Judge John Hodgman - A Jury of Your Tears

Episode Date: December 7, 2016

Donny brings the case against his roommate, Glenn. Glenn tends to cook quesadillas in their shared New York City apartment several times a week. Donny finds that the smell of peppers and onions is too powerful to handle and wants Glenn to vary his cooking routine. With Guest Bailiff Jean Grae!  Judge John Hodgman is coming to San Francisco Sketchfest in January and Very Very Fun Day in Chicago in February! For ticket information, visit maximumfun.org and check out the right  sidebar or visit johnhodgman.com/tour. To submit a case for either show, visit maximumfun.org/jjho! Thank you to Paul Ruh & Tom Brinton for suggesting this week's title! To suggest a title for a future episode, like Judge John Hodgman on Facebook. We regularly put a call for submissions.

Welcome to the Judge John Hodgman podcast. I'm guest bailiff Jean Gray. This week, a jury of your tears. Donnie brings a case against his roommate, Glenn. Glenn cooks quesadillas in their shared New York City apartment several times a week. Donnie finds that the smell of peppers and onions is too powerful to handle, and he wants Glenn to vary his cooking routine. Who's right? Who's wrong? Only one man can decide. Please rise as Judge John Hodgman enters the courtroom and presents the obscure cultural reference. An admiral without ships? A hand without fingers? In service of a king without a throne? Is this an internet judge who comes before us? Or the answer to a child's riddle? Guest bail if Jean Grey swear them in. Please rise and raise your right hands.

Do you swear to tell the truth, the whole truth, and nothing but the truth, so help you God or whatever? I do. Sure do. Certainly. Was it quesadillas with a Z at the end? It was. Yeah, right? It was the 90s, right?

Yes. Onions also had a Z at the end? It was. Yeah, right. It was the 90s, right? Yes. Okay. Onions also had a Z. Yeah. We were in that feud. Not peppers. We were in that feud. Yeah. Yeah. I understand.

Right. Donnie and Glenn, you may be seated. Here we are with guest bailiff Jean Gray, second week in a row. Yeah. Donnie and Glenn, I'm going to get to you and talk about how you're doing. I'm just going to say right now, Donnie spotted my Quebec Nordiques hat when he came in studio. And he's in the running now, Glenn. He's way ahead of you.

I may just have to recuse myself and let you guys fight it out while Jean and I go get a glass of wine. Because we're all here together. Second time only. Yeah. That I have been in the studio with litigants. Aside from live shows, like our great live justice show that we went around the country with,

or at least several New England states. That's the whole country. Yeah, that's right. That's it. But this is only the second time that we actually in studio as me, guest bailiff Jean Gray, Glenn, and Donnie.

We're here at Argo Studios in Manhattan, New York City, presided over by our great engineer, Gary Ruist. No, his name is Paul. But I think at one point today, he called all of us Gary at one point. Yeah. Who knows why? Thank you, Paul. It's great to be here because

it's an unusual situation and basically the whole world is upside down anyway. I'm going to do it once again, normal podcast style. I'm going to get the plugs up top. Up at the front. So that people stick around. People will hear them while they

stick around for the meat, which is these two guys and their fight about quesadillas. And veggies. And veggies as well. Jean Gray, my guest bailiff, has two big things. If you live in the New York area or are coming here that you should know about.

First of all, is the utterly essential church of the infinite you. That's right. Which is a Sunday afternoon basement meet and greet. Yeah. With your friends, with music. You're meet and greeting with yourself. With yourself. Each one of you comes to this thing. You are learning about yourself

and about your friends. It's an amazing experience. It's really a lot of fun. While you drink. While you drink and listen to some great music. Yeah. Cry maybe. Something that we all need to do. Yeah. So that happens every other Sunday at Union Hall in Brooklyn downstairs. The next one is on the 18th of December and then the 24th of December. At 8 p.m. That's a special blowout Christmas Eve service.

Yes. That's going to be big. It's going to be nuts. And it says here that you are working on getting a live stream up for that specific, that big blowout. Absolutely. So how would they find out about the live stream as they're approaching January 24th? I'd say, you know, follow me on Twitter and at Jean Greasy for right now. Or follow my Instagram at Jean Greasy and just stay up for the news.

All right. And I will let you know. And you also host a talk show, which is also amazing, called The Show Show. That's at evening times. And that returns to Union Hall this very night, December 7th, Wednesday, 2016. That is when this episode will be released. It's not too late for you to book your plane tickets to Brooklyn. Right now.

Brooklyn International Airport. Yeah. And then take the shuttle right over there to Union Hall because you'll be welcoming guests Baratunde Thurston and Aparna Nancherla and a special to-be-announced guest. Is it me? It could be. Okay. I can't do it.

Oh. No, it's not you. It's Gary. It's Gary. Gary Rust. Gary Rust. And as for me, I'm very happy to say that this terrible year is almost over. And February 11th of next year, I will be going to Chicago to join all of your MaxFun

friends at the very, very fun day in Chicago. It is going to be this compressed, awesome podcast festival on a single day, Saturday, February 11th at Thalia Hall. Thalia Hall. Thalia Hall. Thalia? Thalia? T-H-A-L-I-A. Pronounce it how you like.

Just get there. It's a beautiful space. Have you played that space? I haven't. You know what? Maybe I have. That's right. Who knows?

I don't remember anymore. This is still in the future. Right. But it's going to be a live Judge Sean Hodgman, along with live presentations from my arch nemesis podcast, The Flophouse. Oh. Stop podcasting yourself. They're my friends. Jordan Jesse Go, my friends.

Tights and Fights, my friends. The Flophouse, they're my enemy. We're going to have an old-fashioned Chicago podcast fight. Informations and tickets can be found at MaximumFun.org slash Very, Very Fun Day. Two verys. Glenn and Donnie, because that adds. Really, really drives it home. Yeah, it really, really drives it day. Two verys. Glenn and Donnie. Because that adds. Really really drives it home.

Yeah. Really really drives it home. Yeah. Exactly. Use the use the adjective. No. Really really drives it home. What is it?

Donnie and Glenn. Whichever one of you can tell me what part of speech very is. Depends on its usage. Okay. Very very. That's Donnie speaking. Very very fun day. If you can tell me what part.

I should know this. They're adverbs. They're adverbs. All right. This is the sound of a gavel. Donnie speaking Very very Fun day If you can tell me what part I should know this They're adverbs They're adverbs Alright this is the sound of a gavel Donnie wins Once again Donnie coming through In the clutch

Alright so here's the deal Donnie Not only spotted my Quebec Nordiques hat One Two Reminded me what an adverb was Three Is wearing a tie to my podcast. Oh, man.

That guy brings a tie to a podcast fight. He's loaded for bear. And four, when he wants to indicate assent, he remembers that this is a non-visual medium and actually speaks into the microphone instead of doing what you're doing to me, which is nodding along ruefully. I was advised early on not to speak over other members of the...

Well, you're correct not to speak over. So I'm nervous to chat too much, to be quite honest. And you're, well, just everything's... Look, this is an in-studio day. Great. It's all just, you know, we can see each other. So I can talk. Yeah, I can't be too mean to you guys because you're actually

right here. Unlike the regular podcast where I'm hearing voices in my head from faceless human mannequins around the world. And especially the Judge John Hodgman column in the New York Times magazine where I never even need to see or talk to them again. That's where I get really mean because the reality is a social media has taught us when you can't see someone face to them again. That's where I get really mean because the reality is as social media has taught us, uh, when you can't see someone face to face, you become a monstrous troll. Well, I look forward to your kindness and I,

and I hope that you shut up. Point is you're behind. Indeed. Didn't wear a tie. Don't know anything about extinct hockey teams and their logos. Or nothing about parts of speech. I would like to point out that he does actually, is that a hair tie on your wrist? Indeed it is. If you are prepared to be a little more put together at times,

in case anything is happening. He has a tie. Yeah, he is. Just to paint a beautiful word picture for those of you listening along at home or in your cars. Glenn has sort of longer hair and he has a hair tie around his wrist. Sometimes you pull that into a little bun. I do. Yes.

I'm with you. Now you're catching up because I was. How old are you? I'm 30 on Monday. Oh. This previous Monday I turned 30. Belated happy birthday. Thank you, Jeff. Thank you, Judge. I'm sorry. I didn't. Belated happy birthday. Thank you, Jeff. Thank you, Judge. I'm sorry I didn't.

Yeah, all right. Good catch. Glenn's catching up, Donnie. Good catch. Happy birthday, belated happy birthday. Thank you. It's getting a little. Yeah, I was going to say I was the same way.

I had some long hair when I was your age, and I put it up into a man bun before that was popular. It was just a bun. It looked terrible. Do you have any pictures? Not on me right now, but I'll show you. If you had one on you, I would actually be concerned. Yeah, here in my wallet. Just that specific picture.

Here in my wallet. Let's see. No, not that one of me. No, not that one of me. It's one of these. Yeah. Yeah. But of course, I was in my 20s.

I was not a grown man. Well, I've only recently left my 20s. Yeah, very. Yeah, well. Would you like me to get a haircut? Do you think that's the move now that I was in my 20s. I was not a grown man. Well, I've only recently left my 20s. Yeah, very, yeah, well. Would you like me to get a haircut? Do you think that's the move now that I'm in my 30s? Paul Ruiz, do you guys here at Argo Studios have an in-house hair cutter? I do have a shaving device.

Yeah, you know what? Let's bring it in just to have on the table to intimidate. Boy, you're really stacking the deck against me here, Judge. No, well, I mean, you let Donnie stack it up. You were too polite. You were told, don't talk too much.

And you're sitting there and you're trying to follow the rules. And I respect that as an only child. But you're letting Donnie run the table with his Nordiques junk and his adverb intelligence. So you have a chance now to make it up, though,

because I will issue an immediate summary judgment in your favor if you are able to guess the cultural reference that I made as I entered the courtroom. Do you remember it? It had something to do about ships and hands. An admiral without ships, a hand without fingers, in service of a king without a throne. Is this an internet judge who comes before us or the answer to a child's riddle? It is not internet judge in the original quote.

What am I quoting? I would, I'm tempted to say, and thus I will say that it is from. Wait, you can take the option since you are since you have been brought to court by Donnie, to make Donnie guess first, if you think that will be helpful to you. Oh, I would love it if Donnie would guess first. Oh, the coward's way out. Glenn, I was just getting to like you. All right, Donnie, you guess first.

Well, Judge, I've noticed a few snide references, maybe not snide, but offhanded references to recent events. And so what are you talking about? Well, you said that, you know, it's the end of a terrible week. Nothing has happened lately. Are you talking about the election? I'm talking about the death of Leonard Cohen, and that's where I'm going to go with my guess. Oh, OK.

I can't imagine you're talking about the election. Aren't you guys over that yet? That was a month ago. That was the whitest answer I've ever heard. Which one? Leonard Cohen. Leonard ago. That was the whitest answer I've ever heard, also. Which one? Leonard Cohen. Your guess is Leonard Cohen? Alright, I'm going to lock that in. Leonard Cohen.

It's in the guess book. Alright, Glenn. Now, what's your guess? I feel like saying it's from Grimm's Fairy Tales. You feel like... So I will, and I have. A particular fairy tale? Like... The...

Is the scorpion in the... Hansel and Gretel. The scorpion in the... The scorpion in the teacup. Okay. The scorpion in the turtles. One of my favorites. One of my favorites.

The three snake brothers. And all of the above. That was a weird fairy tale, by the way, all of the above. Yeah. The child who cut off his finger and turned it into a key. That's one. That's a good one. I really like that one.

There's a lot of dismemberment in Grimm's fairy tales. And, you know, what was my quote there? A hand without fingers. So you were thinking a hand without fingers. So what are some other fairy tales that you remember? Snow White. There's the porcupine that shot himself in the face in front of the school. That was a good one.

The child that was baked into a pie and then ate himself somehow. Yeah, that was a good one. What about Jack Horner? Little Jack Horner. And there was a dance with dragons. And there was also a feast for crows. What was the one you guessed again? Was it a feast for crows, or was it a dance with dragons?

Was that the one? I think that's the one you said, right? Great, a dance with dragons. Grimm's most famous of fairy tales, a dance with dragons. Yes. Okay, well, guess what? Very close, Glenn. Very close. All guesses are wrong. Wait, Okay. Well, guess what? Very close, Glenn. Very close.

All guesses are wrong. Wait, what happened to my guess? Oh, sorry. Oh, I was going to go with the translation of the lyrics to La Bamba.

Right, okay. Which do include ships. You don't know Soy Marinero. Thank you. Soy Capitan. Capitan. I'm marinero. Thank you. Soy capitan. Capitan.

I'm not a sailor. I'm a captain. Yeah, and then, you know, quesadillas. Oh, right. Because that is a subject. So clearly, Grimm's fairy tale, La Bamba. And not just quesadillas, because what's happening here, Donnie, has brought his roommate, Glenn, his newly 30-year-old roommate, Glenn, to court because Glenn eats

too many quesadillas in their shared apartment. And he also cooks up a bunch of stinky onions. And so that quote was from A Dance with Dragons by George R.R. Martin, not The Brothers Grimm. That's where you got it wrong. So close. So close. So close. And specifically, it was about a specific character and clearly you guys

don't know this character major character in the book he was the hand of the king to stanis baratheon donnie got it no got it no i don't i don't know okay davos sir davos seaworth who and you know why he didn't have fingers? No idea. Too many quesadillas? No. He didn't have fingers because his king, Stannis, cut them off as punishment to him for being a smuggler. But he elevated him from common smuggler to knight of the realm, in thanks because Davos Seaworth smuggled food into that castle.

I can't remember, Storm's Landing or something. When it was under siege during the rebellion, specifically smuggling in onions. And so he served Stannis and he rewarded him with knighthood but he still punished him for being a smuggler even though it saved the life of that castle storm town stormville stormville storm lightning lightning striker what's the name of that castle nerds are screaming at their at their podcast right now computers now boy i'll tell you. And so he took as his, because of his humble origin and his life story, he took as his banner the image of an onion. He's called the Onion Knight.

And that's why I thought you guys were both going to get that one. But apparently young people in their late 20s aren't just sitting around reading Wikipedia pages about fantasy novels anymore. You guys have lives, right? Donnie, how old are you? Well, I'm 29, but I will be 30 next Sunday. Oh, boy, you guys are almost birthday pals.

And you live together. You share an apartment. Glenn, you are in graduate school. That is correct. For film. Correct. All right. And Donnie, what's going on in your life? I'm in residency, medical residency. Medical, see? Glenn, you are in graduate school. That is correct. For film. Correct.

All right. And Donnie, what's going on in your life? I'm in residency, medical residency. Medical, see, real respectable guy. Tell me about it. How did you guys meet? We were close friends from college, from undergraduate. Where did you go to undergraduate college?

Princeton University. Princeton. Oh boy. Can I also just add that we were also roommates in college. So you guys have been living together for a long time. Well, no, there were several years where we were not living together, but... About six years. And now we have been together for a year and a quarter year and a third.

Fate brought us back together again. I don't know quite what to say. That was the most adorable. It really was. Like young new couple thing to say. Like, well, there were some years where we weren't living together, but now we've really been together for a year now. And that's a long time. And 45-year-old does over here like, I don't care.

I don't care. It's not a long time. It is true that I have. It's a brief moment in your life. You guys are going to drift apart. We're all going to die. That's what's going through my head. Oh, boy.

Well, I have at times said that Donnie is my platonic life partner. Well, then we better get this settled because you are stinking up the joint. Well. What are you going to film school for? I mean, where are you going to film school? Columbia University. Columbia University. And do you live uptown, downtown, all around town?

Just off 144th Street. I used to live on 105th and Broadway and then 104th and Columbus. Not even near where. You're in another dimension up there. It's very far. Very, very far. And you share. Donnie, what's the apartment like?

Well, we have a third roommate who, well, last year it was a colleague of mine and now my little brother moved in. So there are three of us. I mean, I don't know. It's nice. It's relatively newly refurbished, I guess. Where's your little brother? Why isn't your little brother here? Doesn't he have a stake in this?

Did you beat him up and tell him he had to stay home? Well, the quesadilla fight goes way back before he moved in. Donnie, can I come to the podcast? No, Ned. Maybe it's Gary. Clean my room. It's close. It's Greg.

It's not Gary, though. No, Greg. No kids allowed. How old is your brother? He is, oh gosh, 26. That's right. Don't make it your business to know. 25.

He's 25. That's fine. And is he also, are you going to, you're in medical school? No. I finished medical school. Right. You're a doctor. Yes.

And you're in residency where? Also at Columbia. At Columbia. This is a very convenient little world you guys have constructed around yourselves. My little brother is also a grad student at Columbia. What's he a grad student in? Environmental sciences. Game of Thrones.

Game of Thronesology. Can he call in and tell me the name of that castle? Sadly, no. I can't believe it. He was playing a Game of Thrones video game

the other day, so perhaps. He could. He would have gotten it. Davos Seaworth, a great character. Sir Davos Seaworth. Hang on.

I have to remember the name of this castle. Don't drive me crazy. I'm not going to be able to give you justice. It's really important. I'm glad going to be able to give you justice. It's really important. I'm glad that you made it. Storm's End.

Storm's End. The listeners rejoice. No, Dragonstone. Sorry, whoops. Oh, my. Dragonstone. Right? Or is that the one?

No. Anyway. Oh, boy. Dragonstone is the ancestral castle of the Targaryens. So I think it was Storm's End that was under siege.

And Stannis... Oh yeah, here it is. Storm's End siege. It's the first thing that comes up. I got it right. Okay. Our search engine are so different. My search history. That's never happened. My preferred search engine are so different, my search history. That's never happened. My preferred search engine has learned a lot from me already.

Yeah, it's adjusted. So, all right, let's get into it finally. Donnie, what is your beef or fried onions, as it were, with Glenn? What is your beef or fried onions, as it were, with Glenn? Well, basically, Glenn, you know, he spends a lot more time at home than I do. And he cooks at home, which I usually don't have time to do. Right. So I would say he makes good use of the kitchen, which I admire.

However, as a bachelor to the max, Glenn, um, also on a bit of a budget, he only has two dishes, two and only two that he ever, ever cooks pasta in which he boils one of several different shapes of pasta and pours one of several different canned sauces over the boiled pasta, which smells a little bit but doesn't really smell like that. There's also grated Romano cheese, which I will mention later. Sorry to interrupt. And then the other— Really kicking it up a notch. The other dish that Glenn has in his back pocket is quesadillas.

Sometimes literally. Sometimes in his his back pocket is quesadillas. Sometimes in his actual back pocket. I reached over to touch Gene's hand and try to reach the same joke and then I knocked my microphone out of the way. These are some of the perils of being in studio. It's a powerful joke.

Yeah, it was good. Quesadilla. It's a quesadilla. So what's the problem with a quesadilla? It's a grilled cheese sandwich. It's delicious. Yeah, it was good. Quesadilla. It's a quesadilla. So what's the problem with a quesadilla? It's a grilled cheese sandwich. It's delicious. Well, there's a couple things. First of all, as we've already discussed, the fact that the onions and the peppers when they're cooking

create a, you know, I would say a pungent smoke that wafts down the hallway and lodges itself in my room. And, you know, we've tried various ways of trying to avert that. We've opened windows. We've shut my bedroom door. But there's something about the drafts in our apartment.

Glenn is trying so hard not to talk over you right now. You're doing a good job. Let's finish. Let's finish hearing Dr. Picky's complaint. The real problem, well, there's two real problems. One is that I come home from work, you know, I'm tired, sweaty, whatever. I want to just fall into bed, go to sleep, and it turns out I'm trying to sleep in the, you know, olfactory equivalent of a Qdoba. I'll allow that brand name mention because it is artfully cruel to your friend.

Well, that's one thing. And then, you know, that wouldn't be such a big deal if it weren't every day, because honestly, like I said, there's, you know, two meals that Glenn cooks for per day and only two meals he knows how to cook. So it's pasta at lunch and quesadillas at dinner or vice versa every day. Glenn, thank you. Thank you, Donnie, for your testimony. Glenn, I have some questions for you. Okay. Are you making quesadillas or fajitas? Quesadillas. I can describe in great detail what comprises the quesadillas. He does the peppers and the onions and either puts them on the top or on the inside.

Inside. So it's just sort of more things going on than just cheese. We got beans. We got cheese. We got jalapenos. We got peppers and onions folded inside a, you know, a... Sesame seed bun. Shut up, Donnie.

It's my turn to talk. And I make three of them, and then I put some hot sauce on top. And for the few times I've cooked them for other people, I get many compliments. They are... Let me say, it sounds spectacular. They are delicious. You know, when Donnie first made his complaint via affidavit to this court by emailing to MaximumFun.org slash JJHO, which you all should do if you have fights with your roommates. I was like, oh boy, this guy is a culinary depressive. Because he's just

boiling up some pasta. And then he's just making some grilled cheese sandwiches, and that's all he eats. And I'll say something. It's a high-carb lifestyle that you're leading, and I'm a little annoyed that you're not a big fatso diabetic at this point. Because I can't live the way you live. But it's not as bad as I thought. Donnie, I got to tell you, this is a pretty high-level quesadilla. This is a pretty... It's unclear.

I mean, if you were to witness it, maybe you wouldn't be quite as impressed. Not to put my friend down here, but... How else would you qualify that? How else would you describe insulting your friend's quesadilla? There's never any protein. There's never any variation. You put beans in it, right? There's beans.

What kind of beans are you using? Black beans. Goya canned black beans. I will allow that brand name as well because that's the first name in beans that also share the name of an artist. Well, one of the themes, I guess, of my complaint is the monotony of it all.

And the quesadillas themselves, although they are monotonous in their daily preparation, and Glenn is also monotonous in how he prepares them. So they're prepared identically every single time. They're the exact same quesadilla. You mean with the same basic ingredients? Or do you mean the procedure is precisely the same in an OCD? That's correct. I wouldn't take it that far.

I wouldn't go to OCD. But yes, he does have a very specific ritual and very specific supply of ingredients. How begins the ritual, Donnie? Well, he puts on a podcast and then he uh shuts me out for an hour or so well he chops up I think we just reached the crush oh my that was telling I work hard all day I am in my residency I don't get any sleep I'm the only one of us who's ever going to make any money and I come home from a long hard day and this place stinks of onions and you can't even give me an hour of your time. Well, I see what you're getting at.

I don't think that's quite it. Of course you do. Because, you know, a lot of the time the quesadilla cooking occurs when I'm not even home. So that's not usually my complaint. My complaint is the smell. Although- You have two complaints.

One, it smells bad. Yes. So he's an inconsiderate roomie too. You're worried about his dietary and maybe mental health that this is all he ever does. Well, yeah. I mean, uh, you already pointed out the, you know, the dearth of any other nutrients besides carbohydrates and, uh, listen to Dr. Adverb over here with dearth that, that word I can never remember means that noun i can never remember means a lot of or not enough of but it's not enough of right dearth but what i really wanted

to say is that uh our cabinets are comically uh you know monotonous it's like a target ad you know uh or doug funny's's wardrobe closet. Talk about obscure cultural references here, Dr. Don. Who's Doug Funny? You know, like from the Nickelodeon show, he wears the same green sweater and khaki pants every single day. Well, that could have been a reference to any cartoon character, I kind of feel that. It was very specific that it was Doug Funny.

Excellent point, excellent point. Have you ever heard of Doug Funny? I have. But, you know, the Simpsons when they change all their clothes all the time every episode. Every time they have lots of new looks. Yeah. Lots of new looks. The fall look is what I like most this year.

Lots of layers. Yeah. Real nice. A lot of unstructured jackets. Marge looks amazing. Yeah, exactly. Right. And those bomber jackets are so in right now.

So, but see, here's the thing, Donnie. You don't understand that when you conjure up a picture of a cabinet that has all of the ingredients you like in repetitive patterns, perfectly arranged, that makes me very excited. I'm very happy about that. Go ahead. There are many things Donnie has said thus far that I would like to respond to, but I've been giving him ample room for his fabrications and exaggerations. The problem in your relationship is that you're letting Dr. Donnie totally run over you and your whole life, and you never stand up for yourself. You let him talk and talk and talk and talk, and then you get back passive-aggressively by burning some onions.

We have excellent communication in our relationship. I do not think that is part of the issue. Fine. Refute then. All right. relationship. I do not think that is part of the issue. Fine, refute then. All right. Well, I would like to say that it is an exaggeration to say that I cook however many number he had said. I'd say I cook quesadillas three to four times a week. And a significant appeal of the quesadillas is that they uh the primary ingredients they make me whole they primary the primary ingredients are non-perishable uh and because i have an erratic schedule uh i can count on coming home and having something to cook if i had unlike a physician in his residency

well an interesting you have an erratic schedule yes well you never you never know you never know when you might have to run downtown to catch that screening of that... What's your favorite filmmaker, Glenn? Oh, brother. Catch that screening of Oh, Brother, Where Art Thou? Correct, exactly. The Coen brothers, wonderful filmmakers. The, you know, I'll have evening classes, I'll have to go on a shoot, I'll have a meeting,

whatever the case may be. And in some weeks, I only get to cook quesadillas once a week. But I can count on it in the following week to only get to cook quesadillas once a week. But I can count on it in the following week to still have the ingredients and still be able to make it. If I didn't have those ingredients, if they'd spoiled, then the financial incentive to cook at all is spoiled. And I should have just been eating out. So let me understand this, Glenn. Yes.

In your life, either you're eating out in the world on a shoot or grabbing a snack at the Hungarian pastry shop or whatever that is up there. It's always too crowded. Not a big fan. Is that still there? It is. Indeed it is. See, I'm not. I still got it.

I know places. You're home eating either pasta with jar sauce or a quesadilla. Correct. Now, what makes you decide? Because this is what I was thinking. Like pasta with jar sauce sounds like the most sad and disgusting thing a graduate student could eat. But in the quesadilla, you're really getting into a thing there. You've got layers. It's like five-layer dip quesadilla, you're really getting into a thing there. You've got layers. It's like five-layer dip quesadilla.

And if I may say this, not all of those items are non-perishable items. So there are actually things. There's the tortillas. There's the peppers and the onions. The beans are going to be in the can. I mean, if you're going to use that hot sauce or salsa or whatever you're doing, then that's okay. But that goes off at a certain point. So there are things that you have to replace. So this is a meal that say you could replace with

something else that would take the exact same time to make with the same amount of non-perishable items. So is there something about specific to the quesadillas? Is it just that you've gotten really just it's gotten to a comfort level or are you just stuck? Is it just automatic like this is the fuel I need? Do not care what goes in mouth. There is a lot of truth to that part of it. I will say about the quote unquote non-perishable things. It is that the shelf life is long enough that I know how much to buy each visit. Every two weeks I go to the supermarket,

I buy enough to make six rounds. Yeah, it's in his routine now. But separately, it is true that I take no pleasure in cooking and I don't like to have to think about it. There's a lot of other things to think about in life. This is a sloppy. What the hell are you talking about? There are other things to think about than food and making it and eating it?

There's nothing. You know how I hate to bring this up or mention this, but it is true that those Silicon Valley types often wear only the same thing. They'll eat Soylent or the Steve Jobs with his darn. Third name brand mentioned. Now that's a penalty. That's a penalty. What was the breakdown? How many did Donnie do and how many did I do?

It doesn't matter. Are we both... I'm just looking at a 30-year-old with long hair who's managed to mention Soylent on my podcast, and now I feel like I'm being taken for a ride. You're not a film student at all. I'm on commission, you're right. Well, but that same idea, the idea is there. Like, hey, let's not think about what we're wearing.

Let's not think about what we're eating. We've got other stuff. Is that something you admire? Is that where you want to get? No, I don't admire it, but I do. This is something that exists in our culture, and other people have this tendency, which is I cannot be bothered to

think too hard about this thing that I otherwise do not find pleasure in. You can be bothered. You don't want to be bothered. Can we say that? Correct. Because I think you can be bothered. Yes, I can be bothered. You're not saying, Donnie, what kind of medicine are you practicing?

I'm in training still. I'm in internal medicine. Okay. I've never understood what that means. It's inside. Yeah. What does it mean? What does internal medicine. Okay. I've never understood what that means. It's inside. Yeah. What does it mean? What does internal medicine mean?

Drugs? Yeah, basically. Right. You got it. Okay. But as opposed to say... Surgery. Surgery is you cut somebody open and you manipulate the thing.

Internal medicine is the therapy is drugs, right? Yeah, I mean there's some exceptions like stents and things like that. Oh, I always make an exception for a stent. It's actually my motto. Always make exception for a stent. Exactly. A stent is something you use to

open a passageway, right? Is that right? Like an artery or vein. Yes, sir. Ugh, gross. So the point is, you're saving lives. Not often, but sometimes. How many lives have you saved compared to Glenn

with his film studies? Actually, Glenn does have a story about saving a life in the Mekong River. Boom, let's hear it. So he swam out and saved a man. I was staying. I lived in Thailand for two and a half years,

and at the time we'd gone to a place called 4,000 Islands in southern Laos, and it is a place where many people... Is that an indoor water park? No. It's actually where they send the political prisoners in Laos, but also the white tourists. Yeah, but also a water park. It's great fun.

It's a place where some people use hallucinogenics. We were not doing that. However, a young man jumped into the river, and he later reported after I stripped down and jumped in and pulled him out myself. He was vomiting up water and things. He said, oh, sorry. I forgot I couldn't swim. And then the next morning, well, it's powerful drugs. The next morning, we took the boat ride out.

It did have this feeling. He was on my boat and like we didn't know what to say to each other. Had a sort of a morning after feel to it. A regretful morning after. Uh-huh. Might I ask? And when he jumped in the water, it's weird because you were in the middle of preparing a Sunday pot roast. And you almost didn't make it.

You were like, you're like, I don't hear anybody. I'm splashing around calling for help because I'm, I'm cutting these parsnips right now. That's right. And then, but then you're like,

Oh, I got to save that guy. And you saved him. And you're like, as God or whatever is my witness, I will never care about cooking food again. The point I was trying to make, well, well done saving lives. But Donnie certainly has done more.

Truly say he can't be bothered to care about his food. It's Dr. Donnie. Doctor. That's his full name. Dr. Doctor. What do you like to eat? Do you ever cook at home? Rarely. You make your brother make sandwiches? No, I mean, I'm,'m you know i work long hours and fortunately they provide food for us so i rarely eat at home um are you like glenn you kind of don't care about the fuel you put into your mouth hole uh i'm somewhere in between that and someone who cares more i guess i don't. What's your favorite food?

My favorite food? I don't really have one. I don't know. Anything that comes to mind. Spaghetti bolognese. And not with bolognese from a jar. No, no, no. I think it's worth mentioning that I'd like to ask Donnie, when you cook, does it

create a smell in the house? When your brother cooks, which is morenie, when you cook, does it create a smell in the house? When your brother cooks, which is more often than when Donnie does, does it create a smell? Yeah. Thank you. Let the record show that the plaintiff has admitted that it stinks when people cook in tiny New York apartments. Gene, please enter into the record that cooking creates aroma. Aromas.

Yes. Yes. Stop the press. I creates aroma. Aroma. Yes. Yes. Stop the press. I'm going to do that right now. What does Donnie cook that you don't like the smell of? I have no complaints. It is extraordinarily rare that Donnie cooks at all. I mean, it's been months since he's prepared anything.

So you have no complaints? No complaints about how he operates in the kitchen. What about Donnie's brother, Little Donnie? Little Donnie, Donnie Jr. Gary. He fried some chicken the other day, and it was quite aromatic. Smelled like fat and things. But you know what? I thought, well, great.

Somebody's using the kitchen. I don't know how you just managed to make fried chicken sound gross. It was really weird. Smelled like fat. Smelled like aromatic fat. I would like to ask a question if I could. Yeah, please. I don't know what I'm doing here.

I'm thinking that the issue has less to do with food and kind of specifically tied to the sautéing of onions. When you're preparing this quesadilla, so I'm assuming that your step is to sauté the peppers and onions together first and then set them aside. Correct. Okay. Have you ever considered the option, because you're going to have these quesadillas many

times a week, um, that to, and, and because also I know you enjoy that routine. Oh, I see where this is going. To maybe just take the pepper and onion part out, do that once a week and then have that in the fridge ready to go. So all you have to make would be the quesadillas. I have never considered it, but it is a beautiful compromise. Wow.

If only this court dealt in compromise. It seems like that seems to be the real issue. It's not actually the quesadillas themselves. That just broke my brain. And I almost missed the whole thing i deal in food because while you were while you were talking i was i couldn't help but i the siege of storms

have you been on there this whole time no no i'm definitely listening siege of storm one took place near the end of robert's rebellion lord mace tyrell and most of his forces from the Reach besieged Storm's End, which was held by Stannis Baratheon. I know my stuff. You were right. It took me a little while to get there. You're right. I still got it. Hungarian pastry shop and Stannis Baratheon and Storm's End.

Three. Three for three. Three eventually for three. Three for three. Kind of three. Jean Grey does know a lot about food. Yes. for kind of three gene gray does know a lot about food yes and i'm going to tell you right now

whatever my ruling i'm going to pre-order you to expand your repertoire just for your own life life judge if i may um oh that was that was actually my request Oh I wasn't suing Glenn for never to cook a quesadilla again in his life Oh, so I should have asked you What's more important? And I'll ask you now What's more important to you? End of onion stink? Or Glenn eats other things?

Well, thanks to Gene, we may be able to achieve all of those ends But Yeah, but he might You know, a lot of foods have fried onion in them Well, my thought was just, you know It's called the trinity It is Fried onion, garlic, and celery

Or peppers Wait, that's genuinely called the trinity? It's on it Whoa Dr. Words wins again I think I've heard everything I need to in order to make my decision I can take the heat, so I'm going back I need to in order to make my decision. I can take the heat, so I'm going back in the kitchen, which is also my

chambers. I'll be back in a moment to tell you what I've decided. Please rise as Judge John Hodgman exits the courtroom. So Donnie, Glenn, how are you feeling about this so far? I feel like we might have gotten to a point where something can change. How are you feeling? All thanks to you, Jean.

Sorry. I don't know if you can? Thanks to you, Jean. Sorry. I don't know if you can hear me out there, but I was just clearing my throat to remind you that I'm also here. He is, man, thin walls. How are you feeling? I am now, I'm more nervous

at this moment than I had been upon arrival that the judge has pre-ruled that I should expand my repertoire and there is more judgment of coming has me nervous because I cannot anticipate what other bad news might be in store for me. Well, welcome to your 30s. And that's kind of what adulting is like, Glenn. We'll be back in just a second with the judge's decision on Judge John Hodgman. MaximumFun.org slash join. And you can join them by going to MaximumFun.org slash join. The Judge John Hodgman podcast is also brought to you this week by the folks over there at Babbel. Did you know that learning, the experience of learning causes a sound to happen?

Let's hear the sound. Yep. That's the sound of you learning a new language with Babbel. We're talking about quick 10-minute lessons crafted by over 200 language experts that can help you start speaking a new language in as little as one, two, three weeks. Let's hear that sound. Babbel's tips and tools are approachable, accessible, rooted in real-life situations, and delivered with conversation-based teaching. So you're ready to practice what you've learned in the real world, and you get to hear this sound.

It's not just like a game that pretends to teach you a language. It's also not a rigid, weird, hyper-academic chore. It is an actually productive app that actually teaches you while you are actually having a nice time. And you get to hear this sound. Here's a special limited time deal for our listeners right now. Get up to 60% off your Babbel subscription, but only for our listeners at babbel.com slash Hodgman. Get up to 60% off at babbel.com slash Hodgman spelled B-A-B-B-E-L dot com slash Hodgman. Rules and restrictions apply.

The Judge John Hodgman podcast is also brought to you this week by our pals over at Made In. Jesse, you've heard of Tom Colicchio, the famous chef, right? Yeah, from the restaurant Kraft. And did you know that most of the dishes at that very same restaurant are made with made-in pots and pans? Really? What's an example? The braised short ribs,

they're made in, made in. The Rohan duck, made in, made in. Riders of Rohan, duck. What about the Heritage Pork Shop? You got it. Made in, made in. Made in has been supplying top chefs and restaurants with high-end cookware for years. They make the stuff that chefs need.

Their carbon steel cookware is the best of cast iron, the best of stainless clad. It gets super hot. It's rugged enough for grills or an open flame. One of the most useful pans you can own. And like we said, good enough for real professional chefs, the best professional chefs. Oh, so I have to go all the way down to the restaurant district in restaurant town? Just buy it online. This is professional grade cookware that is available online directly to you, the consumer, at a very reasonable price.

Yeah. If you want to take your cooking to the next level, remember what so many great dishes on menus all around the world have in common. They're made in Made In. Save up to 25% this Memorial Day from the 18th until the 27th. Visit MadeInCookware.com. That's M-A-D-E-I-N Cookware dot com. That's M-A-D-E-I-N cookware dot com. Please rise

as Judge John Hodgman re-enters the courtroom. Glenn, you're a film student. You're going to make movies? That is the idea. You're going to direct them and write them and stuff? Correct. Have you ever seen the movie Tampopo? No.

Well, guess what? Tampopo is a movie and obviously a blind spot in your education. You're not allowed to make movies unless you've seen all the movies, right? You have to see them all. I've heard this. I've heard this. Thank you for identifying. Tampopo is a movie.

It's not talked about very much anymore. Did you ever see that movie, Tempopo? No. It was a kind of a comedy from Japan that came out, I guess, probably in the very late 80s or very early 90s when I was a youth. Ripping tickets and selling concessions at the Coolidge Corner, then called Movie House, now called Theater, in Coolidge Corner, Brookline, Massachusetts. Great movie theater.

That was my film school. And I got paid for it in popcorn. He won't talk over me. Bravo, Judge. Glenn is too polite. Glenn is too polite. Glenn is too polite. Glenn is too polite.

And Tampoco was a funny movie that followed three or four different characters or sets of characters. And basically did sketches around food culture in Japan. And as you know, I've not traveled there, but food culture, it's a very big part of the psychological component of living in Japan. It is not just, you know, nutrient paste that you put in your mouth while you're writing code. It is a nexus of tradition, ritual, meditation, aesthetic appreciation, and other big words that I'm sure Dr. Donnie's got at his fingertips. What's that part of the body called? Fingertips? Come on, you got no anatomy.

I don't know. Is there a fancy word for fingertips? I mean, I guess they would call that the finger pad. Finger pad? Ah. Digital terminus? Yeah, sure. Finger pad?

Finger pad. Ah. Digital terminus. Yeah, sure. And in particular, it's a movie about an older guy in search for the perfect bowl of ramen. And it really, I think, I nostalgia, just exists in a special place in my memory, like a memory of a Madeline. That's a big literary reference I just dropped. Donnie's got it.

Do you think Donnie got that one? Proust. Oh, yeah. We're there. Okay. Okay, good. But I think it'll be worth looking at because what troubles me about you is that you seem like a nice person you should care about the food that you make you clearly do because that quesadilla right that i

thought that you were just making a grilled cheese sandwich and then frying some onions on the side just to annoy your roommate but you've got you got you're opening a can of beans you're prepping peppers which are the worst to prep you're prepping peppers, which are the worst to prep. You're prepping onions, which can be the worst to prep. What else you got in there? What other layers? We got, I mean, cheddar cheese, beans, jalapenos. Jalapenos?

You're prepping those? From a jar? They come out the jar. Pickled, they're very delicious. No, I'm with you on that. Okay. Pickled house, they're very delicious. No, I'm with you on that. You're not as disinterested as you seem. And also, you're an artist.

You don't want to be one of those Silicon Valley paste-eating code writers. That's not who you want to be in life. Do you have other clothes? Than the ones I'm wearing right now? Yes, I do. You know. You've got to have different looks. You know. You know. You can't. You got to have different looks.

He's no Doug Funny. Doug Funny. You're an artist. And cooking is artistry. And that's why they make movies about it. I urge you to. This is not an order. Because people like what they like.

And you may not have the receptor for caring about the food that you make and eat. But there's a reason there's so many great movies about food. Babette's Feast. That was also the Coolidge. This is your culture. You can't just blow this off and eat pasta sauce out of a jar. You're not a medical student. You have to be part of your culture.

Your culture is someone who cares about the food. Now, what I do believe has happened is that you are a busy dude. You have a lot going on. You probably have some weird hours. You're not, you have saved one life, but for the most part, you know, you're running around on doing stuff. And I get that you're busy. And I think you're absolutely right that you have found this recipe for what sounds like some pretty good quesadillas. And you've found a way to slot it into your life so you don't need to think about it that much anymore. But there are lots of other things you can learn to make that you can equally slot into your life. And I think a pot roast is one of them. Are you a vegetarian? No, I'm not. Yeah. I mean, any kind of braise, as long as you're around to tend it, you braise a big hunk of meat with some

aromatics in some stock, which by the way, just buy it from the store. A lot of this vocabulary is over my head, but Dr. Don can help me out. Yeah, that's right. He's going to start cooking you elaborate meals like Hannibal. I will drop a name brand here. I will drop a name brand here. Kitchen Basics, Stocks, Vegetable, Beef, Chicken, Seafood. Those are the ones you want to get.

Kitchen Basics. Do you ever use Bach? They don't make, you know, they can, but do you know what, pre-made stock? Do you ever use that? No, I, well, no, I make my own stock. You make your own stock? Yeah. It's intense. Ooh.

Yeah. You make your own stock? Yeah. It's intense. Ooh. Yeah. So, yeah, I've been, you know, very concerned for Glenn, this entire conversation. Explain to Glenn what stock is.

Well, basically, you want the essence and juices, if that's a good way of explaining it. Better than aromatic fat. Yes. And it's not the aromatic fat. And basically to give a base to any meal that you're making and it really infuses it with amazing flavor and you don't have to worry too much about doing too many other things. And if you're just going to do, say, something like chicken stock, then you can go super easy and do some salt and pepper

and maybe a little bit of wine, maybe a little bit of olive oil. And that's, you know, five things. And then throw a hunk of meat in there and you can walk away. I think the idea is that, you know, there are so many things that you can go basic and you can go simple. And maybe it's going to be another meal that you get into for, you know, another year or so. But at least make that pick two and just try to broaden your horizons. It won't take any more time.

You won't have to freak out about what you're doing. But, yeah, I'm concerned about you. And you are an artist. I think Judge is correct. Do you ever anticipate having a partner in your life, a romantic partner in your life, who is not Dr. Donnie, your old friend? I do. Do you have such a partner in your life?

Certainly no. We are bachelors to the max, I believe, as Donnie said earlier. Don't ever say that again. Okay. You're a filmmaker. You can't be saying that. You can't. You gotta be... I mean, it's okay for Dr. Donnie to sit here with his tie on and look like a weird nerd and go batch to the max, but you gotta... Here's the thing. You have an obligation professionally to be cool. Okay.

And cool people care about food. And also, if you ever want to have someone else in your life, you're going to might want to impress that person by making a food for them. And you don't want to be dumping a jar of ragu over some elbows. I don't care how much cheese you sprinkle over that. That person, whoever it is, is going to be like, check, please. So I think we're each going to pick one thing for you to learn how to make.

And I would say, I was going to say pot roast. That's super easy. So I'm going to say pot roast. What are you going to say? Um, I'm going to, for his comfort level, I'm just going to up the level on the quesadilla. For his comfort level, I'm just going to up the level on the quesadilla. And I'm going to say that every week try to find a new protein to sort of jazz it up with. If you're just going to get like some just a grilled, just a chicken cutlet, you just get yourself some adobo and some cumin. And you're just going to saute that up and cut it up and just start there. Just start adding a couple of things to it.

You understand you're dramatically, Jean, you're dramatically intensifying the aroma profile. Donnie's, I feel like Donnie will have to deal with the aroma, but also know that Glenn's going to be eating a little bit better. And maybe that makes it okay. And you know what? I think you're quite right, Jean. And I'm going to take back pot roast. I was thinking pot roast because it's pretty bland and it's not going to offend Donnie's sensitive nostrils. Yeah.

But your suggestion of protein is correct. So I'm going to make an adjustment to pot roast. Look up these two words, or maybe Donnie will translate them for you. Ropa vieja. Hmm. Ropa vieja. Old clothes. That's the translation.

Okay. But it's essentially long braised. Latino pot roast is what it is. Braised was the word that made me mention before that I don't actually know what it is. Low temperature. You cook a piece of meat, semi-submerged in a liquid of your choice, at a low temperature for a long time, such that you break down the collagen, which is the connective tissue. You usually do this with cheap cuts of meat, like a pork shoulder.

If you were going to make carnitas or short ribs or pot roast. And it has a lot of connective tissue. That's collagen. You braise it over a long period of time. That becomes gelatin. And it's just the most, if you're a carnivore, it's the most delicious thing in the world. So I would say the thing about ropa de yeja is you do that and it takes an afternoon. And then that stuff will keep for a long time.

You can be adding that into different things, having it as a snack. That'll be good. And I think that Jean's suggestion that you do some of your mirepoix ahead of time. Because you're essentially, in the case of your quesadilla, you're using it as a garnish. Right. You're frying up those onions. They're going to get up again when you right make the quesadilla and that will that that might help with your friend donnie and so um that that i think is all fair ruling wouldn't you say donnie i think that's quite fair although i you know if i was this is the sound of a gavel This is Santa Begaddle.

Judge John Hodgman rules. Donnie, save it for the, what do we call it? The after show. The after show. Donnie, save it for the after show. Talking Judge John Hodgman. Please rise as Judge John Hodgman exits the courtroom. Donnie, how are you feeling?

I'm feeling good. Yeah. I think this opens the floodgates to Glenn learning maybe, I don't even know, like five or six total meals. I don't know. I'm so excited for you, Glenn. How are you feeling? I know this has been a long time coming that I should get my act together.

You're 30 now. Yes. And I think there's something appropriate and exciting about... Poetic, even, the timing. Yes, indeed. So, yeah, I'm going to give it a go. Okay. I'm really proud of both of you, and I love you very much.

Thank you, Jane. Thank you for joining us on the Judge John Hodgman Podcast. Hello, teachers and faculty. This is Janet Varney. I'm here to remind you that listening to my podcast, The JV Club with Janet Varney, is part of the curriculum for the school year. Learning about the teenage years of such guests as Alison Brie, Vicki Peterson, John Hodgman, and so many more is a valuable and enriching experience. One you have no choice but to embrace, because yes,

listening is mandatory. The JV Club with Janet Varney is available every Thursday on Maximum Fun or wherever you get your podcasts. Thank you. And remember, no running in the halls! Thank you. And remember, you're on the go, call S-T-O-P-P-P-A-D-I. It'll never fit. No, it will.

Let me try. If you need a laugh and you're on the go, try S-T-O-P-P-P-D-C-O-O. Ah, we are so close. Stop podcasting yourself. A podcast from MaximumFun.org. If you need a laugh and you're on the go. Jean, who named this week's episode?

Well, thanks to Paul Ruh. R-U-H. And Tom Brinton for naming this week's episode A Jury of Your Tears. You get it, onions. If you would like to name a future episode like Judge John Hodgman on Facebook, we regularly put out a call for submissions. If you want to submit a case to the Judge John Hodgman podcast,

you can do so at MaximumFun.org slash JJHO. If you want to email us, it's just him. It's just him. It's just him. It's really going to me, guys. If you don't get a response back, it's because I'm a monster who's ignoring you and I haven't gotten back to you. But it's always me. Yeah, but you should try anyway at Hodgman at MaximumFun.org. And this is what I've been saying to everyone in the wake of this election. There are people in your life who you disagree with and you feel

they need to change their mind you can't change their mind all you can do is give them your testimony say your words and understand that they hear you even if they don't immediately go you're right and hope that down the road you guys might see eye to eye a little bit more that's what emailing me is like you You get your words out. I definitely see them. And I might eventually respond and become a good person again. Yeah. I'm definitely reading all your emails.

I love them. Please send them in and send in your disputes. You know what I like? Disputes between roommates. Yeah. We got a lot of couples for obvious reasons because they're always fighting. Okay. But I don't want this to be the marriage riff.

First time I made that marriage riff joke, that show was on television. Now we're years after it's been canceled. We can't do just marriages anymore. You can't. Your friends, your roommates, your siblings, you all have fights and I want to hear about them. So please send them in. Send them in. And you can also hashtag your judge, John Hodgman tweets, hashtag JJHO, and check out the Maximum Fun

subreddit to discuss this episode. This week's episode was engineered by Paul Ruist at Argo Studios in New York City. Our producer is Jennifer Marmer. Thanks, you guys. A quesadilla is not a sandwich. Maximumfun.org. is not a sandwich.