Joy, a Podcast. Hosted by Craig Ferguson - Jason Biggs

Episode Date: November 18, 2025

Craig's old pal actor and (now) director Jason Biggs joins the Joy Podcast for a bit of a chat about their lives. The duo chat about everything from being a kid actor in Hollywood, podcasting, raising families in Los Angeles and NY York, the influence of roles like "American Pie" and "The Late Late Show" had on them and even some James Bond talk. Jason gets candid about staring and directing for the first time in his upcoming film, "Untitled Home Invasion Romance". So, for an hour you can be a fly on the wall and watch some old friends catch up and share some joy. Have a question for Craig? Drop him an email at [e-mail], send him a message on social media, or drop a comment below. _______________________________________________ Craig is also on the road. Dates and tickets can be found here https://www.thecraigfergusonshow.com/tour _________________________________________________ FIND CRAIG: Website - https://www.thecraigfergusonshow.com Instagram - https://www.instagram.com/craigyferg TikTok - https://www.tiktok.com/@craigy_ferg X - https://www.x.com/craigyferg Facebook - https://www.facebook.com/thecraigfergusonshow WATCH THE PODCAST: https://www.youtube.com/@thecraigfergusonshow About the Joy Podcast Storied late-night talk host Craig Ferguson brings his interview talents and singular world view to a discussion of the modern state of JOY, sitting down with notable guests from the worlds of entertainment, science, government, and more. How's our Joy doing? Bridled? On life support? Where do we find joy in a world that seems by any rational measure to be collapsing around us?

This is me, Craig Ferguson. I'm inviting you to come and see my brand new comedy hour. Well, actually, it's about an hour and a half, and I don't have an opener because these guys cost money. But what I'm saying is I'll be on stage for a while. Anyway, come and see me live on the Pants on Fire Tour in your region. Tickets are on sale now and we'll be adding more as the tour continues throughout 2025 and beyond.

For a full list of dates, go to the Craigfergersonshow.com. See you on the road, my dears. Hello, welcome to The Joy Podcast. I am your host Craig Ferguson, and this is my lovely jacket that I'm wearing today. But I'll be taking it off to interview my guest today, who is a movie star, an American icon, and has recently become a director of movies.

He's a national treasure, and I adore him. Welcome, Jason Biggs. I'm going to take my jacket off so I can talk to him without sweating. Also, I don't want him to be intimidated by how awesome my new jacket is. So it's all good. You in the city for a minute? I have been filming this fucking thing.

We've been everywhere. Let me just say this though. I will say this, that just as we ran into a gentleman the way in that was talking to you about the old American Pie movies and he said, I watched them and then he talked like it was kind of porn.

Yeah. He was like, I'm kind of shameful. That was the word of you. He was like, I don't want to advertise that I was watching. I was like, oh my God. And I was like, stop, and then he kept going. I kept going. I sometimes wonder

when people, because people sometimes see to me, I saw that thing you did, that was really bad. But these American Prime movies, they're not bad. Yeah, I mean, they got progressively worse, I'd say, but you know what? And actually, that's not even true. That's actually not true. I, the first one is still, of course, I think

the best. And there were some, I don't know, I'm proud of all of them. There were some And, you know, there were some moments in some of the movies. It happens with sequels. It happens. Let me tell you. There's some movies I made that didn't go to sequel. For a reason, yeah.

Well, let me just say this. I think we talked about it last time I was talking to you. I did a movie called Life Without Dick. Okay. No, I did do a movie called Life Without Dick, which is also not a great movie. But the one movie I'm going to tell you about was a movie called Life Without Dick. Sarah Jessica Parker, Harry Connick, Jr., Me as an Irish mobster.

Okay. Chalker. Shocker. It's a shame. Harry Connick Jr. is nice, though. Is he a nice guy? Yeah, yeah, he's a nice guy. I just remember filming with him at a junkyard once,

and there was a lot of pelicans or not pelicans. Seagulls? No, close. The ones were the big fan, peacocks. Peacocks? Yeah, there were peacons. Junkyard peacocks. Some people go, some people go dog.

Yeah. Some people go dogs, you know. Some people go peacock. They were like mean peacocks. Like when they spread their ficocks. fan, they did gang signs. They were like, yeah, yeah. It's a big sign at the bug beware of peacock.

No entry. But peacocks make a horrible noise. But apparently they're good guard dogs. So when you're trying to do a two-handed scene with someone and the peacock keeps going, ah! And that's why I remember about Harry Connick Jr. And how he was such, so professional, he was like, they would go, and he'd stop acting.

And then wait for the, and then he'd act again. I was like, man, this is it. That's a pro. Yeah. You know, he's really, I like them. I'm not going to lie, I liked him a lot. You've been around a few peacocks in your day. Yeah, I've been around actors who don't, who would just act through the peacock.

But he stopped and then started again. He's a good lad. Anyway, no, the film was going to tell you about, I told you about it, was called Lenny the Wonder Dog. Oh, yeah, right, which is a movie I did. I looked at it recently, and apparently one of the kids in it was Oscar Isaac. Oscar Isaac. He was like a big-time movie star now. Sure is.

Yeah. Yeah. I bet he doesn't talk about Lenny the Wonderdard. He must have been a kid when he was doing it. Yeah, I think you showed me the where maybe I even looked it up at the, but I went home and looked up all your stuff. But yeah, he was a kid, for sure. He was a kid.

But now he's like, yeah, and he's not just. He's like a big grown-up movie star guy. Movie star and heartthrob, I'll say it. He's a heartthrob. Well, here's the thing, though. You were a kid actor, weren't you? You were a little kid actor. I was a little kid actor, yeah.

And you have kids now. And now I'm a heartthrob. Yeah, you are a heartthrob. You're a heartthrob. I've hung out with you in there and there's like you know you're catnip to the ladies

lots of cats actual cats but you're catnep they're like oh my God and they come over and they're yeah I mean it's a you know it's it's iconic that movie I mean it's pretty

it's not just from that movie there's other movies there's not there any movie sure there are but like but the reason I think why it's as consistent and and diverse of an audience, of people that will recognize me or, you know, come up to me.

And also geographically, it's, you know, that is the thing that has the, that's, you know, Yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah, undoubtedly. I mean, it's funny. Did you ever go through a time when you were kind of like, you didn't want to talk about it? I wouldn't say there was a time I didn't want to talk about it. I mean, I definitely had, you know, I went through that, oh God, am I going to, am I going to be stuck this guy? Is this what's happened?

I did that one late night. after late night I was like for about a couple of years and I was like hold on a minute I did do that

that is that's my thing I did that thing I love that thing I'm not going to reject it yeah it was a successful thing exactly

so I lean I've yeah I mean I especially as I get older of course and I I have a much greater appreciation for it

but I always sort of did and I think being a kid actor was what really sort of um allowed me to you know stay in the in the positive and and and appreciate the success and uh because you know i i i had some jobs as a kid that were really great that i thought were going to be oh god this is going to be that i did Broadway i did a tv series that you know for fox at the time and that um there were a couple jobs i was like oh this is you know this could be a thing. And they finished in the case of the TV show after one season. Oh, I've got a few

of those. Yeah, yeah. And then it sort of goes away. And then I went back to being a kid in New Jersey again. And so... Was that hard when you're a little kid and then, because Hollywood's... Yeah, it's weird. It was weird. And I, although I will say, like, again, I think it set me up, you know, to have realistic expectations about what a career and show business is. Yeah. You know, again, like having that, you know, I was able to just, you know, my parents, I was living at my parents. I was a kid. I could, in my, when, in my ruts as a kid actor, I could just be a kid. Right. You know, I actually welcome them to an extent. Because you're still living in New Jersey, right? So it's not like you're in Hollywood going up for pilot season and all that kind of thing. Exactly. Although I begged my mom every year. So we were, you know, I was in Jersey. I was a New York kid actor. And there was always a contingent of kids that every February, January, February would go out to L.A. and they'd stay. at the Oakwoods in Burbank. Yeah. And they would go out for pilot season.

It was the big, big thing, you know. And we would still audition for pilots here in New York, but it just wasn't the same, apparently. You know, you had to be out there. When we were on the Drew Carey show, every now and again, a kid would come in to play a part and stuff like that. And I always felt kind of bad for them. Yeah.

It's like, ugh. I mean, it's weird. Yeah, it's weird. It depends on the parent. Not that anyone was mean to them around. And they weren't. It just, it felt like, it's like seeing a kid in a, in a bar. or something.

Exactly. You're going to like, what that? That's a great analogy. That's really good. I'm gonna steal that. Sure, help yourself. I probably stole it anyway. From me.

I did steal it from you. And one of the reasons why I wanted to talk to you today was to apologize for that. That's very sweet. This is the show business reach around. This is called. Oh, nice. Yeah. Apology accepted.

Thank you. And so don't ever do it again. And then we come full circle. Yeah, and then I'll have to apologize. Would you let your kids be actors? No. kids, no. Not as kids. Not as kids. Yeah. Yeah, I mean, that's the thing. Like, I, I, um, you know, being a kid actor, again, in terms of the preparation and the sort of all, all that stuff was,

was really, I think, good for me. But, um, but also by the time I did graduate high school, I went to college briefly, but by the time I was a young adult, um, I was, you know, I had done my 10,000 hours. I mean, I had, I had, I had, I had, I had, been in the business. You know, I had an agent. I, you know, had been to L.A. with that show. Like, I had kind of, you know, I was already kind of ahead of all these kids who went to drama school, you know, or whatever. And also be emotionally ahead of it as well. Because I think the emotions of rejection, I think people really underestimate, you know, still. Yeah. No, still. I mean, it's a, I think, I think if anything, I understand that it,

The understanding that is it will continue to be a part of this career so long as I choose to be in this career is helpful. Just to have that awareness, it doesn't make the rejection necessarily for a job that you really want or you got close on or whatever. It fucking hurts, man. It does, but you know what I think is interesting? I always kind of think of the baseball analogy with show business.

Like, you know, you have one ball and you have one pitch in 10, and you're a Hall of Famer. Right, right, right. So nine of them are going by, and you're going to look like. like a dick you know yeah yeah and it's kind of funny because i i was talking to someone who was not in show business a while ago and she said to me uh said you know i love the work of david e kelly i went oh yeah no great stuff i mean he's done amazing stuff and she said and the thing is he never has any failures now he has as many failures as everybody a hundred percent

you just don't hear about them because they're failures yeah yeah that's it's it's they're done yeah um that's it's so true it's so true it's kind of like you know but i and i also what I don't know if you've seen this. Did you watch Colin Hanks did a documentary about John Candy. Have you seen it? I need to see it. You do need to see it.

Yeah. Did you run in him? Because you were kind of a kid actor around about that time. Well, Colin, I know as well. Candy, no. Although I audition for Uncle Buck. You must have.

Yeah, you know, you're at the same age as McCauley Colkin, right? Yeah, yep, yep. Yeah, I knew I would see, and he was a New York actor too. I would see McColley on auditions a bunch. He, he, I, you know, I don't want to. to blow the documentary for it, but it's really good. Colin did a great job. But, you know, there's an interview

with McCauley Cokinan, and he comes across as like, how you really turned out okay. Right. I mean, which is, I mean, I'm sure. There was a period. No, there was a period. Of course, we've all watched and, you know, taking it in over the years. And especially as an actor in the business,

a kid actor and knowing him as a kid, not knowing him personally, although we do have a very good friend in common. Right. I was always curious to see how it would play out and how he would. And there was, he was like a massive biggest movie star in the world when he was like eight or something or 10. Massive. Yeah, it's crazy. It's crazy. And there was a period, I think, where it was a little, from our vantage point anyway,

from what I saw and kind of what I had heard, it was really hard for him. I mean, clearly, professionally it was hard. He kind of took a step back. He was playing music. He was, you know, whatever. But he said something that I thought was really interesting about Hollywood and I thought, oh my God. I mean, obviously, he went through the ringer with it so intensely and in such a young age, but his clarity of vision on it was astonishing. And he said that thing is this thing about, it's always about what's next, what's next, what's next, what's next?

And it puts you in a constant state of anxiety about what's next. And he said, you can be, and he said, I'm paraphrasing, but he said something like, you could be standing on a red carpet with an Oscar in your hand, talking to the people in the line, and they'll say to you, what are you doing next? What's next? And it feels like, I remember when I started in late night, one of the first questions I was,

do you want to take over for Letterman? I'm like, I haven't even started. Started for myself. Yeah, I haven't even started. I was like, this is my boss. So it's like someone saying to you, do you plan on killing the king? I'm like, no.

I didn't even think about it. I had thought about it a little bit. We all did. We all did. worldwide pants worldwide pants that's Dave's company yeah and Dave won the late night show

which you were on a lot yeah yeah yeah oh yours your show yeah yeah you're too much I think I don't know I felt that yeah I felt like by the end I felt like by the end you were over it me me not necessarily just you not the whole show

but me every time I would come back yeah I was like oh begs again maybe I should quit should I quit if it means not if it means back one more time I'm out and I was like And then I read the prompter and goes, ladies and gentlemen, Jay's my, right, that's it.

And I called them that night. It's not, you know, it's funny. The exact opposite of that is true in the sense that as you go, certainly I don't know anyone else's experience about it, but as I went on with that show, I'd say the last three, four years of it, 90% of the guests were people I'd seen before and I wanted to see again.

Right. And every now and again, someone got famous fast and you had to have them on. Yeah, yeah. But other than that, I was like, you know, people's names have come up and I go, eh, what about? Yeah. Yeah.

Do we have to? Can we say there's a scheduling conflict? Right, right. It's always a scheduling conflict. Always. Yeah, I've heard a few. I almost had one tonight. Did you really?

Yeah, I almost had one. It's a scheduling conflict. And then, and it opened up. It opened up and here I am. You kept me on edge, though. You kept me on edge. I know, I know. I'm, here I am.

Did you, did you, did you, did you, did you, did you, did you, did that true? Did he really nearly have a schedule? No. No. So you knew you was an internal scheduling conflict. No, I would not do it. Honestly, I'm thrilled to be reconnected with you. Well, and I was so happy to be here and loved that we talked about podcasts for a good half hour and had, you know, certain opinions about that meant gave me an impression, a certain impression, at least in terms of your relationship to podcast.

Yeah, I know. I freely admit it. And then the big reveal. Oh, I actually do a podcast and will you be on it? Well, here's the thing. This is how I feel about podcasts. I, I, you know, I have mixed feelings about it. I get it. Like, every week. I know. It's hard. Every week. Who is I talking to us? Not everyone's Jason Big. You can't always have a Jason Big. Well, you can.

Last week's episode, I literally did it. Phoneed it in on my phone from my truck as I was filming something in Philadelphia. on my meal break. And you know what? People are like, oh, that's a good episode. I'm like, well, then why do I even fucking bother? Why am I paying for this? I got my white chairs here that swivel. I'm like a bond villain. Like, hello. Oh, by the way.

Yeah. I had... Am I up for the new bond? You are. I am. And I've, this is, they want to announce it on my podcast. When I just made myself laugh. the idea of announcing the new Bond on this podcast that's very satisfied I've just been watching all the old Bond films I got a new TV they don't all hold up do they

some of them are I think are flat of illegal I think really can we can I don't no disrespect to any but the Roger Moore ones Roger Moore ones and and the Roger Moore ones are are weak but if you go to the Sean Connery, there's some

really bad behavior there. He also did so many of them too. Like he almost did. He did too many. Yeah. Did he? I don't know. I don't know. I think so. I don't know who they had the order. It goes, Sean Connery, Roger, George Lasonby for one. Oh my God. He was a male model. Okay. And

he did Honor Majesty's Secret Service. What happened was that Sean Connery asked for a million a million dollars for the movie which was a lot of money then and they said fuck you and we'll get we can get anyone to do this

and they got anyone to do it and it turned out they couldn't then they had to give him a million dollars and he came back yeah yeah brilliant and then Roger Moore did it and there was someone else in there before the sort of modern

I consider Pierce Brosnan in the first sort of modern day bond you know I know Pierce pretty well yeah you know him no I don't he's awesome he seems like like the greatest. He's the fucking greatest.

That's great. I went to his, he has this big house in Malibu, and he had to party one night for his 60th birthday, so that's how long ago it was. Crazy. He looks good. Yeah, no, I mean, he's, he's like 70s or something. I know.

He's like, I should be so lucky. I mean, I'm not particularly gay, but I think I probably would. Yeah. Well, you look great. I mean, you're 84? 84. Yeah. You look wonderful. I moisturize all the time. The longest I go without moisturizing is the podcast. After this, I'll be straight back in.

A vat of butter. But the, I went to a party at his house in Malibu. He's got this fancy guy from the album. It's great. It actually looks like a bond villain. Oh, that's cool. It's amazing. And his wife, Keeley, is super cool and very, and quite scary. She's like, she's, she's, she's the boss. Yeah. I mean, I think Pierce would even say, I mean, if you're on a good side, I've never been on her

bad side, but I never want to be on a bad side. Right. You don't want to know it's like. I don't want to know what it's like. But she's tough. And I, we turned up at Pierce's house and the Astin Martin for the Bond movie was parked right outside the house. Like, oh my God. So in and I said to Pierce

that's the Ashton Mountain for the Bond movie. And he said, yeah. I said, what? And he went, well, Keeley makes me park it there because that's the hole for the septic tank. And she didn't want the guests seen it coming in. I was like, if Keeley told me

partner, I'd part there as well. That's amazing. Isn't that great? That's so good. Do you know, but I feel like... I love to that he could have parked any car. Over it, but, you know? Yeah, I don't know how many... I think he's probably got a few cars. I'm exactly. I'm certain of it, but that's the one he chose. The Aston Martin from the Bonn movies over the septic tank hole.

It wasn't a hole. I mean, it wasn't like an open sewer, I don't think. No, it was probably just a head of a cover. Yeah, it was like a metal cover. But, you know, I didn't smell anything. I don't know. That's good. It works. Other than just the beauty of Pierce Bros. than himself, who smells really good. Oh, my God. As good as I think he does.

It's like sort of burnished leather. You know what I'm saying? Yeah. Like masculine, but not overpowering. A little, like, kind of hint of tobacco maybe. Yeah, tobacco smoke, but just a... But not smoke, not a bad smoke. No, no, just like tobacco and leathery and maybe shoes.

Yeah, sure, leather shoes. Yeah. Why not? But the inside. The inside. So he smells like... Piersbrose and smells like feet. Wait, wait.

You're like the guy A new pair of shoes. It keeps going. I got to cut me off. Cut me off, please. But I think that that that kind of story, that's one of the nice stories

that demystified Hollywood for me. And that must have to you as well. Like you just see people that you, like you're used to seeing them be big stars and then they're totally. Yeah. When you, even when you're a little kid. Yeah.

I had some. Some exposure as a little kid. You know who I worked with as a little kid? Santa. Was it Santa? Yeah, but he's an asshole. Oh, okay. I dared that, but you don't want it to be true.

I know. You don't want it to be true. I know. That's when I stopped believing. I worked with them when I was like 18. Yeah. Well, that's where, you stopped believing Santa 18. Wow, good for you, man.

That's a long run. So who are you going to talk about? A great run. Yeah. Judd Hirsch. You know Judd Hirsch? I don't know Judd. Okay, so Judd was on his big...

I've met him, but I don't know him. I don't know him. I don't know. I just remember the hat man there. That's funny. I thought if he sees this, he'll be like, you, son of a bitch, but... Actually, I'm certain...

For sure, you're CBS, right? Yeah, yeah. He was on that show, Numbers on CBS for them... Numbed three years. They used to do it, like, numbed three years. Exactly, yeah, exactly. But that was just one... That was like his, like, later in his career.

That's not like in the other side. Yeah, but it was a massive hit. But he, the show that he, a taxi, have you heard of taxi? Oh, Judd Hirsch, I'm thinking of somebody else. Who was I thinking of Judd? Oh, one of the breakfast club guys? Yeah! Oh, that's funny.

Judd, uh, Nelson. Judd Nelson. Yeah, no, I'm not Judd Nelson. No, I'm not Judd-Nelson. No, Judd-Hurts, of course I know who Judge Hose. Yeah, he's taxi, yeah. Taxi, dear John. Yeah.

And I did this play on Broadway with him. and, you know, was totally nervous and because it was my first Broadway, my first play period, but also working with him, you know. Yeah, it's a big deal. And he, yeah, he was doing Dear John at the time. And, but he couldn't have been nicer. He couldn't have been more generous. That's gratified.

And he respected me. Like, he didn't, he treated, it was me, and actually David Krumholtz. I don't know if you know David. So he was on numbers. So David and Judd. He was on the late night show a lot. He was like you. Crumholtz was, oh, I was like, crumholt's, bigs, crumholds, bigs.

Yeah, yeah. We're kind of interchangeable in a lot of ways. Yeah. Penis size. Okay. He, it was his first ever job, 13 years old, no, we were 12. I'm three days old. We were 12 years old.

He was plucked out of a production of bye-bye birdie in Forest Hills, Queens. He was just a regular kid in school. but he was so talented. I mean, he is so talented. He's like a savant. It's crazy. But he was like kind of wild and sort of, you know, he needed to be tamed a little bit.

But anyway, it was me and him. And Judd treated us with such respect and, you know, he didn't like, there was no condescension, there was no impatience. Yeah. Now even I've worked with kids and I was a kid actor and I think I have a lot of patience with kid actors. And it's hard to have that.

It's hard. I have kids. Yes, exactly. So, yeah, but he was just so great. But also knew that we were 12 and 13. We turned 13 during that run, and he filled our dressing room with the biggest balloons you could have met.

We couldn't walk in. We had to use a different dressing room. But it was the coolest thing. Like, David and I talk about it to the day. We'll never forget it. Something like that. But the point is, you know, that was my first time working with someone

who was larger than life. a lot of ways, but who is a star and who's sort of, any sort of preconceived notions I might have had about someone like that. You know, it's like, oh, you don't have to be that. You don't have to, not that I even knew, but, and of course, we've seen it. We've seen people who are, you know, they do believe their own, the bullshit and they, you know, they are. Did you ever go through that? Well, my, my thing, and it's still, I think it's still sort of lingers to an extent. I've always had a, I've always been fascinated with fame. And again, I really like, not to sound redundant, but I think the fact that I was a kid actor who saw these things go away,

had these jobs, and then they kind of, you know, I was back to being in a regular. I think that really, like, in so many ways, shaped me for the better. But the thing I've always sort of been fascinated with is that people don't want to say no, right? So I've, the famous people? Yeah, yeah. Yeah, you get, you get, you, there's not a whole lot of nose, you know, and I should be told no sometimes. And I, and I am, you know, but there's, there's just a, I've gone through periods where there was in, you know, just because of, it happening for something. I mean, American Pie was, was 27 years ago, you know.

At the front door, really? Yeah, yeah. So it's been a, I've been famous for a long time. And it's like, I think the nature of fame has changed, though. Well, it's much more accessible for starters. It's like anyone. And it's much more fragmented. And it's also, there's not as much money in it.

It used to be like, you were famous as a pretty decent chance you were making some coin. Totally. Now you can be famous and like, like Instagram famous? Like, I don't think there's any money in that as far as I know. I'm no Instagram famous, so I don't know. Yeah, I feel like. Shockingly, there is a lot of money. Is there?

Yeah. Oh, well, and then maybe I should. do it a little more. I should take it serious. I mean, it depends on what you want to do. I mean, a lot of it is, you know, just showing. Well, the Kardashian stuff and all. Well, yeah, of course, that's, that's its own category, I think. But I mean, fair play to those, these, these, that they're going to hustling. Man, they're like there. They did it. And everything I've heard about them is like, they're on time. They know their lines. They can say hi. They know everybody in the crew. They're professionals and they work well. That's everything I've heard. It's easy to

hate them. But, but, you know, from afar. Yeah. I feel like, you know, it's easy to, I think, do that. but I've heard that as well. Yeah. And I love that. I love that. I'm sure they're... Like if you show up on time and do the job, then that's it. Yeah.

But don't... If you're not going to... I mean, yeah, the thing I've always had issues with, and I've been fortunate where I have not seen it too often, I'm sure you've seen it a ton as a host of your own show, is people being so caught up in their own stuff that they are totally disrespectful to everyone else around who are also trying to do.

job and so obviously um punctuality is the first thing that comes to mind that's that's right like you're you're doing a show you have an hour you have to do it at a certain time but the feet has to go to new york for the night you've got a and and people probably didn't show you know are like one in 10 years that's great one and 10 years and everyone else was on time one guy amazing that's amazing and i never had them back there you go fuck that guy yeah yep uh i think you know who has his uh yeah yeah I was like, fuck it. Yeah, 100%. I've been on sets where people are late

or won't come out of their trailer, whatever the thing. Yeah, that's not coming out of the trailer thing. I don't understand. I don't understand. Is it control? Is it, is it trying to, is it just being an infantile? Is it throwing a, it's a combination.

It depends on the person. I've seen it because they're upset at the creative, which, okay, all right, fine, you need to have a conversation, you need to, you can't get your head around the thing and you want to wait to film it maybe. Okay, fine. I mean, it's the same script.

as it was when you signed on a couple months ago, why today are you suddenly having issue with this is good. We're here, we've been here since 4.30 this morning. Why, why now? Everyone's just sitting around you. Those are the kinds of things that really bother me, you know? Yeah, but I think that if you work, I think that one of the odd things,

I was kind of disavowed of this very early on, because I worked in theater in Scotland, and you know, there's no, you know, people, it's a working class situation. Like, you know, no one's getting rich doing it. It's like it's fun to play dress up with your friends and have an audience in

and everybody, you know, be drunk and all that kind of stuff. That's how we did. Of course, yeah, right. Scotland. Oh, so I did it, to be fair, there's a lot of people out that didn't do it that way. But, you know, good actors and, but it was very much, it was run like a

place of work. It was a place of work. Yeah. I never understood. Do you remember they used to do this? I don't know if they still do it because I haven't talked to anyone like this in a long time but show business journalists there used to be a kind of type of them

that you know what I mean? You used to have to always talk to. I don't feel like that happens. Am I one of them? Fuck am I a show business journalist? Like I'm somebody you have to talk to if you've got something coming out? I mean, fuck.

That's why I'm here. That's why I quit. It looks like you're just running it back. I'm just doing it again. Some things never change. Fuck me. You can take the, you can take the host out of the...

You take the show business journalist out of that. Anyway, I remember they used to always say, did you have fun doing the job? You're doing the show? Did you guys have great... I remember it when you were doing the Drew Carey show, people said, you guys must have had so much fun. I bet they said it about the American Pie says.

You guys must have had so much fun. I'm like, sometimes. Well, yeah, sometimes. It's work. It's work. You turn up. It's early. You've got a hangover or some other form of illness.

But I, usually mine was hangover. Hangover. And you, yeah, I've got a, and you've got a days where. And sometimes you go on with people and sometimes you know it. Sometimes other people are decks and sometimes they're nice. Yep. I could never understand. Particularly, I mean, that show ran for how many years did you.

Drew Carey show? Yeah. Ten years. Oh, my God. So, yeah, 10 years. I mean, it becomes. Kids get born. when people live, people die, life's changed.

I mean, it was like, it was crazy. I'm sure there was a lot of love. It was a family, I'm sure, in a lot of ways. And I'm sure there was also, and also family, there's also tension and all kinds, 10 years. A long time, a long time, man. But I'm sure there were days, I'm sure there were episodes that are just blurry for you.

That, well, I don't know, were you drinking at the time? No, no, I'm sober the time ago. Okay, but I wonder if there's like, you know, there are just, because you just, like, you showed up, you did the thing, became a job, and for whatever reason that week,

there wasn't maybe anything particularly memorable that happened, and it's just like, it's just you couldn't maybe recall, right? That late night's full of that. Yeah, of course, of late nights. Way more than Drew Carey. I mean,

late nights. Fuck, man. I've got, like, like, like, whole, I've seen whole episodes. I've like, no recollection.

Zero recollection. Yeah, wow, wow. Like, I didn't even know I'd, I'd met Judge Hirsch. I think he was on late, can I even on the late night show. Well, that's why I was saying, Numbers was on CBS, I'm sure he came on the show.

Yeah, I know, he was definitely on the show. Yeah, I just can't remember it. And that's no reflection on him. Did you call him Judd Nelson on the show, though? That's what I wonder. Maybe that's why he was only on one. You were great in the... Tell me about being in the brat pack.

Yeah. He's like, he's like 87. Yeah, no, that's... Do you know what he was good at? Do you remember that movie? Ordinary people. Oh, the recently, Fableman's. No, I didn't see the Fableman's.

He got nominated for an Oscar. She, that I... Small, he was brilliant, but it was a good movie. Sorry, I interrupted. What movie? No, please, interrupt away. I talk too much. Anyway, I mean, it's...

Judd Hirsch, he got a... He got an Oscar nomination for the... The Fable Women, you were going to tell me about it. Yeah, the Fableman is amazing. Ordinary People. He also got a nomination. Oh, I know what the movie is, but... Yeah, which one?

The one where Jeff Goldblum saves Earth, and he plays Jeff Goldblum's dad. The Fly? No. No, no, of course not. He doesn't save Earth in the flag? No. The day after tomorrow or?

Oh, Independence Day. Independence Day. That's it, you're right. Yeah. That is right. He plays Jeff Goldblum's dad. Jeff Goldblum is like, I don't know if I should save Earth. He's like, you should save Earth.

But Dad, and he's like, yeah, save Earth, come on. That's right. And he's great in that. He's great. You know, that speech that Bill Pullman. I used to always do that too and Bill Paxton dying, sadly.

But who was also meant to be a great guy. What I heard too. I heard about Bill Paxton. He used to walk around when he was traveling, like in airports and stuff. If people recognized him, he'd give them $20 to do you? No. No, no.

That's amazing. I don't know if that's true. It's like if they come over going, hey, you bill Paxton, you go on, yep, $20. He gave him $20. Isn't that great? That's the best thing I've ever heard. Isn't that fucking great?

I love you. I hope it's true. I'm going to go with true. Yeah, let's go with true because, I mean, a much beloved character, I never had a chance to meet him, unless he was on late night, like that. I'm sure he was. Maybe I did. Oh, that's funny.

It's so good. How endearing. It's kind of great, isn't it? Bill, but Bill Pooleman, who gives the best Halloween parties in the Hollywood Hills. Oh, yeah? Yeah. I lived in the Hollywood Hills for like 20 years. Pilman lived up the street and

at Halloween, I guess his kids are probably growing up now but he used to have this thing where you go into his, he had a big yard and there was a scary way for the little kids to go and the ghosts would go woo and then a really scary way if you wanted to, like the adults

go and like really scary stuff would happen and he like did it all out and he'd be sitting there like movie starring right at the front and giving candy candy. Yeah, he was amazing. And people, I think that It's such an odd thing that it's one of the things I loved about Hollywood is that demystified that.

There were people like that who were just guys in the street. A guy who lived in the street and he was a nice guy and he had a cool thing at Halloween and he, you know, problems with his pool and all that kind of stuff. You know, I mean, it was so, it felt so normal. Yeah. And then you would like read, you know, it was like, oh, the Hollywood cocktail party set. I'm like, I don't think I ever. went to a cocktail party, you know, they have them.

Yeah. No, they don't exist. No. Thanks, because I thought maybe they were having them. No, I wanted to make a event. No, I went to them almost every night. You see things like the Hollywood community, and I'm like, there's no fucking community in Hollywood. There's zero. Everybody's out for themselves. It's a transactional neighborhood. Transactional. That's exactly it. That's exactly it. The currency is fame, and like, it's very transactional, and everyone's out for themselves. That's exactly. It's why I left.

Really? Yeah, I mean Are you kids very young when you left? Sid, my oldest, was just born. Was just born? Yeah, he was born in Illinois. Was that about the kids or was it about it? Yeah, kind of.

I mean, I had sort of been wanting to, my wife is not from East Coast. She grew up in Phoenix and San Diego, divorced parents. Went to UCLA, met her in L.A. He's a West Coast. She's a West Coaster. Now she's not. I mean, she is a New Yorker.

And I kind of always knew. I was like, I've been there. Like she came, I did a play when we first met. We came for like two months or something and rented a little place downtown. And she liked it, but it was more tourist than resident, you know. There's something about living in New York, though. It hits different. It does.

It just comes out you a different way. And it's great. I love this. Yeah, me too. But it's, you know, I, I had been kind of itching. I had this weird thing, you know. I'm sure, maybe you found this about LA,

like, we might have even talked about this where, you know, I went out to LA and was like, one day woke up and I'd been there 10 years. And I was like, wait, I live in LA. Like, the whole, for 10 years, I was like, I'm not, I live, like, almost not even, I live here. Like it's just, being from the East Coast

and given the nature of our job and Hollywood and the sort of sheen that it has, and the perfect weather. And it's, it's just, for me, it was just like this place that still, even while living there, kind of existed in this fictional sort of land. Yeah, I know exactly what you mean.

It's crazy. And so I had always thought like, oh, I'll, you know, we get married. My wife will be from the East Coast. Or I just kind of life in my head when I would see the future and playing out, particularly with kids, it's like, oh, that's, I'll be in, I'll be back east.

And then suddenly we're, you know, we have a kid that's born, we're living in LA. But by that point, we had actually gotten, I was doing Orange is the New Black here. And so we were spending a lot of time. That was a big show as well. It was a big show, yeah. You were good in that show. Thanks, man. Yeah. It was really a lot of fun. Yeah, it's a good show. Yeah, it's the second show ever on Netflix. Yeah, I remember. It was right at the start Netflix. Yeah. And I, so we'd gotten a place. We had a place. We had a place. We bought a little place. And so we were kind of back and forth a little bit. And so that's when she started anyway to kind of

really appreciate it, but still not necessarily want to be here. Right. And then, yeah, and then I came, I came to do a play and it was, while I was here during that play, something for her clicked. She, she had, we had the baby. She had the baby. And for her, it just felt like, yeah, she, she envisioned, she thought her life would be easier. And now it's all, it's all that we know, but raising kids in New York. And I was like, I think so too. And it sounds crazy to a lot of people who don't live in New York.

People are like, how do you raise your kids in New York? New York's like a time, in L.A. in one respect, is that people who have visited for an afternoon think they know it. That's true. It's like, it's not like that. No.

It's like what you see and how it becomes, two different things. Yeah. But I will say, yeah, yeah. And, you know, we had Sid there for a couple months, and it was just like, even those couple months, just strapping this baby into the back seat

into a hot, hot car and driving and you can't, screaming in the back, an hour of traffic to get to the thing. Yeah, it's wild. I mean, we were just, oh my God, no. And anyway, we both had our reasons, but for me, since I'm on the podcast and my wife isn't.

She's actually next week. She's next week. Next week, that's amazing. That's amazing. Way funnier than me. Does she have a podcast? She has had multiple podcasts. She's had different incarnations

of a podcast. but currently does not have a pot. It's hard work. I hear you. It is hard, hard work, man. I've flirted with it. Like, I love chatting and seeing people and I'm inquisitive, I like to think,

but it is, it's hard. It's just relentless. It doesn't stop. It just doesn't stop. But I don't mind it as long as it's only once a week. I can do it from my car if I have to. Yeah, I guess you've settled into a thing where you know, I mean.

I feel like, in all honesty, I kind of feel like the people who know about this podcast or know about or who want to see it will find it. Yeah. I don't do a ton of promotion. Yeah. I'm very, I'm very like you with fame.

I'm very cautious about it. I think you can have way too much of it. And again, can really tip your life out of, out of equilibrium. And just enough so that the people that want to see you, know where you are. Yep.

And then that's enough. I mean, I like the theaters to be full when I do stand-up, but the theaters don't have to be huge, just big enough. Right. So anyway, you were saying, you came here and to New York. But also, you know, those last couple years in L.A. for me, were really unhealthy. That's why I was drinking a ton and just like, and I was very,

and I isolated it a lot, and it's easy to isolate in L.A. Sure. So easy. Alone in my car for chunks of the day. And you get to a beautiful house, beautiful house up, the hills, but you get up there and you're like, I'm not going anywhere now. Why, you have to drive for 20 minutes

to get to the store, yeah. I'm home and I'm drinking, and I just really, it just was, and, you know, my career, just, you know, I was like, oh, what, it was just a, yeah, I was not in a great place. And so New York for me, it's a bit of a geographic, I know,

but in the back of my head, I, it's not like I was, I knew that, you know, you can't, wherever you go, there you are. I knew that, I expected that, But I also expected the energy and the humanity of New York to help me on my journey. And did it? It continues to this day.

I totally agree. I feel like geographics, particularly if you're talking like someone like me who, like I got sober, you know, and when I, and people who were also sober would say, you know, oh, you said geographic if you go there. And I'm like, geographics work a little bit sometimes. They work a little bit. I mean, it's not going to solve all your problems, but I went, like, when I left L.A., I went to Scotland because I didn't know where to go. I went to Scotland for, we were there for like five, six years.

Wow. While my youngest went through elementary school. But then as he's coming up to high school, I'm thinking, what a high school in. You've got to go to high school in America, like his brother, and he's like everyone in the family, and we were Americans. And also, I wasn't sitting right for me being there either. Yeah.

America, you know, particularly New York. I love, I love them people, not I love it, but you ever hear people say, particularly Europeans will say, yeah, I don't, I don't really like America, but I like New York. And I go, well, you know, that's America. Sure is. It's America as you can get, really. It's very America. Yep.

But I hear you on L.A. I went for two weeks and I was there 23 years. Yeah, we did talk about this. I remember you say, yeah, yeah, yeah, it's crazy. I woke up, I had two kids, I had been divorced and remarried, and I was a fucking vegan with a cat, with a cat.

I had a cat. I was like, I turned up there I kind of roused about from the old country and I woke up and I was a vegan who moisturized with a cat. Your cat's a big fan of me. Yeah, I know. Yeah, yeah, yeah.

Big fan. Yeah. Yep. Are you a vegan? No, no. For you. No. I'm not either anymore. I was for a bit. You really were. You weren't gay. Yeah, yeah. I was vegan for like four years.

But what happened was I... L.A. It wasn't just... I'm actually a bit scared to say that I'm not a vegan. Because like, when vegans who are still vegans here, you're no longer a vegan. You're enemy number one. That's when they're going to taste for blood. Really? Really. That's a... That's when they'll eat meat.

Yeah, that's when they'll eat meat. That's when the bloodlust is up on them. Ah, what? And I mean, it's like, look, I did it for a long time. And I'm not... It did me great. I loved it, but health was good. Yeah, yeah, I brought down cholesterol, all that stuff. But I, you know, and maybe I'll go back to it. Never see, never.

But it's not like, when I started eating meat again, I thought I was going to get drunk. Oh, wow. I associated it with. Oh, wow. How about that? Yeah, yeah, yeah. It was like, yeah.

I'll get drunk now. Well, I didn't. Thank God. You don't get drunk from meat, as it turns out. No. Meat sweats, different. Different category. Slightly different.

Same, same, but different. The way I drank, you'd have to eat a lot of fucking meat, I think, to really have it land. But it wasn't, it wasn't the thing. So you came in New York. Yeah, so we came back to. Now we were talking because now you're not, you're not just an actor. Now you've directed your first movie as well. Yeah.

It's a real, that's a real change. That's like you're a big, big kid now. Yeah. Yeah, it was, as you know, it's a whole different set of muscles and it's a whole different set of expectations placed on you and it's scary. And I've always had, I've, I've always been a bit afraid. I, and again, I think this goes back to me, being a kid actor, I've known for a very long time what my strengths are.

I know where I can succeed. I've succeeded in doing it since I was a little kid. Right. And consequently, it's, it's, it's, it's, it's, it's, it's, it's, it's, it's, it's, it's, it's, it's, I've done very well. Sure. So, but I've always wanted to direct. I've always thought I could do it.

I've seen other people do it. And I'm like, I think I could contribute some way. You know, certainly work with actors and, and, but I was afraid. I was afraid. Also, opportunity, you know, you know, it's, it's very hard, particularly now. It's just, it's a weird. Weirdly hard right now, right? Yeah, to get anything made.

But, but so opportunity, obviously, but also fear, I think. Like, I wasn't even really trying to. to make my own opportunity in any way. I'm also not a writer, at least maybe fear is holding me back from that, but I don't, yeah, I just knew I could, thought I could contribute as a director somehow. So what did you do, what's the movie?

So it's called, we changed the title, it's now called Untitled Home Invasion Romance. That's a good title. That's the title of the movie. And it's basically I play a commercial actor in New York. Oh, so you're in the movie. I'm in the movie as well, which you've, we talked about this a little bit. Yeah, I directed a movie that was in, and that was the biggest mistake I made,

or directed a movie, is putting me in it. No, seriously, I would just, I feel like as a director I could have done a much better job if I wasn't dealing with number one on the call sheet, who was also me. Right. Who would never come out of his trailer, because he had concerns with the director. If only, that was the case. He came out of his trailer too much. He was the opposite.

it. Anyway, so you put yourself in the movie. Yeah, I was in it as well. And that's how it actually originally came about. I mean, I had been talking with my agents and managers about wanting to direct, and they had an eye open for opportunities. And this came across my agent's desk, this script, just for me to be in. Right. And a little indie, and he read it. And he said, you know, he sent it to me, it was like, I think you'll like this. It's offered to you to be in. But But I also think you'll want to direct this one. It feels like maybe this could be the one. And it was sort of open.

Your agent really knows who you are then. My agent's great, I have to say. He was right. I read it. I was like, yeah, I think I can, I see this. I think I can do something with this. Let's see if we can get it made, you know? And we were able to get it made.

I have a producer that I worked with who, you know, got the money. And we were shooting in under a year from the time it came across my desk. So it was, I'm incredibly grateful for the opportunity. It was a really hard shoot. It was a really... I've never been on one, that is... That's not. I know.

I know. This was, obviously it was a new role. Obviously there were bigger, newer responsibilities, harder, decisions to make. Decisions to make, period. Decisions to make. I know it's weird. I was shocked when I did it. The very first experience I had direct on a movie was actually a set of stills we were doing

for fake album covers. Oh, that's funny. Right. And even right away, you must have been like, oh, it's up to me to decide what... Right. was I was in it. So I said to the AD, like, after we'd been shooting for about an hour, I went, how much fucking longer are we doing this?

And he said, whenever you're finished, Gavna. And I went, oh, I have to say that it's time to stop. And I was like, oh, my God. Yeah, it is perfect. That's fucking perfect, man. I had moments like that as well. I totally had moments like that. That's great.

Yeah, it was a trip. It was surreal in that regard. And, but also, you know, I found my legs, got my sea legs, and I got more confident as the shoot went on, of course. Yeah. But yeah, there was a lot of fear around taking a leap like that. I was really, and I, and look, I was able to zoom out. Of course, it's trite, but like, yeah, the things you're scared of are the things that are going to, you know, be big for you and you've overcome them and da-da-da-da-da. And all the things.

You got to do it. Yeah. I knew that, but it still doesn't, you know, you still, I was still afraid. And, like, it was a big leap and, and, um, yeah, yeah. And, uh, anyway, you did it. You like the movie? Um, yeah, I, I, I, I, I'm, it's, you know, you, it's so hard. You know, it's so hard.

I mean, it's, if you've been in the edit and the dub and all that stuff. And you're in a vacuum and then you, I'm only now, I mean, we did some test audience stuff. And, but that's, you know, when, when you're editing and you do. the test screenings. It's, it's, to get criticism. So it's like, you're just getting this, it's so hard, but you're, it's helpful. It's, it was mostly helpful. Yeah.

But it was also, you know, it's not like I was taking it and people going, ah, laughing and it's in the way that I was you know, it was laughing with an asterisk, you know, and coming back at you and saying, well, this was what I didn't like about it. And anyway, I digress. It was,

I'm very close to it still, and we're only now kind of having some bigger screenings and stuff, and it's been playing really well. And I feel a bit of relief in that, and so I can now sort of take a step back and kind of try to see it. I don't think you'll know for a while anyway. I don't. I think

that, I mean, that movie that I was talking to you about, I directed that movie. And I was a dick about that movie. How so? Because I didn't like it when it first came out. You know, I thought, it's a fucking movie. I don't like it. And it wasn't particularly successful. It did okay, but it wasn't great. And

and I was a dick about it and I kind of said, ah, this movie sucks. I even wrote it down that I, you know, and now I look at it, it's not a bad movie. Yeah. What fuck was that about it? I was hard on myself. Yeah, I was hard on the other people who worked their asses off in the movie as well.

That's what I was really a dick about. These people really worked hard on this thing. And they did the job I asked them to do and some of them were great in the movie. And I was like, oh, I should maybe shut up about that movie. I don't, once you make it, I think you have to shut up about it.

Which is weird because you have to promote it. Yeah. But I think that's great advice. You know, I don't even know if you realize you just gave me some advice and I'm taking it. Yeah, well, I feel like the, after about 10 years, you'll know if the movie, if you like it. If I like it. Yeah. If it was what you wanted to make.

Yeah. Because I mean, for about 10 years, I was a dick about that movie. And people would say to me how much they liked the movie and I'd be like, yeah. Well, I wonder, is, and I would take away their pleasure. Their pleasure. Yeah. Right. Right.

Right, right. I wonder though, was it because, like, you know, you had, because I have in my head still, you know, we shot it a year ago, you know, the bad days, the shoulda woulda could is, the, the, oh, this is, I needed that or, you know, that day, the, the things that went wrong are the things that sort of weigh more heavily. And so when I see the movie, nobody knows about it, but I see it. And I see it. And I. And I see it. And I. go, oh, could it, this is, this is what it's, in my head, it's supposed to be something else. That's what I did too. And so you get more critical of it and you, yeah, you, what's the word I'm looking for? You, uh, anyway, yeah, you make excuses for it and you're kind of like, well, it's the thing about it is, I, it helped me a lot, though, later on, because when I, when I first directed and I, I was like, oh, I have to be on time and on budget and all that stuff. now when I'm making stuff

and you know the thing I'm working on right now which you know you're very kindly part of and we can't really talk about it right now but I don't worry about it being on time and on budget and it drives everybody crazy I'm like no no we'll wait until we've done it and then it's done it well we're going to overtime well that's a you problem right that's I don't care

you know and unless it's somebody coming to fire me it's like you you guys want me to do a job I'm doing the job and if it cost a little extra money because I don't think anyone I think it was I can't remember guy macawayne I think of somebody who said to me um no one ever went to see a movie because it was on time and on budget huh I think it's like you want to go and see that movie well was it did they make their budget that's like who cares yeah that's a that's an inside baseball thing nobody cares that's that's great I love that yeah it's so go over budgets once yeah unless I'm

I wish me... I really don't want you to go on. Yeah, yeah. Where were you a year and two months ago? Yeah. Yeah, so anyway, it's... Yeah, hopefully it'll have some sort of life. I mean, now, you know, we...

Now, the markers of success are also different, right? Yeah. So, you know, we're hoping to get it on people's TVs, which is sad, in a way, because, you know, I... That's the way it works, now. It's a comedy, and I... I've had some big screen audiences watch it, and it is exponentially...

It's always better in a movie, you know, with any movie, any movie, but, you know, we kind of know how it's going to play, and that would be a success if so-and-so streams it and it hits the top. Like, that's now what success is. And, you know, anyway, I am... To come back to the question, do I like it? You're right.

I don't know, and it'd be interesting to see in 10 years what I feel about it. Like, no, I mean, I haven't talked to you about it, about, I think, I'm cautiously optimistic. Here's the, here's the, the big question, would you direct again? Yeah, so the head. Well, then you like it. Then you made a good thing. Yeah, I guess, okay.

Yeah. I mean, I'll tell you, like, there were, there were, um, yeah, and it, and again, it was, there were, there were issues on this movie that were totally avoidable. I'm sure every, every movie, every job, there's always, of course, it's not unique. I'm not unique in that way. but um it was yeah it was just really really hard and i still came out of it the headline being i would do this again i think i might try to give myself a smaller part if any yeah if i was to do it again i would not be in it yeah i mean i take now it's 20 years since i made that movie yeah and i'm about ready to direct another one yeah but only if i'm not in it yeah that would that would

absolutely be our role. So I'd like you to play. That's sweet. It's a story of a young Scotsman. Yep, great. Great. I mean great. Oh my God. It's like you're in it already. Come on. Yeah, I think I would like to do it again. But it's, I hear you on it. It's a fucking mixed bag. It really is. It really is. And yeah. I also, you know, it was a smaller indie. And time is so valuable, of course. And. And, you know, I'm having to run back and check playback. You know, I didn't do it every take, obviously.

I kind of had a sense of, eh, we need another one. Let's just go again or whatever. But, you know, that takes time. And it's, yeah. Yeah, I don't know that I would. But I loved it. I loved working with the real highlight for me. I liked shot listing.

That was totally new. I was scared about that. Had a DPU. That's brilliant ideas. And that was cool. And I learned so much. And I loved editing. Editing was amazing, right?

Yeah, it's amazing. I loved it. I had a great editor. You can change the movie. We did, we did, yeah, and we, on the daily, you know, and the music, the score. It's just post-production was really, I had a sense that I would enjoy it, but I enjoyed it way more than I... Yeah, no, it's right. Yeah.

But working with the actors, the other actors. What about directing theater? Have you done that? No, I haven't. I haven't, this is the only thing I've directed, but I would love to direct theater. See, I think if you're interested in directing actors, I think... Because that's more pure... Yeah, and also, they tend to be more actory

than actors in the theater. For bitter or for worse. Yeah, I know. But they come out of their trailers, though. They sure do. Because there's a whole line around the block waiting to take the part. I would love to.

Yeah. Well, I'd like to see you do it. Thanks, ma'am. Yeah. I want to see you do it again. You didn't see that movie I'm talking about it. Nope. It's not that bad.

It's not that bad. Well, you say that now. Yeah, yeah, 20 years later, I'm like, eh, it's not that bad. I was pretty thin in it. I look good. Yeah, it looked good. It was 20 years ago. Anyway, we're done here.

All right. Yeah, yeah. But great, always a pleasure, man. Oh, that's terrific. So obviously now I'm going to quit doing a podcast because this was it. It doesn't get better. It doesn't. I mean, it might.

But only if you come back. If I come back. Yeah, yeah, yeah. Which I think we should do Jason Begg's episode to The Revenge of Carly's Gold. Great. That would be good. I'm in. All right, get out of here.

Yes, sir. Thank you.