Joy, a Podcast. Hosted by Craig Ferguson - DJ Qualls

Episode Date: October 15, 2024

Meet DJ Qualls, actor known for his memorable roles in films like "Road Trip “ and "The New Guy,” as well as popular TV series including "Supernatural," "The Man in the High Castle,” and "Z Nation." With a career spanning over two decades, Qualls has established himself as a talented character actor with a unique presence on both big and small screens. He also co-hosts a new podcast called “Locked and Probably Loaded with DJ and Kelly”. EnJOY! See omnystudio.com/listener for privacy information.

I'm Julian Edelman. I'm Rob Gronkowski. And we are super excited to tell you about our new show, Dudes on Dudes. We're spilling all the behind-the-scenes stories, crazy details, and honestly, just having a blast talking football. Every week, we're discussing our favorite players of all times, from legends to our buddies to current stars. We're finally answering the age-old question,

what kind of dudes are these dudes? We're gonna find out, Jules. New episodes drop every Thursday during the NFL season. Listen to Dudes on Dudes on the iHeart radio app, Apple Podcasts, or wherever you get your podcasts. Hey, I'm Jay Shetty, and I'm the host of On Purpose. My latest episode is with Jelly Roll. This episode is one of the most honest

and raw interviews I've ever had. We go deep into Jelly Roll's life story from being in and out of prison from the age of 13 to being one of today's biggest artists. I was a desperate delusional dreamer. Be a delusional dreamer. Just don't be a desperate delusional dreamer. Listen to On Purpose with Jay Shetty on the iHeartRadio app, Apple Podcasts or wherever you get your podcasts.

Trust me, you won't want to miss this one. I'm Sheryl Swoops. And I'm Tarika Foster-Brasby. And on our new podcast, we're talking about the real obstacles women face day to day. Because no matter who you are, there are levels to what we experience as women. And T and I have no problem going there. Listen to levels to this with Cheryl Swoops and Tareika Foster-Brasby, an iHeart Women's Sports Production in partnership with Deep Blue Sports and Entertainment.

You can find us on the iHeart Radio app, Apple Podcasts, or wherever you get your podcasts. Presented by Capital One, founding partner of iHeart Women's Sports. The Craig Ferguson Pants on Fire Tour is on sale now. It's a new show, it's new material, but I'm afraid it's still only me, Craig Ferguson, on my own, standing on a stage, telling comedy words. Come and see me, buy tickets, bring your loved ones, or don't come and see me.

Don't buy tickets and don't bring your loved ones. I'm not your dad. You come or don't come, but you should at least know it's happening. And it is. The tour kicks off late September and goes through the end of the year and beyond. Tickets are available at thecraigfergussonshow.com slash tour. They're available at thecraigfergussonshow.com slash tour or at your local outlet in your region. My name is Craig Ferguson. The name of this podcast is Joy. I talk to interesting people about what brings them happiness.

When I was doing late night television, one of my favorite guests was a gentleman. He was a kid at the time. His name was DJ Qualls. His name is still DJ Qualls. He's not a kid anymore. He's grown up to be one of the most impressive, lovely men I've talked to in a while. Please enjoy this. Hello? Hello! Hey dude, how are you? I am so happy to see you. I can't tell you how happy I am to see you. This is great. It's very happy for me.

I haven't talked to you. I was just trying to figure out. I haven't talked to you properly. I think in about 10 years. It's been 10 years since I saw you. Oh my God. You were lovely when I came out in 2020, you messaged me and we chatted.

But I haven't seen you in forever. Yeah, I remember that. It was funny, I remember because you were taking a little hate for coming out. Yeah. I'm like, what is this, 1960s or something? That's crazy. That's the thing. The thing is, it's not surprising though,

cause I, you know, I'm from the South. I understand, I understand the world. But it also was a point in my life where none of that felt like anything. It just, after a while you're like, it doesn't matter to me. None of this really matters. And a lot of that spilled over into how I feel about my career,

my relationship to Hollywood. Like it really was this time in my life. And I'm like, I think a lot of this is the source of my unhappiness. And I don't want to do this anymore. Yeah, I did that. Same thing. Same for me. Yeah. I thought about you during this.

Yeah. When you were like, what's the goal of this? To come and be miserable like a lot of people in this industry are? And I'm like, I don't... But the thing is, I'm not good with transitions. Change is hard for me. I still have a Hotmail account. And so it's very hard for me.

I now have... I replaced my 22-year-old car this last week because it was dying. But now I have a car that I'm afraid of. Like, it's, there are no buttons on it. It's all computer screen, but it's really, it's not, it's the change of things. Like, I get really nostalgic and overly connected to things. And I think what I was really dragging behind me was this childhood idea

of what Hollywood would be like and, and people loving me. And you get addicted to that until one day I realized, I was like the people making these choices, whether or not to validate me or fulfill my dreams or really provide me with what I was attaching myself worth to was were NBAs from Harvard. Like these people think they're creatives. And then I really started seeing these.

And here's the thing. It's not that I'm never going to do this again. I'm still doing it, but I don't have the same emotional connection to it. I show up every day, like it's my opus and I'm still doing it, but I don't care if you don't want me to do your project. And I'm not going to jump through a thousand hoops for you because I've proven myself. Right.

I go, I was talking to Tom Lennon about this really recently because I got asked to do a chemistry read on a, on some kind of thing that Hulu were making. And I'm like, no. What do you mean no? Is it, it's not a chemistry read. You want to audition me. It's a power play. I'm not doing it.

That's right. And, and, and they said, well, if you don't, if you don't do the chemistry read, they're not going to offer you the part. And I'm like, okay, that's fine. You don't have to offer me the part. I'll be all right. You'll be all right. Your show will be great.

I'm just not, I'm not going to do that for you. I'm not going to create a power dynamic which allows you to treat me like that. It's not, it's not going to happen. You know, and I get that sometimes you have to do that. And there's a lot of people who would do a callus reread, but Tom in fact said he would do it. And that'd be good for them.

Yeah, fine. But you have to do what's right for you. I really do. I mean, I, I feel that as well. I remember talking to you back in the day and we would talk backstage a little bit too. And we didn't talk anything about you coming out. I don't remember having any conversations about you worrying about coming out. But we talked about unhappiness and about the squirming in Hollywood and not quite knowing how to make it.

Because look, I don't come from show business people either. I don't come from that world. And I had an idea about it too, that when you see behind the curtain, it's a little different. I don't come from that world. And I had an idea about it too. That when you see behind the curtain, it's a little different. It is. And then you realize that there are aspects.

Here's the thing, it's given me so much. Like I'm at home. Oh, I love it. But it's just different. I've been all over the world and being famous is fucking awesome. I love it because people are happy that you're there. What a great gift to you.

And so, so many beautiful things. But the thing is, after you play it for a while, the person who doesn't get absorbed by it or into it, for me, knows when to get the hell out and not doing this anymore and getting my self-worth caught up in it. And that was a big thing to me. And so by the time I worked around coming coming out, like I, I, I worked so easily for 20, for almost 20 years. And then it got hard. All of a sudden things that I would be offered, I was asking to read for. And I'm like, well, I'm not doing that because

I've already done that. And then it's, and then I looked around and realized that I was not in a relationship. I don't know many people because I just moved back from Canada. I've been shooting, I was on Man in the High Castle there and LA is so transient. This is where I live. I was like, I don't know anybody. And I'm like, so I've given away all of that. And yes, I've gotten so much from it, but the fundamentals, like they're not going to be here.

I'm clearly not going to be here when I need them. Or it's so easy for the system to turn its back on you. And so I was like, well, I want to build something for myself. And I started, when I started thinking like that, it, the shock of not being chosen wore off pretty quick. Yeah. But then I started seeing little insidious things. Like I was up for a job.

Gilmore de Toro did this Netflix thing, this cabinet of curiosities and he told them to offer it to me and they asked me to read for it and I said no. But they did it to get me cheaper to make me think there was a bunch of other people in the mix. That is so gross. Yeah. But you know a lot of stuff now is difficult. Look things change. I don't know if it's better or worse, but there was a time, I think, in Hollywood where not, these executives have always been there.

There's always been the soulless money people executives, but smattered amongst them were executives who really cared, who really gave a shit about it and really wanted to be involved and wanted to make good stuff and really gave, they would never use the word product about what they were making. And I think they probably still exist, but there's a lot less of them in the mix now. And I think it shows on what work is around and what is getting made as well. I mean, even just as a consumer of entertainment, I'm like, I got 500 channels of fuck you.

You know what I mean? And people can feel it. People can really feel it. Because I am a fan first and foremost. Like, I love the magic of this. And I don't find a lot of magic anymore. And I don't think it's because I'm so jaded because I've worked very hard

to still have clear eyes about things. I think I once worked with a cinematographer called John de Boorman. He's a great cinematographer. We were taking a shot on a film that we were doing. And we got this shot. It was like, it was a bit of a kind of like running into the ocean thing.

And it was OK. It was an OK shot. And it was getting the late in the day and everyone was a bit worried about time. And I said, did we get it, John? And he said, yeah, we got it. It's OK. And I went, what do you think? And he went, it's OK. I said, he said, but is OK.

I said, will anybody notice? He said, well, we'll know it's only we could have done better. And he fell, and I feel this too, that if you don't do your, I mean, you can get away with it. You can make fucking Emily in Paris and everyone will be fine, but it's awful. It's awful. It's soulless. And you should make, find a way to, you don't have to make Pride and Prejudice again, but somebody can write something. But what makes it worse is when you beat your brains out,

begging people for the right to make okay. And that's when I was like, what am I doing? Like I was in hustle and flow, like I've gotten to do so many amazing things. And they came easily because I was trusted and I was trusted by other artists. And so then I started, I mean, it was, it just took two years. It took two years of grieving, sort of like not knowing I was grieving because my life had been changing. How I identified was not there anymore.

Did you ever think you were straight? No, no, no, no, no. I never thought that. Right, so you weren't really, I mean, you knew you were, right? I mean, it wasn't like you were... No. But here's, I knew that I was gay since I was 19 years old. And they're only related in the fact that when I realized that I've been given my life to something that couldn't love me back,

when I really realized that in sort of tangible terms, that's when I realized, well, I've also sold this part away, this part of myself away. Or, I mean, I don't think I've necessarily misled anybody, but here's the thing. At my very first press junket, the executive producer who was a massive director from the 80s, told another actor he almost didn't hire him

because he thought he was a faggot. And those, and that taught me in the year 2000, everything I needed to know about Hollywood. And if I wanted this, shut my mouth. And that is the truth. And that existed until a few years ago. This is new. Wow.

I mean, I've heard slurs like that used around as well, but the idea that you would say I wouldn't hire someone, I mean, that's like- But it's the old school boys club, right? You're so used to being able to do whatever the hell you want. And he was such a huge guy in entertainment. But it really just taught me that if I want this, if this dream that I had since I was a child,

I wanted to go after, I had to, there's certain things I just couldn't do. Like I couldn't take my boyfriend to the premiere of The New Guy. Like it just wasn't going to happen. And then you get used to that. And I don't think that I have any sort of damage from it other than the fact that those were the choices that I made.

I made them willingly. I've stand behind every choice I've ever made because I made them. But the system was fucked. It was very odd. I made a movie in 1999. I love this movie. It totally flopped.

But it was a movie called The Big Teas. And The Big Teas, it was about competitive hairdressing. And it was about a hairdresser from Scotland that came to LA seeking his fame and fortune basically and hijinks ensue. And I'm very proud of the movie, it's a very affectionate movie, it's a very sweet movie and it got rated R because the lead character, I played a gay man. Now there were no gay sex scenes in it, there were no sex scenes in it, there was no violence or there was no hard language.

There was nothing. It was just that the main character was unequivocally a gay man who was in a relationship with another man and they talked to each other and they had a sweet relationship and it wasn't really part of the story. It was just who he was. And it was an art. If you look at this thing, it wouldn't even make PG-13 today. And that's 25 years ago.

And that is not that long ago. I know. And the thing is, I'm fully cognizant of like how things are so much easier now. But Craig, after like in 2021, everything I was being offered was a guy who falls apart because he left his moisturizer at home. And I'm like, I'm not doing that. I'm not going to do that. That's so fucking lame. That's great. But here's the, but also I completely like, I also realized like, I knew something told

me when I first got here. Like, I was in Young Hollywood. Young Hollywood was very small. It was, you know, we got jobs from going out. It was one bar, one night. My friend got a Gap campaign with Joni Mitchell from going to hide one night. That's what you did. But I saw people blowing through money and I was like, this cannot sustain itself.

This won't sustain itself. So I started putting, like during, during, like after 9-11, I spent three months chain smoking on eBay, buying Gold Bullion between 250 and 350 an ounce. We are from a very similar place. I don't smoke anymore, but I still have the gold. Oh, oh my God. I'm honestly, I'm a survivalist. I bought an Airstream trailer on Facebook Marketplace.

And it's in my house. It's not in my house, but it's at my house, and I have it, and I'm ready, and I'm like, stalking it with things. My wife's like, what are we stalking this for? You never know. You never know. I think part of it also is that I don't get caught out. You know what I mean? I, and also once you've been poor and you've been in a situation where you're no longer poor, you would think that you would feel relief, but you feel fear.

This is going to go away from me and be taken from me. And then I saw so many of my peers lose it all by doing crazy stuff because there's no governance. There's no mentoring, right? I'm Julian Edelman. I'm Rob Granckowski. Guess what, folks? We're teammates again, and we're going to welcome you guys all to Dudes on Dudes. I'm a dude, you're a dude, and Dudes on Dudes is our brand new show. We're going to highlight players, peers,

guys that we played against, legends from the past, and we're just gonna sit here and talk about them. And we'll get into the types of dudes. What kind of types of dudes are there, Gronk? We got studs, wizards, we got freaks. Or dudes dudes. We got dogs. Dogs!

We'll break down their games, we'll share some insider stories, and determine what kind of dude each of these dudes are. Is Randy Moss a stud or a freak? Is Tom Brady a dog or a dude's dude? We're going to find out Jules. New episodes drop every Thursday during the NFL season. Listen to dudes on dudes on the iHeart radio app, Apple podcasts,

or wherever you get your podcasts. Hey, I'm Jay Shetty and I'm the host of On Purpose. My latest episode is with Jelly Roll. This episode is one of the most honest and raw interviews I've ever had. We go deep into Jelly Roll's life story from being in and out of prison from the age of 13 to being one of today's biggest artists. We talk about guilt, shame, body image and huge life transformations. I was a desperate delusional dreamer and the desperate part got me in a lot of trouble. I encourage delusional dreamers. shame, body image and huge life transformations. I took zero accountability for anything in my life. I was the kid that if you asked what happened,

I immediately started with everything but me. It took years for me to break that, like years of work. Listen to On Purpose with Jay Shetty on the iHeart Radio app, Apple Podcasts, or wherever you get your podcasts. Trust me, you won't want to miss this one. I'm Cheryl Swoops, WNBA champ, three time Olympian and basketball hall of famer. I'm a mom and I'm a woman.

I'm Tariqa Foster-Brasby, journalist, sports reporter, basketball analyst, wife, and I'm also a woman. And on our new podcast, we're talking about the real obstacles women face day to day. See, athlete or not, we all know it takes a lot as women to be at the top of our game. We want to share those stories about balancing work and relationships, motherhood, career shifts. You know, just all the s*** we go through. Because no matter who you are, there are levels to what we experience as women.

And T and I, well, we have no problem going there. Listen to levels to this with Cheryl Spoope and Tarika Foster-Brasby, an iHeart Women's Sports Production in partnership with Deep Blue Sports and Entertainment. You can find us on the iHeart Radio app, Apple Podcast, or wherever you get your podcasts. Presented by Elf Beauty, founding partner of iHeart Women's Sports. presented by Elf Beauty, founding partner of iHeart Women's Sports. Well, when you get given, you know, large sums of money and success and privilege when you're very young, now that, it honestly didn't really happen to me like that. It was kind of a slow burn.

But I saw it, I saw it a lot in Hollywood. I saw it with your peers. I saw it when there would be people that would come through. When I was doing Late Night, there'd be people coming through and you would go, oh man, you gotta try and get better people around you. This is gonna go bad fast. And some of them-

Yeah, you saw it all. Yeah, and some of them dead and some of them didn't, you know, and some of them made it. Some of them are dead. I mean, it's crazy. It's unsupervised in any way. There's no real structure to it. But at the same time, I wonder, because the, you know, I look at the kind of freedom and the openness

about certain areas of life now, and there are other parts of it where I kind of go, is this good? Like the amount of, Bette Midler said a thing years ago that I always kind of hung on to, which was, she said that the saddest thing about success is finding out that not everyone is happy for you. And, and when that happens and you find out when the, and when social media came along, you find that all of the people that are not happy for you are right there.

Real quick. Yeah, they're there and they're there to let you know. And I kind of, I understand that. I feel Shad and Freud sometimes. I sometimes see people that I don't like do well. And I'm like, oh, come on. I feel that. Do you still feel it?

Yeah, occasionally, but I fight it though. Yeah, me too, yeah. Because the difference is now, like I understand where it comes from and I really do fight it, but of course I feel it. I said something the other day on my podcast that after I said it, I was like, that's not who you are at all.

But I was caught up in this thing and there was a little thing still in my memory from another time ago. And I was like, ah, man, it is disappointing when I do it. But also the thing is I realized that I am, I'm not who I'm going to be, but I'm better than who I was. And so I do give myself, but also I'm an easy apologize. It's really easy to apologize.

Yeah, I think once you start doing it, it gets easier. I go into it about during late night. I had to apologize for stuff every night. And then I was like, you know what? Okay, fine, I'm sorry. And at first I meant it and then I didn't mean it at all. I can't apologize for stuff I don't mean. I can apologize for stuff I do mean, stuff I don't mean.

I could run for office. I could apologize for anything. I could say, no, it wasn't me. No could apologize for anything. I can say, I can say, that wasn't me. I was, I'd say, I wasn't me at all. I wasn't there. But the truth is that when I, it's kind of like that thing when I really apologize, I know and you know, and you can tell what I mean. And it's, it's, uh, but saying something that's kind of awkward or weird,

it's just a human thing. It's not like, you know, to be judged on one thing you say is a little, it's a pretty odd standard to hold anyone to. Late night is a scary world because you can say something. And like, I remember like you were the first ever late night host who didn't pre-interview me. You did it once and we had such a good chat and we went so far off the scripted cards

or whatever you're like we don't have to do this anymore and then you go on and you feel safe and you feel like if you get into something you'll be guided out of as opposed to this thing you have to get back to these stories and you're like, oh my God, I'm so far away from where I'm supposed to be. So you're never truly yourself. Yeah. And that's what I loved, but I couldn't imagine if I was on every night, the kind of stuff that would just randomly come out of my mouth.

I'd probably be held responsible for. Yeah. I mean, I took a few hits, no doubt about it, but the, the, the truth is though, I think the atmosphere then was few hits, no doubt about it. But the truth is though, I think the atmosphere then was a little less frantic because it wasn't about filling the space. You didn't have to fill every website. You didn't have to post every 10 seconds

about some kind of outrage. So, if I say the wrong thing about something in 2010, there wasn't enough of a social media appetite for someone to go looking for it. But if it's now, I mean, look, we could say this, the wrong thing, you could say the wrong thing on a podcast right now. And it's like be tabloid, bang. But it's also gone like that.

But then it's always available to be found digitally. No one has to go through and find the microfiche from, you know, all you have to do is put your name in and then put it by date and it all comes up. But I do feel though, like on social media when people say things, like I feel lucky that we came up in a time when somebody said something bad about us that was in the New York Times. That really hurt because that was official. The New York Times would have said about me, human bookmark DJ Quall shines. I go, you know what, when I got one, when I first started, the New York Post said, when I first started in late 90s, he said, he's awful and it looks like he's wearing a wig.

And I'm like, look, if there's one thing I know about me, the only thing I know about me, I've got great fucking hair. That's the only thing I know about me. It looks like he's weird. It's funny the things you go, I, that really got to me. Like, fuck you. Yeah. I think when the New York Times says something bad about you, it's like when your parents

go, I'm not angry, I'm disappointed. That's why he's like, ah, shit. But really, I mean, after you've been dragged through the mainstream press when it was in print, can the internet really hurt that, unless they're coming for your belongings or your family or your reputation. I always felt like Hollywood and the internet were very, could be treated in the same way. Late night taught me this. It demystified me for me the following way. It's only dangerous if you take it seriously. If you don't take it seriously, it's not really there.

And it's kind of like, it's that Nietzschean thing. If you look into the void, fine, but remember the void looks into you. But if you don't look into the void, you can avoid it. And that's kind of how I feel about it. I refuse to participate in any interaction with media beyond what I think is acceptable for me. Like you were saying, like right at the beginning when you were talking about, no, I still do it. I still love it. When I show up, I'll give you my best, but

I'm not showing up unless I'm going to do that. Right. And I think it's funny now because I'm going to do that. Right. And I think it's, it's funny now because I feel like that's part of the growing up process and I like even talking to you now, cause when I met you, you were a young man, you were like in your mid 20s. I was. You really were. You were a kid.

And, and it's, it's like to see someone it's appropriate for someone to go from their mid-20s to their mid-40s and to change their mind. You know, I feel differently about that now. I'm not a kid anymore. I'm not going to... And what I think happens is, especially if you get success when you're young, is that some people perhaps who are not as emotionally gifted as you or emotionally diligent as you, they get stuck.

You get stuck in what worked for you at that time and you try and keep in that time. Do you know what I mean? Try and stay in the same place. But you can't. It's against the law of nature. You can't stay in the same place. Change is coming and it's coming for you. Yeah.

All the time. Change is the law of God's mind and the resistance to it is the source of all pain. I love that. That's awesome. I'm going to remember that. Yeah, I like it too. So, let me ask you this.

Was there any kind of, because I've always thought of you as someone who has quite a kind of searching personality. You're quite a seeker. You look for reasons. You look for, you analyze both yourself and the situation around you, right? I think that. I mean, that's my impression of you.

Was there some kind of spiritual or emotional switch that flipped when, I'm not talking necessarily about coming out, but I'm talking about the change of attitude that you're talking about. I think something happened to me where my, my grandfather always told me this, when you don't know what to do, don't do anything until that doesn't work for you anymore and you will know.

And all of a sudden, just my heart, how I felt about things, how I felt about myself also during the same time, I just had problems looking in the mirror. And like some days I would have to brush my teeth with the medicine cabinet open. I had some days where I just couldn't with myself. And then it stopped happening.

And just there were these gradual changes and when you release the care and I had this really pivotal moment in the shower where I know, I know where I do all my thinking in there. And so I got asked to grand marshal the Christmas parade in my little town. Right. Where I was horrifically bullied. And this was not that long ago. And I had this, I played this little drama out in my head where I was like, you know what?

I'll tell them to fuck off and this, this and this. And then I was like, what are you doing? You're holding 16 year olds responsible for their behavior. You're a grownup. You've been carrying this your whole life. And I'm pretty sure it's dictated a lot of your choices and behavior. And when that happened, you know, every sort of, every thought, every mistake has been made before you by other people who are older than you or on a different path.

But you can never really internalize anything until it applies directly to you. And in that moment, I was like, I don't want to do this. And I released it, and I'd never released anything before. And I remember exactly how I felt. I felt so light, I could float out of that shower. And I don't feel it anymore. It's so crazy.

It's great though, it's freedom. I always think the best revenge is no longer wanting revenge. That's the best revenge. You know, they say revenge is a dish chef cold. No, the best revenge is no revenge at all. It's like, I don't want any revenge. I forgive you, you son of a bitch. Goodbye. Yeah, but it also makes it intellectually makes no sense because I know for a fact that

when you get successful, the people in your past misremember your dynamic. And so, and I know this and I know this at the same time when I'm thinking all of these things about being put upon. And... That's very true. Then it just changed for me, and it was all these things just started occurring to me, like, and the cool thing about it was none of it was angry.

None of it was like, I've been used and whatever, like, no, all these decisions were mine. I've done all these things and I've certainly profited and had a great life from it but I don't want to do this anymore in this way and that's the thing I know that I can do what I want to do but just in the way that I want to do it and if I don't if I can't then I won't. It's really that simple. It's really funny isn't it? I had a thing happen to me in a similar nature. I, when my, before my mom died, she was in a care home. She was very ill for a while and she was in this care home in Scotland. And when I got there, I was talking to her, she was cognitively, she was fine,

but she was physically, you know, fallen to pieces and needed round the clock care. And I was in this, went to visit her in the care home and she said, let's change her name, actually I'll edit this out. See Mrs. Lady who was mean to me when I was a visit her in the care home and she said, let's change her name actually. I'll edit this out. I would say Mrs. Lady who was mean to me when I was a kid is in here. And the lady, the teacher who had beat me horrifically when I was a child, and that I like a lot of, you know, stuff had come out of it, was in the care home and she was suffering from Alzheimer's. And she had very bad Alzheimer's. And my mom said, you should go in and see her.

And I'm like, I don't think so, man. I think whatever that was, it's gone. And I don't want to go in and lord it over this poor woman who's sick. What would you get from that? I mean, she wouldn't even remember it if you pushed her down the stairs. Yeah, the very definition of it as well is, look, I'm not a doctor. I don't know a lot about Alzheimer's, but I know if I walk in there, she's going to have no fucking clue who I am.

So it's like, what the hell? But it's funny, my mom was like, no, you should go and give it a piece of your mind. I'm like, I don't think so, man. I think it's funny, my mom was like, no, you, you, you should go and give it a piece of your mind. I'm like, I don't think so, man. I think it's all right. It's an odd thing. It's that idea of, of holding on to resentments. I used to think it was a kind of a Pollyanna thing to try and free yourself from that,

but it's not, it's mental health. It really is. It's like, no, I'm not going to hold on to make you feel more comfortable or because I was mad 10 years ago. I'm not mad now. I mean, I can get to it, but I can release it, let it go. But we also do it from behavioral modeling too, because it's what people who that came before us do

and we're told to always get the last word in, get your own back. We're taught that. And it takes, I think maybe if I didn't leave my community, to always get the last word in, get your own back. We're taught that. And it takes, I think maybe if I didn't leave my community, then maybe I'm from a small town and I feel like being exposed to the rest of the world without sort of the net that reinforced that kind of behavior. Yeah. I think that helped me sort of get to where I am or where I'm going.

Did we ever take it to move back? Never. What's so great about not belonging is that you leave and you don't have to go back. Because there was nothing there for me. My high school farms into the casket factory and the pajamas factory and pajamas closed down. It's a fucking country song crack. That's so fucking bleak. It's fantastic. I know, it's the truth though. Yeah, but it's great.

It's such a gothic picture. It's fabulous. I think that, I think also the freedom that comes from, it's really, it feels to me very therapeutic to laugh at stuff like that as well. It kind of, it doesn't, I therapeutic to laugh at stuff like that as well. It kind of, it doesn't, I think I'm sure that's why I ended up getting into working mostly in humor because it's such a fabulous weapon to free yourself.

Like, you know, it's why I'm sure, you know, whenever like the Hitlers or the Stallions or the demagogues come along, they always go after the humorists first. It's always, you can't make jokes about that. And you go, well, why not? You know, it's, you can, you can make jokes about that. And when, when you make, but if you make jokes about things, you kind of emasculate it a little bit. You make it a figure of derision, a figure of fun. And you can do that.

I think you can do it with your own history. When you laugh at your own history, it becomes less threatened somehow. Do you know what I mean? I mean, that was my, I think that was my security blanket or my armor when I moved out here and started doing work as an actor, it's like, I'm going to say all the things before you say them. You don't think I know what the merchandise I'm trying to move looks like. You don't think I don't know myself.

And I did it. And I did it. But I did it out of defense. And now I'm able to do it with like, yep. This is exactly what happened. This is what's going on. Like it feels different. The motives are different.

Right. Because it's not born of pain. Do you feel that, you know, like the movies that you were doing early in your career, hilarious movies, funny performances in these, like kind of, they're not slapstick movies, but quite broad humor movies. And people who loved those movies are sometimes, I think, not necessarily for you, but just for anyone, if you do a joke and somebody likes it and then they find out later that you're not like the joke you did,

they feel a little betrayed by it. It is so crazy that you're saying that because that's what I got. As I've gone forward in my life, people meet me in public way before coming out and people meet me and find out that I'm not that. And I try to explain to them, no, no, no, no, no. I made you think that on purpose because it's funny and it's good for the movie.

But I was I was the reason why you thought that was funny, but it's not who I am. And and so many times people like after Hustle and Flow, everybody thought that I could make music. And it's kind of a little bit flattering that people think that I am the person that I play. But here's what I wanted to say to people. I played a virgin like 27 times. I've been famous like for like seven years at this point. You don't think that one person would have sex with me. I'm on television. Use your logic. Yeah. It's a very, it's a very thing though, because I think that people do get attached to it in a way

with John. I always thought, look, the example is fairly recently was what happened to Ellen Degeneres. It's like, oh, she's not very nice. I don't know Ellen Degeneres at all. I was on a show once or twice, I think, but you don't know someone because you're on their show. You know this, you go on a show, you get a yak, you leave. And she was perfectly nice. And then it turns out, apparently she wasn't as nice backstage as she was on the show. And I'm like, uh, yeah, that's cause she's doing her job. She's pretending to be

nice. Like everybody else in Hollywood. You have to be. Also, it's her job. It is her job. You can't go on a daytime talk show bitch, or talk about things that are going wrong. People don't want to see that. No. And the thing is, they also don't like,

I knew, when I did Road Trip, my first movie, Todd Phillips, you know, he went on to direct The Hangover and The Joker, it was his first movie too. I realized that if I allowed myself to be the butt of the joke, my whole career was over. There's a kid from American Pie who was the butt of the joke and didn't work much beyond that. I knew and also knew that we lost the movie.

So I was like, there's a way to do this where I'm not being shat upon, that I'm being celebrated and I still get to do all these things that you want me to do. Right. I was really, really aware of this. And as I, as my career came, I, along, I started to see like, there's a role I could take that's enough like that, that's going to pay me this big amount of money so that I can go away and do something else. So I was, I think part of, I think I've sort of benefited a lot from insecurity and from being sort of made fun of and all these things that were going on in my head

because it allowed me to, first of all, insulate myself from my career, but also to be a good storyteller. I'm like going for the joke and making fun of myself is first of all, not good for me in the longterm, but also that's not what we're doing. We're telling hero stories and redemption stories and it's not that, and it's too easy to go for that.

And so I think that I made some wise choices and knew when to take the money. The only time I didn't, I got offered Scary Movie 2 for $2 million. I've never made that before or since, never been offered that. But my character had to suck his own dick and my manager says you're Not the kind of guy that could do that and walk away from it and he was right I am NOT the vessel that can tell that story and recover from it

All right that look I just as an aside. Can you can you do that because no I tried No, but I tried. We've all tried. Every man alive has tried. It blew my mind, the offer though. But then it was explained to me, there are certain things that you haven't set that up for yourself. You've gone the opposite route in like being the butt of it and you're not the physical shell or the personality that you created that can endure that. And he was right. And so, instead of doing that...

Is that person still your manager? Yeah, he is. Brian Dobbins, he's been my manager. So when I first came out here, everybody tried to... Like, Brad Gray, I met with him when he was at Brillstein Gray. And they were like, we'll give you the Young Hollywood cover of Vanity Fair. And I'm like, how could you promise me that? And Brian, he now runs Artists First.

He had a handful of clients, him and Paul Young, and he was like, I can't get you that, but I think you're gonna work. And I believed him because he wasn't lying to me. And he's been my only manager my whole career. And so instead I did Hustle and Flow, which is a career highlight. And I'm so happy that I did that.

But I couldn't see around it because the money was, my redneck mind was blown. I didn't realize that agent manager, business manager, publicist, accountant, everybody, I didn't realize, you know, half of it. I didn't think about that. It didn't occur to me because the number was so huge. And then something interesting happened as a result of that. My father found out and called me lazy.

And we got into a massive fight. My father was the welder. He was a welder in that casket factory for 40 years. He was. And so he found this out. Well, look, if you're a welder in a casket factory, your kid gets offered $2 million to suck his own dick and you know he's tried to do it anyway. You're kind of like, why wouldn't you? What are you doing? Your kid gets over $2 million to suck his own dick and you know, he's tried to do it anyway

I'm Julian Edelman. I'm Rob Granckowski. Guess what folks? We're teammates again and we're gonna welcome you guys all to Dudes on Dudes. I'm a dude, you're a dude, and Dudes on Dudes is our brand new show. We're gonna highlight players, peers, guys that we played against, legends from the past, and we're just gonna sit here and talk about them. And we'll get into the types of dudes. What kind of types of dudes are there, Gronk?

We got studs, wizards, we got freaks. Or dudes dudes. We got dogs. Dog.ards, we got freaks, or dudes dude. We got dogs. Dogs! We'll break down their games, we'll share some insider stories, and determine what kind of dude each of these dudes are. Is Randy Moss a stud or a freak? Is Tom Brady a dog or a dudes dude?

We're gonna find out Jules! New episodes drop every Thursday during the NFL season. Listen to Dudes on Dudes on the iHeart radio app, Apple podcasts, or wherever you get your podcasts. Hey, I'm Jay Shetty and I'm the host of On Purpose. My latest episode is with Jelly Roll. This episode is one of the most honest and raw interviews I've ever had. We go deep into Jelly Roll's life story from being in and out of prison from the age of 13, to being one of today's biggest artists. We talk about guilt, shame, body image,

and huge life transformations. I was a desperate delusional dreamer, and the desperate part got me in a lot of trouble. I encourage delusional dreamers, be a delusional dreamer, just don't be a desperate delusional dreamer. I just had such an anger, I was just so mad at life, everything that wasn't right was everybody's fault, but mine. I had such a victim mentality. I took zero accountability for anything in my life. I was the kid that if you asked what happened, I immediately started with everything

but me. It took years for me to break that, like years of work. Listen to On Purpose with Jay Shetty on the iHeartRadio app, Apple Podcasts, or wherever you get your podcasts. Trust me, you won't want to miss this one. I'm Cheryl Swoops, WNBA champ, three-time Olympian and basketball Hall of Famer. I'm a mom and I'm a woman. I'm Tareka Foster-Brasby, journalist, sports reporter, basketball analyst, a wife, and I'm also a woman. And on our new podcast,

we're talking about the real obstacles women face day to day. See, athlete or not, we all know it takes a lot as women to be at the top of our game. We want to share those stories about balancing work and relationships, motherhood, career shifts. You know, just all the s*** we go through.

Because no matter who you are, there are levels to what we experience as women. And TNI? Well, we have no problem going there. Listen to Levels to This with Sheryl Swoops and Tarika Foster-Brasby, an iHeart women's sports production in partnership with Deep Blue Sports and Entertainment. You can find us on the iHeart Radioio app, Apple podcast, or wherever you get your podcast. Presented by Elf Beauty, founding partner of iHeart Women's Sports. So given that you have, I mean, very clearly, you know, matured and, and, and,

and I'm very happy for you. You seem so much more inside your own skin as when we first met. Is that, what now? What are you looking for now? What kind of like sails your boat? I love, I love making things. I form a production company.

I've, we finished production on our first movie and we've done it ethically. We've hired people that we had no business getting, crew members, like our production designer did La La Land and everybody worked for $300 a day. Wow. Because they like what we're doing and we are not, we're doing first dollar splits. Like we want to be ethical and make things that we want to make the way that we want to make them. So that feels good. The podcast, I have a podcast that's getting a footing. We've never done a dollar of advertising. Nobody, I mean, but the word of mouth, we're going 20% month over month.

And it's just my space to say exactly how I feel and what I want. And it's not formatted. We don't have guests yet. It's just me and my friend Kelly. Don't do guests. Guests is a terrible idea. I know. I'm fucking with their whole world right now. You know what?

Soon. It's not. You'll be soon. Well, the thing is about guests is that it's great when you get them, but everybody, and look, I remember this from late night and everybody I've talked to that do shows about guests. It's always like you get a guest and then you have to get another guest and you have to get another guest.

And it's always like people want to do the show, but you know, they got things to do. And I think if I was doing a podcast again, and I might after this, I wouldn't have any guests. It's freeing because first of all, it's on our own schedule. And you can have the other things going on in the world and still find time to do this. But also just the therapy aspect of it, where you just get to talk about how you feel about stuff, you know, and somebody will bring up something that will remind you of the story from 20 years ago. So it's part nostalgia.

It's about my life path and where I'm going and her life path and where she's going. She was the co-host of Jim Jefferies podcast for five years and her and I split off and we do, and it's amazing. I love it. What is her name? Forgive me. Her name is Kelly Blackheart. Right.

Our podcast is called Locked and Probably Loaded with DJ and Kelly. And it's just fun. That sounds great. So you're working with Jeffries? I know Jim Jeffries. I've talked to him before a couple of times. He's good news. Yeah.

He's good news. That guy. I was on a TV show with him called The Legit for two years and it was the best job I've ever had as an actor. I just loved it. Yeah, he's a great guy. He's a pretty impressive stand-up comedian as well. He's amazing.

Yeah, he's great. Did you ever think about doing that? I did. I really did and I have since. But I gotta tell you, a part of it, a part of me doesn't want to make Jim mad at me. Really? I'm not joking. That's crazy. Jim would get mad at you.

I know he wouldn't, but it's his realm. And I'm the actor and I just... Wait a minute, fuck him. It's not his realm. I work in that realm. I know plenty of guys that work in that realm. Like Jim Jeffries is a nice guy and a good stander, but he doesn't fucking own it. That's like saying, oh yeah, Eric Clapton. I don't want to play the guitar because Eric Clapton plays the guitar. A lot of other people could play the guitar because Eric Crafton plays the guitar. Basically a lot of other people could play the guitar. Thank you. I think you'd love it.

I think you would love doing stand up. I've been thinking about it. It's funny that you bring that up because I've mentioned it to several people recently that I've been thinking about it for a couple of years now. It's time, man. It's time. I think what you should do is you should do stand up

and in the background you should have these two ladies that you've got behind you right now standing right there. You see them? They're war halls, Craig. Yeah, I know. They're great. Somebody did okay. Are you a big timey art collector?

I love it. So that is, so on days when I have had on like not good times on set, so things aren't going right in my career, I have divided my salary by the second. And every minute I'm like, I just made this much toward a painting. So it's become my, it's the love of my life, a creator. What kind of painting do you collect? So I started out collecting French paintings

from like 1870 to like 1940. Okay. And so, and because before the 1870s, pigments were not able to be synthetically produced or like red was ground up, corundum ruby, and blue was ground up, you know, lapis. I mean, vice versa. And so, and all of a sudden they made these lead-based paints of them ruby and blue was ground up, you know, lapis, I mean, vice versa.

And so, and all of a sudden they made these lead based paints. And that's why people like the early impressionists and the post impressionists, they painted like a purple tree and you know, all these things because before that pigments were so expensive you had to paint for the church or wealthy people because you couldn't afford to do otherwise. You could just paint whatever the hell you wanted. So it was really the birth of... You could do whatever you want. Are you familiar with a painter called Jean-Michel Raffaellil? The Italian. He was in the first Impressionist exhibition and then they had a big fight with Monet. Monet didn't like him because

he would draw or he would paint in things that weren't idyllic. You know, like he, you know the painting in the Louvre, the Absinthe drinkers? You know that painting? It sounds familiar to me. Yeah, it sounds familiar to me. It's a beautiful painting. I'll look it up.

Well, Raffaele painted that. He painted imperfect images during the Impressionist fashion and he got in a little trouble, but he patented a new form of paint as well. They made all the Impressionists angry. He got in real trouble. Degas liked him and Monet didn't like him at all. But he's a fascinating character. An Italian Jewish painter who was in the first exhibition of the French Impressionists.

And I think he probably ran into a bit of anti-Semitism as well. He's a fascinating character. I urge you to check him out. He's very interesting. And I've got a ran into a bit of anti-Semitism as well. He's a fascinating character. I urge you to check him out. He's very interesting. I will. And I've got a couple of his paintings. He's very interesting. I like very painterly paintings. I like Barbizon and Ellie Impressionist. But then... So I just am learning about Barbizon right now.

Ah, it's great stuff. Yeah. Yeah. So that's what I do. So I use an object that I see at auction. So I started learning. I would get Sotheby's Christie's Bonhams Auction Catalogues and then just start looking at, and then I could identify painters by brushstroke. And then I started, you know, so I got interested there, but then I realized that you pay a huge premium for buying through them and you can find things on, there are web, there are auction houses all over the world. Yeah. And let me tell you, I mean, I can be fooled, but I think it's harder. Artnet, I love Artnet.

I also love invaluable.com and live auctioneers.com. But you have to know what you're looking at. Facebook marketplace for rich people. I get it. It's awesome. Yeah, it's great. But I love it. And I really, I feel like I haven't released a painting yet.

Like I've never bought anything for sale. And I feel like now when I go to like, I went to a little auction, I mean to an art gallery in Dunedin, New Zealand, and they have this beautiful, beautifully curated collection, but they don't have a Louis Valtah, and they're going to get mine when I die. So it's cool because this will go on after me and I'm the guardian of these things and it just, but also it's a sickness. A little bit. I understand that I have more paintings than I care to admit.

I go into it. I don't know if you ever met Meg and my wife, but she was an art dealer before we met, still is an art dealer. And, uh, and so she can get deals on stuff. Oh God. But it's, I'd be bankrupt. Well, you know, but here's the thing you get these amazing paintings, like amazing, there's amazing things that I'd heard of. I come from a very similar background to you economically. I come from very blue similar background to you economically. I come from a very blue collar, kind of poor background. And I'd heard about some of the paintings, paintings that I now own. I'd heard of, I'd heard of the artist. I'd heard of

the, I read about it in school and I was like, oh, that's, you know, a world that's beyond imagining. And now I own a couple of these paints and I kind of love it. It's cool, right? They're not my favorites, but I like the kind of, I guess it's kind of the avaristic nature of having it. It's amazing. It's a great feeling. I fully, my collection is, I have names, but like you said, my favorite things are definitely not names.

There's an artist named Bernard Boutet de Montval. He had, when he, like, it wasn't, I think when his heir died in like 2016, Sotheby's had this big auction. And like he was a massively famous painter, like around the turn of the century into the 40s, like portraits. But his early work were post-impressionist works, and nobody really wanted them. I didn't know a lot about him, and a painting went, I think, for like £10,000. And I didn't buy it, but then I couldn't stop thinking about it.

So I chased it. I looked for it. I set an alert. I looked for this painting for years. Last year, it came up at Dorotheum in Vienna. I was willing to pay whatever the hell it cost. I would have sold things. I had to have it. And it's two guys dragging a boat up the Seine, like at sundown.

But it's so mind-blowingly beautiful. I had to have it. And so I stayed up all night. I was ready to go. I was calling everybody bitches and hoes in my mind. You're not gonna take this painting from me. I was have it. And so I stayed up all night. I was ready to go. I was calling everybody bitches and hoes in my mind. You're not going to take this painting from me. I was in it. I got it for 8,000 euros.

Stop it! It was one of the best days of my life. I know, that's great. It's a great feeling. I will never part with it. Yeah. There's one painting I have in my life that I love above all others.

And it was actually, my wife and kids got it for me as a present and they knew I loved it and they kind of, well, you know, we used family money to get it, but they, um, but it's a painting, it's not by a very famous, it's a gentleman by the name of Aim Peray and it's called At the End of the Day. And it's just a guy standing on the side of a canal bank, waving to his friend on a boat, who's just sailing up the road. Like it's the end of the day's work,

but it's a fucking masterpiece. And when I look at it, I go into a world that I don't know where else in the world, in the universe, that that world is, but it's in there and I can fall into it and then it's hard to explain and it sounds fanciful, but it's so riveting as a thing to sit next to. I fucking love it. And that's how I feel.

Yeah. I know exactly what you mean. And I'm, I'm delighted. First of all, I'm delighted to find this out about you because I really knew I liked you, but now I really, really like you because of your appreciation of great art. And it's kind of my secret thing that I love, that I don't really talk about that much,

but I spend money on it and I love it. Same. People's eyes get dull when I try to tell them too much. I'm cognizant of that. Yeah. And here's the thing, it's okay that it's just for me. Yeah. Yeah, it's fine. It's fine. You can sit by the paint. You don't need to talk to anyone about it. It's like, oh, it's amazing. It's great. Listen, my friend, I'm very, I

really think we should try and talk to each other before another 10 years ago pass. I would love that. And in fact, the next time in LA or if you're going to a, or if you're going to an art auction in Vienna, I'm in, I'll definitely come with you. Done. It's just a world which fascinates me. You're such a lovely man. I'm so happy for you that you're growing up really cool, even cooler than you were when you were a kid.

And you were a pretty cool kid. I know you were tough on yourself, but you were pretty cool. And you're even cooler now. So that's great. Thanks, Craig. I love you. I love you too, man. I'm so happy to see you well and act yourself.

It's great. Thanks, buddy. Thank you for having me. Oh, thanks for being on. It's great to see buddy, thank you for having me. Oh, thanks for being on. It's great to see you. Thanks pal. of On Purpose. My latest episode is with Jelly Roll. This episode is one of the most honest and raw interviews I've ever had. We go deep into Jelly Roll's life story from being in and out of prison from the age of 13 to being one of today's biggest artists.

I was a desperate delusional dreamer. Be a delusional dreamer. Just don't be a desperate delusional dreamer. Listen to On Purpose with Jay Shetty on the iHeartRadio app, Apple Podcasts or wherever you get your podcasts. Trust me, you won't want to miss this one. details and honestly just having a blast talking football. Every week we're discussing our favorite players of all times, from legends to our buddies, to current stars. We're finally answering the age old question.

What kind of dudes are these dudes? We're going to find out Jules. New episodes drop every Thursday during the NFL season. Listen to Dudes on Dudes on the iHeart radio app, Apple podcasts, or wherever you get your podcasts. I'm Sheryl Swoops. And I'm Tariqa Foster-Brasby. And on our new podcast, we're talking about the real obstacles

women face day to day. Because no matter who you are, there are levels to what we experience as women. And Tia and I have no problem going there. Listen to Level levels to this with Cheryl Swoops and Tariqa Foster-Brasby, an iHeart Women's Sports Production in partnership with Deep Blue Sports and Entertainment. You can find us on the iHeart Radio app, Apple podcast or wherever you get your podcasts. Presented by Capital One, founding partner

of iHeart Women's Sports.