Judge John Hodgman - Phone of Contention

Episode Date: February 25, 2016

Must a stay-at-home dad be obliged to answer calls and texts?

Welcome to the Judge John Hodgman podcast. I'm bailiff Jesse Thorne. This week, phone of contention. Al brings the case against her husband, Kevin. Kevin's a stay-at-home dad. He has a cell phone, but he's selective about when he chooses to use it. Al wants him to pick up when she calls. Kevin says he gets back to her in due time. Who's right, who's wrong, only one man can decide. Please rise as Judge John Hodgman enters the courtroom and presents the obscure cultural reference. A little while ago I went and placed a call To tell this girl I know that she could have it all The wedding ring, the whole dumb thing, I was willing to tie the knot.

So I called her up and this is the answer I got. I'm so sorry you have just reached my answering machine. I'm not in and listen, I'm sure you know this whole routine. Leave your name and number and I'll try to get back to you. You have 30 seconds to get sworn in before you're through. Bailiff Jesse Thorne, swear him in. And that's our show, folks. Please rise and raise your

right hands. Do you swear to tell the truth, the whole truth, and nothing but the truth, so help you God or whatever? I do. I do. Do you swear to abide by Judge John Hodgman's ruling, despite the fact that he communicates exclusively telepathically? I do. I do. Very well, Judge Hodgman.

Oh, sorry. Alessandria and Kevin, you may be seated. Thank you very much for coming to Judge John Hodgman Dinner Theater. For an immediate summary judgment in one of your favors, can either of you name the song that I was singing as I entered the courtroom? And I need the name of the song and the artist, if you don't mind.

Kevin, you were brought to court by your wife uh and uh against your will so it's your first guess or you can make her guess first whichever you like which will it be i'm gonna go with her first all right awesome alessandria it's your guess uh i had many other songs prepared but that was not one of them. However, it sounded a little bit like Melanie, Brand New Key, but obviously not that. A little bit like what? Melanie, Brand New Key. Very old. I think 70s, 60s. Melanie is the artist. Artist, yes. And Brand New Key. Oh, I thought you were just saying it was a song named Melanie,

but then you were just throwing shade on the tone of Hodgman's song. I mean, you added a brand new key. I think you invented a new key there. All another level. All right. Well, you know what? It's a guess. Without saying whether it's right or wrong, I now turn to Kevin.

What is your guess, sir? I'm just going to guess that it's from the 70s but other than that I have no idea guess a song from the 70s Saturday Night Fever Fever? Perfect Night Fever

is that the name of the song? Night Fever? I think there are several Night Fever goes Night Fever, Night Fever. We invented a whole new key on that one. In any case, all guesses are wrong. The song is from the 70s. Would it surprise you

to know that it is named Answering Machine? Probably could have guessed that one. The singer-songwriter rupert holmes also better known for writing and seeing the song called escape aka the piña colada song oh okay this i think was his follow-up because the piña colada song, as you may know, is a song about told from the point of view of a man who is tired of his girlfriend. And so he chooses to cheat on her by placing a classified ad asking potential new dates if they like pina coladas, which obviously indicates class. class and uh and then corresponds with a woman and proceeds to cheat on his girlfriend only to meet the woman and it turns out to be his girlfriend who's also cheating on him isn't

that funny they're both monstrous adulterers in this follow-up song you may have heard in the lyrics which i have not heard since i was nine this is a song about a guy who who calls a girl he knows to tell her he could have it all the wedding ring the whole dumb thing he is begrudgingly telling some girl he knows that he's gonna marry her and he's mad at her because of the answering machine like he's the one he's the wronged party here because she wasn't there to pick up the phone when this white man finally was going to gift her the the gift of of marrying him i'm sure rupert holmes is a nice guy but he writes about a lot of creeps he writes about a lot of creeps using uh using all kinds of defunct technology to initiate romance,

like answering machines and personal ads. You may not know, he tried to follow up this song with a song called Telex Sex, and then he did one called Send a Menu, parentheses, the fax machine song, and then he tried to come back in the early 2000s with Friendsters with Benefits, but his best one was Let's Make Love in the AOL Time Warner building.

That was my favorite one of his other ones. See, it turned into comedy. I love that song, though. Alessandra, you bring this case against your husband of 24 years, Kevin. And Kevin is doing something wrong. What is he doing wrong? Kevin and Kevin is doing something wrong. What is he doing wrong?

Well, he is pretty unaccessible during the day. And that's both the phone, cellular phone, the home phone or texting. And this must be because he's extremely busy at his job. Is that so? He's extremely busy at his office or in whatever factory he works in. Or maybe he's a captain of industry somewhere.

Right? Is that what's going on? He's at the hospital operating. Yeah. Maybe he's operating on Rupert Holmes. He's at the ballpark smashing grand slams. He may do all of those things, but not

for pay. He's one of those volunteer surgeons. The surgery is probably not on a human being, but maybe on something around the house. I think he could probably find ways to. I'm just picturing Derek Jeter being like, hey, coach, am I playing tonight?

He's like, no, I think Kevin's coming over. Because he's pretty. Now, we're making those jokes, of course, because I have foreknowledge that Kevin is a stay-at-home dad, and I am not in any way making fun of stay-at-home parents of any kind. And they have a very busy job, which is staying at home and being a parent. Is that not correct, Kevin? That is correct. All right. And how old are your children, Kevin?

14 and 10. 14 and 10. Are you sure they're not my children? Because that would be an awful coincidence. Are you living inside the walls of my house? Secretly parenting my children and not answering the phone? I wish you would, if you don't mind. So, Alessandra, tell me about the ways you try to contact Kevin during the day. Yeah.

So, I will call him on his phone. If he does not answer, I will call him on our home phone and then call him again on our cell phone. I've given up on texting, although I do rely on that sometimes, you know, in attempts. But finally, if it's the children are home, I will actually just use them as kind of a remote device to get a hold of him. So if you were to put it in percentage terms, when you were trying to contact him, how often, what percentage of the time do you actually reach him and get a response from him? About 20%, 30%. Okay. 20 to 30% of the time.

And the rest of the time, it's just no answer whatsoever. No reply, no answer of any kind. Correct. And this is, I mean, aside from just being an inconvenience, this is particularly galling to you. Why? And this is, I mean, aside from just being an inconvenience, this is particularly galling to you. Why? Because as the at-home parent, I need him to be available for the children, for the schools.

And then, of course, I have my own, you know, selfish reasons. But specifically for his job. You want to talk to your husband? Yeah. I want to, you know, I want to kvetch. I want to talk to your husband? Yeah. All right. I want to, you know, I want to kvetch. I want to know what's for dinner, et cetera. Oh, I see. Well, okay.

Gotcha. And so aside from simply shaming him on an international podcast, you know, we have listeners in Antarctica. Hi, Dave King. And I bet you Dave King will call me back if I called him. Kevin. Yes. Why aren't you picking up the phone or responding to messages when your wife seeks to contact you?

Well, I would say there's a percentage of the time where I don't have my phone with me and I'm out and about. And then there's another person at the time where... Oh, do you have one of those corded cellular phones? Yeah, exactly. So sometimes you leave the house, so it's important that you leave your portable phone at home. I think I forget to take the phone with me. That would be the reason I wouldn't answer at that point in time. Where do you keep the phone? I have a, there's a, there's a, there's a pocket in a pocket in my man bag so that I can get to it pretty easily.

And I try to leave it there all the time so I don't forget to take it. Okay. Well, you know what? I'm just going to table that for a minute. That's good. Sometimes you are home, though, in your work at home. I am home a lot. Right. And then you'll hear the phone ring and you'll home, though, in your work at home. I am home a lot. Right.

And then you'll hear the phone ring and you'll just be like, Puh. Close. Yep. No, I'll be in the middle of something or my phone won't be on me because I just don't carry it close to me very often. Yes. And so then I end up, I say i say well i'm not going to be able

to get to it i'll just call them back so that happens and then also uh um i could be in the middle of something where i couldn't get to it middle like what would you be in the middle of oh you know good old laundry um what are your responsibilities dinner yeah she usually calls like as she's coming home which is the same time i'm cooking so um that's one reason i wouldn't answer so as the stay-at-home co-parent and spouse your give me a breakdown of of your basic daily responsibilities um okay so i um do house repairs of course and then um but try how often how often are you how often are you breaking your house i break my house on a weekly basis. And then I try to fix it again.

Yeah. Your kids are getting older and getting to an independent point where. That's right. You know, now is the sort of the glory period, I think, of being a stay-at-home spouse where you could just pop a Valium and drink some gin and watch a story. That's right. In the afternoon. Is that why you're not answering the phone? I wish. I wish it was.

Alessandria, what do you do for a living? I'm in HR. You're in HR. Okay. And has there been a time when you have needed to reach Kevin in an emergency situation, and he has not answered? Fortunately, we have not had emergency situations, but what actually prompted me to write in was, well, one, I'm a fan of the podcast, but two, my daughter was ill at school and had been trying to reach her dad.

He's never going to live this down. First of all, hang on a second, because I'm enjoying this story so much already. I just want to savor it for a second. How was she ill? How was she ill? She had a stomach situation. She was vomiting? Uh-huh.

All right. And she was how old at this time? This was before her 14th birthday so 13 so not long ago not long ago okay and she's your older child yes your daughter was vomiting and and was trying to reach her dad yes daddy i'm sick daddy i need you nothing Nothing. No answer. Then what happened? Calls me. Shh. Go on, Allison.

Calls me, and I work downtown. Downtown where? Downtown Dallas. All right. And it would take me 45 minutes to get to her. And so I proceeded to try to call him. I think I called eight times until he finally picked up. And what had happened was he had left the phone in the car while he went into the grocery store for 15 minutes.

So you so Kevin, you drove to the grocery store, left it in the car and then went in to go pick out your spaghettis and stuff. Yeah, well for repairing something i broke but yes how do you feel about the fact that your daughter was sick and couldn't reach you kevin um i was um actually i just see i just dropped by to give her medicine because she was actually having something else with her stomach going on and the school couldn't give her any medication so I brought some medication to her because she'd called me earlier and I said well I'm going to leave and get some groceries and I'll be right back I'm going to call you after 15 to 30 minutes if the medicine's not working I'll come and get you. Well, within that 15 to 30 minutes, she decided to call her mom. And so...

Well, I thought it was that she was trying... Or she probably tried to call me. She was trying to reach you and couldn't. Yeah. Yes. So let me just look at the timeline again. You took her to school. She was already sick.

You needed her out of your hair so you could do your wandering through the supermarket aisles in peace you you gave her some medicine and said i'll check in with you in 30 minutes you went shopping left the phone in the car she tried to reach you couldn't then called her mom is that more or less it that's more or less it all right and uh how did this resolve he answered he finally did answer the phone after he got back into the car and then you went and picked her up from school kevin uh you explained what happened but you didn't answer my question.

How did you feel when you learned your sick daughter had been trying to reach you and you were not available? I felt horrible. You felt horrible. Yeah. You know, cold sweat kind of thing. Like, I mean, cause I don't know what was exactly wrong. So it could have been worse.

So I saw five phone calls on my phone. I was like, what happened in that 30 minutes? What did I miss? First of all, good. I was like, what happened in that 30 minutes? What did I miss? First of all, good. I'm glad you felt horrible. And I'm glad everything was okay. It also a reasonable answer to say, I felt a little frustrated because she knew I was going to call her and I knew she was okay. I mean, the truth is that there was a long time in our history as parents where kids and parents were not able to reach each other like that. And I'm trying to identify whether you are leaving your phone behind routinely out of negligence or as a philosophy of we don't need to be

in touch as much as we are. What do you think? So I pretty much made plans to go and call her back. So I just kind of deleted that from, oh, I don't need my phone because I'm going to call her back. And it would be a significant burden for you to carry that phone. I can understand that. Yes, apparently. Bailiff raises a good point, Kevin. Most mobile phones are designed to be mobile. and most people carry them with them all the time indeed uh you may see it as a subject of many a new yorker cartoon people have them with them in

the craziest circumstances and are always looking at them why aren't you yeah i i'm a little bit out of touch, maybe a little bit. And I am a little forgetful. I think that might be part of the problem. Have you had a phone for just a few days or it's just never sunk in? I got my first phone in the late 90s. And I think I got the cheapest thing I could get, put it in the glove box of my car, and just hoped it was charged. And I don't think I used it. I didn't use it.

It was an emergency phone. So, you know, and then, you know, just gradually as things got easier to use, I used it. But I never really picked up on texting as a mode of communication. So, yeah, I think i'm a little bit back there as far as answering on the on the go now a luddite like i'll stop luddite is someone who rejects technology for philosophical reasons no I have no issue with that.

You're just kind of a dud-ite. It's like, it's not part of my life. All right. When you need to reach your wife, what do you do? Do you have difficulty reaching her? No, yes, but that's just because she's busy. No, I use my cell phone.

I don't even, like anybody else, I know nobody's numbers anymore., I use my cell phone. I don't even like anybody else. I know nobody's numbers anymore. I just use my cell phone. So I've accepted the technology. You know, when he was staying home and we first had our daughter, we needed a code because he would call throughout the day just to chit chat because we enjoy each other's company. And I didn't know when it was an emergency and when it wasn't. And so we built a code of three calls, right? One on one phone, one on the other, and the other one on the main phone. Wait, so he's calling you.

Yeah. And if I'm in a meeting, right? And the phone rings three times. Which phone? The phone on your desk or your cell phone? Either one or if it goes between. So if it's desk, cell, desk, then I answer the desk. What if it's cell, cell, desk?

I'll usually answer. What if it's desk, desk, desk? So I'm not sure I understand the emergency code. If you're in a meeting, how would you even know that the desk if you're in the conference room, how would you even know the desk phone was ringing? Well, that kind of breaks down a little bit, but then it has to be three calls on the cell. Whose idea for the emergency code, the Kevin to Alessandria emergency code was this? Whose idea was it? I think I instilled a code because I would find myself answering the phone after two rings and him being, hey, what's up? You know, and I've got a room full of people waiting for me to come back into it.

So that's when we came up with that. So in other words, you were trying to weed out the nuisance calls you were getting from your husband. Yes. Because he just wanted to chit chat with you because he was, he was bored. So he would get bored at home, call you, you wouldn't answer.

And then he would call you again. And it was just to say hi. Yeah. Wow. And yet he doesn't, he's not willing to answer the phone when you call him for actual important things. Well,

exactly. Are you calling him? Not just me. Well, exactly. Are you calling him? Not just me. Not just me. As you'll see in the evidence, it's our friends and family as well. All right. I'm not isolated.

This isn't him avoiding me per se. So you did send in some evidence, some screenshots of a Facebook page where you posted to friends and family, does anyone have experience with not being able to get a hold of Kevin, end quote. And Jim, last name redacted, said, try to call him on his cell. No answer. Good leaving a message.

No good leaving a message because he never listens to it. Call him on his homeland line. No answer. Email is no good because he never reads it. Then later I found out he doesn't answer his cell because he was in the drive-thru line at popeyes interesting neil neil says i've found an excellent way to reach him is to send a facebook message to his wife uh jennifer last name redacted said i have attempted to text kevin in the past and he hasn't returned my text. That being said, he's still one of my besties.

But you get some support here from Elian, last name redacted. Why should everyone be addicted to their phone? Good job, Kev, keeping it real. Smiley emoticon. That's, by the way, our friend who is a lawyer who was giving him counsel. Yeah. Oh, I see. Samples of texts I have sent and their responses

if the food is as good as it looks we need to come back here tomorrow this is this is you alessandria texting to your husband yes yes do you have do you have the evidence do you have the evidence in front of you do you have this screen in front of you by any chance uh i do not can you get it because i'd like you to read these, please. Yeah, hold on. Why don't we start from if the food is as good as it looks. Excuse me for a second.

Excuse me for a second. Someone is calling from my home and I have to answer. Hello? Oh, hello, son. How are you? That's what that sounds like. Can you make a very small batch of pancakes? Is there a grown-up there to make sure you don't burn the house down?

Yes, then you may. And may I just say, son, that even though this was not an emergency, I'm glad to hear from you. Call anytime you like. I love you, too, that even though this was not an emergency, I'm glad to hear from you. Call anytime you like. I love you, too. Okay. Bye-bye. Wow.

In your face. Oh, my God. What a nuisance. What a nuisance it was to hear the voice of someone I loved. Anyway, back to this important podcast. Yes. Would you please read the dates? You don't have to read the times unless you feel they're pertinent.

The dates of these texts. And you will, in this case, this is going to be a little radio theater. Alessandra, you will play you and I will play Kevin. Okay. Tuesday, August 4th. If the food is as good as it looks we need to come back here tomorrow There is a bakery next door that looks amazing

Do you want me to bring you something back? They have donuts End of scene Next scene Monday, August 10th How is the lump in Luna's neck? End of scene Monday, August 10th how is the lump in luna's neck end of scene monday august 10th uh an hour later what's going on with luna tuesday august 11th hey when is luna's appointment luna is our dog

i think i'm glad to hear that yeah not our child uh sorry i had to sorry to break character there for a moment it was very even i who did who who made i think the correct assumption that luna was your dog or else you'd be turning judge john hodgman into something a little bit more serious than it usually is felt it difficult to not respond to a message about a lump in the neck. But I had to maintain complete silence because that is what the evidence shows. Could we move forward to Tuesday, January 26th? Can you get me candy? Yes.

That was at the movie theater. Tuesday, January 26th. Can you get me candy? Sunday, January 31st. What is the plan for the booth sale? When are you starting the kiln? An hour and a half later. Backyard movie is fine. and ian figure out which one

tuesday 9 39 what's up talk later okay end of scene why aren't you responding to your wife's text that is an excellent question um the i don't respond to texts as much as i do respond to phones a little bit more than that that's um yeah how is the lump in luna's neck you didn't answer ever well i did in between those days we actually had you know conversations about it but not through not through text like it was either over the phone or when she came home on monday august 10th at 10 21 a.m how's the lump in luna's neck no answer an hour and a half later what is going on with luna you felt at the time that it was important for your wife to stew with that apparently was it your wife that gave the dog cancer or whatever

and what is the plan for the booth sale kevin and when are you starting the kiln i mean and most importantly he didn't buy me candy right did you why because you you left the phone underneath your seat when you got up to go to the sessions all right i'll ask you alessandra because i may never hear back from kevin how is the lump in luna's neck she's fine i guess it was Right. All right. Kevin. Yes. How do you, how do you account for yourself? Okay. So as far as phone calls go, when I do call phone calls back, which is not always because I don't always have my phone with me, but when I, when I do put it on hold,

it's usually because I'm in the middle of something. And I do want to give it my undivided attention. Because a lot of times when I talk to somebody and I'm doing something else, it's pretty obvious that they're not getting the attention they deserve. And so... So, for example, your wife might be texting about the dog's neck lump, but you're having a conversation with someone at that time, so you're not going to stop. Right. Right. Like that. I can't stop. Usually my train of thought goes away. And then they don't, when I am talking to them, when I do answer the phone in that state, it's not good for them. They don't get all of me.

They don't get what they deserve. They don't get my attention. And so I kind of postpone it until I can actually call them back and give them my full attention. But that's interesting interesting how old are you 47 47 why did you laugh when i asked it sounds like an old an old dawdling person maybe here well no i'm just trying to establish i mean you know you're 47 so you're definitely you're definitely of a generation like mine that has transitioned with communication technology from a time from a time when you know phone calls were typically uh spontaneous often missed no big deal, or planned, and you actually sat down and you talked to a person,

and you were using a landline technology that functioned 100% of the time, as opposed to this new improved technology that allows for voice-to-voice communication about 30% of the time and is very frustrating in a lot of ways. And I'm trying to determine if that's part of what's going on here. Do you think it is or no? I would think that's- I'm not talking to you. Alessandria, do you think that's what's happening here or what's your theory?

I think that's actually pretty astute. I hadn't thought about that. How long have you been working at home as a parent and spouse and homekeeper? Since the kids were born so 14 years 15 15 when and so to 2000 all right sure before there were before there were you know the more ubiquitous smartphones that's I think that that's fair to say and what did you do before 2000, Kevin? I probably had a similar path. No, did you have a job?

Oh, did I have a job? Oh, yeah, I worked at a hardware store for a little while. I used to be a potter. When I was working in California, I did a lot of that. Oh, okay. And that's why the question was, are you going to start the kiln? You have a kiln? Yes.

Are you still a potter? I am getting back into it. I've got all my equipment fired up. Right now? Right now? Fired up and ready to go? Yeah, it's going right now. What kind of pottery do you throw?

What do you throw out there, Kevin? I do stoneware reduction, high-power stoneware. How did you guys meet around the kiln? I saw his – so we're high school sweethearts oh uh i saw his picture in my friend's yearbook and uh asked him out awesome how does it make you feel alessandria when you want to reach your husband and you can't have you expressed that to him? Could you express it to me? Yeah, I mean, it's like I married an artist, I understand that. And I love him very much. But it's very frustrating when I want to get a hold of him. And he's unavailable. Very frustrating. Is it ever scary? It has been. Again, we've been fortunate

where we haven't had those kind of emergency situations come up. But we did have a tornado in Dallas a few years back. And I was in Mississippi. And I wasn't able to get a hold of him. And it was right when the school was letting out, and that was frustrating. Now, I understood when he did answer, because what I appreciated was he did answer and said, I can't talk right now. I have to get the children.

They're okay. And that's all I'm really asking for is just a ping back that tells me everything's okay. Kevin, why is that unreasonable that is not unreasonable then why don't you do it right um now the having the phone with me and being able to ignore it at all whenever i choose because i see it ringing is is reasonable wait what having the question was why don't you do that why don't you ping back when your wife requests a ping yeah it depends on the circumstance but usually it's because either i don't have my phone

or you don't really love your wife yeah that, that too. When you do have your phone and your wife texts you, would you say that you text back within 5 to 15 minutes 100% of the time? No, it's generally a lot later. Let's do a little role play here. Um, so even if you see, if let's do a little role play here, Kevin, you're holding your phone for whatever weird reason in the day you happen to actually have it on you. Yes. It buzzes. Boom, boom.

Alessandra comes up. How's the neck lump? What goes through your mind now? Um, what's the decision tree for What goes through your mind now? What's the decision tree for whether you're going to respond to that or not? Well, it's whether or not I can give her a good answer right then, or if I need to call somebody to find out what's going on with that neck. And I could answer and say, I don't know.

I haven't done anything yet. I mean, that's one way I could do it. Or I could wait until I have more answers to give her an entire synopsis of the situation. Okay. Like with the hurricane, with the tornado. I think I've heard everything I need to hear. out of radio contact for a moment into my sealed chambers to consider this and come back in a moment with my decision. Please rise as Judge John Hodgman exits the courtroom. Kevin, how are you feeling about your chances?

Not so good. Alessandria, how about you? I feel like I'm feeling pretty positive. I'm going to ask Kevin this first, but then maybe you can chime in, Alessandria. Kevin, if you're compelled to answer texts or return phone calls by the judge. Is it something of which you are capable? I think so. What do you think, Alessandra? Yeah, I think that what this did was illuminate for him how much his lack of response was impacting the people around him. I don't think until I had posted that on Facebook

or until we'd had the opportunity to have this conversation that he understood how bad it had gotten. So I think he can. And I've, you know, and I'll support him in that. Well, we'll see what Judge John Hodgman has to say about all of this when we come back in just a minute.

You're listening to Judge John Hodgman. I'm bailiff Jesse Thorne. Of course, the Judge John Hodgman podcast always brought to you by you, the members of MaximumFun.org. Thanks to everybody who's gone to MaximumFun.org slash join, and you can join them by going to MaximumFun.org slash join. And you can join them by going to MaximumFun.org slash join. The Judge John Hodgman podcast is also brought to you this week by the folks over there at Babbel. Did you know that learning, the experience of learning, causes a sound to happen? Let's hear the sound. Yep, that's the sound of you learning a new language with Babbel. We're talking about quick 10-minute lessons crafted by over 200 language experts that

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Suzanne, last name redacted. I find that the best time to reach Kevin is to wait for him to call you. I have witnessed his neglect to answer on a first-hand basis. These are your friends and family, Kevin. And I hope that you take it to heart that a lack of response is a kind of response. is a kind of response. It is a response that if someone asks a simple question, like, can you get me candy? No response.

That just feels hurtful and weird. And then if it's a more pointed response, one that has worry behind it, like, how is the lump on our dog's neck? It is impossible for Alessandria to interpret your silence at all. She can't know that you are making an executive decision at that moment to say, until I have the whole answer, I refuse to reply. the whole answer, I refuse to reply. She might worry that there is something really bad that you're waiting to tell her in person, and that might cause her worry. Or she might worry that you have left the phone in the kiln and are now wandering through the supermarket endlessly,

in the kiln and are now wandering through the supermarket endlessly or had fallen down a ravine or something. If you had opened your defense by saying, in addition to being a stay-at-home co-parent, I am also an artist and a potter, I would have said to Alessandria, well, you get what you pay for. Dude's an artist. Dude has been trained his entire life to sit in quiet contemplation in front of a wheel as pottery turned before him. He has a different relationship with reality than the rest of us. And I suspect, Alessandria, that you've known that since the day you met him. Is that not correct? That is correct. Yeah. And I also am am sympathetic because we do we have straddled those of us who are in our mid to late 40s and age when there was a very different relationship with connectivity and and and one that in many ways was more healthy back during a time when we couldn't all reach each other the minute we wanted to reach each other.

You know, your 14-year-old has a phone. Many, including my 14-year-olds, have phones. You both presumably have cell phones. Everyone in your life has a cell phone. Everyone in your life is able to get at you at any moment. And that, that everything about those messages that come through, particularly text messages, which are, I had the idea to contact you, you now must get back to me right away. All of that urgency, or I would say 99% of that urgency is never, never, never, never urgent. And indeed, not nothing that is communicated via text, email, cell phone, voicemail, whatever, is anything that probably can't wait for the most part until you have a minute to sit down and actually deal with it.

So I sympathize with you. I'm not here to just beat up on you. That would be a mean thing to do to a guy who makes pottery. That said, we are not in 1999 anymore, when the only reason you would have a cell phone is to, or maybe one of the only reasons to have a cell phone is to keep it in the glove compartment of your car in case you have a breakdown and you need to call someone to have you get towed away or whatever. in the glove compartment of your car in case you have a breakdown and you need to call someone to have you to get towed away or whatever we are living in an age that does presume a lot more

communicativity than perhaps you feel comfortable with kevin and perhaps it's so alien to you you don't even know that you're rejecting it's like i don't know why those people would expect me to respond to those emails or those texts you have. You have heard the testimony of the friends and family in your life who have basically made peace with the fact that when they want to reach you, good luck. Maybe when they run into you in the town square or see you at the next barn raising or whatever it is that they're going to see you. And that's okay for them. I think that's absolutely fair.

But as a parent and as a spouse, there is a different standard. While it is important that we don't monitor each other's lives all the time, as parents and spouses, emergencies come up. And that's why cell phones are good. You know, it's the equivalent of keeping a phone in your glove compartment in case your car breaks down, right? Think of it that way.

That's a metaphor you might be able to understand. And if you're keeping a phone around for emergencies, like say, I don't know, tornadoes or whatever, you got to keep it in the glove compartment of your life in that situation. In other words, when you, when you have a phone that you keep only in case your car breaks down, you don't leave it on your desk. You keep it in the car. And when you have a phone so that your sick child might be able to reach you or your wife might reach you

in order to solve a simple logistical problem or even because there's an emergency, you need to have that phone in the glove compartment of that situation, which is to say on your person. That's what it's for. And I appreciate that not all of these communications are emergency to say the least, but there is a way to interact with these family members, even in a non-emergency situation that is

considerate without being distracting to you or the other person you might be talking to or whatever. When your wife texts you saying what's going on with the lump in the dog's neck, she does not require you to give her your full attention and a full considerate answer. She, there is a different standard of etiquette at this point in communication where it is okay for you to just write back and say, I'll fill you in later. All okay, I'll fill you in later. You know this. You did this with your children with regard to the tornado. It's just lucky that you happen to have the phone with you at that time in order to respond and say, everything's okay, but I'll fill you in later.

I accept that you may be a person of gracious old world charm who doesn't want to interrupt a conversation that you might be having with a fellow potter or a colleague or an acquaintance at the supermarket or whatever it might be, just because your phone happens to be ringing. But if it's your wife who's calling, she's more important than those people. And you at least need to make sure everything's cool. If your son calls during your podcast, you answer, even if he just wants to make a bunch of pancakes and mess up the kitchen and ruin his appetite for dinner. And if your daughter calls from school being sick, saying that I plan to call her back later anyway is not an excuse for leaving your phone in the car. So this sounds more punitive than I mean it to sound. Kevin, I like you. I'd love to see some of your stoneware. I think you're a good dude,

and you know what? Some of the texts that your wife shared in evidence were not that important. But it is still important that you give your closest family members, the people who are closest to you, complete consideration whenever possible. And that means when your wife texts you to say, will you get me candy?

You write back and say, sorry, I left my phone in the theater. Didn't get the message. When your wife texts you is vocal fry real. You write back forward slash, forward slash, forward slash. If it's between friends and you obviously listened to the one where we had a serial emoticon abuser bothering. It was the exact diametric opposite of this one.

Exactly. Where someone was just harassing someone with emoticons at weird times and so forth. I don't think that that's what your wife is doing. But even if your wife were doing that, this is the woman that you have been married to for 24 years since you've known since high school. She deserves a reply. And if you just can't get back to her at that moment, forward slash, forward slash, forward slash, works pretty good. You can ignore all the other people on Alessandria's Facebook page,

but you can't ignore your wife and children anymore. And that means I obviously find in Alessandria's favor, and I order you to keep your phone on your person. And Alessandria, you, when information is being imparted to him, and you don't need a reply, you can simply say no reply necessary or NRF. Forward slash forward slash forward slash. Okay. No, no. Forward slash forward slash forward slash is his code it's his response got it nr

nr no reply nrn nrn no you know what forget it backslash backslash backslash I'm going to make it hard for you this is the sound of a gavel Judge John Hodgman rules that is all please rise as Judge John Hodgman rules that is all. Please rise as Judge John Hodgman exits the courtroom.

Kevin, how do you feel right now? Actually pretty good. I don't feel beat up quite as much as I thought I would be. And I'm going to keep my phone on me more as much as possible. Just on me all the time. Do you rarely have, are you wearing pants with no pockets? I'm going to keep my phone on me more as much as possible, just on me all the time. Do you rarely have – are you wearing pants with no pockets? There's no reason I shouldn't have my phone on.

I will have my phone on. 95% accuracy. That's right. Al, do you believe this man? Like I said, I wasn't going for 100%, but so I think 95%. I really like the idea of us having a special sound. I think that will be very, very helpful. And I believe he'll try. I mean, literally today was the first time I had called him and I received a text that said, can't talk.

So I feel like progress is already starting. Well, thanks to both of you for joining us on the Judge John Hodgman podcast. Thank you. Thank you. Hello, teachers and faculty. This is Janet Varney. I'm here to remind you that listening to my podcast, The JV Club with Janet Varney, is part of the curriculum for the school year.

Learning about the teenage years of such guests as Alison Brie, Vicki Peterson, John Hodgman, and so many more is a valuable and enriching experience. One you have no choice but to embrace because, yes, listening is mandatory. The JV Club with Janet Varney is available every Thursday on Maximum Fun or wherever you get your podcasts. Thank you. And remember, no running in the halls. If you need a laugh and you're on the go, try S-T-O-P-P-O-D-C-A-S-T-I-H. Were you trying to put the name of the podcast there? Yeah, I'm trying to spell it, but it's tricky. Let me give it a try.

Okay. If you need a laugh and you're on the go, call S-T-O-P-P-P-A-D-I. It'll never fit. No, it will. Let me try. If you need a laugh and you're on the go, try S-T-O-P-P-P-D-C-O-O. Ah, we are so close. Stop podcasting yourself. A podcast from MaximumFun.org. P-P-P-P-P-P-P-P-P-P-P-P-P-P-P-P-P-P-P-P-P-P-P-P-P-P-P-P-P-P-P-P-P-P-P-P-P-P-P-P-P-P-P-P-P-P-P-P-P-P-P-P-P-P-P-P-P-P-P-P-P-P-P-P-P-P-P-P-P-P-P-P-P-P-P-P-P-P-P-P-P-P-P-P-P-P-P-P-P-P-P-P-P-P-P-P-P-P-P-P-P-P-P-P-P-P-P-P-P-P-P-P-P-P-P-P-P-P-P-P-P-P-P-P-P-P-P-P-P-P-P-P-P-P-P-P-P-P-P-P-P-P-P-P-P-P-P-P-P-P-P-P-P-P-P-P-P-P-P-P-P-P-P-P-P-P-P-P-P-P-P-P-P-P-P-P-P-P-P-P-P-P-P-P-P-P-P-P-P-P-P-P-P-P-P-P-P-P-P-P-P-P-P-P-P-P-P-P-P-P-P-P-P-P-P-P-P-P-P-P-P-P- Can't talk right now John, there's a lump on the dog's neck

Forward slash, forward slash, forward slash It's unnerving You ask someone a direct question, just silence What happened? I was just showing you what it's like Jesse, I apologize Clearly a thoughtful, considerate guy He works with his hands and makes pots

And dinner. Pots and dinner. You know what? Good husband, though. He sounds like a good husband outside of this not being available in emergencies thing. I'm surprised both of their children and that dog are all still alive.

But that's the proof. He's a good husband, even though he can't be trusted to answer the phone. Jesse, can I make an announcement before we go? Yes. I am very excited to announce that I, John Hodgman, have been invited to host the 50th Annual Nebula Awards, which is, of course, the big awards ceremony for the best science fiction novels, novellas, novelettes, novelatinas, every year that is awarded by the Science Fiction and Fantasy Writers Association.

This will happen, and it is an event that is all part of the big nebula conference the sfwa's nebula conference happening this spring in chicago may 12 through 15 uh and it's going to be really really fun george rr martin is going to be there and many many great science fiction writers are going to be there and fancy writers and it's going to be terrific and i'm really excited to host it and and you don't have to be a member of the sfwa to attend if you live in chicago and you want to check out any of the conferences or the seminars or the workshops or the the banquet itself and by the way uh it offers you a choice of stuffed acorn squash grass-fed filet or french chicken you can go to sfwa.org slash nebula hyphen awards

and register and i would love to see chicago area's judge john hodgman fans there i get nothing from packing the audience with people who know me but it would be fun to see you anyway so there i'm very excited about it what do you think is the tone of this thing you think it's like a nerdy Ricky Ricky Gervais at the Golden Globes just gonna you just gonna rip everybody a new one yeah I'm finally gonna give them what they have coming on a deflate to their pompous balloons

I'm gonna yep exactly finally I'm gonna finally take those fantasy writers down a peg finish I'm going to finally take those fantasy writers down a peg. Finish what got started through all of middle and high school. Exactly. How can they get in touch with you, Jesse?

They can just send me an email at jesse at maximumfun.org or on Twitter at Jesse Thorne. You are, of course, at Hodgman. You can tweet with the hashtag JJHO or you can go to our Reddit at MaximumFun.reddit.com. That's absolutely true. And who produced this podcast? Well, Julia Smith did with some help on the editing front

from the great Mark McConville. And if you have a dispute that you think might make it onto the air here at Judge John Hodgman, go to MaximumFun.org slash JJHO to submit it. MaximumFun.org slash JJHO. That is the spot to tell us about your case. Big or small, we consider them all. And if you don't have a dispute and you don't live in Chicago and you don't like science fiction and fantasy and you don't have any galas,

why don't you just watch Know You Shut Up with Paul F. Tompkins on Fusion, 10 p.m. on Thursdays. Why don't you? And get ready for the Max Fun Drive coming up in just a couple weeks. Oh, Jesse Thorne, that's a tease. Yeah. I can't wait to tune back in. We'll talk to you next time on the Judge John Hodgman Podcast. Maximumfun.org. Comedy and culture. Artist owned. Listener supported.