Judge John Hodgman - Trivial Peer Suit

Episode Date: April 17, 2013

Steve says he's been the acting team captain of his local trivia team, and wants to make it official! His teammate Claire begs to differ. Can the Judge resolve this trivial dispute?

Welcome to the Judge John Hodgman podcast. I'm bailiff Jesse Thorne. This week, the trivial peer suit. Steve brings the case to court. He says he served as de facto leader of a trivia team for years now, and he wants to make it official. His teammate Claire says that the team thrives under unofficial leadership. Who's right? Who's wrong? Only one man can decide. Please rise as Judge John Hodgman enters the courtroom. Whoa, whoa, whoa, Bailiff Jesse, I don't need you to play that violin. I was just trying to play the banjo.

I'm so sorry about that. Put down that fiddle and swear him in. Please rise and raise your right hands. Do you swear to tell the truth, the whole truth, and nothing but the truth, so help you God or whatever? I do. Yes, sir. Do you swear to abide by Judge John Hodgman's ruling, despite the fact that as the author of three books of all known knowledge, he's hereby disqualified from all further trivia contests for the history of

time? I do. Very well, Judge Hodgman. You may be seated. Steve, Claire, welcome to the court of Judge John Hodgman. For an immediate summary judgment in your favor, can you name the piece of culture that I was referencing as I played the banjo walking into the courtroom? Can you name that song or where it comes from? Best Guest Deliverance. Incorrect. Claire? I was going to say Bonanza.

Even less correct. that's I knew that I'm surprised neither of you guessed car talk because that was gonna be my that was my fake out position but as you may know the the theme to car talk is the banjo tune doggy mountain breakdown which itself is a play on words on the very famous Earl Scruggs tune Foggy Mountain Breakdown, which was just played there by Earl Scruggs himself, performed from a 1965 Grand Ole Opry performance. This song was also used as the main song in the soundtrack to a movie. What movie was it?

Quiz show. Incorrect. Claire? Hmm. Foggy Mountain Breakdown. Yeah. Yeah, no, you got me. I'm afraid that's time.

That's time. Your trivia team is terrible. We're not claiming to be good here. We're just claiming to have a leadership dispute. The film was, as I'm sure many people are yelling at their internet connections right now, Bonnie and Clyde, starring Warren Beatty and Faye Dunaway. And why do I know that? That's my next trivia question, which I know you don't know the answer to. Because that was the trivial pursuit question that I received in 1984 while playing against the Rosenmeier family, our next door neighbors, a team composed mostly of grown-ups. I was 13 years old. I was faced with that question. I did not know the answer.

I made an insane, not Hail Mary pass, because I will not use a sports metaphor, in this case it's not appropriate, but an educated guess and said Bonnie and Clyde and won the game. It is probably one of the most exciting moments in my life. game. It is probably one of the most exciting moments of my life.

And I remember the scene very distinctly now. I got so excited the dog got scared. Now. You two claim to be on a trivia competitive trivia team.

Where does this team play? This team plays at a veterans club on Main Street in Vancouver. Oh, I see. And are either of you veterans of the Canadian Armed Forces? No, my grandfather is, and I am a member of the club. Oh, you got to sneak into the club, even though you dodged... Membership is wide open.

Even though you dodged the draft by staying right there in Canada? Yes. And the trivia night is open to all. Sometimes. Whoa, when is it not? When the manager decides to have a membership drive at the door.

Oh, I see. And then only members are allowed. You have to sign up in order to come in. How much does membership cost? $35 a year. Yeah, and that's Canadian, right? Yes. Seems worth it to me. So here at the Canadian Club of

Army, Navy, Air Force and Pizza, you contest trivia, and the dispute between you two is who is the team captain. Is that correct? Basically, yeah. Yes. The dispute is whether or not we need a captain,

and then Steve has proclaimed himself as team captain, which I definitely dispute. Okay. Tell me, Claire, in your words, what happened when Steve declared himself team captain? A rare Canadian power grab. Well, most of us just rolled our eyes and thought, oh, there goes Steve again. Like, here he's making some great claim to something. Why did it even come up?

It's been happening for a while now. So I feel like it probably came up with a moment of indecisiveness or a moment where the group could not come up with the same answer for a question. And Steve, in his typical megalomaniac way, said, well, as team captain, I'm deciding it's going to be this and shouted out the right answer, to which a number of us contested, A, the fact that we didn't decide things together,

and B, the fact that he decided himself team captain. So we all kind of rolled our eyes and thought, oh, there goes Steve, he's making something up again and thought he would forget about it. But in also typical Steve fashion, something from years ago just keeps getting brought up again and again. And he keeps declaring himself team captain and keeps up this pretense of pretension, basically. Typical Steve. Typical Steve. Steve, when did this originally happen? Probably about two years ago,

two and a half years ago-ish. What was the question and what was the answer? I cannot remember either. Boy, oh boy. Why did you do this? Was there an established team captain before this? There was not an established team captain. We have never had

any type of established team captain as far as everybody can agree on. Steve? Typical Steve. Just calm down for a second. I'm going to ask a couple more questions in quick succession. And I look forward to your snappy answers.

How many people are on your team, more or less? Four to twelve. Oh, that's a rather big variation. Yes. How many teams? Go ahead. I'll allow it. I was just saying it's not like a bowling team where we all show up with matching shirts on

and the same four people show up every day. No one was accusing you of being part of a bowling team. I understand you don't have matching outfits. Believe me, we pre-vetted that. If I learned that you were wearing matching outfits to your trivia night, you would not be on my podcast. Now, how many teams routinely compete at the club? Around about a dozen, plus or minus.

And typical size of those teams? Ranged from a single person to a table of... Yes. A single person? Yes. And obviously a single person is his own team captain by default. Do other teams have team captains? Not that I know of. No. So in this invented position that you created for your dictatorship, where you self-appointed yourself Commodore, a meaningless title, what roles do you define team captain as fulfilling? At our table, we'll often have a bunch of different people,

a bunch of different people at different times, different friends. There will probably be a core group of maybe three to six people that show up quite regularly. I'll probably be one of those people. And what happens is there's a lot of shouting. There's a lot of drinking. There's a lot of right and wrong answers and arguments being thrown across the table sure punches thrown punches thrown sabers drawn i've been to i've been to trivia night before i know what goes on yeah and so what we've sort of been lacking and what has sort of caused a fair bit of conflict amongst friends

is this lack of somebody um well no not a lack of somebody um because there's you know one or two of us that take a leadership role in discussing the questions in determining who may or may not have the right answer who's humming and hawing, who's shouting. First of all, the statement is hemming and hawing, not humming and hawing. I don't know what you say in Canada. They hum. We hem. And so the leadership role as I see it is much like a leadership role on a game show like Family Feud,

where everybody gets to say their answer and one person within some type of reasonable certainty can say, your answer sounds the best or you guys are all full of it and we need something else. All right, Claire, is your team a winning team or a losing team? We are a winning team. We usually win money each week. How much money? It's not a lot of money. Usually for winning a round, you make under $20 and then there's prizes for second and third place. The money is determined depending on

what the 50-50 draw gets, how much money goes in the 50-50 draw. So it's in flux every week, how much money. A lot of rules to canadian trivia it's canadian style and you primarily play uh indoors right and on turf or on yeah on the carpeted bar turf we play uh the main difference as i understand it is that the trivia hall is narrower and longer and you only get three chances and not four our balls are bigger now watch it there captains that's typical steve right there isn't it this is actually it is typical steve this is it's very much uh jesse's gonna go with the football i will have order i will have order typical steve be quiet i'm speaking to Claire now.

Thank you. If we're going to go with the winning metaphor, I would say we are winning. A big part of why we do this is it's a social activity for us. It's our cheers. You know, we show up. We know our friends are going to be there every week. It's going to be a group of people that we enjoy their company and we all enjoy trivia. We have a shared love of the curious and the overlooked and the witty. We like to make jokes and have fun and win money that we throw a big party with twice a year.

If you are suggesting that your team is somehow unique in the world of pub trivia, as in you guys trivia getting together and answer questions yeah i i got it i understand what what you're going there for how is typical steve's power grab ruining it for everyone well it's just taking away from this what i'm hearing from him is he wants to make the answering of questions uh efficient. I see no reason to depose him from his position unless you can make a case that it is somehow ruining it for everyone.

So I would like you to complete this sentence. Steve is ruining it for everyone because he thinks he knows better than everyone else. Okay. That's not a very practical answer. How often do you go to trivia?

I'm there, I would say, twice a month. It depends on my work schedule. Is that 50% attendance, would you say? 50, yeah, 40 to 50% attendance. Steve, how often do you go to trivia? What percentage attendance? 90. Is that accurate? Over what time

span is this? There were a number of months. That's four years. Claire, you quibble. Don't quibble. Is Steve there more often than you are? Steve would probably be there more often. Now he lives closer to trivia so he's there more often. He, for a spell, was living further trivia, so he wasn't there as frequently.

Look, I understand that Steve is a know-it-all, and I understand that Steve typically wants to talk and grab power and lord it over everyone else. The fact that he thinks he knows better than everyone else, that is an annoying trait. But what I need to hear from you, Claire, or else I'm going to throw this thing out of court right away is how has the change official or unofficial from the the ungovernable mob that you used to be to the lockstep dictatorship that Steve has put in negatively changed your experience of

trivia? Do you win less often? Do you have less fun? In what ways do you have less fun? First question, do you win less often? I would say yes, yes. And I think the thing is, is this idea that Steve is captain and he's taking control of things is a fallacy because he isn't taking control of things. And there is what I would call there's still leadership that is happening. And it but it is not Steve that has the leadership to go further on your football reference. In the NFL, the team captains are appointed weekly and it's based on performance the week before. We also have a similar situation in trivia where our status differential is not how well you've done the week before, but it is how well you do during

the night. So if you've gotten answers right that night, you get a green light. We know to trust what you've said. But if you haven't you haven't gotten any questions, right, or, you know, or you've, you've gone rogue, which is our term for if you, you know, shout out the wrong answer, then we're not going to follow behind you. So we do we follow, we, we listen, we listen, our leadership is in flux. And it is reliant on the fact that we are all somewhat intelligent people within this group. But it's not just one person that wears the mantle. And I think that works best for our team. Clearly, I made a mistake by not reviewing the evidence before going to this case.

Did one of you send the 50,000 page manual explaining the rules to Canadian Rules Trivia? I don't understand any of what you just said. So let's go to the evidence. Who sent in some evidence? Steve, you sent in some evidence? I sent in a photo and Julie asked for some notes.

And the photo is, I have it here, I see it as a mug that says Trivia Master on it. Is that all the evidence that you're submitting? That was given to me from one of the team members. And under the rules of Canadian Rules Trivia, the ritual bequeathing of a mug is the same thing as being given an official title. Is that correct? Yes.

I see. What was in the mug? Some Molson's Golden? It was either a White Russian or a Jager Bomb. This mug, does this mug have actual ritual significance, or was this just a nice gesture? It was a very lovely gift. All right. Then I throw this mug out of court, and I hope it smashes.

Claire has claimed that you are winning less often since this power grab. Is that true or false? Answer with one word, please. True. How can you explain that? There are constantly different teams at Trivia, and Trivia is constantly in flux. The questions, the caliber of the questions, the style of the games.

Oh, no, no, believe me, I understand. Some days you play on the ceiling. Some days there's a triple round robin. Some days there's a series of mystery questions. Exactly. No, I understand. It's a very complicated game. You are suggesting that the failure of your organization is due to outside influences beyond your control.

Is that correct? Yes. All right. How many people, since the team varies while widely in size from as, as few as four to as many as a thousand or what have you, that's not out of the question. Yeah.

Have you ever, have you put it to a vote, this concept of a team captain? No, it kind of gets shut down even when it comes to that point. By you? Does it get shut down by you? The room breaks down.

The table breaks down. There's quite a lot of shouting and strife. Right. Is it part of Canadian trivia to smash the table? It is part of Canadian trivia to get up and walk away at the slightest. So if this breaks down in strife, that means there are strong supporters in favor of team captaincy and there are strong opposers?

I would say it breaks down in strife more because most people just want Steve to be quiet about it, just to let it rest. We don't need to go any further with it. Just let it be. Let it be. Would you say? Okay, Steve, go ahead. I'm just saying, I mean, part of the trivia team is its makeup. I'm just saying, I mean, part of the trivia team is its makeup.

Our trivia team is made up of, I mean, I think four people who own their own business and, you know, half a dozen people who have fine arts degrees and none of these people really enjoy being told what to do. So it's a table of people who are used to leading and pushing as well as a table of people who are used to throwing up their hands and going their own way. And so what I hope to do in this is to create an atmosphere where everybody can get along,

everybody can have fun. And Claire mentioned the green light system. That was a system I brought into the group. What is the green light system? If somebody's having a really on day, we get like, you know, questions and sheets and you get to do it in a group and you get to do it far away. And if somebody is just nailing it, you know, they're green light, you know, just give them the go ahead. They're just, you know, having that good day. So whatever they want, just let them jump up and say. It isn't a physical green light. You're saying the team comes to a mutual decision

to let someone who's on a hot streak just roll with it. Is that correct? Yes, absolutely. Boy, look, I might get in trouble for saying this, but Canadian rules trivia, especially as you guys play it, I get in trouble for saying this, but Canadian rules trivia, especially as you guys play it, has more lingo and, and, uh, and acronyms and, and, uh, it is more lingo than Scientology. What they're just, they're just bits that have gone on too long is what they are. They're just, we're just, there are our own inside jokes and that's it. And, uh, and it's, uh, and that's it. And we love it. Obviously, every group has their own inside

jokes and their own things that they like. You love to hate them. So Claire, if I were to find in your favor, what would you want me to order? I don't think you can teach humility, but I would like Steve to realize that our group dynamics actually do, in their own twisted way, work really well and support each other. And we don't necessarily need a captain. And if we did, it wouldn't and shouldn't be him. It would be something that we would come to on our asset group. But I don't think we need a captain. I mean, I think think you prefer anarchy

it's not anarchy we have a commonality of purpose and we have that's what we have there is sort of a a mother and father no that's not the right term there there's like a mom and pop of the group i'll just i'll look it up in the glossary go on Well, there's a mom and pop in the group. There's a couple that are, they kind of have a, they're the ones who, between them, we go to for organizing parties. We often have parties at their house.

I understand, because every Canadian rules trivia team has a mother, a father, a squeegee man, a left back, a forward back, a running center, a green light, and an uncle,

and the person who talks over the judge of this court. Claire, I've heard enough. Thank you very much. Steve? Yes. What would you like me to order, should I find in your favor? I would like some type of recognition of my services to date. I would like some type of recognition of my services to date. I would like to maintain these services till the end of the year.

We have a yearly year-end Christmas party. I would like at that Christmas party for us to have general elections wide open for all of the positions. Our trivia team has positions. We have a treasurer. We have a secretary. We have a secretary? We don't have a secretary. We have somebody who holds onto the money and somebody else who writes down what that sum of money is.

Are these official elected positions? Claire seems to know nothing about them. No, we just tell people that that's what they're doing. You seem pretty intent upon making a fun night of trivia into a horrible bureaucratic nightmare. Exactly! Claire, I am speaking now. We've got dozens of

dollars we have to account for at the end of the year. And we have to fund our party, spring party, and our winter party and money in change in pockets tends to go missing one person's money lunch or get spent on lunch and then one person accounts for that what sort of honor are you looking for? Like a giant Stalin-esque bust in the town square? That would be fantastic. He does like white Russians.

All right. I think I've heard everything I need to in order to make my decision. I'm going into my traditional Canadian trivia oval long grass practice court, and I shall make my decision when I return. Please rise as Judge John Hodgman exits the courtroom. Claire, how are you feeling about your chances right now? Oh, you know, I feel all right. Yes, I feel pretty good.

I feel like I represented what our team was and what Steve is. You certainly represented yourself vociferously, particularly when the judge was talking. Well, you can, I feel like we're at trivia night. How does it feel? How does it feel? This is exactly, but this is, this is, this is, this is what, this is what Steve has to deal with.

So you can understand. Well, it's, it's great. I mean, it feels like Judge Hodgman is welcome to our trivia night anytime so he can put up with me and deal with the rest of us who behave this way. At any time he's in Vancouver, we'd love to have him.

Steve, is the reason that your team needs a leader because everyone just talks the whole time? Something like that, yes. And you just want to be King Talk? I would love to be King Talk. If I could get that title, that would be fantastic at the end of the day. Yeah, I bet you would.

What do you think about your chances, Steve? I think it's 50-50. It's up in the air right now. We'll see. We'll be back in just a moment with Judge John Hodgman's verdict. You're listening to Judge John Hodgman. I'm bailiff Jesse Thorne. Of course, the Judge John Hodgman podcast always brought to you by you, the members of MaximumFun.org. Thanks to everybody who's gone to MaximumFun.org slash join

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Get up to 60% off at babbel.com slash Hodgman, spelled B-A-B-B-E-L dot com slash Hodgman. Rules and restrictions apply. Please rise as Judge John Hodgman reenters the courtroom. Well, I've been leafing through the ring binder that contains all the rules and regulations to your bizarre sport. And I am quite confused. And therefore, I appreciate the necessity or perhaps the argument for necessity of some measure of leadership in the game of Canadian rules trivia. It is obvious that the two of you cannot stop talking to each other, whether another person is talking or not, and I can see why there might be some desire for order at the table itself, particularly, Claire, when you

mentioned that Steve announced out of nowhere that he was now team captain and then proceeded to yell out the answer without consent from the team. That is not productive anarchy. I think that that is obviously the description of chaos. Steve, this may sound as though I am preparing to side with you. I must stress very strongly, you are a monster. with you, I must stress very strongly, you are a monster. It is one thing to say, I believe that our team...

Whoa! This is not the time to deploy the Canadian Tribune Wolverine. That's later in the third round. Shut your growl hole, Steve. It is one thing to suggest that Trivia Night needs a certain measure of order. It is another thing to suggest

that you are the person who can bring the order to seize power without a fair and free election. And then to order or to request this court to order you honors and gold clusters for the work that you have done without anyone's request to date so far. Work, by the way, that has not proven any positive result for your team. Positive's relative. No, it is not, sir. I take trivia... Sir, I will have order. I take trivia contests

very seriously, where they're played by traditional North American rules, Canadian rules, New England rules, Martha's Vineyard sign language rules, all of the various rules and regulations. In every case, trivia is a competitive game. And we have people at trivia who go and they try to make it competitive and they punch walls.

Or I will throw you out of this courtroom and try you in absentia like the dictator that you are. So, you may find it surprising, Steve, that I find in your favor insofar as I do think that this team should consider whether or not some reasonable measure of leadership and procedure should be put forward to make the team free of conflict and effective at the game of Canadian-style trivia. But, and I do so order that you have at the coming, well, it cannot be Christmas because that is too far from now. You must call an emergency meeting via in-person or people can vote through email, presuming that you all have computers,

to vote on this subject. Should there be a team captain? And who should that team captain be? You may nominate yourself, so long as you have a second to nominate you, Steve. Others may be nominated, but only if the team, and that includes everyone who has ever played on the team, has a vote and a majority vote that there should be a team captain.

Then you may begin the nomination process for team captains. No honors are accorded to you, sir, for taking power away. You live in a democratic country. You play trivia in a place where Canadians fought for your freedom. I will not honor dictatorship of any kind. But I do not think that this mushy crosstalk can stand. There are frankly too many rules in Canadian-style trivia to tolerate this kind of disorganization. This is the sound of a gavel. Judge John Hodgman rules that is all. Please rise as Judge John Hodgman exits the courtroom.

Steve, have you got what it takes to be the leader of this trivia group, not by fiat, but rather by democratic election? I may start my own trivia team. This is just you? Just me. You'll definitely be King Talk. Claire, how are you feeling? I'm feeling great right now.

I get to tell Steve to shut his growl hole from here on out. I feel pretty happy about that. I get to tell Steve to shut his growl hole from here on out. I feel pretty happy about that. I did not order that. No, I'm just going to do it, though. The fact that he's willing to go off and be a loner like that one other weirdo who plays Canadian trivia with you, that is, I think, quite telling.

He's actually done it. He's done it before. He's done it before. He's done it before. And that other person by himself cleans up. Yeah, well, I think you should put yourself in competition with him.

I think you should quit this team and start your own where you can be king of your own little fiefdom. Where you can give yourself, you can design your own uniform. You can walk in there in a mock Canadian Air Force uniform with epaulettes and gold clusters and everything else and call yourself...

Denim head to toe. Don't worry, Renly. Lots of others will follow you in your claim to the throne. Oh, nerd bait. I wish I could say it was a pleasure talking to you both. And I can because it was. But watch yourselves, Canadians. I wish I could say it was a pleasure talking to you both, and I can, because it was. But watch yourselves, Canadians.

Just because this is a fake court in another country does not mean that my wrath does not reach Vancouver side. Thank you very much, Judge. Thank you, Judge. Sorry I kept interrupting. What was that, Claire? That was my Canadian apology. Can I please? Thank you for coming on this show. Sorry, what was that? Sorry, what? Did you want to say something? Shut your brow hole.

Hang up on them. Hang up on them now. Hello, teachers and faculty. This is Janet Varney. I'm here to remind you that listening to my podcast, The JV Club with Janet Varney, is part of the curriculum for the school year. Learning about the teenage years of such guests as Alison Brie, Vicki Peterson, John Hodgman, and so many more is a valuable and enriching experience. One you have no choice but to embrace because yes, listening is mandatory. The JV Club with Janet Varney is available every Thursday on Maximum Fun or wherever you get your

podcasts. Thank you. And remember, no running in the halls. Thank you. And remember, you're on the go, call S-T-O-P-P-P-A-D-I. It'll never fit. No, it will. Let me try. If you need a laugh and you're on the go, try S-T-O-P-P-P-D-C-O-O. Ah! We are so close.

Stop podcasting yourself. A podcast from MaximumFun.org. If you need a laugh and you're on the go. Hang on, I'm just trying to assemble my answer nexus on the trivia abacus, and then I've got to convert all of the answers into Canadian, English, and French. So give me a moment and I'll be right with you. Judge Hodgman, we don't have time for Canadian rules trivia right now. We have to clear the docket. Okay.

The answer was Foggy Mountain Breakdown again. Le Foggy Mountain Breakdown. Le Montagne de Fog qui... Bill writes, I compete in a weekly team trivia contest hosted by my friend Chris at a local restaurant. We submit an argument about a recent trivia question to you. The question.

Name, within two, the number of stars on the Paramount Pictures logo. Normally I would just guess, but I was in luck. The restaurant has a movie and a pizza theme and offers shelves of DVD rentals. I found a DVD with the Paramount logo and counted the stars. There are 22. Chris didn't count my answer as correct, citing the rule against using outside sources of information. My team was awarded no points and finished in third place. Now, I did not provide the decorations and movie displays.

The restaurant did. My argument is that what Chris calls cheating is actually being resourceful. The point of trivia is not simply rote memorization. That is one kind of trivia question, but not always. But you can't have only rote memorization questions. It's using context and logic in addition to knowledge to suss out the answer. Your surroundings are included in that context. Because Chris... No, they're not. Because Chris unduly docked us points, he cost my team some bar money,

which we would have undoubtedly spent on pizza and beer. Therefore, I'm seeking damages in the form of one pizza and beer dinner to be provided by Chris within six weeks of the court's decision. I do not find in your favor. It is true that the best trivia questions are those, or I should say there should be a combination of trivia questions, and I've said this before. Some are just the kind that you either know them or you don't, and then there are the kinds when you should be able to make an educated guess, much like a young prodigal John Hodgman, age 13, guest Bonnie and Clyde featured the music Foggy Mountain Breakdown.

But using context and logic to solve a trivia question does not equate to cheating. You had a rule. The rule was no outside information. You took outside information and used it in order to answer your question look i play scrabble right that's a popular board game you know that jesse sure from time from time to time your opponent gets careless and accidentally moves her uh tile rack in a way that you could see what she has. And that is a moment where you rely on your own personal ethics

and you avert your eyes and you say, do you know what? You should move your rack, your tile rack there. You're playing poker, you accidentally see someone's card, you draw attention to it. If you were asked how many stars are in the Paramount logo and you know the Paramount logo is right over there, don't look at it because that's cheating. You're a cheater. I don't like you. I'm angry at all you trivia people today. It's the only reasonable response. Of course. Naomi writes, my father's a reasonable man in most aspects. However, he's under the impression that he's Southern. He was born in New York, but moved to a suburb of Atlanta shortly after his first birthday. He didn't shoot a gun in

Georgia, and his family did not own a pickup truck. He does not have an accent. He currently likes country music, but I don't think he enjoyed it in his youth. I believe he listens to it to spite me. He did not attend university in Georgia or in the South. Judge John Hodgman, please settle this once and for all. Is my father Southern? Well, I think that he has a lot more claim to say so than you do, because you are trying to define his Southerness by some cliches, such as shooting a gun in Georgia, giving you automatic southern bona fides. If he moved to Atlanta and grew up in Atlanta, I would certainly, no one would deny him the right to say that he is an Atlantan, which is to say that he can breathe underwater. Atlanta itself, in terms of its southerness, is somewhat debatable because it's an extremely cosmopolitan city, certainly within the South and throughout the world. So there are a lot of people who are there who are not part and parcel to a tradition of southerness, such as you might define it.

But I think, you know, I don't see anything there to absolutely disqualify him from claiming that he is from the American South, grew up in the American South, and is therefore Southern. That's all we got on the docket this week. How about we take a second and thank everyone who gave us a donation in the Max Fund Drive. You helped pay for the production of this show, and we really, really appreciate it. Thank you so much, everybody. Yes, thank you very much. I agree. I was very harsh in this episode, but my feelings are mitigated by my fondness for you, the donors, and all of the listeners out there. Thank you. Thanks to Frank McGough for suggesting this week's case name. If you want to suggest a case name and maybe hear your name on a Judge John Hodgman podcast, like us on Facebook. That's at facebook.com and search for Judge John Hodgman,

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