Judging Freedom - COL. Lawrence Wilkerson: Trump and the Defense Department

Episode Date: November 15, 2024

COL. Lawrence Wilkerson: Trump and the Defense DepartmentSee Privacy Policy at https://art19.com/privacy and California Privacy Notice at https://art19.com/privacy#do-not-sell-my-info.

Thank you. Hi, everyone. Judge Andrew Napolitano here for Judging Freedom. Today is Friday, November 15th, 2024. Colonel Larry Wilkerson joins us now. Colonel, I'm delighted to see you. I wish you were earlier in the week, and I didn't have to wait till it's dark out on a Friday afternoon to get to spend time with you, but welcome here, sir, and thank you very much for your time. In our world, it's been a tumultuous week in terms of the intention manifested, these are not official nominations yet, of course, by Donald Trump to nominate people to various, very significant positions. John Ratcliffe to run the CIA, he's not going to dismantle the operations side. He's probably going to goose it up, right? That'd be my guess. And I'm really interested in this appointment from a perspective of what Trump said earlier, that the CIA director would not darken his door.

He wants to empower the DNI. And, of course, that's one way to do it. I frankly would recommend that, that the DNI be the only person regularly exposed to the president. But that means Radcliffe is going to have a very shadowy existence. Maybe he prefers that. Tulsi Gabbard, is she in a position to undo, dial back, restrain, whatever you want to call it, the old boys club, who are accustomed to special operations of coups and secret wars and all of those horrible things they've been doing since 1947? Well, I watched Averill Haynes, and I was not very impressed, nor was I impressed with the woman we took out of the secret prisons,

whose name, thank God, escapes me right now, and made director of the CIA. So I'm not down on women, but... Bloody Gina, they called her. You can imagine why her own colleagues gave her that nickname, but go ahead, Colonel. Gina Haspel. You're right. I remember her now. I negotiated, negotiated. I talked with Tulsi at length about the JCPOA and found her to be more conversant with the details than most anybody else in the Congress. So I was very impressed. She didn't tell me how she was going to vote when I left, but I was very impressed that she was studying it so assiduously. So I have a good opinion of her, but some of the

things she said since, particularly with regard to Israel, trouble me. Well, she's right in Mike Huckabee's camp on Israel. I don't know where she is on Ukraine or how she feels about Iran. She, of course, condemned Donald Trump for ordering the murder of General Qasim al-Solomani. I don't know if she still feels that way. So she's been on both sides of a lot of these issues. Is she a political hack that speaks to please her masters to advance herself? Or is she someone who will bring the CIA or the intelligence community to where President Harry Truman intended it to be, which is spying and not disrupting other governments? I'd like to think the latter, but I really have to base a comment answering that question on experience, and there she's woefully lacking.

Generally speaking, when you get someone that inexperienced, it takes a long time to figure out who's playing tricks on you. And by that time, they've played the tricks and maybe you're in trouble. I've seen political hacks go in from the Congress, like Porter Goss, for example, and just make an absolute disaster of themselves in the role. So and Porter, of course, had much more time on the block as or than Tulsi does. So I'm worried about, I'd be worried about that with her. You, I believe, were chief of staff to Secretary Powell when this DNI office came into existence. Yes. I remember I was a lone wolf at Fox. In fact, my guest at the time, now you're

talking, what, 25 years ago, was Larry Johnson. And he and I, much to the chagrin of Fox management, were arguing on air, advancing the argument, we were agreeing, that DNI was superfluous and would ultimately be a toothless. You feel like online security, right? Exactly. Yep. Exactly. I wouldn't have appointed Christie known there. I would have appointed somebody who'll shut it down. But anyway, Ken does Tulsi Gabbard have the authority to say, no, you're not going to overthrow fill in the blank Maduro uh in nicaragua or in venezuela or whatever that character's name in uh nicaragua does she have the authority to say to john ratcliffe no she does but they don't they haven't fixed the problem and if you studied it and you sound like

you did you know what the problem is the problem is no people power and no money power. Correct. How big, how big is her group? How many people work for her compared to the number of people that work for Ratcliffe? Well, you would be surprised there. I toured their facility when their first were created and they had about 5,000 on the books. You never,

never create a government bureaucracy and not think they will be peopled mightily very shortly thereafter. Does she have the understanding from experience? I'm sure the answer to this is no, but don't let me put words in your mouth because she has no experience as far as I know. Does she have the understanding from whatever source to talk them out of what they want to do? Does she have the personal courage to say the answer is no?

Will she be the exclusive briefer of the president of the United States? Or will John Ratcliffe, who is actually close to Donald Trump, find his way into the Oval Office? That's what I'm going to watch to see if Trump lives up to that, keeps only the DNI in there. That would be a major empowerment of the DNI if he were the one. And also the principal intelligence official at formal National Security Council meetings, and even at principals meetings, that would be a real empowerment of that position. Were Trump to do that, then the answer to your question might be a little tending towards affirmative rather than negative. She might be able to do those kinds of things. This podcast is sponsored by Talkspace. You know, when you're really stressed or not feeling so

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code space 80 when you go to talkspace.com match with a licensed therapist today at talkspace.com save eighty dollars with code space 80 at talkspace.com uh switching over to uh mike huckabee now the ambassador is really just an ambassador. It's not a policy-making position. And I know this will rattle you no end, and I'm sorry to do this to you on a Friday afternoon, but

here's a montage of the worst of Mike Huckabee. Cut number four. Basically, I had to be careful in saying this, because people of Mike Huckabee. Cut number four. Basically, there really is no such thing as, I have to be careful in saying this, because people really get it. There's really no such thing as a

Palestinian. There's no such thing as Arab and Persian. There's such a complexity in that. There's really no such thing. That's been a political tool to try to force land away from Israel. The two-state solution, if we mean two governments

holding the same piece of real estate, is irrational and unworkable. If there is a two-state solution, the Palestinian state needs to be outside the boundaries of the nation of Israel. There's plenty of land in the world that we could find a place and say, okay, let's create a Palestinian state. There are certain words I refuse to use. There is no such thing as a West Bank. It's Judea and Samaria. There's no such thing as a settlement. They're communities, they're neighborhoods, they're cities. There's no such thing as an occupation. That last part is particularly odd in light of the Israelis themselves and the United Nations, Israeli generals, the United Nations and the International Criminal Court referring to it as an occupation. You know darn well everybody that observes this knows it's an occupation.

Well, he might as well be Bibi's right-hand man. I mean, if remarks like that are indicative of the way he feels, he's Bibi's right-hand man. I mean, remarks like that are indicative of the way he feels. He's Bibi's right-hand man. He won't be our ambassador. He'll be Bibi's right-hand man vis-a-vis the United States, which is not uncommon for the people we send to Israel. Is that the way Donald Trump feels? I hope not, but the indication there would be. I've said this repeatedly over the last few days as these names have come out. I do not think that a single one of the principal cabinet officers or reasonable facsimiles thereof, such as the DNI, will be in place 12 months from the time he appoints them. And I tell you who agrees with you. I hope he doesn't mind me saying

it on air. He told me this privately. Colonel McGregor agrees with you 100% on that. He said six to nine to 12 months, these characters, if they're even confirmed, will be done. We'll get to the characters in a minute. Now, here's somebody that doesn't need a job.

Senator John Thune, who was just elected the majority leader in the Senate. He's the leader of the Republicans in the Senate. Colonel Wilkerson, can you take a guess to whom he made his first phone call after he was elected majority leader? It was not Donald Trump. It was not J.D. Vance. It was not Joe Biden. It was not Chuck Schumer. Bibi Netanyahu. Interesting. Tells you where we are, Colonel.

Colonel, I wonder if Senator Thune can spell the word genocide. I wonder if almost two-thirds of the Congress genocide. I wonder if almost two-thirds of the Congress could. You would think they couldn't. They're the ones that Thun was there, gave Netanyahu those wild standing ovations when he pointed

out you. I almost wish he had mentioned you by name because you were out there with all these young kids demonstrating in the streets. And so was the former Chief Command Master Sergeant of the Air Force. Correct. The great Chief Command. Correct.

Correct. You know, you need a sense of humor to get through the day, particularly dark days like this. But Tulsi Gabbard is an ardent Zionist. Mike Huckabee is an ardent Zionist. Oh, wait till you hear the nominee to be Secretary of Defense. Trying to find the right one, Chris. Here it is.

Cut number 10. Anyone that wants to take the stage and talk about dual loyalty is dead wrong. What this organization represents, what Western civilization represents today is an understanding that Zionism and Americanism are the front lines of Western civilization and freedom in our world today.

And what better time for that relationship? From the scrapping of the terrible Iran deal to the embassy move, the recognition of Jerusalem as the capital of the Jewish state, and the recognition of Jerusalem as the capital of the Jewish state, and the recognition of the Golan Heights. This president is a true friend of the state of Israel. It is an eternal bond, an unbreakable bond that represents faith and freedom and fidelity to historic religious and cultural traditions, the opposite of secularism and Islamism and anti-Semitism. All right, this goes on and on and on.

First of all, how will the Pentagon react to this person as their boss? Then we'll talk about whether or not you think it could even be confirmed. Well, I have to say, first of all, Judge, that there are so many people who don't know anything about history. Every time the Crusaders came to Jerusalem, the Crusaders were defeated eventually. And that's what he is. That's what he is.

He's a Christian crusader allied with the Jews. The Pentagon is probably right now sweating bullets with the idea that this 44-year-old Princeton, Harvard special guy with the tats on his arm is coming over there to, as he has said, as I understand it, clean house. There are so many things that need to be done at the Pentagon. Cleaning house is not one of them. I would get rid of some of the flags, no question about it, some of the admirals and generals, and I would shake things up a bit, much the way Dick Cheney did when he first came in as Secretary of Defense with Powell and was a pretty good Secretary of Defense. He fired the chief staff of the Air Force just to make sure everyone knew that the civilian was in charge. Thank you very much.

Powell couldn't even talk him out of that firing. But this is absurd what I'm hearing from him. And the biggest problem at the Pentagon, Judge, is they can't pass an audit. They lose $20 to $30 billion of the taxpayers' money every year by their own admission, and they can't pass an audit. That's a huge problem that's just draining money away. And all of these wars in support of Israel, for example, it's draining money away at an alarming rate. And Trump's going to find that out when he gets into office again and finds out just how deeply we are in debt. Can a person with no administrative or managerial experience, or can you even make the argument that a person with no administrative or managerial experience can manage a budget of $860 billion and a team of human beings numbering close to $3 million? I'm talking about military and civilian. The largest not-for-profit organization on the face of the earth. And this guy's going to manage it.

No way he's going to do that. He can cause chaos. He can cause a drop in morale that's so significant that people do begin to abandon him. But I don't think he can manage it. And I would say of the people Trump is appointing, he'll be one of the first to depart. Do you have a feel, Colonel, for how serious life commissioned officers feel? Not necessarily admirals and generals, but colonels, lieutenant colonels,

guys that have been there for 20 years or so and have a great feel for the military and a love of the country. How do they feel when somebody like this, instead of Doug McGregor, I'll be honest, one of the greatest people on the planet for this job.

Well, either Pete or Doug. Pete Hegseth gets it. Yeah, either Pete or Doug. Doug, you and I know, and we can feel fairly confident that he would take a studied, analytical, and decent professional approach to it. If Pete were to do that, if Hegseth were to do that, and align himself with the lieutenant colonels and colonels, you know, not formally, but informally, who are disgusted with a lot of the leadership in the Pentagon, because they see them as just people waiting until they can go work

for Lockheed for a seven-figure salary, then that would be a powerful movement. It would be a powerful movement that would eventually clean out a lot of the dead meat in the Pentagon, just as George Marshall had to in 39 and 40, clean the dead meat out of the U.S. military because they'd been there for so long they didn't know what war was all about. That would be good, but I don't see this guy doing that. He's a rabble-rouser. He's a radical. Just look at his dress and the tats on his arms. Look at where he worked and what he did when he was there and what he said when he was there at Fox. I've been looking at some of his interviews.

One of those interviews, and I don't want to overburden you with running tapes, this is while Trump was president. He advises Trump to bomb civilian targets in Tehran. Now, if Trump called up the Secretary of Defense and said, destroy Tehran's infrastructure, I would think the Secretary of Defense would show up in a heartbeat with a team of people and argue, here are the natural and probable consequences if that happens. Pete will say, when do you want it done, sir? I hope not, but I fear you're right. I mean, you need strategic reasoning.

You need management skills. You need to be able to listen. You need to have empathy. You need to articulate policy. It's very articulate. He can articulate policy. It's very articulate. He can articulate policy. But the other attributes of leadership at that level, I'm not sure that he has it. Unless, unless, Colonel. The real break, Judge, on us attacking Iran has been the Pentagon. Well, unless, Colonel, I'm just getting breaking news from the Washington Post.

Trump team rethinking Pentagon pick after receiving details of past sexual assault claim. I was going to bring that up, but I got it on my list. Yeah, I didn't want to bring it up. I've been married three times, too. I'm an old curmudgeon. I'm a curmudgeon. I was married 55 years very happily.

He's been married three times and one quarter that time. Yes. You're not a curmudgeon. You're a great man because I never kissed a curmudgeon, but I did kiss a great man. The public knows I kissed you on the top of your head. Now I don't remember where I was before this thing came up. Let's go to Marco Rubio.

Well, we already talked about Rubio. We talked about Hegseth. Is Donald Trump a neocon? He gives every appearance of being so from time to time, and so do a lot of the people he's appointing, and some of them are, in fact, certified neocons. I mean, Pete Hegseth clearly is. He's like Lindsey Graham, bomb Iran and Zionism triumphant. Rubio is a neocon. He's apparently changed his mind on Ukraine, but he was a champion of Ukraine

when Biden was sending hundreds of billions of dollars there, and he's very pro-Zionist. Tulsi Gabbard has changed her mind. She's pro-Zionist. I don't know where John Ratcliffe is, but I don't know. I know Donald Trump well and personally and have known him for many years. He called me many, many times during his first tour of duty in the White House. He sounds and gives the impression of being a neocon by these people that he's appointed. We're hearing that on one of these lists and maybe and you probably know this fellow as a deputy to Tulsi Gabbard, General Mike Flynn.

Oh, yes, I know him. That's a disaster. That's a disaster. Tulsi and Flynn would be at loggerheads immediately. No question in my mind about that. What would they be at loggerheads over if she's his boss? Just about everything, including the fact she is his voice. She. All right, Colonel, where do we go from here? I guess we just wait and watch and see what

happens. Are we going to be in World War III? It very well could be, and it could be a step that Trump doesn't want to take at all. And I feel like that much I intuit about him. He doesn't like war, and he doesn't want war. He speaks that way sometimes, but he really doesn't like it. Can I tell you who's very happy, notwithstanding his own domestic issues? Bibi Netanyahu. I'm sure.

I mean, he believes, you tell me if you think this belief is well-grounded, Colonel, that he'll get even more. I don't know how that could be. Joe Biden gave him everything. A big deal. They held up 2,000-pound bombs for 30 days. Of course, they made sure they had enough 2,000-pound bombs, 2,000-pound bombs to last the 30 days before they symbolically held them up. Beebe seems to think that Donald Trump will give him more and faster than what Joe Biden gave him. Is that a rational belief? I think so. And I also think that they won't do things like Biden did, even though Biden didn't enforce it at all. They were supposed to be up by November the 8th, I think. They were supposed to be up to 350 truckloads of food a day. They aren't even close.

So that was a political act par excellence. It didn't have anything to do with reality or caring for the Palestinian dying of hunger. Trump will probably reinforce that, I would suspect. And I know Huckabee will be recommending those sorts of things to him, so I don't know that Netanyahu has any fear now except the fact that he's losing. He is losing, Judge. He is

losing on almost every front. Hamas is replenishing its ranks from people coming from Jordan and Egypt and elsewhere. There are probably as many Hamas fighters in Gaza right now as were there on October the 8th. He's losing, Judge. Wow. Does the Israeli public know that, Colonel? It's seeping through to some of them, but not very many of them. Haaretz is about the only paper that really puts the truth out from time to time.

So you've got, you know, Sheldon Adelson bought up all the press around Tel Aviv, which is the principal population center, despite Jerusalem being moved. He bought up all the press and sold it to Netanyahu. So the press and other things like that constantly tell lies. Let me ask you the $64,000 question. If Bibi attacks Tehran and Trump gives him and Hegseth give him military support, will the Russians get involved? If we come in whole hog with him, which I think we will have to because he can't do it by himself. He proved that on the quote,

hundred plane strike, unquote. Right. Yes. And I wouldn't be surprised to see China there either. What is China's interest in, in that area? Very significant interests. Much of their oil, unlike us, comes through the strait.

What can you tell us about the break in diplomatic relations between Israel and Turkey? What are the likely ramifications of that? I think it's long overdue. I think Erdogan just tap-d danced all over the place trying to keep the Muslim population in his own country, you know, thinking he was going to do something about it. And then finally, he's been getting vibes from that population that, hey, you talk a great show, but you don't do much. And I'm waiting to see if Chehan, if the oil coming through Chehan ceases to flow south, ceases to flow to Israel. That's the biggest thing he could do because we've got problems with the Syrian oil illegally flowing to Israel. And we've got a little kerfuffle going on between

Baghdad and Kirkuk where the Kurds are sending oil to Israel. You cut their oil off. You really hurt them. Colonel Wilkerson, a pleasure, my dear friend. No matter what we talk about, it's your instinct, your courage, your precision. It's a joy for me to be able to pick your brain. Chief Fritz was busy this week. Imagine that he's too busy for me to be able to pick your brain. Chief Fritz was busy this week. Imagine that he's too busy for me. I want Fritz and me and you to share a cell.

I'd rather share a bottle of wine than a cell. Maybe we'll do you and Dennis together. Does he live anywhere near you? Not too far. We have breakfast every now and then together about nine in the morning. All right. Colonel, thank you very much. We look forward to seeing you next week. It's a real pleasure. Take care. Of course. And next week, we will have all of your regulars starting on

Monday morning with Ray McGovern at 10, excuse me, with Alistair Crook at 8 Eastern times, Ray McGovern at 10, Larry Johnson at 11, and hopefully one of our heavyweights in the afternoon. Have a great weekend, my dear friends. We are up to 479,000 as we started the show, 479,800 subscribers. I think because of you, we're going to reach 500,000 by Christmas, which is six weeks away. Help us spread the word. Like and subscribe. There may be some people somewhere that don't like us. Too bad. Like and subscribe.

We'll get that word out there. God love you. Have a nice weekend. Judge Napolitano for Judging Freedom. Thank you.