Julian Dorey Podcast - [VIDEO] - The Great Pyramid's TRUE Purpose, WW2 Secret Antarctica Base, & Soviet UFO's | Patrick James • 205

Episode Date: May 11, 2024

(***TIMESTAMPS in description below) ~ Patrick James is a documentary filmmaker that runs a conspiracy theorist YouTube Channel. His Channel, "MINDFKD w/ Patrick James" covers all topics from UFO's, the Great Pyramids of Giza, to Martin Luther & JFK Assassinations. - BUY Guest’s Books & Films IN MY AMAZON STORE: https://amzn.to/3RPu952 EPISODE LINKS: - Julian Dorey PODCAST MERCH: https://juliandorey.myshopify.com/ - Support our Show on PATREON: https://www.patreon.com/JulianDorey - Join our DISCORD: https://discord.gg/Ajqn5sN6 PATRICK JAMES LINKS: - YOUTUBE: https://www.youtube.com/@MindFKDwithPJ/videos - INSTAGRAM: https://www.instagram.com/therealpatrickj JULIAN YT CHANNELS: - SUBSCRIBE to Julian Dorey Clips YT: https://www.youtube.com/@juliandoreyclips - SUBSCRIBE to Julian Dorey Daily YT: https://www.youtube.com/@JulianDoreyDaily - SUBSCRIBE to Best of JDP: https://www.youtube.com/@bestofJDP ***TIMESTAMPS*** 00:00 - WW2 Conspiracy, Operation Hijump, Rosewell UFO Crash, Antarctica Nazi Base 12:30 - German Black Forrest UFO Crash, Werner Von Braun, Maria Olsic Occult, Kecksburg UFO Sighting 19:42 - Rosewell UFO Crash, CIA Formation, Majestic 12, Alleged Su1c1de James Forrestal, Truman & JFK Connection Antarctica 30:38 - CIA Intelligence MK- Ultra Murder Coverups 39:55 - Lu Reviews (Skeptics vs True Believers), UFO Cults, MH-370 UFO Debunking 55:07 - Tribal Groups, James Fox Skepticism, Gary McKinnon (Hacker UFO) 01:10:08 - Operation Paper Clip, Annie Jacobsen, Hitler Escaped to South America, Tim Kennedy 01:23:45 - Rise of Post-WW2 Germany, H1tler’s Origin Story, Tony Robbins, The Phenomenom Craze 01:34:36 - UFOs Over D.C., Robert Salas, UAP Task Force, Robert Hastings UFO & Nukes 01:45:41 - David Grusch & Jeese Michels 01:53:38 - Great Pyramid of Giza, Time Machine Theory, Inside (Red Paint), Debunking Mainstream, Graham Hancock Accusations 02:07:07 - Zahi Hawass Caught For Stealing, Queens Chamber, Mystery of Gratenbrinks Door, Keystone Cut Dillemma 02:22:13 - Brian Forester, Puma Punku, Coverup, Ancient Aliens 02:29:40 - Bart Sibrel, Buzz Aldrin Moon Potatoe Shaped Moon - Monolith Phobos, Russia’s Failed Attempts of Phobos 1 & 2 02:40:05 - Michio Kaku, Interdimensional Beings, Multiverses, Mufon, Sex w/ Aliens 02:48:03 - Getting Stones to Pyramid, UFOs Manmade, Lonnie Zamora Incident 03:00:51 - Find Patrick James CREDITS: - Hosted by Julian D. Dorey - Intro, Edited, Produced Edited by Alessi Allaman: https://www.instagram.com/alessiallaman/ Julian Dorey Podcast Episode 205 -  @MindFKDwithPJ  Music by Artlist.io Learn more about your ad choices. Visit podcastchoices.com/adchoices

One of the other big incidents happened at Big Sur. And this footage, to my knowledge, has never been seen, but there's been a lot of recreations of this footage. And Big Sur, they were testing these ICBMs that they would launch out of the water. And this guy's job was to have this high-powered telescopic camera pointed at these ICBMs that they're firing into space as test launches. And they kind of just crash land into the water, right?

But they want to see like that the rockets and everything are working properly. They're looking at all the stages of its launch into space or whatever. And as this thing is launching on one particular day, he's filming from several miles away at vantage point with this camera. Well, essentially this is what happens.

He doesn't see this, but he's brought in the next day by his superiors and being like, hey, here's the footage you took. Let's show you it. They turn on the and roll. And while they're in this room showing this to these two guys, there's two men in black men in black suits that are not military guys. Right.

And so he's got his superior. This guy is brought in and going, hey, I want you to see the footage that we took. So they play the film reel in this dark room. Just imagine yourself sitting there in the 1960s, bro. He said, sure enough, you saw this nuke launching into space. Perfect shot of it because his job is just to get a great shot of it, right?

And so then you see this flying saucer-shaped craft zip in and this thing is going at like 5,000 miles an hour or something ridiculous, right? It zips in, beams a laser beam at it and it's following it in space and then it zips around it and the beam at it and it's following it in space and then it zips around it and the nuclear bomb what's up guys if you're on spotify right now please follow the show so that you don't miss any future episodes and leave a five-star review thank you welcome to jersey pat

thank you for having me of course man you enjoying your stay out in jersey city the best way i can describe it i saw this term waking up this morning, the uncanny valley. Ever since I've landed, I've just had this, every interaction is very interesting and unique. It's just very uncanny here. Is that like a backhanded shot at Jersey? Be careful. Last night I was calling it trippy, but I think uncanny is just – there's just something different. Like the example yesterday at the hotel, the guy who was just this nice Middle Eastern kid was wearing a bracelet that had – Oh, the Buddha symbol.

Yeah, that's an unfortunate mix-up. I guess he hasn't been here long. Someone's got to tell him. Yeah. That was the one I was talking to on the phone at the front desk, right? Yeah. Fixed the hotel thing? Yeah.

Sounded like the nicest dude. Sounded like the nicest dude. He seemed like the nicest dude. What was crazy is he was very talkative when I was talking to him, but as soon as you get on the phone with him, I'm like, yo, he must be getting charmed right now by Julian because he's just saying one or two words, and I think Julian's getting his way. I don't think charmed is the word.

Okay. It's a little different than that. We've had a few run-ins with that front desk. So hopefully they figured their shit out. I feel like he remembered you from last time maybe. Probably. Yeah. Because they send me like the same form that has the problem every time.

And then of course this time he actually sent me one that worked. So we're good. But anyway, you have a really cool YouTube channel. Thank you. I love your edits. It's obviously like growing, but I think it should grow a lot more. one that worked so we're good but anyway you have a really cool youtube channel thank you i love your edits i it's obviously like growing but i think it should grow a lot more you're into all the fun stuff so it's gonna be a very fun podcast but one of my biggest interests ever i don't know that it will ever get old for me is looking into world war ii and the repercussions of what happened there and you've done at least one

that i watched the full thing up but maybe more videos on some of the quote-unquote net conspiracies going on yeah so let's start off with operation high jump okay can you explain this and also give us a scale of how true this could potentially be? Yeah. All right. So I haven't been into the UFO phenomenon for like 10 to 15 years like a lot of people. I would consider myself relatively new to this. I think I started taking it seriously maybe around 2020, right around when Bob Lazar was on Joe Rogan, right? But since then, I've gone deep down this rabbit hole. I think I was telling you this last night.

The Antarctica thing is something I found when I was like in weird corners of the internet looking into this kind of stuff, right? And it was one to me that if I had to rank believability about any of this stuff, for me, it kind of starts with Roswell at the top of the funnel. Most people have kind of heard something about it. But I think the deeper down this iceberg or funnel you want to call it, the deeper down you go, I think arguably becomes less and less believable because you have to make a lot of leaps of faith you know to get to that yeah but and i would consider this pretty deep down there however even this morning when i was kind of refreshing myself on some of the details there are so many connections about antarctica and the nazi connect it won't take long to tell you Neutral's ingredients. Vodka, soda, natural flavors.

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that over-deliver. Connecting to so many different aspects of different stories around the time period not just with like what we all know about world war ii but also kind of the conspiracies around jfk and the assassination of uh or the death mysterious death of uh forestall the first ever secretary of defense for the united states can you you explain that one? I mean, it all connects back to Antarctica. Okay. All right. Well, where should we start? Where do you think? We might as well just start with Roswell, you know? All right. You have my attention. So essentially with my channel real quick, I want to address this because you mentioned my channel and I do have quite a few videos on this because when I started to see this through line, I was like, why don't I just as a content strategy, like start in the forties and kind of just work my way up the timeline, you know? And that was kind of my

strategy with like videos I was putting out. Right. Um, but got to keep in mind the, the, the big picture here, which I think is just really imagining it on a timeline. The nuclear bomb gets invented, right? And then World War II ends due to the detonation of that, basically. The Nazis essentially started kind of panicking, right? And the story is that they had a recovered, man, I feel like I'm so, like this might as well be a movie. I could talk about so many aspects

before I even get to Antarctica, but you would see how it leads to Antarctica. Like how deep do you want me to go on this? Deep, baby. Let's go. All right. That's what she said. So, all right. So what she said so all right so

essentially after world war ii the allies go in and they find all these blueprints for what they call the wonder weapons the nazi wonder weapons right they call them the i'm really bad at german but it's like wounda wafa or something is it what they say yeah exactly and one of these blueprints uh some of them had to do with stuff called uh die glock which translates to the bell they've never found it but there's an interesting through line with maybe that could potentially be the acorn shaped ufo that landed in uh in like pennsylvania i think it was um that's a whole other story. But one of them called Honobu craft

were traditional looking flying saucers. And these were craft that the Nazis were apparently working on and theoretically had working models of. And so it all revolved around, they think the dieglock was the propulsion system for the craft itself. And it would kind of just sit in the center because dieglock was like this bell-shaped object that apparently had anti-gravity properties. And they theoretically would

send electric currents into this thing. And it had spinning what they called red mercury which was like some combination of liquid metals and apparently when you put some type of charge in it it started levitating and people also thought that it could warp gravity fields enough to where it maybe could potentially time travel which is why it has that interesting connection i'm forgetting the name of the town but it's like an acorn-shaped UFO in the northeastern United States. So anyways, the theory says that the Nazis fled to Antarctica and South America after World War II, including Hitler, and people have seen, like, there's apparently a lot of Nazis in South America. Oh, yeah.

We'll talk about that. Do we have an idea in this theory of who was determined to go where and why? Like why, for example, Eichmann went to South America and allegedly maybe Hitler went to Antarctica? Yeah. Well, I know that they were working on Antarctic base. I think they called it – fuck. It was New Schwabenctic base. I think they called it, fuck, it was New Schwabenland.

I think it's what they called it. Yeah. And it's basically their base that they had in Antarctica, right? And we know that they definitely had expeditions down to Antarctica. So really, and we're deep in the rabbit hole at this point

as far as like, I don't even know how much of this I believe as far as like the leaps of logic of what they did with potential technology that we think they might have had based on blueprints that we found. Right? Yeah. So but theoretically, we know that they went to Antarctica. There's a guy named Tim Kennedy who had a show about finding Hitler. Yes. And he was talking about like the connection to Antarctica or to South America right but we also know that they think that some of them went

to Antarctica and so they also quick question I'm sorry to cut you off isn't there a record of them visiting it before Antarctica before World War two do we have a real record of that or is that also unconfirmed yeah I'm not a I'm not keep in mind I'm not a historian on this stuff. So what I've done is researched as much as I could for the content that I create and kind of trying to make sure that I understand the story as much as possible. So I'm not sure of the exact timeline of when they went down there, but I that i mean you could google pictures and find pictures of them um like holding flags in antarctica so they were definitely down there and i'm going to assume that that happened before they basically became like pariahs on planet earth you know so um we know that they were down there and so apparently they went down there after World War II with these wonder weapons,

the Honobu craft. And they think that, you know, I guess one of the questions that would come up, I know it came up for me, which is if they had these weapons, then why didn't they win World War II, right? And the theory basically says that they were trying to i mean it's not as simple as putting like a machine gun on the bottom of a flying saucer and just like calling it a day like because theoretically if you believe like bob lazar and kind of how these anti-gravity craft work it forms like a gravity bubble around the craft so if you start shooting bullets off of this craft you might just end up shooting yourself because the bullets are going to stay inside that force field theoretically it's just kind of what i'm thinking but but if you had that kind of capability is it not a leap of faith to say that you would have had other

weaponry capabilities that perhaps were also well ahead of the western and also eastern world yeah i mean the yeah i, we're all kind of guesstimating here, right? These are all kind of just theories until we find one of these craft and talk to a German and say, hey, what exactly went down? That's just kind of the one of the leaps of logic that you have to make to believe the Antarctica theory, right? Is that they just couldn't weaponize these things in time to win the war but we do know that hitler in his speeches was talking a lot about like we have these amazing weapons we're going to take over the world with this kind of stuff so he yeah

exactly um and so basically where this kind of ties into the UFO conspiracy and whatnot, well, the UFO conspiracy, they think they got a lot of this technology from a downed craft, like their version of Roswell in the Black Forest in 1936. Can you explain that event? I don't know much about the event. I just know that a craft went down in the Black Forest in 1936 which is in germany i believe and yeah they think that um a guy like herman oberth and a lot of these you know because a lot of the top rocket scientists came out of germany and we got we got one of them braun from like paperclip oh yeah and

herman oberth um he's a german scientist They call him like the father of the modern day rocket. And he was quoted saying like, we had help from people of other worlds. Like we couldn't have done this on our own. And so- That's not a figurative statement at all. Right. Okay. And so, and he's the father of modern day rocketry.

So essentially, they probably had reverse engineered some of this stuff there's also this story about and this belief like again one of those things that a lot of people would probably call bull on but there's this girl named uh maria orsic who was like this head the head of some uh occult uh group in germ. Have you heard of her? I haven't heard of her, but I've heard of the occult experimentation with Germany a lot. So if you look her up,

she's like this sexy woman, right? Let's just call a spade a spade here, right? Just Google image Maria Orsic, bro. God, I'm so mad she liked Hitler. Well, they say that the nazi party formed out of this group and another group merging um and this is all going down in like 1938 1939 like a couple years after she's a baby yeah i'm telling you bro so their group was a an occult group of blonde chicks that look like her. It's just a group of chicks with long blonde hair.

I think it's called the Vril Society maybe. Do you see it on there? Just Maria Orsic. Google Maria Orsic and you can even – That name does sound a bit familiar now. How do you spell it last night? O-R-S-I-C. Yeah, Maria Orsic and like you could even. That name does sound a bit familiar now. How do you spell it last night? O-R-S-I-C. Yeah. Maria Orsic.

Oh, there we go. But I've never seen her before. I've never seen that picture. I'd remember that. She's all over the place here. Huh. Alright, so this group of people they had long hair and she they basically believed that they had psychic powers, right? This chick, this group of chicks.

And they believed that their powers came from their hair, kind of like Samson from the Bible. You know, like you cut off his hair, he loses all of his strength. So they had intentionally grown out their hair to be really fucking long, like down to their knees basically, right? Oh, that's no good. Split ends like crazy. Probably, but I mean she was a babe. Yeah, she was. I'll give her that. So theoretically, they were remote viewing and communicating with advanced beings that claimed to be from the Aldebaran star system.

The Aldebaran or the Aldebaran, however you want to say it. And it's a star system of, I forget the exact details that they say about the star system, but that's what it was called. And essentially they gave her blueprints to these Hanaboo craft. That's how they got the blueprints. The unofficial story was through her remote viewing sessions where she would do psychic writing with her eyes closed and out would pop out these complex blueprints about these wonderful weapons like Dyglock and Hanaboo Craft, right? So again- By the way, Alessia, can you pull up that? I just want to make sure we hit this because you had asked for this. Can we up the the ufo incident from 1936 that's right the one is this the one yeah and the black no no no the

one in the black forest do we still have that black yeah there it is remember this one you were talking about a few minutes ago i just want to make sure we have the context in 1936 a flying saucer allegedly crashes in the black forest opening the door for advanced german technology in aeronautics and space reverse engineering the ship and its occupants were spirited away to the dark heart of nazi germany where all was dismantled and diligently studied a resulting program was called hanebu which is linked to the nazis uh which is linked to the nazis to ufo underground bases in antarctica oddly i discovered crash stored ufos in a grid travel experience with friends long before i knew about any of this today people incorporate the themes in okay this is just the author talking yeah okay and then the

next one for context was the kex bird one you were talking about like this is the acorn one that's the one that i believe uh and i'm sure people have also talked about this it's not like i created this theory but it's one that i don't think gets talked about enough but it looks eerily similar to die glock if you look up pictures of what die glock looks like the thing about die glock is it was they've never found one you know i don't even think they found a hannaboo craft because theoretically those all went to antarctica but uh and we can kind of get to that when we start talking about operation high jump but this one was interesting to me because it appeared in this in 65 right so a couple years later apparently you could put a couple of people inside of

dieglock and it had this this red spinning mercury i mean i'm sure they had a lot of radioactive poisoning or whatever like i can only imagine red mercury right but um the the theory is that it maybe had the ability to travel through time like time space is a continuum right and so if you can watch that one in there gravity enough it could theoretically maybe move forward and backward in time and you know what you were talking to lawrence krauss about this the whole theory of time dilation time dilation is directly correlated to gravity so um that's kind of where that theory comes from so interesting more of the story is the kecksburg ufo incident ended with the ufo government crash retrieval program coming in in the still of the story is the Kecksburg UFO incident ended with the UFO government crash retrieval program coming in in the still of the night a couple hours after this thing crash lands in this forest or the Kecksburg small town.

Many people saw this thing, but they also saw the government come in and swiftly carry this acorn-shaped thing away. And so now they have that little statue in the town and this is in 1965 which again and i always say this as well as someone who definitely thinks we're not alone in the universe i think that's just statistically like not even possible but you know i still case by case like to look at stuff and say well what else could it be you know this is at the height of when those scientists were running our programs and stuff yeah so they are they've shared their technology with us it could be something we had engineered you know i don't i wish i knew but i don't know

exactly how far ahead like darpa for example is on technology from where we are in society but i know it's far ahead from the people I talk to. So what does that mean? How far ahead could they have been back then? You know? Yeah. It gets, it gets weird, but guys, if you're still watching this video and you haven't yet hit that subscribe button, please take two seconds and go hit it right now. Thank you. We're, we're dancing around the operation high jump. We are. Let's get there. Well, that's why I said, like, when you look into the Antarctica, along the way, just getting to it,

you find out all these random other stories that are somewhat connected or tangential to the story, right? And that's where I really got fascinated with it, too. So anyways, Roswell happens in 1947, three years, two years after World War II ends, July. Within three months, three crucial things happen. The CIA gets formed. The NSA gets formed.

Not the NSA. The CIA and Majestic 12, and they also make Forrestal, one of the connections that we're going to come to. Right. Forrestal becomes the first ever Secretary of Defense for the United States. So we got the CIA forming, him becoming Secretary of Defense, and Majestic 12, which is this top secret group that many people debate was even real. But – and we can talk about the MJ-12 documents, but essentially, the MJ-12 documents basically revealed that it was formed, I think, in September of that year. So a few months after Roswell, around the same time, I think two weeks after the CIA was formed.

And so a lot of this, you got to think, you know, the timing of it is very suspicious in considering roswell just happened a few months prior and world war ii ends so we've got this scramble for all these nazi scientists and whatnot um so anyways i think the following year uh forestall starts working with admiral richard bird to come together and create Operation High Jump, which is this operation where they're going to go down to Antarctica. And the official narrative for the mission was to basically research and see if there were any routes for Russia to invade the US through the South Pole. That was the official reasoning for going down there. That would really put all the flat earthers to bed the U.S. through the South Pole. That was the official reasoning for going down there. That would really put all the flat earthers to bed. Right.

And even Admiral Byrd had said multiple times that before they went, he referred to Operation High Jump as being like military in nature, like this is a military operation, why we're going down there, right? But it was like this big deal. But what really confused a lot of people is the amount of forces we're going down there right um but it was like this big deal but what really confused a lot of people is the amount of forces that they sent down there um i don't remember the exact numbers but it was something like multiple like three to five aircraft carriers with like 60 something planes and like it's way more men than they needed for this right and i

think they came back with only like 68 people or like something like crazy. Like they were completely depleted. A lot of their, like a couple of aircraft carriers were sunk. They lost a lot of planes. So essentially in the course of two months, which this mission was supposed to be a lot longer,

they come back with their tail between their legs two months later, completely depleted. And everybody's like, yo, what the hell happened to you, right? And this is where it kind of gets wild. You know, Admiral Richard Byrd had made a stop in South America on their way back from Antarctica. And he had told reporters in South America, I think it was in chile and they quoted him on like the front page of their newspapers it was like we have encountered craft that can fly from pole to pole with incredible speed which was basically we have encountered yeah right and so they came back and the whole narrative of kind of what happened to them was they apparently had gotten to South America – or not South America, to the South Pole, so Antarctica.

And they had these ships that looked like flying saucers that would come out of the water and they would start attacking them with laser beam weapons. A freaking laser beam? Yeah. Laser beams, bro. And there was apparently this huge battle down there, and they had to retreat back to the US. And they lost a bunch of people. Right. And so, again, do I believe that that's what happened? I don't know what happened.

Yeah. Right? I'm just telling you what the theory is. Based on reports. Based off of, we know these tangential things, Operation Paperclip. We know Operation High Jump really happened. We know they came back with their tail between their legs. We know they sent a lot of military forces and a lot of those were lost along the way. We know that he did talk to the reporter in South America and that was printed in their newspapers. And we know that shortly after this, going back to MJ-12, this secret group of 12 high government officials that were tasked with maintaining the UFO cover-up,

for Saul's name, first ever Secretary of Defense for the United States, who was previously Secretary of the Navy during World War II. He was one of the names listed on there, you know, along with people like Vannevar Bush, who was part of the Manhattan Project and a few others. Well, anyways, after this, Richard Byrd and Forrestal have a very close relationship. And essentially, Forrestal kind of had this similar vibe you guys have mentioned multiple people since last night like oh this person's really weirded out like they think the cia is out to get them they think people are watching them well forestall became one of those people after this operation high jump and so essentially the president at the time um basically was like you have to go uh to this mental hospital because we don't think you're like sane you know uh who

was it it was um forgetting the name of the president at the Truman it was yeah it was Truman right Truman and so Truman basically put him in Bethesda Medical Hospital against his will in the psych ward. And this whole time he was in there and he was talking to these nurses about these ramblings of Nazis in Antarctica. And during that time, he wanted to get out the whole time. He didn't want to be there. He didn't think he was crazy. And he wanted his brother to come and talk to him. But Truman had only approved certain people on his own private list of visitors, of who could actually come. And so a couple interesting connections here. Forstall was a mentor to JFK.

They have pictures of them both going to south america can we pull that up yeah um young jfk and young jfk and forestall antarctica right is this gonna be a mid journey no okay this has been out there for a while um all right let's see what we got here you just perked up this is right after world war This is right after World War II, Forrestal and JFK. Which one is Forrestal in the white? Is that him? Go to all the images. Oh, no, that's his father.

No, that's not. That's Joe Kennedy. Go to all the images. James Forrestal. That picture right there with the men walking, right? Third from the... Third one. Yep.

So that's Forrestal in the center. And then there's JFK in the back. And where do we know where that one is um that might have been in germany that's jfk yeah oh wait a second that's that's in germany after the war right yeah so they were in they were talking of finding like blueprints to top secret weapons they were in germany looking for just whatever they could find it like after the nazis lost the war essentially yeah we're gonna talk about that um keep going so so here's a couple of the visitors the the handful of visitors that had actually been approved to visit forestall

in his time at bethesda medical hospital you got lyndon. Johnson. It's a bad start. You got JFK. Okay. You got Truman and maybe a handful of others, but that's really it. And I think none of his family, he could not see his family. One of them was Father Sheehy, I believe, who was kind of brought in as like a religious person I basically what they were saying was Forrestal theoretically maybe would when he realized he couldn't talk to people that he wanted to talk to like his friends and family he wanted to talk to a religious figure so he could confess and in, you can openly talk about whatever, right? Because it's theoretically private. Allegedly. Right. And so that's why he had Father Sheehy, I believe. And he probably, I don't know what he talked about with him,

but I know Father Sheehy was one of those people. We'll come back to him. Essentially, he was like making such a big fuss. I want my brother to come and pick me up I want to at least talk to my brother Henry forestall so there's like a few weeks after he's there so the night Henry forestall essentially gets the approval to come and take his brother home right the night before his brother's scheduled to arrive james forestall falls out of the 16th floor window to his death come on come on yeah he couldn't fly couldn't fly um yeah so his brother arrives in this crime scene or this alleged suicide scene here's what's really fishy about the official narrative, which was quickly put up by, you know.

Of course. That he committed suicide and jumped out. But in the moments before he allegedly jumped out of this window from the 16th floor, he was writing in his journal. He was copying down a poem. I forget the exact poem, but... He didn't finish it. He stopped mid-word, mid-sentence

to jump out of this window. Ooh. Right? Apparently, there were also... There was a bed sheet tied to a radiator that he was trying to allegedly hang himself from. Very Epstein of him. But there were a lot of scuff marks on the

window that he fell out of what alessi what was the the documentary on netflix the docu-series wormwood i think it's called that did you ever see that no can we pull that up i forget that guy's name i just want to pull this up right now he i believe it was in 1953 that's what this case is about it's 53 or 63 i feel like it was 53 yeah yeah yeah like like wormwood okay you see it netflix yeah yeah so go to the wikipedia wormwood miniseries perfect yeah hit that and then yeah wormwood told through Eric Olson, the son of Frank Olson. That's it. Click Frank Olson. No, no, no.

Yeah, yeah. Yeah, perfect. Sorry. Yes, 1953, November 1953. This was another guy who worked in intelligence and couldn't fly. It was in New York City. It was right over here. Let's see.

What is the – go down, Alessi. He was a part of their MKUltra program, essentially. And he was, I believe he was a scientist on it. Go down to death. Drugging of Olsen. All right. Around 2 a.m. on the morning of Sunday, November 28, 1953, Olsen plummeted onto the sidewalk in front of the Statler Hilton Hotel,

formerly the Hotel Pennsylvania in New York City. The night manager rushed to Olsen, who was still alive and who tried to mumble something. Poor guy was still alive, damn. Olsen died before medical help arrived. Years later, the night manager recalled, in all my years in the hotel business, I never encountered a case where someone got up

in the middle of the night, ran across a dark room in his underwear, avoiding two beds, and dove through a closed window with the shade and curtains drawn now there was like an lsd end to this i forget i haven't watched that documentary in a while i forget if like they had drugged him or something but this point being this is a real common tactic you see with different governments right and even with crime organizations i know the mob used to say oh he couldn't fly you know they throw people out a window but you see stuff like this where they don't even make it look good you know the guy's writing a poem mid-sentence he just runs out now it's more helpful when he's in

a psych ward because they can play that card like wow he's in a psych ward because they can play that card like wow he's in a psych ward what do you want yeah but they also put him there yeah um something interesting about that psych ward i'd posted my video about this on tiktok where it originally started to go viral um somewhat viral like most of my tiktok videos like really pop, I guess. And this was one of my earlier videos, right? Someone commented on that video who claimed to be a current nurse at Bethesda Medical Hospital. And she was like, oh my God, I didn't know about this story. I didn't know James Forrestal, first ever secretary of defense died by falling out of the 16th floor window. But she goes, goes interesting thing you showed the

newspaper article from that time and i'm telling you as someone who works there there's no reason for him to ever be on the 16th floor let alone where that window is but it's all all right i gotta poke a hole in that this is what year did he die 1948 or something yeah something like that yeah i mean a lot of these it's been a lot of shit since then, you know? Potentially. I mean, I grew up in Leavenworth, Kansas. So they have Fort Leavenworth there. Oh, you got the prison there.

And they got the federal penitentiary there. And the thing I can say about military bases, especially military hospitals, some of these buildings look probably exactly like they did a hundred years ago right i'm saying or they could have been using one room for something different true hypothetically right yeah okay all right but that's still sketchy that whole thing's very sketchy so this guy to review allegedly was on that trip for operation high jump to the antarctica so foresaw wasn't but he was like working he was the direct line of't but he was like working he was the direct line of communication like he was the secretary of defense and this is a military operation so bird was the one who went down there right yeah bird was on it and this guy was the

first secretary of defense yeah and dies and also names of the mj-12 documents who would so he he theoretically knew everything there was to know about UFOs at the time. Right. He would be read into things like Roswell. If something like a battle's the argument by some that that wasn't that was german that wasn't a an alien ufo that was german technology right where do you fall on that to be honest when i heard that i think the first person i heard talk about that was uh tom de long tom de long right on on rogan and that blew my mind because i had heard every other theory under the sun about what roswell was but i'd never heard that one and so that's what really caused me to

start looking into it and that's what led me to antarctica which again this is why i'm saying like i don't necessarily know what to believe and i think this has come out the more podcasts that i've done i told you i recently started one uh you mind if i shout it out of course dude that's what you're here for we're like six episodes in like my main thing is my youtube channel with the videos that you see description right but uh another content creator who has a pretty big tiktok uh we kind of came together and formed this podcast called Black Hole Theories where we talk about a lot of this stuff. And we kind of get theoretical. But I think the side that I'm surprised about is the more podcasts that I've done about this, I'm realizing that I'm actually pretty skeptical of most things. I think I try to stay as indifferent as possible because I was telling you I was in dental school and dropped out to kind of start my online brand.

I thought it was the move for me. I still think it's the move for me. But it's – like I have a scientific mindset around a lot of this stuff. Yes. Right? That's good. But the thing I was telling you yesterday is when I meet people who are either hyper believers that are just like aliens or demons and they're here to like take over humanity. And then we got the people who

are like maybe Neil deGrasse Tyson who don't even want to look that way. Right. Um, I'll ask people, and I even talked to you about this yesterday. Oh, okay. So if you believe in aliens, that's like a hundred percent. And if you don't believe in aliens, it leaves like half percentage of like healthy skepticism for me, right? But that's still an A plus, you know? And most of the people I ask, one of the people who was recently on our podcast who I didn't know of, but apparently you knew, you know, Lou reviews, right? I also also I guess my co-host knew him that's why he was on the podcast so most of the episode all I knew was that he was a huge skeptic of a lot of this stuff um and what really stood out to me was that he was um the the reasoning was because he believes

that the government is using this as like propaganda to get money yeah yeah i think i think lou has some i've talked with lou offline about some of this stuff i think he has some very fair points uh but it's like everything else it's just like you said you kind of have two camps that fall hard on this right you're either all for it or you're against it right and i think lou gets put in that totally against it camp yeah well here's the interesting part is i asked him that question like on a percentage like what do you put yourself i didn't even tell him that i'm at a 99 point something but he was at like a 98 or a 99 which again that it exists right which again for a skeptic they think okay because they came from

the paradigm of believing right so if a skeptic is still giving this an a plus i think that's something that's worth noting you know what i'm saying um you know if someone's a hundred percent if they answer that question i even become skeptical of them if they're a hundred percent how can you be a hundred percent Oh, I've seen a UFO. But okay, but did you see who was in it? Well, I think there's – it's kind of like I was saying right at the outset of the podcast. I think there's two layers to it. It's do you believe any or some of the stories you hear about interactions that have occurred with alien species or interdimensionality whatever you want to say here and then the other question is do you believe that somewhere out in the vast universe intelligent life exists that one i don't

mind saying i'm personally a hundred percent on that i guess you're technically 99.99999 but that's a different question i think where lou is and this is fair is the stuff we hear about here the alleged interactions he's extremely skeptical of and views as like some government rollout or whatever which you know he had Lou had a famous back and forth on some web show I don't remember what it was him and another guy with Lou Elizondo I don't know how long ago this was, maybe a year or two years, something like that. And he's very up to date on like people like Lou and still viewing them as working for the government, which that could be their job, which is fine. But he looks at it like, OK, that means I'm not going to listen to a word they say. OK.

Some of that's hard to argue with but you were you're saying you were having a back and forth with him we were talking about this last night where you know you were like poking fun at it to like be sarcastic about stuff and he wasn't really catching the drift no here's the thing is i my introduction to him was given to me five minutes before i met him on a on a virtual podcast i was told that he had a YouTube channel about UFOs. Then he kind of flipped his script and now is against it. And because of that, he potentially lost a lot of audience that he had. Oh, yeah.

And then I was also told that he's an actor in a stand-up comic, right? So that day, I even told my co-host going into that episode before before we hit record i was like i've had a couple of sales calls today where i'm just like in a no bullshit type of mood so i don't know if that'll kind of come across in this interview um but either way i'm gonna get really baked and we'll see what happens yeah and so anyway Lou comes on and I'm expecting this like super professional looking guy and let's I mean he just looks like a regular dude right so he's a regular bro right so I was just like okay so he's like he's like one of us so one of us one of us yeah and so the interview starts and he's instantly going in and getting

like really like man it's like bringing me down you know like i i hear what you're saying and you're making a lot of great points and you know i might even agree with you on a lot of this stuff but i think the mood i was in that day i just started like in a way fucking around, giving him many opportunities to join the jokes, you know, like a yes and type of thing. Right. And, and I think he just wasn't expecting it.

And so he, he was kind of laughing, but also kind of getting back to the point of things. And anytime I felt like he was gaining any momentum, I would just start fucking around and cracking jokes. Like one of the things that he was talking about was like, when we were talking, when I asked him about the percentage of where he is on,

on these are from another planet and they're here. He was talking about things on other planets and aliens from other planets. So I go, you know what? I was talking to Christian, my co-host about this, and we were, this is a real conversation. And I was like, if this comes out as real, you got to think about what's next. Like, how does this affect society? And I was like, well, obviously that might lead to future exchanges of resources, information. Maybe we could have people go over their planet and see what it's like if we get along with them. And then I was like, but we came to the realization that if this is real, you just hope that they're hot, right? Because you're going to go, if you go

over the planet, the other planet, you hope you go to the planet with the hot aliens and not the insects. You know what i'm saying because you're gonna be going over there after all we're just mammals at the end of the day we see where that was going all we want to do is just fuck shit and fuck shit up you know so we go over there our instinct is we're gonna want to start slapping them cheeks and he wasn't catching that no he wasn't yeah so that's good that was that was really good but lou i came to know lou through when i had ashton forbes on and so that's that's when i was talking with him because he didn't like ashton and he liked my podcast with him because

obviously like ashton i had a big back and forth there. But I think Twitter is not good for a lot of people. It's one reason why – like I've never put the links to my Twitter in anything. I don't even tell people about it. I don't want to hear about it now. It's been mentioned a couple times like on my podcast before you know and we we do post we have a second account now so here's your welcome to go follow this called julian dory podcast where we do post clips every day and it's not really like any tweeting but that was always like on purpose because i've lived on

twitter for information gatherings since 09 since i was a fucking teenager, and I have seen what trouble people get into, boom, boom, boom, boom, boom, send, right, behind a keyboard, it is the ultimate place to get in trouble, behind the keyboard, and I see this very unhealthy back and forth that happens, and we're just using one of many examples right here. This is all over Twitter, but in this case between the – you want to call them the believers and the people who are like it's just the government like Lou. And the animosity and hatred that they have for each other from behind the keyboard is kind of like inhumane and and and i i experienced some of it with ashton obviously when he we're not going to get into all that but basically there were attacks levied my way and and then i was forced to actually have to get in twitter response mode

for like a week of my life and i don't that's not my world i don't i don't do that but when i was in there all these other all these other blisters opened to bleed with all these other people. Me and Danny Jones were getting like a crash course on who fucks with who and who doesn't. And I'm just like, I wonder if any of these people would treat each other this way if they were – they talked about it, not even in person, just like on a podcast like that. I don't think so there's something about that that's off and it if anything if you're someone who wants to try to actually get to disclosure which a lot of us want right i'm skeptical we'll ever really get it because it's like what's the incentive for a government to share this with you or whatever

but you know who knows if you want to get there the way not to do it is making a sideshow out of everything and showing that you can't be taken seriously because you're just fucking hurling insults at each other all the time. I don't think that's healthy at all. And, and, you know, I, I stay, I stay out of it. I don't want anything to do with that. Right. I was thinking about this this morning, um, because you and I had talked about this a little bit yesterday and I, I had no idea about about this this morning, because you and I had talked about this a little bit yesterday. And I, I had no idea about any of this drama. Because, you know, as I said, like, I, I'm in my own lane, like, I don't have time to worry about other people. But I also recognize just the beauty, but also the dark side of humanity. One thing we can say about human nature is that we like to congregate in groups.

We like to find people we identify with who share similar values. It's a survival tactic. And at the end of the day, that's our human nature. It's baked into our DNA, right? And the thing about the UFO community is I think ultimately I don't give a fuck what you're doing in your life. Are these things here? Are these things real? Are they aliens from another planet? That interests me. But I think when we get such little progress and we are all kind of grasping at straws, trying to like wonder about something that most people don't believe in, naturally people want to find other

people who kind of think like them. And so I think it's funny that there's essentially been a religious cult formed within the UFO community, you know, and then there's different sects of these different religious cults. And some people believe they're demons and some people believe they're from another planet. And some people believe it's a scam. Some people believe it's all fake. And I'm just like, I don't give a fuck where you identify. It's kind of like LGBTQ. Do your thing, right?

Whatever you want to do. I'm going to be over here making YouTube videos. That's how I feel. I'm with you, man. I'm with you. And the problem here that's also underneath all of it is niche monetization. We haven't done – we haven't really done like a UFO podcast in a little while now. And it's – we have some that are going to come up.

But that's also like a little bit on purpose too because I don't want to – I't want to do things like yeah ufo podcast do good views we can go do good views on other stuff right i don't want i if we're going to do it it's because i want to attack a story like i want to sink my teeth into it and say okay what is what happened here what do we know you know i i actually i'm i'm with you i want to figure it out i want to hear from perspectives of people who may have found some shit or whatever. I don't want to get caught up in that being the source of my income or anything like that at all. I also don't want to be – like I'm a novice fan. I'm like – you want to talk about like the farthest thing from an expert on UFOfo yeah history or any of it like you're looking

at them i'm a podcaster right i like doing all different so when you look at ufo twitter and the ufo community many of these people are making their income off of ufos and that's what they talk about right so if they don't have something to talk about they don't make money and i'm not even faulting these people here what i'm saying is it unfortunately creates whatever your narrative that you pick your opinion the way you're going to be controversial and piss some people off because like you said it's all different teams here someone's always going to be pissed at someone else it's like cereal with everyone in there there's 20 terrorist groups none of them like each other they all just fight right you are going to pick that lane whatever it is and then you are going to

day in day out monetize it and have that tribal following form behind you and the tribal following form against you and it is it's not a natural way to live and i i witnessed this with those mh370 episodes by the way now that we're talking about it oh my god again i if this is a touchy subject like we don't have to keep talking about it but i um cracking up he likes you alessi said the other night on twitter spaces he said i had a great conversation with alessi yeah so this is coming from the perspective of someone who's hearing about all of this in the last 12 hours for the first time, right? And I'm processing it in real time. I just want to think out loud here if you don't mind.

It sounds like this dude faked a video about some missing plane and got mad that he got called out for it. Yes. Now bringing this back to what we were talking about as far as teams, this is where I think it's one of the, I think it's funny about human nature. It's kind of ironic in a sense. I believe that I am very grateful that we live in a world today where I don't have to worry about a fucking tiger going to eat me in the middle of the night while I'm sleeping. I don't have to worry about survival and reproduction. As long as I have a roof over my head, I have a girl in my bed, you know,

life's good, right? But here's what happens when life is good. People start creating problems. Life is so good that someone has the ability in 2024, and I think this is a positive message because people get so much doom and gloom. Keep going. We're in such a good world that someone can spend 24 hours of their day just bashing other people who believe ufos are something different than what they believe yeah or they can spend 24 hours of their day on topic here you know finding a topic to run with and then make money off it and make it a part of their being bro I pitch this idea to Lou on our podcast and and I'm only bringing it back because we're talking about monetization here all right if this is a government scam to get dollars which by the way you said earlier we're all capitalists here

if someone's gonna pay us money to promote something and if we like like the product or whatever, then it's worth promoting, right? But that is capitalism at its finest, right? What he's saying is that some people have figured out a loophole in this game of capitalism, of this life on this spinning rock in outer space where we're just trying to make purpose out of consciousness, right? We came, we woke up one day and was like, what do we do? I don't know, get a job and go to school and make money, right? So some people have figured out that if we just talk about UFOs, we can get the government to give us the tax dollars that we're so mad that they're taking from us and pay us millions of dollars to just sleep at night and say we're looking for UFOs. So in that sense, hey, if the game of life is to win the game of capitalism, they've won, right?

Yeah, yeah. That's what it's not. So here's my idea. Okay. What if we pitch a government program for no less than $100 million? That's a small government program for no less than a hundred million dollars that's a small government program i mean my logic is if you ask for 40 million they're not going to take you seriously so you ask for 100 they go okay these guys mean business right and the government program might need a billy let's get a billy all right a billy I'm not thinking big enough. That's my problem here.

Yeah, you got to think big. Where we get them to pay us to talk about our investigations into UFOs. In other words, a government program for podcasting about UFOs and conspiracies. You want the government to pay for it? And you think that's going to solve the capitalism problem it'll solve the division in this nation of the people on ufo twitter we're all making money here but they're all making money right now yeah they're all making money you're just you're just taking it from the corporations

the government which you know but that's i think that's where the rel where it was relevant to what he was saying because he was just complaining about governments talking about ufos wanting dollars right and i'm like okay if that's the name of the game why don't we just join the game and play it to the best of our abilities yeah i i don't know but i i do think we we got to get out of that. By the way, that's – I'm saying this facetiously. Oh, yeah. For the people listening going, Patrick James is a fucking government shit.

I got you. I follow. But I've had some conversations recently with some different people who were looking to come on the podcast that i don't think i'm going to do where you also have this it's tribal when they're looking at coming on shows in the sense that they're trying to get you to agree with them before they come on and when you then say to them hey i'm skeptical about this. I think it's really cool, the work you're doing. Would love to maybe investigate it more. You know, we'll litigate it on the podcast. You present the evidence and we'll see what we think of it.

They go, yeah, yeah, sounds great. And then the next phone call with them, they'll be like, yeah, so we want to make you a part of our launch. Like, what? You want to make me a part of your launch? Yeah, we're going to be launching this publicly and we'd like to give you the exclusive for that this has happened like four times three times with different things i don't even know what these launches are no idea like

it could just mean like they're launching a twitter i have no idea the conversation stops there that's why because i'm like now i've already said we're going to litigate this and I'm not telling you whether I agree or disagree. In fact, I said I'm skeptical. But you are now trying to use me as a part of your – you see the red alarms in my head going because they want to suck you in. They're like, oh, you're going to get – you're going to be a part of this. You're going to be a part of this. And I'm like, no the fuck I'm not. I'm like I'm interested in this.

I'm a pod no, the fuck I'm not. I'm like, I'm interested in this. I'm a podcaster, bro. This is not, you know, like, and, you know, good luck getting on Lex Friedman or Joe Rogan. That's the other question you get. Apparently everyone thinks every podcaster knows Lex Friedman and Joe Rogan. I've never talked to those guys in my life. They're like, yo, can you get me on Lex or Joe? I'm like, yeah, sure. Let me call them up right now.

Like, what the fuck do you, when I hear stuff like that, I'm just like they're just ladder they're they're trying a ladder jump to monetize it and they're not like it tells me they're not looking at the facts and i get real hesitant with that and that's why i'm like no no we do this on like i'm a dick about it at this point i'm like no no we do this on my terms or we're not doing it you're coming to my fucking studio we're doing it right here we're gonna litigate it that's it i'm not telling you what i think ahead of time. I'm going to find out right the fuck there when you're presenting the evidence, and that's what we're going to go with. If they don't want to do it, then fuck them. I mean it's a good offer.

You got me here. Yeah. Well, it's totally different. It's like say less. Yeah. There's some – like I was saying, there's some who it's like that's not even on the table. I'm like, all right, I'm out on this because it's it's just it just screams like all right this is some sort of not even like a government ploy or something like it's not even talented enough for that it's like all right i i really don't know

here and some of the some of the emails like my agency will get from people i've shown alessi some of these like from people trying to go on this show man that have to do with ufos like my agent will forward it to me with a straight face meaning like he won't type out an email or anything he'll just forward the email it's like a 40 word subject about like a ufo apparition in the middle of the night in fucking antarctica you know like you can't even make this stuff up and i'm'm like, these people, someone really, he's laughing because he's seen this. Someone really wrote this email and said, this Julian Dory guy is going to see this,

read this and say yes. And I'm like, no, I'm not. You know, there has to be a line to it. That's why I like talking with James Fox because James has dedicated his life to this. Of course, you know, and he'll tell you, he wants it to be a line to it. That's why I like talking with James Fox, because James has dedicated his life to this, of course, you know, and he'll tell you, he wants it to be true, too. But James, James tests the evidence, whether or not you agree with how he tests that is totally up to you. There's some things, there's some stuff he'll say, I'm like, I don't think he built that one enough.

Yeah. But like, he puts the work in, he tests the evidence, he spends long time on cases. And I think that's great i think that's exactly what we need you know we're going to do it again soon when when he comes in but to your point there has to be some sort of you know better self-policing i just i don't know if if that's going to happen yeah but um speaking of james fox yeah i told you this last night great podcast with him by the way like One of my favorite. Probably the best interview of James Fox that I've seen. And that relationship is thanks to Alessi because Alessi was down in Brazil making the Moment of Contact documentary with him in 2021.

I mean, I'm so both looking forward to seeing. I'm very curious when you brought, when we were talking about the Kecksburg UFO incident, what he has on that, or if he has ever looked into it. I don't know. I haven't talked with him about that. Because that's one that we know for a fact

is in possession of the government. It is a thing that landed there. People saw it and it was seen getting taken away by the government who came in that fucking night. You know, Alessi, can you text him and ask him if that's if he's looking into that or if that's part of the diet? My understanding, Alessi and I have seen some of the rough cuts as in probably a grand total of like eight minutes, you know, like little pieces as he's been doing it.

But hey, guys, if you have a second please be sure to share this episode around on social media and with your friends whether it's reddit instagram facebook twitter doesn't matter it's all a huge help it gets new eyeballs on the show and it allows us to grow and survive so thank you to all of you who have already been doing that and thank you to all of you who are going to do so now my understanding is that this is going to be looking into kind of the top down of what exists below the pentagon like out there beck and call i guess you will of the quote-unquote government program and he's also tying in like he made he he went over to europe and did some work over there and did a bunch of interviews there including with gary McKinnon, who you made a great video on.

Maybe we'll talk about him later. That's where I'm like – I was thinking about this morning, bro. The fact that you said he got an interview with Gary McKinnon, I am even more curious about this documentary now because his whole thing relating back to even antarctica they i mean the if you take that as far as you can go down that rabbit hole antarctica leads to nazis now launching into the moon to mars um and and having a secret space force and essentially teaming up with this race of reptilians right so this is where it starts to get very like you know that's what i'm saying like you you there's a lot of leaps of logic there but it's a leap or 12. when people talk about the secret space force they talk about antarctica nazis and they talk about gary mckinnon can you

tell people who gary mckinnon was let's just do it okay so gary mckinnon was this guy in the UK who was an IT worker who basically would spend his nights getting high, smoking joints, and trying to hack the Pentagon and NASA. And because he was an IT guy, he knew that most times if you go to a login page that they have a whole database of blank accounts or test accounts where the password is either blank or it's just password. And so using just that logic, he was able to essentially remotely access a lot of people's computers in NASA. And while he was just digging through files of some dude's computer, he came upon a folder of pictures. And these pictures were large cigar-shaped craft in outer space, like high resolution pictures of these things. And they had like two geodesic domes on top and bottom of this cigar-shaped craft. And I'm sure many other similar pictures, right?

But that was the one he specifically has mentioned publicly in a lot of places, right? And then he also found a spreadsheet of officer names. And these names were listed under a list that was titled non-terrestrial officers. Meaning the officers themselves or officers of non-terrestrial stuff? That could mean hardly anything, but the way I, I mean, it could mean a lot of things, right? It could mean that these are alien officers. It could mean that these are officers that are currently off planet so maybe in orbit what i took it as and when put in the and when put in the context of the the pictures of these ufos that he was seeing what he literally was saying these are ufos and i don't

know if there are governments or or like for reverse engineered or whatever. But when you combine that with non-terrestrial officers, what I think is secret space force. So that's where when I hear that James Fox has a documentary coming out about the government program and given all the recent news, the assumption is maybe it's about these crash retrieval programs, right? But if now we got Gary McKinnon mixed into the mix, now I'm thinking, are we talking secret space force here? I don't know. I've been like almost purposely cagey myself, like with James, because we're gonna do, he's gonna come in and do a podcast

where he talks about all this as soon as the rough cut is done. It's almost done. And I kind of want to be a bit surprised by what's in there because he'll obviously show us the rough cut before we go. I would imagine we'll probably watch it like the night before we go on air, and then it will be very fresh. Speaking of what he recently went through. Oh, yeah. Speaking of what he recently went through, I'm just thinking because the rough cut seems like something I would almost want to see more than the final version. Just because as a content creator, we both know that most of it gets cut out of the final product.

Yeah. It feels like this one feels to me like his apocalypse now, right? This feels like when Coppola was making Apocalypse Now. I'm drawing a little parallel here because Coppola goes, makes The Godfather. It's a horrible experience, but then the movie is the greatest movie of all time. The second one is a great experience. He has an unlimited budget. He goes and makes a movie like The Conversation,

which was another amazing movie he made in the 70s with gene hackman and john cazale but when he went to make apocalypse now you know heart of darkness insane budget insane cast like just milked himself in into that film that's what it feels like james is doing with this one because obviously you know he's he's editing angry too yeah he's definitely he's motivated yes he's motivated i i feel like this is going to be his best one yet i feel like it too knock on wood because it just he's put a lot of work into this and you know we've talked about i know we talked about on patreon and i think we put some of that clip public too so people can see that on our clips channel, Julian Dory Clips. There's a clip about the full backstory of – that we're allowed to say thus far of what James went through. But essentially he got financially fucked by 1091, the production company he was with and a lot of other directors were with who also got financially fucked.

And so he, despite the brilliance of Moment of Contact and how far that went, it was the number one documentary in the world for a while. He really didn't see almost any of that money. And so you're talking about a guy who's given over 30 years of his life to this. And until he made theon in whatever it was. I think it came out in 2020. Right. Which he spent about eight, nine years on. Until he made that, James had no money.

That movie was like his crowning achievement and finally got him over the top of like, yo, if we're going to watch content investigating the actual phenomenon, no pun intended, we're watching James Fox. And so now, look, that's the good thing. People are very tuned in for everything he does. And I know it'll be successful. But from an evidence-gathering standpoint, I'm really curious to see how this comes out because he's talked to a lot of really cool people. Yeah. For sure. But I think he spent a couple days with gary mckinnon in in britain

he said that was pretty nuts we saw one of the rough cuts of like one of the little scenes of that but get you were saying he he lives in britain and britain refused to extradite him to the u.s why why was that so usually they just do that mostly, right? Yeah, I guess. So the government, the US government couldn't just go in and take him, right? He had to be either extradited or willingly come over here. And so they tried to offer him a deal that was like, hey, if you pay for your travel over here and just get into the United States we'll give you the the least like the least strict sentence we'll give you the best possible outcome for you right and he was just like fuck no i'm never going to the u.s right and uh and yeah because long story short i mean they

they realized that someone was hacking their systems because he was like basically mirroring their computer screen. And so one of the times he was like viewing these – I think it was right when he was viewing that picture of the UFO that he saw the mouse go down the corner and like log out. Oh, shit. So someone like saw him in the act. And so that's how they found him. And so like instantly they were trying to get him to the US. I think he like was woken up in the middle of the night with like just surrounded by officers you know in the uk but they couldn't bring him over here right so um did they say it was like because he has asperger's or

something that's what the that's what the uk government uh eventually saved him they like they were just like yeah we think that because he has asperger's, he would be a candidate for like offing himself, you know? So we don't want that to happen just by sending him over to you guys. So we're just going to not send him over. They really use that logic. Wow. Yeah.

I mean, I guess that might be right, right? I don't know. I'm not a doctor. You can well tell. Or they just really wanted to save one of their own. I guess.

It's like, damn, you hacked it. Fam, you hacked the NSA. What's up, baby? Let's's go we've been trying to do that for a minute that's probably all that bro i didn't even think just type in password as the password oh fuck damn gary trying to go through these backdoor entries what imagine that like you're just sitting at home obviously like he was talented this stuff but one're sitting there on your computer,

and the next minute you're inside the NSA systems. Who knows what he found? I have a feeling that what we've heard that he saw is the tip of the iceberg because the one detail most people forget is that he was doing this for possibly months. Every night after he got off work, he'd get high and just go through nasa's files right you know that's well that's that sounds like a good night yeah that sounds like a really good night a night that might end in prison but a good night nonetheless but we we've gone on some great tangents today which i knew was going to happen because like there's so many

things all over the place and again like your channel covers all different kinds of things but looping back around to something i had promised earlier when we got off it yeah operation paperclip and post-world war ii germany you know i i think this is a really forget operation paperclip itself for a second just post--World War II Germany, I think is – those five to ten years afterwards especially are some of the most undercovered, insane history ever. And there's some great books on this. Annie Jacobson who just went on with Danny Jones. Everyone go check that out. She's great.

She wrote a book called Operation Paperclip that's mind-blowing. It's like – I think it's like 800 pages or something. It's a long book, but really good. And there's another one that I'm reading right now called Devil's Chessboard by David Talbot. You ever hear that one? So this is all about like the Dulles brothers in a way, and it then centers around at point, the creation of CIA, which is a direct part of the timeline here with post-World War II as it was the OSS during the war. But it's one of the ultimate moral questions for me in hindsight because you look at it. the germans as evil as they were unfortunately they did have some amazing rocket scientific talents i'll say their biological scientific talents were lacking but

if you know what i mean but with propulsion systems and stuff like that there was impressive stuff there was some impressive stuff they were doing with advanced weaponry like bioweaponry and things like that and he writes about that but you know we can say a guy like warner von braun gets us on the moon which i think is true and some other guys who help with that who are from germany but the moral implication of basically taking these awful war criminals who were genociding people and then pulling them into our country and using them that gets tough for me that's real tough to think about yeah i mean that's the operation paperclip not even just including the ufo aspect of all this stuff i mean that's a crazy thing thing to realize that was legit.

I don't know if you've seen this documentary on Netflix. It was a docu-series they did. I don't even remember the name of it. But the concept of it was there was one of the worst, most feared Nazis by a lot of Jews. Who they gave them some really really creepy name like the fucking the hangman something like yeah some really scary thing like that right and jewish people who were in america from world war ii started recognizing this guy in their town in fucking like detroit michigan or some small town like that, right?

Oh, this is the guard. Yes. Can you look up Netflix? I forget the name of it. Is it called like Monster? Something like that. Yeah. Monster. Look up Netflix documentary Nazi guard.

Yes. Yes, I saw this. And he's working for some car factory or something. Yes, the devil next door yeah but there's controversy like is it him yeah bro when i saw the the the footage from the trial that they held for this guy and they brought in the jews to come like some of these jewish people to go shake his hand he wanted to shake their hand the moment they made eye contact with him like the way they cowered in fear like this is him this is the guy like i mean what more do you need you know yeah i i haven't seen this in a while but i i watched this whole thing i didn't know what to

think because first of all you see those scenes and you feel for those people because you're like, oh my god. Right. I can't even imagine. But also, it's tough because they're so traumatized. And what if he just really looks like one of those guys? And they don't know. I mean, I'm inclined to be where you are, which is like you don't forget those eyes. I also think Amanda Knox was guilty. So let's just put that. You do just a sneaking suspicion yeah but snuck that one in there so i mean most people don't so if you feel the opposite then you know i can see why we might disagree all right well let's let's stay on this that's a separate one but you know this guy was like a normal

blue collar worker he wasn't even a paperclip guy. You know, a lot of the paperclip guys, they gave him a mansion in Huntsville, Alabama. Really? You know, and put him to work. There's pictures of Kennedy sitting next to Wernher von Braun and shit. Yeah, he wasn't like a scientist though, right? So I guess that would be why. Yeah, this guy wasn't a scientist.

He was just a demon. It feels like the secrets of the world were all perhaps uncovered by some people in the aftermath of that war. How much is that getting on the mic, Alessi? What's going on outside? A lot. Okay. All right. Yeah, we should be good. But it was also then covered right back up because you have a convergence at the end right you have Russia and then even separate like the United States and Britain all

converging into Germany and it was a race for who can get to what assets because you know even between the British and the US who were good friends they both hate the Soviets but like you know they were all trying to get their own like a pillaging if you will and part of operation paperclip is obviously the u.s and britain wanted to prevent nazi scientists from getting into the hands of soviets so they're like better us than them but you have in the middle of all that a lot of guys who also weren't scientists who escaped through the rat lines this is where you get into like the catholic church helping these guys out of Europe,

which there's a lot of good evidence of that. And you get into what you mentioned earlier, them getting to South America and Antarctica. At the heart of it is the ultimate conspiracy theory, which is actually one that I think I do subscribe to. I've said this before. But I don't know that Hitler killed himself. I don't think he would have lived that long after World War II. The guy was so fucked up on so many drugs.

But I think he might have gotten back to South America. What do you think? If I'm being honest, what I think is... And this is just what comes up for me. I really want to talk to Tom DeLonge and see how he came to the

understanding that Roswell was German. Because for me, that's where one of the things that started me down this rabbit hole of the antarctica and nazis and all that stuff are you saying like hitler would have sent that or something well that's what i'm saying like tell me what you know about why you think roswell was german because i'd be curious to see what he says to the answer to that question. Like, where do you think Hitler was? Do you think he survived?

What do you mean? It was Nazi Germans that crashed a flying saucer in the desert, you know, and that kind of connects back to the Honobu craft, like, and operation high jump, you know? So that's why I'm saying there's all these connections just based off of him

saying that and me starting to look into it. So I don't the answer to answer your question i have no idea i mean tim kennedy is someone who's yeah yeah he concluded that he made it to south america um who knows you know i think at this point i'm more of a schrodinger's cat type of thing where it's like there's a probability that it's a combination or one of any of these but until i open the box and see what's inside i have no idea you know yeah tim kennedy some of the stuff you mentioned a couple times but some of the stuff that he found and the team found when they went down

to south america for what was a reality tv show but But I mean, it's haunting. There's some crazy shit down there. There are German strongholds, if you will. And it's crazy because, you know, the Germans almost, they did have a backup plan in a way. They had paid off so many South American governments while they were in, while the Nazis were in power and they were paying them with plundered wealth. They were paying them with like stolen Jewish wealth they're playing they're paying them with like stolen Jewish wealth and and shit like that and then they even were able to store it there as we've come to know and you know they were able to get some of it over there after the war and then use it in the South American economy which is pretty

crazy but you know it's a real I try try not to overstate it because it's been a lot of years and people like to run with conspiracy theories on this. But it is a real thing that there is a German-Nazi contingent that exists to this day down there. I had a friend of mine – I've told this story on the podcast a few times, but a guy who's really well-connected and could do some pretty crazy shit. He had a buddy of his at a major, major company call him up and say, hey, we got this deal closing with another major, major company. And what's going to happen is when it finishes, we are going to be bringing in their senior team is basically going to run that company here.

And they're effectively going to be top 10, top five people at our company. And the problem is we got a problem with one of the guys. And so my guy says, what's that? And he goes, we think he's a Nazi. And my guy is like, same reaction, like what? They're like, we think he is a German Nazi. Now he's like really laughing because he's like, okay, what are you talking about?

They're like, well, he's a German-descended guy from South America, and we – that's what we think he is. And so my guy's like well what makes you think that is he is he making comments about Jews like what is it and they're like no he's the nicest guy ever dressed perfectly extremely pleasant charming to everyone and he's like so what's the problem and they're like something about him rubs us the wrong way we think he's a Nazi so my guy says to him you're crazy i'm not gonna take your money it's not a fucking nazi relax but they keep coming back to him and they're like please please do your thing check this guy out you know do some intel whatever and so finally he's like

look i'm a capitalist i'll take your fucking money but this is stupid like the guy i i don't know why you're worried about this he's not doing. You just have some weird like conspiracy hunch and they're like just take the money. Okay, I'll take it. Fucking guy was a Nazi. He was a card-carrying, but he's a descendant of some of the senior Nazi guys. And here he was, charming his way at the top of a major, major public company in like 2018, 2019. You start thinking about stuff like that, you you're like some of this shit runs pretty deep no yeah i mean the guy at the hotel yesterday was wearing a swastika wristband but you said that i think that was i think that's i i based on his ethnicity i think that's buddhism but someone should really tell him about that yeah because i mean like i said i've the first time

in new jersey i was like hey maybe that's just how they roll here. He's like the third person I've met since I got to New Jersey. Oh, my God. Like, damn. I can't believe he had that. Someone's got to see that over there. My guy. It's like a holiday inn.

Someone help out. Yeah. That's crazy. Well, he had long sleeves on, and I probably wouldn't have seen it if he wasn't holding my cell phone up to his ear because you were talking to him. Yeah, it gets interesting. There's an image of a statue of Buddha. I don't know if we can find it, Alessi. Do like drone shot statue of Buddha on YouTube and don't put us on the third screen right now because we have to get rid of it.

But I'll show you in here i had actually gone to use this in when i was editing the intro for episode 143 this zoom shot out from this statue of buddha i think it's this one there's a video of it on youtube and i had to use it the zoom very carefully because if i let it come out too far, there's literally a swastika on it. Really? It wasn't, this was an ancient, I forget the exact history,

but this is an ancient symbol that Hitler just took as his own and bastardized. I think, I feel like it was supposed to mean something of like peace or it was supposed to mean something like nice, whatever it was. And then, you know, Hitler shoves it on every Nazi flag and suddenly it don't mean that. But that's – I mean that's the power of symbolism for you right there.

It's crazy. But it's nuts how their rise happened so quickly and their fall happened so quickly and all that happened in that time. I mean he didn't even get into power till 1932 he didn't even start making noise till 1927 28 really did you hear about his origin story bro tell us i mean i this will be a very bro version of his origin story but it like it's kind of like a supervillain. I guess he was in World War I and trench warfare and everything. I guess he survived a grenade blast that killed a bunch of people that he was sitting right next to. And ever since then, he was just like on a villain fucking mission, bro. Yeah.

It's like an Avengers villain. He's the ultimate villain. He blamed the treaty of versailles like on jewish people which is cte yeah yeah maybe yeah actually i've never thought of that maybe because he was so fucked up in the head yeah i mean the amount of drugs they had that guy on he was on everything bro every meth i i think he was on like coke he was on everything bro every meth I I think he was on like Coke he was on everything that's what I'm saying like I don't he's just podcasting on stage bro he's like podcasting with that rage fueled by drugs dude there's another we can't show it because it has copyright material but you ever

seen the video of Hitler performing where where brooklyn had by biggie smalls no oh my god that's exactly what you think like he was such a weird talker that they've re-edited him you know talking on stage doing all this stuff and it's like i got my seven mac 11s on my 38 like oh goodness and it's just like, oh my God. There's stories that he was not... You kind of sounded like Andy Milonakis when you rapped there. Oh, I did?

A little bit. That's a TBT. Like a white rapper. That's funny as fuck. I got my seven... He goes, I got my Lee's on my head, but don't call me a Lee head.

That was it. But he, you know's there's stories that when he wasn't on stage he was supremely not charismatic he was like a boring fucking quiet socially awkward dude but something would happen when that motherfucker got on a stage where he's spewing just hatred everywhere to anyone he doesn't like. But he managed to do it with charisma that just hypnotized people. And I always try to put myself in the shoes of people who get caught up in that group. But you were talking about tribes earlier. There's just something in us that can gravitate towards,

I mean, we see it over and over again with cult-like figures, that gravitates towards that and suddenly rewires our mind to get behind things that we never would have got behind. I just don't know what that is about us as humans. Yeah. I don't know, man. He seemed like that when you say like he got on stage and just something clicked, I guess I can kind of relate to that in the sense of I did an event once.

Not saying I'm like hitler or anything but like i was like where's he going with this yeah yeah i so here's the thing i first noticed tony robbins said something similar and he still says it on podcasts to to this day he goes when i'm like in front of someone who i it's a crowd of 5 000 people and i ask is there anybody in the room who's suicidal if you're're suicidal, stand up. And out of 5,000, just statistically, there's going to be 12 to 15 is what he said. And he goes, when I ask that question and I'm in front of one person in the middle of 5,000 people and we're talking about why they're suicidal and I say something to save them and talk them off the ledge, he goes, I have 100% success rate. I'm just talking what Tony Rob robbins thing is right and um

he said this uh in a moment during that documentary right after he saved some dude's life this just happened right they put a camera in his face right after and they go how do you know what to say like how do you know what happens he goes i don't know like i just kind of turn off my mind and it flows through me like he's talking like yes it flows through him so like it kind of reminded me of what you were saying about like hitler like when he's in that crowd he just switches off and it just happens like you're in the ultimate flow state right there you know but it's also how you say it you know and that's what makes tony Robbins so powerful because the charisma and delivery. And he's got a unique voice too.

There's something to that. But if you say like – I'm going to come up with a very unoriginal line that's not beautiful but pretend it's beautiful. Like you say to someone like that hey people want you here man think of all the people who will miss you when you're gone and now realize what kind of value you have in the world it's not like good but if you say like yeah hey people want you here man think about all the value you have in the world and the people who would miss you if you were gone that doesn't hit but if you like, think about the value you have, man. Think about all the people.

Are you picturing your mother, your father, your wife, your kids? You don't think those kids love you? They love you so much. I know it's hard, right? You say it like that, you start as a bad example. But you get the point. If you say it in a way that makes people feel it, the words change. Yeah.

It's just how it is. And he did that. And instead of like doing something positive, he was like, here's why we hate everyone. He was like, listen, we hate everyone. We hate them all. They suck. But you're going to be better for it. You are going to be so better for it man

and people are like god damn it yes i am let's let's make those concentration camps god damn like that's what it just people in their heads bro you just reminded me of a connection back to something we were actually talking about earlier let's go so you know like they were obsessed he was obsessed with the aryan race and like he saw the Jews as the opposite of them, like dark hair, you know, rather than blonde hair, blue eyes. What was Maria Orsic? Blonde hair, blue eyes. And they say that the Nazi party, and you can like, I've looked it up. It's, there's a lot of there's differing opinions on how the nazi party party body was formed but one of the the leading theories is that real society that was led by maria orsic which was a real occult society that merged with another one i said that earlier right to form the

nazi party but she claimed that these beings from the aldebaran star system were, they called themselves the Aryans, right? The Aryan race. Was it the Nordics? Is that what they were called? We might call that. I don't know if these are the same. And that's why like some of these other stories

where they bring in like Nordic looking beings, like what Travis Walton saw, right? Basically Aryan type of race that the Nazi party was obsessed with, right? Well, Maria Orsic basically fit the profile, and so did all the girls in that group. And she was claiming through her remote viewing sessions and communications with these beings that they were the Aryan race and this is what they looked like. And so they're giving him these wonder weapon blueprints, right? And so that's where if you actually kind of look into this stuff or even start believing some of this stuff,

you go, holy shit, like was this whole thing started because of his obsession with literally extraterrestrials? Could it, I've heard a lot on that because like we were saying like also the occult thing like in general which can tie some of that in that's that's something I gotta go deeper on to I know you've looked at a lot that I've looked at some of that like it could be and it's a part of the big secret whatever the secrets of that war in the aftermath are like that's in there your guess is as good as mine though i just you know we we talk in pop culture now so much about this ufo phenomenon ufo phenomenon especially like the last few years last couple and particularly but

you know the last three to five years has become a bigger thing for so long before that not many people talked about it you know like it went away but as long as humans have been here they've been able to look up at the sky and for you know thousands of years i think like a couple thousand we've known there's planets right and we know there's a solar system i mean the egyptians clearly knew right right you look at some of the stuff that's real i'm not talking like the ancient aliens type yeah it's like there's a solar system. I mean the Egyptians clearly knew right right right you look at some of the stuff That's real. I'm not talking like the ancient aliens type. Yeah, it's like there's real stuff We're gonna get to that in a minute, but like It's always been a question of people But why does it go in spurts of people being interested and maybe a better way to say that?

Why does history like historians? not talk about the people of major times in history and their interest in that stuff like why don't i hear a lot about leonardo da vinci thinking about that which is something apparently he did i gotta look more into that but i've heard that recently right i'm reading his biography right now so maybe that'll come up but like why don't people talk about that why don't people talk about you know the naz' relationship with this stuff as much? I mean, these motherfuckers were crazy.

Yeah. And they lived, I mean, still living in South America, apparently. But, like, they were around 80 years ago. That's not a long time ago. Yeah, that's the point. Like, if this is the narrative of history that actually occurred, that was left out of the history books not even saying i believe it is but if it is you might understand why maybe the government wouldn't want people to know that nazis really won the war because they got advanced flying anti-gravity craft

and having that looming over as a fear over their head that fucking nazis from antarctica are gonna come bomb us at any given point in time. I mean, people who believe that Roswell was German also believe that the 1952 UFO wave, specifically July 1952, when flying saucers flew in formation over the White House, many people believe that those might have also been the nazi german warships sending a message yeah james fox actually talked about that in episode 138 he went through that whole thing so that was like they were a bunch of i want to say like almost small size craft that were traveling at hyper speeds yeah basically like in an instant over dc just

yeah like from from what i've heard it sounds like it was basically the phoenix lights over dc like yeah as big of an event but just you know it's 1952 not 1996 you know so it's not going to spread as wide and all they really have is that one picture, right? Of the White House and the V formation of lights over it. Let's see if we can pull that up. Yeah. Just look at Nazi or UFOs over DC 1952. Yeah, you're right. There we go.

All right. Oh, that's fake. No, not the one with the blue lights, the color corrected one down there. On LinkedIn? Down, second row, right there. This? Yeah, hit that. So that's the picture that exists.

Oh, shit. It's obviously very color corrected for modern day, but that was taken in 1952. Oh, I've not seen that before. And I think there's actual video of it. I included it as B-roll in one of my videos. This is one of the things, I've talked about that before. And I think there's actual video of it. I included it as B-roll in one of my videos. This is one of the things. I've talked about this a lot on the podcast, but not this specific incident. But, like, for example, Commander David Fravor, who I think is a great witness.

Like, he brings a video to the table. He tells you what he saw. This is why he thinks it's crazy. You guys figure it out. Like, I appreciate him a lot. I tend to think, and i get some shit for this but that feels more like darpa weapons it feels like advanced weaponry and it makes sense tic tac yeah yeah so i wonder now this is some crazy shit because this is 52 but i wonder if

you're right about that with there being not necessarily at this point still German craft or something, but it's like engineered by some of those guys because they figured it out. Well, here's the thing. For sure we can say that UFOs and at least the occurrences being reported of them significantly increased after World War II. And coming almost to a peak in 1952 when this happened right and i like i made a video about um the how ufos were spotted over nuclear bases in the 60s yeah let's talk about that kind of uh turned off these nuclear warheads well you know as kind of a prelude to that, again, walking people through the history

of UFOs interacting with nukes, some of the first flying saucer reportings, like when they were testing the nuclear weapon even before the end of World War II, people were seeing UFOs over these nuclear tests. And so there's definitely a correlation there. I forget where I was going with this, but yeah, I think. Well, you're saying there's a core.

I think what you're saying, correct me if I'm wrong, is that the fact that we saw such an uptick in this post-World War II. Yeah. Having to deal, having to do with the world powers and particularly us and the world weapons that were formed as a result of world war ii where there is then an intertwined nature with the quote-unquote phenomenon yeah there's a lot of smoke there that fire right yeah episode 138 with james i just mentioned a few minutes ago literally the intro of that episode and there's your cue to stick that in this episode alessi but he he he talks about that there's there's a story from bob salas and i'm sure we just played it on on the post edit so i don't need to repeat it but that's exactly

that's exactly what a lot of these guys were talking about. It's almost like that line he had, like the aliens or whatever, was taking matches out of the hand of a baby. Now, here's a valid question, though. Who's to say it was aliens? Who's to say that it's not along the lines of what you're thinking, that maybe there is a deeper level of the government with this advanced ancestral of the Nazi scientist technology that is making – is like kind of running things and like, hey, don't fuck with those nukes, baby.

I could see so robert salas bob salas that you just brought up he has one of the more famous incidents um of it's called the malmstrom ufo incident yes i don't know if you remember but there was a moment in one of the recent congress hearings where they brought in the guys who were in charge of this uAP task force that they formed like in 2022 or something. And one of the congressmen directly asked, do you have files on the Malmstrom UFO incident? And if so, what can you tell me about it? And the guy was just completely oblivious to anything known as the Malmstrom UFO incident. Kirkpatrick?

Are you asking about the congressman? No, that was the – were they – the congressman was asking Kirkpatrick, the head of like – It wasn't Kirkpatrick. It was Ronald Moultrie and the other dude, the white dude. Moultrie was the black dude. And they – this was like one of the first meetings that they did. And it was basically an open forum Q&A from congressmen. And this guy essentially scolded them for knowing nothing about it. open forum Q&A from congressmen, you know?

And this guy essentially scolded them for knowing nothing about it. He goes, how do you not even know what the Malmstrom UFO incident is? It's one of the most high profile incidents of UFOs shutting down nuclear weapons over our military bases, and you don't know anything about this? You guys are the ones who are supposed

to be looking into this, right? And he goes, well, okay, we'll look into that. I just haven't looked into that one specifically off the top of my head, right? But another one, and I want to tie this back to James Fox, because if you're texting him right now, I want to know about this. So essentially, one of the other big incidents happened at Big Sur. And this footage, to my knowledge, has never been seen, but there's been a lot of recreations of this footage. And Big Sur, they were testing these ICBMs that they would launch out of the water. And this guy's job, I think his name was Robert something. I forget his last name, but it was ironically just Robert, just like Robert Salas, same name. And his job was to have this high-powered telescopic camera pointed at these ICBMs that they're firing into space as test launches.

And they kind of just crash land into the water, right? But they want to see like that the rockets and everything are working properly. They're looking at all the stages of its launch into space or whatever and um as this thing is launching on one particular day uh he's filming from several miles away at vantage point with this camera and he sees in frame well essentially this is what happens he doesn't see this but he's brought in the next day by his superiors and being like, hey, here's the footage you took. Let's show you it. They turn on this fucking roll.

And while they're in this room showing this to these two guys, to him, there's two men in black there, men in black suits that are not military guys, right? And so he's got his superior. I forget his name. It is important to the story because that guy eventually had the footage. But this guy is brought in and going, hey, I want you to see the footage that we took. So they play the film reel in this dark room. Just imagine yourself sitting there in fucking the 1960s, bro. And he said, sure enough, you saw this nuke launching into space.

Perfect shot of it because his job is just to get a great shot of it right and so uh then you see this flying saucer shaped craft zip in and this thing is going at like 5 000 miles an hour or something ridiculous right it zips in beams a laser beam at it and it's following it in space and then it zips around it in front of it beams another laser beam and this it's riding along next to it this whole time then zips and does a couple zips around it in front of it beams another laser beam and this it's riding along next to it this whole time then zips and does a couple more circles around it and then fires another beam at it and the nuclear bomb just crash lands you know just falls out of space whoa and this thing zips off and this is perfect high definition footage of what is known as the big sir incident so this is one of the year was this again i believe it's 63 64 something like that um early 1960s

well the guy who uh was the superior to this guy um this guy has been on many like interviews about ufos he might still be living um robert hastings uh really helps bring out this guy robert hastings has a book called ufos and versus ufos and nukes or whatever and it really highlights a lot of these incidents i know that um yeah all these guys are named robert for some reason honey holly did that yeah it's been a popular name yeah fucking 20s i only realized that when i was writing the script for that video. But essentially, these men in black took the footage, and it's never been seen since. So it exists somewhere within probably Blue Book files somewhere. And Danny Sheehan has an infamous incident where he got access to some of these Blue Book footage files or whatever.

So I'd be curious what he knows about that. But I saw a tweet the other day, and this is why I want to bring it back to James Fox. He said, the tweet said, a U.S. senator who remains anonymous has told whoever tweeted this, Neil Goodman, that Elizondo has privately confirmed having been given access to the Big Sur UFO film, which was taken by the government and never seen again. And so if Elizondo has it, I know James Fox has been looking into many of this stuff for a long time.

I'd be curious what he knows about the whereabouts of said footage and if he's ever seen it, because a lot of people have tried to have the AI recreations and pass it off as the real thing and it's never the real thing james you know james makes a lot of good relationships but like anyone else he still gets still gets stonewalled with when it comes to some of the intel stuff which is why this next film is cool because he's getting towards that but i my answer on things like that is i don't know man because i don't know what they're telling us publicly versus believing privately

you know what do you what do you think of grush i was calling him grush on some podcast i'm like trying to remove that from my vocabulary but what i think of grush is he seems very credible but we do know he was intelligence you know and intelligence are supposed to be notoriously good at being great liars to deception also misdirection so I'm not putting it past any intelligence former intelligence or whatever to be able to do something like that and I'm not even saying that I think he's a liar i think he's being very truthful but you got to look at it for what it is he is he is everything he says is hearsay it's i was told this by someone who has has been told this i was told this by someone who says they have seen this he is this like if you brought up

someone who met someone who claims they saw a murder, is that person a good witness in a murder trial? Right. That's a valid question. You know? So, Grush, I'll be honest, I don't disbelieve him. I don't necessarily believe him. I believe that he's telling his version of the truth. But when you look at it, why are we making such a big deal out of what he's saying because that's like me literally saying i met someone who says that they saw someone who saw ufo yeah you know yes for some of it it is i think there's a lot of layers to it and then there's things that he directly at least had access to that he alleges so you know the guy jesse michaels

his channel used to be called american alchemy i think he changed it guy jesse michaels his channel used to be called american alchemy i think he changed it to jesse michaels now right he did yeah yeah so i had a chance to talk with him a little bit he's going to come on the podcast at some point here he's known grush for like three years known him a long time that's how he had the first you know sit down with him in it and everything and of course like i'm playing healthy skeptic with it because i have some of the same concerns you do again he might just be doing his job it might be that simple people take this stuff like so personally but like i get it you know there's a job that some people have to do but the way jesse explained it and i'm sure we'll talk

about it when i have him in here to have him expand on it properly and do it justice is that he believes that it doesn't mean a hundred percent of what David says that he's seen will turn out to be true but the if it were just a pure deception the layers to this thing are insane and it's And he thinks it's not possible that it would just be a pure deception because of the different, how many different pieces of evidence he allegedly uncovered. And he spent a lot of time with him too. It doesn't mean he's a human lie detector, just like you and me aren't. But you can take that for what it's worth.

I'm just – I'd be curious to talk with the guy for sure. Not even necessarily on camera. But I would love to have a conversation with him just to get a feel for it myself. Because, I mean, we all heard him on Jesse's show. We definitely all heard him on Rogan's show when he went on there. It's interesting it's very interesting but there's always going to be that yeah that kind of cloud there i think what also is interesting about it is like as someone who's been looking into these deep rabbit holes that is the ufo conspiracy um and real quick i want to come back to one of my gripes about the ufo conspiracy but

when it comes to this what grush is saying is not something that's revolutionary news to people who have already believed in a lot of this stuff oh there's crash retrieval programs so what you're saying is that there could have been a program that would have covered up Roswell, you know? So, and among many other incidents, right? Like the Kecksburg UFO incident. And so, yeah, like I think what he's saying is almost just validation to people who have been saying this for a long time, that there's a crash retrieval program

that covers up UFOs, you know, goes and takes it like in the Virginia UFO incident case case maybe that's the connection back to the program that's what he thinks james thinks yeah i know that so so yeah i think it's it's validation for that but it's also i think tells me that we've got a long ways to go because it's great while it's being talked about in Congress now. At the same time, it's – we've got a long time to go before they're ready to hear about Antarctica Nazis. You know what I'm saying? Right, right. Yeah, and it gets a little – there's so much content on it now too of people who are claiming to have knowledge of it.

And that gets dicey too because, again, it's we were talking about with with ufology earlier right just in general once you have a once there's money signals and something it gets you know it brings the grifters out it brings people are like oh i can i can tell this story all people believe me and And that gets a little hard. And it's hard sitting in a seat like I do or even a seat like you're starting to sit in now with your podcast. It's like, okay, what do you entertain? And to what degree are you a useful idiot at times? I think some of that's inevitable. But you don't want to walk into it knowing that's 100 what it's going to be and that that's that that's tough sometimes so i'm

sure there's podcasts that like i've even turned down that you know maybe i should have done but i i do try to i try to be careful with that i i take like – on a side note, like I take like the CIA spooks with like a different grain of salt because like that's their title. It's what they are. So I have them sitting right in front of me. Y'all be the judge of that, right? Like they're going to say what they're going to say. You're going to agree. You're going to disagree.

But you know what they are. When it's other people who may be claiming specific intelligence on specific events or something that are saying like, oh, yeah, I work there or something like that. That's where it gets weird for me because it's like, well, did you? And are you a spook? Like I don't know. And it's a hazy area. But we just did a lot on nazis and ufos that one i feel like i'm trying to challenge myself to not say nazi anymore i know you know that was way longer than how long

were we on that like an hour and a half or something holy shit one thing i want to say about the ufo we're still on here we go is what's crazy to me about it is that it it seems to take it seems it seems to try to take credit of every conspiracy which makes me inherently skeptical of this the phenomenon yes you know what i'm saying like any conspiracy you thought of jfk there's a ufo connection i have a whole video about that ufo connection there's probably ufo connections to name any other conspiracy i don't want to name the ones that are coming to the top of the head because those are ones that get demonetized by youtube but i'm sure there are sects of the ufo community who believe that they're responsible for all that so sure absolutely that makes me inherently skeptical a little bit of the

ufo um just this these rabbit holes that people go down sometimes you know even even without what we were talking about earlier where it turns into tribes and it becomes religious in a negative way remove that for a second yeah ufology itself is inherently involuntarily a religious type no pun intended phenomenon because you are talking about something that if discovered or if known could unhatch

questions about the very meaning of life which is what the global religions do in their own way and you even have that overlapping in the ufology. You got these holy UFO people and shit too. I've had some in here as well who talk about that and it's like, okay, I don't know. But when it turns into that, people will put questions from beyond the realm of this life as a potential explanation at one point or another onto anything that's ever

happened because it's bigger than what happens on this world so any conspiracy that's happened on this world or in this world is not as big as that you understand what i'm saying yeah so it's kind of like inevitable that it's the ultimate question but agree with you. People will just toss it on everything. Like, oh, yeah, Kennedy was killed over aliens. Yeah. Was he? They have people like – people literally make a living talking about Bigfoot's connection to UFOs. That one I don't even understand.

But it's like, okay, they want to take credit over everything. Yeah. You know? Yeah, and I agree with you. I appreciate your healthy skepticism because i think you have to be careful with that but you all you also made a pretty in-depth video on the great pyramid of giza oh yeah and this i know this is something you look at a lot so i've had matt lacroix in here a couple different times like for four total episodes i've had

luke caverns in here for a couple episodes. There's some other guys we're looking to bring in here. Obviously, they've talked about it in some great depth. They fall on different ends of it and talk about LaCroix and Caverns. But this is one of those I'm very – I just think it's cool. I'm very ambivalent about it. I have no idea. I'm the farthest thing from a historian on it.

But what – for people out there who need to be caught up on the Great Pyramid of Giza and what the narratives are, obviously many of you have heard this before. But can we just start there with the basics and then get to what you've discovered on this? Yeah. So, I mean, the Pyramid of Giza, I mean, in a cut-down version of the video, it took me 23 minutes, so we can give this a try, right? I don't necessarily know the conclusions to draw out of it because a lot of people have some really out-there theories. In my video, I did put out one that was pretty out there, and I did catch a little bit of flack from it in the comments. What was that? It was an experiment that a guy named Joe Parr did. And Joe Parr, and this is real research, so you can probably Google and find,

and that's how I confirmed that it's a real thing, not just something made up. There was a real guy named Joe Parr, has since been deceased, but he spent like a decade or two studying the Great Pyramid pyramid and he believed that the pyramid had an energy field around it and he thought it had to do with the geometry of the pyramid shape um and before i even talk about this in the video that's where i talk about all the insane numbers uh around the geometry and the construction of the pyramid which we can definitely get to but he was able to actually measure a low level field uh of some sort around by field like electromagnetic field you know um i don't necessarily know what he meant

but uh some type of like if you have like those uh electromagnetic meters or whatever you could detect different fields. And so he had a theoretical experiment that apparently did take place where he would have recreations of models that he built of the pyramid. And he would do things like send electrical charges through it, kind of going back to like Dyke Locke, and he would put it like a spinning centrifuge in the center of it so it's very similar type of i guess logic or science if you want to call it that around dieglock and that wonder weapon that we thought may be connected to kecksburg somehow right so apparently in one of his experiments he noticed that when he made this field correct with the centrifuge spinning, the pyramid would start to form an energy bubble that would sometimes make it look like it went invisible for a few seconds. And sometimes it would actually levitate a little bit if the

bubble was strong enough. The whole pyramid. The whole model pyramid that he built, right? And then he said that he did this experiment so much that he figured out that the effect of the bubble was so strong, and this is directly quoted out of his papers that you can Google and find, that he felt that the strength of the bubble formed from the pyramid was strongest between the dates of December 12th through 16th. And he thinks it has to do with the fact that it's at that time of year that the earth passes through a flow of charged particles coming from the sun. He thinks it had something to do with the charged particles coming from the sun. So this apparently happened one time where it got so crazy. And this is where it made the cut for my video, where it levitated and kind of like the ship from the Philadelphia is where it where it made the cut for my video where the it levitated and kind of

like the ship from the philadelphia experiment where it like disappeared and then reappeared it like phase shifted and reappeared embedded into the wall of his lab and and so um that one experiment led him to believe that the pyramid may have been some sort of a time machine because of its inherent ability to transverse hyperspace and that was like his uh conclusion based off of his conversations right do you think there's anything to the possibility i'm just playing devil's advocate yeah that it is what the mainstream has tried to say it is for so long which is that this pharaoh kufu built a pyramid it was supposed to be his tomb and that's what it was do you think there's anything to that i don't um you know

because one of the things that a lot of people don't really know about the pyramid is that the official narrative is that the pyramids were built as tombs, but we've never found a mummy in any of the great pyramids of Giza, those three pyramids. To my knowledge, some people say that pyramids have been found in, or like mummies have been found in other pyramids like throughout Egypt, but a lot of those pyramids are copycat pyramids that were built far after the Great Pyramid. And the crazy thing about the Great Pyramid is that, and the two ones surrounding it, is that those are the original pyramids, but there's hundreds of pyramids in Egypt. Most of them were built hundreds, if not thousands of years later, and most of them have crumbled to time. They are no longer standing. They're nowhere near

architecturally sound. And the pyramid itself, they're withstanding the test of time. By the way, when you look into just the measurements of how large the pyramid is it's kind of mind blowing but it's also mind blowing to realize that the stones are not held in place with any mortar or concrete or anything they are held in place literally using just their own weight and they've using nothing but their own weight withstood the test of thousands of thousands of years. The original narrative is that they were built in 4500 BC by the pharaoh Khufu, right? And the Sphinx was theoretically built after that to guard the Great Pyramid. The Sphinx was theoretically built by the son of Khufu, Khafre, right? And so we all know about – I'm not sure if your viewers know, but I'm sure that you've probably heard of Robert Schock and David – Of course.

John Anthony West and their research around the Sphinx being much older than just 4,000 years. And what did they say it's, what the alleged use case was for it? They said that this, first off, they said the Sphinx was just erected to protect the pyramids. It was like a symbolism. Yeah, like a- Yeah.

And so it was built by the sun and then the sun also apparently built one of the smaller pyramids of the three that are the great pyramids, right? So the sun said that he was put in one of the tombs. The father was put in the great pyramid, but no mummies have been found in any of these pyramids. In fact, unlike pretty much anywhere else in Egypt, there's not even been hieroglyphs found inside of the Great Pyramid. And most people don't know that. And the only reason we think that the Great Pyramid was once the tomb of Khufu was because his name was written on the walls inside the Great Pyramid, but it wasn't inscribed like regular hieroglyphs. It was painted with red paint.

Who knows when that red paint was put there? Because it wasn't carved into the walls, so we know for a fact it wasn't put there at the time that it was built. So was it put there right after or potentially hundreds, if not thousands of years later by someone who's writing graffiti on the walls? And for me, if I go and tag the side of your fucking apartment building does that mean i fucking built it no exactly so um for all we know kufu might might have found the pyramid and put his name on the walls right and so it's possible that's where a lot of people

you know and there's also the the idea that maybe the sphinx itself was once a lion and it was carved down to the head because the head is not proportional to the rest of the body right and so we definitely know it was carved down from something especially looking at the erosion patterns who would have carved it down kufu khafre uh the sun so i've got khafre i we might be getting these names mixed up back and forth but um i think it's coffray coffray is the sphinx yeah let's check the pyramid don't trust me on that yeah but again like if if they found it and the sphinx really is older than them by thousands of years six thousand years potentially or, then maybe he's the one

who recarved the head to make it more of a pharaoh like himself. Yeah, you got it right, by the way. Khafre was the son of King Khufu. Got it. So we're good. But that's the other thing, and this kind of ties into the Sphinx, why the Sphinx is so mysterious, because when they were studying the geometry of the face of the Sphinx, one, the two sides are perfectly symmetrical. Most faces have a little bit of imbalance in the face of people. Like most people's faces are not perfectly symmetrical. And so there have been statues found of the actual Khafre

and they've compared the faces. And most notably they compared like line angles between like what is the angle from the eye to the edge of the lips or like from the tip of the nose to the chin and those types of angles and you see that the face of the Sphinx is distinctly got a more pronounced jaw

like the angle is a lot steeper on the Sphinx, right? Than what Kffray's other statues reflect. And they showed the pictures of these angles actually in a newspaper decades ago, kind of like when, I think it was when they were like studying the Sphinx with John Anthony West and all this. So it might've been the 80s or the 90s, but a dentist from, I believe it might've been like Brooklyn or something. It's a bad start. Yeah. But a dentist from somewhere, I believe it was in the New York area, saw the pictures and the line angles of the face or whatever. And he goes, I can tell you,

I think he was an orthodontist. He goes, that jaw and that jawbone looks distinctly African-American. Like it looks African. And so that's why a lot of people don't, like especially the Egyptians, don't like the narrative that the Sphinx was not built by them. Because, you know, this is why someone like, there's so many names that we've said today. People like John Anthony West and Graham Hancock, they've been called like racist by the Egyptian government, right? Why is it? Because if what they're saying is true,

then they believe it's racist to claim that, hey, maybe whoever carved the head of the Sphinx was African, you know, and not Egyptian. Is there a way? All right, this is a weird question is in africa yeah yeah like they're basically what they're saying is that they're trying to say that someone of a different race on the african continent than what we know is the egyptian race now so you know olive skin whatever would have carved this okay i got that is there a this is way above my pay grade now but because i also i'm going back to like where kufu is but also in my mind

i'm going back to where hancock and john anthony west may be and i don't offhand remember if they have year estimations on it i think they do but i I don't want to say that for sure. Is it possible that what they're claiming though would descend to people who lived in Egypt at the time and that's what they look like as opposed to what they have, I don't know, evolved to in features now? Is that possible? Yeah, I guess that's totally possible, which makes you wonder why is the Egyptian government so adamant about covering up anything that contradicts their narrative? And their narrative is heavily guarded, right? Like anything that's contradictory evidence, they immediately suppress it. And that's like the whole thing with Zahi Hawass, who I believe is no longer like in that position.

I think he actually got caught like stealing artifacts and selling them on the black market. Oh, did he really Google that? Sahih Hawass thief. Like I think he definitely got fired by the Egyptian government. He's such an asshole, that guy. Yeah. You see anything? Former Egyptian and this is 2014 former egyptian antiquities minister

faces questions over theft from pyramid you know what didn't matt talk about this maybe that was off camera i think matt might have talked about this makes sense yeah makes sense there's also i'm trying to remember all this because matt is a million miles a minute i mean that guy's forgotten more in the last five minutes than I know about this in my whole life he showed me pictures I think on episode 153 we did 153 and 154 together

I think it was 153 he showed me pictures maybe in the second hour there of the Sphinx and there's like a hole in the head or something. And Zahi Hawass was part of the people who was trying to say, no,

that's not there. And like, wouldn't let people look at this. Yeah. Does that sound familiar? There's multiple holes in the Sphinx that go into the Sphinx. And this is kind of a big, I guess,

conspiracy around Zahi where he's flipped his narrative multiple times on camera. There's no cavities in the Sphinx. There are cavities in the Sphinx, and I've personally gone through them. I've gone into the Sphinx, you're going to see it, and it's going to be the most amazing experience ever. And then now he's back to denying it altogether. Like his levels of enthusiasm on camera about the cavities in the sphinx have uh changed and right now he's obviously in full denial mode and has been basically ever since he banned john anthony west and all them but that was like a big thing and this is also missing footage that's out there um footage of him literally on like abc with like a camera or something he's like we're gonna go into a room that's under

the Sphinx and you're going to see it with me for the first time ever. And then they go down there and basically he's like, Indiana Jones could only dream of being here, right? This footage has been talked about many times. I've not seen the footage, but apparently it exists. And now anything he says on camera is there's nothing under the Sphinx. Any of those cavities on top, they were put there by grave diggers many years later. There's nothing in there. There's not even worth looking into. Changing the tune completely. Yeah.

Conspiracy brain starts tingling when you hear that for sure. I just, that whole dynamic's weird like if you've seen the video with him it's a pretty famous video now with him and graham hancock where he won't even talk with him when someone won't even talk with someone and they're not like a fucking neo-nazi or something like that it tells me they're afraid of what might happen doesn't even it doesn't even tell me and it may tell other people this, and I understand. It would be fair for you to think this. It doesn't even tell me they're all wrong.

It tells me they're worried about something they're wrong about. But a lot of people out there are going to be like, yo, fuck that. That guy probably doesn't believe anything he's saying because you don't know what types of narratives governments may know about that could shape people's meaning of life like existence questions again. And that's why when you look at – the pyramids are so fascinating to me now. They weren't when I was younger. I just was like, oh, cool. Like I went there actually when I was maybe like 16. I thought it was the coolest shit ever.

I'm like, wow. Yeah. Wow. All right, let's go. You know, there was no thought on like,

Oh, what might happen here? But you look at it, it's pretty, I'll be banned from Egypt for saying this online probably. Uh, but my dream is to like take a bunch of mushrooms inside the great pyramid like you should do that imagine the that experience yeah play some just like just fucking

gong music or something like just get some waves sound waves going through there bro talk about a trip i'm trying to remember though because like we went i'm pretty sure we went inside it right because they take tourists through there you see that but do they have they ever released a full layout of what they claim is the layout of the inside because they don't take people everywhere on the inside i don't think right yeah i mean you can google the layout there's essentially three main rooms and a handful of shafts coming out of each room and they think a lot of these are like ventilation shafts um and but then it was recently discovered and actually again zahi hawass banned the guy who discovered this but of course one of the shafts in the queen's chamber

they thought opened up out to the outside as a ventilation shaft but they sent like this tiny robot down it and they got to the end of what they thought was like a 10-foot shaft that just kind of ended at a dead end in the in the wall because they couldn't see beyond that right um but they realized it actually ramped up at like a 40 degree angle and so this robot is seeing in with a live feed on a monitor like this in the 90s for the first time um this undis on unexplored shaft right in the queen's chamber as sexual as that sounds and and uh at the end of this shaft which was very very long they uh discover a door and the door has copper handles in it and the crazy thing about these copper handles um and they know it's a door because it's just a a dead end in this long shaft that has like edges around it with these

copper handles so it clearly looks like a door. It's currently today, if you want to Google, it's called Gattenbrink's door. It's a German last name, Gattenbrink. You don't say. He was a German scientist who was studying this shaft. So that's what it looks like. And the crazy thing about those copper handles is metal has been found nowhere else inside the great pyramid as far as being involved in the construction of it so this is the only place that metal's been could that have been put there later that's the that's the that's the big question you know and so um when they found it basically z Zahi Hawass took responsibility

or tried to take responsibility for the find and he teamed up with Gattenbrink to, they're like, we're going to find out what's behind the door. And there's videos of him saying this. And then he completely flipped his situation. And this is before, this is right around the time of the whole Sphinx issue as

well, because it's in the mid-90s. And he basically was like, he banned gatton brink from ever researching the pyramid ever again with his team and banned him from egypt period uh i don't know about egypt but he definitely banned him from researching the pyramid and uh basically is denying that there's anything behind the door. So weird. But if you look it up, you see those red paintings in the middle of the screen right next to that picture? So in the years since, they have explored what's behind that door, and this is also kind of interesting. I'm not sure how it relates to what I was telling you earlier about red paint with Khafre's name taking ownership, claiming that he built the pyramid. Behind the door was another door just like it. So they took a little tiny camera that they squeezed beyond the edges of this stone.

And they looked behind it, and like a smaller another section of the shaft with another door with copper handles they eventually got behind that and those pictures that collection of pictures is what they saw behind that second door and it was just basically like a small room with like red hieroglyphs inside of it and the red hieroglyphs uh from my knowledge uh just translates to like random numbers which they think are measurements of something. So they think it was probably put there by whoever built the pyramid to measure things out. But the weird thing about that narrative, again, Zahi aside, the weird thing about it is... I mean, there's so much weird about it.

Like there's nothing that was unintentionally done in the pyramid. So how can you explain this random shaft with this random door, with these random measurements as like the one thing that's accidental or like the one flaw in the construction of the, like there's nothing done unintentionally about it. So why would I think that this was just kind of haphazardly there and just like, oh, they forgot to finish the basement real quick. You know what I'm saying? It gets weird. Yeah. It's also, the thing that blows my mind about it though,

to take it a step farther on what we're talking about and I don't want to like get us off topic with this but it's in the same wavelength is when you look at all these different structures that aren't as magnificent as the Great Pyramid of Giza but all these different pyramid structures that exist around the world. And then you look at the history we know and we think about how much different all these cultures were, yet they all came up with that. And it gets a little dangerous because you can get to where Crazy Guy on Ancient Aliens got to with some of this stuff. Like, it's all aliens, the Mayans, whatever. But I do wonder about how ancient – I won't even say technology, like let's stop short of that for a minute and just say ancient architecture like this was shared. I've heard people argue, like literal commenters out there,

and I look at this and go, oh, that's interesting, saying like, oh, all you needed was a couple guys who made it across the sea and said, hey, here's how we built this thing. I guess technically they're right about that, but it's pretty fascinating that we see this pop up in South America, in Asia even, I think, and other different places, no? Yeah. I mean, that's one of the many aspects that makes this phenomenon really weird. It's like a whole phenomenon in itself

that around the world are ancient megalithic structures that defy explanation by modern day technology standards. And many of these are being dated to dates that we didn't know advanced humans existed back then. Like 10,000 years ago, it completely rewrites history, if that's true about the pyramid or whatever, right? Or longer, like it could very well be 20,000 years, right? But even, even, even John Anthony West and those guys have said many times

that they, they dialed back some of their estimations just because they didn't want to sound too crazy, you know? And so, yeah, as far as some of this estimations just because they didn't want to sound too crazy. Right. You know? And so, yeah, as far as some of this stuff being found in other places, I think it's very mysterious. Like, we were talking last night about a video that I'm working on currently, which is about Pumapunku. And Pumapunku is in South America. And it's got all these, like, megalithic stones that are even bigger than some of the stones that are in the pyramid like some of these stones in pumapunku which seem to be precision cut with lasers just looking at the geometry of all of all of these stones um those are being dated back to 15 000 bc and it shows similarities in like some of the the methods used to join some of these stones together

specifically one that they call the keystone cut the keystone cut what they would basically do is like cut a keystone shape into the into the joint between these stones and they would pour bronze like smolted bronze or smelted bronze or whatever into it and it would dry and it would basically lock these two stones together luke caverns has talked about this with me i believe that was on camera in episode 175 i'm pretty sure but yeah interesting yeah and so the the thing the ultimate point i want to make here is even the so that's what a keystone cut looks like the fact that keystone cuts that were used to melt bronze and use that as poured into

the cut to join the stones raises so many questions, just like any aspect of the Great Pyramid or any other stuff that you found. One question, why are these keystone cuts as a method found commonly in many different ancient megalithic sites that are currently being debated. Clearly that means, and these are sites across the world, clearly that means that either the civilization was the same or the teachers of the civilization were the same, right? And the teachers of the civilization is an interesting idea because even the civilization in Bolivia, South America, where Pumapunku is located, even they don't take credit for this ancient site, which mainstream archaeologists say was built in like 1000 AD by the Tiwanaku culture, who were essentially Stone Age people. Yes, they had a lot of advancements in like agriculture and what you can assume was maybe civilization.

But we're only saying that because of the amazing site that is the Tiwanaku Temple Complex and Pumapunku. And we're attributing it to that society. But – and that kind of led to the current civilization there today. I believe it's the Andeans. Don't look at me. Yeah. I only looked at you because you recently had a South America guy on it. Listen, that was a few months ago. That's a big expectation, all the terms being in there. So that culture, even they don't claim responsibility for building it. The mainstream archaeologists say that you did it, but they

don't take responsibility for it. They claim that their god Viracocha did it, and Viracocha in their mythology was this god who they say is the creator of the world. So they say he came out of Lake Titicaca. Yes, it's actually called Titicaca. Yeah, yeah, yeah. I knew that one. And he came and erected, essentially, with his followers the Pumapunku site overnight in one night. And they also built the Tiwanaku complex, which has a lot of interesting aspects to the stones in Tiwanaku, which is a quarter mile north of Pumapunku. But many of the carvings and inscriptions done at Tiwanaku, they say were put there after the fact because there's a lot of like symbology of Viracocha

and all of his like followers building, you know, things and stuff. And, but they say that the Tiwanaku culture engraved into flat stones that were laser cut, perfectly found, that they found, they came upon. So the fact that they say that is like – it opens more questions than answers anything. And why is the government trying to say that the Tiwanaku culture did it? There's even been people like Brian Forrester, someone who's like on a podcast circuit or whatever he goes to pumapunku like every year or two and he's made note like if you watch his youtube channel videos throughout

the last 15 years of him documenting each time he goes when i was here two years ago this ground was a little bit lower which means that these stones have been covered up even more by about two feet of dirt. Why are they covering it up? Because last time I was here, they were digging under it to see what was under it. So there's a lot of even stuff that's still buried and stuff that has been excavated and reburied at Puma Punku. You know what I'm saying? Yeah. coup you know what i'm saying yeah i i kind of wonder if some of this i don't want to like explain it away too basically but if some of the quote-unquote covering up is less

you know having to do with trying to think of how i want to say it's like government power over the people or something like that versus having some sort of religious catastrophe because you know the major world religions have a belief of a certain age if you will of humanity on this planet that you know again there can be truth to some of these religious texts i don't know but they get really uptight if you question the timeline. And like, I mean, I've had people in here like Elizabeth Weiss who will tell you straight up, like, yes, they're scientifically, there's evidence to say, and I won't say the terms because I'll fuck it up, but there's evidence to say that homo erectus or whatever,

so there is a term, split onto some other form of it at 100,000 years ago or something like that. I've had other people in here maybe with less qualifications than Elizabeth scientifically talk about that as well and so when you see timelines like the one presented saying you know it was building a thousand ad by the Andeans or whatever if suddenly you told people well I'm sorry everybody we fucked it up it's actually like building third thirty 000 bc you know now you get people you know flipping through their quran flipping through their bible their torah whatever

like wait a minute that can't be right yeah and does that cause a problem i don't know if that's the case but maybe yeah maybe yeah and i think the ultimate question that a lot of these ancient structures kind of lead to is like okay is there a lost type of technology here that we weren't aware that they had, you know, based off of what we think that they had, you know, these are people that supposedly were carving stones with copper chisels and tools and whatnot, but a lot of these stones are so precision cut, especially Puma Punku, bro, like sharp edges, like laser precision flatness, you know. And a lot of these stones are – it's actually called andesite. It's an extremely hard stone.

It's volcanic. idea that they were carving those stones and even drilling precise holes at precise measurements to precise depths that are perfectly smooth can't be done with chicken bones and bronze tools, you know? So what ultimately comes down to is like, okay, what does this ultimately mean? Does this mean that civilization was advanced and there was like an ancient cataclysm? Or does it mean that they were built by aliens? I think aliens, again, it's easy to jump to that because aliens seems to be a easy cop out for a lot of conspiracies. Right. But I don't know. I would like to think that maybe civilization was very advanced and something wiped it out. I think that's kind of the side I'm leaning towards and that's another problem too when you look at the different historian dialogues where people can't even agree or not even like agree like people will

shut people down based on talking about like some of the extinctions on the planet over time you know be like oh no there wasn't really something then or there like i can't keep track of all because i'm not in the scientific community but i i hear the noise whether it be on podcasts or you hear about people even fighting about it on the news when you read some of these stories that we've brought up today. But I think I brought this up with Elizabeth Weiss. It's kind of wild if you think about whenever some of these extinctions may have happened, you needed whatever it was, 50 people, whatever it might have been to survive.

So if you go back to it, you think about the fact that, let's say, I'll make one up right now. 25,000 years ago, there was some extinction, and 50 people survived from what was maybe a pretty advanced civilization. Not saying they had iPhones or something like that, but they accomplished some crazy shit. Whole world burns, whatever it is. These people come out from under their rock. Okay, we're going to start humanity again they start fucking having kids and the kids don't have any of that experience and those people die with most of that knowledge the little bit that maybe they're able to pass on that somehow makes its way through the ranks builds the next

society but that that stuff when i start thinking about it it get that actually gets like biblical to me yeah whoa dude one of the things that always makes me question even the ancient advanced civilization hypothesis um which you know if if if this has any merit to it and i'll tell you kind of what my thought of it is if it has any merit to it then it could lean more towards the aliens side of things right but if humanity once got to a point thousands of years ago where it was that advanced one thing i can say about our generation of people is that the more advanced we've got the more shit we've put in space why are there no ancient advanced satellites you know what i'm saying why have we never found any of that shit or have they found that shit we just don't hear about it you know possible i'm not looking up there you know i don't i don't have that but that's that's a good

question and that's like correct me if i'm wrong because i haven't seen all of it did ancient aliens try to talk about some of that like there's some shit in space or did i just make that up i mean ancient aliens has probably hit on every aspect of the ufo phenomenon possible i know one thing that is interesting and i actually have a video about this but it's the whole uh moon of mars you know and the angle of that video was why i haven't seen that video let's talk about that okay so yeah this is interesting so essentially one of the things that um buzz aldrin the guy who you guys said you interviewed the guy who unless he was on his podcast who was that what

was that guy's name alessi bart sabrell so he punched buzz or buzz aldrin punched him in the face for questioning the moon landing because what happened was he literally just like point blank journalism ran in front of him and had a bible and he's like swear on the bible that you um made it to the moon he just like out of like and there's like press and they're in a hotel and everything and buzz aldrin's like leave me alone or whatever and then he just like clocked him in the face yeah honestly good for buzz yeah anyway continue yeah so buzz was on it was like c-span or some like news program you know probably around that time in the 80s or 90s and he was like we need to go to the stars we need to go to beyond beyond Mars and to the other planets and he's like and little do people know but there's a little

potato-shaped moon around Mars that circles Mars once every seven hours and on this little potato shaped object there's a giant monolith there and when people find see that they're gonna go who put that there who put that there this is my impression of i can tell it's a pretty good one and and literally uh yeah i look if you look it up you can google uh monolith on phobos. It's the name of the moon. F-O-B-O-S or P-H? P-H-O-B-O-S. Look up this monolith. It is ginormous. So the picture that you're seeing, it's clearly got like right angles and it's a very tall shadow that has like sharp edges.

That one down, second one down right there. Yeah, click on that. So that's like it at three different zooms and the fact that you're seeing that means that it's probably several miles tall you know what i'm saying from space so that's the monolith he's referring to looking thing that's the face on on mars a few pictures one picture over the one that looks like up left oh yeah yeah i missed that one that's that's the one that's nasa has claimed they've debunked many times so do you have you never seen that photo i don't think so no so there's a nasa photo so funny people expect when

they walk in here like i've seen all this yeah i'm just an internet user like you tell me about it i mean there was like a whole movie in the 90s based off of never saw it visit that face so when i think it was in the 80s or the 90s um nasa satellites took a photo of mars's surface and they found this peculiar face on, and that's made out of like a huge mountain. And then they went back and took another photo of it and it looked completely different. And many people think that NASA changed the appearance of it.

Yeah, I think that might be a more high resolution image of it. But a lot of people have thought, oh, there's aliens on mars because that's a face that they erected or whatever but also looks like you know how like when you look in the clouds yeah i'm like you see a dog that's what nasa says so i might be on nasa's side for that one i'm not gonna lie call me a show well i so i wasn't bringing up the face that was just a face that you saw on the google image

search because i think the face is probably fake but that monolith on phobos which is the moon if you actually click on the image right below the face um that's the potato-shaped moon how big is this thing allegedly not very big so here's the crazy part um what's not very big like the size of new york city the size of New York State? Probably a large comet. Okay. Yeah. So –

Guy thinks I know how big comets are. That's a cop-out answer for me as well. It took big enough to take out the dinosaurs. Let's just put it that way all right that's okay um so essentially if you look at and this again is one of those things that ties into the existence of potential secret space force because that's where the nazis apparently have a base with the reptilians and the secret space program is on mars we're going full david ike we're going yeah again if you believe that line of alternate history i definitely don't but be on this podcast i mean this might trip you out so when i heard about that that

monolith is when i started looking into it and one of the things i noticed was that r Russia is like 0 for 9 on trying to land any rovers on Mars. And the U.S. is like 13 for 14. We're like the homes of that bitch, right? But the crazy thing is Russia has been trying to go there I think even before us, and there's always a weird reason why it fails at the last second. So a couple of the original rovers that landed on Mars were just completely not functional when they landed, right? Another one that they landed on there, I forget the name of it, but it landed and it sent back one image before dying a minute later.

And the image looked like white noise from an old TV. It looks just, there's nothing discernible in that image, right and then the they decided after that that hey if we can't get on mars let's go for phobos the moon and they named and so this mission basically they they created two different ones phobos one and phobos 2. And they sent them both like within months of each other. That way one could be a fail safe, right? Phobos 1 essentially crash lands into the surface and doesn't really do anything. It just crashes, right? The second one, Phobos 2, is their last chance to try to

get there, right? And while it's passing Phobos and going towards Mars, something knocks it out of orbit. Something just hits it, right? Some object. And it's spinning. But while it's spinning, it's flashing pictures, like taking pictures this whole time. So you have a spinning camera that's just taking pictures nonstop essentially, right? Dick Cheney is waving at the camera. Two images that came out of this, very interesting. One image has Phobos in the background. And right next to Phobos and in between Phobos and this thing is this long cigar white-shaped object.

And the measurement that they got from it was like it had to have been something like a mile long. Do we have this picture? You could probably look up the picture. Phobos to UFO, something like that. So then there's another picture that it took. And this one was taken as it was crash landing into Mars' surface because it didn't have a good entry point or whatever. So that picture right here where it looks like a pointer and a white dot

right below your mouse. You go left, one left one right there. That's the image. So that's Phobos in the back. And that is a long, mile long. And keep in mind, that's also really fucking wide if that's a mile.

You know what I'm saying? So that is interesting. Another thing. So go down a little bit. This one or this side? Right there. Right where your cursor was. Where the mouse was right there another picture

it took on Mars surface it got multiple images of this thing is a saucer shaped shadow of presumably what this object was and it was also casting a large shadow of itself onto the surface of mars that phobos was photographing after it got knocked out of orbit by this thing right um so yeah that's interesting and so essentially um russia like they put out these public images that they took like look this is the reason why we can't land on mars like but the u.s can yeah and so there's like a famous photo of like one of the higher-ups in their space program, which the Russian space program has been a joke anyways. Right. But one of the higher-ups was like she's famous for holding that photo that I showed you of that long white object in front of like a conference room full of reporters. There's an image of that somewhere.

Interesting. Yeah. Yeah, I don't know anything about that so you did a full video on that on your channel yeah yeah alright everyone make sure you go check that out Wow yeah like once you start thinking about like colonizing other planets we talked about it so nonchalantly in a way you know he lines like yeah I want to colonize mars but like elon is an american now right like he lives in america if he went to do it that's a national security issue if it's just him for other countries right it's a national security issue for us we gotta make sure you know he's working with the government, I guess, or something like that. But it gets really weird because these are things that if we lived in a utopian world, everyone should be on board with, right?

Like, okay, we're all as a world going to go explore other planets. I would argue that outside of a handful of countries in the Soviet Union, when we landed on the moon, there was probably some some jealousy that like the u.s did it but you know people are like okay this is this is good for us but if we're looking at actually being able to physically maneuver ourselves to get human beings onto another planet with the idea that we are going to populate there and create a community it gets real weird when you put those borders up in space too it's very it's that's something i think about at night sometimes because there's no as far as we know there's no precedent for that there's no it's like the deep sea yeah yeah and people worry people worry so much about like

you know the one world government and all that stuff but does that have something to do with it are they trying to like get together so eventually they could be together on that maybe i don't know i wish they'd find some better cast of characters to do it you know people look quite suspect to say the least but that's that's something that i don't think it's talked about enough that's yeah that's interesting i mean there's gonna be a lot of learning lessons, colonizing space. Oh, yeah. Like it's, and maybe that's why a lot of people in the UFO community believe like some of

them are some of these aliens are here to raise our, our consciousness, and like help humanity. Maybe part of that is just like not being territorial as you explore space. Well, and that would be the thing like if if you're taught, like hypothetically here, I don't know what to think of all that. If you're talking about one of two things, which I think would accomplish essentially the same goal, you either have aliens from a highly advanced, far advanced to us civilization from another planet

who have figured out utopian interaction, or you have interdimensionality in which case future humans are here where they figure that out then too in either of those scenarios that would make sense that they're trying to teach these these idiot you know lab rats us how to interact better but it gets weird because if you stay with the interdimensionality one for a second when i had dr michukaku in here he talks about this a lot and like his theories on this i think are i might be a little biased but i think they're very well thought out and it's all hypothetical we have to say that but because he's a theoretical physicist but you know like he always talks about if you looked at an interdimensional

nature of say something as simple as time travel that we can at least concept and we don't know if it's real or not but he's like if you time traveled back to ford theater in 1865 and made sure abraham lincoln didn't die you're not changing the reality you're coming from it creates a new river of time and a separate dimension a world in which that action was different that one thing was different in this world so now like that's a serious event right now think about like the butterfly effect with that right yeah every little action whether i tapped the table right now or tapped it over there right now there could be two different dimensions where that's the only difference that happened up to this point in time and everything after that's different which means

there's infinite dimensions in that way so to land this plane here what i'm saying is if you had some of these smarter beings coming back i don't know how much incentive they would have to actually make sure we didn't destroy ourselves because they're coming from a different dimension anyway it's like they might just be here with the popcorn to watch like yo this is the one where all these fucking idiots blow each other up with nukes hey jeff get a load of this right it could be something like that you know rick and morty yes yeah yeah i think about that sometimes yeah yeah i feel like maybe i that's what i used to think that they're just here observing us like a like zoo animals um but honestly i have no idea like i personally would love for it to be real that way i could meet one and hopefully meet the hot ones like i said but uh yeah i man i i don't know i wish i wish that we had more

information and more confirmation of certain things or you know less of this like tribal mentality where i'm right you're wrong we're on different sides of the coin here, just creating drama between us, you know? You know, there's a guy like right down the street here who claims he had sex with aliens. Really? Yeah, he lives here. It's like 95 now. Dang.

What's that guy's name, Alessi? Can we look that up? I forget his name. Danny Jones wants to come up. He's wanted to do a podcast with him for years. Bro, I interviewed this girl named Stacey Wright, who's the head of the MUFON in Arizona.

And you know who she is? I'm well aware of MUFON. Through Ron James. Got it. So she's in charge of the Arizona MUFON. And I met her because I went to a MUFON meeting in Phoenix. What's his name?

Sorry. Hit more. what's his name sorry hit more no no i i don't i don't think that's it i'm sorry go ahead is this guy like an actual like high profile story yeah yeah we we cut you off though go ahead you were talking about stacy from mufon yeah um when i was talking to her like mufon basically is what civilians report like their sightings or interactions with and then they go out and independently investigate but they that's that's the dude that's him that's him he lives here david huggins that's it i'm sorry and you've met him twice we've cut you off now

no i've not met him but danny has been trying just like i guess for the entertainment yeah to do a podcast with him for years and he was like son of a bro he lives like five blocks from you i mean does it count if she wasn't human he might still be a virgin that's a good question like what is that his opening line with most of the chicks like is that a thing that looms over him ever since? When I was 17, I lost my virginity to a female. Would you rather get AIDS your first time having sex or lose your virginity to an alien? I mean, am I dying if I lose it to an alien?

Or am I really sick if I lose it to an alien? I mean, if you talk to the guy in Virginia, Brazil. Well, yeah, but he didn't have sex with him. This guy's fucking a fossil. He's like years old does it does that make him a liar because if he had sex wouldn't she have weird diseases that we don't know about these are all valid questions right valid question yeah never thought about that i guess i guess danny will have to ask him the worst part is what if she had some technology that made him turned on even if she was repulsive like a shallow howl type of example you know what i'm saying god i love podcasts

so much fun we do so much serious shit in here sometimes it's like we gotta i mean there are human women who i don't want to touch with a 10-foot pole now we're bringing in a whole other species bro yeah it gets weird it gets weird but now finally the stacy mufon thing yeah sorry so she said that people report having sex with these you know so that's why i brought it up because you actually brought up this guy yeah and um she when i was like really that's a thing like her and her friend that she came with they were like you know how like when so my my fiance she'll be reading like literatica and she'll like literatica you know we're into like those juicy steamy novels like shades 50 shades of gray yeah that type of shit you know my girl

my fiance she said her favorite she doesn't like me talking about her book, books on podcasts. You're doing it now. But she, her favorite trope is enemies to lovers. But anyways, you know how like some girls, they'll like be into like literotica shit. And they like, when they talk about it, they get all like excited and stuff. Like Stacey, when she was like, yeah, people report having sex with it. And I was like, what do they say? Is it like good or is it nasty? Oh, yeah. I swear to God, like her and her friend, they like got all like giddy like school children they're like oh yeah they say it was amazing yeah exactly bro that's what i'm saying

that was what i was basically like okay yeah jumping on the washing machine like oh yeah it was wild yeah apparently the reptilians got some big dick oh my god oh can we go back to the pyramid jumping all over yeah but i but we got off that with because i got us off it talking about the locations of other places but the thing i wanted to ask you about and i'll get some of it wrong if i like try to repeat the entire theory so i won't but essentially luke cavern's argument which he was and i'm grateful for this very open to being wrong about he's like luke is very sober about this stuff which i like but he was trying to say that there is an argument that kufu actually did build the pyramid or whatever i know you disagree with that but one of the things that admittedly even

for him was like a yeah this gets weird is how the fuck they even got the stones there Because the still I don't remember the weights and whatever but maybe you know some of that offhand like the stones are so big and they had to get them from like a Maybe it's somewhere in the Nile and they had to move it. I don't remember how far but very far is there any Real physical explanation for how that could happen i know we've seen the one video with the guy who claims to be able to move stones we've shown it on the podcast but i i don't that doesn't that doesn't also then affect like how they got him up high or moved him that fast across land to be able to build this within whatever it was a

hundred year period or something well it's actually 20 years is what it took supposedly okay yeah that's why i'm trying not to do numbers because i'll get it wrong so so yeah you're correct the the basically the stones were taken from two different places like quarried i think is what the term is right queried from two different places and one of the places um was where the larger stones that make up the intricate interior come from. So the stones go from two tons basically at the low end, all the way up to 80 tons. And the larger ones are kind of what make up the intricate interior and the tunnels and whatnot. And so those larger 80 ton ones were the ones that were quarried from 500 miles south of Giza.

Now, people look at that and they go, well, clearly the Nile River is there. Clearly they used the Nile River to transport these 80-ton stones. But when you look at the boats that supposedly – and I'll just bring it back to Mahomes. Mahomes, the greatest quarterback ever. Even his trainer said after his dad bod pictures come out came out you can't launch a cannon out of a canoe well that's a good quote right that's a good quote so i tell them show me one of those old ass crickety wooden boats carrying an 80 ton stone and then do that times like how many there's over two point there's 2.3 million stones inside

the pyramid right so get this 2.3 million stones going from two tons to 80 tons that are so precisely cut with laser precision that there's no mortar or any concrete used to hold the thing together it's literally the the joints between these, you can't even fit a razor blade between them. And it's withheld its structure better than any of the copycat pyramids that came hundreds, if not thousands of years later, using nothing but its own weight over the test of time, right? And these stones, for them to have built it in 20 years,

which is the official narrative, because that's an ancient Egyptian pharaoh, he's not going to have 500 years to build this thing for his tomb. He's got 20 years maybe, right? So he apparently built it in 20 years. That means they had to place a stone like 600 stones a day or something like that. Those were some impressive slaves. Impressive, right? I think that's like a couple of stones every few seconds or something like that. Those were some impressive slaves. Impressive, right? I think that's like a couple of stones every few seconds or something,

just completely unrealistic, just from the sheer size of it. And we're not even talking about the astronomical alignments and the precision measurements of like how it's literally a scale model of the Northern hemisphere of planet earth to the ratio of one to forty three thousand

two hundred and it's uh perfectly accurate to within two to three hundred feet randall carlson who's looked over all the satellite data um and digested a lot of it famously is like now if you took 10 measurements of the measurements of the earth all the measurements would be different even with satellites and they would all differ by about 200 to 300 feet. Why is that? It's because the natural shifting forces on the Earth, from the tidal forces to the volcanic activity, it's always warping the surface of the Earth by within about 200 to 300 feet at any given point in time. So the fact that they were accurate to the scale to within two to 300 feet is mind boggling. Aside from the fact that it's also more perfectly aligned to true north than even our

buildings that we've tried in modern day to accurately aligned to true north. It's, uh, it's accurate with to within like three 60th of a degree, I believe i could go on for days oh no i know i you know if if you change the timeline obviously in this case where kufu didn't build it and maybe you go back to something like this somehow was able to survive an extinction event and came from some sort of not necessarily like atlantis itself but like an atlantean type civilization that had things figured out it's just very hard to think about because we think about all our innovations based on the order of resources with which we were able to create things on the way to get there right so we think about having the iphone for example through the creation of the internet and, you know, a long time before that, the phone and around that time, electricity,

right? But that doesn't mean that a pattern to get to something on a scale as impressive as the equal of what our iPhone is in some other lane wasn't done by other resources that were somehow created that we can't concept because we don't have it in our civilization within an ancient civilization. That was kind of a word salad, but does it make sense? Yeah. It gets – again, it gets weird. All this stuff gets weird. But it's fun to talk about.

Yeah, I love it. I know you do. It's a lot of fun to talk about yeah it's it's it's i know you do it's it's it's a lot of fun to talk about and you know i'd love to get some some more people in here who have diverse beliefs on what this stuff could be it's it's very fun to go back and forth with the quote-unquote experts have you ever heard of this dude named michael stratt s-t-r-a-t-t uh s-c-h-r-a-t-t no i don't think so can we pull him up yeah he's he's been on on youtube documentaries and ancient aliens a few times he's one of those guys who's done a lot of but he's the aerospace a military aerospace historian um i interviewed him a couple

years back and i was very surprised yeah Yeah, that's him. Um, actually Stacey Wright, the Phoenix Mufon lady, she introduced, introed us together, told me he would be a good guy to interview. So I interviewed him and I was very surprised. If you ever watch any of his content, he has his own like documentary as well. He's studied all the high profile, um, UFO sightings, uh, going from like sightings going from close encounter of the third kind all the way just to the first kind. And he's gone through all the files and research. And he's of the belief, ironically, that a lot of this is secret military technology. He thinks the Phoenix Lights was a hologram.

He thinks Socorro was a nuclear uh craft from a local base and he was on ancient aliens he's been on a lot of those programs right must have hated him on there yeah they're like yo fuck this guy yeah so i've when i realized that and he he'll show you pictures and he'll tell you the the incident um he has illustrations of every sighting and you name it, like all the high profile ones you can think about. Let's get him in here. You should. I haven't asked him his take on Travis Walton. I'd be very curious about that, but I've always thought it'd be a great idea to get him in here with someone like a James Fox, just as an example,

because we've been talking about him. Yeah, I would love that. Because James has gone so deep specifically on Socorro. Yes. And I've made a video about it because of the interview you did with him as one of the resources that I use for that. Because I didn't realize he had gone so deep on Socorro. And when he was saying this was the case

that flipped J. Allen Hynek, I was hooked to become a believer yeah that was episode 138 i think so someone like him who's also gone just as deep as many on many of these sightings who thinks it's actually not aliens i would be very curious to see what how the the debate between that yes you know i would do i i love that yeah that's exactly what we need like good in person not behind twitter talking out facts because i guess none of us know but like let's let's see what the evidence is because now just bring me in to be a guest on the debate yeah you can fucking

come here rip your blunt and enjoy but that you said you were having this guy on or you had him on i i talked to him for like two hours. I'm going to check that out. And then, yeah, I'll send you the – it's actually posted on my channel. It's why the US military thinks UFOs are man-made is like the title. And I didn't put his name or face in the thumbnail. I probably should. But I didn't know if he had a big enough name to put his face in the thumbnail. But it's got like 19K views or something like that on my channel.

Oh, yeah. That's the interview. Yeah. Okay. Got it. So I did ask him towards the end. Again, if I meet someone who's skeptical, I start to see – I want to know exactly how skeptical they are on a scale of like 0 to 100. Right. to see, I want to know exactly how skeptical they are on a scale of like zero to 100. I don't know

if I phrased it exactly like that, but I basically was like, so do you believe that 0% of these are extraterrestrial? Like 100% of all of this is secret technology. Going back to the 1856 US airship wave or something like that. I think I might've butchered the year, but it was in the 1800s. There was was a wave which is also interesting because he's gone through history of of sightings and kind of like the hat man that i told you about last night it seems like the the physical form of ufos that are cited tend to match the time era that they're from the ufos that were being seen in the 1800s looked like wooden pirate ships floating in the sky. But they were anti-gravity just slowly hovering. Could that also be programmed

though? Could that be? I'm just taking the devil's advocate of like the alien civilization here, being able to change the appearance to match what these people might believe very potentially it's so weird yeah so he thinks that that was even uh maybe a secret organization that had access to high level technology he he doesn't make the leap that it's aliens and he doesn't even make the leap of where they might have gotten this technology from but he makes the argument that all of this is clearly man-made technology from just like rivets and seams that you might see on some of these things. Some of them have serial numbers. One of the cases I remember he specifically brought up was Socorro, New Mexico. And so

that one, yeah, I've always wondered what would his conversation look like with someone who is a true believer that in a lot of these cases that it's quite the opposite you know yeah i have to check that out i gotta watch that video that you did with him that's that's really cool really cool so coro james was saying we could do a whole podcast on that maybe we will because there's so much there. It's just like – and he got a lot of data when he was making what eventually was becoming the project The Phenomenon because some of the interviews in there were stuff he did in the 90s. And this thing came out in like 2020. And that was a case he kept coming back to because it was just so wild. But dude, it's getting weird out there yeah it's getting real weird out there what's what's what's the next move with your channel you're

making that video on south america which will probably be out when this comes out we're filming this one a little ahead of time so we'll have the link to your channel in the description for everyone but what else are you working on um working on the podcast that we just started like a month ago um that's more of a newer thing i would still consider my main thing my youtube channel um so that's that's basically it i'm trying to pump out more content like my goal is more frequent posting and i've kind of talked to you a little bit about my workflow where it's taken me the more complex these videos have gotten because my goal has always been longer because some of the original ones

were like five to 10 minutes. Yeah, you have varying lengths, which is tough on YouTube. Yeah. YouTube's algo has an issue with that. So I was given the advice to try to hit 20 minutes and it seems like a lot of my audience was craving longer videos from the comments.

So I slowly worked it up to 20 minutes. And the first video that hit 20 minutes was a Sphinx. And within a month that hit 2 million views. So ever since then, that's kind of become my benchmark, but that's led to me actually just like becoming a little bit too perfectionist at times where it's like the video takes a month or two to get out. So my goal is to at least start posting once every two weeks this year. All right. Good. Yeah. Good. Yeah. I mean, more is if, if the quality is there and I think your quality is there more, more is good on there. Obviously we've moved the cadence of this podcast up to, we're doing like two a week. So, you know, I, I think you got to stay in front of people.

You gotta, you gotta, there, there's so many shorts that you were telling me about. It's about staying in front of people. Yeah. It's like, you know, there's so many shorts that you yeah were telling me about it's about staying in front of people yeah it's like you know there's so many amazing content creators out there and there's room for everyone but the the the best among them who are going to get the attention are the ones who are constantly providing value for their people so you know obviously like you're putting your heart and soul into this just keep going with it and you'll you'll get a cadence you'll get some editors to be able to do stuff i was telling you like i edited every single frame and every single thing on this podcast until the end of april 2023 and i edited almost everything on this podcast until what was it like november of last year and now i started you have to like

you know we have way more going on with the actual business itself and trying to survive here and put out more content and get more people in here and there's so much that goes into that like alessi and me are packed to the gills but the idea is like you scale it up by also now you've demonstrated you can create the content and i'll create more of it so i i think you'll get there no problem man but once again we'll have your link in the content and I'll create more of it. I think you'll get there, no problem, man. Once again, we'll have your link in the description and everything. I encourage people to go subscribe. This was a fun convo, bro. It was a good time. Thanks for coming

out from all the way out there. Thanks for the invite. Get me out here to Jersey. Maybe I'll have to come back in the future. Especially if you moderate a debate between this guy and James, bro. We'll give you a front row seat to that. That would be cool. I'm going to watch your episode with this guy and then talk to you about that.

We'll figure out what's up. But everybody else, you know what it is. Give it a thought. Get back to me. Peace. Thank you guys for watching the episode. Before you leave, please be sure to hit that subscribe button

and smash that like button on the video. It's a huge help. And also, if you're over on Instagram, be sure to follow the show at Julian Dory Podcast or also on my personal page at Julian D. Dory. Both links to follow the show at Julian Dory podcast or also on my personal page at Julian D. Dory. Both links are in the description below. Finally, if you'd like to catch up on our latest episodes, use the Julian Dory podcast playlist link in the description below. Thank you.