Judge John Hodgman - Cuddle Formation

Episode Date: December 8, 2021

It's time to clear the docket! Gen X vs Zoomer text etiquette, cat names, backpack strap location, Jimmy Fallon, and jacket trades gone wrong. Plus we hear back with answers from our questions in Episode 543: The Veil of Honor!Get your tickets now for LIVE JUSTICE at SF Sketchfest! We'll be appearing on 1/22/22 at the Sydney Goldstein Theater, ready to bring back JUSTICE to the San Francisco Bay Area! You won't want to miss it. And if you have a case for the live show, please let us know! Submit your cases, big and small, to maximumfun.org/jjho or email [e-mail].

Welcome to the Judge John Hodgman podcast. I'm bailiff Jesse Thorne. We're in chambers this week, clearing the docket with anonymous local man, Judge John Hodgman. You're dressed like an undercover cop today, John. I'm just wearing my black sweatshirt. You're just wearing a black hoodie. I can't rock a vintage 80s chore coat every day. Sometimes I just wear my cozy sweatshirt. You look very cozy and you also look like you're hanging out on a street corner trying to observe something. And I would really blend in too. They're like, weren't you on board to death? I'm like, shh, shh, shh.

Can't talk right now. I'm undercover. I'm a private investigator now. I'm a private investigator. No, I'm like, shh, shh, shh. Can't talk right now. I'm undercover. I'm a private investigator now. I'm a private investigator. No, I'm very cozy. And also, Jesse, I have to say, I'm very excited. Why is that? Because I have finished all of my holiday shopping.

As we record this, it is not even December yet. Wow. It's the last day of November. And I have finished all of it. And do you know why? Why? Because I was so anxious about shipping and delays in shipping that I mostly shopped locally. And when I shopped and things needed to be shipped from place to place, I started very early and I got it done.

Thanks, global supply chain problems. Well, I thank you, John, for my San Francisco Shamrocks sweatshirt. Oh, Jesse, you have been visited by but one spirit this holiday season, but one ghost of a hockey team. I am here to tell you, wearing the chains I forged in life to my favorite sport extinct hockey you are about to get visited by two more ghosts of extinct hockey before this is over and one of them i almost threw away on my way over here today i had to throw away some boxes in the recycling and i threw away your present it's because it's in card it's in cardboard saying, do not bend. And I had to go back over to the recycling room and fish it out.

A holiday miracle. Well, I feel like I'm in San Francisco's Cow Palace right now. That's where the Shamrocks would play. There you go. In the Cow Palace. Let's get into the docket. Here's a case from Christian. Max Funster and former litigant, Christian, by the way, a litigant on episode 188, I pledge a grievance. Christian has a dispute with his coworkers.

Okay, let's hear it, Christian. Gen Xer. This year, two wonderful women in their early 20s moved into my office suite. As often happens, they quickly became part of an office group text thread. However, I soon found myself accused of being rude and confrontational because I use periods at the end of my texts. Apparently, among Zoomers, periods are a sign of anger or disapproval. I ask you rule that proper punctuation is a vital part of written communication and not some passive-aggressive way to tell someone you're upset with them. Wow. Christian, you ended every sentence in your letter with a period. Why are you so angry, dude? I feel attacked. Yeah, come on, Christian. Ease off the punctuation, dude. Too many mad periods. God, put in an ellipses once in a while.

Yeah, maybe an em dash. I've learned so much about using ellipses from writing for radio. There's a lot of ellipses in writing for radio. What's the radio style guide for ellipsis use? I think that because radio is generally intended to roughly replicate speech rather than writing. Right. And because it is so linear and you thus need to really present one idea at a time, you can't have sentences that have multiple ideas embedded in them. You can't have sub clauses and so on and so forth. But you don't always just want to end with a period, end with a period, end with a period with these short little sentences. So sometimes that ellipsis serves the purpose of separating the ideas without getting into the rhythm of a bunch of tiny sentences in a row.

So when you're using your podcast voice and you're telling a story about something happening, and then turns out a different thing happened. Are you telling me that this narrative has a counterintuitive lesson? What is this, a podcast? Jennifer Marmer, you text, right? Oh, yeah. You are both younger than me. I don't know which one of you is younger than the other.

Jen's a little younger than I. Yes. Jen's the closest that we have to a Zoomer. You are the closest. Not that close, but yeah. You're the youngest on the timeline of the J-Squad, which, by the way, a listener wrote in. I'll have to figure out who this is and thank them next time. A listener wrote in, and they weren't referring to the j squad they were

referring to and i should have thought of this the j crew the j crew genius i know right genius listener you know who you are and i'll let the rest of the world know who you are next time remind me jennifer marmer but meantime jennifer marmer you're the you're the furthest to the left on the timeline if we are timing time from left to right as we do often in the western hemisphere um texting you do use periods I mean if you have to think about it the answer is no right I mean I know that I do I mean I do if I'm typing like more than one sentence at a time I don't just let it run on but I do the last sentence what I I tend to not use a period I don't just let it run on. But I do, the last sentence, I tend to not use a period. I kind of just send it. Right. But I mean, I think what Christian is talking about here

is literally run on sentences, where whole ideas are expressed and you just move on with a space rather than a period. Could be. Or even a comma, I think. Well, Christian says that he was accused of being rude and confrontational for periods at the end of texts. So if they're like, hey, Christian, we're going to have lunch at 1230. And then he responds, OK, period, instead of just OK. That's what I'm imagining. You know what? That would feel harsh to me. Right? I have to say. Yeah. I have to say this, though. This is my perspective on it. This is obviously Christian is describing a cultural difference here. And I think that Christian's request for accommodation of that cultural difference feels pretty reasonable to me,

which is to say that I feel like if Christian was asking his co-workers to use proper punctuation, quote unquote, proper punctuation in their texts, that would be a lot. In fact, I think that would be too much. I think it's reasonable for him to do the modest amount of work to understand where they're coming from and how they're writing their texts. But I also don't think it's unreasonable to ask for reciprocality in that. And, you know, if he's taken the time to gently say to them, hey, this is how I communicate, I don't think it's unreasonable to ask them to do the small amount of work to understand that's how he communicates. Okay.

Good point. Because my dad, speaking of ellipses, shout out to Bob, who's probably listening to this, but he uses ellipses all the time at the end of sentences, but he uses like way more periods than just the dot, dot, dot. like way more periods than just the dot dot dot and he'll say okay dot dot dot dot dot dot dot dot dot and then it looks like he's going okay it's like that's a that's okay when you when when you're being uh when you're falling off a cliff well it looks like he's saying okay like really passive aggressively like hey i'll be there at five okay dot dot dot dot dot dot we'll see but like i know he's just going okay yeah i gotta say first of all okay jesse i understand your

point but jennifer marmer's okay period uh which is my least favorite radiohead album it's my favorite gen x cola brand really hit home and i i went i reviewed uh texts that i have received from the youngest person that i know in my family or second youngest i should should be clear. And not a single one of them ends with a period. And some of them end with one or more exclamation points. Certainly some of them end with question marks, but none of them end with a period. And I texted this person, do you use periods at the end of text messages? And she has not written back and probably never will, even though she's my daughter.

Because this, I think, is the new text etiquette. And I would go so far as to say, absolutely, Christian, you should go ahead and put a period at the end of a sentence if you like it. But I have to tell you, Christian, you're stepping onto a slippery slope when you start singing to younger people things like proper punctuation is a vital part of written communication. And then you start sliding down that slope. Okay.

Because these women, they're in your office suite. They're accomplished. They're as accomplished as any junior peer of yours. They know what punctuation is. And what's more, there's a lot of policing of the way women express themselves by men in the way they speak, this whole issue around vocal fry. And it often hinges, and I'm sure you probably didn't mean it this way, Christian, but it often hinges on if you want the world, that is to say me and men, to take you seriously, you have to express yourself in a certain way. Okay. That's not a cool look. I don't think

that's what you're necessarily going for, But the fact is, I think your younger colleagues are out here doing you a service. English is a living language. Text is a different way. In the same way that spoken English on public radio has its own cadence and sort of vocabulary of silences. and sort of vocabulary of silences. Similarly, texting has a kind of intimate, familiar kind of mood to it that gets a little warped

by putting a period at the end of the sentence. You think I use as many exclamation points in real life or in written communication as I do when I'm on text? Of course not. I feel dumb every time I put those exclamation points in, but I have to because it seems more friendly than when I'm saying, okay, like it's just, it's just a very dad way of doing things, Christian. So you can go ahead and end them on a period and tell your, uh, your coworkers, I am not doing this to be passive aggressive period. You know, you can do that and tell them, but maybe take a lesson from these younger people rather than just presume that, you know, the best way of doing it.

John, talking about writing for radio versus writing for the page and as a, you know, also in comparison to speaking extemporaneously on the radio, which I think is a third form. It reminds me of an analogous situation, which is, as you know, I'm a big rap fan. And there is this canard, this argument- That's French for duck. Yeah. This argument that is often made that I think is false, which is the rap is poetry argument. Right. Now, writing rap lyrics and writing poetry have things in common. Sure. They're both expressions of the English language that are often non-literal and highly emotive.

Sometimes there's rhyming. Sometimes there's rhyming and cleverness involved, like play with language. But when I hear rap as poetry, what I hear is that in order for it to be serious, in order for it to be worth considering, in order for it to be meritorious, it has to be a version of this other form when in fact it is its own form. Right. And specifically another form which is highly coded as educated, worldly, and predominantly historically white, at least in terms of published poetry historically. Obviously there are many, many poets from all different backgrounds historically white, at least in terms of published poetry. Yeah. Historically. Obviously, there are many, many poets from all different backgrounds throughout history.

I don't mean it that way, but in terms of 17th, 18th, 19th, or into early 20th century published poetry. What they're relating it to is your man Harold Bloom in the Western canon. Like, that's what they're directly saying it is comparable to. And no one ever says, well, sometimes people say Shakespeare is like rap, but that's also to diminish rap. modes of communication in different contexts? And is it okay for those, you know, for those modes of communication to be different in those different contexts? And the answer to that is yes, right? this. I don't know that Christian's means of expression here is just a generational difference, a cultural difference, to what extent it is a resistance to the idea that communication could be different in text message form or intergenerationally. But I do think it is important to note that it is okay to communicate in different ways and different forms. Absolutely. And as you said, writing for the page is different from writing for text. It's just a different medium. And rap is not poetry because that would in many ways erase its origin and its inventor, Meredith Wilson, who wrote The Music Man, which has the first example of rap in recorded history.

And probably still the most important. The patter song at the beginning of The Music Man. Yeah. An argument I have seen online from dopes in the past. That's not my point of view. Let's move on. It's a great song though. Here's something from Beth. My friend John threatened to bring me to your court over the naming of my cats. Our family has two kittens we adopted in the last few months, a black kitten named Toaster Oven Dave Jackson, and a black and

white kitten named Can of Beans Beans Finn. Jackson and Finn are their original pre-adoption names that we kept as their surnames. Please rule that our cat's names are absolutely adorable and that John can no longer disparage my kitten's names. Toaster oven, quote unquote, Dave Jackson. Dave is the nickname here. Right. Toaster oven, the given name, Dave, the nickname. And can of beans, quote unquote, beans, Finn. Got it.

You know, Jesse, I initially thought that Beth's letter was a despicable and naked ploy to hype her own cats on the show and basically give a shout out to them for nothing. And to make me show you photos of these cats. Yeah. Classic branding move. I did a little investigation and I was absolutely correct. I'm going to show you these cats anyway. Okay,

cool. I was worried I wasn't going to get to see the cats after all that i'm texting you these cats okay um i'm gonna add a little message to it which is okay a little charles burns illustration on there it's okay cola humor yeah okay cola oh my gosh this is weird this weird form cuddle formation not to be confused with the goatee album huddle formation this is a cuddle formation they each have their little cat arms extended pushing each other to the edges of a very small cat bed yeah and they're it's almost like it kind of looks like when you see people on instagram make a heart shape with their fingers

yeah that's what these cats are doing. These are really good pictures. As you know, I'm much weaker in the face of dogs than I am in the face of cats. Right, because dogs are often silly looking. Cats are often not so silly looking. And as you know, I've asked people if they're going to send me pet pictures to make sure that the pets are doing something funny, that it's not just that they love their pets and I'm expected to. This is great. These are great pictures. This one, they're climbing on top of each other and licking each other in a weird way.

It's really premium too. I don't know whether the fully black one is Toaster Oven Dave Jackson or whether that's Can of Beans Beans Finn, but one of them is really planting the other one with a big old lick on the on the top of the head so i wrote to i wrote to beth and i said is this just a naked ploy to get your cats on the podcast because i don't care what john thinks about the names of your cats

he has no standing here it's not his cats they're your cats why and she's like yeah i guess you're right but she did send me the text exchange that they had where she had posted some pictures some of these pictures on on a popular social media website and john said one's name is beans and the other's name is dave and beth said yep and then she said actually dave's name is toaster of them but we call him dave for short and beans is short for can of beans and john said i'm taking you on on to judge John Hodgman for your animal naming scheme. And Beth said, well, Jesse Thorne, hang on to grab something, Jesse. Jesse Thorne thinks tugboat is the best dog name. So I think I would win.

Whoa, whoa, Beth. It's a matter of settled law. Tugboat is not the best dog name. What's the best dog name, Jesse? Hambone. Hambone, Beth. Tugboat is not the best dog name. What's the best dog name, Jesse? Hambone. Hambone, Beth. Tugboat might be the best dog. Tugboat's a great dog.

A very close friend of Paul F. Tompkins. Talk about Tugboat all the time. Hambone, get your J.J. Ho lore straight. And also, do you know what? It's interesting because John's text messages with Beth brought something into relief here. Toaster O, Dave Jackson. That's a great name. Can of beans, beans, Finn, also a great name. But if you're referring to them as Dave and beans, I don't like that. I think John's onto something here. This is like when I do get your pets, Jesse, my Instagram, uh, afternoon talk show where I interviewed cats and dogs and other pets. And I was talking to Nancy in Pittsburgh.

She has two cats. One is a cat named Mouse and the other is a cat named Simon. Doesn't go together. You got to name your cat one cat mouse and the other cat cat. So you have cat and mouse. That's good. It's similarly beans and Dave, you got one human name and one food name that doesn't work for me that doesn't that doesn't fit now if you and you got it sitting right there toast and beans

there you go done i've been staring at this pulling what little the little tiny number zero on the uh on the electric razor hairs that remain on my head. The little tiny hairs. I've been tearing them out over the fact that this one cat is named Beans and the other one is named Toast, but it's not called Toast. It's called Dave. Dave. I mean, it's beautiful, but it is. It's just like when Hercule Poirot steps in that big old camel poop or whatever at the beginning of the latest movie of Murder on the Orient Express. He steps in the camel poop with one foot and everyone's like, oh, Hercule Poirot, he's such a fastidious little creep. He's going to be so upset that he's got poop on his shoe. He takes his shoe out and steps in it again with his other shoe he's like it's the imbalance that bothers me oh kenneth bran i saw curcule poirot for a new time for a first time

then oh now i can't stop thinking about these best curcule poirot ever cannot wait for murder on the nile i'm old look we all gotta see a movie with our mom at Christmas. Look, I agree. I agree. This release date is December 8th. Is that right, Jennifer Marmer? I'm getting a nod. Thank you very much, J.Crew. December 8th.

I'm going to say Monday, December 13th, 2021. I'm going to have a holiday-themed Get Your Pets on Instagram. I'm going to announce the time that morning. It'll probably be 3 o'clock. That's usually when I do it after lunch and beth i want you and toaster oven dave jackson and can of beans beans finn i want you to be on there so i can see toast and beans because that's what i call them but at the end of the day as difficult as it is for me to accept dave and beans because you want it to be dave and b's then which you don't want a hundred percent I also wanted the other dog to be the other cat to be named Buster I was staring at

Beans wishing it was Buster yeah it's yeah it gives us the the itches a little bit but they're still great names they look like great cats I want to see their faces and I and I want to call them toast and beans just once so I can put this behind me. But in the meantime, I rule in your favor. John has to get over it the same way this John has to get over it. We're going to take a quick break to hear from this week's partner. We'll be back with more cases on the docket on the Judge John Hodgman podcast. Hello, I'm your Judge John Hodgman. The Judge John Hodgman podcast is brought to you Hello, I'm your Judge John Hodgman. The Judge John Hodgman podcast is brought to you every week by you, our members, of course. Thank you so much for your support of this podcast and all of your favorite podcasts at MaximumFun.org. And they are all your favorites. If you want to join the many member supporters of this podcast and this network, boy, oh boy, that would be fantastic. Just go to MaximumFun.org slash join. The Judge John Hodgman podcast is also brought to you this week by our pals over at Made In.

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but only for our listeners at babbel.com slash Hodgman. Get up to 60% off at babbel.com slash Hodgman, spelled B-A-B-B-E-L dot com slash Hodgman. Rules and restrictions apply. Welcome back to the Judge John Hodgman podcast. We're clearing the docket and we have a case from friend of the court, Lama. You remember Lama, John. You know Lama, not least, from Get Your Pets.

Yeah, they're on Get Your Pets a fair amount with their cockatiel cocky. And their two dogs, Coco and Chloe, who are cockadoodles. No, cockapoos. Cockapoos, right? Yeah. Chloe, Coco. Titty cockas. Chloe. Yeah, exactly.

And, you know, llamas out there in the ding, Jesse. That's what I call Redding, England. The ding. The ring-a-ding-ding. You know where Redding is? Northern California? No, it's in the uk it's just between whistley green and tidmarsh oh sure whistley green is to the east tidmarsh is to the left judge my friends are having an argument you may be able to settle if you had to describe

where the straps of a backpack are located would you say they're attached to the front or the back? I say back, as does my friend Laura. Her husband, Fraser, says the straps are on the front. He insists that if asked to put something in the front pocket, he would place it in the pocket closest to the straps. This is wild to me. Please help. Jesse and Jennifer, I'm going to seek your counsel. I ask you for a one word answer only. A one word answer only gut reaction. The answer is front or back. The straps of the backpack are on which part of the backpack? The front

or the back? Jennifer Marmer, what is your answer? Back. Back. All right. Thank you. Two backs. The Beast with Two Backs. Shakespeare, the original rapper. My name's Billy Shakes and I'm here to say that I've written y'all an awesome play.

Llama, thank you for listening. Thank you for- Eat your heart out, Juice. Sorry, Super Nat. Jesse's in town. It's right off the dome, right off the micro hairs of his dome. Thank you, Llama, for everything,

for laser printing cool swords and stuff. Thank you for introducing me via Instagram to not only Coco, Chloe, and Kaki the cockatiel, but also at that UK-based raptor preservation retreat, that incredible raven named Loki. Loki, the raven. Loki, the best bird of all time. Sorry, Kaki.

Loki's got you covered. Incredible bird. I like you a lot. Thank you llama for sending me that time-lapse video that only shows the stuff that happens outside the window and rear window. That was incredible. Uh, you're great llama. You're great. Jennifer Marmer. You're great. Jesse Thorne. I love you both. Thank you for everything, but you're all wrong. Straps are on the front. It's the direction the backpack's going in when you're walking. Straps are on the front.

The most exterior pocket opposite the straps is the back pocket. Sorry, everybody. Here's something from Mikayla of Missoula, Montana. Have you ever been to Missoula, Montana, John? I've never been anywhere in Montana. I got to get out there because that's where our friend Sarah Vowell lives now, her home state of Montana. Yeah, the home ESV. Man, Missoula, Montana, incredibly beautiful place. Incredibly beautiful. I want to go out there. Big sky country.

I recently went, you know, comedian Chris Fairbanks, one of the funniest guys around. Oh my goodness. One of the funniest guys around. Oh, my goodness. One of the funniest guys. Yeah. The only person I've ever seen rock a couch and sweater better than my own son. When he rocked a couch and sweater I brought for him from Vancouver and I paid him $10 to wear it because it was scratchy and itchy. But I said, you can have $10 to wear it. And then we went to go see hamilton and then

jonathan groff uh king george himself said cool sweater now my now my son watches him on mind hunter where he hunts down serial killers it's just a world of connections jesse montana missoula montana can i tell you a chris fairbanks joke that i think about all the time. Like all the time. Please do. It's about those owls that are always wearing graduation mortarboards. I'm already laughing. And Fairbanks goes, huh,

haven't seen you on campus all year. Okay, anyway. I recently went on a road trip with my father and my husband to the small town of Chester, Montana. My dad invited us to tag along while he changed out an ATM. He's the vice president for a rural credit union, and he has to perform this task frequently and all alone, so he was excited for the company. He lured us by suggesting that we visit Spencer's Highway Bar and Grill on the way back. Wanting both beer and scenery, we obliged. Chester and Spencer's were all we could have hoped for. We discussed almost everything we could think of on the drive when on my way home, my dad said that Jimmy Fallon is the most talented performer to have ever come out of Saturday Night Live.

Wow. This independent film of a road trip letter suddenly took a weird left turn. My husband and I were, to be honest, aghast. There are dozens of other people better than Jimmy Fallon, right? Please affirm that my dad is just taking a wildly unpopular opinion to be fun and contrary. Well, first of all, Mikaela, I hope I'm pronouncing your name correctly. M-I-K-Y-L-A. M-I-K-Y-L-A seriously Mikaela you and your husband who I know is named Robert need to write this up as

a screenplay adult children yeah adult children driving around Montana with their dad as he changes out ATMs in rural outposts is a great beginning and middle of a great movie that's a great, the beginning of a,

and middle of a great movie. And I hope Spencer's highway bar and grill is maybe the good third act. I don't know. It sounds like a pretty good place, but whole well, look, I thought about putting this one in the New York times magazine. Cause I just love this letter so much.

It was just not nicely written letter. But then I realized Jimmy Fallon might read it. Yeah. I love Jimmy Fallon. I love Jimmy Fall it yeah i love jimmy fallon i love jimmy fallon i love you jimmy fallon i know you must you must be a listener certainly um you must be must be very very funny person it takes an incredible amount of skill to host a show night after night after night like that and just a champion broadcaster i loved it that time back when i used to be on television and i got to go to a party at the emmys and you were there

and we pretended to laser sword fight like in star wars i love your your energy and everything else and i i i don't i want you to know uh we are not judging you. Your skilled impressions. We're judging Mikaela's dad. But Jesse Thorne, I put it to you. One word answer only. Front or back. Is Jimmy Fallon the most talented performer to have ever come out

of Saturday Night Live? Front or back? Can I please say some nice stuff about Jimmy Fallon too so he doesn't get mad at me if he listens to this? I was giving you an out. You could have said back and it could have meant anything, but okay. The answer is front, not back. I'm sorry, Mikaela's dad. You like who you like and you're entitled to your opinion. I guess I'm actually ruling for Mikaela's dad because I think that he is being sincere. And I bet he's got some interesting arguments to make as to why he's right and you're wrong, Makayla. I think you

just have to hash it out on another incredible road trip. Let's take a quick break. When we come back, we hear from past litigants about raisins, lint traps and lakes. And lakes. Hello, teachers and faculty. This is Janet Varney. I'm here to remind you that listening to my podcast, The JV Club with Janet Varney, is part of the curriculum for the school year. Learning about the teenage years of such guests as Alison Brie,

Vicki Peterson, John Hodgman, and so many more is a valuable and enriching experience. One you have no choice but to embrace because yes, listening is mandatory. The JV Club with Janet Varney is available every Thursday on Maximum Fun or wherever you get your podcasts. Thank you. And remember, no running in the halls. Thank you. And remember, you're on the go, call S-T-O-P-P-P-A-D-I. It'll never fit. No, it will. Let me try. If you need a laugh and you're on the go, try S-T-O-P-P-P-D-C-O-O.

Ah, we are so close. Stop podcasting yourself. A podcast from MaximumFun.org. If you need a laugh and you're on the go. from MaximumFun.org. If you need a laugh, then you're on the go. Judge Hodgman,

we're taking a quick break from clearing the docket. We are headed to San Francisco and the Sidney Goldstein Theater at San Francisco Sketch Fest. This is going to be an extraordinary night, Judge Hodgman, an extraordinary night.

Yeah, you have no idea how extraordinary it's going to be. Listen to the end of this episode to learn just how extraordinary it's going to be. Listen to the end of this episode to learn just how extraordinary it's going to be. Because at the end of this episode, I add an element to this show that is going to bring the Sidney Goldstein Theater down. It's not going to bring the house down. It's a very beautiful, structurally sound theater. theater. We're so excited to get back out there and see your covered faces in January, especially at the San Francisco Sketch Fest. If you can get to the Sketch Fest, do it. I would encourage you to go to sfsketchfest.com and buy tickets for our show and then any other or all of the other shows.

It's such a spectacular event across the city of San Francisco. And of course, we couldn't do Sketch Fest last year. No one could for reasons that are obvious. I think this year is going to be really, really special. But you know, there cannot be live justice unless there is injustice.

If you are in the Bay Area or planning to be there on January 22nd, 2022, and you have a case for the show, submit it now, please, at MaximumFun.org slash JJHO. Let us know you have a case you'd like to hear heard live on stage at the Sketch Fest live justice program of Judge John Hodgman, 1-22-22 at the Sidney Goldstein Theater, sfsketchfest.com, Maximfun.org, slash JJHO.

Hey, I've got another request, Jesse, real quick. The holidays are coming up, and we're going to have a Judge John Hodgman holiday office party. Oh. Yeah. You and me and the J crew are going to get together, and we're going to sample a beverage, a beverage combo that I just heard about this week. Matt and Dan have a dispute.

I think I saw this. Yeah. Dan wants to take Matt to court because Matt likes, as a traditional holiday beverage, he likes to have eggnog mixed with Sprite. Wowie zowie. Yeah. We're going to end up. There's only one way to find out who's right. Gracious. We're all going to drink some eggnog and Sprite.

Bless my stars. And I would ask you, the listeners, who are not Dan and Matt, or at least not this Dan and Matt, because they already got their thing. Do you have a holiday beverage, cocktail, mocktail that's a little bit odd or weird? Maybe some mulled Dr. Pepper. That's a traditional thing. Some hot lemony Dr. Pepper at the holidays. That's an old Southern thing. Or maybe you've got a little

appetizer or a weird holiday food that you just have to have at the holidays that is a little bit in the eggnog and Sprite category of eccentric or peculiar that you'd like me and Jesse and Jennifer Marmer to taste live on microphone. We won't do the munching on the mics. We're not going to mess with our misophonic audience. We'll munch off mic, but we'll get some live reactions. Hey, send it in, won't you? Write to me, Hodgman at MaximumFun.org. And it doesn't matter what holiday it is, by the way. It doesn't have to even be a winter-based holiday. If you've got a holiday tradition, a traditional food,

appetizer, something that's fairly, like, I don't need to roast a goose for goose for this podcast you know what i'm saying something that's a little bit easier to put together even a fine fat goose no i'm even not even a fine fat one uh if you got a little if you got a holiday tradition that you want to share with us uh even maybe that's not food or drink but something else that we can we can try on air hey send it to us, won't you? Hodgman at MaximumFun.org. And of course, don't forget to go to SketchFest, sfsketchfest.com for tickets to our show. Jesse Thorne, what do you have coming up? Well, it's almost the holidays, as you mentioned. We're getting close to the end of the time when I can ask people to buy their holiday gifts from the Put This On shop. But there are so many wonderful things waiting for you there. A lot of folks bought those 100-ish year old college football charms. Yeah, those are great.

A lot of folks, I guess, went to those universities and ordered them for folks who went to those universities. So thank you. There are still a fair number available. I got a pretty big collection of them. I don't know. I thought I would mention, you know, I have this jersey from the Mexican Professional Baseball League, the Mexican League, the Liga Mexicana, for a team that played in Mexico City called the Electricistas. And I bought it in Mexico City. I looked it up, and this team only played in the Mexican League for like two years in the 30s. So this jersey is from the 30s. It's an original jersey from the 1930s. It's vest style, and it's one of the coolest things I've ever had. We also have, there's a Victorian tug of war metal made of silver.

I just put that in my shopping cart. Hang on, let me take it out of there. I literally just put that in my shopping cart. I'm removing it. I'm going to let one of the listeners get it. It's such a cool. You can order it with or without chain. That's how you know I'm really telling the truth.

I was looking at the options. That's a great gift for somebody. I didn't even know who I was going to buy it for. I was just like, someone's going to love this tug of war medal. And I put it in my shopping cart. You should put it in your shopping cart, someone out there. I've made a section of the store that's called Jesse's Picks. And it's a few of the things that I love the most among the things that are currently available

in our shop. You can find it just by clicking on Jesse's P at put this on shop.com. Um, there are many wonderful and beautiful things. And I also just put a bunch of stuff on sale. So if you're looking for a bargain on a bargain, I'm going to be honest, everything, everything in our store is a bargain. Uh, it's all better and less expensive than what you'd buy in a store, a store store. But, uh, yeah, there's a, there's a big sale section with a lot of things on sale. So go to put this on shop dot com for your holiday shopping. Get something special.

Don't buy some baloney at the department store. Yeah, don't get department store baloney. Go to a deli. You want a belt buckle for the state of Montana to buy for your dad. Mikaela, go to put this on shop dot com. These Montana and Oklahoma state belt buckles are fantastic. Put this on shop.com. We'll be back in just a second on the judge,

John Hodgman podcast. Welcome back to the judge, John Hodgman podcast. Here's something from Alison. Oh, Jennifer Marmer. We're going to need to bleep some words in this one. Noted. Allison writes, Jimmy Spilter, that son of a b****.

In a drunken stupor, my best friend Jimmy gave me a fuzzy coat that was meant to be mine. We traded jackets. We shook on it. Days later, he told me he needed his jacket back because a random woman he isn't talking to anymore gave it to him. It's bulls**t. It was given to me fair and square. And now he is assuming custody of said jacket. And I want my full rights reinstated.

Help me, Judge Hodgman. This is also a movie. This is a whole character piece for like Kristen Wiig, I feel like. Would love it. Jimmy, that son of a Jimmy Spilter. We don't use last names very often on this show, but I'm going to say something. Spilter, you son of a. Kids, if you're listening, we were obviously bleeping out a word.

A word that I choose not to use in real life. As far as you're concerned, you can know that what I'm actually saying is son of a young Frankenstein. Jimmy Spilter, you son of a young Frankenstein. I hate you. All right. Jesse Thorne. We all agree that Jimmy Spilter is a son of a young frankenstein no question about that he's always coming around doing pulling stuff like this one jacket that's like how a frankenstein talks pretty much that's how a frankenstein talks

exactly and this is a this is a baby frankenstein yeah Because he's the son of a young Frankenstein. Right. Like, well, I'm Jackie. Oh, keep fire. Oh, make friend with hermit. Yeah. It's from Bride of Frankenstein. Yeah.

Throw flour in lake. Exactly. Jimmy Spilter. But here's the deal here's the thing obviously jimmy spilter has gone back on his word this was a handshake fair and square but i think it hinges on whether or not this woman he's not talking to anymore has asked him back for this coat whether he had permission to give it. Because Allison says he gave her the jacket, but there were reciprocal considerations. She gave him her jacket. Right.

This was a trade. This was not a contract with no considerations on one side, which contract is legally void. Each party received something in this exchange. Right. Well, this is another question. Is Jimmy Spilter, that son of a, he has now taken back the fuzzy jacket. Has he returned Allison's jacket? Has he even offered or did Allison?

I mean, this is what we in the Reddit AITA, am I the a whole community call a more info needed. So here are the contingencies, Allison. If this third party did not give Jimmy Spilter permission to trade the fuzzy jacket, you're in receipt of stolen goods. You got to give it back and get your jacket back fair and square. If Jimmy Spilter and this person had been out of contact and the person had never asked for this jacket back until now for, let's say, over six months, then it's abandoned property. It's fair and square. You keep the fuzzy jacket.

So I don't know which part of that decision tree you fall off. But I'll tell you one thing that I do know. Jimmy Spilter is a son of a b****. We have a letter here. We actually received a number of letters about our recent episode, The Veil of Honor. There were two things that were very controversial. Extraordinarily controversial. Yeah.

Yeah. A lot of people actually love raisins. They were very upset that I don't like raisins. I'm sorry, everybody. You like what you like. You like Jimmy Fallon? Great. I like Jimmy Fallon too.

You like raisins? Go for it. You like sultanas? Great. You like figs? Enjoy. You don't have to write me a letter about every raisin you ever ate. And the other thing that people were just like slamming at me was it's called a lint

trap, Jesse. Apparently. Lint trap was it's called a lint trap jesse apparently lint trap it's not a lint screen it's not a lint filter lint trap i was wondering whether that was a regionalism turns out the region of the united states mostly says lint trap i don't know lint screen is what i always called it then people were really mad that i was suggested that you go ahead and leave the lint screen full of lint. And then the next person or you next person to use it, cleans it off. People are like, you're, you're leaving work for others that you should be mindful of that. You're going back on your own word, judge John Hodgman, your own ruling, be mindful of the work you leave for others.

Fact is I approached that dryer. I approached that dryer. I'm presuming that it is a loaded weapon. I got to clean that screen. No matter what I'm going to check that screen no matter what. If I pull up a screen that's clean, then I've wasted my time. Be mindful of the work you leave for me. Leave that lint on for me to clear it out. So I know that it's not going to catch fire because one of the listeners sent in a picture of their next door neighbor's house burning down. And it happened the night before. Everyone's okay. But this listener said they determined it was a dryer fire. They call it a dryer because it rhymes with fire.

Be careful. Presume that that dryer is loaded up with lint and clear it out. John, be mindful of the work you leave for others. What greater pleasure is there than taking the lint out of the l you leave for others what greater pleasure is there than taking the lint out of the lint trap I know that is the greatest most satisfying activity of all chores

the way it peels out a lot of the comments on the Instagram account were saying that if you're in a communal laundry room people don't want to peel out other like the previous laundry doers link because it could have their underpants in it pubic hair am i allowed to say that on this show i guess it could you know whose pubic hair it probably is jimmy spilters Jimmy Spilter's pubes. Communal laundry situation.

Okay. I mean, if you want to go the extra mile and clear it out so that the next person doesn't have to touch Jimmy Spilter's pubes, that's nice of you, I guess. But the fact is you still got to clean it out. You got to check it every time. Check it every time. Check it every time, check it every time, check it every time. But as I say, there were some weird, there's some weird things that were mentioned in passing that we didn't have details for. And I got the details because I get what I want. For one thing, Teresa had told us that her mother clears the lint

trap. I'm forcing myself to say it in the middle of the cycle. And I didn't even know how you could possibly do that. So she wrote to her mother and her mother wrote, I bend down, put the clothes in the dryer, straighten up, close the dryer, adjust the settings, and then start it. Then I pull the lint screen out of the top of the dryer, clean it quickly and push it back in. Just habit, I guess. And of course it wouldn't work with all dries. I'd forgotten. There is, that's the, on certain dryers, the lint trap is a little thing you pull out of the top rather than inside the door of the drum i get it that makes sense now i understand brian meanwhile who likes raisins he was the one who started off this whole raisin debate saying who

doesn't like raisins and his wife laura said a lot of people judge john hodgman especially he had said that laura had a funny childhood rais story, but he didn't tell us what it was. What are you doing, Brian? So I wrote them and Laura wrote back with the story. It turns out Laura's mom is in the food industry. And when she was four years old, she got an enormous amount of raisins as a promotion or something. Laura, specificity to the soul of narrative, I would have asked your mom how much is an enormous amount like a peck, two pecks,

a bushel, a bushel and a peck, a bushel and a peck, a hug around the neck. Yay. I was going to say two giant scoops of raisins. And Laura wrote quote, because everyone assumes kids love raisins my mom sent

them in with me to my daycare class so i entered the room holding up these two huge plastic bags of plain raisins and i yelled raisins for the people it's a pretty good story cute cute kid finally we heard from amy who wrote who wrote to the show 10 years ago you will recall amy and her ex-boyfriend now roommate charles had a long dispute a long-standing dispute between which is the least Great Lake, which is the smallest Great Lake, Lake Erie or Lake Ontario. And I, because Lake Ontario is the smallest by surface area, whereas Lake Erie is the smallest by volume. It's the shallowest of the Great Lakes, little shallowy, I called it. So that dispute was submitted to us 10 years ago, and we didn't even know what was going on with these people at all. Well, guess what? They wrote us. And Amy writes in saying four things. One, Charles and I are indeed no longer neighbors. I'm sorry, they weren't roommates. They were

neighbors. And I'm like, I bet they're not neighbors anymore. And she says, right. Charles and I are indeed no longer neighbors. We got back together shortly after I wrote you 10 years ago and then got married in Rochester, New York in 2018. Congratulations. You stuck it out, even through this debate. Two, at our wedding, we revived the still unsettled debate at the time by asking our wedding guests to vote, which is the least great lake, Lake Ontario, Lake Erie. My maid of honor made topographic maps of each lake out of construction paper. Wow. Wow.

I hope you didn't ask her to do that that's not that if she volunteered fine but that's not a bride should never ask uh their maid of honor to make topographic maps under any circumstances and the guests voted by thumbtack which is this is my day and I want maps, topographic maps, and I want voting by thumbtack, not ballots, not marbles, thumbtacks. You're not the princess I am. I just figured out now what voting by thumbtack means, because I was about to say this is an election is rigged. But it means they are two. There were two topographic maps. You didn't make one for every member of the wedding party.

Right. And you walked by and you put a thumbtack in whichever one you thought was the least great. And the debate was fierce, predictably based on the number of Clelanders and Rochesterians in attendance. And guess what? It ended in a tie, a dead heat. They had to wait another three years before we, the J crew,

would finally resolve this issue. Lake Erie is the smallest lake. We still live in the same neighborhood in San Francisco that we did when I wrote you 10 years ago, now plus a cat, and finally for Charles accepted the defeat of little Shallowy with grace and rounded up to $1.25. That was their bet. $1.25 is a dollar in 2010 money, it turns out. A little bit more. Congratulations, you guys. Thanks. I'm sorry that you had to wait so long for justice. I hope that you are now able to finally move in together. I'm sure you were waiting for this ruling. Even though you've been married for three years, you were waiting on this ruling as to whether or not you could actually move in together. You can. You have my blessing.

You may cohabitate as a married couple. I thought of a good slogan, set of by words for Judge John Hodgman moving forward. Yes. It sort of hearkens back to the dawn of rap. Sure. What's these are? I think I know. His house is in the village though. You can talk, you can talk, you can bicker, you can talk, you can bicker, bicker, bicker, you can talk, you can talk, you can talk, talk, talk, bicker, bicker, bicker. You can talk you can talk you can bicker you can talk you can bicker bicker bicker you can talk you can talk you can talk talk talk bicker bicker bicker you can talk all you want but it's different than it was wow wow that of course is the opening patter song from the music man rock island you gotta know the territory you gotta know the territory it's different than it was that's

right and only keeps getting more different that's why you look forward and not back. Nostalgia is the most toxic impulse. Be mindful of the work you leave for others. People like what they like. We have touched on all of those laws and many other new ones here on the Judge John Hodgman podcast. podcast. Cash for the merchandise. Cash for the button hooks. Cash for the cotton goods. Cash for the hard goods. Cash for the fancy goods. Cash for the nuggets and the piggins and the frickins. Cash for the hog's head cask and the demijohn. Cash for the crackers and the pickles and the flypaper. Look, what do you talk? What do you talk? What do you talk? I'm just going to do the whole song. Come on. I'm not going to do the whole song. It makes you feel like you're on a train. It makes me in any point in the rest of my entire life, in which case I will definitely do the entire song. Hey, guess what? What's that?

You and I are going to do that song on stage at the San Francisco Sketch Fest. Wait, that song has like seven parts in it. We're going to do three and a half parts each. The docket is clear. That's it for another episode of Judge John Hodgman. Our producer is Jennifer Marmer. Our editor is Valerie Moffitt. Follow us on Twitter at Jesse Thorne and at Hodgman. We're on Instagram at Judge John Hodgman. Hashtag your Judge John Hodgman tweets, hashtag JJHO. If you want to talk about this episode, MaximumFun.reddit.com. If you have a case,

MaximumFun.org slash JJHO or email it to Hodgman at MaximumFun.org. We are looking for your cases. We're particularly looking for cases in the San Francisco Bay Area. So if you are in the Bay Area and might want to join us at SketchFest or might be willing to join us at SketchFest, make sure to mention that when you submit your case, because we are always excited to get great cases for our live shows. Otherwise, we'll probably end up just doing the whole Music Man top to bottom. And, you know, John's probably going to want to play Professor Harold Hill which is Jennifer beep this bulls**t Harold Hill that son of a b**ch that was the original first line we'll talk to you next time on the Judge John Hodgman podcast

hey everybody it's Judge John Hodgman here at the end of the credits. No longer very secret post-credit sequence. I just wanted to come back here to acknowledge a couple of listeners who I made reference to earlier in the program, whose names I couldn't remember. And luckily, I have the institutional memory of my email program. the institutional memory of my email program. I just want to thank listener Angela of Kansas City A for sending me these pictures of this corn buttering mechanism that Jesse referenced a long time ago here on the podcast. And also for referring to John, Jesse, and Jennifer, that's us as the J crew, something that I should have thought of a full year ago when we first started talking about the J squad, along with uh, Joel man up there in Maine,

who I will be seeing soon, although I'm not sure that we're going to be recording while I'm up there. So we'll see what happens anyway. Shout out to the J crew. And finally, I also want to thank listener rich, rich has got a great last name, but I not going to read last names cause I don't want to get in trouble.

Um, but rich is the one who wrote in pointing out that his neighbor's house burned down. He says, everyone is fine, but it's a disaster emotionally and financially, as I can only imagine. And the presumption is that it was a dryer fire, honest to God or whatever. So, uh, my condolences to Rich's family for the loss of their home. I hope that they, well, it's a terrible thing to happen to a person and as a bad time, uh time right now. So I hope that they are okay. And I'm glad that they're all safe and sound. So thank you, Angela and Rich. And if there's someone else whose name I forgot to mention and then forgot just now again, write and remind me. Hodgman at MaximumFun.org. Please send

in your cases for the Bay Area and for wherever you may live. And thanks again for listening. Bye-bye.