Juicy Scoop with Heather McDonald - Dancing for The Devil and Chris Franjola on JLO Divorce

Episode Date: June 18, 2024

Chris Franjola is here! We talk Father’s Day and my Cabo vacation. The Pope met with 100 comedians and I was not one of them and I think I know why. A politician created fake social media accounts to bully himself. Scooter Braun will no longer manager music acts. Legos are being stolen. Are John Travolta and Kristin Davis really dating? Then I talked to Katie Paulson who played an important role in getting the story behind the Netflix documentary, Dancing for the Devil. We discuss a cult verses a religion. We share how concerned family members should approach a loved one who might be in a cult. What has the aftermath been for the families and the dancers since the airing of the documentary? So juicy. Enjoy!  Get 20% OFF @honeylove by going to https://honeylove.com/JUICY ! #honeylovepod Go to https://Ro.Co/JuicyScoop. Sign up today and you’ll pay just $99 for your first month—and $145 a month after that. Medication costs are separate. This summer you can book whoever you want to be on Booking.com, Booking.yeah! Book today at https://Booking.com or on the app. Go to https://TheOuai.com and use code JUICY for 15% off your entire purchase. Wash your OUAI to healthier hair with shampoos and conditioners made just for you. Go to https://ProlonLife.com/JUICYSCOOP for a special offer: 15% off their 5-day nutrition program Shop Juicy Scoop Merch https://juicyscoopshop.com  Get EXTRA Juicy on Patreon https://www.patreon.com/juicyscoop  Follow Me on Social Media Instagram: https://www/instagram.com/heathermcdonald  TikTok: https://www.tiktok.com/@heathermcdonald  Twitter: https://twitter.com/HeatherMcDonald Learn more about your ad choices. Visit podcastchoices.com/adchoices

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and serial data and serial system. You'll be addicted and addicted fast to the number one tabloid real life podcast. Listen in, listen up. Hannah McDonald, Juicy Scoop. Hello and welcome to Juicy Scoop. Listen in, listen up. Woo woo. Heather McDonald. Juicy Scoop. Hello and welcome to Juicy Scoop. I have your favorite blue eyed smiley delight.

Yes. Daddy Chris Frangiola. Happy Father's Day. Thank you very much. What a day it was. What did you do, Chris? Well, you know, my wife's dad's still alive, so they go there. I didn't, so I don't get anything.

I just, my mom, my wife's like, you're not my dad. I was like, I guess that's true, and my daughter doesn't care. So yeah, nothing. It's really interesting because, you know, I saw a lot online for Mother's Day about people educating mothers who now have sons that are married to women and they have kids and that you should step back and not be demanding of their time or what they wanna do.

You should be like to your son, do what's right for your wife. I had the mothers, I had the breakfast in bed and all that, like it's not about me. Yeah. But I think it's also about how the kid wants to spend their time. Like if you were like, I want to do this for my dad

because he'll be hurt, then... Yeah. It's a hard thing to navigate. I say, here's something... It should have been about me, right? It should have been about me. I think it should have been I would I would have done Okay, okay if I don't really remember I had a lot of Father's Day with my dad and I Peter never really cared So I think we would it would be the summer and like whatever my mom would make some food and we would do like a barbecue

We live next door. It was very convenient to celebrate both Yeah, but what I would say to somebody else that like lives within the area and make some food and we would do like a barbecue. We lived next door. It was very convenient to celebrate both. Yeah. But what I would say to somebody else that like lives within the area, why don't you like do something with your dad on Saturday night or ask your husband, would you like to celebrate on Saturday or would you like to celebrate Sunday

and what would you do? Now with me, so it was Peter, right? Right. So we just had a great time in Cabo, which I'll get into. But wake up that day, I'm like, what do you want? Like I'll go to the bagel place, get what you want, you know? And then they wanted to play golf. And I was like, okay, well, they have a really nice thing at the club at four o'clock with lobster tail. He's like, no, no, don't want

to do that. Don't want to do it. And I was like, all right, well, I guess we can come join you and we'll just eat at the casual spot. Well, they closed the casual spot at the club because they had all their people working on the fancy four o'clock lobster tail. So then they went and they picked up California pita for us on the way home and we all ate out of styrofoam. That's what he wanted.

Yeah, I think that's- Like who cares? I'm just like whatever you want. Yeah, my family left and I stayed at home with peace and quiet, which was the greatest gift I could have ever gotten. Yeah, exactly. But I can't say that, of course. I can't say that. But you can also just, I think the biggest thing is just communicate, whether it's Mother's Day, someone's birthday. Yeah. Just be like, what do you, and if your mind changes halfway through the day and you're like, I don't wanna put on makeup and go to this dinner, or I don't, you know.

Right, well, and also there was, I don't know if you've noticed in your neighborhood, there's some ash in the air. There's like ash flying around. No, I didn't notice that. I was outside and I thought it was a beautiful day outside. It is a beautiful day, but there seems to be some ash on my car and stuff.

Oh. So I woke up in the morning on Sunday, Father's Day, and I saw some ash on my car, and my wife and my daughter came with me on an investigation around the neighborhood to see where the ash was coming from. Where was it coming from? Well, apparently it's coming from a fire somewhere kind of far away. So you had to do something fun that you're interested in. So that was a big day for us, investigating the ash.

And that was done by 8 a.m. Okay. Yeah, thank you. Courtney Kardashian dragged her husband, Travis Barker, wearing all black on a day that was well over 80 degrees to Disney World. I know. Oh, Disney World. So they were actually in Florida, which is probably hotter.

It says Disney World on this. I mean, was it Disney World? Yeah, maybe. Who knows? I don't know. I'm going to Disney World. You are? For the first time ever, I'm going to Epcot Center because this weekend I have a show in Tampa and then a show Friday in Orlando.

Oh, okay. So Thursday, Tampa, Friday, Orlando, and then a Juicy Scooper is going to show us around. Epcot Center? Epcot Center, so we're doing that Saturday. I'm like, let's just pick one world. So we picked Epcot Center. Oh, is that like a, it's the international or something?

Yes. You can go to different countries. But I'm going with Brandon and I'm like, Brandon, if it's hot as shit, if we're over it by three o'clock, like you gotta act like an 18 year old man and we gotta cut it down. Like, which he will, he'll be cool about it.

So, but I doubt, I can't imagine a lot of dads saying, for Father's Day, I would like to go to an amusement park. Well, how old is their child? It's not even old enough to get it, right? Yeah, it's like, the baby's not even one. Yeah, so there's no reason. There's no reason. They really want another kid?

Is Travis Barker into rides or something? They are into Disneyland stuff. They are like adult Disney people. They had an old 1960s themed Disneyland baby shower. Yeah, that's fun. You study, that's a weird area. Yeah. Adult Disney people, it's a strange area.

It just is. It is. I know there are people who love it, but it's a weird area. Um Now is he I know you've talked about this on the podcast in the past, but is he considered rodent hot? Is he yes a hundred percent? He's tattooed rodent, but I think he's a little too old to be rodent He's been around a while now. Yeah. Yeah, who do you think was the original? But if you see him like when he was a teenager before all the tats, yeah He was just straight up rodent nerd.

Yeah, okay. The tats made him, you know, and his talent made him sexy. Right. Yeah. I mean, I don't think I'm ever gonna get a break in this town because... No.

...I was never good-looking enough to be in, like, the Brad Pitt, the hot era. Right. You know, the era of those guys when really good-looking was it. I wasn't that good-looking. And then... You're not a character actor. Right. You know, the era of those guys when really good looking was it. I wasn't that good looking. And then... You're not a character actor. Right. You're not super hot. But I think you and I fall into somewhat attractive. Yeah, exactly. There was a breakdown,

somewhat attractive. I can go for that. But you're not Rodan Tyler. Neither am I. I wouldn't be considered Rodan, which is a hot thing now. You know what, I should have leaned into more just being an ugly dork. Yeah. Like I would put on too much makeup and look too cute when I should have gone for ugly dork because the few parts I got, I was a dork.

Like when I guest starred on Frasier, it was like he was on a horrible date, a speed date with me being like, argh, you know what that latest R rated movie was rated? What the joke was. Have you heard of that new pirate movie? And then he goes, no, I have not. And then Kelsey Graven and I go, it's rated R.

And they zoomed in on me and kind of like, you look dorky. And I'm like, I should have just, if my parents hadn't told me that I was so gorgeous, I should have embraced the character dork face. And I think I could have gotten more work. Could have been a romantic comedy with Barry Keegan or whatever that weird looking guy is. He's the one who did all this.

He came out of nowhere. That's a salt-born guy. Salt-born guy, yeah, a weird looking guy. That looks like he's 40, yeah. And then people say Adam Driver's the one who... Adam Driver is the one, but because when it started, I thought when it started when he was screwing in the movie Gills, I thought he was ugly

and they were an equally unattractive bunch. But he's a good looking guy. But then I was like, no wait, he's hot. Like he's sexy, he's fit. I know. And then she just kept casting hot guys that were in love with her, which I also love. She's the Woody Allen of our time. She's the female Woody Allen.

Lena Dunham. Lena Dunham. In that show, she was the female Woody Allen that convinced us that all these guys would be attracted to her because you keep seeing it and you're like, yeah, that's absolutely ... Talk about rodent hot. She's like a wombat. Okay.

I want to talk about vacation because this New York Post talked about like a TikTok or something where this girl said, I paid all this money, thousands of dollars to treat my parents. She was 37. She treated, or her parents were celebrating their 36th wedding anniversary. So she sent them to Hawaii and on a beautiful trip and all this stuff, and they started texting her being like, oh my God, the food is so expensive here. And she's like, Mom, enjoy the free hotel and the free flight.

And the mom wrote back like, well, you should have looked into an Airbnb where I could have gotten some groceries and made my own meals. And I remember my mom saying that some of this young girl in her real estate office had finally sold some houses. And she took her whole family that was all kind of fucked up and estranged on a cruise. And my mom went to dinner with her and she was like, the whole family complained about the food on the cruise,

this on the cruise. And I remember that as a young person being like, you know what, don't expect people to be super grateful for shit like that, especially your family. No, vacations, because eventually they become the people that they are, you know? Regardless of they're getting stuff for free, they become, vacations are tough for like groups of people. We had a great, great vacation, vacations are tough for like groups of people. We had a great, great vacation. Here we are.

We went to the Gran Velas in Los Cablos. Los Cabo, I just said Cabo. And the four of us went, kind of did a birthday celebration, a father's day celebration, ran and graduated from high school. Now it was great because we're 18 and 21. Also it was great because it was all inclusive. And very, from high school. Now it was great because they're 18 and 21. Also it was great because it was all inclusive. Right. And very, very high end. Now can I ask you about all- most delicious food ever. All inclusive. Is that really all inclusive? Yes. Or do people like,

they, you know, when you hear all inclusive, like you don't have to tip, right? But then they wait- You don't have to tip and they don't sniff around for a tip. They don't end up looking for a little extra on top? We would tip at the restaurants and tip here and there. I tipped at the spa. You have to pay for the spa. But it's completely up to you. They are not expecting every time to bring a drink for you to do that.

Because you pay. But they're not going to talk shit about you. If this was below deck. Yes, no, they're not gonna talk shit. And what I love about this place in particular is you actually, on a vacation, sometimes you hear the food noise and the money noise in your head.

And every time you go to eat, you're like, well, am I full weight? Are we paid for the buffet? Let me like stuff my face like I'm a bear or whatever. A Drake went with a family where it was, you could choose the days of inclusive. So they did two days of inclusive and then two not. And then the day before the not started,

they were just like forcing the boys to like stuff their faces like they were bears. And I was like, okay, now that's not a vacation. Like this, what I love is that I didn't overeat. I ate really, really well. I didn't over drink because I'm like, and if my drink was like warm or whatever, I was like, I'll have a new one.

Yeah. I'm not shoving it down my gullet. Cause you got to pay 14 bucks. It's more relaxing. Yeah. It's more relaxing and fun. But Drake does tend to complain sometimes. And I told him at one point, I said,

I need you to put all your complaints in your notes section of your phone. And once we get home to Woodland Hills, then you can tell me if there's anything you didn't like about the trip. Did you hear them when he got home? That was enough for me to tell, and then he stopped. Then he realized, and he wasn't complaining about a lot,

just like, oh, this little thing. And I'm like, I don't want to hear anything from you. Like, this is so fun and so relaxing also I never left the result resort which is a new thing I do yeah never leave that's what you're supposed to do kind of right you don't have to all the restaurants are beautiful we didn't have to go atv we didn't go down a zipline no one got hurt Mayan ruins or anything like that. No one slipped and fall. No one got a cold. Got a little sunburn, but that's it. And yeah, we rocked it. And you had a pony of some sort.

I have a fake pony that's changed my life. Is that right? Changed my life. Who puts that in? Me. Oh. All I do is I put my hair in a bun and then it fits over the bun. And now I don't have to blow out my hair,

I don't have to try to make my curls work and it's not hot. Is that real hair? Is it hair from? No, I think at one time it was someone's real hair. Okay. I don't know who she is but she enjoyed her time in Mexico. Oh, that's good to hear. Like a heart transplant. Yeah, exactly.

I want to go visit my hair. It's been, Heather Ritual's been enjoying it. And then I just have to go, thank you for giving me the best trip of my life. Without your hair pony, I wouldn't have a good time. I hope this bald gal saw the pictures, you know. Now I know some people are going to be like, oh Heather, you with your weird fake pony. But all these housewives wear fake hair all the time. And I'm like, it just, it kind of ups your look.

It's comfortable. All right. I love it. I'm not saying it looks bad. The fake pony is coming with me to Italy, so get ready. It is? Yes, I found a spot in the suitcase. Oh, the other thing is I didn't post until I came home.

And that makes my time much better. Because people don't realize how much time. But you were posting while you were there, weren't you? Just very little like a story. But not where you do the whole thing and all the hashtags and all that. And then you go and check on it and you read the comments. And I'm just saying, it just takes you out of the vacation

because it's part of our business to do that. And I just want it to be like, I just want to hang out by the pool and like chill. I totally agree. Yeah, it was really really fun. Put the phone away, you get something from brain rot. They say everyone's getting brain rot from being on the phone too much.

I believe I am. I am too. Yeah, so I- So many times I'm like put the phone away and watch TV, loser. Now it's like, now TV is like the war in. Remember when that was brain rotting, yeah. Now it's like turn off the TV and read a book. Now it's like no, just put away the war in. Now it's like, turn off the TV and read a book.

Now it's like, no, just put away the phone and watch regular TV to like educate yourself. Exactly. But anyway, very, very good time. Okay, but I have a bone to pick with the Catholic Church. Okay. So I found out all these comedians. Like 200 internet, oh comedians.

It was 100 comedians around the world were invited to meet the Pope. Now Jim Gaffigan we know is very Catholic. He has a clean act and he at one time performed for the Pope when the Pope came to America or something. So they have a relationship and so I believe he got like the Chris Rock and the Julia Louis Dreyfus to come. Yeah, Jim Gaffigan. I mean, Jimmy Fallon. you know, he got like the Chris Rock and the Julia Louis-Dreyfus to come. Yeah, Jim Gaffigan. I mean, uh...

But I want to ask these comedians that were invited, have they, because I added it up with Brandon, the amount of money that I have spent on a Catholic education, my own included, not my sister, just mine, and my kids, Right. Where was my invite? Are you kidding me? I'm sorry, did Whoopi Goldberg send her kids to Catholic school? Did Chris Rock?

No, he did not. Now they'd say, Heather, it's not about inviting Catholic comedians. Right. Heather, did you learn nothing from Catholic school? Be a humble servant. Right. OK? But then Brandon said, maybe it's nothing from Catholic school, be a humble servant. Right. Okay?

But then Brandon said, maybe it's because your viral video where I said, I've never gotten COVID so clearly Jesus loves me the most. And then I fainted. Fainted, yeah. A lot of people thought that was wrong that I said it. Right. And so far I've had so many things prove to me

that Jesus loves me the most. And now this was, I was off the list. I was off the list. But listen, the church has a way of making it up to me. How so? After we go to Italy in the Amalfi Coast, we are spending our last couple days in Rome. In July. Yeah.

So like July, like 22 and 23. Maybe you can get in to see him. If he wishes to see me. I, you know, if he wishes to see me and, and, you know, but the whole reason I said that is cause I believe Jesus thinks I'm a hoot. So I love that he thought this was about him, the acknowledging that comedians

are they might say edgy things and this and that. Why were the comedian? What was the point of it? I think the point was to be like, as the Catholic church, like we don't think that you're blasphemous, horrible people like Heather McDonald. Right. We think it's okay that you joke about things. Oh, gotcha, gotcha.

And I think Jim probably was the one that was in charge of hiring the people and I don't know him personally. Oh, okay. But once again, you get left out because you were too good looking. And then you weren't good looking enough. Or not enough, yeah. And I never get a break.

Well, I'm sorry to hear that. I'm sorry, are there any other female headlining comedians that actively talk about the Catholic religion in a positive way as much as I have in my books, in my standup, on my podcast? No, there is not. So yeah, am I a little bit pissed today? Yeah I am.

But then you would have had to leave your great vacation in Cabo to go to this. Right, well sometimes you just want the invite. I would have worked it out. I'm sure this was six months in advance of knowing and I could have gone another week to Cabo. This wasn't a last-minute hop on the plane to Rome. Yeah. Julia Louis-Dreyfus. How long do you think they had to explain to the pope who these people were who are coming up to see him? You know, I don't think he knows who Jimmy Fallon is. Do you think?

Yes, I think he probably had just like anything else, like that scene in the Devil Wears Prada where someone's just whispering and this is, you know, and she's, Meryl Streep is like shaking the hands to like, no, I don't think they care or anything. And I, of course, you know, so just once again, I can't get a break. I can't even get the respect from my own church. Girls, we've all been there. You're struggling to take off a tight piece of shapewear

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weight loss journey I feel that the ROH program is the way to go. Average weight loss is 15 to 20 percent in a year with healthy lifestyle changes, BMI and other eligibility criteria apply. Go to roh.co.gov.gov. Sign up today and you'll pay just $99 for your first month and $145 a month after that. Medication costs are separate. That's ro.co.gov.gov. I did a lot of workouts for Catholic priests. I don't know why I was invited because I used to work out. Because they wanted to see your muscle definition, right? Well, they would, they were practic- they told us we needed to practice more physical fitness

as young boys. So me and my friends would go down every Saturday and lift weights for the priests at St. Joseph's Church in Ronkonkoma. And then at the end, he would do a contest to see who had the best calves. And Kevin Flanagan won every time. And honestly, the best calves and Kevin Flanagan won every time And honestly to be honest Kevin Flanagan cast not that great neither of mine, but I'm saying that I should have won at least once

That's all Nothing went beyond that I want you to know it was just working out physical fitness Anyway, we worked out he didn't even have weights. We just lifted heavy pieces of wood. Well, my dad's cousin, first cousin, was a priest from Ireland. Mm-hmm. And we had some nuns in our family, and even then this didn't get me.

We had two. I have two uncles who are priests. Listen, we can make up for... I saw the... And I saw the other priest when he came to L.A. in the 80s, went on a bus trip with a bunch of Catholic girls and went to Dodger Stadium and watch the Pope mobile go by Pope John Paul Yeah, yeah anyway I'm sorry to you didn't get invited. I mean just sometimes I'm just like I

Feel like the Roger Rodney changer feel I get no respect. No, we just we just We just don't. We still have a good life. But there's like a different, you know, there's obviously there's huge, huge, huge stars. Julie Louis-Dreyfus is Julie Louis-Dreyfus. Yes. And like I said, I don't know Jim Gaff again. So if I mean if we were friends, if I would have reached out and made friends with his wife 10 years ago, maybe I could have somehow weaseled in on this trip. Now the Pope has been in trouble lately for he's saying a word that they're saying that

there's, I believe he's from Argentina, and they're saying that he's saying he's using a slang term for gay. He's using the F word in his speeches. They told him once. Oh, the translation. The translation. They're saying there's something lost in translation. He doesn't mean to be derogatory. Oh, okay. But he's, I believe the word he's using is, I'm just going to say it, it's called faggotry. Oh.

And he's used it twice now, and I've told him you can't use that word, but he used it again last week. So I wonder if that's something that comedians could joke about, or that's off limits, that he's saying faggotry about the Catholic Church. Well, now I just got disinvited. Someone from, there was a juicy scooper working at the Vatican that was listening to me laughing, writing my name down, starting an email

to get me to be able to be invited, and now it just got X'd next to you, but it's fine. Well, no, I'm just saying he said it to you, but it's fine. Well, no, I'm just saying he said it. I'm just reporting the news. Like all these guys. Jimmy Fallon doing his, this is a pope. Oh, and I had like a viral, well maybe it wasn't viral,

but it was a few hundred things of me actually, I actually do bits in church. Like I actually showed Brandon doing a speech about me during a mass that was a church yeah all right I mean it was in an auditorium but it was a mass well maybe it's gonna be like Netflix is a joke festival they'll do it next year too you know be over maybe the roast Pope the Pope I did I did tag I did go on here and I said, where is at Heather McDonald? She's she's a good female Catholic comedian.

Well, maybe he'll see. Can you let me know today show? And we'll see. The six people will like it and two people will be like, yeah. Yeah, Heather, we don't care about you. OK, this was kind of interesting. So on Wednesday, this the Texas Rangers in Texas, they arrested this guy, Patel, for online impersonation in the third degree.

I'm gonna explain it to you guys, just let me explain it. Okay. This, from what I understand, this guy was running against, he's a Democrat, he's running against a Republican in Texas for a thing. Okay. And then he went on

and said, oh my God, I'm getting so much hate from all these people that are clearly fans of the Republican who are calling me because he's not white, racist things and all that. Like clearly my opponent, the Republican is, you know, just like a Donald Trump with this horrible minions who are coming after me. Well, the opponent noticed that one of these, this collab that he did of all the hate was a handle of someone that went after him. Yeah.

So they did an investigation and it was him. Oh, he was writing that? He had all these accounts They all came from his computer and he was writing all the racist hate About himself to him to appear like a victim like it's a it's like a jussie small at light. Oh Yeah, yeah What was that in the hopes that people would feel sorry for him and vote for him as I? Yes, and for the hopes that people would be so turned off by the opponent,

like we don't want to be associated with any type of his fans. And, you know, I mean, I want to say, as someone who's been a victim of this, it's time we normalize not to pay any attention to online comments and troll accounts. They're not real threats. No one is coming to kill you and stop using it to victimize yourself to be like, oh, my God, look how horrible. And then, and don't you fall for it as the people that see it.

Like, ignore it. Like, unless somebody's really, like, coming to your house and there's stuff, like, in the mail, let's not bother the police with this shit. And just delete and block and move the fuck along. Because it's too hard to figure out where it's really coming from. So you shouldn't accuse your enemy of them doing it

because it might be yourself. It might be coming from within the house to get stories or to get sympathy. And I truly believe that with a lot of things. So like, anyway, now they keep on arresting because it's a crime. It's a crime to what? Impersonate someone else.

Online? Online, at least in Texas it is. It said, yeah, so they realized that he painted himself and his family as victims of a vicious race-based smear campaign perpetrated by his opponent's supporters. That's what he did. So we'll probably see more of this type of stuff as we get into the election. And it's like, just find your own facts.

I think this election is going to be perfectly civil. There's a show on Netflix called Anti-Social, a documentary, that's all about the trolls that created a lot of mayhem. And in the end, the guy's like, we're still just all alone in a basement with six screens. Like they cause all the mayhem and they watch it and they have fun, but then in the end, they're in the same place they were two years ago, alone in a basement.

They're like Martha's from the Reindeer show. I was just. That's where I was on Father's Day, Alone in a Basement, more or less. I wasn't sending out hate. No, Justin Bieber is parting ways with his business manager Lou Taylor. Now remember, this is a woman, okay, short for Louise. She is the one that was Britney Spears' business manager and all that stuff. So he announced he's going away from her, he's choosing Johnny Depp's financial advisor. But then that was last night.

And then today, Scooter Braun, who also used to manage Justin, he has retired from music management. After 23 years, he's divorced, and his reason was, I have three stars in my life that need more attention, and those are his three kids. And, you know, but I don't know, I think it's all very suspicious.

How so? I don't know, just from like the stuff with the P. Diddy and everything, Lou Taylor and Britney Spears, and all of this stuff that's just like kind of coming out that isn't up to par I think he's probably like maybe it's time I bow out now remember he got a lot of hate from the Swifties because he bought the catalog right but then there was a discussion that like he did nothing

wrong was up for sale and he bought it that's what you say yeah and it was her other music management company that kind of did it from underneath her and her dad had signed off on it and all this other stuff. So maybe he's just rich enough and he's just like, but I want to know where the fuck does the name Scooter come from? Is that a real name?

Was he born as Scooter? Probably not, it's a nickname. Well then like as a man that's entering late 40s, you just say, just call me Scott. Well, maybe now that he's retired, he can go back to his real name, which is Moped Braun. Strange. No, just kidding.

Come on, everybody. Let's have some fun. Still looking young though. Yeah. We used to know him a little bit. Remember he was always kind of in our world back in the Chelsea Lately days? Well, I just feel like we talked about him a lot. He was like the manager of several people.

We had his guests quite a bit, not just Justin Bieber, several other people. And yeah, he was always hanging around our offices in the early days. Way back. Yeah. But I don't know. It'll be interesting to kind of see what goes on. And I'm not accusing him of anything bad, but remember right before the P. Diddy thing all got exposed, he all of a sudden goes, oh, I'm giving all the publishing rights back to all of my artists.

P. Diddy said that. Yeah, just has a good sense of my heart. Yeah, yeah, yeah. Just you guys, just, whoa. But I was Scooter Braun affiliate of P. Diddy said that. Yeah, just has a good sense of my heart. Just you guys, just, whoa. But I was Scooter Braun affiliate of P. Diddy. Did he manage him? I'm just saying, it just is an interesting time for this stuff to come out, where maybe he's just like, I'm out, I just don't want to be part of the music industry,

it's icky, it's gross. And maybe it really is just pure things. I have plenty of money and I want to hang out with my kids. I'm divorced and I don't want to screw up these relationships. Hopefully that's it. But I'm just saying when P. Diddy did that, I was like, I don't believe P. Diddy is doing this out of the goodness of his heart. I think he's doing this to like go, some shit's going down.

And I hope you guys don't come after me. So here's your publishing rights. And literally a month later, all this shit went down. Where does P. Diddy go from here? I mean, it's over. Give back the key. To what city? To the city of New York. Oh that guy that guy asked for it back. Eric Adams. Yeah, and he's like it doesn't really open anything right?

Like you can't open a Sabaro at 2 a.m. In Times Square. You know What if it did? What if every key? It was like a master key that just opened to every restaurant. Hey, you guys want to go to Bubba Gump? I have the key. What? Yes. Yeah, I don't think it... So he had to give it back. Oh, that's too bad. You know, in light of the horrible Cassie video. It's a terrible video,

and that's pretty much the end of his career. But when did he put on the socks or the towel? I feel like it was in the hallway in the video, he's wearing socks and a towel, which means he either was wearing, he was completely nude with socks on. You put on your socks first. That's what I'm saying, that's a strange look.

So, like, did he get out of the shower? Right. You're right, who puts on socks before you put on underwear and a shirt? Socks are the last thing before the shoes. Exactly. So I think- That is interesting. Who puts on socks before you put on underwear and a shirt socks are the last thing exactly So that is interesting the socks and the towel were a weird choice For the hallway, and I'm also like you're so you know

Determined to go get her in the hallway and bring her back But you care about covering your own self like you're doing something But you're, I'm surprised you didn't walk out just like butt naked in a rush. I know, anyway, I was just weirded out by the socks and the tag. Anyway, that, I mean, that's horrible, okay. And also his glasses have been taken, I go to America's Best Optometry and I, Oh, he has glasses.

Sean John, Sean John collection. Oh yeah, he had so many clothes. A lot. Where are the Sean John sweatshirts and stuff? Yeah, there's a lot of clothes. He's got a ton, go over to any Marshalls, is he A lot of Sean John sweatshirts and stuff. Yes, a lot of clothes. He's got a ton. Go over to any Marshalls, there's a bunch of Sean John sweatsuits. But anyway, I used to get his glasses at Marks and Bests.

Now I've got to go over to the Randy Jackson collection. He's really done. He has a... Pretty nice. I have several pairs. Randy Jackson. I don't think he's in any trouble, is he? No, and I just met him, not just, but a year and a half ago when I did the, name that tune.

Oh, Randy Jackson's on that? In Ireland, he was on it. Oh, okay. And I had this yellow blazer on that was Veronica Beard, and he was like, where did you get that blazer? I want that for myself. And I was like, it was a very, it was a female blazer. Anyway.

He can, these days, you blazer. Yeah. Anyway. You can, these days, you know, enjoy it. You're right, you're right, you're right. Okay, so, Legos. The crime is just getting worse and worse. Yeah. First of all, yesterday I saw video of this horrific jewelry robbery. The surveillance camera, but somewhere in California.

Smas and grab? It was beyond a smash and grab. It was like 25 people bursting into a big jewelry store, crashing every single one and taking it all. And I think I said this to you once before, but it's like, I wonder if like old, like sophisticated, like oceans 11 type of thieves are like sitting in prison, like watching these smash and grabs and being like, Ocean's Eleven type of thieves are, like, sitting in prison, like, watching these smash-and-grabs and being like,

why didn't we all just put on masks and get together? And just run out. Yeah, why did we have to do these elaborate things when we could have just all... Like, they must be jealous that these guys can just text each other and be like, meet at K. Jewelers, you know, at four, and, you know, wear your sweatshirt and then

put it over your head and put on your mask and we all just go together. Yeah. I mean, it's crazy. Just... And then whatever you can take, you take for yourselves, but in the group, then how are they ever going to know who it is? Yeah. But now it's happening with Legos.

Now, Legos... Is that destination grabbing Legos? Or stealing them from... But now it's happening with Legos. Now, Legos. Smashing and grabbing Legos? Well, they're. Or stealing them from. It's a little more elaborate from the stores, Walmart and whatnot. But now those will be the next things,

just like your skin cream. They have the alarm on them. They have the alarm on them. Yeah, that's why. At Target. Cause some of them are like 700, like you get the Millennium Falcon or whatever. Well, they've always been really expensive

and as much as as a mom that, you know, stepped on Legos and, like, had the, all the Lego things, you always want, you always think that your kid is gonna play with, like, the ones that are, like, leftover and make their own thing, but they don't. So you buy this big thing that has always been expensive. And if you lose any pieces of it, it's screwed, right? Well, you usually don't.

Like, you really kind of follow the thing, and now you've made it. Yeah. And then after that, it's done. It's literally the most expensive toy that is like a two-hour use. That's it. Then you put it on your thing.

You don't really, like, play with the thing. No, you just, it's about building it, right? Yeah, and then they never made anything out of the extras. Right. So, but for boys that would be something I'd be like, it'll keep them busy for a few hours on Christmas, but they're always so expensive. So now they're stealing them and you can get them on the black market.

Like eBay and swap meets and stuff like that, yeah. Okay. Yeah. Psst, psst, yo, yo, yo, that, yeah. Okay. Yeah. Yo yo yo yo I got these Mickey Mouse. What? Lego Mickey Mouse? Oh okay.

You want a, yeah. Yeah. But you want the Star Wars, you want that, yeah those are the good ones. Ford Mustang. I kind of remember the day that like it was like the last Christmas that I was like do you want any like special Legos? And then, you know, and each kid was like, no. And then like-

We haven't gone down that road yet. My daughter's not, not Lego at all, thankfully. They try to make it for girls and do like Barbies and stuff. But the, the following the instructions is just so much more in a general sense, more of a dude's brain than a girl's. And it's just like girls have more of an imagination and the boys like want to like follow the thing and put it together like a

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Okay, this is a weird pairing. This is from Closer Weekly. Yeah, I read this yesterday. But John Travolta and Kristen Davis, Charlotte from and Just Like That and Sex and the City, really like each other and they're not the only ones. Our insider revealed that his kids have gave their blessing too. Wow. Now here's the thing. She's divorced or something? I want to say that she adopted kids on her own. Oh, okay. Something like that. Yeah. So age-appropriate, I think he's like what, early 60s and she's like mid-50s. He's got to be early 70s. He's in more than

early 60s. All right, well whatever. Thank God. I mean he shaped his head, he got cuter. Yeah. Anyway. The wigs are gone. The wigs are gone. He's a widow. Now. There's a Scientology, is she Scientology? I think she is, isn't she? It wasn't there at all? No, I don't think she was ever Scientology.

Maybe not. I think at this point, he's probably like, I am not gonna just like hold it to, here's the thing though. There were so many rumors back in the day of him liking men sexually and the the evidence which I don't know that you know it was true was him kissing his pilot there was a photo of them kissing and then people said no it could have just been like you

know not full kissing, maybe da da da. People always justify that. A European thing. A European thing. Then there was the guy that there was a whole tabloid story of a guy allegedly saying that he wanted massages and ass men, da, dah. And then the whole thing of Scientology being like, you know, did he struggle with his sexuality and Scientology had the secrets for when they take those two cans and be audited.

And you know, and that is why he's so loyal to Scientology. But now if he's pursuing a romantic relationship with a woman well into his 60s. It makes me wonder, A, maybe he's bi, who cares? And, but like what, you know, maybe none of this was true. None of it. Well, yeah, I mean, who knows? It was always just rumor. Right. Right. It was just one massage guy story or a few of them saying it. It was quite a few, you know. I heard, I mean, I had friends who were, you know. Proposition by him?

Not proposition, but my friends worked at like fancy hotels and you would room service, you'd go up to room service and the robe would be open. That's what I've heard. But it was no proposition, just like maybe if this is something you're interested in. I feel like now, like even if I order room service, like I shouldn't even, I feel like anytime you're in a hotel robe, it's like could get you in trouble now.

Right, that's what I'm saying. Like I put on a hotel robe, I've come out like in the towel and been like, oh, you can just leave it there. Especially when they, because they come in, it's like, ah, you know, it's a weird, they should just leave it outside and go, okay, it's a different time we live ah, you know, it's a weird, they should just leave it outside and go, okay, it's a different time we live in, you know? I don't, so, okay, taking all those rumors away.

Okay. I don't know, this could be kind of great if it's true and they really like each other, because like I said, I don't think she ever got married. I wanna say she has like one or two adopted children. Yeah. Like from Africa or something because she was really into elephants as a charity But no like I followed her it was a lot about like elephant stuff

Have you seen that video about the one elephant that can paint and then all the other elephants are like dicks to it and like push it in the water and stuff? Well, you know. Yeah, like because one has like really... One's got talent. One's got total talent and they're just like, oh, you think you're all that? And then it's like paints and explodes. I heard that elephant's meeting the pope next week. I know.

Oh, I mean, Jesus. Heather, be a humble servant. Also, Heather, you don't have to be invited to everything. Okay, shut up, girl. Yes. I mean, why wouldn't you like this? I mean, everyone kind of likes John Travolta. I feel like he's one of those guys that everyone kind of likes. Yeah.

Yeah. Even, nobody has a bad thing to say about him, really. No, everyone says he was always just like a totally nice delight. Everyone, people love him on sets of movies and stuff. They say he's great to work with and very nice, flies planes and like a charitable guy, I think. No, I feel like he's one of those that the only movies he's done in the last like 15 years or 10 years have been like the Randall Emmett films that are like all the old stars.

Or maybe, I don't know what he's done lately. He's like, you ever look in a red box, there's nothing sadder than a red box in front of a 7-Eleven. Do they still exist? In some neighborhoods in front of a 7-Eleven, you know. And then you look in there and there's movies, you're like, wait a minute, John Travolta's made seven movies

that I've never even heard of in Red Box, you know? He kind of had an interesting romantic history. When he was boy in the plastic bubble, he fell in love and had a full-on relationship with the woman who played his mother. Is that, yeah, I think, right. Betty Broderick? No, it wasn't Betty Broderick, it was this woman.

So she was like 42 and he was like 21. And they were like together for a very long time. Yes, and then he was, there was rumors that he was with Lily Tomlin at one point. I remember that when I, I mean, when I was growing up, he was like the biggest star in the world. Right, yeah, because it was the, yeah. He was on the cover of the paper every day with whoever.

I don't know, I would like to see this happen and I would like to see him in something else. I feel like it's been so long since we've seen him do anything. Yeah, he's due for it. Because he has like a come back, not pulp fiction of course, that was a long time ago, but that was his big comeback and then he had. He needs to play like a father of the bride type of like movie, like a cheat, just like be like cute and cheesy. I think you just need to have him host the Oscars.

Cause remember he just comes and does these great flubs and just, just he can't... The brilliantly talented. Wickedly. Yeah, that was it. The wickedly talented. Adele Dazeem. Oh, the Tonys were last night.

I watched it a little bit. I did. I mean, I don't know anything. I watched it a little bit. I did. I'm going to see it in the shows. I don't know anything, but congrats to the winners. OK, J. Lo gets to keep her $2.5 million canceled tour amid marital woes. So I guess part of the tour was she got some money up front. Then the tour was canceled.

She gets to keep that because they say it's gonna be rescheduled. But I don't know, I think that the whatever, AG Live or who is it that does it? Whoever's put the thing together. I think they had decided along with her to cancel it. They're gonna take it to the grave. That they take it, it just wasn't worth it to continue

and we're going to take the loss and we're just gonna cancel it. Then hire all the people to work it and all that and then also she probably was like, I don want to come to like a half empty place arena. You got, you were the ones. I mean, there's gotta be something where they came and they didn't do their due diligence or estimate correctly that this was going to be a huge hit.

Now, why do you think people didn't buy tickets? Cause I mean, she's no different than like, she got pop hits like a Janet Jackson I know I think I know I know why I feel like people are going to concerts So it's not like there's an overwhelming. This is what I think I think Beyonce and Taylor Swift and even Madonna for that matter No have all they have hits that big hits No, they have hits, they have big hits. Right. Really, really big hits. But they have consecutively gone out

every couple years and toured and toured and toured and toured. And then so people go and they're like, I mean, Madonna always puts on a great show. But someone like a Beyonce and Taylor that have really done great in the last 10 years, it's like they know that every that they go, it's going to be a killer show. And so they're like loyal fans, just like when we as comedians go. And sometimes my agent would say this and I'd be like, but aren't aren't the people sick of me? He's

like, No, go, if you go back to the same place and you consecutively be good, they're like I had such a good time last time. And it's true, I have people that are like, I've seen you five times. Because I give a good show and they come and they're loyal. But she didn't do that because she did so many movies and things in between. So she's really, so she just doesn't,

she's a great performer, but it's not like she has these rabid JLo fans like Swifties or the Beehive. And so that is why. That's why I don't think it, I mean, I think people would, yeah, they'd go see her if she went, you know. And also, I think she split herself in too many ways. She's like, I don't know what she, like she's an actress, she's all the clothing and all

this. And now she's also like just tabloid person. And like, I feel like I, I feel like I don't need to pay to see her because I see her constantly. Yes, I think there's always that secretive thing. I remember back in Madonna's rise, it would be so rare that she would ever do an interview or anything.

And we didn't really know her. And it's like, oh my God, I have to see her. So when she came walking out on an award show or something, Madonna was like exciting. Like, oh my God, that's Madonna. Yeah. But these people you see, like her, you see her on TMZ every day.

You're like, I'm not going to spend $400 on a ticket to see her concert. OK, Chris, I love that you agreed to stay because we have so much more to talk about. But first, to conclude today's show, I want you to hear this interview I did. It's very juicy. And so many of you have asked me about the Netflix documentary Dancing with the Devil

about a religion that included all these TikTok dancers. And a lot of people have been talking about it. And I interviewed Katie Paulson, who really had a big part in getting the story out there through the mainstream media and other people picking it up, which made it, hence made this documentary happen. And so let's get into that interview right now. Hello and welcome to Juicy Scoop. I am talking to Katie Paulson,

best known for her YouTube channel and her Instagram, which is how I found you without a crystal ball. Welcome to Juicy Scoop. Thanks, Heather. I'm so excited to be here. Listen, you have a very juicy channel and you covered a lot of cults. Yes. you covered a lot of cults and you are, yeah, you contributed to the documentary

Dancing with the Devil. How did they contact you to get, have your involvement in that, which is on Netflix, which is about these TikTok dancers that we all enjoy watching so much. Some were couples, some all met out in LA. And the documentary is how they are super talented, but they also believe in God. And they joined this church run by this man named a pastor named Robert Shin. And after being part of that church

for a while, he said, you know, you're so talented. Why don't I form a management company called 7M that will help you guys secure, um, dancing jobs and brand deals and whatnot. And so he's in charge of the church as well as the management company. Yeah. And that was a big part of the documentary. Yeah. It's on how much they would end up paying for their gig. So they'd give 20% for the gig. They're not paying for the documentary.

Yeah. It's not how much they would end up paying. For their gig. So they'd give 20%. For the management. Yep. But then they're also getting giving 30% because they broke it down into three tens. To the church.

10, 10, 10. Yep. 10% tithing. 10% man of 10% man of God. And then 10% first offering, meaning like the first. 10% of your paychecks. So really it's just another 10%. Which is, I never had that when I went to church, they would just encourage you to give. I grew up Catholic and they were like- Yeah Catholic, it's like you're supposed to give but it was never- They would send you a health-

But I know Mormons, it's like a real hard 10% of your income and things like that. He comes from like prosperity gospel. He would say he would not be, but it's very prosperity driven. The more with the idea of like the more you give, the more you'll receive. The bigger the gift, the better the blessing. Right. Yeah. So you became aware of what was going on because, and they show this in the documentary. Miranda, who is one of the dancers who ended up marrying this other guy that's part of it. And there, so now they're the Derrick's her sister, Melanie and her parents went live with a plea of saying

we have not talked to, you know, Miranda in a while and we're just going public with it. And that was brought to your attention. And then you started to, you know, get their message out through your channel, correct? Yeah. So I found out about it from one of my followers. Like this family just went live and they're really worried about their daughter. You cover cults. Maybe you could help them. They knew that I have a lot of like mainstream journalists that follow me. And so they felt like if you post on your page, maybe an outlet will pick it up. And that's what happened. So, right. So the sun wrote about it. Daily Mail wrote about it. Yeah. Um, cause I've established So I reached out to Kelly and I said, Hey, like I've covered cults for years. And I know that one of the things that you can do is try to get as much,

you know, if we push it out. And we get enough exposure on this, maybe it'll go bigger. And then it got to sort of a point where. Even though it got pushed out and even though there was a lot of, a lot of, a lot of, a lot of, a lot of, a lot of, a lot of, a lot of, a lot of, a lot of, a lot of, a lot of, a lot of, a lot of, off exposure on this, maybe it'll go bigger. And then it got to sort of a point where even though it got pushed out and even though there was exposure, Robert sort of took the narrative back, right? And he changed things up, which you see in the series. So it was March of 2022. So it was March of 2022. It was February 24th, they went live.

It was March, 2022, everything goes viral. And near the end of March, I was approached by Tim Milgram, who is a choreographer, or not a director that has a dance studio. And Isaiah Shin, who is Robert's son, used to work for him. And he quit to go work for his him. And he was like, I'm going to go to work with him. And he was like, I'm going to go to work with him. And he was like, I'm going to go to work with him. And he was like, I'm going to go to work with him.

And he was like, I'm going to go to work with him. And he was like, I'm going to go to work with him. And he was like, I'm going to go to work with him. And he was like, I'm going to go to work with him. And he was like, I'm going to go to work with him. And he was like, I'm going to go to work with him. And he was like, I'm going to go to work with him. And he was like, I'm going to go to work with him. Maybe he never would have met these people.

He almost felt like it was his fault. Oh, I see what you mean. So he was saying, because he had the dancers in his studio and Isaiah was doing video, filming the videos for him, that is how possibly they met Isaiah. And then Isaiah was like, hey, you should come and come to our church. God, okay, that makes sense.

And so for Tim, he just felt like, oh my gosh, did I do this? You know, like he's a really well-respected director. Everyone loves to go to his studio for dance. He does classes, he's not a manager. So he didn't sign any of these people. He wasn't in charge of their careers or anything like that. But so he approached me and he was like, listen,

I see what you're doing to help the Wilkins. I know the Wilkins because Melanie and Miranda have both danced here. And I want to help. I know Isaiah and he's like, I have a friend named Jessica. She has, she works for WV entertainment, well, well, we're Valderrama entertainment and she does non-scripted and I've asked her to look into this. And I was like, okay. And I was like, okay. And he's like, really what I'd like to do is have all of us working together so that

it's like strength in numbers is kind of how he put it. Like, let's just bring everyone together and we'll do this production together to even bring it to a bigger platform. So that was kind of how it was born. And I met Jessica through, I had a meeting with Jessica and kind of talked about what. Jessica is a producer. Okay. Yeah. She's the executive producer. She's so amazing. And I will say that Wilmer's entire team was phenomenal. Wilmer was involved, but he was like more hands off because this is Jessica's non-scripted department, but he was a really big part of, you know,

helping families feel comfortable, like his level of compassion and all of that. So what I really loved about this production company, more than others, because so many companies approached me, was that their care for the people involved, remembering that it's a human being and it's their real life. And they were really like wanting to,

they didn't want to sensationalize it. They didn't want to exploit it. They just wanted to help give it a bigger platform. And Wilmer's whole thing is about, his whole production company is about representing minority populations. Obviously he's from Venezuela and he's a Latino man. And so this story fit with that, right? So there's like Korean immigrants involved in the story, and then you've got African-American dancers.

And so it's an underserved population. And so it helped them because it's what they're passionate about is elevating these stories, because in some cases, a story like this might've gotten lost because it's, you know, I'm just glad that Wilmer's team was there is what I'm trying to say is like, Well, I thought some of the interesting things about it is that a lot of these dancers were featured on Ellen when Ellen had her talk show. Yeah. She was so big on dancing. And she certainly didn't, it's appeared, I'm sure in my opinion, she wasn't thrilled about this story coming out. And in her defense, these are good dancers. I don't think that she was

taking a cut or going to the church or anything. I just think think that she was, you know, taking a cut or in, or going to the church. No, I just think the dancers came here and then they, but then they're like, oh my God, these dances are on Ellen. So it's like, okay. They're friends. Well, they were friends with Twitch, right? So Twitch was a, one of a contestant on so, so you think you can dance. And so was Vic who is it Slavic and Miranda competed on, so you think you can dance as well. So several of these dancers were friends with them because they were part of the like umbrella of, so you think you can dance. And then B-dash and Kevin were on world of dance. And so if you know anything about the dance community in LA is that it's, it's like small.

Like there's a lot of dancers, but the community is tight. And so everyone knows everyone. And so Twitch was bringing his friends on basically to dance. I mean, I did think it was interesting. One part of it to give Robert Shin as a producer and manager some credit is he was coming up with these older more classic songs that the kids had never heard of. And, you know, it reminds me of this other guy I interviewed during COVID, this really cute guy, I can't remember his name, something white and now I can't remember his name, but he went viral because

he was like singing old 1970s songs. Oh really? And he was so cute and he had like kind of wavy hair and it brought it. Was it Vic? No. Oh, because that's just lip syncing them. But it just kind of went viral because it was nostalgic and it was also like these great hits. So in the videos that they did, they were great. They were shot great. They dressed sharp. They were two really great songs. It was charming.

It was good, clean, fun. No one was twerking. It was like, I could see why. It felt like fulsome, right? Yeah, I could see why it was such a big thing. And in the documentary that we see that, these kids don't have a lot of money. So isn't it great that you guys wait,

I have a property that you can all live at. And at the house, just like there's a tick, there are TikTok houses and YouTube houses where a bunch of kids get together and collab and make videos and everything. So it was kind of like that. So- Like high quality is what Aubrey said in the series. So how would they know that it's not weird,

right? Exactly. There's so many other people out there doing this. And also it's like, you know, hey, we believe in God and you know, we believe in the scripture and this is helping us and it's providing, you know, a discipline and like all that kind of stuff. So I, I do get it. And then also there's that side of like, well, maybe Miranda, you know, was happy to get away from her sister a little bit and maybe she wanted to be on her own and now she's in love with her husband and all of that. Yeah. And so then, but I could see what also thought was interesting is, and I wish they kind of would have focused a little more on this, is when you suspect that your child or someone you love might be in whatever organization you want to call it, where they're not communicating

like they used to and you feel like it's not 100% their choice or they're being influenced not to. Like these, these decult people or whatever that will help you to say the right thing. Yeah. And I think that was really interesting. They were like practicing in the car before they saw their loved ones of like what to say so that it's not like, leave me alone mom or something like, hey, you know, we wanna hear about your journey. And if there's something that, you know,

was hurtful in your childhood that you feel like this is, you know, comforting, we don't wanna question that. Like there's a certain words that you use that I thought was like very interesting. Yeah, and Kelly is actually, she's a counselor. So she has a school counselor and she is, they worked with deprogramming, like cult experts. They had conversations, I know with like ex members of Nexium. And I know that they spoke

to different psychologists and professionals and they contacted like the human trafficking coalition in Los Angeles. Like they literally did absolutely everything. I think the challenge with this specific case is that. Those people might be able to help when you can actually communicate with that person. But in this case, they didn't know if they were actually communicating with her. Because they didn't know that they were actually communicating with her. And then the other thing that I would say is that, you know, I think that the, you know, the person who's in charge of the church is the person who's in charge.

Of the church. And so those people might be able to help when you can actually communicate with that person. But in this case, they didn't know if they were actually communicating with her. Because. Robert's system is set up that the mentors. Had access to their. Bones.

Their passwords, their social media. They were, there's like a person that's like in charge of a small group within the church. Yeah. They kind of have to check in with those. You're saying those people. Yeah. Allegedly had could control that stuff. So they would see the texts. Yeah. So, yeah. So he's got a hierarchy. Um, it's like Robert's at the top and he's the man of God and he claims that he is getting, you know, divine prophecies from God. He kind of is that Pentecostal speaking in tongues full like charismatic, right? And a part of that is believing in prophecy that you are getting direct messages from God. And so it can open up these doors where the wrong leader believes they are God or acts like they are God. And so with Robert, a lot of it became like, I am the source, right? But because he elevated himself so high and believed he was so high,

he had other people doing his bidding. And so the mentors are the ones that are really in charge. Of directing. And so, you know, the, the, the, the, the, the, the, the, the, the, the, the, the, the, the, the, the, the, the, the, the, the, the, the, the, the, the, the, the, the, the, the, the, the, the, the, the, the, the, the, the, the, the, the, the, the, the, the, the, the, the, the, the, the, the, the, the, the, the, the, the, the, the, the, the, the, the, the, the, the, the, the, the, the, the, the, the, the, the, the, the, the, the, the, the, the, the, the, the, the, the, the, the, the, the, the, the, the, the, the, the, the, the, the, the, the, the, the, the, the, the, the, the, the, the, the, the, the, the, the, the, the, the, the, the, the, the, the, the, the, the, the, the, the, the, the, the, the, the, the, the, the, the, the, the, the, the, the, the, the, the, the, the, the, the, the, the, the, the, the, the, the, the, the, the, the, the, the, the, the, the, the, the, the, the, the, the, the, the, the, the, the, the, the, the, the, the, the, the, the, the, the, the, the, the, the, the, the, the, the, the, the, the, the, the, the, the, the, the, the, the, the, the, the, 22 years younger than him. Um, and that's a full thing, but these mentors, Hannah is the manager and she's also the mentor for Miranda. Right. So because Miranda is having these, this person above her, they don't know if it's Hannah or if it's Miranda. And then the way that Aubrey explained it in the series was that, you know, they had to go to their mentors for everything. So they couldn't spend money without talking to their mentor. They have to report throughout their day, what they're doing to their mentors. And they have to talk about if someone's reaching out to them and then their

mentor might tell them what to say. And the mentor might actually log in and type it for them. And in the case with Miranda and the other people, there was a suspicion that we've kind of had confirmed that they weren't really controlling their social media. Even though they could, they also had, the mentors have access to delete things, block people, you know, type in their DMs. So, and then with Robert's teaching it seem like their, their families are going to die. Right. And so he's making it seem like they're going to die.

And so he's making it seem like they're going to die. And so he's making it seem like they're going to die. And so he's making it seem like they're going to die. And so he's making it seem like they're going to die. And so he's making it seem like they're going to die. And so he's making it seem like they're going to die. And so he's making it seem like they're going to die. And so he's making it seem like they're going to die.

And so he's making it seem like they're going to die. And so he's making it seem like they're going to die. And so he's making it seem like their families are going to die. Right. If they don't cut off their families. So that just adds a whole other layer of like, well, if I reach out to my family, are they going to die? So a lot of the people that everyone participating is no longer part of the church. And Miranda does come to visit and does talk to them. And we see that she did go to her sister's wedding, which happened after the doc had

wrapped. And so she just spoke today on her Instagram. Yeah. And she basically is talking to the camera and she looks great. She looks fine. And she says, you know, since the documentary is aired, my husband and I prior to that felt safe in our life. Now, we are getting all these death threats and messages and emails saying if we're walking on the street they're going to pick us up and kidnap us, we should kill ourselves, we should die, all this stuff. Which I can imagine if you receive it

is really horrific. But one of the things I want to say about this, because we hear about it so much when someone, whether they're on a reality show and they have a bad edit, or they are part of this documentary about if in fact they might be a part of a cult and unwillingly or not aware of it, a part of a cult and unwillingly or not aware of it. Is because of what then comes into my social media internet, therefore, whatever it is, the opposition should be blamed for it. Like as if, first of all, who is mad at Miranda in this world

for dancing and being with her husband? Right. If she is in fact part of an organization that later on she realizes wasn't what she thought it was, nobody is mad at her for that. No. So I believe in my opinion, and nobody, why don't people wonder?

Maybe these messages are coming to her, but maybe they're coming from inside the house and they could be, they're coming from so that you will go, Oh my God, my family put out this, this documentary and now my life is worse because they spoke my life is worse. they spoke, my life is worse. It's and it's like, there's no way to prove who these anonymous troll bot people are. There is no, I've been through it myself. And Robert is known to use fake accounts and bots and all of that. And I actually saw this happening yesterday. They'm not going to do that. I'm not going to do that. I'm not going to do that. I'm not going to do that.

I'm not going to do that. I'm not going to do that. I'm not going to do that. I'm not going to do that. I'm not going to do that. I'm not going to do that. I'm not going to do that. I'm not going to do that.

I'm not going to do that. I'm not going to do that. I'm not going to do that. I'm not going to do that. I'm not going to do that. I'm not going to do that. I'm not going to do that. I'm not going to do that.

I'm not going to do that. I'm not going to do that. I'm not going to do that. I'm not going to do that. I'm not going sending those messages and it's not connected to the cult, don't. And I'm also saying there's just no way to prove who these people really are. In this world of AI, fake accounts, bots, trolls, people can buy those, they can disguise them, they can make it look like they're Juicy Scoopers coming after this girl. They can make it look like that. And I feel badly that anyone receives even one mean comment, DM or message. It should never just be like, oh, get over it girl. Because when you read it, it's really upsetting. It's totally upsetting. So it's like, but I just think it's, yeah. But when you first get it,

if you've never really gotten that before, you do think, oh my God, it's coming from that camp. And I don't wanna fuck with that camp anymore no matter what, even if it's my family. And so it helps strengthen her resolve that she needs to go deeper in with Robert. And that, you know, this got exposed and because it doesn't make any sense why anybody watching this doc. Right. Compelled to get on their phone and write something mean to any one of the

victims people that are involved, you know, dancing and believing in this man. Whatever. Why? Well, here's the thing is I don't think Miranda and I, I don't think that's the reason why she's not in the camp anymore. I think that's the reason why going to be able to see it. I'm not sure if you're going to be able to see it. I'm not sure if you're going to be able to see it. I'm not sure if you're going to be able to see it. I'm not sure if you're going to be able to see it. I'm not sure if you're going to be able to see it. I'm not sure if you're going to be able to see it.

I'm not sure if you're going to be able to see it. I'm not sure if you're going to be able to see it. I'm not sure if you're going to be able to see it. I'm not sure if you're going to be able to see it. I'm not sure if you're going to be able to see it. I'm not sure if you're going to be able to see it. I'm not sure if you're going to be able to see it. I'm not sure if you're going to be able to see it.

I'm not sure if you're going to be able to see it. I'm not sure if you're going to be able to see it. I'm not sure if you're going to be able to see it. I'm not sure if you're going to be able to see it. I'm not sure if you're going to be able to see it. I'm not sure if you're going to be able to see it. I'm not sure if you're going to be able to see it. I'm not sure if you're going to be able to see it.

I'm not sure if you're going to be able to see it. I'm not sure if you're going to be able to see it. I'm not she would know that nothing was really said badly about it. There was not one thing said. I mean, the only thing that you could be everyone talks so lovingly about her. I mean, the only thing that you could be offended by if you were her is, you know, I'm a big girl. I know what I'm doing. How dare you think that I'm dumb enough to be succumbed to something that is not truthful. I believe in this, this church, I believe in this man and how you dare you question me as an adult. That's about it.

And, but it's coming out of a loving thing, but I assume that's why anybody in any religious organization gets pissed and offended when people question it. Well, Robert has made them so paranoid of the outside world too. Like he And I think that's the biggest thing that I think is the biggest problem. And I think that's the biggest thing that I think is the biggest problem. And I think that's the biggest thing that I think is the biggest problem. And I think that's the biggest thing that I think is the biggest problem. And I think that's the biggest thing that I think is the biggest problem. And I think that's the biggest thing that I think is the biggest problem. And I think that's the biggest thing that I think is the biggest problem.

And I think that's the biggest thing that I think is the biggest problem. And I think that's the biggest thing that I think is the biggest problem. And I think that's the biggest thing that I think is the biggest problem. And I think that's the biggest thing that I think is the biggest problem. And I think that's the biggest thing that I think is the biggest problem. And I think that's the biggest thing that I think is the biggest problem. And I think that's the biggest thing going to do that. I'm not going to do that. I'm not going to do that. I'm not going to do that. I'm not going to do that. I'm not going to do that. I'm not going to do that.

I'm not going to do that. I'm not going to do that. I'm not going to do that. I'm not going to do that. I'm not going to do that. I'm not going to do that. I'm not going to do that. I'm not going to do that.

I'm not going to do that. I'm not going to do that. I'm not going to do that. I'm not going to do that. I'm not going to do that. I'm not going to do that. I'm not going to do that. I'm not going to do that.

I'm not going to do that. I'm not going to do that. I'm not going to do that. I'm not going to leave nasty comments. Please be kind to these people. Don't even comment. Like you have no reason to comment. You don't need to comment. No one needs to go and you don't need to tell her she's in a cult. You don't need to say anything really. Right. Just leave her alone. Like, and remember that they're victims and they don't know it. So it's like, you don't know you're in a cult until you know. And also the shame of it is. I've talked about that. Well, also another shame of it is without all of this being exposed through the documentary.

Yeah. Someone may have come across her page, her dancing. Yeah. And been like, oh my God, we want her to be on Dancing with the Stars as a, you know, with the star, or we want her to be part of this. Well, now I'm telling you, if that was my job, if I was producer of one of these dancing shows, as cute and as fabulous as she is, now that I know that this is her manager and this is this other stuff that's happening, I'm gonna be less likely to wanna hire her

because of the people that are attached and all of that. And that's the real shame. That is the shame of this getting out is that, well, you may have, without it being known, you might've gotten this opportunity, you would've had to give 50% of your money your way before taxes. Yeah. Now the opportunity is not going to come at all because it's just too sticky and icky.

And they were doing a good job. If you saw in the series of like, he's like, we're going to cut people off and they're not even going to know it, you know? And that was a whole thing so that they could hide what was happening, right? Like he signs them all into NDAs. So really is, is she going to be able to be truthful? Because if she has an NDA and she can't disparage him, she's not going to blame him for any of this. And she still believes that he's her man of God. And so of course it's the outsiders that are creating this.

Of course it's her family that is the blame. But I think I can say this for certain that her family did not come into this with ill motives. They did not come into this to hurt her, to hurt James. They came in to help get people out. And that lie that they did woke up six dancers. That live woke up former members that had been in his cult for 20 plus years. Priscilla left as a result of everything that happened

after they went live and all of that coverage, you know? And mentors start finding out again that Robert, all these years later is still having inappropriate relationships with women in his church while he's married, you know? And that creates a whole conflict and his daughter takes off with her husband, you know? So families that were in this cult for 20 plus years are exiting as well, because they're like, this isn't what I signed up for.

You know, you lied to me about this, you know, you you've deceived me. And we were shocked when Miranda and James didn't leave and when tight eyes and Kendra and Vic and Nick didn't leave. It was shocking. So those people that are in the dock are still active in the company and the church. Yeah. Well, again, this is all alleged and then what we see and what has been told and from the other members.

And she is saying she's very happy. She did go to the sister's wedding and you know, and there was some of that in the dock of like, we'll go call your family, go see your family because this is out. We don't want it to look like you can't be hanging out with your family at all. Yeah. And I think now because they can't do that, right? Like he's been exposed. Like that was a whole thing he was doing. So now what is he going to do? Yeah. He's going to try to blame the documentary for causing harm to her.

Right. And really anything that she posts right now is coming from him. So, and her mentors are telling her what to post. So do we even know that these are really happening? Do we know? I wonder if all this, what if someone just reached out to 7M and they're a really good dancer and they're like, hi, I'd like you to manage me, but I don't wanna join your church. If you're truly a manager, then why not just like be thrilled that, oh, you have such great people

under your management company manage me. Like, then you should be happy that you've been given all this attention. But they can't have the control. Be happy that these great dancers are now being featured on an international platform. So have you looked at their her her the views on her Instagram or like through the roof right now? Like, yeah. So, I mean, why isn't there anything positive? Like, I would think a different attitude to take if I was he is to say, look, whatever, these things are not true. What is true is that have these

really talented dancers that, you know, that are available to work and for things. And let's make a deal and whatever. And then also on Sunday's they, on Sunday's they, you know, come to my church and pray or whatever it is. Like, I'm just saying there's a way. It's just interesting the reaction that's come from it. You know, I'm just saying there's a way. It's just interesting the reaction that's come from it. You know, he could stop all of this, right? Like he could be the, the, the man of God and the, the manager and come out and speak and say something, but he's really putting these people out like sacrificial lambs and like he's telling them probably that it's a spiritual attack against him and they need to pray harder and be more obedient to him. It's sad.

What's going to happen is like anything in a week or two, there'll be another hot doc, a doctor, a doctor, a doctor, a doctor, a doctor, a doctor, a doctor, a doctor, a doctor, a doctor, a doctor, a doctor, a doctor, a doctor, a doctor, a It's sad. What's going to happen is like anything in a week or two, there'll be another hot doc or thing that people will be talking about. And you know, and then these families will not have everyone chatting about it, getting the attention. And all they're gonna be able to do is just hope and pray

that they're able to keep their relationship do is just hope and pray that they're able to keep the relationship with their daughter in an authentic way. And like, who knows if that'll happen. And then at a certain point, I feel like the family's got to get on with their life. You know, I mean, I also think about the daughter, the other sister, like how many years and are we as our whole family just going to be like the other sister? Like how many years? And are we as our whole family just going to be like, the other sister is married, she's gonna want to have a kid like at a certain point, you're just gonna be like, Okay, all right, we'll see you twice a year, and we won't talk about your church. And, but it won't,

it'll feel fake. But what are we supposed to do? Like, I just think after a certain point, what what, what, what is a family supposed to do? And that I just think after a certain point, what is a family supposed to do? And that's where, you know, I find it really intriguing. And that's kind of the conversation that was had in this documentary is what is it like to lose someone and they're an adult and it looks like human trafficking,

but when adults are involved in human trafficking, the adult has to recognize they're a victim. Right. I mean, and this type of thing does happen. Kids go off to college and they get involved in organizations that are very, very different than the mindset of the parents. And the parents are like, I want my son. Yeah.

But I remember my mom had a friend whose daughter was in the moonies, which was like this old school. Oh yeah, that was a cult. Cult. And how terrible it was. And it was just like, oh my God, you raise your child your whole life. And it's just like, I, what are we supposed to do? And then if, but if you're too strong hold, you know, and you know, you then you're, what are you supposed to do?

Kidnap them? Like when they're adults, how it's just- I think right now the concern is, is that there's illegal activities happening here that are happening very publicly. There's obvious signs of labor trafficking and multiple women have come forward related to reports of sexual assault and sexual abuse. In our research, there's been at least 10 women that have accused him of this. And so it's not just a situation of my daughter joined a group and it's high control. This is beyond high control. I mean, this is, they're controlling everything in their lives down to And then for him to try to say that the documentary is making her unsafe. When the realities. When Priscilla tried to leave.

Who's Priscilla again? She was the one that came out of the cult. That was Melanie's sister. Oh, yes. When she tried to leave, she said she was beaten by Hannah. For an hour. And. You know, she says that Robert raped her for years and she wasn't allowed to get married and she wasn't allowed to have kids because Robert will not let them have children. So it's like she has, she has filed a lawsuit against him, right? Yes. Everything you're saying is part of her lawsuit. Correct. Like, and it's part of, it's part of her lawsuit.

So it's like she has filed a lawsuit against him, right? Yes. Everything you're saying is part of her lawsuit. Correct. Like, and it's part of it's an allegation and a lawsuit, which he denies. Right. So he says that the relationship was consensual and that it no inappropriateness was happening outside the fact that he was her employer and pastor. Right. And had her employer and pastor. Right. Um, and had her living

in housing. Now the court, he tried to get it thrown out when she said that she was being human trafficked and he said that she hadn't pled that complaint well. And the court basically said, no, she did. You were controlling her housing, her care wallet, her keys, access to cars. I mean, Priscilla really was a prisoner in that White House in many respects. And for her to get out, she was beaten. So like, that's the concern about the longer Miranda stays that could be her. Yeah.

And- Well, I mean, it was, you know, well, I commend you for, you know, using your platform to get this story out. I really do feel like you were the one that got the ball rolling. And hopefully, whatever happens, they continue to be happy and prosperous and don't fall to anything that's worse than what we've seen. And we'll see, we'll see what comes about, you know. And hopefully everything with you in speaking your truth will, you know, come out on

the right side. Yeah, I'm pretty, I'm just hope that the conversation keeps happening, that people start questioning, like how many women have to come forward before police do anything about someone. Yeah. That was really interesting too. And sad. We need a couple more women. It's like, Oh my God.

So you apparently have to be a serial. Person doing that. Right. Right. Well, I mean, basically it's like the puff daddy thing. Yeah. It's like, Oh my God. So you apparently have to be a serial person doing that in right. Right. Well, I mean, basically it's like the puff daddy thing. Yeah. Danny Masterson didn't happen until yeah.

It's like women in numbers is well, anyway, um, I'm going to let you go, but tell everybody where they can follow and get more of your content. So I am on Instagram. It's at without a crystal ball. I'm also on TikTok at without a crystal ball. And then I have my YouTube channel, which is without a crystal ball. And then on Facebook, I'm without a crystal ball, Katie joy. Um, so yeah, I do content on all the platforms, all the things.

And I do love that name. That is very clever. Oh yeah. Well, it fits with the whole cult thing, right? Yeah. Well, I, and it's like, I always love that name. That is very clever. Oh, yeah. Well, it fits with the whole cult thing, right? Yeah, well, I did this like I always have like prediction. I do have predictions, but So I should be like prediction but not without a crystal ball. I don't have crystal ball. It's very It's clever. Well, anyway, thank you so much. Thank you, Heather. It was wonderful talking with you. Okay. Thanks. Bye Bye. All right, you guys, I hope you enjoyed that.

Remember, I'll be talking even more about this this Friday on my Patreon at HeatherMcDowell.net. That's where you join the Patreon. And then also I will see you this Thursday in Tampa and Friday in Orlando. Everything, all these tickets for all my upcoming dates are at HeatherMcDowell.net. Girls, we've all been there.

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