Judge John Hodgman - Monte Belmonte Python

Episode Date: July 25, 2014

Beth loves animals and wants to get a pet snake, but her husband is opposed to slithery things.

Welcome to the Judge John Hodgman podcast. I'm your guest bailiff, Monty Belmonte from WRSI 93.9 The River in Northampton, Massachusetts, in for Jesse Thorne. This week, strangely, Monty Belmonte Python. Beth brings the case against her partner, Ross. She loves animals and wants to get a small snake to keep in her workshop. Ross says snakes are disgusting and terrifying and thinks they should be satisfied with the animals they already have. Who's right? And who would the sorting hat put in Slytherin?

Only one man can decide. Please rise as Judge John Jake the Snake Hodgman enters the courtroom. Snakes are among the most misunderstood of all animals. As a result, many beneficial and harmless snakes have met untimely deaths at the hands of shovel-wielding humans. Observe snakes from a respectful distance. Don't attempt to capture them or keep wild snakes as pets. Leave snakes alone. And with that, guest summer bailiff Monty Belmonte, please swear them in. Beth and Ross, please rise and raise your right hands.

You swear to tell the truth, the whole truth and nothing but the truth. So help you Medusa's head. I do. I do. You swear to abide by Judge John Hodgman's ruling despite the fact that the judge is sick and tired of all these monkey fighting snakes on this Monday to Friday plane? Yes, I do. I do that as well. Thank you. Judge Hodgman, you may proceed. Monkey fighting. That is the actual what made for TV translation of the epic line from snakes on a plane right monkey fighting snakes on this monday to friday plane but i'm sorry about this uh beth and ross you may be seated is not the original quote i am tired of these mother snakes on this mother plane yeah but instead of bleeping it out i thought i would go with the made for tv movie

original no no i understand yeah and i'm and i'm very glad you mean the tv the tv edit the tv redubbed tv edit yeah so you're you're telling me that they replaced the term mother with two different yes options monkey fighting snakes on this monday to friday plane what who did why didn't they just use the same monkey fighting is fine but i've just i just delight at the fact that in the same line they replaced the same offensive phrase with two different ridiculous options and both of them are equally ridiculous monkey fighting snakes and and the Monday to Friday plane. No, monkey fighting snakes makes perfect sense. And a Monday to Friday plane also.

I mean, it's the only time it makes sense now that I think about it. Because I'm sure snakes would fight a monkey under duress. And Monday to Friday plane, that just means it's a plane that only flies on the weekdays. It's a daily plane, I guess. You're right. So it makes sense. For an immediate summary judgment in one of yours favors, can one of you lovely Australian people name the piece of culture that I was paraphrasing or rather in this case, quoting directly as I entered the courtroom? Ross, can you? I have absolutely no idea.

No idea. Of course, of course you don't. And what about you, Beth? No, sorry. No, sorry. No, sorry. Because why, if you lived in Western Australia, even if you were considering getting a snake for a pet, would you possibly be looking at the state of Maine website, maine.gov? The state of Maine website, Maine.gov, specifically the area on inland fisheries and wildlife, where they tell you, please don't kill our non-venomous snakes because there are no venomous snakes in Maine. And you find me, well, you can't see me at all, all you other people who are continuing the great northward summer migration of Hodgman. We're continuing the great northward summer migration of Hodgman. I was last time in Northampton, Massachusetts, with Monty Belmonte, my summer bailiff in the studios of W.R.S.I. The River in Northampton, Massachusetts.

But now I have moved even further north to Maine, the state of Maine, where you find me in the studios of W.E.R.U. Thank you very much. I'm being handed by Joel T. Mann, Programming Operations Manager, his card. W-E-R-U Community Radio 89.9 FM Do you say you're in Blue Hill, Maine or in Orland, Maine? In Blue Hill, Maine, right?

In Blue Hill, Maine www.weru.org One of the last great total local community free form radio stations. You guys need to listen to the station. It's crazy. Monty. I can't wait till they sell out and go commercial like us.

I know. I know. This is what, this is what WRSI, this is what WRSI would be. If you are given your way, if you are given free reign, take over.

Look, they're both great radio stations. They're both great states. Well, one state and one commonwealth. I happen to be in Maine now, which is a state. And here in Maine, there are no venomous snakes. And the website of Maine wants you to not kill them. Even though most people find them to be frightening and disgusting. And I believe that this speaks directly to the conflict at hand.

Is that not so, Beth? State your case. Yes. I would like to get a pet snake, which would live in my workshop and would only come out of its cage when Ross wasn't home. And I would take care of it, and he wouldn't need to ever see it. And you live in Western Australia, is that correct? Yes, Perth, Western Australia, so the southern part. It's a very, very big state.

Oh, I know, WA. And Perth is the only city there, right? Oh, no, there's a few more. I've never been. I've been to Melbourne, Australia, but I've never been to Western Australia. It's the wilderness, is it not? We do have a lot of wilderness. And I think it's actually faster to fly to Singapore than it is to Melbourne from here. It's faster to fly to Singapore? My goodness.

And what do you do there in Perth? What goes on in Perth? You guys are a couple, a non-married, but steady romantic couple, is that correct? That's correct. And Ross, what do you do there? Are you in Perth itself or in Greater Perth? The Perth Metropolitan District? That is it exactly, yeah. Okay. The PMD? Perth Metropolitan District? Is that what you

call it? CBD. I think we call it the Metropolitan Area. Oh, okay. I was just making a joke, but it is called something like that. Alright, good. So you live there in Perth, metropolitan area, the PMA. And you do what, Ross?

What is life like there? Well, I work as a software developer for one of the hardware store chains that we have here. I'm not going to drop brand names on you, but yeah. I think it's safe to say that, well, I don't know if any of the Western Australian hardware chains have made it to the United States such that you would violate my podcast ban on inadvertent or advertent buzz marketing. Oh, it only applies to American corporations. I'd be curious.

Well, let me just put it this way. I will lift the ban because I'm curious to know what the name of the biggest hardware only applies to to american corporations i'd be curious well let me just put it this way i will lift the ban because i'm curious to know what the name of the biggest hardware chain in perth is like most of uh america please tell me it's not just restricted to perth it's across all of australia go on uh it's called bunnings bunnies yeah like rabbits no like Yeah. Like rabbits? No, like with an I-N-G on the end. Bunnings. Oh, Bunnings. Excuse me.

All right. I liked Bunnies as a hardware short chain. I wouldn't feel so insignificant when I walked into a hardware store named Bunnies. I know. It'd be pretty cute, wouldn't it? I'd be feeling really confident. I can handle these people here at Bunnies. Well, let's hear it for Bunnings then.

Australia's largest hardware store chain yeah i think that's accurate i think that yeah well they're definitely the largest yeah all right there's not an endorsement i'm saying it is the largest that's all i'm saying it's it's a it's a evaluation of size and and you don't make any kind of quality judgments here. That's exactly right. That's my motto. An evaluation of size without any quality judgments. That could be a t-shirt right there. Qualitative, not quality. Right.

And now, Beth, I'm sorry. I'm going on all kinds of summertime. So I'm just talking about what I feel like. Beth, what is going on in your life? You have a workshop at home, you mentioned. What do you make in your workshop? Lots of things. I sculpt items and then I make

silicon molds and then I cast them out of resin. And what are the items? Are you allowed to say what the items are that you sculpt and mold? Oh, yes. I pay very greatly to whatever I feel like doing, but it tends to be wargaming related. Wargaming related? Mm-hmm.

Now we're getting somewhere. Thank you for not having a boring software hardware store, John. Thanks for not making software for hardware. Actually, that's pretty cool now that I think about it, Ross. Yeah, you're back. You're back. But still, you're not molding wargaming. What are you making?

Figurines? Sculpting figurines as well as terrain and tokens. Okay. And dice as well. Making my own custom acrylic dice. You're making your own custom acrylic dice? Mm-hmm. For fun or

for profit? For fun. Alright. But if I sent you some American dollars, could I get some of your dice? You could. All right. Now, why is having a snake going to help you in your dice making? Not at all. Mm-hmm.

But I really want a snake. All right. Yes. How many animals do you have already? I'm counting. hang on are they all lined up in front of you well when it comes we're not counting individual fish are we no i think it's fair to count fish by the school okay well i have well we we have three cats, one dog, and I have several fish tanks. Fish beyond measure. Fish beyond measure.

How many fish alone would you estimate are in your aquaria there, Ross? I don't know you can call it my aquaria. I'm not really sure. They seem to breed. Yeah, well, they're living creatures. If you were to guess how many fish, give me a ballpark. Do you understand that sports reference over there? Give me a cricket oval assessment.

You're going to have to ask Beth about that because the fish are not my department. Are any of the animals your department, Ross? I would claim co-ownership of the cats and the dog, but the fish are outside of my wheelhouse. Yeah, because you hate fish. I can't get a handle on fish. Now, Beth made a fine case for inserting a snake into your lives, in that it would live in her workshop, which I presume is a separate building. Is that correct? It's outside, sort of the side area of our backyard area.

All right. And she wants a snake that will live in her workshop. What kind of snake are you talking about? I would like a pygmy python, the world's smallest snake. A pygmy python. I think it may be the world's smallest python. Oh, maybe it's just smallest python. As we say in Maine.

Yeah. Because there are some pretty small, like, you know what a garter snake is no all right i think that's probably maybe not by length but by girth smaller than any python tell me about the pygmy python native to western australia it's native to the northern part around the pilbara region. It grows to a maximum of 18 to 28 inches. On average, it can get up to, no, 18 to 20 inches, but it can get up to around 24 inches. Oh, that's pretty small. And that's a python?

Yes, and that's from nose to tip of tail, stretched out. Now, why a pygmy python as opposed to the second smallest python, and the best-named python of all, the children's python? It is a children's python. They've renamed it. It's the western... No, they have not. Yes, yes, it's a... Oh, no, they have not.

No, I swear. Oh, no. Oh, no, Beth. I'm sorry. Maybe it takes a little bit extra time for Wikipedia to reach you in Australia. But as of this morning, they were two separate species. It's a Western children's python. It's from the same family. All right, good. A Western children's python.

I love that there's a python called a children's python, but it's not named for the fact that it's suitable for children. It's named for a British zoologist named Children. His name was Bob Children or something. So, all right, you like that pygmy python because it's small. And what else? Smart, easy to train. It'll bring you your slippers in the morning. What? It's meant to have a fairly good temperament. So, isn't a very aggressive breed of snake um easy to look after uh the small size means a smaller terrarium for it and uh and and and what what kind of dogs do you have we have a pug cross chihuahua a pug a wawa a pug-hmm. I love it. And you're getting the snake to eat that Pugawawa? No. See, this is why I've got to get a small snake.

What does it eat? Pinkies? It does. It eats mouse pinkies, very small ones. And explain for the listenership who does not know what a pinky is and has not yet been utterly nauseated today, What is a pinky? I believe, I hope I've got this right. I've only ever seen them in the freeze-dried, not freeze-dried, frozen packets.

But it's a freshly born mouse baby. Yeah. Yeah, it's a mouse baby. And you speak also to the pleasures of reptile ownership, which is not only are you feeding your snakes mouse babies, but they come in frozen packages of what, a dozen? Mm-hmm. And they're going to keep that in the freezer, which you store your own food in and stuff? Well, I already keep bloodworms in the freezer, brine shrimp, artemia, and yeah.

Oh, boy. Is that for your monstrous fish yes it is i also sometimes get live blood worms and keep them in the fridge in the refrigerator in a in a in the same refrigerator that ross goes to get his uh his jar of vegemite from i don't think you do you need to refrigerate no no no vegemite goes in the cupboard but it is it is the same fridge that I get everything else that I require to be refrigerated before consuming from. All right. So did I already ask you why you need to get a snake now at this time in your life? I don't think so.

All right. Why don't you tell me why? I've wanted a snake for a really long time. How old are you? I am 26. All right. We've spoken about it several times, and Russ has always said no because he's terrified. And I'm home a lot at the moment, and it would be a lovely pet to watch while I'm waiting for

resin to set. Yeah. So, but let me say that when I ask, why do you want a snake? The answer should not be, I want a snake. You need to, and have wanted one for a long time. I appreciate. Now, how long have you guys been in a relationship together? I've wanted one for a long time. I appreciate. Now, how long have you guys been in a relationship together? About six and a half years. Right.

So since you were maybe almost 21, right? Before 21. Yeah. So you never had that opportunity as a single person in your early 20s to go out and get a weird pet because there was no one else to stop you from getting it finally. And you could go out and get your weird reptile and feed it little baby mice. You never had that opportunity to do that. No. So now you want it. And so you've put it off,

you put it off, you put it off. But what I want you to do is cast your mind back to when you were something more than a teenager and something less than an adult. And you thought getting a snake would be a great idea and tell me about why you want that snake what is it because realize you're not just speaking to me you're speaking you're trying to convince ross that this is something that is meaningful and important to you i want to hear some i want to hear some monday to friday mother friending snake poetry at this point

they're very fascinating creatures and beautiful and unusual they're easy to care for and after the initial setup they are very cheap for maintenance of them um i find them fascinating beautiful and i i like holding them. I hold a snake at every opportunity whenever we go to fairs and festivals that have them. Some of those Western Australian snake festivals? They actually have one. I think it's in May next year. in May next year. Is it the Perth Snake Fair or the Greater Perth Snake Expo? Because I hear they're

real rivals. It's the WA Herpetofauna Expo. Herpetofauna. Herpetofauna. Herpetofauna. You mean, oh, what a wonderful word. You mean reptile animals? Yes. Are you a herpetologist?

No, I'm not. But I do believe you own a license to keep snakes. I haven't put in my application for a license yet, as there was no point paying the fee if I wasn't going to be allowed to get a snake, but it's not difficult to get the license. Your Herpetofauna Class 3 license that you mentioned in your original letter to me? Yes, that's correct. How much does that cost? $40 a year. How much does it cost to, how much, you say they're inexpensive to keep How much are the pinkies? I think I've seen them in packs of

About 10 to 12 for about 8 dollars And it eats one every 10 days or so Ugh And it will eat a Frozen pinky? Not frozen, you have to defrost it in some water

First But I also have to defrost it in some water first. But I also have to defrost the bloodworms. Just a moment. I don't want to. First of all, can we just not talk about bloodworms for five seconds with you? Okay. How do you defrost a pinky? Just in a container with some lukewarm water.

I wanted to take to thoroughly defrost a pinky, I wonder. Not long, I don't think. No, I wouldn't imagine. And if you keep the water running, convection will even speed that up. You've thought about parboiling them and then maybe throwing them on the grill. I, this is not... I'm resisting the temptation to say to throw a pinky on the barbie no no you're not you're not resisting that you're not resisting the temptation i wish you had resisted it i

resisted it shut your pie hole monty oh i'll stick my pinky in there once a week you have to defrost a pinky you have to break a pinky off the pack, toss it in some lukewarm, then throw it in. And your pygmy python will eat that frozen thing. Will eat the dead thing. It doesn't want live prey. No, you can't give them. You're not

actually allowed to. You're only allowed to feed them dead prey. Why are you not allowed to give them live prey? It's so that they don't associate movement with food. At least I think that's why. Oh, I see. I think also they don't want people breeding lots of

rats or mice to have fresh live food for their reptiles. I see. Okay. Right. They'd rather have that business confined to Big Pinky and their industrial frozen pinky operation. All right. Ross, let me say, if you can't sense from my discussion, that I find this all to be very gross.

I find snakes to be wonderful creatures. I find snakes to be wonderful creatures. And certainly during the time when I was not an adult, I considered it would be awesome to have a snake. But then I realized I was going to have to feed it animals. And that's just too much familiarity with the food chain for me to divert an afternoon of play with. So I didn't do it. But to each his or her own, Beth is obviously a delightful small

creature who is easy to take care of in her own little enclosure in your backyard that you have a lot of affection for. Why not? Why not let her fill that shed up with all the weirdest animals in the world? What do you care? Why are you so scared of snake? I don't know. I think it's, I think I have a, I think justified, but irrational fear of snakes. So the very idea of having one in the vicinity that is going to be here all the time kind of freaks me out a little bit. And Beth says that it's going to be hidden away and, you know, never going to come out while I'm around.

while I'm around. She says that, but I have a sneaking suspicion that at various points it's going to be brought out and pointed at me, possibly in a taunting kind of way. I can definitely envisage that happening. She doesn't sound... Beth, are you going to taunt Ross with your snake? I will admit I might have threatened that, but I wouldn't. No.

Ross, is Beth getting a snake because she wants to push you to the limits of your fear to help you grow as a human being? It could be. I'm comfortable with the degree to which I am a human being in this area. Yeah. and a human being in this area um yeah the the other the other part and i in my preparing for for this uh for this case i i went and did a little bit of research and a lot of the things i was going to say in um opposition to getting a snake is what you were covering earlier about the pinkies and the feeding of the pinkies and that they're called pinkies and that whole yeah i don't think you guys had the tone quite right of how how i would have put it that how

could you have layered more nausea and disgust in your voice than I did? Let me hear how you would have said pinkies. They called pinkies. It would have been something like that. Yeah. Yeah. I still don't think you're completely committing, but I hear I'm,

I'm hearing the disgust. More annoyance than disgust. Like if it's, it is foul. It is disgusting to think about in the most visceral sense there should be an almost like vomit into your mouth kind of pinkies kind of thing wait monty are you are you are you expressing your own disgust or are you coaching ross in disgust acting i'm doing both all right i want i want you Ross. What I want you to do is I want you to picture,

I want you to picture you breaking off one pinky from a string of frozen pinkies and then putting it into some lukewarm water before feeding it to a snake. And then I want you to say pinkies one more time. Pinkies. i like that that was much better that was that was chilling that just the under the breath pinkies if i could assure you that beth was going to keep that snake in its habitat in her in her uh uh dysyson figurine shed, if I could assure you and order that, and if I were to order that Beth get a freezer,

a refrigerator and a freezer for all of her gross animal food and keep it out there, would that satisfy you? Look, I'm not sure it would, because the other part of this is that I can see getting a snake is – I don't want to construct a straw man argument here, so bear with me for a moment. All right. But this – This will be the first time someone hasn't constructed a straw man argument on my podcast so i'm i'm i'm i appreciate your uh i appreciate your diligence go on uh when we we have we have a trend here when we get

some new kind of pet brought into uh uh house here um it seems to escalate and develop beyond just getting a new pet uh at one point a few a couple of years ago we got uh quails there was some there were some cute quails that we we kept in a little a little thing uh and and it wasn't long after we got the quails that now we were raising quail eggs and then having baby quails and breeding quails for a while which was cool but now i'm imagining that we're going to get a snake and then after a while we'll get another snake and then we'll start having snake eggs and then there'll be a there'll be a clutch of snake eggs and then they'll hatch and we'll have a writhing mass of serpents that will be meters from where i sleep at night i wouldn't the incubator's being repurposed so i can't use it for eggs anymore

what is it being repurposed for um i now use it pinky defrosting? No. What is it being used for? I'm afraid to ask. I use it for warming silicon and resins. Oh, alright. That's not a problem. Did you say quails?

Yeah, quails. And do quails mean the same thing in Australia as they mean here? Yes. What do they mean there? Small ground birds? Yeah, quails. And do quails mean the same thing in Australia as they mean here? Yes. What do they mean there? Small ground birds? Yeah. What if I said giant bats?

Quails are giant bats, right? Everybody knows that. Although, now that I think of it, you're closer to Malaysia than to Melbourne, right? I think so. I don't know my geography well enough. We're not far. Maybe you could get some of those giant fox bats as pets. Have you seen those?

No. They're the size of foxes, but they're bats. That's awesome. Yeah, and they crawl around on the ground because they think they're land animals. They fly, too. Yeah, and they crawl around on the ground because they think they're land animals. They fly, too. But you've never seen a more ill-thought-out animal until you've seen a fox bat crawling around on the ground on its knuckles. You should get a couple of those.

I think whales are cute, and I think it's strange that you kept them and I guess you guys have a lot of space out there in Western Australia so that you can create a little quail enclosure in your backyard or whatever. What concerns me is that the quails are now in the past tense what happened to all the quails? Beth? These particular ones

were Japanese quails I got the eggs from a poultry company in Western Australia. They're not bred to be pets. You're telling me an origin story. You're telling me how the quails started. I don't want an origin story. I want to hear which ended first, the quails or the eggs. What happened to the quails?

I want to hear which ended first, the quails or the eggs? What happened to the quails? Due to select breeding for food production, their lifespans are only two years, as well as they're prone to genetic issues that cause them to die. So these were the first quails in history to have died of natural causes. They were not taken by predators or eaten for food. No, they used to follow me around the garden, and then I'd put them in their hutch at night.

And then one day they just stopped quailing. Oh, and I'd eat their eggs. Yeah, quail eggs are great. Put them on a little salad. We made the tiniest little omelets. Tiny fried eggs. All right. Beth, is snake, is the snake, what are you going to name the snake if you get it? I haven't decided yet.

I haven't let myself do that because then, you know, I become too emotionally invested. But also, you have to meet the snake first and get to know it. Where are you going to get the snake if I allow you to get it? It would most likely come from a reptile breeder up north in the Pilbara region and would get flown down. It would get flown down on a plane? Yes. Oh, my God. Historically, that hasn't worked out well for the plane.

Is it a Monday to Friday plane? Yeah, because if you need it on the weekend, you can't get it. If it's a Monday to Friday plane, forget it. I believe the monkey fighting snakes come on the Monday through Wednesday plane, and then the pygmy pythons come Thursday through Friday. So you're going to have the snake flown in from a reputable snake dealer. Presumably you're going to fly up there first and meet the snake? No.

All right, so it doesn't matter. Meeting the snake doesn't matter. What was I going to say? All first and meet the snake? No. All right. So it doesn't matter. Meeting the snake doesn't matter. What was I going to say? All right. If you get the snake, but you're not going to fly up. Is this going to be very expensive to take care of the snake? You already talked about that. I don't know.

What was the question I was going to ask you, Beth, about the snakes? Oh, yeah. When does this stop? That's the question. When does this stop? If I say to you, you can get get this snake but no more quails no more fox bats no more no more uh bush babies or wallabies or kiwis or exotic pets of any kind no more giant tarantulas no more whatever sperm whales for 10 years is this snake worth it to you

yes yes it is because the snake will live for between 15 and 25 years 15 and 25 years mhm that was a pinky level of disgust that I was expecting

when you talked about pinkies I know because what you're thinking is what I want you to're thinking is, what I want you to do, Beth, right now, is I want you to do a quick calculation of how many pinkies are going to have to be defrosted to maintain that snake for, let's say, 20 years. You do that back of the envelope. Ross, I'm going to take this final moment with you. Ross, snakes are gross, but they're not going to menace you. You understand that, right? On some level, yes. It was said to me in the initial brief that I received that you

resisted getting the pugwawa or whatever it was that you pug pug. I did. I, I, I was not a fan of dogs previously. I'm still not really a fan of dogs, but I'm rather fond of our, of our dog. He was scared of him. Why were you not a fan of dogs? Um, we've always had cats since I was like little,

uh, and just, I'm just not a fan of big loud aggressive dogs and so well you don't have one you have a chapug pug well that's that's yeah that's the the key difference here really it's it's a chapug pug is nothing but it's the same thing as a cat except it poops wherever it wants to and not in the same place and it's it would be as if you had injected a cat with a bunch of amphetamines. Pretty much, yeah. And other stimulants that made it love you a lot instead of hate you a lot.

That's probably the best description I've heard of our dog, yes. But you came around on dogs. Is there not the possibility you might come around on the topic of pygmy python, the children's python? I'm not going to say it's impossible, but what you have to bear in mind is that our dog has a really adorable face, as opposed to the nightmarish maw that I understand snakes have. What, you've never even seen one? Not for very long. I usually look away before examining it very closely. Out of...

Do you have other irrational fears that keep you from living the fullest life that you can? Yes. Oh. I have a constellation of irrational fears that keep me from living the fullest life that I can. Give me three of them. Listing irrational fears?

Hmm. Um. All right, Beth. Yes. Have you calculated the number of pinkies? Yes. It would be, depending on how long the snake lived for, between 555 and 925. 555.

Although, as an adult, you might move up to the next size of pinky. Sure. They call it the ring finger, I believe. Nice one, Monty. If you're feeding that, I'm not sure you understand the calculations I was asking. How many pinkies is that snake going to eat over its lifetime? I think you did it correctly because it would eat one every 10 days. Yeah, for 20 years.

Oh, maybe you did it right. 36.20. Yeah. I rounded it, it's actually 36.5 a year, but I rounded it right. 36.20. Yeah. It's actually 36.5 a year, but I rounded it to 37 to be safe. Less than 1,000. So we don't have to cut one in half every year. Now you've just turned my stomach. I'm sorry that I accused you of doing bad math.

It's only because I do terrible maths in my head. So you did a good job. Beth, what are some of Ross's irrational fears before I go into my chambers to make my decision? Beyond snakes. Well, he's still scared of even medium-sized dogs to large dogs. What else is there? Oh, he doesn't like bats. He's a little bit fearful of bats.

And he finds tigers. Although he thinks they're pretty, he thinks they're scary. Being afraid of tigers is not irrational. We went to the zoo recently, and he seemed to comment that a lot of them seemed a little bit scary. Are they mostly animal-based fears? Yes. All right. I think I've heard everything I need to in order to make my decision.

I'm going to go back into my herpeta fauna enclosure and consult with my dozens of iguanas and I'll make my decision in a moment. Please rise as Judge John Hodgman exits the courtroom. Beth and Ross. Snakes.

First, Ross, you seem to be upset and think and fear that these snakes are going to multiply in number and increase like the quail did. Is there a possibility that you could have the snake spayed or neutered? Can you neuter a snake? I personally can't. Beth, are snakes neuterable or spayable? I don't think that's a thing you can do. But, however, you do need a special license in order to breed herpetofauna in Western Australia.

So it would be expensive and difficult for me to start doing that. So you're going to have just the one snake. There's almost no possibility that... Just the one snake. going to have just the one snake there's no almost no possibility that just just the one snake and i will even use all of my wonderful silicon and resin supplies to make it a beautiful custom enclosure now ross i'm also curious are you fearful of the the plumbing snakes and the sort of like under the door draft snakes that they sell at the hardware store you work for bunnies i did i did catch one out of the corner of my eye last time we were there and,

and was worried for a moment, but then, then, then we, we, we investigated and it was okay. Now, Beth, you are, seem to be extremely knowledgeable, not only about these pygmy Python or the children's Python or the Western children's Python, but about all manner of the animal kingdom. And also your voice is adorable. And I feel like it can't go without saying.

Thank you. You're a delight to listen to. I want you to read children's books to my children. We'll be back in just a moment with Judge Hodgman's decision. Hello, I'm your Judge John Hodgman. The Judge John Hodgman podcast is brought to you every week by you, our members, of course. Thank you so much for your support of this podcast and all of your favorite podcasts at MaximumFun.org. And they are all your favorites.

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on menus all around the world have in common. They're made in Made In. Save up to 25% this Memorial Day from the 18th until the 27th. Visit madeincookware.com. That's M-A-D-E-I-N cookware.com that's m-a-d-e-i-n cookware.com please rise as judge john hodgman re-enters the courtroom well first of all i'm just going to order right off the bat beth you got to get those blood worms out of the fridge

you have to you have you can't You can't be keeping your live blood worms or even your dead blood worms in your food fridge. You are keeping exotic or semi-exotic. You're keeping animals that require food and enough such that you are keeping

worms alive, you put them in a separate fridge. I don't know if they call them dormitory fridges there. I think mini fridges. Get a small mini fridge or small mini fridge freezer combo. Put it in your shed or your workshop. And keep that stuff in there. Normally, I mean, here's the thing.

Beth, I appreciate that snakes are beautiful animals, and they are peace-loving animals. And much as the state of Maine would like to remind us, they are misunderstood and have been attributed with evil intent throughout all time because of their simple weirdness and disgustingness. But they are not themselves evil. They're just animals that eat disgusting things and do disgusting things. And they're weird because they have no legs and that's weird. And so we are freaked out by them. The irrational fear that Ross feels is not entirely irrational because you are confronting,

when you confront a snake, the discomfort of the utterly uncanny. It does not conform to any other animal that seems to make sense to us. And it's not as weird even as the glass lizard, which is not a snake, it's a lizard that has no legs. The difference is it has eyelids, unlike a snake. It just gets weird in the world of herpetofauna. Do you know what I mean? It's weird. Last night, I was out here in the semi-wilderness of Maine,

and a luna moth tried to enter my home. Luna moth is the size of my hand, outstretched hand. The biggest moth I'd ever seen. It was basically knocking on the door. Gross nature was knocking on the door saying, let me in and take care of me forever. And some things like that, some big moths and all snakes, just weird people out. It's just a natural reaction. But not everybody.

And some people love them. And some people appreciate that they're not evil. And some people find them to be very beautiful. And those people who keep them as pets enjoy them very much. But those people tend to be solitary. Snakes are not the kinds of pets you get when you're in a couple, typically. Snakes are the kinds of pets when you just get out of college and you get your first apartment, you're like, finally, I'm going to cut loose. I'm going to get a weird snake. It's a pet that you use to court other people with by walking around the park with a snake on your hands or over your shoulders to make contact with the other weirdos in life who love snakes. You happen to be in a relationship now with a dude who is just put off by snakes. And his fear of them is not entirely irrational.

It is, I think, hardwired into us to some degree. The idea of feeding frozen baby mice to a creature is not everyone's idea of a good time for a pet. But of course, Ross, you do have an irrational fear of snakes. And that irrational fear is your belief that the snake is suddenly going to become lots of snakes. I don't know if you know anything about snake biology, but it takes two snakes to make more snakes. It's just how it goes. more snakes. Just how it goes. And regardless of whatever piece of paper, phony license that any Australian could print off the web in order to breed snakes, the fact is, Beth is not talking

about getting two snakes, she's talking about getting one snake. And there aren't a bunch of pygmy pythons sneaking around your house, looking to get in with that other python to make a bunch of pygmy pythons sneaking around your house looking to get in with that other python to make a bunch, what you called, I thought beautifully, what was a writhing mass of serpents. That is an irrational fear. Because snakes are so odd and because I believe, you know, I'm going to get a lot of angry letters from reptile fans here. And I love those. I love reptiles. I've always wanted to have one until I realized I had to feed it a mouse or a rat or a pinky. Then I'm just like, not for me. That's fine. But because snakes are traditionally the pet of the solitary person, and it is unusual to bring them into a home that you share with another. I would normally say that the rule about pets applies here as it does to all couples.

Both, the decision to get the pet has to be unanimous. You can't just have a unilateral decision to get a snake or a dog or a cat. You have to both agree upon it. And Ross is digging his heels in, and he has not been moved so far, Beth, by the snake poetry you tried to lay down on me. That said, a snake is unlike a dog, not only because it is not cute or affectionate in any way, but also it does not require as much care.

Snakes and reptiles are the pets of the solitary people because it is a personal relationship between you and that reptile. That reptile is just basically going to sit around most of the time in its enclosure and not look at you or think about you. And every now and then you're going to throw it some meat and it's going to eat those things and it's going to go on about its life. It is not going to frolic about the yard. It is not going to try to sneak into your bed. It is not going to require Ross going on a midnight walk around the neighborhood with the snake on a leash in order

to relieve itself. The implications on Ross's life of snake ownership are minimal, to say the least, or even the most. I'm not even sure what I'm saying anymore. Point is, the only imposition upon Ross is that he's scared of a snake in a shed on his property. And for that reason, and because I do believe it has been a lifelong dream of yours, Beth. I am going to allow you to get the snake, but on very firm condition. Ross wants no part of this snake. He doesn't want to see it. He doesn't want to hear about it. He doesn't want you throwing it in his face, trying to convert him into snake lichen. Ross is on the side of most civilization of snake abhorrence. You are of a selected few

who love snakes and appreciate them for the completely simple, innocent animals that they are. He doesn't want to feed that snake, doesn't want to see those pinkies. As far as he's concerned, out in your shed

is a dark dimension that he will never enter and will never hear about. And you may not get any more animals. You may replace a dog or a cat should it come to an untimely or timely end.

But until this snake bites it, until it eats its thousandth and final pinky, this is as far as it goes. This is the end. No quails, no fox bats, no nothing. Do you understand these rules and strictures? Yes, I do.

Then the court finds in your favor. This is the sound of a gavel. Judge Sean Hodgman rules. That is all. Beth, you must be delighted. I am. I'm very happy. Do you think that you might name the snake Judge John Hodgman?

I could do that if you would like, or I could name it Monty. No, Monty Python would just be too much. Oh, yes, of course. do you think you could make some i order you to name it monty belmonti python done if you do it send me a picture because i will i will adopt your python from from these shores i will i'll even put a little hat on it have you seen the snakes wearing hats please tell me this isn't true. Yeah, it's... Oh, it's the greatest thing in the world.

I tried to convince Ross that snakes weren't so scary by showing him the snakes wearing hats. Little hats. I'm sure they love it. If I were you guys, I would look into the Instagram account of the recording artist Jean Gray, G-R-A-E. She is a singer and a rapper and a comedian and a writer and an excellent person all around. And she loves snakes with hats. And she curates a lot of pictures of snakes with hats. But Ross doesn't have to look at any of that stuff.

Ross just doesn't like snakes. Leave Ross out of this. This is between you and your new pet Monty Belmonte python. And your new pet fetish of snakes with hats. I've never heard of anything like this. Ross, does that make you like snakes more? When you see them with hats?

No. No. Just no. Ross, I feel for you, but it does seem like you have some irrational fears. Although you've put up with quite a bit with three cats, one dog who you were terrified of at first, and fish beyond measure, as you say. Are you ready to welcome Monty Belmonte Python into your home? No, Monty, he doesn't have to. He doesn't ever see the snakeonte Python into your home? No, Monty, he doesn't have to. He doesn't have to ever see the snake.

Onto your property? I suppose I'm going to have to be. Ross, let me say that I want to be friends to all the people and beasts of the world, and especially to my friends in Australia. I realize that I have made a judgment that you don't agree with. How,

how, uh, how upset are you by this judgment? I figured it was going to go this way. So you sound, you sound so defeated and snake feared. Yeah. Yeah.

Not only did I lose, there's also snakes coming now. So, yeah, but I want you to, when that snake comes into that shed, I want you to remember the joy that you heard in Beth's voice. Yeah. And I also want you to remember, no more bloodworms in your fridge. I was going to say, that's good news right there. No more bloodworms in the fridge.

Yeah, he really didn't like the bloodworms, especially the time they escaped from the container. Yeah, he really didn't like the blood worms, especially the time they escaped from the container. That was really bad. And don't you understand now that that might be, we might have gotten to the source, the traumatic event at the source of Ross's herpetophobia? Now I'm afraid of

snakes envisioning that. Guys, thank you so much for calling in, and I wish you the best. But Beth, I want you to appreciate that this is not, it's not your job in life to make Ross in love with snakes. It's your job in life to respect his disgust of snakes. I understand. And to keep that snake to yourself. Thank you so much, Beth and Ross,

for being on the Judge John Hodgman podcast. Thank you very much. It was a pleasure. Hello, teachers and faculty. This is Janet Varney. I'm here to remind you that listening to my podcast, The JV Club with Janet Varney, is part of the curriculum

for the school year. Learning about the teenage years of such guests as Alison Brie, Vicki Peterson, John Hodgman, and so many more is a valuable and enriching experience, one you have no choice but to embrace, because yes, listening is mandatory. The JV Club with Janet Varney is available every Thursday on Maximum Fun or wherever you get your podcasts. Thank you. And remember, no running in the halls. If you need a laugh and you're on the go, try S-T-O-P-P-O-D-C-A-S-T-I. Were you trying to put the name of the podcast there? Yeah, I'm trying to spell it, but it's tricky. Let me give it a try.

Okay. If you need a laugh and you're on the go, call S-T-O-P-P-P-A-D-I. It'll never fit. No, it will. Let me try. If you need a laugh and you're on the go, try S-T-O-P-P-P-D-C-O-O. Ah, we are so close. Stop podcasting yourself.

A podcast from MaximumFun.org. If you need a laugh, then you're on the go. Alright, Judge Hodgman, you want to clear the docket? Oh, I'm so mad, Monty Belmonte. Why? Well, I was a good, Monty Belmonte. Why? Well, it was a good quote from the State of Maine's

website about snakes, but I just remembered this movie that I could have had a quote from in which, it was a movie from the 70s, in which Dirk Benedict, before he played Starbuck on the original Battlestar Galactica,

played a lab assistant, It was a horror movie. He plays a lab assistant to a herpetologist and he gets injected with an experimental formula and turns into a giant snake. What is it called? Do you know what the name of the movie is? No.

That's the name of the movie. I'm not joking. It's like 15 S's. Yeah, no. Not hiss. There's no H. I don't understand why you can't hear me. I know I'm in Maine and you're in Massachusetts, but our connection is pretty good.

I thought that I lost your signal for a moment there. Here's what I want. But that's just a title. That's the title. Oh, well. I didn't put an H. I'll have to save that. You know what?

I'm going to have to save that for another cultural reference. Well, hopefully you have another snake case soon. Here I am in Maine. Monty, here I am in Maine. And you didn't even ask me if I stopped at the Kennebunk Service Plaza on my way from you to Maine to see Jonathan, the Fresh Banana Man. Did you see the Fresh Banana Man? I did not see him. I stopped at the Kennebunk Service Plaza. I'm referring, of course, to the gentleman at the Kennebunk Service Plaza, who is a friend of the show and occasionally writes letters that we read on the show that I met driving down from Maine to Massachusetts last year, who stands and sells bananas by calling

out to the food court, fresh bananas here, we got fresh bananas. And if you listen to the show at all, you've seen pictures of listeners with him and so forth. But here's the thing. I stopped at the service plaza on the northbound side. He works the southbound side. So when you come home. I did stop at the service plaza. I'm like, maybe I'll see Banana Man. Maybe he's working on the northbound side just for a fun.

But he wasn't working there. And instead, I got a phone call from a creep who had hacked into a computer system and had stolen my identity. I had to change all my credit cards. Because you visited that service plaza? While I was at that service plaza, I got a phone call from a creep saying, is this your name and social security number? I have all your information. How much money will you give me? And I said, zero.

And I hung up. That is unbelievable. And had to change everything. And so meanwhile, he was working on the Southbound side that day. And I think it may even have been that day that a bunch of teenagers from the Youth Harmony Choral Summer Program

showed up and did a weird flash mob celebration of him by singing a South African folk song, replacing all of the words with the word banana to him impromptu to his surprise and tears and delight. Did they do that because they know him from you? No, that's the thing. I thought for sure, but they just, they had discovered him. The name of this summer program, it's based in Vermont, and I just want to make sure that I have the correct name here, so bear with me one second. The name of the summer program is called Village Harmony,

and it's based in Vermont, and it's a summer choral program for teenagers and adults, and they all get together, and they sing songs, and then they go on tour together, and they were on tour, and they had stopped at the service plaza, and they saw him selling his bananas, and they were so moved that the next time they came through, they did a flash mob

banana song for him. And you can check out the, Jonathan tweeted it out, you should follow him, guys, at Fresh Bananas here, at F-R-E-S-H Bananas, H-E-A, here. And we'll post it on the show blog as well when this comes out. But it was an amazing moment. And it just goes to show that the southbound service plaza at the Kennebunk Rest Stop rules northbound drools.

Southbound is the site of magic and beauty, and the northbound is the Randall Flag side. It's the dark side of the service plaza. It's where the snakes live. It's where only evil happens. Well, I'm going to Canabunkport this weekend, so I'm going to make sure not to go to the northbound service center, but I will hope to stop on the southbound and see Jonathan the Fresh Banana Man because I've got to meet him at this point.

You were filled with so much joy when you came down to do the podcast after you met the Fresh Banana Man that it makes me sad that you had to experience identity theft in that way. Probably the worst. Probably the most. It was the most frightening. I lifted up the phone and lifted up the, to my ear and answered it, and this evil person was on the other end, like a snake. Anyway, let's clear the docket. Nick writes, my friend Ben insists on referring to monster movies like Godzilla, Pacific Rim, or Cloverfield as kaiju movies. Okay, they are kaiju movies, but the way he only refers to them as kaiju instead of just big monster movies is pretentious.

Maybe my mind just can't take hearing the term kaiju more than ten times in one conversation. Can you help us kaijudicate the issue? Kaijudicate. Tee hee. Yeah, they are kaiju movies, but kaiju as a phrase or as a descriptive term for big, giant monster movies, while that has been how they were always described in Japan, the place of their birth, it's only recently that kaiju has finally broken through into common parlance with this uh this godzilla movie i think finally that's when you started to see like the hollywood reporter and other magazines referring to that as that genre as kaiju this particular godzilla movie that just came out yeah and also a little bit of the pacific rim you started to hear kaiju and like i you know it's been bubbling under the surface like like a lot of uh japanese and asian popular culture that's been working its way into our popular culture via Internet. But it finally burst through into accepted mainstream parlance in the same way that all of a sudden, after many, many years of resistance, the dams burst and suddenly everyone loves soccer here all of a sudden.

Right. That whole World Cup thing that took me completely by surprise that everyone in the world would care. Right. That whole World Cup thing that took me completely by surprise that everyone in the world would care. So there's nothing wrong with... Everyone else in the world usually cares, but not this country as much. Australia, they care. But the American acceptance of the term kaiju is similar to the American acceptance of the term soccer, which is that it's been bubbling up for a long time and then suddenly it just broke through. which is that it's been bubbling up for a long time,

and then suddenly it just broke through. And so there is this kind of, to my ear, to refer to Godzilla or Pacific Rim as a kaiju movie does wreak a little bit of nerd pretension and or Johnny-come-lately-ness, but it's not wrong to say. I would suggest using it maybe once in the conversation. If you're using it 10 times in the conversation, you're not having a conversation anymore.

You're just dictating a 5,000 word think piece for the Dissolve website. So just say Kaiju one time, we all know that you're cool, and then move on. And maybe say it was like Kaiju, you know, big lizard movies or big monster movies. And also Godzilla. Welcome everybody

in there. Yeah, and also Godzilla, if you you got a movie with Bryan Cranston and Julia Pinochian it's okay to keep them around for the whole movie it's okay to have the hero of the movie be a grown man every now and then just my thought nothing against I don't have anything against uh Kick-Ass the star of that movie no problems but you have a you have some great actors. It's okay to make a movie where the hero is a grown man. All of the big blockbuster movies, or women, all of the big blockbuster movies that you're emulating had grown men and women as the center of them. Harrison Ford was a grown man in Indiana Jones.

They don't have to be children. They don't have to be children all the time. I'm just, you know, now that I'm getting old, I'm much more attuned to ageism. Do you say manga and anime? Or manga, some people would say? I say manga. I say, no, I know. No, I don't say those things. But I'm okay with people saying them. All right. Yeah, I think you can say it once in a while. I say Star Blazers and Battle of the Planets. Move on. Next one. Aubrey writes, My partner Ginger and I have a long-running argument. Is it okay to go into a restaurant that's 10 minutes from the official closing time?

Ginger thinks it's a huge burden to the waitstaff to have a patron come in just before closing. I spent about 10 years in food service. On a slow night, latecomers can be a little annoying, but it's all just part of the job. Plus, people who come in late are often great tippers. I say that if a restaurant wanted to have all patrons out by 10 or whenever, they should have set an earlier closing time. Judge Hodgman, please settle this for us. Well, first of all, Aubrey and Ginger, your names are delightful,

and I would think fictional. You sound like a pair of snakes in a children's book maybe even a children's python Aubrey and Ginger if you had two children python hey Monty Monty still my courtroom my joke isn't even that good

Aubrey and Ginger go out to dinner is the name of the children's book and the two snakes go to the restaurant and it's ten minutes before closing and the host or hostess at the restaurant looks at them and goes, this is why everyone thinks snakes are jerks. Don't go to a restaurant 10 minutes before closing and order a full meal. I don't care how long you worked in food service. You should know better. You're causing all those people to stay much later than they would have otherwise,

if you're the only ones there now i'm telling you you can go there and you can ask nicely and if they say yeah yeah yeah no problem then obviously no no problem but read the situation they're not going to say no no problem they're going to go yeah okay and if you have to eat some food because you're starving and you go into a restaurant 10 minutes before closing don't order uh you know the the souffle order something simple scrambled eggs get out of there but coffee humans go home gone right right i'm sorry about that i would never do that yeah i don't care how long you worked in the service industry that doesn't give you license to to be a be a jerk all right well judge john John Hodgman, I have also stolen your identity.

That's something I didn't want to tell you until it was all over. And that was me on the phone in the northbound plaza. But I'll give it back when you come back from vacation, when you come back to Northampton to visit me here at the WRSI studios. Well, our thanks this week go to WRSI, the river in Northampton, Massachusetts, for hosting Summer Bailiff Monty Belmonte, while I am in the northern New England confines of the great state of Maine at WERU, Community Radio 89.9 FM, with Joel T. Mann, Programming and Operations Manager, who has no microphone. He is waving at the microphone. Very good. He says hello to all of you. Thank you for making this New England summer edition of the Judge John Hodgman program

possible. Monty, who else do we have to thank? Thanks to Patty Caffrey for suggesting this week's case name, which is wonderful and embarrassing at the same time. Monty Belmonte Python. I guess she didn't even know I was going to be part of this when she suggested that name. To suggest a name for a future case, like us on Facebook, we regularly put out a call for submissions. If you have a case for the judge, submit it at www.maximumfund.org slash JJ Ho. Or write me. Okay. Or write me directly at Hodgman at maximumfund.org. Or write me directly at Hodgman at MaximumFun.org. I've been your guest bailiff, Monty Belmonte.

Julia Smith produces the show. Mark McConville is our editor. Thanks for joining us on the Judge John Hodgman podcast. That is all. MaximumFun.org. Comedy and culture. Artist owned. Listener supported.