Kermode & Mayo’s Take - Danny Boyle, Men, Pistol, The Midwich Cuckoos

Episode Date: June 3, 2022

Simon speaks to renowned filmmaker, producer, and writer Danny Boyle to discuss his new Disney+ series ‘Pistol.’  Mark reviews folk horror ‘Men’ which stars Jessie Buckley and Rory Kinnear, the new adaptation of ‘The Midwich Cuckoos’, Mia Hansen- Løve’s ‘Bergman’s Island’ and ‘Pistol’. Plus, TAKE IT OR LEAVE IT: Ukrainian special. Box office chart and more. You can contact the show by emailing [e-mail] or find us on our social channels. Show timings: 14:42 Men Review 24:42 Box Office Top 10 34:43 Danny Boyle Interview 49.36 Pistol Review 01:00:54 The Midwich Cuckoos 01:07:55 What’s On 01:10:12 Bergman Island A Somethin’ Else & Sony Music Entertainment production. Find more great podcasts from Sony Music Entertainment at sonymusic.com/podcasts Exclusive! Grab the NordVPN deal ➼ https://nordvpn.com/take Try it risk-free now with a 30-daycare  money-back guarantee! Learn more about your ad choices. Visit podcastchoices.com/adchoices

Something that's... ... What's up Mark? What's up Simon? I kind of missed not being in the in chapel. Yeah, it was lovely wasn't it? It was very good. Thanks to everyone for turning up. Sorry if you couldn't get in or if we were like so far away from where you live,

there wasn't even remotely possible for you to come and... But it was a really lovely venue. And there was definitely thing that when you walked out, not when you went one walked out on stage, well, obviously when you, but when one walked out on stage, you were kind of struck by the majesty of the venue. And it was terrific. And it would be nice to take the church back to chapel at some other time.

Yes. Great organ playing, including by our guests. Yes. Who thought, who knew? Who knew? Such special skills. Who knew? Such special skills.

Next time, we'll have to get our guests if they can play the organ to play something that we can play for rights reasons, rather than something that we can't play for rights reasons. I had a that we can't play for rights reasons. I had a very good week in the interim. We're clearing out my mum's house at the moment. Okay. Because she's moved, so we're selling our house. So we, as one does it various times in your life,

we're going to, the house is full of clutter. Yes. So I found this file, which has got all my school reports in. I have, can I just say, I have exactly the same file at home, but I also found clearing out my mum's house some years ago. So I brought in my school reprillian for a worthy high school for boys July, 1974. And the reason that the reason it struck a chord in I'm mentioning here is you know my theory of the double infection when it comes to your

rantings. So if there's a film that you particularly go off on one about it's because not only is it a bad film but it's an offensive film. It's that double right. There's one line in my from my maths teacher. It's a terrible report like I just say to the list this is a real thing. It's genuinely holding, it says from the, let me see at the top, the high school for boys, worthy. Yes. So for example, this is how good I am.

Chemistry, term placed 19th, exam percentage, 30%. Most disappointing, a greater effort is required. You know, he will find the fact I wrote the H. Books hilarious. But anyway, he's the comment that I like the most because it's a superbly written district. You couldn't say, respect all the teachers out there who are currently maybe doing exams and all that kind of stuff and thinking about what they're going to write on the darlings reports.

I don't think you could say this anymore. For maths, set four, he says he does not seem to realize how little effort he makes. So he's not saying he's not trying hard enough. It's not that. It's just, and I don't, he does not seem to realize how little effort he makes. I will bring you, my maths teacher. I will bring you one of my school reports next week, but I should just sit on a site of this before, but my mum was very proud around the town? One of the problems, what was it, went past her house. So she'd just go to her, she'd go home. And at the end of year report, when it came to P.E. and cross country, it just said, who is this child? Excellent. A general comment at the end, his rather lighthearted approach to study masks, his real ability. There you go. And, and that is something which is still true to this day, isn't it?

That you're rather lighthearted approach. Hey, incidentally, what? Over the weekend, I met Lem Sise, who I've known for years and years. Oh, yes, nice guy. Top writer. OBE. Oh, really? OBE. Everyone is an OBE. I know. I didn't even know.

Over the weekend, I met Poet Laureate Simon Armitage, good friend. And Lem Sise,, top poet OBE. What are you again? I'm only an MBE. He is nothing. He is nothing. I feel as though I've failed. I'm gonna go back and see if I can trade it up.

Thanks very much for all the emails, by the way. We're gonna start with this one from Lackler. Dear Top Gun Maverick and... That's your response. Oh, you see, Top Gun Maverick! On arriving at your family. So we're not in the church. You can only do that when there's an Aussie. On arriving to your fantastic live show in Showbiz and also London. It was both exciting and a little terrifying to see the physical embodiment of your church following in the form of a spectacular but very ruling, queue of excited witter takers. I made my way, Julie, to the back,

about two street corners away to take my place amongst them. Being still a few minutes before doors open, they continued a stream of slightly bewildered fellow attendees, continuing past to join the ever-growing union centipede. Don't mention centipede. When one such traveler unable to see around the next corner as the lion extended indefinitely

before them stopped to ask me how long there was to go, I saw my moment to reassuringly tell them it'll be all right at the end. And if it's not all right, it's not the end. Police to report, it really was more all right in the end. It was more than all right in the end. And when it comes to the live shows, I certainly hope it isn't the end. Well, we had a great time. So it definitely won't be the end. And when it comes to the live shows, I certainly hope it isn't the end. Well, we had a great time, so it definitely won't be the end of our live shows.

It should be known that Ben Bailey-Smith and Rufus Jones met up for a couple of sharpness in the Compton Arms just around the back of the Union Chapel. Right. They stumbled out into the evening light, like this after the show, like a modern day with nail and eye. And the queue had already reached a length of several hundred

meters, so it's before the show. Ben Baby Smith tripped up on his way out the pub and into the queue. The traditional greeting was exchanged, and Ben and Rufus made their way round to these substitute entrance. You can, by the way, and this is a slightly clumsy script line, I think, Simon, you can, therefore, sign up at cummer.mo.com to be the first to hear about the next show. Now, I think that's almost unnecessary and slightly gratuitous.

Did, but did Ben really fall over into the... Apparently, they staggered out, you know, after the sharpeners. I remember Steve Wully, the great movie producer, once came to a party that I had in which a good friend of mine was playing jazz piano. Steve Wully became so overcome by the, my Nick Cooper's jazz stylings that he had in which a good friend of mine was playing jazz piano. Steve Wally became so overcome by my Nick Cooper's jazz stylings that he had to go and have a breath of fresh air and took a lie down in the rose bush. Really? He's at a comfortable place for a lie down. Anyway, what's coming up on the show as far as you know? I'm going to review pistol,

a Bergman Island and the Midwitch Cookies on TV and men and we have a special guest indeed We do and you might as well get it out of the way now or Danny boy It is Danny Boyle director extraordinaire mark. He's not in the room when I did the interview So that'll be the last that probably won't be the last time He does that. It's talking about his new series Pistol about the rise of the sex pistols plus be recommending some streaming films available to watch right now In take it or leave it and we'll run through the box office top 10. And as if that wasn't enough coming on Monday, there'll be another take to where we'll be spoiling the Wolf of Wall Street, although it might be spoiling

itself already. Plus doing a one-frame back-on punk movies to inform your viewing of Danny Boyle's pistol. And in a couple of weeks, Mark will be really adding value to our extra takes as we watch together some of the greatest cinematic creations of all time and supply you with a watch-along podcast, starting with Pirates of the Caribbean, the Curse of the Black Pearl, recording the last bit of that later today, which is very exciting, Mark. As it says here, it's Mark head on table. It says here that Mark gets to choose the next one.

Okay. But I've already made it very clear. It can't be Jeremy with the exaspect. Anything else will be fine. Can you email Correspondence at... ...commoda-mail.com. Just remind me of all the reviews Jeremy. Why I'm never ever going to watch Jeremy. You play that one. Greatest hits radio. We got an ass storm. Correspondent, yeah, but we care about ratings. Correspondents at COVIDOM.com, your thoughts on the first Pirates film will be very welcome.

You can subscribe to our Extra Takes and Apple podcasts to get all of that, or if you prefer a different platform, you can head to extratakes.com. If you're already a subscriber, thank you very much indeed. We love you. A great stuff to come for you.

The squad is growing, Mark. And we are the, apparently, the biggest subscription show, EvesS, and the fastest growing. And that is actually true, right? It sounds as though it's just guff, but it's true guff. That's true, that is guff. Honestly, guff is so hard to tell, isn't it? Come join the Vanguard.

Now, this is a top email. Is that a song from Sound of Music? Wasn't it come join the Vanguard? Almost. Eric Kuslovsky, heritage listener. Right. From Brooklyn. This is Eric, the unquiet American,

from the Union Chapel Show audience. Oh, OK. I realized I should have been more specific when asked where I traveled from to attend your program. I should have specifically, and patriotically said, I hailed from Brooklyn. When Mark rightly reminded me to vote in our upcoming elections.

OK. I almost wished I had time to explain slash deplore the American electoral process of gerrymandering. Among the other inherently dysfunctional facets of the constitutional democratic republic, that would make my vote as someone from Brooklyn have less weight than someone else in New York and indeed other parts of the United States. I also won't explain gerrymandering in this email, except to say that it is bad. Yeah, we all know what gerrymandering is. Named after Elbridge Gerry. Oh, I didn't know.

Yes, apparently he was a governor of Massachusetts in 1812, and there was a lot of jiggery pokery as it was known before. No, no, no. Back then, but there is a particular state in, which was shaped like a salamander. Right. And so they put some journalist, enterprising journalist, put Jerry and salamander together

and they made it a Jerry Mander. You know, I, and that is true. I'm sorry, that's how, did you, do you know that because you studied history? No, I know that because I thought, I should look it up because they're talking about Jerry Mandering in this email. So I thought I just did a bit work.

Very good. Anyway, says Eric, allow me one Brooklyn anecdote which you might appreciate. Yes. Which I think you will. Can I just say, I have to just say the half of the carry on. Thank you. Several years ago, my wife and I boarded a full,

but not very crowded subway train. You're going to love this story. Okay. Really, really love this story. Okay, good, good. This is going to be your favorite story of the year. I'm sitting back. Very crowded subway train, along with long bench seats

to head home into Brooklyn from Manhattan. Yes. There was just room enough on one of the benches to fit two people. Or rather, there would have been enough room, if not for one rather awkward way, a thin gentleman was sat on the bench. He was sat halfway off the bench at a 45 degree angle.

He had pivoted himself in such a way as to hopefully prevent anyone from sitting next to him. It's the kind of posture that you have when you're on a train, and you don't want anyone else to sit next to you. Or Jacob Reese Morgwood had that was docked in the... In the House of Commons. I gestured to this gentleman to indicate that we're going to squeeze in next to him, not that it should have required any squeezing at all. The little bird song, Huffed and made to resist.

I'm normally a pacifistic and frankly timid person, but I took one look at this bird song and thought, I can take him. I squatted my plump rump right next to this picky and privileged denizen of the bench, and he finally conceded the barest of space with noted animosity to me and my wife. I took no further notice of the bird song, and we made our way into Brooklyn. The not-so-charming fellow, a lighted about halfway through our journey, exiting at a

not-so-trendy but established and busy Brooklyn neighborhood. Upon the bird song's departure, my wife said something to the effect of, wow, that was Jordan Catalano. I had to think for a moment who that was, and I quickly realized that Jordan Cataleno is the name of a character on one of my wise favourite television shows called My So-Cold Life. The Jordan Cataleno character was the heartthrob or so I gather. I turned to my wife and remarked, so that little bird song was Jared Leto.

What? That's all I got. Thanks again for the wonderful time at the Union Chapel. So that person on the bench was Jared Leto. Wow! Wow! He's every bit the same in real life as he is in the movies. You can imagine that.

So you're already a TV star, and you act and behave like that. Anyway, and Eric Syed, Eric Kuzlovsky, heritagelist and voter, local provincial government agent of Brooklyn. But you say you're right, that is my favourite email of the week, probably of the year. My so-called life also starred Claire Daines, who we've discussed recently. And maybe, maybe I'm speaking half of the listener here in the traditional Greek choric role. Yes. Do you think you could do Jared Leto telling people not to sit next to him on the tube? I'm a sit-aheer,

I'm a sit-aheer, you're not a sit-aheer because I'm a sit-aheer, I've very thin, but I take up a lot of space in it. Ha ha ha. See, that's very good. We could have a regular Jared Leto feature. I think we already have. Correspondence at comedameo.com. You're going to spell it out. Yeah, that's right.

And, um, stranger things. So, streamers. So, we're going to do some box office and emails, but last week streamers, and on Stranger Things, which is now up there. It is. And people are enjoying it. All it's many hours.

Michelle Garland, Stranger Things 4, is more grown up, like the characters, as we see them, wrestle with their finding their own identities and how they fit in the group. The tension, horror and breadth of the storytelling has ramped up. I think it's the best series yet. Daniel Stocks says, if you're not invested in the series, I can see why Series 4 would be a chore to watch. However, for someone like me who's fully invested in it, I've loved all the series so far. Series 1, good opener. Series 2, my favourite, Series 3, mostly good. Series 4, very good and always engaged. The episode lengths were never an issue for me.

No, that's fine. I mean, I didn't think it was a chore. I just thought it was more of the same with the emphasis on more, but certainly a comeback after series three, which was a bit of a damp squib. And if people are puzzled why Kate Bush is turning up in the charts again, it's running out very well. It's because the influence of strangers. Because of stranger things. And if you work on a radio show which plays, you know, 70s, 80s and 90s,

you're looking at that and thinking, oh, well, I think we should play some more Kate Bush. And that is always a good thing, always good thing. So one of the movies that we discussed last week when Roy Keneer was on, organist and some time actor Roy Keneer. That's right. And Ender of Sanjeev Baskar's acting career was the movie Men. And at the time, it was slightly uncomfortable because the only two people had seen it.

One was very conneer because he's in it and me. But now you have seen it. Yes. So, Men, the latest from Alex Garland, who's the writer director behind X Macchina, which I think you loved, and the nihilation, which as I point out every time I mention it, was one of the movies that Obama, Barack Obama, listed as one of his favorite films of the year. His favorite movies of the year lists are always worth checking out. So this is a playfully twisted gender fairy tale with body horror trappings.

Jesse Buckley, the great Jesse Buckley, is Harper. She is the survivor of an abusive relationship who has escaped into the verdant surroundings of the dream country house with the emphasis on the dream. The whole palette of the countryside that she goes into is you know oversaturated greens purple and blue flowers. There is an apple tree dropping forbidden fruit onto the grass. Once she gets into the house, it's kind of painted blood. I mean, the whole thing tells you, this is a dreamy, fairytale, hyperreal, or, you know, unreal environment.

The house is rented by Jeffrey, who is played by Rory Keneer, who actually says forbidden fruit, scrumping. And she tells her friend on the phone that Jeffrey is a very specific type. And it's significant that she says that because everyone that she then meets, every man that she then meets while she's in this dream country house, is a type. Whether it is the smarmy vicar who puts his hand on her knee whilst apparently sympathising with her and telling her that she's basically to blame for all everything that happened

to her, or the policeman who's rolling telling her that she's basically to blame for all everything that happened to her. Or the policeman who's rolling his eyes when she's getting very upset that she appears to have a naked stalker on the grounds of the police saying, well, it's harmless enough. And then suddenly turns up, again, the character, all these characters are played by Rory Keneer, including the character who then turns up on her lawn and attempts to get into the house is a clip. What is it? What's happened? What are you doing here? by Rory Kania, including the character who then turns up on her lawn and attempts to get into the house. What are you doing? I think we should explain a few things about that clip. The thumping on the ground was all Apple's falling out of

the tree. And Rory Keneer, who you didn't hear in that clip, but is there as the police movement. First is the policeman who then disappears. Doesn't say anything. And then another character, Rory, incarnation, charging the door, which is why she slams the door and says, why are you doing this? So firstly, the fact that all the characters are played by one actor, by Rory Kinnit, tells you something very clear. And some people have said,

why doesn't she react to the fact that all the characters, all the male characters are played by the same person? I think I did mention that to Rory. And, well, the reason is because it's a dramatic contrivance. It's a device to say, look, this is telling you something about the way in which she perceives the world. Or perhaps it's telling you something about the way that the world is.

That all these men are on one level the same. And of course she can't mention it because it's a dramatic contrivance that is there to make a dramatic point as opposed to something which is realistic. The other thing is that the uniformity of all the men means that no matter how nice or unpleasant or naked with trees growing out of them or standing behind a bar they seem, they all fundamentally share certain traits which are that they're variously smug, patronizing, controlling, predatory. There is also this kind of wicker man style folk horror element in that one of them is an incarnation of the green man,

replete with bits of branches growing out of his body. And we see that the face of the green man first on a font in the church, and then we sort of see it out in the world. And there's also, we're going to talk later on in the show about a new version of the Midwitch Cookies. There's also something oddly midwitchy about the village because the village appears to be completely cut off from everywhere else. And it is just this village in which everyone is played by Rory Keneer and she is completely isolated. And at certain moments, that isolation is heightened by the fact that there appears to be some kind of electrical signal that's going on. So, it's a fairytale. It's a metaphorical story. And in the third act, it goes completely mad, but in a way that makes perfect sense within the drama itself.

In the third act, it becomes a story about mailness, birthing, mailness, and, you know, a great big sort of primal edging and you're rolling your eyes already. But I wanted to leave at that point. Okay. But as we mentioned last week, if you don't like mother and all those things, then you're not going to be a fan of this. And the mother comparison is good because the whole thing about mother is, you can read

mother in a number of ways, but there's one way in which it is clearly to be read, which is a creation myth, it's a garden of Eden story, it's a story about God and sacrifice and the selfishness of God. And in the case of this, yes, you could probably read many different ways. There's a lot of stuff about how when they were making it, everybody had their own ideas. Yeah, sure, but it does really have one central idea, which is that this is a version of monstrous maleness, and some of it seems to be monstrous, some of it doesn't seem Jeffery, for example, it's a bit tim nice, but dim, and he seems perfectly fine. He's certainly nothing like a scary as the naked man charging a number of the tree growing out of his head. I kind of

enjoyed this. I think it's not quite as complicated as it thinks it is. I mean, I think all this stuff about it's open to various different interpretations. I don't know that it is. The last third is full on body horror in the manner of Brian Yusner's society or of David Cronenberg's video drawing. Or in fact, any of kind of David Cronenberg's

fleshy Body Horror pictures. I think it's got some, I admire the fact that when it decides to go full fairy tale mad, it doesn't do it out of nowhere, because there's almost nothing in the film, right from the very beginning, which you can almost see as a flying sequence. There's almost nothing in the film that tells you this is a realist depiction of the world.

The whole thing builds its fairytale air right from the very beginning. So it's not like it follows some kind of realist thread and then goes crazy in the third act. It's that what it does is it cranks it up over the course of the movie. It has an absolutely brilliant soundtrack by Benzolz, Brian Jeff Barrow, which has got these choral voices that sound like they're kind

of coming up from the bowels of hell. And it's ambitious and it's a film about ideas. My reservation would be that I don't think the ideas are anything particularly special. I think they're fairly straightforward and I think it's like a one viewing will pretty much tell you what you need to know. I'm not convinced that it's as ambiguous as people think it is, but I did enjoy it. It's not ambiguous. No, it's not ambiguous. But I did enjoy it and I'm very aware that you didn't. Correct. I did not enjoy it, but I don't enjoy body horror, so therefore, yeah, exactly. I was happy to go and see Rory Keneer and happy to watch Jesse Buckley.

Rory Keneer is great at doing the individual... I mean, because those individual characters that he plays are all individuated, you do see them all as different people, albeit part of the same person, including a bit when his head is transposed onto the body of a young child. Yes. Which again, he's very wicker man, because the young child is first seen wearing a mask and looking very creepy, which is very wicker man. And it's certainly true to say you see an awful lot of Rory Kniehm.

Still to come, Mark, what are we doing? I'll be reviewing the Midwitch Cookies, which I just mentioned and Bergman Island and Pistol. And I'll be interviewing the one and only Danny Boyle director of Danny Boyle. Director of that new series on the home of punk rock Disney Plus. After this. Happy Nord Christmas.

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guarantee. The link is in the podcast episode description box. Hi, esteemed podcast listeners, Simon Mayo. I'm Mark Kermot here. I'm excited to let you know that the new season of the Crown and the Crown, the official podcast, returns on 16th of November to accompany the sixth and final season of the Netflix epic Royal Drama series. Very exciting, especially because SuperSub and Friend of the Show Edith Bowman hosts this one. Indeed, Edith will take you behind the scenes, dive into conversation with the talented cast and crew, from writer and creator Peter Morgan to the crown's Queen Elizabeth, in Mel Distant. Other guests on the new series include the Crown's research team, the directors, executive

producers Suzanne Mackie and specialists such as Voice Coach William Connaker and props master Owen Harrison. Cast members including Jonathan Price, Selene Daw, Khalid Abdullah, Dominic West and Elizabeth the Bikki. You can also catch up with the story so far by searching The Crown, the official podcast, wherever you get your podcast. Subscribe now and get the new series of the crown, the official podcast, first on November 16th.

Available wherever you get your podcasts. Okay, and we're back, and here is Andrew Reynolds, a Vangardista. Vangardista. Dear Baker Intenant, in the words of Inigo Montoya, you keep using that word. I do not think it means what you think it means. Which word? Mark uses the word ambivalent to describe the ending of the power of the dog in episode

3 of Take 2. Ambivalent means having mixed feelings or contradictory ideas about something or someone. Yes. That's from the OED. Yes. The ending is incapable of having feelings, so it cannot be ambivalent. One can be, but the ending cannot, instead... It's ambiguous.

...open to more than one interpretation not having one obvious meaning. At the risk of laboring the point, most people use the word ambivalent when they mean indifferent. The latter meaning having no particular interest. I would never use it to mean indifferent or Or not preparing one thing every other day. But this is like, when I said an avocado, can't decide what it's meant to feel like. And you said, no, it can't decide anything because it's a fruit. Yes.

It's like, okay, if you wanna go down that absolutely strict, this is how it is. And ending cannot have any feeling about how it is, then fine. You know ambiguous. There's an ambiguous ending. There's a word, there's a phrase in William Peter Blatt's Legion in which Kingdom and Turns to Actkins and says, the problem is he hears no music.

Box of his top 10, at 17, between two worlds. Which I thought was actually pretty good. I've read some very sniffy reviews about it. I mean, it's Juliet Binoche as a character who goes undercover in very low-paid jobs. And she's, like the original was an expose of the cleaning industry on the fairies in France. And there was some criticism about the film

being more about her character lying and being duplicitous to the people that she ends up working with because she's pretending to be one of them when she isn't. She's actually middle class and she's gonna go back to that life. I thought that was what made the film dramatic and I liked it.

She's great in the staircase, which is untali at the moment with the comments. She's great in everything. That would just be a competition. Tell us a thing in which Juliet Binoche is not great. Number 10 is F3, which I don't know. I haven't, wasn press-screen as far as I know if you've seen it, let us know. UK, number 9, America, number 10, fantastic beast, the secrets of Dumbledore. And are they going to be more Potter movies? Is there more? Yes.

Really? Of course. Okay. It's in the chart, it's making money. Yeah, but it's on the way down. I no, it's not right, isn't it? Number eight, the lost city. To quote you. It's all right. It is. But you know, I know, I know.

There was a lot's wrong with it's all right. All right, we've mentioned this word satisfactory before. Yes, satisfactory meaning good enough. Yes. It is worth going to see. It's satisfactory. I know, whereas now the satisfactory means. Please, please, please, please, please, please, please. Number seven here whereas now it's Satisfactory means. It's a little bit disappointing.

Number seven here, five in America, the bad guys. Which has done better with the animation than I expected it to. I mean, I thought it was fine, but I didn't expect it to do as well as it has done. Number six here, seven in America, Sonic the Hedgehog. Which we kind of did expect to do as well as it's done, but it's just kind of sad that it has done that well. UK number five, US number three, Bob's Burgers.

So let me just steal through. Real treat. A real treat. Tom Blight says, Bob's Burgers is one of my favorite shows, and the movie is near perfection. It is. In adapting a half-hour show to a feature, brilliantly funny, incredibly heartfelt, just wonderful through and through.

Not only had I not seen the TV, I hadn't even heard of it. And when I went into the screening, I thought I was going into what your kids cartoon. I mean, five minutes in, I realised that I wasn't watching a kids cartoon. But I thought it was terrific. I really enjoyed it. I thought it was really funny. And it has made me want to go and watch Bob's Burgers, the TV series from which this is a spin-off, because I thought the movie was really funny. And number four here here and in America, Downton Abbey, a new era.

There was a talk at one point, wasn't there, about that one of the Downton Abbey movies kind of reinventing the series and going a different way and becoming all political and doing a whole bunch, then they went, no, let's not do that, let's just do that, that was the right thing. Exactly. Well, it's the right decision again in this one,

and I'm sure that if there is a Downton Abbey movie three, we'll be exactly the same. The only remarkable thing about this is that it is a remake of again in this one, and I'm sure that if there is a dance and Abbey movie three, it will be exactly the same. The only remarkable thing about this is that it is a remake of singing in the range nobody saw coming. You'll like this, Heather, from Leicestershire. My 16 year old son loved Maverick, which we'll get to. Maverick! He loved it so much, he saw it twice in three days.

Excellent. His review being, edge of the seat stuff gave me goose bumps throughout. We'll get to Maverick very shortly. And goose bumps is a very good top-g top bump. But you'll like this. I asked the guy in the kiosk at the Odin in Ketring if they had any red wine when they're going to see Maverick. To which he replied, no, I'm sorry we've run out. Gin and Tonic, I asked hopefully, no, I'm sorry we're out of that too. Really, I said incredulously, he lends across the counter, conspiratorially and said, Downton.

So everyone's going to see Downton. Completely sozled, sozled, on red wine and gin and tonic. Missed you in a shot in between loving the new show. That's great as hell though. That's very good. Number three here, six of America. I love this style of the movie. It's everybody's because it's a series. Everything everywhere, all at once.

Which, as I think we've established, is terrific. And if you want a multiverse movie, it's more interesting than number two, which is dog strange in the multiverse of madness. So the movie everyone wants to talk about is Top Gun Maverick. Top Gun Maverick, which is the UK number one and the US number one.

Yes, you can go for it. And it's done absolutely terrific business at the box office. I mean, I went into Top Gun Maverick, having remembering that I was never a big fan of the original Top Gun. I mean, remember, the original Top Gun came out when I think I was politically opposed

to its existence on principle. But also it was like also it was fine, but it was one of those movies that there was that period in the 1980s when every movie looked like a pop video, and every time you watch top of the pop, it was an advert for an officer in a gentleman or an advert for TopGum,

because that was how those things were put together. In the case of this, it's just irresistible, and believe me, I tried to resist it. Partly, I think because the real flight aircraft sequences are absolutely nail-biting partly because the emotional beats are so bang on the money. I mean, every single thing, you can feel yourself being manipulated, but it's like being in a chiropractor.

You go, okay, I know what you're doing. You're twisting me out of shape. But hey, go ahead and do it because that's what I came here for. And really, for any other movie that is going to have scenes in a plane, if you can't do it as well as Maverick, then people are going to go, well, this isn't actually good in there. And also, what it demonstrates is, when people say, you know, pop-corn blockbuster, that's

often, oh yes, just a pop-corn blockbuster. It's not just a pop-corn block. If you're going to make a pop-corn blockbuster, do it properly. In the opening two minutes, you sit back and you go, okay, it's just about your... I'm here for this. Catherine Bryers. Yes. Dear Zimmer and Fultamire, Top Gun Maverick is an excellent sequel that had me grinning with joy through the opening credits. They are just to be immersed in that Top Gun World once more. There are many strengths to this film, but I just wanted to comment on how thoughtfully created the two main female characters were. Phoenix, being the only female pilot within the group, was a realistic representation of the

mix of sexes in that role. I love that there was no attention drawn to because of her sex. She just got on with her job. I was also delighted that her role did not exist as a love-intrest plot device. The character of Penny was perfect and a realistically mature female match for the mature maverick. The intimacy between the two was illustrated primarily when they were shown in bed, facial wrinkles and all, talking openly about real life emotions. Tom's The Last Samurai was a masterclass in demonstrating how deep intimacy can be portrayed to perfection without any hanky panky. I thoroughly enjoyed the whole film. Sorry, can we just say well done for using hanky panky?

Exactly. I thoroughly enjoyed the whole film and was also so touched by Val Kilmer's appearance perfection. At this point, I would have expected to sign off thanks for a great show from Catherine Breyer's Heritage Listener, Subscriber, and once broadcasted my review of Rocks for which you gave me and my daughter, the pseudonyms of Hannibal and Roger. However, the day after seeing TG Mav, I asked my daughter what she thought of the film, having had time to reflect. She replied it was good, but they didn't show how it followed on from the first film. Yes, it did, I said, hardly able to hide my incredulity.

It was set, some 30 years or so after the original There was a lot of talk about what happened to Maverick's career in the meantime, but there were no planes in the first film What I was incredulous the whole film is about flying fighter planes. What happened in the film? You thought was top gun Well, there was a tower which got a bit knocked off she explained Well, there was a tower which got a bit knocked off, she explained. But was not able to remember much more, including when asked whether there were any ants in it. My son and I conferred. Was it back to the future perhaps, but apparently not. My son came up trumps with the answer she thought she'd been taken to see a sequel to Hot Fuzz. Anyway, best wishes, Catherine Pryors.

Thanks, Catherine Pryor's. Thanks, Catherine. Edgar Wright would be delighted. Who I've come to yesterday, buying a sandwich. Did you say he does? He's just a normal guy that somebody had mistaken Hot Fuzz for Top Gun. That would be very fine. Because, of course, weirdly enough, one of the things that Hot Fuzz is attribute to

is the movies of Tony Scott. Perfect. So actually that is really good. So that's actually a very smart mistake for your offspring to have made. He was buying a smoothie in case you're interested. Not as much. Still to come, reviews of these films

and film adjacent television. Mia Hanson loves new film, Bergman Island, and on TV, pistol, and the movie, which cookers. So my interview with Danny Boyle, coming up in just a moment, first Marco, wanted to invite you into this lift or elevate it for our friends across the pond. It's not an ordinary lift, Mark.

It's the laughter lift. Oh dear. Going up. Floor 7, please. Architects Alcove. I've already lost the will to live. By the way, Mark, what's leather and sounds like a sneeze? I don't know. A shoe. Oh, a shoe. I see. I thought you said this was a good joke this week.

Yeah. Things not going to well at home, Mark. Okay. This week, the good lady's ceramicist, Terran Dahls, keeps saying, are you even listening to me? I mean, who starts a conversation like that? Unbelievable. Again, again. I got robbed this week. Yes.

Well, try and sound content. OK, sorry. I'm sorry, sorry, sorry. You got robbed. You got robbed, OK. I was enjoying a delicious chilled adnum's white burgundy with aromas of peach pear and ripe honeydew melon.

They don't sponsor us, but please apply it to usual email address if you'd like to. In Showbie's North London, when a woman in seven-inch heels stole my favorite camouflage jacket. Here we go. If you're listening to this, you can hide, but you can't run.

LAUGHTER Jeff Goldblum is somewhere chocolate-yong onto that. Oh no. Here we go. If you're listening to this, you can hide, but you can't run. Jeff Goldblum is somewhere chocolateing onto that. Oh no. Oh no. Oh no. Oh no. Oh no. This episode is brought to you by Mooby, a curated streaming service dedicated

to elevating great cinema from around the globe. From myConnect directors to emerging otters, there's always something new to discover, for example. Well, for example, the new Aki Karri's Mackey film Fallen Leaves, which won the jury prize it can, that's in cinemas at the moment. And if you see that and think I want to know more about Aki Karri's Mackey, you can go to movie The Streaming Service and there is a retrospective of his films called How to Be a Human. They are also going to be theatrically releasing In January Priscilla, which is a new Soviet couple of film, which I am really looking forward to since I have an Elvis obsession. You could

try Mooby Free for 30 days at Mooby.com slash Kermit and Mayo. That's M-U-B-I.com slash Kermit and Mayo for a whole month of great cinema for free. month of great cinema for free. Simon, as you know, is the show, the self-deluded showrunner. The Grip and Führer of the programme has written. Now, this man needs no introduction and then does a very long introduction to Danny Boyle. So, let's just say the man who brought you, shallow grave, transporting T2, the beach 28 days later,

slum dog millionaire 127 hours, Steve Jobs yesterday, and now the new sex pistols by a pick, called Pistol, he is Danny Boyle, and you'll hear him talking to me after this clip. Airwolds, malecom. Don't know. 29. You're only 29. Gotwolds, Malcolm. Don't know. 29. You're only 29. Got a lot to learn.

You're only 29. Give the... get... um... Make more stomach... now. You're only 29. Got a lot to learn. But when your mummy dies, she will not return. That's small like it. It's a little bit weird.

You're welcome. We like noise, it's our choice. It's good. We're keeping it. That's a clip from Pistol. I'm delighted to say that his director is Danny Boyle and he's back with us again and how are Danny? How are you?

The bad penny turns up again. You're welcome every single time. You know that. And the last time we spoke to you, it's 2019 for yesterday. Oh yeah. And at the end of the interview, I ask you what you're working on next. And you say, and I'm quoting here, I'm trying to get the life rights of these guys, these two guys, you say, but you wouldn't be more specific.

And in the program, after the interview goes out, Mark Kermord says, you wonder if it's Simon and Garfunkel or something like that. Now, we're still waiting for that. But was that the Pistols story? No, it wasn't actually. No. Was that the Albertine story? What was it? No. Maybe it's still a secret.

Well, it sort of is really, because we are working on that story, this one with the life rights of the two guys, we did get the life rights. And John Hodges writing that, who's of what with many times, and he's working on that, but. And what is that? Well, it's sort of, until you get backing for it, it's like superstitious, you know that.

You know that, you don't go around saying what you're writing the whole time because you just never know whether it's going to appear or not You know whether it'll pull itself up on its feet and actually what was surprising is when we went into lockdown I had tried with Vivian Albertine on her extraordinary book To work with her and that all fell apart and Although subsequently I believe that she's there someone else is having a go at it. Steve Wully, I think. This script turned up the first part

of an adaptation of Steve Jones' book. But it turned up in lockdown. Literally, I was reading Middle March, I remember it. I've never read it. I did. I recommend it to all your readers. I'd suspect it, isn't there, cup of tea? Tanny Bawke.

I'd pay for that. I'd gone, water book. Anyway. And it was extraordinary, because it was like a back door into the sex pistols. And I'd never thought, I mean, you know, you think about doing punk like Vivol, the team, the class you I was obsessed with,

but you never thought about the pistols, it just seems such a hostile edifice that you could never approach. And then there's this little kind of trodden horse way in and it's through Steve's life. And the book is disarmingly funny and chatty and then very dark and disturbing and very truthful. I felt very, very truthful.

And Craig Pierce had done this adaptation of the first part of it. And I just said, yes, straight away as you should. And we brought Frank in, Frank Cultural Boys, who have worked with many times. He's the great Frank Cultural Boy. The great Frank Cultural Boy. So you did some amazing work on Episode 3, 4 and 5, but he doesn't take a credit, he doesn't want to go, but we are indebted to him enormously for some of the work in those episodes. And we turned it into a six-part series. And yeah, and here we are, kind of like pushing it out into the world.

So it was always going to be television, it wasn't a movie. Yeah, no, I mean, that's how they brought it to us and they set it up as a six-part set. And then we tried, listen, this is the honest truth, then we tried to flog it, we able to zoom meetings with Amazon Apple, all of them. Nobody was interested, absolutely no one.

I can report truthfully honestly. I remember the meetings. It was like no one had any interest. And this guy, Peter Rice, who had been involved, had been involved with since right at the get-go, and was the guy who rescued slumdog millionaire when it was about to be abandoned by Warner Brothers, he rescued it and turned it into the hit that it was. He's responsible for that in so many ways. He said, I want to do it, I know Ron half of Disney. And he's just like, you're called Disney. How is that going to sit with six pistols? Yes.

But obviously strange bed follows have happened before and they'll happen again. And the world has changed, of course, the streaming world has changed enormously. These are one of the reasons why you were sort were thinking the pistols is such a hostile environment. The story is that for the 2012 Olympics opening ceremony, which was, of course, you, that you asked the pistols to play pretty vacant. And Johnny said, no, is this a great story? Is that not true? I've not heard that before. That's brand new. As far as... Oh, OK. But we did meet him because we used a pistols track

got to have the queen and we also used a pill track under the house and so he wanted to meet to see what our plan was and we met him and the producer of this show Tracy Seward who also produced the Olympics thing we went along to meet him and he was fantastic and we showed him what we were planning and one of the things we featured in the soundtrack was the Millie Smalls track, My Boy Lollipop and when that played he said oh he said that's, you know that's the first number one song by a black artist in Britain. I said yeah that was one of the reasons that we're featuring it. He said I've written a song about that called Lollipop Opera on my new album which at the time was the album This Is Pill, which he was putting out, wonderful song.

And I think that helped him realize that we were serious about our intent to portray music as the lifeblood of Britain. And yeah, and he was great, but no, of course he's back to me. That was a rare moment of harmony in any relationship with John. Because he tried to stop you using the music. If that had gone a different way at the high court, would you have lost the show? Yes, I mean, you couldn't have done this show

without the pistols music. No, I mean, I'm sure people would try to convince you that you could, because you often see these films come out and they haven't got the original music, but we all know what we think of them. It's just pointless, and it's particularly true with the pistols. I remember the album, it's weird doing a show about all the characters around it because I remember when it came

out, we weren't really interested in them as individuals, even rotten. We were interested in the music and it's interesting the album, of course, I had no pictures of them on it or anything like any marketing materials like that. It was just the music and it was, when they all broke up, then they became celebrities while Sid and John did, and they became that route to celebrity dome. Discord is the source of the genius, I think, in him and in the group. So your way in is through the Steve Jones memoir, and we start the story through Steve Jones. And then Johnny Rotten comes up in, right at the very end,

and then episode two is called Rotten. You've cast sort of, for most people, I think unknowns as the band, which kind of works because we didn't know who these guys are. But Anson Boone, who plays John Leiden, is extraordinary. Because John Leiden has a unique way, a pattern of speech, a kind of a leery, sneer-y tone in the way he speaks

and the way he talks, which I've never had anyone else talk like, and your guy nails it. Yeah, he's very good. Did he have that from the audition? I mean, how did you find the job? So he came into this audition, and it was a COVID audition. So we were in a long, long room,

and he was at one end, and me and the casting directors were down the other end. And he did that audition from the shop I made to and he did the Alice Cooper. He's magnetic, you want to go closer to him, and he's repulsive, you want to get away from him at the same time, which is like an impossible combination. And that was it, you just thought that's him.

That's as close as we'll ever, ever come. You can't cast him, you can't, because he is properly unique. In the way, that's what we value about him, just how unique he is. But that was as close as we get. And some days it felt like there were two of them in the room. There was Anson's version of him and him, inspiring us.

And Anson used all the, he's very diligent, you know, his research, and then he just leaps. I mean, he's got that foolishness, confidence. I don't know what you call it, of youth, which is just leaps. But you need your four members of the band to play as a band. They need to be a band, and there's a scene where they play, is it Chelmsford Prison? Yeah, I'd love love.

Which is fantastic, but it's not just casting four people, but they have to play together. Well, that COVID helped us because we started them off. We said to you, you've got to learn the songs. Because I was adamant that we weren't going to overdub or play to click tracks or to play to back in tracks or anything like that. Everything that they played would be live and it would be their music. And we got to put back a couple of times our start point because Disney, having a big public profile, got very nervous about the COVID figures in London.

So our start got put back, and they could just, but they just kept playing and getting better and better and better. We went to Chelmsford. It's not Chelmsford, it's actually in Dolver. With a bunch of brilliant extras cast by the actress, casting people, brilliant, who look like prisoners from the 70s, It's just like, I was a stonest, you know, and they played for them. And I'm really glad you picked that out. That's one of my favorite moments because that's where everybody thought this should be in prison.

I want to talk to you about spitting. Okay. I saw the clash play at Tiffany's in Coventry when when they were doing bank robber, okay? And the supporting artist was, I think, called Mikey Dredd. And when he left the stage, he was covered, absolutely covered. And there's a moment in the gig where Joe Strummer says, if anybody else spits, and someone does spit at that point, and lands on him, and he launches himself into the crowd, and beats up this guy, attacks this guy, and then the security guys have been involved anyway. But you would, I mean, you've got an interesting theory in your story as to where Spitting comes from.

But did you learn anything about that and about punk which you didn't know before? Because I've never seen it in a drama dramatized in the way you've done it. I remember being a class show. It was where Lion King's on, it. I remember being a class show. It was where Lion King's on now. I remember seeing a class there. And I remember just glancing, I was down,

I wasn't out the front, I was near the front. And at the side, as they turned and came down towards the audience, so they'd start, I think they were doing complete control or something. Anyway, and they came down towards the audience. And I remember looking on my left, and there was this shower of spit was traveling towards them like azure core arrows. I remember seeing it, like that. I mean, it was just extraordinary. So you've got a cover spitting. I said to Disney, listen, we're doing spitting, you will not be able to

cut this, I'm promising you, I'm telling you, because without it is not true. And I'd learn about it that it was the release, really. And it wasn't pleasant and Joe Stromer got very ill. You got to have a time. Absolutely, yeah. But it was the release, that's what they released. You could, you were just free to do anything. And you would so imprisoned before it, that it was inevitable.

The problem wasn't the spitting, it was the imprisonment that you'd felt before that. Suddenly you were free to do anything and anything was acceptable. It wasn't, a lot of it was unacceptable and thank God it died out. And what we try to do in the series is you try and kind of limit it to episode three.

So it's in episode two. There's lots of different people with different theories about who started it. I mean, that's one of the problems we're doing this series. You just didn't know how so many versions of it. I thought it was in episode two. There's lots of different people with different theories about who started it. I mean, that's one of the problems we're doing this series. You just didn't know how so many versions of it. I thought it was the damned actually, but anyway. Yes. I just want to ask you before our time is off about Malcolm McLaren, who you have played

by Thomas Brady, as I think we've discovered with the spitting, this is not a sanitized version of punk. This is thrilling where it needs to be thrilling, but nasty and complicated, where it needs to be those things as well. But he, McLaren in your drama, it feels as though he is the puppet master. You know, that he does more than put the band together. He kind of manipulates and manufactures the band.

Is that fair, do you think? I think that's, again, there's so many different versions, but I think that's a result of it being Steve's story, because I think that's clearly the influence that he had on Steve, and Steve acknowledges that when it comes to the final showdown, that Steve doesn't side with John, he side with Malcolm, which is true,

and takes cookie with him in that respect. And so the bands split up and they went off to do all the terrible stuff you were mentioning from Rock and Roll Swindle, all the sadder songs, which is... Ronny Bigstaff, which is a strange kind of PS. I remember Thomas auditioning and hearing Malcom's voice, and again, he's a wonderful actor. He's the kid from Love Actually, unbelievable, but he's got like, Olivia like abilities now on film where he's building a character, he takes one thing like the voice and he just builds all the rest around it. But I remember

like with Anson, I remember hearing the audition thinking that's him, oh my god that's him, but we should mention Malcom borrowed it all from Vivian, of course, which is untold, which is that most of it came from Vivian originally, because there are two geniuses in the experience. It's John and it's Vivian. That's my... Vivian Westwood. Yeah, Vivian Westwood. They're the two geniuses. Damian Westwood. Damian. Jamnickulous Vivian Westwood. Danny, it's always a pleasure to have you on the program.

When do we get your Simon and Garfunkel story? When would that be? We're asking. Danny Boyle, thank you so much for talking to Simon. Thank you very much. I think I've worked out what that... I absolutely have, I haven't, he didn't give me any information.

But he was, when I was talking about Simon and Garfunkel, he was, he wanted to tell me something. Yeah, go on. As though that was part of what he was trying to do. And I think, this is just again, I think it's the Evily Brothers. Oh, because, Oh, that's interesting.

That's two guys and that kind of Simon and Garfunkel with big fans anyway, but that's not. Yeah. And of course, the Evily Brothers relationship between each other's notoriously, famously, completely famously complicated. Anyway, but always great to be to Danny Ball. He's obviously the perfect person to, to make this TV series, Pistol Disney Plus. So, I mean, interesting. I mean, you know, you raised the whole idea of Pistol's on Disney Plus and, you know, John couldn't get very upset at the beginning and saying it's going to be a middle class version and blah, blah, blah, blah.

So I've watched all six episodes. And I have very mixed feelings about it. Let's start with the positives. I think the casting is great. I do think Thomas Brody thanks to get McLaren's, you know, situation is stuff right. The programme is... Well, he was inspired by the situationists and all the kind of the slogan-earing that

he uses has got a lot of that in. But the programme makes very clear that what he's doing is stealing everything from Vivian Westwood, who at one point, I think it's in episode 6 or maybe episode 5, he refers to as you're just a person who does the sewing. point and I think it's in episode six and maybe episode five, he refers to as you're just the person who does the sewing. And so the, you know, it's the program is kind of very clear on the subject. I mean, I think he gets the mannerisms right. I mean, I would do an impression of it, except I can't do an impression of it. You know, Thomas Brody-Sanks, I really can.

I also think you're absolutely right, but Anson Boone, who just gets the delivery of rotten as he was then completely spot on. I mean, it's annoying and weedling and people talk to the time about Richard III like. I mean, one of the strange things, I remember reading quite early on, somebody saying, have you noticed how much Johnny Rotten sounds like Norman Wisdom? And once you go from that into Mr Grimm's Dail, you realize it is, they are surprisingly close.

And what Anson Blue manages to do is to get that it's sneering and weasily and you know, aggressive, but it's also kind of comical and ridiculous. So a lot of the stuff has been talking about Richard the Thurbing, the influence, but actually it is Norman Wisdom. So I think the casting is really well done. I think that it's even though it's six episodes to tell the story of the pistols, there is a certain amount of compression happening, and obviously we've all heard other versions of these stories. I mean, first told to some extent in the Great Rock and Roll Swindle, which is Julian Temples film which started life as Huckel Bambey, and then again, Julian Temples then did the film from thele, which is Julian temples film which started life as Who Kill Bambe. And then again, Julian temple then did the film from the Fury, which is pretty much the definitive Pistols documentary, which I think

actually is a real masterpiece. And then to some extent you get another version of it in Alex Cox's Sid Nancy, in which the Pistols is kind of a side story to the central episode. And there's an episode in this one, Nancy said, which is, you know, which focuses on those two. I think one of the issues for me is this, this is written by Craig Pierce, who worked with Baz Lerman, and it definitely feels like something

which has been written by somebody who worked with Baz Lerman for all that is good and bad about it. It's very broad strokes. There, it has a tendency to want to turn it into a fairy tale about Steve Jones and Chrissy Hine. And Chrissy Hine is the person who comes out of the whole thing as the heroin. And it's very much about Steve Jones' backstory and then Steve Jones' experience in his relationship with Malcolm and his relationship with Johnny Rotten

and his relationship with Chrissy Hine as told in this fairytale manner. I think it absolutely pays huge dividends that the band seemed to be playing, that you seem to be seeing people playing songs at first quite badly and then quite well and then after Glenn Matlow leaves quite badly again because Sid Vicious couldn't play bass to save his life. I was the only sort of problem musician. And they do have the thing about Steve Jones pulling it, pulling, um, Sid Vicious is basically that and just turning the bass up on his guitar because he's basically playing lots of, because, you know, Sid Vicious couldn't play.

And of course, Matt Locke is the person who's behind all those, I'm going to great tunes and, and we also see Steve Jones creating the sex pistols guitar, wall of sound, the Chris Bedding sound, you know, the kind of, you know, let's overdub loads and loads and loads of guitars and I'm not going to get to sing at some point. I'm just going to play around with this guitar. I think the time that the wheels come off is there are a lot of chubby hum moments obviously because that's how songs get written, something happens, somebody takes an experience, they turn it into a song and it's very hard to do that in a way which isn't clunky as we've discussed here before.

I think in things like episode three tries really hard to make sympathetic sense of bodies and to deal with the issue of spitting. I think on the issue of bodies, which is a song that I think is absolutely reprehensible. It fudges it and it tries to make it into something more palatable and nicer than it is. I mean, it's kind of unsurprising that John Lydon ended up as a Trump supporter as you discovered when you interviewed him and he told you that he was... He's so left-wing! So left-wing, I'm going to fight for Trump because he's an outsider, you know, yeah, and suddenly everything makes sense. I think the time when it's at its best is when it's doing

the ephemeral stuff in a way that's witty. So it is the McLaren behaving like a kind of, you know, carnival pantom. And there's an interesting comparison. I would think between this and you've seen the Elvis movie. I haven't. But obviously they share a writer. And it was interesting in Hibbler and Danny Boyle

that Frank Cultural Boyce had been involved in some of the rewrites, which was fascinating. So the music played live works well. The story itself is cartoony. Although the fact is, the Sex Pistols were always cartoony. I referred you to that book by Tony Parsons and Judy Birch, the boy looked at Johnny, which basically sort of said,

you know, all of this is nonsense. And the two people who were the real heroes of the punk movement were Tom Robinson and polystyrene, which I think there is a very good argument to be made about. The sex pistols were always a pantomime performance. They were, however, a pantomime performance that was quite scary at first. And then, and clearly punk broke something open and liberated a whole bunch of people, because the amount of people who, because of punk, got up and formed bands who wouldn't have done so otherwise, it's what came afterwards that was important. So this is a sort of fairy tale, which weirdly

enough makes it suitable for Disney, because amidst all the spitting and the swearing and the episode, which I can't say the name of, because it has that word in it, it is a fairy tale, and that is what it is. But there are some very kind of, there are some very good performances in the fairy tale, and the songs work well because they do sound like they're being played by a band figuring out how to play. What did you think?

I was mistrusted, I mean, I enjoyed it. And it's enjoyable. It is enjoyable. And it's a period drama set in a period that I kind of remember. And I slightly distrusted a period drama that says, hey, we're going to be setting it in the 60s. And the 60s is always pretty

that something else. Yeah, it's great. And I just wanted to say 1974, 1975, I thought was great. It was modern, it was contemporary. I was listening to music. I liked Rick Wakeman, you know, which they cut to Rick Wakeman doing six wives, and I like that stuff. I still like that stuff, you know.

It wasn't all terrible before, and they didn't save me anything like that. Anyway, but I still enjoyed it because of the casting, like you said, and because it's nice to see that on the television. And it's interesting that we were just talking for Thomas Brody Sanks that looks very, very young. I think he looks to... He is the same age that McLaren was. He's 30, but McLaren looks...

But he's 30, like he's 15, though. Yeah, but he gets the mannerisms. Don't you think he gets the mannerisms? Yeah, spot on. Absolutely, and the voice he's absolutely sport on. Yeah. So, was to come still, Mark, in this fabulous take? Reviews of Midwitch Cookies and Bergman Island.

That would be back after this. an avalanche of customer emails, texts, and social media messages, keep your edge with thrive small business software and never miss a message again. Thrive offers one solution to communicate, market, and run your business. But simply, small businesses run better on Thrive. Get Command Center for free today at thrive.ca. That's THR-Y-V dot CA. Terms and conditions apply. Free plans have limited functionality Okay, so take it all in a bit time now mark this

We're going to do a Ukrainian special couple of weeks ago Brian wrote in And asked us for some help for movie recommendations on mainstream Streaming services. Yes, mainstreaming services, to watch with their Ukrainian guests and make them feel a bit more at home. So Karl has written in with some suggestions. Dears as his Karl Chastanay, I would say, yes, Chastanay Chastanay. So, in response to your listeners' request for movies to watch with their guest Ukrainian family, might I suggest the following movies to be shared and enjoyed in a linguistically

heterogenerous crowd, heterogenerous crowd, lacking a mutually intelligible dialect. I think Chris' call as an intellect. An academic. You know, people who speak different languages. Anyway, we end up with the artist, Buster Keaton's, the general, you know, people who speak different languages. Anyway, we end up with the artist, Buster Keaton's the general steamboat bell Sherlock junior, anything by Charlie Chaplin, the red turtle. Absolutely. Earth, this one earns bonus points, Dove Shenko was Ukrainian, and in a darker vein, Metropolis, best regards, Karl Chastanay, PS, the inspiration for this list,

came from the good lady, epidemiologist, her indoors, herself, the daughter of forced migrants, she came to the United States as a six-year-old, and still remembers going to see Laurel and Hardy movies with her mum, at the local Uniplex in Baghdad, in the 1980s, before Iraq became unwelcoming. Turns out the language of cinema really is universal. So that's obviously useful to go in a very good silent movie.

Can I just flag this up again once, I know I say this a million times, but I'll say it again, Mike Figgis always said that if you wanted proof of the universality of silent cinema, when immigrants used to arrive in America, the thing that happened to the Ellis Island was that they were shown a silent film showing them what life in America was like, and that was what prepared them for, you know, what was an extraordinary new world. And he said, and as soon as sound arrived, cinema became language-specific, and that universality was lost, and he always said, and as soon as sound arrived, cinema became language specific and that universality was lost and he always said, what happened on Ellis Island was proof of the universal language of silent cinema.

Leo has emailed. This is my first time writing in the two odd years I've been a listener, and I feel obliged to contribute to your recommendations of film to watch with the Ukrainian family. The universally popular Paddington 2014 is available dubbed into Ukrainian and the lead role is, as you probably know, voiced by none other than Velodimir Zelensky, now president of Ukraine, which is remarkable but true. Incredible, isn't it? As someone who has studied Ukrainian, lived in Ukraine, and now works with Ukrainian colleagues. I'm heartened to hear that your listeners are hosting Ukrainian refugees.

It is hard to exaggerate that act of generosity, which I'm sure will be remembered by generations of Ukrainians to come. All the best, Leo. Thank you very much, correspondents at kona-mode.com. And I think we should just continue this. So obviously the silent movie genre works, but if there are other movies and if you remember from that original program, we're looking for family movies and with, please, no war

in there for obvious reasons. And so Russian, Ukrainian, friendly, anything that occurs, get in touch, correspondentsacodermaid.com. So let's do something that's brand new. So the Midwitch Cookies, a new adaptation of John Wyndham's sci-fi novel from a writer created by Far, directed by Jennifer Perotte, Alice Trouton and Abok or Sigour Falson.

Let's begin with a clip. This is a clip from the new version of the Midwitch Cookies, which is on Skymax. What you were T. How are you feeling? Is this my recession? Paid for by the government. I'm just asking you how you are. It's...

Disturbing. And it's okay to say so. Actually, it all... Kind of makes sense. I knew that I'm not had to be for something. The way that I felt right after I couldn't put into words. But now it felt like I was visited. And of course that's exactly what happened because on the night in question,

the sleeping village town of Midwitch was indeed visited. Everyone fell asleep, nobody could get into the village and then when they woke up all the women of childbearing age are pregnant. Now do you know the story of the Midwitch cookers? Did you read the book or anything? No, I have not read the book. Okay, well that's basically the setup. So the source was famous, in the 50s, was famously made into a film in 1960 Bible, for a book called Village of the Damned, which will always have a place in my heart because some of it was filmed around my school in Elstrid.

I don't think you're going to London. I do that one. That's the one. Village of the Damned. So you do know it, but you know it as Village of the Damned, because actually it's probably better known now as Village of the Damned than there's Midwitch Cookies. There was then a remake of village of the dam because actually it's probably better known now as village of the dam than there's midwitch cookies

There was then a remake of village of the dam later on by John Carpenter, which was absolutely terrible, which is a real shame But the novel is really fascinating because I said this story something happens nobody sure what the women of childbearing age become pregnant and they give birth to these children who are preternaturally talented, who develop very fast and clearly have some kind of telepathic connection between each other. So they are, I mean the title tells you the cook is, it's the cook is in the nest. Where do they come from? How did they get there? How are they connected and what are they doing? I wrote about the novel in my PhD because I was writing about Peter Fobick, horror novels. The novel is about fear of children and obviously I was relating this to things like, you know,

exorcist and Rosemiss baby to some extent. But Wyndham was always fascinating to me because when I was a kid I used to read John Windham, you know Dave the Triffids, Crackham Wakes, Chris Lyd's Chockey, which I think was his last of which I absolutely loved and he had a really brilliant eerie feel to his writing, which is quite hard to capture on film Village of the Damned is very, very chilling Medwitch Cookus this version does something very interesting, which is it takes the story and it updates it. Firstly, it refocuses the story very much onto the female characters. So, Kinihause's Susanna Zellabee, in the original film, Zellabee, George Zellabee,

who's played by George Sanders, and he's this kind of aging professorial character through whose eyes we see the story playing out. In this case, it's through Susanna Zellabee, who's a psychotherapist whose daughter is one of the women who become pregnant during the blackout. There's much more emphasis on the question of how those characters react, how they feel about what's happened to them, how they feel about the... Weirdly enough, there's almost a subtext about, you know, reproductive rights and control of your body

and the way in which the authorities move in and kind of take them, they suddenly find themselves prisoners within the village, whether they're being held prisoner by the children or whether they're being held prisoner by the authorities, it gives it a very oddly contemporary edge. And at first, you think, well, the update's gonna be difficult because in the modern age, how do you have the idea of anywhere that is isolated

because nowhere is isolated from anywhere? And yet, because of the way that the narrative is refocused, that stops being an issue. They quite cleverly establish the rules of how the isolation works. Max B. is the disciple Kirby, who is this police officer who is involved in the original tragedy and then follows the case through and then becomes very attached to one of the children. And I went into this thing, okay, I love this novel, I love this

text and I love the wolf real village of the damned. How are you going to manage to give me a new version of it that works? And I think this really does. Firstly, I think that the refocusing works brilliantly. Secondly, I think that it makes an awful lot of sense, like it manages to to take a science fiction story, you know, a fairly outlandish science fiction story, and give it a down to earth very, very, in it feels very close to home. To make that that eerie and uncanny feel very very domestic. It has a brilliant score by Hannah Peel, which is kind of like a nursery rhyme reimagined by John Carpenter, which has a kind of retro thing going on, but also feels very contemporary. And when it needs to be scary, it is scary. I mean, when it needs to have, there's just, there's a hint of the glowing

eyes that you'll remember. And, but it's, all that stuff is very much hinted at, but when it needs to have, there's just, there's a hint of the glowing eyes that you'll remember. And, but it's, all that stuff is very much hinted at, but when it needs to be creepy, when it needs to be, I don't think you're going to go to one, it does that stuff well. Because someone say that. But the, what's the series? But not quite, no.

But the principle about not leaving is the key thing. But what's really interesting is that Wyndham's fiction wasn't horrifying, it was perplexing. There was something really perplexing about Wyndham. And I think that what makes this new Midwitch cookers work really well is that it is really perplexing in a way that's actually very satisfying and very rewarding. I thought it was well-written, well-directed, very well played, brilliantly scored, as I said. And I watched the whole thing,

and I was really kind of bound up in it, and it kind of felt like a relief, because I thought, okay, I want this to be good, but I think it's unlikely that it's going to work as well as it should do. And I thought it really brought a fresh eye to a text that I love, you know, that it was, it looked like it was made by people who understood what was great about the original book and also

understood that you can't just simply do that again, you have to bring something new to the table. And I really thought they did. Is the isolation of midwitch similar to the isolation of the village in men, which you were talking about? And this is the weird thing, that this is exactly the comparison that I was making. There was a moment when I was watching men, when I thought she's landed in midwitch.

Okay. And where can I see this new and very intriguing version of the Midwitch Cookers? You can see it on SkyMax and now, and I think you'll enjoy it, not least because I think from a writing point of view, you'll find it really intriguing. Is that SkyMax Beasley?

SkyMax is checking. Brrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrr Irish Kiwi Massive Canadians, German Spanish. We play out your 20 second voice note and your special screening or festival gets a welcome boost. We are officially global. You've seen the figures. They're astronomical. They are. They're out of this world. Very good.

Correspondents at KermaderMoa.com. This week we start with Matt Saw from Canada. This is Matt in Joujage on Montreal and I'm co-hosting the 13th Orphan film symposium at Concordia University, June 15th to the 18th. Registration is necessary, the full fee is not. We'll also be live streaming. For more, visit orphan.film. Hello Simon and Mark, this is Janan from the Weapons of Mass Hilarity Festival, which

showcases performers of Middle Eastern heritage and is breaking a Guinness World record by being the very first. It will take place from June 2nd to 4th at 2 North Down London. Hi, the annual Onder Tours sci-fi and fantasy film festival we're taking place as usual in Nontel, France, every night in June screening films such as Listenia's Anul, A lot of the rings, Star Wars, Matrix and Matrix, Batman, in English with French subtitles. Unless there's a live support on TV in which case the screen will be taken on a free. That was outrageous, live French. I think he was putting that on. So that was the orphaned film symposium at Concordia

University Montreal, followed by the weapons of Mascilarity. Which I have to say is a very good pun. Sounds great. That's a very good pun. And wrapping up with Ian Ashworth on the Rounder To-Lose sci-fi and fantasy film festival in, uh, on France. Ian Ashworth, he's not going to be speaking in L'Axis, is he? It was an old joke, wasn't it, To-Lose the Trek, Ian Ashworth, he's not going to be speaking and it'll exist. Is he? It was an old joke, wasn't it, to lose the track is hard, but to find the track is harder still.

So, correspondence at covid-19.com, we would love to hear from you. No, just pass it over, I mean, it was a joke, but there's a message. I just thought I didn't even say it. You know, it's fine. If you'd like to promote your screening or your festival correspondence at covid-19.com and you send us a little voice note. That would be fabulous.

So what else is out in New? Bergman Island, which is a new film by Mia Hanson Love, who made Father of my children. Goodbye, First Love, Eden, things to come. This premiere in Cannes, last year, we've just got to the end of the new Cannes Film Festival. Vicki Creeps, who was in Phantom Thread, which you loved. I did. And Tim Roth. Is it him again? It is him again.

Chris and Tony. He's not playing the... He's playing the FIFA box. He's not doing that anymore, no. There are filmmakers who go to stay on Bergman Island, which is Farrow off the Swedish coast. They're there for inspiration for work, to talk about work, to talk about Bergman's work in private and in public.

Everywhere they look, there are the ghost of Bergman's films, there are 35 millimeter screenings of Christ and Wispers. There is a Bergman Safari, which takes you around all the places where Bergman worked and shot and looked at stuff. There are conversations which feel like real conversations about Bergman and his life and his work and whether it's possible to separate his life and his work. And all the while, the central relationship between the two characters, the central characters seems to sort of be mirroring that Bergman-esque thing. We hear that scenes from a marriage, the Bergman thing which caused thousands of people to divorce.

And it looks like it might be happening again is a clip. How was it? It was pretty good, actually. Yeah. But I've been feeling a bit year since I got back. Why would happen? Must have been a burger. Hmm.

So where were you? Driving around. I've been feeling a bit year since I got back. Why would happen? Must have been a burger. So, where were you? Driving around. Oh yeah, driving around. I'm a guy. Are you a man of a guy? Student. Oh, student, was he? Film student from Stockholm.

Is he handsome? Is he sexy? Yeah. Was he brilliant when he talked about Bergman? I don't like you, but his clumsiness has his charm. Thanks. Shout out. So at that point, the crack seemed to be sort of on the surface. Then as the film goes on, you think, okay, well, the cracks are slightly deeper.

They're very Bergman-esque cracks. And then what is a Bergman-esque crack? It's a piercing and often rather unforgiving way at looking at the lies that we tell each other under the guise of normal human behaviour. Okay. Thank you. I was actually quite proud of that. That's very good.

Thank you. And then at one point, she says, look, I'm writing a manuscript and I've got a problem with the ending. Can you help me with it? He said, I doubt it. But you know, tell me. She starts then telling him her script about a doomed relationship. And as she tells the story, we start watching the film that she's telling him about in which

Meev Asikovska's character meets an old flame who she was with and then they broke up with the wedding and now the past arises again. And so we're suddenly in a different film and now past and present seem to intertwine as do fact and fiction. And it becomes clear that this film is really of it's a work of fiction, but it's a veiled discussion of her own life and our life are in fact indivisible

in just the way that they had spoken about with, is it possible to separate Bergman's life and Bergman's art? Now, it sounds pretentious and boring. It's actually anything but that. I thought it was rather enchanting rather seductive, not least because the music, and you will love this as greatest hits radios, you know, drive time host. Drive time host. The pop tunes include Abbers, The Winner Takes It All, and Tina Charles is I Love To Love, which plays a huge part in the drama of Bergman Island. I mean, it could so easily become naval gazing.

There's one part in which one character in Ireland slags Bergman off of being a nasty piece of work. If anyone saw Bergman a year in life documentary, it's kind of hard to disagree, but actually the film is so much, it's so much lighter than that, it's so much more whimsical and profound, but it wears that profundity lightly. And I think a lot of it is to do with just how natural Vicky Cripps feels in that central role that she really brings the audience on board. So it becomes a meditation upon life and art and the interplay between the two, but it never feels like it's hammering a point home or the ponderous or it never

feels like what the title implies that it would be, which is let's just stodge through a back catalogue of grief. It's actually really enjoyable and rather lovely and I love it for using, I love to love. And before you tell us about the movie of the week, if you had to spend this coming weekend in Midwitch, the village in Men or Bergman Island, where would you go? Absolutely Bergman Island is. Right. It's so much. I mean, the weather's nicer for a start.

That's the end of take one, Mark, I don't know what I'm telling you because you know it's the end of take one. Take one is own post script. Production management and general all-round staff was Lily Hamley, videos by Ryan Amir, a social media producer who is Jonathan Imiere. Johnny Socials. Is that what we call him now?

As of now. You can feel it Imiere tonight. There's a Phil Collins. I bet you've had that before, haven't you? Studio engineer Josh Gibbs, Flynn Rodham, is the assistant producer, Hanatul, but is the producer and redactor in Chief Simon Paul? What is your film of the week?

My film of the week would be Men. My TV series of the week would be Midwitch Cookies. Next week we say hello to Jeff Goldblum, who's talking about Jurassic World Dominion. It's a fairly unconventional conversation. Do join us for that. Thank you for listening. unconventional conversation.

Do join us for that. Thank you for listening.