Judging Freedom - What's Wrong with American Diplomacy w/ Larry Johnson fmr CIA

Episode Date: September 19, 2023

What's Wrong with American Diplomacy w/ Larry Johnson fmr CIASee Privacy Policy at https://art19.com/privacy and California Privacy Notice at https://art19.com/privacy#do-not-sell-my-info.

Thank you. Hi, everyone. Judge Andrew Napolitano here for Judging Freedom. Today is Tuesday, September 19th, 2023. Larry Johnson joins us now. Larry, always a pleasure. Thanks, Judge. Thanks for coming back to the show. What is wrong with American diplomacy today? Is it consensus building or coercion? Well, there's no diplomacy. It is bullying and threats. Usually when we have a problem with another country now,

the first response is sanctions. We're going to impose sanctions. Like the other day when Kim Jong-un went to Moscow, Washington, we're going to impose more sanctions. Excuse me? I didn't realize there were any other sanctions to impose. We had already exposed everything. So it's just, and we do the same with China, with India, with Egypt, South Africa.

You know, the short list, as I wrote at Sonar 21, is come up with a list of countries that we haven't imposed sanctions on. So the era of talking to people and trying to understand that, you know what, other countries may have a different point of view than ours, and that does not necessarily make them wrong or evil. What will it take for the people who do the imposition of the sanctions, which is the executive branch, under a Depression-era Supreme Court opinion, the court said the president can oppose whatever sanctions he wants. There's no due process as long as it's a legitimate foreign policy issue, which presidents always claim it is. But what will it take for whoever does this, whether it's Joe Biden or Jake Sullivan or Tony Blinken, to realize that sanctions don't work, don't change government policy? Three generations of Cubans have grown up trying to drive

Chevrolets that were built in 1956 because of our sanctions. Has the public policy of the country changed? Not one whit. Ditto for Iran. So, you know, what I'm afraid will happen, it's just like if, you know, you're told that you need to buy fire insurance for your house and you keep putting it off and you don't do it, then your house burns to the ground. It's only after you burn the house down that you realize, oh, maybe we need to change

what we were doing. And I'm afraid that's going to be the result of a terrible military confrontation that will involve Russia and China. The United States will be militarily defeated and it will be out of those ashes that will come to the realization, you know, we can't go around ordering everybody to do what we want. That we have to live as equals with others in the world. And I mean, that's an alien concept to America. It became particularly prevalent after the dissolution of the Soviet Union in 1991. We were the big dog on the block. We could do what we want. Everybody else had to do what we said. But it's just like with those school bullies you may have dealt with. Yeah, when you're in fifth

grade and the kid's bigger than you, but one day you grow up and you may end up being bigger than the bully. And that is, I'm afraid, the process that's unfolding right now. The United States is making demand after demand after demand, and we're becoming increasingly irrelevant with those demands. How poorly have the sanctions that Biden imposed on all things Russian worked. I think they've helped the Russians and hurt Americans that trade with Russia. Yeah. Well, it's worked wonderfully for Russia. It was a wake-up call that, hey, we can no longer rely upon the West for anything. We're going to have to become self-sufficient. And self-sufficient they are. And in the process, it's caused an economic collapse or the start of a collapse, a depression in Europe. Germany is in the process of de-industrializing itself.

And yet, you know, the hypocrisy in all of this is several of the European nations are still importing oil from Russia. They're just doing it with a middleman in India. So they're paying more now than what they did before. Same with the United States. The United States is still importing uranium from Russia. So it's just this notion, the sanctions, I think, are more often than not political theater targeted at a domestic audience instead of really having teeth and substance that can change the policy of another government. You could probably also argue that the sanctions imposed on Russia are largely responsible for the rise in BRICS

and all the other nations that want to join BRICS. You don't see anybody wanting to join the G7 or the G20 that want to join BRICS. Yeah. Three, four years ago, nobody took BRICS that seriously because it was still seen as G7, G20, U.S. dollar was supreme. Not anymore. And in fact, both Putin and Xi Jinping sent a clear message to the G20, like, you're not worth our time.

We're not coming. We're sending our foreign ministers. I mean, Lavrov is a great representative. He's magnificent. But it was still sending a message to the rest of the G20, you're not relevant. And then, you know, in the aftermath, look at to the rest of the G20, you're not relevant. And then, you know, in the aftermath, look at what's happened in the G20. The Trudeau in Canada has insulted the Indians, Modi.

The Germans have referred to the Chinese and Indians as not really being intellectually capable. I mean, yeah, with friends like this, who needs enemies, huh? What became of the Nord Stream pipeline after it was destroyed? Are Russia and Germany going to rebuild it, or is Germany afraid to do something that the American establishment doesn't want done? I don't know. I've, the only thing I've heard is that Russia is contemplating rebuilding it, but they're not going to rebuild it until they get the relations

sorted out with Germany and the rest of Europe. And that means the end of the war in Ukraine. How would it mean the end of the war in Ukraine? Well, it means until the war in Ukraine is over and finished, and they've settled that, because in the process of settling that war, it will wind up settling relations with NATO and with Europe. Right. Does Russia have some weapon, either new and unused or known to us, but that we can't resist or shoot down or stop? Well, they already have two versions of the hypersonic missile that we have no defense for. So they've already, the Kinzhal and the Zircon. But on top of that, Putin made some statements at the International Economic Forum last week in Vladivostok,

in which he intimated that Russia has some other weapons that it has developed that are not conventional, and it's led to a lot of speculation regarding directed energy, laser, etc., that Russia may in fact have made some leaps ahead in technology. What's relevant about this is, if I can take you back five years ago when Russia was saying that it had developed hypersonic missiles and everybody in the West laughed and derided them. Oh, that's ridiculous. Russia's so backwards.

Russia's incompetent. Russia doesn't have the capability. Well, nobody's incompetent. Russia doesn't have the capability. Well, nobody's laughing now. In fact, it was a year ago, March 13th in 2022, at a base out in Western Ukraine, that the Russians hit it with one of their hypersonic missiles. And I know for a fact that the guys at the Department of Defense and the joint staff were shocked. They couldn't believe it. They had no warning. Where did that come from? It hit them blind and it killed some NATO personnel. So that was the Russians sending a clear message. Not only do they have the ability to develop it, they have developed it,

deployed it in at least two forms, and it's been used in combat. And with an $880 billion annual defense budget, we haven't developed anything as powerful as that, nor anything that could shoot it down if it were aimed at the East coast of the united states hell we can't even keep track of our f-35s you know you've got to find a button like yeah find my f-35 hey public would you come help us look for this 80 billion dollar aircraft where it is oh you know we need to look in the mirror and just arrogance is going to be, what happened to that F 35? Do you know? Well, they finally,

talking about the one over South Carolina. Yeah. Yeah. They finally found the wreckage. They found a wreckage trail. Now it's still not clear why it came down. They still are. They're taking great pains to hide the identity of the pilot. That tells me you've either got a female or somebody who fits the woke agenda, because if it was your conventional white Caucasian guy

flying the plane, his name would be out there. Could it be some sort of intelligence thing like that plane that went down in the 50s in Warner Robins, Georgia, and they refused to reveal who was on it because there were intel people there. No, no, that's not. This was an F-35. And the other issue with it, there was a wingman. I'm not even sure they call it wingman now. Maybe it was a wing they, wing them. But they should have seen it.

All right, so there were two people on it and they both were saved? No, there was one flying. There were two planes flying, one next to the other. The other one goes down. The other plane should have seen it. One spotted where the pilot ejected. Number two should have seen where the plane crashed. And, you know, so there's a lot not known about this right now.

And it is, it's not so much, I don't think they're hiding anything secret. I think they're hiding incompetence. What do you think is behind the extraordinary media, media drum beating in support of Ukraine. I mean, we're going to watch Joe Biden in a minute, but tomorrow's New York Times is going to make him sound like Ronald Reagan or Paul VI or one of those great speeches that was given at the UN in the past 50 years, rather than the stumbling, bumbling, worried about re-election political hack that he is. Well, I'm not sure the media parade is as enthusiastic as it once was, because you note that today, the day that Zelensky arrives in New York. The New York Times comes out with an article saying, oh, the Ukrainians were responsible for bombing that civilian market that they blamed on the Russians last week. The timing of that is

not coincidental. It wasn't that the New York Times said, oh, hey, we got a good story. Let's just run with it today. No, that was timed as a sort of a shot across the bow of Zelensky. And if you saw any of the footage of the Ukrainian delegation at the UN, Zelensky and his buddies, the little green men, they're all dressed like they're miniature Fidel Castros. They didn't look happy. They all looked like they had a bit of constipation or stomach upset. While you're mentioning that, we'll run a clip of President Biden, who in my view is off the wall, saying that Russia could have resolved this diplomatically. Ukraine could have resolved it diplomatically, saying Russia alone can stop the war. He alone can stop the war. He alone can stop the war.

But watch, the camera pans, about a minute and 20 seconds, but the camera pans to President Zelensky quite a bit. And he is just the way you described him, looking very unhappy, almost as if he has a stomach ailment or there's a foul odor around him or he can't wait to get out of there. Watch this. We strongly support Ukraine and its efforts to bring about a diplomatic resolution that delivers just and lasting peace. But Russia alone, Russia alone bears responsibility for this war. Russia alone has the power to end this war immediately. And it's Russia alone that stands in the way of peace, because Russia's price for peace is Ukraine's capitulation, Ukraine's territory, and Ukraine's children. Russia believes that the world will grow weary and allow it to brutalize Ukraine without

consequence. But I ask you this — if we abandon the core principles of the United States to appease an aggressor, can any member state in this body feel confident that they are protected? If we allow Ukraine to be carved up, is the independence of any nation secure? I'd respectfully suggest the answer is no. We have to stand up to this naked aggression today and deter other would-be aggressors tomorrow. That's why the United States, together with our allies and partners around the world, will continue to stand with the brave people of Ukraine as they defend their sovereignty and territorial integrity and their freedom.

Gosh, I think it's more than the New York Times that he's upset about. He just looks absolutely miserable. One wonders if Jake Sullivan didn't whisper into the ear of his Ukrainian counterpart, we need an off-ramp because this is just not going well. Yeah, well, they are not winning. They're taking terrible losses on the battlefield. The promised F-16s, M1 Abrams that are being sent are going to make zero difference as far as the outcome of this. And, again, it's just the article in the New York Times is not the only sign.

And, you know, Biden, watching Biden talk, the guy does not inspire confidence. No, no, he was just dreadful, dreadful. I mean, if you know the ventriloquist Jeff Dunham, he's got a dummy called Walter, a cranky old man. Honest to God, it looks like the twin brother of Joe Biden, except the dummy's more articulate than

Joe Biden. Joe Biden is not articulate. And as one of our viewers points out, Zelensky's an actor. I don't know what was animating that sour, dour look on his face.

Maybe his PR people told them, you know, you're in an international stage. Pretend to be serious. Pretend to be angry. And I also didn't notice until you pointed it out that his whole entourage is dressed the way he is. It used to be just he dressed in that in that military green, but that word seems to have spread to all of his people. But do you think that the Western press is either getting tired of cheerleading, or do you think CIA and MI6 are starting to feed other information to the Western press as a way to sort of set the table for the gradual wind down of this? I don't know. What do you think? Yeah, no, I think it's a combination of both. Yeah, there are some in

the journalistic community that are going to continue wearing that cheerleader outfit until the bitter end. But there are others who are coming to grips with the fact, no, this is not going as well as was said. Congress is going to have a major say in this, that with the need to refund the government, re-up the money, that may be potentially held hostage to those who want to end the funding for Ukraine. You know, I know Marjorie Taylor Greene's already on the record saying, hey, if they're going to send more money to Ukraine, I'm not voting. And I can see a couple of Democrats, let's say from Hawaii, who represent Maui, you know, they might be saying, hey, let's get some money to Maui as opposed to sending it to Kiev. I hear you. I hear you, Larry. But you know how extensive the war party is.

Oh, yeah. There are there. I am. Ninety nine percent with those courageous 44 Republicans in the House who are serious conservatives and serious libertarians. But Kevin McCarthy is lockstep with Chuck Schumer on this stuff. And they have enough Democrats to negate those Republicans who will vote no on the money. I think Joe Biden's going to get another $28 billion. What is he going to do with another $28 billion except allow Zelensky to buy another mansion or villa somewhere? Yeah, he's already got his mother-in-law taken care of. The problem, we can allocate money to send weapons, you know, tanks, F-16s, HIMARS, M777 artillery pieces. We can do all that, but when that equipment gets to Ukraine, the problem is who is going to use it?

The size of the casualties they are suffering are approaching like some of the major battles in World War II. You remember the Battle of Stalingrad, I think the Russians lost close to 900,000 men in just that one battle over a four or five month period. So here you have Ukraine really probably in excess of 500,000 killed in action. So where do you get the replacements from? You know, yeah, you can run out and grab them off the street, but that doesn't mean even if you send them to four or five weeks of a basic training, it does not equip them to operate sophisticated equipment like an artillery piece

or drive a tank or launch a HIMARS. So they're going to have to increasingly rely upon foreigners to do that. Do your sources indicate to you if Biden has surreptitiously inserted more Americans out of uniform so he can say no boots on the ground into the battlefield? Well, if that is how it would be done. I mean, that's how we've done it over the years of the last, you know, 70 plus years since the CIA has been set up. You don't send in people with, you know, what they call black passports or red passports that are diplomatic. You send people who are undercover or in contract relationships that the CIA will have some plausible deniability. Even sending those kind of people in, there's limits to what can be done. And the risks that are incurred, you know, they recognize a good chance of at least being wounded, if not outright killed. And survivor benefits, they don't have the benefit of survivor benefits that would normally

accompany a U.S. government employee if they're, in fact, in a contract relationship. So Ukraine has a manpower problem. That's the simplest way to put it. Well, the fools in the American government, blinken to austin to sullivan to the president if he even knows what's going on should recognize and understand that i mean are we at the point now where this is all about getting joe biden re-elected now with that i think that was the plan six months ago i think there's really the dawning realization, after watching Biden's performance at the UN,

he's not going to make it to the election, much less to be inaugurated for a second term. They've got to figure out what they're going to do with him. And this kind of mental incompetence that he displays, the rest of the world sees it. Now, I can understand Democrats refusing to admit it, but please, even the people from Africa, Asia, Europe, they see it. They recognize he's not competent. They call him, the telegram channels, the Russian telegram channels, they make fun of him as the demented grandfather. So, you know, it raises real questions about the competence of America's leadership.

And they're coming up against some real hard decisions and this you know this this is as perilous a time as uh you and i have experienced in our lifetimes which go back to you know we started off in the 50s uh this this this will put the cuban missile crisis of 62 to shame what are your thoughts on how much longer the combat will go on? Will Putin march to Kiev? Will Ukrainian troops, such as they are remaining, just throw down their weapons and walk home? Or will this stalemate along these battle lines just continue on and on and on? If they go to Kiev, they're not going to go much farther beyond that, I believe. Because I think Russia is really having

the Kremlin, not just Putin, Putin, the generals, the intelligence services, they're all having a discussion about how much of Ukraine do they really want to have to worry about? They don't want to get locked into controlling territory

where everybody in there is predisposed to hate them. So, you know, I think they're thinking this through. They recognize that their current strategy, which is defensive attrition, they're able to destroy inbound equipment. They are targeting warehouses. They are targeting troop assembly points. They are targeting key technological junctions, and they're destroying that.

They continue to destroy troops and recognize that Ukraine is going to reach a tipping point at some point. I think it'll be this before December, because they don't have the ability to sustain it. But ultimately, what the West does can be a determining factor. If the United States, Britain, and Germany continue to pour billions of dollars into Ukraine, they may figure out a way to hang on. And frankly, I think Russia may see that as not a bad way to bleed the West dry. Larry, always a pleasure. We'll see you again Friday with Ray McGovern for our Intelligence Roundtable. Thanks very much for joining us.

Thank you, Judge. Oh, and Larry, over the weekend, we surpassed, you may know this, 200,000 subscribers on this show. Thanks in no small measure to you and all the time you've generously given us my deep personal and professional gratitude. You're most welcome. Thank you. Thank you. We have Professor Jeffrey Sachs at 4.30 Eastern today, and he's really sticking his neck out on this one. God bless him. Where did COVID originate? You don't want to miss that. Judge Napolitano for judging freedom. Thank you.