Joe and Jada - Angie Martinez IRL - Tems: Embodying Intimacy In Love & Standing Firm In Faith

Episode Date: April 2, 2026

Grammy Award–winning and Oscar nominated artist Tems sits down with Angie Martinez to talk about how Celine Dion changed her life, learning the true meaning of love, and how she deals with comments on social media. Plus, she answers questions from our "IRL Bowl of Questions" including describing herself in three words and how faith has played a big part in her career path.All lines provided by ‪Hard Rock BetSee omnystudio.com/listener for privacy information.

This is an I-Heart podcast. Guaranteed Human. How could this have happened in City Hall building? Somebody tell me that. A shocking public murder. This is one of the most dramatic events that really ever happened in New York City politics. I scream. Get down. Get down. Those are shots. A tragedy that's now forgotten.

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So I've learned to be a cheerful giver, but also know when to step back. Like, I don't need to be the one that people say thank you to. I can't be the one saying thank you. Yeah. Oh yeah, because, you know, sometimes people don't realize it's almost selfish, like you said. Yeah. Yeah. I took care of everybody.

I took, you know, I did that. Well, we didn't ask you to. Exactly. Exactly. Thanks for watching, guys. Today's episode is brought to you by Boost Mobile. Okay, a girl from Legos who used to sing alone in her bedroom. That girl is now one of the most celebrated artists on the planet.

She is Oscar nominated and the only Nigerian artist. male or female to win two Grammys. She is a singer, songwriter, producer, entrepreneur, and now co-owner of the San Diego Football Club. And then most recently, her EP wrote and produced almost entirely by herself. It's called Love is a Kingdom. Thames is on IRL today, guys. What's up, my love?

What's good? Thank you so much for having me. This is very exciting. It's exciting for me, too. And a great intro. That was, I was like, whoa. It's funny because I haven't seen you in a little while. The last time you came to the radio show.

And since then, a Grammy happened. Yes. A tour happened. An EP happened. Some things have happened. Things have happened. Things have happened. It's been a whole, I don't think I'm the same person that you met then, for sure.

I'm definitely like. Tell me how. Oh, I just think I've just evolved. I think I'm, I'm, I just know more I mean, so much experience. Like, there's just so many things that have happened since I last saw you that I don't even remember.

I don't remember. I think I watched that interview finally, like, the full thing. Maybe like a year or so ago. Really? Yeah, and I was like, what was I? Why was what was going on? Do you watch your interviews normally,

or not? No. It's not that I don't. I'm just like, you know, it's not for me. It's for them. Yeah. You know, they watch it. I'm like, tried not to.

Are you critical of yourself? Sometimes, yeah, I think so. Are you sensitive? I'm, I'm, hmm. I am an artist, you know. So you're sensitive about your shit? No. I'm sensitive about my music.

You know, anything else, I'm not too sensitive. I'm not sensitive about, like, yeah, like, you know, I think the way I look facially, I can't do much about, you know, body-wise, I can't do much about. So everything that I can't really do much about, I'm not too critical of myself. But I think music is like, I think, a bit more of a sensitive topic for me and, like, the direction of, like, visuals and things like that.

Where does that come from? Like, when did that start and where does that come from? I think, well, you know, when I was making music or when I started out writing stuff, it used to be a secret and didn't tell anyone. So it used to be my thing. I was very possessive over, you know. People couldn't hurt me because I had something that nobody knew about. And it was mine.

And then, you know. I know we talked about this a little bit. people like, but how did you know how to do it? I don't know. I loved it. Like, I fell in love with music. You're how old? I was, um, Selindian was the first person. Is it the Titanic song? It wasn't, it was, um, it was, um, the song that goes, um, just all coming back to me now. And you touch me like this. Oh.

And when you hold me, it was like, oh, my God. That was the song that did it for you? That was the song. And then that's the way it is. And that's the way it is. That was like, oh, that was my. But I was like maybe like seven when I first heard that song. And what was it though?

Like was it the, just sonically? Sonically, I think the melody. I felt like she The songs were very like They just touched my heart What were you going through What were you learning when you made this last project? You don't have to say who

Well I mean it's a couple of people But I think I Even till now I'm learning the true meaning of love. Ha! We're all trying to figure that out.

Are you close? I am very... I think I am close in understanding what love truly is. Please share. You know, I think, first of all, the reason why I said love is a kingdom is because God is love. and God is the kingdom that I'm talking about. And the type of love that everyone is truly looking for is not the love that it's physical,

but one that is spiritual, it's intimately, it's spiritually intimate. It's more of like it's in your heart, it's in your character, it's in your personality. You become love before you even meet someone. And when you meet someone who has also embodied love, then you know, you recognize it instantly because you know where the source comes from, which is good. I love that. Have you gotten there?

Have you had a love like that? Well, earthly, I don't know. Well, you know what, actually, let me be. We're being honest here, right? So right now I'm in this stage in my life where God is teaching me about love through people. But it's not through romantic love necessarily. It's the way certain people in my life show up for me. It's how I see my flaws.

Like I see that I messed up and nobody's saying that I messed up. Everybody's encouraging me. Everybody's still showing up for me. And to be honest, I have experienced like a love where I thought was love and it was like, it was more like when someone is trying to own you. You know, they think that they own you. And love is not, that's not. That's not a god. It's not obsession.

No, it's not obsession and it's not possession. We can't, I can't own another human being. We can be caught. Love is when both of you become one person. Like, you're not nobody, we don't own each other. We are each other. Like, you know. It's a song, by the way.

That's a whole song. You just wrote. Like, we're so, we're locked in, you know. And, you know, I feel like everyone has experience of that toxic love. It's someone that doesn't even know that they're toxic. They don't even know that, you know, They say, I love you, I love you, but they don't know that they don't even love me. Because you can't love someone if you don't love yourself.

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people always talk about marriage and they're like, well, who do you know who's in a happy marriage? Or who do you know, do marriage really work? I don't know anybody's happy. This is a conversation that happens a lot with girlfriends or friends, right? And whenever I really try to think about, okay, let me, let me think about who I know who got it right, who's happy, who's in love, who loves their spouse. I do know a couple of people who are in those relationships. and there usually, usually there is spirituality inside of that relationship. Not usually, every time. Anybody I know who, from the outside,

because you don't really know what goes on inside people's house, right? But from the outside, anybody that I know that has gotten in it, right, there's some spirituality involved there. They pray together or there's something bigger than themselves. Yeah, there has to be. Yeah. Because what's the reason why would you love me, if you don't have anyone you answer to.

If you're not accountable to anyone or to, how could you choose to love me and keep loving me for the rest of our lives? If there's no accountability, if you are the God of your life, then why are you really, like, why would you love me forever? You could just discard me anytime you want.

Or marriage is, I mean, obviously, I have not been married. I'm not married, but... Would you one day, is that something you helped that to do? I think, yeah, if I feel like that is the next step of my... Like, I feel like marriage is something that makes you better as a human being. It should... It shouldn't be about whether you or you're, like, so into this person

or like you like this person so much. It's about compatibility, and it's about whether... this relationship makes you a better person. Like, if it evolves you, like, you are now on the next stage, because marriage is a whole other level. Yeah, it's a whole other level.

It's supposed to bring out the hard times. So how much of that goes into, like even this EP, like how much of those feelings and those ideas about love play a part into you know what I'm saying? Yeah.

Or is it actual things you're going through in real life? Or is it just? Oh, it's definitely things that, it's definitely inspired by the things I've gone through in real life. Yeah. And what is, it's just my journey. I was just like, most of the songs on there,

just like me documenting every stage like, oh, in my understanding of love. You know, um, talking to a guy. and you're not sure where he stands. And I have a song called I'm not sure where it's like,

if you want to see me, come and find me. Like, I'm not chasing you. Bro, if you want me, if you want me, you know where I'm at. You know, you have my number. So let's know, it's either you are here or you're not here. There's no way. There's no midu. And also, I think at the end, there's a song called Is There a Reason

Where, really, that song is about me speaking to God and wondering why he chose me. I think that's, those are the kind of things I contemplates on like, okay, surely I'm, I'm here for a reason. Like, what do you need of me? Like, you know, sometimes I get scared that I'm not doing what I'm supposed to be doing. Really? Yeah, sometimes I feel like I need to do more. I need to show up more. I need to help. more people. I need to physically like go and

I don't know, go through get something, do something you know. Is that because of what you've built and how blessed you are? Yeah. Like is that Yeah. I think it's definitely because of just how much God has

really blessed me and you know I want to make sure that I am the person. You know, I am the daughter. I am the daughter that he's called me to be. And yeah, I think sometimes I worry, but I'm not meant to be worrying, you know. So that's just a human. I love that you know that.

I know that. That's a human thing for sure. That's definitely not something I'm meant to be doing. But all in all, I feel like everything is working, how it's supposed to be working. Maybe you're not meant to worry, but I do think you and all of us, probably, are meant to ask the questions. Yeah. You know what I mean?

I'm meant to like stop what we're doing and just look around and ask. Am I my purpose? Am I, am I walking? You know, am I doing what I'm supposed to be doing? Am I missing something? Like, I don't know that that's worry so much, but I get, I get you asking those questions. Yeah.

Yeah. I try not to worry though, because I feel like if you are the person, like, if you are being transformed into like a. hire you, a better you, you would automatically be doing the things that you're meant to be doing. It's not something that you would even need to think like, okay, let, you know, like, you don't need to force it as well. I mean, the ideas will just come. They'll just come to you. Yeah. How often do you pray a lot? Oh, yeah. I mean, I think sometimes I pray twice in a day and I feel like that's not enough. I think what's more important is spending time in, like, the word.

I think so because that's what fuels my prayers. Sometimes if I haven't read or filled myself up with, like, word, I don't know how to pray. I mean, I know how to pray, but I don't know. I have nothing to, like, unless it's like, you know, I'm on the road. There's so many things going on. I would always say like a little prayer, but I think to constantly filling yourself up with like knowledge of the word, truth,

I think that helps me understand where I'm at, like, heart-wise, like where my heart posture is and, you know. I'm wondering if you've ever had a word given to you, or something come to you and completely stop you on your tracks and put you on a different course. Like,

I mean, the best I can say is when I quit my job. Like, that was like a word that came to me and I was like... Like clear? It was really clear. It was very urgent.

Uh-huh. You know, I had already settled in the job and my, my auntie, she was my boyfriend. at the time. How'd she take this?

She's like, she's my, she's not like my auntie, like my mom's sister. She was more like. A friend of the family, like a... She's more like my mom's sister's husband's cousin. Yeah. You know, so it wasn't like, you know,

but still close. I remember, I actually begged her for that job. You know, I actually worked. I was desperate. I looked everywhere for a job. You were on the phones, right? Yeah, I was in marketing.

Marketing, right? Yeah. Digital marketing. I remember as you told me. I was selling furniture. How do you sell furniture on the phone? How does that even work? Oh, I wasn't on the phone always. I was actually going to places and pitching them like, oh, we can furnish your office for you. Yeah. We, you know, this is our track record. This is what we've been doing. I go to hotels, I go to different, like, companies.

How old are you at this time? I was, like, 21 or 22, I think. Wow. Yeah. It's not that long ago. Not that long. That's crazy. Yeah.

So you're going on and you're doing the furniture thing. You beg for the job. She gives you the job. She gives me a chance. I'm terrible at the job. You're not good. I did my best, but, like, I did my best, but, like, don't think I was very personable. Knowing what I know now and seeing how I used to be,

I definitely know that I was not. A salesperson? You don't give me salesperson vibes. I don't think so. I didn't. And when I received that word, it was like just after the new years. How does it come, though? Tell me. Honestly, like the first word, the first verse, I just, the same verse, sorry, the same word, which was take a leap of things. just kept on coming to me. My mom was telling, my mom was like, oh, this is what I received for you this year. Like, I think you should really stand in your faith

and actually do what God is telling you to do. And I was like, well, I don't know what he's telling. I don't know. What do you mean? And then what I was reading was about faith and how, like, you have to have faith first. You can't cease. I'm Lori Siegel, a long-time tech journalist.

And consider my new podcast, Mostly Human, your bridge to the future. Anyone can now be an entrepreneur. Anyone can build an app. And it's very empowering. Each week, I'll speak to the people building that future. And we're going to break down what all of this innovation actually means for you. What I come to realize is that when people think that they're dating these AI companion, they're actually dating the companies that create this.

We're experiencing one of the greatest tech accelerations in human history. And let's be honest, that can be messy. There's no playbook for what to do when an AI model hallucinates a story about you. But it's my belief that we should all benefit from this moment. Mostly Human will show you how. My goal is to give you the playbook, so you can benefit. The reason I say agency is because if we can give power back to people, then I think that's probably the best thing we can do for your mental health.

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You have to have faith before you see anything. That's how it works. You first have faith. Right, because if you see it, you don't need faith. It's there. It's too easy. If you see it, you won't understand. it actually.

So what faith does is you have faith and then you get understanding. So I, apart from that, the devotional that I had the, I can't remember, the day before work started again was take a leap of faith again. So in my- Are you seeing it or people are saying it to you? You're reading it. I was reading, I mean, my Bible, I was reading about faith at the time. My mom was speaking to me about faith.

I think there was a sermonized. I watched that it was about faith. The algorithm wasn't there at the time, so it wasn't any algorithm. It was God's algorithm. It was, you know, and then I just started, there was just like a voice in my head that was like, you need to leave this job right now.

Like right now, you need to do it today. You need to do it by the end of today. You need to have done it. I'm always fascinated when people tell me these time of stories. No, no, it was like, okay, it felt like as if something was going to happen, like if I didn't do it. Had you ever experienced that before, or was that the first time?

No, that was the first time. Was it a little scary? It was. But the thing is, I had, before I experienced that I had prayed that God would reveal what he wanted me to do. And so when I received that, I felt like I needed to be obedient. And I needed to leave that job, like, ASAP. So my auntie, I went to her house.

Oof. How do you say this? Because she was still sending me missions. She was like, oh, I need you to do this. I need you to do that. She was already, you know, for the year. Yeah, because she didn't know that this word came to you. You know, usually I'm like, okay, yes, yes, yes, I will.

Yes, I will. But this time I said, oh, I would like to speak to you. And she was like, you know, if you're not careful, you're going to be fired. And I said, actually, I would like to. speak to you about this. So I went to her house and she was like, you know, giving me a talk like, what are you doing?

You know, I told, you're not handling this thing well. I was trying to believe in. I was trying to help you out and look at what you're doing. You're doing nonsense and you're not handling this well. So I was like, my leg was shaking.

I said, she was like, do you want to get fired? And I was like, actually, yes, I need to leave this job. She was like, what? you need to want I need to leave this job

she was like she looked like she wanted to meet me she was like you want to what you want to quit she was like who do you think

is going to hire you after this like you don't have any credentials like who do you think is going to want you I said actually I'm going to do music I'm going to when you crying

I was crying Oh, my God. I was crying and I was shaking. And I was like, I'm going to do music because I know that that sounds crazy. I know it sounds crazy. But this is why I truly believe that God has told me to do. And I'm so sorry, I have to do it. I know you may be disappointed.

Oh, my God. Oh, that day, my whole body, by the time I left there, I was leaving there shaking. I left it. That was the hardest thing I ever had to. do. Oh, that was so hard. I went to my car and I was just crying. I was like, well, I guess this is it. I guess we're going to see what's going to happen from now. Why were you crying though? Because you were scared? I was scared. Yeah, I was scared. I wasn't very confrontational. Oh, so you felt bad probably to letting her down in some way. I just was, I was very people-pleasy.

I didn't want to disappoint anybody. And that was one of the first times I felt like I was disappointing everyone. I wasn't going to have a job. I wasn't going to have money to take care of my mom. I wasn't going to have anything, you know. I was letting down everyone in my life, you know, their perception of me of what they thought was the best life for me, you know? And I didn't even have the answers. I didn't even know what to do.

Are you doing this because you had such a strong desire to do music or is it strictly you're doing this because of the word that you received? It was because of the word. Wow. Because I was okay not releasing me. Like I was okay. I was enjoying my own music. My cousins would be like, you'll send me that voice notes that you,

because I'll send my cousins like voice notes, like just one. A song. A song. I should be like, why aren't you posting this online? I'm like, oh, no, I don't want people to, I don't, you know, my cousin would be like, do you have any new voice notes for me? She'll be the only one enjoying. That should be your next EP is all the voice notes. Yeah.

And I was content with that. Like, you know, my dream was like, you know what, maybe I'll just make this a Friday night thing. I'll find a bar. And I'll have one of those Friday shows that people come and listen to live music. That was my idea. of making money. You see how funny it sounds now. Like, are you insane?

No, I mean, I get it. Yeah. I get it. But do you ever, are you ever in awe of how that moment? Like, just, because I'm sure people get words sometimes. And out of fear or out of whatever, just don't pull the, you know, pull the trigger or whatever. that's probably a bad term, but they don't push the button or they don't, they're not diligent about listening to that voice.

Are you ever in awe of that moment, even yourself, that you were able to do that? Honestly, sometimes I just thank God that I couldn't ignore it. For me, it was, especially what I was learning about, was actually Abraham. right and basically he made a covenant with God and for me at the time it was like if I say I really believe like I'm not just performing I'm not just I'm not just making sure that

I don't go to hell or something right you don't get in trouble if I really like I'm saying I really want to know you I really want to work on this journey with you then I have to have faith And I have to say, God's part is, if you believe, then I will do. So for me to show that I believe, he instructs and the proof of your belief is your obedience. So for me, I was like, I have to be a woman of my word.

I can't go back now. And as I was quitting my job, I was like, well, God, you see, I'm shaking all over. I don't know what's going to happen, but I did what you said. I did what you said. If I perish, I perish. If I find myself under the bridge, that's going to be the best under the bridge life I would ever have. Because you said, you know, whatever life he has in store for you, it's going to be better than your imagination. And has it been?

It's been beyond my imagination. Yeah. You know, when you read certain things, it's like, could this possibly be true? Or what it is is I allowed myself to actually truly believe, like, just trust. Because I had never seen any other thing. All my life, I'd been relying on my own knowledge. So maybe I should just try this for a second. And, you know, it wasn't easy at first, but I was like, you know what?

I'll just take it step by step day by day, you know. I'm not going to chase anything. I'm going to wait. In my mind, I was like, you said I don't need to do the work. Like, I don't need to do too much. I just need to believe, right? Okay. Here I am.

I'm just going to believe, you know, and I'll do whatever I receive. How much do you attribute the career that you've had to that moment? Or all, I think every passing day that, like, I wouldn't be terms if I didn't, if I chose not to answer that voice, I would still be, I might even be unemployed because things are hard now. Yes, you clearly couldn't sell no furniture. I couldn't. I would definitely have been fired. I don't. I might be like a sales, I might be like a cashier or like a. registered person, I don't know. There's nothing wrong with that, by the way, if that's, you know.

But that wouldn't have been, that wasn't. That was not the highest I could have gone. And I don't think I would have reached. I mean, maybe I would, I don't know. You never know. We'll never know. We're never going to know. We're never going to know.

How good are you now? So now, okay, so that happens. And then time passes clearly before you, this thing really, I mean, opens up. Or was it? How long from that? that moment. So, where you're like...

2018, January, I quit my job. January, like, second or fourth. I can't remember, but that first week, I quit my job. Then, after that, from January, March, sorry, January, February, March, April, I was kind of living off handouts. My aunt, I would ask, oh, do you have any, you know, just doing my... my best to, you know, live. My mom had to move out of state because I get my job.

But I spoke to- Was she upset with you? No, she was actually like, this is something that I know that you have to do. So don't worry about me. I want you to actually, like, go chase your dreams and go chase this thing that you really feel strongly about. Wow. So she was very supportive.

It was like the rest of my family that was like, how can she? She's out of her mind. She's crazy. By May, my cousin convinced me to finally put out a video on Instagram of me singing with my face. Just doing that, that was nerve-wracking for me. Because I used to put videos out, but without my face. And this meant like I was going to be. seen. So the first time I did that, that's when I started getting people, um,

DMing me, oh, hey, do you want to work? Do you want to come to this studio? I'll go to the studio. I'll meet different people. Um, and then at some point I decided, you know what? Now I understand a bit more about this music thing. Let me try and release his song. And that song was called Mr. Rebel. and that song came out August of the same year, 2018. Wow. Yeah. Wow. Yeah.

He works fast when he works, right? There's no, he literally, it's actually us that makes it slow. Because we don't listen. Is that what you think? Yeah, I think you have to be the kind of person that can handle the thing that he wants to give you. And if you're someone that isn't true to your word, how can you trust you with the whole? load of things when you can't even trust yourself with a little. How do you sort that out through your head, though, sometimes?

Do you, and how do I ask this? Like, you know, sometimes, how do you know what? Because sometimes we have a lot of voices in our head. A lot of things, the world, our own thoughts, things that we ingest from whatever situations we're in. How do you know which is the right voice? Does that make sense? Yeah.

Because sometimes, man, our own wants even could sometimes get in the way. Where you're like, right, God, that's what I should be doing. You know, sometimes there's just so many voices. So how do you quiet the noises to hear the one noise you're supposed to hear? Yeah. I think for me personally, what I've discovered is that a lot of the voices that people hear are not theirs, their opinions that they've read or they've heard from other people. Like especially now that we're in the social media,

you know, AI and social and technology and when you're online a lot, you don't realize that you're reading a lot of the comments in your mind. You're reading a lot of the opinions of other people in your mind. Even though it was someone else that typed it, you are reading it in your mind. If someone was spewing like negative, like comments, you're still the one reading it. So your body is not going to think that it was somebody else. It's you that you're still feeding yourself that.

So when you go to sleep, all the things that you've read, that you've fed yourself, that's what's in your mind. Those are the things that your mind uses as references for what to think about things that happen to you. That's so good. That's where the narrative of how you see life is drawn. It's from the things you read. It's from the things you allow yourself to watch, the things you allow yourself to hear from your eyes, your ears.

What you feed yourself. What you feed yourself. And so if you're reading so many people's opinions and you're always online and you're always watching comments, watching people talk, right? you won't be able to hear the voice of God or even your own voice because your voice should align with the voice of God, right? Like, it should only be good.

It should only be good things, right? Because God only wants you to win. There's no, there's no, there's no, there's no, there's no, there's no hate actually. Right. So if you're thinking hateful things or like if you're not believing in yourself and you think, yeah, I will never make it or. I'm not good enough. That can't be you. That can't be your voice.

You ingested that from somewhere. From somewhere. It's something you believe. Like, it's something you believe and you've adopted it as yours. But you can also let it go. But it's about awareness, you know. So I feel for me, once I realize that I stop reading opinions. Sometimes, like, if I'm scrolling and I see, like, someone starts to speak,

and I already know they're about to start saying. So I just scroll. You want to get away from it fast, right? I don't want to hear, I can't hear too many crazy things. Yeah. You know, I try not to be online too much because anything can pop out at you and you can't stop it. And you're reading all these things in your mind. So if someone is angry at someone else, you're reading the anger into yourself.

Yes, that's so good. You're reading the anger, you're reading the hate, you're reading the negativity. And then how do you read all of that and then go and pray? Or then go and tell yourself, yes, I'm a winner today, but you've been reading hate all day. Right. And in your mind, it's fun. It's banter. Yeah.

But the banter is all your body knows. It's all your mind knows. It's so good at times. I think of you in 2018, sitting in that, hearing that message that it was time for you to do that. Had you spent the past month reading negative shit or hanging out with negative people a month? I don't know that you would have had that type of clarity to hear that type of word. Yeah. I was very isolated.

I wasn't around in love my friends. The friends I had at the time, I started distancing myself because I wanted to find out more. And I feel like that period, God really like, was calling on me to just, like, separate myself and understand, like, who I'm actually dealing with. Because we are living in life. This is some kind of reality. So what is this reality? And that, for me, that was like, I need to know what's going on.

And I think, yeah, if this was then, it would have been hard. Yeah, I wonder, because then I wonder, like, when you, now you become famous. Yes. that I had to navigate. I was going to say, for somebody who's quiet in tune to this voice and tries to block out all other voices, you put you jump in the pool.

Oh. How do you navigate through that? Oh, it was tough. It was so tough. Even me having a conversation like this. It's tough for you? No, it's not tough anymore. I've shed a lot of skin.

you know, coming, getting to this point. At the time, I was very hostile because I thought, why is everybody that suddenly like liking me and why are people wanting to talk to me? You didn't want to talk to me before. Why do you want to talk to me now? You know, and at some point,

I thought at some point the world would just move on. So I was kind of waiting for that to happen. I was like, okay, this is how it usually goes. They first like you, then they hitch. So let me wait till they hitching. hate me so I can continue my secret life. I was like, let me wait for this to pass. And then months went by and he just kept on getting worse.

I'm like, wait, what's going on? You know? God, please, I don't want to be in the spotlight. I'll go to the airport and people like recognize me and they'll be, your terms. I'll be like, no, I'm not. Or are you terms? You look like her.

I'll be like, no. Like, people say that. I don't know. See, somebody could misinterpret that and think you're not grateful for it, but I understand. Yeah. You're afraid of it. I'm so, I was so afraid. Yeah.

I was just like, why everyone, you know, someone would meet me and they would be like, they'll be like shaking. And I'm like, it's just me, though. Why are you shake? Like, it's just me. I'm just, I'm just Timmy. I'm just the normal person. Hey, stop that, you know. Stop being weird.

Stop it. You know, people on my team, new people that were. come on my team, you know, they'll be asking me questions. So, are you excited? Do you want to, are you happy to be here? I'll be like, why are you asking me that? Like, I would come off very, like, standoffish because I'm like, why are you here though? Yeah. Like, why is everybody suddenly here? I just want to be alone. I just want to make music and sing. I just want to make music. And I just, I didn't handle it. If you're trying to keep up with everything happening on off the court. We've got you covered on the podcast, flagrant and funny. You look at the top four

number one seeds. What do you think UCLA is going to do? Break down that for me, my friend. Obviously, Yukon is the overwhelming favorite in this tournament, but I'll be honest, I think people are kind of sleeping on Texas. Experts are suggesting that UCLA is the number one challenger to Yukon and that right after that would be Texas. S&C is so deep and so thinking just about everything. I really is annoying. So it's UCLA, Texas, South Carolina, LSU. Only ones that could possibly upset Yukon. On Flakron and Funny, we're giving our unfiltered takes on the biggest moments of the conversations everyone's having. So whether your bracket is busted or you just want the latest on the tournament, we got you. Listen to Flakron and Funny with Carrie Champion and Jamel Hill

on the IHeart Radio app, Apple Podcast, or wherever you get your podcast. Presented by Capital One, founding partner of IHeart Women's Sports. I'm Lori Siegel, a longtime tech journalists. And consider my new podcast, mostly human, your bridge to the future. Anyone can now be an entrepreneur. Anyone can build an app. And it's very empowering. Each week, I'll speak to the people building that future. And we're going to break down what all of this innovation actually means for you. What I come to realize is that when people think that they're dating these AI companion, they're actually dating the companies that create this. We're experiencing one of the greatest tech accelerations in human history. And let's be honest,

that can be messy. There's no playbook for what to do when an AI model hallucinates a story about you. But it's my belief that we should all benefit from this moment. Mostly Human will show you how. My goal is to give you the playbook, so you can benefit. The reason I say agency is because if we can give power back to people,

then I think that's probably the best thing we can do for your mental health. Listen to Mostly Human on the IHeart Radio app, Apple Podcasts, or wherever you listen to your favorite shows. You know Roll Doll, the writer who thought up Willie Wonka, Matilda, and the BFG. But did you know he was also a spy? Was this before he wrote his stories? It must have been.

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10, 10, shots five, city hall building. A silver 40 caliber handgun was recovered at the scene. From IHeart podcasts and Best Case Studios. This is Worshack, murder at City Hall. How could this have happened in City Hall? Somebody tell me that. July 2003, Councilman James E. Davis arrives at New York City Hall with a guest. both men are carrying concealed weapons

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Well, do you have any regrets about that? You know what it is? I feel like I had been in my mind rejected so much that when I found people that finally accepted me, because I found people that finally accepted me, because I was so used to rejecting myself. I couldn't accept their love. I couldn't accept that their acceptance. I rejected myself before anybody even. So I was waiting for the rejection.

I was expecting it. That was my normal daily life. That was my programming, you know? And I had to unlearn that, oh, actually, I've never been rejected. I've always been accepted. Where did this come from? or cause one person or a few people said something

when you were a child or I don't know. You know. Fear? Fear. But it's from that is when you experience something that feels like rejection in like your young days. That's where you get this conclusion that you are not worthy or, you know. They say that fear stops a lot of people from living their full,

potential in life. That alone. But that's why I always encourage people to become aware. Get curious about this fear that you have. Like, go deep. How have you learned so much? Have you done like therapy? Have you done like, is it just prayer?

How have you learned so much about understanding how you work? It's a combination of things, I think. Honestly, a lot of the things I've learned. have been revealed to me by God. I'm going to first say that. Secondly, I didn't like the way I was. Like, you know, I just felt like something was always off. I was always making people angry, you know,

and I didn't understand why I was the way I was. Sometimes I want to talk to someone and nothing comes out of my mouth. You know, I'll just be in the corner. you know, when I was in school, I would, like, cover my head and eat, you know, I would just be. Oh, and you were probably misunderstood so much for that. And I was just like, I want to, I don't want to be this way. So why am I this way? Why can't say, in my mind, I'm like, Tammy, move and I won't move.

You know, oh, Tammy, do something. And I won't do something. Say something. Nothing. You know, and I, and that's when I realized, like, okay, I'm actually so flawed. and I need help. And I can't help myself clearly because I read all the books.

I'll say, okay, they'll say, oh, write this to yourself 10 times in the morning. Affirmation. You know, and I would, and it would work for like the first two days, but then your natural programming, your human programming kicks in.

So how can I be changed? That was my goal. And I think that's what actually led me to go. because I realized, like, I can't do it myself. I need someone greater than me. And that was, like, my only solution. Help me. Help me.

Help me, because I don't know what's happening. So what have you learned about yourself? Because you seem, I don't know, you still are, like, reserved and careful, but you seem more, like, confident in your skin and where you're, you're not. are in the yeah like what have you learned about yourself that has shifted that hmm um i think what what's happening now is like i'm walking more in my identity like i think what has changed is what i believed who i believed i was you know before i just believed i was in nobody you know so even when i became someone in my mind i was in nobody so i shouldn't be

somebody, right? You didn't deserve this. I didn't deserve anything. But now, it's not even about whether I deserve it or not. It's what has been allocated to me. Oof! You know, it is what has been given to me, whether I like it or not. And what I'm learning is that I'm here for not myself, but to be a light, to be an example,

to be someone that people can say, well, if she did it, I can too. You know, there's so many labels I can say that I had. You know, I wasn't, I wasn't, you know, autism is going around these days and everybody is saying they're autistic. But I've decided actually not to say that and just be Timmy,

like just be a child of God that is deciding to be a light in the world, you know, no matter how much. people throw out me. I have, I'm not going off my own strength. I think that's what it is. So I don't feel like I can be taken down, not because of my strength, but because of the strength I know that I have behind me, you know, I have like, it's not, it's not me that will fight for myself. It's, I don't need to fight, actually, you know. You can just be. I can just be. And that's what you're supposed to be. Yeah. You know, everything in the world, that way. It's, you know, it's only human beings that are, like, we're not being.

You're trying to control everything. Yeah. Yeah. I get it. What's so hurt. Like, the world is so hurt. And that's why. It's like, you know, like, when you come out, you're like, let go. When you have it, your fist like this, your whole life. It's like, what's the concept of actually releasing your fist? You can't think of it. It's like a foreign concept. So letting go is very hard. Right? So I understand because that was really hard for me. So you just let go? I just let go. I'm still letting go. It's like a step by step process. I'm not all the way there. I'm not, this is not my final form at all. Really? Can you imagine when your final form? I can't, I can't even, I can't even imagine what it is. You have to just be in it and wait, right?

Yeah, I'm still being worked on. Yeah. I'm definitely not perfect. But you have had, of course, the evolution continues, right? But, like, you have had big victory moments, even in our intro, some of the accolades. I mean, even just this Grammy, right? Mm-hmm. When you're up there, you're accepting a Grammy.

Mm-hmm. What does that feel like to you? Can you even imagine that moment? How much up to that? point, does it feed, you know what I mean? How much does that, those type of moments mean to you? It just, I think for me, it solidifies, like, it just further confirms everything that I've been experiencing. It's like I'm on some great big adventure. And, um, especially in those moments, I really feel like, yeah, I couldn't have thoughts about this. Even if I tried, this was not me.

This was not my vision. Me that I wanted to sing at the bar. That was the big goal. If somebody told me, I'm going to give you anything you want right now, I would have told you, yeah, I want to do the Friday night life. That was going to be my dream. That was your vision for yourself. Yes.

Yeah. So even when I was on that stage, I'm like, this was not, I know that that was not me. Because I wrote what my dreams were, and it was nothing like this. at all. They say that, man. So I think that's what comes to me.

Like, I know that this is definitely good. Like, I couldn't have thoughts of this if I tried. Yeah. Is it make you happier that you're in this space and feel disconnected? It does make me, it gives me hope. I think that's what, the difference between me now and me 10 years ago, there was no hope in my mind. I didn't have hope.

Really? I didn't. I didn't. I thought like I wasn't, I wasn't expecting much from life. I was not, I wasn't someone that people like cared that much about. You know, I was used to people not caring. I was okay with it though. I wasn't feeling like sad or anything.

I was just like, oh, nobody cares. Cool. That's great. I could do whatever I want in my little corner. Aw. You know, but I think now I have so much hope, not for me, but for the world, for people, for life. There's so much to look forward to, even in the chaos, even in the craziness that's going on. There's still hope, you know?

That's good to hear because it is dark out here. It's very dark. Yeah. Sometimes I put myself on a limit of how much news. Like I watch only this amount of news. Then I had to stop. And you have to. Because I will be in just a dark place every day that doesn't serve me.

That doesn't serve anybody in my life or doesn't help me move around the world. I like to be informed. Yeah. But I have to be like almost on a diet because there's so much darkness in the world. Yeah. How do you navigate through that? How do you, I guess prayer, right? Yeah, no, I do the same thing.

But hope, I guess. No, like for me as well, I actually don't watch too much news either. I'm not a news person because news is meant to be negative. Like, hardly do they report on anything positive. Like, today in the positive news. The good news is. The good news is that this little boy was saved, you know, there's nothing like that.

Somebody should really do it. They really need to have a positive news channel. Yeah, I would watch that. I would watch that too. that would be great. But yeah, I think I don't, after I use my phone, I keep it, I throw it in many different places. I try and live life in reality. So I try not to be online too much, especially if I'm not actively doing anything.

Like, I'm not posting anything. I'm not, like, there's no reason I'm really online. After a few scrolls, I become so aware of myself, like, what are you doing your scroll? Why? It's so easy, though. It's so easy to get sucked into it. You get, it's like a vacuum. It's like literally.

No, it's meant to do that. Yes, it's designed. Yeah. That's why it's so scary. And that's why you can't let them get you. Like for me, sometimes like, it's like, because it's the damage of what it does to you is so ingrained in me. When I find myself scrolling, I'm like, yeah, they're getting to you. They're getting to you.

You need, I switch off my, I don't even go out of the app. I switch off my phone and I throw it across. I make sure I throw it behind the couch. I throw it. I'll just look for the father's place and I throw it. My phone is all cracked up because I keep throwing. Oh, it's a real thing. No, it's real.

I really throw it. I'm like, I believe you. Once I, if I'm scrolling and I catch myself doing that, I switch it off and I throw it away. Because you feel it controlling you, right? Yeah. feel the things. And I have a phone that has no social media. It's just for communication.

That's smart. So even if I've done that phone away, people can still reach me. On the non-social media phone? Yeah. Hey guys, you ever sign up for a phone plan thinking, wow, what a great price. And then a few months later, it's like, surprise, your bill is higher. We hate that. With Boost Mobile, you pay $25 a month forever.

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So we have a segment. It's an IRL voice notes. Okay. Somebody leaves a note. Usually it's a fan or somebody who listens to the pod or who's going to be here. So this is from Cynthia. Cynthia. Let's see right.

Hi, Tims. What's going on? My Nigerian queen. My name is Cynthia O'KK. I'm a journalist with Amplify Africa. I want to speak to you about your heart. I watched an interview with Don Juan. where he talked about a younger you.

He talked about a younger Tims that will come to the studio and even at the time when you didn't really have much, you still chose to buy little things for the people in the studio and you still chose to give. So you have a giver's heart.

I want to talk to you about that. Where do those characteristics come from? Is it a faith-based thing? Is it your love language? Please share. What a sweet question. Oh. What a sweet question.

really sweet. I've never thought about that before. I don't remember. You don't remember that? I mean, I remember now, but it's not something that I would have thought of at all. Well, um, are you a giver by nature? I am a giver. I'm actually a chronic giver. I actually have to stop myself from giving. I'm the kind of person that like, you'll give it all the way. I'll give it all the way. I would, you know, when I'm out with my friends, I would literally be fighting with them to pay, you know, and I shouldn't be doing that because they are their own people. And I had to think, you know what, this is not helping anyone.

Stop trying to be the one to give, to pay and no. So. How's that going for you? It's actually, you know what, it's making my relationships a little bit. better. Really? It is. Because you know what happens when you are too much of a giver?

It becomes like your identity subconsciously. So when you don't give, you feel weird, you know? You don't know how to receive anymore when you give too much. And it makes you a bit self-centered, or it makes me a bit self-centered because when I don't give and I feel weird, then I feel like whatever happens in the room was because of me or, you know, because I didn't do something, you know. And sometimes when I over give, then the other person feels weird because they want to give, you know, and imagine you wanting to give someone that is never accepting what you want to

give. It puts a little, it's strange, it puts a distance between you and that person. Because you're saying, I want to give you, but don't give me. Like, this is not an exchange. This is, I'm imposing my own gifts on you. Just take I don't want You know

If it's like It needs to Love is a mutual thing It's like We are one You know We can't be one If it's just coming

From one side So That's so interesting I've never heard it Put that way But that does make sense And also if you're the only giver Then how can you find

Real genuine relationships Because that attracts People who Take Who are takers. Yeah. And you don't want to be surrounded by a bunch of takers your whole life. That's a nightmare, actually.

Yeah. That's draining, exhausting. Yeah. You know, and I think I've learned the hard way because I definitely had a lot of takers in my life. You did. But, um. She said, a hole. You just went somewhere.

But yeah, I think, so I've learned to. to be a cheerful giver, but also know when to step back. Like, I don't need to be the one that people say thank you to. I can be the one saying thank you. Yeah. Oh, yeah, because, you know, sometimes people don't realize it's almost selfish, like you said. Yeah. I took care of everyone.

I took, you know, I did that. Well, we didn't ask you to. Exactly. Exactly. We just want to be on the same. That's funny because I have that. I have friends that are, that they're not. do better than me in life and friends who I always like to pay.

And sometimes I can see that becoming a thing. When you're all out and you're all equal and you're all friends, but then the one person wants to always be the show out, you know. You're like, it does put a separation. Yeah. That's interesting. It does. It's very subtle.

Yeah. But it's so, that's a hard thing, you know. And that's, you have to allow your heart to be molded. And giving is one of those things that you have to like, have some discipline in as a giver. That's a giver. Yeah. Because you'll give it all away.

I would. I would. Like, when anybody around me is distressed, I'm like, okay, what are we doing? What do we need to do? Cancel everything right now. I'm not going anywhere. I'm going to stay here. We're going to, what, one million?

Let's guess it. Let's get one. Who stops you? Do you have somebody in your team or your family? Yes. And now, my managers, my team, they're like, no, we're not doing it. And I'm like, no, we are. They're like, nope, get in the car.

Not getting the car. And I'm like, okay. And then I'm like, fair enough. It would have been nice to give that person. But, you know, especially my one of, both my managers, they're very, like, strongheaded. I'm strongheaded, but they're, like, they can be also strongheaded. So we all do who is going to, who's going to back down? And it's usually me.

because I'm the one spending all the money. I don't know if we... I'm Lori Siegel, a long-time tech journalist. And consider my new podcast, mostly human, your bridge to the future. Anyone can now be an entrepreneur. Anyone can build an app. And it's very empowering. Each week, I'll speak to the people building that future.

And we're going to break down what all of this innovation actually means for you. What I come to realize is that when people think that they're dating these AI companion, they're actually dating the companies that create this. We're experiencing one of the greatest tech accelerations in human history. And let's be honest, that can be messy. There's no playbook for what to do when an AI model hallucinates a story about you. But it's my belief that we should all benefit from this moment. Mostly human will show you how.

My goal is to give you the playbook, so you can benefit. The reason I say agency is because if we can give power back to people, then I think that's probably the best thing we can do for your mental health. Listen to mostly human on the IHeart Radio app, Apple Podcasts, or wherever you listen to your favorite shows. If you're trying to keep up with everything happening on and off the court, we've got you covered on the podcast, flagrant and funny. You look at the top four number one seeds. What do you think UCLA is going to do? Break down that for me, my friend.

Obviously, Yukon is the overwhelming favorite. in this tournament, but I'll be honest, I think people are kind of sleeping on Texas. Experts are suggesting that UCLA is the number one challenger to Yukon and that right after that would be Texas. S&C is so deep and so thinking just about everything, it really is annoying. So it's UCLA, Texas, South Carolina, LSU, only ones that could possibly upset Yukon. On Flagrin and Funny, we're giving our unfiltered takes on the biggest moments, the conversations everyone's having.

so whether your bracket is busted or you just want the latest on the tournament. We got you. Listen to Flacrant and Funny with Carrie Champion and Jamel Hill on the IHeart Radio app, Apple Podcasts, or wherever you get your podcast. Presented by Capital One, founding partner of IHeart Women's Sports. You know Roll Doll, the writer who thought up Willie Wonka, Matilda, and the BFG. But did you know he was also a spy? Was this before he wrote his stories?

It must have been. Our new podcast series, The Secret World of Roll Doll, is a wild journey through the hidden chapters of his extraordinary, controversial life. His job was literally to seduce the wives of powerful Americans. And he was really good at it. You probably won't believe it either. Okay, I don't think that's true. I'm telling you, the guy was a spy.

Did you know Dahl got cozy with the Roosevelt's? Played poker with Harry Truman and had a long affair with a congresswoman. And then he took his talents to Hollywood, where he worked alongside Walt Disney and Alfred Hitchcock, before writing a hit James Bond film. How did this secret agent wind up as the most successful children's author ever? And what darkness from his covert past seeped into the stories we read as kids. The true story is stranger than anything he ever wrote.

Listen to the secret world of Roll Dahl on the IHeart Radio app, Apple Podcasts, or wherever you get your podcasts. 10, 10, shots five, city hall building. A silver 40 caliber handgun was recovered at the scene. From IHeart Podcasts and Best K Studios. This is Rorschach, murder at City Hall. How could this have happened in City Hall? Somebody tell me that. July 2003,

Councilman James E. Davis arrives at New York City Hall with a guest. Both men are carrying concealed weapons. And in less than 30 minutes, both of them will be dead. Now everybody in the chamber is docked. A shocking public murder. I scream, get down, get down. Those are shots. Those are shots.

Get down. A charismatic politician. You know, he just bent the rules all the time. I still have a weapon, and I could shoot you. And an outsider with a secret. He alleged he was a victim of flat down. That may or may not have been political. That may have been about sex.

Listen to Roershack, murder at City Hall, on the IHeart Radio app, Apple Podcasts, or wherever you get your podcasts. Answer her question, did we? But the answer was so much better. We kind of answer. I answered it. Kind of.

Because it comes from, that was her question, where does that giving spirit come from? What is that rooted in? People pleasing? Self-worth? Hmm. Because it doesn't sound like that's a godly thing. No. I think, I mean, I think who I am is, you know, definitely God.

Who I truly am is God, but I think, I think it's something that is ingrained in me. I just know that when I was younger, I used to see. like in Nigeria, there's just a lot of suffering. And I used to be really pained that I couldn't do anything. And I didn't like people crying around me. I didn't like people being hurt. I didn't like people like looking sad, you know. So I would just be sad just because someone else is sad.

And I don't even know them. They don't even know me. They don't even know that I'm sad. Oh, you're an empath. I'm just, I'm crying. They don't even know. And I, yeah. Did you see a lot of that as a kid?

Yeah, I did. I did. You know, and my mom is very much, she's very humanitarian. Like, she used to adopt, like, children for, like, some months, for some weeks. She just bring, like, a kid home and will take care of the kid. Some of them have, like, my mom's a doctor. So some of them had, like, medical conditions they're trying to heal from, you know, and just seeing things like that

and on the road, people that don't have, it's just like, oh, why is this happening? So I think for me, I just always wanted to ease everybody's pain. Like, why are you crying? Don't cry anymore. Look, everything is still great. Look, I don't have much, but here, this should make you just count, you know. Be okay, please. Don't be sad anymore. Please, I don't want to cry. You can't take it.

I can't take it anymore. That's very sweet. So maybe you are going to heal the world. That's probably why you pray to make sure you're always asking yourself, are you doing enough? Enough. Yeah, I always feel like I can do more, but maybe it is that I'm not ready. Like who I am right now is still being working.

on to get to that level because you have to be able to handle whatever it is. And you also may be doing things that you're not even aware of what you're doing. Yeah. Because even today's conversation, I need my bowl. Even today's conversation, the way that affects someone else, you don't even know how helpful that could be in somebody's life. You know what I mean? Yeah, it's so true.

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Take out a couple of questions. Let's see what's going on in Thames' real life. Okay. If you had to describe yourself in three words, what would they be? That is so deep still. I can tell you what I think your three are. Yes, please. Godly.

Yes. Something to do with your relationship with God. Empathetic. right and hopeful yes you feel seen I feel seen I don't know if I

I don't want to answer your question for you if you have other three words you could do it or you could pick another ball a question from the ball I've said it all All right get another one get another one and then I have some IRLs here too She's a writer.

I thought she was going to go to the park that one. Oh yeah, you are a writer. You are a writer. But, you know, that one, that one is a whole three words is a

quite small. You need a few. I need a few. This one says, I'm at my best when. Hmm. I'm at my best when

I let go. I like God Ah ha ha ha That's a Party that You did good Okay

If you could Master a skill Instantly What would it be Who The gift of Master a skill Mm-hmm

Is it like a Whatever You could want to write motorcycle, I don't know. Oh, that would be so cool. Really? Well, to write, to be like a master, I've always wanted to be one of those bike riders.

You see what I mean? My dreams were crazy. My dreams were so far off. God makes better dreams for you. He does. He does. You'd have been performing on Fridays on your motorcycle. Literally.

I would. I actually would. I always wanted. I used to admire. like bike riders. Like what? Like wheel? Like,

like what? Like just the really cool bikes that like just in movies, you know, take the helmets off and ooh is a girl, yeah. You know, and I'm that. Yeah, I'm tough. Badass on the bike. I think the skill, the ability probably to,

to persuade. You want to rule the world I would have to persuade That would be the best gift Because you could persuade anyone to do anything But I wouldn't I want to rule the world, obviously What would be the first matter of business

As a professional persuader I'll call a meeting Of all the world leaders We're going to sit in the room And by the time we come out of the room Yeah. Peace. Peace, yeah.

Well, yeah. What? Love, peace and love. You put them all in check? Well, the thing is, I'll have the gift of persuasion. So they will all be persuaded. I wouldn't even need to put them in check. They would just be so convinced that they didn't know what they were doing before.

They just walk out of the room like, wow, everything she said made sense. What have we been doing, guys? You really do all. He healed the world. It is your nature to really want to heal the world. I mean, like, that's the first thing that is, like, the most important. Like, how can you have, I can't, we can't, we don't know what's going to happen. Yeah.

So how can we truly have peace when the whole world is at war, you know? Yeah. So I think that's the first solution. Let's address this first. Then I can enjoy my life on a yacht somewhere. As you should. As you should. You know.

What is your guilty pleasure? in real life. Guilty pleasure. Oh, yeah, I am a shopaholic. I think, well, I'm not a shopperholic. I experience symptoms of being a shopperholic, okay? I am in recovering. You get it, I get it.

I get it. Okay, I go into a store. They could be selling, I don't know, rat poison, and I would buy at least different types of rat poison, even when I don't have rats. You want to buy it. I'm buying. I go into a store and I'm doing something in that store.

You show serious signs of shopaholicness. I do. I don't know why I do such things. I really don't. Now that I'm aware, before I go anywhere, I'm like, once I step in here, I know I'm buying something. So do I really want to step in here? Oh, my God. I like this question for you, Thames.

In real life, what are you most proud of about yourself? Hmm. In real life, I am really proud that I've stood on business in certain aspects of my life. Like I said no, and I never went back to certain things, vices, people. I just said no, and I stood on that. I'm not an addict to anything. I'm not, you know, I do. I'm not in any toxic situations.

I just, I know when something isn't for me. And I say no, and that's it. Wow. Yeah. That is to be proud of. Even in love. I was always like that. I was going to say, even in love, are you that?

Well, to be fair, I am like that, but in a forgiving way. So I don't cut off out of anger or out of, hurt or anything. It's just out of understanding that the best thing for you right now is to not have me in your life, actually. You don't need to eat. I'm not what you need. You know, no puny.

That's pretty good. I see what you did there. No, no pun intended, but... I love that in that song that you say that, though, because it's not... You know, people break up relationships end, and usually a lot of the songs somebody left me or...

Yeah. Or you did something so bad to me. You're like, you... I'm like, what you need is something different. You're not here yet. You know? You're not here yet. And that's okay.

I'm actually not, like, you're not... You know? So for me, when I do cut people off, it's not like without explanation as well. It's like, I don't talk too much, but I just like, So this is what's going to happen now. Okay.

And I want you to know that you can do so much better. And I believe in you. And I have faith in you. Oh, this is killing them. Okay. Yes. I have faith. And I know that I'm going to see you successful in the future.

And I am really happy when they're successful, when I don't really actually... This is how you break up with people? Yeah. Well... Well, the thing is by then, it's not an emotional thing. I'm not emotional. I don't feel hurt. I've already like...

Cried and... Yeah, I've already done everything I need to do. Because for me, once someone is presenting symptoms, right? Oof. I have to diagnose it. You know what I'm saying. I have to give you a diagnosis like, okay, this is what this person is experiencing. Out of love, what does this person need?

right now. What does this person have to work with? And what can I do to help this person? And sometimes that means I'm not in your life. Because I also have to think about myself. And if I'm not good, how can I, how can I help you? If you're making, if you're triggering me or if we're not meeting eye to eye, then what could I possibly do for you? Even if I wanted to help you, I really can't, actually, because you are not in the states where you can't even let me help you. This is the most grown-up way to break up with somebody I've ever heard of or to cut somebody off. It is the most mature adult way that I've ever heard. Are you really like this in every, like, are you that non-emotional about it?

I mean, the thing is, yes, I am non-emotional about it. I think, obviously, I do have emotions. And I sort, what I do is I sort through my emotions. I get all the information I need. Like, this is how I feel. This is the reality separate from how I feel. This is the fruits that this person is producing. This is everything this person touches looks like this.

And everything that I touch looks like this. This is what this person has to offer. realistically. This is what I have to offer. Clearly, we are not compatible. So now emotion is gone because it's not even about whether I want you or it's not about wanting. You are not for me. It's all an illusion, the feeling of wanting illusion, because you can wake up tomorrow and you don't want that person anymore. That's not love. So love is actually seen beyond your wants and thinking about what does this person need right now as a human being, like to be better as a human.

What does this person actually need? And whatever that thing is, I don't have the answers, but I know that I need to get away from you as soon as possible. So I'm going to do this nicely because you're human. I guess you're working through some things. I don't judge you. I don't blame you, but goodbye. Wow.

Women struggle with that, you know. Yeah. Separating emotion and practicality and just truth. Yeah. You know what I mean? They struggle with that. Have you always been as like a gift, I guess, no? No.

I've not. I also struggled with that. I'm very, I used to be so emotional. Oh. Like incredibly. But it's the awareness thing. I think from me wanting to be so aware of myself, like I want to know, like I've been researching and researching like,

well, why do we feel this way? Why do we do that? I'm asked so many, all the questions you can think of. I've gone to find the answers. So I think in that journey is when I realized, oh, this thing I feel, it felt like the end of the world, but it really wasn't the end of the world. So that means that this thing is an illusion

You know And you figured it out And you trust the answer You know so I'm like Okay so how do I come out of this when I feel it Let's start researching You know and that's how I worked my way up You know what's so exciting about you is that

Because you're in such a state of learning All the time Like to watch your progression Like I can't wait to sit with you You know God willing whatever In two years or three years

to see what life has taught you and brought you along by that point. I don't even know what that's good it looked like. It would be fun. It would. I would like that.

It would be fun to see. In the meantime, what do people need to know now as we wrap up? What does this next chapter for you look like? I mean, you're still kind of in it, right?

I would imagine because you're still in this, you just drop this music, you're still on the road, you're, But I don't know, what do you envision for yourself this next Tim's chapter to look like? Personally, and I guess your career. Personally, I think I'm more grounded now. So what I'm trying to do is sow my seeds.

I think now is the time to sow seeds and plant trees and meet people. I'm ready to get out there and talk to people. I'm ready to get that out there and make more music. Music is always going to be part of my life. And also, I'm moving away from seeing myself as one thing, like, oh, yes, I am a musician, but now I'm realizing that I have gifts in many other things,

like pattern recognition and applying that in, like, business and learning about business, learning about the world, learning about politics. I think because I'm really trying to learn, and a lot. I think this next chapter is diversification you know, of investments.

Wow. Well, I really can't wait for our next chat then. Me too. Wait, one last question that's in the bowl. All right. I love this question. I wish you would have got it, but I'm going to pull it for you. Okay. If God were to text you right now, what would it say?

Wow, deep. If God were to text me. Like on that phone that you don't have the social media on but you get a text and it's from God what does it say? I am with you

is there an emoji? He would probably be like my daughter I am with you I don't, he might do an emoji but I can't put myself in the place of God I can't know what he would actually text

me in reality but I imagine that that's what he might, but I know that what he would really text me if he did would be so much better than what I just said. That's perfectly aligned with who you are. Yeah.

That's Thames in real life, everyone. Thank you. Thank you so much. That question is so funny because it really always reveals so much about people. And the fact that you can't even answer it because you're so much in your faith that you don't even want to pretend

that you can answer it better than he would answer it. No, that question always is very telling about people. This is Thames in real life. Hey guys, thanks for watching. Make sure you subscribe, like, comments, and check out all of the other episodes we have on Andrew Martinez, IRO podcast.

I'm Lori Siegel, and on my new podcast, mostly human, I'll take you to some wild corners of the tech world. I'm about to go on a date with an AI companion at a real-world cafe. Bay right here in New York City. There's no playbook for what to do when an AI model hallucinates a story about you. Mostly Human is your playbook for how tech can work for you.

Anyone can now be an entrepreneur. Anyone can build an app. And it's very empowering. Listen to Mostly Human on the IHeart Radio app, Apple Podcasts, or wherever you listen to your favorite shows. Five, City Hall building. How could this have happened in City Hall? Somebody tell me that. A shocking public murder.

This is one of the most dramatic events. that really ever happened in New York City politics. I scream, get down, get down. Those are shots. A tragedy that's now forgotten. And a mystery that may or may not have been political. That may have been about sex. Listen to Rorschach, murder at City Hall,

on the Iheart radio app, Apple Podcasts, or wherever you get your podcasts. You know, Roald Dahl. He thought up Willie Wonka and the BFG. But did you know he was a spy? In the new podcast, The Secret World of Roll Doll, I'll tell you that story, and much, much more. What?

You probably won't believe it either. Was this before he wrote his stories? It must have been. Okay, I don't think that's true. I'm telling you, because I was a spy. Listen to The Secret World of Roll Doll on the Iheart Radio app, Apple Podcasts, or wherever you get your podcasts. In 2023, Bachelor star Clayton Eckerd was accused of fathering twins, but the pregnancy appeared to be a hoax. You doctored this particular test twice, Ms. Owens, correct?

I doctored the test once. It took an army of internet detectives to uncover a disturbing pattern. Two more men who'd been through the same thing. Greg, a lesbian. Michael Mancini. My mind was blown. I'm Stephanie Young. This is Love Trapped.

Laura, Scottsdale Police. As the season continues, Laura Owens finally faces consequences. Listen to Love Trapped podcast on the IHeart Radio app, Apple Podcasts, or wherever you get your podcasts. This is an IHeart podcast. Guaranteed human.