Judging Freedom - Zelenskyy vows to defeat Putin/ JFK assassination update - Ray McGovern

Episode Date: May 8, 2023

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Hi, everyone. Judge Andrew Napolitano here for Judging Freedom. Today is Monday, May 8th, 2023. It's about 11 o'clock in the morning here on the East Coast of the United States. Ray McGovern joins us for his weekly Monday session with us. Ray, always a pleasure. Thank you very much for joining us. I want to run a clip for you which shows President Zelensky giving a highly produced talk. We're only going to run about 30 seconds of it. Vowing a victory that will be appreciated by Ukraine, by Europe, and by all freedom-loving peoples in the West. Take a listen and let me know what you think of it.

We fight now so that no one ever again enslaves other nations and destroys other countries. And all those old evils that modern Russia is bringing back will be defeated just as Nazism was defeated. We will rebuild what was destroyed, and together we will protect it all. We do not yet know the date of our victory, but we know that it will be a holiday for all of Ukraine, for all of Europe, for all of Europe,

for all of the entire free world. Does he need to rally his country or his troops or his intelligence community behind him with something as highly produced as that, while bombs are dropping over Kiev? The judge, he's an actor. It is a supremely good act of somebody who's defending their country till the end. And a few weeks, he'll be in Cyprus in his villa, and the Ukrainian people will be left to their own devices. I mean, you have to remember that he's just playing a role. And, you know the important thing is is what people like john kirby

of all people of the white house national security spokesperson says we've given ukraine 98 percent of what they need we've done our part now it's up to them to see how they can do well most credible people believe they can't do. Most credible people say that the next couple of months is going to be a disaster for the Ukrainian army or what's left of it. So will the U.S. then be in a position to say, well, we did everything we could, you know, let's make the best deal we can. I think that's likely. And I think the Chinese might actually be able to play a helpful role in brokering this kind of deal. When you say the Chinese might be able to play a helpful role in brok where the two militaries currently are, and then negotiations going on, supervised by or mediated by the Chinese while the ceasefire is being enforced?

Yes, I refer to the miracle that China has just worked in the Middle East with Iran and Saudi Arabia getting together. My God, who thought that would happen? Xi Jinping is sending a special representative around Europe to talk to the relevant people to persuade them, look, we need to have a ceasefire. We need to start talking. And we need to do the best deal we can. Gradually, when this counteroffensive by Ukraine either falls short, gets destroyed, or doesn't even happen, something else is going to happen.

And with the whole world saying, hey, the Pope, the Chinese, even Lukashenko in Belarus, they all say we'll have a ceasefire and talk. Let's do it. I don't think that even blinking, even with those blinkers on, so to speak, and Sullivan and Nolan will be able to resist that kind of thing. You mentioned miracles in the Middle East. reports last night that, sorry, our colleague Larry Johnson reports last night that Syria has joined the Arab League or the Arab League has admitted Syria as a member. I mean, where does that put U.S. troops that are there fighting against President Assad? Like that is really an American national security interest, but they've been there since the George W. Bush days. Well, President Trump explained why they're there. They're for the oil.

We get the oil. We take the oil. We take that oil. They're not going to be there very much longer, as you point out. The only thing that I would have added to Larry's article is that you can't mention Syria without mentioning Israel. Why do we go into Syria in the first place? It's very simple. Actually, in September, September 6th, you can look it up, New York Times, front page, lead article.

Jody Ruderin, New York Times Bureau Chief in Jerusalem, talks to the Israeli officials. She says, you know, all this stuff going on here with the insurgency and the counterinsurgency and the brutal dictator there in Damascus. What do you make of that? What's your preferred outcome? And Alon Pincus, high level. See, he used to be head of the Israeli office in New York. He says, now, Jody, this doesn't sound very good. I'm sorry, but our preferred outcome is no outcome.

She said, Alon, no outcome? She said, allons, no outcome, what do you mean? She says, well, you know, this doesn't sound very good, but, you know, as long as the Shia and Sunni are killing each other off, as long as it keeps hemorrhaging, we have nothing to fear from Syria.

And she says, oh, and mirabilidicto, by some kind of miracle, the editors and the censors are all off in Southampton sipping martinis because it's Liberty Weekend. And she gets it on the first page of the New York Times. Now, that's the answer. That's why Syria, Syria's no threat to us. And, of course, Syria's a pal of Iran at the time. So all I'm saying here is this is a real blow to Israel, first and foremost, not so much to the U.S.

They can protect those 200 troops up there in the north for a while and take some more oil before they take off and come back home. There is circulating this morning the story in which it is alleged that a Russian hypersonic missile destroyed a Ukrainian bunker 100 meters below the earth. And in the bunker were American, British, and Polish military officers, including some generals. The story suggests that it might be a ruse. How do things like that get out there? Would something like this have been manufactured by the Ukraine intelligence community? Would the CIA have looked the other way as this stuff leaked out? I mean, if an American general, if an American general was killed in Ukraine, wouldn't we know about it no matter how quiet the government

wanted to keep it? Not necessarily, not for a while. This is very sensitive stuff. One way we know about this is from local Ukrainian sources, local newspapers and broadcasts in that very area, which talk about, you know, a calamitous event on that day. You know, it bothers me that it hasn't been able to be confirmed yet. Nobody has stepped up and said, yeah, this is the case, but it's altogether possible this is in the far western reaches of Ukraine. They would have a bunker in Ukraine, and there would be NATO officers in there, and these hypersonic Kinzhal missiles are quite capable of penetrating that far and that deep. So I tend to believe it's a real situation as the as the months go by and no generals come home in coffins at least through uh through delaware where they usually come home then i'd begin to say well

maybe it didn't happen whatever that thing did hit and there was damage how many people survived or how many people were killed i just don't know over the weekend the ukrainians claimed uh that they shot down a russian hypersonic missile now a hypersonic missile goes 10 times the speed of sound almost an unimaginable speed is it possible the ukrainians could have shot one down? Do they have that equipment and the skills to do that? No. The answer to that is no. You know, the Ukrainians make all kinds of claims. I find it kind of interesting or ironic that one of their top generals is Ilyushny.

Ilyushny, but it sounds very much like illusionary. And a lot of things that he and other Ukrainians say are delusional or illusional, depending on how you define those terms. All right. At the same time that President Zelensky has said we're going to kill the Nazi Russians. Russia vows to defeat the Nazi Ukrainians. So the Nazis are painting somebody with a brush of being a Nazi. It's obviously the boogeyman in Ukraine. What is the significance of today, which is May 8, maybe May 9 already, in parts of Russia for these kinds of you're a Nazi, no, you're a Nazi allegations to be made? Well, you have to start with the fact that World War II, the end of World War II in Europe is a major, the major celebration in Russia now.

Everyone, every family lost someone. Okay. 26 million plus. Wow. 26 million Russian human beings, military, civilian combined, died in World War II. Most people say 27 million. Putin has said 26 million plus. It's typical for him not to exaggerate, believe it or not. Anyhow, how many U.S. troops were killed? Not many U.S. civilians. How many? I think it's 440,000. Now, each of those troops, that's a tragedy, but you do the math, okay? 26 million against 440,000. It's a big deal. We have never experienced, except for Pearl Harbor,

an attack or war on the United States of America. The Russians all have. Now, that terrible event came at the hands of people called Nazis, all right, Germans. And there were people in Ukraine who are being honored and who have been, there are anniversary celebrations and statues erected to them, Bandera among them, who cooperated with the SS, who was in effect the arm of the SS, killed tens of thousands of Poles, Hungarians, Ukrainians, and some Russians, okay? Now the Russians look on this and say, my God, what's going on here? These guys are very influential. When Zelensky became president, and he promised to have a better relationship with Russia, right? Remember that? He went out to the Donbass and he said, okay, I want to talk to the leading general out here. It was the Azov battalion, a Nazi battalion. He says, look, could you stop

shelling the Donbass for a while? We're trying to work a better relationship with Russia. And he looked at Zelensky and said, who the hell are you? Zelensky said, I'm the president. Get out of here. And he got out of there. How do I know that? The Ukrainian press. Now, so Zelensky is between a rock and a hard place. The hard place is the Nazis.

The rock is Washington. He's not a free agent, but he's a terrific actor. Wow. I see over your left shoulder a book which I have read on a bookshelf,

not on your shelf, called JFK and the Unspeakable, or words to that effect. It argues and argues persuasively that the American intelligence community was largely responsible for his assassination. A theory that has been out there for many years, for a long time, was considered tinfoil hat type craziness. Now, over the past weekend, Robert F. Kennedy Jr., the nephew of JFK, the son of Robert F. Kennedy, similarly assassinated, has argued that both his uncle and his father were killed by, he didn't say the intelligence community, named the CIA directly.

And rather than treat this as a tinfoil hat nonsense, the New York Times and other mainstream media have picked it up. A, what do you think of this theory? I can only imagine because that book is over your shoulder. B, why is the mainstream media picking it up now? And C, does this have, as we say in the media, legs? Is this more than just a two-day story? Well, let's pick number two first, which was, let's go to the first one. Sorry about that.

Okay. Now, the book is entirely credible. When you look at a good book, you look at the author, obviously. No access to grind. He's a Catholic worker, for God's sake, who set up a Catholic worker house in Birmingham, Alabama, and he works out of an office on the tracks of the railroad because that's the cheapest place to live. He's written lots of this kind of book.

It was published by Dan Ellsberg's son, Robert Ellsberg, and it got a bunch of attention when Oliver Stone took it out to one of these talk shows and says, you got to read this book. Suffice it to say, it says, yeah, the CIA, the top military who didn't want the communists to take over Vietnam. After all, JFK had issued two executive orders to draw down troops from Vietnam before he was killed. Now, one of the little factoids that I make people know is that exactly a month after the JFK assassination, President Truman wrote an op-ed appearing in the Washington Post. And he said, you know, I think it's time to rein in the CIA. It's not doing the kinds of

things that I created it for, namely intelligence analysis without treatment. It's doing other things, okay? It was a, it was a torrid sort of thing, exactly one month after the assassination. It appeared in the first edition of the Washington Post. There used to be two later editions. Disappeared. Any other broadcast media or any other paper? No. In the Independent Sentinel, whatever it was in the Missouri, it was published.

It completely. I mean, the press was onto it even then. Worst came to worst with Alan Dulles, the previous head of the CIA, who had mousetrapped Kennedy into the Bay of Pigs fiasco, was appointed by President Johnson to be pretty much the head of the Warren Commission investigating the assassination. When people like me said, no, it's a little odd because a lot of people think the CIA may have been involved. After all, there's a lot of circumstantial.

You know what they said? That's a conspiracy theory. Conspiracy theory. Conspiracy theory. Now, that's what gave that whole charge of conspiracy theory its legs, okay? Now, will this thing have legs? It all depends on how much control the deep state can exercise over the media. They've been immensely successful so far.

Look at the Hunter Biden thing, for God's sake. Now, if Robert Kennedy Jr. can force this up and out, and have decent people take another look at it, it's going to be very damning. Because why indeed is the CIA, why is the FBI refusing to declassify documents that by act of Congress should have been declassified three years ago? Why are they doing that? You know, I don't know. I don't want to be a conspiracy theorist, but they might have something to hide. Let me just jump in at this point on what you just said, because of conversations, which I've discussed publicly, as has he. So I'm not revealing any secrets.

Conversations I had with President Trump when he was in the White House. So he called me about two or three weeks before he left office to ask my opinion on some of the people he was about to pardon. And then I said, Mr. President, after giving him my opinion on the pardons, and I won't mention any of those names, but Mr. President, do you remember promising me personally and the American public that you would, before you leave the White House, open up the JFK assassination files? Yes, I do remember promising that. Well, you only have two weeks left. And he said to me, Judge, if you saw what I saw, you wouldn't open up those files either. And I said, what do you mean?

He said, someday when we're talking together and there aren't 15 people listening, because he was calling me from the White House switchboard, I will tell you what I saw. Then we ended the conversation. What could he have seen? He could have seen the truth. He could have seen the plotting. It all fits together very nicely. This book is based on all the evidence up to date. That's about 15 years ago. But there's secret evidence in CIA cables and FBI cables and so forth. It's got to be there, otherwise they would release it. So the teaching point I take from this judge is that the presidents of the United States, including Donald Trump, are too afraid to do what they can do on their own authority. That's big.

Who's running this country? The people who are successful in preventing the president from doing what he is not only entitled to do by law, but required to do. Okay. Now, when Trump got up about four years ago and said, today's the day by act of Congress, I have to release these documents having to do with the Kennedy assassination. It was odd because five hours later, he got up before the same microphone and he said, and this is a quote, I've just talked to the FBI and the CIA. They say we can't release these documents. And so we're going to push it back six months, which is technically within the president's prerogative to do, okay? So,

McGovern makes a little note of six months, you know, six months, he asks the question, nobody remembers, nobody wants to ask, they're afraid, and they have good reason to be afraid, and that's what Bobby Kennedy Jr. is trying to get at, who would feel more strongly about getting to the truth on this than the nephew of JFK and the son of Bobby Kennedy. So I do think it will have legs. How soon the media can cut Bobby off at the legs remains to be seen, but they're already doing a pretty good smear job on him, raising this stuff about vaccinations and all this business.

It doesn't really matter. What they should do is cue in on what his uncle said at American University. Almost exactly, what is it, 63. Do the math. June, 63. We should have a decent relationship with Russia. My God, we almost blew up the whole world. Let's work together because humanity should be served by responsible statespeople.

That's what is, that's in a nutshell what his uncle said. And if he runs on that kind of platform, I dare say if he gets a modicum of coverage in the media, he has a good chance of displacing this benighted view that we can still be the indispensable country in the world. Wow. Fascinating stuff, Ray. Thank you very much. Thank you for joining us. These Monday mornings with you are absolutely spectacular. In fact, I'm so addicted to them, we might have to throw in an occasional Thursday afternoon just to sate my appetite. And of course, the Judging Freedom audience loves your wisdom as well. Thanks for joining us. You're most welcome. Boy, if you like that, like and subscribe.

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