Joe and Jada - Angie Martinez IRL - Tashera Simmons on DMX: How Strong Women Lose Themselves In Love

Episode Date: March 19, 2026

Author and wife of hip-hop legend DMX, Tashera Simmons sits down with Angie Martinez to talk about the ups and downs of being married to DMX, setting boundaries, and learning how to say no. Tashera also hits on her bond with Irv Gotti’s wife, Debbie, her relationship with God, and finding purpose in her life outside of marriage. Finally, Tashera answers questions from our IRL Bowl of Questions, and explains why living in the moment is the most important skill to have.All lines provided by ‪Hard Rock BetSee omnystudio.com/listener for privacy information.

This is an I-Heart podcast. Guaranteed Human. On paper, the three hosts of the Nick Dick and Poll show are geniuses. We can explain how AI works, data centers, but there are certain things that we don't necessarily understand. Better version of Play Stupid Games, win Stupid Prizes. Yes. Which, by the way, wasn't Taylor Swift, who said that for the first time.

I actually thought it was. I got that wrong. But hey, no one's perfect. We're pretty close, though. Listen to the Nick Dick and Poll show on the iPod. I Heart Radio app, Apple Podcasts, or wherever you get your podcasts. Come check this. IHeart and TikTok have come together to create something new.

I love it. Where the world of TikTok meets your playlist. Three words that will change your life. IHeart TikTok Radio. The biggest hits across IHeart Radio. What's trending for you on TikTok? Tell me a sound that's better than this. IHart TikTok Radio.

Plus TikTok's most influential creators all in one place. Search for I Heart TikTok Radio. Make it a preset and stay connected all day. This Women's History Month, the podcast Keep It Posit, Sweetie, celebrates the power of women choosing healing, purpose, and faith, even when life gets messy. Love is not a destination. You have to work on it every day.

Keep It Posit, Sweetie creates space for honest conversations on self-worth, love, growth, and navigating life with grace and grid, led by women who uplift, inspire, and tell the truth out loud. I have several conversations. with God, and I know why. It took the 20 years. To hear this and more, listen to Keep It Posit, Sweetie, on the IHeart Radio app, Apple

podcast, or wherever you get your podcast. It's the new me, and it's the old them. This Woman's History Month, the podcast, If You Knew Better with Amber Grimes, spotlights women who turn missteps into momentum and lessons into power. My, like, tunnel vision of, like, I got to achieve this was off the strengths of, like, I want to make a better life for us. If You Knew Better brings real talk from women who've lived. lived it, unpacking career pivots, relationship lessons, and the mindset shifts that changed

everything. Listen to if you knew better with Amber Grimes on the IHeartRadio app, Apple Podcasts, or wherever you get your podcasts. The more you listen to your kids, the closer you'll be. So we asked kids, what do you want your parents to hear? I feel sometimes that I'm not listened to. I would just want you to listen to me more often and evaluate situations with me and lead me towards success. Listening is a form of love Find resources to help you support your kids and their emotional well-being at soundedouttogether.org

That's sounded outtogether.org Brought to you by the ad council and pivotal. What do you think about the term ride or die? Because we were fed that. Our generation was fed that so hard. Like ride or die. Doesn't X have... Ride or die.

And guess what? I love to be that ride or die chick, but I'll tell you that's that's over. Like, I'm done. I'm done being a rider die. Is ride or dying this, like, is that overrated? That's the word I was looking for. Ride or die is overrated.

Thanks for watching, guys. Today's episode is brought to you by Boost Mobile. My girl was in the room for it all. The number one albums, the sold out tours, the lows that the public never saw. She is the ex-wife of hip-hop icon DMX. And for the first time, she's telling me the full story. story, hers, her children's, and she's telling the story in her new documentary, X versus Earl, the Simmons family speaks. Please welcome to Shira Simmons, to IRS.

Hi, baby. E.C. Oh, do you remember what we, like, I try to remember, like, meeting you for the first time. And I don't remember the exact first time, but I just remember, I remember the early days of ex gushing about you on the radio. He was very much my wife, my wife, my wife, my wife. Your love was so, I don't know, just a big part of his life. Yeah, it was pure, I feel, and unique, especially coming into an industry like this. Well, there's so many questions I have for you.

But like, so when I was like, yo, I really want to talk to her more, but we were were at recently at Irv's funeral. And you got up to speak. And I had never seen you speak publicly. Like I've seen you on the reality shows and things like that. But in that moment, I just had such a sense of your faith. You talked about being young with X and the two of you meeting Irv for the first time and him doing everything he said he was going to do by ex or Earl, as you say.

I know. I'm sorry. I can't even help you. You never call him X? Never called him X, yo. Yeah. And you really have, your faith was just woven into everything that you spoke about. You really, it was really a beautiful moment.

Wow. Yeah. And your words, I think the whole room, it meant a lot to the whole room. And that was a very challenging time for me because I don't even want to get emotional, but Irv was the beginning. of a life-changing moment in me and Earl's life. And after dealing with so much fake, X being signed with Columbia, you know, finally we was excited about his one single

and being dropped and Irv coming. I felt to the rescue. Me and X was in the hood. I'm going to call him X. Yeah. We went in the hood and Irv came. and he already had met, you know, X before that, and they were already just doing some things.

But I was always very skeptical about everybody because I was the one paying a lot of the bills. You know, X was bringing, you know, he had his side job and selling his mixtapes and doing constructions just because I was like, I need help. We have a son. So he already had a son and he wasn't, he wasn't X yet. No, he was developing before we had our son.

I went out to a few battles. One was with Jay-Z and another one. 50, yeah, and a couple others that kind of was out there. He told me it was about when we first met, he was telling me about Red Man. And they were in jail together and shared a cell and just about that whole situation. But so he'd been trying to do this for a while when I first met him.

I'm like, it's not paying the bills. Like those tapes that you're selling is not, you know, covering everything. And he said, nah, I met somebody that believes in me. He's already up at a label, and he's coming through. And he's going, you know, he said he's coming through. I think I talked about this at the funeral where he came through with Jha and Mike Geronimo. To the house? They came to, I pulled up at our house.

Where are you living at the time? Yeah, we was living in most regarders than y'all because it's the projects. And Irv pulled up in the MPV, and Jha and Mike Geronimo jumped out. They were really young looking. Then, Irv was big belly, though. He was kind of real stocky then. And I was like, and it kind of looked at beat up the van. So I was like, I was like, oh, man, they got them.

Like, you know, these dudes ain't real. Like, they're not going to take us nowhere. And it's like, you know, never judge a book by its cover. So Jowru wasn't Jail Roo. Jow Roo wasn't Jow Roo. He was Jeffrey. He was Jeffrey, Atkins. And they was excited to meet another MC from Yonkers.

They heard of that. I'm almost sure they heard about the name because X was everywhere, battling different boroughs. I mean, he put that work in to get where he was. You guys are how old, first of all? I just had Xavier. So I had to have been about 22 or 21. And me and Irv was like the same age.

I think age might, I mean, he might have been one year older than it. And you had other kids already, right? No, we just had Xavier at the time. It was our first child. We had just got that apartment, but it was in a basement apartment. And so Irv was, I mean, the funniest, he came in. And it was, it was real. Like, you had to, it was a basement apartment that we literally had to walk through the, like, look like a grimy steps.

And he wasn't slipping, actually, Earl. Like, we did that, that video in that apartment. Oh, the slipping video? The slip and it was shut down. We had bought a house already. They shut the apartment down, but they opened it back up because X is X. So they were like, oh, no problem. But when we, when he walked through, like, to open our door,

like a little jug. So like Irv would tell this story all the time. He was like, yo, like when X blew up, he was like, from the dirty, grimy basement to the what the bends to this, like to that. Like he would, but it was, but it was real though because he saw it. He saw it. But when you walked in an apartment, X was an artist. So he painted the apartment so nice. Like with stripes, like a black and gray stripes. And there was a fan that was hanging over. off the pipes that that was our like air conditioning. It was crazy, but we were happy. It was dope.

And we didn't know what to expect. Like when Irv was saying, yo, like, I'm telling you, there's no talent. Like, you from the streets, that's what we need. Like, he would be telling X and he'll just be sitting in an apartment, like, just listening. You know what I'm saying? And Irv was so hopeful and excited. Like, he knew what was about to happen before we did. And he was like, yo, this is all temporary, dog, this is all temporary.

And I was like, you know, just sitting there like, yeah, I've heard this before. And we've already been let down before. So, and then mind you, he pulling up in the MPV. I'm like, the people that's going to make it happen is the people with the big cars. And you know what I'm saying? Yeah, you weren't impressed. Yeah, I wasn't impressed. Yeah.

And, you know, Earl, Earl believed Irv. But, you know, he was like, you can. could show me better than I, you could tell me. And he's like, I am. All right, guys, today's show is brought to you by our presenting sponsor, Hard Rock Bet, Florida Sportsbook. And listen, it is tourty time. That means there are some brackets to fill out. So join me in the volume bracket contest presented by Hard Rock Bet. The Grand Prize winner scores a two-night's day at the Guitar Hotel at Semino Hard Rock Hotel and Casino in Hollywood, Florida. Plus, on top of that, $1,000 and bonus bets to use on the hard rock bet app and all you have to do is head to bracket

the volume.com that's bracket dot the volume dot com to make your picks and once your brackets locked in it's time to hit the hardwood on the hard rock bet app all tournament long hard rock bet is rolling out daily dancing boosts featuring a live profit boost and a parlay profit boosts every single day that's more ways to shoot your shot and cash in with boosted odds and you know those heart stopping zero on the clock moments. Now they are going to pay off. Hard Rock bet is giving out $25 bonus bets throughout the tournament. If a team that you bet on to win or cover hits a buzzer beater,

that gets really exciting. And if you haven't joined the Hard Rock Bet app yet, now is the time to check in the game. New signups can double their winnings on their first 10 bets, max $50. That means if you would have won $100, now you're going to win $200. So that's how you start March hot. So don't sit on the bench, download the hard,

Bet app today. And let's get the parlay started every day. Who were you an X at the time? So you guys had been together at that point for, for, we met it. Okay, so we met when we were 11 years old. We got together. We was 17, which was 1988. And then we got married 10 years later in 1998. Wow. So the first 10 years was a struggle. But we was happy. We were connected. We understood each other. What was the love? What was the connection? Now that you're older and you know about more things and you can kind of analyze that, what do you think that that connection was? I wanted to be honest with you. I think it was a trauma bond because I was abandoned as a kid. He was abandoned in a sense, you know, put in a group home at seven. So when we first met, he thought I was from the other side because I, you know, I always worked and, you know, dressed nice.

So I was totally out of like what the type of women eat. Well, little girl, young girls that he would mess with. So he couldn't believe that I liked him. But when we started to talk more and tell our story, which was happening like the first night, to be honest with you. But it was a trauma bond. Trauma bond. So he had been abandoned. You had been abandoned.

Yep. Trying to figure it out. And then what does that look like for somebody who doesn't even know what trauma bond is? Because I think people still are experiencing that. What is that? You know now better. I know you've done a lot of work on yourself. Yeah. Somebody that has been through intense hurt and pain as a child that is very different from what everybody else is dealing with.

Everyone around us had mothers and fathers or maybe a single, but at least they had a parent. No money. No parents. No parents. Scraps, looking for scraps for food to eat. working Burger King because we're young and I was working at ShopRite and Burger King at the time Earl was Robin

that was his thing with his dog and I was told to stay away from him from the neighbor you know people in the neighborhood like he's no good he's going to take you know he's dangerous

but when I met him I didn't see that I saw someone who was like me and we understood each other. And then on top of that, he was, he was, he believed in God. And I was a Muslim at the time. And I wasn't really seen because of the religion. Women are always, you know, separated from the men.

And Earl saw me from the first day he saw me. He saw me before I saw myself. Saw you how? He saw my heart was pure. He saw that even though I've been through the same trauma that he had been through, I still had love. And he didn't have that. He used to tell me my heart can get real ugly. Because I used to say, you're so good.

Like, why, like, why people say what they say about you? You're so nice to me. And I would see the switch then. Like, not. but his heart can get ugly though. But I was so like, I don't know what, I think God, and I think I know now that there's a gift that God has given me to always see the good in people, no matter how dark they are.

And that's to a fall, to be honest with you. I've kind of hit my bump, you know, got hurt a lot from that. But I don't want to allow people's, you know, actions to change who I am. But, yeah, he's the first person who saw something. something in me that I didn't see in myself. And he was able to identify that because it was something that he didn't have at the time. He was, he was bitter. He was very bitter.

You probably gave him hope because if he sees somebody who's been through what he's been through and you're so bright and you're working to jobs and your spirit is, like you said, he probably looked at you like, good, like, I don't know, you probably just gave him hope. No, you're right. And he said that, but I still didn't get it then. Like, he was just like, you're something good in my life. I mean, no exaggeration, like, because he lived with his manager at the time in the Rochelle. I went and stayed with him and it was like no sexual.

Like, back then, such a different time. Like, sex was not, like, I feel like girls just from my hair from my sons, they give it up faster. Like, back then, it was like, I'm a virgin and I'm trying to keep myself. Yeah, I'll come over and stay tonight. We could have fun. was so 80s. Like, innocent.

Yeah, and he wasn't even trying either. He just was like, I'll make you some French toast in the morning. I make real good French toast. And, you know, seriously, and we like talked all night. And I like, like, he,

I know I fell in love with him that night, but I was afraid to even step in that space. But he said to me that night, and he talked about this. I don't know if you could find footage because he said in some of his interviews, but he said, you know, you're going to be my wife.

And I said, listen, like, you're really trying hard right now to get this pussy and I'm not giving it out. So funny. Because I was like, there's no way that he's going to tell me I'll be his wife and I only knew you for a week. But isn't it that saying about like a man knows what he wants when he first, when he first meets the woman that he wants to marry? When did you start seeing, when did you first start seeing signs that there was darkness there? Did it take a while or? Nah, it didn't take long, but for some reason that was by good girls like bad guys. I looked at it.

When I first saw it was he, you know, he hurt people to get money. You know, like, and when I say hurt people, I kill them. He was robbing people. He was robbing people. It's all documented. Yeah, exactly, things that he talked about. He put him to sleep. I mean, he used to show me how he used to do it.

I was so exciting. Because back then, I think we had like four or five channels or just starting to get cable vision. So it was like, and I didn't have it. So hearing his stories was like exciting. Like him and his friend used to set like set people up. Like they'll have friends for that with girls and bring guys from. That was a thing back then. Like if you're not from our hood or even our borough, like bring them in so we could rob them.

Like, you know what I'm saying? So he would come back and be telling me the stories and I'd be so excited. And like, wow, you really did that? You're so cool. Like, you're strong. This is classic trauma bonding. Classic trauma bonding. Exactly.

And I look back now, but that's what Slippin was inspired by because we broke up for a year. Because once I had Xavier, because mind you, this is all this was happening way before Xavier. And then when I had Xavier, I was like, wait, something turned on. A light turned on in me. But it didn't too much for that. him. What was the light? The child. What happened to you? Like what changed about you? Well, first of all, to be totally honest, when I talk about this in my book, is that I didn't want any kids because I was abandoned as a kid. I'm the oldest of the seven and I basically took care of them.

So I told them I don't want any kids. So when I got pregnant, I tried to get rid of. I tried everything. I went on roller coasters, hot baths, whatever they said that you could do miscarry and it didn't work. And then when I finally had to tell Earl because I was getting too big, like not too big, but I was like starting to show. I told him and he was so excited, like jumping for joy. And I was like, what are we going to do with a kid? Like you rob people. Like you don't even have a legit job. I was like, yeah, I have a job, but it's like, we can't afford a kid. And he was like, no, I'm going to make it happen. I'm telling you. And it kind of actually, it did change him. I saw him want to be more responsible. But it was just, he said it's just so easy, though.

to take. It's so easy. These, these suck-ass niggas. He was just really like that kind. And I was like, okay. But once I had Xavier, I experienced a love that I've never felt before as far as like having to live for someone else. Like before, it was just all about me and Earl, really.

And I'm like, he's grown. Like, you know, I thought he was grown. Like, I was only 20-something years old, but I felt very old. But you had lived a life I lived a long, hard life and then this baby came and I was just like

wow, like he's so helpless and then it kind of took me back to my childhood where I was abandoned and my parents didn't really you know they did them. I had to fend for myself and my siblings and I was like I don't want this baby to have to go through that.

I want to love and make a change with this baby. And it was the conversations me and him used to have. And he was like, we're going to do that. And I was like, you got to stop. Like, you got to stop. I said, because I don't want somebody to try to do that to you or to me now. Because now we're getting up in age. Not really. I'm like, we're only like 22. You're like, we're getting old. Yeah, we get it old. I'll be looking back now. I feel like I've lived three lifetimes. You be totally honest with you. I know you can relate. I totally can. But when you listen to podcasts about AI and tech and the

future of humanity. The hosts always act like they know what they're talking about and they are experts at everything. Here, the Nick Dick and Poll show, we're not afraid to make mistakes. What Kugler did that I think was so unique. He's the writer-director. Who do you think he is? I don't know. You mean, like, the president? You think it was the president? You think Canada has a president. You think China has a president. Love Crosette. God, I love that thing. I use it all the time. I wrap it in a blanket and sing to it at it.

It's like the old Polish saying, not my monkeys, not my circus. Yep. It was a good one. I like that snake. It is an actual Polish saying. Yeah. It is an actual Polish saying. Better version of Play Stupid Games, win stupid prizes.

Yes. Which, by the way, wasn't Taylor Swift who said that for the first time. I actually, I thought it was. I got that wrong. Listen to the Nick, Dick, and Paul show on the IHeart Radio app, Apple Podcasts, or wherever you get your podcasts. I heart and TikTok have come together to create something new. I love it. We're the world of TikTok.

meets your playlist. Three words that will change your life. I heart TikTok radio. The biggest hits across IHeartRadio. What's trending for you on TikTok? Tell me a sound that's better than this. I heart TikTok radio. Plus TikTok's most influential creators all in one place.

Search for IHard TikTok radio. Make it a preset and stay connected all day. A ambitious, well-intentioned, ferocious and wealthy mother looks like in the black community. This woman's history month, the podcast Keep It Posit Sweetie celebrates the power of women choosing healing, purpose, and faith, even when life gets messy. Love is not a destination.

You have to work on it every day. Keep It Posit, Sweetie creates space for honest conversations on self-worth, love, growth, and navigating life with grace and grid led by women who uplift, inspire, and tell the truth out loud. I have several conversations with God, and I know why it took 20 years. To hear these and more, listen to Keep It Pies Sweetie on the I Heart Radio app, Apple Podcast, or wherever you get your podcast. The more you listen to your kids, the closer you'll be. So we asked kids, what do you want your parents to hear? I feel sometimes that I'm not listened to.

I would just want you to listen to me more often and evaluate situations with me and lead me towards success. Listening is a form of love. Find resources to help you support your kids. and their emotional well-being at soundedouttogether.org. That's sounded outtogether.org. Brought to you by the Ad Council and Pivotal. I'm Anna Navarro and on my new podcast, Bleep with Anna Navarro. I'm talking to the people closest to the biggest issues

happening in your community and around the world. Because I know deep down inside right now, we are all cursing and asking what the bleep is going on. I'm talking to people like Julie K. Brown, who broke the explosive story on Jen, Jeffrey Epstein in 2018. These victims have been let down time and time again for decades and decades by local law enforcement, by federal law enforcement, by administration after administration.

The Justice Department through, I think we counted four presidential administrations, failed these victims. Listen to Bleep with Anna Navarro as part of the My Cultura podcast network, available on the IHeart Radio app. Apple Podcasts or wherever you get your podcasts. Wow. Yeah. So that was a big change.

So when did you see? I don't know. When did you start thinking this might not be healthy? This relationship might not be healthy. Like when did you start to understand that? I started to understand that a year in with Xavier. So that was 1993. Like again, I just wasn't that girl anymore.

because there was one time before I had Xavier where this guy was trying to talk to me. I used to work at a bank and he was flashed his money to try to get me to date him. I told Earl and we set him up. You told me honest with you. Don't judge me, guys. I was only 20. She was finding her way. She was finding my way.

I was. But you know, I feel like, you know, I'm sure a lot of people out there could relate to this. So that's why I'm just being so brutally. honest about that. And, you know, like I said, they put him to sleep. They took his money. He woke up in a cab with no money, the dude, and he went home. And he said, you know, he didn't know what happened. And he worked with me. So when he got back to the next day, he said, what happened? I said, I don't know. I jumped out to cab, like some guys or whatever, like, you know, and we laughed about it, me ex and his best friend. And these are the things that I was totally, you know, broken,

coming from, you know, feeling like no one loves me. Surviving. Surviving. Surviving. I mean surviving. And once I had my son, I was just like, we got to start growing up now. This is not cool. So in 93, 94, I can't remember what year because there was it, he slowed it down.

He slowed it down, but then we broke up because he started, like, messing around with drugs, which I had no idea about. I was very clueless about, like, what drug users look like or their actions. And he told me because he was disappearing for, like, two and three nights. And I thought he was cheating on me. And he said, I have to talk to you one night. Never forget, he had a hood on. He said, meet me.

He was called my phone. It was on cell phones. He called my house phone. He said, can you meet me on Ludlow, which is the street of Yonkers? He was sitting on his seat, took a cab, a chair, I mean, a stoop. And he said, I have to tell you something. I said, I already know. You're cheating.

Like, you know, you found somebody else. And he was like, I wish. No, not he didn't say I wish. But he was just like, no, it's not really like that. He was like, you know, I've been using drugs. I was giving drugs when I was a little kid. I'm a wooly. An older man did this, you know, put it in my.

weed. I didn't know about it. I had no idea and I've been craving for it and every time I get a little cash or I feel a little down because I'm not getting ahead where I want to be, I just use and I go on a bench. And I had this whole notebook on like, this is how we're going to beat this drug. And I told them what's what are your downfalls? You know, how can I help? And, you know, I actually feel good about this saying this now because I gave my all every step of every piece of that relationship to try to help when it came to that drug. We started calling him. What was the drug? Crack?

It was crack. Yep. And I used to call him his second wife because I felt like the love, like there, well, one thing I learned throughout our relationship. shit. And that's why sometimes I don't really call him X because I fell in love with Earl. I met Earl. Not many people know who Earl is. They think they do, but they have no idea. The more he started to grow, he's turned into DMX because that was the artist in him. That was the man who wanted to be heard. He knew that God gifted him with a talent. He came up with his rhymes and, I mean, like, bars, I've seen him go in with the grates and go in and go out.

It was late, wrote his joint left. It was a gift. And he needed to be seen. And DMX came alive when Irv came in his life, when his career took off. But then X came. X was dark. X was always dormant. He had access. He had money. Then the women, remember when I first met him, you know, I'm sure, I mean, he was, nobody wanted him. Just be totally honest with you. Not the way he was wanted when he became famous and had money. And I'm just saying that because it's the honest of God truth. And X was ugly. X didn't like me. Ex protected.

He didn't like you? He did not like me because X wanted everything and I was in a way. I can see when X came in to protect Earl because Earl was the soft-hearted boy that was left in the group home that just wanted to be loved that Tishira met. You probably reminded him of Earl. Yep. And he was like, you make him. week. And I know that now. Back then, it was crushing, but I would see him to come into these different personalities. Like, I would literally see it. Like, after a show, after a prayer, after he prayed after

a show, he would say, clear the room only for me and Tashira. And he would cry like never before. And then he would go, all right, let everybody in. It was literally a transformation. And to be honest, I'm telling you this now, but back then, I used to be like, he's so extra. He's so extra because I didn't understand about multiples personalities about trauma and how you, if you don't deal with it, if you don't heal from it, you just create somebody else to, you know what I'm saying, to, to, to, I'm looking for the word. I can't worry it. I'm fine. But like to survive to suppress.

That's what I say to suppress because I would get Earl when he came home. It was, it was, you know, sometimes. What was that due to you? I can't, like. That's why I was getting ready to go. I was like, I look back now and I'm like, how was I able to keep my mind? How did I not create different personalities to deal with the different ones that he created? And he literally lived in them.

like live he literally lived in them um and um what it did to me well first of all i got to thank him and he knew this before he passed away is that um he introduced me to christ he brought me to christ i admired how he manifested his life how everything that he had faith in literally took took took a per like it took root. Like it came to pass. And I was like, I want to do this. Oh, that's why I was going before about being Muslim. He told me that if you believe in Jesus Christ and God, that you can be, like, you can speak. You don't have to like hide. Like you can be powerful too. Like you can be like we're equal. Like with God, there's no, I'm powerful, more powerful than you. So because of what I've been through, I was like, wow, I want to know who.

I want to serve that God. And it was God because had he not introduced me to God, it was God who came in my life. It was God. I know this now. It was the Holy Spirit that me and Earl prayed together every day, every morning. No, he prayed every morning. I was always afraid. I was like, you do it better.

So he'll just pray. And then he's like, you got to have to pray sometime to Shera. And it was not until our relationship blew up is where I was like, if you're really real, I need you to show yourself. Because I served you, I'm talking to God now, I've served you honestly, loyally, very loyal to you. And look what happened. Like look like he, the drugs took over. Like how can you let a powerful man like him be taken down like this God? And I just didn't understand.

I was crying. I was upset because I was just like, I want to fight for this marriage. But I don't even, I mean, ex has totally taken over. I don't even know if Earl's even in there anymore. Like, it was like the most scariest, darkest thing I've ever experienced before in my life. Wow. But God came. He came.

How did he come? I think now it was all part of the plan, to be totally honest with you, because I feel like God stripped Earl out of my life. because Earl was like my God. My world revolved around him. And I, like Earl was always, you know, quoting scriptures and reading the Bible. And I was sitting there like, mm-hmm. And once God got him removed him out my life, it's like that's when God came in. And I remember scripture saying that we serve a jealous God.

And God obviously have a plan for my life. And I always say this. Well, people used to say that before, but now I know behind every great man is a powerful woman as well. And I was powerful in my own right, but I never wanted to be up in the front. I always wanted to be behind. But I wanted to be behind because I didn't know my worth. My worth was in my marriage. My worth was in Earl and his happiness.

And what he wanted for me, everything was about him. Everything was about him. not because I was obsessed or I was now, now this me, the me now knows it wasn't because I was weak. It was just because I went through trauma. I was abandoned as a kid. My mom left me when I was 14. My dad verbally abused me. I was 14 years old. Earl almost played every role that you can imagine from husband, boyfriend, best friend, God. I mean, just protector. He was a very big protector of financial. He was never cheap.

You know, even when he was robbing, he always brought something home. So when he became- You know how many women's story? Like, your story is, it's definitely unique and it's your own, right? And also it's because you're connected

to this big figure, and so we got to know you through that. But like, the quiet women who found somebody that trauma, like trauma bond is so... It's out here. It's out here. Growing woman, grown man.

And like, yes. So what did you learn about that? Like, what could you tell me about that? Like, the difference between what a trauma bond is and what healthy love is. You probably had both. I mean, I know you loved it. Yeah. And, you know, okay, so I'm just, you know, the reason why I'm talking about a lot of the, I shouldn't say negative, it's just part of the story.

Yeah. You know what I'm saying? Not unfortunately. I don't find what you're telling me negative. Oh, good. Okay, good. think the story you're telling is a beautiful one. Oh, good. Okay. Okay. I don't think, I mean,

I don't know how everybody else feels like that, but I just see two kids who were left for dead, kind of, like to fend for themselves, and you found each other. And yes, he fell victim to vices and to addiction. But I don't, I don't know. I don't, I see, I see the love there. I mean, I see it's unhealthy because you come from two unhealthy experiences. How could you

possibly survive that together? How could you create, how could two unhealthy situations create healthy love with no guidance, no therapy, no help? Like, give yourself a break. You know what I'm saying? I don't think what you're saying is negative. I think it's honest and there's so much beauty in that. No, you know what, Angie? Thank you for that because, I'm trying to hold back my tears.

But that's part of why I'm doing a sacramentary, a talking series, because I feel like it's a lot untold. I feel like Earl died unhappy. Unhappy? Very unhappy with a broken heart, misunderstood. And I was so broken from a lot of things that happened with us in the marriage. I stayed as long as I did because I knew him. When I say him, I knew Earl. I wanted to save Earl.

I saw the road that Earl was going down. It got very unhealthy for me in this aspect of, you know, then just starting to step out of our marriage and creating a bunch of different families that I know that it's one of the first things he told me when I met him at 17 was I come from a home with three different fathers. When I get married, I want to have only one home because I know what that felt like.

It's chaos. And I want to be there. I want to make sure that I create a solid foundation. So to see that not only he was ruining himself, but now he's creating other families that's unstable and going through trauma because, as we both know as women, you know, it's hard to have, you know, to file everybody.

You have to put work. You have to be intentional. And it's possible. And you have to heal. And you have to heal. And he's never healed. Through all of this, I used to constantly tell him. I used to, I lost myself in it.

I mean, I almost physically, mentally, spiritually died because I wanted so much for him. I felt like he deserved to be really happy and heal. What about you? What if you deserve? Well, that's why when I go back to it was. nothing but God because had God not stripped me from that relationship, that marriage, I'd probably been in a loony tune home because I have a very powerful calling on my life. I know that now.

My voice and my courage, I'm not afraid. I'm not afraid to tell people what I've been through, how I felt, how ugly it was because I'm going to help someone to be, to keep everything all bottled up and try to wear a mask like everything is good is not the move. And God has given me this courage that I had from day one with Earl. It's what he saw in me that I didn't see in myself. And I wasn't able to blossom and bloom until God stripped me from that marriage. And I've been going on this 10-year healing journey. of dying to everything that I thought the enemy told me I was, which was worthless, only good as a wife, a loser, basically unaccomplished, unsuccessful because I couldn't. It's just so crazy because at the end of the day...

You put your value in being a wife that could save her husband? Is that what I'm hearing you say? Very much so. Yeah. Which is like when I look back now. So you couldn't save him. I had to really focus on myself. And it's something that I had not known how to do. Because remember, I had, when my mom left, I put all my attention.

I turned into a mom overnight at 14. So it was all I've ever known to do. So Earl was another project for me. But I didn't realize that. But a project to get away from Tashira. And not until that marriage went left. is when I had to really look at myself in the mirror and say, you are more. I will never forget it.

When we finally, I realized we were really broken up, I had a calendar of just his schedule in my two kids, no, no, four kids at times, four kids in a time, three and a half because I just had my daughter. But literally the two years, because the two of them were home. So I had a schedule of two kids on the calendar. After everything left, I was just like, what do I do? I went into a five-year depression. I didn't even know.

I literally was a zombie. I went to sleep, slept all day. The kids got off the bus, cooked, went back. It was a cycle that I needed to break, but it took a while. And that's why I'm like, when I look at other people who have been through trauma and they say they're good after a year, yeah, that's possible, I guess. but when you deal with real crushing trauma now mind you I had to get over I still didn't get over the healing of my mom leaving then I jump into a relationship another trauma bond another two broken

people coming together then we get rich now we don't need now that we're not wanting for anything so how oh no not let's forget about the yes man no one's telling him no one's telling him him no. No one is telling me. No, they're actually starting to feed him, the drugs, to start to find out later on in life in a relationship where I had to say something to him about it. Now, just mind your business. And I was like, who are you? Wow. So it is, but, but again, here I am, Angie. Bravo, boo. Yeah. What do you say to a young girl? I mean, And you even have daughters, like, what do you say to somebody who's in the beginning stage of that now? Who's entering, who's in a relationship.

And now, you know, this generation has more verbiage. There's more information. Yeah. Because you're explaining this story. People have to understand that. You probably didn't even know the term trauma bond back that. It wasn't even a term, a familiar term. People weren't doing therapy.

There was no understanding about. Any of that. No. So you're in it. You don't even know what you're in and you're in it. Now at least there's some verbiage that helps people understand. But what do you say to a young woman in that space right now who's in a trauma-bonded relationship? Like, what have you learned?

What would you do different? What should they know? What I would tell is that question is always hard for me because my whole life molded me to where I am today. where but like you said the the information wasn't there like right now I've been in therapy for eight years

so that has literally changed my life so with a young girl now when you see the red flags when you first of all you cannot fix nobody I will tell any there is nothing that you can do

for someone who has been broken, who's bitter, who doesn't have the right perspective for their self, there's no saving. There's no saving them. They can save themselves, but you have to walk away. You, I mean, you could create boundaries. That's something I'm just learning two years ago about boundaries. How can I say crazy? I'm 54 years old. Boundaries had none. You have to, I mean, I don't want to sound harsh, but what I know that I know that I know now, what I know that I know now, you got to walk away. Unfortunately, you can, you know, you can try to give them the best advice. I would say point them to a therapist. This is what I tell everybody. When I speak to people, when I go out and speak,

they ask me, how did I do it? I say God first. That's still not good enough for them. I say, because God is the one that's going to guide us and lead us to what we need to be. So that's why I say, God first. When you listen to podcasts about AI and tech and the future of humanity, the hosts always act like they know what they're talking about and they are experts at everything. Here, the Nick Dick and Poll show, we're not afraid to make mistakes. What Coogler did that I think was so unique. He's the writer-director.

Who do you think he is? I don't know. You mean the like the president? You think Canada has a president? You think China has a president? You think China has a president? those walk Rosette.

God, I love that thing. I use it all the time. I wrap it in a blanket and sing to it at night. It's like the old Polish saying, not my monkeys, not my circus. Yep. It was a good one.

I like that saying. It is an actual Polish saying. Yeah. It is an actual Polish saying. Better version of Play Stupid Games Win Stupid Prizes. Yes. Which, by the way,

wasn't Taylor Swift, who said that for the first time. I actually, I thought it was. I got that wrong. Listen to the Nick Dick and Paul show on the IHeart Radio app, Apple Podcast, or wherever you get your podcasts.

Come check this. IHeart and TikTok have come together to create something new. I love it. Where the world of TikTok meets your playlist. Three words that will change your life. IHeart TikTok Radio. The biggest hits across IHeartRadio?

What's trending for you on TikTok? Tell me a sound that's better than this. IHart TikTok Radio. Plus TikTok's most influential creators all in one place. Search for IHard TikTok Make it a preset and stay connected all day. A ambitious, well-intentioned, ferocious, and wealthy mother looks like in the black community. This Woman's History Month, the podcast Keep It Posit, Sweetie, celebrates the power of women choosing healing, purpose, and faith, even when life gets messy.

Love is not a destination. You have to work on it every day. Keep It Posit, Sweetie creates space for honest conversations on self-worth, love, growth, and navigating life with grace and grid, led by women who have lived and uplift and fire and tell the truth out loud. I have several conversations with God, and I know why. It took 20 years. To hear these and more, listen to Keep It Posit, Sweetie, on the IHeart Radio app, Apple podcast, or wherever you get your podcast.

The more you listen to your kids, the closer you'll be. So we asked kids, what do you want your parents to hear? I feel sometimes that I'm not listened to. I would just want you to listen to me more often and evaluate situations. with me and lead me towards success. Listening is a form of love. Find resources to help you support your kids and their emotional well-being at soundedouttogether.org.

That's sounded outtogether.org. Brought to you by the Ad Council and Pivotal. I'm Anna Navarro and on my new podcast, Bleep with Anna Navarro. I'm talking to the people closest to the biggest issues happening in your community and around the world because I know deep down inside right now, we are all cursing. asking what the bleep is going on. I'm talking to people like Julie K. Brown, who broke the explosive story on Jeffrey Epstein in 2018. These victims have been let down time and time again for decades and decades by local law enforcement, by federal law enforcement, by administration

after administration. The Justice Department through, I think we counted four presidential administrations failed these victims. Listen to Bleep with Anna Navarro as part of the My Cultura podcast network, available on the IHeart Radio app, Apple Podcasts, or wherever you get your podcasts. If you're trying to help someone else, direct them to therapy. You can't be, you're not built and equipped, and I don't mean that an offensive way, but this is a mental and emotional and spiritual battle that you cannot handle. And I know that now, I can see.

say that now because I realized that I was in spiritual warfare. There was so much darkness over X that I did not have a clue. I just thought that it was because what he'd been through. I made every excuse in the book. And at the end of the day, we only have one life. And God has given us all equipped us for a plan and a purpose for our life. It's uniquely made. And I know that now. So you can't try to bamboozle yours, because I'm trying to find a word, you can't bamboozle yours for somebody else. It's just a, I mean, I would even say that for a relative, a sibling, I mean, I'm sorry, a relative, a child. Like, I'm learning now that mental illness is real. And I didn't understand.

I didn't know that even existed. No one talked about it. my generation, my dad's generation, I used to try to have conversations with him about my ex-husband, and he would always give me very toxic answers. He thought I was speaking too much, stop telling people about what's happening. This is the kind of the generation advice I was getting. And what it made me do is, you know, keep dealing, keep dealing. So, I mean, I would just say not, you know, try to save yourself before you try to save somebody else to a younger girl. please try to save yourself first.

If you even feel some kind of connection where you want to help somebody that's been through so much trauma, then you need to kind of look at yourself to be honest with you. You got something, something's going on down inside you, that you even feel connected

to want to help that person. Yeah. You know what I mean? I do. I get that. What about, you said you learned, you're learning about boundaries in the past couple of years.

What does that look like? What have you learned? How are you implemented? them. So people don't like boundaries. I'm learning. I'm learning that. I'm learning.

I've never said no. Never. I thought that was the most worst thing to do. I don't know why that, like I don't know why I put myself through that. Because no is so good. It feels so good to say no. Because if you don't want to do something, then no. Like, why is that so?

Why is that so hard? Why was that so hard for me? Why was it so hard? Why do you think? Because. But worth? It's my worth. And you know what?

I feel like because of my mom and my dad, no was no. When I say no, like you're on your own. Go survive. We can't help you. We got our own stuff that's going on. So for some reason I put that together with if someone asked me for something, money, help, just out there. Like, just stuff that people ask you, can I come stay with you? Can I come live with you? I don't have money. Can you pay for my trip? Like,

just anything, I would feel like I'm letting them down if I said no because of, that's why it's just, right? Yeah, I get that. It's so weird. Yeah. You're like overcompensating for, I don't know, how you were disappointed. You didn't want to disappoint. You didn't want to disappoint. You don't want to disappoint anybody else. Yeah, I get that. And that's why self-healing is so important. Like, you cannot, because I literally let everything flow over into places that shouldn't have even been. Yeah. Like, why, like, no, I don't, like, why am I a bad person? Because I said, no. And people play on that. No, for sure. Yo, I'm like, I'm just two years now. And I'm at peace now. You wouldn't be, you would be surprised.

to how many women struggle with this all. It's not uncommon. Wow. Saying no and having boundaries, no, it's not uncommon at all. Not uncommon. I feel like I've lost a few people. Well, that's okay. And they weren't meant to be there.

Yeah. You start to really see who people are when you set your boundaries. You have an interesting friendship with Debbie. Yes, Debbie Irv. So Debbie was Irv's wife. You were ex's wife. I would imagine she had her own little trauma. on going on over there. I don't want to tell her story. She can tell her own story.

But, I mean, we saw some of their story because they had that reality show at one point. But how much has that friendship kind of helped you find your way? I mean, I don't know how close you are. I always got a sense that you were really close. No, no, no. Yeah. She's like one of my best friends. What I love about her is because we literally mirrored the same story. we walked through our trauma from our marriage together literally when X and Jav fell out things got weird

well X and Irv never fell out they always stayed close but it made it weird you know like and X was like I get it like you know what I'm saying but Debbie was like we called each other up literally like we're not letting this affect our like what the guys are doing is so dumb Like we're not going to do this to our relationship.

Like literally, that's the conversation we had. And from then on, we were just so close. We were still married, happily married at the time. And when things started to go left, it went left with her first with Irv. So she would start hanging with me and ex all the time. Where Irv would get mad at X and be like, yo, like, what's going on? Like, why is Deb with y'all? Like, you know what I'm saying?

Earl was like, because I love Deb. Like, I ain't got nothing to do what's going on with you with Deb. was so funny, and then me and X fell out, which Debbie, Debbie, and she'll probably tell you if you ever get a chance to speak to her, but she was devastated that me and X fell out because she said she's never seen like someone love someone so much. And, you know, I used to row with X all the time. It wasn't like her biggest thing with Irv was like, you don't take me nowhere. Me and X, I would go everywhere with him. So she was like, there's no way he was cheating. It's no way he was doing this. There's no way he was doing this.

There's no way he's doing that. I was like, no, yeah, he did. He was the way. He found a way. Yeah, yeah, he found a way. And it's real juicy, too. Let me tell you how he was doing it. But, yeah, she is one of my best friends.

We definitely went through a lot of trauma together. And the fact that, you know, when Irv passed, you know, her and the kids asked me to speak, I was scared, to be honest with you. Really? You were beautiful. Thank you. Well, just because I was just like, I was. scared because I'm like, what? First I spoke at Earls, now I'm speaking at Irs. This is real creepy.

Yeah. Like, you know what I'm saying? I'm like, what am I going to say to two great lives? And that meant a lot to me too. Like, you know, I was just like, but I nailed this. So thank you, Angie. No, it was amazing. You were amazing. Thank you. What about, you know, there's like a fine line, I think that women, especially when they're so, when their marriage means, like how you say you found your worth kind of as a wife. Right. I mean, where's the line between like giving grace? You gave X so much grace, Earl, so much grace. Where is the line between grace and then also self-care?

Because I also like to, I don't know, I think I give people a lot of grace. Sometimes people say too much. You know what I'm that person, trust me. No, I see that you are. I see that you are. But what have you learned about that? because you are, you know, you believe in God. You are a godly woman that does usually mean you give people grace.

You try to see them through how God would see them, right? But also then you have to see yourself the way God sees you also too. So how do you kind of separate that, like when grace, like giving him grace probably kept you in that relationship for way longer than you needed to be? Yeah. Right? Yeah, it did. That's that. Yeah.

So I'm just saying how do you navigate that? How do you think? Does that make sense? It's a question I'm asking. No, it does. And you know what? I feel like it was life. It was a life or death situation.

Like a spiritual life or death situation. I start and when I say that is because when you give the grace to a fault where you start to realize that your heart doesn't feel right. Like my heart and my spirit. started to feel like, I want to say, I want to give a better word than off. You know what? I'm going to tell you, it's a word that I've been working on. It's called debreding. Debreeding. So it's a real medical thing that they do with people with diabetes. And it's a metaphor that I learned in my third with my therapist where oh i'm going to make sure that i say it right so the what they do is

when people have um diabetes every time they go back like when they have a sore every time they go back to the doctor they have to cut and it bleeds every time and this is a mentor of mine who suffered from this, they said that they asked why when I thought that it's starting to get better and heal, you cut it again. And he said, because I'm constantly cutting and letting it bleed and I know it hurts, but when we get to the core, you will be healed. And I use that metaphor for myself from what you just not said about the grace because even though I'm giving grace, I'm bleeding. The person's cutting me, but I'm finding something positive to keep on going. But as I kept cutting, getting cut, and keep getting hurt during the process,

it came to a point where I said, no, no more. there's a soft hurting spot here that I have to pay attention to and I can't allow them to hurt me anymore. They don't deserve my grace anymore. And it's not until I got to that

hurting, I mean I bled out. Every time I gave Earl Grace or anybody who hurt me for that matter it wasn't only once. Every time I did it, I was hurting. I went home. I beat myself up. Or whenever if I'm driving home, like the last week before I saw him,

his heart was always with me. And I could really say that. Was mine with him? No. Because I knew I was finally at the place where I was just like, you're toxic. You have not changed one bit.

And you continue to try to hurt. me. But this way, it wasn't, it was a different kind of hurt. You know, he was mad that the kind of outfit that I had on, like I was still his wife. And it hurt me because I'm just like, I can see that you still love me, but you've hurt me so bad. How can you not comprehend that? And I went home and I cried the whole way home and I said to God, I said, God, why do this, why can I, why, why, why do I still allow this man to make me feel this way and I give him grace. I should have cussed him out, but I didn't. I just said, yo, worry about whoever you wit right now and how they dress. Why are you worrying about what I got on right now? And he was so angry that he left the party.

It was we were celebrating our goddaughter. He left because I don't know what kind of reaction he was wanted to get from me, but it was a little embarrassing. You know, everybody's paying attention to us because they know that we're not together but we're at this bar and we're kicking it, we're talking and it was also the same time when he told me my vessel is tired but my name's going to live on

and it was a week later that it happened so literally so it was like a lot happened in that moment. So you're dealing with this all the way up until for his whole life his whole life even when we're broken up.

Wow. So the divorce didn't free you from this trauma bond. Did not. As much as I tried to run away, it's still. How long were you divorced before he? We divorced in 2016. So, 17, 19, 22, five years after our divorce. And it was a struggle.

Like, I mean, we didn't see each other all the time, but he came every Thanksgiving. Never missed a Thanksgiving. Did that annoy me? Absolutely. Every time. But we have kids. And it was hard for me to date and move on. I mean, and every time he, every two days before Thanksgiving.

So who's going to be at your house at Thanksgiving? The last year, the last Thanksgiving that he spent, I said, Earl, I'm not dating anybody and no one's going to be at the house. Oh, oh, okay, okay. I'm just saying, you know, I don't have to hurt nobody. I'm like, why would you want to hurt somebody that I'm dating and you moved on a thousand times? Like, what the, like, it's like, you know, it's like a.

But what about you? Have you been able to move on? So I have, I've tried to date. So this is, okay, so it's, because this story, I feel like we have to do a part two, right? Because it's like, because it's so much. But I did. Like, I tried to move on, like, in the six years after I divorced. I dated a couple of guys, tried to make sure it was outside of the industry.

One was a therapist, a psychiatrist in a school. I liked this for you. Right. Exactly. Exactly. Oh, yeah. Exactly. And it was really nice.

But he had a drinking problem. Oh, come on. Exactly. So when you say, would you say another girl? The good thing is, see, I had maybe had a trauma bond with Earl, but when I saw that drinking habit, I ran. I was like, oh, no, we ain't about to do this. Exactly.

He's a really nice guy, but it wasn't for me. Then I dated another guy. He was a construction worker. And he was the most kindest man I've met in my dating. You know, because there was a few guys that maybe just talked on the phone, but he was so kind. And I started to see how wounded I was in that. He aggravated my soul because he was kind to me. Like, I literally turned into Earl, I feel.

Like, why are you so happy today? Meanwhile, that's how I used to be to, like, Earl used to say that to me. Why are you so happy today? And I used to be like, because I woke up today. And I started to be like that with that guy. And he said to me, he said, I noticed that you're like starting to be very mean to me. And it's always when I'm trying to be kind.

Are you okay? And that really hurt me. It really hurt me. And I said, you know what? I think it's time for me to start taking time for myself. I don't think this dating thing is the move for me. I am broken. I'm a broken woman.

And I tried to act like I was just healed. I'm happy. I moved on. And no, I was really broken. And that was 10 years ago. Wow. That was 10 years ago. You got to give yourself a break, though, because you don't unravel all of that life quickly.

It took you all those years to build that life. It took me 10 years to get to where I'm at now. Where do you feel like you are now? I think I'm in the best place I've ever been. The X versus Earl is I didn't want to talk about Earl. I tried everything to not go. the route that I am now when it comes to being public

but I'm noticing that it is my story so even though I talk about it like it's kind of present it really isn't like now I'm in a place where first of all I had to raise four broken kids

they were very broken because Earl was very present in their lives and then he wasn't I had to try to help them and help myself at the same time. So here we go again. From Earl to now my children.

But it was so much more rewarding because I knew that it was important for me to put out some human beings in this world that were not broken, like myself and their dad. How do you do that? How do you help children who are broken? When I tell you it was the best lost myself.

I lost myself, but I found myself at the same time in my children. And how I did that was I had to shut off the world in a sense, lock in, don't go out, dating, dead, and really take the time for each individual to find out, who are you, why are you hurting? This is what happened with mommy and daddy. This is what happens if you are not whole and heal. And I don't want you to be like this.

I don't want you to repeat this generational curse that me and your dad did because I was abandoned. My mom was abandoned. My father was abandoned. I found that out as I did my research in healing. Earl was abandoned. His mother and his father in a sense, his father definitely abandoned. him, his mother, because, you know, put him in a group home. Then his mother was abandoned. I don't know about his dad, but these are generational curses. And I was like, it's time to stop now.

So I would talk to them. My daughter was one. One of my sons was four. Another one was seven. And then there was a 14-year-old. And I literally talked to them like me and you were talking. I just there's no right there's no guide for being a parent so I was just like you know what I'm gonna go for it because when I was left alone and at 14 nobody told me nobody told me nothing so I'm gonna take the risk and they it worked they I mean it's the best they are the best they are the reflection of what I've been through what I overcame that God is really real that's a another thing. I instilled God. I said, I know it looks crazy right now. And I don't know if you got a chance to look at the last episode. Because just so, you know, these are like very short clips. Because there's so much more to come. But I do feel like I'm gone. I'm done. I'm not that woman that I used to be. When you listen to podcasts about AI and tech and the future of humanity,

the hosts always act like they know what they're talking about and they are experts at everything. Here, the Nick Dick and Poll show, we're not afraid to make mistakes. What Coogler did that I think was so unique. He's the writer-director. Who do you think he is? I don't know. You mean, like, the president? You think Canada has a president.

You think China has a president. Those law crusade. God, I love that thing. I use it all the time. I wrap it in a blanket and sing to it at night. It's like the old Polish saying, not my monkeys, not my circus. It was a good one. I like that snake.

It is an actual Polish saying. Yeah. It is an actual Polish thing. Better version of Play Stupid Games, win stupid prizes. Yes. Which, by the way, wasn't Taylor Swift, who said that for the first time. I actually thought it was. I got that wrong.

Listen to the Nick, Dick, and Paul show on the IHeart Radio app, Apple Podcasts, or wherever you get your podcasts. I heart and TikTok have come together to create something new. I love it. Where the world of TikTok meets your playlist. Three words that will change your life. Iheart TikTok Radio. The biggest hits across IHeart Radio. Because I'm too messy.

What's trending for you on TikTok? Tell me a sound that's better than this. IHart TikTok Radio. Plus TikTok's most influential creators all in one place. Search for IHard TikTok Radio. Make it a preset and stay connected all day. A ambitious, well-intentioned, ferocious, and wealthy.

Mother looks like in the black community. This Woman's History Month, the podcast, Keep It Posit, Sweetie, celebrates the power of women choosing healing, purpose and faith, even when life gets messy. Love is not a destination. You have to work on it every day. Keep it positive, sweetie creates space for honest conversations

on self-worth, love, growth, and navigating life with grace and grid led by women who uplift, inspire, and tell the truth out loud. I have several conversations with God, and I know why. It took 20 years. To hear this and more,

listen to Keep It Posit, Sweetie, on the IHeart Radio app, Apple Podcast, or wherever you get your podcast. The more you listen to your kids, the closer you'll be. So we asked kids, what do you want your parents to hear? I feel sometimes that I'm not listened to. I would just want you to listen to me more often and evaluate situations with me and lead me towards success.

Listening is a form of love. Find resources to help you support your kids and their emotional well-being at soundedouttogether.org That's sounded outtogether.org. Brought to you by the Ad Council and Pivotal. I'm Anna Navarro and on my new podcast, bleep with Anna Navarro. I'm talking to the people closest to the biggest issues happening in your community and around the world. Because I know deep down inside right now, we are all cursing and asking what the bleep is going on.

I'm talking to people like Julie K. Brown, who broke the explosive story on Jeffrey Epstein in 2018. These victims have been let down. time and time again for decades and decades and decades by local law enforcement, by federal law enforcement, by administration after administration. The Justice Department through, I think we counted four presidential administrations, failed these victims. Listen to Bleep with Anna Navarro as part of the My Cultura podcast network, available on the IHeart Radio app, Apple Podcasts, or wherever you get your podcasts.

Whatever that happened before, whatever Earl did before, I was over it before he passed. Right. But when he passed opened up a whole other wound that I didn't even know was there. Yeah. I'm sure you worry about too because he is your children's father. And you do still like have love. I do. So it's like a fine line between protecting him and honoring him and what he could have been and talking about him honestly and his struggles.

But then also giving yourself the freedom to tell your full truthful story. It's like I'm sure that's complicated. Well, the good thing is I was honest from the beginning. They've watched me really struggle and survive. I mean, it was really bad. We basically were like homeless in a home that me and Earl bought with love, but couldn't afford to pay a lot of the bills. And it was just by the grace of God.

I mean, because, you know, Earl was totally taken over by the dark side. The person, I don't care what anyone says. I know that the man that I fell in love with, the man that I met, the young boy that I met when we were 17 years old, but never abandoned his family. And I say that to say because the devil's real and I hate to be sounding all like, but it's the truth. I always say the greatest trick that he ever did was make people believe he didn't. And why I say that is because Earl taught me who Damon was.

And I was like, he called him Damon. But I was just like, he doesn't exist. He's not real. And then I've seen him get taken over by him. So my children know that. I told them that you have to be very careful, the spirits that you surround yourself with. Women, men, I'm very big.

I talk very freely about sex. I feel like soul ties come through sex if you're not aligned with the right partner. I just was honest with them. What is that? What are your beliefs about that? Yo. You think sex could actually... It's definitely soul ties.

I don't know if you ever experienced it before, but I've talked to so many women now. And they say that sometimes they have sex with somebody that they didn't know they were with a bunch of other different women. and they're taking on these energies that they don't realize, but I think it's an empath. I'm an empath, which I've had to learn through therapy, what that was. But they would feel funny after having sex. Then they wouldn't even want to be with the person anymore, but for some reason they still craving and yearning for them.

And I said, yeah, because you have a soul tie. Like, when you have intercourse, you're sharing spirits at the same time. And this is why marriage and I know everybody ain't doing it, So I'm not, please, I'm not trying to judge anyone. Everybody got to get to that space. But when you, you know, God created marriage for a reason because it's supposed to be intimate with your partner. You know what I know.

We're living in an era that that sounds crazy right now. But that's what you believe. But you believe in that. And, you know, I believe that walking in the light is always better than walking in the dark. For sure. What do you think about the term ride or die? Because we were fed that. Our generation was fed that so hard.

Like, ride or die? Doesn't X have... Ride or die? And guess what? I'm the... I used to always be... I love to be that ride or die chick, but I'll tell you, that's...

That's over. Like, I'm done. I'm done being a rider die. I'm done. Is ride or dying is... Like, is that overrated? That's the word I was looking for. Ride or die is overrated.

For us grown women out here and you young girls that's trying to be a ride or die, is overrated. It's whack. It's not even a way to go anymore. You ride it out for yourself. What do you think about the term unconditional love? Yeah. Do you think that's a good thing or do you think that there should be some conditions to love? Even marriage, even the way, you know, marriage is for better or for worse?

And then we're fed this term, I love you unconditionally. I just wonder for you from having such a tumultuous kind of experience. To love someone unconditionally is, I feel, it's dangerous to even try to do that. Like, I feel like love has, like, obviously love is supposed to be easy. and when it doesn't feel easy and you know how I know that because my children doesn't loving your

you have a son right? Doesn't loving your son come easy? I mean obviously nothing's perfect but it's so easy and I learn that through my children that this is love it comes easy, we communicate sometimes you may get on my nerve

but I love you unconditional but when it comes to relationship so I guess it depends on who you're saying it too. Like, I love him unconditionally. Obviously, it's too early for me to say, but in my next relationship, I feel like I have to kind of fall back on that unconditional and create some conditions there. And some boundaries.

Yeah, exactly. I got to put boundaries there. And so, no, I think that that's kind of something as we were growing up, we weren't properly taught how to love. I didn't, you know. they didn't think about conditions. They just laughed. They walked out,

figure it out on your own. And then I met this young boy. And I was like, I love him unconditional because that's how he loves me. But I don't know if that was really right. Like, if I put some conditions up, maybe things would have went a little better.

Maybe if I stood up more for myself. And, you know, obviously, I want to be harder myself. But sometimes you got to treat people how to love you. I don't think I did that. You know, and that's in his defense. He's going now. But you got to put a problem. put some rules. You got to say some boundaries.

You didn't hold them accountable for nothing. I was just like, I made an excuse for everything. And you know what? I think he had some boundaries. You know, I think he had not in love, but he was always very honest about how he felt. And Mines was just like, whatever makes you happy makes me happy. And that's very, very, because if you don't, people will suck you up. And, you know, so unconditional, yeah, got to come with some conditions, happiness. And that was my way of saying, I love you, unconditional.

And no, now and where I am today, it has to be some conditions. And guess what? You know what? Probably with our children too. Because sometimes children could do things that may be hurtful, and we got to call them on it. Because we're like, listen, I love you. But that didn't make me feel good. you know and thank God I haven't had those really yeah but you're putting your you being honest

and holding your kids accountable exactly different exactly and I didn't do that I didn't do that in my marriage um well I tried to when it was him out of control and how he treated other people or how he treated himself but not how he treated me that's weird now okay we just dropped it just now because I really that's why she said that's weird that's weird like when I look back now

I'm just so grateful to be where I am now like that you know I know people I've met grown women who are still in this place and that's no judgment it's just that we got to do

better for ourselves what about what about love I don't know would you marry again yeah you would I would

you know what because now that I know what I know I have friends who have friends who have came out of similar situations, 20 years later, meeting someone who is just like, they're like, we're doing life together now. And I'm like, wow, I didn't think about that until recently, though, because now that

my kids are getting older and they're good now, my oldest son tells me all the time. He's like, Ma, I want to see you happy. I said, I am happy. He said, but you know what I mean, Ma, you know, like, you know, with someone, you know, having a good life too, like, you know, with someone. And I'm like, at first I got offended, like, but I like being by myself. Like, I love being single. I was with your father for since I was 18 years old.

But now I'm like, you know what? It won't be too bad. That doesn't sound too bad. But obviously, God got to be the one to do it. I'm going to know. Yeah. It would be so interesting to see you navigate those waters with this new understanding of yourself. Yes.

Just new love for yourself. Yeah, I think it's going to be a lot better. And that's why it makes me happy thinking about, you know, if I was able to do life with someone else. I think, well, they have to be the right person, obviously. They got to be, have done the work if they haven't, you know, if they have any issues. But I think marriage is beautiful. I never really talked about a lot of this before because I do believe, believe it or not, the good outweighed the bad. And me and her relationship.

You still do. I do, man. I just learned so much. from that. It was the best times of my life. I mean, we had so much fun. Like I said, like so many other marriages, like they didn't let their wives be around or they didn't know how much money was in a bank account. Like Earl always made me feel like he was just like, she runs everything. And he always put me on a pedestal and I never knew that he was doing the things that he was doing until he started getting really sloppy in the end. And a lot of drugs was being used. So he couldn't keep it together like

he used to, but I'm telling you, it's a, it's a crazy love story, but I like it. I take it. It's your life. It's my life. It's your real life. It's my real life. And I'm still here to talk about it. Thank God. Thank God. God. God. God bless me. Yeah, seriously. Hey, guys, you ever sign up for a phone plan thinking, wow, what a great price. And then a few months later, it's like, surprise, your bill is higher. We hate that. With Boost Mobile, you pay $25 a month forever. That's unlimited talk, text, and data starting at just $25 a month. There's no price hikes. There's no contract.

And this is forever. Plus, Boost Mobile is now a legit nationwide 5G network. They invested billions building 5G towers across the country. So what you need to do is visit boostmobile.com or head to your local booth store today and get unlimited talk, text, and data for $25 a month forever. 5G speeds not available in all areas. After 30 gigabytes, customers may experience lower speeds. will pay $25 a month as long as they remain active on the boost unlimited plan.

All right. We have a second we call the IRL bowl. No, we're going to do our voice note first. This is a voice note. This is usually a listener answer, I mean a question or comment. So let's get to our voice note. Hi, Tashira. My name's Lauren.

So my question was on forgiveness and not for DMX, but for yourself. So a lot of times we blame ourselves. for staying in relationships longer than we know to stay in them. And of course, it's always difficult. And have you forgiven yourself for staying longer? Oh, good question. That's an amazing question. The first time I knew I had to forgive myself was the first day I sat on the couch of my therapist.

And my first two sessions were just crying because I had realized that I had went too far. I realized that I didn't know what made me happy. And I knew that I was going to start. I had to be on that journey to love on myself. So the love of myself, I go away by myself. I went to Hawaii by myself. I went to some spiritual retreats. But really loving on yourself, to be honest with you, is getting a therapist.

Because they tear you to pieces and they build you back up together. It's not about Earl. It's not about the kids. It's about the girls sitting in that chair, that warm. help. Mm-hmm. And that's the biggest love. Have you forgiven yourself for some of the things that you've done to yourself?

Yeah, I have. I just started, though. I would say, again, a lot of stuff took place two years ago. I've just started to forgive myself. I didn't even know that I needed to forgive myself. And I have these moments where I just start crying. Or I started laughing. And I'm like, girl, you did some dumb stuff.

Why did you do that to yourself? And I think the laughing is good because I don't feel that hurt anymore. I don't feel that whole anymore. I feel like I finally feel whole. I finally see Tashira the way Tashira is supposed to see Tashira. Now who is she? Man, Tashira is courageous. She's smart.

She's loving. She's kind. I'm out. outgoing. I love to travel. I'm sporadic. I'm last minute. That's sporadic. I love God. Oh, my God. Tashira loves God. I don't know where I would be without him. He's my best friend. Yeah, seriously. That's pretty good. Hey, guys, support for this podcast is brought to you by Walden University. Have you ever thought to yourself, what if I could go after what I actually want and I could really make a difference?

Well, you are not alone. And this is exactly why I want to. tell you about Walden University. For over 50 years, Walden has helped working adults, like you, get the W, with the knowledge, the skills, and everything you need to build the future that you want. And you can make a difference where it matters most. If you've been waiting for the right moment, this is it. Head to waldenu.edu and take that first step. Walden University set a course for change, certified to operate by Shiv. All right, no, we have a bowl. Let's put you in the bowl. We got an IRL bold, pick a question. I'm sorry, I love my kids too, but I'm sorry.

The kids are aye. You said you're crying? Right? I was like, my kids. Oh my God, I'm sorry, guys. Y'all already know. This is our IRL bowl, presented by Walden University. If you could instantly master any skill, what would it be?

Master living in the moment. that's a skill that takes serious intention just enjoy every day and live in a moment and that's a skill that I'm working on in my healing I love that all right in real life what are you most proud of about yourself in real life the mother

I've I've um I was afraid in the beginning of not being a good mom because of what I've been through and how my mom abandoned me But that is one of the most things I'm proud of because I have won. I've succeeded to raise healthy four children to be someone's amazing husband or wife. Well done, Mama.

Thank you. What do you like most about yourself? What I like about myself is that I'm comfortable in my own skin, that I know who I am now. And I have my own identity. For a very long time, my identity was in Earl, and now what I really love about myself is that I'm happy to be Tashira. Good for you, Boo. I am no longer available for. I am no longer available for negativity, for bullshit, for people speaking on my life that they have no idea about.

I am no longer available for that. If it ain't positive, I got no energy for it, period. And I'm not afraid to say no. Do you still feel the need? We're going to wrap up right now. But do you still feel the need? Well, I guess you must because that's your son's father. But do you still feel the need to represent for X, for Earl,

to be a representation for him since he's no longer here? I do. I do feel the need to. And that's the point of the name of the docket series, X versus Earl, because I feel like he hasn't had the proper representation. of who Earl is because, you know, X is who most people really knew and DMX.

So I do still feel the need because I know who he really was and two because it's only right. That's my children's father. Not to mention my first love, my childhood sweetheart. And it makes me sad

that he went at 50 but Earl was tired And he told me that. And that's why I had peace in it. Not happy about it, but I had peace with it because he told me he was tired and I could see it in his eyes and in his voice. And I got scared. And I didn't think it was going to happen, but it did a week later. Wow.

Yeah. That must have been a tough time for you. I didn't think it would be just because I knew that Earl was tired, but I felt a part of me died, definitely. because he knew he knew me longer than I was alive. We were together and were friends for over 40 years. And a part of me was ripped. I mean, I really, before he passed away, I thought I found myself. And then when he passed away, I had to die to myself to find myself again.

And that was not an easy journey. It has taken me another three, four years to get to where I am now. I'm like, God, when is it over, God? Well, I think we finally here, Angie. I think we're here. And I think you are well on your way to wherever you're supposed to be doing. Yeah, thank you. I feel that now.

Yeah, good for you. Yeah, thank you. Yeah, for sure. Congrats on the doc. I love that. Thank you. Our final question you didn't get in the bowl, but I'm going to ask you, if God were to text you right now, what would it say?

If God was to text me? If you got a text from God right now, what would it say? I want you to start focusing more on yourself. Yeah, it is. Justiress, Simmons, in real life. I don't know my leg all the way over here because that was so good. Woo-hoo. Angie, I just want to tell you real quick, though, you made it.

Your energy and your spirit, it felt safe. This is to Shiris Simmons in real life. Hey, guys, thanks for watching. Make sure you subscribe. like, comment, and check out all of the other episodes we have on Andrew Martinez, IRO podcast. On paper, the three hosts of the Nick Dick and Poll show are geniuses. We can explain how AI works, data centers, but there are certain things that we don't necessarily understand. Better version of Play Stupid Games, win Stupid Prizes.

Yes. Which, by the way, wasn't Taylor Swift who said that for the first time. I actually thought it was. I got that wrong. But hey, no one's perfect. We're pretty close, though. Listen to the Nick, Dick, and Paul show on the IHart Radio app, Apple Podcasts, or wherever you get your podcasts. I heart and TikTok have come together to create something new. I love it.

Where the world of TikTok meets your playlist. Three words that will change your life. IHart TikTok Radio. The biggest hits across IHartRadio. What's trending for you on TikTok? Tell me a sound that's better than this. IHart TikTok Radio. Plus TikTok's most influential creators all in one place.

Search for I Heart TikTok Radio, make it a preset and stay connected all day. This Women's History Month, the podcast Keep It Posit, Sweetie, celebrates the power of women choosing healing, purpose and faith, even when life gets messy. Love is not a destination. You have to work on it every day. Keep It Posit, Sweetie creates space for honest conversations on self-worth, love, growth, and navigating life with grace and grid led by women who uplift, inspire, and tell the truth out loud. I have several conversations with God, and I know why it took the 20 years. To hear this and more, listen to Keep It Posit, Sweetie, on the IHeart Radio app, Apple Podcasts, or wherever you get your podcast. It's the new me, and it's the old them.

This Woman's History Month, the podcast, if you knew better with Amber Grimes, spotlights women who turn missteps into momentum and lessons into power. My tunnel vision of, like, I got to achieve this was off the strengths of, like, I want to make a better life for us. If You Knew Better brings real talk from women who've lived it, unpacking career pivots, relationship lessons, and the mindset shifts that changed everything. Listen to If You Knew Better with Amber Grimes on the IHeart Radio app, Apple Podcasts, or wherever you get your podcasts. The more you listen to your kids, the closer you'll be. So we asked kids, what do you want your parents to hear? I feel sometimes that I'm not listened to.

I would just want you to listen to me more often and evaluate situations with me and lead me towards. success. Listening is a form of love. Find resources to help you support your kids and their emotional well-being at Soundedouttogether.org. That's sounded outtogether.org. Brought to you by the Ad Council and Pivotal. This is an IHeart podcast.

Guaranteed Human.