Kermode & Mayo’s Take - Zack Snyder, Rebel Moon – Part One: A Child of Fire, The Boy and the Heron & Ferrari

Episode Date: December 22, 2023

It’s Christmas! This week, Simon chats to Zack Snyder about his new space opera ‘Rebel Moon – Part One: A Child of Fire’, which sees an ex-soldier search for allies to help defend her home when it is threatened by the cruel ruling Imperium. Mark gives his take on the film, as well as reviewing ‘The Boy and the Heron’, the long-awaited and apparently final film from legendary filmmaker Hayao Miyazaki, which follows a 12-year-old boy, who, after speaking to a talking heron, journeys into another world to search for his mother, who he believed to be dead; and ‘Ferrari’, Michael Mann’s 30-years-in-the-making passion project, a biographical sports drama about  Enzo Ferrari, who founded the iconic Italian car company. Time Codes (relevant only for the Vanguard - who are also ad-free!): 11:35 The Boy and the Heron Review 20:08 Box Office Top Ten 31:53 Zack Snyder Interview 49:00 Rebel Moon – Part One: A Child of Fire Review 57:36 Laughter Lift 01:05:14 Ferrari Review 01:13:00 What’s On You can contact the show by emailing [e-mail] or you can find us on social media, @KermodeandMayo EXCLUSIVE NordVPN Deal ➼ https://nordvpn.com/take Try it risk-free now with a 30-day money-back guarantee! A Sony Music Entertainment production. Find more great podcasts from Sony Music Entertainment at sonymusic.com/podcasts and follow us @sonypodcasts To advertise on this show contact: [e-mail] Learn more about your ad choices. Visit podcastchoices.com/adchoices

I was very dark out here. I feel like I had a small but powerful tart. Ah, that's better. My sail, my sail, my sail, my sail, for family's sake. Take one, take one. I'm going to take one. I'm going to take one. I'm going to take one.

I'm going to take one. I'm going to take one. I'm going to take one. I'm going to take one. I'm going to take one. I'm going to take one. I'm going to take one. I'm going to take one. I'm going to take one. I'm going to take one. I'm going to take one. I'm going to take one. My sail, my sail, my sail, my sail, my sail for family's sake.

Take one, take two and name victory, its command and nails take. Witches Simon, witches Mark, we ask the question true. Both are merchandise and hand to sail to me and you. Question's messed in film review asent TV shows, correspondence far and wide To keep them on their toes Whos sail, whos sail, whos sail, whos sail for family sake Take one, take two and name take three, its covenant nails take The budget for the clues was cut so on canal they went

No laughter, lift upon a barge, no expense was spent The very best production team, the point is surely moot The vanguardist has kept us strong, so here we also loathe We sail, we sail, we sail, we sail for family's sake Take one, take two and name, take three, it's common and nails take We sail, we sail, we sail, we sail for family's sake Take one, take two and name, take three, it's common and nails take It's good to know that there are some Christmas traditions that are unaffected by the March of time. And that was our traditional wasaela, who is of course Kenohara in Presswick, who says, dear Drs Fous and Halsey,

the wasaela's are back with another ditty. We've tried to keep it short this time, only two verses instead of the usual 50. We do hope you can find time for us in this season of festivities. Very Merry Christmas to you two, Chaps, the stand-ins, the whole production team, the church members, and of course, Jason and Heretha Sanjeev,

everyone really is like one big family. Family. From Ken, actor, musician, artist, and one-time winner of Larry Grayson's Generation Game. Yes. I've still got the Cuddly toy. Well, our grandson, Nisha, has. Tickety Tonghtown, with people who just won't't go away and up with those who might just make them.

Thanks for their heads up on the offer. Excellent. Anyway, Ken, thank you very much indeed for another. I've got that ringing through my head now. It's almost as memorable as the Dodge Brothers Christmas. Thank you very much for bringing that up. Because all four tracks on there are like earworms. They are, and it's like, you know, when they do,

I imagine in a few years time, when they do carols from King's College, that's what they'll do, you know, heart-be-heral, they'll do a Kamayi faithful, and then they'll do... Don't shoot it, Santa. Don't shoot it, Santa. And, hey, let me think...

I can't wait for Christmas. Trim your tree. Trim your Christmas tree. And is that Christmas in her? That's kind of the rule, isn't it? It's all in the mind. No, I don't think so. It's all on the CD. It's as I said, that's a cover version and as the great little big band in Manchester used to say these songs, the historical artifacts and do not necessarily represent the views of the musicians. No, no, absolutely. You know, of course, I understand that. Anyway, thank you very much.

And what's sail to everybody? And with apologies to the Danes who listened, when you said quite reasonably, what is Danish for happy Christmas? Yes. And I said, I can't remember. And it's clearly your... Clearly your... Clearly your... Clearly your... Like this, here's the poster that we had, Christmas. Yes. And I said, I can't remember. And it's clearly your, clearly, you're clearly

like this is the poster that we had a throw air pulled up. That's how you write it. Oh, you did the love actually thing. When did they come in? A Christmas day. Okay, but it's not Christmas day yet. Yeah, that's last. Oh, that's last Christmas. Last Christmas. Did you give me a heart? And a very next day. Very next day. We could make a movie about that. That's the entire plot of the... Is Emma Thompson free? Clearly are you?

Clearly are you? Anyway, that's the thing. So, apologies for not remembering it. For the last program. Anyway, we're here, and we're on page 13, by the way. Why are we starting on page 13? And why is my page... Oh, you know that bit before we start. Is it that? Yes. We're on page 13 by the way. Why are we starting on page 13 and why is my past? Oh

You know that bit before we see that Yes, that's what it is. Why is mine all blah? Oh, yes, because you've got a notion which is gonna I'm not you with any of the secrets of the show Anyway, thank you very much for downloading us and what are we expecting to happen in this in this particular podcast? I'm going to be reviewing the boy in the heron and Ferrari and Rebel Moon Part One, a child of fire with our special guest. Thank you. And there's a hyphen and a colon in that. So it's super punctuation. Rebel Moon, hyphen, part one, colon, a child of fire should be full stop. With our special guest, Zach Efron, one of your favourites. So that is your actual Zach Efron on the show.

You're doing that as a joke or you're doing that because your brain's gone. No, no, no, I know how much you've always respected. All pretty much all of his films. I love Zach Efron. Whenever a Zach Efron movie comes up, you go, I'm really, really looking forward to this. Yeah. So that's what I'm thinking. Okay, it's a shame that that's what I'm thinking. Okay. It's a shame that that's not who we're talking to. No, we're talking to Zac Efron.

Okay. We're just going to keep that, are we? What? It's not Zac Efron. Oh no, it's not. It's not. Sorry, I couldn't tell you were making a joke. No.

I do love Zac Efron's movies. You do. And you love his hair, particularly. Oh, I love his hair, particularly. What is it about his hair that you like? It's Spritely. Does that, is that like his hair that you like? It's Spritely. Is that like a shalame thing? Is that like it has like its own presence?

Did you just compare Zac Efron to Timothy Shalame? Yeah, Shalame is much better. Don't you think? No. His hair is much better. No, absolutely. No. But I also have the same hairdresser as Shalame.

So that's what? When Shalame is in the country, do you mean you have the same hairdresser as Shalamey. So that's what when Shalamey is in the country, you mean you have the same hairdresser as Shalamey? Mark cuts Shalamey's hair when he's in town for wonker and things like that. Who's Mark? Mark is the guy who cuts my hair. Where? In the hair shop. To London Barber Institute.

I don't know. So he does show his hair. Okay, but he doesn't do Zac Efron's hair. So I don't know. So anyway, he does show his hair. Okay, but he doesn't do Zac Efron's hair, so I don't care. No, that's true. Timmate Shalamet's hair, I could give two figs about it. I would love to have Timmate Shalamet's hair, wouldn't you? No.

I think it's fantastic, he really? It has presence, it has bounds. It moves independently of him. Yeah. Anyway, Zack Snyder's got that. I really couldn't tell whether you were making a joke that it moves independently of him. Yeah. Anyway, Zack Snyder's got that. I really couldn't tell whether you were making a joke and you were just going to call Zack Snyder,

Zach Efron for the whole of the rest of the show. Well, I have to say, if we had Zach Efron on the show, I'd be very excited. The only Zack that has any presence on the show of a period of time is certainly Zach Efron, which is hence my mistake. But Zack Snyder, I've had two bits of contact with Zac Efron. I'll tell you these very quickly.

One of them was that when Zac Efron was in me and Austin Wells, they did the premiere in the Gayity Theatre in the Isle of Man, which is where they shot it. It's been New York. And Zac Efron was there, and it was a crowd. I was there with my mum, and it was a crowd of screaming girls because Zac Efron was there. And somebody ran past us screaming, I touched his bum. That was great. Well, you would. You would. And then the other thing was that Jason Isaacs got into a lift in America

with Zac Efron and forced Zac Efron to make a video saying hello to me. I do remember that. It was really sweet. You have much. It would be. Anyway, so along with Zac Efron and Zach Snyder, both appearing in the show, we have bonus reviews of Society of Snow and Jules. And Jules, you have that's probably your bit to do.

No, it was fun, you've just done it, it's fun. Okay, pretentious. Moire, it's back again, Mark falling a little bit behind, but he's definitely going to be a... Oh, don't do that. On a winning streak very, very soon. One frame back is inspired by the boy in the Heron, the best Ghibli films, plus loads more witchering and various wasailing

and TV movie of the week and so on. You can access all of this. Are we just, are we now just calling it TV movie of the week? Have we given up? By Apple Podcasts or you can go to extra.extrotakes.com if you haven't got a fruit based device. So Mark, if you are already a Vanguardista, don't forget, so this is with sufficient emphasis, but not too much emphasis. We salute you. So you did a sort of question

at the end of it. We salute you, but however, also, hmm, no, we do salute you. We do salute you. Calam in South London, I turned 26 at the end of this week. Imagine that old. Child. And I've listened to you both since seeing the shape of water and three billboards at my local world of Sydney within a week of each other. And let me to stumble across a previous iteration of the show. And it got me into films as my friends have pointed out

to an annoying degree. That could be a memoir. To an annoying degree. Yes. But cinemas and my upcoming birthday bring me to the subject of my correspondence when I was looking for ways to satisfy my newly found film habit. I ended up at the doors of the BFI South Bank in London. Yes, very fine establishment. There 25 and under scheme has been a blessing, allowing me for three pounds to see films that I would never otherwise have had the chance

to see on the big screen, and introduced me to a whole world of international and independent cinema. I suspect this is what was meant when I got selected for my university challenge team because of my quote, weird media knowledge. Right. As I am soon officially to be old in the BFI's eyes,

if you see what I'm saying. Yes, we go. I want to thank them and all their staff for opening my budding, cineast's eyes and providing a safe haven for film lovers everywhere. I'll be back as a full price-paying oldie. And thank you to you and the top-notch production team for setting me on the path. Anyway, so that's quite interesting. But so the BFI, mostly, you're old when you're 21, you're a full or 18.

Yes. As far as the BFI extend your youth until you're 25. That's because when you've devoted yourself to film culture, you stay young longer. Yeah, or your poorer. Well, that is definitely true. Asked me how my BFI show went on Monday. I'm imagining that it went very good because you had gorgeous George McCoy on it. And therefore, did you have Zach Snyder?

Or anyone called Zach? No, he didn't have any Zachs. We had, we had gorgeous George Surrey and McKellen. Yeah, I'm talking about Henler. He's quite good. Yeah, um, me and McKenna Bruce. That was fantastic and Jason Isaacs for the musical number at the, Jason Isaacs joined in on tambourine. Is he any good? No. Does he have any musical sense at all? No.

He's nice to find some of these not good at. No, I mean, he will tell you himself that he doesn't have a musical bone in his body. I mean, he was great. Obviously, the audience absolutely loved him. But it was... Archie, our friend Archie. Archie, yeah.

And Godchie, but Godchie's George played the guitar. Don't tell me he's good at the guitar. Oh, he's good at the guitar. And and and God just George played the guitar. Don't tell me he's good at the guitar. He's good at the guitar. He's very, very good at the guitar. And then afterwards there was a I saw on him. He's got some kind of fan site that's called something like everything gorgeous George. And it's just like everything he does, there's just pictures of it and people going, isn't he gorgeous? I just noticed time is moving on. Oh, sorry. And they're all there. They're all getting, they're all getting, very fidgety.

Sorry. You've got like 30 seconds to tell us about the boy and the heron. Oh, I can't do it in 30 seconds. How do you want? I'm like a few minutes, is that going to be okay? Hannah. Okay, fine.

It's Christmas. If the podcast is a couple of minutes longer, people will love that. Exactly. They will love it. So this opens on the 26th, which is boxing day, isn't it? Boxing day? To 26 it? Boxing day? 26th of boxing day?

Usually. Yeah, no, I'm just checking, because I'm very good bad with dates. So this is the new Christmas days always the 25th, but it's not always the same day of the week, is it? No. No, okay, fine. Just checking, fine.

So this is the new film by Hermes Ackie, who announced his retirement some years ago, like Elton John. Exactly. Then made the short film, Bar of the Catapult. And now this, this is this studio jibbly production, I think the production span like seven years, it is reportedly one of the most expensive movies. It describes a big, fantastical film.

Story is a boy who during the war loses his mother in a fire, then moves to a new town where he discovers an abandoned tower And he meets a fantastical talking heron that is the heron of the title however the heron has teeth and a voice that sounds like a demon voice from the exorcist and they're ahead Emerging from his beak and this little you know man coming out of it draws the boy into a world of the dead in his dreams. I have a choice. No, that voice is actually not unlike what it was. We're going to play you a clip that is from the dubbed version.

I saw the subtitle version, but this is from the dubbed version for the radio version. Have a look. A lot of strange things happen in this place. I just don't in this place. Destroyer! I just hope it stays safe. Save me! Save me! My door!

What exactly are you? Dear mother, she's awaited in your rescue. I'll be your guide. What is this place? This world is filled with the dead. I know it's a lie, but I have to see. I'm looking for someone. So I mean about the voice, and that maybe goes,

your mother. Anyway, so from the chorus of fish chanting, join us to that sketch, you sort of brief clip of it there in that trailer, the brief clip of the mother turning to water and he touches them, she's turned to water and starts to live. There's a lot of dark stuff in this. The Japanese tight love it translates as how do you live, which references a novel of the same name from 1937,

which appears in the film, but this isn't the same story, this is an original story. The best way to describe it, there is shades of inception in the world into which he goes, that kind of watery world, which is like going into this strange dream-scape environment. And the world bends and reshapes itself,

but obviously it does so in that kind of absolutely beautiful, ghibli animation style. It's about the search for lost loved ones, and therefore the search for your own true self. The animation is breathtaking. I think even from that short clip that you just saw, it's good. The music's by Joe C She, who is always terrific, and I think that music is awards-tipped,

mesmerizing. If there's a message, the message is, build your own tower, a kingdom free from malice, the idea being that freedom is built and it's fragile and it must be built and rebuilt. It was released in Japan with almost no promotion and it did very, very well. And this caused a lot of consternation in the industry about hang about a minute. If you can release a film with almost no promotion, it does this well.

What are we here for? There've been comparisons with things like Grave of the Fireflies. I thought it was really impressive. And I remember back to when Miyazaki was apparently retiring and everybody went, oh, you know, the myestro had stopped making any great works. And it's like when Ken Loch retired and then the next thing he was back winning a palm door. So anyway, it's a really, really fine film. A lot of very dark stuff in there, but really beautifully

done. Boy in there. Is it a, Is it uplifting? I think so, yeah, because I think in the end, there is a very, as I said, that thing, which is actually a quote from towards the end of the film, when he literally says, build your own tower, a kingdom free from malice. And I think that that is a lovely message. And so yes, it is uplifting. But it's as in the great tradition of all great sort of of fairy tale-like stories, it's to do with confronting your demons. And therefore, it is to do with things like death and loss and loved ones and, you know, and taking control of your own world. A cinema release. Yes. At the boy in the heron. Still to come on this take. I'm going to be reviewing, well, I'm gonna be speaking to Zach Efron about Rebel Moon.

That's the most important thing. And then I'm doing another film which I have to scroll down in my spirit. Ferrari. Ferrari. I mean, I could steal it. There was something, there was a comedian who used to do this thing about,

have you noticed how cars sound like their names? Like, Ferre, Rade, Sab, Trium, Fum, Fum, FW. Yeah, no, 4, 4, 4, 4, 4, 4, 4, 4, 4, 4, 4, 4, 4, 4, 4, 4, 4, 4, 4, 4, 4, 4, 4, 4, 4, 4, 4, 4, 4, 4, 4, 4, 4, 4, 4, 4, 4, 4, 4, 4, 4, 4, 4, 4, 4, 4, 4, 4, 4,

4, 4, 4, 4, 4, 4, 4, 4, 4, 4, 4, 4, 4, 4, 4, 4, 4, 4, 4, 4, 4, 4, 4, 4, 4, 4, 4, 4, 4, 4, 4, 4, 4, 4, 4, 4, 4, 4, 4, 4, 4, 4, 4, 4, 4, 4, 4, 4, 4, 4, 4, 4, 4, 4, 4, 4, 4, 4, 4, 4, 4, 4, 4, 4, 4, 4, 4, 4, the Gayity Theatre in the Art of Man, or right? And now part five of Wise Wise words in which Mark and I in all 18 weeks have to guess. Oh no, is it my week again? Well, it's all tonight. I did it last week. You've forgotten again. Okay. Why does nobody send me an email? It's every week. What?

Right, fine. Okay. You know the email with the script. Yes. The bit where it says, okay, fine. Mark now chooses some wise, wise words. Okay, I will give them to you. Okay. And in the death,

as the last few corpses lay rotting in the slimy thoroughfare, is it Harry Belafonte? No. Emil Ford. Closer. Bebubble and the stingers. Pat Boone. It's Pat Boone.

Go on. I mean, no one's going to know. Well, everyone will know. People will be shouting at the radio. They'll know. They'll be shouting. Hi, esteemed podcast listeners. Simon Mayo. And Mark Kermot here.

I'm excited to let you know that the new season of the Crown and the Crown, the official podcast, returns on 16th of November to accompany the sixth and final season of the Netflix Epic Royal Drama series. Very exciting, especially because SuperSub and Friend of the Show, Edith Bowman hosts this one. Indeed, Edith will take you behind the scenes, dive into conversation with the talented cast and crew, from writer and creator Peter Morgan to the crowns Queen Elizabeth, Emelda Staunton. Other guests on the new series include the Crowns research team, the directors,

executive producers Suzanne Mackie and specialists such as Voice Coach William Connaker and propsmaster Owen Harrison. Cast members including Jonathan Price, Selim Dor, Khalid Abdullah, Dominic West and Elizabeth Elizabeth the Bikki. You can also catch up with the story so far by searching the Crown, the official podcast, wherever you get your podcast. Subscribe now and get the new series of the Crown, the official podcast first on November 16th.

Available wherever you get your podcasts. Happy Nord Christmas. Protect yourself while Christmas shopping online and access all the Christmas films from around the globe. Plus when you shop online you'll have to give websites your card details and other sensitive data like your personal addresses. Those websites should already have their own encryption built into their payment systems, but to be on the safe side you can use a VPN to ensure that all data coming to and from your device is encrypted. Even if you're using an unsafe Wi-Fi you'll still be able to shop securely with a VPN.

And you can access Christmas films only available overseas by using streaming services not available in the UK. To take our huge discount of your NordVPN plan, go to NordVPN.com slash take. Our link will also give you four extra months for free on the two-year plan. There's no risk with Nord's 30-day money bank guarantee. The link is in the podcast episode description box. Okay, well, before the break, unless you're a Vanguard East, in which case it was... There was no break. Seconds ago, Mark had forgotten again to come. I've got a lot of things going on to come up with anything.

So he just told, said these words. Off the top of his head, he said, and in the death as the last few corpses lay rotting in the slimy thoroughfare. Is it a heart of the heroine angel? No, what is it? It's the opening of Future Legend, which is the first track on Diamond Dogs by David Bowie,

one of the biggest selling albums of Eves. And I can do you the whole of that off by how incidentally. And you said nobody will know that. And I said everyone of our age will be going, the shutters lifted in in Inchin Temporas building a high on Pochus Hill. And Red Mutant Eyes gaze down upon Hunger City. No more big wheels.

I don't think so. Chris and me is the size of rats. I've rats the size of cats and 10,000 people always split into small tribes, coveting the highest of the sterile skyscrapers like packs of dogs, assaulting the glass fronts of love me avenue. Chris and Manchester says no one cares. Your pedantic discussion about Pettin's corner last week reminds me of the almost exact same discussion that raged in the letters page

of private eye. All right. Some 15 years ago over a very similarly named corner, which I imagine is huge corner. So I imagine they had huge corner within apostrophe after the day and then someone's maybe it should be after the day. I think they have pedants cooler. They have pedants cornered as well. I think they do in private eye.

Do they still do huge corner? They do say I've been in huge corner. Over the course of a, so anyway, Chris says, over the course of a few months, the debate raged on us to where to put the apostrophe and the column was renamed a number of times, depending on how pedantic the pedants were feeling that week. Eventually, the debate was settled when a reader suggested the much simpler name, pedantry corner. There we are. There we are. Although I do realize that it's a lot less fun, especially in the church where corners are named after groups of people rather than the specific behaviors themselves.

So that does help, doesn't it? And no one can... No one can dispute that. No, but also no one can enjoy it anymore. No one can go in it. No, that's right. We like to debate and discuss. So box office top 10 in just a moment. Just on the subject of Maestro because that's that's now Netflix and you reviewed it last week. Yeah. You hang Uyang says, Mark and Simon, I hope you're both well. I'd like to share some thoughts on Maestro. I thought Bradley Cooper was brilliant in Nightmare Alley. Yes, he turned out to be a promising director and a star is born. Plus, Kerry Mulligan has been magnetic in everything I've seen. So I ventured out to catch my strokes. Sadly, I was strangely unmoved by it, and I can't quite pin down why. I wonder where a

Star Is Born succeeded, and this failed was because Bradley Cooper had to direct himself as a central character. For a biopic about a conductor slash composer, I find the use of its soundtrack almost suffocating, too loud on occasion, trying to fill in the blanks when the script fell short. Over years, I relied on your reviews to find new and interesting films. Okay, nice things at the end. You hang, thank you very much indeed. That's my strobe, which is out there. It won't be in the 10 anymore, but it is on there. But I agree with that. You see, I think that that was that's exactly, you know, I was impressed by it, but I wasn't moved by it and I watched it twice now and I felt the same thing about it was stifling and it felt very, very performative. Now that said a very good friend of mine

yesterday said, I listened to your review of my strokes, rubbish. The film is actually really, really, really magical and it was, I was completely swept away by it. So I mean, obviously, you know, there are differing opinions, but I have had two runs of it. And both times I have admired things about it, but it feels so performative. And claustrophobic is exactly the right word. Santa claustrophobic.

Santa claustrophobic. Number, so, but in the, you hang, thank you very much for the email. correspondentsacademy.com. Number 10, home alone 2, lost in New York. But in the you hang thank you very much for the email correspondence at kovato made.com number 10 Home Alone 2 lost in New York I will use this to roll out the anecdote every time the good lady fresco her in doors and I were in central park walking through it in a Lovely summer setting and it started snowing and we thought wow climate change is speeding up. No It was artificial snow being blown onto

the park from the set of the hotel in which that film takes place. They were filming it in the summer, but they had a snow ice machine. It was blowing snow onto the park. It was very, very magical. Did you propose? We were married already. Why? You can propose again. I mean, I do quite regularly go, why are you with me? And does she ever say, I don't know, it's institutionalization. And number nine is home alone. So there we go, both her. Elf is at eight.

It's just the reissue, tastic time, isn't it? Animal at seven, which I haven't seen because they didn't press green. Did we have any emails about this? No, we didn't. Okay, so salt, burn at six, which I like more than you do. Napoleon at five. Napoleon. I mean, I like it. You're just saying it with a friend. Yeah, because it's, well, it's, you know, I mean, if you haven't listened to it already,

go back and listen to Simon's interview, particularly for the wacky and Phoenix. I think it's in Vanessa Kirby. But yeah, but Vanessa Kirby is quite sensible, and wacky and Phoenix is quite out there. Yes, and I did think it was one of my favorite interviews of the year. Just like, I think it's a very good thing to do with the But yeah, but Vanessa Kirby is quite sensible and Waking Phoenix is quite out there. Yes, and I did think it was one of my favourite interviews of the year just because he's out, he's great and I had a hand bet in the form, but Vanessa Kirby is clearly the anchor in that situation. In that relation to the balance. Thank heavens she was there. But I think that gave Waking permission to sort of go off

off, to go off on one. Yes. So Napoleon's at five wishes at four, which I don't think is anything like as good as all the Disney films that it references. It's a shame. I've sort of fallen out of love with that a little bit. So Hunger Games, the Ballad of Songbirds and Snakes. I don't like Songbirds and Snakes, but that ain't what it takes to make it a hit. Apparently it has, you know, well, it's done much better than I thought. So what do I know? Godzilla minus one is at number two.

Loved it. Absolutely loved it. Mike says. So there's a lot of Japanese pronunciation in this. Okay. I'll see what I can do. I'm sure you can. I can't know.

Okay. Simon and Mark, Konichiwa from Nagoya, Japan. Long time list, the first time emailer. After just getting home from my local IMAX, having seen the new Godzilla with a good lady her in sliding Japanese doors. That's very good. I thought now was the perfect time to email him. Excellent.

In recent weeks, there have been a couple of discussions about various Japanese things. You spoke about the toilets here, which really are first, right? Although the B-Day feature is a little too intrusive for my toiletry preferences. You also spoke about children here cleaning up their schools. The same goes for the cinemas, which are spotless by the time everyone leaves. This incredible cultural difference, which we should adopt. Very quickly a filmmaker got asked, what do you want the audience to take away from the film? And he said, they're litter. Which is very good. And obviously, in Japan, they do.

Mike says, I might add, everyone waits for the credits to finish as well, but to the heart of the matter. Godzilla, I did have a couple of issues with it. Okay. The biggest one is the poor casting, most notably of the protagonist, played by Riono Suki Kamiki, who plays the role, like it's a live action anime adaptation. This was the problem for a handful of the actors, actually,

and unfortunately the best actor, Sakura Ando, see shoplifters and love exposure, had a relatively small part. Not to spoil anything, but the ending also seemed a little bit of a cop-out. Other than that, the film was fantastic. It was possibly the best cinematic experience I've had. Certainly the best IMAX experience. The visual effects are incredible.

The heat ray scenes in particular, leaving me particularly astounded. How they created this on a budget of $15 million is beyond me. It's not 15 at all. It's not how cheap they did it for. And the special effects, I was reminded of Garath Edwards. Yeah. But even he got me to film 15. The Neyoko Sato score is also wonderful. Yeah, it's great. And I love the way it harken back to the original Godzilla film as it borrowed

Akira if Ukube's iconic theme. As the final battle with Godzilla took place, I could feel a tear rolling down my cheek. The emotional power of the film is what really set it apart. With this, and Miyazaki's latest film soon to be released in the UK, which we just reviewed, it's a big time for Japanese cinema, and I hope it encourages people to dig further into the incredibly deep and diverse catalog of Japanese cinema.

After all, that's the reason I fell in love with this country and moved here. I look forward to Simon trying to get to all the Japanese names and apologies for all the mistakes. Up with the Golden Age of Japanese cinema and down with live action anime. Before you go on, because there's quite a lot on this, Frank from Stafford. Godzilla minus one was my final visit to UK. Can I just show this in because it relates to that? Yes, just on the 15 million thing, okay?

During a panel that Tokyo Comic Con over the weekend, Godzilla minus one director Takashi Yamazaki, disputed claims that the film was made on a 15 million budget. As reported by Twitter, blah, blah, blah, blah, he said, I wish it was that much. Okay, so that's entirely wrong. Frank, that's funny, I wish it was as much as 15 minutes.

So entirely right, it was made for thromping. I wish it was that much. I wish it was that much. I read that as though he was in trouble for spending more. No. And so he wishes it had only been been actually spent more than that. I'm currently in the process of traveling to Japan for Christmas and new year to be with my dear partner who I haven't seen for months.

I will no doubt be seeing this again in the land of the rising sun where the film is still going strong, but this time, I hope to take my better half, who, despite being Japanese herself, has very little experience with the exploits of the radioactive dinosaur and normally takes my fandom as a foreigner with good humour. However, I think this film is particular, in particular, is far more likely to resonate with her as besides being a perfect blend of spectacle and narrative. Godzilla minus one is ultimately film about life and community in the face of death and abandonment. Yes. From a uniquely Japanese perspective and historical context, but one I think appeals

to a wider audience of any country. As a long time fan of the series, I can easily say without baited atomic breath that this is the best in the franchise to date. Excellent. I mean, I think it is really, I was so surprised by how good it was, and then I saw Kim Newman, and I said, I just think of Zilla-Minus-One. You went, yeah, isn't it great? And then Dave Norris and Julia went to see it. Isn't it great? It's so much better than we had any right to expect. Elliot Stedman, just come out of the screening of Godzilla minus one, I am blown away. I have been a lifelong Godzilla fan, admittedly I'm only 22.

So there will be some much more lifelong fans out there. And I've watched all 37 preceding Godzilla films before this latest entry. As a child, I always look forward to the films where Godzilla fought other monsters and had less of the human stuff, but as I've got older, I've come to appreciate the human tales a lot more. But I've often found them lacking, but with Godzilla minus one, we finally have the perfect balance of both in this masterpiece of a film. As we approach the 70th anniversary of the first Godzilla next year, I believe minus one to be the most fitting tribute to the original story of any of the sequels

that came after it. Taking the series back to its roots and placing the narrative in post-war Japan is a brilliant decision, taking the Godzilla story to an earlier point in history that we've ever seen brings the themes that make the original so successful to the surface. I could happily have watched the story of Koichi and Noriko for two hours in a non-Godzilla film. I was so compelled and engaged by the narrative. And the scenes with Godzilla are absolutely masterful with some of the most tense edge of your seat stuff I've seen on film.

I simply adored it. I might even say it's the best in the series. And I loved that the cinema I saw it in was near full. I'm so glad that the cinemas can still pack houses with foreign language films. There we go. There you go. That's enough, friends.

Yeah, the world is in a better place as a result of Godzilla minus one. And the UK's number one movie is Wonka. With him and his hair. Owen McGarry, my dad, Paul and I, a fan of the show, so I decided to write into you guys. I saw one class weekend in Dublin, really enjoyed it. I understand Mark's qualms with the film,

but they didn't affect me as much. I sure. Timothy Chalamet was way better in the role of the titular chocolate tier than the trailer suggested. The entire cast was delightful. It was visually pleasing for the most part. And it had a good-natured vibe that is just what the world needs after the pandemics,

political outrage and the like. If I had any problems, it would be that the musical numbers weren't very memorable, except for pure imagination and umpulumpa, and the running gag relating to the chief of police scrunched my eyebrows. But overall, I'm glad that I never doubted Paul King and Simon Farnamy for a second. It was, in one word, scrum d'idlyumptious. Scrum d'idlyumptious. Scrum d'idlyumptious. Scrum d'idlyumptious. You could say, Doshas Ali, experienced it,

Frederic Ali Rufus, but that will be going to be interesting. Well, you'd see, what's wrong with that is, Doshas Ali, and it's Frederic Ali Rufus. It's Rufus. But that's the only bit that they invert. So the word super, they actually change it for the letter. I do understand that they're not actually saying a backwards. Do you know what Finsbury Park is backwards?

What's that? Crapie Rob Sniff. Okay. I think that does ring a bell actually. I tell you that every time. Anyway, oh, McGarry, thank you very much indeed. Correspondence of Kermin and Mayor.com. Do you know what Robertson's mom will lay these backwards?

This is one of my favourites. I think we're going to tell me. Edeland Ram, Snostrobor. Very good. Is that still around? Can you still get that? I don't know, but it does sound like a character out of Harry Potter, doesn't it? This is one of my favourites. I think we're going to tell me. Edeland Ram's Nostrable. Very good. Is that still around? Can you still get that? I don't know, but it does sound like a character

out of Harry Potter, doesn't it? Don't look. Here comes Edeland Ram's Nostrable. A famous Zach is going to be with us in a moment. Zach Efron. This episode is brought to you by Mooby, a curated streaming service dedicated to elevating great cinema from around the globe. From my connect directors to emerging otters, there's always something new to discover, for example.

Well for example, the new Aki Karri's Mackey film Fallen Leaves, which won the jury prize at CAN, that's in cinemas at the moment and if you see that and think I want to know more about Aki Karri's Mackey, you can go to Mooby the streaming service and there is a retrospective of his films called How to Be a Human. They are also going to be theatrical releasing in January Priscilla, which is a new Sophia Coppola film, which I am really looking forward to since I have an Elvis obsession. You could try Mooby free for 30 days at Mooby.com slash Kermit and Mayo. That's M-U-B-I dotA-D-M-O for a whole month of great cinema for free. Thrive offers one solution to communicate, market, and run your business, which simply small

businesses run better on Thrive. Get Command Center for free today at thrive.ca. That's THR-Y-V dot CA. Terms and conditions apply. Free plans have limited functionality. Now today's guest is an American film director, screenwriter and producer whose debut feature film was Dawn of the Dead, the remake in 2004, went on to direct 300. Batman vs Superman, Dawn of Justice, Justice League, and now Rebel Moon, Hyphen, Part 1, colon, a child of fire.

It is, of course, Zack Snyder, and you'll hear my interview without Mark of course. You'll hear my interview with him after this clip from the movie. Well those hawkshaws at Page you working for the mother world. I don't like bounty hunters. I didn't ask. And to be clear, I don't like bounty hunters either. So you've gone for hire? No, that's not my thing. I'm more of an opportunist, you might say. I'll be here. Wait. Look, I heard you in there trying to get the Pollux.

I could help you. Oh, understand we're just simple farmers. We're searching for soldiers for a fight against a mother world. We have some money that for a fight against a mother world. We have some money, but this is not the one you get rich on. I understand. Stel, pay me what it's worth to you. As a clip from Rebel Moon Part One,

delighted to say I've been joined by its director, co-writer, and its director of photography, who is Zack Snyder. Hello, Zack, how are you, sir? I'm great. How are you? Thank you for having me. Did I miss any of you? Producer as well. Did I miss anything else out of that list? I think I have a story by credit, but that's fine. Okay. Just kidding. So Rebel Moon, part one, a child of fire, is the full title. Introduce us, Zack, if you would, to this brand-new world which you have created. Tell us. Yeah, I was inspired by a lot of these films that sort of shaped me in the late 70s and early 80s,

and this kind of science fantasy that really blew my mind and kind of made me want to make movies for one and just kind of, what this impossible world that's out there, this massive, when you see, I remember seeing the trailer for Empire Strikes Back and just thinking, what the heck? And so it was like a lot of that stuff, and as well as, and I've said this famously, but the this adult illustrated fantasy magazine called Heavy Metal that I was a huge, that I subscribed to and that was shaped a lot of sort of my aesthetics as a child and as a young teen and as an older teen, I guess.

And even the animated version of that, you know, the animated Heavy Metal movie that they made, which really also star blazers, you know, the animated series. That was a big influence, and on and on, but really, that's the world you're going to sort of dive into. So specifically your idea of the Rebel Moon and the characters on that Rebel Moon. How far back are we going? Because is it like your student days in Pasadena? Is that where the story starts? I mean, I think I've said that, yeah, I had a pitch class in Pasadena at my art center.

And I think I said something about, you know, it's a combination of dirty dozen, seven samurai and star wars in space. And I remember sort of pitching it that way. And my teacher going like, that's good. That's a good actually. That could be good. And thinking, I wonder if that's true. But anyway, that stayed with me as a concept, you know, through the years, that it became,

it was maybe going to be a video game. It was going to be, it was a lot of things. Then it was, I pitched it famously as a Star Wars film, and then after the sale to Disney, it came back to us, and then we were gonna make it into a TV show, and then finally I was like, let's just make a movie, because I know how to do that, so that's kind of what it ended up as.

Was it always gonna be a two-part? You know, I wrote a 200-page script, a little over 200 pages. And so I didn't know 100% how to, I didn't know how to shorten it, but I didn't really want to. And I had the idea to just kind of break it in half and turn it into two movies.

And Netflix was like, that's a great idea. Let's do that. And just explain why you went with Netflix. What was it about, I know you've worked with them before, I'm here for Dead and so on, but what was it about what they offered you for this project? I made you think that would be the best place for you. Yeah, it was a few things. Well, I just finished Army of the Dead that I had done for them.

It was an incredible sort of creative experience working with them on Army. Army is a weird movie. It's a weird idea. Zombies in Vegas, you know, it's whatever, you know, you can't, but they loved it from the beginning and they were really encouraging, creatively encouraging and free, let me kind of do my thing. And then we finished that movie. I said, you know, we can either do a sequel to Army or hear me out.

I have this idea for this sort of original IP, crazy sci-fi movie that's too harder and it could be like more like what do you guys think and they were very like incredibly enthusiastic and very encouraging of the concept frankly that this could be not only two movies but possibly more and they said yeah we would love for you to try and make that happen and so I went to work creating this world and they've been incredibly supportive. And you mentioned original IP there in your answer. Yeah, well, I wonder how, I guess. Well, I just think, you know, having worked with lots of projects, which was not a original

IP, where there were comic books and there were other movies and there was canon which you had to refer to, to begin again with a budget from Netflix must have felt enormously liberating. Exactly. And I think that even just this movie, original sci-fi universe scratch-built is a difficult proposition, I think, for the normal studios right now, you know, as a, just as a concept, you know, as just as a concept, you know, it's not based on a book or a movie or anything. You just have to trust that it's going to be cool. And I think that that's a difficult proposition for the major studios

right now. But for Netflix, they were very much like, let's do it. This is very enthusiastic. So I realized that we haven't actually told specifically about the story that you have here. So tell us about the Mother World and the Velt where we start. Yeah, so basically, the concept is that we're on a distant planet that is like a farming community. These sort of space fascists come to this corner of the universe and they are needing to feed their soldiers because they're kind of far. They've kind of, you know, gone out past their supply lines

and so they need to feed their men and so they come to these farmers and say, listen, we want your grain to feed our soldiers. I just saw you planted your crops. We'll be back in nine weeks to claim all of it. And we're going to leave some soldiers behind to make sure you do the work. And they end up, there's a mysterious woman that lives among them. And she is a ex-soldier of the mother world

and she ends up killing all those guys. And they realize that they really have no choice but to either fight or flee the village. And the only way to fight would be to go out and collect warriors from the galaxy to stand with them. And that's the basic concept. And it's a pretty straightforward premise, but then you can imagine it gets shaded

by all the sci-fi elements and all the world building and all the new wants that you have to create like a real world that you wanted to defend. And it ties in to all the films that I watched when I was growing up where movies, you know, I suppose spinning out of Robin Hood, where evil King John is trying to take his taxation from these poor people who can't afford it

and so he takes it by force. And that's what it is. And that community that you've got, which to me look like Iceland in space, although actually you can't grow wheat in Iceland, so it's not that, but it's sort of, it's tying into that tradition, isn't it? We use some sort of Scandinavian rough kind of concept

to create this. What I, because I wanted to create create a sort of society that you could believe was a farming community that was really connected to the land, sort of felt slightly ancient, but we're on the fringes of technology, of that world. I think there's a line where Corey says

that the bad guys are saying, look, if you sell a shoe wheat, we can buy you, you can get robots and harvesters, you don't have to harvest this wheat by hand. And he says, we believe harvesting the wheat by hand connects us to the earth. And, you know, they're very like, that's how they are. And I think that that was, that was the idea of, to try and create this culture. I don't think I've ever asked a movie director about wheat production before, but it feels as though this is the movie where the question has, you know,

it's time has come. Tell us about the wheat production, Zack Snyder, in your movie. Yeah, there was a lot of wheat production. We had to, a lot of the production itself was revolved around. The length, it took to grow the wheat because we had guesstimated that the wheat would be ready to harvest at this point in the production.

So we had to back into it, shoot all the material we needed to so we could get to the moment where the wheat was golden and ready to be harvested. And of course, it wasn't ready exactly when we thought it would be. And we were, so we were elusive. We had to make work up to like, past the time correctly to get to them the moment when the wheat was ready. So, you were growing your own wheat.

Yeah, we grow like about five or six acres of wheat, maybe a little bit more, that we had to harvest, because there's a huge sequence of, in movie two, there's a huge sequence where they harvest kind of a day's a heaven vibe where they have to harvest the wheat. And you know, of course our warriors have to join in

and you know get all connected to the land and to the place so that they fight, so they have something to fight for. Yeah, and that type in you're wearing has a piece of wheat on it. It doesn't do. So the wheat is, it doesn't do. So when you have the tie-ins and the spin-offs and the games and the and the comics that come out of

Rebel Moon, you're gonna do your own bread as well. We were thinking about what we already made a little bit of beer the guy who helped us Make the you know harvest the wheat. He also was a beer maker and the reason he knew how to harvest the wheat was because he was a sort of organic beer manufacturer. So we brought him down from Northern California to teach us all how to size and make sheets and do harvest the wheat correctly, and then he took some of that wheat and made beer for us, and it was amazing. Can I ask, is it a very specific question? Which will any make sense once people have seen the film? Who are the priest guys with the weird hats?

Yes, they are the scribes, we call them. They are the scribes of the mother world and their basic job is to write down and record all the events that the mother world participates in. And they're sort of a religious sect that are sort of these propagandists that sort of tell the mother world side of every conflict. And so back on the mother world,

there's a huge store of information that is their perspective on every battle that they've ever, every encounter, every battle, describes, write it down. And then it's transferred to a vessel that holds all that information. And the vessel happens to take the form of a person, but that's how they kind of store all their information. So, we look at them and we don't like them instantly, obviously.

We do like Korra, Korra's our hero. Tell us about how you cast her. Sophia, is it butela? Is that how you say it? Sophia, butela, yep. I cast her. I had my eye on her. I saw her in Kingsman and she was in the mummy as well and I really had my eye on her because I really thought she, I knew she was a dancer. I knew she, I had hope that she could do the fighting and that hope was realized because she's incredible athlete and did an amazing job in the movie doing all the stunts. But we did a small addition with her and she just really, for me anyway, really could capture this kind of troubled ex-soldier who had done questionable things,

but now was on this sort of path through redemption. And that she also, you know, she's Algerian, had this amazing sort of exotic quality that among the Scandinavians made her stand out and also made you realize that she was maybe something more, something different than they were. And I think that's realized in the film. And I really wanted her to have sort of a dark past. And I think that Sophia does an amazing job

and just kind of holding all of the things that made her who she is, are just bubbling below the surface. And at any moment, could breaker or make her stronger? We don't know, you know. Earlier in the conversations that you were talking about wheat and robots, and I asked you about the wheat, and I think the robot needs to get a mention.

I've written down Jimmy the robot, which is not how he's referred to in the movie, but tell us, but your robots are kind of weary creatures here with a very familiar voice. Yes, Anthony Hopkins is the voice of our Jimmy. We call him Jimmy's, but to call him a Jimmy is a derogatory term for them, but that's, it's accepted. Even so, Fiya at some point in the next movie refers to our anti-Hopkins, Jimmy as James, just to be respectful.

But it's really, he is his number. He's the, he's this JC class robot. And so the idea with them was to create these sort of order, the sort of night's template or kind of order of warrior that was really sort of almost religious based on this religious belief in this risen princess Issa, who in the mother world's sort of mythology,

there had been one born in the ancient world, one born sort of at the dawn of their technological world, and they were all waiting for this third coming of Issa. And then when she came, all the robots rejoiced because they were like, yay, everything we believed was true. You know, our religion is real, and then that child was assassinated,

and now they're just like lost. And they won't fight. They don't know what to do with themselves. They're just like these sad nights. And it's really about that guy's journey to kind of finding out like the why of his existence as well. The version of Rebel Moon Eye source, I think it's the PG 13 version. When do we get the director's cut?

Those come in the summer, and they'll come probably at the same time. The director's cuts are just sort of like what the initial pitch of the world was, this kind of weirdo, dark, r-rated, bizarro, sci-fi world, that I was really sort of, I think if I've left to my own devices, you get something a little weird, and know, that I was really sort of, I think if I, if I, if I, I've left to my own devices, you know, you, you get something a little weird. And I think that's kind of what, you'll get with those, with those two. And just one final question, if, if I may, there's a connection between this and the army of the dead, do they exist in the same way? There's a very, very small

connection. They probably exist in the same, what you don't know is that in the Army of the Dead Universe, there is like this, at Area 51, there is some kind of a portal that allowed the zombie virus to make it through across this. It's a dimensional rift, and I think that rift could carry you possibly to this universe. So they're not connected directly, but there's a way for them to. There is a hyperspace link somewhere. All right. We're out of time, Zack Snyder. Thank you so much for talking to us. Appreciate your time very much. Thank you. I'm pleasure. Thank you. Zack Snyder on the program for the first time. And what was it when I said,

dim, because I knew that there was a director's cut, but so this is the PG 13. Yes, that's the moment. He referred to that as a plural. Those. Well, does he mean because there's another part coming, isn't there? So there, but he said, he said, you get those in the summer. I'd lose track. So I don't know whether there's going to be more than one.

Maybe there's a director's cut, which is still PG, but it's longer. And then there's an R version. But I don't, I don't know. Anyway, I know that you're going to, I know you love most things that all everything. Well, look, okay, so let's start by saying so I'm not, not as a X-Nighter fan as you know. Watchman, Sucker Punch, Batman, Superman, Justice League, it's not a, I mean, I actually really since the, the very first thing the dawn of the dead remake, the fastest, one of the very early, fast zombie movies,

which are quite liked, I haven't been a fan of his work. He was clearly very civil, and you had a good conversation with him. So here's the thing, so like Garithead, what's the creator, this is an original sci-fi property. And that, you know, in and of itself is a good thing. It's a good thing. Unlike the creator, which itself owed a debt to things like Blade Runner, this doesn't have an original idea in its head. And I mean, you know, it's, it is originally unoriginal. I mean, he says in that interview, it's like he had this crazy sci-fi movie.

It's not a crazy sci-fi movie. It's a sci-fi movie. He talked about all the nuance you need to build a world. Neuance? I mean, whatever you think, there's some slow mo, but I'm not sure that nuance is that is the right word. Obviously, he talked about it being originally. It was a Star Wars pitch. Then they talked about being a video game. Then to about being TV show. Then finally, it ended up with Netflix, then it's a two-part movie. I mean, it might as well be a Star Wars spin-off. I think this is the Star Wars, what Percy Jackson was to Harry Potter, you know, that thing at the end about it somehow exists in the same universe as Army because there's a hyperspace portal link. That was my, I didn't know. No, I know, but you know, but no, no,

it exists in the universe of all those movies that I've tried I didn't know. I know, I know, but you know, but, but, but, but, but no, no, no, it exists in the universe of all those movies that I've tried to reproduce Star Wars and failed. Well, there I did, I mean, he said, you know, I originally thought of dirty dozens, seven Samurai and Star Wars in space. Star Wars is in space. I mean, I know that that was just a sentence construction thing. But so George Lucas famously looked

to Samurai movies for inspiration. No, it was obviously looked at George Lucas famously looked to Samurai movies for inspiration. Nighty was obviously looked to George Lucas because there's a weapon in this. This is basically a lightsaber. I mean, isn't there? There is a glowy cutty thing. The baddies are all in terms of purposes, the Empire. The goodies of Star Wars caricatures crossed with, you know, magnificent seven and all that kind of thing.

And our guide through this world is a robot voiced by Sir Anthony Hopkins. Yes. Who, I mean, look, Sir Anthony Hopkins is a great actor, but he's no Anthony Daniels. And it is a pound shop C3PO. That, all of that is true. The biggest thing is about that, that, just that, yeah, yeah, particular thing, because you're right, Anthonyique Hopper, this is the first voice that we hear. The first voice that you hear. You think, oh, okay, I wonder how that's going to work out. In Northern Lights, which was Golden Compass. Yes. The voice of the bear, Eric Björnsson, is your friend from this week, Ian McKellen. Oh, yes, he is. So then as soon as this bear opens his mouth, everyone goes,

Oh, yes, he is. So, he does. So, then as soon as this bear opens his mouth, everyone goes, so we're a couple. So we're a couple. And if you've got, and I thought that was enormously distracted, so here you've got a robot, which is an interesting character that their religion has proved to be untrue and they don't know what they're doing. But I'm just thinking, why is Anthony Hopkins? They're a fantastic voice over artist who could have done you a great kind of sad robot,

like in Douglas Had to be the reason. Marvin, yes, exactly. Paranoid Android. But anyway, I just thought, Anthony Hopkins was a distraction. Well, on the subject of distractions, Charlie Humbrom's accent, I don't know what's going on there at all. I mean, and I'm not sure why. Ed Skryne's got killer cheekbones and an accent which says,

space fascists. Which was, you know, it's, I mean, there's absolutely no subtlety in these. No, they literally come down out of the thing as space fascists. That's exactly where they are. And we know where they are. One of the key characters has got a squid face that looks, makes even like a cross between

Jar-Jell, Binks and Davey Jones from Pirates of the Caribbean. And then there is, as they say, in love and death, a tremendous amount of wheat, fields of wheat. And then the whole thing takes two and a bit hours. And at the end of the two and a bit hours, they've just established the characters who are now gonna go and do some stuff in the next two and a bit hours.

So here's the thing, I don't think it's terrible. I mean, I have disliked Snyder movies much more. I see that the reviews are generally not great. All full impact. I don't take any notice of any reviews other than yours. It's just, it's, it is quite dull and it's, there's an awful lot of stuff when nothing is really happening and then all the stuff that happens, you do think, but I have seen every single bit of this somewhere else. And the thing about building a world and what I think the thing that people forget, Star Wars and whatever one thinks of Star Wars, Star Wars people went, wow, get to the force and you know, and somebody maybe, maybe, or couple of something, said to Lucas, you should turn this into a religion, you can make a

fortune out of it. There was a sense of magic, even though it was kind of hokey and strange and actually comparatively cheap. This feels like it's got all the visual. I mean, Zack Snyder knows how to do visuals. So there's no question about the fact that he's a very, very accomplished visual stylist. I just don't like what he does with that. But all the stuff is just stuff. It's just building stuff. And then you go, okay, fine.

And then there's the scene in which she gets rescued from what looks like it's gonna turn into a reading. So there's a kind of slightly leery thing going on and then it's, but other than that, it's just stuff in space. Every one of them read. Looks like they've come out of a hair commercial. They all have that kind of look at me.

I look fabulous. Yeah. And yes, they do. But I just... The phrase I thought you were going to use is it's perfectly fine. Because in as much as it does what it sets out to do, it's just that given that it's an original piece of work, as in, you know, as you said, not tied to any other piece of intellectual property.

It's just completely unoriginal. But just come back to this thing when he said this crazy cypher. It's not crazy. No. It's unbelievably well behaved. And it's just like a series of building block elements that are just, they should just call it stuff in space. I remember when Jesus of Montreal came out and reading someone saying that it was just like the magnificent seven and the seven seven, going around. And Jesus of Montreal.

Yes, because the Jesus character goes around. Oh, I see. Gathering this book over. I see. I think actually I think... Okay, fine, fine, got it, yeah. I think the origin story of this that you're talking about is slightly older than the magnificent seven.

Is it Jesus going around collecting people? Actually, he's being going on for a couple of years. And it wasn't seven of them. No, that's right. It wasn't Jesus and the seven disciples. No, but... Snow White and the Seven draws you. But that idea of we're in trouble against an oppression.

Yes, let's go and get a bunch of people together, and then let's go and, you know, but I'm not particularly holding my breath for the director's cut. Well, the director, I mean, when he was saying that, you know, the R-rated version, it'll have some kind of weird stuff in it. Well, what weird, I mean, I don't know that the problem with it is that it doesn't have

R-rated stuff in it. The problem with it is it's just quite boring. I'm slightly nervous about the R-rated stuff because there are a couple of hints that make me think, I hope you're not going to go there. That's what I was referring to in that particular thing. And they don't with the PG-30. No, and I think that's fine with that. And they don't.

So let's hope it doesn't go there. But I don't know. I mean, like I said, it was a very civil and you did a brilliant job with the interview, but I just, I don't, I really don't understand what. And obviously, the Zack Snyder fanbase is very, very devoted because of all the stuff they did with the Snyder cut, you know, just, anyway, correspond. And so therefore for a change with some relief, we step into the laughter.

So they've just come on. Because the best thing about the laughter lift is, I said, okay, Ian McKellen, I said, what's the best Shakespeare play? He said, Macbeth, I said, why he said it's the shortest one. Very good, that's top answer. Laughter lift, I mean.

TELLING BELL Oh. With bells on. You know how unoriginal as Axe-9, though. I do. Well, same. Here we go. Hey, Mark. Hey, Simon. I love Christmas Day. We've got all the family. Grandchild One is going to be there.

It's going to be great. Glarely a yule. However, Child 3 always gets very anxious about Father Christmas. He just gets a bit panicky. Each year that Father Christmas is going to get stuck into the chimney since... It's like in the chimney. Yes, stuck in the chimney because he has...

Claude Strafopius. Of course, there you say. There you go. There we go. Had you read the script before when you... I had, okay, Kabil. I like me, you read the script in advance. Thank you very much. What's the difference between the Christmas alphabet

and the ordinary alphabet? There's no L in the Christmas alphabet. Oh, my God. One of these to finish. What did Santa say to the smoker? I don't know what did Santa say to the smoker? I don't know what did Santa say to the smoker. Please don't smoke. It's really bad for my...

Elf. Elf. There's no L in the Christmas library. I'll be back after this. Unless you're a van Gogh Eastern, which case? We salute you. We have just one... No, we've already saluted. We have just one... no, we were already saluted.

We have just one question. Is it true that the earth's rotation changes speed back in a moment? So is it true that... So this is one of those questions... So is it true that the earth's rotation changes speed? speed well the fact that you've asked it's exactly yes it does indeed suggest that the answer is yes so I'm gonna say no the answer is yes oh it's a true fact you're your initial gut reaction was the correct one the earth rotation is changing speed it's actually slowing this means that the length of a day increases by around 1.8 seconds per

century. 600 million years ago, a day lasted 21 hours. No. Yeah. But you know, so if it feels as though time is dragging, that's actually true. 1.8 seconds per century. So in your lifetime, a day So in your lifetime, a day has lengthened by just under a second. Okay, I find that quite disturbing because isn't the speed that the earth is going around? Doesn't that affect gravity and how heavy we are? You'll be fine. Everything will be fine. No, but it won't be fine. The earth will keep going round. It's just slowing. It might be a problem in a few million years, I would say, but I don't think we need to do that.

Okay, but just philosophically, the earth slowing down. Yes. That's not good. But not just a slow that you'd actually notice. Well, you said how long over six million years? A minute and a half. No, you said six million an hour, a day was 21 hours long.

600 million years ago. Well, yeah, and 600 million years, a day will be 27 hours. There are lots of things to worry about next year, but that's not one of them. The shortening of the day is not one. It's not the shortening of the day that worries me. It's the earth winding down. It's not winding down. It's just going slower

winding down. Well winding down implies an inevitable You know, it's getting slower and then it's going to slow down then it will stop. No, no not necessarily It might it might speed up again. How? Because a big mighty hand is going to come in and go whizz like It might you don't know that it's not going to happen. Have you been talking to Brian Cox again? Did he tell you that? If a universe is amazing. I'd rather talk to the other Brian Cox about that. I think. Did you see that?

Yes, it's miserable. Of him ending newsnight in the style of Logan Roy. Yes. I'm questionable, I think. I just wanted to. I think so, because he was still being Brian Cox, and Brian Cox saying that is one thing on a news program. And in a drama is something else altogether. I thought it was funny.

He told me that apparently people come up to him all the time and ask him to tell them. And I said, do you imagine he said, it's easier than you think? Jen in Edinburgh, dear Titus and Leonidass, Belgian chocolate man. Leonidus, isn't it? Potato. Long term listener and sometime emailer, Van Goddester, second place in the year two drawing competition.

Although you might remember me as the person who watched, top gun maverick with a fighter pilot dad who thought it was a comedy. Oh, that's right, yeah, yeah. By the way, Mark, the country they're attacking is Russia because the coordinates are left up in a computer scene and dad recognize them as Russia. Isn't that interesting? That is interesting, although of course,

they very specifically don't name the place, but there we go. If you leave up the corner of the corner, I'm going to go and bomb wherever that says. You can call it glifuria, but unfortunately, it happens to be Russia. Following your recent discovery, this is last week, of the 10th American President having a living grandson. It reminded me of my family having a long but not that long tale. 37 for context, which isn't young, but definitely isn't old. My mum was a late baby and her parents were born in 1907 and 1917. So my grandad was alive when the Titanic sank. He

would have had memories of people going into the trenches in World War I. I'm a tour guide, says Jen in Edinburgh. And when I do tours, I like to tell people how when my Nana was born in 1917, women did not have the vote. I knew Met and loved someone who was born without the right to vote due to her gender. I have a friend in his eighties who went to a a sales with Helen Duncan, the last person in the UK tried under the witchcraft act. No, isn't that amazing? These events are not as far back in the past as we saw.

And when did you say the last French guillotine was in the early 70s? Early 70s. Well, as Jen and Edinburgh says, these events are not as far back as that is remarkable. Remarkable. Keep up the amazing work. Hello to Jason. I want him to sign my water bottle and love the show Steve. If only you'd known, then you could have sorted it out when he was massacring his tambourine. How bad do you have to be at music not to be able to play the tambourine? Well, I mean, I believe firmly that he can do anything, but he issues me that he does not have a musical bone in his body, but he also, you know, he is the, you open the fridge the night, goes

on, he'll do three minutes when, when somebody said, would you want to play with the band, he just said, yes. Of course. And if he got the lead role playing, which musician could he play? He could play any music, he could do any, he's a great actor. Okay. So let's say he gets the role of art garfunkel. Art garfunkel? Art Garfunkel? Yeah, Simon and Garfunkel, by a pick. He would, the wig would be amazing.

Yes. And he would hit those notes for Bridge Over Trouble Water if it's the last thing he does. What was it? The album, the Half-Man, Half-Bisky album called Trouble Over Bridge Wars. You wonder, I don't know if anyone made that joke before half man half biscuit, but that is just very fantastic. Anyway, Jen, thank you very much indeed. Correspondence to KerbertoMeta.com, if you have a moment over the festive period to send us something, tell us about something that's brand new and on posters. Ferrari, which opens on the 26th,

which is the new film by Michael Mann, who made Mann Hunter, heat, which of course you and I did as the radio one, movie the month, all those years ago, back in the day. Clatural, Last The Mahekens. This is written by Troy Kendi Martin from a book by Brock Gates called Enzo Ferrari, The Man, The Cars, The Races, The Machine. This was a long-standing passion project for Michael Mann. The story that he told me was that he first saw a Ferrari

when he was a student in London in the 60s and he just thought everything about it, the design, the, you know, he sort of fell in love with it. Started pre-production on this film, on a version of this film in 1993. What? And then it kind of kept not happening, kept not happening, kept not happening.

Christian Bale was here, he walked to start at one point, then Hugh Jackman, I think was in conversations, and 2015 Robert DeNiro was involved in another Ferrari thing, or maybe anyway, he said he was gonna play Ferrari. So now it's here. Enzo Ferrari played by Adam Driver.

And the action centers around 1957, when to quote man, everything he's been collides with everything he might become. Okay, here is a clip, and then we'll talk about the film. On the straight into the tight corner at Novermont, there's only one line through it. Berra pulls up next to you, challenging. You're even.

But two objects cannot occupy the same point in space at the same moment in time. Berrin doesn't lift. The corner racer said to you, you have perhaps a crisis of identity. Am I a sportsman or a competitor? How will the French think of me if I run Berrin to a three? You lift, he passes.

He won, you look... So, Adam Driver do... And you can hear through that, the sort of hint of an accent. Yes, so it's English with it. With a very slightly... What's sprinkling of it? With a sprinkling of House of Gucci.

Yeah, I... It was a little bit House of Gucci. Although it's not full House of Gucci, but, you know, anyway. So the company is in danger. His marriage is, you know, anyway. So the company is in danger, marriage is, you know, in bits. He's failed to save one son, there's another which is so far unrecognized. And all the hopes get pinned on the millimetre, which is this road race involving great days. I bear in mind what I know about cars and racing is absolutely nothing at all. I once had a conversation with David Cronenberg and I said,

whatever happened to the red cars. He said, well, do you know about cars? I went, no, he went, okay, there's no point. John explained to you. And, but that racing involves great danger. Anyone who knows historically about this, which I didn't, but you can find it quite easy, not only to the drivers, but also to spectators and him.

And so Michael Mann has talked about this as being a spectacularly operatic melodrama in real life. And the drama sort of raises a number, but is the devotion to the cars a way of distracting from personal failure, the failure is marriage, the failure of these children. The way, I mean, as with all Michael Mann films, it looks really spectacular.

The cinema togford talked about, you know, looking at 16th century renaissance when he caravaggio and that sort of thing. And there's a lot of it is due to the soundscape, the sound of the cars, the way in which, you know, that's why it's funny enough when I was going, you know, fair, Adi, you know what I said, there is a lot to do with the noise of it. And then at the way in which, you know, that's why I'm friendly enough when I was going and I was like, you know, fair, arty, you know, I said there is a lot to do with the noise

of it. And then at the center of it, you have Penelope Cruz, the sort of the heart of the film, as the sort of the, you know, the wronged one. But in the end, it's what it's about, I think, is somebody who has got this kind of obsessive pursuit of something that is essentially trying to stand in for some other gap in their life. Now, when I was watching it, because I know nothing about racing and I know nothing about the history of Ferrari and nothing about the story, there is a sort of central train. There's a couple of crashes in it that are quite, you know, like really, you know, distressing. I mean, they happen in a way that's very realistically done one particularly. And I find the idea of people driving cars very fast, quite scary.

I mean, we've seen quite a lot of quite good mainstream movies in which that whole thing about when you are racing fast cars, the difference between being alive and being dead is a millisecond. And funnily enough in that clip, when he's doing the thing about, you couldn't see if he's just listening, maybe he's doing the two cars next to each other, the two things cannot exist in the same space at the same time. What do you do? You take your foot off the pedal? Yeah, you take your foot off the pedal,

because two things cannot exist in the same space at the same time. And I confess that I don't really understand the desire to race cars. I find that idea quite frightening. And so what I thought was well done about the film is that for all the things that are sort of slightly hokey and the accents everything, it drew me into a world that I don't understand and that I will never really, really never really understand. And I'm a fan of Michael Mann because he's a filmmaker who throws

himself 100% into his films. I think the problem that it's going to have is that if you if you you're not really interested in the Ferrari story, you're not really interested in because it it may feel sort of quite off, it may feel like a movie made by somebody is absolutely in that world and absolutely loves the subject matter. I felt drawn into it and I felt that I was kind of emotionally moved by it

in a way that I hadn't expected. I actually quite early on got over the, any problem with, you know, I actually quite early on got over the, you know, any problem with, you know, why aren't they speaking it's hanging? You know, got beyond that. Because it has, it has style and it has a sort of melancholy heart to it. But it also has a couple of really, I mean, you know, like I said, at least one of the crashes is really, really powerfully disturbing to the point that I kind of, you know,

does it have a moment? There's an unfair comparison. Okay, the SFC Party, if you remember, at the center, you know, the bit where just before the final crash and it's raining and oh, we discussed this before, but you're thinking, just get out the car. You know, you're watching a documentary,

so you know what happens. And you're so involved in this that you're just saying, don't get out the car. The difference is, in the case of that, I knew what was going to happen. And in the case of this particular thing, I didn't like that. I knew that engaged into the story. I was engaged enough that, in all the cases that those things happen, because yes, I yes. So in that case, to answer your question, which is thank you, because that's actually put me on the right course with this.

To answer your question, yes, I was engaged enough to be upset when things went wrong and to be distressed by the thing of cars traveling at great speed, coming a cropper. And also just the fact that man clearly, he's gone back to the original locations, he's immersed himself in this stuff. You can tell that this is, you know, it's like when Coplar often talks about, you know, films being, you know, you make films about the obsessiveness of making films. And in a way, actually, there is a comparison here

between the central character and the filmmaker and that obsession with getting the thing on screen. And he's a very, very fine filmmaker. I don't think it's going to be a huge hit by any means. Because I think that in the end, it's the question about, are we going to go on watching movie about Enzo Ferrari and Car Racing? Or are we going to go and see a family drama?

So Ferrari is out when you've seen it, let us know. 26th, how much? 26th. Okay, which is still boxing day, I think. Is it still boxing day up? And it's boxing day all over the world. Okay. Correspondence to CoeuranyMoe.com is where you can send an email, or if you want to do a watch on for us, you can attach a voice note to that address,

like this, for example. Hello, Mark and Simon. Sajan Wooten here. I'm the proud curator of the BFI's first ever comprehensive UK retrospective of the brilliant Italian filmmakers, Taviani Brothers, showing at the BFI South Bank in February and March. Visit the BFI website to see the full line-up of films and to buy tickets. Well, he was, he was bread. I know Adrian.

Right. Well, he was, were you in the room when he did that? No, I wasn't. He was very well directed and it was to the point and he told us what we needed that. That's what he does. He's very well directed and to the point. In the new year, then, well into the new year, at the BFI's Taviana Brothers Retrospective,

being plugged by Adrian. So if there's something cinematically related, interpret that as loosely as you wish, tell us about it, correspondents atence at carbonemode.com. That is the end of tape. Well, this has been a Sony Music Entertainment production this week's team, Lily, Matty, Vicki, Zaki, Mikey, Hanna and actually Hanna was the redactress in charge.

Although I'm not sure that Redactore is male, so I just think Hanna is the redactore. Yeah, you wouldn't say Velociraptress. No, I don't. Is that how you think of her? No, it's like an outer control dinosaur. No, I don't. Savage can rip you to shreds.

No, I just want to think of a word that ended with awe, if I haven't said. Thanks for mentioning that. You know that I didn't mean that. You know that's not what I meant. I think he did. What's your family the week? Boy in the heron. And I didn't mean that.

I do not think of Hannah as a velociraptor. All right. Oh, now she's telling me she'd be flattered. All right, I do think of you as a velociraptor. She's leaving the show anyway. So she can take that. Exactly, yeah. Take those skills and terrorize some other people.

Anyway, take two has already landed in land adjacent to this particular podcast. And then over Christmas and New Year, who knows what's gonna happen? Stuff will arrive just when you don't expect it. Anyway, thank you for listening. Pay attention to your inbox. Thank you.