Kermode & Mayo’s Take - Gorgeous George MacKay + Mark vs. The Stath

Episode Date: March 27, 2025

Vanguardistas have more fun—so if you don’t already subscribe to the podcast, join the Vanguard today via Apple Podcasts or extratakes.com for non-fruit-related devices. In return you’ll get a whole extra Take 2 alongside Take 1 every week, with bonus reviews, more viewing recommendations from the Good Doctors and whole bonus episodes just for you. And if you’re already a Vanguardista, we salute you. A smashy crashy action movie double bill on the review slate this week. First up, ‘Novocaine’—the action comedy where Jack Quaid plays Nathan Caine, a man born with a disorder that leaves him unable to feel pain. When the bank he works in is robbed and the girl of his dreams taken hostage, he discovers his physical quirk can be a superpower. But will it make Mark wince? Plus, The Stath returns in ‘A Working Man’--where he’s Jason Statham, doing Stath things. That’s probably all you need to know... but Mark will tell us where it’s at in the Stath stakes. Our guest this week is none other than Gorgeous George MacKay, who plays ‘Son’ in Josh Oppenheimer’s post-apocalyptic bunker-musical (yes, you read that correctly) ‘The End’. Set 25 years after an environmental catastrophe leaves the earth uninhabitable, MacKay and his ‘Mother’ (Tilda Swinton) and ‘Father (Michael Shannon) carry on a life of luxury and denial in their opulent underground shelter—where Son was born and raised, never having known life before. As Father writes a memoir nobody will read, and the family sing and dance their way through their bizarre existence in Golden-Age style, their brittle harmony is broken by the arrival of an unexpected guest. George tells Simon all about singing, dancing, having the most arthouse onscreen parents evs, and how his own new fatherhood has made him feel differently about the end of the world. Plus more correspondence on Flow from our Latvian listeners, the Milennium Bug from ‘Y2K’ defenders, and of course Snow White--including a message from a young critic giving Mark a run for his money. Timecodes (for Vanguardistas listening ad-free): Novocaine Review: 09:04 George MacKay interview: 29:14 The End review: 42:54 Laughter Lift: 51:55 A Working Man Review: 56:13 You can contact the show by emailing [e-mail] or you can find us on social media, @KermodeandMayo EXCLUSIVE NordVPN Deal ➼ https://nordvpn.com/take Try it risk-free now with a 30-day money-back guarantee! A Sony Music Entertainment production. Find more great podcasts from Sony Music Entertainment at sonymusic.com/podcasts and follow us @sonypodcasts To advertise on this show contact: [e-mail] And to find out more about Sony’s new show Origins with Cush Jumbo, click here Learn more about your ad choices. Visit podcastchoices.com/adchoices

This episode is brought to you by MUBI, a curated streaming service dedicated to elevating great cinema. MUBI is the place to discover ambitious films by visionary filmmakers, all carefully handpicked, so you can explore the best of cinema streaming anytime, anywhere. Now, Mark, we just had the Oscars. Or for our Hungarian listeners, films like my Don Tübizőcsog, now streaming on MUBIi, take it away. Around the world, the International Oscar Collection, which is now streaming on Mubi in the UK, brings together some of the amazing films that have either won or been nominated for the Academy's Best International Feature Film Award. You can watch Pan's Labyrinth, this is Guillermo del Toro's

masterpiece. Another round, the Thomas Vinterberg film and also Son of Saul which is the winner of the Academy Wolf Best International feature film from Hungary. All of those are available. You can try MUBI free for 30 days at MUBI.com slash Kermit and Mayo. That's MUBI.com slash Kermit and Mayo for a whole month of great cinema for free. Hello, Simon Mayo here and Mark Kermit here. Before we begin a quick reminder that you can become a Vanguard Easter and get for free. You can get all that extra stuff via Apple Podcasts or head to ExtraTakes.com for non-fruit related devices. There's never been a better time to become a Vanguard Easter. Free offer now available wherever you get your podcasts. And if you're already a Vanguard Mark, how are you?

Very good. That's how you're opening the show. Yeah, here's the thing, Mark. Yeah, it's sort of an Alan Freeman kind of. And? All right. All right. Stay bright.

Not half. There's a social media post on Blue Sky from a bloke called Lance, who I saw this overnight. He says, as the sole publicly professing member of the Vanguard in Kentucky, see iwitter.com. Remember, this is lowercase I-W-I-T-T-R.com. So, he's identified himself as the only member of the Vanguard in Kentucky. I feel it's my duty to pass along a story about basketball and Weetabix. He's wishing the Take team have their own Weetabix or other energy supplying breakfast before this week's podcast. Now we're not sponsored yet by Weetabix, are we?

Do we have any commercial links to Weetabix? No, but I'd be happy to. So he sends this, yeah, it seems a relatively harmless sort of product, though you never know, do you Mark? You never know. You never know who's bought them up. It's the story of a desperate trip to an international food store in Milwaukee to find Weetabix. This is because one of their star performers in

this basketball team, Amari Williams, is a native of Nottingham. The headline in the paper is, better eat your Wheaties? Kentucky's Amari Williams credits Wheatabix instead for his big game. So do you want a Wheaties? Are they those sort of small little square versions? No, aren't Wheaties like a packet snack that you have behind the bar in a pub? Aren't they little tubular things? Aren't those Wheaties? Oh, I see. I don't know. Anyway, apparently it's eating like five Weetabix. This is all a very big puff for Weetabix. But apparently if you want to play successful basketball in Kentucky, and Williams just had eight points, 10 rebounds,

six assists, and three blocks in their 84-75 NCAA tournament second round victory over Illinois, I know you were following that. And he puts it all down to Weetabix. Yes. Wheaties is an American brand of breakfast cereal made by General Mills. It is well known for featuring prominent athletes on its packaging. There is also a Wheaties Crisps that is now renamed as Wheat Crunch. Toby So, what we clearly learned from that is is forget the Wheaties with the photographs of famous sports people. What you need is you trad English British. You know, it actually, their slogan, I'm just looking at a packet of Wheaties now, is the Breakfast of Champions. And of course, in that case, and I've forgotten this because I had read Kurt Vonnegut's The Breakfast of Champions, in which he does say at the beginning of the book, this is in no way an endorsement of the breakfast cereal that uses the slogan, The Breakfast of Champions, and their doubtless

fine product, which I have not partaken of. It looks like that is Wheaties. I always thought The Breakfast of Champions was peanut butter and marmite on toast. That's the breakfast of champions. Yeah, I mean, I love peanut butter and marmite. Elvis had peanut butter and jam, jelly as they call it. Or is it jelly? Yeah, jelly is jam. Yeah, that's a weird American thing. Yeah, no, that's not good. But the proper breakfast of champions is egg and fish, isn't it? It's poached egg and then smoked haddock on a sort of like, because that's just like the protein hit from heaven. Is that right? Oh, I didn't know. I had no idea about that. Anyway, if any of these companies

would like to sponsor us, contact our commercial department. The redactor says Jelly and Jam are different. Well, they are over here, that's the point, but are they different in America? Because when people say jello, don't they mean the kind of stodgy gelatinous sweet? Yes. I think jelly is closer to marmalade. It's not jam because jelly is like jello. Yeah, you're right, but you shouldn't have it with peanut butter anyway. It's a very bad thing. Didn't do Elvis any good, did it? Now he's saying Jell-O is different to jam and jelly. But the key point is also the Americans don't get marmalade. They just don't understand marmalade. We should say happy new year. It's

the Balinese New Year on March 29th, which is in a few days' time. Mark, I'm just wondering what you're going to be reviewing and getting animated about in the next few minutes. We have a packed show. We have Nova Kane, Nathan Lane, he can't feel pain. Nathan Kane can't feel pain. We have Working Man, which is the new movie by Jason Statham. And we have The End with our very, very special guest. Yes, gorgeous George McKay who plays son in that film. Son in that film. This isn't Son Heung-Min, the veteran Spurs player, but although he does have son on his back, this is the fact. He's just called son because the dad is called father and

the mother is called mother and it's all very strange. And our super special bonus review section for the Vanguard in a special late edition, Mark. Yeah, that won't drop. Take two won't drop until midnight. That's Thursday into Friday midnight because Woman in the Yard is embargoed until 8pm Eastern Standard Time, which is midnight our time. So it's going to be a late arrival for take two because of that embargo. Plus all the extra stuff you know about every Thursday, slash late Thursday, and indeed the whole back catalogue of bonus joy can be found if you want to sign up. Just indicate your commitment.

If you work for Weetabix, just go through the usual channels. An email from Carl Webster, dear Juicy Fool and Exalted Imposter, the Dunning-Kruger effect, as you will recall, relates to the psychological phenomenon of illusory superiority. We were talking about this a few weeks ago. What you might not yet know, and what I have just discovered whilst researching sociopathy, is that the 1999 study in which the effect was first introduced, is that the 1999 study in which the effect was first introduced, unskilled and unaware of it how difficult it is in recognizing one's own incompetence lead to inflated self-assessments, was inspired by the tale of two would-be Pittsburgh bank robbers, MacArthur Wheeler and Clifton Earl Johnson, who robbed two banks in one day in 1995. Okay. Rather than wear disguises, however, Wheeler and Johnson simply covered their faces in

lemon juice, confident that lemon juice contained chemicals that would make them invisible to security cameras and therefore impervious to justice. Of course, they were mistaken, and apparently when Wheeler was arrested and shown surveillance photographs of his face, he cried, but I wore lemon juice. I wore lemon juice. Imposter syndrome, where competent people tend to doubt or downplay their own abilities, is considered the opposite of the Dunning-Kruger effect. And it seems to me very much preferable, but what do I know? So, and I just changed David Dunning and Justin Kruger, who are the people who came up with this and unskilled, but what a name for a paper

unskilled and unaware of it, how difficult is in recognizing one's own incompetence lead to inflated self assessments, but such a useful concept as we proceed through these weeks and months. I saw there was an interview that Rob Brydon did with Jason Isaacs, hello to Jason Isaacs, for his podcast in which they were talking about the fact that self-deprecation doesn't go down very well in America. That in America, if you're self-deprecating, they think you need treatment. In America, it's just boasting

and pride. When you do the sort of self-deprecating thing, they think there's something wrong with you. So they thought it was like a transatlantic thing. All European. Yeah, that's right. Which is obviously to be disapproved of. Okay, correspondence at Kermit and Mayer.com. Box office top 10 on the way, but first of all, something that is out and interesting maybe. Yes. So, Novakane, do you remember Kick Ass, which I really liked? Remember Kick Ass, the film?

I do remember Kick Ass. In Kick Ass, Kick Ass's superpower was basically that after getting his head kicked in and being severely damaged, he effectively became impervious to pain. He had a couple of sort of replaced bones, but basically his superpower was that he couldn't feel pain, which isn't much of a superpower. So that same riff reappears here in Nova Kane. This is an action comedy written by Lars Jacobson and directed by Dan Burke and Robert Olsen. And the tagline for it is, meet Nathan Kane, he can't feel pain. Here's the trailer. I'm just a regular guy with a regular job, but I've got this condition where I don't

feel pain. Hey, there we go. Oh my God, you're a superhero. Can you feel this? Definitely feeling something. Last night was amazing. Get on the ground! Definitely feeling something. Last night was amazing. Get on the ground!

Open the vault! Cops are here early! We need a hostage! Oh my god, what am I doing? I just want to know where Sherry is. Wow. So you get the general sense, shooty bang bang action, and then sort of quips about the fact that you can't feel pain.

So Nathan, who's played by Jack Quaid, son of Dennis and Meg Ryan, is this retiring bank deputy manager who is smitten with one of his team Sherry, played by Amber Midsunder, who was brilliant in prey. He's too shy to talk to her. It turns out that he's been impervious to pain from birth, having been born with congenital insensitivity to pain with anhydrosis, CIPA. As a child, his schoolmates nicknamed him Novocaine, and they all hit him and beat him because they thought it was funny that he couldn't feel pain. Now he has to be super, super careful about not cutting himself or biting off his own tongue or allowing his bladder to burst, all these things that might happen because he can't feel pain. Then the bank is held up by some bank robbers. The girl of his dreams is

kidnapped. He goes out hell for leather to save her. But now, rather than being the hindrance, the thing that keeps him at home playing video games, the fact that he's impervious to pain sort of becomes a superpower. So BBFC rated 15 for strong bloody violence gore with comically exaggerated style, heavy beating, stabbing, slashings, use of imaginatively improvised weapons, stranglings, bone breaks, and extensive bloodshed. I mean, that's a 15 nowadays. Kids, you don't know you're born. So all that sort of stuff I think is fun. Although honestly, it's not as fun as it should be. And it's certainly not as fun as Kick-Ass. I mean, I wasn't a fan of Kick-Ass 2 at all,

but during the course of Kick-Ass, I did get to, I really liked the characters. I really enjoyed their company. I really sort of cared for them. In the case of this, everything is very one-dimensional. The script isn't funny enough to make the central conceit work properly. And there is this central problem, which is, okay, he can't feel pain, but he gets stabbed, shot, impaled on a spike, mangled. And you think, well, fine, he can't feel pain, but he would die. I mean, that is an essential problem when you think,

I just don't believe that the main guy is alive anymore. There's one scene in it in which he's being tortured by somebody who's pulling off his fingernails, which is wince-inducing. And the gag is that because he can't feel pain, he's faking it and going, oh, oh, oh, please stop. I can't believe the pain. The joke being that he can't feel the pain. But there are several other times when you just think, yeah, well, no, oh, please stop. I can't believe the pain. The joke being that he can't feel the pain.

But there are several other times when you just think, yeah, well, no, okay, he's literally just been impaled on a spike and therefore I don't believe he's walking around. Anyway, it had a sort of decently strong opening weekend in the US and then dropped very severely after that. And I suspect that the same will happen here, that it will be a sort of one week wonder. I mean, it is better

than Kick Ass 2, but most things are better than Kick Ass 2, but considering they have the same central idea, it's not a patch on Kick Ass. Although there were moments. I mean, I enjoy the stabby, gory, bloody nonsense because I just think that stuff's funny. I'd just like to say hello to everybody who, where it may well only be me, in which case I'd be saying hello to myself, which is fairly stupid, but when you say Novocaine in my head, I hear For the Soul by Eels, which I believe is mid 90s indie pop sensation. We used to play Eels quite a lot back in the day.

Eels, Eels. Yeah. Wow. I think that's their biggest hit, but Nova came for the soul. That's what I was thinking. I don't remember any of their other tracks. I just remember that. Nova came for the soul.

See that sounds like 1996 already, the way you just sang that. So I'm straight in there. Was the next line something before I scuttle off or something? Box Office Top 10. First of all, that Numerio Babysham 1974, Y2K. So Ian Infinitly. I enjoyed myself rather a lot. It's not amazing, but this mid-30s millennial got plenty of laughs from the late 90s, early 2000 references, and even enjoyed Fred Durst's appearance. I'm willing to accept that film festivals often slant positive because of the whole experience. The cast showed up for Q&A, including a very inebriated Durst, but my similarly aged pal watched it a few days ago here in the UK and came away with an even

more glowing review than me. Really good fun and a great soundtrack, that's what he said. That being said, I know my particular age bracket seems to be skewing much more positive than most on the film. And the fact that A24 held it back for over a year from premiere to UK release clearly means they weren't particularly confident in it. Still, a few of us had fun, so it's not quite the universal stinker that Marks think it is. Toodlepig, up and down with the usual Ian and Finchley. David in Nottingham, dear 31st of December and the 1st of January, greetings from NHS Nook, long time listener, multiple emailer. There is an old adage, you

never get the credit for the disaster that you stopped happening. Is this a reference to the movie? Yes, it is. I get that. Okay, here we go. The Millennium. It's a bug and everyone's. That's right. The Millennium Bug. So David says, yes, yes. The Millennium. It's a bug and everyone's... That's right, the Millennium bug. So David says, the Millennium bug was very real. It could have had enormous serious problems. I mean, not being eaten by Tamagotchi's, but it would have been unpleasant. And these problems were averted and fixed by an incredible effort by a stack of people

who probably weren't paid very well for it. The next problems along in 2038, please look up year 2038 problem, why 2038 or the apocalypse as in epoch ellipse. So here's to those who will end up fixing that one for the very little celebration. So I looked this up. Okay. The year 2038 is a problem because apparently some computer systems are unable to represent times after the 19th of January 2038. It's to do with something called Unix time, a digital way of keeping time digitally. Once you go beyond a certain moment on the 19th of January 2038, then everything is going

to explode. Wow. Not that. And then, and I was looking it up, there's a paragraph which starts, there is no solution. So I'm just saying that my guess is we'll get to 2038 and as David in Nottingham correctly says, someone will have fixed it. They won't have been paid very much money and we'll move on to 2039. But David is absolutely right.

The reason that Y2K didn't make hospitals fail and planes fall out of the sky is because people worked really hard to avert it. And then of course, as is the, as is the kind of, you know, the collective idiot mind, everyone went, well, it didn't happen, did it? You know, yeah, no, that's sort of the point. But the thing is, Y2K is still a terrible film. Number 10, Captain America, Brave New World. No, thank you. Yeah, and it's funny, if you haven't seen it in a cinema, don't worry, the American

Defense Department will just text it to your phone. So it's fine. Okay. That's a very useful thing. Thanks for doing that. Dog Man is at number nine. Still laughing at the Dog Man and the walking buildings. Sorry. Number eight is Marching Powder. Number seven is The Alto Nights. Now that seems to me a little bit of a low entry. Does it not?

Yes, it is. It's performed poorly. The trade presses have been filled with stories about just how poorly it has done. The main criticism which everyone seems to have, which I raised in my review, but I certainly wasn't alone in it, is why is Robert De Niro playing two roles? Why didn't they just have two actors doing it? Somebody said to me that they thought, and I thought this was very astute, they said that they thought that the reason he was playing two roles was to keep him interested. And I think that's right. It's not to keep us interested, it was to keep him interested. Because otherwise it is just seen it all before gangster story. This email, which is signed best wishes to both of you from

Anonymous, when I was watching The Alto Night, I didn't think of any Martin Scorsese films, but one film floated to my mind and that is Once Upon a Time in America. Not only is the theme extraordinarily similar, but also both star Robert De Niro. However, The Alto Nights lack the charisma and the intrigue that made Once Upon a Time in America enjoyable. I was wondering if they chose Robert De Niro to be in both the protagonist role and antagonist role, because they want to emphasise the message that even though they grew up together and had the same environment, their values and the view of the world are drastically different. Regardless, I found the first part of the film extremely

boring. The second half was okay, but overall, mediocre. I mean, I enjoyed it whilst it was on and then the minute it was gone, it was gone and I don't think I'll think about it again. And as I said, he's very, very soft opening and it will probably be out of the charts in a couple of weeks. A new entry at number six, which will be around a lot longer, I suspect, and that is Flow. Well, both you and I loved this. As I said, I just recently interviewed Michael Dudek-DeVitt who made The Red Turtle, something else I was doing. And we're talking about the way in which, who made The Red Turtle, something else I was doing. We're talking about the way in which flow like The Red Turtle tells its story without

words. It's a kind of universal language of cinema. Making history at the Oscars, it's just lovely. It is a film for children of all ages, and I include a 62-year- old man in that. You loved it too, right? It's Latvian, isn't it? Latvian, yes. I think we've had our first email in Latvian. Oh, fantastic.

It comes from Ilona Scudja. There's a bunch of Latvian and then I imagine a Google Translate, which says, on the weekly film podcast yesterday, British critics also talked about Flow, of course with good reviews, a very popular and cool show about cinema. They also recognized it as the best of the films reviewed on this week's show. Okay, so that's like an extract from a conversation somewhere in Latvia, I imagine. Thank you, Ilona. Matt from Bristol, Daphne from Los Angeles, and Maria from Kiev. Dear doctors, we made an emergency trip to the cinema on Friday to see Flow after hearing both of your thoughts on the show,

and it was well worth the visit. On our way home, our little group reflected on just how global it is. We could not think of another film that could be shown, unedited, to a room of people of any age and in any part of the world and have it be universally understood by all of them. At a time where the world is feeling increasingly disconnected and full of hostile differences, this was a little comfort for some on come on ground.

And the fact that Matt then signs it, he says up with bridges and down with walls, but the fact that he's in Bristol, Daphne is in Los Angeles, Miriam in the Keys sounds like an extraordinary group of people anyway, but they make a profound point I think. Yes. And I think again, this is a profound point about non-verbal cinema, silent cinema as it's generally called, which of course isn't silent. But I'll say this every time because Mike Figg has told it to me and it really stuck with me. When immigrants arrived at Ellis Island during the great wave, they were shown a silent film of life in New York in order to introduce them to this new world that they were entering. Figgis said, and then sound came along and suddenly film became national rather than international because the international part of cinema is silent cinema. So go see Flow if you get a chance. And obviously people might think,

well, we're adults. Why would we go and see an animation? Well, you need to trust us on this. Yes, you do. Mickey17 is at number five. Had a good run at the top and I liked it. I'm surprised by how well it's been received because if you remember when I reviewed it, I said, well, I like it very much, but it's very Bong Joon-Ho in as much as it's very, sorry, which genre are we in? And I think it's done pretty well and that's kind of encouraging. I think people who were going expecting Parasite may be surprised, but anyone who's seen The Host or Okja

will know that this is a very bong film. Black Bag is at number four. It's kind of an intriguing, exciting, I mean, essentially foolish but fun espionage thriller with some great performances, almost like a sort of, like a chamber play or something that just happens to be about international espionage and good performances. Bridget Jones mad about the boys at number three.

I laughed, I cried, I thought it was a mess but I didn't care. Number two is it, do I pronounce this, Neijia 2. Yes, so this wasn't national press screened, although some critics have been to see it now and have done reviews of it since then. It is a Chinese animated fantasy that has broken box office records inside and outside of China. Highest grossing animated film and highest grossing non-English language film in its domestic market. And first animated film in history to hit the two billion mark. So I will go and see it this weekend in Cornwall and I'll have a review next week. Have we had any emails about it?

We have not, no, but maybe we'll have for next week if you see Nezha 2. Correspondence at cobanamerica.com. We have had correspondence about the number one movie here and the number one movie in America, which is Disney Snow White. Why don't I do a roundup of all of them? And then you go ahead, go ahead, go them and then you come in. Maria Friel, Disney really need to stop doing this. Every iteration has just been a pointless attempt to churn money out of familiar properties and rewrite past cultural insensitivities. I honestly think the true test of all these films is who is going to watch these over the original animated classics. Also, the point at the end about the intended audience. What happened to films aimed

at 9, 10 and 11 year olds which adults could also genuinely and thoroughly enjoy? Arkham Knight says, you know when you're bringing in modern day sensibilities and politics into a fairy tale, of course. Of course, you're going to be able to tell a miserable story and make a horrible film. You're shooting yourself in the foot. It is a fairy tale. None of this is real. Folklore dwarves don't exist. Magic apples don't exist. Magical mirrors don't exist. Princes barely exist. Of course, films have become more

terrible and miserable because people can no longer separate the two things. We are left with make believe in misery. It's no longer escapism. There's more similar vein. Greg in Oxfordshire. I just came out of seeing Disney's Snow White with my six-year-old and loved it, loved it, loved it.

Whilst Mark is right about the new songs not being a patch on the old classics, the story was heartfelt and fun. My six-year-old fell about laughing at the dwarfs and he pretended to whistle all the way home. Whilst the cartoonishness entertains and throws back to the original nicely, the love story at the centre didn't feel contrived or forced but was given the time to grow. Snow White standing up for

what he's right, a story of people power against the greedy oligarchy felt connected to our time, and the central message of inner beauty over greed also landed well. Ignore the online abuse of people who make money criticising a film they haven't seen and go out and see it, says Greg in Oxfordshire. Um, and regarding junior input, here is the voice of Eva Jones, aged five. This is from Dr. Bob Mann in West Wellow Hampshire. This is a voice file of Eva Jones, age five, one of my six and a half grandkids. Okay.

His Eva's review. Hello, granddad. This is me, Eva, obviously. I'm here to tell you what my review of Snow White would be. I don't know why the prince is not a prince, like in the original movie. And there are some scary scenes that made me jump a bit. But the good things about it that I really liked was that it was really,

really funny. And I loved the songs. That's why I'd give it a full star of Eve. Thank you very much to Dr. Bob Mann for sending that in and thanks to Eva Jones for sending that in because it seems to me that that's exactly what these conversations haven't had. Inevitably, we're old guys, Eva is eight years old and this movie was made for her. So anyway, there's a random bunch of selection of opinion. Yeah. And I mean, as I said last week, I knew somebody who had taken their kid to see a preview screening of it and they said it was okay. They didn't love it. And they were at that point in their life when they were still quite new to cinema. So every film they saw was the best film they'd ever seen. We were talking last week about the fact that the brand awareness is so big that the film

might still have legs just because it is a Snow White film. I don't like it, but I equally don't like, and this is why we began last week with that very good email from somebody who was au fait with the production. I think that the sort of culture war backlash against it being woke is the very worst of human behavior. And what we were trying to do was to review the film rather than that stuff. And I do think it is really important to distinguish, you know, I didn't like it. And I thought there were things that were just that didn't work about it. Although

I like Rachel Zegler very much. And I think she nearly saves it, but not quite. But it is a perfect example of something which got completely drowned in this shrieking right-wing, anti-woke culture war nonsense. I will say this. If you ever use the phrase woke to describe something in a derogatory or a disparaging manner, you are an idiot and you should be ashamed of yourself. So what we'd like, I mean, so thank you very much for all the, for all the emails on this. And I just, it is quite interesting that Greg in Oxfordshire went with a six

year old, had a great time. Yeah. Uh, Eva aged eight had a good time and let's have more of that. And if you went and you didn't like it, then that's also fine. But at least these are reviews from people who have seen the film. Who are reviewing the film. And that is the point. Go see the film and send us an informed review based on what you've actually seen rather than what you've actually heard. And if you still don't like it, then that's fine.

Fine. I didn't like it, but the thing is it just rather puts paid to the idea that, well, it's woke and he's woke. So therefore you must like it because he's woke. She's just destroying the country. I mean, you can't, can't go down the high street anymore without trans athletes overtaking you. Anyway, in a moment, uh, we'll be back with, uh, amongst other things, Jason Statham in a working man. Also the end with us, a very special guest, George McKay guest, George Mackay. Gorgeous George Mackay. Well, March is upon us, Mark. What hair-themed movies can you think of? Why?

Well, I'm feeling mad as a March hare here. Actually, where does that phrase come from? It's a breeding season thing, but beyond the etymology, I'm ready to spring down rabbit holes in the internet, of course. Well, NordVPN can take you there. You can unlock films and global content with a single click by switching your virtual location in 111 countries. So you can watch Alice in Wonderland, Peter Rabbit, Jojo Rabbit, Who Framed Roger Rabbit,

Watership Down. And I can say, do it all safely, guarding against hackers and using public Wi-Fi securely. And NordVPN is the fastest VPN on the market providing smooth streams, oh Monty Python, the Holy Grail with the rabbit with the big teeth, no lags or buffering. Unwrap a huge discount on NordVPN by heading to nordvpn.com slash take plus with our link you'll get an extra four months free on the two-year plan and it's risk-free with Nord's 30-day money-back guarantee. Check the link in the description. What's up, Mark? All's well. How about you?

Well, I've been thinking about that cushion that we gave away at our live show. Yeah. That and the pencil case. Imagine if we had a load more that we needed to shift. Imagine the riches. Every bottom or pencil case in the country would be graced in some way by our presence. Mason- Well, when you put it like that, we should have used Shopify. Shopify is the commerce platform revolutionizing millions of businesses worldwide from people selling compasses to comfy cushions. Jason- And it covers all your sales channels from a shop front ready POS system to its all-in-one e-commerce platform.

It gets you selling across social media marketplaces. Oh, and it's full of the industry-leading tools ready to ignite your growth. Shopify gives you complete control over your business and your brand without learning new skills in design or coding. And thanks to award-winning help, Shopify is ready to support your success every step of the way. Sign up for a £1 per month trial period at Shopify.co.uk slash curmode. Hi, it's Jesse Tyler Ferguson, the host of the podcast Dinners on Me. Spring is here, and you know what that means, longer days, backyard hangs, and of course, firing up the grill.

longer days, backyard hangs, and of course, firing up the grill. And when I'm planning a get-together, Whole Foods Market is my secret weapon for making it both fresh and effortless. Let's start with lighter fare because you know sometimes you want something crisp and bright after those rich winter meals. Whole Foods Market has the best seasonal veggies. Think asparagus, artichokes, and easy salad kits to throw together in just a few minutes. Pair that with some wild-caught halibut or a perfectly marinated chicken breast and boom you've got a meal that feels as good as it tastes. And if you're planning on having some folks over for this

barbecue, Whole Foods Market has everything from high-quality meats to the best side dishes like deli salads and charcuterie boards that instantly level up any gathering. Oh and of course don't forget the drinks. Their seasonal Italian sodas like berry blend and orange hibiscus are my new obsession. So whether you're keeping it light or going full-on feast, Whole Foods Market has you covered. Make Whole Foods your destination for all spring gatherings. Make Whole Foods your destination for all spring gatherings. Make Whole Foods your destination for all spring gatherings. So this week's guest is the one and only gorgeous George Mackay. He's back with us to discuss

The End, Joshua Oppenheimer's post-apocalyptic musical where he plays son to Tilda Swinton's mother and Michael Shannon's father. They are the characters names. It'll all become clear, hopefully, in our conversation which follows this clip from The End. Look at me, see how I shine, the best comes last in the grand design And I'm unsurpassed, the future's mine alone The shining city on the hill is me alone, alone Who else to light the way but me alone, all alone I'm delighted to say I've been joined by one of its stars.

That's George Bukai. Gorgeous George. Hello, how are you? I'm very well, Faze. How are you? It's Kermode who insists on doing the gorgeous bit beforehand, but it's like as soon as he sees your name, he has to add the word beforehand. I'm very touched. Okay. So The End, I'm going to let you describe it because it is certainly one of the more unusual films of the year, so in your words. So The End is a musical about ostensibly the last family on earth who are living in a luxury bunker

25 years after the collapse of the earth on the surface. And it is about the family dynamics and how a family exists in that extreme situation and the sort of delusions and lies that hold that place together. It's not the most obvious idea for a musical, you would think. The last family on earth, because the earth has been destroyed through climate change, is a sort of inherently depressing subject. So how was this explained? Because this is Joshua Oppenheimer, who has done basically documentaries up until now. How did he explain the idea to you and why the need for music?

I think firstly that the need for music, or Josh's documentaries as well, for it was the act of killing and the look of silence, I believe. And the act of killing particularly is rather an extraordinary documentary and sort of quite bizarre in a way that the lead protagonist in that is a man who perpetrated this genocide in Indonesia and then Josh basically made a documentary about him and his fellows making a film of everything that they did in the genocide and over the course of making that film they suddenly start to look at what they've done. And so Josh's kind of, his specialist subject is kind of denial really in his documentaries and the ramifications of it.

And so he chose to make this a musical because for him he said feels that musicals so often are inherently delusional and the family at the core of this are surviving on delusion basically and I think what's interesting about the film is it's kind of looking at that tight rope between when is something just putting the best foot forward and building a narrative that is positive and necessary and useful to get you through a pretty tough situation, or when that becomes really damaging because it's entirely untrue. And the music is the exact opposite of what people might expect just listening to the opening part of this conversation.

You know, it's not gloomy at listening to the opening part of this conversation. It's not gloomy at all because this is part of the delusion. It's all rosy. In fact, the first song you're singing is called Together Our Future Is Bright, which has to be the most deluded song in the whole piece. It's definitely kind of a homage to the sort of golden age musicals. Josh, I think the concept and the idea came from, he was going to make a documentary about an oligarch in Indonesia who was looking to live in a bunker and buy

a bunker to move his family into. And when Josh sort of realised that the documentary he actually wanted to make would be 25 years beyond the point of him going underground, he thought, how can I find this story? And he went back to kind of cleanse his palate from that day's filming and then watched the film The Umbrellas of Cherbourg and kind of put these two ideas together. Now your character, and I think I'm about to say no one has a name, you're just father, son, father, son, mother, friend, and so on. He has no nothing of life on the surface. No, he was born in the bunker. So all his relationships and sort of socialization has

come from the situation that he's born into. So I would imagine that was quite an interesting character for you to get into, not just the fact you have to act and sing, but also he's a kind of a like a man baby. You know, he's very childlike. Yeah. Yeah. He's, I mean, I'm fascinated, like in general, but especially with work with this idea of nature versus nurture. And you or I, born in another time, in another country, keeping other friends, would we still

be us? How much of who we are and what happens to us is defined by the context that we're in, and how much is innately Simon or innately George? And so, Sun is a perfectly extreme version of that question. All he has is a very limited understanding of the world, also a lot of which is lies. But yet he is also, he has this kind of innate radar for truth. And the thing about kind of the joy of playing him and trying to sort of get to the bottom of was just very simply trying to work out what he actually knows and what he knows

innately, what he has been told and when he is facilitating something for the betterment of the people that he loves or when he's kind of obscuring something to protect the status quo of the family. And it so it kind of speaks to that first question of like, I guess, what is truth and who are we, who is he? And as soon as people see, I mean when I looked at all the details, they're like, okay, so your father's Michael Shannon, your mother is Tilda Swinton, that's going to be an unusual upbringing for sure. It's very much a theatrical piece, you know, it is. When you are performing the numbers, when you are singing the songs, are you singing

live? What was the setup that you all wanted to follow? What was Josh Oppenheimer asking you to do? Well Josh, confusingly we have Josh Oppenheimer, our writer-director, but then we've got Josh Schmidt, our composer. Okay, so between the two Joshs, it was, and Marius, our musical producer, it was always going to be that we sung the the songs live and of course with that you know that's to get the performance and the feeling and the sort of tonality of the voice and a lot of those musical numbers are done in one takes or very

few takes so you know we wanted it to be as truthful as possible but then with the caveat that when there's multiple voices some of those will be cleaned up afterwards or pre-recorded so that you can get a clean track of the lead vocalist. So we usually would be doing them with a live piano in our ears and like a little tiny sort of headset in our ears. So compare and contrast this musical with Sunshine Elite, which was the last time I saw you sing, I think. This is, well, this is much bleaker as he's trying to get people into the cinema. No, it's, it's, Sunshine

Elite is joyous, you know, it's a much more kind of, I guess it's heartfelt and it's, it's ultimately sort of positive, I guess, as you know, there's different shades to the drama and the story within it. It's also based upon established songs by the proclaimers, where this is, I think more of, to be honest, more of a specific vision in terms of just it's the growing of the project. Like Josh was always very specific about this has to be a musical and I kind of always, when I think about the script and the project, it's sort of almost like tartan or tweed or something. It's made up of like patterns upon patterns upon patterns upon patterns, which are all in themselves quite rigid, but when laid upon each other

make this kind of very textured piece. So I mean, the difference is, is it's probably a bit more bizarre and the ending is a bit bleaker. It is. No, it certainly is. It's only connected by the fact that you're singing and there's no other connection. I think the thing that really worked for me, and I think the thing that makes it so unsettling, which it's intended to be, is this idea that you are writing or helping Michael Chan, your father, write his memoir, which of course no one is going to read, but he is telling his version of the truth.

And there's a bit where you say, and I think I've got this right, because I stopped it and spooled back just to make sure. So you're reading this out to Michael Shannon, but the words are his. We'll never know if our industry contributed to the rise in temperatures, but without fossil fuels mankind would have been languishing in poverty. And we start to realize that you're the last family on earth, but he is guilty of, he's one of the criminals responsible for the fact that the earth is in flames. And it's unsettling because these are exactly the kind of arguments that we're hearing now from millionaires and billionaires who are trying to justify drilling again.

I mean, who knows who I'm thinking of? But it's said in the future, but this is all about what's happening right now. No, totally. Totally. I mean, I think there's such a discussion at the minute as to what is truth. Also because our understanding of what is right or what is true is so polarised around the world, I think, at the minute. And with all our, in all different countries, you've got everything is so polarised around the world, I think at the minute. And you know, in all different countries, you've got everything is so polarised, these two sort of worlds of truth

exist entirely separately from each other. And there's a more extreme and literal version that, yes, it's about the climate crisis, it's about these billionaires, it's about these oligarchs. But what I love about the film is it's hopefully it's also about ourselves. Those are the extreme versions. And the point of this is, this is a very extreme Petri dish of an example with Michael Shannon's character and our setup. But in every sense it's all these kind of like tiny little half truths or lies that sometimes are made for the best intentions that the ramifications of which can be really damaging. And I'm fascinated by that. You know, I've had a family recently and you know, even I got a bit of sad news the other day and immediately as I start telling it to a friend, I start softening it.

And I, the conversation that I've had, it changes ever so slightly and it bends for the benefit of, and what I was intending to do was sort of ease the delivery of that, but actually you're warping it. And just that as an example, every interaction we have, we've sort of, you know, you've got to be present within them, but the ramifications of any sort of deviation from the truth for our own ends and for the protection of our own, the potential ramifications are so dire,

given where the climate's at, given where the world's at. And that's what the film's about, because I think it's something we're all responsible, have to be responsible for and take responsibility for. But some people are more responsible than others. Oh, totally, yeah. And also that's the thing, so many of the leaders around the world,

there is no sort of vision for the world seemingly. It's often a career thing where therefore you sort of, people sort of handing over information that they know will attract people regardless of what that information is or the ramifications of it. Do you think, I mean you just touched on it in your previous answer, do you think you played this differently because you're a father? Well, yeah, I mean I had our second child over the course of like, just after making this but my wife was pregnant during the filming and yeah definitely.

Definitely I think it's that kind of crossroad moments of trying to want into, I don't know, all constantly navigating, oh, there's going to be my decisions are going to reverberate in a different way than they have done previously. Or at least my understanding that they will reverberate further than, than me has changed since you know, since having them. And I think that's, they would have reverberated before kids, but just knowing that I've kind of got my family and also wanting to protect my family in this world and do what's right for them, but also kind of have a responsibility for

the wider world community. You know, it's like traveling for work. You say, here we are, we're doing a film about the climate disaster and aren't we good for doing that? And I'm on my moral high horse about this and that. But if my family needs me to get back quickly and I can take a plane to get back there quicker, what's the best option? For the wider community do I say sorry you can wait for another week or do I hop on that plane and be a good dad? And I don't know the perfect answer for it that this film explores that because you know I could either do what's right for my family but it might actually the world that they step into 25 years from now that might have been the wrong choice for them. And that's a sort of warmer, lighter

example, but there's a sort of darker, more extreme version questioned in this film. And that conundrum is something I'm figuring out constantly, and I think we're all figuring out constantly. And yeah, and the film looks at that, and that's why I love the film. And towards your next project, what are we seeing? So the next project, there's a couple to come out, which I'm not sure is in various stages of announcement, but I did three projects last year. One of which has been announced, which now I could talk about because Mark mentioned it a wee while ago, it was Mark Jenkins' next film, Rosa Nevada, and that's just being

finished off right now. So when it is released, I'm not sure, but that and a number of other films will be coming out next year. So what are the ones you can't tell us about? What are they? I don't know. I think I can measure. Paul Wright, the director, for those in peril,

we did a film called Mission. So now I'm just mentioning it. And the other one, Pablo Ciopera, he's done a film called Anne Sons with Bill Nighy. So yeah, there'll be those three. Well, we'll follow everything that you do, George. So we appreciate your time. Thank you very much, Antti.

Cool. Thank you. Thank you, Simon. Notice how he melted under my withering questioning about the films he can't talk about and then told us all about them. I know. They don't sound to me like top secret kind of Marvel films or Chris Nolan films. So I'm sure he's going to be fine on that.

I was on stage with him and I said, you know, we can talk about Rosa Nevada, can't we? And Mark Jenkins was in the audience and went, no. Although we can now, it's all been properly announced. Right. So, okay, that's interesting as to why you can't talk. You would think any kind of buzz is a good thing. Yes. I think it's to do with organizing the buzz and all that sort of stuff. And everyone's just terrified of being the first one to break an embargo nowadays. Are you suggesting that a buzz has to be organized? I always thought a buzz is kind of like a

naturally occurring buzz because something is exciting. Yeah. Maybe not organized, maybe marshaled. Anyway, onto the first fantastic interview, both from you and of course from gorgeous George McKay. You, anyway, anyway, onto the first fantastic interview, both from you and of course from gorgeous George McKay. You said in that interview, so here's the thing, you said that this seems to be a very, very different project for to Act of Killing, for example, that Oppenheimer previously worked in documentaries, which is true. But it's worth remembering that Act of Killing used drama, fantasy, and in fact, even musical theatre. It was getting people who had committed atrocities to restage those atrocities and through the

restaging to perhaps start to recognise their own guilt, their own involvement. In fact, there is a really weird musical fantasia sequence in The Act of Killing in which the word act is doing a lot of work because it is about the reenactment. So this, once again, although it seems very different on the surface from The Act of Killing, it once again uses musical fantasia to address atrocities, namely, the destruction of the planet and the extermination of, as far as we can tell, most of the population by people who are now living the high life in a lavish underground bunker filled with art and cake and every possible luxury. So although the film

seemed very, very different, there is a strong thematic core. And I mean, George McKay in the interview talked about, well, it's a film about the family dynamics, about the dynamics of the last family on earth stuck in this bunker. It's also, he said, about delusions and lies and the things that hold things together. And I think Oppenheimer's work is absolutely about denial. The point that George McKay was making is that there is something inherently delusional about music or fantasy. You know, you suddenly go into these sequences in which there's music playing and you're dancing and all the rest of it. Remember also, in this, George McKay's character, Son, is in the process of writing a memoir that will completely rewrite historical truth about his father.

So he's editing his father's memoir, which won't be read by anybody because there isn't anyone to read it anyway, other than perhaps if this family's lineage continues. And I also think it's important that musicals are able to say the unsayable thing. I mean, whether it's the Hills are alive with the sound of music, because obviously if you were Julie Andrews on those, you wouldn't say that out loud, but you can sing it. Or, you know, if you look at a musical like Cabaret and that sequence, the Tomorrow Belongs to Me sequence, there is something about the way in which music can say things that you couldn't just simply say.

I think that the songs that you have here in this film, they have a strong sort of golden age pastiche element. It was interesting that George McKay cited Umbrellas of Sherborg because Umbrellas of Sherborg has become like a touchstone movie for musicals which have their head in the clouds, but their feet on the ground. It was a key inspiration for Chuck Chuck Baby, which is, as we said, was this romance that played out in a chicken factory, and yet was absolutely driven by the inspiration of Umbrellas of Sherborg. The songs here, which are by Joshua Schmidt and as George was saying, the music producer

Marissa Vries, they're sung live so that lends a kind of post Les Miserables realism even in the midst of outlandish fantasy because of course they use that in the in the um the film version of Les Miserables. Um and I mean although so it's a musical but it's more a musical in the manner of someone like Leos Carracks than than Busby Berkeley but it is a musical and the fact that he said it has to be a musical, I can't tell this story without it being a musical, I think is really important because everything about what they're doing in this bunker is performance.

It's all an act. The whole thing is an act. I mean, you said, for example, your parents in this are Michael Shannon and Tilda Swinton, okay? Who are they? Imagine. Imagine. But also, as you quite rightly said, sorry, this interview was so brilliant. are Michael Shannon and Tilda Swinton, okay? Who are- Imagine. Imagine.

But also, as you quite rightly said, sorry, this interview was so brilliant. All I'm doing is talking about the things that you've raised because you really got to the heart of it. Michael Shannon apparently terrified Werner Herzog when he turned up to audition for whichever film it was, My Son, My Son, I think it was. And you know, Werner Herzog said he was absolutely

terrifying. Tilda Swinton famously did that art installation, the sort of modern Sleeping Beauty, in which she slept in a glass box in an exhibition space. These are people whose theatrical persona expands beyond the screen. And so therefore, yes, it is performance heavy. It is about performance.

Also in terms of the musical element of it, Brody Gallagher was in Commitments, Tim McKinney did Frankenförter in Rocky Horror on stage. You know, everyone in, George was in Sunshine on Leith, everyone in this is coming at it from the point of view of, of course that's what it's about. And I thought it was really interesting. I didn't know this thing that it began life

as a documentary about oligarchs. then decided, well we can't do that, so I'll make a musical fantasia about it. And I would say in terms of the sort of the overall assessment of the film, Joshua Oppenheimer is not scared of a challenge. And I think the same is true of George Mackay. I think they are utterly fearless in their choices. If you look at George McKay's career after 1917, right, 1917, great big blockbuster, big movie, right? What's he done since then? He did that Babak Anvery film, I Came By. He did that strange gender sexuality drama, The Fam. He did The Beast, the Bertrand Bonello film, which is a film that's inspired by Henry James

and plays out over multiple timeframes from early 20th century France to some weird science fiction future. These are not the choices of somebody who is afraid of a challenge. He's recently completed work on the Mark Jenkins film, you know, Mark Jenkins who shoots his films on clockwork cameras and does all the sound post-synced.

And so my feeling about the end is, it may not work for everyone. But I just look at it in the same way as I look at it. We just think the fact that somebody is doing work this brave is wonderful. And it was interesting when last week when I was reviewing Snow White, I said that my general feeling was,

it would be better if it didn't exist. I think that in the case of this, the world is better that it does exist. Whether it works for you or not, and I am absolutely willing to believe that there are some people for whom it won't work. I know that the critics have been quite divided about it. Some people have been quite sniffy about the songs, but I just think, yes, make films like this,

with films that you literally have you going, what? Sorry, what? Over to you. Well, I think it's going to struggle. That would be my honest assessment. I mean, clearly the cast is extraordinary. And my opinion on Michael Shannon was formed. I mean, to be honest, it's another apocalyptic movie. You remember Take Shelter? I do. Yes, of course. And he came in and we did an interview

for a previous incarnation of this year program. He was not forthcoming. Miserable get. I mean, come on, Michael, you know, the film or don't. Steven Graham was originally earmarked for that role in the end. Yes, I do. Cause I told you that. Oh, sorry. I beg your pardon. I do that all the time. I do that all the time. I'm so sorry. That's right. The good lady, Sarah Mrs. Taring-Dawes often says, I heard this thing and then recounts to me something that I have done either on a podcast or on the radio. I'm so sorry. That's the way it works. But anyway, I think there is something about the bleakness, which

means that when times are bleak, I don't want to see a bleak film. I don't mind being challenged, but I'm just saying, I think it will. They put in some very good performances and George is great, Michael Shannon, Tilda Swindon, very good, Tim McEnany, very good. But I'm glad it exists. I agree with your basic premise. I'm glad that it's there. In one frame back, which is in take two, we will be discussing and recommending further viewing of the best post-apocalyptic movies. If that's your mindset, then that's where we're going to be. Which takes shelter is another one. So, If that's your mindset, then that's where we're going to be. Which takes shelter is another one. So, correspondents at kerbandomeo.com, delighted to say that after the end of the world, it's

high time we all had a good laugh, which won't be happening because it's the laughter lift. Here we go. Hey, Mark. Yes. Hey, son. With spring here, I thought I'd get out in the garden again and perhaps replenish the local anthophilia population. So I bought a hive and headed to the local pet shop.

I thought, I know, I'm going to start with a dozen. And the shopkeeper carefully counted out 13 bees into a container. I said, no, no, no, that's one too many. I said, that one's a freebie. Yeah you were right about the absence of laughter. I'm in you know who's bad books this week again. She was out all night at a ceramicist social event and hadn't eaten a thing. She put some leftover lasagne in the fridge with a post-it note on it and said do not eat.

But you know what it's like after you've had a few glasses of macron village. Sure enough, when she came in, she shouted from the kitchen, did you eat my leftovers in the fridge? No, dear, I said, I ate them in here. At the kitchen table, yes. Anyway, to cheer her up, I reminded her of when Child 3 was born and I rushed her to the maternity unit in Showbiz North London and when we arrived she started screaming and screaming. So I grabbed the doctor and said, I think it is a contraction. Yes, he said it is, but please Mr. Moe enough with the English lessons.

First let's find out what's wrong with your wife. So very good, I thought. I think I heard a little laughter there. A little laughter in a little laughter lift. We'll be back very shortly with a review of a working man. A working man. It's the state after this. A working man.

With the Fizz loyalty program, you get rewarded just for having a mobile plan. So an email here from Sean Chacksfield from Wiltshire. Dear Bruce and Wayne, I was listening to your discussion on the last pod on the Jurassic World trailer, which managed to include the final shot of the movie. As you were talking, I thought to myself, I'm sure the last shot of the Dark Knight was in one of the trailers. At that very moment, Simon stated confidently, I bet Chris Nolan doesn't let that happen. I checked to make sure my memory wasn't playing tricks on me. And not only does the final shot of The Dark Knight appear in the trailer, spoiler alert for a 17 year old film that is one of the most watched of

all time, but Batman riding his Batpod into the distance to evade the Gotham police is the very first thing shown. The shot out of context doesn't give much away, but still. The Dark Knight is the film that made Chris Nolan, Chris Nolan. So I suspect such flagrant marketing doesn't happen on his watch these days. Well, next time we interview him, we'll check it. And Sean sends us the trailer and he's absolutely right. But I guess if the shot doesn't give anything away, that is slightly different. Yes. Yeah. I mean, if it's just Batman on a bike, that's fine. But the thing with the shot with the Jurassic thing is it is because it's the thing coming out of the wave in the

sea, isn't it? Yes. So it's like they're everywhere. Which is a bit of a spoiler. Which is a bit of a spoiler, yeah. Charlie emails to say, Dear Stygimoloch and Mosasaurus, listening to you talk again about the final scene of Jurassic World Fallen Kingdom being in the trailer last week reminded me of watching the excellent Spanish found footage zombie film, Wreck, on DVD. Yes.

That's REC. Yeah, a very, very, very fine, terrifying film. The experience was somewhat ruined by the fact that when you pressed play on the DVD main menu, something I haven't done for a long time, you were shown the final shot of the film as a transition between the menu and the movie. The scene in question shows the protagonist being pulled by her legs across the floor into a dark room to her obvious demise. So it's impossible to watch the film on DVD without knowing how the main character dies and waiting for that scene to happen. That just seems like nonsense. If they're going to have an image just for a transition

from one bit to the next bit, you don't need that bit. No, that is really, really weird. Really, really weird. Thank you, Charlie. Correspondence at KohlerMeier.com. What else is out? One final flourish. Here we go. Okay. So there's a new Jason Satham movie in set of miles. This is a working man. This is the latest in Jason's ever expanding job description of, after the mechanic, the transporter, the beekeeper, now it's just generically a working man. So this is adapted from a source by Chuck Dixon,

best known for his work on Punisher and Batman script, co-written by Sylvester Stallone and director David Ayer. Now think about this. So Stallone was Oscar nominated all those years ago for writing Rocky and David Ayer wrote Training Day for which Denzel Washington won an Oscar, wrote and directed Harsh Times and End of Watch, which William Friedkin, who made the French connection said was one of the great police procedurals of all time and more recently, Helmed the Baykeeper with the state.

So the state is either Levin or Levin, Levin Cade, anyway, he's a working man. He works on a construction site for a family business, which is run by Michael Pena and his wife and his daughter. And he's just a guy, you know, he's just a guy. But when some other guys come onto the site and hassle one of his guys, he sorts them out proper commando style. Because he's got a past. Here's a trailer. So listen, today's going to be hard. Let's all go home with the same amount of fingers that we came with. Let's get it. When my wife passed and I left the Royal Marines, a lot of people would have given up on me.

You gave me a job, you were patient with me. You, Carla, Jenny, you're my family. You're gonna forget it. Excuse me, it's not your business. I'm good boss. Lovin', was that some military shit? Hey, you didn't see anything. Just get my back if I ever need it. You get the general idea. Yeah, I do.

I've understood the whole film. Yes. And here's the thing, Simon. You absolutely do understand the whole film as a result of hearing that clip. So he was a Royal Marine and the opening credits show him saving a comrade who's lost his eyesight in this attack and blowing stuff up and shooting things. Now he has to live with those demons. He's lost his wife and his father and daughter is trying to get custody of his daughter. Anyway, so one day Michael Peña's daughter,

Jenny, goes out for a party and he's kidnapped by evil Russians and Michael Pena asks the state, he says, you must help us. The state says, I'm not that person anymore. But of course he is that person. So he takes a few days off work and he goes to solve the problem by killing everyone. So which kind of, to be honest, all problems disappear, don't they? If everybody else disappears, it's not a problem. Just basically just kill everyone. His general approach appears to be go to bars and buy

drugs and kill everyone until you finally arrive at the girl. That's it. So it's basically it's taken. It's taken, but without Liam Neeson, but with the Stath. And it's not his daughter, but it might as well be because as he says in the thing, your family. And so, you know, he's got a special set of skills that will make things very bad for people like you. And also, I don't know whether you heard it from that clip, his accent is a bit nonspecific. There's a lot of stuff about what Stath does is he does a bad American accent. But in this, I mean, obviously he's living in America, but he was in the Royal Marines. So I think he sort of, he just does Stath for most words. But then he goes, you gave me a job. Was he from Boston? Where does that come from?

As for the Russians, well, they include a hilarious cameo from Jason Fleming, who is, I am Russian and my name is Vrandy de Farty. He turns up, he does some stuff, Jason Statham hangs him over his own swimming pool, threatening to drown him in a chair. And then as we get higher up the chain of oligarchs and fiendish evildoers, they become, they say less and less, but their henchmen become more and more like Marilyn Manson roadies on a week off. You know, it's all sort of like pouty hair and big starey eyes. It makes no sense whatsoever.

As I said, it's a, oh, your daughter's missing, right. I'll go to this bar and I'll attempt to buy drugs. Then whoever sells me drugs, I'll kill them and then find the person who... You go, okay, well, fine. The killings are crunchy. Surprised to see once again, 15 certificate, okay? 15 certificate, according to the BBFC, strong bloody violence, injury detail,

fast paced stylized sequences of frequent shootings, bites, fights with bone breaking, stabbings, knife slashings, large spurts of blood and bloody aftermath detail. 15 certificate, kids today don't know they're born. The problem is it doesn't have any of the... See, classic statham is the transporter period. I mean, obviously when he was doing it, he did Spy, that's brilliant. But the transporter movies, the one in which

he has to oil wrestle people for no good reason at all. They just take off his shirt and then wrestle a bunch of very fit muscular guys in oil. Okay, fine. The bit in transport, I think it's transporter three, when at gunpoint, the person who he is transporting gets him to perform a strip tease on the top of a cliff. Why? Well, because, you know, nice to look at. And he does. And there's none of the stuff, you know, there's none of the great state thanam one lines like i am not the guy so the problem is in in the way of many of these films this takes itself seriously it's kind of it's got a it's it's got a kind of po-faced you know bad stuff has happened to a young girl and now i must kill everyone um and it's not witty and it gets quite dull at times. I mean, I'm, I am a state fan because I like the sort of the, the, the ballet of

it and it's not very bullet. It's very, it's very punchy, crunchy, stabby, stabby shooty, but not funny. And, you know, certainly not a, it's, it's a lower ranking stay thing. And it does make me think, wow, David air is really down shifted, you know, from a guy who was making the kind of movies that attracted Oscar attention to this. But you know, there we go. It's the state. That's what he does. I just wish he was doing it with people that gave him funnier lines and forced him to take his shirt off and wrestle in oil. Speaking of which, just for anyone who's watching the Reacher series on the telly at the moment, there is

clearly something in the guy's contract, I forget his name, that he has to take his shirt off, at least his shirt off in every show. So he's, I don't know, he's polishing some cutlery or something. Oh, I've got a stain on my shirt. I know I'm going to take my shirt off and then strut around for a while and then find another shirt. It's just pathetic. Can I say it's pathetic? If I look like Jason Statham, I would do this show topless, but I don't and so I won't. Thank the good Lord for that.

Because there's vision that goes with this. I'm very happy to look at your t-shirt, your guitar, and your posters. No, no, no. And your Tom Robinson band. Believe me, that's why I started that thing, if I looked like Jason Satham. And let's be absolutely clear, I don't look anything like Jason Satham. I look like the old guy from Up, and you look like Tintin. Also, on the subject of adolescence, which we have been, if you had a body like Steven Graham, who clearly worked out just

to an extraordinary level to get to where he has to be for the boxing show, Thousand Blows, next time you're on a show, you are going to wear a t-shirt that tight because he looks incredible for 51. And also remember when George Mackay came in talking about fam, you remember that? And in order to play fam, he played this tattooed, you know, beefcake, really, really sort of pumped up guy. And you know, what is possible to do that? How do you know what, what work? I mean, obviously you have to be young and you have to be fit, but he was, he looked astonishing, didn't he? I mean, he was just like- He did, but Stephen Graham's 51. That's why it gives inspiration to everybody.

Yeah. I think because when I get to 51, I want to look like, like Stephen Graham. Do you think if you and I went on a training regime, we could, we could buff up? Definitely. No question. Really? Absolutely. I have absolutely no doubts at all. It might need

a few sacrifices here and there. Less of the Macomb village, less of the Guinness, and fewer packets of crisps. But anyway, personally, I'm hoping that A Working Man is our movie of the week, but let's find out because that's the end of take one. This has been a Sony Music Entertainment production. This week's tea was Jen, Eric, Josh, Vicki, Zachy and Heather. Producer was Jem, the redactor was Simon Pool. And if you're not following the pod already, please do so wherever you get your podcast. Mark, what is your film of the week? A working man you say? Okay, that's a surprise. This is the end, beautiful friend, the end.

This is the end of Take 1. Don't forget, take two has landed adjacent to this podcast. It hasn't. Take two is delayed due to the embargo on the woman in the yard. So take two will be the very end of the day because of the embargo and we apologize for that in advance. Even though it's nothing to do with us. No, nothing to do with us. Well, fairly shortly, and maybe by the time you've actually listened to this, it has arrived, but it might not have arrived at exactly

the same time. If you want to get in touch, don't forget it's correspondence at kerbandamer.com. We'll see you shortly.