Kevin Harvick's Happy Hour presented by NASCAR on FOX - Riley Herbst signs with Jimmie Johnson & Legacy Motor Club

Episode Date: September 6, 2026

Jimmie Johnson and Riley Herbst join Kevin Harvick for an exclusive, wide-ranging sit-down breaking down Legacy Motor Club’s expansion to a 3-car operation. 7-time NASCAR Cup Series champion Jimmie Johnson explains why Riley Herbst was The Club's top target. Herbst opens up about the new challenge leaving 23XI and taking control of his career trajectory. Plus, Kevin and Jimmie dive into the reality of driver-to-owner transitions, scaling a 3-car shop and Legacy's star-studded investment group. Learn more about your ad choices. Visit podcastchoices.com/adchoices

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Yeah. We're old. Fun is a little bit different than running 120 down the streets in Mexico in a trophy truck. That's more exhilarated than fun, to be honest with you. Welcome to Kevin Harvick's Happy Hour, presented by NASCAR Fox. And today we have two special guests, Jimmy Johnson and Riley Herps, with some big news today. So I don't want to spoil it. So I'll let you guys go ahead and tell us what we have on tap here today.

I'm just super thrilled to announce Riley as the driver of the 84 and our third chartered vehicle legacy motor club for many years, for multiple years. So very, very excited to have Riley come in. My family, his family, the time that we go back through the world of off-road racing and to be able to watch Riley evolve as a racer, you know, this is a really special moment for me, and I feel for the Herps family as well, and to see his evolution through the sport,

what we need in that third car, a place for him to grow. We're super thrilled to have him on board. That's got to be fun for you. Yeah, absolutely. I'm just so excited to be still opportunity to race in the Cup series. First off, just sitting with two of my heroes, obviously with Kevin and Jimmy,

But yeah, watching Jimmy race, watching you race growing up, kind of gave me the hope and everybody on the West Coast that you can make it from the West Coast into this southern heavy sport and be champions of our sport and to win races. But to join Legacy Motor Club with Monster Energy, it's just honestly a dream come true. You know, it's so interesting that you talk about the West Coast like that, because when we raced during our cup career, at one point, we had nine guys from California. Yes. And, you know, you hear the southern sport part of it. And I think people are like, oh, yeah, NASCAR is a southern sport.

But, I mean, the West Coast has produced a ton of great talent that has come through the Cup Series, through racing in general. But for you guys, the off-road truck thing to me, you know, it's a little bit foreign to me. I was fortunate that your dad took us out and showed us what it was all about one weekend while we were in. Vegas. How has that connection kept you guys together through the years? You talk about the Herps family and everything that you guys have done. How did that connection evolve throughout the years of off-road racing? I think, and you know, I formed a friendship on this through Hornaday and others. There is a welcoming and encouraging environment from individuals that live here and are in this sport wanting more people from the West Coast to come in. And when Riley's journey started

and he ends up back here, Troy at the track, just welcoming friends that we've known for decades, you know, there's so much diverse racing that takes place on the West Coast. And, you know, when that floodgate opened after Gordon was recognized and got things going, not only did it help the West Coast, but I think other forms of racing. And so this is just an extension of that. We did have nine guys from California, although the fan base on the West Coast doesn't have the exposure. I think racing culture in general, you know, there's a deep awareness of NASCAR and the desire to come here. Yeah, California car culture, West Coast car culture in general is big. So you wind up in the Cup series. You wind up going asphalt short track racing. Your family is involved in the

off-road trucks. So how did that path navigate you towards asphalt racing? Yeah, honestly, Kevin, it's literally because of Jimmy. Walking into the garages in the desert racing or the short course racing, Jimmy Johnson is, there's like this lore about Jimmy Johnson, how you can make it from a... You got a tour of it. Yeah. Yeah. You can make it from Chula Vista or Glenn Helen and race pro fours, pro twos, and then you

can make it to the Mount Rushmore of NASCAR. And so I remember my first time going to Bristol. It was a K&N series, 2016. And I've heard about Jimmy Johnson. My dad says he's friends with him. I don't know. I don't buy it. And we're walking through the tunnel.

And Jimmy probably got done with happy hour number two or how many practices you guys had back then. Yeah. Yeah, he's like, hey Riley and kept walking. And I was like, holy shit, Jimmy knows my name. Yeah. And then I, sorry for cussing. And then I walked back in.

And yeah. So it's just, it's so cool to be with Jimmy and just, yeah, from the West Coast and off. road racing. How does the third car dynamic, I know you guys have dabbled in a little bit with yourself driving that car. Obviously, the number is going to be 84, which is pretty cool to be driving the car that you started with at Legacy and all the ties to the 48 and everything that you've accomplished in your career. But how does that third car dynamic and change the dynamic at Legacy? And why? Why go to a third car? What does it help hurt? What are the challenges? What's the, what's the, what's, what's,

the thought behind the third one? Running the third car on a limited schedule has, we had ambitions for it to run more often. And when I first started with Legacy, I ran, I think, nine races the first year. And it just took too much away. We really felt like we could use that to develop talent, maybe bring in some, you know, senior level individuals to then start building towards the third charter. But honestly, it just took too much away. So we've been much more strategic with how we use it and the frequency of that. But with the third car, when you look at scales of economy, when you look at the ability to collect data and to develop your race cars,

you need the maximum amount of cars. And four car teams, you know, have 25% more. You know, for us and where we want to be in five years as an elite team, racing for championships, it's just that next step. It does mean that we'll need a new facility. It does mean that we're going to go from 150-ish people to 200, people and we're in that whole ramp up phase right now. So then that kind of ties back to some strategic investors that have come in, our expansion into other ways to take care of our sponsors,

bring in and recruit new sponsors, retain talent, generate revenue. You know, there's a big business and a big ecosystem that will help us on that journey to become an elite. And all of this honestly is coming on the confidence of the charter system itself, and then post-settlement, now that we have legitimate franchises, it gives us more leverage and more strength. When you look at your journey into the Cup series, what has been the biggest surprise for you,

as far as going Cup racing, that you didn't expect, that you can take over to helping them get the third team established as you go through this journey with Legacy to get this team up and going? Yeah, well, I think when I say this, both of you guys will shake your heads in unison, but it's the people you have around you. It's everybody who makes your individual team and then makes the whole collective race shop and the men and women who put the race cars together.

Yeah, I just saw how the people make you a better race car driver, whether it be the crew chief, the engineer, or the assembly guy putting the brake lines in. But it's a huge proponent, and I know Jimmy and everybody at legacies on top of that and getting the right people over at legacy, and that's a huge thing. But from a personal standpoint, I don't know, from the O'Reilly series, you race 33 times a year,

and that sounds like a lot. And then six, what's six more? But I can promise you six more is grueling, mentally, physically, everything. So I'm just, I'm more experienced now and ready to tackle it. When you look at that experience, I think we would probably both tell you, the people are the most important thing,

for sure, like you said. But I think that the, the hardest, thing for the young guys when they come in is the time management piece of it to be able to live a normal life and also be able to go to the meetings, go to the simulator, do the grind of the season of the travel is part of it. And it just becomes difficult. And I think as you go through that, it's difficult not only on the driver. It's probably the easiest on the driver because of the fact that the team guys are there at 4 a.m. opening the doors, working on the cars,

And so, you know, I think as you ramp up towards this, Cal Wells has been a big part of what you've done. Toyota has been a big part of what you guys are doing and done in the past. And I think explain to explain the process that you go through now of being able to develop the team, hire the people, because you're in the money season of hiring people, right? Like August to September. what's the path that you go through now? Do you hire the cruci first? Do you hire the engineers first? Because there's just so many people. And you said you're going to ramp up by how many people for the... Probably 50 people. 50 people to go to that team. And you guys have taken the approach of, we don't want to just go buy everything from everybody. We want to establish the foundation of being able to

develop people, to develop the cars, to develop our own system. And that is a little bit different than, say, the 2311 model where they just go to Joe Gibbs racing, write a check. What was the thought process in that? Because it's a long, like you're not doing it in two years, three years. What's the thought process of that journey to be able to do it that way? Because it seems like you and your group are committed to it for a long time to be able to get to that point and suffer the consequences like you have to get the journey started. Yeah, there's a lot to unpack there.

But starting with Morrie Gallagher and his commitment. to us controlling our own destiny. And then when Mori wanted to exit in the capital partner that I found in Nighthead Capital, they want, a lot of people think private equity just wants to flip things. Their business case and mantra is far different. They want long-term positions, and they firmly believe

in sports and entertainment, and they have a ton of examples of what they've invested in. And for us to have sustainability and for us to truly be a tier one partner with it, and OE, you know, we need this infrastructure to compete with Penske, Gibbs, and Hendrick. It's just plain and simple. And in the Toyota opportunity, the way that they have such a incredible focus on their teams, we are working down that road and we will have that opportunity.

It's just up to us to, you know, bring it to life. And that was really interesting and appealing and helped made that transition easier for us to, for me to leave Chevy and come over. But on that journey, you know, I mentioned the 50 people, not all 50 are just focused on the third car itself. Our advanced engineering group, our arrow group, quality control, vehicle dynamics. You know, there's a lot of engineering. Although this car is, you know, off the shelf vehicle, there still are, you know, plenty of areas to find all these little margins to make yourself better. And as we're doing that, we're creating our own software tool chain.

due to very honest and fair reasons, since we're not in that Joe Gibbs Racing Alliance, we shouldn't have access to their tools because behind those tools and the data are their setups. And so we've been on this journey for the last two years alone with raw data, but raw data doesn't work unless you know the setup the car has been sitting on. And so as time goes on and we expand to three cars, we can collect data 33% quicker in those inputs, and mature our systems. And with all that requires headcount.

The third car brings in a whole new level of data collection and also monetization just to get the money to fund this whole damn thing. So it's a big journey and really more of a franchise approach than the traditional approach to ownership in the sport. And, you know, it's just a dynamic environment that we're building for the long haul. What's the most unexpected thing from the ownership side that you've, you've, you've stumbled upon to say, oh, man, this isn't what I expected it to be. Because, I mean, team ownership is, it's a 24-7 job.

And it's going to be somebody picking up the phone or walking through the shop that's going to everything from complaining about the toilet paper to how fast or slow your cars are. What's been the biggest surprise for you as you've gone through this journey from the ownership side? Because honestly, I would have never expected you to jump in like you've jumped in with the amount of time and effort that it takes because it's just it's hard it is it is super hard it is to do what you're doing i uh there's a couple but i assumed i would jump deep into the competition department but just out of necessity and need to find the money to do all this i've ended up in a whole new

space in revenue generation and it's so strange because that's the exact same thing that jeff Gordon said, right? Yeah, that makes sense. He wound up on the, on the marketing side, and you think that you're going to jump right into the competition side, and it just, you wound up in the exact opposite spot. It's been, it's been a great education. And what I have realized is, you know, from five until 45, all I did was competition. And I didn't realize some of my, you know, reasons of stepping away was just, I've done that

for 40 years. So I've found new energy, new, an opportunity to learn and do something different within the industry I love. So it's been really an aha moment to see how much fun I've had with it. The competition side, we get judged every Sunday, and that brings plenty of frustrations as we're taking the hard road. But ultimately, it's just how slow it takes things to mature and come to life on the ownership side. Yeah. Being on the team, you wanted a new widget. You know, somebody had built it in a few days. It was on the car. Now to get this 150 person ship to change direction, not soon to be 200, the time it takes to do that is mind blowing. Yeah. When your family is obviously involved from the sponsorship side, the marketing side, the things that you guys have done in the past.

how deep do you dive into that side of it? And I think one of the unique parts about the situation that you're getting into with Legacy, and I'll ask you this after I ask him this, but the strategy off the racetrack for Legacy is eye-opening to, in my opinion, to the sport and other teams with the approach that they have from how they entertain their clients, customers, partners, whatever. is coming to the racetrack at a level that is much different than everybody else. How much do you dive into that side and work on that side from the sponsorship standpoint

at the racetrack with paying attention to where the customers are going, the experience they're having for the people that are coming with you to the racetrack? Yeah, I think that's a great question. Definitely more in the last six, eight months or so, just because my dad's kind of showing me how it works and how it works. takes people to get to the racetrack and he's showing me different experiences and we've been fortunate enough to go to different racing races around the globe and see kind of a different eye than the Darlington NASCAR garage. And so it's definitely eye-opening and what Jimmy and everybody's done at Legacy with

the tents and the food and the drinks and the hospitality area. That gets people to want to come to these races, whether it be my buddies or somebody who wants to sell bananas in a convenience store. And that's a huge, huge eye-opening and that they're not necessarily just interested in 40 stock cars going in circles, but they want to have a good time with their buddies at the racetrack and this hospitality area, this whole hospitality tent, and just everything that legacy is doing is trying to bring more eyeballs to the sport that all three of us love so much. So with the off-road background, the Baja 1000, all the, I mean, you, you ran a off-road race last year, or this year, that we covered.

Yeah, that we covered on speed. And that was very interesting and entertaining to follow along. So is there a point where we see your family's off-road trucks and Jimmy has obviously driven them? Is there like a legacy off-road adventure that is on the table here? or are we just focused on NASCAR right now? Because, I mean, that would be great to see the two of you driving a truck together somewhere, somehow, some way. Is that possible?

Well, you'll have to ask my team owner. Yeah. But no, right now I'm focused on this childhood dream of mine that I'm just so. Well, you have to have fun, Riley, too. There has to be something fun every once in a while. Fun is a little bit different than running 120 down the streets in Mexico and a trophy truck. That's more exhilarating than fun to be. honestly, but yeah, no, it would be cool to go do that with Jimmy and try to win a ball haul in

thousand. Yeah. I mean, what do you think about that? Yeah, what's interesting, the conversations with Riley coming to legacy, you know, happened, we're starting to happen around the time that I was in the off-road truck with his dad, but his dad and I have been working on me going off-road racing for years. Yeah. I just didn't have the opportunity. And then going to the event and with so many people in our leadership group that believe in off-road racing and see the moment that it's happening. Of course, our partners, Toyota had a long, long history in off-road. We've been working on something that we hope can come together for the 27th season, where I would be in an off-road truck a lot more.

I don't know if I can convince his dad to do it, but, you know, that there is an opportunity there that can help legacy NASCAR through all of our partnerships, through technology, engineering that takes place on that side. And we've been working hard on it and hope to have something soon. So when you go and you look at all the things that have happened over the last couple years with your racing career, what are the realistic expectations as you come into 2027? Where do you start? Where do you set the goals?

I mean, what are the things that you think that you need to accomplish early in the season to get things started off on the right foot? Yeah, honestly, I think it's continuing what I've been doing this year at 2311 and just continuing to take that next step forward. I felt like our progress from year one to year two is huge and I think that's just true. So hopefully we can hit the ground with legacy and do all the small things right, as somebody always used to tell me, and just be consistent. Week in and week out and then the speed will come with that. building a new foundation with the third with a third team is difficult i lived that at 2311 and hopefully we can take what i learned there and make it smoother at legacy um but yeah i mean this is the cup series it's extremely difficult these are the best stock car drivers in the world and um i'm just

fortunate enough to to do it when when you look at the dynamic of the of the sport now jimmy you know i think that it's very different than when you and i came in because i mean they're also young Yes. And, you know, we talk a lot about superstars and who do we make into a superstar. How do you put the marketing behind them? But, I mean, think about this. Chase Elliott seems like he's been here as long as we've been here. Yeah, yeah. And I think he's 30. And so my point here is Riley's super young. Everybody's super young. Where do you think that just the platform for NASCAR is. currently from the team ownership side we've got the charter stuff all all situated and now now you're really trying to promote uh the the next generation of stars and you've really only got one super old guy in denny hamlin uh you know which is hard to say he's super old yeah younger than us yeah

we're we're definitely old uh we've got as old as kensith though yeah we've got the grade to prove it and and i think that when you look at that dynamic of of our sport currently it's really interesting because your superstars are still really young. I mean, Joey Lugano, I feel like he's been here a lifetime, and he's, what, 35, 36? So it's a strange question, I know. But when you look at the dynamic of the veterans teaching the young guys, where do you think we are overall as a sport as to being able to say, okay, these guys are going to be our next superstars,

but they're still trying to really figure out who they are as a person, who they are from a team standpoint and how to express themselves in a way that is not, they don't want to be controversial, but now they're all, there's a few of them starting to come out of their, out of their shell. And even, even you, right? Like when you, when you came through, it was very, it was very corporate and you didn't, you didn't have to stretch too far out to make it exciting because you won so much. The rest of us were trying to figure out how to keep up and keep ourselves relevant because he won so much that it was tough. So from a marketing standpoint, you have Riley, you have Eric Jones, you have yourself,

where do you position yourself as a team to help promote the guys that are on your team from your standpoint, from a legacy standpoint, to be able to create the superstars that everybody wants to be able to create? So I know it's a loaded question. No, it is. And I'll, you know, get up to like 50,000 feet on it. I think the stars of our sport that we grew up watching and then had the honor to race against where the consumers were only so many ways to ingest, you know, consume sports, entertainment. We had a television. There wasn't streaming. We didn't have smartphones. And you could just turn the television on a Sunday.

and that's how stars were made through the television and maybe once or twice a week in these cycles that would happen. Today is totally different. And I think our industry in general, we are so busy and we do focus on various brands. But in my opinion, in my opinion only, the brand of NASCAR, they spend time to develop the brand, but that activation piece,

I think when you compare to other leagues, and especially the way I look at it, we're the second largest league in the country. You look at TV viewership or number two, attendance over the course of year number one. We haven't had a franchise model for independent contractors, sport is family owned. We've all had different objectives, maybe not the alignment that we've needed, but at the end of the day, we're all really busy and we all have people to answer to. If you look at the team side, I haven't seen many teams really lean into building a brand around their team. Their stars have been their drivers. Those drivers have contracts and obligations to partners.

It's all really busy. Knowing is taking any extra time to build stars within teams to get their drivers out of the industry itself into new spaces. And there's only a few that are even comfortable doing it. And then on the team ownership side, you know, we're we have obligation to all these. partners to keep the lights on. And so our branding ends up being more aligned with their objectives. And all along, you know, me coming into this ownership role, I've been thinking it more from a franchise perspective. And we need to build our own brand as a team. We need to build stars within the legacy brand to help carry the water. So when you look at our strategic ownership group,

there are a lot of notables in there that want to go racing, love racing, and are willing to lend their legacy to the greater good here. And, you know, staying at that 50,000 foot view, if you look at the NFL, their stadiums, the way their economics work, the players are beholden to the actions on the field, not to all these other commercial obligations. So they might have some more freedom. The brands and teams themselves now build all these practice facilities, have a huge real estate play, all this other benefit of their overarching brand. It's not always apples to apples, but there are some comparisons here and how to behave as a franchise and a league that I'm just trying to draw inspiration from and figure out how we build from there. Yeah, well, that's really

interesting. And when you talk about it from a branding standpoint, like you're in a NASCAR commercial this year with Noah. Yeah. And are you comfortable with all those types? of things. And I think it's, it's always important for the driver to understand that they have a brand. And where, where do you sit with that branding from your personal brand and the things that you do? You obviously have a sponsor with, with Monster that has been super aggressive with their branding and very successful through the years. And I'm sure that they push you to, to try to, lean into that. Where do you sit with the, from the branding side from yourself personally? Yeah, obviously, I've been fortunate to work with Monster. And they're a, um, extremely,

edgy brand from Southern California. So they pushed me to be myself and to be edgy. And if it doesn't work, they throw their hands up and say, okay, well, let's try the next one. And so it's cool to have that long leash and the runway to go try different things to explore yourself and try a cool commercial. And if you don't like it, then we'll go to the next commercial or we'll do a super cool music video production shoot down the Las Vegas strip in a NASCAR Cup series car. Like stuff like that. that. They collapse with a helicopter at the ball ring.

Exactly. At a short track behind Las Vegas Motor Speedway. But yeah, I don't think many other brands would do that. And so Monsters like, if I have an idea, I was kind of, they kind of gave me a blank shoot of paper. And I was like, what do you envision? I was like, I love Las Vegas. That's my hometown.

I would love to make a cool movie there. And they said, let's go do it. They got Von Gitton Jr. I got the cup car. And it was just a really cool experience. Yeah. Well, you talk about cool experiences, and I'll end it with this. And I think that both of you got to experience this this year. But you talk about reaching out to do different things going to Coronado this year. And I was fortunate to be there on Friday and see the truck race and all the things that were happening. And I would put that in the top five of events that I've ever attended and been a part of from a NASCAR standpoint. What was that like? I mean, from the driving aspect, but just from the event aspect of doing something different, you can start, Riley.

Yeah, I loved it. Again, I'm from the West Coast like you guys. So I don't necessarily, I know this might be bad to say, but I don't get the cool feelings when I walk into old historic tracks in the South. Like, when I'm down in San Diego on Coronado Island, I'm like, this is cool. This is what we need to be doing. Like this is this is the young, this is youthful, this is NASCAR on a Navy base. Like that is, that's insane. Like I'm just thinking, where else can NASCAR and the Kennedys and Ben take us? Like, that's what I'm thinking. It was awesome to experience that. I hope that we go back.

I hope that we try new cool cities. Heck, maybe even out of the country. But I just want this sport to be how it was when you guys were on top of it. And I think that was a huge step in the right direction. You got to drive it, right? I did. What a fun experience. The cup car, we had some issues and it was less fun, but the truck was a lot of fun.

You know, to pull on the thread a little bit what Riley was speaking to, the diversity amongst our fan base in historic venues, new venues, you know, it's not an easy challenge that NASCAR has to figure out where the dates are. And we have two ownership groups of the tracks. But I just feel like everyone is pulling in the same direction, the growth in sport. And there are a lot of neat concepts being brought forth. One thing that really stood out to me in San Diego was where the activation space was located next to the garage area. You created this really central hub where everyone wanted to be.

And it most ovals, garages in the infield, activations on the outside. You have this departure. You know, so there are a lot of fish to fry and a lot of things to think about. But, you know, what works for us being West Coasters and having a street circuit, which is closer to at least our roots. I know you drove in circles most of your life. That's right. But, you know, it just hits some different emotional elements. But Wilkesboro hits a different emotional element for others and having a good balance of that.

And then taking some common practices to make it a scene. Get everybody closer together. And then I think there's a responsibility for us to, if it's simple and we're going to Martinsville, like let's dress it up and have the best tailgate that we can there. Serve the best hot dogs. Have a bunch of Natty light floating around, whatever it might be. You go to a big market, yeah, sure, it can be a bit more elevated. So it's not a one size fits all thing, but the intentionality to really, you know, cover these bases

and create the best at-track experience is, I think, an early win that our industry can have. And San Diego did that, like no one else. Yeah, it was over-the-top cool in so many different ways. And I'm excited for you guys. I love the approach of kind of breaking it up into doing something different, not just the old NASCAR way. And I'm excited for Riley and your group to be a part of that.

And can't wait to see the progression of the third team and legacy and everything that you guys are doing. So congratulations on the new deal and looking forward to seeing how it all progresses in the future. So thank you guys for taking time to come sit down with us today to let the world know what's going on at Legacy Motor Club. Appreciate everybody. Yeah, we're a young-growing team,

and we can't wait for Riley to start building his legacy with us and go on this journey. So it's going to be a lot of fun. Thank you. Yeah, thanks, Kevin. See you in Daytona.