Judge John Hodgman - Passover-ruled

Episode Date: June 24, 2026

Marc is Jewish, and Marianne is Catholic. Together with their extended family (and friends!) they celebrate a LOT of holidays. The dispute? When a holiday falls in the middle of the week, as many Jewish holidays do, Marc would prefer to celebrate them on a Saturday night instead, so more of their loved ones can join. But Marianne says no! It's not kosher! Who's right? Thanks to reddit user u/lexfri for naming this week’s case! To suggest a title for a future episode, keep an eye on the Maximum Fun subreddit at reddit.com/r/maximumfun! ---Judge John Hodgman is member-supported! Become a member to unlock special bonus episodes and more. Memberships start at just $5 a month. Just tap here!

Welcome to the Judge John Hodgman podcast. I'm Bill of Jesse Thorne. This week, pass overruled. Mark brings the case against his wife, Marianne. Mark is Jewish. Mary Ann is Catholic. They celebrate a lot of holidays. But Jewish holidays often fall midweek. When this happens, Mark wants to celebrate on Saturday night instead. This way, more people are available to attend. But Marianne says, that's not kosher. She says, if a holiday occurs midweek, that's when she's hooking and hosting. Who's right, who's wrong, only one can decide, please rise as Judge John Hodgman enters the courtroom and presents an obscure cultural reference. He found the matzah because you told him where it was hidden, didn't you? Didn't you? Bailiff, Jesse Thorne, please swear the litigants in. Mark, Marianne,

please rise and raise your right hands. Do you swear to tell the truth, the whole truth, nothing but the truth. So help you, God or whatever. Yes. I do. Do you swear to abide by Judge John Hodgeman's ruling despite the fact that he doesn't celebrate any holidays at all since he was converted by Larry Graham of Sly and the Family Stone and Graham Central Station to Jehovah's Witness? I will. Sorry, John. It just occurred to me. That was Prince. That was Prince. The singer Prince. Yeah. It's not. It's not uncommon that I and the deceased artist formerly known as Prince and then known as Prince again are often confused with one another. Exactly. Judge Hodgman, you may proceed.

Mark and Marianne, you may be seated for an immediate summary judgment in one of yours favors on this episode of the podcast called Passover ruled. Can I either of you guess the piece of culture that I referenced as I entered this courtroom? Marianne, we'll start with you. You were referring to hiding the matzah for Elijah the prophet to come to find it. Is that? Yes, but I was quoting a specific, I'll give you a hint, a television show. If you didn't guess the obscure, it's not that obscure a television show, but the reference itself was it. Curb your enthusiasm?

Was it what? Was it what some is it? Curb your enthusiasm? Well, it might have be. Let me write that down in the guest book. Curb your enthusiasm. Anyone watching the YouTube now can see that not only am I writing it down, but I've also become left-handed recently. Mark, do you understand the mission now?

I do. And am I pronouncing your name correctly? It's Mark with a C, correct? You're hearing the C all right, Mark? It is, you're coming through loud and clear. That was more of a Mark with a K. I'll try it again. Mark.

A little softer. Mount, good. Sounds good. Marianne guessed that I was quoting from Curb Your enthusiasm. What do you guess? I was quoting from. I would say, all in the family. All in the family.

Another TV show, I'm going to write that down. Thank you. And those of you who are watching me write this down on YouTube, you'll notice that I'm in a new location. I'm here at Ginny Media Studios in Midtown Manhattan with Ryan over there on the board, on the knobs and dials. Ryan, do you have a guest you want to make? Ryan says curb.

Ryan, what season and episode do you think it was? Season 7, episode 6. If you couldn't hear him, Marianne. What season and episode did you think I was? By the way, Mark, you're wrong. It is curb your enthusiasm. Did I just win? Well, only if you can name the season and the episode.

Because I'm a little stinker. Season 6, episode 5. I have no clue. All those numbers sound familiar. The correct answer is season 5, episode 7. Oh, you were all. All so close, except for Mark with a C. It was not close at all.

That's typical. I don't know if there was a Seder on All in the Family, I wonder. But there was on Curb Your Enthusiasm, I believe the episode was called The Sater. And Larry and Cheryl, aka Mrs. R. F.K. Jr., no comment. Host a Sater. And, of course, you made a reference, Marian, to the Passover tradition of hiding a piece of matzah and the children are invited to go and find it. And if they, the first find it gets dollar in the case of this episode.

And Stevie, the kid comes to demand his dollar. And Larry accuses him of cheating. Specifically, he accuses Stevie's dad, played by Stephen Tobolovsky, of tipping Stevie off the Mata was in the bookcase. Stephen Tobolovsky, of course, played my dad in what very, very famous animated show still available on Hulu. Mark, Marianne, any guesses? All guesses are wrong. Dick Town on Hulu. Still available on Hulu.

Sorry to have to say that in front of two respectable people like yourselves, but guess what? It's not what you think it might be about. And to everyone's surprise, most of all mine, if you Google Dicktown, it actually sends you to our animated show that David Rees and I created a show with a lot of heart, a lot of, not a lot of bad words, not a lot of serious themes, but we called it Dick Town in order to get FX to sign off for it because they're edgy. Anyway, here we are. To take up your case. Who seeks justice in this court of mine? Well, I'm seeking justice for many years. We've had this disagreement, and we're looking to you, to your wisdom, to give us the correct answer. Now, you're looking at my wisdom, Mark, but here's the thing. You're a judge. That's correct. You're a legit judge in the Commonwealth of Massachusetts. Correct. Yeah, I'm retired now. Retired. Right. Yeah, I am retired. Because you're looking at a judge who never served.

What area of judging did you get up to when you were on the bench there in Massachusetts? I was on the appeals court, so I decided every issue from each of the trial courts, criminal, probate, land, everything. And let me ask you this. I got this off of a retailer website. It's actually a graduation robe. And it's in pretty bad shape. Where would you get your robes as a judge? From the same place. Really? Graduationrobes.com or whatever?

Exactly right. Do you still have any of them? I do. Did you ever embroider anything special on your robes like Rehnquist used to on the Supreme Court? Just my initials on the back, just my initials on the inside. Did you embroider on the back of the robes? It's Mark with a sea god or whatever, damn it. No, no, okay.

And Marianne, are you also a judge? No, I am not. I never was, and I never will be. But you met in a courtroom? Yes. Correct. I'm sure there are many circumstances that would cause for a meet cute in the court. What were yours?

I was the court reporter, and he was an assistant DA, and it was an unarmed robbery case. and he came in to try it. And he unarmed stole your heart? I still remember the defendant's name and the assistant DA, who later became my husband, won the case. Well, that's wonderful.

Let me ask you this. Assistant DA, Mark, were you a shaggy DA? How is it? I'd like to think competent DA. I'd like to think. And Marianne, you were a court report. Did you do the thing that went like this? Yes.

For those of you're watching, not watching on the YouTube, I'm pretending to play a mini Casio keyboard, which is what they used to record the proceedings. When the trial was over, he asked me if I wanted to have lunch with him. And that rest is history. We had lunch, and it lasted all weekend. Whoa, wow. That sounds like a hot lunch. It was. How long ago was that, my time?

I was in, that was 40, what, 43 years, yeah, 43 years ago. Wonderful. Would it be fair to say that it's a 43 year old first lunch still? From time to time. The magic is still there, even if the food's gotten a little cold. From time to time. All the time. Right.

Sometimes there are conflicts, including right now. So you're in a mixed faith household. And Marianne, you are, you're Cass. click and Mark, you are Jewish, and you want me to rule which is better? Is that right? Sorry, I'm just talking my notes here. I have on this piece of paper that they want to know which God prefers. Yeah, which is God or whatever's favorite religion. No, it says here that you, you host a lot of holidays in your home. How many holidays are you hosting in your home, Marian? I'd say we probably do 10 large holiday dinners every year.

And by large, what are we talking about? We have big families. So the minimum is usually 18 to 20 people. We have gone up as high as 35 people. Oh, Marianne. And we're talking about Passover. We're talking about Thanksgiving. We're talking about the Feast of the Seven Fishes.

That's something you do? Yes, yes. Really? Yes, the whole thing. Christmas, Easter, Hanukkah, Rosh Hashanah. Passover. Father's Day, Mother's Day, everything. We do it all. Now, Mark, you are arguably, this is the argument that you might be making, I hope, actually trying to lighten the load for Marianne. Because you are arguing that there are,

that there are certain holidays, Jewish holidays in particular, that often fall in the middle of the week. And you think it would be easier and better to actually have the big dinner on a weekend. Is that your argument? No, it'll be, it'll be more difficult to have it on a weekend for Mary Ann. Oh, okay, great. Then I rule in Marianne's favor. But that's what you want to have happen. You want to make it more difficult for her? It is more difficult because she's going to cook for far more people on a Saturday night than a Wednesday night. Yeah, but that's what you want. You wanted to be on a Saturday night. That is absolutely correct. More people, more festivity. Well, if it's not to make it easier for Marianne, why are you insisting?

that you observe these holidays that would fall in the middle of the week on a weekend instead. So our family can all come together, like my son and his wife and the two children can join us. They can't do it on a Wednesday because it's too far away and the kids have school the next day. If you do it on a Saturday, our son, our two grandsons, and our daughter-in-law can come and join us. Marianne, what's your position on this? Well, I have two positions. My first position is it's tradition. You hold it on the day that it is and not move it to the weekend because it's more convenient. I think that's crazy. And number two, everybody knows what day it is when they look at the calendar because you see it's Rosh Hashanah and they know they're coming to my house. If we try to move it to a different day, we have to deal with everybody's conflicts. And I have to deal with everybody's conflicts. And I have to, Little League and I have to go to the dentist and I did it I'm just it now there's some certainty because we're dealing with two families with two different traditions so this year Wednesday was Passover and then

we had my family for Easter on Sunday I don't have enough time to move Passover to Saturday and then have Easter on Sunday and it's for a lot of people so I just think he should butt out because I do everything anyway. I mean, do we even need to keep rolling, Mark? What is your defense here? Well, candidly, I've been fighting this battle for 42 years, and I'm 0 for 42. So this goes all the way back to the beginning of your marriage.

When I presume you did not have children or grandchildren. That's correct. Families were smaller. But how did this start? When did this first come up as a dispute? for you. Well, his parents moved here from New York, and I had a toddler, and his brother had a toddler, and his parents' house was small. So I volunteered to do the high holy days dinner, because people would just be more comfortable. And it never went anywhere else after that.

They just always assumed for the next 40 years that I would just continue to do it. and I'm happy to do it. I learned how to cook all the food to make his mother happy, and I make great brisket and great matzo balls, and I'm very proud of that. But in my mind, I'm doing it because we're celebrating these high holy days. You just don't move it to Saturday because it's a better party night. I actually think we have some evidence of some of the food you prepare. Can we take a look at some of that evidence, please? Yeah. Okay. What are we looking at? There's a photo here of a beautifully set table and it looks like some carrots in a bowl. What's going on here, Marian?

Those are honey carrots. And right behind those look like potato lackeys. So this was obviously a Hanukkah dinner. Hanukkah dinner. Everything looks delicious. How many people came to Hanukkah? Oh. Oh, yeah.

I can see some Hanukkah gelt in the corner there. Yes. I'm going to say there were probably 25 people at this dinner. Oh, my gosh. Eventually, you know, everybody had more children's. So then there were more kids there and more spouses. Wouldn't you tell them to stop having children? She couldn't.

She's the Catholic one, John. Oh, right. That's true. We had our house renovated so that we could make the table longer as the families got bigger. Let me see some more pictures of food. That's what's going to sell this podcast right now. That's briskish. Delicious.

That looks amazing. What's your brisket recipe there? It's a sweet and sour marinade, and it goes into the refrigerator three days ahead of time. Whoa. Then I cook it on the second day, and then on the third day, I have to skim all the fat off and slice it, put it back in the sauce and reheat it. Yeah. So it's a bit of a project. And when you skim all the fat off, do you put it in a container and then mail it to me?

That would be my preference. And was this also Hanukkah dinner or a different holiday? I don't know. The family likes brisket. So when I do brisket for Rosh Hashanah, I do brisket for Hanukkah, I do brisket for Passover. And a few years ago, when we used to do, we used to also do the night before Yom Kippur, then I would do a chicken or a turkey because they had just had brisket the week before. Right. So you had to mix it up a little bit. Yes. And then for Easter, what are you doing? Easter is Italian. So we start off with scuralla soup. Then we have lasagna with the gravy meat and salad. Then we take a break. Then we have roast lamb, roast and baked ham and grilled asparagus and roasted potatoes. And then we have dessert. So that's a lot too. And it's hard to do Passover and Easter on the same weekend. I don't even know how I could do that.

Now, as I'm not someone who observes Passover, Jennifer Marmer, you, you, you, you, you, you, you, you, you, you, you, you, you, you, you, you, you, you, you, you, you, you, you, you, you, you, you, you, you're, you, you know, I'm sure there is an issue, theologically, to have your Passover Seder on a Saturday? I don't know if you, this is going to be a helpful answer for this case. I might need to recuse myself, um, but, you know, I'm sure there is an issue, but my family is a family that will celebrate on the weekend instead of the middle of the week because for the reasons that Mark, I think, is arguing, but also because my mom still works, and it actually is easier for her to do it on the weekend, and she's still the host of these gatherings. So, but Mark, as a Jewish person and your extended family on your side, I presume, is also Jewish. There's no, it's not a big deal for you to be having Passover on a Saturday, theologically speaking. Yeah, it would be fine to have Passover. over on a Saturday. Even though God hates that.

Marian, it's a lot of work to host a big holiday dinner party like this. Do you enjoy it? Do you have any help? Tell me about your process. Well, my daughter was a big helper, and she would always stay after to clean. We had a whole cleaning routine in the kitchen with the music and the dancing and the dishes. but she just recently had a baby, so she's retiring from that. So actually, this year on Passover, I made him stay in the kitchen with me and help with the

dishes because I was all by myself there. And he kept saying, are we done yet? Can I go? And I know we're not done yet. Holy moly. Yeah, hi, holy moly days, right? Wow, okay. Mark standing in a whole.

and the only tool he has is a shovel. Yeah, no. I'm kind of like, I got to angle around the camera here in the studio to see Mark on the monitor. Mark, it looks like you have two legs, but weirdly not one of them to stand on. Am I to presume you've already made your decision? No, no, no. Judge to judge, of course not. I am forming my opinion.

I'm trying to hear. hear everything. So let's hear from your side of it. Why do you think Marianne refuses to cook and clean for your pleasure? Let me tell you. My wife is the best cook and she's really terrific. My family, her family loves everything that she cooks. I know. I'm having her send all of that brisket fat to me. And I'm just saying it would be nice if like my son and my two young grandsons and my daughter-in-law can join us on the weekend to engage in this festivity. Is this a problem that has come up in the past? Have you had holidays, have you had celebrations of the high holidays where your family members can't participate because it's a weekday?

Yeah, yes. Yeah, my son can, you know, my son and his family usually cannot make it. And is your son saying, gosh, dad, I wish you would have it on the weekend? I wish you would make Marianne cook for us on the weekend? Or is this something that's more internally motivated by you? No, no. He would love to have it on the weekend so we can join us. But there are other weekend holidays that he could come around for, right? And he does. They do. Yeah. How far away do they live? You said 45 minutes or so? Well, it depends on the traffic. They live in East Boston. We live in Canton, so I would say it's 35 to 40 minutes. But his wife, my daughter-in-law, works in Lynn, and that is considerably farther away. And that's why they don't come during the week.

But may I just say this? They are with us a lot on the weekends. They have their own little apartment in our house. So they spend a lot of Saturday nights sleeping in my basement. And I feed them when they're there. Marian, it's one thing to work really hard to feed a large family dinner on any holiday. But you also, as you pointed out, had to learn a lot of new recipes and traditions in order to observe these holidays properly. What was that like for you? I was scared at first. My mother-in-law had a lot of rules, and she was a stern taskmaster. But is she no longer with us, I take it?

She is not. I'm sorry. What were some of the things that you learned from her specifically? Some lessons either about food or life or both that you remember. I remember the first time I made a brisket. I think it tasted fine, but she came in the kitchen after dinner. And she said, the next time you make a brisket, you have to remember to slice it across the grain so you don't have all strings on the plate. And I've never forgot that.

That was probably 40 years ago. I mean, that's rock-solid advice. That's not just a whiny complaint. No, you're absolutely right. I remember then she was right and it works. I mean, another good piece of advice is don't serve a bunch of strings on a plate. Mark with a C, Judge Mark with a C, excuse me, your honor. What's your favorite thing to cook?

Steam. Okay. I don't, you don't cook at all. Why would I ever cook would I have a master chef living with me? So she is. She's a phenomenal. I don't know.

Maybe you thought you'd go on a podcast sometime and not want to be judged harshly. That's right. Mark sounds like my college roommate Nathaniel, who God bless him. I mean, one of the wonderfulest guys in the world, one day I came home to our apartment and there was just an egg on the stove in a sauce pan. cooking a dry sauce pan. And there was much dissension about whether Nathaniel thought you boiled an egg, you didn't need water to boil an egg,

or whether Nathaniel had been boiling that egg so long that all of the water had left the pan. Wow. I don't remember which one Nathaniel claimed was what had happened, but he strongly insisted on one of those. Mark, let me ask you this question, and I'm saying this with a lot of affection, judge to judge. Can you cook an egg? Yes. In fact, over the weekend, I made some scrambled eggs with a little cut-up ham and cheese.

And it was pretty good. Because if I had to guess, I would have said the only way you know how to make an egg is on your face. Mark, do you feel like your family gets short shrift on Passover if it's held during the middle of the week? can't join when Easter is almost always celebrated on Easter Sunday. Well, the only short shrift is that, you know, my whole family cannot attend. Although most of my family does attend, the main people who did not attend were my son and his wife and their two young kids. Right. They're the ones that Marianne are cruelly locking out.

Absolutely. Of this night that is unlike any other. Absolutely. Absolutely. My son brought up over the weekend, they came to visit us over the weekend, over the weekend that we're celebrating Father's Day the day before Father's Day. We're not celebrating it on Sunday. We're celebrating it on Saturday at my wife's insistence. So my son said, if you can do that, why can't you celebrate the Jewish holidays on a Saturday? Would you normally

have a big family dinner on Father's Day to finally give Mark a chance to relax? We usually do a big Barbecue on Father's Day. Well, that raises a good point, Mary. And Mark, your son is the one who's agitating for a weekend. Couldn't he host it in his house? He and his family? No, they can't. So I'll just leave it.

No. Mm-hmm. I see. Well, they live in the city. There's no parking. They live in a beautiful house, but their entertaining area is much smaller than ours. And there's never just a few people. It's always a crowd.

Well, that's because people have learned that you're a pushover and that you'll feed them at any time that they want. Mark, are you just inviting people to this thing? I can get the impression that you're a serial inviter. I do sometimes, like, if we're on the road and we're in, you know, Asheville, North Carolina or something like that, and I'll be at the record store. I'll be chatting to the guy at the record store, and I'll be like, look, I don't know anybody else in Nashville, North Carolina. You want to be on the list for the show tonight? I get the impression you're passing out Seder invitations that way. The answer to your question is yes, and I will add, Judge John, when you're in Boston,

let me invite you over to the house and we'll have a little party in your honor. I'd love to come and enjoy a meal. We will, well, and you're invited. Yeah, but I don't know if I could do it in good conscience unless I came in there and helped make some lotkas or something. You know, Marianne, Mark says he's capable of making a delicious egg, and it sounds like it. If I were to order him, say, to help you in the kitchen, as however you would instruct, would he be help in the kitchen to you? No. Can he do any basic prep or kitchen prep, food prep?

No. Dishes was kind of a bust, it sounds like. He will wash dishes afterwards. But I mean, he's, if I said to him, well, why don't you chop the onions, he would immediately say, well, what knife do I use? Is this the right way to cut it? And after a few minutes of that, it would just be easier if he leaves the room. Oh, right. The knife that you want to use, Mark, for cutting onions is the one. I know that knives sometimes seem scary, like you're going to cut yourself with them, but they're not. The knife that you want to use is the one that has written on the side of it, weaponized incompetence.

Mark, I'm being rough to you. But what would it mean for you to have your son and your grandchildren and your daughter-in-law and all the people that you, You want to invite to your Seder. What does it mean to you be to be so inclusive? And what would it mean for you for them to be there? And what does it mean for you to have them not there? Well, it would be wonderful if they're all there, the whole family celebrating. But admittedly, we have a lot of parties and we celebrate a lot.

We just had a, you know, a big gathering on Saturday night where my son was there with his family. So, but, you know, I feel badly for this significant holiday that they can. cannot join us. Are there any other, I mean, is this a Passover-specific ruling that you're asking me for here? Or are there other similar conflicts that you'd like me to resolve? Schedule-wise? Yeah, the major Jewish holidays. All of them.

Okay. And a Hanuk a Passover, yes. Saturday, Saturday, Saturday, Saturday, no matter what. Yes. Easter notwithstanding, other obligations notwithstanding. That you cannot believe. what a great job she does. I can believe it.

I can believe it. There's something I can't believe, but that's not it. No, I remember a few years ago, we must literally had like 20, 25 people over for Friday night for Passover. And then literally two days later, we had close to 30 people over for, you know, Easter. And the Easter feast is unbelievable. She left out when she was described. describing it. You know, we have, she makes lasagna, meatballs, sausages, et cetera, et cetera.

Then we take a short break and then we go into the lamb, the ham, the roasted the potatoes, and the I love a dinner with an intermission. You can't, you can't continually eat. It's some, you need, you need a break. When did this back-to-back Passover Easter, more or less back-to-back Passover Easter thing happened? Was it just an accident of the liturgical and the religious schedule? It's just the way the calendar fell. And I'd say over the years that we've been married, it's happened probably five times where they've fallen on the same weekend. And I, you know, I'm not as young as I used to be. I used to be able to do Passover on Friday night and Easter on Sunday, but I just, I can't do it anymore.

Mark said that you put together wonderful spreads for both events. They were both perfectly hosted. What was it, in case he's never heard it before, what was it like for you to do both of those holidays almost back to back that way? What was your, how did your days go? How did you spend your days? You know, I would start at the beginning of the week every day, make a list of the 15 things I had to accomplish that particular day to get everything ready for the weekend. And then on the day in between, I would just be like a crazy person. Right. Now, you say you were making a list, but to be fair, that's not as hard as it seems because you were using your little machine, right?

You mentioned that you had renovated your home in order to accommodate more people. Yes. And I have to imagine that the two of you would not be married for 40-something. odd years. And so obviously in love and like with one another, I have to imagine that you would not have spent that money if you both didn't agree that you like having big family meals, correct? Yes? Absolutely. Mark?

Absolutely. All right. So if you could afford to renovate your home to accommodate more people, couldn't you afford to maybe hire some help on the day? I would be happy to do that. I would be happy to hire someone to assist my mother. Is this the first time you've offered or have you offered before and it's been declined? I've never heard that before.

Oh, wow. Well, it went without saying. So nothing in a marriage goes without saying. I've not been married as long as you two have. But I have learned. Don't let things go without saying. Saying is important. Marianne, would you be open to accepting help?

I mean. Yes, it might be nice to have someone come in and clean up when we're all finished. Yeah. I mean, I don't know what's going on up there in the Commonwealth of Massachusetts, but, you know, when I discovered, I had my non-religious conversion to understanding that Thanksgiving is stupid. And then I refuse to, I refuse to do it. It's a great holiday. It is.

But I'm always happy to go over to Christine and Jonathan's house if they're posting Thanksgiving. And one of the things I've noticed is that Christine and Jonathan very smartly hire a company that brings all the tableware, all the plates, all of the silverware, all the glassware. And so everything matches. If there's a big occasion, you maybe don't have 15 or 20 matching sets of, you know, table. And not only that, but at the end of the day, you just take all the dirty plates, the dirty plates, and you put them in a box and they come and take them away. You don't have to do them. Yes, I have seen that at other people's homes, not mine. And is there a reason that you would not be willing to do that? Would that be helpful? Not helpful? I would absolutely be willing to do that. I just never thought that was on the table before. I have to say, because I'm a crazy person, I have collected dishes,

over the year for all these different holidays. I have Christmas dishes, Thanksgiving dishes, Easter dishes. I have blue dishes for the Jewish holidays. So I, like I said, I am a crazy person. Well, you could hire some help in, since obviously the free help isn't very helpful in the dishwashing department,

you could hire someone to come in help. This is something that is like outside of my cultural milieu, but John. What, having storage for all those places. Yeah, or not only outside of mine. Hiring help for something. But like I helped to host a brunch for John a few months ago. And the person who hosted with me, my pal who hosted with me, and I did almost all of the cooking.

But we had somebody come to help with prep and serving and last minute things. She did some help with cleanup while things were. going on so that my host and I could host the party and did a little bit of help with cleanup afterwards. That's somebody that even if you pay them really well, you're talking about maybe six hours of work. And, you know, it's about the cost of renting a bounce house. So it's something that might be worth considering. I mean, it's not available to everybody. By the way, Jesse, I want to say that was a wonderful brunch that you and Jenny hosted. And also, thank you for getting the bounce house that I requested.

He wanted the one with the slide, and so we just, we just sprung for it. It was a little extra, but I really wanted it. But I was, I was shocked at what a difference that made for us to be able to both host and socialize, even though, again, you know, all the care that we put into cooking was a parent in the, in the meal that was prepared. It was nice to have somebody like, oh, we could have, we could have her. make the fruit salad. You know what I mean?

Even if you want to be the one who's in charge of the brisket. The other thing is that as your guest, both my wife is a whole being in her own right, and I and Josh Gondelman and Maris Kreitzman were there as well. Your guests were able to enjoy you more, Jesse, because you and Jenny were able to relax a little bit more.

And what's even more important than that was, I got to bounce and slide. And that's like not the answer for every party. or every situation, obviously. It was the first time I'd ever experienced that. But I thought, you know, in this context, it was a pretty valuable thing in terms of me and my co-host Jenny's ability to enjoy the party and honestly provide great food because we were able to focus our pre-pre on providing the, on doing the cooking. That sounds lovely. See, but I've kind of often that, because we, yet another party I throw is right at.

After Labor Day, I invite a large group of people for a barbecue, and my wife, once again, does all the work barbecuing. But I have offered her, we should hire someone, and she was somewhat resistant, I have to say. Okay. Were you, Marianne? Well, I don't know that he offered to hire someone. I know he offered to have everybody bring food, which is never helpful because people bring what they want to bring, not what you want them to bring, and then you end up having a lot of food in your refrigerator

that no one wanted to eat. So I said to him, I don't want people to bring food, but I don't remember him ever offering to hire someone to come in and actually run the barbecue. What was the worst food someone brought to one of your potlucks? Oh, God, there's so many. Be careful, because these people are coming back. Oh, I know. I don't want to insult anybody. But maybe it's time, Maryand, to start insulting some of these so-called friends, so they'll stop coming to your house and luching off your goodwill and incredible hostessing. But what we did at my wife's suggestion, I told everybody, last year, don't bring anything.

You don't have to bring anything at all except devil dags. A few people love Peggy's deviled eggs. You told all of your guests to bring devil d'ags? This sounds like my kind of party. I love devil d' eggs. Everybody brings dogs. Some people bring the kind of a little bit of bacon on top. Some people, yeah, I love this.

Yeah, that's... Just one person brings deviled eggs, and that's it. No one else brings anything else. Maybe they'll bring some wine or soda or something. So they have listened to my wife that they don't want. They don't have to bring things. Marianne, who are the people that Mark's inviting outside?

Is it only family or is he tossing out invitations? No, he tosses out invitations to everybody. Anyone. How do you feel about that? You know, if you're particularly nice to him in the checkout line at the supermarket, He'll ask you if you want to come for dinner. I noticed he invited me and I presume Jesse to dinner as well. I want to be clear, he did not invite me to dinner.

You're invited. You are invited. This is a classic part of Mark's problem with not saying things out loud. Marianne, I noticed you didn't chime in and go, yeah, you guys must come to dinner after Mark invited us. You know, he'll, he does what he does. and then I work around that. I have learned over the years. That's probably the best way for us to get along.

How is working around that working out for you? Well, I get tired. I'm tired a lot. I'm tired just listening to this. The work that goes into hosting a party of the science that you're talking about. I feel like I have it down to a science after all these years. I have learned how many days in advance I need to start. and I have a list every day.

And some of the things that I do with my family, I have four sisters and they're very helpful. And we all cook the same way. So when I say to somebody, you know, you bring the soup, I know it's going to be the soup that I would have made myself. So, you know, the stuff that Christmas and Easter stuff, I have, you know, they help me. My sisters help me.

It's on the Jewish high holidays where it seems like you're kind of on your own. Yes. If Mark said to you, I don't know, pick a holiday, anyone, it doesn't matter which one it is. It's one where it's like, whatever, your standard compliment of 30 to 50 people are coming. And Mark said, you know what, honey, I love you so much and you work so hard. But this is a big one. I've invited an extra 25 people that I met on the tea this morning. I want to do something for you.

I want to let's just all, I've rented a catering hall or we're all going to go to, what's a restaurant in Boston? Lockovers? That doesn't exist anymore, does it? Closed, yeah. We're all going to go to Kowloon Palace or whatever for the Feast of the Seven fishes this year. We're all going to Melville's upstairs from Cheers. Yeah, that's right. Yeah. You're right. If he said, I'm going to take the burden of one of these holidays off,

let's say that it's Passover. Like, I don't, obviously Passover is something you traditionally, Sater is something you traditionally have in your home. It's a truly a family event. So maybe that's the wrong one. But you know what I mean? Like, if he took the burden off of you completely, would you feel good about that or would you feel robbed of a certain kind of hosting joy? I would feel good about that. Oh, okay. I would. I would. would have a few extra glasses of wine and enjoy myself instead of running in and out of the kitchen all night. Do you feel joy cooking for your family? Most times.

But I will say I was doing Thanksgiving and it was a lot because there's so many traditional things at Thanksgiving that Thanksgiving that people expect to see on the table. And a couple years ago, my nephew came to me and asked if I minded if they took it over and I did a little happy dance. I'm so glad to have that one off my list. People wanting specific things for Thanksgiving. That thing, that guy comes up. I hear about, who are these people? If you want to eat it, you got to cook it. Otherwise, you've got to accept what the person who's cooking is feeding you.

These people who are like, well, you've got to make nana's blah, blah, blah, blah. Up your nose, you make nana's blah, blah, blah. Yeah. Up your nose with a creamed pearl onion. Something that's always trying to sneak its way onto my Thanksgiving table when I'm not looking. It's not our family if there's not blood. Yeah, great. So learn out of cookie your own dang self. Marianne, you say your sisters will help you with some of your traditional Italian-American holiday dinners. They're not of any use to you with regard to Passover or Rosh Hashanah.

No. You couldn't train them. Is there anyone, you know, your expertise in this field of cooking for the Jewish high holidays, you know, you had help from your mother-in-law, right? And counseling and mentorship. Is there anyone in your family that you will be able to pass these cooking traditions on to? I'm hoping I will pass them to my daughter when she's not mothering a newborn. Right.

Someday she'll step up and learn how to make the brisket and the matzab balls and go to her house. Congratulations, by the all these grandchildren. Yes. That must be delightful. It must be fun to cook for them. It is a joy. Every day they are a joy. Do you tip them off to where the matz is hidden at the end of the day?

Now, Mark, I think it's fair to say, judge to judge, I've given you a little bit of guff during this recording of the podcast, Judge John Hodgman podcast. I've been a little bit of rough and guff. with you, Judge Mark. But you're, you know, you're a charmer. What are you, what work are you doing during these big events? I would imagine you've got to be a very charming host. Are you doing some social work if you're not doing some actual physical labor, cooking and cleaning and stuff?

I'm making sure everybody's very comfortable, that they have something to drink, that we're talking to each other. So I just want one big happy event. Would you agree, Marianne, with Mark's self-assessment there? Is he a pretty good in the dining room host? Yes, he is a great chatter. He loves to chat. Given that Mark is in the dining room host position,

and given that you're in the kitchen host position, setting aside moving certain holidays to weekends, on the current calendar, do you feel that your work is divided fairly, Marianne? And I'll remind you, you're under fake oath. You know, I have never really thought about it, but I appreciate the part he plays in all this entertaining that we do. So maybe it is fair.

But, you know, he's making a lot of extra work for himself and you by inviting these strangers over all the time. Yes. Who was the most random, Yes. His sister and brother-in-law have a friend. Say no more. I thought was Jewish, and he invited him to come to Passover,

but he wanted to come to Easter instead. So this friend that we didn't know very well came to Easter dinner with my family, who he never met before, which I thought was very random. Yeah, if you get invited to one thing, you go to that thing, I would say. Yeah, he was invited. it to pass over and he said, you know, I'd really rather go to Easter. And then he came to Easter. And they loved him.

The crowd loved them. Honestly, as wonderful as the Passover sounds, and I like Brisket and Lackas as much as the next guy, which is to say very much. These are wonderful foods. I'm considering buying an airplane ticket so that I can get involved in this intermezzo four-hour meal with the gravy. and the lasagna and the lamb and the lamb. That seems tough to be.

If I were to rule in your favor, then, Mark, what would you have me rule? Passover on Saturday. Is that what it is? It's a stretch, I realize, but I would ask, yes, Passover on Saturday. Is there anything that you're going to offer to sweeten the deal on this one?

Because I think you can get a sense that it's kind of a non-starter. I would say to my wife, anything you want, honey, anything she wants to do Passover on Saturday. Wow. Okay. Anything you want. Anything you want.

Interesting. Is there, there's not like a different holiday that you could make your last stand on. One that doesn't, one that doesn't often coincide with a holiday that your wife celebrates, thanks to her cultural heritage. With 74 different beasts like she was a 12th century. English king. Marian, you just heard him say whatever you want, to have Passover on Saturday, whatever you need, whatever you want. Tempted?

What would you want? I would want him to stop asking me to move these holidays to the weekend. Just stop. I don't want to have this discussion anymore. Every year, twice a year, in the fall and in the spring, we have this argument. And it's just crazy because, you know, I do everything. So I'm going to do everything the way I'm going to do it. And it doesn't really matter what he thinks because it just won't work.

She said it doesn't matter. So I would like him to stop asking, can we just do it on the weekend? No, we can't. All right. I think I've heard everything I need to in order to make my decision. I'm going to go hunt through the wonderful studio. here at Ginny Media and Midtown Manhattan, looking for any matzo that might be left around here

because, frankly, it's past my lunch, and I'm a little peckish. I'll be back in a moment with my verdict. Please rise as Judge John Hodgman exits the courtroom. Marianne, there's been a lot of vibes in this recording. How do you feel the vibes are headed? How do you feel about your chances in the case right now? I feel pretty good about my chances.

I think I have the right, point of view. Mark, you've been in a lot of courtrooms. How are you feeling about what the jury's going to decide this time around? I'm, this is one of, it's a losing case. I'm not confident. We'll see what Judge Hodgman has to say about all this when we come back in just a moment. Judge John Hodgman, we are taking a break from the case. And you're taking a break from the real world and entering a monastic life in Maine. Yes, by the time you have heard this, Jesse Thorne and I will have plied the waters of Penobscot Bay

aboard the Grace Bailey, visiting with a select group of you who were willing to go on our weird murder mystery adventure. Luckily, no one, luckily there are no mysteries to solve other than how do we all have such a great time together. Thanks for being there. But by now I have now gone into the woods of Maine where I am very happy to be hiding out, working on some personal projects for a while.

If you would like to keep up with me, obviously the podcast will continue each and every week, as well as the members-only mailbag. But if you'd like to keep a little bit closer, touch with me, I want you go to hodgeman.substack.com. That's my substack that I started a couple of years ago. It's where you get all of the updates on what's going on in my life. And also, where I am reading to you aloud, the public domain work known as Moby Dick or the Whale by Herman Melville,

and doing it in a ridiculous main accent. You might be like, look, you've been reading this aloud for a while. It doesn't matter. Each one of these chapters is its own weird novel into itself. And obviously they're all archived there for you. If you would like to listen to Moby Dick going back from the beginning or just catch up with me now, we got a lot of Moby Dick to cover. We barely even seen the whale.

It's just about to get really exciting. So if you want to go over there to hodgeman.substack.com, I would enjoy it. And one other thing I'll plug that I have nothing to do with Jesse. We talked to Rachel Reed, had a wonderful conversation with Rachel Reed a couple of weeks ago about her novels, heated rivalry and all of the hockey romance novels and her Game Changers series. Of course, that was made into the TV show Heated Rivalry by Jacob Tierney, which is also amazing. Nothing Jacob Tierney is involved with. He directed all the episodes of Shorzie, the follow-up show to Letterkenny.

If you want a different kind of heated hockey show, also directed by Jacob Tierney and written by Jared Keese, so. starring Jared Key. So Shorzie has been a complete delight. I loved Leonard Kenny. Everyone's like, wait until you get to Shor Z. I'm like, I have to wait because I got other things to do, but it started last night and I'm loving it. It's a real treat. So there you go. Jesse, what's going on in your life? Of course, so many folks have been doing their summer wedding shopping and to put this on shop. If you've got a summer wedding coming up, whether you are looking for a wedding gift for the bride or groom, or you are looking for a wedding gift for the bridal party or the grooms party

or the family members or whatever. Yes. Get those wedding gifts to put this on shop.com where you can get very special things. I think a very easy one is if you got some groomsmen, I think that they might appreciate nice. cufflinks to wear during the wedding. And also.

And also perhaps some Yo MTV rap cards? And why not? Sure. And if your groomspeople are rad dudes, then get them some red dudes cards. Besides that, I have some really cool stuff on Bullseye this month and next. Next month coming up in July, we have a, I mean, this is like borderline pandering, but we got a week where we have Ken Marina. and David Wayne, the co-writers and director of Wet Hot American Summer. They have a new movie coming out

and the hosts of Taskmasters. So if that isn't a Judge John Hodgman listener coded week on Bullseye coming up, there could be no other thing. However, I would also encourage people to check out, we just had an amazing interview with the great Ben Vareen, one of the greatest legends of musical theater, television and film history. Next week, we have Craig Ferguson, who has a brand new show on CNN, Michael Sarnowski, who directed the movie Pig with Nicholas Cage and the upcoming The Death of Robin Hood. So, yeah, go subscribe to Bulls. I hear in-depth interviews with all of the most important people and wonderful people in culture and the arts. You can also find them all on YouTube if you are so inclined to do so. Let's get back to the case. Please rise as Judge John Hodgman re-enters the

courtroom and presents his verdict. My wife, whole human being and I are recent empty nesters. We love for our kids to come home and visit. One of them is doing so right now. We love cooking for them. We love feeding them. But what we really love is being alone home together, doing nothing, where dinner is mostly like, what do you want to have tonight for dinner? Popcorn and gin again? Now, maybe when I move into a new chapter of our lives, presuming that we get to grow and mature as you have

into your wonderful marriage of 40-odd years, of their grandchildren involved, maybe after I've taken a rest of a couple of decades, I'll be ready to do what you do again, Marianne, and take pleasure in that. But as much pleasure as there is in it, there is a tremendous amount of work that you're performing. Which isn't to say that you're not doing work too, Mark. You are doing important social lubrication work. That is work that you're doing, Mark, and I bet you do a great job.

I'll make my final judgment when Jesse and I and our 15 friends come over to your house for dinner on that. And you're invited. Yeah, better stock up on brisket fat now. Because the amount of advanced planning, like you're talking about looking forward to the fall, like, you know, the amount of advanced planning that Marianne is doing, the amount of thinking ahead that she is doing, the mental load that she's taking on in order to make these events as special as they are and as wonderful as you enjoy them, you know, takes a lot of work in advanced planning. And whether or not I'm going to rule on Passover on Saturday or whatever it is breakfast for dinner or whatever it is you want. You know, I think that we've already touched on some of the most important parts of the Judge John Hodgman's book of settled law. One being, of course, the person who does the work, the person who drives gets to choose the music. like the person who's doing the work, the mental and physical work of the chore, you know,

gets to make more of the decisions about how that gets done than the person who's simply enjoying the ride. And the other one is, you know, help is, the real help is helping in the way you are asked to help, not in the way that you want to help, and certainly not saying, what can I do to help? I think that it's really important, whatever my ruling is, and I am still figuring it out my head. Even as I talk, don't know if you ever did this one, Judge Mark, from the bench, figuring it out while talking. Probably we did, right? We know. But the thing is that whatever I rule, it is important for you to take in the work that Marianne is doing, just as is important for

Marianne to take in the work that you're doing. And I think it's important to offer her help, real help on these events, in the planning stages, in any stage. I think that hiring help on the day, professional help on the day, is a great gesture and something that you should avail yourselves of if that's what Marianne wants, if that's helpful to her. But I think it's equally meaningful and more meaningful that you learn how to chop an onion. I mean, it's just a basic skill that everyone should have. And as pleasurable as cooking for family is, I was going to say, as pleasurable cooking for family is, cooking with a partner is even more pleasurable.

Actually, that's not true. It's usually a recipe for fighting. Yeah, that's my worst nightmare. Yeah, I'm sorry. I love my wife so much. But, you know, like, you know, Marianne is hoping at some point that she'll be able to teach her daughter some of these recipes and some of what she learned from your mom. mom, Mark. But in the meantime, she's got no one to teach.

And I think that whatever I rule here as penance, she's got to teach you how to cook some foods. Or else figure out some other way ahead of time to be helpful to her, practically speaking, in terms of prep, in terms of grocery shopping, in terms of putting things away, in terms of moving things around, something. In terms of doing all the cleaning. Okay.

Don't let my court officer get it down. I'm not yelling at you. I'm just saying there's a lot of pleasure that will be taken in learning these new skills and observing the help that you can offer and offering it without asking, but instead just by doing. And Marianne, I go to say,

goes for you. I'm sure that there are areas in which Mark works very hard to, you know, make your life comfortable and make your life happy. And, you know, you should tune into the work that he does, too, and see if there can be help there. But mostly, Mark, you have to do it. At least in regard to these family dinners, especially if you're inviting a whole bunch of people over. You know what I mean? Sure. The other big piece of settled laws, be mindful of the work that you leave for others. You know, if you're making more work, you have to take up, even if it's in an act of generosity, if you're making more work for Marianne, you have to take up that slack and figure it out. Don't ask how to help, but figure out how to make that easy. And one of the

ways, honestly, is if a guest says, nah, I'd rather come for Easter, both of you have to figure out how to say, I'm sorry, that's not convenient for us. Can't let these guests run your house for you. You're the hosts. Both of you. Co-hosts. If there's someone in your family, Marianne, who's like, I must have marshmallow on my yams.

Be like, just like my court officer said, go make it yourself. I know. Go make it yourself. Yeah. And make it into a dessert. Because if it's got marshmallows, it's a dessert. I want you both to enjoy these big parties,

and I want to come to one. You're invited. I know I am, Mark. But when I come to the party, I want to, I want to see and feel that the two of you are working in concert to lift the burdens off of each other and also having a great time too. And part of having that great time, I think, for you, Marianne, Fairly, is not only cooking and feeding the people that you love, but also being able to escape to the kitchen like I like to do and have my introversion moments as well as my extra. version moments. This is just some advice from the bench, some pre-sentencing advice. Look, you're going to get a couple of good ones coming up here, Mark, because Rosh Hashanah is on a weekend, I guess, and Passover is going to be on a spring break, and, you know,

family's going to be free and everything else. But when it comes to scheduling these events, if you want to move the holiday, setting aside whatever theological implications that might have, or traditional observance implications that might have. If you want to move the holiday and all you're doing is inviting people and and topping off wine glasses and hiding the matzah or whatever you're doing out there and everything else, you have to offer a lot more help than you've been offering. That's just the way it is. And you have to come up with like, I'm going to do these things because it's meaningful

and understandably meaningful for me to have, you know, grandchildren and sons. and daughter-in-law and all the other folks. Like, you have to be able to say, all right, next, you know, looking ahead now to 28 when Passover may not be, might be in the middle of the week again. I don't know. Here's what I'm willing to do and really figure out what you're willing to do. And if you, and honestly, I would say, you know, like, if not learn to cook, look, watch what's happening in the kitchen during these upcoming high holy days and make some mental notes so that when you make your pitch in 2028 for Passover, which will be the next time this is revisited, you can say, here's my pitch.

Here's what I'm willing to do. Easter's going to be yours, and here's what I'm going to do on Passover to make sure that it is enjoyable for you. what do you think? And if Marianne takes that in and says yes, then great. But if she takes that in and I order Marianne to be honest here and says, no, it still doesn't work for me. And it still doesn't work. Short of you taking over Passover completely, that's going to, that, which would be fine. If you want to do it, it would be a weird Passover, I bet.

That's good. That's how you learn. You know, you've got two years to plan this thing now. Right? Almost two years. Unless you're not, unless you're going to take over Passover completely, soup to nuts. My two favorite Passover dishes. Then, you know, don't make work.

Don't make extra work for Marianne. She's doing the work. She gets to choose the music. And the music is middle of the week. Now, I have a little gabble here. here. Just a wee little gavel because my big one was confiscated by security at San Francisco International Airport. But I'm also going to throw the book at one of you. This week, the book is this wonderful advanced reader's copy of Cloud 6 by my friend Amy Fustleman, a really funny and wise novelist. It says here, following a catastrophic plane crash, married couple ma'am and Bunko have found themselves in Cloud 6. It's the newest and lowest tier of heaven. It's a really funny, wonderful novel that I enjoyed a lot. I got to read it early on this ARC.

It doesn't come out until September. So you would get to read it early, too. And since you live together, you both get it. So I'm throwing the book at both of you. I'm ruling in Marianne's favor with the caveat that, Mark, you have a chance to repitch this in 2028, but you got to figure out how you can help and you got to pitch it. And Marianne's got a chance to say no. This is the sound of a gavel.

Let my people not. Judge John Hodgman rules that is all. Please rise as Judge John Hodgman exits the courtroom. Marianne, how are you feeling about this decision? I'm very happy. What are you imagining for the future? I'm imagining that he'll be saying the same thing in two years and we'll have the same discussion and then I'll say,

no, just go away. We're not doing that. I will keep an open mind and I will keep you posted. And I'm telling you, if you are in Massachusetts and you want the best meal you're ever going to get in Massachusetts, let me know you're invited over and we'll have a nice party in your honor. Your honor. Marian, I'll check with you first. Thank you. You're welcome. Mark, Marianne, thank you so much for joining us on the Judge John Hodgman podcast. Thank you. It was fun.

It was a blast. Thank you for both very much. Thank you. Another Judge John Hodgman case is in the books. Our thanks to Redator Lex Fry for naming this week's episode. You can join us on Reddit at R slash maximum fun, R slash maximum fun. Will you take our suggestions there? It's a lot of fun. A lot of good times, a lot of good chats.

Yeah, I love seeing all those suggestions. They're always great ones there. It's a lot of fun. John and I both, we're visiting. We're in there posting. We have a nice time. We're also on Instagram, where you will find those beautiful Hanukkah

and also question mark spreads that we saw photographs of. We don't know what holiday that brisket is from. If you've got a guess, put it in the comments. All the holidays are brisket holidays at that house. We're also on TikTok and YouTube. You can find full episodes of our program on YouTube. You can find highlights and video-only content on both YouTube and TikTok, as well as on Instagram.

So follow and subscribe to us in all those places. John and I both individually on Instagram as well. and I've been posting a lot lately on blue sky, so join me on blue sky. Jesse, you've been blue sky in it over there? I'm a real blue sky guy now. And hey, when you're interacting with us on social media, you're following Judge John Hodgman or Instagram or Blue Sky, Jesse Thorne over there on Blue Sky or whatever. Keep in mind, we need your disputes.

We need cases. Yeah. I know. What about bringing dogs into bars and restaurants? Cool or not so cool? or other public spaces. Are you a planner and your friend just likes to go with the flow

at the gym? Are you a peace and quiet person? Or are you like to get chatty with your weights? I'll judge who's right and who's wrong. And I'll also judge if your dog is cute enough to go into that restaurant. Just make sure to send your disputes in because we need them in order to make the show go.

You can send them to maximum fund.org slash JJHO. There's a little form you can fill out there. You can email me, Hodgeman at maximum fund.org. Those go directly to my email box. And then I send him over to Jennifer. And then, of course, you know, if you're seeing us on social media, pop in with a dispute there. Anywhere you can get a dispute to us, get it to us, whatever's convenient for you because we need them to make the show go. John, Jesse Jr. came with me to the flea market this weekend and he was really good.

Yeah, did he need to buy some more fleas? You hear that tone? I said, do you need to buy some more fleas? What did you say there, John? said it was your dog needs to buy some more fleas. Right, at the flea market, sure. Hey, speaking of putting things in the comments, if you're watching us on YouTube right now, thank you very much for doing so. Please, please, please, press that subscribe button.

Getting more subscribers helps more people discover the show. YouTube is the way that most people discover their podcasts now. And while you're there, I would like you to put in the comments. This is for real. Give me your brisket recipes in the comments. Give me your vodka making tips in the comments. Give me your favorite Passover food recipes in the comments. I want to look these things up.

I want to learn them, and you know Mark needs to learn them. When you put a comment in there, you become eligible for the YouTube comment of the week. And I have right here this week's YouTube comment of the week right here has been printed for me. We had a lot of great comments and a lot of wonderful people watching our recent conversation with Rachel Reed, the author of The Game Changer series of hockey romance novels, upon which the, you know, incredible Netflix show, Heated Rivalry is based. Rachel Reed came by, talked to us in that very office where Jesse is sitting right now in that wonderful studio. I was there, too.

We had some great comments as well. I don't know how to pronounce this user. At I'm Here, Delight, 7-1-4, you know who you are, wrote, The Game Changer Books and the Heated Rivalry TV show have made me a better, more ardent, and attentive lover. Thanks to Rachel, Jacob, and the team for supercharging my libido. ardent. Not something this podcast has ever been accused of before. Yeah, this is a new one for us.

Normally this is something people listen to when they want to get cooled off. Yeah. But... This is what they call a cold shower show. Yeah, that's right. But that's not our YouTube comment of the week, Jesse. This is our YouTube comment of the week. This one comes from at Clyde Bryce 72 in the comments of our heated rivalry episode with Rachel Reed.

Had to stop watching the video and just listen. Jesse Thorne in that bailiff suit mixed in his handsome. face, bald head, and long fingers, if you know, you know, was giving me fever here at work. That wedding ring nearly spoiled it, but you can't have everything in a man. If you're not watching the YouTube now to see the specific shade of red that Jesse is turning, please go over to the YouTube right now and subscribe. You get to watch our whole episodes here, right here on YouTube, plus a lot of video-only specials and shorts, make sure to subscribe, hit that bell for notifications.

The video, John, the only way you're going to be able to properly imagine how good I will be at getting things out of jars for you. Yes, exactly right. If you know, you know, check out those long tapering fingers over there at our at Judge John Hodgman pod on YouTube. Just search it up and subscribe, won't you? I mean, I'm glad we got that finger comment on our most finger-centric episode of the year. I think we did a lot of finger work on this program.

All right, now I'm getting grossed out, so why don't you read the rest? All right, Judge John Hodgman, created by Jesse Thorne and John Hodgman, this episode engineered by Chris Kalfarski at the PRX podcast Garage in Boston. And at Ginny Media Studios in New York City, Megan Razati runs our social media, the podcast edited by AJ McKee and our video editor, Daniel Spear. Production help this week from Ragu Manavalin, our producer, Jennifer Marmer. All right. You ready for swift justice, John? I am ready, Jesse. Grab him by the Putin, says on the Max Fund subreddit. Amongst my partner's many virtues is their commitment to flossing regularly.

But they often leave their floss picks on his used dishes. As the resident dirty dish collector, I'm not exactly sure why this irks me. Well, but please make them throw away. their floss picks. Am I under the impression that this person's partner is flossing their teeth at the dinner table?

So it would appear. Look. It seems that they have a pocket stash of floss picks. Yeah. That they are accessing at the table or, you know, on the living room sofa at the coffee table

in front of the television if they're a TV dinner family. Yeah. Then they're flossing, and then they're putting down that pick right on that used dinner plate for everyone to see. Now, look, Marianne in this episode has a lot of different plates, different styles of plates, Easter plates, Hanukkah plates, different plates for different occasions. But there has not been a dedicated floss saucer at the table since the days of the Titanic. that's over. Do your flossing in the bathroom and throw it away. Remember to submit your cases to us at maximumfund.org slash jj-j-ho. And we'll talk to you next time on the

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