Juicy Scoop with Heather McDonald - The Strike, Real Housewives History with Guy Branum

Episode Date: August 8, 2023

The hilarious showrunner, writer, actor, comedian and my former office husband Guy is back! We discuss OG Housewives and your favorite franchises and moments. Since we are both psychotherapists with no degrees or credentials, we chose also to analyze these women. Being that we are also WGA and SAG proud members we get into what is going on in Hollywood. Enjoy! Vote For Juicy Scoop: realitytelevisionawards.com/vote Get extra juice on Patreon: patreon.com/juicyscoop Subscribe on Youtube: youtube.com/@JuicyScoop Follow me on Instagram: instagram.com/heathermcdonald Follow me on TikTok: tiktok.com/@heathermcdonald Follow me on Twitter: twitter.com/HeatherMcDonald Follow Guy on Instagram: instagram.com/guybranum Learn more about your ad choices. Visit podcastchoices.com/adchoices

Heather McDonald has got the juices scoop. When you're on the road, when you're on the go. Juice is scoop is the show to know. She talks Hollywood tales. Her real life, Mr. St.Van Cereal Data and Cereal System You'll be addicted and addicted fast to the number one tab or real life hot cat. Listen in, listen up.

Woo, woo, and a McDonald. Juicy scoop. Hello and welcome to Juicy scoop. Well, everybody, I am in New York this week. I am so excited. I am going to be on watch what happens live. Yes, so make sure that you watch that. And then, of course, if you haven't

already, go and get your tickets and come to Vegas November 4th. Seamy Saturday, November 4th at the Venetian for Juicy ScoopCon. It's going to be so fun. Please go to HeatheringtonAll.net for that. And then also, I'm leaving New York and going to meet your favorite Chris Franjola. We will be in Redbake, New Jersey on on the 10th this Thursday, August 10th. Then we jump all over to Foxwords in Mashin, Mashin and Tucket. And that is August 11th. Then we're going to be in Huntington, New York on August 12th. And then I enjoy the week in the Hamptons. D.I.M.E. hook me up.

I'm so excited. I'm going to be hanging out with my friend Lisa. I'm going to hang out with Jill Zarin with Luanne. And then I'm doing a show at the West Hamptons Theater on August 18th. And then I come back. But all the shows will be fresh and good. I've got lots of things planned for you.

Everything is at HeatherMcDonald.net. That's where you get all my tickets. That's where you join Patreon. That's where you change your life. Now for a wonderful interview I do with my good friend Guy Brannum, who's kind of new to watching the housewife. So we did another deep dive. We did some juicy scoop history.

We did some pop culture talk, and kinda got into like a psychological examination of these women, which I always find so fun and juicy. So get ready for a great interview right now, and here's Guy Brannon, thanks. Hello and welcome to Juicey Scoop. This is another special episode of Juicey Scoop History, Housewives Edition, with a return favorite, this is another special episode of juicy scoop history housewives edition

with a return favorite my one-time office husband guy brand new writer producer actor model uh... showrunner okay podcaster whatever i'm not be your current workspiles but like Sonia Morgan, I'm in the blue book, okay? I get to wear the shoes with the McDonald family crest.

Sadly, my current workspace is my actual spouse, which is just not as fun as saying my work has been. My gay husband. But I have to ask, you have like a rich life going on out here, but you are now formally on strike as a writer and an actor. Have you picketed just to see and be seen? Have you picketed just like to see who's out there? Because it's good some days, like some days it's exciting.

I saw Chris Pine. I know, well listen, I completely support it, but this show, a couple of people asked, can you still do your podcast? Can you still do stand-up? Some people don't understand how it works. Yes. No podcasting, at least for me, when I started,

I completely owned and have soul-propried whatever you want to say over this. So no, no one can tell me not to do it. Well, I know so. So thank God for one can tell me not to do it. Well, and also, and thank God for that for the last eight years. But yeah. At any point in time, we have four to seven jobs.

And it's like, yes, I'm a guild writer. Yes, I'm a SAG actor, but it's like, I'm also that is not going to be my full-time job because it's never my full-time job. You know, it's like doing podcasts are always part of my life. Right.

Like, you know, doing stand-up is always part of my life. Good. Well, let's talk about another part of your life, which was you started watching Real House wives of Beverly Hills. Yes. And you wanted to just, we wanted to talk about the Kyle Mariso divorce because I want to ask you a lot of people know my opinion, I've shared it, but I want to know yours through fresh eyes being that you're just kind of getting into housewives now.

I think also consuming it in a mehagadose like I did. You sort of like see the journey and you see the arc and you know, Kyle is the bedrock of Beverly Hills, a fundamentally more stable franchise than New York, I would say. And like, guess Ramona's been there forever, but no one's saying Ramona's too stable. But I think that Kyle has been on this journey of being the center and being the heart. And I feel like she does also in this kind of like mid-s, late 40s kind of way. Once, I think she's on a journey, I've heard rumors about some degree of lady on lady activity.

I've seen a lot of cowboy hats. Right. And so I think she's wanting an evolving personality and also like, you know, like she has two sisters who are sucking up all the batshit. and also like, you know, like she has two sisters who are sucking up all the batshit. And I think there is a part of her that wants to sort of like have the space

to grow and explore. And also Maricio's got his own show. And I'm fascinated to see, even though I think it is a fundamentally boring show. Buying Beverly Hills with some people from his agency. Yes. Now I I saw that you know Kyle was not at all part of it and I thought it was because maybe contractually she couldn't do it. Yes. But I just heard from a good source. No. It was that the network or the producers of it to thought that she would draw too much focus from they wanted to grow on its legs.

I've like the daughters are interesting enough. Mauricio is interesting enough. The daughters are interesting. I mean, my understanding of Kyle is so much defined by you in the first season of Beverly Hills in our office saying, Kyle Richards with the hot husband. And just sort of that thing of like, she's got a husband, he is hot.

They've got relative stability and you just are like, oh God, I want that. They were able to sell like charming domestic comedy better than anyone else. I mean, like Ken and Lisa are a great comedy duo, but fundamentally they're having to do comedy with like miniature horses and decent stuff. And like they had a real, you know, the little one was always good for a one-liner. And then also I think there is something, like nothing sells me on a man.

Like him taking your your child from a previous relationship as his own. And the relationship between Farah and Mauricio, like I love so much when I'm in my neighborhood and I see that there is a listing by Farah O'Manski or she goes by Farah Brittany or something or something. Yeah. I'm just like she like she went into her dad's business, even though it's not her biological dad. It makes me so happy. And so, you just have to assume that I have to assume, he took the relationship for granted too much.

And then, I don't know, I feel like any housewife situation, there's always suspicion of cheating, and he was the hot one. And I could tell you, I'm like any house of a situation, there's always suspicion of cheating and he was the hot one. And I could definitely see him like having a little fun and not thinking like it could shake this very sound relationship

that he has, you know? I'm okay, so I've said this before, but I'll tell you in that shot. I need to hear it. For so I've said this before, but I'll tell you behind the other for the first time just recently on a previous episode I said maybe their relationship wasn't always that great and they actually were really good in front of the camera. Yeah. And that they led more secret lies and she did turn up blind eye to any discretion she might have, but none of them turned into like a girlfriend,

it just like he had fun or whatever. But again, there's still no evidence, real evidence of it. And then also I just think, yeah, I mean, she's evolving like everybody else. She may be attracted to women. She became sober, she lost weight, she's, and then also just with anything, I mean, the relationship's long, maybe she's just like not...

Maybe she's more annoyed with him, and I think maybe... She's not finding him as fun and charming and doesn't really want to put up with it anymore. Do you think it's hard to be a real housewife and be sober? Yes! Yeah, I mean, so much of it revolves around having that third mongerita and having a little bit of fun, you know. And so she was, she was a tequila girl and now she's sober, but I think a lot of them do become sober

because as you get older, you should drink less. That's just a fact. And also she's been on it for 14 goddamn seasons or whatever, you know? Like it's a lot of time to be sort of like going with who can't all she's never looked better in her life and what is amazing about today's world is that you can be the cutest you've ever been at like 55 then you were at 25 because you have a better nose, better teeth, better things, and you're thin. Like you can feel it's amazing.

It's the revolution of real housewives that it really does sort of center the power and agency and sexuality of women at that age. And like previously when you represented that, it was as some sort of like joke or monstrosity. And the fact that there are so many of them and so many diverse takes on it, like you really do have to take it seriously.

And like, to reach the best example of look at a photo of Doreet from when she was 22, shit was not together. Like at 43 or whatever, shit is together. Yeah, and you can, yeah, she definitely just had some work done because there's some night nurse, plastic surgeon nurse that's saying she wasn't paid. Oh, really? So she definitely had something done.

Now I mean, yeah, you can look amazing and feel really great about yourself and then you have all this love. And if you're feeling like then you're not also getting at home and maybe you put up with that for a lot of years and now you're like, no, I don't want to. But I just, I wanted to believe in Kyle and Mauricio. I want those like very stable relationships. Well, the thing is, are they fine? Have they always been like this?

But they're like, you know what? Let's let's let the cat out of the bag so that people want to watch this season. And I'm going to be a little more honest. OK, well, like the notion of you have to go into every season with an idea of what you're going to do this season, and I'm gonna be a little more honest about it. Okay, well, like, the notion of you have to go into every season with an idea of what you're going to do that season, the relationship between being produced and self-producing is interesting.

Yes. And the notion of Kyle saying, like, Jesus Christ, I'm doing this for the 12th or 13th time, like, I have to have, because- Stuff it up a notch. Yes, because there have also been some seasons when she just trying to do light family comedy and it's a little bit you're getting to full of yourself like with the dogs yes your Kyle Richards you have to

cry and you know it really helps when she is a speaking of crying yes okay when to reach got robbed yes and they were went all over Kyle's house that night yes there is a moment that was caught by several of us, myself included, and people that watch it, where Doreet saying something, and then Kyle goes, oh my God, she looks right at the camera to make sure that the camera was catching her, getting this emotional moment, and the girl has been working since she was four. Yes. So she can cry. No. She can do this. She can do whatever she needs.

Absolutely. She knows how to play the game, but also like, you know, like Kim is a better actor than she is. Like Kim can give you the real thing, but that's also because Kim is drawing from the chaos. And she Kyle is so perfect for reality because she has the acting skills to be able to sell those moments, but she also has the producer skills to be watching and managing all of the dynamics. And I think her releasing some degree of character growth to us this late on is like kind of impressive.

And also as a gay, I'm always going to be supportive of if she and Mauricio had policies, I support those policies. I would much rather they were allowed to fuck around, but also that house and those businesses and those children are something that they take seriously. And it's also like, I can understand not wanting to be public about something like this when Porsche was seven, but Porsche was like 15 now and maybe can understand, you know?

Yeah, I mean, I've said this to like, there are a lot more people than the average person knows is living like an open marriage. Where they're just kind of, but they're not public, I mean, they're not public figures, but they have money and they have people. And since the beginning of the time, people have been like, have your mistress,

we're not gonna get divorced, I don't care, I don't care to screw you. But in this case, they're like, if they thought it was coming out or whatever, they're like, we can't really hide it because our persona is that we're the hot sexy couple. Okay. I need to tell you about PeaceGay guys now.

Yes. So, older gay guy works in fashion and his, like, no paperwork, long term boyfriend. Okay. 40, multiple houses, they are not in the same place very frequently and the 40-year-olds has a career of his own, like does his own thing. And the 40-year-old found out that the fashion guy too much.

Now how much older is the other guy? He's like mid 60s, too much plastic surgery. Okay. But he had another boy in another house, but because of medical issues, he hasn't been having sex with them. Okay. And like, the 40-year-old got very upset. Yeah. Um, and was like, how dare you?

And I was like, what I... You think I do your friends? These are friends of friends. I mean, I found out about that. I was like, that's not playing the game. Playing the game is being upset enough that you get something. Yeah. You know what I mean? Like, that's what you need to do.

But you are a much more sophisticated student of these dynamics. I'm going, well, I don't know. I mean, I do think every dynamic is different. I think there's some that are like, I don't care at all. And I think there's a billionaire who's like, listen, you do you, boo. I mean, I'm not giving you half of my billion, but we have kids together, and I think for a while, I think for a while that works until someone

really falls in love and wants to be out with that person publicly, or me, that's someone that has even more money, and they're like, I can divorce you now because this person wants to be with me. Grabby third party is the thing I think is dangerous. And you have to be really impressed if they have been open that Mauricio has avoided grabby third party.

Yeah. Because that's, you know, I mean, maybe if this is just a way of saying to the press, like you might see us out with someone, that's, you know, don't get freaked out about it. But like, I want to think about it in terms of them producing for the show. I literally just came from listening to the Bethany and Jill Zaryn podcast. Okay. So, you really let's switch to that. Then talking about... We'll pop up to that. Let's just talk about that for a minute.

Then talking about the relationship, which we, what's real and what's spectacle, was fascinating. And then sort of like so parsing Bethany's arrival to Bobby's Chivett and Funeral was like really fascinating to think about the ways that they are thinking about those things. Yes. And what was your thought? What like, listening, what did you think?

I was impressed. Do you think it was all, do you really think it was a genuine thing? Or, I mean, listen, it was really good timing on Bethany's part. The new show had just aired and was being well received. I've, I've not changed my opinion that she's a monster. Like I've not changed my opinion that she's a monster that with Jill fucking Zaren, who got her on the show, and with whom she has a real and true, I think fundamental friendship that she's like,

set on fire for the last 12 years. That she couldn't just like create some space for, you know, I was terrible too. She kept saying that she was owning her shit, but she had to be so alpha and controlling about everything. Yes, totally. And Jill was like trying to process and clearly in that way, you and I both have people in our lives

that we have in not great space. And, you know, resolution with some of them would be nice because they're people who mean something to you. Yeah. And it just, it was hard, but talking about the way that they both acknowledged, like when Bethany was saying, I don't know if I would have come to the funeral

if it were outside of shooting, that like that was part of, that she cannot extricate herself from that calculation, is so interesting. Well, I mean, I did. I didn't respect Bethany for being honest about that. I may not comment if I wasn't being shot. That I can't believe more people aren't jumping on that

because granted, again, happy that you were honest about it, but you. Yes, but the thing that bothered me the most was that she was like, I'm the Michael Jordan of Real Housewives. I don't know if you would have made it in the hall of fame because you dropped the ball. And it's like, yeah, she kept doing all this.

Like you dropped the ball. I handed it to you, fumbled it. Like, oh, God, shut up. Be a little generous, especially at this point in time, but also put there is something, but also Bethany is so smart. In the way that she expresses it as it is a sport, in the way that each of them has to go in individually with an idea for, like, that they are coming in with five to seven different

narratives and trying to wedge those together into a storyline against each other. How much cabaret is going to be there, you know, how much of Heather's spank line is going to be on the show. Like everybody's trying to play five-dimensional chess with and against each other is such an impressive way of thinking about it. But I definitely feel like it with the New York Housewives. And it's entertaining as Bethany is. I just don't feel like she's ever truly like cared about any other other women no i mean as real friends that she really has it and a lot of the other women have you know yes that there's actual friendship

remona singers a god damn basket case but she fucking has lunch with people you know like remona singer and she may talk too much about herself, but there is a way that she is keyed in to these parties. She's, you know, seems to still be having lunch with Heather Thompson, who never gelled that much with the cast, you know, anyway. Yeah. Yeah. And like, I appreciate that. And like, Bethany, for those first couple of seasons, having somebody with one foot in and one foot out, being really funny talking shit about them. So valuable. When she came back and was just a monster,

shitting on them constantly, like the existence of her only friends or her paid employees, that half of her scenes were her talking to a chauffeur, you should be in there and ask about. Oh, you're talking about like, which scene, when was that? No, she wasn't in that one that one let me say I don't

know if I have a cast photo of but okay I don't see came back yes would she came back friends with Carol for one season and then Carol for a season so you guys have seen me you've been following me I've been traveling a lot I've been in the ocean I've been in the sun I've been using a lot. I've been in the ocean, I've been in the sun, I've been using lots of products. Well, thank God I have my way shampoo, conditioner, my detox shampoo. But I also want to tell you about their best selling product and that's ways,

best selling hair oil. This is a fast fix to get your hair looking healthy again. I absolutely loved it because it just, it was like a multitask oil and it really helped smooth the frizz that I have and it helped actually seal some split ends. These split ends, not some I have a lot. And it gives me that high gloss super smooth finish when I blow out my hair that I absolutely needed after a summer of havoc on my hair. And then when I was at my friend's house she had way products too. And I was like yes that's what I need. This is the smell I love. I feel like I'm just, you know, walking through

a hidden garden. I'm just smelling violent and gardenia. I absolutely love it. Live life your way and get your fast fix for healthy looking hair. Go to THEOUAI.com. Theway.com and use code juicy for 15% off any purchase. That's Theway.com THEOai.com code juicy. Tell me what you thought about the Carol and Bethany Diabic. I mean, it was... Andy is the part of this game that is always hard for me to wrap my head around. Carol was brought in to be a Bethany who you can control more. She was there to comment and make jokes and everything. And I fucking loved her because of that. But like bringing Bethany back when there's already a Carol,

I understand he was like, mm, let's see what happens here. I thought it just fundamentally came down to like, Bethany wants to control people. And like, Ramona, Sonia, and Luanne are fucking agents of chaos and they cannot be controlled. And she can try to use her powers on them as much as she can and she can make them look bad. But like she's only going to do so much and she just decided that she was going to own

Carol and Carol played the game until she started pushing too hard and then Carol like the thing is is I'm going to say Carol was never really a real housewife until fucking Bethany turned on her. At which point in time we saw how like how far Carol could go. You know, that's exactly right. I always, I'm friendly with Carol. Yes. Carol, you were the, you know, until it ended, you had the best of anyone because you were, because you didn't have kids yes because you're a widow

yes there was no you were risking no banister yeah you were you were risking anything and you just kind of were having fun and you make some stark remarks but they were pretty funny and they're pretty harmless yeah you'd be telling this story where you're like i heard two men one being luanne like get all the funny like little lines

to the point where nobody was like mad at her or anything, but what happened with Carol and Bethany, kind of, and I don't know how much it was on the show or how much been told on my podcast, but this is my understanding remembering it, is Carol, everything was fine. And then Carol left for the summer when they weren't shooting to be with a friend whose husband had passed. And while she was out there, Bethany came, was like, I'm going to come out there. And there was some other friend of hers that was a wife of a very powerful studio head. And so Bethany was really wanting to meet that woman.

That woman didn't want to meet Bethany. So when Bethany came to pick up Carol, Carol came like, bye, got her keys and ran out the door. And then Bethany took that as a real snub. No, she mentioned it on the show, didn't invite me in. Yeah, didn't invite me in, and everything, and didn't like that. And then after that, it was sort of like, Carol was kind of blindsided that she was just,

like, on a campaign to make her look bad. Well, what's so funny to me is that it's a mixture of Bethany jilling someone saying, oh, you got something that I want, like let me get in there, but also with this element of just burning down relationships that feels, I forget how much we talked about this when I was here before, but like, I mean,

Bernadette, Bethany's mom, sounds like a piece of work. Yeah. And you get little feelings of the like, you know, and I'm sure she had a very, very difficult childhood, but like, you just get that sense that she is a burn it down person. Right. Like, if you you're not gonna do what I want, I'll destroy you. Yeah, yeah. So, I definitely, so do you think these two are gonna actually hang out? I'm seeing Jill in the Hamptons. And Jill was very, very happy about this whole thing. The thing is, I think that they have an organic and human friendship that predates all of this.

And I think that they are like, there are ways that they are cut from the same fog. Well, they really didn't know. They really weren't like buddies before the show. But I think they barely knew each other before the show. I think they're energies. Similar. Yeah.

And I think that like, Jill is strong enough to stand up to what Bethany Breeze at her. But when I hear things like, I don't wanna go to your gift bag party or whatever. long enough to stand up to what Bethany Breeze at her. But when I hear things like, I don't wanna go to your gift bag party or whatever. Well, isn't that the rudest one? That's what I said. And she said it like three times.

I'm like, I said to Jill, like, oh listen, if you guys hang out without bikes and cameras. Yes. Fine, but it's gotta be her inviting you. It's gotta be her calling you and being like, come to my house, I'm cooking, do this. You'll probably cut this out, but it reminds me of a former friend of both of ours. I'll cut it out. Who needs to let you know that she's a little bit better than you and that she's real classy.

Yeah. And it's just like, come down. We all know where you come from. They come from the same fucking place. Yeah. Yeah. Very true. Bethany was bitching about trying to get a union together for the saying that reality shows stars deserve to have a union. Oh, but she's the one.

It was so fast-dating to find out that she's the one who ended favorite nations for the housewives. You know, it's truly bonkers how little they got paid at the beginning, but like that truly does help you understand the way that everyone's coming in, that everyone is at a different level, everyone's at a different rank. And you know, you're right. She had the opportunity to do a union thing, right? And say favorite nations. And it was like, no, I'm going to be Beyonce. I'm going off. And it's also, I mean, it is, she's a very hypocritical. It's the hard state of Bethany right now,

because she's like the whole thing was, I'm richer and better than you. And now she wants to show you that she's doing Chili's food crawls just like you. You know, she doesn't know quite where to fit herself. And it's really interesting because she does have such a wonderful natural skill set. Yeah. But like, it wasn't the skill set for a daytime talk show. She's not Kelly Clarkson.

Yeah. You know, it really is, you know, skinny girls are good angle. But I feel like there was a more right, where would you put her, if you had to put her in an entertainment somewhere, where would you put her? I mean, I think she was the best as a mean housewife. She was a snarky mean housewife that could be funny, and that could also laugh really hard at somebody else. But like, no, I don't, I mean, I've heard, you know, some of her rants and stuff,

and they're not particularly funny, but some things that I do are captivating when she does stuff on the shelf. Like she's very smart and talented, but the perfect fit was Real Housewives. That was the perfect fit. It was the perfect fit for those first couple of seasons when Ramona was still able to say,

you have nothing and we'll rule it everything. Yeah. To me, as time goes on, I appreciate and respect what Luanne does more and more because Luan has this like Hard take of a character and such an enormous weakness that is so like she's a well-written character She's a fancy Countess who will fuck anything like who really will get down in the gutter And she's always trying to show you that she's fancy and she doesn't like using curse words, but also the minute a piece of tail comes by,

she's, you know, like presenting. And- Yes, that is all true. I just hung out with her. She's built a last. And she gets dudes and she is proud of how many dudes she gets. Yes. And she's not hiding it and she's a little brag about it

and I love it. Good for her. And she's gorgeous. Yeah. Stunning. I know I'm like looking at her face because we just hung out at her friend's house. And it's like she doesn't have any kind of face left or anything. Yes. She just is like a very fit looking person. When you're great. When you are hanging around with these people, are you able to be fully yourself? Or? Yeah. Okay. I mean, with these people, are you able to be fully yourself? Or? Yeah. Okay. I mean, yeah, I mean, I have to get scoop. I'm asking for scoop, but I'm also like, this is just, you know, I'm keeping the scoop from myself, some of it, you know, because I know,

like, she'll be like, now this between us, and absolutely, that's why I'm able to keep the friendship, because I don't. There's so many things that I've known that I've kept secret and then it shows up on the show. And I'm like, well, at least people know when they told me that I know it's in the person that went to Dumois or something. Yes. You know, because also it's fun for people to see it as it comes along.

You don't want to know everything. There's something so lovely. Well, and you enjoy it. Like you more than, like you love this world and you've turned it into a career, but I also think you are like an old school anthropologist. You are a participant observer You go you can fully participate in their rituals and then remove yourself from it and comments on it and analyze it Yeah, I mean, I don't know how like

The future will be so they there's this new, the new house. Do you like these girls? I do. I think, yeah, you have to take a minute to get to know them, you know, and but I love their style. I think it was smart to do it. Yeah. The second episode, I wasn't like it was taking me a minute. They went to the Hamptons and it was in the winter and I'm watching it. But there's this one girl and you know, she reveals that she has an at-sexity year. Her twins are one and they're all like and then she says, well, you know,

he was my roommate first, platonic roommate. And then one day my mom was like, you should be with him. And so I'm like, okay, now this is the thing. Now you've revealed to the world a pretty big deal. Yeah. That, you know, the sex life needs help. And even if they bow in the next episode and she goes on the reunion and said, sense that trip to the Hamptons, we've screwed three times. Whatever the world was to hear, they think is a regular marriage or whatever. I just was like,

oh, this is, this one's gonna end badly. Would you ever coach, if you were allowed to, if you could have like one phone call with a new housewife every week and be their coach. Would you do that? Of course. Who would I coach on the new? I don't know. There's these new. Also, I haven't seen the second episode. Which one was it? Is it Rayleigh? No, it was the Indian

girl who's in fashion. Oh, okay. Yeah. She has the twins. Yeah. Yeah. So she hasn't had a, yeah. So, and everyone's like, you know, oh get into and then of course on the second episode They have to do the lingerie thing and I'm just like no, we're gonna get home and we're lingerie I'm like there is no girl trip. Yeah in the history of girl trips We're only on a real housewife girl trip. Do they then get in like SNM outfits or then get in like SNM outfits or lingerie. And I'm like, why are you guys letting the producers talk you into it? I don't care how good your body is.

The show is for women and gay men. Like you're not gonna, I don't care that you went on a Zempek, you're not going to look good in it. Just wear the sweats and be like, no, I'm not wearing the lingerie. Do you think it has to do with some sort of like product placements or anything like that? No, I think they're just I think the producer the segment producer

whatever is like we need to up it so if it's not a costume party let's tell them to dress in SNM yes let's tell them to do some weird thing let's trip you want to get them drunk and have them do cartwheels right that's what I mean that's entertainments yeah yeah even that even that felt fake. Like, you didn't say it, but like, one girl was trying to do something with her legs on a wall, like a twerk. And it just felt like, I just feel like so many times now, some of these seasons, whether it's O.C. or whatever, where they're like, okay, I clocked in,

let me go down the slip and slide. Let me grab my friend's tits. Let me throw an app kit in someone's face. Let me yell at you. Is it, is it, is it not yet? So I'm like, two more things and then we can go. Like that's the way it feels. Oh, that's interesting.

The notion of them just trying to like give enough good tapes so that they can get out of there. I've had them say that where they're like, what do we need to do to end this? And they're like, someone needs to start something. Otherwise, this whole night was a waste. I, that's interesting. I'm midway through like Liam McSpenese for a season.

And the amount that it feels like she's just trying to matter. So hard. It's like so frustrating. And it's like, Tinsley's right next to her. And Tinsley, of course, never mattered. I never tried to matter. Yeah.

Tinsley was so useless. But. Tinsley's in love now. With Scott or with her. No, she got rid of Scott. That's for sure. I think she played with the idea of coming back at some point or girls or whatever,

but no, I heard that she is in love with someone who's like rich and good and nice and she's smart enough to be like, I'm not going back on housewise and fucking up something that could like be with me talking to me. She seems to really want to be on that path and she's so gorgeous and so cute, you would think she would be able to, but it is also, I guess it's a harder and more complex path of being a society person and being married to one of those rich guys, who was like, I was reading about her,

she did some Prince for a period of time, and I'm like, you know, get a title out of it. Why not? But like watching, that was one of the things I wanted to talk to you about was, my friend Matt Rogers loves talking about the people who show up self-producing. And there are ways that like truly, you know,

I thought that Lisa Rina was amazing at creating moments. I was good at that sort of thing. But like, that's the kind of producing I can stand by. But Leah showing up with kind of, or, I mean, I think that there is a real divide between the women who are just, that should crazy. I Kelly Ben Simone, if you will. And somebody like a Viva who ends up looking crazy, but I think like a vassar educated attorney who also didn't like getting on planes,

how to real idea of how she was going to make herself be interesting on that show. A Viva, you mean? Yes, and it made her look like a monster. Was a Viva an attorney? Yes, I mean, she's a housewife, but she has a lot of gray. Oh, yeah, I mean, she brought in her, she had told the story now. It's like a, you know, yes, she planned

on doing the leg and everything. Yeah. And, um, but one of the things that Ramona told me is that the real plan, according to Harry Dubin, who was married to a new obidator, Ramona, I mean, the greatest character in Housewives history. What she really wanted was to throw the leg, not have someone retrieve it, and then Harry or her husband, I can't remember, would have to carry her out. Ha, ha, ha, ha, ha.

I mean, the thing is, is like, that's like one person who thinks she's smart coming up with a plan, and like, it's not entertaining. And I just wonder. I mean, it is an iconic scene, but I think, Joe, do you think when, when, you know, the, do you think the producers,

because I think it's such a hard thing to play. It's like, okay, I gave you all this, I yelled at this person, I got this horrible fight, but then the audience turns on them and then the producers are Andy, whoever are like, no, you were too bad. We wanted you to be a little bit bad, but you were too bad.

So now you're gone and you're like, well, God, I thought I was doing a good show. It's such a hard thing. I understand, but it's also like performance involves nuance. And like, you know, what you also want are the like come to Jesus moments when somebody like turns around and comes together again.

And just like one season of insisting that Carol used a ghost writer over and over and over again, that's not entertaining. You know, like Kyle finds fucking arcs, like good Miss Rina finds arcs. And like Lisa's capacity to, you know, to say like, I'm owning my shits and then come around on something or someone or like, you know, Luanne fought like cats and dogs over the titles with Carol Radswell for the first season and then the next season, you know,

they were hanging out in the Hamptons together. And I think you just have to have, and there are ways that some of the women who don't feel as deliberate or managed, the raw messiness of a sonia or Ramona is just sort of more likeable. And there's something that feels artificial. Well, because I will say about those about Sonia, Ramona, and Luann, and I told Luann this too, because she and Sonia are doing the show likeann, and I told Luann this too, because she and Sonia are doing the show like crappy lake when they go to the small town. And I go, you know, throughout all the years, though, you and Sonia and Ramona too, never,

we're never doing that plotting manipulative, like I've got, I've got the receipt here. No. I know what your husband did in 1995. I'm going to destroy your life. Like now with New Jersey, you don't want New Jersey. But now in New Jersey, this last season took this turn where there was a alleged private investigator involved and they were getting all this crap on everybody else

and this person's business and this person's ex-wife who's in prison and it just felt like, ugh, and it's all this stuff that like, it doesn't, it's better that we see the fight happen or the misunderstanding of the argument or whatever happened organically and I do feel a little bit with the new housewives so they go to the girl, one girl's house in the Hamptons. And because they're all so pretty nice and normal, and they've probably been watching these shows and they were like 12 at this point,

that the most you can say is that one girl got caviar, but they still wanted to get a sandwich before they came. Yeah. I mean, all your root house guests, I'm like, that's not there. The cheese fight in the first episode. Yeah. It just felt so low stakes and I had to tell myself,

well, this is because they're still establishing themselves. And the reason that bad house guest lands correctly with Luan and D'Arinda is that you know it comes from an honest place. D'Arinda takes me me a good housekeeper so seriously. Right, hostess, yeah. Yeah, and like Luann sees herself as better than Fishroom or Basement, you know? Yeah, yeah.

Yeah. Like, you really, I do think it's funny. It's kind of like watching Survivor with like people in newer seasons having to develop newer strategies towards finding the game and winning the game. And I just feel like I would love to see somebody really smart show up, but it also, it takes more than smarts, it also takes relationships. And you know, I would say Ms. Movelle has probably done the best job of showing up. But the thing is, yeah. I mean, yeah, Garsel is just like a really likable person, and she laid out all her scandal.

Yes. So there isn't really anything like for her to do, but she's so pretty and fun to watch, and she's really real. Yes, I mean, really real is the thing, and I think that for some of these, especially when they're like a 38 year old with like a decent claim to a career and are kind of pretty, like they feel like they gotta be doing something and it's not that settled in kind of like, I'm just going to, you know, see where this

dinner party takes us and, you know, find a reaction. What do you think of Miss Sutton? I mean, I love that she comes to West Hollywood. Like, I think she's a mess. She is to me a little crazy and overreactive in the way of Kelly or Brandy, people who I don't really care for. You know, like, she's all cute in her like, Southern latin-ness and making chicken salad

is all charming and nice, but at the end of the day, she's, you know, calling Crystal's leather pants stupid. You know, at the end of the day, she will just like Escalate so far right And you know it's a lot of you see I just see that the famous scene where Crystals like I don't know I think you're jealous. They're really good friends down really okay now they are But but she was like what you're ugly love pants. And I do kind of like that moment,

because I think she's like, what the hell is going on? And she's frustrated. And she's new to the game. And I think right when she walked in, she thought, I'm not into that style of leather pants. And so that was like in the forefront of her body. And she said that.

And I like that, that she just was like. Crowd work is working from your immediate visceral reaction, absolutely. But I also think the thing of like, if you come into a series of real housewives, the person you have your first fight with should be your best friend by your second season. And if you're not doing it that way,

you're doing it wrong. Like if you're not doing it that way, you're possibly participating in somebody else's group dynamics, which means they are owning and playing you. Yeah. That all look really good here though. All right, let's go to an older season. What are you thinking? What was, what did you love most about Kim Richards? I mean, I, I loved that there was a dose of real chaos. She is like very similar to the thing that Ramona has on New York of just sort of like, you know, this is a person with demons inside of her and she's going to have very

Natural organic reactions to things that are going to be huge and unfortunately in Kim's case It's all just fucking liquor and drugs. And that's really hard. I also think. Were you watching it when she was dating the guy that Kyle was just disgusted by you, so unattractive that she met at her mailbox in West Lake? Yes.

And that kind of like desperate death. And what was it? Brandy said, you look like a, she said he looked like some dog that started with an M, but anyway, yes, that night where she was spiraling and she's like, I'm gonna have another baby. And Kyle was like, oh my God, that's what I really felt for Kyle

because I was like, Kyle, now it's going to come out and the famous scene of them in the limo and Kim goes you stole my goddamn house and you know that it was like everything that Kyle was going through of anything They have put up with her how many times she's covered for her or whatever During the season or whatever and she's like now you're saying on camera that we did something like financially shady or real estate shady when you know it wasn't whatever the case was. That's when she's like, okay, now I'm gonna fucking say it. You're an alcoholic.

Yeah, I mean, the thing is you cannot cast for that shit. It is the kind of thing that can only happen from 40 years of sisterhood. And you know, and like high stakes Hollywood sisterhood. And but those sorts of things of like the com, the raw complexity of we gave you alone against the house and then you never paid us back. I mean, this is the sort of shit that I've had to explain to you or you've had to explain to me about going on in your own life.

And yeah, it like, you know, there's just so much honesty to Kim Richards that there was no part of her that was hiding that she would desperately love to have a man in her life again. You know, like she was not presentational, she was real. And I think that it gave so much richness to every, everyone else seemed realer because they were engaging off of the shit that she was doing. Well, you know, I read that Hilton book.

Uh-huh. So, juicy came out that scene's bloggers. Well, I mean, it was very much a woman. I mean, there was a lot to the book and there was a lot about her character and it is all other people speaking about her. Yeah. So they don't like it. But the book got made because at the time Paris Hilton was rising in this guy's like, my god, there's this whole back history to all the Hilton.

Yeah. So I'm way older than the mother and everything. But I was, I'm fascinated by the fact that the mother, I believe, taught the girls very well. And not just well, like you can afford a home. I mean, go for the richest air in America, like that she came. I mean, first Kathy gets the first guy, which is the Hilton. That was huge. And he was already massive generational wealth.

And then Kim, I can't remember. She had some good cats along the way. But it was like, yeah, then she had one, and then she was cheating with another before she left with this one and got another rich one. And then she was like, I only want love. And then that guy was involved in like a Ponzi scheme and then was shot at the Brent Stellian Northridge. And then she had another one and then she, I mean,

I don't think she ended, I don't think she has a lot of money because none of the marriages lasted and they were all, I'm sure, pre-Neps and everything. So the only money she really got was when they were kids. But I was mostly glad to see, as I learned more about it, that her children had decent inheritances coming their way, that like there was somebody. They can take care of her, I guess.

Well, I mean, I wasn't thinking as much about like, who's going to take care of her. But I do like, there's some things that are interesting about everyone's parents, teachers, number of world view. And I think also, I mean, we just saw the Barbie movie, like, you know, like as a girl, you get'm a world view. And I think also, I mean, we just saw the Barbie movie, like, you know, like as a girl, you get taught a world view and approach. And, you know, in the

same way that your parents were like, you're going to get a real estate license. That's how you survive. And there's just something so that like the grandma Richards managed to understand LA enough to realize if I bring my daughters here, they can play this game and they can succeed. They all really did in one way or another. Well, I mean, it was definitely never anything that came to mind. Even if I would find out someone at USC or something was like, like the Davies who would have been like, she's a little older than I am. But there's, she, Kim married this girl's brother.

Yeah. So this girl was at SC of the Davies. And they're like, oh, it's Dana Davies. It's Dana Davies. Are you going to go to her party? She's her 21st birthday. She ran it out of nightclub. And I'm like, I, it's Dana Davies. It's Dana Davies, you know, are you gonna go to her party? She's her 21st birthday, she run it out of nightclub, and I'm like, I don't know, hacking and bike, she's not in my sorority or whatever.

And then there was a rumor that she married this guy that was like really hot at the school, but then they hired a detective, this is all rumor. And realized that he was like cheating on her, so then she couldn't get married to him and all the stuff and then she then there was the brand gummy bear davis do you remember that whole thing? no! they were like these there's like brand inner brand and there's somebody else someone just got engaged and now he's like 43 but there were these those the nephews or whatever of this were all the Paris Hilton ages. So they were all like so intertwined. And there's so many generations of like, you know, LA wealth, which isn't that many generations

of it, but this is it. It's also so interesting the way that these things sort of like similar under the surface and these people are around. Like when you go back, there's this one Instagram account that I follow that you would love that is like premieres and stuff from like 20, 30 years ago and you realize all of these people like are there and on the scene and dating these people and like in that world like Actor like people who didn't become famous until they were in their 40s, but who were regularly, you know the fact that Kyle was dating

until they were in their 40s, but who were regularly, you know, the fact that Kyle was dating, you know, C. Thomas Howell or whoever she was like in a long-term relationship with. Before she got with the Iranian prince or whatever, she's a dad affair, yeah. Yes, and there are these sort of like, moneyed LA people who are sort of like, swirling around that kind of thing.

Like, eat you so interesting, but also, like, so strangely, and the fact that, you know, Bethany was Kathy's babysitter. You know, like, it's all just so intertwined. And it's like, I mean, I joke about it too, but it's like such a different mom. I mean, I've said, like, my mom mom was just all about like, you get an education, you make your own money, you know. Yes.

You know, you're a stable man from a Catholic background. But not it, but it was like, you know, well, you'd want to get married forever, but she was never really like pushing like any kind of thing because she just was, she didn't want me to like give up my dreams of whatever that was. Well, it's true. It's true. A man. But it's interesting too that I also respect a mom that's savvy enough to like research the richest person in the town and put her daughter in front of that boy and know that proximity you might just fall in love or in these cases you might get pregnant and then

have to get married, which is even better because that's a double whammy. Yes, I mean, there are some people who have had to deal with in Hollywood who I'm like, I wish I knew them less so I could just admire them. Like, I wish. Because you know them too well and now you don't like their morality or. Or just sort of like, they just like been mean to people that I

know one time I tweeted this and then Mindy Killing immediately tweeted at me or immediately text me and she was like you're not talking about me or no I fucking love you and then I told her who I was talking about and she was like I don't know she's the worst but that what could you say what the tweet was about? Um, uh, it was literally me saying like, um, I wish I didn't know entertainment person's name redacted so well. So I could just admire her, her Machiavellian feats from afar or something like that. I probably didn't even phrase it that well. Um, but you know, it was like somebody who like secured

the fucking bag. And like I do admire that, but then when you think about it too hard, you're like, why didn't you raise your child to be a person? You know? And it's one of the reasons that I always enjoyed your books and you talking about the world because you were here in LA,

but also just from a good, like, a family that was trying to take care of itself. And you had, like, that balance between a little bit of crazy and a lot of stability. I mean, I will say, like, it is so amazing to me and seeing someone who marry so rich, you know, and sometimes it's real love, but sometimes it's like, so are you really just gonna fake it? Like for the next 20 years, you're like acting like you love this person

because you want to go shopping and you have all this stuff. Like I think it's so weird. Like with Tinsley. It's a long acting job. But with Tinsley. It's a long acting job. But with Tinsley, it's like that is what she wants is like stability. And you know, like the life.

And I respect it, Petona's highly understand us. I mean, listen, I know it's, if you don't come from money, it's so hard to like think that, oh my god, in this world, could I even attain anything or own a home or whatever but God, I mean even the richest people it gets boring. Yeah, you get over it and it gets boring And if you're not fulfilled like creatively with your work like let me just tell you something You're gonna get I mean even even Erica Jane, when I interviewed Erica Jane, she thought she hit the jackpot, Mary Tom Girardi,

25 years older than her, 30 years older, whatever it is. And she literally said, at a certain point, there's no other place I could go to. No other bag or jewelry that I could buy. And she was totally bored. And then that day, some postcard came for some guy's wife who was doing a cabaret and the guy putting it together, she knew from Atlanta or something.

Yeah. And she was like, what are you doing? And he's like, yeah, if you want to do something like this, we could put it together. You know the money to do it. And then she started doing it. That's really wonderful because I think so many people try to make entertainment for themselves

by stirring up drama. Like bored people make drama. And I think you're so much less likely to be bored if you have something that you love, that you, like if you have a career that you are interested if you have a passion, if you know, if you have something in your life that gives you meaning, you don't have to just talk shit about other people. Yeah. So I mean, it's just, but you know, being the rich wife and all that stuff, like who's really

your friend? You really, I don't know, it's just kind of, um, I read the book that Sex and the City was based on. Oh yeah. And just the way that Candace Bush and I talked about like there are only so many guys in New York. It was just like, there's just a way that like your view can become so narrowed. And it like it is kind of cute when they talk about Sony or Gerrinda back when they were

like girls on the town and realizing that we're a limited number of women who were like running in these social circles. Or like when you would talk about, I remember you talking about the OJ stuff and you talking about like Fey Resnick and, you know, just sort of being like the girls in Brantwood. But like so much of that requires just like narrowing your view, like coming to a point, like, you know, when the housewives have to go south of Canal Street and they all wind about it, and it's like, maybe you could remember that you live in an interesting city and can deal with people other than fucking Harry Dubin.

You know? Yeah. Um, bear, wait. So are you watching since we're just talking about, you just talked about sex and city. Are you watching in just like that? Of course, of course.

Let's get your take on in just like that. Oh, isn't it sad on behalf of everyone? I'm gonna go to I'm gonna go to the picture real quick. Okay. Because I just why not? Yes. Okay. Yeah. I'm so sad for those characters that I love because like Michael Patrick King

it doesn't appear to be trying. Yeah. I mean, he has so much money from Sex in the City and two broke girls that why would he try? But also why are you doing this? The fact that Miranda has spent how many episodes in the background of episodes, like fumbling, dildos, or whatever,

like this woman who was a capable, like smart attorney has turned into a joke and then the way that like the episodes used to be so elegant. I have a question about that. Yes. Miranda being the actress Cynthia Nixon is an out lesbian Ben with her wife or whatever for like so long. Why do you think she is playing it like,

even if she was a new lesbian, okay? Couldn't she act like she was a little like more, like not so goofy, like, couldn't she act like she was a little more like, trying, okay, I'm gonna try to be more hip. I'm like, I guess sometimes when they're having a sex scene, she's acting like she's hot for her, but you're right. The comedy of it is just so lazy.

The writers aren't giving her anything. They go so far out of their way to excuse Chae Diaz's worst behavior. Like, you know, when the three ways started and it was so clearly something that Miranda wouldn't be into, and they were like, oh no, but Che behaved perfectly the whole way. And like I get, no. What about that though? Let me talk about that. And then she was like, you guys go ahead.

You know, it's like almost like, do you want to go, you know, go on, do you want to go on this roller coaster ride? And you're like, I'm a little scared, but you guys go on it. I'll just wait up by the exit. That's what it was like. It was literally, I'm like, this is your girlfriend, this is her ex-husband,

and you're just gonna allow them to have sex and not be like, wait a minute. No part of that would she have ever done for Steve. And me, it's because she loves Chamor, but I think it's because they're trying to create this sort of like, you know, sort of like flawless non-binary character so that they're not making a non-binary character seem bad, but it's also creating a character who isn't a character. And the way that, like, you used to have Four plot lines that all thematically threaded together in some way whether it was just some fun pun or turn a phrase or something

Yeah, and now having six plot lines. They don't give respect to any of them. There is like it truly is like Serita Shaudry, what's her name? The real turd. I just call it the real turd. The real turd. She had a plot line that was, like, she lost her person, then she found it. And like, what are we supposed to get from that?

It's, you know, it's like one of these, the law profession. And also that exact storyline happened to Samantha. Like, well, they're so clearly trying to position her as the Samantha. Yeah, yeah. But like, yeah, but like Miranda's law professor like there were Miranda went to

LA for like four episodes and this character was like out on a limb having no relationship to these other people And it's like at least real housewives does the job of trying to build an idea of these people are friends Yeah, and you know, I don't know I do kind of feel like This real housewives does the job of trying to build an idea of these people are friends. And you know, I don't know. I do kind of feel like Charlotte and the lady who makes documentaries sort of aren't getting it as bad, but maybe that's because Charlotte was a goofy or character to begin with. Yes.

But like, I want Carrie Bradshaw to be smart. You know, I want Miranda to be smart and They've sold them short and it's kind of unfair to women in their fifties, you know, I don't know I just have to say like the last episode I was gonna I was getting ready to talk about and I was like literally couldn't Remember anything that happened. Yeah, and I was like wait a minute Wait, what happened then? I was like, oh, that's that happened. And I was like wait a minute, wait what happened? And I was like, oh that's right, Charlotte's daughter wanted to have sex.

It should have go in the cyclone to get the condoms. I'm like, I literally couldn't remember anything else from the episode. So I'm like, I'm a little bit worried, Aiden's coming back. So, like I never liked Aiden. I controversially, burger is my favorite of Carey's boyfriend. I just saw when we were at the Barbie movie the preview for My big fat Greek wedding three. Oh, this is Christ. How do you as an I mean I have to say not one chuckle

Not just for me from the entire audience. They just did not look funny at all as a former Groundlings Sunday company. Yes, you must be dazzled that somebody managed to turn her ground like one woman show Into three separate movies. I believe it was ACME. Oh really? And you know the story. Yeah, she did her one woman show and Someone saw it and was was Greece Greek and was like I was Rita Wilson, I got to get Rita Wilson to come see it, then Rita Wilson saw it. And it all went from there. And no, I so admire her. And she is, every time I've seen her at anything,

she could not be nicer. And I'm kind of sad she got divorced, though. Oh, I didn't know that. Because she's one of those couples, her and also Melissa McCarthy, are like these like ground links couples that I believe in. You know? Yes.

Well, yeah. I'm pretty, I'm like almost positive that she married. So the girl and my, what is her name? My big Greek, what's her name? What's the lead? Her name is Vinavar Dallas. Okay. Yeah, her husband, they had a child.

Then she, after that, you know, it was so hit She got the sitcom of course that didn't make it she was always on talk shows and they're like you have you got two million dollars And you still live in your little like studio city home and she like yes, and and then he worked on other shows and They adopted a daughter and then no they got they got divorced on the Drew Carey show But like yeah, I mean it is just that rough thing of like, did you watch Kanye on Carla? No, what is that? It was, one of her two terrible follow-ups to my big, bad guy.

It was her and Tony Collette and it was the improvisers and clinicians to have two characters who are exactly the same, which I don't understand why you're this. Was this a movie or TV show? It was a movie about two women who have to run from the mob, so go to West Hollywood and pretend to be drag queens. And it was terrible. So oh my god, like a reverse white chick. Yes.

And like it was bad. And I just feel like why she kept getting chances is a little crazy to me and why she didn't sort of like don't you feel like there was a point in time when she could have gone and been supporting on a sitcom and like gotten in there? Yes, but I also just think yeah that's what's hard. No, I just think it's a hard thing I just think when they are casting for those supporting roles, like they always go for Who who is Carrie Fisher's sister Jolly? They always just go for Jolly fish. Yes, or Heather Dubrow Yeah They just always go for someone that they know that they can deliver it

That's not gonna overshadow that knows how to learn her lines quickly, and it's a safe bet, and they always would just go for the safe bet, it seemed like. Like, they're so aware that like, they give the part to a new person. Yes. And I'd be like, God, this person got another pilot, and they just always got the pilots over. I remember,

at least, no, Leah Remini. Yeah. Like, when I read her book about escaping Scientology, it was like this boohoo book, but you get, I remember she was like, and then I had my 30th pilot. I'm like, you shot 30 pilots and it was like boohoo, but none of them have been a big hit until King of Queens. I'm like, but you were obviously making a solid living and all these people were saying yes to you and all of us for getting nose nose and nose

Yes, but wait I wanted to go back because you said white I guess that a reverse of white chicks Yes, and I don't know if I've said this in a while But I did it in interview recently and somehow the guy brought up white chicks and and I go Oh, yeah, I love that white chicks and for those that you don't know that don't know i i was working on another movie and it was bat it was basically a parody of like the movie science and stuff was going to be alien parody and then they found out that like uh...

was that for the game yeah and then they found out that the people that screwed them over on scary movie two uh... which was the wine scenes i guess they were going to make a scary movie three and they are parroting alien movies. Oh. And that's after we wrote the whole thing. So I didn't know that the wine scenes. I think it was wine scenes. I'm not sure. Oh, wow. Like I'm trying to remember. But it was so hard. So then they're like, Oh my God, they're writing because they wrote one and two then they parted ways. Yeah. And then they're like, let's do another parody. Let's do parody of A-Lion movies.

And one of my friends who worked on Kenan brought me in because Kenan was like, there's always a single mom character like in these A-Lion movies. So we wanna have a single mom character. So Heather would be good to write for that character. So when you try to come up with the stuff. So we finished that and we were like, we find out we're gonna show it.

And I'm like, in this office waiting for Keenan. And I see that there's like a dead, I didn't subscribe to like a variety or anything. I see there's a variety article that they had sold a show, a movie called White Chicks. Based on two FBI agents, a pretendery White Chicks, like Paris and Nikki Hilton. Yes.

And I go, when is you working on this movie because oh my god don't you need at least one white chick consultant yes so then so that anyway we did so we did the movie that's yeah so that ever anyone that knows i got to be in the movie too and we wrote the movie and that was all fun so it's a hit so people always ask is it gonna come it's gonna come back yeah well in the last six or seven years it was like well got it going to come? Is it going to come back? Well, in the last six or seven years, it was like, well, God, I don't know that it could come back with everything

with the trans-Americans and trans people and trans-everything. And but I always thought the storyline had to be, once we were talking about it in the last 10 years. Any time I could, like, could like someone asked me i'd say no it has to be that they're the fb i agents okay there is a crime or murder or something happening within the real house wise

that would be so much fun so then you have all these you have all these different housewives and like that it's got to be white ones right it's got to be something like new york of Beverly Hills but then like mean he makes an appearance and like they're like we went to the wrong franchise they want to get in the i mean i guess you know what i'm thinking though like i wonder if they would even have to wear the masks and make up anymore uh... could we just do like a see just i know they hated getting ready oh really make up that was so long

But like that is what I think could be not a friend dresser has her way have her okay good friend dresser has her way We won't be able to do a like yeah AI character likeness Yes, but with Andy Cohen and everything and I actually think you know with trans women and drag queens and stuff that are so popular today I think that could be incorporated in the movie. No, absolutely. It's such a clever, funny way that isn't a thing because the movie didn't offend anyone. Right. And, you know, and I think as people get more inclusion and as we move further away

from, like, these traditions of really terrible, like jokes and mockeries of people, everybody is able to calm down enough and be able to sort of like enjoy the joke again because like white chicks is not in any way commenting on the trans experience or parody anyway. No not at all and people would be like well is it okay that they wore white face I was was like, uh, yeah. Do you think one white chick had a problem with that they, there was like a bulimic joke in there? I'm like, no, we fucking didn't. You know, like, hence why we're writing it. And then there was a lot of jokes that they were coming up

with that, you know, of course, was fine too. You know, that Terry Cruz's character only liked white chicks. You know, like, so that type of thing was just so like fun. I remember, you know, I just remember this one of the nephews was working on it and he goes, and they're pitching jokes. And one of the nephews being one of the Wayne's nephews, which I can't remember which one, but it was funny. And he was like, well, you know that expression, you know, once you go,

once you go black, you never go back, whatever he's like, I just had to be funny if someone says, well, you know what they say? Once you go black, you had to put a wheelchair, and then a girl at a wheelchair comes by and is like, hey, Terry, what up like? And like, then that made it right into the movie. Like, if there was such funny things at that, if we overthought it and like picked it apart, it right into the movie. Like, if there was like such funny things at that,

if we overthought it and like picked it apart, it would never be there. Well, I really hope that Barbie returns us to a place of like remembering the place of fun and play and comedy, you know what I mean? Like, it engages with so many questions about gender and feminism, but like, doesn't purport to know too many answers. Right.

And, you know, just as fun and like, talks about the ways that we are all, you know, that we all exist in the system. Do you, um, I talked about this with Brandon Julie, do you think they'll be a Barbie too? Like, truly, I hadn't even thought about the ramifications of it but Mattel already announced what they're slate. That basically Mattel and Warner Brothers are going to try to roll out like the way that Marvel and Disney have. And like I'm sure they're going to try to do a Barbie too but the thing is it won't be fucking Greta Gerwig because Greta Gerwig and Noah Bombak

are going gonna go off and make other good interesting movies. I know, it's not gonna be the same. Yeah, and it's kind of going to, like, really? It can't be the same if it's Bratz. Bratz can't be it because those were just sluts trying to get into the bar. Right.

That now have the face of everybody. But like, you know, like, it's different. Like, it was such, it was such smart writing, I just, I don't know how you can really do it again, but I think that they will. Of course they will, because they will. It won't do as well, but it'll still be worth it. Yes, and the thing is, it's like,

I'm so pleased that we had a weekend at the box office with things we're making money, and everything you remember, that it's fun to go to the movies. Yes. But I just worry that they won't take that lesson back to these IPs and they'll just turn things out with it like truly.

Do I need another Ant-Man and Wasp movie? You know, to like- Oh, I saw that preview. Like it's just there's so many goddamn superheroes out there. Sometimes when I see these movies, are they creating them now? Are they still all existed before? They're all existing IP.

They all exist. So, and then, but then they just change it. So they make it fun. Like this one now is, you know, Mexican. Was he always Mexican? Well, the thing is, is even those comic books that have had so many iterations that so many of the times like, um, Miz Marvel,

uh, is it, is Marvel was a couple of things and along the way one of the iterations was like a Pakistani Muslim girl and so the Disney series is the Pakistani Muslim girl version, but she was a white girl at other times captain Marvel was a dude for extended periods of time but then he was Captain Marvel was a woman, and that was the one that they used for the Brie Larson movies. It's basically like,

it's kinda like soap operas. I don't know, I never go out of these movies, by the way. But you know how I'm soap operas? Different people, players and characters? Yes, that's kind of how comic books work, even though they're not actors. Yeah.

Yeah. Interesting. I'm so tired of those. Well, let's see if there's any last thing to talk about with you. What did you think of Alex McCord? Let's just end on that. I miss the bonkersness of they were so terrible. They were so ill-suited to it. The fact that they like now live in obscurity in Australia and Simon is a lawyer is crazy. Like there was something really fun about seeing these people who like, she's gonna come up back on a girls trip. I just remembered. I mean, I'm excited for that and I like them getting to have

another dose of fame and excitement, especially because they built this franchise. Like two of the women here, Kristen Taekmint did not build a franchise. She brings nothing to the table. She comes back on Ultimate Girls Trip, too. Yes, I can't imagine she does anything useful. But she's pretty nice, though. And she's pretty cool.

I think I heard she does. I heard it is dope. It's nice what we're looking for in her part. I don't know, I heard it does come about. And the thing is, is like Alex never had it in her to be mean, which kind of made me, which meant that the other girls ate her up. But like, I love that there are those bonkers, energies.

And I wish that some of these women were a little bit better at like, I don't know, like launch a line of something. Like, can't you, I want her to get a little bit better at like, I don't know, like launch a line of something. Like can't you, I want her to get a little rich off of this in some way. And I feel like she just doesn't have this skill. I think they also make it really hard to launch something too. Uh-huh. Well, I really think they do, Nancy. I really think these new girls, if they are, if they

already had something to, obviously, just going gonna be a little more famous and then you gotta make your money off of being famous. Yeah. And so no, I think it's harder than people think. Yeah. Especially now because it's like people like, what are you gonna do? You're gonna have a lotion line, you're gonna have a blah, blah, blah, blah.

And it's already really running to buy someone's like. So many of them are so pathetic, but also like they've given so much time to all of Sony's ventures and they're also fake. And I wonder if that's why they give them time is because like Sony is not making money off of this stuff. No, I think she just isn't good about the follow through.

I think someone else that was given that that had the toaster of an idea and wanted to really go for it, could have executed it and made some money because if you think about it, like people, if it wasn't really good Toaster of it, you got with a really good company and she was just a spokesperson of like,

let me tell you, let me show you everything you could make it a Toaster of it and you never have to get a record of it. I think like she could have sold a lot. But it's also that thing of like good management. Some like if Sonya had a better if a better manager, but also in those earlier seasons, they normal know by the time she showed up, they had to have been making decent money. No, I just don't think she's a business woman. She always gets so many to do to address Slider with or something. And then it doesn't last.

And then she just moves on to something else. Alex and Simon were such a wonderful role on the show, but it's not you wish it were the kind of skill set that she could take and apply to an Australian series, the way that like Taylor showing up in Orange County, I'm very excited for, but like she and Simon were like comedy side characters who created trouble for other characters, right? They just thought they were like above it all, but he was yeah, they're not are you watching us see? I'm not watching us see Yeah, you're not yeah, you're not missing that much. I'll never stop. I'm gonna watch it tonight But it's not yeah, it's there. Yeah, I don't know don't you like I?

It's not, yeah. It's, they're, yeah, I don't know. Don't you, like, one gains such power from building their life around the things that they love. And I really love that you have been able to build Juicy Scoop and the Juicy Scoopers so much from the things that meant a lot to you. You, like, I think it's, there's been enough fun that these women have given us that it's like

Even when something's kind of boring or someone really misbehaves or whatever I'm like who cares are still entertainers like yes like I'm always gonna be nice to them I'm never gonna dislike that but we definitely know people in comedy who's comedy who work very hard and are very successful But their comedy is based on something of a false persona Right, and I think it is never as fun as hearing like What like what pisses you off or what pisses Natasha Lajero off these things are coming from people souls Absolutely guy Tell everybody where they can get more of Guy Brannum in their life. I am at Guy Brannum on all social media and please watch Platonic on Apple Plus.

Oh yes! Yes, I am in 7 or 10 episodes. Wait, I have not started watching that and people tell me to watch it. How could I not watch? Why didn't you remind me more? Hey, Platonic Apple Plus. Okay, that's a good one. Yes. You, um, oh wait, why is it? You want to get it because it is fundamentally about,

it is fun, it's like, sorry, I could finish it. It's fundamentally about a woman in her 40s, like getting her youngest kid to school age and then asking, what the fuck am I doing with my life? Okay. But it's told in a, in a weird fun way. I look forward to hearing what you think.

Um, okay, Guy, I love you. I love you, Red Sky. And hopefully this strike will be done soon. In the meantime, you can watch Platonic. You can follow him. Do you do threads, too? Oh, I need to go to Threads and Blue Sky. I haven't done it yet.

What's Blue Sky? I think it's from... Oh, God, no more. I'm so tired. No. No. So tired. No. No. No. So tired. OK.

Love you. Bye. So you guys, I hope to see you soon at my East Coast shows with Chris Franjola. And Ashley, let me also remind you for my California peeps. We are doing a live juicy scoop Sacramento in Sacramento, September 29th and San Francisco September 30th with Chris. All these are with Chris Frenchola. Everything is at HeatherMcDawn.net including get that ticket and get your plans together for the greatest Las Vegas we can ever November 4th Saturday.

I'll be at the Venetian with a live juices scoop. Thank you. Thank you.