Judging Freedom - INTEL Roundtable with Johnson & McGovern: Biden/Putin; Schumer/Netanyahu

Episode Date: March 15, 2024

INTEL Roundtable with Johnson & McGovern: Biden/Putin; Schumer/NetanyahuSee Privacy Policy at https://art19.com/privacy and California Privacy Notice at https://art19.com/privacy#do-not-sell-my-info.

Thank you. Hi, everyone. Judge Andrew Napolitano here for Judging Freedom. Today is Friday, March 15th, 2024. To some people, today is the Ides of March. To others, it's the beginning of St. Patrick's Day weekend, and some people are celebrating. You can see Larry has green on, and McGovern himself doesn't, and Napolitano, who's a graduate of the University of the Fighting Irish, doesn't have it either. But gentlemen, welcome here. Always a pleasure. Larry Johnson, Ray McGovern. We have a lot to talk about. I want to start with this out-of-the-blue statement by Senator Chuck Schumer. I'll let him speak for himself. This is just about a minute excerpt. Chris picked the best parts of his speech on the floor of the Senate yesterday.

Cut number one. Prime Minister Netanyahu has lost his way by allowing his political survival to take the precedence over the best interests of Israel. He has put himself in coalition with far-right extremists like Ministers Smotrich and Ben-Gavir, and as a result, he has been too willing to tolerate the civilian toll in Gaza, which is pushing support for Israel worldwide to historic lows. Israel cannot survive if it becomes a pariah. As a lifelong supporter of Israel, it has become clear to me the Netanyahu coalition no longer fits the needs of Israel after October 7th.

The world has changed radically since then and the Israeli people are being stifled right now by a governing vision that is stuck in the past. To start with you Ray, aren't some of these statements true? He has put himself in a coalition with far-right extremists like Smutrich and Ben-Gavir. He puts his own political survival over humanity. Well, of course it's true. The interesting thing is that Chuck Schumer is saying this when Chuck Schumer is just as responsible as everyone else for having this outcome.

Sure, the Israelis are maneuvering around, but we give them about $4 billion worth of military equipment and other stuff every year. And of course, we're furnishing, supplying, and politically supporting genocide, for God's sake. And I never thought part of my country, I never thought my country would be involved in condemning and supporting and enabling genocide. So what Truman needs to do, if he feels strongly about this, is quit or make sure he appears on the president's door and say, look, the time is up.

Netanyahu has outlived his usefulness even to Israel. Tell him no more arms. That's all that has to happen. He didn't do it. He's just posturing. Larry, the odds of Senator Schumer doing what Ray just suggested are none and none, right? Yeah, yeah. Look, number one, he pre-vetted the speech with the American-Israeli Public Affairs Committee, APAC.

He didn't go out and just do this on his own. He ran it by other Jewish members of the Democrat caucus. They all gave a thumbs up. political ploy by Schumer in a bid to try to portray the Democrats as being a little more empathetic towards the Palestinians, because they realize they've got a terrible problem up in Michigan, in particular, where there are a large number of Arab Americans and Muslim Americans, and that the Democrats have been losing the support. But the reality is, if you get rid of Netanyahu, it's not going to change Israel's policy one bit. So get rid of Netanyahu, great. A bunch of Jewish American liberal Democrats, they hate Netanyahu anyway.

Put in Benny Gantz. But Gantz, former general, is still going to pursue the same policy. So this was, as I said, it was sort of a meaningless gesture. If anything, Schumer has probably boosted Netanyahu's support in Israel. Don't the Democrats know, Larry, or didn't they know ahead of time when they invited General Gantz that he's basically Netanyahu with a more smiling face, but in terms of his military policies,

they'd be the same. I mean, he once ran for prime minister and he showed pictures of slaughter that he directed in Gaza, talking about 10 or 15 years ago. Yeah, no, it's just like what Ray said. So, you know, Schumer is just as responsible for this. If they were serious about putting an end to it,

they'd pass a resolution immediately cutting off all funds to Israel. Not authorizing it anymore. Ray, excuse me. Ray, is it likely that Muscad knew what Schumer was going to say and reported it to Netanyahu before Schumer said it? I'd say only about 99% likely. Wow. They talk to each other all the time. How would Mossad have gotten a copy of Schumer's speech? Oh, it wouldn't have to be Mossad. The political operators here in Washington or in

Washington and New York, they're hand in glove with the PR people that, Vice Schumer, the ones that Larry referred to. So yeah, this is all well-coordinated and Netanyahu and the others know what the game is. And as Larry said, it's not going to make any difference. And, you know, if you have the vice president shake her finger at any glance, and now you have other people like Schumer saying, oh, this is really good, bad. I mean, it's just kind of a, it's a charade. And the problem is that people who just watch the major media don't really get it, that it's a charade, that really we do want to restrain Netanyahu, but what can we do? And we are meddling in internal Israeli affairs, but that's how strongly we feel about it.

But when we can stop it with a telephone call, you know, it gets me angry. Why do they hate Netanyahu personally, knowing that his policies are supported by the overwhelming majority of the Israeli public and the Israeli elites? I'm not talking about what he tried to do with the courts. I'm just talking about the handling of the war, as repellent as it is to us, as outraged as we are that our own country is supporting and funding genocide, as indefensible as it is, it is universally or nearly universally supported in Israel. Yeah. Well, I think number one, Netanyahu has been seen as more empathetic and supportive of Republicans than of Democrats over the years. And I'm not sure what it means to be a conservative anymore or a liberal anymore. But basically, Netanyahu's embrace of this ultra-Zionist perspective, which means there is no accommodation of peace with Palestinians. All Palestinians are treated the same, whether they're Muslim or Christian.

They are outsiders that have to be eliminated. And so I think it's just the political differences that are perceived, I guess, between Republicans and Democrats is one of the reasons our Democrats dislike Netanyahu. between slaughtering the Gazans and trying to feed in a paltry and ineffective way those who survived the slaughter. Here's Andrea Mitchell, a friend of mine. She is Jewish. It's a bit disjointed, the question, but you get the point. The question to Secretary of State Blinken. His answer is far more important than her question. His answer is going to raise the blood pressure of both of you. Cut number seven, Chris. The U.S. is weaponizing the war. We are the leading supplier of weapons to Israel. At the same time, you are leading an international rescue effort to get this aid in, despite the obstacles from members of the cabinet

in Israel which have delayed the opening of more land access and still are. And as you point out, these sea routes are slow – slower than they should be even because not all the ports are open – and they're not a substitute for the hundreds of trucks that could get in by land. So can you explain to the American people this incompatible policy? These policies are in conflict. SECRETARY BLINKEN These two objectives are not in conflict. The question is whether Israel, on the one hand, is and can effectively deal with its security needs in

defending the country, while at the same time maximizing every possible effort to ensure that civilians are not harmed and that assistance gets to those who need it. And as I've said for some time, we see a gap between the intent and the result that we're determined every single day to close. With regard to Rafah, the President's been very clear about this repeatedly. What we've said to Israel is this. Given the large number of civilians that are now in Rafah, many of them displaced from other parts of Gaza – about 1.4 million – we need to see a plan that will get civilians out of harm's way if

there's to be a military operation in Rafah, and not only gets them out of harm's way, but also ensures that they have what they need, that they have shelter, that they have food, that they have medicine. We've not yet seen such a plan. This is hogwash. These two objectives are not in conflict. We are maximizing every effort to ensure the Israelis will maximize every effort to ensure that civilians are not is an online accredited university that specializes in personalized learning. With courses available 24-7 and monthly start dates, you can earn your degree on your schedule. You may even be able to graduate sooner than you think by demonstrating mastery of the material you know.

Make 2025 the year you focus on your future. Learn more at wgu.edu. Well, it's not the same reality as the rest of this experience. I don't know. He must be sort of brainwashed into thinking that these two incompatible things can be compatible. We're dropping bombs over here. We're telling the Israelis that the Gazans go over here, and then we're dropping food over there. Some of it drops on top of them, of course. Why don't we just tell them, let the trucks in?

They're lined up by the thousands. Let the trucks in. We don't do that. Well, we don't do that because our president and the Zionists, let's face it, the Zionists who advise him, and the president has himself bragged about being a big, big Zionist. I don't know if he knows what that means, but what does it mean? It's not Jewish. It means Zionist. Look at the history book.

So these people are high bound. They talk about 1.4 million people in and around Rafah. And you're going to create little islands. That's the latest idea. Little islands of people so that the bombs can fall outside the islands and just kill them. How do you identify the Hamas people? Give me a break. This is really awful. And the proof will be in the pudding. Will Netanyahu and his advisors, will they go ahead and do what they intend to do in Rafah? Or will they hold off for a while? We'll have to see, because the president has laid down a sort of a marker here, or Blinken does. But whether, if Netanyahu goes ahead and decimates the population,

those 1.4 million people driven into this corner of Rafah, then will the president stand up to him then? Not so much. The last thing he said was, well, we have a red line, but we don't have a red line now. If the Israelis kill 30,000 more Palestinians, well, then what? Then we'll wait till the next 30,000. This is really terrible. Larry, if the United States, if the President of the United States sent two or three hundred trucks there through Egypt to enter Gaza, would the IDF stop them from going in? Yes, the Israeli settlers are stopping the trucks. And as Max said yesterday on your show, he noted that the Israeli

troops at the border were passing out bottles of water to the Israeli settlers instead of forcing them to move. So they're blocking the trucks. And even if the U.S. sent trucks, the Israelis, they're happy to block them. So this is a deliberate effort on their part to kill, starve, destroy Palestinians. Here's how wedded Joe Biden is to APEC. You mentioned Max. Max Blumenthal is, of course, an expert on all of this, and we're deeply grateful, as I am for you guys.

Here's Max yesterday on the relationship, the deep, long relationship between APEC and Joseph Biden. Joe Biden is the largest recipient of Israel lobby money of any active U.S. politician. He's received over $1 million throughout his career. He identifies himself as a Christian or Gentile Zionist. He said in a floor speech in the Senate that if Israel did not exist, it would have to be invented. We would have to invent it. The way we kind of did. In 1982, Joe Biden shocked the hardline Likudnik Prime Minister Menachem Begin during a closed session of the Senate Foreign Relations Committee when Begin had just invaded Lebanon. All the senators on the committee were badgering Begin,

declaring, how could you do this? You're destabilizing the Middle East. And Biden was the lone senator to support him. But he actually shocked Begin when he said, I would go even further than you. I would be willing to kill women and children. Does this surprise you, Larry? No, no. Well, let's put it this way. Guys, Menachem Begin was one of the founders of the Irgun, a terrorist organization that carried out terrorist bombings against British civilians and soldiers. So when a terrorist like Begin is shocked by Biden, that tells you how off the charts Biden is. I mean, good Lord. Right. Right. Do you believe, Ray, the so-called rupture between Biden and Netanyahu?

I mean, if there truly was a rupture, then Joe Biden would call him up and say, stop in 24 hours or you don't get spare parts. You don't get ammunition. You don't get jets. You don't get anything from us, and Bibi would have no choice. Judge, it has mostly to do with money. Money, the root of all evil. The campaign is on. To whom are the AIPAC people likely to give more money? I mean, when Joe Biden flies out to L.A. to participate in some really, really well-heeled fundraiser operations, you see where the heart is.

So, you know, it's really a very strange sort of situation, because no matter what Biden really would like in his heart of hearts, if he still has one, it doesn't matter, because the election is first and foremost here, and that's what's going to prevail. What more needs to be said? I heard, I didn't ask Chris to get the clip, but I heard Senator, or excuse me, Speaker of the House, Mike Johnson, feigning shock at what Chuck Schumer said. And in the speech, Larry, I want you to respond to this.

He said, how could he say that? Israel is our closest ally and the only democracy in the Middle East. Isn't he wrong on both points, Larry? Well, you know, to quote Bill Clinton depends on what the meaning of ally is. So, you know, Israel has bought and paid, as Ray has said many times, and others like John Mearsheimer, Israel's bought and paid for the U.S. Congress. And so basically the U.S. Congress becomes a rubber stamp for Israeli policy. And as far as democracy goes, just look at how Palestinians are the territories of the West Bank and Gaza are treated. Even Arab Israelis are second class citizens in Israel. So, but, you know, Mike Johnson illustrates one of the real problems here, and Biden knows this, that no matter what Biden does to try to placate or calm the waters with the Democrats who are Arab Americans or Muslim Americans,

he knows that he can always count on the Republicans continuing to support Israel, no matter what. So he's got the Republicans in his back pocket to always write the check out for Israel. So not far from where I live, a Jewish temple invited two Israeli real estate companies to put on a program offering property for sale in Israel. And the objection is that's a violation of New Jersey law because this property can only be bought by members of the Jewish faith. And New Jersey law prohibits discrimination in sale or offering of sale of real estate under any circumstances. Did it stop them? No.

Did the government intercede or interfere in any way? No. The newspaper editorialists were the ones who had to raise this. Let's switch gears. How close to its last leg, we keep saying this, but how close to its last leg is Ukraine, Ray? Well, Ukraine is on the way down. The question is how quickly the Russians want to finish them off. The real problem here is the different reality that the Washington Post, New York Times, even the Wall Street Journal portray for most Americans. Today, there was an incredible op-ed in the Washington Post. It was by Fareed Zakaria.

And he started out on a really hopeful note. Here's what he said at the beginning. The war in Ukraine is for the West a way of improving a tactical position versus Russia, Putin said. But for us, it is our fate. It's a matter of death, Putin added. mistake, says Fareed Zakaria, is Western's strategy against Russia has been to ignore this reality. Well, okay, so it's an existential threat to Russia. They're going to do what they have to do to defend themselves. It's just a tactical sort of move for America to use against Russia. Who's going to hang in there? Well, clearly the

Russians are. Because I have to say, the Russian economy has survived all these sanctions. And Putin, you know, what he's said is he's threatening to use tactical nuclear weapons. A big, bald-faced lie. He has done nothing of the kind. He's never said tactical nuclear weapons, but our side has, and you know my worries on that score. We just went downhill. He says, you know, we should get those frozen Russian funds that's in those banks, use them, and we should actually, when Macron, quote, French President Emmanuel Macron is surely right that the central fact that must guide Western strategy is that Putin cannot win. If that means greater Western involvement, even military forces

of some kind on the ground, that's better than watching Russian aggression succeed. I read Zakaria, Washington Post. So they don't realize that the Russian army has already succeeded. They don't realize that they don't have any troops to fight on the Ukrainian side. It's really bizarre. Larry, the queen of the neocons is gone. She's with her buddy Hillary Clinton teaching these poor students at Columbia University. Does the establishment she

left behind, neocon as it is, did they ever take Putin seriously? Did they ever accurately and fairly assess the seriousness with which the Russians take this special military operation? The short answer is no, but as Ray can comment on based on his years of experience, this has been a problem with America, with the Central Intelligence Agency, and with the State Department that goes back to 1946 at least and before that. We have never understood what the Soviets or now the Russians are doing and why they're doing what they're doing. We have created on the U.S. side a narrative and a meme. And so the narrative essentially is that the Russians are totalitarian, authoritarian communists who want to conquer the world. And it's up to us Americans holding our candle, our little light of freedom to stop that darkness from overwhelming the world.

OK, that's been the nonsense that we've pushed for the last 75 years. And all the while, the one country that has been most aggressive in overthrowing other countries, in changing regimes in other countries, in starting wars in other countries, is the United States, not Russia. And yet, our complete misunderstanding of Russia, we don't pay attention to what Putin says. Hey, if you keep building up to bring Ukraine into NATO, we're going to push back. They push back and we're going, well, I can't believe they did that. It's just, it's absurd. Ray, there's a report this morning that some NATO troops have been killed in Ukraine.

It's unconfirmed. Do you or you, Larry, know from your sources if this is true? And if so, were any of them Americans? Ray? Well, the Ministry of Defense, the Russian Ministry of Defense, has said that there have been 13,000 foreigners killed on the field of battle, 6,000 of which were, let's see. Oh, yeah, 6,000 of which were killed.

The 13,000 was the aggregate figure. So the Russian Ministry of Defense has been usually accurate about these things. I want to add something to what Larry just said about how Russian or Soviet analysts, American types, look at Russia and the Soviet Union. Interestingly enough, Vladimir Putin thought it right to comment on this just three days ago. And he said, you know, there used to be people in the United States government who knew something about Russia and the Soviet Union. They were all cashiered. They were all let go. They can't get a word. They're all Russia folks now. Look at them. Look at them all. They even appoint some of them ambassadors of the Soviet Union to Russia, okay? And of course, he has in mind people like Stephen Cohen, people like John Biersheimer, even people like us who studied under a different kind of regime and looked at the facts

and tried to figure out what they're really saying and whether they actually meant what they were saying. Larry, the 12 CIA bases, which for some strange reason, your former colleagues decided to tell the New York Times about in Ukraine, are they still there or are they shut down? I don't know. I would imagine they're still there, but here's the one thing I'm certain of. Whatever CIA base is out there on the border of Russia. Russia knows about it. Russia, you know, this, again, this goes back into 75 years of CIA history. CIA kept trying to infiltrate people into the then Soviet Union. And would give people parachutes and food and money and drop them behind lines. And they kept disappearing.

Could never figure it out. Well, the Soviets then had penetrated Western intelligence and knew what was coming. Well, guess what? Russian intelligence has not gotten stupid over the years. They're not incompetent. And so they're very much on top of this. And I think the CIA has been engaged with lying, deceit, and self-delusion for many years. And the mere fact that they're talking about 12 bases, it's a dead giveaway

that they're not useful. Go ahead, go ahead, Greg. It just means that they have to justify their own existence and their own budgets. Yeah, budget. And talking about China, for example, cyber warfare against China. We're defaming Xi Jinping and the Chinese are believing us. It's a budgetary intelligence, as we used to call it. And it's worth nothing. It's just PR. The government of Taiwan,

I don't want to get into another subject, but you mentioned China. The government of Taiwan yesterday confirmed that on the island of Kinmen, K-I-N-M-E-N, I never heard of it until I saw this piece, which is in the Straits of Taiwan, U.S. troops. U.S. combat troops

on this island. Hey, Genocide Joe, what the hell are they doing there? Yeah. Probably related to a military exercise, to be my guess. Well, gentlemen, thank you. Always a pleasure, my dear friends.

It's nice to be back in the U.S. It's great to have both of you on twice a week. Thank you very much for your time. Have a great weekend. We'll see you Monday. We'll start this round robin again. All the US. It's great to have both of you on twice a week. Thank you very much for your time. Have a great weekend. We'll see you Monday. We'll start this round robbing again. All the best. All right. Do the same. Thank you, guys. Thank you for watching, my dear friends. I love Ray and Larry. I love all the time they give us, and it's a great way to end the week. It's a happy time. It's Friday afternoon, at least in northern New Jersey. It's practically summertime with the weather. Have a great weekend, everyone.

All your favorites will be back with us next week. Judge Napolitano for Judging Freedom. Resolve to earn your degree in the new year in the Bay with WGU. With courses available online 24-7 and monthly start dates, WGU offers maximum flexibility so you can focus on your future. Learn more at wgu.edu.