nuts on each other trying to figure out what works what doesn't work learn the basic

concepts and then maybe Saturdays maybe every other Saturday maybe one Saturday a month You drive an hour to the school with your buddies you go in there you say hey man we live up in wherever an hour away from here if we give you ten bucks can we get on the mat You know this weekend. Yeah. Just for just for a couple hours. Can you look at what we're doing? Maybe even say, hey, look, can the four of us get a private?

We'll all give you 20 bucks. That's 80 bucks. You can make it an hour. Coach, please. So then you get some detailed training and that's going to give you a base. You know, that's, I think, your best option. Yeah, fully. And these online, you know, academies and stuff, that's essentially what they're made for.

If you can make it to the academy. Oh, yeah. If you can make it to academy, you go to the academy. Yeah, exactly. Academy is yeah yeah and I think podcast number six we talk about what to look for in a Jiu Jitsu Academy yeah so go back to podcast number six if you're starting Jiu Jitsu and you want to find a good academy go back to podcast number six yeah it's in there yeah fully and I think to start especially if you don't know Jiu Jitsu at all I think a lot

of us started Jiu Jitsu with watching UFC one two three four you know so we kind of after watching that we kind of see okay I see if you're mount if you have a That's good. Yeah, if you're on the bottom guard if you know see you can pick up okay I didn't I knew what jujitsu was so I didn't get to experience Trying to learn the basic moves from seeing on a UFC so I'm taking what you're telling me as Factual and it makes some sense but so did you actually like compute the the positions? You were like okay. That's the guards you must have watched in detail well no you must have watched remod be like okay that guy hoist gracie That guy that's wearing that white thing that white uniform Look what he's doing. He's got his legs closed around that guy. That's what you guys were doing essentially but because even the announcers weren't calling it guard back then were they? Yes, there was a guy who's real nerdy guy and he was that was you see two I want to say

Maybe even one I forget which one was which but yeah he he knew and you could tell he was like kind of prideful that he would train with Horian or whatever But he got see you know he's gonna pull him in between his guard like that's you know You know he's going to mount and it was real repetitive because he'd do the same thing so yeah you you essentially if you're paying attention You learn guard you don't learn how to do an arm bar how to you know well when I teach kids sometimes I'll just say You want for like let's say a kid's been training for a day. It's their first day. You want to keep your legs around them right Yeah, that's guard. They don't even know what they're doing and then you say the other kid you want to get away from there or get around their legs Yeah, and so they just try and do it and that's a pretty cool way to start things off very You'd be surprised at what kids will instinctively do yeah yeah, yeah make things happen there

Yeah, and you even at the muster you know how you explain it just real quick like you're okay this is mild this why it's important this guard this one's important that's really like the other day at there was a new girl in there named Sarah I remember that because you know I know someone else named Sarah but anyway Adam it was time to roll rounds he'd say hey there Adam was like hey you know there's some new people here smasher no day zero days whatever experience can you I don't know teach or something you know as the rounds are going on because I didn't have a partner at the time came in late whatever but so I went and I did essentially that just a crash course This is mount, this is guard, this is a side mount, you know, and this is the importance of each one. And then this is literally takes five minutes. So here's the importance of everyone. And then I do a little quiz at the end.

I say, okay, boom, boom, we fight. It's like a half speed. We fight. Boom, we fall to the ground. Where do you want to be? And, you know, so it's like a little quiz. And boom, right there, that five minutes, you learn everything that I learned from watching UFC. One, two, three, but in a more specific detail.

And you were studying them and you were trying to figure it out. But yeah, you can learn it in five minutes from somebody's your own day to you. Exactly right, if that's what they're teaching you. A lot of times people will go in on their first day. And some academies, they're dope. They'll have an introductory class, which is kind of that. It's called an introductory class. But if you're like, hey, it's my first day, let me see what I can learn.

Then they'll learn like some, you know, homopata or something. And they're like, wait, whoa, I don't know how this even makes sense to me, you know. But if you learn that crash course or, you know, even go in the muster, that's why it's so cool. You go over that. And everyone's like, dang, this is cool. You can leave that and now you're way better off now. You know it's funny at the muster is everyone has heard us talk about jiu jitsu.

So they have this anticipation of it being really cool and then when they connect the dots between like, okay, you learn the mount and then you learn the guard and then you learn the sit-up sweep And when you're done with the sit-up sweep you're you're from the guard. You're back in the mount and people are like it's a miracle It's a miracle. There's the magic. Yeah, it is and it is and it's a miracle. I think there's the magic. Yeah, it is and it is and it. It's essentially before the actual moves, like doing the moves, it's just you have to know what's important and what's not. Like if you mount on someone, just by happenstance, you don't know what mount is or the importance of mount,

but if you wind up on the mount, you're trying to punch the guy, I'm saying in the fight. You're trying to punch the guy and trying to do damage. You're trying to win the fight. But punching the guy is not what you should be focused on primarily. It should be keeping the mount. Maintain the position. Yeah, exactly, right?

But no one's going to automatically know that it's not. You're trying to beat up the guy. I'm on top. I can punch him. Let me punch him. But no. It's just one of the many examples. next question jaco my boss is incredibly controlling an ego maniacal i like him already

ego maniac huh i have i have attempted to use extreme ownership in dealing with the people under me but my boss has reprimanded me for leading he has said he gets he gets to do all the leading because he's the one in charge quote unquote and and his job title is higher than mine I've had that happened to me before by the way if I could continue to try to lead my responsibilities will be taken away if I step back into the shadows I won't make an impact on the people under me what should I do so it's black and white yeah right in his mind seems that way you can either step up and lead and get fired or step in the shadows and do Nothing and everyone will suffer.

It's not, it's not that way, right? It's not black and white. And actually start by putting your own ego in check. Because you're calling someone an egomaniacal, but your ego is being being touched a little bit here. You rubbed the wrong way a little bit

because you want to lead and when you get told don't lead, it offends you. Guess what that is? That's your ego. So what you need to do is Maybe you like the you like the feeling of being in charge. That's cool. I like the feeling of being in charge Yeah, it feels good to me feels normal to me when I'm not in charge. I don't like it

I have to consciously suppress it, which is fine sometimes you have to do that like right in the situation here that this guy's talking about and what you need to suppress is You need to not be so overt with your leadership He shouldn't even be able to sense that you're leading but you should be leading Yeah, you got to be be under the radar you got to be covert with what you're doing and by the while you're doing that your massaging homeboy's ego making him feel good about it making him feel that he is running things and because because you can absolutely lead

from the shadows if your ego allows it because a lot of times when we want when we lead we want everyone to know that we're leading yeah I want everyone to know that I'm in charge I want them to know that I'm the man right that that That's really hard when you're leading from the shadows a lot of times not even the people that you're leading Recognize overtly that you're leading think about that so the people that are actually Following you don't even know that they're following you They don't they don't consciously know it maybe if they were to break down and you give give them like a hey who do you think is actually giving you instruct me? Well, I think that might be probably that seems like it's echo Okay, okay, but they don't like consciously think about it

So that's what you need to do you need to suppress your overt leadership Not step on the boss's toes massage his leader massage his ego a little bit Because if you do get your response you want to help right well you want to be helpful you want to lead these people in a great way If you don't if you get your responsibilities taken away or you get fired Then you can't help anyone anybody you're not gonna help the team at all so you have to be smart and you have to play the game to win his confidence and his trust so he does let you lead and what's going to do that when he realizes that you're not going to step on his toes that you're going to give him the credit because he wants the credit he's an egot maniac right he's controlling so that's kind of what you need to do now this is

the weird thing and this came up at the muster people don't want to hear me say that people don't want to hear me say that people don't want to hear me say that if I come up against a boss with a big ego what you need to do is back down people don't want to hear me say that they say they want to hear me say if you come up against someone with a big ego what you do is you bow up to him yeah and you show them that they ain't got nothing on you yeah don't back down to that guy with a big eagle that's weak you know it's true and what I said at the monster I said I said listen because I could see it I could see it People are like, oh, I guess Jocko isn't always as hardcore as I thought he was because he's going to back down to somebody with a big ego.

And I said, guess what, people? This is why you feel that way. If there was a machine gun nest on a hill and there was a bad guy in there and he's killing a bunch of people shooting that machine gun. And everyone in the room wants to look at Jock and say, Jocco's brave and Jocco's tough and Jocco's going to charge that machine gun nest. and take that guy out well guess what a machine gun belt fed weapon

in an elevated position bunkered in I'm not going to take that guy out I can't it's a heavily defended position I can't do that so what Jocko does his backs down

I hide I get behind cover so I don't die once I've gotten behind cover so I don't die I look at Echo and I say Echo stay here shoot some rounds at this guy occasionally distract him I'm gonna flank him So Echo's gonna keep undercover himself. He's gonna plings some rounds up at the machine gun nest While he's doing that I'm gonna scurry away like a little baby like a little sneaky little squirrel

Yeah, yeah and I'm gonna go around to the flank because the machine gun is in a bunker right? So he can't see out the sides I'm coming up the side I'm gonna get right up the side I'm gonna toss a grenade in there and kill him I'm gonna take out the ego But I didn't do it going head on So what happens is people coming up against this big ego and they want to be the hero and they want to be aggressive and they want to the default aggressive Jocco you say B T you you you got a chapter in your book default aggressive man I'm gonna be default aggressive against that ego Wrong answer yeah the right answer is indirect warfare the right answer is maneuver war

For the right answer is you flank these people and by the way if I do charge that machine gun nest or I do attack that guy's ego Guess what I die or I get fired and now I'm no good to anybody Yeah, so it's people have this this desire To be the strong hero yeah, and you have to fight that that's your ego That's my ego charging the machine gun nest. I'm gonna go do this. Yeah, I'm the man. No, I'm actually not the man It's a machine gun in an elevated position. I'm gonna die Yeah, you have to be be smart.

Yeah. Like on... Don't attack the ego head on. Don't attack heavily defended positions head on, period. Like you said in Training Day. You ever watched that movie? Training Day?

No. Come on, bro. You watched it. Anyway, he says, the shit is chest, not checkers. He's not the first person that ever said that,

I know, but it was dope when he said it, in my opinion. Nonetheless, yeah. So default aggressive isn't default aggressive head-to-head. It's default-aggressive. default aggressive in being effective.

Yes, yes, it is. Really you're effective or ineffective at the end of the day. I can see you've been to the muster. I'm being, you know, I listen. Leif knows what he's talking about. You like that. Yeah, man, it's good. Jock.

Is this next question? Yes. Okay. How do you shift your mindset from individual contributor to manager? Growing a company from nothing to something required being an individual contributor and getting a lot done with a little. But as we grow, it's clear. it's clear that I need to hire people for specific roles and accept that I can't do everything.

I'm very used to getting stuff done and doing everything myself and it feels a little weird trusting someone else to do it. How can I shift my mindset to appreciate being a manager over an individual contributor? So straight up out of the gate, you are actually failing as a leader by doing what you're doing. But by doing to do things yourself getting the weeds and not let people lead you're actually failing as a leader and therefore failing the team So number one you have to watch out for that and you know by the way that means the more time that you spend in the weeds Getting stuff done yourself because you're so perfect that's the last time that you're thinking about strategy That's the last time you're thinking about you know what's going to happen tomorrow and future operations and that's not good to be in that situation.

So, first of all, you need to build the trust with these people. You don't have to give 100% trust to someone out of the gate. If I, if we're in a company and I hire you and I'm going to have you doing some task, that doesn't mean I say, hey, echo, here's the task, go do it. And now I'm just going to walk away. I don't even know you. I don't know how well you can do the task. So I'm going to say, hey, echo, here's the task.

ask actually watch me do it okay you've seen me do it now I'm gonna watch you do it okay cool you seem to be doing that pretty well I'm gonna come check on you in two hours see how it's going come back two hours next day I check you once every five hours next day I check you in the morning I check you once in the afternoon next day I just check you a lunch time maybe two three four days later I check you once every other day pretty soon you're good to go and guess what I'm doing I'm doing something else doing something that I should be doing I built the trust I confirm that you know how to do it I you trust me because now I trust you

we're building some team and some relationship so that's all good so to the original point though I think the way that you shift your mindset is to recognize that micromanagement is actually failure no progress is made while you're micromanaging the longer you are micromanaging someone the longer it takes for them to develop as a human being and as a useful person in your organization Every minute that you Micromanage someone is a minute of them not thinking for themselves Is a minute for them not taking ownership of something

If I'm micromanaging your task, you're not taking ownership of it If you're not taking ownership of it we know where that leads So let people learn let people lead and to not do that is failing Don't fail One time when I was young in Hawaii you get your driver's license at 15 I don't know how what it is now That was a long time ago, obviously. But I learned to drive with my dad before that, you know, when we're young.

We'd get in quite as dirt roads everywhere. So he's like, hey, you know, and it started with when we're young, when we're young, like seven, eight years old. We'd sit on his lap. So he'd do the shifting and the gas and the brake and stuff like that. Dirt roads, we'd just do the steering. That's what it kind of started with. Then after a while, he's like, okay, now we're just going to learn how to do this, you know, it was a manoeuvre, stick shift so he was like okay now you just learn how to go right and now it's going shift gears

all on the dirt road whatever and so I was like 50 just turned 15 or maybe even 14 and he was like hey he's like all right let's go drive no usually it'd be like we're going to the beach on the way home hey let's take this dirt road you can steer kind of thing but this was actually like okay let's go drive so I'm like all right but he plops me in the front seat and he goes all right take us there and we're going wherever we were going down to the beach He's like, all right, take us there. I was like, dang. I don't know, but I've steered before.

I've shifted. I haven't done the whole thing all at once, but he was sitting right there. He just said, take us there. I was like, dope. I took him there, whatever. He didn't critique much, you know? But I got there and he just kind of let it happen. It was the same kind of thing where first he's checking my steering.

Then he's check. This is over time the years. And, yeah, after a while, it's like, boom, he still doesn't I? He's still managing. He's right there. He could slide his foot over to the brake if he needed to, I guess. If need to, yeah. Put his hand on the wheel, steer you away from the oncoming truck.

If need be, yeah. And at the same time, he's letting me make little micro mistakes. I hit the curb a little bit. Yeah, or it was more like, you know, stick shift. You know, you do it too much. Yeah. And he let that happen. Because that's my thing to figure out.

The feel, because each car is different. And it's cool because that's actually good. One time we were going on an operation, my first deployment. to Iraq and We were driving a far distance through cities we'd never been through before and we got turned around in the city and We were had a far way to go to our objective. It was a kind of a high profile operation and We stop and I hear the call on the radio like all stop and

I say something along lines of you know, we What's up and you know the the point man which is the lead nav in the vehicles He comes up in the radio. He's like just trying to get my bearings Little stress in the voice I walk up so I get out of my vehicle just to make him this guy's one of my bros and I walk up to the vehicle and he's in there and I could see he's he's flustered He's flustered and he's you know I don't want to say embarrassed but he's flustered and now I'm there. You know what I mean?

Yes. And I think his thoughts are Jocko's, you know, Jocko's gonna be mad or whatever. Yeah. And I go up and he's, he's cracks open the door, right? I open the door on the Humvee. And I go, you know, what's up, man? Just in the most mellow voice I thought.

I go, hey, what's up, man? He goes, I don't know where we are. I was like cool man we'll set security let me know when you got it dialed and he's like all right cool and that's what we did so cool and it took like you could see his face like he he just turned back computer he started working but when I walked up to him you know he could see that he was panicking yeah because you know you got we had a bunch of vehicles you know you got seven vehicles with us and and and they're all driving around and now you've done two laps around the it's not fun

and you know you make it through and like pass the enemy one time you got away with it. Now you went by him three times? Fishing it, son. Not cool. And everyone in the whole troop is sitting there in the vehicle is going, hold on, jackass is going to run us by this checkpoint again or buy this thing again. Yeah, all of us. So, but yeah, I just went up. Hey, bro, what's going on?

I'm just trying to, I don't know where we're at. Okay. We're going to set security. Let me know when you got it figured out. It'll be good. So good, man. And that's, brother, that's so good on you because you know everyone is feeling the stride, like what you're saying. For sure. It was like dang where is this guy leading us what the hell does he not know what I'm sure everyone was feeling that Then it's like all right I got it kind of detached from that feeling and goes you know

Yeah and and then you know I got on the radio because that was you know I just said I said the guy's name I'm like hey just getting it sorted out right now we're gonna be rolling here at about a few minutes when we when we know we're at And everyone's you know set security boom done there was another time we got ambushed on that same deployment sure and I was in vehicle number two and we're in a big convoy and The ambush pretty much was aimed at the center and then the back of the convoy So a bunch of machine gun fire a bunch of RPGs and nothing really hit and in fact nothing did hit the RPGs went over us And and I was I would never say much on the radio right? Sure and the guy in the back vehicle He's actually the platoon chief

But I say I didn't say much but clearly we just got ambushed I mean there was a massive machine gun fire and explosions going off And we power, you know, we go through the, we continue on. And the platoon chief in the back, he says something on the radio, something along the lines of, he's like, you know, comes up on the radio, he's like, hey, Jocko, you know, we just got to hit with an ambush back here. And I got on the radio and I was like, Roger. And, you know, it's like, it's it. You know, and everyone goes, okay, I guess we're all right. It's like, all good. All good in the hood.

You guys are crazy. Yeah. I think you did me like that one day. Yes, in fact, when I say, I think, I mean, I remember the time you did me. Okay, so I was, forgive me right now. You just talked about an actual ambush that actually happened. I'm talking about something way less impactful. Just bear with me.

At least you're asking for forgiveness before you tell a grocery story. It was actually this podcast. We had recorded like a week or something early. So I was like, boom, let me finish the whole thing. Get it ready to get pushed out. All I need, it was done. all I had to do is press the button to make it live. That's all I had to do.

And this was like a week, I think it might have even been two weeks in advance. Wow, those are the good old days. Yeah, yeah. But, and then the day came, it was so done and out of my mind, the day came and I was just like, hey, I don't know, I don't know.

It's not out of my mind. So long story short, I didn't do it. So I didn't press publish. It was ready to go. Anyway, so I wake up in the morning as he message a bunch of Twitter posts. I understand that, but I got a text message. I think there might even been a phone call.

Oh, no, no, no. It was a phone call and a text message from you. I was like, this, you know, this is something, you know. I'm like, all right. Did you know what it was? No, I had no idea. It was out of my mind. I was like, oh, something obviously is something.

You know, I get this early in the morning, by the way. So I look at it. And so I listened to the voice message first. And it was you all coming. Like, hey, how's it going? Good morning. So as he goes, just to sort of let you know, it's Wednesday, you know, we have that podcast we recorded that's, you know, that's supposed to be going on right now. So whenever you can, whenever you're ready, go ahead and post that.

And it's like, but it wasn't like all the Twitter posts, where's the podcast, bro? Where's the podcast, bro? Where's the fucker? You know, all that. And then there's, joccos, like, hey, whenever you're ready, it's all good, you know? I didn't know what happened. Maybe you're under more stress. I never know. You got to think when you're in a.

Leadership position not that I'm like the leader here but if you're in a leadership position You don't know what someone else is going through maybe you had some technical issue and I'm like gonna call you up me like where's that thing and now you freak out even more I don't need to make it any worse. There's something going on like you were sleeping I didn't want you know but you always think about the perspective of the other person that you're dealing with and you don't want to Escalate yeah that's not gonna help yeah just de-escalate Hey man just wondering what's up if you know if you need anything for me on the podcast maybe we need to re-record it I don't know. No big deal. Let me know.

I'll be over. That's what we're here for. Kind of like with two people shouting at each other and you chime in say, Stop drouting! And you're shouting. I got three people shouting. Yeah, yeah. Messing it up.

Anyway, next question. Jocko. I'm not sure I agree with your statements not to pursue belts in Jiu-Jitsu. It doesn't seem wrong to me to benchmark success using a rise in rank as a quantifiable measure of success. as a person is working to master their craft any craft it's nice to have markers for accomplishment and Engagement why have belts why have belts if they're not to be strived for or why have them right yeah and that's actually a a little conversation I I had that I as soon as he asked me this this is with Brandon no brandon pickworth yeah He's he's been around like since day one in in in the game here and We were going back and forth on something he just

He actually sent me this random because he sent me text about stuff, you know, whatever, we're doing some projects and whatnot and He sent me this random thing Well, I guess it's random to me. It was random to him. Maybe he just listened to a podcast where we were talking about this, but he said you know, hey I don't know you know, I don't know what to do this stuff about belts Yeah, and so and by the way Brandon is had a goal of doing a hundred burpees in 10 minutes Brandon is in good shape. He's an athlete yeah athletic dude and And for some reason he can't do 100 burpees in 10 minutes. I don't know where he's at right now

We are publicly calling him out yeah to post his You know video video no cuts no cuts yeah or maybe doesn't have to post the whole thing I take his word for it because he's owned it a bunch of times he'll put like He'll do a hundred in or no I think what he's been doing he's been doing 10 minutes worth However many he can do he gets like 84 yeah, so and he'll post it like I did 84 and 10 minutes Was that you can do 10 sets of 10? Yeah, 10's at 1. 10 every 10 every minute or something.

It'd have to be less because actual burpees will take a certain amount of time. Yeah. Yeah, that's kind of hard. I'm telling you 10 in a minute is not that hard. Yeah, but plus your rest. 10 burpee pull-ups in a minute is harder. Yeah. But still a good measure.

So just regular burpees. But back to the conversation. Sure. I'm going to try that, by the way. Okay. So Brandon hit me up and and you know I understand belts you know and it's because we've said on here like don't worry about belts don't worry about the belts the belts are going to come I understand belts and I understand trying to earn a rank and that's cool but I'm telling you at some point and I think this will happen to everybody at some point jiu jitsu becomes a lot more than just belts and

eventually the jiu jitsu itself completely bypasses what the belts are and what the belts mean now I could you could say back to me like well that's because you're a buck belt. Yeah. And so that's why you feel that way because of course they don't matter to you. You're already a black belt, you know, but the fact is that that didn't happen to me at black belt. That happened to me at like purple belt. I think about midway of my purple belt time, I had no care whatsoever of what belt color I was. This is literally zero. And I just wanted to get better. I just wanted to know more. I just wanted to keep training and never even thought about it after that. And And even like degrees on your on your black belt

Like Pete I was talking to Pete Roberts the other day He's like well what degree are you? You know he's a black ball in my black ball He's like what degree are you and I was like I don't know I don't know I got my black belt in 2005 what does that mean you know what I mean like I don't have the tape on there with how many degrees I am Not that I don't respect it yeah, but I just don't care for me personally So and I think that This isn't like he's like Brandon talked about you know to master any crafts I think it's the same with any craft that you're trying to master Yeah if you're trying to master the craft

Hopefully and eventually The craft itself becomes more important than the rank that comes with being skilled at the craft Yeah, that's what I would hope for that's what by the way that also makes it a lot easier to keep pursuing because I don't care I'm not sitting there going I hope I hope I get a stripe on my belt today. No, I don't care if I get a stripe my belt. I want to go learn more. Yeah. And guess what's going to propel you towards more stripes? Wanting to learn more. Yeah. Wanting more stripes does not propel you towards getting more stripes and getting advanced in any craft is getting better at that craft. So focus on getting better at the craft. Yes, sir. The belts are

going to come. Yes, sir. Even your belt's going to come one day. Preach it. I'm not concerned with belts. We're glad you're not. You ain't got much in your future. nonetheless yeah and I think that this it's like a matter of perspective okay first off you being a black belt and thinking that or whatever and be like yeah that's easy it seems like that's obvious that oh it's easy for you to say because you're a black belt but at the same time doesn't kind of go along with that detachment thing

it's like hey I'm not in the game there's no reason for me to be striving for any belt right now so I can be detached I'm not emotionally invested in the whole situation I can look back in and at the same time understand when I came up me being focused on belts would not have got me here. You know, like you have that clear vision. Hey, that's natural. It's a natural thing to be like a blue belt.

And I wish I could wear that purple belt. And everyone would know me and respect me as a purple belt. And I'm tapping some of the purple belts right now. Yeah. And bro, do you do this? I don't know if you know this, but if you know the feeling of wanting that purple belt really bad and I just want that purple belt and your skills from your, from your instructor's standpoint,

Don't match purple belt and promotion time comes long and you're okay. This is the damn I get my and you don't get that purple belt bring you know how sad you're gonna be real I had I've known people that quit the gym straight up because they didn't get built Um promoted on on a on a certain day and you know what that is the day that's really sad it is it's sad from the bottom for sure that's a side note But I guess sad was neither right word word well it's sad for them. Yes like because if you if you're in that zone where you should be getting your purple belt at some time and Maybe this promotion, maybe next promotion, maybe some other promotion. That means you're dedicated jih Tutsu. And now you're just going to walk away because you didn't get the belch. Yeah. Yeah, it's rough.

And like I said, like that state of mind can really, really jam me up. Yeah, man, true story. And I've heard of people where they didn't get their belt and then maybe someone else did. Not maybe straight up. Other people did. And it was their belt, you know? Oh, they're all mad. Super mad to the point where they're vocal about it.

I tap that guy out. Why did he get his belt openly? Saying that. So, yeah, it'll jamming. you up just that whole mindset one thing you know I would say to those people that might be thinking that way for my perspective and for many jiu jitzu instructors the the you're you're advancing and you're getting promoted based on your potential not based on your skill level to yeah like yeah your ability to you might be you might not have a lot of potential and so you know what

hey man the guys you know he can't train he's you know 68 years old And he's been training for a year and a half He's learned a lot of knowledge He's here all the time He can't tap out any other blue belts We're giving him his blue belt

Because for potential of him As a 68 year old man that never worked out before Now he's training jiu jitsu Do that guy's a blue belt Yeah Now the further you go up You know black belt is a little bit more serious So is brown

So is purple But I'm saying you're getting judged against yourself and that's an extreme example by someone else by the way not by yourself you're being judged by your instructor not yourself yeah that's right that's right so yeah man and that's the and that's a important thing and what's what's your to your point everything that we're talking about right now makes jiu jitsu suck right it makes it makes it it'll make you mad it'll make you frustrated it'll make you it'll make it political and this guy got it and i didn't know that's for me i just don't even like that stuff yeah you know don't even

like that stuff yeah when you're ready your instructor's gonna promote you yeah until then keep training yeah and and by the way also in your work skills when you're ready to get promoted you'll get promoted yeah and if you're not ready you won't or there's not an opening you won't you know what you do to solve that don't get frustrated don't get all crazy don't blame the guy that did get promoted don't undermine him you know what you do keep kicking ass you know wait next time it'll be your turn Yep enjoy what you're doing master your craft Yes sir don't let your craft become your master

I just said that yeah I liked it. Yeah and that's what happens right? Yeah, you let the thing control you Instead of you controlling the thing instead of you mastering it it's starting to master you and get in your head Yeah, but he does make a good point and here's the thing is that this is a mix of perspective So where um or a clashing of perspectives where he's like Like, you know, as a person working to master their craft, any craft, it's nice to have markers for accomplishment and engagement. It's true. Yeah. And you know what I actually texted back to him?

I'm like, hey, man, I know I'm not normal. Yeah. I'm not normal. Yeah. And all I need is a rock and a hill. Yeah. That's what I texted to him. And he laughed, right?

Mm-hmm. But so there are normal people that need to have like, I want a goal. I want to see. I want to have a checkpoint. And that's okay. Yeah. And that's why, guess what? There are belts in jiu-jitsu.

And you can get certain I don't we don't really give a lot of stripes out at at victory like me Jeff Glover Mean Lister Craig James I mean we'll give out like occasional stripes you know for various reasons But most of the time it's like oh the guy's ready for his next belt right let's give it to him Yeah and usually the stripes are that's a subtle thing in my opinion like I've the stripes don't Reflect much compared to what belts you know nonetheless I mean yeah cool back in the day you like a four striped blue belt right that guy was the deal but he's saying you know and you know what to to degrade what you're saying and what Brandon saying you know when we do a lot of stripes and a lot of different colored belts kids right and that's going to be the point yeah

and as a grown ass adult Brandon no as a grown man you should be like I'm just here to learn yeah to get after well to me what he's saying doesn't clash with what you're saying in my opinion no it's a matter of thing with Brandon is Brandon is you know I don't know him that well but you know we go back and forth a lot he's a guy that's like metric driven you know like I'm gonna get this I'm gonna get this I'm gonna get that and that's awesome that's what makes him successful and in what he does and the craft that he has mastered very successful but he likes to have those yeah those measurements yeah let's have metrics to go off and say look I just crushed this this goal boom

done yeah so well yeah and so with belts is gonna be a little bit different just like with promotions and you know based on skill so you he says it's nice to have markers and here's the thing it is nice of course after after when you got your black belt for you to say I don't care the fact that I got this black belt I don't care about that at all I don't know if I would believe no no you're you'd be correct yeah you'd be correct I was I was stoked yeah it's just a matter of what you're striving for being kind of surprised me too like I wasn't expecting it right which should tell you something yes I wasn't in there like tonight's probably You can be the big night.

No, I like showed up at the gym and trained or whatever. And then all of a sudden it was special ceremony time. And I got the black belch. Yeah. And I was stoked for sure. Yeah. I was stoked. But you know what's funny is like at the team like people, people like I don't know who heard about it.

But people like, hey man, I heard you cut your black belt. And I was like, yeah, yeah. But I didn't tell anyone. Right. I wasn't like, hey, everyone, I got my black belt. Yeah, yeah. You know. Right.

But yeah. You know what? You know what belt I cared the most about was my purple belt. Yeah. When I got my purple belt, I was super pumped. Yeah. At that time, it was a big deal. Yeah.

Getting your purple belt. I got my purple belt from Fabio Santos. Yeah. I think that's a big deal. No. Back in the day. You had to earn that thing. Yeah.

And you know what? And I don't know because obviously I wasn't there at that time. But I think it's always going to be like that. If you get a purple belt, that's a big deal. Yeah. Purple belt's a big deal. Yeah. Purple belt is definitely a big deal.

Because there's just so many people now doing Jiu-Jitsu. No, Purple Belt is a legitimate, when you're a purple belt, you will not lose in a fight to a normal person. No. In my opinion. Could you get caught with a punch? Yeah, sure. Yeah.

But a normal, you know, you've got a very high, high percentage of winning a fight against a normal person if you are a purple belt in Jiu-Jitsu. Yeah. A good purple belt. Yeah. Meaning not someone that just, like, got a purple belt for no reason. Right, right. You're a real purple belt jitsu.

I mean a purple belt You're rolling like when I roll with the purple belt It's a good roll yeah, you know It's a good role. It's not like oh this guy's just a purple belt Right blue belt Most blue belts You don't have to worry about much of anything Yeah when you're at a higher level

Yes, yes Yeah, I mean you're not worrying when you're rolling with most blue belts, right? I'm worried when I roll with everybody Yeah I said well no no no worried No, I'm just joking Yeah I dig it It's not about me being I'm not saying you're disrespectful, but I'm not saying you're disrespectful to a blue belt,

but realistically you know that chances are there's no possible way for them to submit you. Very small chance. Yeah, yeah, the skill levels don't match up. Purple belt slap a triangle on you or something. And purple balls grab your arm somewhere. Oh, yeah. Yeah, that can have Noah. You rolled with Noah lately?

Yeah, he taught me out. Oh, dang. Yeah, I mean, not like the, but yeah, like within the last year. Yeah. Yeah. He straightened my arm out real. Yeah, I had to go into level nine defense mode Since the emergency escalated. Oh, I went through full and I any surprised me that was the thing

You know we're rolling and and all of a sudden and he's a purple belt that's there you have it. There's a classic example in this in the defense No I'm gonna give him I'm gonna give him a nickname right now good. I'm gonna give him a nickname right now good Because he's good and he's very handsome by the way. He's better than I'll let you judge that one He's better than a typical purple bout though. Oh no, yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah, but now Nonetheless, to your point, that's exactly to your point, though. If you have a purple belt, you're, you're not, you're not, you don't have many holes. No, maybe some timing things, maybe some, you know, whatever, but good. Yeah, he's a classic example.

Yeah. Noah's a good purple belt. Watch out. But yeah, you don't pursue back. You know what, Noah asks me all the time, when do I get my brown belt? No, I'm just kidding. He never said word one. No, he doesn't care.

Yeah. He's the type of dude that's like, hey, I'll just sit around and tap everyone out. Maybe one day they'll get me a belt. Maybe they won't. Whatever. I'm going to keep crushing it. Yeah. And that's how and so-

Taping out Echo Charles. I know, bro. What's up? Did you give him your brown belt once you got tapped out by him? I wanted to. Actually, you know what's cool? When you get tapped out by a lower belt,

it's like, guess what? Jiu-jitsu works. They should be able to wear your belt for the rest of the day. For the rest of your life. Demote yourself. No, Jiu-Jitsu works. If you do a jiu-jitsu move against me,

I'm going to tap out to it. Yeah. Like, that's the way it works. You know, I might try the defense, but the jiu-jitsu works. Yes, sir. I mean we just saw Roger Gracie hodger Gracie against Bucchetch. Yeah, and people were a little bit freaked out. I was like yeah, Jiu Jiu works. Yeah, you know, get that choke on Bucchetech is it an animal, a savage. Yes, but get that gie collar sunken choke. You got you got, you got Jha Gracie X amount of times world champion. Can you imagine his grip strength that you rolled with him? Yes. Yeah. Grip strength. How was his grip strength? it was really good

and not to go into a whole thing about Hodges' game but he has this thing where this is weird if you don't know the depths of Jiu-Jitsu but he has this feeling that he has all bases covered so he's not necessarily his game isn't to out-hustle you, it's not to out-speed

you and it's not to out-strength you for sure but it's like he it's like he has this whole base like all his bases in the Jiu-Jitsu situation they're all covered so he'll do this thing that, and he was trying to do it on Boucherche, but, you know, Boucherche is really, really good.

He'll grab one sleeve with the opposite hand. He'll grab the elbow. And he'll just, from close guard, by the way, and he'll just wind up on your back and there's nothing you can do about it. All your little defenses, he's got those covered. No problem. And it's just this thing that it's like this eventuality

that you have no defense for it. That's how it feels, his whole game. Yeah. So, yeah, I mean, it's crazy that he was able to bring that same game to someone like Buchesha. Yeah, he was like, he's like, he's a thing. Yeah, it's just crazy. But yeah, that's how nonetheless, back to the point,

it don't pursue the belt. That's not the pursuit. The pursuit is getting better. The belts will come. When the belt comes to the, to, um, Brandon's point, when the belt comes, that is nice.

And to me, when you get your belt from your instructor, not from yourself. Yeah. When you get, well, if you're, but if you're the guy who's getting mad,

if you're the guy that's getting mad and because you think you should have got your belt, you're thinking you're getting your belt from yourself. That's what you're thinking. Oh, in your head, yes. Yes, exactly. Right. So forget that. I'm ready.

Yeah, I'm ready. Exactly. It's not up to you. It's not up to you. You can tap out all the black belts. It's still not up to you. It's up to your instructor. Anyway, when you get your purple belt, brown belt black belt, yeah, that's, bro.

I would say this happens more times than not. If you're a blue belt, you're getting good. You're learning a lot. When you get a purple belt, that's going to empower you so much to be like, now my standard just mentally is higher now I'm a purple belt now that's my minimum standard right now well a purple belt is full on in the game yeah yeah right you you can't really be super casual and get a purple belt right I'm saying where you're casual or not yeah I'm saying it is empowering and it is you you're gonna have a lot of pride with that well I

wouldn't say empowering I would say it puts you it it it raises the bar on you yeah like You're wearing a purple ball you can't be you know you now you're like I can't tap these blue belts anymore You might but I'm saying yeah same thing to me tomato tomatoes raises the bar yeah Would you say it raises your standards? Yeah of rolling like my own state basically exactly what you said Yeah, I got to represent yes you know all this stuff it's like it comes with a sense of price Yes it's a huge it's a deal and that's why also when you're a blue belt enjoy being a blue belt you can take more risks you can get tapped out doesn't matter you let it flow Yeah let it flow 100% But yeah, when you get that belt, yeah, be happy, be prideful, posted on Facebook,

and, you know, thank your training partners, all that stuff. But don't just pursue the belt, man. It'll jam you up big time. Next question. I'm a 24-year-old machinist. I work CNC machines, do setups, and order tooling. Most of the people I work with have worked here for over 15 years. The owner of my company wants to make me the shop manager,

and honestly, I'm not too tore up about it. I feel like the older guys who've been around won't, Want to take scheduling and manufacturing advice from a young guy. I have good relationships with all the the shop guys, but I'm worried about stepping into this role so soon Only been with a company for three years any advice Okay, your boss isn't asking you to do this job if you're not ready for it That's that's number one and the fact that you don't think you're ready is a good sign I've said this before Because it means that you're humble so you feel like that that's good. That's probably one of the reasons why you're doing well and probably one of the reasons that your boss thinks you're ready for the job is because you're home So that's good. But you also have to remember that being humble has to be balanced

dichotomy of leadership with confidence and even with a little bit of aggression. So there's a reason that you're getting asked to do this job and the boss needs you to step up now just because you become the manager the boss doesn't mean that you have to start bossing people around right it actually means that you should remain humble that you should take input from them that you can still take advice from them as opposed to just giving them advice All those things are fine and I just got to ask this question the other day young construction business and a kid we were in a big meeting with a with a bunch of leadership from Foreman to engineers all in the same room bunch of great guys from a great company and he one of the young engineers raised his hand and said you know I'm young and I am gonna be in charge of these guys you know I'm not sure I'm comfortable with these guys that have been doing it for a lot longer what can I do to

You know gain their respect and I said okay Who in this room knows more than that engineer back there about construction and all these salty construction foreman's raised their hands and I said who you know who's gonna think that this guy's got the best idea raise your hands all the hands go down And I said so this is what you're dealing with buddy I said now let me ask another question the group and Group if this kid comes in and says I know how to do this better than you Listen to me and do it my way who's gonna have respect for him raise your hand no hands go up If this young kid comes in and says hey

I'm an engineer I've been educated but I haven't been doing this for long Can you give me some recommendations on how we do this so we can do the best job possible who's gonna have respect for him Everyone raises their hand so there you have it You you don't have to know everything as a leader No one expects you know everything, especially as a young leader. That's okay. And actually, when you admit that, you actually gain respect. When you ask for people as input, you actually gain respect. People get the paranoid feeling that if they don't know something, they're going to be seen as weak. It's not true.

So you can just step up into the position, still be humble, still take advice. Now, this doesn't mean that you're a pushover, right? This doesn't mean that you just listen to what everyone says. You don't make any decisions. No, it actually means that you show respect to their experience and when it comes time to make a decision You get the best input and then you make a decision and you explain your decision and if your decision is wrong, you admit it and if it's not wrong you push forward So that's what you need to do you're getting asked to be put in this position for a reason. So do it It seems like a common one, yeah? That one I'm stepping in the new role for sure everyone asked that question

Yeah, man. I answered it again There you go for everyone's benefit including my own yeah I learn from it every time That's the ethos, right? Go in humble. Yeah. Be open-minded, take advice. Yes, yes, yes. Don't have to know everything, yes.

Three days ago. Uh-huh. Our neighbor, young girl, one of my daughter's friends. 12 years old. Mm-hmm. She comes over, they're messing around, they're swimming. She grabs my daughter's jump rope, and she's jumping rope. She does the cross.

You know, you jump rope and you cross, crossover, whatever. Yeah. Cross over, yeah. So she does that. And man, I used to jump rope back in the day, but I never really could do the crossover. Let's face it. Nonetheless, so she's jump roping and jumping rope. And I'm like, hey, do that cross the crossover thing again.

She does it. She's doing, you know, she's 12 years old. She's like, dang, I never could do that. And she's like, well, you just got to do it like this until that. So I'm like, oh, okay, I grab the rope. And I try. And the rope's too small. So I go grab my rope.

Yeah, I got a jump rope. Well, I told my daughter to grab it. So she grabs it. And this is like a kind of like one of those pro speed ropes, you know. So it's like kind of. So if I make a mistake on this rope, it's going to hurt. I didn't have any shoes. I was barefoot.

Hawaiian style for sure, 100%. And then, so I go forward. I'm jumping jump rope's still pretty good right now. Still, I haven't done it in a while. And she goes, okay, so right here at the top, you know, you cross. This is where you want to cross at the top. I try it. Ooh, it hits my foot, painful.

And she's like, no, you got to do more at the top. No. No, no, no, no, never show the pain to the kids. Good. I try not to. Anyway, so I was like, okay, boom, fail. She's like, no, more at the top, you know, it'll, it'll just whatever. So I'm like, okay, I do it. And it took me four times. On my fourth time, I did it.

For the first time in my life, by the way, the crossover, with a painful speed rope. Some, you know, some mental fortitude right there. For sure. So, I did it. You should have seen it. Very hardcore. but you should have seen the look on her and my daughter's face. They were like, oh, like it was, you know, like I just got my purple belt or something.

Nonetheless. So boom, what do we have right there, a situation? This is what I took from it too. We have a situation, a full-grown athletic, arguably person, learning to do something that's really not that easy, obviously, if I've never done it in my life. learning to do something that takes a fair amount of skill from a 12 year old girl in real time

and you know what I did to boot gave her the credit I said dang you are the best teacher you have been going to the muster yes exactly right so that's the thing you're still humble

the moral of your story which was a long story yeah yeah be humble you can learn from anybody and when you do learn from someone give them the credit boom that's what I did see I said that in 13 seconds. I know, bro, but I'm just saying it was impactful and it reminded me of that story.

Anyway, next question, Jocco. Just checked out podcast 21 with Tim Kennedy. Awesome. Raised a big time question though. You and Tim agreed that cops who make controversial decisions slash mistakes do so simply because they're not trained well enough. That begs the question. How much does the environment someone trains in impact their decision making? How much tactical decision making is innate versus learned could killing the ideology that that the insurgents buy into be better than killing insurgents or can they simply not be reasoned with at any level there have been terrorists who flee their organizations and start new peaceful lives in other locations okay yes so the first part of the question yes you train how you fight and the more

you train the more you reprogram your instincts so that's important you're reprogramming your instincts when you train and you get better instincts So that's what you do and and now when cops make mistakes Oftentimes it's because of their lack of training sometimes they make a mistake That is a mistake that got made you know it's it's a mistake. That's all it is and they've been trained well and they still make a mistake I'm gonna tell you the percentage of mistakes go down dramatically the more that you train and the more realistically trained and the more often you train you're going to get better no doubt about it but that's like an instinct you're training your

instinct so that's one thing this this idea that we could just attack an ideology of terrorists and then have some of them convert that be a wonderful thing that you attack the ideology and then some of them become peaceful productive members of society and if we did like a full court press to try and make this happen we might be able to convert Let's say we were really successful we might be able to convert five or ten percent a year Okay, so that's great then you have to remember that the enemy is also out there converting people right? Probably at at least equal rate Maybe even a little bit higher

So we still end up losing the fight because to break even is to lose because they're still out there doing what they're do the And in the meantime, by the way, they're still gaining territory or causing terror. So it's not a good situation. Now, the examples that I use all the time, obviously, are Nazi Germany and Imperial Japan. Both of those groups were, like the current day jihadists, they were looking to take over the world. and if we just tried to kill their ideas with our ideas, we would be speaking German right now because we would not, we couldn't have changed their ideas fast enough.

And by the way, they were playing a different game. If we were playing the game of let's change ideas, the enemy is playing a different game. So for instance, if someone is trying to assault you and you're a pacifist, So you decide that you're going to try and convince them of the virtues of nonviolence through through debate and the socratic method and critical analysis and the use of various rhetorical devices and that's what you're going to do and you might be the best debater in the

entire world but none of those things are going to stop that assaulter from punching you in the face he's playing a different game and once you're on the ground he's going to start kicking you he's a violent person now maybe if you were to be able to slow him down long and to try and reason with him he's not playing that game though he's there to attack you he's there to stab you so your ideas aren't gonna defeat his ideas you don't have the opportunity to do that he's not playing debate so you have to know how to fight you have to understand a violence and you have to be prepared to use it and if you can if you can debate and you can win that's awesome that's

awesome but if it doesn't work you need to be prepared to use violence as it's needed and that's the same thing on a larger scale obviously we can do everything we can to try and help snuff out this extremist ideology let's prop up reformists as much as we can let's try and bring economic opportunities to these impoverished and deprived regions so that they're less likely to come under the psychological grips of a death cult but at the same time that we're doing those procedures let's attack their strongest factories of hate let's go after their centers of gravity and let's snuff out and destroy those individuals that clearly have no hope of reform and exist only to spread this cancer

of hate and violence and terror and death and if we attack on both those fronts Hopefully one day where we can live in a world where we can solve problems not with physical force but with our intellectual power and that would be great and And unfortunately, I don't think that day will ever come Because there's always going to be someone out there That's going to attack you regardless of your debating skills Next question. Yeah, long question here. Yeah.

My general question is, is there a point where it's no longer physically realistic To train Jiu Jitsu? Big Jiu Jitsu today on the podcast. Yeah, Jiu Jitsu heavy. Jiu Jitsu day, yeah. And actually, I noticed we were going back to Jiu Jitsu a lot yeah yeah we took some questions that weren't about jiu jitsu yeah we turned them into jih Tjitsu questions jiu jitsch and happens sometimes yeah I'm a

former competitive athlete but have experienced various injuries that I still work through on a daily basis I really want to get into jiu jitsu but my only hesitations are my lingering injuries I don't know anyone who trains so I don't have any sense of how much is too much when it comes to physical limitations and injuries I'm sure you must have had injuries over the years that hindered your training. Were you able to modify your training to accommodate them? Although I have no experience, I greatly respect the martial arts. And the last thing that I would want to do is waste the instructor or other students' time

by not being able to fully participate and or holding up the class. I hope this question can benefit other podcast listeners who may be wondering the same thing. However, to give you full detail in reference to the question, I'm 26 and the injuries I'm dealing with are There's the list Left knee that I need to work on daily to maintain full range of motion on my third ACL Meaning he had surgery three times Hmm well yeah he's had three actually said he had hurt surgery seven times but that's his third ACL

Oh ACL oh yes third ligament been put in there Dang yeah because they replace the ligament yeah, because it doesn't grow back and it doesn't heal so they got to give you a cadaver or they either give you your own From your hip or your yeah from your Yeah, or hamstring or patel. Or hamstring. And they put that in there or they give you a cadaver one. Yeah, I had that. I had ACL back in the-

cadaver? My own from my hamstring. Okay. I've had seven surgery. Well, I haven't. Back to the question. I've had seven surgeries. Most recent being a femoral osteotomy in cadaver meniscus transplant.

There you go. I'm told one more major injury to the joint and I'm looking at a full knee replacement. Dang it, 26-2. Left shoulder dislocated several times torn ligament, cartilage, and labrum Don't plan on having the surgery anytime soon and his and a history of multiple concussions I power lift jog Metcon Hell yeah Regularly, but all cutting sports But all cutting sports are pretty much out of the question

I think so cutting all sports. Yeah, yeah, gotcha No, he says but all cutting sports are pretty much meaning cutting you know you know when you cut on the field? Oh cutting Gotcha okay cutting left cutting right I'm pretty sure that's what he means okay yeah I thought he meant yeah because he can power left He can jog he can do Mac cons but he can't cut gotcha Check okay either way I get I got you Sports are pretty much other question if jiu jitsu isn't feasible do you recommend any other martial art that would Better fit my situation just getting tired of only trying trying to stay physically fit and would rather incorporate a beneficial skill into my training Or is this all in my head and I should stop worrying and just get after it? Thank you for

Any advice you can offer a podcast. Thank you for your service. All right. Awesome. So I kind of broke these out. Let me let me break these out here. So his first general question is there a point where is no longer physically realistic to train J Jitza? The answer to that really is yes, but you can also train Jiu Jitsu in a wide variety of levels of intensity of very wide. You could theoretically just go and learn the techniques. Yeah. You could just learn the techniques and never actually rolled to someone. And if you couldn't do anything at all, that would in my opinion. I would still do that. Yeah. Just to just to know and understand it. I would still do that. Yeah. Would you agree? Yes. And now what you have to be watch out for is that you're going to want to try him. Yeah. You're going to want to try him and someone real. And that's just that's what you're going to need want to do. Now, you know, like I said, you can do it from just from just learning the techniques only to all the way to competing in jiu jihitsu. And like I said, you got to watch out. that you if you can only learn them and maybe you can roll light maybe you can find you can roll with light people or you can roll with really good brown belts that are light and that that you tell them you know up front hey I got injuries I'm not here to for an ego trip I just want to try the moves you better freaking keep your ego in check though which is what's so hard because you're

gonna think this guy's kind of skinny I think I could do this right now I think I get out of this and then you end up getting hurt so you can't let that happen. So don't let your ego get in the way you might not want if you have all those serious injuries like it sounds like you have You may not want a role with anybody for a long time until you really truly understand Jiu Jitsu so that's question number one. Yes, you can learn it without much risk actually Very limited risk if you're just looking to learn the techniques you could learn it with very limited risk Now the next question Have I had injuries over the years and was I able to modify my training to accommodate them? Absolutely

Yeah, I've had ankle, you know, sprained ankles, high sprains, all that stuff and when that happens, you see me training my bottom game a bunch because I'm not going to be on top. I hurt my back one time really bad and I couldn't do an umpah. This was when I was a blue belt. Couldn't do an umpa. Couldn't do it Guess what I did? Elbow escape My elbow escape got good Because I could not do an umpa I've had my MCL

80% tear Get some Guess what No factor Put on And I couldn't train For like a couple weeks But then I put on one of those

Hinged metal braces Strap that thing on tight Could I do close guard No Could I do a triangle on someone No Did I have to be careful? Yes

Did I train? Absolutely My neck I had neck surgery and you know my neck now does it hurt yeah though I and my whole game is kind of based fundamentally around protecting my neck so I don't do certain moves that I used to do that were that are high risk neck moves interesting right like yeah there's just certain moves that I just don't do anymore because it's high risk neck move and I don't want to put my neck

into just into jeopardy so yes you do go through things now occasionally like I just got through a few weeks where I had three simultaneous injuries and it was a broken knuckle some kind of a knee issue and I had a gaping cut on my toe my big toe ripped half the skin off the bottom of my toe and so I said to myself okay I'll just tape up my entire body and still train no I didn't say that I said you know what this is you know my body telling me you know one injury you can get through two injuries okay wait a second but when I finally tore my toe open I was like okay maybe it's time to take like some time away from the mat so I didn't train for a few weeks right probably the longest I haven't trained in it since I

can't remember but that's three injuries stacked on top of one another and now I'm just thinking to myself you got to be kidding me let them all heal and that's what I did so that's that the next sort of question was if jiu jitsu isn't feasible do you recommend any other martial art that would be better fit your situation I think you can always learn jihitsu I think you could learn to box you could learn moitai you got to be careful with moitai you got the knee surgeries you got I would say little no sparring since you've had concussions and like I said in all those cases you're gonna learn to box you're like well I think I want to try this out man looks pretty easy in that sparring ring I'm gonna get in

there don't you've already have concussions you can't you got to keep your ego and check and then the last part of the question was or is this all in my head and I should just stop worrying and get after it look we all have got to know our limitations you got to also know that sometimes you're putting limitations on yourself that are too tight and you also got to realize that sometimes you can push yourself too hard and overdealing It and end up in a really rough spot where you got a permanent injury like you know right my my knee is not fully healed And so instead of doing nine rounds of Jiu jitsu I did like four yesterday five yesterday five today you know not and and and avoiding a couple positions right?

You know that's what I'm doing yeah that's okay I can't go in there you can have the big ego and be like I'm gonna be on top right now. No Yeah, can't do it and the more impact I can't have the big ego if like somebody comes up like hey let's roll right like okay. I'll roll with you because I don't want to look like a wuss Yeah, yeah no actually I got an injured knee can't roll right now which I hate saying yeah I despise saying that I despise saying that I I despise it But I know that you know I got to heal up Yeah, man so part of the game. Yeah, that's yeah you go and check Remember Jerry Loudon? Yeah, so he had jammed up knees and I thought of him

You know well you know You know reading this guy's question Yeah Same age maybe I don't know Jay or maybe maybe like 32 or something Yeah so jammed up knees But you know he Jiu Jitza guy so he comes in

And what he'd always do is he'd be like hey Lits he'd grab me because I've known him long time Roll him in many times He'd be like hey Lits he what he called it is he's like hey Do you want to play meaning like we're just rolling You know just like how you said like you Like how I warm up with Andy Yes exactly right yeah

He's really good for that too by the way. Now Dean is not good for that. Okay, so don't roll with Dean. Dean will literally say to me, hey, let's just get warmed up. And then he'll get across side and smash me for four minutes and 38 seconds. Yeah, yeah, yeah. And torture me. So I do not do warm-up rounds with Dean.

Yes. Way different. You can go to hell. No warm up rounds with you. And obviously Dean does that on purpose. Oh, for sure. If like new guys. Because when we do that, when we do that, Dean has two advantages.

Number one, I'm not warm. And that means there's no sweat yet so he's so there's there's like just friction Yeah, yeah, and he can just secure positions and it sucks and and Psychologically we both know oh and the other the other advantage that he has is he's fresh Because the deeper we go into deep waters the better I'm doing because I'm in better condition than him I dig it man, but he has those two advantages out of the gate He's gonna make me pay so funny you can tell no, it's not like a little thing Oh, it's a thing.

It's a 20-something year thing with Dean. Hey, man. I dig it, and that's probably going to continue to, you know, till you guys are both kind of out of the game. Yeah. Man. Incident yesterday happened. You know?

Hey, what happened? Talk about it. No, I already did. No, no. Words were exchanged loudly. In the gym. Anyway, Jerry is really good with that where this is a guy in this guy's situation, more or less knee-wise anyway.

Yeah. And I think he was even both his knees. Yeah, I think it was. You know, so you can do that and you can get like a good movement, good rolling without that, that impact. You know, every once in a while you got to turn up the heat or whatever on a guy because that comes from ego, yeah. It's more of like this competitive kind of spirit of rolling jiu-jitsu. That's kind of what it is. So if you can avoid that, you've got to actively avoid it and still get that movement if you can find the right person.

And you can go. And you can go. You can learn. You can get more or less live situations. But you just can't be like, you can't fight that. little fight in the fight you know you gotta let that go can get crazy but yeah you can learn for sure you can learn yeah don't do take down if you got a knee situation don't do take down situation that's that's gonna be hard check all right

okay last question and you know this this last question it's it's not really a question well it look I get a lot of awesome emails and I get emails from people that have completely turned their lives around they've they've lost weight if they need to lose weight or they've gained weight because they need to gain weight or they've gotten promoted or they've become a better parent or they've become a better spouse or they become a better kid yeah and I get emails from people that have quit their addictions or they've or they've overcome their fear and I'll tell you what

I get letters and and packages and notes about all this kind of stuff and it's awesome I get I get people send me books for the podcast and in pictures and drawings and and and and military memorabilia or unit patches and coins from your police departments and fire departments and military units it's just it's awesome and and and and and And I'm so thankful for all that feedback. And it drives me. That feedback that I get drives me to work hard and keep pushing to do this to the best of my ability and try and get better at it. But, you know, I hear from people that have used the podcast and the discipline and

the the mindset of looking at things that are problematic as being good I hear from people that have used those things to overcome you know dark patches yeah in their lives you know whether it's depression or anxiety or even like full-fledged despair and again when you hear from people that are turned that corner that's just incredibly rewarding to know that there's you know there's people out there that are really changing for the better and turning their lives from negative to positive it's unbelievably rewarding but I also get some other emails and I get some other messages from people that haven't been able to dig out of that hole to overcome that that despair I hear from people

sometimes that feel there's nowhere nowhere else to go there's no way out and they don't have any more options and they are considering taking the only way out that they can see and that is they want to take their own life and to anybody out there that's in that place you know i don't really know what exactly to tell you but i can kind of tell you what i think i think no i think no i think don't save that last bullet for yourself Don't save it for yourself. You lock and load that last bullet and you shoot it at your enemy. And when you're out of bullets, get out your knife and attack with that.

And if you lose your knife, you grab your enemy by the throat and you keep fighting. And you keep fighting and you keep fighting and you keep fighting no matter what. And you never quit. Never like your life is in a place where you can't get any lower and you don't think You can find any way out because that means the ultimate Challenge is ahead of you it means you can only go up and it also means that things are gonna be Things are gonna be tougher than anything you can imagine but from that you're in from from

From your perspective, it seems like that storm is enveloping the whole world. Telling you, it is not the storm that you're in. It is hard to see out of that storm. It's hard to see past it. It seems like the storm, it seems like the storm is everything. It's not. Get out of the storm. And you will get out of the storm.

And when you get out, you're going to see the sun. tried you're being forged you're being tested by fire and by pain fail the test don't give in don't quit fight on fight through the storm fight through the pain and come out the other side stronger and tougher and better a fighter a A survivor, a winner, free from that storm, free from the darkness. I think that's all I've got for tonight. So, Echo Charles, speaking of being better, you could tell us some ways to make ourselves a little stronger and a little better. Yeah.

And at the same time, possibly support this podcast. If they want to. You're under no obligation to support yourself. Well, I think as a human being you are, but I'm just saying as far as the message here, it's up to you. But if you do want to, what, pursue whatever you want to pursue, your participation is required. Does that make sense? No. Okay.

Anyway, so I'm going to talk about on it. So, good fitness gear, good stuff. I just got some phobic minerals. It's actually for my wife. Nonetheless, they got some good stuff for any area of getting after it that you need to, or that you want supplementation with. So remember that jump rope story I told? Mm-hmm. Right?

That wasn't on it, jump rope. Oh, there you go. Yeah. Pro speed rope, I think it's called. It's like, bro, there's a lot of technological advances in jump rope. Yeah, I know. When we were, you know, elementary school. For me.

Yeah. Just a piece of leather hide. Yeah. Or what was mine like a rope? It was straight up a rope with a handle. Yeah. And another handle at the end. That's it.

This one has like a swivel. It has a thing. It has a pulley system. I don't know. Maybe. I don't know what it's called. It's made out of this stuff. It's like, yeah, it's good.

It's will. It's good. Anyway. Yeah, that jump rope was good. Also kettle bells. Solid. Solid. Heavy.

Heavy. As you need. Varying weights. Right. I bought one for my daughter. The, what is it? The little monkey howler. That's what it's called.

I think it's like 18 pounds or something like that. She can lift it up. She can't swing it. She's dead lifting it though, right? She's deadlifting it. Yeah, yeah, yeah. Good for me. You'd be surprised, man, little kids.

They have a natural instinct for form. Exactly, right? Because they're trying to find the perfect balance. That's why they have no choice. They do off down. They're just going to fall down. My son, 11 months old now, started walking at straight up.

Kind of earlier than my other, like nine, almost 10 months. You know what that means, right? Yeah, yeah, he's going to be also out of him. Oh, that means he's going to be an unbelievable athlete. You're set for life. You need to start getting it recruited right now. That's what everybody thinks.

That's what they say. Everybody's kid is the best kid in the world. Yeah. That's what everybody thinks. And by no means is that my message here. But the message is you watch them do a squat to pick something up. You're like, dang, that's good form. So my daughter, she's four, she picks up the kettlebell, little howler.

And I'm like, first I'm like, oh, shoot, I don't know if she should be picking it up. She doesn't know what she's there. She picks it up with this perfect form, deadlift form. My when my youngest daughter was like six or seven I had her deadlifting And uh straight up had her deadlifted no no and I I pushed her too hard and she was deadlifting and she like her back How old like six or seven I mean she was just doing like double body weight and But it was with kettlebells and so you're not going that low so it makes it a little bit easier so I thought So she was deadlifting and my son was in there too and I think my other daughter we were all just getting after

Sure and you know, so I'm like you can do this you can do this and we're escalating weights and going heavier and heavier and finally we get to like a pretty big weight I forget what it was it might have been It might have been Maybe the 32 kilogram or something like So she lifts it and like right as she gets almost the top She gets the look on her face and like her like moves sharp And then she like started to tear up and she dropped she didn't drop but she put it back down She started a tear up and she's like I think something happened to me back daddy and I was like oh god

I am the worst father ever yeah, you think you are actually don't go with the heavy kettlebells for the kids or heavy deadlifting They're not ready for it yeah I'll go on record trade up and say don't buy kettlebells for your kids or a program that you got sorted out for them And when they're four or 11 months or whatever wait till they're six Don't do it I bought the kettlebells for you Bell because when I go out there she'll watch. I took a picture of one of my daughter of that daughter deadlifting and like posted at one time people were all pumped yeah because it's pretty dope it's dope to see in a picture but man you can't get crazy with that I think if I'm lifting my kettlebells and they're cool there's a werewolf ones and you know all this stuff my daughter's out there she's cruising she's watching she's like you know she obviously let me try let me try and she she wants to get in the game yeah I don't want her to pick up that werewolf it weighs 62 pounds one of them You don't let her? I don't I don't push her to pick that up

No, she'll grab it and try She doesn't pick it up, no It's too heavy for her And so she just wants to be You like dad Yeah, that's all it is So you got to the how how older Just as a little gift

You know, hey, you got your own kettlebell You know how empowering that is? I'm not saying that now now let's Lift kettlebells girl, you're only four Now you're on the pro, it's not that It's for her to have her own little kettlebell And it's like a cohesive thing You know

No, that's cool Just like she likes to do pull-ups, but not really. She's not on a pull-up routine. She reads where your kid, I read it to her. And she sees me doing pull-ups. She's like, my turn, I want to do pull-ups. Now when she's able to get on her own program or be more in a position to facilitate a program imposed upon her, as the case, maybe. Not too early, by the way.

She'll be familiar with pull-ups. She'll know the value of pull-ups, plus dad does pull-ups. So it's obviously cool. Yeah. You know, and she's going to be down. She's going to be kind of set for life in regards to pull-ups. Kettlebells whatever so I like it so back where can you get those? Oh the kettle pulls yes on it. Or the jump or the jump rope or the jump rope's dope nonetheless

Don't I don't think actually do think that those designer kettle bells Those are kind of like the that's the kind of the pre-madonna one actually no said that last time Yeah, that's a wrong word. You're okay with it now I'm okay with it they're dope they're just good. Yeah, you like them They're not like the hardcore dusty yeah Cannon balls with handles you're artistic not the ones I have yeah yeah the ones I have yeah they're not like that I got all the design ones but they are cool if you walk into a gym You know you go to the gym you're wherever and there's a bunch of kettlebells right and you're you're looking for a certain weight and let's say there's the werewolf ones and then there's the regular ones Which ones are you gonna use me is this a serious question or just like a basic question for everyone

What do you think I would use? We're wolf ones probably see that's why You're dope. Well, nonetheless, I think they're cool. And go ahead, check them out. They're on Onet.com slash jocco. That's where you get it. Support yourself, really. And it supports this podcast.

Also, if you're into these books, we didn't read any books. But. I mentioned a few books today. Yeah. Mention Hackworth books. Yeah. Right? I mentioned Dick Winner's books.

Where can you find those books? Well, ultimately, you get them from Amazon like everything else. But if you want to go through the list, the specific books, go to the website. jocklepodcast.com section on the top or menu item on the top boom you to the page with all the books by episode by the way actually I don't think I put extreme ownership on there but nonetheless

click through there that's kind of jacked up well actually is it never to the right yes so that's the thing extreme ownership is but we never covered it in the podcast correct so it's not going to be on the list of books covered in the podcast because the section is called books from the episodes unless maybe all of lay phone it will do extreme ownership. Yeah. That'd be cool. That'd be like layers because you wrote the book, you experienced all the thing with Laif, you do the audio book and

now you're doing it on the podcast. So it's like a thing. Anyway, go to that, go to jockpodcast.com, boom, choose whatever book or books that you want, click through there to get them. Boom. Got you. That's a good way to support. Yep. Very good. It's like, and it's what? It takes what? One second, two seconds and big support. Small action big reaction Just saying You know what you're saying You know what I'm saying you understand

Also good with support is to subscribe That's on iTunes stitcher Google Play And all these other podcasting Providing platforms Not to mention YouTube If you like the video format You wanna see what Jocko looks like If you don't know already

You know I guess you can see what I look like Which I'm not saying to look at me To look at me because whatever I'm gonna say this if you don't know what echo looks like Go look on you You can see what he looks like because he doesn't look like what you think he looks like Apparently yeah apparently I've known him too long to understand the what he appears to be Via his voice sure but apparently he doesn't sound like what he looks like so yeah I guess I want to check that out

Yeah, I guess they don't match my look in my voice yeah apparently not but you know I live in a world where we're judged on the content of our character and the contents of our hearts so I look doesn't matter quite as much as one might think But if you are less interested in seeing that, go to YouTube. While you're at it, subscribe. That's a good way to support. Plus, we do add other videos that are shorter in form. We do have the video version of the podcast, whole thing, two hours, three hours, however long.

And Echo is going to post a video of, I think it's the most I've laughed captured on video in history. So I was laughing at something that was not in the podcast. We were recording. wasn't in the podcast I laughed really hard It was pre-podcast Yeah pre-podcast record sesh

Sure And that happened So I'm looking forward to seeing that one You better get it up before this thing comes out Anyway And just yeah Anyway That's a good way to support

Subscribe YouTube Other small excerpts on there Anywhere from one minute to 12 minutes was the exception Usually it's between one and three minutes Little lessons that you can kind of extract Anyone that thinks 12 minutes is an excerpt I don't know.

I don't think that's right. Technically it is. Yeah, I guess it is. But technically, let's make them three minutes. Okay. You got it. You should put more effort into them

and cut them down, like the real critical parts. That's what I think. Okay. Thank you for that. I just called them out on the effort. No, no,

no. No, no. All good. Thank you for your. Direct method. No one. I'm going to try flank. Hey,

you know what? I think they're good, but you think they'd be over better if they were even a little bit shorter? What do you think? Yeah. And the long ones really...

You're the pro with this stuff. I'm just kind of... Over here. See? Yeah, you got it, bro. Whatever you need. You're the man, but nonetheless, that's a good way to support. Or you can make the extra 17 minutes long.

Yeah, but maybe there's 17 minutes of complete... Of beauty. Yeah, unbridled value. Yeah, exactly, right? I'm just saying you never know. Good times. Also, Jocko has a store. It's called Jocco Store.com.

That's the website. So anyway, on there, there's what? T-shirts travel mugs some bumper stickers on there some patches these are velcro patches you can interchange them they're cool they wound up being pretty cool yeah I agree yeah guys that are deployed yeah representing where those overseas yeah it's so cool too um it's it's weird because you know like you always say like we're sitting in this room you know and sure we got some patches out there but to see them yeah like people will But, you know, they'll post it on social and they'll send it to you and they'll tag and stuff like that to see them like, dang, guys are rolling around straight up representing.

It's like it's weird. It's weird in a good way. Yeah. No, it's awesome. Yeah, it's super awesome to see. So yeah, there's some stuff on there. Hey, just go at jocco store.com. That's the website.

And hey, if you like what you see, if you like an item, get an item. Good way to support. Also, on your journey, we all, no matter what jacoa, ever say we all hit moments of weakness and just like if you're gonna max bench i know i said this before i'm gonna say it again because it holds true if you're gonna go one rep max or even two rep max whatever on bench what about three rep max three rep max as well it starts to get a little bit more safe i think in my opinion but let's say two rep max you're gonna have someone there to spot you just in case you fully intend to get those two reps fully

but when you're pushing it it's wise to have a spot because for some reason maybe you didn't eat your you know a good whatever maybe you didn't get enough sleep I don't know but you could hit a little roadblock little moment of weakness you have that spot there boom gets you through

gets you that last inch on your rep but whatever keeps you on your path this is the real world version of this is called psychological warfare what that is it's an album with tracks jaco tracks and for any situation you might find yourself in that you have a moment of weakness like getting up in the morning or skipping your workout when you intended to work out or slacking on your diet jocco will be there with a track that'll help you through it it's called psychological

warfare jocco will link to a search iTunes Amazon music other mp3 providing what do you call it outlets like outlets yeah it's a good one real good on Cool. Also, you know, we've got, we got kind of a, kind of a big announcement coming. Which we haven't really had any big announcements, right? I'm not a big, because you know what? I'm not a big announcement kind of guy.

Right, plus. So I guess I'm not going to do this whole thing with the big announcement thing. I will, I will say this. This is it. Okay. Just we'll say, we're not going to hold back. This is what's going on. After.

many months of due diligence and conversations and relationship building and growing understanding, we are actually joining forces with a company called Origin. Origin Brazilian Jiu-Jitsu in Maine. Now, this actually occurred, believe it or not, due to this podcast. This podcast, I was doing a Facebook live. I said something about, this was months ago, said something about origin. Say, if you want a geek, get a ghee from origin. They make them in America. They're well-crafted, special material woven up in Maine.

They're cool. Check them out. And Sarah Armstrong. You know Sarah Armstrong, right? course they do she motivated got after it and put me in touch with this guy P Roberts who's the founder and owner of origin and you know I knew about him that's why I was talking about him on the Facebook live because I because I had seen him and I'd known that like a like a possessed psychopath he wanted to make geese in America so he went and

found looms to weave material with and all that stuff and he and the thing is is he was basically alone with his team on his quest to make this happen but the cool thing is he's not alone anymore he has a partner now the fact he has partners now me you and and really all of us to help out to get in the game with what we're doing now and and just so you know origin like I said it's not some brand that's throwing some graphics onto a t-shirt right that's not well that's not what's going on there you have a legitimate movement for lack of a better word of a guy that is up there and what we're trying to do is re reb rebirth manufacturing in America So that's it started with geese

That's definitely a huge focus But we're gonna make everything We're gonna build the best gear in the world Not just for Jiu-jitsu But for everything you do in life We're gonna make the best gear for Being on the war path That's what we're gonna do

So we'll come out with a bunch of details That's the big announcement that was gonna come I just made it so hey You know what In the meantime check out origin main.com for geese for rash guards for whatever else you might need and if you want to see what this is all about by the way if you want to see what we're going to do come up to the camp that we're having the jihitsu camp up in main echo's going to be there I'm going to be there a bunch of black belts are going to be there

we're going to be getting after it or cruising or both it's I'm August 20th through the 27th, two sessions are going to be there. Echo and I are going to be there the last day of the first session and the first day of the second session. So that's when we're going to be up there. And people have been asking what level of Jiu-Jitsu do you need to be? You can be any level. If you never done it before, that's cool. Come, we'll teach you.

We'll give you the base. I will give you the basic thing that Echo talked about earlier. So if you've never done it, come, learn. It'll be the best introduction you're ever gonna get in your life, quite frankly, just to come and train immersion for either four days or seven days. That's a good way to start learning a language, get immersed in it. And by the way, also, if you're a black belt or a brown belt or a purple belt and you want to come up and just train hardcore, the bunch of good dudes, come on out. So that's that also. This is cool.

On the 23rd of August. So in the middle of that camp, there is, we are opening a new. factory 20,000 square feet of American manufacturing in Farmington, Maine. Come on up. It's actually open to the public. So come on up, hang out. We're going to be there, you know, doing what we do, cruising, checking now out. And it's going to be, it's like pretty historical in my mind.

This merging of bad assness coming to fruition after many months behind the scenes. Um, so yeah, come and join us on that day, the 23rd. Even if you're not at the camp, come on up. Uh, you know what else we're going to have at the camp? Jocka white tea. Dig it. We have plenty of it. So, uh, you, if you're, if you're not coming to the camp and you want chocolate

white tea, you can go get it on Amazon. If you're, if you're sick and tired of deadlifting less than 8,000 pounds, order some immediately. Yeah. Also, weigh the warrior kid. And thank you for all this awesome feedback that everyone's been given me of kids getting stronger and faster and smarter and better That's awesome So if you have a kid or you know a kid get him or her this book and by the ways if you're wondering well It's a warrior kid is that for girls? Believe me

Well, what does your girl think of it? Echo Josh outstanding it doesn't matter So they need it We all need it So get one for yourself as well There's lessons for everybody in there from uncle Jake True

The other one got another book coming out Discipline equals freedom field manual Now if you want a feel good book If you want a book that's gonna fill you with a bunch of fantasies Don't get this book The book is not for you This book is real this book is gonna hit you hard And if you don't want to get hit hard

Then don't order it If you want to be coddled don't get this book If you want to be lied to don't get this book But if you want the truth and if you want to get stronger Faster smarter and better then yes go ahead and order this book Order it from your local bookstore go into them and say you know can I order this book and when you get it in can you just put it in the get after it section for me? I'm me so I can find it so this clinical freedom field manual order it online Barnes and nobles Amazon your local bookstore put the word out of course you can also get

extreme ownership ownership is a key word there and I recommend you own it get that book own it yourself and get it your team this copies as well so that you can go out and annihilate your enemy your competitor or whoever's bothering you we also have a echelon front leadership consulting no one else can do what we do and I'm saying that right now and the reason I'm saying that now is because we've been doing it long enough and I've seen what other people do from a leadership perspective and consulting no one else can do we do so if you need leadership alignment so your team can win you got me Leif

Dave it's our company don't book us through a speakers agent don't book us through our online book agent go to a echelonfront.com or email info at echelonfront com and finally the muster the next muster September 14th and 15th in San Diego this is kind of crazy we've already sold more than half the tickets so this is absolutely gonna sell out just like it sold out the first time in San Diego just like it sold out in New York City just like it sold out in Austin Texas don't get left out in the cold get registered extreme ownership dot com and come and get it and while you're waiting for the immersion camp or while

you're waiting for the muster we're not hard to find because we're rolling on the interwebs kind of hard actually extra hard something we're on Twitter the Instagram and that facey boy Echo is at Echo Charles and I am at Jocka Willink and finally thanks to everyone that makes this podcast possible first and foremost our military who keeps us free to create and grow and live the way we want to live thanks to you all for holding you all for holding you. line and thanks also to police law enforcement firefighters paramedics and other first responders thank you all for making this podcast possible by keeping us safe here on the home front so thanks to you all as well and finally to everyone else out there whether you're going through good times or bad times whether you're winning the game or you're making a back whether you're building a house or a road or a bridge or a piece of

software whether you're assembling a car or assembling a meeting or if you're in a diner pouring a cup of coffee for someone that's about to go out and pour concrete whether you're sewing seeds in a field or sewing the stitches into a gee no matter what you're doing and what you come up against fight hard do it with everything you've got and no matter what never quit and always always getting after it so until next time this is echo and jaco out Thank you.