Judge John Hodgman - Bed, Bath, and Begone

Episode Date: October 22, 2025

Live from Seattle's Neptune Theatre: BED, BATH, AND BEGONE! Lindy is in her first year at college. Her dad, Clay, wants to redecorate her room but she says it's TOO SOON! What will become of Lindy's life-sized Oscar Isaac cutout? Plus in Swift Justice: is it ok to talk about poop at parties? Are all ketchups the same? Please consider donating to Al Otro Lado. Al Otro Lado provides legal assistance and humanitarian aid to refugees, deportees, and other migrants trapped at the US-MX border. Donate at alotrolado.org/letsdosomething.We are on TikTok and YouTube! Follow us on both @judgejohnhodgmanpod! Follow us on Instagram @judgejohnhodgman!Thanks to reddit user u/baltinerdist for naming this week’s case! To suggest a title for a future episode, keep an eye on the Maximum Fun subreddit at reddit.com/r/maximumfun! Judge John Hodgman is member-supported! Join at $5 a month at maximumfun.org/join!

It's the Judge John Hodgman podcast. I'm Bill of Jesse Thorne with me, Judge John Hodgman. This week's episode was recorded live in Seattle, Washington. Yes, we were back at our wonderful partner, the Neptune Theater right there by the university. And not only did we have a great time, we also managed to send those very steep stairs and make it to the stage alive.

This is the inside. If people outside of people in Seattle, Seattle have probably been to the Neptune theater. Everyone else only knows it as the place where podcasters that they listen to complain about how steep the stairs are. Well, we make a living by sitting down, going up and downstairs and now become a novelty to us. But on the stage and in the podcast, we discuss issues such as should poop talk be banned from social conversation, which ketchup is the best will tell you and then we'll talk to a first-year

college student and her dad about what to do with her abandoned childhood bedroom. It's a real t-jurker and a knee-slapper. Yeah, this is hot topics. Let's go to this stage at the Neptune theater in Seattle, Washington. Hold on to that handrail on your way down. Yeah. People of Seattle, Washington, you asked us for live justice, and we're here to deliver it. the court of Judge John Hodgman is now in session. Please welcome to the stage, Cat and Locke. Cat brings the case against her spouse, Locke. Locke says Cat talks about poop too much at parties.

Kat says her poop facts are more interesting. interesting than you might think. Please rise as Judge John Hodgman enters the courtroom. Cat and Locke, you may be seated. Welcome to the Court of Judge John Hodgman. Thank you for being here. Cat, you talk about poop at parties.

I do. We all know from that famous children's book, everybody poops. But why talk about it at parties? Well, I sort of can't help it. I work for the King County Wastewater Treatment Division and a very... Very...

Thank you. Thank you all for your contributions. So... Jesse, I can see we're no longer needed here. The litigants have come in with prepared material. We're going to look bad. All right, go on, Kat. So that is a very common question in parties.

What do you do? Yeah, well, you can say, I work in wastewater treatment, and then you can stop. But where is the fun in that? Here's a thing. We're at a party now. We're having fun now. We're eating cocktail weeners.

Actually, no. I don't want to eat that now. No. But we are drunk. We're having stiff drinks. And I say, where do you work? You say I work at the King County wastewater treatment. What do you do, what is your specific role there?

My specific role is less exciting, but I'm a research coordinator. So I help people research poop. You're not working hands-on with the poop. I used to. You're trying, I think I know what's, I haven't even spoken to Locke, nice to meet you. Likewise, Your Honor. You're the husband of the poop professional?

I absolutely, yes. I haven't heard your side of the case, but I think I know what's happening here. Which is that you are afraid your job is boring, so you're pooping it up in order to get attention at cocktail parties. Wow. Are these cocktail parties, Locke, answer me this question. You're at these parties, right?

Oh, yeah. as a Poop Professional Plus One? That's your role? I'm so sorry. Where do you work? You're in town? Yeah, I work at the University of Washington, Department of Chemistry. Oh, okay. Yeah, I work over there at the Skagit Putt.

Don't start. She has stories about Skagit Bud. I think I do, actually. Is there a big rivalry between King County Wastewater and Skagit Putt? Oh, you know it. Huh? This is very interesting. This is a party.

This is a real party, honestly. These parties, though, are general attendance parties, right? Not wastewater shop talk parties. Not like the... What's the holiday office party like at the... At the poop tank, crappy. Oh. We're all...

I find in favor of Kat. Oh, thank you. Thank you. Yes. Fair. Preliminary. finding in favor of cat. We are all pretty poop forward at our

parties, you know? At your wastewater. Yeah. That's something you're going to want to have your doctor look at. Let me ask you, so here we are at our general attendance party. You've told me that you work at the poop factory or whatever. Yes.

What is the, and you're researching the poop. You're not handling the poop, I'm glad to hear. Yeah. What's the most interesting poop fact you can share at a party? So one of my favorite things about what we do with your poop. So once you poop and you flush your toilet, it all goes through the wastewater treatment process. Yeah, and it goes directly to you.

Directly to me, and then I treasure it. If I sent a message with it, would you read it? Absolutely, I would. But so it goes through the treatment process, and then some of it goes off into the woods and gets put in this giant machine that I affectionately call the poop flinger, and it gets flung at high velocities into the woods.

the woods. I always regret talking over litigants, but never more in this case, because I really, I really stepped on the poop flinger. When you talked about the poop going into the woods, I'm like, this sounds like a grim fairy tale. To be fair. Like, do the, do the two turds go hand in hand

into the woods because they've been exiled by their poop parents? Does Judge John Hodgman talk over litigants? I don't know. Do Seattleites have their poop flung into the woods? To be fair, to be fair, it's not really poop at that point. It's mostly the dead bodies of microorganisms, which is less exciting. That sounds less exciting, but more appetizing. Yes, yes, it's really quite nice.

Why are you flinging poop corpses into the woods? because it has more nutrients than you could ever want, and it really helps trees grow. So we help Douglas fir trees grow with our poop. This sounds like a noble profession? Indeed, yes. No, Douglas fir. Douglas fir, yes.

This sounds like a noble profession. This sounds like a fun job. This sounds like you're a hoot at parties. What could be your complaint, Lott? So if the party happens to involve any sort of food or eating, I think that's really where the problem kind of starts for me when you get the immediate

sort of like I know to start tuning in when you get the thank you for your contributions and I know to immediately disengage from whatever conversation that I happen to be having at the time and run to where my partner is as soon as I hear the words like I don't know gravity belt thickener or something like that so it's not necessarily

the... Excuse me for a second. Yes. Would you marry me? I am already taken. I'm so sorry. Well, so am I, but I mean, maybe that's why you're running over.

Are you concerned that your wife is more interesting than you are? Oh, no, I know she is more interesting than I am. Yeah, I think that's pretty clear. I disagree. My job is just cooler. What's the most interesting thing you fling into the woods in your job?

you said we were trying to keep this family friendly do your best no comment well you would be like a mysterious figure at a party but a lot you would be a lot less fun fair you're concerned that people are grossed out by your lovely wife

and that she doesn't understand that she's grossing out these people I think that there is a certain point at which somebody's like, oh, I'm a programmer, I compiled this thing, blah, blah, blah. And then they hand it off, and Kat says, oh, I'm in wastewater treatment. And then 10 or 15 minutes later, people are going. Are they, though? Are they?

Because they've talked about it for 10 or 15 minutes. Look, we're running out of time. This is Swift Justice. I got to come to a thing. But I could talk about this all night long. And honestly, it sounds like she's got a tight, and she's ready for Carson. I think if anyone doesn't want to talk about

poop, it's incumbent upon them to say, I won't want to talk about it anymore. You don't need to rescue the people who are fascinated by your wife. All of the people who want to propose to her, even though she's married, and I'm married too. Kat's doing a great job. Keep talking, poop. Everybody poots. We all love to think about it. Thank you, Kat

and Locke. Swift Justice continues. Please welcome to the stage. Zach and Teresa. Zach and Teresa, please. Teresa and her boyfriend, Zach, recently moved in together. Zach has proclaimed that only one brand of ketchup is allowed in their new home. Teresa says, it shouldn't matter.

All ketchup is the same, and also all ketchup is worse than mustard. Judge Hodgman. Zach, let's give this out of the way. There's only one brand of ketchup that you like. I presume it is... Hunts. I think we all know which one it is. Whoa, coming in, very arrogant.

People might have different ketchup preferences, but what is the brand of ketchup that you favor? Well, those people are wrong. Okay, okay. Order in this court. Just answer the question. Sorry, Heinz ketchup. Heinz ketchup.

Heinz ketchup. Default ketchup and most... All right. Shut your pie holes! Sir Kensington. Somebody's here from Baltimore. It just occurred to me that we should have had someone dressed up as Sir Kensington.

Whole audience of Sir Kensington's dropping their monocles right now. Fun story about Sir Kensington ketchup, it's terrible. So is there mayonnaise. Also, the couple that founded that company used to come to my show and I'd say, sponsor my podcast and they said, we will, and then they never did.

So, there you go. No, it's all, it's good. Everyone likes what they like, and that's actually high-quality condiments, but Heinz is default. Now, are you here buzz marketing Heinz as a member of the Heinz Corporation or family? No, I don't work for them. You have a little John Kerry to you, you understand. Thank you. And why are you so into Heinz ketchup?

Is there something specific about your growing up? I am from Pittsburgh. Pittsburgh. That is Heinz ketchup country. Yes, it is. Right. And Teresa, when did you realize how serious Zach is about his ketchup? I mean, we got to go to Pittsburgh for the holidays, and I had never been.

It was amazing, beautiful, beautiful city. It's a wonderful city. Lovely city. And we were out to lunch. Very ketchup forward in its signage. We literally met the Oscar Meyer Wiener Mobile when we were in Pittsburgh. But you wouldn't put ketchup on it, would you? No, no.

And we were out to lunch, it was just he and I, and there was Heinz ketchup everywhere, and I was just like, yeah, people are really into Heinz, but it's just like any other ketchup. And it was like a record scratch moment in the restaurant. Like everyone stopped talking, and I was like, oh, no. You were like, oh, I'm in Pittsburgh, and you're like, let me recover. Yeah, people are really into Mr. Rogers, but he's just like any other television host. I mean, he might as well be Captain Kangaroo. No disrespect to Captain Kangaroo.

But it was then that my lovely partner, Zach. We've been together a year now. Are you married or just? Just dating. Just dating, yeah. So, okay, so this was relatively recently within the past year. You learned that he's a high-speed. We agree on so much.

Our values are very aligned. It was wonderful. We love puns. We laugh at each other's jokes all the time. It's great. But this was something wholly new. And I wanted to explore this because I don't taste a difference of any ketchup. They all taste the same, and I think...

But you don't really like ketchup is what I understand. Like, you're more of a mustard girl. I'm a mustard gal. What kind of mustard do you like? Oh, stone mustard's really great. I mean, any mustard's pretty great. Yeah, there we go. Yeah, thank you.

Thank you. Honestly, if we wanted to make money, the whole show would be about condiments. Yeah. Like, I could send an hour talking about Worcestershire sauce. One time, like, 10 years ago, Dave Schumpka from Stop Podcasting yourself, mentioned mustard. He still gets like four mustards a week. in the mail. I encourage anyone

within the sound of my voice to send to Maximum Fun HQ all of your off-brand ketchups and mustards. I really want to try them all. But save your off-brand mayonnaisees. I've got one true mayonnaise and that's almonds.

All right. So what do you care then? I just want to... You can't taste the difference because you're unsophisticated. Apparently. You've burned out your taste beds with Grey Poupon.

Pardon me. This could be true, Judge. I'm just concerned about... You're an elite. You're a Grey Poupon swilling elite. And Zach is a man from a working class catch-up town called Pittsburgh.

With rivers, with names that are hard to pronounce. Manangahila River. Another river and a third. Three rivers. So, you don't taste the difference, but he does, what's the problem? I want him to have everything that brings him joy in this world, truly. I love this man very much.

I want to make sure this brand loyalty is not taking him down a crazy path. In our relationship, as he has mentioned, if I cook with something other than his brand of ketchup, he wouldn't eat it, and it would upset him. And so I just want to make sure our relationship is not going to die on the hill of Heinz. Zach, is this about the flavor or is this about Pittsburgh Pride? Like, is this because other ketchupes taste bad to you or is it like if you came up to me and said

an it's a caduzzi is the same as an it's it? I think part of it is hometown pride. There's a good friend of mine who lives in the Seattle area and we pose this question to him and he, what did he say in the text message chain? He told me that I was wrong.

He basically said rude things to you and yeah, yeah, yeah. It's partly that. But also, I think... So your friend said rude things to your beloved and you're like, yes. She's strong. Off to a great start. She can handle it. I think there's a flavor aspect to it as well. Are you, are you cohabitating?

Yes. We are cohabitating, yes. So you're choosing a ketchup for the home. Oh, you're saying, You're saying that if she pushes this ketchup, you might have to live in a separate apartment. Is that what you're saying? No, no, no, no, no, no, no. Why is it so important for you to have a different kind of ketchup in the house?

You're just trying to make him jealous, keep your relationship spicy? That could be part of it. I think the true reason is I've always been someone who buys a lot of off-brand food. and condiments and different things like that. Out of curiosity, or for economical reasons? Mostly for economic reasons. Right, right, right, okay. So you want to buy some cheap-ass ketchup.

And what are you going to make with it? I wasn't planning on making anything, but this became such an issue that we had to bring it to the courts. Now you've said it's part hometown pride, but also that there's a distinctive flavor profile that you prefer. Is that correct? I believe there is. Do you think that you would be able to identify

Heinz ketchup. Heinz brand ketchup, if you were perhaps blindfolded with a makeshift Judge John Hodgman blindfold made out of a Judge John Hodgman t-shirt for sale in the lobby. I'd like to think I could. I'd like to think I could.

Jennifer Marmer, would you please come out? Round of applause for our producer, Jennifer Marlowe. Would you please take that high-quality Judge John Hodgman t-shirt and give it... Wait, John. Yes. If we put this on him,

are there still going to be more available for sale in the lobby? No, this is the last one, and it's going to be covered in ketchup. Wait a minute, I'm receiving something in my earpiece. I'm wrong. There are plenty of them. Oh, thank goodness. In fact, there are so many

that you have to buy them all because we don't want to carry them around anymore. All right. I would just tie it on him as tightly as you can. close your eyes I don't think that's going to work that way

here's what we'll do because honestly you won't be able to tell otherwise we'll just do that Jennifer I might need your That looks awesome

This is styled very nicely Now Jennifer let's gently remove this we have here four different catch-ups and they're labeled A, B, C, and D and honestly, it doesn't matter

that you're blindfolded at all, I just wanted to do that because and I, you're Judge John Hodgman I'm going to feed you spoonfuls of ketchup which has probably been an erotic dream of yours for some time here I can look

here's what you need here's it just put it back like that yeah that's good enough my eyes are closed all right keep them closed this is this is my hand do I have permission to feed you yes all right I will try not to bring shame to my ancestors open wide first ketchup chucho coming in Don't laugh and choke and die on stage.

Okay, it's just ketchup. It's right in front of you. Here, okay. All right, that's ketchup number A. Very sweet. It's very sweet. Okay. As a pallet cleanser,

because we should have had some sparkling water up here, but as a pallet cleanser, may I offer you some crushed-up ketchup-flavored potato chips from Vancouver, Canada that just traveled down with us this morning. Okay, here, that's coming in now. Sure. There you go.

Wow. Does that scrub your palate? You ready to go to ketchup B? Is that popular in Canada? Yeah, very popular. Oh, man. But, I mean, so's curling. That's not bad.

All right. Here's ketchup number B. I'm bringing it in. And I'm going to tell you when it's right near your mouth. All right, it's there now. Ready? Go. Okay, ketchup number, letter B.

Ketchup B. Formula B. Now, would you like some more crushed up tomato, tomato, I mean, ketchup flavored potato chips? No, thank you, Judge. Teresa, would you like some crushed up? Thank you, though. What you can do is, you know, you can coat some chicken in that and fry it up. Perfect.

Take that home as a souvenir. Thank you so much, Judge. That merch is not available. Thank you. That's Canada only. Would you like a drink of water or something? I actually do have an unopened water here that I'm putting in your hand if you'd like to take a little sip.

This is unopened bottle of water. It's definitely not poisoned. No. It's definitely not urine from the wastewater plant. Mmm. All right. All right. Don't make a mess, dude.

Don't fling it into the forest. All right, and finally, here comes ketchup B. C. Wait a minute. All right, okay, I'm gonna let you know. Hang on, it's dripping. It might taste lightly of stage towel now. All right, it's in front of you.

Ketchup C. I honestly don't know. which is which. And you can take a sip of water. We honestly didn't even write down which is which. So scientific. All right, Zach. Yes.

Here's the deal. You may now remove your blindfold. Is there one more? No, the D was the ketchup flavor of potato chips, but I decided to use them in a different way. So I heard A described as sweet. You were surprised how sweet it was. What was your reaction to B?

B might have been the same as A. Okay, and then C, what did you think of C? C tasted a little bit different. Okay. And now, may I ask the audience, did I trick him? Did I feed him the same ketchup twice in a row? No. It was A, B, and C, and they aren't...

Well, except in the sense that all ketchupes are the same. Wow. Oh, no. Look, I'm over here humiliating this guy for his ketchup preference, but even I must strongly disagree with you. All ketchupes are not the same, and this I agree with you, Zach. So the deal is, if you identify the Heinz ketchup correctly, then that is the only ketchup you shall ever have in your home,

in your shared home, in your shared life together. There shall never be mention of any other ketchup. And Teresa must acknowledge that as far as you are concerned, it is the finest ketchup on earth. Now, if you can't identify it, then you still deserve to like what you like, and you should have Heinz ketchup in the house. But Teresa can, you know,

have a little bit of an adulterous affair with some hunts or some red gold or some of the other trash brands that are out there. Now, are you, have you prepared an answer? I believe so. Jennifer Marmer, you have the, the key. key code, right? Will you hand that to me? I have not heard this before. Another round of applause for Jennifer Marmer. So, we know that the D cup was full of crushed up potato chips,

which is not ketchup. A, B, or C, which is the Heinz? You can take a wild guess and you have a 33.3333333 repeating chance. It might have been C. Is that your final answer? I think for the sake of time, yes. I'll tell you this. A, you're glad you didn't pick A. It wasn't A. It was definitely not yet. Right, because A, speaking of hometown ketchups, that's Portland brand ketchup.

Yeah. We tasted it yesterday. It's not very good. I'm not going to taste it now because your saliva is all over those ketchups. It's not good. I'm sorry, Portland, B, well, it's not good. And did you say B or C? I believe C. Really?

I think so. Are you absolutely sure? Now I'm thinking maybe B. B is the Heinz. That is correct. The ketchup that you thought was Heinz. Irony of irony. Oh, no.

You like fancy mustards, right? You ever enjoy just some trashy yellow mustard? Mustard on a hot... 100%. Maybe what's the most famous trashy yellow mustard? French. French is ketchup. Is what you chose.

They make ketchup? They make ketchup. And it's your favorite, you nasty freak. Oh, God. Why did you put that packet of ketchup where I smash my gavel down? Do you dare me to do it? Do you dare me to smash your beloved Heinz? French's wins.

You are now a multiple ketchup household. This is the sound of a gavel. Get out of here. That's Rift Justice. Thank you, Teresa and Zach. Seattle, Washington, are you ready for mega-justice? Let's bring out our litigants. Please welcome to the stage, Clay and Lindy.

Tonight's case, bed, bath, and be gone. Clay brings the case against his daughter, Lindy. Lindy is in her first year of college. Now that she's out of the house, Clay, wants to redecorate her room. He thinks it's time to reclaim the space. Lindy thinks it's too soon. Who's right, who's wrong?

Only one can decide. Please rise as Judge John Hodgman enters the courtroom and delivers an obscure cultural reference. Dad, did you notice anything out of the ordinary about my old room? Well, son. We kept it exactly as you left it.

And then we filled it with cement. Geez, I've only been gone since yesterday. Well, it turns out some guys will work all night if you throw enough money around. Bail of Jesse Thorne, please swear the litigants in. Clay and Lindy, please rise and raise your right hands. Do you swear to tell the truth, the whole truth, and nothing but the truth?

So help you, God, or whatever? Yes. I do. Do you swear to abide by Judge John Hodgman's ruling, despite the fact that the departure of his... children for college led him to triple the size of his chambers? Indeed. Yes, I do.

Judge Hodgman. Clay and Linda, you may be seated for an immediate summary judgment in one of yours favors. Can either of you name the piece of culture that I referenced as I entered the courtroom? Clay, you're very old. Why don't you go first? I mean, comparatively. Yeah.

Only in the sense that you're hurtling towards death. Yeah. You're in the prime of your life. life. Well, that's clearly Dame Judy Dench and Daniel Day Lewis in a room with a view. I remember the concrete filling the room scene quite well.

The view is of the concrete? Jesse, we got a live one. We got a straight-up weird dad over here. All right, that's a good guess. Lindy, what is your guess, if I may ask? I'm going to say it's a niche outtake from Star Wars Skeleton Crew that you were on.

Starring Snobbiest Snee? I like that guess a lot. You are your dad's daughter and a whole human being in your own right. Thank you very much. I got a lot. Wonderful, adorable guesses, which all of them being wrong, that was in fact a quote from the early 90s sitcom created by Chris Elliott called Get a Life in which Chris Elliott co-starred with his own father, comedy legend Bob Elliott,

and Chris Elliott played a version of himself in his 30s who was still living at home with his dad and mom and running his paper route that he'd had since he was a kid and living in his old room. and in this episode he announces it's his birthday, he's turning 31, so he's finally going to move out of the house. He rents the neighbor's garage for a single night, gets freaked out, tries to move home, goes up to his old room, opens it, and it's just a blank wall of cement.

Because his dad filled it with cement. That's something he would do too. So you're both wrong, but it's a great series, and apparently it's all on YouTube now, so go steal it. Go watch the episode where an alien moves in. into their house and all it does is barf on them. It's a very strange show. In any case, we do have to hear this case.

So, Lindy, first of all, congratulations on beginning college. Thank you. How's it going? It is so good so far. Yeah. I love it. Go Beavs, Oregon State University. College of course. Hey, wait a minute.

Can I ask a serious question? Your father is sitting next to you and he knows the value of pandering to the audience. He's wearing a University of Washington quarter zip. But he's what we call a quarter zip haughty. Clay, did you just wear that as a fuck you to your own kid? I have said fuck you to my

own kid, but not in this case. Not today. So, no, I'm incredibly proud of her. And she's having a great year at Oregon State University. Really loving And what are you, what are you studying? Natural resources. Natural resources.

Yep. Minering in forest poop flinging? Hopefully. I mean, like, if I can add that, now I know it's interesting. And you live on campus? I do. In like a dormitory type situation. And you left your childhood room behind.

And now, Clay, you're eyeing it greedily. Why? You must be very proud of your daughter. I am, absolutely. So why do you want to erase her existence from your home? Yeah, why? Well, it's not so much that I want to erase her existence. It's that at some point, you know, our family, where we live, it has to evolve, you know.

And so I really am seeking a judgment of what is the appropriate length of time to wait before it's okay to actually, yeah, remove her presence from our house? And so it's in September, October, November, December, five months? You're saying five months is enough? No, no, no. I actually, I think in my original request, my request was that once she returns for her sophomore year of college, which would be, you know, in September of this calendar year. Of this calendar year, that we would be, we might. You start turning it into a foosball air hockey room.

You would begin to evolve your family to its ultimate form. And I wouldn't be there for it, which I think would be the worst part. Become shining clay. Tell me about your home, it's here in Seattle. We live north of Seattle in Mukletio. Okay. And do you, shirt, go ahead. Yeah, give it up for Mukleto, I guess.

Wonderful. A smattering of applause. Is Michael Tiel Pud here tonight? A lot of people who catch the first. ferry to Whidbey Island, apparently. And are there any other siblings? Yes. I have a younger sister

who's two years younger than me than I. So she's still in high school and living there and enjoying my space as well. And my clothes, too. She moved into your room. Were you sharing the room or no? No, no. She just likes to go in there and take my things. So she has her own room. She has her own room. She has her own respectful room, yes.

Right, but she needs a farting room. Obviously. Wait, have you met, Piper? On a fairly well-known podcast, you call your own daughter a farter. You weren't sitting on the couch next to me last night when something magical happened between my daughter and my face. But I'm not here to adjudicate that. No, sir, I was in Vancouver and I'm thinking about going back. So it's not as though you're tight for space.

Not like you've been sharing the room or anything like that. You have your own bedroom, I presume. Yeah, so, yeah, my spouse and I have our bedroom. What is your thought? What is your plan for Lindy's old room? You know, a number of things have gone through my mind. I think certainly it would make a lovely sitting room. You know, as is court mandated, I'm married to a librarian, and so...

That's wonderful. Congratulations. So as a result, there's a lot of reading to be done, and so I think it would be a great location. I thought you mentioned you didn't allow you to sit down anywhere, so you needed a room. So... A reading room. A library, if you were. A reading room, but actually, I fear I might be pandering. to the bailiff, but

our next-door neighbors have two dogs that are derpy in the best possible way, and I almost would love to create some sort of dog observatory there. This guy's rear-windowing dogs. I love

everything about this. Are you talking about, I think I understand this, a dog observatory. Which is a common thing. Everybody in muckletyo has one. You're talking about

designating a room in your home for the observation of dogs, I presume through peep holes that you have cut into a spooky painting and hung on the wall and then you will then steal your neighbor's dogs and put them in there and watch them like it's a weird Dean Coontz novel.

This is what you have in mind? A dog observatory? I had not gone that deep into it, but that sounds like a great idea, actually, now that I think. Don't steal dogs. The dog observatory is just one of a number of ideas, but really to repurpose that room to a potential guest room or other, just other uses for that space besides what would be known as Lindy.

room, you know. Does your wife, as a whole human being in her own right, agree with your plan to exercise the room of the spirit of Lindy as soon as this September? She's not gone on the record. However, when asked, she did, I believe, say, what's the rush, you know? What's the rush? Well, I mean, I ask you the same thing. What's the rush?

There is no rush, but if you speak with parents about this question, you get a whole range of answers from 24 hours to the somewhat creepy, never. And so I think what I'm really seeking is what is that length of time that is the right length of time to wait before you start to say, no, okay, this is not. Now, not just Lindy's room, but it's Lindy's old room, and now it is this other thing. Now does this neutral dog observatory slash sitting daybed beanbag chair room or whatever it is, you're going to come up with. A rumpus room. A rumpus room. Lindy, the state of your room currently, I hope and trust is a shrine to your memory, the exact way you left it, the day you left for college, correct? And tell me a little bit about the decor in your room.

Um, it's very, I have lots of posters up on the wall that match my, like, aesthetic. Yeah. Um, I have things from all throughout my life. Um, what are the, what are the posters of like, I have, black light posters of bongs? I wish. Um, uh, I have like a Seattle Cracken poster in there. Oh, Cracken. Um, I have a portrait that someone, drew of me at a punk show here. Oh, wow. Here at the Neptune or just in Seattle? Oh, just in Seattle. Yeah, it was a little underground thing. But yeah, and in one corner, I have this...

You know, it's been a long time since I've gone to any punk shows, but my favorite part of all the punk shows was the caricature station. Yeah. Lindy, is it possible that was a bat mitzvah? It was a mishmash of things, but yes, there was a little caricature charcoal station. It's very beautiful, but... Jello Biafra did read a Torah portion. Did you have any life-size or semi-life-size cutouts of actors? I do, actually.

It's crazy you ask that. I have, in a corner with all my vinals, I have a life-size cut out of Oscar Isaac. dressed up as Poe from Star Wars. And is that life-size cut-out here in the courtroom? It just might be. Jennifer Marmer, will you produce the life-size cutout, larger than life-size cutout? Lindy, do you recognize life-size cut-out of Oscar Isaac?

Yes. Is he in this courtroom now? He is. Can you point to him? Let the record show that Lindy is correctly. identified life-size cut out of Oscar Isaac. I don't know whether it's quite life-sized. Look at him.

Very nice to have here. He is a little short. You know, a little wee. And so anyway, this is what you want to destroy. Yeah. I do not want to destroy it. What are you going to do with

Poe Damarin? What are you going to do with this portrait of your daughter from the punk rock show if not throw it in a fire? I could only presume knowing how Lindy feels about Poe Damran that she would take him with her to her sophomore year domicidal. This isn't the kind of item that you would ever have in a college dorm room. No, sir, no.

It might distract from her studies. Such a thing would never be seated next to a lava lamp in a cinderblock room and Oregon State University. Why didn't you take Poe Damron with you? I feel like there might be another crime here that's been committed, your betrayal of your love for cardboard Poe.

I actually, I talked to my roommate about it beforehand, and I was like, oh, it'd be so crazy if I brought this life-size cut out to the dorm with us, and she was like, yeah, that kind of would be crazy. I was like, okay, so. So you've never had to share a room before. No, I haven't.

Yeah. And so, in a sense, it might be, you know, you know that you have this personal space back at home. Yes. And right now, you're out in the wilderness for the first time, like poop flung into the woods. One could say, yeah. How long have you been at college at this point? Since late September. So that's a long time to hold your farts.

Yeah, tell me about it. Only you had a farting room at home. If only. Clay, if I were to rule in your favor and kick Lindy out not only in body but also in spirit out of this room, would Lindy still be welcome to visit you? Yeah, of course.

And honestly, it will always be her home, right? Where we are? Just not her room. There we have it. Where would she sleep? On a mat on the floor of the dog observatory? That'd be awesome. I love those dogs.

I think we found a solution, actually. I think I might have convinced her with this. No, we do have, yeah, we would be able to keep a bed in that room, you know, for her to sleep in. But again, it's that evolution and the change coming out of the, as our family transforms going into the future. It's not necessarily her space anymore. Would it be fair to say that it would also be sending a valuable message to your younger daughter, the farting one? That message being, don't get too comfortable. It would feel a bit like a shot across the bow, yeah.

And her room is a little bit bigger. So actually, in the long term, I think we're really talking about that as a guest room. So that we could have a guest room and a dog observed. is Lindy your oldest child she is yeah she first to go to college she is yeah and uh on a scale of one to 10 10 being most and one being not at all how much daily pain are you going through daily pain emotional pain that your daughter isn't is grown up and has left the house um i can i i hate to buzz market tom papa um because i don't know if you're you have beef or not.

No beef with Tom Popper. That's great. Lovely man. Great comedian. Yeah. But he has a great line where he said that they never tell you after your kid leaves for college that the hardest thing is to pretend you're sad about it. Let the record reflect that upon Clay having said that Lindy turned away from the microphone and mouth to the audience.

where will I fart? You know, a lot of, a lot of, I mean, I know that it seems a long way off because Lindy just started college, but a lot of kids who graduate from college can't afford to live out in the world on their own. A lot of them do move home for a period of time. You're saying that Lindy would be barred from your home and not allowed. No, not barred. And honestly, this is probably the biggest act of faith I have in my child.

that I am so confident that she will graduate from college and she has fledged into the world so well just in these first few months that when she graduates, I can't imagine a future where she will find herself wanting to return to her room that she's had since she was two years old. I think you should train your imagination. Do you know how much natural resource majors get?

in a job. It's not that much. I mean, I share with you complete confidence that Lindy is going to thrive in the world in her chosen profession and major and everything else. But, I mean, it's hard out there for a Lindy right now for all college graduates. She's studying to be a poop master. You still haven't answered what you're going to do with Poe Damarin and all the other stuff. You're right. I have an attic or something like that. Yeah, I think it would probably end up folded up.

and put with some of the other things that we might store on her behalf. In your home or in like a storage locker somewhere? A creepy storage locker? We do. We have enough space to store it. You have enough space to store the cardboard cutout. Yeah. Okay.

She has a closet, you know, that is full with clothes and books and things like that. So if those... Everything goes into the closet. Yeah, we could put that, we could store it in there if need be. Okay. And this, I mean, it's your house, you're going to do this. You don't need my permission or ruling to do this. You're just asking essentially my judgment as to when would be the appropriate time.

Yeah, that's essentially it. When you think of your dad throwing all your stuff into the closet, what makes you feel worse? Poe Dameron in the dark or the feeling that you no longer have a room of your own in the house that you grew up in? Well, the thought of Poe Dameron in the dark That strikes up some Other feelings But it makes me sad most of all Not unreasonable

I think I've heard everything I need to In order to make my decision I'm going to step into my chambers Think this over, I'll be back in a moment with my verdict Please rise as Judge John Hodgeman as is the courtroom. Clay, how are you feeling about your chances right now? Not good.

I think we went a little deep on the dog observatory. So, not. I hadn't quite thought we thought that went through all the way. Well, I mean, you could start the not having thought it through with pandering to me, the guy who has no power in this situation. You've successfully pandered to the audience with your quarter-zip, to me with the dog observatory, and to him with nothing. Lindy, how are you feeling about your chances right now?

I'm feeling pretty confident, you know? I think I have a solid baseline, and, you know, I got Poe right behind me, so what more could I need? We'll see what Judge Hodgman has to say about all this in just a moment. Good, Sean Hodgman, we are taking a break from the stage at the Neptune Theater because we are hitting the stage, not just in God's United States of America, but also in the godless United Kingdom. Yes, that's absolutely right. The Thrilling Adventure Hour starring Paul F. Tompkins, Mark Evan Jackson, Mark Igliardi, Busy Phillips, and many,

many more talented people celebrating its 20th anniversary this year with some big shows. including upcoming one in London, and I am joining them there. That's right. November 1st, I will be joining the cast. The Work Juice Players at the Thrilling Adventure Hour. At the Leicester Square Theater, there are two shows, the early show, I believe, is waiting list only, but there's some tickets left for the late show, and if you want to grab them, please do. Thrillingadventure.

Live is the link for tickets there, and Jesse Thorne, Thirling Avengers is enjoying its 20th anniversary. Is there anything else that's celebrating an anniversary right around now? I got a beat baby the 25th anniversary of Bullseye with Jesse Thorne. My public radio program is this year. I started it in my dorm at UC Santa Cruz when I was 19 years old with my friends, Jordan Morris and Gene O'Neill. We are doing all kinds of celebrations. We just did 25 consecutive interviews.

That's on the Bullseye with Jesse Thorne YouTube page right now. Like I sat in a studio and interviewed 25 people in a row as they just sort of like, came through, all the, all the Rob Hubels and Pat and Oswaltz and Elvis Mitchells, all these wonderful people who I have gotten to know over the years doing Bullseye, cruised on through for five to seven minute interviews. It is so fun. You can watch the whole thing on the Bullseye YouTube page. We also, in addition to that, are doing live stage shows. We just did the Los Angeles one. I had such a great time with our friend Roy Wood Jr. and Jason Manzoukis and Rebecca of Sugar, and Al Madrigal as well.

We're also headed to Santa Cruz on November 1st at the Cumbwood Jazz Center with Santa Cruz's own Adam Scott, plus filmmaker and rapper Boots Riley, stand-up comedian Scott Simpson and Glenn Washington from Public Radio's Snap Judgment, plus the greatest rock band in Santa Cruz history, The Merman. I know what you're thinking, John, it could really get contentious between the merman and camper van beethoven yeah i was thinking of that exactly camper van beethoven don't tour anymore so it's the merman because they said yes the merman they lived down the street from the venue so it's fine the merman said yes then on november 15th we'll be in new york city at the people's improv theater and by

we i mean i think you're you're going to be in attendance right john i'm going to be i'll definitely be hanging out i'm going to get a seat in the back row and i'm just going to stare daggers at the stage the whole night long our daggers of delight to see these wonderful my wonderful friend jessie and his guests who are. Jad Abelamrod, of course, of Radio Lab and an awesome new podcast about Felacuti, H. John Benjamin from Bob's Burgers and Archer, among many other things. Kristen Anderson Lopez and Bobby Lopez, past Judge John Hodgman guests, friends of Judge John Hodgman, egot homeholders, their homes contain egotts.

Yep, they got the egots. They got the gots. They probably don't even have room for family photographs on their mantelpiece because there's so many dang awards for their singing songwriting. Exactly, right. Plus stand-up comedy from our friend Josh Gondelman. Tickets are all, for all those things are at maximum fun.org slash events. And make sure to subscribe to Bullseye because we have so much cool 25th anniversary stuff

hitting the podcast feed as well, special episodes and retrospectives and prospectives and all kinds of wonderful stuff at maximum fun.org slash events. And John, I'm making a special promise today. Yeah, I'd like to hear it. If you have a podcast and it has a hundred reviews on Apple Podcasts, I'll go on your podcast as long as it's not like a Nazi thing or something. I'm on board. 100 reviews, no Nazis. Jesse Thorne will be there. Email us at Hodgman at maximum fund.org about your podcast. We'll shoot it over to my publicist, Emily Erskine, and we'll find the time. I cleared out a bunch of time in my schedule. I'm just promoting the. the 25th anniversary of Bullseye. So all you so-and-soes out there with podcasts that people listen to,

invite your boy on, I'll bring my podcasting Hall of Fame Trophy, and we'll do this thing. I'm headed to see my friend Allison Rosen later today. There you go. Oh, that sounds so much, you're going to talk on her podcast. Yeah, Allison Rosen's your new best friend. Why? Because she's the best. She's my best friend. She's terrific. Uh, 25 years of Bullseye, congratulations, Jesse. If you made a promise to yourself 25 years ago that you were going to subscribe to Bullseye and its YouTube channel in 25 years. Well, now's the time to do it. Make sure, go to Maximumfund.org slash events.

Get those tickets. Subscribe to Bullseye. Watch the YouTube. And if you want to see me in London on November 1st, the few tickets remain at throwingadventure. Dot live. Let's get back to the case. Please rise as Judge John Hodgman reenters the courtroom and presents his verdict.

I actually, you know, Clay, I admire your openness to acknowledging in front of all of these people and your daughter that you're happy, she's gone. And, you know, look, my wife is a whole human being in her own right, and I, our youngest child, just left to go out into the world last fall too. Or actually a year ago, last September, I should say. And our daughter just graduated from college. Congratulations. And is living on her own for now. And I'm annoyed by it because I want them both to come home all the time. I just was on the drive from Vancouver to Seattle today.

I was saying to Jesse earlier, while he was laughing to himself about Skagit Pud. I was crying inside because I miss my children so much. I really do. And it's not to say that it's not a mix of feelings. Of course, I love my wife, who's a holy meeting our own right, and so much. And we're really enjoying this time. It's a wild time of freedom to do whatever we feel like and to watch whatever we want on television and to go to bed at 7.30.

at night, and, you know, we don't have any dogs to observe, but I'm thinking of taking up a new hobby, you know, but I really miss them a whole lot. And indeed, their rooms are, well, their rooms for a long time were as they left them. In part out of respect for them in case they wanted to come home and visit, but also in part of due to laziness because it's hard to. I'm not an industrious person. Might as well just close the door and walk away, you know, rather than...

And yet, over time, you know, there was a time when my wife was like, well, I think we should make our son's room a little bit more neutral. We should start, and we should start storing garbage in our daughter's room. And to my great surprise, neither of them had any complaints about this. and in fact our daughter who's now graduated from college was saying like yeah you you should make that your office or something dad like I don't I never want to go back there which is hard to hear but great to hear too

because it's like yeah you are this is an evolution of the family and and it is great to know that your kids feel that they are happy and independent outside side of the family. That's the whole point of the parenting job. One of the main points, let's say, you know, the other is to obviously spread your seed and guarantee your legacy

throughout eternity and make sure that your genetic material goes out into the world. That's kind of the job number one. You'll observe those dogs doing that too, I'm sure, at some point. For sure. And as a father,

job number two is, of course, to get really into the movie Master and Commander the Far Side of the World. Yes. Indeed. Have you seen the movie Master and Commander the Far Side of the World? I have not. All right. I think I know enough to make my decision. It sounds like you're about to have

a Master and Commander Far Side of the World Room. Yeah. You know, he would probably call it a Master and Commander Fart Side of the World Room. Because of his obsession with farts. This guy's obsessed with farts. I didn't bring that up. No, I didn't. quoted a better Tompapa joke than I've ever made

and also makes better fart jokes. It's weird dad's running laps around me over here. You ask me for judgment as when is the proper time to denude a child's room of their stuff and their cutouts and their posters and their identity and their presence in the home. And honestly, that's not for me to judge. That is something for you to negotiate with Lindy

and the fact that she's saying, I'm not ready yet, should be enough that you shouldn't take it to a podcast to overrule your own daughter. I think that there will be a time when Lindy will naturally want to dissociate herself from you. That might have already happened tonight.

I don't think so, because look where she's sitting next to you. What a wonderful daughter she is to actually want to spend time with you. This is something that we as parents think about all the time. How can we make sure our kids actually want to spend time with us rather than avoid us? And one of the things we've decided is you have to make them comfortable at home. And right now, the kids don't care about their rooms anymore. But if they do care, we would keep them that way. so that we would lure them back into our lives.

There will come a time when it will not be important to Lindy and she will be ready to move on. And then maybe, maybe, Clay, you'll feel something. And I think it's perfectly reasonable for you to express your thoughts and wishes about wanting to, you know, scrape this room of all of her identity so that you can move on with your life. you're being open as an adult human being now. In fact, you can have these adult conversations

is very valuable and so forth. And there may come a time sooner than you think that Lindy was like, yeah, I don't want that stuff anymore. Or I'm moving into my own apartment. I want Poe Damarin with me in the dark. Yeah. I think you see where I'm going to rule. But Lindy, I'm sorry that you can't take

Poe Damarin with you because of your dud of a roommate. Oh, no, she's cool. I bet I could bring it now, but I just take the train back and forth, so... Really? Yeah, you can't afford two tickets. A snobby-as-knee stand-up card, because Snobby-a-S-S-Stee is a much smaller character. Yeah. So is that available?

No, I couldn't find... What the? I searched, and it just said, nah. But Jesse, you know what's really cool in a dorm room to have? What's really cool in a dorm room to have? It's not a dog. No? What's a cool dorm room pet?

I mean, if I was going to think, I'm trying to think about different pets you get in dorm rooms and the one that's the coolest would probably be a bearded lizard, I think. A bearded dragon lizard? Yeah, bearded dragon lizard. Well, there happens to be one in the house right now. Isn't that right, Ked R? Please bring forth the Neptune theater's

own Lomas the bearded dragon. Oh, hang on. Kedar lost Lomas. Everybody look under your seat. Lomas, the bearded dragon is here. Would you bring Lomaz over closer so that

Clay may observe it? this is Kedar's lizard first of all this is KDAR so let's start with how awesome that is. A round of applause for KDAR who's been working the monitors up here on stage and there's also Christopher and Derek back there doing the sound and lighting here at the Neptune theater. Lomas comes to work with Kedar in a special bubble backpack. Yeah, Kada, I kind of wanted you to bring out the backpack too so you could see how

portable a bearded lizard is. Oh, thank you. So Matthew, no, you can continue to hold Kedar because he's the star. Bring him forward. Is this okay? Is he... There is a pink sock monkey in the backpack. We did ask Kedar if the pink sock

monkey had a name. He said probably but the lizard doesn't speak English, so Kedar doesn't know what it is. And you see, you could take this on the train back and forth, back No, I totally could.

And it's very great for observation. Wouldn't you say, Clay? I absolutely think so. Now, I'm not giving you Kedars Lizard. Right? No, okay. I wasn't going to ask that much. But bearded dragons are great pets, aren't they?

They are. Absolutely. They have a lot of personality, don't they? They do. Well, mostly. Lomas, not so much? Well, he sleeps a lot. Perfect.

Thank you so much. Round of applause for Lomas. Can I hop in that this is a really odd moment for me because I literally studied dwarf-bearded dragons while I was in college at the University of Washington for a class at Woodland Park, too. Oh, oh, oh, oh, oh. And it was amazing.

Okay, Blumer. How the fuck did you get a job? Yeah. Here I am making six figures doing underwater basket weaving. That's wild. I'm really starting to draw a line between my interest in observing dogs and now watching dwarf bearded dragons for all those years. So in any case, obviously I'm fine in Lindy's favor for all the reasons that I said,

but I further, I was going to sentence Linda you to get a bearded dragon as your companion in college, but you're free and easy right now. Clearly it's your dad who needs a companion. bearded dragon expert. I order him to get a bearded dragon for you to visit in your own room when you get home. That's your new roommate at home. This is the sound of a gavel. Judge John Hodgman rules, that is all. Thank you, Clay and Lindy. Oh my God. That's it for this episode of the Judge John Hodgman podcast. Thank you to Reddit user Boltonerdist for naming the case in this episode. That's a classic reditor.

And Bolton Nerd is always getting up in the mix on the maximum fun subreddit. We have so many talented people who are dropping in name suggestions in the subreddit. I read it every week. I have such a great time. And I want to thank you all for submitting those title suggestions. They're all really great. It's always hard to pick one. Baltimore just did it this time.

Who knows who will be next? Follow us on Instagram at Judge John Hodgman. We are on YouTube and TikTok at Judge John Hodgman pod. By the way, John and I are here. both individually on Instagram as well. That's true. You're at John Hodgman. John Hodgman's my personal account.

Someone camped on my name, Jesse Thorne. So I am at Jesse Thorne very famous. Jesse Thorne, very famous, all one word, all truth. I didn't want people to think that it was one of those not famous Jesse Thorne's. No, which is the famous Jesse Thorne I'm looking for? It must be the very famous one. The Judge John Hodgman podcast was created by Jesse Thorne and John John Hodgman, this episode recorded by our friend Matthew Barnhart.

Thanks to Natty Lope. By the way, Matthew Barnhart just texted me a couple days ago about the prices to get the singer behind Drinkwater and Mind My Business, the Judge John Hodgman tour anthem to record a cameo. Too expensive. He can find $180. Not worth it. I'll kick in some cash. No, it's okay.

You know, it's okay. All right. She's getting our streaming money because we just listened to that song over and over in the van. There you go. Thanks to Natty Lopez for her help on social media this week. A.J. McKeon is our podcast editor, Daniel Spear, is our video editor, our producer. Of course, Jennifer Marmer. We'll talk to you next time on the Judge John Hodgman podcast.

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