Judging Freedom - 9/11 Remembered - What We've Never Been Told w/Ray McGovern

Episode Date: September 11, 2023

9/11 Remembered - What We've Never Been Told w/Ray McGovernSee Privacy Policy at https://art19.com/privacy and California Privacy Notice at https://art19.com/privacy#do-not-sell-my-info.

You Hi, everyone. Judge Andrew Napolitano here for Judging Freedom. year for judging freedom. Today is Monday, September 11th, 2023, 22 years to the day after the worst attack on American soil, the cause of which still disputed and never resolved, and for the perpetration of which no one has been tried criminally or even civilly. 22 years ago today, the government allowed this horrific event that slaughtered 3,000 people to happen, used it as an excuse to shut down our civil liberties. The civil liberties are still shut down. The laws enacted supposedly to weed out those among us who caused this are still on the books. Didn't weed out anybody in the government.

No one in the United States mainland or at Guantanamo Bay has been prosecuted for 9-11. Ray McGovern joins us now. Where were you on 9-11? Were you in the CIA in that era, Ray? No, I had already retired, but I was very much in Washington watching all these events and keeping track of what happened and what happened particularly in the aftermath. Give us a first big picture, your handle on this. Do you think elements of the United States government either knew about this in advance or intentionally looked the other way or engaged in the most massive cover-up since the bombing of Pearl Harbor? Judge, we ought to investigate that.

It hasn't been investigated, okay? The question as to whether it was malfeasance or misfeasance of a grand scale is still up in the air. What is clear is that there was the mother of all coverups, okay, in which Congress, in which everyone participated to hide the fact that there was plenty of information out there to indicate what was going to happen, and it was suppressed. Suppressed by whom?

By the CIA? By NSA? By FBI? Now, you can call me a conspiracy theorist if you like, but those are the facts, and they never have been understood or explained. I'll give you just one little for instance, as we used to say in the Bronx, okay? For instance, the Bush-Cheney regime fought tooth and nail against any investigation of this. When finally Congress decided, well, you know, we're looking really silly if we don't investigate. There was a joint committee set up. And the joint committee did some really interesting work during 2002. And when they came up to their first and only public hearing, the head of that investigating committee, a former Pentagon inspector general, her name was

Eleanor Hill, said, ladies and gentlemen, before we begin, I have to tell you that I had a communication last night from the White House, and it said that we are forbidden to put into our report any information with respect to what the President of the United States was told. Wow, was told in appointed a 9-11 commission, largely because the victim's wives insisted on it. And, you know, if you look at that 9-11 commission, no offense, Judge, the only common thing that they had were very well-heeled tests and the fact that every one of them was a lawyer. Half of them were politicians. Also, half of them were professors or something else. They all had to do with the law, and they didn't represent, by no means did they represent, the people who were killed on 9-11,

including a first cousin of my wife. I'm from New York. Permit me to feel pretty angry about all this. Do you think that elements of the American government knew this was coming before it came? Yes. Other than the suppression of civil liberties, which began immediately, we all know the Patriot Act had been drafted before 9-11. Other than wanting to suppress civil liberties and wanting to extend American hegemony deeper into the Middle East, who could have had the cold heartedness as to allow this mass murder to occur for some political reason? Well, the same fellow who left the torture, who justified torture, his name was Dick Cheney, and he was running things. Now, I'll give you another for instance. My friends operating at a very high level at NSA at the time knew that the Al-Qaeda central, so to speak, was based in Yemen.

They had it all mapped out. They had the numbers, okay? Now, you can't tell me that they didn't know that Al-Qaeda was planning all this. I asked one of my NSA colleagues, retired now, do you think that Michael Hayden knew? And he said, I know Michael Hayden knew. Michael Hayden is now retired General Hayden, four-star Air Force general, who at one point ran the CIA, but in this era ran the NSA. Correct, Judge. Okay. Now, the answer was, and this is a little speculative, but not by much. Hayden knew, he had to know. This business about

they couldn't contact or figure out where al-Qaeda was speaking, you know, there's a telephone mechanism where you can find out what the number is, right? Anybody can do it. So what is this fellow's explanation? Cheney just told Hayden, look, don't tell anybody. Don't tell the president. Don't tell anybody, okay? And Hayden, being the good, I won't say soldier, being the good Air Force general that he was, saluted and didn't.

That happened with respect to Condoleezza Rice as well. Tenet, for all his faults, George Tenet, the head of the CIA, was banging on her door. Look, let's have a, the lights are flashing red. Let's have a meeting on Al Qaeda. And there was no meeting until one week before 9-11. In addition to all that, we had two hijackers that the CIA was trying, knew about in Los Angeles. They had visas to the United States. They were in contact with Saudi intelligence. They were very dangerous characters, having participated in some meetings back in Kuala Lumpur the year before.

And what was the CIA doing with these guys? They were hiding the fact that they had these two guys. They never told the FBI, for God's sake. Now, are there elements in the CIA and the NSA that wanted 9-11 to happen? And if so, for what purpose? Who could justify the slaughter of 3,000 innocents, no matter the purpose? Well, there are varying degrees of culpability with the intelligence services. But with respect to the bottom line here, Judge, nothing is above Dick Cheney and the neocons. Now, we know that they had a plan to invade those countries, Iraq, Afghanistan, the whole schmear. they had a whole list of them. And they couldn't do that without

some convincing reason, retaliation for 9-11. So we know all that. That's all circumstantial. My point is simply that the 9-11 Commission, when it finally got underway, came up with some mealy-mouthed suggestions. And the authors of the, the co-chair of the committee, a Democrat and a Republican, Senator, Senator Kaine from, from New Jersey. Okay, so Governor, Governor Tom Kaine from New Jersey and Congressman Lee Hamilton from Indiana. Hamilton, a serious intelligence guy. Kaine, a well-respected moderate Republican that nobody could really object to. Were they hoodwinked by their executive director, a guy who's now a professor of law at UVA called Philip Zellicue? Yes.

Now, the proof of that, don't believe me about that, they wrote a book, Judge. They wrote a book a year and a half after the commission had its findings, and they said, we were set up to fail. Well, now, isn't that interesting? Hamilton and Kane saying, well, we were set up to fail. We were not given enough access to confidential information. We weren't given enough money. We weren't given enough time. We were set up to fail, and fail they did. My God.

What does that speak? What does that say to you? So, again, you know, this is the... When 9-11 happened, when the first plane hit the first tower, President Bush was reading children's stories to kindergartners in Florida. Dick Cheney, I believe, was in the White House, Cheney there, Bush not there, in which a young naval officer purports to warn those in the situation room that another attack is coming. Yes, Judge, you're putting your finger on one of the more intriguing aspects of this whole thing, okay? The story is, and it's documented, not only was Cheney there, Condoleezza Rice was there, Cheney's wife was there, okay? Cheney was

in charge. Bush was flying around the country. He didn't know exactly where, okay? So in midst of all this, Cheney, wife, Condoleezza Rice, and Mineta, Norm Mineta, who is Secretary of Transportation, were all there, okay? And in comes this naval person, I think he was an enlisted person, and he says, Mr. Vice President, I forget exactly the miles here, but I think he said, they're 15 miles out now, about 15 miles out, same instructions? And Cheney said, of course, same instructions. Three minutes later, same guy comes in. Mr. Vice President, five miles out now, same instruction?

Cheney whips around and said, did I tell you any other instructions? Five minutes later, boom, Plane goes into the Pentagon. Now, I had a personal encounter with Norm Mineta. Okay. Just before you get to Mineta, because I know your encounter with him is fascinating. But what was meant by same instructions? Meaning don't do anything? Don't warn anybody? Don't tell them to get out of the way? Don't

shoot the plane down? Put Cheney under oath, for God's sake. He knows what he meant. Well, he was never put under oath in all of this. But what is your understanding of the naval person's understanding when he said, Mr. Vice President, same instructions. What were those instructions? Do nothing? Well, again, this is not documented, but the only reasonable explanation was, you know, the instructions were not to prevent whatever hit the Pentagon from hitting the Pentagon. Now, you know, the timing was perfect, you know, five minutes later, boom, you know, into the Pentagon. Now, you know, the timing was perfect, you know, five minutes later, boom, you know, into the Pentagon. So a year later, I was asked to speak at Georgetown University, and Norm Renetta

was one of the other people. We were speaking about the U.S. Constitution. It was Constitutional Day in September. And I waited where people came out after they spoke. And here came Norm Renetta all by himself. And I went up and I said, Norm, Ray McGovern. Of course, he didn't know me from Adam. But in Washington, the ethos is, this person might be important. And I was addressed to the guild, right? So, oh, Ray, how are you? I said, no, I'm just a quick question here. What do you think that young sailor or that young naval guy meant when he said same instructions? And he blanched. I mean, my God, he got all white. And he says, we were talking about Pennsylvania, but we're talking about Pennsylvania, that other

planet, Pennsylvania. No, no Pennsylvania, that other play in Pennsylvania. No, no, no. This was not Pennsylvania. This was at something approaching the Pentagon, Norm. No, no. It was Pennsylvania, Pennsylvania. And, my God, I have never had an encounter with a high muckety-muck, as my grandmother would say, official that looked so pale. And then he said, excuse me now, Mr. McGovern, I have to leave.

My God, you know, what's that all about? Well, he kept his mouth shut. And I understand he has an airport named after him now in San Jose, California. I mean, hello. He died last year. It's not nice to say bad things about people who are dead, but I'll say this about Norman Edda. He should have told the American people what he knew.

What is your belief about the cover-up? What did Zellicue, the executive director of the 9-11 Commission do? And why would the FBI, the CIA, the NSA engage in a cover-up? Is it to make George Bush look good? Or that's impossible, to make George Bush look less bad than he already looked? Well, actually, to most Americans, George Bush stood on that rubble and looks good, Judge. Let's remember that, you know. God.

Anyhow, Condoleezza Rice, who with Zelikow is very, very close, like they wrote a book together. Not a very good book, but a book about Eastern Europe. Zelikow was appointed to make sure that nothing untoward came in that 9-11 commission report. And he had, as I say, I think it was 10 commissioners, all of whom had legal experience, and many of them had government experience. They were all too timid to insist that they talk to the president and Cheney. They designated one or two people and never got to first base. So was Salikov trying to protect his old good friend, Condoleezza Rice? Of course he was, for God's sake. She was grossly negligent, if not criminally negligent, in refusing, apparently, to go to the president

and say, look, this is something really serious here. We ought to let George Tenet tell you what's going on. And she didn't do that, as I said before, until one week before the attack. Now, why didn't she do that? Again, I imagine Vice President Cheney, who was really running things, said, look, Condoleezza Rice, don't worry about this. Don't worry about it. I'll take care of it. And if something bad happens, I'll take responsibility. Right. He didn't take responsibility. Sully Cuff was there to cover. I know some of the people that were appointed to the Night Commission. They were all people. they were all yes people, and they did what they were told. There was one exception, and I can talk to that if you like in a minute. Okay, we'll talk to the exception in just a minute. George Tenet,

to whom you referred, was the director of the CIA at the time, a former congressional staffer with no intelligence experience, no personal intelligence experience. Nevertheless, he was the head of the CIA. What did he know and who kept him from telling it what he knew to George W. Bush? Well, it was a combination of Condoleezza Rice and Dick Cheney. I mean, Tenet went down to Bush's farm, for God's sake, twice in August. Tenet lied to the 9-11 Commission in saying he never talked to the president during the month of August 2001. And then after the public testimony, his PR person, oh, we forgot, he did brief him down in, what's the name of that place where Bush cleared the brush? Crawford, Texas. Crawford, Texas, okay. He did brief him down there, and guess what? He briefed him another time.

Another time when it became clear that Moussaoui, the fellow that was going to be a substitute pilot for one of these planes, was training in Minnesota to how to steer the plane, not necessarily how to take off or land, just how to steer the plane, right? When Bush learned about this, that he had ties with al-Qaeda, and it was proven, he insisted on going down to see Bush one more time. It was the very end of August the 30th, if I believe. And then it was finally arranged that there would be a briefing. And that briefing took place a few days later with Condoleezza Rice finally saying, look, Mr. Cheney, we've got to do this. It was far too late. And as I say, each one of these agencies, the main ones, NSA, CIA, the FBI, had all kinds of indications that this was going to happen, that they didn't put it together. It's hard for me to. Someone put it together and someone was told, look, don't bother the president with this. This is going to be all right. I'll take

responsibility if it goes south. Forget about it. And across the Hudson River on a rooftop in Jersey City, New Jersey, a half dozen Mossad agents were cheering as the planes struck the towers. Did Mossad, the Israeli intelligence arm, know in advance this was happening? It looks very much as though they did, Judge. I can't prove it, but there's all kinds of circumstantial evidence. More heinous than that is this little exception that I found in the 9-11 Commission report. You have to remember that as these people were laboring on a report that would talk about what happened,

all of a sudden, Khalid Sheikh Mohammed, the mastermind of the whole business, was captured. Now, I know some of the folks working on the commissioners, oh, let's ask him why he did it. Maybe it was because, yeah, he studied at University of North Carolina Greensboro. Maybe they called him a towelhead. Or maybe he had an affair of the heart.

Find out why he did it. Well, the CIA went to Khalid Sheikh Mohammed and said, why did you do it? Now, on page, I think it's 154 of the 9-11 Commission report, Khalid Sheikh Mohammed is quoted as to why he did it. He said, or the reporter said, it was not because of any affront or indignity that KSM Khalid Sheikh Mohammed suffered in Greensboro, North Carolina, at the University of North Carolina. No, it was done, as Khalid Sheikh Mohammed said, out of extreme anger for the indignities inflicted by Israel on the Muslim states. Now, there's a little footnote there. It goes down to Ramzi Youssef, nephew of KSM,

he said the same thing when he tried to blow up the towers back in 93, I think. Well, he said the exact same thing, that he was proud to go to jail for the rest of his life because of his hatred for what Israel was doing to the Palestinians. That's on the record. It's not in the New York Times, but it's right in the 9-11 Commission report. Read it, page 154, if I'm not mistaken. Wow. Ray, this has been such an eye-opener. I'm deeply grateful for it. We are going to have Bernie Kerik on later today, who was the New York City police commissioner at the time and who I think shares a lot of the views that you articulated. We'll see you again later on in the week for our roundtable with Larry Johnson on Friday. Thank you, Ray.

Thank you very much. Quick correction. 147 is the page. Page 147 of the 9-11 report, the involvement of the Israelis. Thank you very much, Ray. Thank you, Judge. More as we get it, my friends. Help us spread the word.

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