Kevin Harvick's Happy Hour presented by NASCAR on FOX - Ricky Carmichael Interview

Episode Date: November 7, 2024

On Episode 72 of ‘Kevin Harvick’s Happy Hour,’ Kevin Harvick is joined by the greatest motocross racer ever, Ricky Carmichael! Kevin and Ricky discuss the recent Cup Race at Martinsville before Ricky gives his picks to win the Championship. Then, Ricky reflects on his motocross career, transition to stock-car racing, and more!  Learn more about your ad choices. Visit podcastchoices.com/adchoices

My kids were born the night before that, and it was my last Supercross home race at that. And the level that we were riding at was so fast, but it felt effortless. And I just remember thinking that was probably the best Supercross race that I executed. Welcome to Kevin Harvick's Happy Hour, presented by NASCAR on Fox. And this week's interview is the greatest they ever do it on two wheels, Ricky Carmichael, one of my good friends and got to know really well through the years as he drove one of our KHA trucks a couple years. So I'm looking forward to this interview and I can't wait to hear Ricky's reaction to some of these questions. Well, Ricky, long time no C. And I appreciate you taking the

time today to come on the show and just catch up because we're at this crucial point of the season where we've set our championship for. I know that you guys have kind of gone to some different formats on the on the on the motorcycle side super cross side and you know i think as as you look at what we do um the intensity and things that have come with the playoffs has added another element to the inner to to the entertainment side of things where do you think that balance is from from what you guys have done with with your format to where you were when when you raced what it what is that balance from entertainment to uh kind of that historical um you know point system and things like we used to do it. Yeah, I mean, that's a great question. And I think we're so new into it,

Kevin, that like, I don't know if we know what that real balance is, this yet, or the perfect balance, I should say, before we get going, thanks for having me on. It's always great to see you. It's been too long. But, yeah, it's hard to tell. I can tell you this much. I think that the playoff system for us, we've got a three-race playoff. And what they've done is really cool, little bit different than what you guys do as far as elimination rounds. We have a tiered point system. So the first race is standard points. The second race is double points. In the finale, the World Championship race is triple points. So what that has done, instead of eliminating riders who are mathematically out, I mean, technically they're really never mathematically out

because of the triple points tiered system. It really puts emphasis on the guys to have to execute, especially the second, the last two rounds, you know, because there's just too many points that can get lost. So if you're going to have a throwaway race, the first race is the one to do it, no doubt. But I think it's done a lot for the sport. I think it brings a lot of value to the TV package.

I'm a massive supporter of it. This was our second year having the playoff system. And to give you an example, I think it forced riders to maybe come off the bench, return from an injury late in the season when, as before, they probably never would have because they want to go into the playoffs at a higher seed. You guys, I think NASCAR has done a great job of that by rewarding stage points. I think it's super important to do that. So I think it's a work in progress, but at the end of the day, I think it brings value to the TV package.

As far as balance, you know, I think it's going to take some time. I do think it could be tweaked, whether we do less regular season races and more playoff races. But, you know, it's a work in progress, but I think it's been a warm reception for the most part. When you look at our championship four, we've got Joey Lugano, Tyler Reddick, William Byron, and Ryan Blaney. And, you know, I think for me, when I look at Ryan Blaney coming off that back against the wall type win, and knowing that feeling as the competitor, do you see, I mean, Joe Lugano, he's basically taking two weeks off and getting out of that championship form and that details that go with that preparation. Reddick, you know, he won a couple weeks ago. I always had a hard time with that. How were you as a championship writer with that preparation?

And if you had a couple weeks off, I just, I never could make myself want to run 20th. I always wanted to, you know, stay up there and compete for the win. Could you flip it back on? Could you flip the switch back on, just on and off? Yeah, for me, I wouldn't like it. For me, I wouldn't like it. Very similar, similar I feel, Kevin, to you. but we grew up you know i don't know how many years i mean you were in the chase so many times but

before that you know it's how good can you be over you know i think for you guys is what 35 34 35 races somewhere like that and like for me it was 17 or 16 super crosses and 12 outdoors so i had to be you know i had to execute and and just be really good on the average for that many races and then you know now you think of it i mean it's basically a one race championship. And whoever is best in this one race wins all the marbles. So I like it for excitement on this side of the handle parts and this side of the steering wheel, probably like you do.

But if I was racing, I personally wouldn't like it. However, as you know, Harv, is that somehow, you know, the best guy wins. And I believe that all the guys that have made the final round, the final four, they've earned that right. They were the best when it counted. Now, you guys have a lot more variables going in. I understand that. But at the end of the day, I think the guys are deserving of it.

Again, I don't like it, but I'd like to think that I would find a way to be at my best, even if it just was basically a one-race championship shootout like you guys got this weekend in Phoenix. But I think it's just how we were raised, you know, and what it was like at the beginning the beginning of the years, I think about for me, with this, with three race playoff and the triple, you know, the triple points tiered system that they had, like that would be my worst nightmare because I'm a guy of average, you know, like of 10 races. I think that I could be the best on average. But then you get a guy like, say, in my modern day, whether it be Chad Reed, James Stewart, guys that were just super explosive and had a lot of sprint speed. But you were willing

to take the gamble that they wouldn't be there. you know, 17, 25 races in a row, that's what throws a wrench into the system. So it's definitely interesting. I wouldn't like it, but I love it on this side of the handlebars. That's for sure. It is much different when you're watching it from the outside. And I know from a competitor standpoint, I don't particularly like our point system, but I love watching it. It's made the, it's made me turn the TV on every week and go to some of the races and watch. So 22, 45, 24, 12, who's your pick? Dude, come on. Now, listen,

you're an analyst now, okay? I don't make predictions. I give my analysis. You know what? They're all deserving of it. I like each competitor for who they are. I would have liked to seen Larson in there, for sure. Love what Blaney brings to the table.

I think each guy has their story, right? William Byron has his story of why he's so good and how he got into NASCAR, watching Tyler Reddick throughout his progression and, you know, his team owner, it's been cool to see Jordan and Joey Legano. I mean, he's proven, you know, multiple time cup champion and you can never count them out. So you like how I didn't give you a prediction and just talked about how you have to give me a prediction. You're just, you're, you're an analyst,

but you're the guest on the show and you have to pick one of them. I tell my other two counterparts, they can't just, they can't give me that bullshit answer. They're going to have to, they're going to have to tell me who's who they think is going to win. Well, I'm going to give the reigning champion the nod. He's earned that right. He stepped up when he needed to. He ran a hell of a race at Miami. Love what he brought to the table. Just came up, you know, a quarter of a track shy. And he came out and he passed all the guys that he needed to in Martinsville. And I'm going to give it to Blaney. Can't beat Mo. Oh, Mo. That momentum is a real thing. It's a real thing. I want to talk. about your, it is, it is such a real thing. And I want to talk about, we'll get into your past and history on the motorcycle, but while we're, while we're talking NASCAR, I want to talk about your transition from the motorcycle to NASCAR. You came in and decided, how did all that start?

And explain to our fans where your stock car career started, because I think that's a, that's a fun little tidbit that a lot of people probably don't know. Yeah, it is. So everyone that listens to, to Harv Show. It was around 2005, and I had knew that I was going to be done racing and only racing part-time in 2007. Well, in 2005, I was approached by Casey Cain's manager at the time, and he asked if I would be interested in maybe driving a late model, or if I would ever be interested in doing four wheels. And it just came at the right time because I knew I was going to be phasing out, and I was willing to forego some of my practice time on the motorcycles and do certain things like that. And I guess Casey was a fan at the time. So one thing led to another, and I got a chance to drive

the late model car that Everingham had going for the development program at the time. And I went to Hickory. I had a great time. And from that point on, I was hooked. Now again, that was 2005. So towards the end of 2005. Well, one thing led to another, and then I got contacted by JGR at the time, because they were wanting to have a motocross team, or they already had a motocross time or getting ready to have a motocross team, and they wanted Suzuki, the manufacturer, they wanted them to come on board. And so I retired from Suzuki and had a fantastic relationship with them. So they entertained me. And I think I did a development test with them as well, maybe around the 2016, or 2006 year. And a long story short, another opportunity came about with

MB2, which then turned into again, and Mark Martin was going over there. And that program just worked out better for me. I could get right into the seat. I didn't have to bring it. money and, you know, I had Mark Martin with some leadership with him. So it worked out well, did some super late model racing. And I do really think that I picked, overall, I picked the right program. There's always things that you could go back and do differently. But really, that's how I got, that's how I got into the four-wheel side of things. And I didn't, I wasn't sure if I was going to like it, Kevin, but yeah, I absolutely enjoyed it. And still today, I mean, I have, I'm still bummed.

I feel like, you know, there's some things that I could have done different, but at the same time, I mean, you were in the, you were in the mix with me. You knew what some of the challenges were that I had. I came in at a tough time, and I know I'm being long-winded here, but I came in at a tough time. That was when NASCAR wouldn't let you test, and if you did have the test, it was like really, really short amount. And, yeah, I just kind of came into the Hornets Nest there, and I had a lack of, you know, a lack of, of seat time and some racing knowledge in the four-wheel world, but overall it was a fantastic experience, and I made some great relationships, some that I still have today with people like yourself. Yeah, and I think for us, Ricky came to drive our trucks at the time at KHA,

and we had a great time, you know, going through that process and watching him learn. And what was the, What was the hardest thing for you? I know the testing was difficult at the time. What was the hardest thing going from the two wheels to the four wheels for you to learn? What were the differences between how everything worked on the motorcycle side compared to how things worked on the NASCAR side? Yeah, that's a great question. So from the business side, number one, you know, a lot of times you had to bring the money where in Moto, it's not. like that. You know, your talent, you know, you represent your own talent, and if you're good, you get,

you get opportunity. And so it was co-ing more towards, you know, pay to drive when I came into NASCAR. So you got that, right? And then you're kind of, you're at the mercy of whoever your sponsor is and how much money they're willing to spend, and then you have to perform. And then trying to make up for lost seat time and just, just the unknowing. Again, I don't think, that the race craft part was as tough to learn as number one for trucks is just arrow. You know, what aerodynamics is like? And, you know, I could go out there and qualify good, especially when I was at KHA, when you run racing for you, like qualifying was good, especially on the mile and a half stuff.

But then, you know, you get in there in a race situation. And it took me a while to figure out arrow. And by the time I figured out the arrow and where you needed to be and most importantly, where not to be by that time, it was too late. So those were the two frustrating things. Or for an example, like I loved Texas and I loved Atlanta. I always did well at those two tracks. And I loved Martinsville and ran really well there because that was very similar to Supercross.

On the gas, off the gas, breaking points, things of that nature, loved it there. And it was as less aerodependent. But when you would go to that track and you'd like get off, you'd unload and you'd be like easily top five. And then you'd go back in the fall and you'd drive in as hard as you can and you can barely bust a top 10. That was so weird to me. And it was hard for me to accept that because I always wanted to take the personal responsibility of like, hey, you know, I need to be better. I need to be better when in all reality, it was probably just the, the, the car or the truck wasn't where it needed to be. Those are tough pills to swallow.

Yeah. Yeah. And you know, you're just, you're so relying on the equipment. And I always like to tell people, and I'm not sure if you ever heard me say this, but you can't drive a slow car or truck fast. It just, you know, it just, it doesn't happen. It makes it, it, it just makes your job impossible. I mean, you don't have to wreck it. You don't have to do the things. You've got to get the most out of it. But there's this progression that happens through the year. We've seen it this year with the Hendrit cars, right? Like, they've fired off right out of the gate. And the next thing you know, they're not the fastest cars. They're fast, but they're not as consistently fast every week as the guys who have caught up. And I think that that is definitely a part of the sport that a lot of

people don't see because those cars are parked apart, six feet apart in the garage. And they see every week, I mean, there's videos and cameras. And it's like you have this whole spy, you have this whole spy system that is built into into what you do. So it's, you know, it's an interesting world. You know, one thing I will, I want one thing I will say is like, I go back to our conversations that we had. And then for guys that, you guys watching Kevin's show, like he, he, he came in with open arms and took me under his wing, took to myself, my manager and, you know, allowed us to stay with him. He's like my older brother. And you gave me so many great pieces of advice. And, in the one. thing is like we can't move you up too fast we can't move you up too fast and you always look back and

i and i hate to you know like role play and see what would happen but i always felt like we were under the gun you know we never knew what monster was going to do had monster came in and said all right we're going to give you uh you know we're going to give you three years and you're going to run all the races and at the end of the day if we don't like the progression that you have made we're going to pull the we're going to pull the rip cord from you and it was never really that you know, and I feel that, although I had a great opportunity at Turner Motorsports, if I could do it over, and, and again, I go back to the funding, if I could have, you know, had the full support and race the full year with you, I think that that could have changed, that could have changed,

maybe the outcome and what would have happened in the long run. I mean, again, I don't, It's hard to speculate, but I just feel I would have been better with guidance. And, you know, I mean, hell, you were a champion at the time, racing for the championship at the cup level. And I just, it's hard to beat that experience. You can't buy it. Yeah. And I think it's so interesting. I've had a lot of conversations with Ty Gibbs and, you know, his development.

Because I feel like, you know, as he came into the Cup series, he had some of the best. best success that anybody had had in a long time right off the bat. And because I was curious for Keelan and I hear you talk right now. And the problem with the things that we do for our young drivers now is now practice is only 20 minutes. So you show up to the racetrack and you get 20 minutes of practice and then you go to qualifying and then you park it and you go race. And I think that that is, that is a, you know, that is a tough thing to get over. And I think that the, you know, if you go back to the beginning of your career. It's almost like you needed to stay in that late model stock, super late model world for a few years and then go to the trucks for a few years. And then,

you know, like you say, though, it comes down to that funding. But it all comes down to lapse. It's so interesting to hear him talk about going to Hickory and some of these places to test his late model. And they would just go there once a week and make laps. Like he didn't even, he didn't race more than anybody else, but he had more laps in everything that he drove. And that's really some of the path that we've tried to follow with Keelan. And I hear you say the same thing. It's I got I need more laps. I need more practice. I need more races. I need more reps. And and and so that that leads me kind of back to the things that you did on the supercross, motorcross side of the world. I look back at what you, and every time I heard you talk,

it was I beat them on diet. I beat them on practice. I beat them on just sheer grit. And I think it's, if you could explain just kind of your practice routine and the things that you did on the motorcycle during the week and then go to the race, because I don't know that people really on our side of the world understand the amount of practice and time that you guys spend on that bike during the week. Yeah, I think, you know, it's a lot. You know, you got to think most of these guys start, most successful riders start. anywhere from five years old to to seven years old and it's just for the most part it's it's nonstop you're racing every weekend you're practicing all during the week and and just a quick you know rundown of what my week was like midseason is you race on saturday you fly home sunday

um for a lot of the for most of my years i was flying commercial so you fly home sunday you practice Monday, Tuesday, take Wednesday off. When I say off, you're just not on the motorcycle, and then you ride Thursday, practice again, then you fly to the race on Friday, and then you race Saturday. So, I mean, when you think about, you know, the risk that you're taking and the amount of time that you're on the motorcycle, it's just countless hours, you know, and now a lot of guys don't ride as much as I did, but that's what it required for me to feel comfortable, not only physically on the motorcycle, so I was completely in tune with what the motorcycle was going to do in every situation. And it was helpful for me mentally as well. I knew if I had a good week and I got the amount

of volume of training in on the bike and off the bike that it required for me, I could go into that race on the weekend knowing I had just as better of a chance to win as anyone because I had prepared more than anyone. I had did more laps in anyone. I did more cardio than anyone. All that fun stuff. So that's what it takes. And that's at the pro level, not even to count how many times these young amateurs are riding during the week. I mean, it is crazy now, Kevin, how the amateur scene is. I mean, there's full-blown facilities. You go to these facilities. There's 50 kids living there. They're all in homeschooling, and they're riding, you know, three to four days a week and racing on the weekends.

And then they go to their big nationals. So that's what it requires, completely different than NASCAR, like what we're talking about. So when I come into the car racing world, you know, the amount of effort it takes to go and have a test and practice during the week is substantially more. There's a lot more costs that goes with it. It's just not you in the motorcycle. It's you, the crew chief. And, you know, and a whole bunch of mechanics.

It's just a lot of effort. So maybe it's not realistic. So that was different to me. So I would go to the race on the weekends and just like cold turkey go out there. And that's where I needed the laps. I needed the laps. I needed to be comfortable right out of the gate. And it was just completely different than anything I had ever expected.

Oh, by the way, I lived my life on dirt. And I knew the levels of dirt and, you know, the slip angle. of dirt compared not knowing the slip levels of comfort and grip on on asphalt and pavement, completely different. Like that time, I schooled you at Eldora. You remember that? I don't remember much about Eldora, other than the only thing I remember about Eldora is I sucked really bad and I wrecked a lot. So there was nothing, there was nothing good about me in a dirt car. I did have, I did have one run. I went with Strader. I went with Ken Schrader and Kenny Wallace one summer.

Somehow they convinced me to run this IMCA car during the summer. And we ran like eight or nine races. And I got pretty good at that. Actually, actually won a race up in Ohio. It's the only dirt race that I ever came close to actually being competitive at. I went back there the next year thinking I was Billy Badass and got T-Boden in the door, hit my head against the roll bar, and never, never raced another dirt race again. I was terrible at dirt.

I didn't understand the slip angles that went with dirt. You know, one thing I will say that we have tapped into something really, really cool in the motto side of things, and I think that it would be a great opportunity for young, inspiring drivers. Someday wanted to be a cup champion like you or Expendity champion, truck champion, whatever they might do. But we have a thing called the futures. And if you come to a Supercross, yeah.

So it's like basically the hottest amateurs around. What it would be like, Kevin, it'd be like, when you're not. I was racing the East Series and a couple of times like I know we race them at Loudoun, at Iowa, they would, so now at certain races that we go to, supercrosses, they have the futures during intermission. So you're inserting all these young, hot shoe, wanting, aspiring supercross racers in that realistic situation. You know, you got a PAC Stadium. They're racing, you know, the racing at intermission. It's the track is realistic. So you're kind of getting their feet wet and exposing them to what they're hoping that they will be doing the following year.

I think that would be pretty cool for NASCAR to start doing that, whether it's the East Series, the West Series, at some of the bigger tracks, not the smaller ones, the bigger tracks. Because a lot of those guys, I feel like, you know, they grow up racing on small tracks. They need to feel what it's like on those mile, mile and a half, you know, high bank stuff to really get. get a realistic feel. And then have it on weekends when people, you know, the hot dogs are there, when all the cup drivers are there because it changes the mindset. It changes how special it is. You know, when you've got team managers and teams there all watching,

I think that would be a great opportunity for young drivers in the four-wheel world to come up and be able to, you know, display their talents and be in a situation like that. Well, you definitely get more recognition when you're at an arc race or at a truck race. and I know with the guys that we manage. I mean, they definitely get more recognition when they have good weekends like that. I think for us, we have the cars tour and everything that goes with the late model scene there

that has helped give those guys a platform to have more exposure to the cup teams and the NASCAR world. And that's a tough spot. I mean, you've been in that spot. And I think when you were an amateur and you had all those reps and you're riding around the country with your dad

and doing all those things. What was the, what was the break that finally got you to that level? Where were you? What was the manufacturer? What do you think that big break was that propelled you into being on the path to, to race and professionally? Yeah, that's a great question. So it would have probably been my first professional or my first amateur national that I went to in Ponca City, Oklahoma. It was 1987, I believe it was. And I came out from Florida. I did all right. Like I ran top three and, you know, I was doing a lot with a little. My bikes weren't the prettiest. I wasn't on the best equipment, but I had that grit and I really had I really had no other option other than to do well. And not that my parents were pressuring me,

but they just had instilled in my mind like, hey, this is the effort we're making and putting towards you. You need to go out there and give it your best. Don't make these mistakes. Do these. Do what we practice and, you know, and it should take care of itself. And it did. And I started getting recognition from some local sponsors and then national sponsors. So nine, and then 1988, uh, when I went to a few more amateur races, then I started winning. And then that's when I got manufacturer help from Kawasaki. And then I got onto their amateur program at the time, which is Kalsaki Team Green, which was the best program to be on. And, uh, yeah, I was with Kalasaki pretty much all of my, amateur career and then for the first what five or six years of five years of my professional career

and uh yeah 1988 from there on that's when it really started to go when i started winning those amateur races at a at a young age and then each time that i stepped up you know i did well you talk about tie gibbs i think about like his his progression and and kind of watching him what like he would do the east series and he'd go in there and then he'd go the next one uh arca and then win there, and then he went to the Xfinity and wins there. You know, so I, I, then that, that's really how it got going. But then when I got to the cup level of, of motocross and supercross, it took me a couple years, especially in Supercross, motocross, I went straight on to winning championships.

But Supercross, hell, it took me, I didn't win it until my third season. So, it's just a different animal. And I go back to one thing that you always used to tell me, Kevin, and it was like, the each level that you go up in it's harder to cover up the mistakes and i think like you know i could like tie you know i think he's got the talent to do it i just it just shows you it's a big step and most guys that you're racing in the cup series have had just the same amount of success as each other guy has in every series if that makes sense so when you made it when you made it to that top level and you think back to those days of all that success.

What was the one race you looked back to and say, man, that was the most epic, badass race that I ever had. And who was it with? Yeah, for sure, hands out. I didn't even win this race. It was my final Supercross in 2007 at Orlando. It was a hell of a battle with myself and James Stewart. We passed Chad Reed about five laps in and just absolutely motored away from

him. And the reason that I didn't even care that I didn't win is because I knew that I couldn't have ridden any better. My kids were born the night before that, and it was my last Supercross home race at that. And the level that we were riding at was so fast, but it felt effortless. And I just remember thinking that was probably the best Supercross race that I executed, and there was nothing that I can do, even though I came up a few, a few, a few, bits short of winning and beating James, but the level that we were riding at, it was just absolutely incredible. And that's one that sticks out to, sticks out in my head. It's fun to think back to those times where your competitors push you to do things that you didn't

think you could do. And then you ride at that level and you talk about it being effortless. And, you know, it's just the way that it goes when you compete against the best in the world and you want to be better than them, you push yourself to do things that you wouldn't do. So when you look back at your, yeah, and you look back at your, yeah, and you look back. at those types of moments and you go even a little bit further back. Was Clint Boyer the best amateur motorcross racer that you raced against? I mean, was he any good or was he just, you know, full of crap and just out there? Well, you know he's full of crap, so let's just start there. Clint was always, so his older brother, Andy, was always always the best one of the three, him,

Clint and Casey. Casey seemed like he was always into traditional stick and ball. sports so he was just kind of doing his thing but clint was always clink could always do better but you could tell his heart wasn't into it right he was just there by by proxy of his his he was having a good time he was having a good time well i don't think he was having a good time and all real realistically he wasn't and all reality wasn't um he he could have done better but i don't ever think he wanted to do better right like it's the craziest thing i used to get pissed off for him like dude if you would just try you could do a couple positions better and he just it almost like he knew and i don't want to speak for him but i feel like it's like he almost knew that he wasn't destined to do

this so he's just going to go out there and just kind of mail it in and that's exactly what he did do you have any do you have any just stories that we need to know about clint do you have one good climp warrior story that the world needs to know he got mad at me one time We were at Loretta Lins, Tennessee's biggest amateur race in the world still to this day. And they give you like a sight lap. So in the four-wheel world, it would be like you guys on your warm-up laps before you take the green. And I was messing with them, right? We're on our little like per, they call it a siding lap.

And like I knocked him down, right? He got so, dude, he got so mad at me. So anyhow, like we take the siding. lap and we get back to the starting line and we race the race and I don't know I think I did pretty well Clint Clint did what he did he was going to run seventh the tenth somewhere in that area and anyhow we always parked next to each other right and we got back to the to our motor homes and I put my bike on the stand and I get back and he runs up to to my bike and kicks my bike over on the stand it was mad at me and calling me a dummy and why did I

I do that and I was and I literally was just playing with them but that that's one that rings out in my head. So we've had some good times together. There's no doubt, no doubt. There's never a dull moment with plant. We've, we've been, we've been the same. How is it with you guys in the booth? Have you, have you enjoyed it? I know we talk and text on the on the side, but what, what would be one thing? I had a question for you. Like, what do you feel was the, the, the most challenging part for you. I know you guys are always in a three-man booth, but what's the biggest challenge for you each weekend? Honestly, the hardest thing for me was the grid. The grid, for whatever reason, because we prep for everything else, you kind of know everything that's going on,

like the back of your hand before you get there with all the production meetings and everything is happening. The grid, I always felt like I was tongue-tied, fumbling, who knew what. Clinton didn't know what Rosie would have on a week-to-week basis. and Mike would be frustrated with both of us, and we'd start looking at each other, and half the time Mike would start walking. And that was the freaking grid was the hardest thing for me to get going

because you had all these other thoughts in your mind about the race and everything that's getting ready to happen at the start of the race. But I think that the thing that I found the most intriguing was just how fast everything moves. And in NASCAR racing, it's not like a football game, right? Like you don't get a break and you can't have a replay. you're looking for to help everybody.

There's so many things happening that you're looking to help, you know, recognize things that are happening on a racetrack or something that somebody says because there's just so many different little bits and pieces to go with it. So, you know, I think there was a couple times Atlanta comes to my mind the most

where the finish got chaotic. And I wasn't really ever in the mix. And Mike and Clint were kind of in the mix of calling the end of that race. And it all happened so fast. And I, there's a couple of them at the beginning, I just stood there and listened to them, listen to them call the finish of the race because it all happened so fast.

So it was fun, but man, it sure is nice to be able to take those headphones off at the end of the day and nobody's mad at me. I don't have to worry about how fast I went, how slow I was, who I ran into, where I have to go next week,

what time the simulator is. It's all pretty stress-free. So that part was good. So let me ask you this. So, like, you didn't find it hard. Like, you didn't upset any drivers for maybe your honesty and telling it like it was. And they didn't get upset with what you said during the moment. But then maybe after the fact, they were like, hey, you're right.

You know, like, I messed up there. I shouldn't have. I mean, you didn't, like, that wasn't tough for you to call the shots like that. And, you know, I think that we've had all these driver committees throughout the years and driver council that, that I think I've been a right. most all the drivers and they know that I'm pro driver. They know that I'm pro driver and I'm going to be on their side no matter what. But I'm also going to tell you, they've heard me tell them when they're wrong. They've heard me tell them when they're right. And I got, I had one, I had one text. And that was the only text all year. It was a short answer back and I never, never heard anything

else. And that was the only time anybody said anything all year. So I try to keep it fair by just, being honest and saying what I see because if you see it, you can't deny it. I mean, that's pretty much the way that this all works. So I feel I feel pretty good about the way that all of that went. But it was fun. One last question. One last question before we go. What was your first car? What was it? Was it yours? Did you own it? And where did it go? which i mean you're talking what you're like when you when you turn when you turn 16 what was your what was the first thing you drove yeah i i bought my own uh 1996 uh Chevy extended cap or extended cab z 71 uh it was maroon um and i sold it to a guy in town um three years later i

I think I had it for three years. I bought it on my own. And how I bought it was throughout my amateur career, through certain sponsors, Oakley, Fox, you know, they would give me championship bonus money. So I get like 500 bucks for championship, you know, per championship. And I was winning 10, 15 championships a year. And so I let that accumulate over, you know, from when I was 11 to. 16 and I think that truck was $26,000 is brand new and I had $32,000 in the bank and I bought it.

Yeah, so I bought it. I bought it. I bought it on my own. That was it. I love it. Well, man, it was it was great catching up with you. I appreciate you taking the time today. I know we've been trying to get you on here for a little bit. I'm glad it. I'm glad it worked out. We'll catch up soon, but thanks for all the insight and we'll talk to you again soon. That's right. I appreciate you having me on, brother. Always good to hear your voice. I want to thank Ricky for taking the time today. It's always fun to catch up and tell old stories. And always good to hear insight from people outside of our world to get perspective on other racing and things that they had to do when they came to this sport. So we appreciate him taking the time. We encourage you to follow us anywhere on social media and YouTube.

And we look forward to seeing you next week after the championship race.