Judge John Hodgman - Honey Don't

Episode Date: April 24, 2014

Lani says her husband Alistair insists on doing most of the household chores, and she appreciates his generous spirit. However, she says she's tired of having to ask him to take out the garbage when she could very well do it herself! Is Alistair TOO chivalrous?

Just a little warning, this week's show is a little bit saltier than usual, so if you happen to be listening with kids in the car or something like that, be forewarned. Welcome to the Judge John Hodgman Podcast. I'm your guest bailiff, Jordan Morris, in for Jesse Thorne. This week, honey, don't. Lonnie brings the case against her husband, Allister. Allister does most of the chores around the house, and he likes it that way. her husband, Allister. Allister does most of the chores around the house, and he likes it that way. Lonnie says that when she tries to take out the trash or do the dishes, Allister stops her in her tracks and insists that he do it instead. He says that if he doesn't mind taking care of it, she should let him. Lonnie says she'd like to be able to do chores if she wants to. Who's right? Who's wrong? Only one man can decide. Please rise as Judge Jesse Thorne enters the courtroom.

Lonnie and Alistair, please raise your right hands. Do you swear to tell the truth, the whole truth, and nothing but the truth, so help you God or love or, you know, the universe or just whatever? Oh, we do. We do. Do you swear to abide by Judge Jesse Thorne's ruling, even if it gives you diarrhea? Yes. Thank you. Judge Thorne, you may proceed.

You may be seated. Lonnie, you bring the case here. Can you explain to me what your beef is with your husband? Mostly it's just that he likes to do the stuff around the house. And that's great. But there are times when there are things that I would like done right at the moment. For instance, the incident that brought all this to a head was, there's a smell to the garbage. And I smell it because I have a freakishly sensitive sense of smell, and he doesn't. So I try to get up and take out the garbage, but that like offends his sensibilities and he doesn't want me to take out the garbage. And that's kind of where the conflict happens. So to clarify, you're upset that he does too many chores around the house. I'm not upset about that. I'm grateful, but every now and again, I'd like to help him.

Or if there's something that I want done right now, I don't want to interrupt what he's doing to have that done. And he thinks I should interrupt him and demand that he do it right now. Alistair, tell me about this problem from your perspective. And if you would, please start by telling me what chores you do around the house. Well, Lonnie would tell you that I do all of the chores around the house because she is, and I think this will be relevant to the proceedings, apt to hyperbolize pretty much everything in her life. You're calling your wife a liar? A liar is a strong word and one that would inevitably bounce back to me after the podcast was over. She is a storyteller. She exaggerates for effect.

She likes to spin a yarn. This is what I'm saying. She's a real Scheherazade from the Arabian Nights. I was going to go Tom Bodette, but I hear you. A halfway house between the two I think is a very apt comparison. Like a sort of down-home Scheherazade.

Some stuff around the house. I take care of the trash and the groceries because she hates going to the grocery store. And some laundry, some share of the house. I take care of the trash and the groceries because she hates going to the grocery store and some laundry, some share of the washing up, things like that. It's not as stark a split

as Lani might suggest. But when we reach these situations, she's a very focused individual. She pours everything into her work and when she's distracted from her work, that transition can lead to some stress. It can lead to some raised words. Now, I'm curious, when you say work, what are you talking about? Air traffic controller?

Yes. Yeah. Primarily. No, we work from home. We run a business, not to buzz market, we run a business that provides editorial services for self-publishing authors. So it's a very kind of creative and fulfilling endeavor, but it's something that Lonnie takes extremely seriously. It's a business that you run by advertising in the classified ads in the back of science

fiction magazines, essentially. You're telling me that you're 21st century hucksters. We're the good version of that. I've been meaning to confront you guys about these x-ray specs I bought from you. They absolutely work under certain lighting circumstances. I haven't seen boob one, so you guys are foolish. Alistair, I don't mean to raise concerns on your part that this will certainly prejudice the proceedings, but it sounds to me like you're some kind of foreigner.

Is that correct? I am. I am. I am originally from Scotland. I've only been living in the United States for about four years now. You sound like you learned to speak English by listening to interviews with Latter-day Madonna. That and watching a lot of 80s sitcoms. A little bit of this, a little bit of that, a little bit of this, a little bit of that.

Okay. So, Lonnie, tell me what chores you do around the house regularly, on a regular basis. On a regular basis? Well, you know, Alistair is going to, you know, accuse me of hyperbole, but not a lot. I mean, I, you know, I make the bed. I think on occasion I'll throw in a load of laundry. I will do the dishes on occasion. But like, honestly, he does most of it. He does the vast majority of the stuff around the house, which I appreciate. He likes doing it. He likes taking care of us, which I think is an admirable quality. You know, so, but honestly, like I don't think that I have a lot of regular responsibilities around the house. He might see it differently,

but I don't think I do a whole lot. You know what? I think it's an admirable quality too. I think he's going to make a great grandmother one day. He makes a lasagna like you would not believe. I'm kind of curious about when you are doing a chore and he stops you mid chore like like can you describe that is it does he does he grab your hand and physically like pull it away from the dishes does he tackle you does he threaten you

yeah does past violence lead you to believe there could be violence does he just does he just look at you shake his head and make throat-slitting motion with his finger? No, he's an incredibly gentle soul. He often does this thing that he, it's like a little trick he uses where he will romance me to get me distracted. Like if I'm doing the dishes, he'll come up behind me and he'll give me a little snuggle. The dance of the seven overfull garbage bags? Yes. It's very, very sweet.

I mean, when I went for the garbage, he has physically raced me to the garbage before. That is a thing that has happened. Alistair, tell me why you do this, because most people in the world do everything in their power to avoid doing chores. That's why chore wheels were invented. I would, you know, in one way, I think I should claim that it's some great act of selflessness and altruism that I like to take care of my family. The truth of it is that as someone who spends a lot of time at my keyboard, you know, I spend a lot of time engaged in word processing and layouts and web design and things like that. It feels really good to do something physical. You know, it feels really good to just accomplish a discrete unit of tasks that I can just scratch off the list and do it. So that coupled with – I think that Lonnie has a desire for these tasks to be done.

She doesn't necessarily want to do them herself. She wants to live in a post-trash world. And I'm happy to take it out. I think that this is the most equitable and certainly the most domestically blissful arrangement. the most domestically blissful arrangement. Alistair, I don't mean to cite historical precedent, but I think that generally speaking, men who felt this urge around the house have evacuated themselves to the garage

to play with their shop vacs. Well, we are actually living in a very small townhouse right now. We're closing on a real house next week. So two weeks from now, this entire situation could be different. So all this chore energy you're spending now, once this house goes through, you'll just be in the garage working on your muscle car? I'm thinking building a boat, but it's a similar endeavor.

Lonnie, can you tell me exactly why it is a problem for you to have a partner who does too many chores? Exactly why it is a problem for you to have a partner who does too many chores, because I think right now there are people of both genders who are engaged in romantic all the time. He's wonderful. He's amazing. I think what it is, is that I want to help him. Like he's doing all of this stuff. And if he's in the middle of working and I can do the dishes or I can take out the garbage or I can take something off of his plate, then I want to be able to do that. I mean, I'm simply looking for the freedom to be able to take out the garbage or do the dishes. On occasion, I'm not arguing that I need to do exactly 50% of the work. I am happy with the situation. Just on occasion, I want to be able to pitch in and help out. Do you think that there's something

troubling going on here with Alistair? do you think that there's something problematic or compulsive about his behavior no honestly i think it's i think it's part of what makes him such a wonderful person is that he is he is very giving he is very attentive he makes sure that that things get done you know um and it's it's part of that i don't think that there's anything alarming and i do we have this thing like this is one of the few disagreements that we can't we can't see the other person's side in it. Like, I don't understand why it's a problem that I would take out the trash like that is beyond my comprehension. And he doesn't understand why it's a problem for me to to just let him do it. me to just let him do it. So this is kind of why we're coming to you guys, because we haven't been able to sort of, you know, figure this out amongst ourselves and we really need the professional help. Alistair, you're trying to be helpful to your wife. Why won't you just do the things that she wants? Why not? Sincerely, why not do all of the chores except the ones that she is actively doing at any given moment?

The circumstance under which Lonnie wants to do a chore is usually—okay, not to suggest that this is the only circumstance because she does, as I've said, take care of her share around the house. But in this particular instance and in instances like this, it arises from a sudden and overwhelming urge to have a problem rectified. sudden and overwhelming urge to have a problem rectified. When the singular incident that we're discussing arose, she was deep in her work. She was sitting in her recliner, working away on her laptop. And suddenly, in a fit of pique and disgust, jumped to her feet and said, I've got to take the garbage out. It smells so bad. And I felt at that point, this is a thing that I can do that helps me, makes me feel good and manly and all of that great stuff and also allows her to return to work as quickly and as peacefully as possible.

So as I said, this is entirely selfish. I have a theory. An erotic theory. Most of Jordan's theories are erotic. Usually they involve Kirkirk and spock yeah i just wanted to read you guys some slash fiction um so i mean this seems to me like maybe there's some sort of dom sub dynamic going on like like you know and i think like the traditional you know view of the dominatrix is you know someone in leather spanking someone else and etc but i mean i think there's also like

different kinds of dominant relationships like i don't know if you've heard of these guys who just have a have a dominant woman and they just like give them their bank account number it's like uh there's a word for it it's like financial domination or something like that and you know i'm i'm just wondering like allister like is this is this sexual for you are you some sort of trash based submissive knowing that this is going out on the internet, I have to pick my words very carefully. So I'll pick no. You know, there is an element to... So you are a trash-based submissive.

I fear that's what I'm implying. No, there's certainly an element of, you know, romantic service. Just the nice kind of, the knowledge that you're taking care of something, that your partner doesn't have to worry about it. We all do these little acts of service to ease and to negotiate the treacherous waters of any relationship. So when I do this, yeah, I enjoy taking the trash out. So it's kind of a chore-oral, or a choral, as I like to call it. Choral set? Well, see, now I'm not having as much of a problem with this, now that you put it in that light.

Lonnie, I want to talk about this specific incident that you've brought to us and alluded to here. Yes. It involved the garbage can. Can you describe it to me specifically? The incident was, we were both working. It was in the morning. We're in this very small townhouse and the kitchen is right next to our workspace. So the garbage is right next to our workspace. And again, I have this freakishly sensitive sense of smell. So we were both of us working. He was working. I was working. And I

thought, okay, I'm going to, you know, just take out the garbage because the smell is making me nuts. So I got up and and he his desk is right next to the chair that I work in. And he's like, well, what are you doing? And I said, I'm take out the garbage. And he was like, no. And it was like that slow motion, like, you know, where people just run to like, you know, and he runs, gets to the garbage before him. And he's like, I'll take it out. And I said, no, I can take it out. And then it went back and forth like that for a while. And then eventually I gave in because, you know, there's a certain point where fighting about garbage becomes a little silly. A certain point.

A certain point. Now you've told me, Lonnie, that part of your objection in this particular instance was the smell of the garbage and your superhuman sense of smell? Yes. Can you tell me a little bit about that? A little bit about that? Well, because the thing is, I smell the garbage before anybody else smells the garbage. So whereas the garbage may not be completely full, and Alistair may be looking at it from a point of view of efficiency that you don't take it out until it's completely full. As soon as I smell something, I want that out. I want it gone.

I want it out of my arena. So because I want that done, like that's the kind of situation where it has to be done right now because it smells right now. And Alistair wouldn't have noticed it because he doesn't have the sensitivity to smell that I have. have the sensitivity to smell that I have. I think the best vehicle for Lonnie's sense of smell is maybe like a CBS procedural. Maybe like 10 o'clock on Tuesday. It's you and you join the police department and you're a little unorthodox, but you use your superhuman sense of smell to solve sex crimes. It's called olfactory.

When we say it's you, we mean it's a character based on you played by Busy Phillips. Sure. Oh, yeah, you'll be like a consultant. Yeah, that's you don't have the screen presence of a Busy Phillips. Nobody does. She's great. Okay, I want to bring an expert opinion into this situation. So let's take a moment for a quick break. And when we come back, we'll have expert witness, Mary Roach. Hello, I'm your Judge John Hodgman. The Judge John Hodgman podcast is brought to you every week by you, our members, of course. Thank you so much for your support of this podcast and all of your favorite podcasts at MaximumFun.org. And they are all your favorites.

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That's M-A-D-E-I-N cookware dot com. Welcome back to the Judge John Hodgman podcast. I'm guest bailiff Jordan Morris. In for John Hodgman is Jesse Thorne. Please rise as Judge Thorne is re-approaching the bench. You may be seated. We'd like to welcome to the program slash courtroom a guest expert. She's the author of numerous popular books about science, the most recent of which is Gulp, about the process of eating. Her name is Mary Roach.

Hi, Mary. How are you? Hi, Jesse. I'm very well. I'm delighted to have you on the program, Mary. I really loved your book, Gulp, and one of the things that I loved reading about was the relationship between eating and the nose. And I wonder if you could relate to me your experiences trying to qualify as a food taster and specifically an olive oil taster. Yeah, I tried out. They have tryouts. I love this.

It was an olive oil flavor expert panel, and you can show up knowing nothing, having an ignorant palate. And I did. I showed up, and all of the other people there were from the olive oil industry, so they had a bit of a leg up. And I humiliated myself, and I was sent an email that night saying, Hi, Mary, I hope you enjoyed the tryouts. Unfortunately, you didn't make the cut. But what was interesting about the whole experience is that you are not born with a super amazing, discriminating, able-to-pick-out-16-flavor-descriptor nose.

able to pick out 16 flavor descriptor nose, you're not born, that's actually a process of education and training the nose is really super important for smelling for food, you know you put food in your mouth and you hold it there and chew it and all these

volatile aromas waft up into the nose so like 80% of what you're experiencing when you eat is coming through the nose and people who are experts they're not like genetically gifted waft up into the nose. So like 80% of what you're experiencing when you eat is coming through the nose. And people who are experts, they're not like genetically gifted. They're usually just, they've learned all the little individual components of an overall smell and they can go, uh-huh, okay, there's mown grass, fresh hay, oh, there's pepper, getting a little lemon, getting a little citrus.

Whereas me, I just go, yeah, I think that's olive oil of some kind. You're just like, this smells a little bit Greek. I couldn't even tell. One of the samples was rancid, and I was like, wow, this is, yeah, really, this is really good. Does anyone have any bread? How is your sense of smell just in your day-to-day life? What's your experience of your sense of smell relative to others? Are you one of those people who's bothered by, you know,

sniffing people's cologne in an elevator or something like that? I am bothered by cologne. I don't, here's the thing with the sense, I think when people say they're extremely sensitive, it's more that they are extremely off-put by certain smells. For me, it's cologne. I can't stand, like, Axe body spray. I can't believe cologne has made a comeback. This is a horrible thing in my life.

I don't mind something like manure, cow manure. I kind of inhale deeply when I go by a farm. So people have weird preferences, and they're sensitive in a kind of emotional way rather than a genetic nose way. I have to say, you have done some of the most amazingly gross— I mean, basically, you've written a series of how many books is it now? Five or six? Something five or six. Yeah. And they're basically lists of gross stuff you've done. I mean, to some extent, they're lists of funny studies that you've read. But it's sort of a combination of funny studies

you've read and gross stuff you've done. And I wonder... And smelled. read and gross stuff you've done. And I wonder if you've experienced any smells that really put you off. I have, Jesse. Thank you for asking me. For my first book, Stiff, I spent some time at the Body Farm, which is a facility at the University of Tennessee where they study human decomposition at the forensics research facility. And they're trying to figure out if you put a body in the trunk of a car versus the back seat of a car, will it decompose more quickly? They're trying to figure out, like, when was this person murdered?

What environmental things affect how quickly the body decomposes? So you go to this place, and P.S., it's the middle of August in Tennessee. It's really hot. And there are all these bodies in different phases. For example, the fresh phase, the not-so-fresh phase. And I was close enough to them that I got a lot of that odor. And that's not an odor. I don't think anybody likes that smell.

You're married, right, Mary? I'm married, yes. How does your husband feel about these gross things that you go out and do? Is he on board for grossness? No, my husband, Ed, my poor husband, Ed, he's very squeamish. The last time I upset Ed, I upset him frequently. But when I was doing packing for Mars, there was a chapter about it had to do,

or it doesn't matter what it had to do with, but in the course of this, I was talking about how for a Mars mission, everything will be recycled. Astronauts will be drinking recycled urine. It will be treated, and you won't be able to tell the difference between urine and drinking water. But if Ed were an astronaut, he wouldn't go near it. And for this chapter, I wanted to go down to NASA Ames and have lunch with the researcher, and as our lunch beverages, we would both drink our own treated processed urine. And so he sent the kit for doing this and I did it at home and using a water bottle,

kind of a fancy glass, you know, glasso or something. What's that glacier water bottle? I used that but it wasn't glacier water, it was my own urine. And Ed said, what is this bottle? I had to confess that that was my own treated urine. Ed got excited because he thought it was some pre-mixed crystal light. He's like, why couldn't you just leave it on the porch? Why did you put it in our refrigerator?

Let me ask you this, because this is the central question of the case that we're facing right now. Let's say that you faced a situation that you considered to be unpleasant, that you both considered to be unpleasant. I mean, look, you and I, Mary, both love drinking urine. But let's take the example of Axe body spray. Let's say there were some Axe body spray, which both you and your husband were bothered by. And both of you had the power to go ask the gentleman with the Axe body spray to leave.

And your husband stood up to go do it. Would you consider it reasonable for you to then cut off your husband and ask to tell the man to leave yourself? Well, I am more persnickety about cologne and Axe body spray. So I would welcome him going up and doing the deed because I don't want to get near him. So I would welcome his stepping in. I'm happy not to go close to... I mean, I... But if he... So we're both in this hypothetical situation.

We're both bothered by it. Is that correct? Yes, that's correct. Okay, we're both bothered by it. I'm bothered more, you're saying? No, equal. Oh, equal. Wait, you're bothered a little more, but you're both bothered by it. I'm bothered more. No, equal. Oh, equal. Wait, you're bothered a little more,

but you're both bothered by it, but you both have equal power to stop it. Well, it's a nice courtesy to, if you're the person who's bothered less, to go up and do the deed. I would welcome Ed confronting. But see, Ed is very non-confrontational. I know this has nothing to do with it,

but Ed would never be the one to go up and do the deed. I'd have to go be do with it, but Ed would never be the one to go up and do the, I'd have to go be obnoxious because that's, in our marriage, I'm the one who's not afraid to be obnoxious. Who does all the chores around your house? Ed does more of the chores. No, the cooking. Ed does the cooking. To me, that's the granddaddy of all chores.

I do the dishes. He fixes all the cooking. Ed does the cooking. To me, that's the granddaddy of all chores. I do the dishes. He fixes all the stuff. It's a kind of a balance, but he does the big one, the cooking. Okay, let me ask you this question. Are you or is your husband the kind of person who feels compelled to finish things that he or she starts? things that he or she starts? I am compelled. Ed isn't compelled to ever start them often. I'm more like, I walk around not finishing things. He'll say, Mary, can you set the table? Like, I'm cooking here, hello.

And I will put down placemats and walk away. I don't finish doors easily. I'm a little distracted. Yeah. Mary, I really appreciate your insight into this case. It was great to get to talk to you. I bet I was really helpful. Mary Roach's awesome most recent book is Gulp.

I guess we don't get to know what your next book is about, huh, Mary? No, it's a secret. Oh, jeez. Lonnie, I want to ask you this question. Do you think that you are really bothered by super smelling? Or do you think that it's something about the work that you're doing at that moment that requires you to take a moment and go do something else? No, I'm really bothered by it.

Like, smells make me crazy. And it's just one of those little quirks of personality I'm like Mary and I have a problem with cologne I hugged a colleague of mine the other day who I hadn't seen in a long time and smelled of his cologne all day and it made me insane so I think it's it's I don't want to when I'm in the middle of work when I'm in the middle of like that whole process I'm deep into the. I do not want to be interrupted at all. What about for you, Alistair? How much of this is about you wanting something to take a moment away from your work? Oh, a great deal. That's absolutely part of it. The ability to leave my desk and get some air and accomplish something that, you know, because we work in a field that requires, you know,

week-long engagements where we're constantly revising and revising and revising. And even when things are finished, they're never really finished. So the ability to get up from my desk and go outside, I love taking out the trash. The worse the weather is, the more I love it. We've just come through a harrowing winter here in upstate New York. And when there was three feet of snow on the ground and a howling gale, I genuinely, and perhaps this is just native Scottish perversity, I loved taking out the trash. So as I said, this is a selfish act.

Would you be into a situation where the trash can was maybe 50 yards away and you had to run from the house to the garbage can and while that was happening, wolves were chasing you. We don't have to deal with the wolves just yet. Although, yes, I would be open to that possibility. But the dumpster here is a good hundred yards away from our house. So there's an epic track involved.

It's not just to the end of the driveway. It's a whole thing. I'd heard a lot about the native Scottish perversity, but it didn't involve wolves. Yeah, it was about fucking the Loch Ness Monster. Well, obviously that's the first thing. But a young Scottish boy becomes a man he must go out to the loch. Lonnie, you bring this

case. What would you like me to decide? What damages do you seek? My ideal situation is simply that if I get up to do something, that Alistair cannot interrupt me. He cannot stop me from doing what I'm trying to do, either with wily sexual moves or with a direct interruption of what I'm trying to do. So basically, I think it's a fairly mild request. Alistair, how would you like to see this situation resolve?

I would like an adjudication that finds that whoever cares the least takes care of the problem. I think this is what our expert witness ably suggested. I am less bothered by the garbage than Lonnie is. Therefore, it falls to me to take care of it. If she's troubled by the small garbage can that we have in our kitchen, she's going to be traumatized by the dumpster that's out at the end of the road. I think I've heard all that I need to hear. I'm going to excuse myself to make my decision. Thank you much.

Please rise. Judge Jesse Thorne is leaving the courtroom. Guys, there's a couple of questions I still have, even after your grilling. You guys are parents, right? Yes, yes we are. Who does baby-related chores? Oh, they're not babies anymore.

They're teenagers. Who does teen chores? Who takes them to their Snapchat games and their Minecraft tournaments? We share the child-rearing, I think, too. Alistair does the more, like, you know, making their lunches in the morning and he does the cooking. I discuss with them, you know, their emotional issues.

I do the discussions of I do the sex education. I do the like all that kind of stuff. So the big talking stuff I take care of. But the day to day chore stuff, I think, is more more alistair it should be noted that you do the sex education because you love that because if i tried to do it you would hip check me out of the way she just has that nice bound copy of our bodies ourselves that she's been dying to use and it is a well-thumbed copy every time. Now, do you guys ever hire a housekeeper or anything like that?

Is that something that you guys do? Oh, no. No, no, we never have, although. That could be an option. It's not that I want someone else to take care of the chores. It's more that I would like to stop having this fight. Yeah, I mean, have you worth 100 bucks have you considered that yeah just dropping it just dropping 100 bucks once a month and you guys go to a movie and then uh and then then it's done it's cheaper than marriage counseling yeah

um now you guys also i mean also it seems like something that could be going on is that like you know you guys co-run a business and you both work from home. So these kind of little chorey things, I think sometimes when you live with someone and you spend a lot of time with them, you know, those these little things become, you know, grains of sand in the oyster, little irritants. Do you guys do stuff, you know, solo? Are you sure to have, you know, separate time, book clubs, bowling leagues, things like that? We actually spend an irrational amount of time together. We have this business together. I teach at the university at Syracuse University twice a week, but that's basically the only thing that we do separately. And honestly, this is the only thing that we do separately.

And honestly, this is the biggest fight that we have. This is the only one where we can't sit down and talk and understand the other person's point of view. I mean, yeah. We're disgustingly competitive. We're actually revolting. We're really, people don't like being around us. We are incredibly compatible. No, I'm not enjoying doing this podcast.

So, I mean, I get it. I can imagine. I understand how your friends must feel. Enduring us. But have you thought about that? I mean, do you think that might, you know, ease some of the tension that comes along with kind of chorey discussions? Have you guys thought about having separate trivia nights or, you know, mistresses, something like that? Mistresses. Yeah. I have thought of taking a mistress. Actually, I'm really, it's interesting you should say that. I thought you were interested in these guys who will financially submit themselves to you.

Financial. No, actually, I would really like to know that. Taking on a financial submissive. Exactly. Yeah, hook me up with some of those financial submissives and we'll talk. We'll be back in just a moment with the judge's decision. Hello, teachers and faculty. This is Janet Varney.

I'm here to remind you that listening to my podcast, The JV Club with Janet Varney, is part of the curriculum for the school year. Learning about the teenage years of such guests as Alison Brie, Vicki Peterson, John Hodgman, and so many more is a valuable and enriching experience. One you have no choice but to embrace because, yes, listening is mandatory. The JV Club with Janet Varney is available every Thursday on Maximum Fun or wherever you get your podcasts. Thank you. And remember, no running in the halls. Please rise.

Judge Thorne is re-entering the courtroom with a little toilet paper on his shoe. Oh, look out. Yeah, boy. That's embarrassing. Classic dork move. Trying to be in a position of authority here. You may be seated.

Okay, Lonnie, Alistair. Whenever you hear the details of another couple's life together, you enter what I would call a world of madness. Every set of matched behaviors, every pair's activities being different than your own, sound completely nutty. This case for me is a perfect example. I can hardly imagine a world where a couple fights to do chores. I hate chores. It's because I'm not a crazy person or a fool. But the two of you are at least fools and possibly crazy fools. So it's fallen to me to untangle this web of lunacy. First of all, Alistair, you're a good man. Your efforts are appreciated by your wife. They leave me in awe. But it's time to drop the pretense. You're not doing this for her. You're doing it for yourself. And an unwanted favor is not a favor.

It's a burden. Lonnie, you seem to appreciate your husband's efforts. That's good. And you seem to have reached a detente in almost every matter, which is also good, even given the fact that the two of you share the same room in which you work, which is amazing. But you as a couple are locked into a power play. You're so tired of deference, each of you, that you pick this tiny corner of the world over which you can fight for yourself and your own rights. Just assert a little bit of identity. And that's fair. So here's my answer to this quandary, even though I fear it will only

lead to each of you fighting over something else. Alistair, make a chore wheel. Put yourself all over it. I don't care how many times it says Alistair on the chore wheel. If you want to, you can literally make a pie chart that just lists all of the chores and in the middle it says Allister. Lonnie, you don't even have to participate in doing this. You can just watch him do this.

And enjoy the fact that you have the only husband in the world who wants to do chores. Once you've done all of that, Alistair, do the chores that you've assigned to yourself. But do not do additional chores. I understand, Your Honor. Lonnie, you can also do whatever chore you want. You can also do whatever chore you want.

You can do them at any time you want, unless your husband is actively involved in doing that chore at that time and doesn't want you there. So if you get suddenly overwhelmed by an odor, you can take care of it. If you want to deodorize the cat, if you want to take out the trash. If you want to put white vinegar in the garbage disposal. Whatever you want to do, you can do it. Go to town. This is your prerogative. You have to have something for you. Now, I know this is going to cause problems for you, Alistair.

So. I will bear up as best I can anytime that you get the urge to interfere with your wife's voluntary chore doing I'm working from the assumption that you're just going to assign yourself all the chores it's not an inaccurate assumption anytime you get the urge to interfere with your wife's work

you will go to a special place in your new home it doesn't have to be the garage. But let's be honest, it's probably going to end up being the garage. You're going to want to hang up some sweet electric beer signs in there. Maybe get some beanbag chairs. Yeah, you're going to really want to create for yourself what I call a manhole. You know, a gay bar right in the garage.

It's your own little gay bar you can go to. I want you to go to this special place that you have created for yourself and do a special thing that belongs only to you. It doesn't matter what the thing is. I suggest something that has discrete elements that you can complete on the way to a greater whole. So doing a jigsaw puzzle, building a really sweet train layout, whatever you want to do. Make things, learn, make a quilt.

All right. But I want you both to remember that it's one thing to be romantic. It's one thing to be considerate, but it's another thing to deceive and impose in the name of those first couple of things. So I find in favor of Lonnie, that is all.

Thank you. Please rise as Judge Thorne is retreating to his judge area. What do you call that? Cell. Judge Cell. Lonnie, how do you feel about the judge's decision? I feel it is a fair and reasonable decision. And I think that he definitely took Alistair's point of view into account. So I'm feeling pretty good about this.

Alistair, how do you feel? And do you immediately know what your garage activity is going to be? I don't immediately. I think a combination of woodwork and guitar playing sounds very tempting. Also, I may take up some recreational cigar smoking. I think that sounds appropriately manly. No, don't do that. Next thing you know, you're going to have Jeremy Piven hanging around your house.

You don't need that. I issue an emergency injunction from my quarters. I'm passing it out through the bars of my judge cell. Thank you. It's against you taking up recreational cigar smoking. Yeah. Understood, Your Honor. Thank you, Your Honor.

Well, thank you both for being on the Judge John Hodgman podcast. Thank you. It was fun. If you need a laugh and you're on the go, try S-T-O-P-P-O-D-C-A-S-T-I. Were you trying to put the name of the podcast there? Yeah, I'm trying to spell it, but it's tricky. Let me give it a try.

Okay. If you need a laugh and you're on the go, call S-T-O-P-P-P-A-D-I. It'll never fit. No, it will. Let me try. If you need a laugh and you're on the go, try S-T-O-P-P-P-D-C-O-O. Ah, we are so close. Stop podcasting yourself.

A podcast from MaximumFun.org. If you need a laugh and you're on the go. I am joining Judge Thorne in his judge's quarters. Judge, do you want to clear the docket? Yeah, sure. Why not? Do you mind if I finish building this cigar out of wood? No, I don't mind. Let's clear the docket, Jordan.

Sarah writes, My boyfriend and I have a disagreement about movie going. If he isn't interested in a movie I want to see, I go with friends or by myself. He won't go to the movies alone, so he always tries to drag me to see things I don't want to, primarily horror films, which really upset me. I don't see why this is necessary when there are plenty of movies we can both agree on. For example, we all saw the Avengers slash Spider-Man slash Batman movies. Oh, man, I got excited for a second when I thought those were all one movie.

We've also happily watched Seven Psychopaths, Lawless, Argo, Looper, and Django Unchained together. He says that as his girlfriend, I should come with him to the movies, even when it's one I don't want to see. I think this is unfair, since I don't expect the same of him. What do you say, Judge Thorne? First of all, I order you to expand your movie-going palette beyond movies, the posters of

which are on the walls of dorm rooms across America. I feel like... You think there's a lot of Argo posters out there in dorms? I guess maybe not Argo. I guess that's the... But that's the, as they say, the exception that proves the rule. Sarah, honestly, if I could,

if it was within my purview to order you to break up with this dumb boyfriend, I would. I, too, hate horror movies. If my wife insisted that I went to horror movies, I would have no wife at all.

I would be alone right now. And I would be sadder for it. But my principles would remain intact. I judge that you should go to whatever the heck movie you want to go to, while the two of you should make reasonable accommodations for each other so that you can enjoy movie going together. reasonable accommodations for each other so that you can enjoy movie going together. I'm sure that there are plenty of opportunities for you to go to movies that you both would like to see.

It sounds like from, it may be that you presented a biased sample. However, I would say it sounds like it might be that you're just agreeing to go to the movies that he wants to see. And that's very kind of you. But I would insist that he go to a few movies that, while he may not find them upsetting, he might not have chosen. Joe writes, my wife and I disagree on how to adjust the temperature in our house.

She will state slash ask, it is hot in here. Can you turn it up? I respond by asking her if she wants me to turn up the temperature set point on the air conditioner unit. She will often reply that she was referencing the intensity of the unit and not the temperature, despite the fact that our AC is either off or on and there is no intensity change like fan speed. She will also ask me to turn down the AC when she is cold. The heater is not an issue since up can refer to the intensity or temperature. Judge, can you give us a direction on how

temperature changes in the house should be requested? During the summer months, should the direction up and down reference a non-existent intensity or the temperature set point? Joe? I had an interesting experience reading that. I simultaneously read it out loud and zoned out. I feel like I would just enter a fugue state reading the most boring paragraph of all time. You know, the other day I got to witness something that I had never seen before. And it's one of those miracles of having children that they don't tell you about. I saw my two and a half year old son sleeping with his eyes open. It was genuinely amazing. It was like a shark. Sure. Like he really was asleep and his eyes,

he had just not bothered to close his eyes. Like he had not, he has not gotten to the point in his development where he realizes that you have to close your eyes to go to sleep. And that's the way that I felt while I was listening to this. I felt like my eyes were open, but my REM waves were going, you know what I mean? Yeah. I say, Joe, that you sound like a real jerk for making an issue of this. You don't sound like you're actually confused.

And if you're not actually confused, it's on you, buddy. If you are actually confused, then I say you do it her way. You discuss with her whatever her way is, and you do it that way. But I don't think you're actually confused. I think you're a perfectly, despite how boring your sentences are, I think you're a perfectly mentally competent individual who is capable of understanding what your, what is it,

a girlfriend or a wife? Something, I don't know. It doesn't matter. It won't be for long. Yeah. This guy's going to be out on the street in no time. It looks like the docket

has been cleared. Thanks to Dave Schroeder and Jess Kriwosa for suggesting this week's case name. To suggest a name for a future case, like us on Facebook. We regularly put out the call for submissions. I have been your guest bailiff, Jordan Morris. You should listen to Jesse and I on the podcast Jordan, Jesse, Go.

That's in iTunes or at MaximumFun.org. Come on, do it. It's free. It's easy. Yeah, why wouldn't you? It's fun. It's a podcast. You like podcasts.

You're listening to one. Julia Smith produces the show. Mark McConville is our editor. Thanks for joining us for the Judge John Hodgman podcast. The Judge John Hodgman podcast is a production of MaximumFun.org. Our special thanks to all of the folks who donate to support the show and all of our shows at MaximumFun.org slash donate. The show is produced by Julia Smith and me, Jesse Thorne, and edited by Mark McConville.

You can check out his podcast, Super Ego, in iTunes or online at GoSuperEgo.com. You can find John Hodgman online at AreasOfMyExpertise.com. If you have a case for Judge John Hodgman, go to maximumfund.org slash JJHO. If you have thoughts about the show, join the conversation on our forum at forum.maximumfund.org and our Facebook group at facebook.com slash Judge John Hodgman. We'll see you online and next time right here on the Judge John Hodgman podcast. We'll see you online and next time right here on the Judge John Hodgman Podcast.