Judge John Hodgman - The Host with the Most, with Janie Haddad Tompkins

Episode Date: June 14, 2023

It's time to clear the docket! This week, we're joined by Judge Hodgman's regular host in Los Angeles, Janie Haddad Tompkins. We tackle disputes about hosting, guesting, restocking larders, hostess gifts, and more!

Welcome to the Judge John Hotchman podcast. I am bailiff Jesse Thorne. We're in chambers this week to clear the docket and with me is the host with the most Judge John Hotchman. I'm the host with the most coconut water in this room. When I was feeling poorly over over the winter, I thought I never get things like coconut water. I'm like, I need to replenish. And I got some coconut water and I put it in the fridge. It doesn't go bad for another five months, so don't worry. When you say replenish, you mean you had lost all your coconuts? I was the host with the most coconut water of the least coconuts. So I got this coconut water.

And just before we started recording, I'm like, I gotta get a drink of water. And then I was like, or do I get a drink of coconut water? And that's what I got. And it's delicious. This is not an advertisement, but Vita Coco, get in touch with us. Cause I will, I will vouch for this product. You have to balance your humors. That's blood, phlegm, coconut, chyme, and coconut. Judge Hodgman, I mentioned that you're the host with the most, because when I'm visiting New York City, Brooklyn, New York, I tend to stay at your office where you are sitting right now as we record. That's right. You are my host when we visit. And that's the subject of this week's Judge John Hodgman, house guests. Yes.

So we had a great time expanding our brand recently. Love to expand the brand. We went on the radio program, all of it with Alison Stewart on WNYC. And it was a terrific time. And they suggested, have you ever done anything on house guest disputes? And we're like, no, what are we thinking? Let's put out a call for some house guest disputes. And we got so many of them. And we only had time on the radio to deal with about three that we decided we should have a whole show dedicated to house guest disputes. We got so many that we had to do a whole episode. And who better to join us than not only you, Jesse, one of my favorite house guests, a perfect house guest, I may say. Thank you.

But perhaps my very favorite house host, Ms. Janie Haddad-Tompkins. Hello. Hi, Janie. Thank you. Joining us from unspecified neighborhood in Los Angeles. Yes, I am here. Thank you for having me in your virtual chambers. And I see that you're joining us virtually from your guest room.

Yes. A.K.A. the John Hodgman suite. A.K.A. your bedroom. But we'll get to that in a moment. First, people don't know, Janie is an actor, writer, comedian, a picketer. You know what I mean? She's picketing. Deep into the labor stuff.

A SAG member. Yes. Thank you, Screen Actors Guild and American Federation of Television and Radio Artists. Yes, we just- Or author. Explain why I'm thanking you. Oh, that we are about to renegotiate our contract terms for fair pay and lots of other things. And we just, in an overwhelming show of solidarity, had an almost 99% yes vote to authorize a strike. Should it come to that?

I don't know when you're hearing this, but that strike authorization vote just happened yesterday. Historical. It's historical and it's a huge boon to this fight to get fair compensation in this industry, which is an important part of the fight to get fair compensation in every industry that is dominated by a few corporations that are addicted to impossible exponential growth at the expense of the living wages of their employees. So thank you for that. But, and beyond that, you are also the co-host of the great Stay F Homekins podcast, which comes out wherever you get your podcast, the second Friday of every month.

And it's just an after dinner podcast with you chatting with your very special friend and roommate, Paul F. Tompkins. I dare say your husband and a whole human being in his own right. Yes, he is a whole human being in his own right. And the two of you also have a sub stack now, which we will talk about a little bit later in the program. Okay. little bit later in the program. Okay. But to the point at hand, to the matter at hand, during the middle of the last decade.

Correct. From about 2014 to some years after that. Yes. I stayed in your home with you and your lovely friend and partner, Paul. And roommate, yeah. And roommate and special buddy. partner, Paul. In roommate, yeah. In roommate. Special buddy. I would guess probably over the course of four or five years, I probably stayed in between eight and 35 times in your house. For varying lengths of

stay. Even possible? Yes, probably. I don't know. Well, I don't want to put you on the spot, but this episode is about house guest dilemmas, conundrums, horror stories, and others to get through here. So Jesse Thorne, why don't we get into it? Here's a case from Kate in South Burlington, Vermont. My partner, Joel, thinks going to stay with his family is a vacation. I disagree because it means we are house guests. Who's right?

So Kate wrote in, and I know Kate because she's a regular, she tunes in to Get Your Pets, my afternoon talk show with pets, cats and dogs and other pets from South Burlington. So thanks, Kate, for watching. Thanks, Kate, for listening. Thanks, Kate, for submitting. This is an interesting one, right? Because there are three kinds of house visits or home invasions, as I like to call them. There's the friend house visit, and then there's a family house visit. And then there's the romantic house visit. So, but this is family. And I understand that family is tricky because family is the most likely to feel entitled

to stay in your home, whether you want it or not. And equally on the other side, they're most likely to feel hurt if you don't stay in their home. If you come to their town and you get a hotel or whatever, plus the family are most likely to infantilize and alienate your spouse or partner because you're not their child. What do you think about visiting family members? Have you ever gone to Philadelphia and visited Paul's family and stayed in their home? We do not stay in their home. We stay in a hotel. And why?

Well, number one, we've never been invited. Okay. And just because we need our own space or whatever we have stayed at my brother's in philadelphia a couple of times but yeah it's just better to be in a hotel there jesse is staying with family a vacation yes or no staying with family in their home, their primary home. That's right. Vacation isn't the word I would use. Vacation isn't the word. What did you say?

Trip? Yeah. Trip. It's a trip. Yeah. Yeah. I asked Kate for some more information and, uh, and she wrote that, uh, his family, her partner's family live about 90 minutes from them in extreme Northern Vermont.

And there's no hotel to go to, but he wants to visit his family. And she tries to be a good house guest by helping with the dishes and the cooking and the groceries and sending a thank you card. And she points out, I don't have to do any of that on vacation. It's true. Yep. It's not a vacation. do any of that on vacation it's true yep this yeah it's not a vacation it's not a vacation and and you know i would say that being a house guest in itself you should you should be wary of the house guest who thinks it's a vacation for them because they're not going to be helpful around the house if your house like you know if you're invited if your mom and dad or mom and mom or dad and dad or the parental figures in your life invite you to visit their house on, I don't know, let's say Sullivan's Island, South Carolina. If only.

And they're the kind of parental figures who are just like, I'm not going to do an accent, Janie. Just have a good time. Just relax. Don't worry. Howdy, partner. That's when you visit on the ranch, I guess. On the ranch. Come down to South Carolina and ride some bogeys.

Cows or something? Cows? Yeah. something a cows yeah if you got if you got a couple if you got a couple of really really cool you know southern parental units who are just gonna be like just come on in and help yourself to whatever's in the fridge do not clean a thing do not do a thing do not bother us because we're just going to be sipping mint juleps from dawn till dusk on the lanai, that could be a vacation. I could see that as a vacation. True.

And if you've got kids and those family members are like, we're going to take care of those kids, that's a vacation. Oh, that's a vacation for parents, that's for sure. Yeah. But I think that, Joel, you need to be respectful. And when you're counting up your vacations as I know you were doing, don't count the time that Kate drove you to Toronto to visit your father and sister

and did all the work of driving and then cooking and cleaning and everything else while you were there. That wasn't a vacation for Kate. That might've been fun for you. Yeah, I feel like maybe he defines vacation differently than the way I define vacation. Right.

Because vacation, like I want to be somewhere new even. That's a good point. Yeah. And anything to be a vacation if someone else is doing the work for you. Yes. But that is not what is happening particularly in a, you know. In a family. In any house guest situation.

And in a family house guest situation when it's not your family but your in-laws, if the family situation is that you're visiting your parents and your partner is there, it's never going to be as comfortable for your partner as it is for you. But also you should help your parents, period. Why do you say wow, Jesse? Why wow? I'm thinking back to all the challenges of my family are very hard work, no matter what. I love them all very much, but it's a lot of hard work for everyone involved. My wife's family might be the easiest human beings to get along with in the history of the world. But in the days when we had few

enough children that when we went to the Bay Area, we would sometimes stay with my wife's family. The amount of work it was for me to live in someone else's home life situation. Right. And it was the same even on a trip that I would consider a vacation, which is my wife's grandfather and my wife's grandfather's brother co-owned a cabin in a national forest in the Northern Sierras. And their family would go there once a year. And I went a number of times and always had a wonderful time. But even that was a lot of hard work given that it was not my family. Yeah.

If it's not your family, you're always going to be walking on eggshells a little bit. So here's the takeaway. Vacation is when someone, when you are not doing the work, when you actually get to relax. And that should never be the case when you're visiting someone's home. You got to be conscientious. They're there to make you comfortable, but you're there to make them comfortable as well. I think we have another family visit conundrum. Is that right, Jesse?

This one comes from Reditor Taco Salad. That's taco spelled in the Adventure Zone manner. Oh, there might be some crossover listenership there. My wife and I have six children in our blended family. Three of them are adults who live out of town. We have one guest bedroom. How do we decide who gets to use the guest bedroom when everyone visits for the holidays? The oldest is 30, married, and a high income lawyer. Hang on, I have to get my to get out my scratch paper for this logic problem. Okay, go ahead.

The second is headed east from Kansas City at 55 miles an hour. Understand. Okay, got it. Right? Okay. So the oldest is 30 and a high-income lawyer. The next oldest is 25 and low-income. The youngest of the three is 23 and a graduate student. Boy, Taco Salad really threw the

next oldest under the bus there. Low income. There's a nicer way of saying that, I feel like. Pursuing their passions. Pursuing their passions. The youngest gets grad student. We all know what that means. Pursuing their passions. Probably doesn't have a lot of money either. Well, okay. What do you think, Janie? This is the deal.

There's one room three adult kids are coming to visit. Who gets that room? Well, here's my... And what happens to the others? My solution would be to 100% the high income married lawyer has to stay somewhere else. I mean, that's just like, that's a given. Easy peasy lemon squeezy. And also they're probably like, yeah, we want a hotel. Like, ugh.

And then. I'm a married high-income lawyer. I love hotels. Yeah. Like, I don't need to be with the blended family and then the presidential suite please uh is the high income lawyer suite available tonight thank you that's an outlook my suggestion would be for the younger two siblings that have difficulty would be to either one solution would be to share the room and put like a like an air mattress on the floor and then another solution would be like okay one of you got

one of y'all like decide amongst yourselves gets the guest room and the other one we're gonna help pay to stay like at the you know holiday inn express because i don't think you should burden the family with the with the pay of coming to see you like if they are having trouble financially i would say that uh first of all the the siblings should all get together and just have a little meeting and say, does anyone want to stay in this guest room? Like, anyone actually want to do it? Because if so, you get it. It's fine.

Good point. And I got to give a hat tip to Redditor Greg, who in the comments when this was submitted, I think suggested a very good solution, which is the high income lawyer should get an Airbnb in town and all the siblings stay over there. Oh, like that's good to have a party. You know, I have a party. That's good. I think that's I think that's the solution there. But would that hurt taco salads feelings? I think taco salad doesn't get a say in their feelings.

Everyone deserves their feelings, even taco salad. That said, the point of visiting should be to have fun and be comfortable. But if your child is more comfortable in a hotel than in your own home, don't be too sensitive about it. If you're an adult child, I should say. If your nine-year-old is more comfortable in a hotel than in your home, obviously. That's a children's book.

A very sad children's book about an abandoned girl named Eloise. But it's still, it's not legal. But if your adult child is more comfortable staying in a hotel than in your guest room, try not to take it personally. They're just in a different phase of life is this anything here's the story of a redditor named taco who was bringing up three adults who live out of. Plus three others who were unnamed. We don't know their income.

Two were passionate. Then one day, the three adult children said, we're coming to town and one of us must sleep in your guest room. We will not contribute to solving this problem. Go and ask a podcast. Go ask a podcast. Go ask a podcast. Go ask a podcast. That's the way that we solved taco salad's problem, except Greg did it first on Reddit. Thanks, Greg. I appreciate it. We're going to take a quick break to hear from this week's partners. We'll be back with more cases to clear from the docket on the Judge John Hodgman podcast.

You're listening to Judge John Hodgman. I'm bailiff Jesse Thorne. Of course, the Judge John Hodgman podcast always brought to you by you, the members of MaximumFun.org. Thanks to everybody who's gone to MaximumFun.org slash join, and you can join them by going to MaximumFun.org slash join. And you can join them by going to MaximumFun.org slash join. The Judge John Hodgman podcast is also brought to you this week by the folks over there at Babbel.

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on menus all around the world have in common. They're made in Made In. Save up to 25% this Memorial Day from the 18th until the 27th. Visit madeincookware.com. That's M-A-D-E-I-N Cookware.com. Welcome back to the Judge John Hodgman podcast. We're clearing the docket this week with our friend Janie Haddad-Tompkins. Here's something from Vicki who posted on our Instagram account, is it rude to bring your own towels when you're staying at someone else's home?

I don't want to risk leaving my own, to put it delicately, mess, on my host's linens. I also have sensitivities to certain laundry products, but some argue this would insult the host's housekeeping habits. First of all, I'm just going to put this out there right up top and you two can deal with it. But I have some concerns about what the mess is that is underlined in this question, because it is quite literally underlined. Go ahead, Jamie.

I noticed that you were having a strong reaction. Well, I don't think it's rude because if you tend to have like allergic reactions to certain detergents or whatever, then what you're doing is taking care of your own medical needs. So I don't see something rude there. So, yeah, I was laughing about the underlyingline mess but you know whatever what are they doing with their towels i think i don't i that may be a mystery that we never solve maybe they are worried that the host will provide white towels which can be problematic. Okay. Elaborate. I mean, if you're like, you know, like having bodily functions that could stain white towels, like every 28 days or something, then you might be like, oh, not into that. Don't want to explain.

If the person has an issue with towels and their skin responds to hypoallergenic materials or whatever and detergents, then I don't think it's rude at all. If that's the case, that's all you need to say, Vicki. And if that's not the case for any of you listeners, but you prefer your own towels for whatever reasons, you can just you could well your truth should be good enough but you can always use the vicky excuse i also feel like it doesn't even have to be discussed unless you're like freaked out of like oh my god when i leave they'll see i never used a towel and think that i never bathed but you know that there are listeners who are screaming at their podcast phones or whatever they're listening on right now screaming at their earbuds saying if i brought towels to my mom slash dad slash guardian's house or my aunt linda's house or whatever to stay when over thanksgiving or whatever they would be so insulted and they would be so angry.

And do you know what? You are so right. There are just people out there who would be insulted by this. And they're wrong. I have a fix. Let me hear it. So take your own towel and do your thing and then take the guest provided towel and wipe the bottom of the bathtub and leave it on the ground. You're talking about pretending?

Yeah. Pretending that you used it? You do like a fake out. Like no one needs to know your towel business. You know what I mean? But if you want to avoid the conversation just you you just do like a little fake out no one needs to know your towel business no it's true it's true where are you keeping your moist towels in this scenario do you put up a towel rack inside your car or something

no you like hanging over the chair in your guest room and then you close the damn door because your stuff is in there and they don't need to be going through your stuff. I can just say this to those people out there who are screaming at their earbuds. If you got people in your life who would be insulted by this, that's their problem. 100% their problem. They have a confusion around what a host's role is. And a host's role is to make the guest comfortable. And if there are things that make the guest comfortable within, I mean, within reason, like you can't go to someone's house and go, you know,

it helps me fall asleep is lighting a bunch of magazines on fire. Like that's not okay. But if, if your guests is open enough to say, to be comfortable, I need my own towels. I hope you're not insulted. Your job is to say, of course, I'm not insulted. I want you to be comfortable. And let me say something as well to these, to these, to these parents out there. If you want your kids to visit you, make it a vacation, you know, like be, be those imaginary Sullivan's Island parental units, you know, be the, be the Sullivan's Island parental units you know be the be the sullivan's island parental units you want to see in the world exactly like if you know if you want if you if you want family to visit you make it fun for them and make them comfortable and they'll come and they'll come if you don't want people to visit you then assign them a bunch of chores. Then they'll stop coming.

Oh, one quick thing from Instagram. Someone wrote in after we closed the docket, but I think it's important. It's a bathroom issue. Where should a plunger be stored in a bathroom that guests use? This is inky cats of Instagram. And Janie, you're raising your hand. You don't have to. It's not not a classroom you're here to school us i feel very strongly that a plunger should be on the floor next to the toilet just visible kind of right in the back area it It should. And you know, there are very decorative plungers out there now. Oh, I've even bought a plunger as a hostess gift.

Like when I stayed like a cool looking plunge, like at my friend's house in New York, I was like, you don't have a plunger in your bathroom. Like I was like freaking out about it. And then when I left, I bought, I was like, I ordered you something. Okay. Okay. Okay. I like that. That's an incredibly intense move, Jan was like, I ordered you something. Okay. Okay. Okay. I like that.

That's an incredibly intense move, Janie. And I love it. I love it. Well, she's my friend from college days. So there was an intimacy there. Put a pin in the plunge. I mean it. Because I just want to say that I 100% agree with you.

And Inky Cats, in a separate letter to me, relayed a longer story that indicated there was a bad backstory to this. Of course there was. Because there was not a plunger readily visible to a guest. When you need one, you really need one. You need it quick. And if you don't know where it is. And you don't want to have to ask for one. Why would you ever put your guest in a position

where they have to ask where you're you know when your guest comes out and they say where do you keep your plunger things are not going well plungers are ugly to have in the bathroom but there are pretty ones out there i i just did a quick search for a pretty plunger and a lot of options came up i would say you know here's what you don't necessarily want to do as a host. Don't say, and this is the plunger in case you need it. Right. You just leave, it's an unspoken, it's like it's there existing to comfort people.

Right. You don't want to be, you don't want to be acknowledging like, I know you're going to wreck this bathroom. So here's the plunger. Right. But on the other hand, you don't want to get a plunger I know you're going to wreck this bathroom. So here's the plunger. But on the other hand, you don't want to get a plunger that is so decorative. That it's invisible.

That they can't find it. It's like you put some googly eyes on it or something. Have a sense of humor, you know, like you can, there's lots of ways to handle this. Have a sense of humor, everybody.

Yeah. This is a big, a big one that came in and a lot of different forms and ways over not only this call for cases, but over the years. And it comes from Marie, right, Jesse? My sister-in-law lives out of state. When we visit her, she gives us her bedroom to sleep in. Are we obligated to give her and her husband our bedroom when she comes to visit us? Neither party has a guest room.

We all set up air mattresses when guests come. So you know my theory, don't sleep in your host's bed. That's not a theory, it's an axiom. But this is not the first time it's come up on the podcast. When I first learned that some people were offering their own beds to their guests, I was aghast. But then a lot of people say, that's what I was taught to do by my family. What do you think about it? I think that it, I don't think she's obligated to do that.

I think that if it's better for her to have, like, it's the person's home and they have all their stuff in there. Like, it seems like it would be more trouble than it's worth because you're like, oh, I forgot my whatever toothbrush and you have to knock on the door and be like, sorry, I just, you know, I need, you know, I don't know. Like, I, I think like maybe it's fine that the one sister does it because maybe for them maybe for them it's like oh my gosh we get to sleep on the floor it's so fun like we're camping out and having movie night or something like that and like you really don't know what the true motivation is i would say that there are like exceptions like if it's someone that has had like recent back surgery

or like an elderly you know you know like a case by case thing but in terms of like because she does this do we have to do this i would say no you get to dictate sort of the terms of like this is what we do i i trust that the listeners who wrote in in the past about this issue were not lying when they said that they were brought up to offer the best bed in the house as opposed to couching their guests on a sofa bed or whatever. To this, I would say, first of all, there are very, very comfortable sofa beds available now. Janie Haddad is sitting on one of them right now. I've slept in that sofa bed many a time, from eight to 39 times over a period of five years. I'd also say that the way you were brought up is wrong. That's the other thing that I would say.

I'm not saying you don't ever do it, but I am saying that, you know, here's the thing about etiquette. We don't, we don't, we try not to just do etiquette do it but i am saying that you know here's the thing about etiquette we don't we don't we try not to just do etiquette stuff but it comes up those are a lot of because etiquette the reason we don't do etiquette on the show often is that this is a show about disputes and etiquette is designed to eliminate disputes discomfort and in. Etiquette is not about determining what is rude. How rude of you to bring towels to my home? You should be messing up my towels. Etiquette is supposed to give a ground rule for different kinds of behaviors that everyone has kind of agreed on so that everyone feels at ease. Everyone feels comfortable. Everyone feels okay.

There is no more important rule, we discussed it already, about everyone feeling comfortable than when it comes to being a host or a guest, and specifically where you sleep. able to speak to what your comfort is and what makes you comfortable. And you should be able to accept when your host or your guest says, I wouldn't be comfortable sleeping in your room. Thank you very much. Because I wouldn't be. It's the most intimate part of someone's home is where they choose to be unconscious solo or with their partner. I would never feel comfortable. I would insist on sleeping on an air mattress. But on the other hand, if you have to make someone feel comfortable because I've got a messed up back or whatever, or maybe your grandma or your grampy grew up with this dumb rule and they're not around for much longer, you don't have to reteach them the rule. If they're going to feel more comfortable following this rule and sleeping in your bed, then you should offer it to them. Make them feel comfortable. You know,

everyone being comfortable doesn't mean no one makes a sacrifice. It just means everyone should be able to speak about what makes them comfortable and everyone should be able to hear what the other person is saying. Agree or disagree? Anybody? I agree. And I also think there has been a lot of technological advances in air mattress technology. Right. And if you feel guilty, put some chocolates on the pillow or something. You know? Yeah. People don't understand that like Janie and Paul are such tremendous hosts that not only

is this mattress and the sofa bed really, really comfortable, but they don't fill it with water. They fill it with gin for me. Your favorite gin. Yeah. It's a gin bed. Yeah. It's a gin bed.

My favorite gin. It's very kind. One quick thing from, I just want to speak to the wisdom of Stuff Stalker on Instagram who wrote in quickly if you have two grown adults coming to stay in your home overnight you better have at least a queen-size bed absolutely true agreed in fact i would dare say you know that my policy is if there are two people sleeping together they should get the largest bed that they can fit in the room and is within their means. But generally speaking, I would say double beds, cut them up and throw them on a fire, all of them in the United States and elsewhere.

No one wants them. They don't work. Too small for two people, too big for one person. It should be twin, queen, king, California king. And then, of course, for certain certain married couples separate villas in Greece you visit each other you've often said with a path connecting them and possibly a fountain

in the middle a reflecting pool between like in the crown or at the White House or whatever in the crown for the White House exactly yeah that kind of space why not you know spread out exactly Joe and Jill share a double. I bet they do.

I bet they love to cuddle, right? They do not. You think they do? They share a double on the Amtrak to Delaware. Amtrak to Delaware, by the way, one of the better hold steady albums. I like that record. Lyrics are transporting. Okay.

Let's take a quick break. When we come back, we will solve more of your house guest challenges. Hello, teachers and faculty. This is Janet Varney. I'm here to remind you that listening to my podcast, The JV Club with Janet Varney, is part of the curriculum for the school year. Learning about the teenage years of such guests as Alison Brie, Vicki Peterson, John Hodgman, and so many more is a valuable and enriching experience, one you have no choice but to embrace because, yes, listening is mandatory. The JV Club with Janet Varney is available every Thursday on Maximum

Fun or wherever you get your podcasts. Thank you. And remember, no running in the halls. If you need a laugh and you're on the go, try S-T-O-P-P-O-D-C-A-S-T-I-R. Were you trying to put the name of the podcast there? Yeah, I'm trying to spell it, but it's tricky

Let me give it a try Okay If you need a laugh and you're on the go Call S-T-O-P-P-P-A-D-I It'll never fit No, it will Let me try If you need a laugh and you're on the go

Try S-T-O-P-P-P-D-C-O-O We are so close Stop podcasting yourself Oh, try S-T-O-P-P-P-D-C-O-O. Ah, we are so close. Stop podcasting yourself. A podcast from MaximumFun.org. If you need a laugh, then you're on the go. Judge Hodgman, we are taking a quick break to discuss what we have going on. Of course, first and foremost, we have labor actions going on.

The Writers Guild of America strike. And we may soon be joined by the Screen Actors Guild slash AFTRA. That's the American Federation of Television and Radio Actors. One terrific member. Look, all of our siblings in labor over there at SAG-AFTRA. I'm a SAG-AFTRA member. They're all wonderful, but there's one that I really like. And that's Janie Haddad Tompkins.

Hello. And Janie, I know you're out there on the picket lines, but you've got some other stuff going. Obviously, we've talked about the Stay at Homekins podcast. Yes, wherever you get your podcast. Second Friday of every month. Yes. That's where you and Paula Tompkins just have a little chit chat after dinner. Yes. There's always a cameo by that,

by that cuckoo clock that lives in your living room. And we have invited our listening community to subscribe to our weekend water sub stack, where we have a lot of conversations about things we talk about and we offer extra content and there's a free tier to subscribe. So it costs you nothing. And if you want more of the bonus content you can always upgrade your subscription at any time that's at the weekend water over on substock we get look people don't listen to the tears everybody you know what i mean doesn't tears don't matter when you're talking about

janie haddad tompkins and paul fpkins, you're getting top quality, entertaining, charming content at every tier, at every level. It's true. So just get over there. Get over there. What's the URL again? It's weekendwater. Well, I don't know the URL.

Should I have looked that up first? No, no, no, no, no, no. So just get over there. Navigate your browser to Substack. Weekendwater is the name of the Substack. It comes to you in your mailbox. It lives on the web. It's a delightful thing that you get whenever Paul and Janie want to send something to you.

It's weekendwater.substack.com. That's weekendwater.substack.com. And I'm here to tell you, I'm not just a pitch man for this substack. I'm also a client. Correct. I'm a proud and very pleased subscriber, uh, to get that weekend water email from you and Paul.

Uh, I'm a subscriber and I love it and everyone else should do it too. And also listen to the podcast and, and then you'll know everything that's happening with Paul and Janie all the time. And that's worth it. But Jesse, you also have a radio show.

The NPR show Bullseye, also available by podcast. This week, we've got Tony Shalhoub and Anna Fabrega, who is the co-creator of my favorite show, Los Espookys. And next week, we have Dapper Dan, the legendary uptown New York tailor, who is totally fascinating. And the great Jon Hamm. All of those coming up on Bullseye with Jesse Thorne. And guess what? Tomorrow I'm going to Ann Margaret's house to interview her. So bye bye, Bertie.

Get out of town. Wow. Zowie. That's that's a heck of a lineup on Bullseye. Check it out. Let's get back into that docket. Welcome back to the Judge John Hodgman podcast with special guest this week, Janie Haddad-Tompkins from the Stay F. Holmkins podcast. Yes.

Did I say every syllable correctly, Janie? Sounds like you did, yes. Thank you. We are solving house guest challenges with my regular host, John Hodgman, and John's regular host, Janie. Here's a case from Jeff. I'm tired of people ignoring my explicit instruction not to bring anything. I understand the social convention, but bringing a big tin of mixed nuts or a tray of peanut butter fudge cookies

when I've told you repeatedly that those things will literally kill me in minutes. Seems rude to me. Please order them to stop. There is a jump in this question. Wait a minute. There is a leap over a chasm. I feel like I just watched Evil Knievel jump the Grand Canyon. Tell me what's the jump, Jessie. There's two issues here.

Yeah, so issue number one is bringing something. Issue number two is bringing something your host has repeatedly warned you is something to which they are deathly allergic. Okay. Yes. Okay. Yes. Now, I have made the error of dedicating too much time to reading Reddit. So I have learned or have been taught that the world is actually full of monster humans who don't believe in their family members' allergies. Oh, wow. And are constantly trying to prove that the person is not actually allergic. It's bananas.

And I'm sorry to all of our listeners who are allergic to hearing the word banana that I said it. Yeah. So I don't know if this is a true thing, but it seems to be true in Jeff's life. And you know that this has got to be family, right? This kind of steamrolling

over another person's reality happens mostly in families, right? Yeah. So obviously Jeff's family member who's doing this or members don't bring nuts to Jeff. But what's going on with Jeff here? What do you mean what's going on with Jeff here? What do you mean? What's going on? You're putting this on Jeff? I would never question Jeff's suggestion that he

is allergic to nuts. Lots of people are definitely allergic to nuts. Of course they are. No question in my mind. There's no reason Jeff would say that were he not. But what is it about Jeff Of course they are. Both that he is allergic to these nuts. I'm presuming it's the nuts since it's mixed nuts and peanut butter cookies. But Jeff is saying he's allergic to these nuts and is thus saying don't bring nuts,

but is also saying don't bring anything. Is Jeff allergic to a bottle of wine, the normal thing to bring? I don't even drink. I know you're supposed to bring a bottle of wine. I have a controversial stance. Okay. Let's hear it. You know how much I love controversial stances because they help us get the clicks. Jesse, how are the clicks? Clicks are doing fair, but could use improvement. Okay. This is a great time. This feels like a succession episode. It feels like a succession episode. That's right. All right.

I. Yeah, sure. Yeah. Yeah, for sure. I'm about to drop a truth bomb on you and everyone listening. All right. I'm getting into my truth bomb bunker. If the host says, don't bring anything, I believe you should show up empty-handed. Wow.

And I know there is this societal- Klaxon, Klaxon, Klaxon, truth bomb detected. Klaxon, truth bomb incoming. There's like some societal- Truth. Acceptance of being on autopilot, of showing up with a thing when it's like, I feel like it has rendered it somewhat meaningless.

Janie, I think there are two situations here that I would like to tease apart. Okay. And get your perspective on. Okay. I'm very clear on your position on don't bring anything what if a host says you needn't bring anything i say don't bring anything yeah i think that you need to take people at their word there There are some exceptions. In dialectical behavioral therapy, there is something that has really affected my perception of the world around me and the

positive, which is simple common sense, but it's easy to forget. You don't know what people are thinking. The only way that you can know what people are thinking is for them to say to you what they're thinking. And everything else that you're you might be guessing right, but you should act upon what they say and not what you think they are thinking. Which is hard in the South. Which is hard in, you know it's hard in the South. Because they never say it directly. It's hard to do it when we're out here roping doggies.

That's right. And you know, yeah, that's definitely, and that's, there are lots of different cultures where you are expected to read minds. Yes. You know what I mean? Yes. And that's hard, right? It is. And it's not fair.

But I think that, so, you know, that's why I would always say, if nothing is said, don't show up empty-handed. If someone is opening their door to you, they're giving you a great gift, it is appropriate to acknowledge that gift with a generous gesture. And there are all ways to go about a gesture like that. That's right. You could show up with a bottle of wine. Sorry, Jeff. And I think that probably that's the smartest, easiest way to go unless they are sober. But, you know, you can bring them something. Flowers. A consumable or a flowers that isn't going to junk up their house forever

and also isn't going to kill them in minutes. Those are two rules of thumb in terms of giving a host slash hostess. A candle, like a nice candle. A nice candle. That's a hostess gift, a cookbook or something. Yeah. Those are all things that won't kill people. But if your host says, please don't bring anything or feel no need to bring anything,

I think you are obliged to take them at their word at that point. You can't because you don't want to reverse gaslight. Right. If someone says, don't bring anything anything and then you do you're like well you didn't really mean that here's a toaster and you might have a deeper relationship with your host where if you're bringing like oh my gosh i saw this book i thought of you that's to me is not even a hostess gift that's like a friend gift yeah exactly and it doesn't have to be presented in that moment either but it could be yeah well i mean that's another issues like so there's an arrive there's there are two opportunities three

actually for for gifting or a generous gesture one is upon arrival one is during the stay you offer to as jesse has done offered to make the most delicious macaroni and cheese i've ever had in my life while wearing the most adorable apron. I remember it to this day. Anything you remember fondly is an act of generosity. The best gift is a nice memory, right? And then of course there's a thank you gift. And here's where I'm going to unpin the plunger. Okay. Because that is the greatest thank you gift I've ever heard of in my life. Obviously you got it all with all of these things. You got to know the person and know what's going to make them happy. Right.

If you don't know what's going to make them happy, maybe you shouldn't be visiting their house. Right. You know, maybe you don't have that kind of relationship and it's important to be thoughtful when you're there. Keep an eye out for stuff that maybe they don't have. Yes.

Or that, you know, like if, if your host or hostess or whatever says oh i gotta remember to get olive oil we're almost out like get a nice olive oil or if you go get them a nice they might be into really good coffee or something and you know of a a good coffee place and send them a bag of coffee or something yeah because if you do that then that that's the sort of thing where they'll realize and you know of a good coffee place and send them a bag of coffee or something. Yeah, because if you do that, then that's the sort of thing where they'll realize, like, you're not just giving them something. You're also saying, hey, I'm thinking about you. I've seen you.

I see you. Yeah, I'm thinking about you and I'm constantly surveilling your every word and I'm probably watching you while you sleep. Thank you. And I've left cameras behind that you'll never find. probably watching you while you sleep thank you and i've left cameras behind that you'll never find yeah by the way i came to this house with a with a bag full of apple air tags and i'm leaving without them so i'm looking for have fun trying to find them uh but i think like that that that plunge gift is like if your friend has a sense of humor and also, you know, that's a great gift.

You noticed that they needed it and you gave it to them. And now they know, Janie, Janie over, she's going to use that plunge. She needs to have a plunger around at all times. But when it comes to those gestures, you know, again, you have to take people at their word in this life. And if they say to you, and I'm sorry if you grow up in a culture where people say, don't bother doing that when they really want you to do it. You know what I mean? Right. That's not acceptable. And you don't wanting to do bring a thing and you're like, oh, should we bring anything? Do you need anything? And they're like, you needn't bring anything.

Like you said, you can get specific and say, well, I there's this really great dessert place. Is that covered or do you have enough wine? I have this really nice red wine here that I'm happy to share. Like kind of have, you know. Yeah. All right. So if they say, well, you needn't, then you can go in for something a little bit more specific. And if they still say no, then drop it. You will know if you're bullying them into bringing a gift.

At some point, the gift becomes about your own pleasing tendencies than the host's convenience. A gesture of generosity should never be about you and it should never be a burden to the person. Or kill the host. Or kill the host. Should never be a burden or certain death. I feel like if Jeff, if someone shows up with a tray of whatever nuts stuff or whatever, he can say, Oh,

thank you so much. Can you leave it on the bottom of the porch stairs? Because they're deadly to me and I'll make sure that I'll get someone to handle those nuts and put them somewhere proper. Thank you so much. Yeah. Here's the thing, Jeff,

just get a decorative shovel, something nice, like Google pretty shovel, have it by the door. And when they come up and try to come into your house with those nuts, just say, oh, that's wonderful. Here, could you take this decorative shovel and go dig a hole in the woods and bury those God or whatever darn nuts? You know what my gift to jeff would be if i stayed at his house what i would send him a sign for his door that said you are now entering

a nut free zone yeah i think that's a good idea i think we should make that and send it to jeff That's our gift. Here is a case from Andrew. A few years ago, a friend let me and my friend Tony stay in their vacation house. Our host stocked the pantry with some snacks and drinks before Tony and I even arrived. When we left, Tony said we should take the food with us because it was purchased for us. I said that would be rude. Should we have taken the extra cans of soda, half-open box of crackers, and other leftovers? Before we get into this, I'm just gonna, can I drop a truth bomb? I'm ready. I'm listening. Please please battening down the truth hatches this isn't the same vein as as janie's it's from the same same uh stockpile of metaphoric weapons

if you are staying at someone's house for a night or two then you should bring a gift upon arrival if for whatever reason and it it's prearranged, don't, you know, like you have been invited to spend five nights and they're your good friends, you don't have to arrive with a gift because you have extra time to offer them other, you know, you want to up your thank you gift maybe or up your generosity during the week.

But if they're like offering you lodging for a week i'm just trying to excuse the fact that i never brought you guys a bottle of wine or anything i feel like i always gave you a gift on the back end i gave you points participation points yes i have a strong stance on this specific thing. Are we getting into a fight? Well, this is about leaving about like leaving the whether you take the snack spot for you. Oh, you actually want to talk about this case. Okay. Yeah, let's do that. I'm sorry. Here's exactly. All right. First of all, I do need to say this. First of all, I made up the name Tony. Andrew didn't name his friend. There were two friends, the friend who was loaning them the second home and then the friend that was staying there. And it was just too complicated. So I gave

one friend the name Tony to make it clear. Tony. Okay. Tony. Here's exactly how this entire thing should have gone down according to my personal etiquette that people can take or leave but you know i feel strongly about it yeah what i think you should have taken everything with you i think it would have been rude to leave the stuff there like even like three unopened cokes or whatever just like take it because then like, if this is a vacation home, first of all, they don't know if you drank all the Cokes while you were there or not. But second of all, I think it looks better if you're leaving the space in a neutral state of readiness for the next people. Now, I'm not saying you should take like the packets of sugar for the coffee or whatever, you know, whatever, like that can stay because I was like condiments or whatever. But like, whatever they bought for you, which was so nice and thoughtful. And I wish I had a friend that would loan me their vacation home and stock the fridge or whatever.

But here's how the gift should have worked on the back end was when they left. First of all, leave it very neutral and ready for the next. Leave it like you found it. Without the snacks. Just like a campsite and a national park. Yeah, but taking the snacks with you. Yeah, but okay. I see what you mean. Right.

And then they should have sent a gift specific to the vacation home. I've done this before. to have sent a gift specific to the vacation home i've done this before you go and you find like soaps or something and you can have like the address like etched on like very like high-end like powder room soaps that you can etch like the the address on the soap they come in like a box that look like a box of candies or whatever but they're like and it's sort of like specific to the vacation home or like tea towels with like the house on it or something like that that's a very generous gesture and i couldn't disagree with you more strongly interesting it was a vacation home though yeah you know what i don't know if you can see this on the teleconference but i got a poster on my wall for a weird Turkish science fiction film called Body.

Okay. B-A-D-I. Got a weird E.T. looking guy staring down a USS Enterprise. I don't know what this thing is. It's psychedelic. It's bizarre. Did I put it up there? No. Ken Plume did. Okay. You know, because I have this office and I have a fold out sofa in it. And it's a wonderful feeling to when you can be generous and offer people places to stay. And Ken, you're welcome to come back. Just please don't redecorate my personal space with this weird poster that you left. I mean, I just came in one day and there it was. And this poster is so outrageous.

And I'll send a pic and we'll put it up on the Instagram and the Judge Sean Hodgman show page as well. But I've really come to love it. I've really come to love this poster. I haven't taken it down. But I don't think you should. I mean, I don't think that you should leave unless they have said or intimated, sure do wish I had some new tea towels.

Then yes. said or intimated, sure do wish I had some new tea towels, then yes. But I don't think you should be redecorating even someone's second home if they're lucky enough to have one. I have a third perspective on this. I love it. We're all on board for don't leave half a box of crackers. 100% don't leave half a box of crackers. Don't leave anything that's open or perishable in someone's vacation home because you don't know when it will next be used. Do restock the larder. Interesting. were specific gifts for Andrew because Andrew specifically wants to drink a particular brand of soda or, you know, Andrew loves Malbec. And so there was a bottle of Malbec there. I think more likely this is a vacation home that has a certain amount of shelf-stable food that is kept in it.

And that is restocked by people who leave. I don't mean that there is a full home completely with eggs in the fridge and milk delivery every day or whatever. But I know like I have a cabin in the mountains and I keep dried pasta there. Oh, can Janie borrow it? I know she's looking for one. Janie, you and Paul are welcome to use my cabin in the Southern Sierras. I appreciate it.

It's a long drive and there's been a lot of catastrophic weather lately. I was looking for like a beach situation, so I might hold up. We have a giant sequoia, the beach of trees. And I think it is possible that- Technically beach, a beach tree is the beach of trees though. Yeah. I think it is possible that the neutral state of this house is an empty larder.

That is very possible, Janie. And I agree with your principle of returning it to neutral. However, I would suggest that it's very possible, especially in a vacation home, that the neutral state of this house is there's a couple boxes of dried pasta, some cans of soda and beer, some liquor in the liquor cabinet. And, you know, of course, you're, you know, there's a little thing of olive oil and salt and pepper and so on and so forth. situations, um, that you are not just leaving it neutral, but I would also suggest think about leaving something completely shelf stable behind that is nice, like a nice bottle of liquor or a nice bottle of wine. I would say it's appropriate to leave literally anything that you purchased at the ladies auxiliary of literally anything. All right, let me see if I can get to a grand unifying theory that we can all get to unanimity on here

with regard to this half a box of crackers. Here's what you take with you. Half a box of crackers. Any unfinished package of chips or food or whatever. You don't want to be leaving that around to attract pests. Butter and eggs, leave it in the fridge. You're not going to be bringing four eggs in a Ziploc baggie for your road trip. They just stick around.

That's neutral. Eggs and butter in the fridge is neutral. Half a box of crackers, non-neutral. Take with you anything that was left in a gift basket for you. All that stuff is yours. I'm taking the chips even if they're unopened because on my drive home. If they're in that gift basket or in a welcome display of any kind, that's your stuff. But if you hit that pantry, you got to restock the pantry.

No one is leaving a can of Amy's split pea soup as a welcome gift for you that's just something they have in their cupboard return to neutral means replacing that amy's split pea soup and by the way amy's i love your split pea soup sponsor judge john hodgman return it to neutral and now here's the here's something before we move on to the end of this program. We have one more case. This one's from Hannah in Boston. When I have guests, my cats always sleep with them and not with me. I request the judge issue an injunction against my cats to prevent them from snuggling with my guests because I miss my cats.

Wow. Hannah, bring your cats over to the speaker. Bring your cats over to the speaker. You know what would be really cute is to put little AirPods into the cat's ears. That would be good too, right? One in each ear? So cute. Yeah.

And Valerie, do you have your cat with you? each year so cute yeah and valerie you have your cat with you he is currently bouncing off the walls like a god or whatever darn loony tune i was looking at your zoom and i thought i taught a pretty chat i'm sorry that i'm missing that i'm sorry you're missing it but please relay this message to big b and hannah i don't know the names of your cats so janie what's a good what's a good name for one of these cats um Scratchy Scratchy and uh Jesse what do you got oh gonna go with uh well it can't be Hambone that's a dog name I'm gonna say Furball Furball Scratchy Bigby listen to me sleep with the ones what feed you right yeah exactly I know you're not gonna listen to me cats because you probably don't One's what feeds you. Right?

Exactly. I know you're not going to listen to me, cats, because you probably don't understand English. And probably those AirPods fell out of your little ears a long time ago. But yes, you are right to be insulted by your cats sleeping with your guest, Hannah. And they're probably doing it on purpose. All right, that's all I got to say about houseguesting. Janie, thank you so much for joining us on the Judge John Hodgman podcast. Thank you for having me. I enjoyed it. Thank you so much.

Our docket is clear. Judge John Hodgman was created by Jesse Thorne and John Hodgman. Our producer is Valerie Moffitt. We are on Instagram at Judge John Hodgman. Follow us there and join us on the Maximum Fund subreddit at maximumfund.reddit.com. Judge Hodgman, we got so many incredible house guest disputes. Folks who went to maximumfund.org slash JJHO, folks who tweeted at us, folks who shared them on Instagram, folks who shared them on instagram folks who shared them on facebook we have a new topic yeah so one thing that's happening very swiftly is our our docket involving card game disputes is filling up very quickly seats at the poker table are filling up very quickly so if you've got a dispute about uh, hearts, poker, whist, I know there's some bridge disputes out there. Magic the Gathering is especially encouraged.

And the more complicated and granular your dispute is, the better. Send that in to MaximumFun.org slash JJHO. And also, what about weddings? There's got to be a lot of disputes surrounding weddings and wedding etiquette. If there's one thing I've learned while reading Reddit, it's that stuff is popping off all the time at weddings. People are always doing the wrong thing at weddings and getting mad. Action-packed weddings. Action-packed weddings. Pack them all in to MaximumFun.org slash JJHO. Pack them all in to MaximumFun.org slash JJHO. And of course, no matter what the subject of your dispute, please send it in to us.

MaximumFun.org slash JJHO. This is serious business, John. This show lives and dies by your disputes. So if you're out there in the audience listening to this, I think you probably have a dispute with somebody that you could submit at MaximumFun.org slash JJHO. If you're worried it's not big enough or it's not right, don't worry. We'll worry about that. Just send it to us at MaximumFun.org slash JJHO. We'll make it work so you don't have to.

We'll talk to you next time on the Judge John Hodgman podcast. MaximumFun.org. Comedy and culture. Artist owned. on the Judge John Hodgman Podcast.