Joy, a Podcast. Hosted by Craig Ferguson - Jordan Klepper

Episode Date: June 24, 2025

Meet Jordan Klepper, Emmy-nominated comedian and Co-Host and Contributor of The Daily Show. You can watch his special Jordan Klepper Fingers The Pulse: MAGA: The Next Generation HERE or on Paramount+. EnJOY! Recorded at Kid Super HQ in Brooklyn, NYSee omnystudio.com/listener for privacy information.

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Listen on the iHeartRadio app, Apple Podcasts, or wherever you get your podcast. We are telling our scientists today we have disdain for your expertise. And then you have China as an exception saying, actually, we're

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Listen to WebMD Health Discovered on the iHeartRadio app or wherever you get your podcasts. This is me, Craig Ferguson. I'm inviting you to come and see my brand new comedy hour. Well, it's actually about an hour and a half, and I don't have an opener because these guys cost money. But what I'm saying is I'll be on stage for a while. Anyway, come and see me live on the Pants on Fire tour in your region. Tickets are on sale now and we'll

be adding more as the tour continues throughout 2025 and beyond. For a full list of dates, go to thecraigfergusonshow.com. See you on the road, my dears. My name is Craig Ferguson. The name of this podcast is Joy. I talk to interesting people about what brings them happiness. Live from Brooklyn, New York City, this is the Joy Podcast coming to you from the Kids Super Studios, the tent within the kids. It's a long story. Anyway, we're here. And my guest today is the guy who's going you from the Kid Super Studios, the tent within the

Kid Super... It's a long story. Anyway, we're here and my guest today is someone that I'm very excited about talking to because he does political stuff and I don't, but he's very good at it and that's probably why he does it and I don't. Look, he's very good. He's got a new special out called Jordan Klepper Fingers the Pulse. MAGA, the next generation. He talks to the young MAGAs.

The name of it, Jordan Klepper Fingers the Pulse, gives you a clue as to who is my guest today. It is Jordan Klepper! Enjoy. You're six foot four? Yeah. Very tall six foot four. How can you be a tall six foot four? Well, I think, I say that...

You've got high hair. Does that add another... Yes. You know the swoop. I'm sure you've experimented with the buzz, the shorten. Yeah, yeah, yeah. I've done a lot. I've done it all. But now I just go for a lot of product. Yeah.

Just as a... I feel like we're working with the same stuff here. We have, we have long faces. Long faces. We're lucky enough to keep the hair long enough. Have you ever gone to a bar and anyone say to you, hey, why the long face? Yes. Yeah, I've had that too. Yes.

Do you have, are you a compulsive drinker? I look at you and I don't see that. That's, I wouldn't say compulsive. I drink, I drink more than I'd like to drink. I read all of those articles that come out warning. I mean, every article comes out tells you drinking is not good. Except in France. They always have these things come out in France where they say, a glass of wine a day will make you feel fabulous.

That red wine a day cures heart disease apparently. That's right, stops heart disease. And a cigarette will cure COVID apparently. Did you hear that? Really? Nicotine for COVID and arthritis, I think. That's so French. The ivermectin of France is a cigarette.

Ivermectin was the horse tranquilizer. No, it's not a tranquilizer. It's a horse. It was a horse. Was it a dewormer? I don't know. Ivermectin was primarily used on horses. Right.

To help a horse eat someone. Do you have horses? Do I have horses? Yeah. Personally? Yeah. Zero horses. You don't. Is that going to be a problem with this podcast? Maybe a little bit. This is a horse-based thing.

I should see the tent. I know it. Mostly what we talk about is horses. I in my life had three horses. Well, two and a half. You still have the horses. Well, I don't have them. I'm married to a woman and she likes horses and she has two proper horses and a kind of a backup horse.

Really? Yeah. In case of a backup horse. Really? Yeah. In case a Shetland pony. Oh, so it's no good for anything. Well, what is the overall purpose? Is it riding? Is it dressage?

Dressage is a, I'd like dressage. Do you know who does dressage? That's the kind of fancy one. Yeah. William Shatner. No. One of the best at it. One of the best. He. One of the best.

He's the captain Kirk of Dressage. That guy's been to space. He's been to space and he does quarter horses, which is a whole horse, but they call them quarter horses. Because there's small. You have four of them. Two in your feet and two in your hand. No, I think that he said he started, because have you ever met William Shatner?

No. It's a treat in store. I believe it. Oh man. I was actually watching a William Shatner video recently of him coming back from space that is haunting in the clarity that he had in space. The feeling he felt was like grief and despair for like humanity and what have you. He was sharing that at the same time Jeff Bezos was celebrating with his girlfriend.

Yeah. Yeah. You can see like the the disconnect between somebody having an actual experience and somebody else tried to sell it. I wonder why Jeff Bezos didn't go to space. Has he gone to space? I'd like to see him go to the Titanic. One of those little submarines. Hey, check it out. Where you going, Jeff? It'll be fine. It's kind of like an Uber.

But underwater. Yeah, you're quite the explorer, Jeff. I have to say, I'm not a huge fan of Jeff Bezos. Do you not like the product? I love his product. I mean, I love the Amazons. But the workout regime, are you a fan of that? I don't love the Amazons. Yeah. But... The workout regime?

Are you a fan of that? I don't know the workout regime. Well, he just looks quite... Oh yeah, he's jacked, isn't he? He's jacked. Is he very small? He feels very small. Yeah.

He feels hairless and small. But suddenly bulging in ways that he... That wasn't inconceivable years ago. Do you think he got them delivered overnight? Oh yeah, well if he pays for the Prime, it's almost a crime not to get them delivered. It's a crime not to pay for the Prime. There you are. I'll take my million dollars.

I don't know. Do you use it? Yes. And yes, I do. I mean, I have the time. I know. I feel like there was a COVID, I feel like created, you can make an argument as to why you're using it so often.

And now it's left us in a place where, and I also have a child who constantly wants things and a wife who constantly wants to be loved. How old is your kid? How old is your kid? How old is your kid? How old is your kid? How old is your kid?

I have a four and a half year old. He's aged in that direction. Yeah, that's a good place to be. Between about three and 13, they're awesome. It's a great place, but they constantly want, and they also constantly know that there is a device that exists in our house that we are sometimes looking on that can get them anything they want.

When are you gonna give them a phone? Oh my God, I mean, I think teenagers, I read, you know, there's a... Good luck. What? There's like a Jonathan Heitbuck, The Anxious Generation. Yeah. That's all about like, I think social media when you're 16.

Yeah. I think phone when you're 14. I've heard there's like a hack with giving them a smartwatch that can just call home. Yeah. Maybe early on, my sister's doing something like that. Yeah, how's it going for her? Is it successful? Just started. Just started. Yeah. Maybe early on my sister's doing something like that. Yeah. How's it going for us? Is it successful? Just started.

Yeah. Cause I have a 14 year old is my youngest and he's had a phone since he was about 11. Is that right? No on social media, but, but, uh, internet access on that phone. Yeah. A little bit limited. I mean, you can, you can kind of, and I always say to him, you know, no porn. So I sure he he's like, yeah, okay Okay, great. That's it. Let me go on. So yes, I will well Yeah, if you it sounds like you're you've really set up the bound very clearly. I'm a fairy Oh, I'm what they call a helicopter parent. I was going to say you really put in the work itself Well, you know my wife's very good at it. Yeah, she's very kind of on top of it. I, I resist. I have this, I wonder if you do this. I've talked to a lot

of performers and people who are in show business to do this. I have, I have a social media accounts, but I go on, I dump and then I delete the app. And then I go on, get the app, sign in, put what I'm putting in and then delete the app before it gets me. Every time. Every time. How often then do you re-download? Uh, probably a couple of times a week. Okay. Yeah, and that's about it. But it doesn't take that long.

Yeah. Yeah. I've added the time restraints onto my phone. So I have like 20 minutes and my phone like shuts off. But then I can add a code and I enter a code and then I can get it back. And so now I've achieved that. So there's, I think it's important to put the speed bumps, but I'm still driving through them.

I think it's, well, I mean, at least you question yourself a little bit if you're going through it. I started doing a thing like about a week ago. I thought, what it's like to just pick up a book and read again at night, you know, and before you go to sleep, I've been sleeping great. Like great. Like I, I'm a 63 year old man.

I should be getting up three or four times for a pee. Not even that. Are you urinating on the books? I know I'm peeing in the bed, but I'm sleeping the whole night. But they, I, it's kind of weird. I really love it. So I think what I'm saying is back to analog for me, I think. I mean, I'm a, I'm a secret Luddite or perhaps a hopeful Luddite. I love that last night, last night I did, I did the book before bed situation.

Right. What are you reading? Well, I got a couple of things going on right now. Last night, well, I got a couple of coffee table books. Sometimes I'm like, let me just look at some art before bed. Yeah, I like that. I got some Bob Dylan books I'm working through. Yeah, yeah.

I'm interviewing Bill Clinton on the program in a week. So I'm working through his book. That's very exciting. Yeah, his book. Got a book with James Patterson. That's a thriller. Is it really? It is. Yeah. He wrote it. Did either one of them show up for this book?

I feel like James Patterson and Bill Clinton kind of have a, it's like, what was his name? Lichtenstein who would come in and go, yeah, this is great. Keep going. And then walk out. I think Paterson has a team. This is what I've heard. You know, that I think some of these big time authors have a crew that assemble literature. Is that really writing then? I don't, you know, you're curating. I think it's like first step AI in some ways. Yeah It's like that's the thing. I'm sure I could write you a partisan novel now. Sure. Yeah, I mean I think like They've probably feed it into AI understand. I mean it's it's a novel that clearly to its credit. It is a page-turner

It has the language of the White House, which I'm sure Bill Clinton weighs in on yeah But yeah, it's a genre that he's in some ways perfected that I'm sure AI gets a look at that. I was like, yeah, I can pull one of these off. Do you use AI in your 20 minute food journeys? I don't. I mean, I've started a little bit on things like restaurants, weird New York questions.

I go to that for the first time. But I mean, it makes me feel old. I don't quite know an access point for a lot of this AI. I'll talk to friends to be like, we're using it for, for work or for reading emails and stuff like that. And I frankly don't understand. Did you hear about Claude four? No Claude four is an AI program, right? They were doing an experiment with it and they told it that we were going to shut it down.

Some guys said, I'm going to shut down Claude Four and Claude Four constructed blackmail letters, letters from the guy who started it, who was going to shut them down to his fictional mistress and said, if you, if you shut me down, I'm going to release these to them. Which it didn't really think it through because if you're shut down, it I'm going to release these. Which it didn't really think it through, because if you're shut down, it's very hard to release anything. Do you know what I mean? But the idea that it would try and leverage something

to stay alive. There's cruelty in AI already. Eh, you know. Self preservation, I get it. Humanity. It's show business AI. You know what I mean? It's like you got to do what you got to do.

You got to do what you got to do. Kill or be killed, right? Yeah, it's still business AI. You know what I mean? It's like, you gotta do what you gotta do. You gotta do what you gotta do. Kill or be killed, right? Yeah, it's kind of a thing. No, you're... I was Googling you today. Yeah, congratulations. I was actually, what was interesting is the name Klepper. I've never heard it before.

Really? Dutch? Dutch name. Yeah, have you been to Holland? No. You should go. I know nothing of it. I know there's a kayak. You can stick your finger in a dike and save the country.

Is that right? That's how you save the country. Okay, I'm going to quote you on that. Well, you're the one that does all the fingering shows. Stick your finger in a dike and you can save Holland. Like, get me to Holland. Let me save a country. Now, it might be, you know, a different, the translation might be different, but that's

what you do. That's what the little boy did. Is that based on an actual story? Is it a fairy tale of some sort? I feel like it's nonsense. There's like, there's a Paul Bunyan, there's probably, to me, I imagine that as like a Davy Crockett situation. Right, or the Paul Bunyan is the kid had a really big finger.

It's like, she's the giant, do you know the Christmas Holland thing? No. Oh, it's really bad. It's the giant. Do you know the Christmas Holland thing? No. Oh, it's really bad. It's really bad. They have to get rid of it. It's like a blackface tradition. Oh, it's very bad. Yeah.

It's Santa and he has, I think, nine black helpers or something. You realize there are some countries that are a good 70 years behind culturally dealing with these things. Listen, when I grew up in Britain in the 1970s, they had a TV show called the Black and White Minstrel Show. I'm not kidding you. Really? Right.

And it was white guys, blacked up, singing barbershop songs on TV, on prime time. I'm not kidding. And I was like, whoa. And we used to watch it. Well, my parents used to watch it. I don't know why it's the black and white minstrel show. But it was a real thing. And it was on in Britain in the 70s.

I think it made it even into the 80s. Do we have Google anywhere? Look up the black and white minstrel show. Who's the audience for that? I think old racist British people. But I don't even know if they were, I don't even know if they would. Yeah, I'm not going to stick up for them. Old racist British people. I think. They made it from 58 to 78. 78. 78. They made it to 78. Is that right? Yeah, I think what happened is the sex pistols came out in 1976 and we're like, you know, maybe we should

probably get rid of the black minstrel show. But it was a real thing and we're like, you know, maybe we should probably get rid of the But it was a real thing. That's wild. I know right crazy. It's crazy. You should go over there Have you been to Britain? Oh, you went to London, didn't you? I did I did I did foreign study and at Goldsmiths and outside London in New Cross. All right, so I was there for like six months. You like it? I loved it I mean, I think like Python Partridge all that stuff became like awakened, everything in my head. Oh really? The Alan Partridge stuff? Oh yeah, I mean that's still... Coogan I've known for years.

Oh yeah, I mean I... We came up at the same time. Is that right? Yeah, yeah. That character to me is... It's a great character. Incredible. Incredible. It's a great character.

He can age into it. I think he's done such a good job of using like formats like adapting to formats Yeah, I'm casting mid-morning matters has such great like short attention span video stuff I the fact that they played with sitcom. I just I think there's so much about that character stuff Barely, I mean I came up in the improv sketch world. Well, that's what I was gonna say cuz you were in the Upright Citizens Brigade, right? Yeah, so I was I I Well, that's what I was going to say because you were in the Upright Citizens Brigade, right? Yeah, so I was, I performed there in Second City in Improv Olympic in Chicago. So like, yeah, there's always characters. I think like, as I've gotten older though, I realized like my acting range is slight.

Does it need to be much? Not much. It's status. What I can do is I can do status. I can do high status. I can do pretty high status. Right. And high, did I say high status. I can do high status. I can do pretty high status. Right. And high, did I say high status? And high status. Yes. Well, what about, I mean, I think you could do, let's try racist Dutch Santa with a giant finger. Right.

With a giant finger. I've got to save the country. I don't know if that's a Dutch accent. Yeah, that one. That's a fun accent though, right? Dutch. I think it's one of the ones you can do. Like German you can do. You can do German because they've still... World War II, you can still point to that.

We can still kind of, you know, still talking about it. You can do German. Dutch I think you could probably pull off because not enough people understand what you're doing. Right. I don't know that I could do Dutch and German. I couldn't tell the difference even with a Dutch or German person, I don't think. It's like Canada and other parts of Canada.

Yes. You know, Canada. I'm in Midwest too, so Canada gets into Northern Michigan as well. So it's just like, that just sounds like a level of like niceness or like, or yeah, it's like a kindness. Passive aggression too. Sure. A lot of passive aggression. Yeah, there's something behind it, but it's a form kind of passive aggression to sure a lot of passive aggression yeah there's something behind it but it's a formative nature of like things are okay this five month we are not just celebrating we're fighting back I'm georgian Johnson and my book

all boys aren't blue was just named the most banned book in America. If the culture wars have taught me anything, it's that pride is protest. And on my podcast, Fighting Words, we talk to people who use their voices to resist, disrupt, and make our community stronger. This year, we are showing up and showing out. You need people being like, no, you're not going to tell us what to do.

This regime is coming down on us. And I don't want it to survive. I want to thrive. You'll hear from trailblazers like Bob the Drag Queen. To freedom! Angelica Ross. We ready to fight? I'm ready to fight. And Gabrielle Yoon.

Hi, George. And storytellers with wisdom to spare. Listen on the iHeartRadio app, Apple Podcasts, or wherever you get your podcasts. storytellers with wisdom to spare. Listen on the iHeartRadio app, Apple Podcasts, or wherever you get your podcasts. Hello, this is Craig Ferguson. And I want to let you know I have a brand new standup comedy special out now on YouTube.

It's called I'm So Happy. And I would be so happy if you checked it out. To watch the special, just go to my YouTube channel at The Craig Ferguson Show. And it's right there. Just click it and play it and it's free. I can't, look, I'm not going to come around your house and show you how to do it.

If you can't do it, then you can't have it. But if you can figure it out, it's yours. What about standups? Is that ever intrigued you as a? Yes, I do a bit of it now. I basically when I got the Daily Show, all the standups on the Daily Show were like, you should do standup. Right. Every standup thinks you should do standup.

You should go do standup. And so I was like, I'll try the standup thing. And so I've been doing it for the last few years. I'm going on a bit of a tour now. I did standup. I like standup. Honestly, I as an improv guy, you're taught to dislike stand up. It's such different worlds at least coming up.

Why would you be taught that? I mean, I think like in the world of Chicago coming up, you're either an improv or you are a stand up guy. So you pick a side. You like solo stuff or you like working as a team with a bunch of the theater kids. I think though I grew out of improv by the time I got Daily Show I was pretty tired of it and I kind of fell in love with the craft of stand up.

But also in doing that became very aware of like how much work it took to get where I wanted to be with it. Like my first few shows I was able to by that point at 35 having done comedy for 15 years I could put up a show. People would watch it. I could be all right. Yeah. And it was really frustrating to be like, shoot, I'm all right. Yeah.

I'd really like to be good, but I'm all right. To be good, I need these kinds of reps. I also think that there's different types of stand up. I feel like, you know, not just like the individuals, but there's actually different, like I went down to the, have you been down to the Comedy Cellar and that Village Underground? Which I thought was a fantastic place. I love it down there. And I went for the first time last weekend and, and then I had got up and did, you know, they call it a drop in, I guess. But the, I did a set, a set, a little short set. I did it twice over the period of the evening

and you know, cause the role shows through and you do 15 minutes and I don't do 15 minutes. I do, you know, about 90 to a hundred minutes. So in the first set, I was like, oh shit, I better kind of pick this up a little bit. And the second set, I got it, but it's a different, it feels like a different instrument. It's like a guitar or a banjo.

You know what I mean? I don't know which one is which, but the, or a guitar and, you know, glockenspiel or something. But they're, it's a different thing because you have to joke, joke, joke. The rhythm, the rhythms to stand up are so different than the rhythms of improv.

I think also like an audience, I was, my first reaction was like, as an improviser, an audience is rooting for you and is cheering along the process. And so there's like a rap attention that holds the spaces. Very nice, very theater-y. It sounds very comfortable.

And then you come stand up, and I feel like the audience is like, sets the clock and it's like, go. Am I laughing every 25 seconds? How's this working? I got used to that a bit. That's club stand-up I think. But stand-up you know when I'm doing a theater you know you tell stories and you kind of

meander and you got that thing you got that kind of grace to talk and do stuff. That's what I kind of shifted over to that in the last year and a half that's been so much nicer because I feel like the club world I would get half the audience wanted me to just to talk about politics stuff because they knew Daily Show stuff I did. The other half was pissed I was talking about politics. That's politics for you though. I mean, I made a decision like 2016 actually that I would remove it from everything I do. Everything. Everything I do. How is that out of the road now? Do people still want it or they feel like... Well at first everybody assumes that you're on

the other side. Yeah. So everybody, at first, everybody assumes that you're on the other side. So everybody, like everyone on the left assumes you're on the right. Everybody on the right assumes you're on the left. And at first, it's kind of like, it doesn't go away. But when you keep talking about it and saying, look, I'm not doing it. And every interview I gave, I'm like, I'm not doing it. And I mean, you do the local radio things with Zippy, Bingo and the Wheeze to promote that show. Then I say, look, it's not about Paul and I keep doing it.

I keep doing it and now they get it. And I think it's kind of, for me, it's a relief. I just don't want to, and I'm kind of, I admire, because I remember talking to Stephen Colbert about this. It's like, you know, he ran right at it. Like if I was going, doing late night right now, I'd be like, man, forget it. And then everyone would hate you for it. They'd be like, ah, why?

Coward. What are you doing? Yeah. That's exactly what they would say. You would say you're a coward. Yeah. And I'm like, why? I just don't want to, I don't want to get into it. I'm sick of listening to people I agree with, you know, I'm like, fuck, please.

But I guess when you have that volume of stuff to fill, policies is great. Oh, because every day there's a new show, especially now. There's a new show every day. We're going to invade Canada. Look out Greenland. They're breaking up. I mean, how much Trump do you think you'd be talking about right now if you were doing a monologue tonight? I don't think I would be doing any of it. None of it? I don't think so because I kind of feel like I came up during punk rock, right?

And particularly British or really English punk rock and particularly the pistols and the kind of the vibe of that and the kind of the instigator of that was Vivian Westwood and Malcolm McLaren and Vivian and Malcolm were great. The whole thing was selling the swindle. Like it's a swindle. It's a fucking, it's a game. And so the kind of the, what you kind of gets in your bones is like, I don't want to be

hoodwinked by this fucking, the great rock and roll swindle. And I feel like politics right now, particularly media coverage is like, you fucking suckers, they're giving you a new piece of misdirect every day. Look at all this is going on. That's not the thing. The thing that you're not looking at is the thing. Yeah. And then of course, if you go that way, then conspiracy theories and I've got a lot of

them. Yeah. Yeah. You're flat earther, where you at with the earth? Flat earther, contrails. Oh yeah. Yeah, contrails. Have you ever flown a plane?

No. Actually flown? Really? Yeah, you'd like it. My guess is you're a control freak. Yeah, yeah, third department, yeah, for sure. Yeah, yeah, see? It? Yeah, you'd like it. My guess is you're a control freak. Yeah, yeah, third department. Yeah, for sure. It'll appeal to you.

I feel like I just watched the rehearsal of the Nathan Fielder show, which I loved. Can't say enough good things about it. But boy, places you in the... I think it really set me into how stressful that job is. It's easy. I walk on a plane and I'm like, I bet you push a couple buttons, you get on up there and you're like, oh no, I think like the pressure of that, I've never jumped out of a plane. No, I wouldn't do that. You wouldn't do that stuff. You'd be prepared to jump out of a plane if you're flying, right?

Well, I'd rather land the plane. I like the idea of landing the plane. I wouldn't jump out of a perfectly good airplane to start going, whee! That doesn't appeal to me at all. You have like a, you have a pilot's license. I do, yeah. I only did it because I was frightened to fly. Really? Yeah.

Yeah. Which I, you know, I thought, and then I was talking about this on late night, actually, to Kurt Russell, who is like a big timey aviator. I mean, he's, that's really what he does. He acts for money to pay for gas. Yeah. And and he said, you're not a you're not afraid of flying. You're just a control freak.

I'm like, I don't think that's true. And then he said, this is what really got me because vanity wins every time. He said, I just read your book. You're a control freak. And I went, oh, right. I was like, oh, tell me more about myself. Yeah. Enough about you, more about me.

And he kind of got me hooked up with a flying instructor and I got in a flying and. Wow. Yeah. And did that do it? Was suddenly like, oh, riding in a plane is no big deal anymore? It changed it.

Yeah. Now I'm frightened of flying, but I'm afraid of the correct things. Yes. As opposed to... It feels like that hurdle though, it allows you to control something when you're flying, but it perhaps gives you more respect for the people who are in charge there, and therefore you release, you relinquish some of that control?

Well, I think you have to relinquish control. I mean, I think that you have to be a bit more, see that my life has been stand up and you are a team player, you know, and you're learning to, I mean, you're now, you know. I'm learning to be selfish. Slowly and experiment. I've been, you know, pathologically selfish

since I was, I nearly drank myself to death. I'm so selfish. It's crazy. I had to really work on it. But kids will do that for you as well, actually, I think. I mean, yes. Well, I do think that was a giant wake up for me. Of like, oh, I realize where I am selfish

and how I am selfish in all those ways. Yeah, then a kid is there, you're like, oh, I thought I'm doing this for that reason or this for that reason. But really most of these things I'm doing for is for me. And then a kid comes along and it's like, oh yeah, the whole name of the game is like, just protect that thing. Feed that thing. Be nice to that thing. Make money for that thing. Live for that thing.

Yeah. That was another big thing where I'm like, oh, got to stay alive. I have to stay alive. Yeah. I was like, I wasn't thinking about staying alive. I got to fucking stay alive. I know. It's kind of a bummer. Sometimes. Yeah, you're like, oh, I need to grapple with that, that now my new job is to withhold pain from this child's life. Yeah.

To be able to create space and security for this child for as long as humanly possible. And how's it going? It's okay. Did it kick in first day for you? Did like when the baby was born, was it like a, like a, whoa, this is all because I'll just be honest with you. It took me about six months. Yeah. Cause at first when it's the baby, I'm like, babies, Jesus, pain in the ass. Babies are, they're just, but when they start interacting with you, it's fine,

but when it's just that screaming slug in the middle of the night, oh God. Yeah, I mean that first wave is all of like, I just, I have to learn a new skill to keep this cellular thing alive for a while. This egg that I brought home, just what do I need to do for it? And then yeah, when it becomes a human that you interact with,

then I think I could project into the future that human, like going on a date for the first time or being heartbroken, a human like, like that stuff scared the shit out of me. And I also, for the first time in my life also, like, saw the moment where my son would no longer call me and tell me how he's doing every few days or what have you. I saw it in the future. I'm living that. Yeah, yeah, like, oh, that will be a pain that I will feel.

And I haven't been thinking about how my parents are feeling that pain. You'd be surprised I'm okay with that. Is that all right? You're like, yeah, whatever. Oh, hi, son, yeah, all right. Yeah, okay, you're fine, good, you're alive. Good, yeah, we're all good, yeah, yeah, yeah.

Brushing your teeth, good luck. Food, food, SPF, great, all right. Yeah, okay. You're fine. Good. You're alive. Good, good, good. Yeah, yeah, yeah. Brushing your teeth. Good luck. Food, food. SPF. Great. We'll talk in four days. Yeah, it's funny. I'll get the news for your mom. My dad used to say that to me. I'll get all the news from your mother. Anybody who's had the phone when I was calling in Scotland. Is that right? Yeah.

Now, here's the thing. My wife has a theory that all stand-ups, and I extrapolate that to performers actually all have very similar mothers. Oh Tell me more She says cold with bad boundaries Cold with bad boundaries. Yeah I'm gonna say no for me. Yeah, I'm gonna say I mean, yeah, I I Didn't go in the stand. That's why maybe I didn't go to stand up

I think my brain I had very parents, like working class parents in Michigan who were just excited that I was doing stuff I liked. But I was like, without it being put on from a parental pressure, I think they were too worried about putting food on the table, doing all that. But I was like, I need to do these things to succeed in life to get a college scholarship to go to college to get a job. Like I was a nerd. I got like a math scholarship going into college.

That's great. I was. Yeah, I was all about like what are the things I need to do to succeed in life? So therefore I will not let my parents down and I will be OK. And then in Kalamazoo, Michigan, the only thing you were told you could be is like, if you're smart, you could be like a doctor or a lawyer. Realize it, you know. So it's like, all right, I'll probably be one of those things. I can be a smart kid and I get a scholarship to be a smart kid. And then like the improv thing, the bug hits me.

They sent me to England and I get a little bit of this stuff. And suddenly my brain is like, oh, I like this. I'm asked to think about stuff in different ways feel in different ways express in different ways There's not like a path for that right and so then it was like well fuck it I want to I want to explore this And I do get I give my parents credit like they didn't come at a from a place of like stay on the path do that thing They were I think tickled by the fact that I was exploring in this way I don't so that it sounds like you were happy.

I was happy. I was doing an interesting thing that like they were like, we'll come visit you in London. We'll go to Chicago and see your your dumb little shows in the middle of the night because you love pretending and doing all this. I think in some ways, at least for the improviser mindset, like it's such a luxury that like my job for seven years, not even job, my job was a substitute teacher for seven years, but my, what I was doing is like pretending on stage. Substitute teaching what math?

Uh, everything in Chicago public schools. Oh man. That's. I do that for the day job. You don't need to do stand up. You've been in front of top. I've been. Exactly.

They're judging me constantly. Oh my God. That is, that's hard. Yeah. Yeah. It's constantly crowd work with a bunch of kids who don't want to listen to the things you're saying. Yeah, I don't know if I could handle them. My mother was a teacher.

I was like, oh, geez, no. In fact, a lot of people in my family are teachers when they think about it. Really? Uncles and aunts and stuff, yeah, yeah. You don't see a connection to that though with standup that you feel like you would have naturally been? Yeah may be a little bit now as I think about it. Yeah, the kind of, the standing in front of groups of hostile Scottish people.

Yeah, I see it now. Yeah, I think that's, yeah, I never thought about it. Yeah, maybe, although I don't consider myself in any way in a teaching position with these people. I, you know, mostly it's about survival for me, I think. But I feel like one of your, I mean, one of your superpowers though is putting people at ease, right? Would that be fair to say? I feel like you famously, like, your ability to interview and get to the quick with people.

Yeah. And put them in a comfortable place. I feel like I'm not threatening. I'm not threatening. Sure, of course. And then maybe, you know what it is? It's like, I really don't want to damage you in any way. I'm not interested in scoring a point against you.

I don't care about that. You've got to try to get a point in here or there. Eh, not really. Come on, win. I mean, who's winning now? Who's going to score? You're winning and I want you to win. Oh, boy.

It's no fun if you just give it up, Craig. You're winning at life. You're tall. You're tall too, Craig. Come on, fight for it. You're winning at life. You're tall. You're tall too, Craig. Come on, fight for it. You're winning. You're past the tall post first. You're the checkered flag of the tall race.

I've gotten there. And you're in. I'm in. You're in. And you did a little extra with the high hair. You got to. Yeah. You know?

I don't know. You're a shimmy when you're in the end zone. You know what? I don't know if I have the testosterone anymore to get my hair to go high. I think it'll just. You know what the secret is? The secret is less product.

Shut up. You think it's more product. No. The secret is less product. The product weighs it down. And you need enough to keep it in some sort of shape. But when you want height, if you're going for height. I don't know if I am though.

It looks good. I feel like if I go for height, you know, at this point in my life, it's like I'm the oldest guy in the club. Do you know what I'm saying? It's like, I think I should just, you get to a certain point, and I think it's run about 60, where you just, you try and not embarrass people by being in the room with them. That's it. This is like, oh, I hope he does. Last night I was doing a podcast and I was sitting talking to these people for

about an hour and a half or something. It was one of those long ones where you hold the microphone. That shows your age right there. It's one of these long ones. One of these exhausted podcasts where they make you hold the microphone. You got to hold the microphone. I'm like, oh no, don't we have one of these? I had to hold the microphone. And when I stood up, my leg was kind of seized up.

And I was like, Oh my God, this is awful. And I was limping. I thought, this is a, you know, it's a little kind of trailer of what's coming. I'm literally limping now because I broke over. I fractured a bone in my foot. Really? From standing on a two-law. From what?

From standing on a two-law. Really? From standing on a two-law. Really? Yeah. Can that happen? It can happen. You should maybe see a doctor. That sounds like brittle leg syndrome. I have the foot bone density of like an ailing sparrow.

Wow. Yeah. And I feel like I'm feeling very old this year. I've got a lot of like, likements have suddenly had I'm 46 and so like foot cracked I get out you have got out. What are you King Henry? I sup at the table of Kings how did you get go cuz goats like a Build up of a mineral of some kid is is. You get it because you're eating,

I joke that it is like I have privilege essentially because you're drinking yeasty IPAs and you're eating red meat. But a big part of it is too, it's a genetic thing. Basically if you get a certain level of like, you get uric acid buildup and diet is part of it, but mostly it's a genetic thing. Do you have to go vegan then?

I should go no booze and no red meat, and I go no red meat. That's me, that's me. Yeah. I live my life like that. And do you like it? Yeah, it's fine. But the no booze thing is up.

Are you essential? Yes. Essential. I mean, that I get. I go sober when I was 29. Yeah. But I was, you live that life. Yeah, no, I was, no, no for,

well, as it turns out, it wasn't for me, but it was for me at the time. Yeah. No booze and no drugs and no red meat, because, you know. And you've just now gotten into reading? No, I've been reading for a while. I was going to say, I feel like night time reading

is to me, like when I'm at my best and I'm not drinking, I'm taking a break and I'm eating good. To me, one of the biggest elements of social drinking or even just solo at home is like marking the end of the day. And so I have such a hard time like transitioning into something that feels it's a good use of time at night. And to me, books does that sometimes. Let me talk to you.

Let's wind it back a little to solo drinking at the end of the day. Oh, Craig, come on. I was winning. I was winning this conversation. Now, let's just take a little stop here. Oh, God, I knew this was happening. Rest up on this little freeway and go solo drinking at the end of the day. Yes, a little solo drinking at the end of the day.

Yes, a little glass of beer or wine or something. Yeah, I'll go a little bourbon at the end of the night. A little hard alcohol. A little hard alcohol. It's better for the feet. You know, your fucking gout is well deserved. So cheese and bourbon at the end of the day with a burger. Yeah, this is all right. You know what? Now I'm winning. Sit on your high horse or your quarter horse and look down on me.

Say on one of your four horses. One of your four horses. I love it. You come in here bragging about your four horses. I don't have four horses. I don't have any horses. Your wife has three horses. She has a reserve horse.

She has a backup horse. Backup horses. It's not really a horse. It's a Shetland pony. You're still on a high Shetland pony with this perspective. The thing is though, I'm It's a Shetland pony. You're still on a high Shetland pony with this perspective. The thing is though, I'm frightened of the Shetland pony. It serves no purpose. Well, that, it's a very angry thing.

Oh really? Oh yeah, it's a very angry thing. They're very cranky Shetland ponies. You mustn't have one. Really? You live in New York City? I do. They'd be very inconvenient anyway.

Although that makes you that guy. I mean, the guy with the iguana at Starbucks, that guy, I don't want to be that guy. You don't like that guy? It's not that I don't like him. I just don't want to be him. You don't want to be him. Yeah. I don't want to be the, cause that guy's, people are going to talk to that guy. I don't want to talk to you.

That's true. You know, I'll talk to you here in the tent. But, but I'm, Starbucks? Yeah. I like to be ready. Do you know what I mean? Like, do you ever get like, like, like, like, like, like, like, like, like, like, like, like, like, like, like, like, like, like, like, like, like, like, like, like, like, like, like, like,

like, like, like, like, like, like, like, like, like, like, like, like, like, like, like, like, like, like, like, like, like, like, like, like, like, like, like, like, like, like, like, like, like, like, like, like, like, like, like, like, like, like, like, like, like, like, like, like, like, like, like, like, like, like, like, like, like, like, like, like, like, like, like, like, like, like, like, like, like, like, like, like, like, like, like, like, like, like, like, like, like, like, like, like, like, like, like, like, like, like, like, like, like, like, like, like, like, like, like, like, like, like, like, like I'll talk to you here in the tent. But, Starbucks? Yeah. I like to be ready. Do you know what I mean? Do you ever get like, when you get recognized? Because you get recognized and people recognize you at times

where you really don't want to be recognized at that time. For sure. A lot of times. And a kid usually blacks that out. New York is a pretty cool place. New York is actually the best city in the world for it. Because if people recognize you they're like, oh, it's that guy. Yeah.

I had the best one a few weeks ago. I was like parking in Brooklyn on a Sunday and I hop out and I'm about ready to pay my meter and a guy walks by and he goes like, Klepper, it's Sunday. You don't fucking pay. And he kept walking. That's great. I was like, that is so New York. That is very New York.

But here's the thing. Let's go back to paying for the mirror. I never do. You don't? Never. You just roll the dice. I roll the dice because I figure and I get tickets but I don't get them every time and I feel like it works out kind of even. I will say I do that I do street parking. Yeah I got a car and I got no parking spot and so you know the New York thing of like getting your car and then wait for two hours as the cleaner comes around so you don't get a ticket. Right. Yeah. I've given up on that as well.

I'm like, I'll roll the dice. I'll pay it. It's so much cheaper to get a couple of tickets a month than it is to pay for parking in New York. Yeah. I mean, it's like if you go try and park in one of these structures, it's like it's more expensive than getting tickets. Doesn't make any sense. Yeah. Yeah. So what do you, you double park? You're driving in town. I don't have a car in town. You don't have one when I do because I drive

a Ram 1500 pickup truck That's a fucking tank. Yeah, that's what I got tiny ponies and big truck. I got a tiny But I would never let a pony in my truck That's from my wife's how many ponies could you put in the back of that truck? A Ram? Dodge Ram 1500? I don't know, one Shetland pony? You couldn't get a huge, no, you're thinking of the 2500. What is it?

What are you, you like the beefiness? You use it? I like the, you know, because I'm an immigrant. And I feel like, you know, when you're an immigrant, it's kind of like, you know, people that convert to a religion are more religious than the people who were growing, grew up in the religion. That, that's kind of like me with America. I'm more America than people who are American.

You have, you have like a cowboy hat at home. Oh, more than one. Yeah. Three horses. Two and a half. I have a cowboy hat. I drink root beer over crushed ice. I yell at the TV.

I watch NASCAR. You watch, you like NASCAR too? I watch NASCAR. Oh, you are in it. Sometimes I fall asleep in front of baseball games. I like, I do the whole thing. I respect that. Yeah, it's, I threw myself wholeheartedly into it.

I'm Homer Simpson. That's the best place to be, to be honest, to enjoy all of the indulgences of American culture. I feel like there's elements that I feel like I myself am always probably partially pushing against because I grew up with it. Yeah, yeah, it's an interesting thing. What did you miss about it when you were in London? If anything. Well, I was such a sheltered child by what I left. Yeah, yeah, it's an interesting thing. What did you miss about it when you were in London, if anything? Well, I was such a sheltered child by the when I left.

So like, I mean, I immediately sought out everything that felt American in London, but I'm also like 19 at the time, 20 at the time. So like I'm eating at, I mean, I'm eating at the McDonald's in Trafalgar Square. You know, I'm like, I'm just eating at chip shops. And so I'm the culture was as close to like American fast food culture as I could. Right. Find. But as I like settled in, I mean, I loved, I think what I mostly loved about London at the time was that I love big cities. I didn't know it. Kalamazoo is a tiny one. Yeah. These big cities have an energy. I love big cities. I love this. New York City. Yeah. New York City is my favorite city. I think every other city is just

kind of pretending to be New York. I went to Tokyo. Tokyo doesn't give a shit. Yeah. I was like, oh, this is Tokyo. Tokyo is Tokyo. Yeah. I think some of the European cities, I'm like, oh yeah, but New York is New York. Tokyo is three New Yorks. Yeah. Tokyo is kind of crazy. Yeah, I loved it. Yeah, me too. I felt if I had gone to Japan when I was a young man, I would not have come back. Yeah, that would have been your life. Yeah, I would have just, because I really liked it. I really, I don't know why.

I mean, just everything about it just seemed great. Yeah. Why did you go? Were you working? No, that was five, six years ago. My wife has always wanted to go. She loves Japanese culture. I was, I did as well, but it wasn't on my bucket list necessarily. And so we went, we spent like two weeks. We did like a week in Tokyo.

Did you go to Kyoto? Yes, we went to Kyoto. And then we went to the Noto Peninsula. Then we were like, we want to go to like a small fishing town and spend a couple days out there. And that was amazing. I feel like I felt a little bit this with Rome. What I loved about Rome is that there's like three centuries going on at the same time. Like now the 1600s and like Roman culture is like on the same block. And Japan felt elements of that of like Tokyo felt like a super city in its own future that I loved, didn't give a shit about Westerners or what they had going on. This Pride Month, we are not just celebrating.

We're fighting back. I'm George M. Johnson, and my book, All Boys Aren't Blue, was just named the most banned book in America. If the culture wars have taught me anything, it's that pride is protest. And on my podcast, Fighting Words, we talk to people who use their voices to resist, disrupt, and make our community stronger.

This year, we are showing up and showing out. You need people being like, no, you're not going to tell us what to do. This regime is coming down on us. And I don't want it to survive. I want to thrive. You'll hear from trailblazers like Bob the Drag Queen. To freedom.

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Have you been to Russia? No. Russia's amazing. Yeah. Yeah. I was, because I kind of came up during the cold war. So you know, I had been told a lot of stuff about Russia. That's not true.

And people are hearing a lot of stuff about Russia. That's not true right now. Yeah. You know, and, and like when I was in St. Petersburg, which is as beautiful a city as I've ever seen. I mean, it's like Paris, but clean. I mean, it's amazing. And Moscow is an amazing city.

And the people are so gregarious. You know what they're like? They're like Irish people, literate drunks. They're all drunk and they've all read everything. I mean, I feel like the literature culture over there is incredible. Yeah. When did you last been there? I went there, I think it was about 2012 was the last time I was there.

So I'm probably not going to go at the moment. Not a great time. Flight's to be cheap. Yeah. I don't know how you would get there. You'd have to fly into the Middle East and then fly up, I guess. Yeah, I think so. Yeah.

Yeah. I don't know. I mean, I just, I was, I always liked it. Yeah. I was like, I know. So I went to go and see, uh, Lenin was the first dead body I ever saw. Is that right? Yeah. We got to pick one. Yeah. Yeah. He's in the mausoleum. Yeah. The, I went in and see him. I've seen those pictures. It looks very spooky.

Yeah. It's, It is very spooky. Yeah. But also I kind of was like, is that really him? Really? Yeah. I thought maybe it might be, you know, feels like wax. It's at a distance. It's dark.

I thought it was Jimmy Hoffa. Is that where he is? I think that might be. It might be Jimmy Hoffa. Yeah. Okay. They took Lenin out and Lenin is still alive on Ivermectin. And yeah. And it's Jimmy Hoffa is in there.

They steal it from the horses. You got sick horses there, but Lenin is still kicking it. Yeah. I think Lenin Putin sounds kind of the same. Yeah, it does. Yeah. Well, not really, but there's definitely certain letters that are the same. Do you know they have a lot of statues of Lenin.

I don't know if they still have them, but they had a lot of statues of Lenin holding up a newspaper. Yeah, I really don't know why he was doing that. I thought he was hailing a cab of some sort. It looks like that, he's always his coat is flapping and he's always like, hey, they're striving. You can't get a cab in this entire Soviet system. That's why I went to Estonia and they had like one of those, they had a sculpture park of all of the decommissioned Russians.

Oh, they've got that. They've got that in Moscow as well. Really? Park of totalitarian art. Oh, wow. It's amazing. Amazing. Oh my God.

I mean, because yeah, the art, it's fascinating. It's so brutalist in nature. All of these figures are, they're all striding. They all striding. They're all moving in some kind of direction. Big heads, yeah, great tailored suits. And also the one in Moscow, I don't know about in Estonia, but the one in Moscow, they're all kind of like toppled over.

So that's kind of weird. You know the weird thing I found in Red Square? First time when you go into Red Square, everybody, you walk into Red Square and you start crying. It's the weirdest thing. You're like, Oh my God. It's just, it's enormous. It's enormous. And then just the kind of weirdness of it all. Maybe it's, maybe it's my generation because of the mystery of the Soviets and the terror, it was like going to like the devil's house or something. And then the graves on the, John Reed, the American communist is buried at the Kremlin wall. Really? Yeah.

And Stalin is buried there and Stalin's grave by far has all these people like leaving flowers. And that's the one everybody goes to. It's all right there in Red Square. Yeah. And there's a department store on the other side of it called Gum. You can you see it? Is it purposely? It's right there.

It's right there. Yeah. It's an old building. I don't know if it was always called, if it was always a department store, I think it may have been the czar's wardrobe or something like that. I mean, it's insane. Yeah. Oh man, it's insane though. Oh man, it's crazy.

And Lenin's right there, like in the center? No, you go down the little steps and it's kind of dark. Not unlike this. And then it's like a Dracula or, you know, sleep in beauty but done by the cure or something like that. Oh wow. Yeah. Is there like a line?

Is he still a draw? I don't, I mean in 2012, yeah. 2012, he's yeah, people were still going, but I don't know if they're going now because it's an Instagram moment now, isn't it? You would be down there like, here's me and Lennon, here's me and Will.i.am, you know, I mean, whoever it is at the time. Will.i.am is fine, by the way, he's not dead. As of this recording, Will.i.am is fine. Yeah, who knows? Fingers crossed. He was a hologram at one point, but I think he was still alive. That was mostly a...

Have you seen ABBA or a hologram now? Are they really? Yeah. ABBA, I've got a show going on in London that you can go to and they're robot hologram machines. And that's the whole show. I know that Tupac was a hologram for a bit. Right. Yeah, but for obvious reasons.

But Abba, they just didn't want to go. Like, Tupac can't make it, to be fair. I can't do a six-night-a-week run. That just doesn't make any sense. He's not available for that. But Abba, they could still conceivably go and sing the songs, but they don't. That's power.

But it's young Abba. Oh, I mean, that's, you get to pick, you get to pick the... No't. That's power. But it's young Abba. Oh, I mean, that's you get to pick, you get to pick the... No, that's what you get. You get young Abba. But it's like, have you ever been to Graceland? Yes. Right. Well, you know when they have Elvis's suits up there? Oh, yeah. It's not fat Elvis.

But see, I love old rock stars is what I want. Oh, yeah? I love it. I love it. I'm a Dylan guy and I love old Dylan. Did you like that film? Yes! Oh good, good, good. I think like it's not the Dylan film I would necessarily make, but I think part of what I love is all the lore around him and somebody just being like, all right, this is the Dylan story we're going to tell. Right, we're going to do this bit. It's an artist's life. There's too many different bits. I thought Edward Norton was great. I like Edward Norton. I think that's such a fun Pete Seeger.

I think he's always in the Dylan myth been such a kind of a dweeb attached to Bob Dylan. I know next to nothing about Bob Dylan. Really? Yeah, it just didn't pass me by. Yeah? Yeah. I found him late and just his talent, but beyond that, like as a performer, his freedom to...

He found his success as a performer at such an early age and then just dumped it and looked for something else. And I feel like so much of like being a performer and improviser is like trying to find what's your thing so that you can sit in it and find a little success for a moment. And like Dylan figured it out and was like, fuck it, I'm going to do another thing. And he figured that figured it out and was like, I fucking I'm going to do another thing. And he figured that out and they're like, I fucking I'm going to do another thing. Like the, his impermanence is so impressive to me.

I think people who get very successful, very young, also get injected with a confidence. For sure. That sometimes is warranted in the case of Dylan, definitely. And sometimes it's absolutely not, you know? And then they get into this odd kind of sense of entitlement. Yeah. Yeah, I think there's a world where you can then

completely freeze and this is just who you are. You're confident, you're successful. This is the gravy train you will ride for life. I think it's an interesting, I worked for a while with Mick Jagger and we were working on a screenplay that we were writing for a movie that was never made. And I was, I remember talking to him about, cause he was 18 when that, you know, and he

was like, well, you know, it's like, I know what I am. You know, I was thinking, even as I was working with him, the myth of Mick Jagger is like, he went to the London School of Economics. Did he really? Yeah. He's a very clever, astute businessman. And he's made a couple of mistakes that no one really talks about. But I remember them because I look for the negative. But did you ever see the movie Ned Kelly?

No. The Australian Robin Hood or Jesse James is Ned Kelly and Mick Jagger did a movie in the 70s where he played Ned Kelly. It's catastrophically bad. It is fucking wonderful. Yeah. And make his terrible. And, and no, I've seen him perform up close a lot of times. One of the best performers. I mean, look, it's not news. Mick Jagger is an amazing performer, but as an actor, he's not that guy. Yeah.

It's kind of interesting, but he had the confidence to go in. Yeah, I'll be, I'll do this film and it'll be awesome. Yeah. And it's not awesome. But it's awesome. But you enjoyed the performance of it because I love it because the schadenfreude of it is just fucking delicious. The freedom of that is, I mean, I feel like Dylan has that in an acting standpoint too. Like, I feel like he had such an allure to be famous on screen as well.

And, you know, he did Ronaldo and Clara. He did what, the Pat Garrett film in Billy the Kid. And he's so stiff and stilted, but the confidence to be that within it, and he still pops up. He just literally, he popped up, you know, He did like a Pawn Stars episode of years back. Then he pops up. He pops up in the weirdest stuff. It's crazy. Literally yesterday. He's one eighty three. He and he just popped up doing the voiceover for the trailer for the rapper

Machine Gun Kelly's new album. Wow. That's just is I didn't see that coming. He makes the weirdest choice. I feel like when you have that level of fame, the Mick Jagger's, the Bob Dylan's, and you can do whatever the hell you want. Yeah. The ability to just be like,

well I'm gonna fucking do some weird stuff right now. Wow, you know, Jagger said a thing to me that I still say to my, whenever my kids have to do a presentation at school or anything like that, or whenever I sometimes get a little in my head before a show. I remember the first time I saw Jagger was

we were, it was the Bridges to Babylon tour and they were playing Istanbul. And I just met Meg for lunch that day and he said, come to the shop at night and you sit right down in front and you'll see all of them. And so you were able to decipher that. Yeah. So I went to the show and they started, it was amazing. It was this big stadium in Istanbul and there was a, you know, you could see the blue mosque at the back and there was like a thunderstorm around and it was just unbelievable.

They started with the, you know, the sympathy for the devil and stuff. And they started and it was just amazing show and make through. I've never seen a performer like I've seen everybody. This guy was unbelievable. And we went for dinner after the show and I was like effusive about his performance. I couldn't help it. I didn't want to be that guy. But, and, and he said, he said, well, I said, you just really threw down.

And he was like, why I look at it, no one ever paid money to see someone who was shy. I thought, fuck, that's the truth. Yeah, 100%. It's like, put on a fucking show. My, one of my improv teachers early on used to say like, that effort isn't sexy. And it's not that you don't want to put effort into these things but like people aren't there to

watch you struggle to figure something out. Right they don't want to see you sweat. They're not exactly it's like they want to be put at ease. Yeah. I want to see somebody who is great or unique or other than me. Yeah. Like I don't want to be nervous. No. No. No. I want to be a little nervous. I want to be a little nervous so I fucking wake up and focus. Right. You want to be nervous to think this guy is so fucking crazy. I don't know what's going to happen next, but not nervous as in I hope he's not sad. Oh, is he okay? I can't even watch pretend.

Like if you see something in a movie or something where a standup is meant to be doing badly, I can't even watch it fictionally. I'm like, really? Can't fucking look. Can't fucking look. Can't fucking look. I also, I'm frightened it's contagious. Watching somebody fail. Watching somebody, like, oh Jesus, I hate that.

I just don't want to see it. I'll never have to do it with you. You won't have to see it with me. No, because you're awesome. I only succeed and also because I, it will live in the improv world primarily. Yeah. All right, well we're done.

Now that's it? That's it. So who won? It was definitely you. Thank God. Definitely you. I thought you spectacular job. Ten out of ten. A star on your workbook and can, you know, take the rest of the day off. I'll go drinking by myself. If that's what you're really doing, give me a call later on. Fair enough. All right, get out of here. What up y'all?

This your main man Memphis Bleak right here. Host of Rock Solid podcast. June is Black Music Month, so what better way to celebrate than listening to my exclusive conversation with my bro, Ja Rule. The one thing that can't stop you or take away from you is knowledge. So whatever I went through while I was down

in prison for two years, through that process, learn, learn from me. Check out this exclusive episode with JaRu on Rock Solid. Open your free I Heart Radio app, search Rock Solid and listen now. This Pride Month, we are not just celebrating, we're fighting back. I'm Georgian Johnson,

author of the most banned book in America. On my podcast, Fighting Words, I sit down with voices that spark resistance and inspire change. This year, we are showing up and showing out. You need people being like, no, you're not going to tell us what to do. This machine is coming down on us. And I don't want to just survive.

I want to thrive. Fighting Words is where courage meets conversation. Listen on the iHeart Radio app, Apple Podcasts, or wherever you get your podcasts. We are telling our scientists today we have disdain for your expertise. And then you have China as an exception saying actually we're going to invest a trillion dollars in new science. You heard that right.

While the US is slashing science budgets, China is doubling down. This means here in the United States, less innovation, fewer breakthroughs, and falling behind on the global stage. This week on Dope Labs, Chelsea Clinton breaks down what these cuts really mean. Listen to Dope Labs on the iHeartRadio app, Apple Podcasts, or wherever you get your podcasts. Hear insightful, entertaining discussions on today's important health and wellness topics

on the Health Discovered podcast from WebMD. Through in-depth conversations with experts, Health Discovered covers everything from tips for healthier living to the latest on therapy and mental health. My goal is to really destigmatize mental health treatment and looking at it from a whole health perspective. Physical health and mental health can be intertwined. Listen to WebMD Health Discovered on the iHeart Radio app or wherever you get your podcasts. This is an iHeart podcast.