Julian Dorey Podcast - #53 - Shannon Johnson: THE ISRAEL / PALESTINE CONFLICT; THE CIRCULAR POLITICAL SPECTRUM; THE HOLOCAUST; THE RISE OF TYRANNY; "THE THING" FOUND IN ALL THE GREAT ONES

Episode Date: June 23, 2021

Shannon Johnson is a political/social commentator & podcaster. He currently Co-Hosts the “Faces of The Future” Podcast. ***TIMESTAMPS*** 5:30 - The Israel Palestine Conflict 14:29 - Why we’re lucky to be in America 25:22 - The lack of nuance in discourse today; The intolerance of opposing opinions within political parties 33:30 - Enes Kanter & his struggles after speaking out against Erdogan and the government in Turkey; The Edward Snowden Case; The murder of Jamal Khashoggi & “The Dissident” 56:59 - The strength of bad ideologies and the threats they pose to the communities around them; Julian tells a story about a Marine Gunnery Sniper faced with a horrible decision 1:07:58 - Nazi Germany & How Hitler rose to power so quickly: The Beer Hall Putsch, Mein Kampf, The Night of The Long Knives, & The sycophants around him; Shan & Julian watch video of the Allied Troops forcing Germans from towns near the Concentration Camps to tour their horrifying remains 1:26:56 - Is martial law a realistic fear?; The 1st  Amendment and The banning of speech on tech platforms; Are we a true democracy?; Shan talks about the show, “The Handmaid’s Tale” 1:38:47 - The power hunger of politicians; Kamala Harris’ recent flip flopping on immigration; Demanding Accountability from politicians; Revisiting Trump’s rise to power 2:00:23 - How is Biden doing as President? 2:06:26 - Our search for acceptance in society; groupthink; The unfair “boxes” that people get put into based upon who they vote for 2:18:59 - The disrespect of the Commander in Chief these days; The circle of life politics and how the parties shift to opposite beliefs over time; Biden’s ban on US Investments in Chinese Military-affiliated companies; Shan tells a story about somebody flying a Confederate Flag 2:43:27 - People who are born with “it”; Elon Musk, Kanye West and the creative genius gene;  Kobe, MJ, and people wired in ways that most others can’t understand 2:51:04 - What if Kobe Bryant or Michael Jordan had been in charge of countries instead of basketball teams? 2:59:54 - Whether or not the “it” factor is a chemical component of the human brain   ~ YouTube EPISODES & CLIPS: https://www.youtube.com/channel/UC0A-v_DL-h76F75xik8h03Q  ~ Get $100 Off The Eight Sleep Pod Pro Mattress / Mattress Cover: https://eight-sleep.ioym.net/trendifier  Julian's Instagram: Learn more about your ad choices. Visit podcastchoices.com/adchoices

Which side are you on? Because I'm going to put you in a box and tell you what kind of person you are based on who you fucking voted for. You know what I mean? Like, how twisted is that shit? How twisted is it? Because I might not agree with a certain candidate's points, but certain things in this party appeal to my beliefs more. That's totally fine. That my beliefs more that's totally fine that's fine that's totally fine like that it's fine you know i'm saying i appeal to my

beliefs more exactly and that's and that's really what it is to me right that's really what it is but it it's really gotten to a point where it's like you voted for trump you're a racist bigot you voted for for you vote for the democrats you're a tree hugger and you're kumbaya. Bullshit. Bullshit. What's cooking, everybody? I am joined in the bunker today by Mr. Shannon Johnson. Shan is a co-host of the Faces of the Future podcast, which you may remember because I had on his other two co-hosts, Miles Matthews and Toby Mustafa, a.k.a. Moose, in numbers 42 and 47.

And this conversation here now completes the triumvirate. I've appreciated all three of those episodes. They each bring something different to the table. And Shan is the fucking man, so I think you're going to enjoy this one now if you haven't used the link in my description to go look at buying an eight sleep pod pro mattress or an eight sleep pod pro cover hear me out i know that buying something like this is an investment especially if you're buying the mattress and a lot of you may have bought a mattress five years ago, and it's perfectly fine, and you want to keep doing it. Here's what I'll say. You sleep, I sleep, we all got to sleep.

But how well do we sleep? 8sleep is the first mattress company to effectively bring tech and science to mattresses. Other companies have tried it. It's not very good. 8sleep is a legit Silicon Valley company. Their founder, Matteo, has been called the Elon Musk of sleep. Effectively, what they do is they give you six hours worth of sleep and make it feel like eight on any other mattress you've ever slept on in your life. And they do this

through their proprietary app, which leverages their technology, I'm going to use all the buzzwords right here, that plugs right into your bed and measures you. So it measures your body temperature, it measures your REM, it measures your sleeplessness and restlessness throughout the night, et cetera. And within the first night's sleep, it will optimize to how you sleep. That's how it improves you. It's a total life changer. And look, the mattress, obviously full investment. The cover's half the price. The cover's what I use, by the way. So if you like the current feel of your mattress, or you don't want to buy a full mattress, buy the cover. Comes in queen or king sizes. It does all the same things.

Hooked into the app just like the mattress. Again, total life changer. So use the link in my description and use the code TRENDIFIER, T-R-E-N-D-I-F-I-E-R, at checkout. And I promise you, you won't be disappointed. If you are the rare individual who actually is disappointed within 30 days, you can return it for full refund and the company, by the way, H-Sleep, is phenomenal to deal with.

Their customer service is impeccable. So even if you like it, but you have questions, call them up. They're reachable at all times. It's great. You will not regret this at all. It's going to change your life. Anyway, if you're not subscribed, please subscribe.

We are on Apple Podcasts, Spotify, and YouTube. Anyway, if you're not subscribed, please subscribe. We are on Apple Podcasts, Spotify, and YouTube. If you're on YouTube right now, hit that subscribe button, hit that bell button, and leave a like and comment on the video if you would, please. To everyone who's been doing that, by the way, huge help. Huge help in the algorithm there on YouTube. Obviously, audio has grown a lot faster than YouTube has for my show. I like to get YouTube up towards audio numbers. So all help I get there is appreciated. And to everyone who's been doing that, again, thank you. Also, all the people leaving five-star reviews with a comment on Apple Podcasts, that is a big help. I know a lot of the audience now

is on Spotify, but there is still a sizable audience on Apple Podcasts. There's still plenty of users out there who use it. So when new listeners are coming to the page, they're checking out the comments and they're seeing what the show's about before they give it a try. And it's a huge help if they see some good stuff there. So if you own an iPhone and you have the Apple Podcasts app on there,

even if you don't listen to me on there, if you could take a second to leave a review with a five, leave a five-star review with a comment, it is a huge help. Finally, to all the people who have been using the word-of-mouth thing and spreading around a favorite episode to a friend each week, thank you very much. It's something I started in the last few weeks because it was already happening organically before then.

I wanted to encourage my listeners to help grow the base here. Obviously, I grow because you guys grow, and all help is appreciated. So if you have a friend who listens to podcasts, who you think hasn't listened to this podcast yet, pick out your favorite episode this week. Maybe it's this one and send it to them. See if they'll give it a try.

That's the biggest help I could possibly get here. And again, to everyone who's done that and will do it. Thank you very, very much. That said, you know what it is. I'm Julian Dory and and this is Treadify. means this but few seem to do it if you don't like the status quo start asking questions have you been looking at this israel palestine stuff at all yeah that that tells me you're looking at it heavy what are your thoughts my girlfriend actually is israeli so no kidding yeah so it's close to home

yeah and what i mean for people that don't know there was the whole thing i guess it was this was like six weeks ago now something like that where i guess hamas was firing from palestinian territory into israel and then israel responded and they responded fast and it seems like they went and they took down some buildings that they obviously or we hope they didn't intend to take down is that is that about right they have an iron dome do you know what the iron dome is the iron dome iron dome is a technology that that is that Israelis have that intercepts bombs in the air doesn't yes doesn't get all of them but it gets the majority of them so a lot of time those bombs that are being fired in the air from the israelis are to stop the bombs that are coming in you're not going to get them all

but they did fire on hamas the amas group terrorist group it is a yeah I mean so it is people need to and that distinction so important too because there's a huge difference between a terrorist group who is gonna do what the fuck they want to do you know that's that's how these groups work who happens to be taking advantage of a situation and then dragging upon the people there and obviously there's been I mean that's what a three thousand six thousand year history where of war exactly exactly but at the end of the day they're still like kind of that i guess the line you have to draw where when you see how israel

responds to stuff how much of it is intended for them to defend themselves literally and how much of it is intended to take out hamas who also not for nothing but they're like some of the biggest drug dealers in the world like that's how they fund what they do it's a crazy story if people haven't looked that up i think that was a uh i think that was in political problem is with this kind of stuff is a lot of people don't look these things up and do their own research. They just repost what they see on social media, and that's an issue. You have to look at it deeply and then look at the context of what's going on so you can really understand the history of it because, like you just said, it goes back thousands of years.

And sadly, I mean, this happens couple years I mean and it's probably going to continue to happen sadly unfortunately I'm with you yeah I don't you know I try to try to balance between being a cynic about stuff and being a cynic about stuff right because it is hard not to and then when you add in the fact that this is not you know this isn't like a recent election or something to your point it's thousands of years and that whole you know literally family trees of tradition passed down and and i guess distrust you know and and that seems to be at the core of it it's it's hard for me to wrap my head around it and it it always has been but you know I I guess it hits close to home with you with your fiance and everything

But is this is this something you were aware of before you started dating her or you know, you learned through her? Absolutely um, I had no clue about everything that that was going on with the situation before I met her. And, like, you can't fathom it happening here. That's why it's so, like, you don't even know how to react sometimes. You know what I mean? And I see my fiancee and her family upset because they're watching their home, their homeland get bombed, their historical buildings being torn down, people being killed. So, I mean, it's just madness.

It's chaos is what it is. And like I said, it seems like there's no one in sight for me the way I look at it because the Israelis in the Muslim community that's there they're not going anywhere you know I mean they're not going anywhere so it's like how do they get to a place amongst themselves where there can just be peace you know so it I mean it's scary it's definitely scary I mean I can't imagine being in a place where there's bomb sirens going off and me and you got to run to a bomb shelter. We don't know where a bomb is going to hit. If we don't have a bomb shelter near us or close to us, what are we going to do? I can't imagine being in that situation. I mean, it just gave me goosebumps. You know what I mean? It's a terrifying situation to be in, and it's sad.

It's very sad. Yeah, my buddy Nico was in here a few weeks ago, and he was going over. You know, he's a dual citizen of Greece, and he's like, I wouldn't pretend to understand it myself because I lived most of my life in America, nine months out of the year growing up. And like in Greece, there hasn't been like a lot of war during his life. But he's like, my grandparents and my parents, like they know war.

They know what that is. They know what that looks like. And they understand what it's like where, you know, you wake up in the morning and you don't know if that's going to be it because a bomb comes or something like that. And it's such a foreign concept for us in America, which we're very lucky that it is. But I don't know. I've been thinking about this so, so much. And I always compare it on a, frankly, one-off type situation, which is you saw happened in september 11th here and how horrifying that was and granted that was a lot of people in one day that was that was thousands of people in

one day and the whole country shut down like all these things i'm not saying that that happens every day in these places that wouldn't be realistic to say but the i guess the level of expectancy that people who live in israel and pal that like, yeah, you know, one day a building could come down and 150 people die. And it could be a Tuesday, could be a Thursday, could be a Sunday, whatever. That is a crazy, crazy concept. Hey, man, listen, I mean, those kind of things like suicide bombers and shootings and killings and stuff happen in Israel frequently. I want to say not bombings on an everyday basis, but things happen on an everyday basis, right? The Israeli military is all over the place in the Israeli territories in Israel.

I mean, even such things as somebody leaving a bag somewhere, that's going to get looked into. You know, anything, anywhere. I mean, people are always on alert. People are always carrying things to protect themselves because you never know what's going to happen. And here, we really can't fathom that because we can't relate. It doesn't happen here, especially where we live growing up in the suburbs. We ain't got to worry about shit like that ever. When have you ever thought walking out of your house, I need to take a gun with me or I need to carry a knife on me?

Probably never. All right. It's quiet. It's laid back. It's reserved. I mean, there's not that much. There's hate here, but there's not hate on a level that we see on a daily basis. So, I mean, and I think not even just like in this very situation, but all over the world.

I mean, we are so lucky to be here. I don't think people really understand the danger that people have walking out of their doors living in some of these countries like Mexico or Colombia or even like dictatorship regimes like you see in China and the Koreas. Like, we wouldn't even know how to handle those kind of things. And especially with everyone with our First Amendment, you know, you can say what you want to say. Other countries, you can't do that. You can't go to North Korea and start spouting off about, you know, the powers that be or go anywhere and talk about the powers that be in most places. You're going to end up dead. You're going to end up missing. You know, I mean, people really can't put it into perspective here. So I think when it comes to these kinds of situations, you really got to take your time

and do your research before you go off and saying really anything especially putting out there on social media i want to come back to that first amendment point you made at some point we'll get there because that's interesting time for the first amendment but you're 100 right comparatively speaking as far as what you can and can't do in other countries. I think right now there is an enormous complacency in our society. And I can never put this in words the best, so hopefully I do it justice. But the way I look at it in my head is that we are constantly trying, like we're tearing ourselves down and treating us like treating our country as it's the worst of whatever it is whatever system we're going after instead of tearing down the things

that are wrong with it and still recognizing that like hey comparatively speaking we're a lot better i mean dude i even use this example with our government i can't fucking stand our government for sure can't stand them like i i think it's a group think society i think the fact that we've had two parties for however fucking long it's been is absurd i think that most of these people don't fucking like you i think that they are all about staying in power and i think they do a great job doing that that said i can say all of that out of one side of my mouth and then say out the other side of my mouth that even if all that is true and and I happen to think it is, leave that up to other people to decide, we still have the best government system in the world. If it's a piece of shit, it is the best piece of shit on a steaming pile of shit.

Oh, yeah. that so many people right now are you know looking almost like romantically at other places like oh yeah you could go there you could you could do this look at how well they do this thing or whatever and maybe in some examples as one-offs they're correct but if you want to look at like other systems and i'll use the extreme example like if you want to go to china knock yourself out go to fucking china see how you like it ask the nba players how they like china right and they're not a lot and that's sketchy like they can't talk about it because they're they owe so much fucking money from china they're like it's a bad business move which is like a whole i'm not gonna go there right now but like they get it oh yeah they get it. Oh, yeah. I mean like I like to use the example of

When Trump won the election and 16 and then you had no I'm not a Trump fan by by any means I'm not really a fan of any politician. Like you just said I don't like the Bidens and the whole nine yards either But when people were like, oh, I'm gonna move to somewhere else Go to fuck ahead ahead first of all nobody wants any Americans in our country so take that into consideration first and foremost and then like you said it's not going to get much better than here because you could say whatever the fuck you want literally and really not getting any really any trouble for it

and you can come and come and go anywhere as you please i mean if you even look at some places like some places have restricted internet access where the internet shuts off and you can't access certain sites period so people really just don't have a fucking clue what it's like to live, to live, not go on a vacation, to live in another country. Because we just came from the Dominican Republic as a group. As we leave the airport and we're riding through, it's the slums. It's shacks. It's people walking around barefoot.

People that they've been wearing the same clothes for 10 weeks, months, if that. So, and our driver goes, do you guys want to stop and get some melons off this truck no no no first of all take us to the airport take us to where we got to be like we're all dressed in nike clothes and we got a nice gear we got watches and stuff on like when people see that they don't their thing and probably oh, these motherfuckers got money when we really don't. But the way it looks, it looks like we do. So, I mean, other countries are so dangerous. Like I said, like Mexico, the cartels are at war with the military. It's insane.

It's insane. People don't know about this either. It's insanity. They're at war with the military. And it's like they're kind of winning. So that's what kind of makes it even crazier, that they even have the means and the resources to be able to compete. Exactly. That cartel money is different.

I'm holding up a money sign here. You know, they have the means and the resources to compete with the military. So when you think about that in the grand scheme of things, everything here isn't perfect but it's really not it's not as bad as we like to think it is a lot of times it's comparatively speaking i think you use that exact phrase and that's the thing i try to underline and bold because like you talk about that example just one in the dominican the difference with that is that that is the norm there. Trust me. I mean, I don't need to tell you. We have some problems in this country where we have plenty of people who have been left behind. We have a wealth gap that's gone like this. I know you guys talk about this on your show and it's like,

okay, that is problematic. But the large majority of individuals here are not living in that. They are not living in a complete slum. There are some people who are and I think that's a problem. But again, it's a problem I want to fix. Sure. It's not a problem that it's like, that's the norm and that's why we're the worst country in the world. That's the rhetoric where it starts to get really funky for me. And like, to tie it back to the original Israel-Palestine point, like, you talk to people who are from either one of those places, the love they have for their country and their land is insane. And I love that from every angle.

I love that. They also, especially when you're talking to people who are here now, like your your fiance's family immigrated here, they that hey i love that but there is a big price to pay to even try to have that because we have so much other that goes on there and it's like you don't have to worry about that in america you don't and even you know to go right at that first amendment point i said we were going to bookmark. It's an interesting time for the First Amendment right now. I think that's fair to say. But we still at least have a lot of it, and I hesitate to say at least there because that's not a good sign that I'm saying at least.

Like, that needs to be fought for more than anything. But I don't think people comprehend the fact that you literally can't say things in other countries. You can't forget like a tweet. You can't. If you say something on the street to one asshole and there happens to be a guy with a badge walking by, you're done. Oh, yeah. Oh, yeah. I mean, you hang a poster somewhere.

You're going to go to jail. Like there was a kid a couple years ago. I forget which Asian country he was in, but he hung a poster. North Korea. He hung a poster. And he got, what, 15 years hard labor, right? And I forget the exact logistics of the situation, but I remember he came home. They got him out, and he came home, and then he died like a couple months later.

I think his name was like Oscar something. Am I right? He worked in the death. He died still there. They got his body back here. Yeah, that's exactly what it was. I think it was like 15 years of hard labor, which is, I mean, we don't even have, I mean, the agencies definitely do. But we don't even have see-through to what their hard labor looks like.

Oh, yeah. You know, it's. I watch a lot. This kind of stuff intrigues me i don't know why it intrigues me because i think i just kind of watch these shows and i'm like i'm lucky to be here because we don't have to deal with those things i mean yeah prison here it sucks as well but prison in a lot of these other countries they have guns they have not i mean they have shanks here too but i'm like it's normal for someone in another country to be walking around with a machete holding it here at least you got

to conceal it somewhat and to do 15 years hard labor i mean i can't even begin to imagine what he was doing what they had him doing mean, they literally worked this man to death. So we definitely, people, like I said, need to start educating themselves on what goes on and be quick before you are going to say, I'm going to move somewhere else. It's not going to end well for you unless you're a billionaire or a millionaire and can afford to live in one of these places, but live in the upper echelon of these places if you don't have the means to do that you're going to go these other places and quickly realize i need to get the fuck back to america because this ain't it and like i said and what i tell

people all the time a lot of these other countries don't like americans they see what goes on in our elections they see what goes on in our social media and i'm like these motherfuckers are crazy we don't want that we don't even want that kind of stuff to infiltrate here so i mean you're talking about the governments in other places yeah and even even just the regular citizens like i was talking to a friend about going to australia i'm like bro you know it's hard to get a trip to australia they don even want nobody to come there. You know what I mean? And Australia is one of those places that they're very much to themselves. They have their own way of doing things. I mean, they have been having like concerts during COVID, like three months into COVID was at its peak.

You know, they were never, ever in a bad situation like the rest of the world was. They have their own way of doing things. And they kind of just stick to themselves. And when you put into perspective the kind of things that you see going on here, even in this country, I'm like, when I see things on our social media, and especially the things that are in our government, like these elections, I'm just like, what the fuck is going on? Like, what is happening?

Like, you see some of the things that they're getting people to vote like in down south uh you come get beer get strippers and all that i'm just like what is going on in our own country and it just puts it puts things into perspective like you gotta be aware and you gotta educate yourself got to really do your own research and educate yourself you can't rely on twitter and instagram to and even and even these these networks like a cnn or a fox screw that they they have their own agenda they they all have their own agenda and all it is is it's reality tv they don't have an agenda you know what i mean it's just all they're doing is bashing the other side yeah when at the end of the day both sides are full of shit to me you know what i mean so people got to do your own research and come to your own conclusions about things because i mean the

world is a crazy ass place it's a crazy ass place and how many how many i gotta ask you this stuff because i i agree with you i i think that that would be an optimal world where everyone said you know what i'm gonna look past this headline i'm gonna go find another source but like you've been podcasting for three years you're an informed guy you are interested you're self-educated in that way like on a daily basis like you're curious i'd like to think i'm the same way i'm in the same kind of business how many people are really like that though not a lot you know like and and realist that's my question like realistically you know people have lives and stuff they and they have their priorities things good things bad depends on who the person is and

it's like well they have the same 24 hours in a day and they're sleeping six or seven of them as well and how much of it is like okay you know what i'm gonna sit down for two hours now and study what's going on in israel and palestine how many people really do that like how many of these of these you know basic chicks on on social who are putting free palestine in their bio i'm not saying they're wrong i'm saying like what do they even know about it probably nothing they know what they see on the internet. Yeah a headline. Yeah a tweet. Yep You know someone that has an opinion like if you are going And getting your information from a quick tweet from sean hannity or rachel maddow. You're not getting information You are getting a complete agenda behind whatever it is

Now if you put them in a giant group, right, of all different opinions and ideas and suddenly went and read all that and actually educated yourself, you could start, it'd be a little foggy, of course it is, but you could start to kind of be like, okay, it seems like it's kind of here. You know what I mean? Like there's more of a, you get a, the higher the number of diversity of takes on it and then ideally obviously you want just news that's straight news. Here's what happened. Here's what's happening next, whatever. But assuming you can't get that, the higher number and volume of like across the spectrum takes you can get, the better average you can create for yourself to show where the truth tends to lie and even with that being said right someone put something out

there for me the way i look at things that are reposting social media i'm not going to repost something that i have no fucking clue about right because how does that make me look that's that's the way i kind of think about it right so if i see something and it's a a topic that's very complicated, I'll say, I'm not going to just repost something because it's a celebrity I like or it's a TV personality that I like. And then I tend to agree because there are people that have opinions that I'm big fans of. A lot of things that they say, I'm like, yeah, 100%.

My guy is always on point. We kind of see things the same way. But you have to take those things and take them deeper and look at them. I'm not going to just agree with what you said because you put it out there and you're my boy. You know what I'm saying? So for me, when it's something like that, you got to do your own research and come to your own conclusions. We're all our own people, right? Come to your own conclusions. Don't just agree with what someone else said and a lot of times i find people always about oh well the facts say this and the facts say that i i find a lot of times

and it sounds kind of crazy that you could find facts to support any argument right you could find facts to support support anything i mean you could be on different sides and we think you can give me facts and i can give you facts doesn't make either one of us right or wrong we each have our own own we each have our own opinion from the from the research that that we did right so just come to your own conclusions and i would say an even bigger issue as far as that is is people don't want to take the time to listen to what anybody else has to say that's on the other side right so you know me and you might have different opinions a lot of people will say, you know what? Fuck that. He must be this type and this type of motherfucker because he thinks that. But in reality, there's nothing wrong with agreeing to disagree or just disagreeing

in general. I don't have to hate you because me and you don't agree on something. That's fine. You know what I'm saying? I know you're not a bad guy. You don't have any hate in your heart. But just because me and you don't agree on a certain topic doesn't make you a bad guy. And I feel like a lot of times, especially on Twitter, it's the worst. You know what I'm saying? You say something on Twitter, it goes viral. Your mentions are blown up. People are telling you you're dumb.

Your opinion sucks. You're incentivized to get that action. Right. Right. And how can you tell somebody that their opinion is dumb it's my opinion it's how i feel it's how i think right so with the research that i did this is the conclusion that i came with it's not dumb it's dumb to you it's not even dumb you just you just don't see things the way i see them and that's fine but you don't have to hate me because of it you don't have to go on social

media and call me names and tell me i'm stupid and I'm uneducated and I have no clue about the real world bullshit. We just don't agree. And I think a lot of times people just don't want to take the time to hear what anybody else has to say. And it's kind of disturbing. How do we move forward as a society if me and you can't sit down and have a simple conversation about something that we might see differently? You know what I mean?

Because if you go into things open-minded, you might learn something. And if you just listen, somebody might say something and you think, you know what? I never thought about it that way. It's a very good point. Maybe I should take that knowledge that you just gave me. Maybe I can readjust the way I'm thinking because I got some new knowledge now. You know what I mean? And a lot of people don't want to take the time to do that because they think it's weak. And a lot of people are so obsessed with being right. Everybody wants to be right. You know, and I could go on and on for days about this because, I mean,

I have a lot of, I have trouble having a conversation with someone that's closed minded. Right. If if you're just so stuck in your ways and your opinions, I can't have a conversation with you. If you're a Trump fanatic or even a Biden fanatic, how can I sit there and have a conversation with you? Because all you want to do is tell me that this person sucks. This person is a narcissist. He's a terrorist. he's egotistical this one's a racist okay well that may be true right but let's sit here and have a conversation about it because to be honest i don't like either one of these motherfuckers yeah so like i don't i don't care about who you're more a fan of and just because i might criticize a trump doesn't mean that

i'm pro-biden because i criticize biden doesn't make me pro-trump you know what i mean god there's so many things man so we're gonna miss so much of what you're getting at but like i want to go right at it so what you're talking about is pure tribalism it's the expectation now you must be in a tribe and it is usually in on a given issue whatever it is could be something as broad as a political party or something as micro as one type of little issue you need to be a or b you cannot be c you cannot be d yeah you can't be fucking k right that is such a problem because these situations most of them i would almost say all of them but i'll hedge and i'll, most of them, I would almost say all of them, but I'll hedge. And I'll say most of them have significant nuance.

Like if someone comes up to me and says, like you're talking about dumb opinions or whatever. If someone comes up to me and says, you know, I think Nazi Germany was a good idea. You know what? That's a dumb opinion. How many people, I hope people think that's a dumb opinion. But how many people are going to sit there and not say that's a dumb opinion how many people i i hope people think that's a dumb opinion right but how many people are going to sit there and not say that's that's a dumb opinion right right most of us are going to do it and the people that don't are going to weed themselves out because people are going to be like well that guy's a right and and that's with the first amendment part of it

that's how i look at things i want everyone to state their ideas including people who can tell us exactly who they are right because then then we know like okay well i don't want to fuck with that guy right and if you are so concerned about losing to a terrible idea like that then you got a problem because if you don't think the majority like it's a numbers game man if you don't think the majority of people a significant majority overwhelming isn't going to look at an opinion like that and be like that's then i don't know what to tell you right and let me be hypocritical for a second on something though with something a little specific on that i will say that there has been an unbelievable, and it's scary to me, rise in specifically anti-Semitism online.

And it's correlated with this recent Israel-Palestine thing. And the angel side of me tries to say, like, all right, there's some people who are typing some things they don't know what they're typing. Oh, yeah. But there's also the realist in me that goes, no, some people feel this way. Oh, yeah. Oh, yeah, 100%. I mean, like you just said, people will type things out without knowing really what they're saying, right? So if you type in something, some like anti-Semitism stuff, don't be surprised when someone that's Jewish or something that knows,

that is well-informed about their culture, comes at you and tells you you're wrong. You know what I mean? So before you put anything out there, I'll keep saying it, do your research. You got to know what you're talking about. Like I just said, I'm not going to put something out there without at least feeling confident that I can have a conversation with somebody about it.

How do you, and I'll stay with the extreme examples because i've seen some it's a little fresh in my head this week because i posted some content and i was alarmed at some of the stuff i saw on my own and like you know i'm a guy on tick tock right some of these accounts that are huge on tick tock i see it in the hundreds of thousands of comments and some of its bots no doubt but like i see it i'm like holy so i'm thinking about it more but you shouldn't there are certain things that for self-awareness of the worst that we're capable of as humans you absolutely should should research i agree with you there but there's also like certain one-off ideas to those things that it shouldn't take the research for you to know it shouldn't take the research for you to know that you shouldn't harm another

person based on how they look or where they're from oh that shouldn't you know what i mean like i think that's a good baseline expectation yes and so that's the that's the battle here because you do get like you pointed out people are going to respond when people say that so what happens the algorithm then you know it's got likes on it it's got it's got ratios on it it's got comments on it now it's getting volume and the algorithm the computer is just pushing it wherever it's supposed to go so now it starts going up towards the top if it's a comment section or if it's a tweet it starts going up towards the top of the results and then more people who may hate everything about it hopefully they do they're going to be coming at it and

they're drawing more and more attention to it and then you you automatically every time we'll get some people who just have that built-in devil's advocate in them like well maybe this guy's a point yeah and eventually they start to then say that two three four five six times and then it starts to take over their head. And that repetition is a very real thing. So I see it on this – we keep coming around like the First Amendment here. But I see it on the spectrum of where people are like, hey, if you just totally let it be wide open, you can get some people to take up questionable things. I say, though, on the other end, end though that i have enough faith in overall

humanity that if that was the case and the good wasn't being shut down so people saying like no that's wrong if that's getting shut down we have a problem right you know maybe in places like china it could that's a problem but in america here if that's not getting shut down like the people coming in being like yo you're full of shit man that that's that's a horrible idea i feel pretty good about that winning over time because people want to be agreeable even if they do everything they can not to be they want to be agreeable and when they get attacked as having ridiculous beliefs and they start to see that no one else has them they'll come back to earth right it's when they're it's when they're attacked and they see wait a lot of us have this belief and why are you attacking this belief there's nothing bad about this you just disagree that's a different story then they go It's when they're attacked and they see, wait, a lot of us have this belief, and why are you attacking this belief?

There's nothing bad about this. You just disagree. That's a different story. Then they go farther, whatever the other direction is. You're right on, bro. I mean, working in the space that we work in, right, we're really putting ourselves out there to be picked apart by people that don't fucking know us right and that's one of the challenging things of being in this space because somebody's always going to disagree with you right but like you said you put an opinion out there

like my man moose did on twitter i don't know if he told you about that. Which one? He put a tweet out there that was disagreeing with something and it went viral. He had a tweet that went absolutely bonkers. And his comment section was full of people telling him you're stupid, you don't know anything,

you're uneducated, my man is about to go to law school. He's got to be somewhat smart. You know what I mean? And people telling him, then people start attacking the way you look. And, oh, well, you know, you're a dark-skinned dude, so you automatically think da-da-da-da-da-da-da. You know what I mean? It's like, how can you?

Don't put people into a box, which is something that also drives me crazy. Don't put all men into a box. Don't put all women into a box. Don't put all Christians into a box. Don't put Muslims into a box. Don't put a woman into a box. Don't put all Christians into a box. Don't put Muslims. Don't put anybody into a box because everyone's different. And there are so many different variants and nuances, like you said, of every single thing. There's a bunch of Christian groups.

There's a bunch of Catholic groups. You know, so, I mean, social media is a wild place. And it's hard to... We're being very vulnerable. And it's hard to be vulnerable. And it really takes... You got to have thick skin. Yes. Is what it comes down to.

You got to have thick skin because people are always going to be out there saying crazy shit to you. And just... You know what this all ties back to to me bro is there's so much fucking hate in this country like as good as it is as much as i love there's so much fucking hate in this country it's like everywhere you look people are just hate i don't even know how to how to put it into words other than agree than just hate you know i mean you can't can i say one thing to that just to like in the middle of this hedge while we're there and you know if you disagree with this no problem but i agree it's at an all-time high oh yeah in my lifetime never seen

anything like this and social media is very much the culprit behind it in my opinion but i still think people don't understand the level that he can get to in other places. So again, this is a prime example of like, hey, I want to fix this shit here because it is a problem and it can get out of control. It can get to where other places are. But like there are other places that still kill people for having a different opinion or having – you know what I mean? Like there's real shit out there. So just pointing out live right here, this is another prime example. And yet we can still sit here and say it pisses us the fuck off because it's negative for all of us.

Right. Let me give just one example about how crazy things can get in other countries if you disagree. Do you know the NBA player Enes Kanter? Know this story well. Please tell tell us so he is from turkey um what he did was he came out and he spoke out against the government big no-no erdogan right yes what they did first of all they they said he can't come back to the country pretty much if you come back we're going to lock you up or we're going to kill you. They kidnapped his father. They kidnapped his father because of the things that he was putting out to the masses here in America.

So they don't want it to look here like there's bad things going on in their own country. So, I mean, just imagine me or you saying something right about a political party and your mom goes missing or gets kidnapped. What the fuck? And this is one guy, one famous guy. I mean, you can't even begin to imagine. I don't even know. What do you do? My father was taken by the government

he wasn't kidnapped by a cartel or by someone holding him for ransom he was kidnapped by my homeland country's government imagine imagine you saying something about biden or trump and somebody from the secret service trump secret service secret service, comes and kidnaps you. What the fuck are you going to do? How are you going to get out of that situation? There's no lawyer. Nothing. What can you do?

What can you do? You're at the mercy of them at that point. And it even got so bad to the point where he couldn't travel to Toronto to play a game with Toronto because they have a big Muslim community there. He was considered almost like a flight risk. We can't go because we don't know if somebody's going to try and do something to you in this

other country. So think about you're an NBA player. Like be kidnapped and stuff. Kidnapped or killed or somebody could, God forbid, bomb the bus, come to our hotel. I mean, who knows what's going to happen imagine being an nba player you can't even go play in a specific city because of your beliefs and because of your opinion it's like it's unfathomable so people here need to really appreciate the fact that you can go on and you can say fuck trump fuck biden i will kill biden like say you're going to kill a government official somewhere else in another country you might never be seen from ever again period i can't emphasize

that dude like it's it's crazy times but i can't emphasize that enough i'm glad i'm really glad you brought that up i never talked about anus concert on on this podcast but he is to me it's a great symbol example because he's just one just one guy but he's a guy that happens to have attention he's been a solid player in the nba too and credit to him for maintaining maintaining his ability to speak about this publicly that is a very hard thing to do and i can't imagine the weight on his shoulders knowing that his family i believe they're still there they still they still live in turkey and i maybe it was just his dad but i thought some of his other like maybe his brothers too i'm sure i wouldn't doubt sure about that i wouldn't doubt it

but it was definitely his dad and like you said a big pat on the back to him because I can't imagine how hard that is. And it's like, it's one thing to have everybody on Twitter against you. Who gives a fuck about what you have to say on Twitter at the end of the day, right? You're never going to see any of these motherfuckers in your life. I can't imagine having an entire government, an entire government against me as a person. That's like the entire Republican party coming for shannon johnson how i don't stand a fucking chance yeah you know what i mean i don't stand a chance so it's it's an ideology though too it's not just like these places think about how many levels to government

are there you and i bitch and moan about Congress and the president all the time because that's a thing we see publicly. But like I can believe that there are a lot of great people that work in the government. But there are enough who aren't great or maybe don't realize that they're not great who are just so caught on trying to keep the established order that they do things that they don't think about what they're doing, which is no excuse, by the way. But I'm talking about places like the agencies and stuff like that. You know, I, are you familiar with the Edward Snowden case at all? No, I'm not. That was the guy who, in 2013, he had been CIA and NSA, and he leaked to the press, to Glenn Greenwald and Laura Poititras and there was a reporter at the guardian forget his name all the data of the stellar wind operation so oh yes yes yes yes

now you remember yes yes yes i'm a i'm a big fan of his and i've read a lot of stuff he's written i've he's been on joe rogan a couple times they're great, he does a lot of interviews now so you can go find him on YouTube and I love listening to him and he's controversial because he did leak you sign a contract when you go into the CIA, the NSA that says I promise no matter what happens, which is kind of

crazy that this is the case we could be practically not that they would do this you hope I'm using an extreme example but we could be you know we could be practically not that they would do this you hope i'm using an extreme example but we could be killing people in another country just because we want to do it and you can't say anything oh yeah like that's how far it can go that said this system that he exposed that dude that had been around since like oh two oh three no one was doing anything about it and people that that give me the argument seriously like we're cynical and we laugh at that i laugh at it too right but

people give me the argument of oh he could have gone through the chain of command what would have happened if he did yeah yeah yeah that's gonna see the light you know what's gonna happen maybe in this country it won't be that he's never seen again. Maybe. Hope so, right? But he'll never be heard from again. Oh, no. He'll never be heard from again.

Oh, no. He'll go to jail or he'll be in prison or, I mean, like, things like that. They'll send people to just follow you. They'll do something. To just kind of scare you. I mean, and, you know, like, in this kind of situation, just imagine the fear that that incites in the rest of your population in your country. Right? That's the point.

You know what I mean? That's exactly why they do it. Because it's like, look at what we'll do to a guy that's brought a lot of notoriety to our country because he's in the NBA. And there's not many Turkish players in the league. So, look at what we did to a guy that's brought all this these eyes to our country look what we did to him what do you think we'll do to you we'll knock you off and it won't even be it'll be nothing and not for nothing but this is how these places work you know the khashoggi case jamal khashoggi and i think i've talked about that in one episode a while ago but that was the reporter

at the Washington Post who was, it is confirmed he was straight up murdered in Turkey in the Saudi Arabian embassy on the orders of Mohammed bin Salman the crown prince of Saudi Arabia

these countries don't give a fuck they don't care, no regard and guess what? They're still humming over there. They're still doing their thing. You know what's crazy? Khashoggi worked for the Post, which is owned by Jeff Bezos, right? And to Jeff...

Big Jeff. Yeah, Big Jeff. To Jeff Bezos' credit, he obviously came right out and was like, this is crazy and supported his widow. I think he had a fiance. So Jeff has supported her, handled all the memorials and stuff like that. But Jeff also was a victim himself when it was confirmed that MBS ordered his phone to be hacked with the whole sexting thing a couple years ago they know about that that was the saudis right so even despite all that and then killing a guy who works for him when they made the documentary the dissident this past year

which have you seen that phenomenal great phenomenal my guy jim from lifelong fbi guy watched and he was just like incredible he was pacing his apartment just like I don't even know what to say about that right you know but you watch that and I bring up Jeff because he's all about this but he didn't put it on Amazon Prime for Prime members he put it behind a $20 or $25 if you buy it paywall knowing that most people wouldn't do it. I did it. I bought it straight up to watch it. But he did that because they still have a ton of business with Saudi Arabia.

Oh, man, you got to play nice in the sandbox. I haven't heard that one. That's good. You got to play nice in the sandbox. I mean, the powers that be are all connected one way or another to me, right? The ones who are making the decisions of what's going on are all connected. And every now and then somebody might need to put you in check and say, listen, don't forget who you're dealing with here. You know what I'm saying?

Don't forget who you're dealing with here. And it's like on a grand scheme of things, right? we do something to the Saudis or whatever or any other country. What y'all want to do? Y'all want to go to war? Y'all want to go to war? They're not afraid of that at all. They are not afraid of that at all. No.

So it's like if y'all want to go to war, we could take it there. But y'all know who y'all dealing with. Y'all know the kind of money and the kind of backdoor deals that we don't know about that they have going on with each other. That is engulfed in all the powers that be. Our country, China, all the big players are the ones that are making the decisions. So you got to play nice in the sandbox. And every now and then somebody will remind you of who you're dealing with. You know what I mean? So, I mean, nobody's untouchable.

Like you said, they hacked his phone. Nope. And that's just the richest man on the planet. What did he just came out? What is he making? What is he worth? $215 billion? Whatever it is.

Nobody is untouchable. No. So, I mean. It is a group think money talk ideology. money yes it is ideology it's not any one person you know xi jinping and china's a very bad guy i am not naive enough though to think that if he left power or was taken out of power that he wouldn't be replaced by someone pretty damn sadistic too you know unfortunately that's what look at iraq when did we get saddam like oh three yeah oh four yep you know later isis happened there like when there

are vacuums of power no like but it's it's real man it is when there's vacuums of power that's what goes on and like we are not very good at nation building. We have been very bad at it now for a long time. I even... I'll give them credit. That's a great point. That's a great point that you just said. What, the nation building thing? Yeah, yeah.

I will give us some credit with post-World War II Germany, which was still a clusterfuck because it was split. West Berlin and East Berlin and all that. So, say what it is, but Germany now is a major country in the European... Oh, they're a power, they're a war of power. Exactly. And they don't, look, I mean, they were fucking Adolf Hitler Nazis. And like that did turn around. They still have one of, if not not i will say probably a definitely a top

five military and on the planet sure for sure absolutely and it's like that wasn't that long ago no so no despite the mess of the cold war and listen there were still things like operation paperclip which people have googled that google that there were still things like hiring people ex-nazis over in that zone to fight the fucking soviets and stuff there was still bullshit there's bullshit anywhere but i'm talking about the overall populations that even though it didn't go fully to plan like that denazification thing went fairly well you know as well as it could you know exactly right because think about how crazy that ideology was and how widespread it was and everything so like we did okay there and some people are going to yell at me because they probably are going to point out a lot of

things we did wrong no doubt i'm sure we did but i'm saying like since then well what are we doing vietnam like what did we do what did we do in iraq the first time the three-day war with you know the fucking desert storm storm what did we do the second time how's afghanistan we've been trying to do that since what oh three afghanistan that's what i'm saying like we're not good at it almost 20 years in wow like i i heard a line in a show it was a fictional character i don't remember what show it was i'll think of it later but it was it was somebody you know some like sadistic terrorist in the show i think it was homeland that's what it was so there was one guy in one of the seasons but you know he's such this

hateable character and everything but you're still trying to understand through the show and they were trying to get this across how these people get to that point and one of the things he said that really stuck with me is that america i'm gonna get the quote wrong it was a phenomenal quote so i need to check that after but it was something along the lines of america hates what it can't understand and it doesn't seek to understand it and that is a problem we have as a country in the sense that we just think like oh you know we're the free country we're we're america you know we're gonna go in anywhere and people are just gonna be like you know what that's great let's go with those ideals sure some the people that want to come to this country that dream about the american dream they're gonna say that right but there's a lot of people that don't and you said that earlier too

and that is important like there's still i didn't want to get lost in the fact that there are still a lot of fucking people who want to come here. Oh, yeah, for sure. Don't get it wrong. But to your point. To escape what they're living with now. Exactly. To escape those countries.

And I want to go back to something that you just said about how people get to the point that they're at. Let's say an extreme terrorist for a reason. Let's use somebody in ISIS, for example. That kind of stuff is ingrained in them from birth yes from the time they're kids from the time they can speak they're being taught those ideologies of you will die in the name of this cause you will be rewarded at the end of this at the end of your journey, so to say. So to them, that's all they know. So for us to say, you know, you're a radical fucking terrorist, to them, I'm fucking normal.

This is the life that I live. This is the life that I've been living. So for you to call me crazy, it doesn't make any sense to me because this is what I've been doing my whole life. This is what I know. This is what I believe. This is what I believe. This is what I eat, breathe and sleep. And, you know, a lot of times with these terrorist groups, these people, the scariest part to me about it in any terrorist group is when you get to the point where you're not afraid to die for something. That's where I'm like, all right, it's a little bit too much for me because i i love a lot

of things i don't know if i'm willing to die for anything that i believe in to be honest you know what i'm saying like you know i i believe in a i'll just use ohio state for example i'm not willing to die for something like that but people i'm just using an example that thing that people love you love your country you love your religion People are willing to die for it. That's how you get to that point of how did you get there. So people don't realize that this, take the time to do a research on an ISIS and how it is from start to finish, how their kids are raised, how they treat their wives, how they treat their kids, how the whole culture works. That's how they get to the point that they're at. And it's a scary thing because, I mean, there's ISIS attacks that are being planned for here right now, I'm sure.

You know, like we never know when anything is going to go down. You know, I mean, and there are so many places that i that that i look around in our country and i think this place could get shot up right now and there is no protection there's no anything i had a realization after the shooting in vegas happened remember that shooting at the concert that happened in vegas so yeah i remember that one like right after that how sketchy was that dude right Right. From a fucking hotel room. Dude's walking in with cases of heavy rifles. And we went to Atlantic City in the casino. I'm just walking around like there's no security. Sitting ducks.

There's no protection. Everybody's got bags. Everyone's people are walking around with suitcases. You don't know. I mean, you could put an AR-15 in your jeans, put a shirt over and you wouldn't even know. You could have clips in your pocket and a whole rifle in your pants and nobody would know it. So it's like, there's no protection. There's no security. Like you said, we're all sitting ducks. So when I see these things like these, these mass shootings that happen at like these Walmarts and shit like that,

I'm like, you never know. You never know when you're going to be in the wrong place at the wrong time. You know what I mean? So it's a really scary. And I'm at the point where I'm like, who wants to live in a fucking world where I have to think about before I walk into a Walmart, is somebody going to walk in here and shoot the motherfucker up? Or I got to think about it when i have kids but one of these kids gonna just snap one day and decide that i'm gonna come to school today with a gun and i'm gonna just start shooting motherfuckers who wants to live in a world like that you talk about it

though in the context of this country and i i do that too like i will and it's sad that i gotta do this but i'll walk into public places and cynically be like, well, they could just walk right through there. Yeah, we're done. Yep. Right? And it's sad we got to do that. The positive side of it is that the percentage of times where things like that happen is unbelievably low in this country. Right. Whereas to an earlier point you made, it's not in other places.

Oh, no. For different reasons. But you talk about how people have these ideologies ingrained in them as kids i struggle with that all the time because i feel bad me too i really do because a buddy of mine was he was a marine gunnery sniper and he was one of 52 man teams so the american sniper chris kyle he was one right and then there. So the American sniper, Chris Kyle, he was one, right? And then there were 49 other teams, I believe. I could be, I believe it was exactly 50 teams.

I would love to pick his brain. But yeah, hopefully I'd love to get him on here at some point. We'll see if he does it. He's a private guy, but he was one of the other snipers. And so he covered for SEAL Team 2, 3, 6, and a bunch of SEAL teams you never heard of that we don't know about. And, you know And he was there. He was there for Operation Iraqi Freedom, Battle of Fallujah, the whole nine. And I don't – there's some specific stories I would rather him tell because they also kind of blend together in my mind.

But I remember him walking me through just like a scenario, and I believe it like this is something he encountered but i don't want to say that for sure but he was walking through like something that happens in that kind of job that he did and he's like you know i'm perched up in some kind of abandoned building i don't know 30 feet above the ground and in the center of a square 250 yards away whatever it is there's a nine-year-old child walking out next to a young woman and i know that there's 50 other people right there who are all innocent and yet i know that that kid has a bomb and his hand is on a trigger the idea I got to take a nine-year-old's life. I don't give a fuck who you are. Unless you are a sociopath.

That fucks with your head. You may be trained so well that you know like in that moment. Well, 50 or 1. Right. I got to take the 1. Right. You still think about that later though. Of course you do.

You know, if you are sane, you do. And it's scary to me because you have to make, frankly, I do not want to use the word easy, but if you were just looking at it from math, you have to make an easy decision there. You do. 50 or 1. Like that as well. Like that. It's still a human life, and it's still a nine-year-old kid who doesn't fucking know any better he has no he's been promised 72 virgins the kids balls haven't even dropped right but

he's gonna fucking go out there with a bomb and blow up this square in the name of you know a bullshit part of the muslim religion it's not you know these people how many muslims are there in the world like 1.5 billion or something It's the biggest growing religion on the planet. Right. The number of people who agree with that kid murdering himself and other people in the name of Allah, it's not the majority, man. Right. There's a lot of people who are like, that's fucking horrible. Right.

But the problem is you see these people bastardize this Quran and everything and then use it in the name of terrorist acts. But these terrorist acts, they come back to the same thing. They hijack babies with the ideology from the time they're a little seed, right? They did just the whole way. You're born into it. You're groomed that way. You believe this. You believe this.

You believe this. Repetition, repetition. Or else. Or else. You go through puberty that way. You go through everything and that way you go through everything and that's what you believe and they also use it under the cover of the religion right because everything they're doing is based off of economic disappointment which is fair that part's

fair and you know the violence that then comes out of that and yet they answer it with something worse on the other side and inevitably like all human fallacy they want power themselves you know they do this osama bin laden didn't exist to let other motherfuckers be osama bin laden oh yeah he was fucking osama bin laden man i'm fucking god on earth yeah you know there's there's a story about him seriously there's a story about him i believe it's true but he when he was fighting the soviets in like the late 80s some kind of like grenade fell right next to him and he looked up at the sky because it was beeping or whatever the hell it does and it's about to go off and kill him and he was prepared to go and i don't know three four or five seconds went by and he looked down and then finally he

picked it up and he realized you know that the hatch was out but it was it was a faulty grenade and so he took it and tossed it right over there and fell to the ground nothing happened and he in that moment said i am god yes and that's and but that's the thing like that type of and he already had a lot of this ideology built in but people will then go for that oh yeah you know so i see where it gets bastardized in the sense of like the power struggle as well it doesn't change the fact that at the lower rungs of it where you start with children you you don't feel bad about that i feel fucking terrible it's disturbing because what the fuck does a nine-year-old kid know all All he knows is what any adults are putting into his head. He can't even make his own choices at fucking nine years old.

So you're telling him, hey, you know, everything we've done over all this time, you know, this is your time now. This is your time to go be with Allah or God or whoever. So what you're going to do is you're going to take this bomb and you're going to run right into that tank or you're going to run into that crowd of people and you're going to press that button, then after all that's over, your life is going to be, wherever you go next is going to be, like you said, 72 versions. Your life is going to be filled with happiness and joy. You know what I mean? That's what they tell them. Right.

And that's not fair to the child. We can't relate. No. And it's not our culture. And at the end of the day, it's disturbing. And, you know, I just can't imagine, you know, your friend who's that sniper having to make that choice because I'm sure in a moment he probably saw himself as a nine-year-old kid. Oh, yeah. If he had kids, he probably thought about the kids.

And if the mother was there and wanted to take a child from his mother, albeit during this terrible regime, I'm still taking a child from his mother. Any mother, like you said, if she's not insane, is going to be deeply, deeply affected by losing someone that came out of her body. You know what I'm saying? So it doesn't matter what they did. It doesn't matter. It's a thing, man. It's your child. I mean, you could have a son that commits murder and goes to prison. You're going to feel for him because that's your seed. That's flesh of your flesh. That's your blood. You know what I mean, you could have a son that commits murder and goes to prison. You're going to feel for him because that's your seed. That's flesh of your flesh. That's your blood. You know what I mean?

So those whole ideologies of starting a kid at that age, to me, is just very disturbing because they're innocent children that deserve to, first off, at least be able to see their teenage years to the point where they can make their own decision yes they don't even get to to get to that point and it's like you're almost kind of in my opinion brainwashing them to make them believe things that they don't even really understand little kids don't understand war they don't understand like you said the the economics of war and and how power works they don't understand, like you said, the economics of war and how power works. They don't understand any of that stuff. All they understand is this is what my teachers, my parents, my uncles, my grandfather, because you know, that coach is very family oriented. This is what I know my elders have been telling me my entire life. So to him, he doesn't probably think twice about

what he's doing carrying that bomb because this is what he's been essentially preparing for. We have such a great theme going on in this conversation where we built off – and I love how this just happens naturally – where we built off a recent news story with the very not recent just forever war between Israel and Palestine, but then relating it to all these different, almost like puzzle pieces on the chessboard that is our world and how it all kind of ties together from our perspective here in America to how other places work, the good, the bad, and the ugly, right? But there's such, there is something to be said for the fact that so many people, when you look around it at these issues become swept up in things very very quickly and like as a quick example just off of what we were last going off of you have something like a religious

disagreement for the years where there was plenty of you know attacking on both sides of course it's there's been wars fought over this but the ideology where like jihad really like took hold of at least a noticeable segment you know whether that's five percent or three percent it's a lot right that thing happened basically like after the soviets yep and i know some people will say it stretches earlier in that yes sure but like legitimately where it started to become like there were people around the world who suddenly became attracted to this type of idea like an al-qaeda that happened very very quickly the soviets were in there fighting in the middle east in the late 80s i think mid 80s late 80s something like that september 11th happened within 15 years so things happen fast and another thing that i've been studying and it actually – like I'll go down these rabbit holes once a year, every other year with certain things where I study some modern history and some past history and I study the worst stuff.

Because a part of me wants me to always be aware of what we're capable of in all the wrong ways as humans and also be aware of the things that beat those things and how they were stopped if they were stopped right and so after the the israel palestine stuff happened i had been studying some of the history there because i hadn't looked at that in a few years and then i got into one topic that i will get to every other year pretty much heavily and it's world war i Two because it blows my mind not just that that happened but that it wasn't that long ago and the level of hatred that occurred in the world at that time was unfathomable especially when you consider the fact that things like cameras existed you know it's one thing if you're talking about like who's the

guy Genghis Khan or whatever mm-hmm three thousand years ago no you know it's one thing if you're talking about like who's the guy genghis khan or whatever three thousand years ago you know that guy was i think he might have been the worst person statistically maniac yeah in human history but like but that's the point like we don't have video of it no we don't have pictures you know what i mean and it's so long ago that it's like well were we still like lower on the evolutionary spectrum then like were we barely human i don't know right you know whatever it is it was horrible hitler happened in a time where we could see it and i you know the the thing i went deep on this time i started at going through the war years itself and re-looking at the holocaust which i just every time i see that i'm just how exactly how i look at it and i'm like

that and like you said it was in the 40s to put it into even more perspective israel was officially named a country after world war ii we're gonna get to that you know what i mean so i mean that's the 1940s we're talking about. I mean, my grandparents were born in the 40s. We have relatives that were born before that and lived through that time. It really wasn't that long ago. And it's like the same with like civil rights movement. My dad was born in 67.

MLK was killed in 68. You know what i mean so like all of this all those things are still relatively not new but they didn't happen that long ago there's still people alive who were very much in them yes there are holocaust survivors that are living there are there are there are nazi soldiers that work those camps that are still living yes you know what i mean so when you put in perspective it wasn't that long ago. And, you know, like you said, how? How was one man in Hitler able to have one of the most powerful armies maybe in human history? Yes, it was. Go in and invade countries

and murder 12 million people. The Jewish population in the recent years just got back to the number of Jews there was in World War II. Yes. Think about that. They just got back to the number that there was in World War II.

It's like unfathomable that one man well obviously he didn't do it by himself but was solely responsible for killing 12 million fucking people while the rest of the world like you said had cameras and was able to see it going on and how long was that going on before everyone finally stepped in and was like all right we got to shut this shit down and that's that's the thing man you know what i mean the power that he had during that time was you can't even put it into words and how you raised the question now that how did that happen and when i when i start with the the Holocaust, and that's something I fucking make sure I study. Because it's just like- You have to.

You have to remind yourself of the worst of the worst that people could be capable of inflicting on other people. Another one I want to go study that I haven't dug deeply on but I want to look at like the Armenian genocide as well which occurred I think it was roughly like 20 30 years before that so also like not that long ago right and you see you see what these people did to other people and when I went down deep this time on it I very quickly got to the question of, well, let's answer how and how fast, how quickly, like, let's put some math on it and some progress on it. And I don't mean that in a good way. I mean, like, how did it progress over time to get to that? And so I've really, for the first time, went very one-dimensionally deep on studying hitler's rise and i was curious because i'm like you have

to be able to say that he was unfortunately a compelling guy when he was coming up he was a he was not funny at all at least anything i've studied but he was an incredibly vivacious speaker he was captivating yes and and you don't get people to follow you like that unless whatever it is you're saying is reaching them deep in their soul. Correct. So he was, you know, I hate to give him credit for anything, obviously, but he was great at public speaking and captivating people. He got into people's minds and he touched people in some way to make them believe whatever he was spewing out. We have to – this is so important though, and this is why I was looking at it. We have to look at what worked because we – you can't just say never again and then just turn your blind eye and not look at anything that happened because then it can happen again, right?

And it still could even if you do study it because people fucking forget, right? And not enough people study it. But that is the thing. You have to say, what did he do that worked, that got them there? Because when I talk about how fast the rise was, I always thought they had that Beer Hall Rebellion in 1923, which... I truly don't know how he got to be as powerful as he was. Oh, dude. I don't know. All right, buckle up. Did you read Mein Kampf? I have not been able to get got to be as powerful as he was. I don't know. All right. Buckle up. Did you read Mein Kampf? I have not been able to get myself to read that. Okay.

I know the content of it. Of course. I've never read it. I know my dad had it assigned, I think, when he was in college to read it, which I've never heard of that since then. Maybe it happens other places, but actually I kind of wish I had a professor do that so that we could talk about it. I had a teacher in high school when we were studying the Holocaust actually suggest that we all take it upon ourselves to read it, just to kind of see what the hell was going on during then. Because that, as crazy as it is, is considered one of the most influential books ever. I mean, Hitler was on the list of the most influential people of that century,

which he absolutely was. He was. Without question. But I'm sorry, continue. No, no, no. Any color commentary along the way here I think is good because I know what I've studied and there's some stuff. It's a deep topic there's a lot you know that that i don't know from it but i've been able to glean at least

the main key takeaways from it and you know he he did that rebellion in 23 which you know we talk about like living in a country and taking for granted all the things that happened these motherfuckers went into a beer hall in like in i think it was in munich and they had just like been training some dudes like out back but it happened to be like 30 000 dudes at that point and they they took hostage like the local government in one city and they're like yo you're gonna be with us this is hitler you're talking yeah yeah and so that the guys were amenable and then what happened was one of, I think, who was a general in the army in World War I, had a conversation with one of the guys they were keeping there hostage in the back room. And he said, hey, Ernst, I'm with you guys.

We're going to do this. On my honor, I need to leave now, and I need to go take care of whatever and Ernst shook his hand and said cool that guy then turned on them and Like turned him in and then they got surrounded and they ended up getting arrested and going to jail now Hitler used the court To make the news he was fucking playing chess with everyone Unfortunately, and what he did is he made his court appearances political speeches and they were all reported and people were like damn this guy This motherfucker has a point and then he goes to prison for only two years But when he's in prison, it was basically like, you know, he's treated very well

He had his own, you know, Rudolf Hess who later became the deputy Fuhrer or whatever he was like his personal secretary in there in prison with him, and he wrote this book. And I think about it a lot because he had four walls around him and time to just get more and more pissed off and type away and have another guy who was a psycho fan. Rudolf Hess lived to please Hitler. He was the first of his kind in that way, right, who was just like, yes, you are a god. You are like Jesus, whatever. And so he starts getting more and more into his head. And then he keeps going and going and going.

So when he got out, this is what's crazy to me. He gets out in 1927. There were two election cycles, 28 and 32. In 1928, the Nazi party, even with all the hoopla he was causing, and they were still like raising a fucking army. It just blows my mind. they're like something like that it's like it's like you and me getting a militia and being like yeah we're gonna get some boys over here let's take over yeah exactly and we're gonna we're gonna train with guns in the backyard like it's fucking crazy right but that's what they did and in 28 i don't remember the percentage but there's there was a giant house in in germany so like our

house or something in a different structure and they won a very small percentage of it. They did not have any power. In fact, it was a letdown of an election. Then 1929 happens because Germany had been really bad after World War I because they got fucked after that. But the 20s had been so good in other countries that it had dribbled down to them so by 1928 most people weren't starving anymore and there was at least like a little bit of an economy like it wasn't great but there was something so they were getting more in germany yeah they were more like all right this hitler guy whatever like they were tuning them out a little bit then 1929 stock market

crash happens that affects everything i'm about to say we're it's how we're approaching great depression yeah and so the great depression came there and now hitler said got him so in 1932 and this is the other part that's crazy 1932 the nazis win i believe it was 44 of the house so they were the biggest represented party there because there was more than one party but only 44%. They invaded Poland on September 1st, 1939. So between 1932 and 1939, either by force of repetition and getting people to come to their side or by force of putting people in prison who disagreed, they got the country 100% publicly Nazi. Right? And so I'm looking at that going seven fucking years now you look at how it happened behind the scenes forget the publicity of it he had the same six guys whatever it was behind the scenes who lived to please him they were total psychophants so it was the rom guy they whacked

they whacked him in 34, right? And like the Night of the Long Knives or whatever because they started building the SS. He had – the bullshit army had been called the SA and they were like kind of like blue-collar bruisers. The SS was – the SS. So he's got this guy Himmler building the SS who's like a total psychophant. He's got a – he had a minister of propaganda it was called that a minister of propaganda propaganda is a huge key to all this no but they called it that it wasn't like minister of marketing like minister of publicity it was

like no minister of propaganda joseph garbles who literally called hitler second coming of jesus christ right he had this guy hans goring or whatever who was the war hero quote-unquote from world war one who was like building his army and then i'm forgetting one or two i'll remember him this guy borman came along at some point hydrick who was major with himmler and basically doing the final solution which was ended up being the holocaust that was another guy who was in there and these guys were battling each other to be his number two in command and so they just wanted to please him so much that at some point hitler i don't know when it happened but i would say it was before

1933 when he took the chancellorship he at some point stopped hearing the word no or the word i disagree like he was put in an environment and he was already an evil fucking guy obviously you add that to the fact he was put in an environment where everyone said what can i do mein fuhrer like that's that's what they all called him that right it wasn't just like yo like you know how we looking here is this whole fucking like he was this god among men. And then it transformed this whole country into it. And the last thing I'll fast forward to here now is right at the end of the war, which is Germany slowly lost the war, which, by the way, not for nothing.

Thank God Hitler was the leader once the war was underway because in my opinion if he just hadn't been such a fucking jackass who was impatient right you said it yourself their army was unbelievable their technology was world class they train our military if they had dude we laugh but it's true if they had just waited a little bit and not started a two-front war which by the way one of his guys told him not to do that still did it different world so thank god he was calling the shots and was a psycho and he ended up being his own worst enemy but at the end of the war in 45 you went from that power structure let's call it 32 to 39 where it goes all in and then 39 through 45 in 1945 when the concentration camps were found and then whatever was left literally was freed, they made some of the major local populations around those places of people tour it. The soldiers – do you know about this? No.

Bro, I want to pull this up and I want to put it in the corner of the screen but the the i think it was both the soviets and the americans who got to various camps the soviets were the first ones to get to camps but i know when eisenhower was taken to one of them maybe it was like bergen-belsen or something like that um i want to pull it up so he said i want all he saw how close the local city was and i'm talking away from the mic if people are listening right now uh germans tour concentration camps he saw how close these villages were and he was like there's no way that these people couldn't have seen this the smoke for sure stench and everything smell for sure and like they never did anything it's right behind you now

but he went and collected and you can hear the cackle in our ears he went and look at all these people smiling i'll put in the corner screen for people to watch he went and collected all these germans and made them walk you know the two three miles to the camps and they're just like oh okay whatever and they go and they walk in you see they're literally smiling and some of that may be selective you know they found a few who were laughing at something and you know they're trying to market this which i don't blame them for by the way they needed to that. But now they're walking them to the camps and they make these people see the bodies. They make them see the...

No way. Yeah, man. It's wild shit. And they make them witness it. And like they... Look, they show them like the charred wigs and stuff. It's like almost like a sadistic museum tour. And these people are forced to look at the carnage that happened around

them and so you the reason i say this is because you can see it in their eyes they are they're now they're like what the fuck they're distraught yeah right look some people are fainting and being carried out they're distraught about this but yet in this 13 year period they got to a point where they could ignore shit like this and only when they are then shown it now be like what the fuck yeah and so i think about this because i look at like our system in america right now and how that's disturbing right it's but that's the thing i look at systems like ours and i also compare them to systems around the world like what china is doing to the uyghurs right now that people conveniently don't pay attention to and everything and i'm like it doesn't take much no you get the right group behind you you never know what could happen you get the right group behind you that that believes

what you're saying there's there's no limit to what you can do i mean there are genocides that are still going on now you know um the one in rwanda a couple that wasn't also wasn't that long ago i think that was in the 90s man that was in the 90s you know what i mean and one of the one of the things about the situation and this can really be with all genocides and things that happen like that is one of the the people that was there i was reading the book and he was like you know we're sending videos and we're showing what's going on. They thought, you know, how could anybody not come help when there was a TV man from America, a reporter that told this guy, and it's written in an interview. People are going to look at that on TV in america they're going to say you

know what that's really sad then they're going to change the channel yep you know what i mean there's something about the fact that we and it's a weakness we have as humans yep until the devil is on our doorstep yeah we don't think it can happen to us and we assume it's someone else's battle to fight and be taken care of. Exactly. And that's the thing. Like, you used the Rwanda example,

which wasn't long ago. No. We're talking millions of people. Millions of people. So, do you think, like, you know, a couple thousand UN soldiers are going to go over there and do shit? What are they going to do

against an armed militia? Dude, that was... Serious stuff. And even, like, another one in um uganda with ed i mean oh yeah who was killing his own people and this was a this was a uh a president of a country you know it was the last king of scotland the last scotland and james mcavoy one of my favorite movies and i mean so but let me ask you do you think that could ever happen here? Do you think – so let me ask you, do you ever think that there could be a society where martial law takes over? My heart wants to say absolutely not.

This is America. We're the shining light on a hill. And I still would lean that way. But I don't think – I don't think anything's impossible, number one. If people want to tell me magic's impossible, okay, fine. But you know what I don't need to expand upon that. And I don't think humans change when it comes to the extremes of who they can be. Meaning, I think someone could be a Mother Teresa in today's time still. I also think someone could be an Adolf Hitler in today's time still i also think someone could be an adolf hitler in today's time still and i don't see why just because we have things better here i don't see why that couldn't emanate in our country there are a lot of people it takes one it takes

one who's got some charisma behind them and like some people yell at me. Yeah, bro. Facts. Some people will yell at me because we talked about this very briefly in my last episode with Nico, maybe like 15 minutes total. But I never got to the other point. But I had been saying – I had been drawing some parallels, and I was very careful how I said this, and I'll be very careful how I say this again. I am not equating the two in any way but when I look at things that make people think things that maybe they they're just thinking because they're getting caught up in the tribal moment and they're looking at the leader that's telling them that and saying well that must be right there are patterns of what Trump did charisma wise that Hitler did boy and I said the same thing and i am not want to be very clear about that in no way shape or form am i calling trump hitler in any way right that's a disgraceful thing to say

he's absolutely and and and fuck you to people who even try to say that's the case and i'm not a fan of trump but that's ridiculous to say that the pattern starts somewhere though right and i the reason i said people get pissed is not just that, but I never got to the second part of the point. I didn't realize that until after, but I was saying I saw patterns on the other side as well. And the patterns I see like from the Democratic side are more where they are trying to control the narrative

of what's allowed to be in play. You know, because frankly, like, let's be honest, the tech platforms are controlled by people who sympathize with the left, not the right. You know, it's just what it is. And so when I see something like QAnon banned, at the moment, selfishly, am I like, oh, thank God, I don't have to hear that shit anymore? I am. But I'm also then concerned because I'm like, well, do not. I still see Antifa doing their fucking thing over here you know what i mean

so like if you're if you want to play that game if you're the public square now and you are a tech platform and you're representing that and to be fair they are fully allowed to do this because of section 230 they are doing nothing wrong in that way it's still scary though because they are the public square if you want to do that you better keep it balanced and then when you keep it balanced where do you draw the line? And that's why it goes to our earlier point, and that's why I believe everything has to be said, and you just have to destroy bad ideas. I think the big QAnon problem happened because enough people on smaller scales were told to go fuck themselves about something that could have been true. Let's use an example.

Everyone who was told that the lab hypothesis in China was racist last year. Do you know? And unfortunately, I know a couple people who went down that rabbit hole. And I'm not going to say who, but not idiots either. Not idiots who then went and started. They didn't realize it, but they were like empathizing with like QAnon points because they got caught along because they were told they were crazy. And what they were saying we now know is looking like it's going to be true yep you know so i see stuff like that and that scares me because one of the other things hitler had that but he also had the propaganda arm behind it he did you know and like people say trump had fox news he had one channel

all the other fucking channels hated him people don't realize there was no fox news back then so that mean that shit was on every corner you looked every street you turned on every time you turned on the the people that had tvs during that time all you saw was was the swastika in hitler his his speeches his speeches being broadcasted all over these these networks during that time you know propaganda is a huge part of all that stuff. You know, the reason I asked you if you ever think it could happen here, because I don't know if you watched the show Handmaid's Tale. I haven't yet. I've heard phenomenal things about that, though.

It's fucking insane. Can you explain the plot behind that? So, it's fucking insane, bro. I mean, pretty much our country is ruled by martial law. So pretty much whatever the government says goes, everybody has their role. You either play a role or you get put on the wall. Simple as that.

Wait, are you talking about in the show? Yeah, in the show. Okay, okay. So what I'm saying, I always ask people, do you think that could ever happen here? Because some of these things that I see on the show, I'm like, I don't know how hard it would be to make this actually happen here, right?

Because you see, you know, if the militia goes to every neighborhood and says, we need every man from each household and they're toting guns, what the fuck are we going to do? Can we stop them? Can we go to war with them? We can't as civilians go to war with our own militia. So if they come to every household and say, we're taking every man, he's's going to work every woman that's fertile is going to have children with these powerful people i don't know if it's that far-fetched off from happening now obviously it's fucking extreme obviously and

it would take a long time for that regime to get put in place but i don't think it's far-fetched thing that something like that could happen because there's already regimes around the world where you see things like that going on. People can't leave their house. I mean, China had what? They had a limit on how many kids you can have. Remember that? The one-child policy.

You know what I'm saying? So I don't know how far-fetched things like that are, but it's just crazy to think that there could be a society where that exists. You know what I mean? And it does all come back to the First Amendment for me. Like it's – people say the Second Amendment is most important because it stops tyranny. Yeah, but if you lose the First Amendment, the Second Amendment could be canceled real quick. Oh, yeah. So it's like everything comes back to that for me.

They all play off one another, the amendments. Yes, they do. 100%. to that they all play off one another yes they do exactly 100 and like it's funny not funny but like you draw as you go up the board there when if someone actually if if you go and read through each amendment they get way different as you go along but then you can spot the patterns like these weird little patterns across them which is interesting to me but side topic there is such an issue though with the fact that you know we can look at these extreme examples around the world and know that all it takes is that slippery slope to be dived down and go farther and farther and farther for us to wake up one day and

realize holy we're in tyranny and i don't look i don't like to me the fucking it goes back to like people trying to act like it's the worst thing ever here which goes to my point of like no it's not right let's look at the positive and let's look at the negative and try to fix it and know how we compare in context but the people who come out like we live in tyranny it's all over whatever i don't think we're there like at all i i think people not even close i think people who say that have no fucking idea what tyranny is their theme yeah their theme of saying some patterns are spotted to get there and look we've now seen it from both sides because we've seen trump abiding right so now we've had opposite sides screaming tyranny when the other's

in charge so we can see these patterns of these people talking about this and i think some of the themes are a little scary because they're on the edge and it starts for me with what people are allowed to say and where they're allowed to say it and so i someone had a line where they're like i will fucking hate everything you say whoever you are if you have some horrible ideas but i will fight like hell for your right to say it i agree with that you know i i want to body bag you in public fairly and be like that's a horrible idea here's why here's evidence and and hope that there are enough sane people out there to see this and when you start to cross that chasm to where you're asking like hey do i think we could ever get there well it starts with the chasm crossing so it's not an impossibility i would just like to

think that there are foundations of the constitution and the great experiment that we've set up here that can stop that from happening what i need you mean like our democracy yes so as much of a democracy as we are i kind of feel like a lot of times we really don't have any fucking control we have no say over anything that goes on first of all how much control do we as the american population truly have because if the powers that be come down and say this is the way we're going to do things this is how we're going to enforce it and if you don't abide by these rules these are the consequences that are going to happen what can we as civilians do if we go to a martial law type of? Now, I'm not saying this is going to happen, but I'm trying to think about it theoretically.

Could it happen? And the way I started to break it down is, let's say all the top politicians, you know, people in the House, they all come down and say, you can only have, like China, you can only have one kid per household, right? And they're going to be doing checks. If they start checking and they say, you know, these are the consequences that are going to happen if you don't follow these rules, what are people going to do? Now, we as Americans are going to throw our hands up and say, this is fucking America. We could do whatever the fuck we want to do. First Amendment, you know, nobody tells us how many kids we can and can't have but if the government comes in and starts enforcing these things that they said they were going to enforce then what so then

you that's just how you start then it gets bigger and then it gets bigger and then it gets bigger to the point where now everybody's living under this regime just out of pure fear of the consequences and repercussions if you don't follow the rules right so when i watch a show like handmaid's tale and that's really what's going on because what's going on is they they take all the fertile women the one that can have babies and they it's it's fucking crazy i mean there's a whole ceremony it's another and it's another thing that's that's it's all in the name of god it's all that's what they do it's fucking crazy. I mean, there's a whole ceremony. It's another, and it's another thing that's, it's all in the name of God. It's all, that's what they do.

It's all in the name of Christianity. You got, you got to live. This is all, this is all God's will. This is how God wants you to live your life and everything. The rhetoric that they're teaching people in their training, because they have to literally go to like camps and shit to,

to, to learn the rules is all in the name of God. Right? So once you, once you take all that and put it into it, like camps and shit to learn the rules is all in the name of God, right? So once you take all that and put it into it, people are going to be terrified. The ones that are going to rebel are going to end up on the wall, and they're going to end up on the wall to the point where me and you are walking down the street, we can see our friends' bodies hanging in the street because they're making examples out of them. So when I think about it, I'm like, could that ever happen?

I hope not, but I could see it happening if the right things were to fall in place because if our government would decide to go that way who's going to stop them who's going to stop them is any other country going to come in and say nah y'all can't do this who's going to say we're a world power i don't know if we're number one but we're up in the top three at least or at least in the top five? Who's going to come in and stop our country's leaders from doing whatever the fuck they want to do? I think the cynic in me actually thinks, though, that that's already I don't want to say it's it's it's already been happening and we've seen that it doesn't go that bad way. But this is like a good cynical point i hope i'm right about this i think we've seen that power structure remain the same you

know the two sides of the same hypocrisy for so long that i don't know if it could change and like people were asking me they're like you know they were getting on me because i i didn't guess a vote for either of the candidates in the last election and i knew by about early 2019 mid 2019 that i was not going to vote for trump and i was like all right let's see if someone's gonna earn my vote and no disrespect to joe biden but he's an old frail man i don I don't know. No, I'm sorry. I don't know. That's the truth, bro. I don't know who's calling the shots there, right? And I'm not a fan of Kamala Harris at all.

We're on the same page. Right? So I couldn't do that. And I'll be honest. That decision of mine, and this is my opinion, ages better and better every day. And it's very freeing for me, too, because I just felt like they were horrible options and they've continued to prove that point the last two elections I'm just want to build my own opinion out there yeah man 150 percent but and and I was and I was a big trumper in 2016 I was an Obama guy in 2012 I always tell people this so I'm on the same page

with him like and I was I was a big Trumper in 2016. And it didn't happen like overnight where I'm like, wait a second. That did not happen. It took a while where I was like, wait, no, that's not – wait, that's not what I thought it was. You know what I mean? Like that thing – you have to see like 10 of them, 10 things happen. I think it took until – I'm dealing with it now with the vote that I casted.

With Biden. Yeah. Yeah. And it's like i think that's perfectly fine and and like i we also put um this is side note here but we put people in boxes when they cast a vote in an election for sure it's like dude it's a binary choice if you're gonna vote you're gonna vote for one of them right like in in that case if you're actually not voting third party or something like that you know in my case i didn't vote for one of them i didn't i didn't feel that way but like i have a lot of friends who voted for biden i have a lot of friends who voted for trump i would say the minority of them was pumped about the decision wherever whichever direction they went right so what am i going to do the people who are all like this i'm going to judge them because they voted for trump or i'm going to judge them because no like this it's it's how it is so side issue there but

point being these power these powers that be have maintained this control by power hunger manipulation for years and like i said i'm not a fan of harris but did you see her thing over maybe it was like last week or something like that, where she talked about the migrants coming in? You did see that. Yep. I want to pull up this video because I saw four years of them playing, you know, Trump in 2016 and then Trump in 2018 where he said the opposite shit. Well, it's happening again. Oh, yeah.

They're fucking politicians, man. I don't believe any single word that comes out of any politician's mouth ever. Because their job and their sole job is to get your vote, to keep the powers, to keep the real people that are in power in power. Because at the end of the day, they're not the ones that are making the choices for any things all these corporations that have money tied into all these things are the ones that are making all the decisions at the end of the day period so i mean we're gonna go with that yeah that's that's the other we haven't said that yet yeah that's that's the 500 pound elephant in the room like alec i i have the video behind you i i want to watch this because they do and that's my problem with the media they make you they put you in a position where I'm not defending Trump but I have to be like come on right you know what

I and no one wants to be at least unless you're a fan of his no one wants to be in that position but it's like you have to call this shit out when you see it so this video it's two minutes long the first I think like i think it's roughly half and half is and i'll denote when it changes over the first half is kamala harris speaking at some sort of like early campaign event in 2019 and the second half is her speaking the other day and the issue is the same she is talking about migrant families coming to this country so i've seen this i'll play that just for the people here we have always presented ourselves as being a nation of strength with strong arms that when people are

fleeing harm we will embrace them but look at what has happened with this administration there are children who are fleeing murder capitals of the world let Let's be clear about this. Imagine a mother who makes a decision to pay a coyote to transport her child across the entire country of Mexico, facing unknown peril. She does that because she believes for that child to stay where they are is worse. But what does this president do? He virtually looks at those children and says, go back to where you came from. What do we have in this president? A policy that was about taking children, separating them from their parents, and calling it border

security. No, that was a human rights abuse being committed by the United States government, and it is against the morals and the values of who we are as a nation. I want to be clear to folks in this region who are thinking about making that dangerous trek to the United States-Mexico border. Do not come. Do not come. The United States will continue to enforce our laws and secure our border.

There are legal methods by which migration can and should occur. But we, as one of our priorities, will discourage illegal migration. And I believe if you come to our border, you will be turned back. So let's discourage our friends, our neighbors, our family members from embarking on what is otherwise an extremely dangerous journey.

There's a lot that we can unpack. There's a lot to unpack there. And I'm not even going at the immigration issue because that that is such a fucked up broken system i but i have just issues just looking at these motherfuckers man there's like a thing it's like a thing i'm just like you lying i don't need oh my god yeah but it's politicians man it's their job unfortunately it is and i'm turning it into a positive right now because it you know the the one thing about trump is he always talked so like guy contradicted himself left and right because he was always fucking talking so you could put these tapes next to each other these people

seem to talk a little less so there's there's fewer examples at least in my estimation of it and some of that's probably they're like you you know, shoving it to the side. But I look at this and I go back to your point of can it happen here? The difference, and maybe I'm totally wrong here, but the difference with this is this is a prime example of politicians morphing to the issue of the moment to maintain power. Oh, yeah. When you look at examples of places where tyranny occurs, they don't morph to the moment to maintain power oh yeah when you look at examples of places where tyranny occurs they don't morph to the moment they always are the moment you look at china recently they've been communists they've been about that life you look at hitler hitler didn't like jewish people

in 1923 he still didn't like them in 1939 it wasn't like this you know like like this in a way it was a slow burn to where it got to obviously like you know slowly injecting more and more hate sure but it wasn't like one day he was opportunistically saying hey they're our friends and then the next day being like let's put them in concentration camps these people will opportunistically go back and forth on total opposite ends to get whatever they have to get. And it goes to the overall point that people said, and I want your thoughts on this. The political spectrum is a circle. It all comes around to each other.

The right becomes the left. The left becomes the right. And such is life. And I keep looking at it. I mean, it's true. You're 100% right. I keep looking at it with issues over time. And there are things where it's like, okay, I see why that direction is going that way and that direction is going that way.

And then eventually they switch. This is the fear. This is the fear that comes with politics, right? In your heart of hearts, you want to hope and you want to believe everything that they're saying on the campaign. Right. You want to believe that everything they're spewing out to you is, oh, yeah, they're going to they're going to be the ones that are going to make the change. These are going to get better. Yada, yada, yada, yada, the whole nine yards. In the back of your mind, if you're hip to politics in general, or even if we do a little bit of research, and you go back and you look at the history of Harris and Biden, you'll see that it's not exactly great. And I'm being nice by saying it's not exactly great.

Right? So this is the fear that you have when it comes to voting for him. And then you have the people on the other side that now have the opportunity to say, see? Exactly. Fucking told you. Yes. Fucking told you yes fucking told you and what does that do what does that it just makes things worse well it it just makes the divide even bigger now you're because nobody now now really nobody wants to

listen to what what the other one has to say well you you bashing me for voting for trump look at what the fuck biden and harris are doing they ain't doing no fucking better so like you said the left becomes the right the right becomes the left nothing's changed what's happening with the student loan debt you know i'm saying what's what's happening with you you you're sitting you're sitting there pouring your heart out telling the story about a mother who's dragging her child across the plains of mexico and everything they have to go through to get here then you say don't come to the fucking border come on this this is a great moment though to point out like people who don't want to see like a trump happen again or something let's point out something that he did very right here that

these people can't do right he said whatever the fuck he wanted to say and he said it like it was you and me just sitting here talking when they say these things i mean you see her face they're being politicians she's like picture a mother right pause for the audience reaction turns but turn back to the person asking the question for dramatic effect that mother sent you know what there's just bullshit bullshit you know and i feel like but i feel like real recognize real you know i'm saying like i feel like what do you mean by that like i feel like a lot of people it's not hard for me at least i feel like to decipher bullshit

right i'll give you like a sports analogy you have a guy on your team that's trying to be a leader he's rah rah but he doesn't put the work in he doesn't put in the extra time he fucks around and he sucks that's not somebody that you're going to look and look at and say you know that's the leader that i can look up to and listen to we'll recognize real you're not even putting the work that i'm putting in and i'm a i'm an under You're a senior. How can I sit there and respect what you have to say? So real recognize real. I feel like it's not hard to decipher bullshit, right? And I just feel like with, and it's not even with just them, it's with almost every politician. I feel like you're reaching the masses that want to hear that shit. I don't give a fuck about what you have to

say. Show me the action. You said you're going to do the student loan that you're reaching the masses that want to hear that shit. I don't give a fuck about what you have to say. Show me the action. You said you're going to do the student loan debt. You're going to cancel it. When is that going to happen? Do it. Once you start to do things, and I'm seeing you putting your words into action,

now I can get behind you and support you wholeheartedly. But until you put your words into action, I don't give a fuck about, your words mean nothing. Your words have no value to me, period. So something that we always talk about on our show, and even when this whole election was going on is accountability. And we were talking about before this election even happened, if they don't deliver on what they said they were going to do, we are going to hold them accountable ourselves because we already are on the fence about voting for them in the first

place. So now my vote essentially helped put you in office essentially so you'd like to think right so now you're not doing what you said you're going to do i'm a hypocrite by not holding you accountable because for everything trump said that he didn't deliver on i held him accountable for and i talked about it so i got to keep the same energy with you you know i'm saying so i mean when you see shit like that it just makes like my skin crawl because i'm like all these politicians are so full of shit they don't really give a fuck about what what the regular middle class people like me and you think because we're not the ones that are filling their fucking pockets you know i mean i mean do you know how much money was spent on these

two previous elections the numbers are like outrageous other countries other countries don't even reach one percent of the money that was raised for these campaigns 150 million dollars on a campaign is doesn't even make any kind of sense when you have all this other shit that's going on in this country that that money could be used for for me and i could go on on a whole nother rant about that and that and that was that was such an issue with trump too because he became a part of that he like just call it what it is i mean i don't remember the numbers we can look them up but i know what you're talking about there were astronomical numbers and he like he came in regardless of what his political beliefs were when when he came in, I mean, the guy was a true outsider.

These circles of elites had always been like, oh, that fucking guy, his whole life. How does Trump become president, bro? How? How does Trump become president? He's a fucking reality TV star. Yes, yes. How the fuck does this man go from The Apprentice, being on Monday Night Raw with Vince McMahon, all this other shit, to being the president of the United fucking States of America? Because he comes in as that outsider, but he leaves as the biggest insider, just like the rest of them.

That's my point. People like to talk about the pardons he left on the table at the end with Assange, Snowden, and even Ross Ulbricht. Those are symbols they're and i agree like he should have fucking he should have commuted ross in my opinion and then he should have pardoned the other two as well and i was very disappointed because it was like it was a total swamp swamp move like to use his words but he became a part of that same hypocrisy where once you are in there and i i don't want it like, there are some tidbits I've known through sources I trust, I don't want to share them on air, because it becomes a he said, she said, I'm not going to do that. I shouldn't. I don't need to support this more than I already have

the enough public support with things we saw. He became such an insider that it even came back to like, yes, was he raising money the first time around once he got to the final two, you know, with him and Hillary in the election and taking people's money? He was. But this time around, that campaign started when he got into office, which is how it always works. But the money raised was astronomical. It was all about maintaining. It becomes the game.

Oh, we can't lose to these people. Therefore, I can't lose to these people. And he gets lost in it. He loses sight of the fact that he's becoming everything that he said he wasn't going to be and that was my biggest issue because i did hear one instance and again i'm not going to give specifics on this but there was an instance when he got into office where he did tell a major donor to go fuck themselves on something and i never heard a story like that again which is very interesting to me because i heard that i'm like oh my god he's like kind of holding to it

no he didn't yeah he became became a part of him i don't know if people they i'm i mean i'm sure there were all kinds of threats and like that i'm a cynic i understand what goes on back there i'm a realist i should say i understand what goes on back there but like it just goes to show you that regardless of what his political beliefs are one person having ideas is not going to take down a system the system's too strong I mean

you're right on bro I mean with these last two elections it's like it's a fucking joke like it's like this we're talking about the future of our country we're talking about the future of our country we're talking about the future of my children the future of the life that me and my fiance want to have the life that we want to live in this country and it's like it's it's almost become a fucking joke not even become it is a

joke right when you look at like we talked like we touched on in the beginning fox news and cnn they both have a fucking agenda they both have a narrative that they're trying to push which is just to denounce everything the other side is doing right at the end of the day all these politicians to me are the fucking same and you know when you see a trump go from where he was to be able to captivate the people that he did and get the support that he did to become the president of the United States. What's still to me is unfathomable because I was watching Donald Trump as a kid on the apprentice, cursing people to fuck out to now being the person that's the commander in chief in my

country. Wild, wild. You know what I'm saying? It's like when you think I'm like, are people not realizing what's going on here? This dude doesn have any history in politics dude i think that was part of dude i 100 think that looking back on it for myself i think that was part of the allure because he was and i said this earlier where we were talking about like speech styles but

he was really fucking funny too like captivated people yes like it was even when he was in office and shit was going south i'd be lying if i told you i wasn't entertained as and i shouldn't be this this shouldn't be what we look for in a president still entertained as fuck almost every time he talked unless he said something just beyond the fucking pale like he makes those faces and he and he talks with those words and you know huge you know all that shit you know what i'm saying so fucking hilarious it definitely that definitely draws people in because they see that they see their fucking uncle at the table making funny jokes that it's like he's not supposed to say that but all right whatever fuck it you know exactly you know yeah so where does it end yeah where do you draw the line and with this last election i mean it was a mess with covid and all

i mean having um you know the mail-in ballots and then and that kind of voting and stuff i thought was insanity the whole voting process was in was insanity i mean that you are you are you let me i have to ask this are you comfortable with the fact though that it was a wide enough margin and if there was fuckery going on biden still won this election yeah so so that's like the point that i'm getting to right because we're talking about how how much this divides the country even more right this shit right here talking about how well you guys are holding trump look at what the fuck biden harris are doing right i thought that it was it was crazy how after everything went down and an

election was over how trump could not bring himself to admit the shit that he lost right like i even go back to the thing should have happened on january 6th at the capitol right the first thing he comes out of his mouth and says is, we won the election by a landslide. This is why these motherfuckers are going to storm the Capitol. Because you as a person in power got them thinking that you really won the election. So I think that what I'm saying is when the powers that be aren't acting right, I don't know how you can expect the rest of the country to fall in line. Yes. Because everything, any business, anything starts at the fucking top.

That sets the bar right there. So if you're acting like that, how can I expect someone underneath you to be acting, quote unquote, in the right way? You know what I mean? So, I mean, politics have really become a joke and people don't want to hear what you have to say and a lot of people feel like,

you know, I voted Republican my whole life, I have to stay this way or because of who I am, I have to vote Republican and I think that's total bullshit.

I think you should be very flexible and be willing to come to your own conclusion, your own person. Just because you've been a Republican your whole life doesn't mean that you have to vote for Trump in a second term

because there were a lot of people and a lot of women who were just saying, you know what? I've been a Republican my whole life. I can't get behind this for another four years. You know what I mean? And that's where a lot of the people that voted on the other side came from was just because of the pure fact

that they couldn't morally stand behind the things Trump said in the way he acted as a president. You know what I mean? So I think that. Like I said, I have trouble when people are just boxed into one thing. If you're if you're such a Trumper, that mean you can't have a conversation because you're not listening to what I'm saying. You're not even hearing me because everything that I'm saying, you're just thinking of in your mind of a rebuttal to come back and say, well, Obama this or Biden that. You know what I mean? So we can't even have an open conversation about this shit.

But that shit right there is a joke. These politicians are a fucking joke, man. And it's scary. It's fucking scary. Because like you said, I don't know if Joe Biden is in his right mind. I work in home care. Right? So, I mean, I work very closely with people that have mental issues.

Expert opinion. You know, not even. Not even. I've seen a lot of people that have issues in their later years. And some of the times when you watch some of his speeches and his press cameras, it's like, I see his eyes. Just, he's not even in his, like, own body speaking. I don't know if the lights are on.

He loses his whole train of thought. I'm like, yo, does this dude have fucking dementia? Dude, I used to caddy for his brother-in-law a lot. Did you really? Yeah. Okay. Because I worked at, for a few years, I worked at Wilmington Country Club caddying up there. And what's so unbelievable to me, and this is just what happens.

I think something happened, first of all. But the last time I stood next to him was the summer of 2014. You met Joe Biden? No. Okay, his brother. Never shook his hand. His brother, you're saying. Okay.

Never was on his back. His brother. Okay. I think he nodded at me a couple times. Oh, but you've been around him? Yeah. Okay. Yeah, from closer than me and you.

Okay. And the fucking Secret Service is everywhere. All around us, right. no god damn country club like there's there's no issues in that way but you know it's still like kind of weird that you're like i'm right next to the second most powerful person in the country like kind of hot but what did the summer of 2014 was the last time i was very close to him and he walked on the practice tee and i i guess he was like 71 72 at the time and i remember thinking to myself holy shit this guy's a fucking machine he was like yoked yeah he was walking on there busting balls moving around like like whipping it and you know i don't know how far he hit the ball but he was getting like probably all of maybe like 230 240 boom boom boom boom boom

like in between shots bullshitting with people hey tom how you doing like with it completely i'm like this motherfucker's a goddamn machine and then i see him give his first speech five years later in 2019 hasn't been in office for three years now i see him give his like first campaign speech and i'm like this man has had 10 strokes it's not the same guy bro he is not the same guy frail and it's like it is frail it's it's it's frightening to me because it is still a symbolic thing and as opposite as obama and trump both were we just went from two presidents who were fucking machines they were on all the fucking time in different ways like trump was loud and boisterous on obama was like kind of controlled on but they were on i mean you've seen the picture of obama's face over eight years like how much aging and the gray hair the guy was fucking on right and trump

say what you want a cocaine machine something like he's on yep this guy's off yeah he is he's off and as a symbol for the country like you you look at it you see him at the g7 meeting and stuff like angela merkel is on man like she's with it boom like these other macron he's on even kamala harris she's on quick with and and and i then i i see this guy and i'm like how much is he really there bro how much is he really doing you know he's not there so when you don't know who it's like and that's my when you don't know who the – it's like – and that's my point. You don't know who the president is. That's problematic for me because it is like kind of a ridiculous position in the context of modern history.

This was set up when we had 13 colonies, right? The idea that one person is in charge of all this shit is fucking crazy. You're not really in charge. Right. But there's still – there's a lot coming across the desk. There's a lot. It's 24 fucking seven it's 35 seven whatever you know and i think about that a lot because i'm like well what what kind of precedent is this you know is he and i pray to god he makes it for years me too because like dude i i never like to say based on identity we need this or we need that but symbolically like we we

we do we need a female president at some point here and like i don't want it to be how i don't think it's the first one i don't think it's her either that's problematic like that you know to me i think it's a big issue that the first two women who were like legitimately like on the ticket or close to it or had a shot where hillary and kamala it's like that we can do better than that we can do better than that dog i i couldn't fathom when hit when when hillary won the nomination for the democratic party did she win it i'm just like yo what the fuck did she win it she ran she was on the ballot you know what i mean i mean what a time i mean the the clintons also even as democrats you know

people always want to think that you know the republicans are the the evil ones and the democrats are the or the good side but that's total fucking bullshit too look at what the clintons did the three strike laws i i always say the way i and this is over generalizing it but let me over generalize for a second the way i look at it is the the republicans have themselves to blame because they just look at an issue and go you know what it doesn't affect us like we're not going to deal with it fuck it pull yourself up by the bootstraps you know it works the same right no that's not how it works the democrats and i sadistically give them credit for this they at least take the time to go pander or at least talk about it yeah right and therefore in my opinion they're full of shit

so i i kind of view it the generalization is that i view the republicans as asleep at the wheel and i view the democrats as more corrupt but to be fair i view them both as corrupt i i don't think you get a mitch mcconnell you know how many fucking years has he been in power like 40 he's a republican you don't get that without a level of just complete power control oh yeah period and people behind you supporting you yeah so it's to me it's a systemic problem for sure and you know one of the things you had brought up there at some point that i didn't go at because you were going on something else and i wanted to let that rip was the idea that people get pushed in the other direction we touched it a little bit but you

hear about like these pills and stuff you know like the red pill the blue pill there's the orange pill now with bitcoin which is like kind of interesting right yeah these pills in my opinion are not born out of great ideas that people are attracted to they're born out of very bad ideas that people feel forced upon and say fuck that right like the thing is humans that is consistent across history is that if the fastest way to get us to not do something you want us to do is ask not even ask to tell us what the fuck to do yeah you know so when these people are like you must think like this you must think like that if if someone's like well i don't know about that and then they're told to go fuck themselves they They're going to go hard the other way. And so I see it because I see people in comment sections, especially being on Reddit, TikTok, which is fucking crazy.

I don't know if you read those comment sections. TikTok is a wild place. It's wild. Twitter, obviously, prime example. I see a lot of these people, and I will sometimes go to their profiles, right? So the stereotypical ones on the left will be the pronoun people with pink hair. Stereotypical ones on the right will be the fucking don't tread on me flag people with a fucking American flag across the top. And if they're crazy, a fucking Confederate flag. And I will go – it happens, right?

I saw one yesterday. I will go look at – I will never understand that. I'm sorry. But I will go look at these profiles, and I will sometimes get lost trying to look and say, how? How did they get here? And if you go back far enough on some of them, sometimes it only takes two or three years. If you can go back far enough, and Twitter, it's hard to do because they archive it after three months. So you can't really do that.

But on other platforms, you can, like maybe Instagram, stuff like that. Instagram, you scroll all the way to the bottom of the page. And you can kind of see it. There's a point where maybe you don't know what it was, but you're like maybe Instagram stuff like that scroll away the bombs right and you can kind of see it like there's a point Where maybe you don't know what it was be like something happened and then you look at a thing that happened publicly and you're like Oh, maybe it was that right, but then you also think about who is this person? Where are they from? What issues did they care about where how did they get hit? they get hit with one or two things and Then they get so hard on that that they adopt the tribe that seems to wrap their arms around them and say, we agree with you on that issue.

So now what they don't realize is they get into this groupthink of agreeing with all the millions of issues on whatever left or right side that is that now they go farther and farther and farther. And what they don't realize is they're not really going towards the great ideas they may rip off the three broad things that they can say represents whatever party they're on now and act like they actually understand what that means but they don't really know the issue by issue basis of what it is they're supporting right so i feel bad for them because it's like you know they think they're right or they think they're left maybe they're not right you know and and that's to me that's a huge problem i see and it's what leads this discourse because those are the people who get the clicks and attention on social those are like you said that group think that shit bothers me the same way it bothers you bro it's like people want to be accepted also you know people want to feel like they're a part of something you know what i

mean so you know you have these crazy ideas not even crazy ideologies just you feel a certain way about something and you got a bunch of people that back you. That makes you feel good. So like you said, you can take it to the extreme now because those people are probably going to think the same way you think because everyone wants so badly to be accepted. And that's with everything. You see it all over Instagram. You see it all over Instagram. You see it all over Twitter. I feel like a lot of people don't even know who they are themselves anymore because they're trying so hard to be accepted or to fit the stigma of what they think they should be instead of being them true selves. Which in the end, at the end of the day, all that is going to lead to you hating yourself even more than you already do.

And your insecurities are just gonna want to eat at you more and more and more and more and more right so i mean that group think shit it's a huge problem to me people don't want to think for themselves bro why why people are so thirsty to just be accepted you know and feel like they can't be themselves now you know we have a group of friends six of us we all have different opinions on shit i don't give a fuck if what miles thinks not that i don't give a fuck but he says what he thinks and i say i feel i don't have to agree with him to know that if i call mills i'm like yo mills my car broke down can you come pick me up he'll be

there in a heartbeat so i don't i don't feel the need to for for everyone to accept my opinion because not everybody will anyway you know what i mean so the group thing shit is a it's a major problem when we were growing up you know before social media was the end all be all you know know, when we were kids, maybe like 2009, 2010, stuff like that before it really, really got there, right? On the scale. We didn't have this stuff. No, we didn't, bro. We didn't.

And guess what? People, even if it wasn't loud back then, people still had all different beliefs on shit. You know, you could be in a friend group where there were two hard pro-lifers and two hard pro choicers right and maybe the rest didn't care that much or that wasn't their issue right and no one fucking cared and now i see it with kids i talk to you know in in high school or in college and like their friend groups don't happen because people think a certain way and I'm just like how fucking sad is that and then I look at my own and what I notice is that the people I know who are hard on either side they're different friend groups for me which is so interesting and I guess I'm kind of lucky to be in the middle of

it you know and it's still I'll still go at both of them. Right. Like with certain things, but they at least know I'm quote unquote, not the enemy, you know? Right. And that I never thought of it that way until maybe a couple months ago, but that's even sad on my end. And that to me is a very, very piss poor precedent because you've talked several times today about the fact that this whole disagreement point it's good to disagree on stuff you know it's it it's it shouldn't be an end-all be-all and you should be able to say you know what you have your evidence i have mine i learned something

right and i don't think we're i think we're setting up these little mini cells of people throughout society that are losing that ability because they don't hang out with people who don't agree with them because they know that they don't agree with them because they can scroll through the goddamn social feed like you said there was a time where none of that shit was ever relevant right i remember there being a time when i was a teenager in high school where it was disrespectful to ask somebody who high school where it was disrespectful to ask somebody who they voted for. It was disrespectful to ask somebody

which political party do you affiliate with? It was disrespectful. It was something that was never ever talked about. Ever. You don't speak about that kind of stuff, right? Now we're at the point where it's like which side are you on? Because I'm going to put you in a box

and tell you what kind of person you are based on who you fucking voted for. You know what I mean? Like how twisted is that shit? How twisted is it? Because just because I might not agree with a certain candidate's points but

certain things in this party appeal to my beliefs more that's totally fine that's fine that's totally fine like that it's fine you know i'm saying appeal to my beliefs more exactly and that's and that's really what it is to me right that's really what it is but it it's really gotten to a point where it's like you voted for trump you're a racist bigot you voted for for you vote for the democrats you're a tree hugger and you're kumbaya. Bullshit. Bullshit.

You know what I mean? And that's the point that we're at in society. And it's frustrating because it's hard. You see it everywhere. You know what I mean? People often assume it's because you're it everywhere you know i mean people often assume it's because you're black that you voted for the democratic party and that's not true in all in all situations because i know plenty of black folks that voted republican for trump both terms and what can i

ask you about that specifically though why is that so ostracized i mean they really it's and it's and i'm not just talking about within the black community it's what what's way more alarming to me not that it's okay anywhere but like if it's within your own community and and people are going at each other or whatever maybe there's an element of that that can end up being healthy even though i think that example's not where i draw the line is when i see chelsea handler getting and i'm using i'm cherry picking one example but this is a pattern when i see chelsea handler getting on tv and telling her old ex-boyfriend 50 cent you're black you can't support trump yeah that's where i start to go

okay you know i don't like to just label stuff racist right away i think we've hurt that word because we overuse the fuck out of it but i look at that night and i think about it i count to 10 and i go is that racist i think so i'll even give you another example when biden said on um breakfast club you ain't black if you ain't voting for me how the fuck do you even form your fucking mouth to open your mouth and say some shit like that? Shout out to Charlamagne Tha God for keeping a straight face. You know what I'm saying? How the fuck do you even form your lips to say that shit?

And it's like, so to what you're saying, right? Because it is ostracized. Because if you're a black person that lets it be known that you vote a Republican, you're going to be called an Uncle Tom. You're going to be called a traitor. You ain't black. You don't care about us. Blah, blah, blah, blah, blah, blah, right? What I think is, and I'll go back to this.

This is what we've been saying from the beginning of this episode. People need to do their own research. Go look at what Kamala Harris was doing in California. Tell people what she was doing. I mean, locking black people up for weed charges everywhere, left and right. Go look at Joe Biden's history of what he was doing when he was a start in politics. Can I ask a question about that? Sure.

Specifically, real quick. He was a co-author of the 94 crime bill, which I think we can all agree was a horrible bill. Mm-hmm. The 94 crime bill, which I think we can all agree was a horrible bill. Is it okay over time for people's beliefs to change and to be able to say, yo, I did get that wrong? It's okay to get it wrong. If you can admit and if you can fix it, then yes. Okay. I like that answer. If you can help rectify what you did wrong, then yes, it's okay.

But if you just say, hey, you know what? Yeah, I got that wrong. And you just leave it at that. Words, again, don't mean shit. You need to put into action which say, okay, you did wrong. How are you going to fix it? Fix it. You're somebody that's in the power to be able to at least try and fix it or have something to do with something.

Do something about it. That's what you have to do. It's all about accountability. Okay, the first step was you saying, I fucked that up. That's the first step. How do we build on that now? Because it doesn't just stop with I fucked up. You know?

You got to rectify that as much as you can. So I would say to a lot of people, do your research on it on these candidates because they all got fucked up past. You can very much you sit here and call Joe Biden a racist and a bigot just choice about who they want to vote for. Right. Because I feel like a lot of people that vote. I don't even know how to how to phrase this right. We're in a capitalistic country. Right. Everybody wants to make their money and capitalize on making even more money to get richer, as they say. For a lot of people, the Republican side appeals to that more because they're like, you know what? They think I did what I had to do to get here.

Period. And I want to stay here. I don't want to be having to pay this and that coming out of my checks to pay for people that are sitting on welfare that don't want to work hard. Period. That's interesting. You know what I'm saying? You just introduced two ideas, I think. Maybe I wrong so if i'm wrong correct me but this goes right at the whole like circle of life thing i'm talking about because historically at least when

i was growing up and everything 100 correct and i disagree with that notion i also disagree with the opposite notion that says you know everyone has to like let's use the extreme example socialism right like don't think that's a good idea and i could say and i do say this on this show capitalism has a lot of flaws it's got a lot of things that leave me up at night because it fucks over people it's still a lot better than that alternative and cynically i think there are parts of capitalism that will never be perfected, unfortunately. That is – I don't like saying that, but that's – It's what it is. It's human nature, right?

But that whole circle of life has shifted in a way to where the opposites have now remained opposites and they're starting to come around. Because what I've seen now, and maybe it was just like Trump and now it'll shift back. I don't know. I don't know. don't know but who was trump appealing to more than anyone he was appealing to pissed off people from the lower middle class or upper lower class who had been left behind in this country who were who couldn't stand those goddamn bankers in new york right like he was appealing to more of the common man who then went and was paying the democratic party hand over fist to take him out the powerful people in fucking new york with all

the money right so it's like this still it's so weird that that happened because you're right i think both are wrong yeah but the people i knew who were like lifelong Republicans who held their nose voting for Trump or just didn't vote were people who more appealed to the whole like, you know, I appreciate the fact that there can be just total winners in society. Right. You know, we need to have full. Doggy dog. Right. Right. And so it's just so weird to me because now we have so few principled people with that.

Right. And now we have so few principled people with that. So my grandfather, lifelong Republican, can't understand for the life of him how someone votes Democrat. But he has principles. He was in the army. There are certain things about the countryiden he's like that is whether you like him or not and i am not a fan that is the commander in chief for sure and they are doing the same things to him that they did to trump that i yell that and i appreciate this is a lifelong net i promise you has never voted for a democrat a day in his life i would stake my reputation but like he's he's an outlier there are very few people who say that and yet i point that out as somebody who's you know he's an outlier. There are very few people who say that. And yet I point that out as somebody who's, you know, he's 85 years old. How many times has the Republican Party shifted beliefs that he's gone along with in his life? Probably a lot. And yet there's still some sort of principle there.

The problem is most of the people who are part of this shifting cyclone don't have principles like that. I love that you said that the thing about principles, because it's true. Because above all else, there should be a respect for our commander in chief, no matter who it is, right? I think what a lot of people struggle with is when somebody like Trump, I would say, who would say things that would offend people. Oh, yeah. So people think to themselves, well, how can I respect somebody that says shit like that? If he wasn't the president, I wouldn't respect him. You know what I mean? So, I mean, I think there's a very fine line, but I also am not going to go on Twitter or a platform and say, fuck Trump, I hope he fucking dies like a lot of people do i'm not i would never take it that far but there should always be a respect for the powers that be so

to say you know what i mean i think i think the respect is in rooting for them to do good right and that's all and that's all anybody should want period because we're all living in the same fucking country why shouldn't we all just want it to be the best that it can be? I don't care what you believe in. I don't care what you believe in. How can we make this better for all of us? It's what it should come down to no matter what. People get too caught up in this side and that side,

my belief, your belief, you're wrong, I'm right. No, you're wrong, I'm right. Your opinion doesn't matter, mine does. People get too caught up in the fact of we're all Americans. We're all Americans. I want our country to be the best that it could be, period. I don't give a fuck who's in office. I don't. Republican or Democrat. I want our country to be ran to its best abilities, period. That's all it ever comes down to for me. And that's all it should ever come down to.

The the I couldn't help but think of this example with you going through that. The Biden administration did something a couple weeks ago that was fucking awesome. It was, and I'm going to gloss over some of the fine details on this, but they essentially, they restricted investments starting in August to 59 chinese companies that are directly tied to the communist party slash the the military itself which china is a huge issue for me and i always say this very clearly because we need to because it's concerning to me but i separate that heavily between my issue is with their government it is not with their people who are oppressed by it if there are people who have been brainwashed and fully support that government and actually do then fuck them but there's fucking

two million people in that country and there's a lot of great people who are forced to live under this regime so i do not want to get lost in yo fuck china man i'm saying directly fuck the the chinese communist people's party right the biden's administration restricted in i think it was 59 companies i'll put that link somewhere so people can see that and i was like well fuck yeah that's what i'm fucking talking about people and yet some of the same people i know who are like huge trumpers who can't stand china the government and what they're doing i'm like yeah this is good news and they're giving me all the reasons why it's not and i'm like we can't win you can't we

can't win you can't see that see that's the fucking problem bro nobody wants to hear from the other side period and it's like that's not a good space for us to be in because how the fuck are we ever going to be able to come to agree on anything outside of politics how can we agree on anything if we can't even have a simple conversation about that and see the good in it because we don't want smoke with china man you know what i mean period they got like you said two billion fucking people they outnumber us like a motherfucker and again that's one of those top three militaries on the planet earth we don't want smoke they own everyone too they own everything you know what i mean so we and we just gotta listen bro we talk about like freedom here that you know some of the

restrictions that happened during covid in europe were insanity compared to here what and we could never no this country could never. No fucking discipline. Right? No fucking discipline. And I had an issue with some of the over-the-top shit we did here, no doubt about it. And I don't want to ignore that. Again, it goes right back to I can improve, try to improve something my view is wrong, but also recognize it like, yeah, we had it better.

When I had Nico on here, he talked about what happened in Greece. In Greece, they had to text the government to leave their home. My friend, his cousin Achilles, left his apartment that he lives in with his fiancee to walk their dog and got a 300-euro fine because he didn't text the government. And I bring this up because a lot of people don't know this, but the Greek ports are owned by China. And again, this is not full causation. There is – I'm pointing out suspicious things. I'm not putting full facts behind this and then saying it's the Chinese that implemented that policy. What I do – and said you have to control your people like this.

What I do see is patterns in a lot of these countries and it makes you ask questions because that communist party you know let's give them the credit where it's due i hate doing it but they are technologically innovative and they are 12 moves ahead on the chessboard way ahead of us in all in all aspects i mean we're not even in the same realm as they are. They are light years ahead of us. Light years. And that's where I get a little concerned, though, with the power struggle we were talking about in this country because it's not nearly as bad. But these – we've had our own problems that are now dividing us from within. And I – look, I think everything – everything's a great way to put it dude i think everything goes back to money in life it just it's it's the most important thing there is

because like you and i would probably agree our family's health and our health is like the most important thing to us what funds that government but sad you got to say that but yes because the government controls the money and what funds it the fucking money yep right and and to your point yes now the government's subsidizing a lot of that which is a whole separate issue and i'm not going to pretend to have an answer to health care i've never seen a good i've never seen a good solution but yeah you see that and it's like okay how did how do we get there and then what is why why – why are a lot of the same things with the money like the wealth gap from the 80s? I talk with Moose about this. We really hit a stride on this.

But you've seen it move like this. And for people listening and not watching, my hands are moving directly apart and like a sideward V-shape. It's happened like that consistently since the 80s. Dr. Steven Pinker has written about this extensively. A lot of other people have written about it it's true and so what i see is that quote unquote winner take all bad part of capitalism winning out and it's pissing off the other 99 but who are the people on both parties who are enabling that to continue to happen oh yeah the people in government and what's the one because they're not most of them most of them aren't billionaires and stuff

right they're not you know but they're swimming in it. Nancy Pelosi's got a lot of money. Mitch McConnell's got a lot of money. They all got bread. And it's a power thing. They're more powerful than their net worth actually appeals. So that's their competition, and they stay there. How do they stay there?

How do they keep those same two ideologies in power? They convince – and I'm not the one to come up with this. Smarter people have come up with this, so I'm not going to take credit for it. But they convince the other 99% of us that we hate each other on the most visceral things. Oh yeah, about everything. It's like they take their finger, they put it right in the vein, like race as an issue. So like we look at the problems we have with the police in this country. There are problems there, but they take their finger and they stick it all the way deep into it to make it seem like it's apartheid south africa it is not right you know

so again like i want to look i want to look to improve that but like i also don't want to be like we we're not the most racist country in the world like we need to say that you know i i want to be able to say both things and these people put it to where if you don't say one of those two things like either we have no problem or we have the biggest problem in the world we hate each other there's no in between there's no in between my design is my point yeah yeah for sure that's i never thought about it like that that's a good point i i saw a perfect tweet there's a he's kind of crazy but he's all over the place this guy on twitter hotep jesus he said it the best I had seen it said. I'm sure someone else said it before him too. But he said it like that. I won't do it justice, but it was the 1% have convinced the 99% to divide and hate each other such that they can continue to deflect from the real problem, which is them. And it's like, well, how do you get an ideology to stay in power for 300 years? Two of them.

Well, that's probably how. Yeah, bro. The divide in this country is so... It could be very exhausting. It could be very demeaning sometimes because it's so much all around you. Like I told you, I had an event I had to go to yesterday. I'm driving, and there's a Confederate flag that I see. I'm like, yo.

Like automatically, like now I'm uncomfortable. You know what I mean? You should be. Like now I'm uncomfortable because i i never i never been here before now i'm uncomfortable and it's like i wish we didn't have to walk around seeing and feeling shit like that you know what i mean but like you said the powers that be are going to be the ones that that are continue they're going to continue to drive us because it's going to keep them in power and that's a hundred percent fact what a world i i don't i i said this earlier but to go right at it

i will never understand that i i'm sorry like i i just will not there is no part of me that can understand the decision of someone to be like you know i think i'm going to buy a confederate flag and that was right outside philly which made it even more bizarre oh bro yeah they're dude there's fucking one like around the corner i know where i'm at yeah yeah and it's like and like that is in no way reflective of the people this is a regular south jersey town at all you know but like i think about that and i'm like huh what when did that become a good idea for them like what are they trying to say with that what does that represent maybe maybe it doesn't represent the worst things but from a common fucking sense

scenario exactly what do you think is going to happen when you put that out right you know i so i can't there is no part of me that can say you know there could be an no like i just don't there should be very simple things in this country like it's it's a crime in germany to end this probably great thing to be honest for people to question the holocaust or something like that and people say it's a slippery slope with the first amendment or whatever it never happened which is blows my mind it blows my mind right there's fucking video you can see it but it's like that's probably a good thing and like that i view it pretty similarly here with that and i know it's a slippery slope and some people yell at me who totally disagree with that but they'll say like look if they did it for

that what else could they do it for but like there's certain things like in history that it's like i think we can all agree that that wasn't good you know so to me it's just like when i see that i'm like if that person is not a hateful individual which there's a probably 50 50 chance at least that they are then they're just an asshole right and insensitive like if i see something like that how can i not when you you see that flag, it's a representation of hate and rebellion, right? So when I see that flag, that flag specifically, I'm not talking about like a Blue Lives Matter flag where I think you hate all black people because that's not always the case. I think that's more of a... You know what I mean?

But it's more of a reaction. Yeah, it's not really like it's not the same as a confederate flag where i'm just like you must be a hardcore fucking racist yes i mean i don't know how i cannot feel about that because of what that flag represents and and in the time that it was established and what it was used for you know what i mean so when i see something like that how can i not be like i need to wash my back where i'm at like i need to like like i need to be careful about where i park i'm like this is some shit like i don't want to be feeling like this on the fucking friday night i'm trying to i'm trying to be at this event representing you know i mean i can't now i'm like is the person you never know is the person who are they here at the event that I'm at? You know what I mean?

What are they capable of? Yeah. Like there you just go through all these things like I need to leave before it gets too late because I don't want to be walking around here. You know, I mean, I literally hate where my mind will take me in a situation like that. Like I don't want to be a black kid walking around this neighborhood at nighttime because God forbid that person looks out the window and thinks I'm a fucking thug or something like that. You know what I mean? Like your mind takes you to all these fucking places and it's like, I don't want to be fucking feeling like that. And you don't, by the way, and this is important to say, and I would say the same thing. I don't, I don't think I had to say this in the context of our conversations, just where they went when I had

them on, but with, with miles and moves moose same vibe there isn't a thing that it's like you're on the lookout for it all the time you're like looking you are looking for where can i find to be offended no no there's a level of things where you see it like oh that's fucked up yeah now you have to think about it and that is the important fine line because these are the things that when i say like the people who try to say like there's no problem well no no no no no you you can't say that when you have evidence of things where i you know i'm talking to a black guy who's like yo i i saw this thing this just happened in fucking south jersey somewhere on a regular road and like yeah my my mind does go to those places

yeah it does and it should because you don't know know. It's like, why are people more afraid when they go out at night versus when they go out during the day? Because during the day, there's light. There's an ability to witness things. During the night, there's fucking darkness, right? It's the same psychology with things. It's like, why do you not feel that way when you're next to somebody putting up, don't know the flag of the country where they're from right versus a fucking confederate right and i i remember this is one of those childhood memories etched in my brain i remember we used to get these little pamphlets i don't remember what

the thing was but it was in like fourth fifth grade something like that and it was like some sort of national geographic junior or something we had to read it for social studies and i remember seeing a little article that was the precursor to social media. You'd see a little article in this pamphlet. And it was about this girl who designed by hand a dress to go to her high school prom

in the South that was a Confederate flag. And I remember seeing that and being like, wait, wasn't that like the... Because we learned all about that. Wasn't that like the fucking flag of the people that lost like the people that were enslaving people and then i'm looking at i'm like oh she goes to a school with white and black people i'm like and and i'm seeing her defend it as this is my family's history and

and and that's my thing i'm like and i'm sorry to just totally compare it, but I'm not because I don't view it very differently at all. But you look at it, it's like, do you see people in Germany wearing like the Nazi SS suit? Swastikas and shit. Yeah. Like, is it any different? And look, I don't want to be like people on two sides. We're comparing what's worse let's let it let's totally just call it what it is this history of slavery and the history of the holocaust

for different reasons and different actions that were taken upon it were black eyes no pun intended on history completely so like when i view it at a high level i look at it like why would you ever fucking try to defend yeah not even just defend it why would you ever even try to like start the conversation of revisiting that history so like when i see something like that that flag that's all i can think about slavery. What black people had to go through and what that flag stood for. Right? And like you said, that you talked to Moose and Mills about, like, I don't walk around looking for things to offend me. Right?

I was having a regular ass Friday. I'm driving to where I got to be. I just happen to look over and I see a Confederate flag. Immediately, I'm like, like you know my mind starts going where the fuck am i i gotta make sure i'm out of here by this time before it gets too dark because like i said i don't want somebody that's white to see me walking around as a black man and that's what they see is a black man not not a kid that uh wouldn't hurt a fucking fly you know they see a black kid walking around their neighborhood i get the cops called on me for no fucking reason

now now i'm agitated because i got the cops called on me for no fucking reason. Now I'm agitated because I got the cops called on me. Now I'm giving them fucking attitude even though I'm trying not to. Like, there's a whole chain of events that happen, you know, because of that. So, I mean, when you see things like that, there's... I don't know how there's a way for your

mind not to go to those places, and it really sucks. It does. Because none of us want to be feeling like that, man. Like, I'm from Philadelphia.adelphia that's my fucking hometown i don't want to be walking around my city or the outskirts and have to feel like uh i gotta be watching at my back oh i can't stay too long i gotta leave that's bullshit stupid you know what i mean i'm an american just like you fucking are i don't understand how like there's still an ability to i guess have these types of beliefs and problems when we have full instantaneous access to see at least see a highlight of somewhere else in the world you know like you can i can pick out

a random country that has 10 fucking people in it right now in your brain whatever it is south america asia africa where i've one of the small ones up in the corner of europe okay if i wanted to go see what at least a little snippet of what life is like there youtube google yep i can see it i can see that i can read fucking science on shit i can read information that's been backed right but people still want it's like they're always looking for a boogeyman yeah and somehow the boogeyman always comes back and it's not just a white black thing i'm talking about all everything it somehow comes back to people who have a different origin quote unquote than they do which by the way we all have the

same fucking origin but that's neither here nor there right i'm saying like in more recent history a different origin and a different way of looking at it could be religion, could be race, could be something. And they have to be able to say, oh, my life is fucked up because it's their fault. Right. I don't get it. Right. And it comes up like this is a conversation that happens a lot on the show.

And it happens when I'm talking with a white guy. And it happens when I'm talking with a white guy and it happens when i'm talking with a black guy too you know and it's like to me i guess that's like the healthy part of doing this because we actually do talk about it and say well why the fuck do we see this stuff but there aren't enough people asking those questions because the people who are on the issues are extreme on one side or the other and they either celebrate it or say like ah there's nothing to fucking worry about or they say you know they scream fuck you which in that case obviously i'm more on that side but like i do want to know what gets somebody to the point where they start thinking those things i am very curious about that i want to same way we were talking about the kid with the bomb earlier how does that happen i want to know

so that the kid that comes after him doesn't if if there's something I could do to help it, they don't have that happen. Right. I mean, what do we do about that, man? I mean, so like the thing with the kid with the bomb, right? Would you say that it's the same here? How so? Not with the bombing per se, but let's say people that are racist that have kids that will raise their kids to be – because kids don't know what fucking hate is. 100%.

So you think that happens here as well? Yes. You think that's a big issue? I think it's – I think there's more hope for kids here because there's freedom for them to decide things, go find things for themselves on their phones and stuff. They're much more available to see other things now than we were because there's five-year-olds that have fucking iPhones. Yes. You know what I mean? So I think there are kids who can absolutely beat the odds

and come up in a different way than their parents did. Even if their parents are trying to beat it, I think it makes it a lot harder. Right. But yeah, unfortunately, yeah, I think it's just science. I think there's kids that get lost in that environment. They don't know anything else. They don't.

And then it's – from the time they're five years old on, it's confirmation bias. Yeah. There are still people in this world that try to say that, like, different races have different levels of intellectual ability. We still have people perpetuating that type of stuff. You know, like, are there stereotypes? No, seriously, though. Like, go to Google. Yeah, you're right. still have people perpetuating that type of stuff you know like are there stereotypes no seriously though like go to google yeah you're right you will find dissertations from people describing like well the size of this rub whatever the fuck in the brain and it's like dude there may be

stereotypes that exist of all our different races i can think of 10 right now in my head of my own but it's like when it when it comes to human being versus human being it's it's all the same shit we have the same makeup same we have the same capabilities some people are just a little bit more blessed than others some people just are just born with certain shit like a like your man right there elon musk that's hanging on the wall yeah well exactly he's somebody that said in his joe rogan interview he's so fucking intelligent, right? He's like, just imagine never being able to turn your brain off. Yes. And it's constantly going and going and going.

I'm thinking of this 20 years down the line. That's what makes people say, oh, he lost his fucking mind. No, he didn't lose his mind. His mind just hasn't stopped yet. It's like the same thing with Kanye West, like creatives like that. They're just wired. They're wired differently. You know what I mean? Do you like Kanye? I thing with Kanye West. Creatives like that, they're just wired. They're wired differently. Do you like Kanye?

I'm a Kanye fan. I think he's crazy. But I think he's a genius. He is a genius. That's what I'm saying. He's of that creative mindset where it's like, it seems like his thoughts and ideas are so far ahead of everyone else's and just things that people haven't thought about.

And the way he goes about it makes people kind of uncomfortable. They don't really understand it because they're not wired like him. He can't understand why we are because we're not wired the same way as creatives, like artists and tattoo artists and artists that do like painting and stuff like that. They're just people that are just wired different. Someone like that who's just a genius, a genius engineer of a person that is just like, you can't imagine to put yourself in their shoes. You know, I wouldn't want to be an Elon Musk. I don't want to have it to a point where my brain literally is always just trying to figure shit out. I like the fact that I can go home and lay in bed at night, relax, and put my

mind at ease and go to sleep. That doesn't exist for people like that. You know what I mean? There was another example from Joe Rogan a couple years ago. He's had on Neil deGrasse Tyson a few times. He just had him on recently. I got to listen to maybe like 20 minutes of it, but I haven't really listened to it. But the last time he was on before that, Tyson got a lot of shit because he was interrupting Joe the entire time. But I really, really appreciated that episode because he wasn't trying to. This is what people don't get. He is – you want to talk about one of the smartest people in the world he's another example like that in a different parallel you know he's in he's interested in some other things than elon is but like

joe would say some things that are smart or like good questions or whatever and his mind is you can see it watch the tape it's working so fast he's not trying to cut off joe and be like joe joe joe hold up no no no no it can't be that like he's not trying to do that but in his head he's like oh this man can't see it hold on let me make him see it right and like i i love that i love like it's genius it is you know and i and so when i heard that one i actually even though like some of it's cringy because he's like coming on, like just going right at him. Like, no, no, no, hold up, Joe. Like the entire time.

Then I listen to what he's saying and I'm like, oh, my God, like he's 14 steps ahead. He already had the answers before Joe even finished what he was saying. Some dudes are just miles ahead. That's just God-given ability, man. And it's not even people like that it's like him people like uh like mj or colby or lebron athletes or like ronaldo who just god just gave them an ability that not everyone on the planet had those guys like that one of one one of one you know you'll never see anybody like that so those people like that are always the most fascinating because they're not your everyday people those They're prodigies. You know what I mean?

There's a thing. There's something different. There's a thing. And it is in absolutely every walk of life. There are examples of it. And I think there is an it gene that exists. And I think it's more widespread than just the one of ones. I think the one of ones are on in a different stratosphere. But there is a thing that exists that makes people so focused on a certain goal and a thing that hopefully is for good that that is what consumes them. And like Kobe and MJ are one of the best examples ever for it

in different ways a little bit too. Because like, I mean, if you saw the last dance, you see how MJ is wired wired man oh yeah he does not know how to not body bag you in anything he wants to destroy you dude he can't and that's why he's a gambling addict he can't play not play for five thousand dollars a hole which is trump changed him right he can't not do that because he's like even if like he's so crazy in that way that someone could walk up. I mean I don't know if this has happened, but I would assume it probably has. Someone could walk up and be a scratch golfer.

He's like a 10 or something like that, like a solid golfer but not amazing. And like he'll say, we're playing no strokes. I'm going to beat your ass today because that is his thing. Like he remembers every single time someone slighted him, all this shit. And then you see with Kobe, Kobe know, Kobe wasn't like you. He was the mamba. And he's one of the few people who was able to give himself a name and it clicked and it worked, right? And like he's this thing.

He has this. You don't think like me? Get the fuck off my court. You know, and people, sometimes it took them time it took years later and in some cases sadly it took him dying for them to actually think about it and understand it but it was just because he he was built a little wired different man as as a competitor to me i had nothing but respect for that you know what i'm saying because like if you're like the mj type i want i'm trying to get to that levels i i can never fucking get there but please believe i'm going

to spend all of my time busting my ass they said kobe didn't party kobe didn't go to no fucking clubs kobe was in the gym every fucking day even mj didn't have that mj was a gambler he smoked cigars and shit like that kobe was in the gym every fucking day because Kobe wanted to be the fucking best. If I'm on your team and I see that, how the fuck can I not get in line? You know what I mean? And I think that was one of the hardest parts about leadership for me. When I was a leader for some of the teams that I played on, is that not everybody is going to buy into that.

And people that are wired like that can't understand why. Why? Then what the fuck are you doing out here then? What are you doing? We're here to bust ass. We're here to work hard. Because when it comes time for the game, we want to be ready for every situation.

We want to be able to have nothing faze us, period. We want to be ready for everything. So some guys can't fathom why you're not wired like that. You can never be on their level. Like B.J. Armstrong said in the last sentence, if you don't love basketball, he was a hard guy to be around. You know what I'm saying? For me, I would have loved it.

And I look the same way for like a Bill Belichick, who's stern, who's hard, and who's the patriot way, the structure. You say what you want to say about Bill and Tom, 10 Super Bowls, six rings. You can't argue with shit like that. So whatever he's doing has worked, and he's taken also a lot of guys that needed that. Some guys need a person like a fucking Jordan or someone like a Kobe that's going to get in your ass and hold you accountable. Because that's what it is. And there's also that standard that Jordan had and Kobe had. You come to the fucking Lakers, you're in the purple and gold, motherfucker.

They've been doing this before I even got here. There's a standard. So if you can't buy into the standard, get the fuck out. I fucking love shit like that, bro. The competitor in me fucking loves that shit. I want to throw a curveball at you. Uh-oh. Okay.

I only started thinking of this recently. Okay. But I want to throw this curveball at you because it's a little bit of a mind fuck for me and it stresses me out. Okay. Everything you just said is exactly how I think about it with those guys. They're just built different. It's like they don't understand not being able to win. Kobe and Michael were basketball players.

It's entertainment. You know, it's a legacy. It's a sport. It's like we want to win. It is a money game. The more you win, the more you make for the organization. Now, Michael owns an organization, and he's been not so great as an evaluator on the other side but you know he was the best player to ever play the game and it's like they were so consumed by that that i wonder like we view michael's interesting let me go to kobe

we view kobe as at the end of the day, society before he died had gotten to the point where they're like, you know, he's a really good guy. He's a really, really good guy. And I say put that to the side with Michael because Michael is way more mysterious. It's's harder to know right like kobe was he was a later era there's more see-through whatever not that he didn't have flaws he did but you know it's like people really fucked with him like in in that way so it's like all right he's cool but they were still doing something that wasn't life and death and i i've been thinking about this recently and maybe it had to do with some of the stuff i'm studying but i'm like what if kobe and michael had been in charge of an upstart country would that consumed thing let's say they took the same mentality to it individually right would that same thing drive them to want to win so bad that now as a leader of a country where everything can be life and death bad shit happens yeah it does it is going to happen because i think that guys like

that are expecting you to be at their level there's a standard there's a standard that what they don't understand is nobody can reach those standards besides them, right? Like, you say running a coach, I'll look at it like this. MJ can never be a coach. Never. I agree with you. He can never be a coach because I think Kobe would have a little bit more success being a coach. I don't think Jordan could ever be a fucking coach because how are your players?

First of all, they're being coached by the greatest of all fucking time, right? So just the intensity, his intensity in a level that he would be expecting them to play at, they're not able to attain that. They can't get to that level. So how as a team can you be successful? Because people are trying to, everybody has a role, right? How is everybody going to do their role when they're trying to be something almost they're not which is trying to get to your level it's not going to work out let me let me add another curveball in then okay because i like the example you just gave

let's even make it more crazy and let's say he can never be the coach and he can also never especially never be the coach of a franchise he owns because he can't get fired right in the nba though there are 30 teams you have a draft there's an order to it you better be able to evaluate talent and then you better be able to to develop it when it comes in right and there's a level to which the combination of those things leaves control to the open market in that way of the other entities the other teams which are empowered under the same collective bargaining agreements to do what they have to do to build a team can beat you if you suck at it with the country example though if you're the

coach of a country and you are also the owner because you run it as a dictator you're not fireable no now we have seen examples of where this goes yes we have very bad to where the country's fucked like not getting making money like gaddafi saddam shit like that i was digging my mind right to gaddafi your mind's going right to that now what about the other example too i pointed out earlier that like hitler ended up falling under his own weight because he got too impatient but the rise like if he hadn't gotten impatient built a fucking machine because you know why i see what you're saying because he has a country of borders and there's people who are born in there already they don't get drafted to one of 30 teams he has automatic access to any

and all talent that lives within there i see where you're going michael jordan had access to drafting lebron and drafting wade and drafting chris bosh and carmelo anthony in the same draft even he probably couldn't fuck that up as like a bad coach yeah so i said my curveball is what if they're in a situation where they can't be fired and they get access to all the best we're looking at it from an nba scenario but i'm saying that meant and i do not want people to stretch this and say i'm telling you that kobe and michael would have been hitler or gaddafi or you know what i mean but i'm saying like is it a possibility that the fallacy of human nature could make that type of mentality when put in a different context and a way more higher stakes context get the bad to come out because they're so relentless in the pursuit of being the best i see what you're saying okay you fucked me up yeah you fucked me up yeah

okay so are you saying like there there could be a meteoric rise to power like a hilly situation was with the nazi party because of the resources that they have available like you said if he has the accessibility to lebron d wade kobe if he has the accessibility to LeBron, D. Wade, Kobe, if he has all of them available to him and he can bring them in. In a government scenario. Then of course he's going to be successful. Of course. I'm saying like in a parallel government scenario, not a basketball team.

Just pretend that whatever their talents are in basketball, you could take those talents to military, government, whatever. They would be successful. That's what I'm saying. They would be would be successful would the success be good that's what i struggle with now see that's my question what you have to think about them when i think about that is is anybody else going to start to get power hungry eventually is anyone else going to try and then become the mj is leBron going to want to be the MJ? Because we all know, like I said, they're chasing ghosts.

Kobe's chasing Michael. LeBron's chasing Kobe, chasing Michael. So they're all chasing. So when eventually does it get into your mind? Now, you know what? I have a role in this government. I'm the best at what I do. And I'm bringing out the best in my said field.

I could probably do his job too. So at what point does it become to the point where you stop hearing that MJ voice in your head? And you start thinking, well, I'm saying I'm doing shit just as well too. Now I'm going to throw a change up at you. From a curveball to a change up okay so same scenario michael jordan athlete you have a window at some point you do you lose a step right your your knees give out like he retired at the i'm not counting when he came with the have fun yeah he retired at a perfect time because he knew like i was still the best if i

get started i could feel my knee going wrong like let's get out of here and he was still great when he came back he just wasn't you know michael what about when you're a leader and you know you you can run until you're biden and kind of decrepit right maybe you're 35 years old or 40 years old coming to power you got a long window there and any time and and it's also not a free market if a lebron comes into the scenario unlike the fact that another team could draft him and you got to compete against him no you can put him in your own house and undermine him you can put him in your own house right so michael never lets kobe happen he never lets lebron happen because he gets control of that and that scenario you're right then jordan will be in power for as long as he wants to scary man he'll be in power for as long as he wants to. That's scary, man. He'll be in power for as long as he wants.

I don't mean to make people bet, and I'm not saying he would be. I'm saying we need to open ourselves up to the possibility that that gene, that trait could make you that. He's definitely not giving up the reins to anybody else. He's definitely not giving up the reins to nobody else. Just that innate competitive wanting to be the best. Even at his worst, he might not think that that is as bad as it is. He might not even be able to see it. You know?

Just because of his mental. I'm going to struggle with that one for a while. It's so crazy to think about. Because these guys are just certain people who are wired different. Wired different, wired different and they're put in it they attack a niche that's beautiful for it to be wired different but then if they attack the wrong niche where now people's livelihoods let alone lives are at stake where does that mentality take you it's it's dude we are just so fucking interesting, like humans. Yeah. I am so fascinated by the human brain that, like, because there's, like, what makes people do the things they do?

What makes people tick? What makes me and you who we are? You know what I mean? It's very, very interesting that I would love to be able to sit down with somebody that would have some answers to that and that they could tell me because what makes someone wired the way they are, like an MJ or a Colby or a Gretzky or somebody like that or like a Randy Johnson or a Nolan Ryan or like a Jackie Robinson? Yeah. What is it in their mind that gives them that it factor that you're talking about, right?

That thing that makes them special. We say it's just God-given ability right what is it in their in their mind because something makes them tick something makes them something makes them feel the way that they feel that mean you don't feel right what is it about their brain that gets them to that point i've always wondered about people like that what what makes him as smart as he is you know i mean what is it in him elon talking about elon yeah yeah but but look at the people look at the other people i know too i know like i'm just thinking about that what makes jet like look at what jay-z's done right i started as a rapper see a rapper anymore nah no he's and he still does it still great yeah but

like look at all the other shit what what does that muhammad ali yep don't even get me started that motherfucker was different he wasn't dude i think he was an athlete second he was yeah he was and he's like one of the greatest to ever live yep it's i don't know i don't know when people wired the way there, but I would love to know. I would love to know. It's got to be something in our brain that triggers something. What is it? I mean, they'll never be able to figure out what goes on with our brain because, I mean, you can't really set people's brain when they're alive. And there's not much activity, obviously, when they're dead.

So, I mean, we'll never be able to truly know, but people like that amaze me because they are so talented. So talented. I'm just like, what makes them be that way? I love how you're looking at it from the chemical scenario too, like the inner workings of the brain. It's something in your head. Yeah, yeah, yeah. Because let's think about it. Let's stay with the wall here.

Muhammad Ali, Kurt Cobain. I'm just naming a few of them Kurt Cobain Elon Jay-Z and Marlon Brando all of those people who did all different things too mostly I think there is something that when the average person

understands that they already have attention or whatever or maybe even at the beginning just a more intuitive person sees them before anyone knows who they are where they watch it and they go that's different there's something different but i pointed out those examples because those people are wildly different yeah you do not the first two i named muhammad ali and kirk cobain you look at the two of them in separate rooms let's say it has a divider between them and you get to look like a science experiment between the two there is nothing in common between those two that meets the eye oh yeah but there is a thing that when kurt picks up the fucking guitar and puts a marlboro i think he smoked marlboros or newports one of them in his mouth and then fucking rips

it out and starts playing some chords and then starts doing something. You're like, whoa. You're like, what the fuck is that? And then when this motherfucker. Starts talking. Start. I wasn't even going to get to the talking. Start with the boxing.

You see, that's different. Then you get to the talking and you're like, float like a butterfly, sting like a bee. I'm going to make his ancestors feel. And you're like. Yeah, you're like, what the fuck is that? I went in the room, turned off the room. I was in bed before the light turned off.

Like, you see that and you're like, okay. I've never seen it before. But there are people that, I'll leave for an example, that will talk that way, right? But with an Ali, you feel it. Yes. Like, you feel it. If I said, I'm on a float, I'm on a float. That's what I'm saying. You're like, i said i'm on a float that's what i'm saying like a b you're like get the fuck that's what i'm saying like like um like like a ray lewis right

he'll give you a fucking speech about writing your fucking paper you'll be ready to fucking write the fuck out of that paper you're ready to run through a fucking brick wall some people just something about them they're fucking it's like their aura and their vibe. It will fucking just run through your fucking body. You know what I mean? That's the effect that Mills had on me when we were playing football. When we were young kids, he used to get me fucking jacked up. You know what I mean? But some people just have that kind of effect on you.

You know what I mean? And something is just, I don't know. I can't put my finger on it as to what it is. We call it God-given abilities. It's God-given. But you pointed out the chemical. I'm just saying, what is it as to what it is. We call it God-given abilities. It's God-given. But you pointed out the chemical. I'm just saying, what is it in your mind that gives you that? It's something.

That's my question. Yeah, it's something. Physically. I pointed out how physically they look different, and then the senses that we have take it differently. But is there the same chemical? Is there the same flow that happens in a different outlet? One's creative. One's an athlete. One's a different outlet one's creative one's an athlete one's a businessman one's a fucking actor right like there's differences there but is it the same

tract in the neurons or i'm some people study the brain are gonna yell at me but you know what i mean because when i'm looking at all these people on the wall i'm looking at all these people and thinking he didn't give a fuck she didn't give a at all these people and thinking, he didn't give a fuck. She didn't give a fuck. He didn't give a fuck. She didn't give a fuck. None of them gave a fuck about what nobody else fucking thought. Something in their brain was wired.

You know what? This is who I am. This is what I stand for. This is what I do. At least I'm not going to no motherfucking war. Lock me up, pretty much. Didn't give a fuck about losing years off his business. You know what I'm saying?

Didn't care about- Changed his name? Hold on. hold everything didn't care about losing years when he was in his prime when he was in his prime conor mcgregor i'm not the biggest mcgregor fan either but the way he got he didn't give a fuck about what he said i'm gonna knock you out in the first round period the reason and i say this the reason i have respect for him is he talks a lot of shit and minus khabib because i think the two of them actually legitimately hate each other no that's like that's deep that's deep yeah that shit's dead i always say like that's an asterisk but everyone else in victory and defeat he is everything you want because he is he when he beats someone like when he really embarrassed cowboy serone he yelled at everyone it was like how dare you disrespect that guy that guy got in the me. He has my, he talks so much shit on him.

It's like, he has my respect forever. He fucking hugged his grandma. When he lost to Diaz, he was like, that motherfucker beat me tonight. He's a champion. I'll rise up. I'll fucking beat his ass. But right now it's his. And it's the same with Ali.

Yeah. And those guys, them two specifically. That's why I have them next to each other. That's what they got in common. I know going into a fight fight that's got to kind of fuck with you a little bit oh yeah like this motherfucker don't give a fuck ali don't give a fuck you know ali ali is coming here talking all this shit and he believes everything he's saying to me i'm gonna knock you out in the first round you don't you don't stand a chance

so his confidence and his swagger is already there when we get into the ring so not only do i have to beat ali the boxer but i got to compete with the swag and the attitude and the just and you add on top of that the skills tough greatest of all time you know what i mean i just i'd be real i i just love what you brought up though because i i'm gonna look into that because i i never have looked deeply at that like is there a commonality in there that at least drives gets you on the same road right do they start driving down the same road and take different exits right right right like within the brain it's interesting because all these people here are wired somewhat the same because like i said even rihanna she doesn't give a either you know what i mean savage dude and it's i'm the biggest rihanna me too you know savage you

know what i mean it's it's like and they still all have flaws and everything, but even like at certain things, like Steve Jobs, for example, who I love and was incredible in all these things. Sometimes in the gym, I will listen to those tracks on YouTube that have like the speaker with like the music in the background. I'll go through little phases with that. I'm not going to lie though. I'm a fucking huge fan of steve jobs study him inside

now i think he was incredible when he comes on and he's giving me the dot speech where he talks about how the dots connect i love that when i'm listening to it outside of the gym i'm less of a fan of it when i listen to it in the gym whereas when ray lewis comes into my ears and goes i heard a whisper i'm like yeah my whole mind goes oh my god yeah yeah for sure like that's his like i'm about to kill somebody right you know what i mean ray's not telling me how to use my five fingers as the greatest clickers ever on on my phone but like he is telling me like you hear that whisper yeah you know whereas steve it's a man's game yeah that's the beauty of humanity that shit gets me jacked up and gone bro oh my god it's a man's game yeah there's just like and that's the beauty of humanity that shit gets me jacked up

and gone bro oh my god it's a man's game that's the fuck it is you know what i mean it's incredible yeah it is incredible shan i have been bad the last not in a row but some of these episodes i get so deep talking to somebody that i actually never look up at the clock and i don't stop it i had one go for like five hours the other day yeah then we're gonna i'm gonna just cut it off and leave people hanging at like three because i was i looked down i'm like geo fuck man it's like 3 a.m we started at like 10 but you know i'm looking now and we're like right at i think we're right at about three hours i'd stay talking to you all fucking day yeah this was dude, I've now had all three of you on the show. I knew this from watching the show, So Faces of the Future.

I knew you guys are all different. But when I get you in here, it is such a different vibe every time. I've had Miles, I've had Moose, and now I've had you. And in very different ways, I could stay talking to you guys all fucking night. So thank you for doing this. Yeah, man. You were amazing. Hey, man.

Thank you for having me. Hey you were you were amazing man thank you for having me it was hey bro i'm in the fucking bunker man this shit is dope bruh yeah dude i i love because like when i when miles first came on that was like the thing you texted me you're like the fucking bunkers yeah man the bunker i love that i love the name of it and everything man it's a great vibe in here i'm like this guy hasn't even been here yet and he's saying that so i i love that but i want to have you in here again obviously as i said to the two of them come on our show now oh dude you tell me why yeah i'm in so faces of the future people can get on apple and spotify and you guys are also doing youtube now too yeah we're everywhere all platforms check us out man all right i will put that link in the description as my own little

sale of that show as well i did not know any of you guys before miles and i had somebody in common and he and i started talking and then i had him on here and then had moose and had you but when i went to listen that show the thing that really attracted me to it is miles has like the podcast platform here with you guys on top of his business so it's like it's a pure side hustle kind of deal but you guys have true conversations about shit i cannot predict what the opinions are going to be so i'm like a snob with podcasts i need podcasts that are open and you're kind of like oh wow they said that but i'm not just saying this is raw man dude i backed it up i've had three of these guys all on the show i'm gonna have them on again people if you're looking for good solid

conversations you guys do like 60 90 minute episodes yeah they're. We've got to get you in a fucking studio. Yeah, we do. We have to do that. But the conversations are fucking great. So you've had a chance to hear Miles, number 42, Moose, 47. I think this is going to be 53 or 54. So you can get a vibe for where these guys are all coming from. But this conversation today.

It was awesome, bro. I had a great time. Dude. I had a great time. It built all off that first theme. Yeah, it did. It started Israel-Palestine, but we tied it all into that without saying those words, too, which was so fucking cool. So thank you for doing it.

Thank you for having me, man. Hey, live from the bunker, baby. Live from the bunker. Everybody else, you know what it is. Give it a thought. Get back to me. Peace. so you