Judge John Hodgman - Sibling Drivalry

Episode Date: May 31, 2012

Luis insists his big sister Alejandra monopolizes the use of their shared vehicle. Alejandra says Luis refuses rides and then pouts. Who is right?

Welcome to the Judge John Hodgman podcast. I'm bailiff Jesse Thorne. This week, sibling drivelry. Luis brings this case against his older sister, Alejandra. They currently live with their parents and share a car to get to school and work. Luis claims that his sister prioritizes giving rides to her boyfriend over rides to her brother, leaving Luis lugging around art supplies on the city bus system. Alejandra says Luis refuses rides and then pouts over it. Who is right? Who is wrong? Only one man can decide. Please rise as Judge John Hodgman

enters the courtroom. Well, hello and welcome once again to Car Justice Talk. I'm Judge John Hodgman. That's bailiff Jesse Thorne. We're the podcast friends. And even though Ira Glass punches Jordan Morris in his pretty mouth every time we say it, this is MaximumFun.org. And remember, don't judge like my brother and don't judge like my brother, even though I'm an only child. Jesse, swear him in while I work out the copyright issues on this song. Please rise and raise your right hands.

Do you swear to tell the truth, the whole truth and nothing but the truth, so help you God or whatever? Yes, I do. god or whatever uh yes i do do you swear to abide by judge john hodgman's ruling despite the fact that he has a chauffeur and not just any chauffeur but a chimp chauffeur with a little chauffeur outfit and the whole nine yards even more so alejandra yeah i'm all about it let's do it very well judge h Hodgman. And so we begin our gradual transformation into the car talk for our next generation with another automobile-related dispute, this time between brother Luis and sister Alejandra, neither of whom are either a monk or a nun. They actually are brother and sister to one another. And so who is it who is bringing the case?

Is it you, Luis? Yes, it is me. I'm the one who arranged this. And you are the younger sibling? Yeah. And my sister didn't have any idea who you were. I was just like, you're going to do this. Okay.

And where are you located? Madison, Wisconsin. And did you come and see me when I performed in Madison? I sadly did not because I was in Milwaukee. I have everything I need to make my decision. Even though I, says Judge Sean Hodgman, exits the courtroom.

Even though you tried to prejudice me against your sister, Louise, which even for a little brother is a pretty weaselly thing to do. She at least committed a crime of ignorance. First of all, let me get some basics down. You guys are what ages? I'm 21. And I'm 22.

Okay. And you live in the Madison area? Yes. Okay. And where do you live? We live right now about... Do you share an apartment or something? Right now we're living at home with our parents.

Can I correct him real quick? Oh. I just moved out yesterday. And I no longer have a car. So I know how he feels. She's totally asking for rides. He gave me a ride today. Okay, so it's all settled then?

No, not at all. Now he's the one with the car. It goes deeper than this because she so often prefers giving rides to Eric, her boyfriend, rather than me and doing other stuff for him as well. Yeah, that's her boyfriend. That's why. I hope that she prefers to do other stuff for him rather than you. Yes. But I'm her blood.

She should give me a ride to school. You're a grown up. You both are. I don't care that you moved out yesterday, Alejandra. What is your age again? I'm 22 years old. You're 22 years old and you moved out yesterday, Alejandra. What is your age again? I'm 22 years old. You're 22 years old and you moved out of your parents' home yesterday. Well done.

You are beginning to act like an adult. Thank you. But as of yesterday, okay? So you have a lot of bragging rights. Okay, cool. Now, for the sake of podcast verite, because now that you've moved out, it seems like this may be settled law. I'm not sure.

Let's pretend like it was yesterday. Okay, I will have orders. Let's pretend like it was yesterday. Okay? It's just a matter of faith that we're talking today and not yesterday anyway. You're both living at home. I'm setting the scene now. Both living in your parents' home.

How many vehicles do you guys have access to? Basically one. Although we have our parents' cars, but by the time we need to go somewhere, they're usually at work. Come on, you don't want to drive around your parents' old Monte Carlo or whatever.

Mom has a nice car. What does your mom drive? A Santa Fe, a Hyundai Santa Fe and a Ford F-150. Oh, wait, so dad drives a Ford F-150. Yes. Mom drives a Hyundai Santa Fe. Yes. And then there is a third garbage car that you guys get to fight over.

Is that what's going on? Yes. It's another Hyundai Sonata, but this one has, like, a broken side mirror and, like, a missing hubcap. Oh, no. It's still dry. It's a 1997, but it's lovely. Who pays the insurance on it? I do.

Oh, you do? All right. Very good. Even more like a grown-up. I split it? I do. Oh, you do? Alright, very good. Even more like a grown-up. Or I split it. I don't know. I know that I pay a lot for it. Our mom just tells us to give her money at the end of the month and then we just give whatever amount of money she asks for.

And how long has that been going on? A year. Okay, and how much money do you give her typically? I usually give her about $210. Yeah, but she was also paying... And how much do you give, Denise?

$50. $5-0? That's your cell phone bill. No, it's extra, too. My cell phone's $30. You have a right to complain about this Hyundai Sonata that you use for free while you're living at home

eating for free, presumably, and paying $50 on insurance. Is the car paid for? It is. Obviously, you're not paying any car payments. The only expense of this car is $50, and it doesn't have a hubcap. Oh, I'm sorry.

All right, I'm going to stop making fun of you guys now, because you're young. There's no reason why you shouldn't be living at home when you're 21, 22. You're just out of college. You're going to college presumably. You're making a life for yourself. So I don't mean to be too rough on you. I have kids, and I hope that they live with me for a little while after

they get out of college. As long as they go to the college I want them to go go to which is the homeschool college of my living room and i'm sure that your mom and dad love for you guys to to be living there and i'm sure they're sad alejandra that you've moved out they are and my mom cried a little bit yeah that's because she's your mom but i've moved out three times so this is the fourth fourth time. Let's focus for a moment on your little brother who seems to believe that the world owes him a ride and a car. You are still in college, is that correct? Yes, I am. You were studying something? Yeah. What are you studying?

Art education. Oh, okay. So you are going to become an art teacher? Yes, in the high school, hopefully. Okay, and you are an artist yourself? I mean, I would presume you have to be, to some degree. Yeah, no, I'm just taking it because it's easy. Like, yeah, I don't know what these paints do.

Why don't you guys put them on a thing? I'm not taking fun of art majors. I'm just trying to get the lay of the land here. So you're also a deadbeat then, Alejandra? I am not a deadbeat. I work about 40 to 45 hours a week as a manager and server at a restaurant. But in the meantime, I try to make art when I can.

But I do prefer writing. But yes, I'm just an art major. You work at, I don't want you to buzz market the place, but is it Canadian House of Pizza and Garbage? I don't know. I think it's similar, quite definitely. So you're an art major, you work full time, and you like to write as well. Is that correct? Yes, that is correct.

Well, I feel like we all know each other really well now. So, Louise, state for me very clearly what the problem is. You won't get a ride when you want one? Well, it's not that I don't often ask for rides, but when I do, she always says no. And that's the problem. Do you not know how to drive? I do know how to drive. But the thing is, she needs the car to go to work

as well as me to go to school so we're trying to balance our schedules together and she often refuses to wake up a little bit earlier to get me a ride oh hold on your honor if you don't mind I do mind oh please I have a comment

order just say I object I object I've never been to court but I object. I object. Okay, I sustain it. I've never been to court, but I object. Me neither. I'll see where you're going. All right, I object.

Go. He, for some reason, doesn't understand that if I don't have to be to work till 11, I don't want to get up at 8.30 and give him a ride when I am six miles uptown at my boyfriend's house. And I object. I'm nowhere near him. And even when I leave the car, you can't object right now, Louise. Even when I leave the car for him, he won't take it. So wait a minute. Now I object.

So you're taking the car up to be, you're taking the car to your boyfriend's house and sleeping over which is your right as an adult person but you're saying that you louise you call for a ride you call your sister for a ride when she's still at her boyfriend's house saying come back to the house pick me up and drive me to school is that what's going on she won't even give me a ride when she's at our house and i usually don't ask her when she's at Eric's house, but she'll give Eric rides even when he's here. When he's where? At your house? Yeah, at our house. So, Alejandra, do you give Eric's... What do you mean?

What? What he's trying to say is that when I am here at the home and we are together and I am available to do it, I do not want to give him a ride downtown. Which I don't think is entirely true. I think I've done it on a few accounts, at least a third of the accounts. One third of the times that you are asked, you can apply. So let's just say it was probably 15 to 20 times tops this past semester. But whenever I'm with Eric, i never say no to eric first of all by the way you're 23 years old your 23 years old semesters are over in your life

they are they're over you have to stop thinking that way i know i go by his i well my brother's still in college so i still think like a college student and your boyfriend oh and my boyfriend yeah they're terrible stop he goes to the same college, same place So what does that mean? What do you care? It's the same distance Of driving I don't understand So wait a minute, when she is at her boyfriend's place

With the car Do you ask her to come pick you up and drive you to school? Yes or no? I don't, I've given up on asking her So you did, but she said no and so you stopped Yeah When she is home And you ask for a ride I don't. I've given up on asking her. So you did, but she said no, and so you stopped. Yeah. When she is home and you ask for a ride, she says that she gives you a ride one-third of the time.

Is that accurate or inaccurate? I'm going to say it's inaccurate. What would be more accurate? One-fifth or one-sixth. One-fifth or one-sixth. That's a little steep. Okay, that's enough. You know, I've given you a lot of leeway, Alejandra. I'm going to try to protect this young child from you.

Would it be fair to say that you have terrorized him since the day he was born? I think there was a gap where I didn't, but, you know, yes, most of the time. There was a 30-day reprieve. When you were sedated for minor surgery. But get this. He followed me and went to the same college as me for three years.

I don't want to go through all of this crazy stuff. Okay. Let's just stipulate that the older sister has tortured the younger brother since birth. And the younger brother has annoyed the older sister. He's a burden. By wanting to be around her all the time because he loves her. This is the way it is always. Older sisters and younger brothers.

If you guys think that you're unique, guess what? You legally are required to stop thinking yourself unique once you're 24. So you just have a very short period of time before you have to give up this illusion. Luis, when you are home, no matter what the proportion of time she says yes, when you are home and she is home and you need to go somewhere in the car,

why are you asking her for a ride if you can drive? If I have to go somewhere that's not school, I'll go ahead and drive. But when I go to school, there's no parking downtown. It's really hard. Don't object. I want to hear. Let's let him finish one sentence, please. OK, because I'll be at school.

Alejandro, what? I'll be at school for eight hours. And yeah, I could go park in a garage, but I'll be like ten dollars and it'd be free if she just gave me a ride and a little gas money from me. How much gas money would you give her to drive to the... If she did it regularly, I'd give her $10 a week. You'd give her $10 a week to be your chauffeur. So Luis borrow my mom's car. So that's the first thing is when my car is there and my mom's car is there,

my mom's car is much nicer. So Luis will just take her car. He won't even touch my car. But then on the weekends, he takes my mom's car. He works as a student teacher or a teacher at a little technology program. And he will take her car for many hours downtown and he will go down there. By little technology, you're talking about nanobots? Possibly.

Small things. I think more like Photoshop and like computer business. Yeah. Oh, I misunderstood. You're just trying to run him down. I get it. But he never, never, ever, ever,

never in the history of the whole year that he's been bothering to take her car downtown has he filled up her gas. He's never filled up her gas ever. Well, is your mom involved in this dispute? My mom bullies me into driving my brother. My mom makes me feel like a horrible person.

She's like, you're you're awful. You're a terrible sister. You don't want to help your brother. Go give him a ride. And then she'll make me feel like for the rest of the night, she'll just give me the stink eye if I don't do it. And I'm like like i'm 22 years old if i don't want to take my brother downtown because i know he's fully capable of doing it himself i don't have to and what are you doing typically when you're refusing to give your

brother a ride downtown well usually when he gets done from school i'm already at work right but then usually in the mornings i'm sleeping because i work so late or I stay up or I go out with my friends. How far a ride is it from your house to downtown to school? About 15 minutes. It's about 15 minutes. We can concur on that. Okay. And how late do you work, Alejandra?

If I close and I'm a server, about 10, 30, 11. And then if I close as a a manager depending on the weeknight probably like 11 30 or midnight and how far away is your is your uh is your restaurant you're my restaurant is right in between now in school here in school seven minutes away about yeah okay 10 and how far away is your boyfriend's uh domicile my boyfriend's house is about 15 to 20 minutes, depending on construction, all the way in the other direction from downtown. Okay. Okay. All right. Believe me, I'm constructing an incredibly accurate diorama of your lives here in Plasticine. It's fantastic. It's like that table in Game of Thrones. It's a perfect map of your world.

Whose car is it? I'm going to ask you first, Luis, and then I want to hear your answer, Alejandra. Whose car is it, Luis? Really, it's our parents' car, but I'd say it's both of ours, but she acts like it's more hers. Well, she refers to it as my car.

So, I would agree with you on that. Alejandra, whose car is it? Well, given the fact that I put gas in it and take it to the, what do you call it? Is it like a wash? A car wash? I take it to the car wash and I fill the tires. What do you call it? A water put on shack? I couldn't think of what you call it. car wash but i i try to like soap rubbing machine factory that sounds like a different thing though i know go on but i think it's more like so you take it to the car wash how often do you bring it to the car wash

because this is a bearing on a case we just heard. Probably like twice a year I try to do it and vacuum it out real good, like in the spring and in the fall. Okay. So you care for the car? And I have a sentiment towards it, too. I have emotions about it. There's no room for sentiment in my courtroom. She also crashes it. But wait a minute.

You were about to give an example of your sentiment. Okay, but you backed mom's car into a truck. I want to hear about this in a second. But what was your example of your sentiment? You have a sentiment toward it? Like today you referred to it by your special nice lover. Even today, like, you know, with the moving process, I've basically given up the car and settled for my bike, which is fine.

But I saw it today and I was like, oh, I miss you so much, car. Like, I just love my car. At 22 years old, you're going to feel that way about everything. I know. I do. You're leaving childhood behind, including my car. Like, I just love my car. At 22 years old, you're going to feel that way about everything. I know. I do. You're leaving childhood behind, including this car. Yes, I am. Luis?

Yes? Why don't you put some gas in this car? I don't use it enough because she always uses it. So how do you get to school regularly, Luis? I'm just trying to understand your life. I take the bus. How often do you get to school regularly, Louise? I'm just trying to understand your life. How often do you have classes? Four days a week this semester, but five usually. Okay.

And what time and how much time do you need to be there? Like, how long are you going to spend there during the day? Anywhere from, like, probably five hours minimum to maybe eight. And you need to be there earlier than she needs to be at work? Yeah, but she said, be at work. Yeah. But she said like eight 30. That's a lie. Like one of my days,

I don't go until like 11 and like, that's a pretty reasonable time. I'm at work by then. I don't even know what time you go to work. 10 30 is when the server shift starts. I think what this comes down to basically, it's clear that this car thing is not working out for you guys. And now it may be rendered moot, right? Pretty much. By the fact

that you've moved. And now, Alejandra, you're saying you're relying on your bicycle? Yes. So where did you move? I moved right downtown, actually,, just right in the Capitol Square area. So you don't even have this car anymore? No, I can walk to work now. I don't have to even think about my brother. Well, you don't have to brag about it. I am going to need rides eventually, and I know that he's going to give me hell. He's going to have to help me. Oh, yeah, well, turnabout is fair play.

So now we're switching it up. Yeah, well, it doesn't feel good, does it, big sis? No, it feels awful. Because now the whole situation is reversed, is it not, Luis? Now you have almost sole control of this car. Yeah, but the thing is, I'm such a nice and loving brother that whenever she asks for a ride, I'm always there. I beg her to think of a time I refused to pick her up from work. Alejandra, is that true or not true?

It is true. He's a really good brother. And he always picks you up when you ask him? He does. I think it's also because mom pressures him because she doesn't want me bike riding at night. Mom pressures you and you don't give it. I think that's just her job.

She just pressures. She's a bully. Mom doesn't pressure me because I think that's just her job. She just pressures. She's a bully. Mom doesn't pressure me because I'm nice. All right, all right. I will have order. I will have order. What this comes down to is, at this point, the sharing of the car is completely unfeasible to begin with. Second of all, it's not even a point of dispute anymore because the car is now de facto in control of Luis.

What it really comes down to is fairness. Do you guys extend each other the same courtesies equally? I don't think so. In a brotherly or sisterly way. You don't think so, Alejandra? No, I think I, okay, and this is what I've told my mother. I don't think that I'm a bad person or a selfish person. I think I'm lazy. I'm incredibly lazy. And I'm not gonna lie, like, I work a lot. And I'm really tired. Maybe I just don't want to do it because I'm bitter when I wake up. I don't know. But I could I know, deep down in my heart that I should do these things for my brother. I know it with all my common sense. that I should do these things for my brother.

I know it with all my common sense. It's just a matter of changing in me the fact that I'm so incredibly just not willing to do things for other people. I really need to just, that's my one character flaw that I need to work on. Shows an amazing amount of personal insight, I have to say. So you appreciate that this is a flaw. I do, yeah.

You are essentially confessing that you do not give your brother as many rides for the same consideration that he would afford to you. This is true. I think it would be helpful to have a third party to weigh in. Is there another witness that you would like to bring to the case? Well, my boyfriend Eric is here with me. Oh, okay. Eric, are you here? I am here. Eric, have you heard the testimony so far from both sides?

Yeah, I've been listening. All right. As an expert witness, do you agree with, first of all, you and Alejandra are still involved? Are you seeing each other? You're going steady? Yes. All right. And would you agree with her? You're going steady? Yes. All right. And would you agree with her testimony that she is lazy? Yes. Do you think that she is unduly stingy with ride giving to her little brother? I see it. Yeah. I see. Okay. is there anything you'd like to say in her defense I just want to say

that I myself often transport myself downtown and I live probably twice the distance that Luis has to travel so I mean in the winter I would rely on rides but now that

it's gotten nicer I don't think the bus system is terribly bad in Madison. And biking distance is, you can pretty much bike as fast as you can drive there. And how do you resolve the parking issue when you get downtown? Parking sucks pretty much downtown, so that is a problem. Do you drive yourself into town, or are you saying you take the bus? I never drive downtown. You never drive downtown? No, I always take the bus or bike.

See, this whole thing has set me off considerably, because I was ready, Luis, to just tear into you. You seem like a really nice guy, but I think you would agree you don't fill up the gas on the car particularly often. You pay less in insurance. You don't wash it twice a year. You have not gotten that hubcap fixed, right? You do not require the car to get to a job. you have not gotten that hubcap fixed, right? You don't, you, you, you do not require the car to get to a job and you do require the car. That doesn't even sound like you require the car to get to town because you

say you take the bus. I think the main issue comes when I'm carrying around, like, like this is one specific example. I had three four-foot boards of wood I needed to get to my art room. What kind of boards of wood are you carrying around? Why are you carrying around boards of wood? Well, I was in a printmaking class this semester, and it was woodcut, so. It was what? I'm sorry, I didn't hear it. Woodcut relief printmaking.

Three, so four-foot boards. Like, what are the dimensions on these boards of wood? Four feet by two feet, right? Yes. Okay, I gotcha. And you don't want to bring those on the bus because you're going to look like a jerk. Yeah, and they're really heavy, so carrying them to the bus stop and from where the bus gets off to the art building up six flights of floors. Like, that's a trek. And how often is it in your life that you have to transport boards of wood?

I've had to do it about four times this semester, and she helped zero times. Ooh. Yeah, that's right. I only knew of the boards one time, to be fair. See, Alejandra, you're really throwing me off, because even though I said all big sisters and all little brothers are the same, I have never known a big sister to be as self-critical

as you are. Well, I mean, I went to art school, so critique is my specialty. Yeah, wow. I judge myself as well as I judge others. Yeah, and you're not looking very good right now. I'm trying. No, I'm not trying. You don't want to win this thing because you don't care anymore.

No, but okay. Because you live in town. Fine, okay. I'll get ugly. Let's get ugly. Finally. My brother does not give a flying hoo-ha about that car. He does not, he like, I'll come up to him and be like, do you need a ride?

Do you want one? And he'll be like, well, if I'm such a burden, then no. And like sasses me. And I'm like, well, no, I don't want to give you a ride? Do you want one? And he'll be like, well, if I'm such a burden, then no. And like sasses me. And I'm like, well, no, I don't want to give you a ride at all. Like, why would I want to give somebody a ride who sasses me? Are you an ungrateful little brother, Luis? Do you sass your older sister? It's just that she's refused me so many times that I've gotten cold.

That feels like a mean joke when she asked me for a ride. Is it a mean joke, older sister? Are you sitting down? Are you like Lucy sitting down a football for Charlie Brown to come running? Not at all. I don't know what I'm doing anymore. I don't either. You're in the big change of life period right now. You're 22 years old. You're living in the big city. You're working. What are you going to do for the rest of your life, Alejandra? Hopefully I will move in a few years and, you know, like once I've like made enough money, like start something that's more in the artistic field. Like what?

Well, I'd like to work in a gallery or like with a collective and like organize art shows and artists and events. Those are the things that I like to do more so than making art. And where would you want to move? I haven't really decided. I think that Colorado sounds like a good place or Arizona, but just somewhere. Those are definitely random states. I'm looking for drier weather, whether it's cold or hot, as long as it's like in between. Yeah. Okay. And so, so basically when it comes down to weather, my brother has an incredibly nice bike that he paid a hundred some dollars for.

And I don't know why he can't just bike downtown when he doesn't have any. What about the boards of wood? Get a trailer. Get a trailer for your bike. All right. Now, younger brother, what do you want to do with your life? I want to be a teacher. And that's about as much as I figured out.

That's pretty good. Yeah. Very noble, right? do you also want to move to drier weather i'll probably just follow my sister wherever she goes he probably will and then my mother will die alone here because he's such a terrible person are you saying that first of all are you saying that it's your brother's obligation to live at home while you go running off to Arizona. But he does have a couple more years yet.

He'll probably, well, he's going to get an apartment too soon. So we're both trying to take this as the year to grow up. I can tell you're trying. I can also tell you're failing. But when I come back from Chambers, I will render a decision that is going to help and hurt both of you. Yay. Please rise as Judge John Hodgman exits the courtroom.

Alejandra, I mean, I understand that this is a tough period in your life, but I don't know, maybe you need to just take some time and get your head straight. How does one do that? I don't know, like one of those silent retreats or something oh i'm still a mess it just gets worse and worse and then you have a kid and you're like oh my god what am i doing and i work around kids all day so i don't know what i'm doing either oh boy they're scary like they can't they can't eat right. You got any recommend? You don't know. With all due respect, shut your pie hole.

Luis, you got any tips? You've got the blithe confidence of youth. Oh, well, I will probably be spending my whole life working with children now. So I don't know. This is a good chance for her to baby me and practice before she has her own kids. I'm not your mom. Jeez. We're going to have to let the judge decide this one.

He's wise. Please rise as Judge John Hodgman reenters the courtroom. Children, stop fighting. I'm going to solve your lives for you. Or make them more complicated. First of all, Alejandra, you may be many things, but you are not lazy. And I don't think you should put that on yourself.

You are working a job quite a bit. You are out in the world. You are earning money and presumably saving some. Oh, I hope. Or trying to, at least. Trying to, yeah. You have your own apartment, is that correct now?

I do now. You have rented your own apartment in the big city of Madison, Wisconsin. You're doing everything that you need to do in order to become an adult, including taking care of a car until recently, and including being confused and not knowing whether you're doing any of the right things, which is totally normal and exactly what should be going on right now. If I were to put one fault on you, which is one that you have confessed yourself, is that you have been, in a somewhat sisterly way, ungracious and ungenerous to your annoying little brother.

He's not that annoying. He's lovely. ungracious and ungenerous to your annoying little brother. And you have lorded. He's not that annoying. He's lovely. You have lorded your age and your power over him, as is what happens among children when there is an older sister and a younger brother. And that is also perfectly normal for children. You have denied your brother rides unduly so. And

your brother will now deny you rides. And that is karma. And that is something you are going to have to live with. Yes. That is something you are going to have to live with. Luckily, you don't need a lot of rides. Luckily, yeah. But part of being an adult

is knowing that what goes around comes around whether it's on a bus or in a hyundai and so your brother is well within his rights if he so chooses to be somewhat stingy now that he is full use of the sonata i'm doing a lot of buzz marketing for Hyundai. But, Luis, you are 21 years old. Yes. You got to get it together now. You won. You got the car. It's time for you to start taking care of yourself and stop asking people in your life for rides, literally and figuratively.

You have to pay the insurance for this car. If you want to use this car, you got to talk to your mom, got to say, I'm going to give you a dollar. I'm going to take over this car. I want a name on the title. I want to start paying for the insurance. I'm going to start taking it for baths.

I'm going to make sure that it's vacuumed out. I'm going to fix that side mirror. You got to take responsibility. And if you got boards of wood and you got to take responsibility. And if you've got boards of wood and you want to take them to school, you put them in the Sonata and you park it in a garage for $10.

Because that's what grown-ups do. Getting this boy to spend his money is like getting a cat to be friendly. It doesn't work. It just doesn't happen. It's funny a friendly cat. I was trying to think of... Okay.

I can't think of a better one. I apologize. No, it's okay. I'll allow your bickering because that's what it's all about between brothers and sisters, particularly of close in age. I get it.

But he's like my best friend. I can tell your pals. And now it is time to move beyond the lording over and the and the passive aggressive you know if only if it's not too much trouble to give me a ride all that stuff has to stop i find in favor of aleandra. Party! Time to get the beers! Because even though she was being a jerk to you,

Luis, and admits it, she was taking care of her adult business with regard to caring for the car and getting herself to work and moving on with her life and deserved a rest. And you equally deserved a chance to figure out

how to get your boards from one part of Wisconsin to another without always relying on family. That said, it's your turn now, Luis, to take over that car, take responsibility for it, and you are entitled, karmically, so to speak, terrible pun, to deny rides to your sister at will forever after. Are you going to do it? Are you going to be the kind of person who takes vengeance? Or are you both going to be the kinds of brothers and sisters who are able to relate to each other as adults now that you are adults? That's the question that I cannot answer. Only you can by your behavior in the future. Also, Luis, you should

probably move out of your house. You're a grown-up. You should probably get your own place soon. Alejandra, you are a jerk. You're going to pay for it, but you were right in this case. This is the sound of a gavel. Judge John Hodgman rules. That is all. Please rise as Judge John Hodgman exits the courtroom. Louise, how do you feel? I feel kind of mixed because at least I got a confirmation that my sister is a jerk and I will be able to reprimand her later on for this. Alejandra, are you ready to change your life?

Oh, yeah, for sure. I'm I'm well, I know that I will definitely be a lot kinder to my brother after this and a bit more generous. Luis Alejandra, thank you for joining us on the Judge John Hodgman podcast. Thank you. Hello, I'm your Judge John Hodgman. The Judge John Hodgman podcast is brought to you every week by you, our members, of course. Thank you so much for your support of this podcast and all of your favorite podcasts at MaximumFun.org. And they are all your favorites.

If you want to join the many member supporters of this podcast and this network, boy, oh boy, that would be fantastic. Just go to MaximumFun.org slash join. The Judge John Hodgman podcast is also brought to you this week by the folks over there at Babbel. Did you know that learning, the experience of learning causes a sound to happen? Let's hear the sound. Yep. That's the sound of you learning a sound to happen. Let's hear the sound. Yep, that's the sound of you learning a new language with Babbel. We're talking about quick 10-minute lessons crafted by over 200 language experts that can help you start speaking a new language in as little as one, two, three weeks. Let's hear that sound. Babbel's tips and tools are

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Rules and restrictions apply. The Judge John Hodgman podcast is also brought to you this week by our pals over at Made In. Jesse, you've heard of Tom Colicchio, the famous chef, right? Yeah, from the restaurant Kraft. And did you know that most of the dishes at that very same restaurant are made with made-in pots and pans? Really? What's an example?

The braised short ribs, they're made-in, made-in. The Rohan duck, made-in, made-in. Riders of Rohan, duck! What about the Heritage Pork Shop? You got it. Made-in, made-in. Made in. Riders of Rohan. Duck. What about the Heritage Pork Shop? You got it. Made in. Made in. Made in has been supplying top chefs and restaurants with high-end cookware for years. They make the stuff that chefs need.

Their carbon steel cookware is the best of cast iron, the best of stainless clad. It gets super hot. It's rugged enough for grills or an open flame. One of the most useful pans you can own. And like we said, good enough for real professional chefs, the best professional chefs. Oh, so I have to go all the way down to the restaurant district in restaurant town? Just buy it online. This is professional grade cookware that is available online directly to you, the consumer, at a very reasonable price. Yeah. If you want to take your cooking to the next level, remember what so many great dishes on menus all around the world have in common. They're made in Made In. Save up to 25% this Memorial Day from the 18th until the 27th. Visit madeincookware.com. That's M-A-D-E-I-N cookware dot com.

Hello, teachers and faculty. This is Janet Varney. I'm here to remind you that listening to my podcast, The JV Club with Janet Varney, is part of the curriculum for the school year. Learning about the teenage years of such guests as Alison Brie, Vicki Peterson, John Hodgman, and so many more is a valuable and enriching experience.

One you have no choice but to embrace because yes, listening is mandatory. The JV club with Janet Varney is available every Thursday on maximum fun or wherever you get your podcasts. Thank you. And remember, no running in the halls. If you need a laugh and you're on the go, try S-T-O-P-P-O-D-C-A-S-T-I-A. Were you trying to put the name of the podcast there?

Yeah, I'm trying to spell it, but it's tricky. Let me give it a try. Okay. If you need a laugh and you're on the go, call S-T-O-P-P-P-A-D-I. It'll never fit. No, it will. Let me try. If you need a laugh and you're on the go, try S-T-O-P-P-P-D-C-O-O. Ah, we are so close. Stop podcasting yourself. A podcast from MaximumFun.org. If you need a laugh, then you're on the go. We're back. Ding, ding, ding, ding, ding, ding, ding, ding, ding, ding, ding, ding, ding, ding, ding, ding, ding, ding, ding, ding, ding, ding, ding, ding, ding, ding, ding, ding, ding, ding, ding, ding, ding, ding, ding, ding, ding, ding, ding, ding, ding, ding, ding, ding, ding, ding, ding, ding, ding, ding, ding, ding, ding, ding, ding, ding, ding, ding, ding, ding, ding, ding, ding, ding, ding, ding, ding, ding, ding, ding, ding, ding, ding, ding, ding, ding, ding, ding, ding, ding, ding, ding, ding, ding, ding, ding, ding, ding, ding, ding, ding, ding, ding, ding, ding, ding, ding, ding, ding, ding, ding, ding, ding, ding, ding, ding, ding, ding, ding, ding, ding, ding, ding, ding, ding, ding, ding, ding, ding, ding, ding, ding, ding, ding, ding, ding, ding, ding, ding, ding, ding, ding, ding, ding, ding, ding, ding, ding, ding, ding, ding, ding, ding, ding, ding, ding, ding, ding, ding, ding, ding, ding, ding, ding, ding, ding, ding, ding, ding, ding, ding, ding, ding, ding, ding, ding, ding, ding, ding, ding, ding, ding, ding, ding, ding, ding, ding, ding, ding, ding, ding, ding, ding, ding, ding, ding, ding, ding, ding, ding, ding, ding, ding, ding, ding, ding, ding, ding, ding, ding, ding, ding, ding, ding, ding, ding, ding, ding, ding, ding, ding, ding, ding, ding, ding, ding, ding, ding, ding, ding, ding, ding, I wish people liked us the way that they like them. I used to listen to them before they were national. Wow.

In WBUR in Boston. I used to listen to them local, when they would occasionally talk about cars. You mean instead of just reading jokes that people forwarded to them on the internet? I'm not going to play that. I'm not going to be mean to them. I like them. They're wonderful. I like them. They're wonderful. I like them.

They're wonderful, and they're good business people. They are. They're great radio hosts. They're among the best. I have nothing but good things to say about them. Natural broadcasters. And next time some hipster makes fun of Garrison Keillor in front of me, I'm going to punch him in the nose.

Note to self. Yes. You know who that message is for, Jesse. We've got a few items on the docket here that we could clear up if we want to change the subject. Sorry, I'm just trying to be more click and clack. Okay, here's something from Bryson. B-R-Y-S-S-O-N. I'm going to go with Bryson.

Bryson. Bryson. A couple of years ago, I was issued a speeding ticket by a motorcycle cop. I was considering how to handle the ticket, whether to attend traffic school or appear in court and hope the cop didn't show up when I read an article in the paper. The officer that issued my ticket had been involved in a traffic accident and was in the hospital. My friend Josh congratulated me on my tremendous luck. I ran the different scenarios through my head and decided that I could not bear to face a judge who would most likely know that I knew the officer wouldn't be there and why. I paid the fine and took traffic school. Josh says that I

was stupid to pay the fine and I might as well have thrown the money away. I argue that I have a clean conscience and that is worth more than $500. Should I have tried to contest the ticket? No, you did the right thing. First of all, you were speeding. You knew it. And then you had an opportunity to what? Dance on the comatose officer in order to get out of it. I believe it's called tap dancing on his iron lung. Yeah. You were going to tap dance on his iron lung in order to save yourself 500 bucks and feel terrible for the rest of your life.

You did the wrong thing. You recognized it. You paid wrong thing. You recognized it. You paid the price. You moved on. I think that your friend Josh is a dime store novel villain for suggesting that you're a dum-dum for doing the right thing. And I would watch him carefully from now on.

Do processes for people that didn't do the thing that they are accused of, right? Due process is for everyone. But I mean, they're supposed to, that's when you're you could, if you did it, you can cop to it. Uh, yes. Uh, well, that's the thing. It's like,

you know, there is a systematic there's a system in place by which if the officer does not show up to the hearing, right, it tends to be automatically dismissed. And it seems like Josh is sort of of the mindset, which is you should use every part of the system to your advantage because the system will not care about destroying you, whether even if you are innocent. And I sort of see that cynical point of view. you are innocent. And I sort of see that cynical point of view, but it sort of reminds me of my wife's high school students who believe that it is okay to cheat because everyone cheats and it's part of the system now for everyone to cheat on their tests and so forth. I don't think that that's a good way to learn. And I also think it's a great way to train sociopaths. So yeah, if you know

you've done something wrong, even if the system is set up to beat you even if the man is trying to put you down all the time like it seems foolish not to go ahead and and pay the fine for something you knew that you did wrong karmically this is a little pun uh or i guess motorcyclily motorcycle motorcyclically motorcyclically uh thatcycle cop. Motorcyclically? Motorcyclically. That's no good. And especially if the only way that you would get over on the system is by virtue of another person being in the hospital. That's terrible. Terrible stuff. You wouldn't want to live that way.

You already don't. That's why you wrote to me. You're right. He's wrong. Let's move on. Do you have anything for the buzz marketing segment of the show? I do. MaxFunCon East. I'm choking with excitement.

You and I will both be at MaxFunCon East. I don't know. How would you describe MaxFunCon to people who don't know what it is? It is like a miniature TED conference with more comedians, more s'mores, and a wonderful, low-key, fireside mood of fellowship and entertainment for people who are not billionaires. billionaires. We're putting on our first ever East Coast MaxFunCon in October in the Poconos, which we chose because it is driving distance from many of the major metropolises of the eastern seaboard and certainly driving distance from several major airports. And we are so excited about it. This is the first time we have ever brought this to the East Coast. We've done, this will be in June, our fourth West Coast Max Fun Con. And, you know, every time we do it, someone comes up to me

and says that it, sincerely says that it changed their life. And it's, you know, it's just a wonderful weekend of... And that person is always me. But it's just a wonderful weekend of and that person is always me but it's still great and that's just because I mean every time you go away to MaxFunCon I murder one member of your family

you'd think I would have figured this out by now but you really can't put two and two together so wise but so stupid so anyway MaxFunCon east is october 26th through 28th you can find more information and get tickets now at maxfuncon.com we have not announced the lineup although i have just revealed that both you and i will be there um and the reason we don't announce the lineup people sometimes ask why don't you announce the lineup, is because we would rather have people who are there to go to MaxFunCon or at least a preponderance of people who are there to go to MaxFunCon than because they want to see one particular performer or do one particular thing because it makes for a better sort of community environment.

And frankly, these events are very intimate. There are only a couple of hundred people there of whom roughly 25% are performers or presenters of some kind. And so our challenge isn't filling the joint. And so what we want to do is make sure that it's a really special event for everyone who comes and what we find generally is that you know people who are there for the event um are happier than people who are there just because they you know they want to see journey oh great now i spilled the beans no but there is i know of at least one very special guest that we are not prepared to announce yeah i am going to be very excited to see and spend time with.

It's not just like a festival, right? Where you go and you see a lot of bands play or whatever on a stage far away, and then you eat some tacos and then hang around on a field, right? This is a small event where, personally, I go not only because I enjoy performing there, because the audiences are fantastic, not only to see the amazing other creators and performers, comedians and actors and other interesting people who come to present there, but also because I like the people who come to just be there. And I enjoy seeing them year after year. And I enjoy getting to know them.

It really is a thing where everybody is part of the lineup. So if you want to know who's in the lineup, it's me and it's Jesse, some secret people who will be announced later. And if you sign up, you're part of the lineup too. Yeah. And you can take a look at who's been at past MaxFunCons. If you want to get an idea of the kind of folks who have been at this thing in the past. It's an amazing group of people who have joined us, and it will be again for MaxFunCon East. So go to MaxFunCon.com for more information and tickets. It's October 26th through 28th. And I want to extend a special thank you to our co-sponsors for MaxFunCon East,

my affiliate station in New York City, WNYC, my affiliate station in New York City, WNYC, who are just, I think, probably the best public radio station in the country and have been a big part of helping us make this MaxFunCon East possible. And look, I'm not going to say that it's possible that they might be involved in the lineup at some point, but it's possible.

It's possible. Anything's possible. Could be. Who knows? We'll see. MaxFunCon.com. And how quickly did the tickets sell out for MaxFunCon West this year? I'll tell you that MaxFunCon West is June 1st and tickets sold out on December 31st. So get your tickets quickly if you want to go. Please act fast. That's our time for the

Judge John Hodgman podcast. We'll see you next time. Don't drive like my brother. Don't drive like my judge. Goodbye. The Judge John Hodgman podcast is a production of MaximumFun.org. Our special thanks to all of the folks who donate to support the show and all of our shows at MaximumFun.org slash donate. The show is produced by Julia Smith and me, Jesse Thorne, and edited by Mark McConville. You can check out his podcast, Super Ego, in iTunes or online at GoSuperEgo.com. You can find John Hodgman online at AreasOfMyExpertise.com. If you have a case for Judge John Hodgman, go to maximumfund.org slash JJHO. If you have thoughts about the show, join the conversation on our forum at forum.maximumfund.org and our Facebook group at facebook.com slash Judge John Hodgman. We'll see you online and next time right here on the Judge John Hodgman podcast.