Judge John Hodgman - Daylight Savings Crime

Episode Date: November 27, 2019

This week, Daylight Savings Crime. Kari files suit against her husband Joshua. Kari and Joshua had solar panels installed on their house in July of 2019. Since then, Joshua has been monitoring their solar production and is actively trying to make the household more energy efficient. Kari believes that Joshua’s interest in energy efficiency has gotten out of hand. Joshua would like the whole family to get on board with his energy saving goals. Guest bailiff Ify Nwadiwe from Who Shot Ya? at Maximumfun.org and Nerdificent Podcast fills in for Jesse Thorn. You can follow him on twitter @IfyNwadiwe, and send him DIY film fest recommendations. Thank you to Neil Pogorelsky for naming this week’s case! To suggest a title for a future episode, follow Judge John Hodgman on Facebook. We regularly put out a call for submissions. — SUBSCRIBE TO THIS PODCAST in APPLE PODCASTS or the RSS FEED  

Welcome to the Judge John Hodgman podcast. I'm guest bailiff, if you're wide away from Who Shot Ya? on MaximumFun.org. This week, daylight savings crime. Carrie files suit against her husband, Joshua. Carrie and Joshua had solar panels installed on their house in July of 2019. Since then, Joshua has been monitoring their solar production and is actively trying to make the household more energy efficient. Carey believes that Joshua's interest in energy efficiency has gotten out of hand. Joshua would like the whole family to get on board with his energy savings goal. Who's right?

Who's wrong? Only one can decide. Please rise as Judge John Hodgman enters the courtroom and presents an obscure cultural reference. Our people, Bruce, you laugh at at them they can do this and you laugh they can split the very fabric of reality blast a hundred thousand tons of sand into the sky they are tiny and stupid and vicious but please listen to them please i am slow and dying. I need only reach the sun. I've always loved you, though I was born a galaxy away. I have always served you.

The same power, the sun's power fuels us both. You hold it here. You store it. I beg you for a suffering world. Release it. Guest bailiff Ify Wadiwe, can you please swear the litigants in? Carrie and Joshua, please rise and raise your right hands. Do you swear to tell the truth, the whole truth, and nothing but

the truth, so help you God or whatever? I do. I do. Do you swear to abide by Judge John Hodgman's ruling, despite the fact that you were probably expecting Jesse Thorne, but instead you got one sexy, buff, chocolatey podcaster instead. I do.

I do. Judge Hodgman, you may proceed. Kerry and Joshua, you may be seated. Sexy, buff, chocolatey podcaster. Ify Wadiwe joins us as today's guest bailiff. You might know Ify from another Maximum Fun show, the excellent movie podcast called Who Shot Ya? And if you don't know that show and you don't know iffy come on you're making a mistake he also holds the nerdificent podcast with danny fernandez in which they take a deep

dive into a different nerdy subject each week and because oh bailiff my bailiff jesse thorn is feeling a little uh poorly and his tum tum if he jumped in saving the day like a superhero to guest bailiff this episode of judge john hodgen podcast thank you so much if he's i'm so glad you're here oh i'm happy to be here got this cool police outfit that i'm wearing you should know this is a totally non-visual medium. Well, you know, just imagine it, listeners. It's real tight. Yeah. Awesome.

You were listening along to the cultural reference. You can make a guess, too, if you feel like it, Ify, but for an immediate summary judgment in one of yours favors, can either you, Carrie, or you, Joshua, or you, Ify, name the piece of culture I referenced when I entered the courtroom? Carrie, why don't we start with you? One of the Batman movies. I entered the courtroom. Carrie, why don't we start with you? One of the Batman movies. One of the Batman movies. Valid guess. You want to take a shot at which one? Could be any of them,

so long as it is The Dark Knight, which is the Batman movie, as far as I'm concerned. That's the one I was going to say, actually, yeah. We'll put in The Dark Knight. Now, Joshua, your turn. What's your guess? It's got to have something to do with Leonardo DiCaprio. I don't know what, but it sounds like something he'd be involved in. I'm sorry. Am I talking to Joshua or Martin Scorsese? Why? Why does it have to have anything to do with Leonardo DiCaprio? There are other actors in the world, Mr. Scorsese. Why? Why is it always Leonardo DiCaprio? I mean, it's energy. It's Leonardo DiCaprio. It's something good. Whatever you said, I really liked it. So I'm guessing Leonardo had some part to play in it.

Well, I think I can already rule on this case. Should we even continue? I know that Leonardo DiCaprio is a listener to this podcast. I don't know that. I hope that's true. Look, he's a very talented actor, but it doesn't have to be in every Martin Scorsese movie, right, Ify? No, not at all. You know, even though I do want the Leonardo cut of Taxi Driver, let's see what he does with it. How many reboots of Taxi Driver can we get in 2019? We already got one.

Yeah, we sure did. I'm ready for another. Let's buckle up. Yeah. Ify and I, we're movie buffs. We're talking about Joker. It's just a Taxi's a taxi driver king of comedy mashup right yeah that's exactly what we said on the pod who shot you your podcast about movies that everyone should be listening to oh yeah i'm not stealing your idea though i got that idea because at the alamo draft house we're gonna carry and joshua we're gonna give you true justice in a moment but we have to talk about joker for a second my son is 14 years old and i took him to see joker because it had to happen he did not understand the context in which this movie was made he did not understand the director's really dumb comments about who can be funny in this age of pc wokeness or whatever he did not understand that it was a celebration of a incel creep he just knew it was

the joker and he's got good taste in movies and at the alamo draft house in downtown brooklyn which is where i like to see the movies if not at the nighthawk pavilion they knew what was going on because before the movie they showed the trailer for king of comedy and then they showed the trailer for taxi driver the original trailers. Those, yeah, those are some cinema nerds. They're like, oh, we got you. Yeah. And my son, I felt him during the trailer for Taxi Driver lean in, like just lean forward,

watching it wrapped. And then he turned to me and he said, why have you never shown me this this movie it's been a long time since i've seen taxi driver but i think i have some memories of why i would not show it to someone when they were 10 or 11 or 12 14 i have to go back and take a look but i was happy because clearly he was responding to the movie making yeah even in the trailer and that's why after he saw joker he's like what do you think i was like it wasn't as bad as i thought and he goes responding to the movie making. Yeah. Even in the trailer. And that's why after he saw Joker, he's like, what'd you think? I was like, it wasn't as bad as I thought. And he goes, that was the greatest movie I've ever seen.

I'm like, I know, because I didn't show you Taxi Driver. That's my failure as a father. I didn't show you Taxi Driver when you were nine. We've got to sit down and watch this. Yeah, see, you've just got to jump on that. I've shown my three-year-old daughter Monsters Ball already. I had to get her to drink that in.

Joshua and Carrie, do you have children? Yes, two. How old are they, if I may ask? 15 and 11. Do you guys want to have a taxi driver party? I don't know how much energy the TV soaks up in your household whether you're allowed to watch movies anymore because i know you're trying to conserve energy you have to show your kids stuff that's a little bit above their pay grade i think you gotta be open to showing

stuff that challenges them but in any case all right so if he did you have a guess for the cultural reference or no i'm on uh team carry already i'm thinking it's batman i think it's the tim burton batman i think it's a tim burton batman i think it's a tim burton batman i'm so excited by your guesses because they're all wrong but they're all pretty close it's because i said bruce at the top right was that oh yeah you know what it's from it's from a comic book called the dark knight returns by frank miller Klaus Janssen, and Lynn Varley. It's Superman's monologue after he stops the nuclear weapon and a blast sand up in the sky

and he's blocked off from the sun because he survived a full-on nuclear explosion, flying desperately to try to get to the sun because that is the source of the yellow sun of Earth, our planet, his adopted planet, is what gives him his powers. son of earth our planet his adopted planet is what gives him his powers and even though frank miller is a problematic person politically he went through some stuff i think he's very ill now but i think that he's kind of come around a little bit i've read some interviews lately

where he's like yeah i was going through some hard things and i said some things that i shouldn't have said i don't think he's made full amends for the bad work that he put out after 9-11 but this is still an important part of comic storytelling yeah do you feel okay about me including it if he yes yeah yeah i mean dark knight 2 is like a very integral speaking of joker they borrowed one of the scenes from uh the Knight. That shot of him smoking a cigarette off to the side of the TV show is a direct reference to an illustration from that. So anyway, yeah, there you go. Are we still doing this?

Yes, we are. The Judge John Hodgman podcast, mashed up with Who Shot Ya? Movie talk and justice talk with me, Ify, and Joshua and Carrie. Carrie, you bring the case to this court. Tell us the nature of the dispute and what the problem is. Like you said, we got solar panels in July of this year. They were installed. I was very excited and Josh was very excited and never stopped talking about it. He would check the meters like once an hour and come in and report how much production the solar panels were doing and let me know about it. And then he would

change things around the house, unplug different appliances, and then go check the meters again and see if it made any effect. And then he'd run around the house and it was fun for a while to watch, but then it just got a little overwhelming. And where do you live? In Minneapolis. Oh, so that's interesting because you have these solar panels and yet you have no sunshine. Yeah. Last night, Josh said, oh, we just lost another hour of sun i know as we're recording this it's just a day or two after we fell back and you lost an hour of precious weak middling northern sun up there in minnesota i'm being facetious of course i love minneapolis st paul i recently visited there and

had a great time but it is a cold dark place place in the winter. When the sun shines, it shines hard and it shines hard upon your panels, Joshua. What inspired you to install the panels? How did you go about doing it in case some listeners want to do it? And then we'll talk a little bit more about your mania. Yeah. So I've just always been an environmentalist and wanted to kind of take it to the next level. And we looked at panels for a while and there was a company, All Energy Solar, that puts them in Minneapolis. And they came over, they looked at the house. It wasn't going to work on the house, but then they said, you know what, your garage gets a lot of sun. I said, let's do it. Let's get them up on the garage. So they put them up there and they said, this should provide you two-thirds

of your electricity. And I said, well, that's great, but I want it to provide 100%. And that's the goal I've been going at ever since. Well, if the solar panel company says this is going to provide two-thirds of your electricity, I mean, it's their job. We have to come in with the consumption part. They got us two-thirds of the way and I'll bring us the other third with great ideas around the house. And so that's what I'm working on right now. You're talking about reducing your consumption of electricity so that it zeroes out. Correct. So when we had a home in Western Massachusetts, and it's a little hard for me to say that in the past tense, but it's true. It's in the past now. Our dear neighbors, the LeBlancs, Dave and Cindy and Aaron, they installed solar panels on their house,

but basically they were selling the electricity that they were generating to the power company who was then crediting their account. Is that how it works for you? Yeah. So basically when we're producing more energy than we need, we're basically selling it back to the electric company. And then when obviously when we're not able to produce enough, then the company sends us their electricity. Right. So you're not just hoarding it all for yourself.

Correct. So my question is, maybe the two thirds is part of the deal, right? Maybe the power company wants a third of that of the solar energy that you're collecting to sell to other consumers. Yeah, I'm not sure. What I do know is that the closer I can get to zero, the happier I feel. So I can say that much. I have a feeling that our listeners are less interested in the mechanics of solar energy production and resale and more interested in your feelings. So let's talk about them. You've sent in some evidence, some photographic evidence. Both of you have. All these photos can be seen at the Judge John Hodgman page at MaximumFun.org

or on our Instagram account at Judge John Hodgman, all one word, all small letters, including evidence submitted by Carrie. But to the point of this discussion, a photo of your energy and solar meters, the ones that you like to check. Tell me about what I'm seeing in this photograph on the side of this discussion, a photo of your energy and solar meters, the ones that you like to check. Tell me about what I'm seeing in this photograph on the side of the house, Carrie. There's two meters. Right. One is like our energy meter, our consumption, and one is our production.

So you can see by looking at those meters how much energy the panels are producing and how much we're using as a household. And is that a real-time measure, Joshua? Like, what's the measurement unit? Yeah, it's very real. Yep. Oh. You know, if the direction arrow is going to the left, that means you're producing. If it's going to the right, it means you're consuming.

And it shows the numbers right there in real time for you to see like in the moment how you're doing. And so when you go out there, like what's a readout that would make you happy? What would that look like? Numbers? Arrows? I don't understand. Yeah, it'd be both. The arrow is going to the left. That's my first indicator that I'm going to have a smile on my face because that means we're producing. If I'm not seeing a big difference between kind of how much we've consumed and what we're producing, then I'm also happy. You know, the closer those numbers are, the happier I am. So I look at two numbers and then the direction that the arrow is going. So Carrie also sent in a photo that she took of you looking at these

meters. It's something of a creep shot,rie i have to say like you could have gone outside with him but instead it's a photo from inside the house taking a photo through the window of joshua looking at the meters the window itself is strategically situated so that we cannot see if he is smiling or scowling so i don't know what he's seeing at this moment i do see that he's wearing a grateful dead t-shirt for which I will make no comment I do want to point out that it's the Grateful Dead shirt with the like lightning

bolt on it so it could just be a sign of his fanaticism for electricity and not necessarily the band itself and you know just wanted to put that out for you your honor. Joshua does not require your excuses he likes what he likes, and he likes the Grateful Dead, right, Joshua? Very much. Very much. Okay. And I also see a

variety of pillar candles on the windowsill, which to me suggests that Joshua prefers that you don't use electricity at all in order to make him happy. Carrie, does that reflect what I'm seeing pretty accurately? Pretty accurately, yeah. Yeah. Tell us again how often Joshua is out there staring at his meters? Well, it has decreased since the summer, but in the summer it was like once an hour. Is that true? I'm not, I'm not lying. Once an hour? What are you doing all day, Joshua? Do you have a job? Not in the summertime, no. That kind of is my summer job, to make sure that the production is what we need it to be. Yep.

Do you work in education? Yeah, I'm a social worker in an elementary school. Oh, that's awesome. Fantastic. And Carrie, what do you do all day, if I may ask? I'm a teacher. Oh, wonderful. Carrie, what do you do all day, if I may ask?

I'm a teacher. Oh, wonderful. Joshua, do you feel that going out once an hour is helpful to your cause? What I like to do are things that bring me joy. And if I go out there and it makes me happy, then yeah, it is helpful. Yeah. Right now, it's getting wintertime. I'm not out there as much. But everything, when I go out there and I see good numbers, I get happy

and I want to come in and share it with Carrie and kind of let her know that like we're doing good. And so it brings me joy. It makes me happy. So I'm going to share. What was the best hour? What was the outcome that you were the happiest about? Was it just that it was really sunny and you were producing a lot? Or was there a situation where you were doing some A B testing and you realized that if you unplugged every electric device that you could zero out? I think a little bit of both. I think when I realized like, oh yeah, most of the appliances I don't even need to think about because they don't take up much electricity. But for example, the laundry, the dryer just crushes electricity and I could start hanging clothes, that brought me more joy than

like anything else. That made me really happy to hang clothes in the backyard, hang them in the basement. It like, that brought me a lot of joy. Let's take a quick recess. We'll be back in just a moment on the Judge John Hodgman Podcast. Hello, teachers and faculty. This is Janet Varney. I'm here to remind you that listening to my podcast, The JV Club with Janet Var many more is a valuable and enriching experience. One you have no choice but to embrace because, yes, listening is mandatory. The JV Club with Janet Varney is available every Thursday on Maximum Fun or wherever you get your podcasts. Thank you. And remember, no running in the halls. Court is back in session.

Let's return to the courtroom for more justice. And what other things did you learn about your energy consumption that surprised you in terms of stuff that you could turn off that would save a lot of energy? Well, I think that we can put our router to sleep at night, and that kind of saves us energy. The kids have a PS4 that sucks up a lot of electricity that we can put our router to sleep at night, and that kind of saves us energy. The kids have a PS4 that sucks up a lot of electricity that we can turn off when they're not using it. Things like that are things that, you know, kind of easy things that we've been doing. I think that they're easy. Things that connect you to the modern world. True. Yeah. Fair. That's interesting. Does

turning off the router save a lot of energy, or is it just a marginal thing? I'd say it's fair. That's interesting. Does turning off the router save a lot of energy or is it just a marginal thing? I'd say it's a little more than marginal. It's a little more than like, you know, charging your phones or having your radio plugged in. But it's not, it's not a lot of energy, no. Okay. What was the best outcome you ever had? Because I know you also sent in a spreadsheet. Have you ever listened to the podcast before?

I've listened to a show before, yeah. Oh, to one episode. I did. Yes. So you may not know the precedent in this court that dudes who send in spreadsheets tend to be looked upon poorly. I did not know that. No. Well, it's in part because it's asking me to do homework that I don't feel like doing. And second, it tends to suggest a certain hobgoblin-y ordered mind. The spreadsheet has a lot of numbers. I have a current energy usage tab and a projected 20-year energy tab. What I'm hoping to glean from this data

in your interpretation of it for me, please. What row, column, cell should I be looking at on your spreadsheet that really shows that what you're doing is awesome and not attentively weird? Last year during July, we used 930 kilowatt hours of electricity. This year during the same time, we used 27. And so for me, that shows like we're making a major difference. Yeah. And so were you a net producer in July for sure?

All of July? You must have made a lot more energy than you used. We were just a little bit under making that because we did have the air conditioner going in the summertime and air conditioners. What? I know. How dare you? Carrie, if Joshua is conserving energy around the margins, but he's still leaving the air conditioner on, this, I think, undercuts your case that what he's doing is overly disruptive to the household.

I would say that it probably wasn't Josh's decision to run the air conditioner. Okay. And, yeah. Yeah, because you want to live like human beings. Yes. Right. Yeah. Joshua, would you prefer to turn off the air conditioner in July?

Because it gets hot in Minnesota. I mean, there's a few days I'm going to want it on. But most of the time, I've always just been a window fan guy. But, yeah, there's times in the summer where, yeah, in July you've got to have it on for a week or two because it gets hot. So we turn it on. But air conditioning consumes a lot of energy. And I would imagine if this were a preoccupation for you, as opposed to a fun hobby, that having that air conditioner on would drive you a little bananas. It's painful. How do you feel when the air conditioner is on and you know your stats are going down?

You know, I'm good most of the day, but then like as we move into maybe like the evening and it's been on for, you know, 12, 15 hours and I'm thinking, I think we can probably open up some windows and get a fan on. And I know that I'm the only one that's thinking that, you know, I have to make that decision and say, okay, let's just sacrifice tonight and have the AC on. Is it hard for you to relax at that point? No, once we decide it's on, then I just let it go. Okay, all right. That's pretty flexible for a dude with a system.

I like that. Carrie, how has Joshua's need to monitor energy use affected your life in any other ways? Okay, so he has the spreadsheet. That's fine. It's not fine. We know it's not fine. But I don't have to look at it, really, you know. Well, that's has the spreadsheet. That's fine. It's not fine. We know it's not fine. But I don't have to look at it, really, you know.

Well, that's a good point. Is he making you look at the spreadsheet? Because you know how it makes me feel. I hate it. Well, I only had to look at it once, and it was overwhelming. Tell me about the day he made you look at the spreadsheet. It was the day that the solar panel rep was coming to our house to sell us the solar panels. the solar panel rep was coming to our house to sell us the solar panels. And Josh, before we even had made the decision really, he had put together that spreadsheet to like project out

what kind of savings it would be for us and for energy savings, like money and energy savings. So he put that together. He showed me, I could tell he was super excited about it, but I'm not a numbers person. So it's like hard to take it all in anyway. So then the rep comes and he starts to open up his iPad to show us like his spreadsheet with projections. And then Josh showed him his spreadsheet with projections and the rep was like blown away because he'd never had anybody show him their own projections before. That's when you, Carrie, just need to walk out of the scene, go into your bedroom, shut the door, turn on the air conditioner, and take a nap and let the spreadsheet boys do their thing. Yeah. It's not your hobby is the point. No. like to me you're not right i mean obviously i trust that you value the savings of

energy is particularly now increasing global catastrophe we all need to be doing our part but joshua mentioned that he loves not merely going out to read the meters, but also to come back and report to you on the meters. Does that also happen hourly? When we were, you know, at home during the summer, it did. How did that feel? interesting but then it's not only the reporting of like when things are going well but also the reporting of when the numbers aren't going the way he wants them to go how would joshua appear to you when things were not going well what would his mood be like and how would that make you feel he'd be kind of down about it and i'd like feel guilty oh man, what am I supposed to like, I don't know, turn the air conditioner off.

It's like he thinks about it so much that when it's not good, then I feel guilty that I'm not doing something right to keep the numbers up. Joshua, when you hear that, how does that make you feel that Carrie feels guilt when you express your dismay? Well, it doesn't make me feel good. I don't want my wife to feel bad. So no, I don't feel good when I hear that. No. Why do you feel it's important to share your hobby with her when obviously she doesn't care the same way you do about it? And that should be fine. Yeah, I you know, I think there's two things. There's like the numbers part of it, and then there's the environmental part. And also, I love that we're making these changes that are making a difference in the world. And so I want to be able to share that in a way with her. And maybe the language I speak with numbers doesn't work, but I want to share we're doing

this together. And I think it's more than just getting panels or getting a Prius. There's things we can do day to day to make a difference. And I guess I was trying to get her to be excited as I was about it. You know what I mean? Yeah, like when a spouse wants someone to watch a movie that they love and the other person isn't into it and then you feel like you have to make them love it.

I think that was Judge John Hudgman episode number three. You can't make someone love what you love necessarily. Look, I hope you understand that I support this hobby. I support what you're doing, Joshua. But Carrie, you're the one who's bringing this case to court. Obviously, it's caused you some distraction, some damages. It says here there is something that I should ask you about called the Wi-Fi incident. What does that refer to? There's been a couple incidents. The first one was, this was after

Josh learned that if he turned the router off at night, then it would save us, save some energy. So he turned it off, but he didn't really tell anybody that he was turning it off. And then our son had the Google Home Mini hooked up for an alarm clock in the morning. The alarm didn't go off because the Wi-Fi wasn't hooked up. Oh, and what happened? Your son was expelled from school? Yeah. You know, I realized, oh, he's not up yet. I should probably go wake him up.

So that was the first one. Then actually just recently on Halloween, same son was having some friends over for Halloween. They were watching scary movies. And then at 10.30, the router turned off and the movie was stopped. How did the router turn off? He's got it on a timer. I didn't know such a thing existed, Joshua.

The problem was it was a weekday. You know, on the weekdays, 10.30, everyone goes to bed, but the kids didn't have school Friday, so I didn't think of that. So I was already kind of in my bedtime mode because I had to work the next day, the kids didn't have school.. So I was already kind of in my bedtime mode because I had to work the next day. The kids didn't have school. So it was just my bad on that one. How does a router have a timing? What are you, MacGyver? No, I didn't make it myself. I just bought a timer where it's like you do with your thermostat. You set it and forget it. It just sets the time and turns it

on and off at different times during the day. What? Where did you get it? I just got it on Amazon. Just a timer that you plug your router into. Is it just for routers or for any electrical? It's for any electrics. Okay. So I have a power strip that I have a few different things on and all that goes off then at 1030 at night. So you're buying electrical equipment to turn off your electrical equipment.

That's true. What movie did you ruin for your child? The Apostle, I think. Or maybe Scream. Yeah, one of those. I can't remember which one they were on at the time. I just watched Scream again for the first time probably in 15 years. And it held up.

Biffy, what do you think about that movie i like scream i was gonna ask did you get your kids to get uh tales from the hood in the rotation i think it's i think it's a great poignant movie surprisingly the title will trip you up but right you know i'd sneak that in for the next halloween uh, noted. We're curating a really good film festival for your kids. It's going to be Taxi Driver, Tales from the Hood. I'll throw in Midsommar

because I think that's the best movie I've seen all year and it's definitely above their pay grade and it's a movie about sunshine. You're going to love it, Joshua. It's basically the main character is the sun. You'll be able to watch this film festival in 15 minute increments over 35 days so long as it's sunny out and the timer allows it and otherwise your kids can sit just wearing uh you know light pajamas in a stifling hot non-air-conditioned room with the playstation 4 thrown in the well they can make toys out of wood is that the life you want to lead for your family

joshua no that's that's not the life we want no over now almost a decade's worth of judge john hodgman's when it is a heterosexual married couple that the husband is usually has a weird system that he observes obsessively to the detriment and uh distraction of his family and i usually rule against him but right now i'm not seeing what any major damages here aside from your guilt which i think is important and i think that joshua is now alerted to is there any other damages that i should consider? The air drying of clothes. Is that a chore that redounds to you rather than the insisting that you do this air drying of clothes? Does this make your life harder in any particular way? Not now, but I feel like once his joy wears off of hanging the clothes, then I'll probably be asked to help. hanging the clothes, then I'll probably be asked to help.

Is there any precedent of Joshua finding joy in a particular hobby or obsession and then losing that joy? Not that I can think of. Because I can tell you right now, this hobby is going to turn very dark soon, Joshua. I mean, you already lost an hour of daylight and daylight savings. It's going to get cold and dark in Minnesota. And you're going to be going out there and checking those meters. And when you come in, you're not going to be feeling good. And Carrie's going to be feeling guilty. And I'm worried that it's going to turn into this shame spiral that'll make it a very grim New Year's Eve for you. How are you mentally preparing yourself for using more energy than you generate? As I suspect you will, right? Yeah, you know, I haven't gotten that far. I think I'm kind of in a day-to-day right now. And, you know, we're going to Austin for New Year's. We'll get away from the house for four days. So I think that will also give us a little bridge through the darkness. And yeah, we'll just keep pushing to spring when sun comes out and people get happy.

Carrie, if I were to rule in your favor, how would you have me rule? I would have you rule that Joshua has to recognize that just by having purchased the solar panels, we're making a difference. I can be happy with that. He can do what he needs to do, but I can just be happy being happy about the solar panel decision. And he needs to find a notebook to put all his number scratchings that I find around the house in. Yes, you did send in evidence of notebooks full of sort of John Doe journal entries from the movie Seven. Yes, it's not in a notebook. They're like, those are found all around the house on scratches of paper. I have to say, Joshua, I don't know what your calculations are here.

This looks like... It's a beautiful mind. I'm going to say a beautiful mind type of situation. Guilty. Yeah. You want him to put this stuff away? Yeah. Because when I see it, I'm like, you know, am I supposed to like not use the stove or like, I don't know.

It just makes me feel like he's thinking about it all the time. I'm not. So I'm the bad person. There's one note here that's just left hanging around. It says modem 180 kilowatts a year, 15 kilowatts a month. Dehumidifier 34 kilowatts for 10 hours. No, three kilowatts a year 15 kilowatts a month dehumidifier 34 kilowatts for 10 hours no three kilowatts 10 hours security camera 33 kilowatts per year years am i reading this correctly joshua that that sounds about right phone charger three kilowatts a year for one overnight charge dryer 3.3 kilowatts per day oh there's a lot there's a lot of appliance shaming in this no yes i don't know if this is mandatory in minnesota but in new york they have to put the

calorie counts on menus that is not a good feeling to see what that cheesesteak is going to do to your body calorie wise are you leaving this stuff around on purpose to make your family feel bad about charging their phones too much absolutely not no i wouldn't do that i'm not i'm not that mean of a person are you just leaving it out because you're messy and disorganized okay you kind of put me in a box there. Maybe a little bit that like, you know, it's kind of like when you when you go back in the envelope jottings, I guess I've been doing back of the envelope jottings for about two months. And then I take those jottings and convert them into a clean Excel spreadsheet. So yeah, I guess it's sort of like the rough draft of a novel

or something. And I'm leaving the rough draft all over the place. And I can see what she's saying here. I can see that point. So, Carrie, you would ask that these materials be kept private, that he write them all in a composition notebook and keep them behind a secret panel. Exactly. Somewhere where they can't be found by the police. Right. All right. Now, I know what you want, Joshua, because it is laid out here in my briefing very plainly.

Joshua would love for Carrie to be excited that this year they could go to zero electricity. Joshua wants her to engage in conversation with him about the spreadsheets he generates. And he would also like her to agree to hanging clothes instead of drying them in the dryer, even in the winter. Two questions. Where are you going to dry those clothes in the winter, Joshua? This is the beautiful part, right? It's so dry in the winter in Minneapolis that we got to actually run a humidifier, but we actually don't have to run a humidifier. We can hang clothes in the basement. We can hang them in our bedroom. We can hang them anywhere, and it actually helps us, right? It's kind of a beautiful idea. So I've got some lines in the basement. I've got a couple of racks, and there's plenty of a beautiful idea. So we've got, I've got some lines in the basement. I've got a couple racks and there's plenty of space.

So Carrie, I apologize. There was a brief time where I felt like I can't rule against Joshua. He's just being a normal person. He did not fully reveal himself to me as he is clearly revealed until this moment, as he's clearly revealed himself to you, his excitement and his passion for getting rid of the dehumidifier and putting the clothes in the basement and the lines. That's the first time I've felt you, Joshua, in this entire podcast, I have to say. I feel like you've been very buttoned down, whether you've been doing this on purpose or not. Perhaps you're a little bit shy perhaps you're concealing yourself from me so that i would not judge this properly but i thank you for showing me the real joshua you're welcome the almost christopher lloydian

eccentric scientist joshua now that i've seen you i feel like I'm able to make my verdict. I'm going to go down into my very dry basement and take a moment to consider my judgment. I'll be back in a moment with my decision. All right. And we're going to find that verdict out right after this break. You're listening to Judge John Hodgman. I'm bailiff Jesse Thorne. You're listening to Judge John Hodgman. I'm bailiff Jesse Thorne. Of course, the Judge John Hodgman podcast always brought to you by you, the members of MaximumFun.org.

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All right. So, Carrie, how are you feeling about your chances now that, you know, it's all been said and done? I'm feeling like 60-40. I feel that he'll find more in my favor than not, maybe. All right, what about you, Joshua? How are you feeling? Well, I felt like I came off on the wrong foot with the Leonardo stuff in the beginning. I felt like I was behind the eight ball there. Then I felt like I kind of balanced everything out.

I kind of had some good points. And then right at the end, I think that the hanging stuff on the line, I just think the judge wasn't ready for that. And that was maybe more of a should have kept that one in the back pocket. But you know what? I got to be real. I got to say my part. I think that probably, I think he's going to give me a little bit and give Carrie a little bit.

I don't think he's going to go all to one or the other because I think he sees both of our points of view. Yeah, yeah. No, definitely. I mean, I will say that was some nice foreshadowing when Carrie said she was worried that you would want her to hang out the clothes. And you were like, yeah, definitely in the winter, though. That was a fun shift. But man, I'm gonna stop talking because, you know, he's in that dry basement and he says he likes me to ramble less so he can get out of the basement. So. So everyone, please rise as Judge John Hodgman reenters the courtroom and presents his verdict

i don't want you to ramble less i want you to ramble more if it's a delight to have you here oh thank you but i did need to get out of that basement because i was down there and all of a sudden the lights went off apparently they're on joshua has him on a timer i got very scared everything's on a timer yeah yeah i hit my shins on the stairs as I was trying to climb back up. It's a little bit inconvenient. Joshua, you know, I listened through the basement door. I have to confess that I had completely forgotten about that Leonardo DiCaprio thing. I wish he hadn't brought that up again.

Dang it. He's a good actor, pretty much. Just there are a lot of them. There are a lot of good actors i don't i don't understand that about you i can't claim to understand you perfectly or anyone things took a turn when you finally showed in real time your enthusiasm and how it carries over into your voice and your demeanor and ultimately into your actions for this project. When you really showed yourself to me,

I realized something. I like it. I like it a lot. You're right. You have to be yourself. Absolutely. If for whatever reason you're modulating your demeanor to try to win this fake internet

court case all the way up until that moment you were doing yourself a disservice you should have just let me see you from the beginning because you know what i felt i felt electricity i felt power i felt energy i felt charge in you Up to the end of the podcast, you're unplugging your router, trying to save your energy. I like it. I like your project. I think it's great, obviously. And I'm sure Carrie agrees. It's a very cool and responsible thing to do and something that I'm going to investigate

insofar as it's feasible in one of the places where I live. Of course, I also live in a dark cold place much of the time which is in maine so but we'll see if i can harness some sunshine there i completely appreciate your desire to check your stats frequently i am frankly surprised surprised that neither the solar panel company nor you in your mcguivory ingenuity hasn't figured out a way to be able to monitoring the stats on your phone from inside why you have to go outside i do not know we do have an app that i use as well well do you not trust the app well the app doesn't provide all of the information that I need. I do need to get some extra numbers from out of the meter.

Yeah, and plus using the app uses electricity and it ruins your zero energy project. In any case, you have gamified conservation in a way that is ultimately a net good, right? Your reduction of energy, even with the air conditioner year over year if he is some real business dad lingo what i hear the business dads yelling into their cell phones before the plane takes off i'm gonna write that one down i'm gonna save that one we need to look at year over year production ah yeah or in this case year over year reduction. Ah. Yeah. Or in this case, year over year reduction. It's very good. Very good for you, Joshua. With the exception, of course,

of the alarm clock incident and the scream incident, the inconvenience that your hobby is posing to your family does not seem too terrible, though worthy of some adjustment. The major inconvenience, and I would venture to say

there's more than an inconvenience, is of course the emotional terrorism that you are bringing to your family. I do not believe this was your intention by making Carrie feel guilty when you come in in a sulk because your numbers are off and make her deal with your sadness and make her churn through some shame of her own as a result. That should stop. This is your game, not hers. Also, you have to answer to your own son, is it, who was watching Scream? Do I remember that correctly?

Correct. Yeah. He's the 14-year-old watching Scream or the 9-year-old? That would be weird. Just turned 15. Right. Okay. Yeah.

First year, sophomore in high school? Fresh old? That would be weird. Just turned 15. Right. Okay. Yeah. First year, sophomore in high school, freshman, new school. Yep. Right. Trying to make new friends.

Yes. He's trying to make way in this world through a major emotional, physical, and educational transition in his life. And he's got his friends over to watch scream. And all of a sudden the lights go out. Best case scenario. His friends think this guy's dad's weird because his router's on the timer worst case scenario they're worried they're gonna get

murdered i'm certainly not going to order you to stop this game, but I do order you to keep the game to yourself. That is to say, I cannot order Carrie to be excited that you could go to zero electricity this year. I'm excited. That should be enough for you. But Carrie's going to have her own feelings about it. She is not playing this game. She is not watching these stats. You do not need to show her a spreadsheet you do not need to leave things around for her and everyone else to see this is your own private hobby it is one that is doing them and this world a lot of good but if you had bothered to listen to more than one single episode of judge john hodgman you would have heard me say people like what they like this is not her

movie same way i'm never going to watch friday night lights same way my wife is never going to read game of thrones marital standoff that shall last forever i do order that you shall hang those clothes up to dry in the basement as long as it's you who is doing it. If this is your hobby, you do it. Absolutely. I'm not sure how the labor is divided currently, but certainly if you really want to reduce use of the dryer, that's on you to do it. And everyone will enjoy watching you do that labor alone.

And then they'll enjoy wearing those shirts and pants that have that special je ne sais quoi feel of having dried out in a moldy basement i can't rule for you carrie either that joshua only gets to share his solar stats maybe once a week or every three weeks because i don't think you should have to deal with them ever it's hard for me to rule in either one's favor but i have to choose one because joshua what you said before about leonardo dicaprio wrong and also what you said about me giving something to each of you also wrong it's a one or the other scenario but it has to be one it can be only one you ever see that movie iffy oh yeah yeah the jet lee one i've never seen a highlander well you can see the one it's

basically the same thing oh the one oh right is it yeah there's there's multiple jet lees and the one jet lee will be the most powerful so they fight each other add that to the film festival in minneapolis you guys yeah gotta watch the one ander. Okay, so I have to choose someone to rule in favor of. I think on balance, I have to rule in favor of Carrie. Josh, you got to make this your hobby, not hers. You can't implicate her because it is causing her bad feelings. Carrie, if you're interested, you can ask him. But otherwise, Joshua, you keep it to yourself.

Laundry will dry in the basement so long as Joshua is doing it. No one else is allowed to basement dry the laundry. And Joshua can keep his thing going so long as the rest of the family is not inconvenienced in any other way. I must say that ruling with the stipulation, which is Joshua. I think you're terrific. And I think this is a great project. And I wish you the best of luck in getting to zero energy. Even if Carrie's not excited, you know, your judge, John Hodgman's excited.

This is the sound of a gavel. Judge John Hodgman rules. this is the sound of a gavel judge John Hodgman rules that is all all right all rise as judge Hodgman leaves the room all right now that he's gone how you feeling Carrie I feel good I feel relieved it was dicey there it was no like I was man I didn't know who's gone for and you know but you know between you and me right here in this small vicinity that we are obviously standing in, I was on your side the whole time. Thank you. I was like, I don't know. All these numbers. That's why I became a comedian because I was like, forget Matt.

But I got to walk over. I'm going to go talk to Joshua real quick. Hey, how's it going, Joshua? How are you feeling? Well, a little bit disappointed, but you know what? I understand that not everybody's into numbers. I just need to kind of take that down. And I think that message was received today. I mean, well, look, let me tell you something in the vicinity, the vicinity that we're standing in right here. I mean, I was on

your side the whole time. I mean, those numbers are great. I mean, that's why I became a comedian, because I love numbers. I like to count the number of hot wings I get paid in. So, you know, I'm definitely on the side. But we think you're doing great. Me, John, Greta, we're on your side. Just keep up the great work, okay? Appreciate that.

Can I just say before you guys go, I really like you a lot. I hope you have your film fest. I hope you invite us. Ify, I love that you said that you were going to walk over to Joshua when he's not in the same room. You wore a Bale of Outfit and you pretended to walk around

and I really like that. Thank you so much. I'm doing lots of space work in this booth if you only knew joshua carrie thanks so much for being on the judge john hodgman podcast if you need a laugh and you're on the go try s-t-o-p-p-o-d-c-a-s-t-i hmm are you trying to put the name of the podcast there yeah i'm trying to spell it, but it's tricky. Let me give it a try. Okay. If you need a laugh and you're on the go, call S-T-O-P-P-P-A-D-I. It'll never fit. No, it will. Let me try.

If you need a laugh and you're on the go, try S-T-O-P-P-P-D-C-O-O. Ah, we are so close. Stop podcasting yourself. A podcast from MaximumFun.org. If you need a laugh, then you're on the go. Another case in the books. Before we dispense some swift justice, we want to thank Neil Pogorelsky for naming this week's episode Daylight Savings Crime. If you'd like to name a future episode like Judge John Hodgman on Facebook, we regularly put out a call for submissions. Follow us on Twitter at Jesse Thorne and at Hodgman and on those Twitter internets, hashtag JJHO and check out the Maximum Fun subreddit to discuss this episode. And we're on Instagram at Judge John Hodgman and make sure to follow us there for evidence and other fun stuff.

This week's episode was recorded by Beth Gibbs at Foolproof Studio. And this episode was produced by Hannah Smith and edited by Jesus Ambrosio. Now let's get to Swift Justice, where we answer your small disputes with a quick judgment. And that says if the temperature is at 71 and it's too hot, so it's turned to 68, are you turning the ac down or up 16 year marital dispute okay so let me understand this the temperature is 71 in the house and it's considered to be too hot so the temperature is then changed to 68 using air conditioning iffy would you say you have turned the air conditioner down to 68 or up to colder see when you formatted it that way it changed because if i'm turning the temperature then i'm turning the temperature down but if i'm turning the ac then i'm turning the ac up i think it's exactly yeah that's the that's the

the most important factor what are we talking talking? If we're talking temperature, turn it down. AC, turn it up. That's right. Because as Joshua will tell you, when you turn that temperature down, you are blowing your stats, first of all. You are using more energy. You are cranking that AC up. Instead, do what Joshua's kids are forced to do. Sit in a hot, moist room whittling hey iffy you gave all our hashtags and our ads we need to know where to find you you're the host of

who shot you yeah first of all that you can find that at maximumfund.org you're the co-host of nerdificent podcast with danny Danny Fernandez on another network, as they used to say. Yeah. Yeah. So, but yeah, just if you follow me,

you'll hear me talking when either of those go live. And where can we follow you on Twitter? If that is a thing. Oh, you, you can follow me at if you want to weigh I F Y N W a D I W E. And, uh,

and on Instagram or any other socials that you'd like to plug are you a tiktoker oh yeah same same thing on uh instagram i'm not on tiktok yet but i feel like it's cold young hand is gonna get me soon it looks too fun i'm like those those zoomers they're having all the fun we got to get in there cold young hand is going to reach out of crystal lake and pull you down yeah all right that's about it for this week's episode i'll take over this outro this time since poor bailiff jesse thorne is not feeling so well jesse we send you best wishes and hope you feel better submit your cases at maximumfund.org slash jjho or email me that's me john hodgman, at this email address, hodgman at maximumfund.org. I gets them all. I

reads them all. I sorts them all. No case too small. Something else that rhymes with all. We'll see you the next time on the Judge John Hodgman podcast. Maximumfund.org. Comedy and culture. Artist owned. Audience supported.