Kevin Harvick's Happy Hour presented by NASCAR on FOX - Burt Myers Interview

Episode Date: October 30, 2025

Kevin Harvick sits down with short track legend Burt Myers for a conversation packed with stories, rivalries, and reflections from one of the most recognizable names in grassroots racing. Myers shares how he got his start in racing, the family legacy that shaped his career, and what still drives him to compete today. He and Kevin dive into the rivalries with Tim Brown and Justin Miller, reliving unforgettable Bowman Gray Stadium moments that have made the track a fan favorite for generations. The two also talk about Myers’ interest in other racing series, what keeps him motivated behind the wheel, and how watching his son, Slate, begin his own racing journey has changed his perspective on the sport. LINK TO SUBMIT PICKS FOR PHOENIX: https://forms.gle/VRyHMpj8cGTBsWCK8 Learn more about your ad choices. Visit podcastchoices.com/adchoices

Before I was competitive. Me and Tim used to be best friends. It all revolved around money. It didn't matter how fast I was. And I'm as happy as I've ever been. Here I'm sitting with Kevin Harvick doing a podcast. Oh gosh, I'm going to tell this story. My wife's going to kill me.

Welcome to Kevin Harvick's Happy Hour, presented by NASCAR on Fox. And today we have a short track legend in our seat over here, Bert Myers. Thanks for taking the time to make the journey down here to be in studio. Yeah, it's my pleasure, man. Thanks for having me. Yeah. Well, you know, it's, we talked a little before the show. We've tried to kind of mix up our guests on the show to really help the, I guess,

everybody who watches the show understand more about the grassroots system of our sport. And for you, it's a livelihood of what you've done. Just how did your journey start as far as your family has a deep tradition in short track racing and NASCAR racing and well tied to the sport? But how did the journey start to get you in the driver seat? Well, you know, it's cliche, but the old saying is not if I race but when I race. Yeah. You know, I knew it was coming.

And I guess the first time I drove, my dad bought me a Dotson 510 for a silver. Right? So it had to have a new body put on it. And I can remember being sunburnt. I'm talking 16, 17 years old. And I can remember my face being burnt from Tackwell. and the new body on. And I mean, that's just...

Live that. You know, yeah. So, but I mean, that's what we had to do. If I wanted to race, that's what came next. And I ran a season of four-cylinder at Bowman Gray. And I ran a few, I ran caraway in a few places like that. But the same, I guess, sort of the same path that Slate is taken right now is it was easy for me to get into the modified because that's what we had.

Yeah. And that's what we were doing. My dad was doing. So the very next year, my dad built a car. And building a new car back then was a little different than build a new car. now. Like when I say we built a new car, I'm talking about you built the chassis, we built the body. And then you took parts that you had laying around. Yeah.

Excuse me to put together. So we put a car together and he didn't like it. He drove it a couple times and didn't like it. And he said, if you want to run this car, there it is, but you're going to keep it up. And I remember at the end of the year, I had to take out a loan to pay the tire bill off. Really? Yeah. So that's kind of how it started and then

I guess the rest is history. Well, it's evolved into, what is it, 28, 29 championships? Yeah, I think so. Total, yeah. Yeah. And so you've built this legacy and you've continued the family tradition. You're going to pass that on to Slate and the things that you guys are doing. It's obvious that, and fun.

Yeah. It has to be fun. And I think for me, it's been as much fun in racing. But did you ever settle into it's a business side of it? Because for me, it took Keelan to start racing and going back. to the go-kart track to remember why I loved racing? So I'm not quite, it is a, as far as that transition was Slate. I'm not, that, that wasn't yet for me.

Yeah. What was it for me is when I drove for Philip Smith. I drove for my dad, okay? First of all, I drove for my dad. Well, my dad, let me just back up. So when I first started in the Modifieds, my dad was still driving his own car. Philip Smith was driving his own car. So when my dad, Philip Smith decided to retire.

So when he retired, my dad started driving for Philip. the one car. So when my dad moved on to drive for Philip, I drove for my dad in the four car. So then my brother comes along. He's racing a little bit. My dad decides to retire. Philip says, I want you to drive for me. So now I'm in Phillips car, the one car. My brother moves to the four car. So that's kind of how it all started. Well, I had always, I think I'd always known in my mind that I wanted to own my own stuff and drive my own stuff. And when you build it, it's hard not to be as meticulous with this not yours. Whenever, whenever I was driving for my dad, that was a little different because it's your dad.

Yeah. So then I started driving for Philip. Well, Philip's got a car. I said, and we put a car together together. So I'm putting it together, and I've got all the sweat and all the blood and all the hard work in it. But Phillips's paying the bills on it. I said, man, I want all my own stuff. So in 2010, unfortunately, Phillips' wife got breast cancer.

He said, I just don't know how much more I'm going to be able to do. I said, if you'll let me take it over, I'll do it. I'll do it all. And Philip's still heavily involved. Yeah. And I think then it kind of when it started transition, and then when me and my wife Kim got married and you write the checks out of Burt Myers racing account. And I race for a living.

I'm one of, if not the only southern modified racer that races for a living. And I'm blessed to be able to do that. But at the same time, there's a lot of responsibility because it's not just as much fun anymore. Yeah. It's, we got to perform because we got bills to pay. We got checks to write. I think that's kind of when that transition took over for me. Now that I'm still racing, so even though Slate's racing,

two, it's not, I haven't made that transition because I haven't quit yet. Yeah. I'm not ready to quit yet. Yeah. And how old are you? I'll be 50 in December. Oh man, we're the same age. I'll be 50 in December.

I knew we were right there close, yeah. It's interesting because as your kids get older and they start, you just think differently. And when you own your own stuff, I started off kind of the same way. We had our own stuff, built it with dad, banged heads and, you know, went and did my own thing. and now you're back and we had our own go-kart teams and things. And then, you know, you learn a lot about a lot about what it's doing. But, you know, I think that the interesting part with the family piece of it having it for so long, you have your brother involved too.

Yeah. And you guys battle it out on the racetrack. And so is there any point where it's been like family, a little bit of family tension because you're running each other? You guys good at solving those problems. Believe it or not, there was only one time I can remember that we butted heads. My dad was still driving for Philip. I was driving for my dad,

and then my brother was also driving for my dad, and we had a race at Caraway, and Jason will argue this. I pinned him in behind a lap car, and he made it three wide instead of taking his medicine because I pinned him in and ended up causing a spin or whatever. Did you both rack? Yeah, I think we both got turned around or something, yeah,

and I remember calling him a squirrel. I said, man, you're a squirrel. So that's really about the only time, believe it or not, as long as we've been racing, do go head to head at Bowman Gray every week and now with Slate, there's three of us. Knock on wood, we've been pretty fortunate to not have that, you know, scuffle or anything. We've, it's been pretty good. So do you do anything else outside of racing?

No. Nothing. Nothing. It's all racing. And that's, that's tough because when you're, when you're writing all those checks, it's, there's no, there's no extra income. It's, it's, I mean, obviously, with great partners like Sitters Safe and we do our arms bumper podcast. Do you do that?

Do you sell all the sponsorship and you do it all? That's awesome. Yep. So our acquired Pinnacle financial partners last offseason, they came on board at the clash and then stayed with me through the modified season. So, yeah, that's basically I have to kind of do it all. The way I look at it is like this. The difference in me, and I guess what drives me is,

is there's times that my wife will say, you know, there's X amount in the racing account. Yeah. But if I want to keep racing, I have to go hustle and we have to make it happen. And you mentioned the cup race. I think when NASCAR, and we'll get to Bowman Gray in a minute, because that's its own story on its own. When you mentioned the NASCAR race, and I saw that you were going to run that race, that to me was exciting. And that's somewhat of what we've kind of gotten away from as we go to some of these local tracks. Like when I was racing cup, every Saturday when I first started, I'd get on a plane and we'd go somewhere nearby.

I'd go with Jimmy Spencer and Ken Schrader and whoever was going that weekend and we'd go race. But to me, the local guys being in the show matters. But two questions on the cup thing. Are you going to do it again? I guess it's three questions. Are you going to do it again? But what was the reception from the locals about the cup race? And you being in it.

But what was the overall perception of what they thought? Because it was a way better race than I. I thought it was going to be. Yeah. I know there's a few questions in there. Yeah. On that point, I even said it with Joey Ditto, which on our thing last week, our podcast,

I thought the race would be terrible. Yeah. I said there's the tracks green, big heavy cars. It's just, it's going to be hard to pass. And it was, the racing was actually really, really good. It really was good.

As far as me doing it again, I'm trying my best. I'm working hard. And obviously, I want to do it again. Yeah. It's just a matter of logistics and trying to, put all the pieces of the puzzle together.

The response from the fans that I saw on my side was amazing. And it may have just been because they were fans that kind of related to me and me being in the show. Excuse me, I think that me and Tim together being in there, I mean, who could write a better story than the two top winners and champions at Bowman Gray. As normal, you wound up around each other. Yeah, I know, right.

That's what I told somebody. So that one, when I passed Tim for last, I said that was the most talked about last place pass in history. and Joey talked about when they were in the booth and the crowd went nuts. Oh, yeah. And everybody else decided or knows to tell. And they're like, what's going on?

It's a Burton Tim. So it's pretty cool to be able to be a part of it and to back it up with going to Martinsville and getting to do an actual points race. It's like I said before, I know I don't have a cup career ahead of me. So any boxes I can check at this point in my life is just a bonus for me.

What was it like to drive it? I mean, what did you expect? Well, you know, I talked to you a little bit. Yeah. I talked to you a little bit on, Sonny, I think that there was a point where we had to get the car where I could make changes in the seat that mattered. So me making changes in the seat and the car not being what it needed to be,

it was for nothing. It didn't affect anything. And one of the things I took away from is what you told me about my braking. You asked me if I was breaking it like a modified, and I was. But when I went back and tried it again, without the car being where I needed it to be, it didn't really matter. Now, when Tony Jr. kept tweaking and got the car better, I was like, man, this is pretty good.

We were actually pretty good. I was expecting it to be, I've driven a few late model races here and there, and they're just lethargic. That's the best way to compare to them modified. But it wasn't that way. It had good horsepower, had grip. I mean, it was really a lot of fun to drive. Yeah, and when you look at the, when you look at Bowman Gray,

you think bottom of the racetrack, and all of a sudden those cup cars started moving into that second groove, it was like, oh, there is a second groove at Bowman Gray. And they didn't put anything on the racetrack. They don't really put anything on the racetrack anymore, do they? So, you know, I think that that was, I think that was probably the biggest surprise of the gear. It was cool that you guys were both in that race because of your history at that racetrack.

But I think it was way cooler that it kind of knocked the stereotype of Cup Cars Can't Race at a quarter mile racetrack and put on a good show, but it was a good show. It was a really good show. It didn't snow. We can pass on a, you know, on our hundred hundred lap nights we draw, and then we have the choose cone. Yeah.

So there's a night you qualify on the pole we draw dead last. So you have to make the outside work. Right. Because you can't just bulldoze your way through the field or you end up, you know, pissing people off. And they're going to retaliate. So I had to make a career of trying to figure out how to pass on the outside. So it was very refreshing to see the cup cars run side by side. Yeah.

So Bowman Gray. I mean, that's really, I mean, it's the biggest mystery to race promoters in the whole country, right, because of what it is. I've been there one time. Obviously, I watched the Madhouse episodes and everything that I wish you guys would still do because it was exciting and entertaining. Intertaining is the key word. Yeah, entertaining is the key word. And you witnessed it from a young age of what Bowman Gray is. But what's it like to be in the middle of all of that? because, I mean, it's feuds, it's competition, it's weekly happenings,

it's fans flipping you off and cheering and all those things above. I mean, you've lived your whole life around that. So what's it like to live in the middle of what I would call somewhat of a soap opera? It is, so I tell people, even when the race is not good, you will be entertained. Yeah. Okay, and so that's why I say entertainment is the key word. And I think the formula that Bowman Gray has created is a form. formula for entertainment.

Yeah. The draw races, the inverts. You're racing around a flat quarter mile. It's around a football field. Yeah. So when you qualify last and draw first, and I qualify first and draw last, when I get to you, something's got to give. Right.

Right. And so they know that. You know, I don't, Kevin, I think that I just sometimes don't realize it because I'm so used to it. Yeah. I'd mentioned this on the podcast last week that I've seen drivers who are, you know, great drivers who have won all over the place come in to Bowman Gray and they kind of have that look of all. Like, oh my gosh, man.

And I'm like, it's just Foam and Gray. It's the fear of getting out. I guess, I guess. In case they pass off from the locals. But it's just, I think it's just, I take, maybe I do take advantage of the fact that I don't realize it is a spectacle. It really is a spectacle.

When you think about it, we call it, it's 30 minutes from anywhere. There's a full film narrative vision. It's $12 a head to get. and you can bring a bag of snacks and a cooler in, and you get paid cash at the end of the night. Yeah. You know, maybe that's the winning formula. Maybe that's the winning formula.

But Bowman Gray is one of the few tracks that really doesn't even have to advertise. They used to have one little clip in the, in the Western Salam Journal. They have one little square ad in the paper because they didn't have to because everybody knows about Bowman Gray. The Madhouse Show obviously did a lot for getting national attention.

But the thing I always said about that is there's thousands of drivers across the country, that are in the same shoes I'm in. We were just fortunate enough to be on TV. But that was fun. I wish that hadn't ended. That was really cool to be. And Bowman Gray has been kind of in the fabric of the NASCAR system for a long time.

And I think it's, you know, when everybody has really started to try to figure out how to re-engage those grassroots fans, I don't know how many of those people actually go to a NASCAR race. I mean, a lot of them left after the modified race. last year, you know, and went on and didn't stay and watch the heat races and qualifying. So, you know, that is the show. But I think when you look at it and a lot of people say, well, you know, you'll put a quarter mile or something on a touring schedule. It'll be here, I don't want to go tear my shit up. Right. I don't want to do this. And then you go to Bowman Gray. It's like, well, I just fix my stuff every week because that's what I do. And you get, you get good at working

on a car. But, you know, so when do you think that, I mean, Bowman Gray always has, seems to have been established in the community. And, you know, I think when you look at that, that network of racetracks, you know, you've got Carraway, you've got Bowman Gray, you've got Southern National up in Rale, you've got all these racetracks all around the area. Is, is the short track system broke or broken as far as the promoters and the racers? and the people, or is it Bowman Gray has just been so established through those years from a short track piece of it? Because you talk about what they've created for an entertainment value instead of just trying to say, okay, we're going to open the back gate and we're going to have a race

this weekend. It's, okay, this week, we're going to invert the whole field, we're going to draw. And it doesn't feel like a lot of the other racetracks do that. And you talk about that show. Has it always been that way? It's been that way, as long as you remember. As long as I can remember, we were drawing for 100 lapers. Okay. And, you know, I don't know if the world knows this. Bowman Gray is who created the choose cone. Really?

Bowman Gay, during the bad house show, Bowman Gray come up with the idea of being able to choose. I can remember being at a banquet. You know, we always go to the banquet for the Myers Brothers family stuff. And at the time, it was the luncheon, and we were in the little media thing next door. And the rumors were that Cup was going to have a cone, choose cone. And I heard rumors of no one, no, we'll never do that.

We'll never do that. Well, I think that they embrace the fact that it's entertainment. Yeah. It's entertainment. It really is. We are in the entertainment business. It's entertaining. You know what I mean?

If you don't give them something to watch, they're not going to watch. It's real simple. Yeah. And just like the race at Martinsville, the race at Martinsville, the last 30 laps, 40 laps, was some of the best racing you'll see. Right. Side by side. Guys leaning on each other but still respecting each other.

That's what we do every weekend. Yeah. It's full contact. It is full contact. And how many other announcers are saying, oh, this is my favorite race of the year. This is my favorite race of the year. We do it every Saturday night. Right.

So I will say, you asked me about Bowman Gray. This just came to me. Like what it's done for me, Bowman Gray helped me whenever I went to some, another track. So if you can just imagine, when you're at Bowman Gray, how keen your senses have to be,

your closing rates, your throttle, you're breaking, everything happens so fast. So when I go to a half-mile track, my brain is working twice as fast as my surroundings because I'm so used to, through the close quarters of racing at Bowman Gray.

And I think that helped me. I think that helped me when I move away from somewhere else. And I go somewhere and there's a wreck up here. It's like it's almost in slow motion because I'm used to it happening so fast. So that's one of the things that I think racing at Bowman Gray, Bowman Gray's got a terrible reputation when it comes to certain things. People say you go to a fight and a race breaks out.

Yeah. Okay, well, that's because you did 100 great things and the one bad thing is what made YouTube. And I think that that's a part of the entertainment part of it. Yeah. And you talk about those, those, I'm going to call them, well, you said fights, but I'm going to call them rivalries. And this is just a question for the fans because I think I know the answer. But is your biggest rival, has it always been Tim Brown?

Yeah. Well, back in the day, so Junior Miller back in the day was him and my dad went head to him. Okay. And I can remember watching Junior basically bully everybody around. And I don't know why, maybe because I was a young punk. I just got it in my mind that I'm not going to let this happen to me. And I didn't. And it cost me about four championships and a bunch of money because I was just, my goal was to stand up for myself and not be bullied around.

Once I got competitive, it was Tim Brown. It's been Tim Brown. We've got 23, 24 championships out of the last 27 years between us. He's got 105. I've got 102 wins. The next active driver is my brother at 44. So if that gives you an idea, and I'm not trying to boast by any means, it just tells you the history and how long we've both been doing it and we've been able to be pretty successful at it. And when you, I mean, my rivalries off the racetrack, some of them were, I'm not speaking to that guy.

And I just want every opportunity I get, I'm going to put him in a bad spot or whatever it is. Has it changed through the years as you guys have gotten older? Yes. So. Now, I don't want to ruin anything for the fans to show up next. No, well, I don't think that's a, you know, that's not a threat. But me and Tim, a lot of people know this, me and Tim used to be best friends. Oh, really?

This was before I was. I didn't know that. Yeah, before I was competitive. Him and his ex and me and my ex would go ride, go carts, go to eat, go to movies, go golf. Like, we hung out. We were really good friends. But when I started getting competitive, obviously, the nature is that's going to kind of fizzle out. And I always, the one thing I can say about Tim is I always, I respect Tim because

of how much he puts into his racing. It's his whole life. And now, to a fault sometimes, I think you have to be careful there, especially when you get our age, what's really important. Now, on Saturday night, when I put my helmet on, there's only one thing I can think of that's important

is that's the rest of your brain off. It does, it really does. And you hear people say that. We puts the helmet on, he's a different person. When you get our age, you start thinking about away from the racetrack, you know, was what I did or what I said was that really important?

And so I think that's affected us just a little bit. YouTube has as well. Yes, YouTube has. At least with my son. It's like, Dad, why'd you do this? Yeah. But let's talk about that. It's funny, we were at the Trunk or Treat at Tribe Baptist at our church,

and this couple came up. Didn't know the first thing about racing. And she saw the name on the side of the trailer, and she's asking questions and the dad. And, oh, I'll look you up. Oh, boy. Oh, boy. Yeah.

So that's the one bad thing over the 100 good things, has always shows up. But you know what? I've always said this. The things on YouTube that make me look like an idiot at the time, I can't. Yeah, I did it. Yeah.

I did it. They didn't manufacture that. Nope. And so I learned from it. And I think with you and Keeling, you probably is the same way with me and Slate is, all right, you see what I did here. Let's don't repeat this. Yeah.

Yeah, it definitely leads to some interesting conversations because you're like me. You've been there, done that, right? and you've done a lot of wrong, but that's what's led to the great moments. Those bad moments, people ask me all the time, they're like, well, what if you to, you know, left RCR earlier and gone to, you know, S.H.R. Gibbs or Hendrick, or I said, I don't, I just don't think I'd be who I am.

Right. Without going through all those moments of looking like an idiot or running bad or running good or whatever it was, because you mature in life, but if you can go through those moments and have to deal with the adversity of all, those things, it just makes you a better person. If you're willing to learn and progress in life, it's, it makes you a better person.

I agree. It sucks when they pull it up on YouTube, but you can always say, well, you know, I learned from that moment. So, is there, is there any good stories like after the race? What's the, what's the best story, the best, the best war with Tim Brown after the race, with the crews and people and, I don't know. It's the one that sticks out. Me and Tim never really, there's been a few times, like, post.

race stuff with me and Tim, but not for the most part. There was a lot of stuff with Junior Miller back in the day. Some brawls and one of his fans tried to walk out in front of my truck, was beating on my hood. I mean, you know, there's, it was one of the, the crazy thing about that is, is we had gotten into it that night. And I'm like, look, let's just get out of here. So we load up, I'm backing up to leave.

Well, at Bowman Gray, when all the races are over, the fans can come down to the pit. So I couldn't get out of there fast enough. And she walks right out in front of my truck, like Darren me, to run over. And she starts beating on my hood. And there's a chance that my foot slipped off the gap, of the break just a tad, and maybe rolled a couple inches. And she wanted to take me downtown, and they wanted me to come down, downtown Winston-Salem. And I said, well, just so you know, I'm driving this truck with the dulae and the trailer and everything else. And I'm going to bring about 30 witnesses with me to, you know, and they're, all right, all right, we'll, we'll forget

about it. Yeah. There's been, there's so many of that stuff, Kevin, that's, that doesn't even register anymore because it felt so normal at the time. And that's how. And that's how. I remember when I was growing up, like I used to sit in the grandstands as a kid, and you'd be sitting up there and there'd be some controversy on the racetrack. Next thing you know, you'd see a swarm of people and a fight. And, you know, when I turned 16 and got in the middle of all that, I mean, you can come up with, I've had death threats of wrecking the, wrecking people on the racetrack and people pour, go pee in a cup and pour it in your seat.

I've never had that. That's pretty rough, man. That's, well, I grew up in Bakersfield, California. So it's very, it's not, it wasn't as rough as Bowman Gray on the racetrack, but it was pretty, pretty intense. And I think that's what, that's what gets those, those fans to come back. So you've gone through all the stuff with, with the competition at Bowman Gray. Was there ever a moment where you went and said, okay, I want to go drive late models or I want to go drive a truck or try to take a different path in your career? Absolutely. And, and, and, It all revolved around money. Yeah. Every bit of it.

I got invited to do a test for Rausch in 01 at Lakeland, a truck test. Now, was that part of the gong show stuff that they were doing? No, I think it was. That was just an individual test. I think this was after that, maybe. My dates are kind of fuzzy, but that was in 01. And it was me, a late model guy and a girl that was running late models. And I was within two-tent.

They brought Mark Martin in. I just told his story the other day. They brought Mark Martin in. put a set of stickers on the truck. He goes out and runs a 21-52. He runs 10 laps. He comes in. I get in a truck.

I run a 21-71. I was thinking, man, all right. It's Mark Martin. Hey, man, you know. And I'll tell you, I'm not a, I'm not of, at this point in my career, I can tell this. I was the best of who was there that day.

And I was really happy with how I performed. And it just tells you a little bit about the industry, maybe. I talked to a friend of mine later who said he ran into the guy, one of the guys that was there representing the team. And he said, I think my buddy, Burt Myers, tested with you guys. He said, oh, you mean the cowboy that showed up with the open-faced helmet, no head and neck restraint?

So at the time, it was, you know, they were, it was a little bit more tight-knit. Yeah. It was a little bit more business where it didn't matter how fast I was. But, yeah, I've always wanted to progress and climb the ladder. And, you know, I ran that truck race at Martinsville, 0-9.

I've driven some late model stuff. I've won some late model races. But I think one of my things that's probably my own worst enemy is, once you get in a modified, there's nothing like a modified. And so nothing else satisfies that taste for what a modified can give you. I was willing to sacrifice that to be able to move on. There's been several opportunities I've had and money was always the end of the stop sign. But I always said it's just like you said a while I go about going through things in your life.

life, I used to, I've sitting this many times, but I used to pray, say, God just let me make it. That was my prayer, okay? Young, naive, just let me make it. And in some ways I have made it, just not how I had envisioned it. But God has definitely blessed me and my family. And man, I get to race for a living. You know, I'm not rich. I can, I've got, there's going to be food on my table tonight and a roof over my head and I get to go racing.

So my make it and his make it. We're kind of a little bit conflicting. But at the same time, Kevin, I wouldn't have my wife, Kim. We wouldn't have Slate together. There's just so many things that guided me that I didn't know what was happening at the time. But here I'm sitting with Kevin Harvick doing a podcast. I'm a local modified. You're happy doing.

I'm as happy as I've ever been. You're happy doing what you love to do. I'm happy as I ever been. Especially in this part of the country, you're one of the few in the modifies. but I stand in that late model stock garage and I look around and there's a lot of people that their teams itself. There's not a, like I love Ryan Millington

because of the fact that it's just, he's over there just digging on his car all the time. He's got two guys there with him and, you know, he's, they're putting a thing together. And that's, you see that in this part of the country, people that are maybe not doing it for a living, but you're capable of doing it yourself. Right. If you had to.

Yes. And, you know, our late model stock championship happens to drove for our team, Linden Lewis, this year. Kid can build the whole car and do all the things, sell the sponsorship. I didn't know that until I watched him, until I saw him on the podcast. Yeah. I mean, the only reason we ran that car this year. And at a young age, that's, that's right. But there's just not many of those kids that that do that anymore. And it's just, it's not the end of the world, but it's just, it's different than it when you and I came, came through because your dad said, well, there you go. Yeah.

If you want to build it. And you can go race it and you can take care of it. And, And you learn a lot along the way, and you learn a lot driving up and down the road. And it's like I told you earlier, we tell Keelan all the time. It's more important to be a good person than it is to be a fast race car driver. Because in this sport, you have the ability to learn about life. It'll teach you a lot of things about life. If you want to learn how to balance your checkbook, I had a checkbook when I was in the fourth grade because dad said, all right, you're going to know how much this costs.

So you're going to handle the checkbook. But there's so many things that you can learn about. about life in racing, even if you don't make it. And just that drive and passion and all the things that come with it. When you watch racing now, do you watch any other forms of racing? If so, like, I mean, do you watch F1? Do you like F1, NASCAR? What do you like to watch when you're not racing?

Or is it just flow? I like, well, honestly, I'll be the first to tell you, unless I win or perform very well, I probably won't watch the replay. Yeah. I just... Same way. And maybe that's a good thing, a bad thing, I don't know, but that's just because I don't...

I put it behind me, you know, and you learn from it, but at the same time, why do I want to... Why do I want to watch a lot? If I just stup my toe on the hearth, why would I want to go do it again, right? Right.

anymore. Yeah. You know, the Earnhardt and the Elliot's and the Wallace and all that. And then even when you guys, and there's not many of guys our ages are doing it anymore. They're all, you know, Denny's, what, 44?

Yeah. It won't be long. He's going to be done. So, you know, you're looking at 20-year-olds that are out there doing it. And sometimes that's hard for me to relate because I am so old school when it comes to that mental thinking.

But at the same time, I appreciate what they do for the sport and the show that they do put on and the talent that these kids now. I really, I think a lot of it we relate to, and you've probably been there. You've around a road trip and the kids in the back seat

and you hand them a phone or you hand them an iPad. Just here, here, here. Well, guess what? At three years old, they know how to navigate an iPad. And then they're playing these video games that have 18 different buttons on them.

I remember the Atari that had the joystick with the non-a-button. I had it in television before the Atari. Okay, well, then you got the PlayStation that's got like five buttons. That's what I can do. And I can remember Slate one time playing some kind of,

video game, he's like, here, you try it. I couldn't do it because there's like 18 different buttons. And I think that these kids now are so prepared, they're mentally prepared, their hand and eye coordination at such a young age. I think that shows up on Sunday on the racetrack. So when did you put him in, when did you put Slate in the car for the first time? So Slate ran when he was five and a half, I think he did one season of go-karts. He drove Luke, Phillips grandson. He drove his go-kart for a season. He said, what do you think about this? And Slate loved it. That off-season, Slate gravitated more to basketball.

He loved basketball. And I always said I wasn't going to be the dad that pushed him. When he got around about 12 years old, I decided in my mind and I talked to Kim, I said, what if we push a little bit just to see if he's interested or not? And I don't know if I should tell this or not, but we went to Carraway and a guy wanted me to come shake his modified down. And I said, hey, can Slake just kind of right around, make a few laps? And he let him. And I think that's kind of when the light bulb went off.

Hey, this is pretty cool. Were you nervous? Not a little bit, a little bit, but not terrible. I don't know why, but it doesn't really bother me. I don't really think about Slate unless there's a caution. I say, hey, how's Slate doing? But I don't, like, it's not my mindset. Now, his mom's a whole different story.

They turn into a basket case. Oh, yeah. Yeah. But I think Slate ran his, I don't know if I should say this either. Slate is actually on paper a year older. then he actually is. If you follow where I'm going at. So he ran his first race at Bowman Gray.

I'm trying, well, he was trying to think of the year. If I tell the year, then that might not get in trouble. But either way, very young, very young, he ran his first race at Bowman Gray. He's been hooked ever since. Obviously, he wants to progress. We've talked to some late model teams because it's money. Yeah. It's all about money.

and we're working hard to try to get him. I want him to have better than I did. How old is you now? 17. He's 17. He's 17. In August. Okay.

So if you had a roadmap, what would you do? Well, cars tour, obviously, I think is a perfect avenue to kind of filter through. I think if money wasn't an object, I think he'd go right to ARCA. Like he could go right to ARCA and then through the trucks and expediting. It's interesting right now because we've had a lot of the kids, Landon's going to the trucks. He's run some. some Arka races. You got Butterbean who came through the late model stocks. You got Carson Guapel. You've got all these guys that have come through there now. And they go to go to the Arca for a very

brief time and then they go on to trucks and Xfinity. It's crazy how much that that late model stock prepares them to be ready because it's a lot like what you guys do on a weekly basis with the modified stuff. It's the most competitive thing in the country to race from a late model standpoint to to prepare them. And I think that it's like you said, they're so prepared because of eye racing and the generation that they live in, you hear all the fans say,

wow, he's too young or he's this. They don't understand. It is not like it used to be. So I'll just tell you, because it's personal for you. Keelan's 12 years old. He ain't got my business a race car. Yeah. And he just wasn't a race.

I say, well, you try it. Now, I'll be the first to tell you. I'd love to drive that 62 car. Yeah. I'd love to get in that thing one time. But what I'm getting at is, is people will make comment. about drivers, whether they're age or they don't think they're capable.

Or if that guy's in a good car, he should be doing better than that. And my thing is, is you have to have some level of talent, period, to drive a race car. Whenever you see somebody like Keelan, who has had the success he has at the age he has, I don't care how good his car is. There has to be talent there. So, and me and you probably look at it different than a lot of people do because we have been there and we have done that. Yeah, and you would never put, you would never put Slate. in the car if you watched him practice, you know, ooh.

Right, right. And I know I'm biased. And I think the biggest compliment for me is when I hear somebody else brag on Slate. Yeah. Of course, I'm going to brag on him. But when I hear somebody else, say, man, he's got great car control. Slate's biggest problem right now is he's a little too aggressive. Yeah.

But just like, so Jason's his crew chief on a smart tour. And he said, I'd rather have a driver that's too aggressive than not aggressive. 100%. To drain them back is a lot easier than to try to kick him. Yeah. And Slate from day one, when he was running six or six or. M.O.2 mods just over driving the car. I'm like, man.

So that's when we went right to tour mods, because you can hustle a tour model a little better than you can to 602. But Cars Tour would probably be our next step if that door opened. Yeah. Well, that'd be great. That'd be a wonderful addition to the cars tour. It'd be a great story.

And maybe you could race against each other in your first outing. Do you never know? That would be pretty fun. That would be fun. So last question. When you go back, what was your first car that you drove on the street?

My first street car, so I have to give you the backstory to this because I told this to somebody one time, and they said, wow, must be nice or something like that. So my dad was a bodyman, grew up doing bodywork, and he bought a 1986 Alpha Romeo convertible, black on black, five-speed, and it was hitting aside, and he fixed it. My mom drove it for a couple months,

and when I turned 16, they gave it to me. So it's pretty cool. Yeah. Riding into school with fresh license riding around in a little convertible, black convertible Italian sports car. That might sound a little bit and not so macho.

Yeah. Not so macho, but at the time, I was a cool kid on the street with my little black convert. Did you sell it, wreck it? What did you do with it? Oh, gosh, I'm going to tell this story. My wife's going to kill me

because she makes fun of me all the time. I actually, my dad and his uncle would go to Atlantic City once a year. whenever the kids and whatnot would get old enough, when you turn 21, they'd take you to Atlantic City. So it was my turn coming up, and I was broke. And I'm like, man, I want to go to Atlantic City bad. I actually sold the car for probably a lot less than I should have to go to Atlantic City.

So I'd have some gambling money to go to Atlantic City. And I tell my wife that, she said, you're an idiot. I said, yeah, I was. I was. So did you come home with more or less money? I think I came home, I came obviously less money. I didn't come home broke, but I came home with less money than what I took. Isn't that how gambling goes?

That's exactly how it goes. These casinos don't look the way they do because people win all. The lights burn for a reason. That's because they are making money. That's right. Well, Bert, I appreciate you taking the time today. It's fun to introduce the fans to people that have been such an integral part of the short track system. And you've been a great person to fill one of those roles through the years.

entertaining to watch, but you're still doing it. So good luck with the rest of your racing and have fun with it. Thanks, man.