KFC Radio - CCK Podcast: Bye Bye Baseball & Nate Boyer

Episode Date: June 8, 2020

Nobody knows what is going on in the baseball negotiations. Laura Ingraham does whatever Fox News tells her to do. Jared Carrabis was on The Blaze in 2016. How Tomi Lahren goes viral. Most read blogs at Barstool. Nate Boyer on advising Colin Kaepernick, the perception of kneeling during the anthem as a form of protest, how it is perceived by some people in the military, what the flag represents, and Drew Brees.You can find every episode of this show on Apple Podcasts, Spotify or YouTube. Prime Members can listen ad-free on Amazon Music. For more, visit barstool.link/kfcr

Hey, KFC Radio listeners, you can find every episode of KFC Radio on Apple Podcasts, Spotify, or YouTube. Prime members can listen ad-free on Amazon Music. Kevin! Kevin! Kevin! Kevin! Oh. Kevin! You're just ridiculously stupid. Welcome back! Welcome back! Welcome back! Welcome! Welcome! Welcome! Is this Kevin? Welcome back, welcome back, welcome back. Welcome, welcome, welcome.

Is this Kevin? Welcome back. Oh, yeah, man, how you doing? You good? I know you like that. I know you like that. Come on, you've been back. Welcome, welcome, welcome, welcome.

It's Thursday, June 4th, almost through another week here as summer officially, unofficially begins. It's me, Casey Smith, Jared Karabas. Got a big show for you at 2.30. Joined by pretty much the only guy not named Kaepernick that I really want to hear from when it comes to the kneeling situation and what Drew Brees has stepped in. We got Nate Boyer on at 2. 230, who is the American Green Beret, who also played in the league a little bit,

who wrote letters to and directly worked with Colin Kaepernick and kind of explained why it's okay to protest the way he did and why I want to find out why he thinks the message got lost and all that shit. So pretty big guest. Shout out to Eric Fenton, our series producer, who's been grabbing us all these great guests, but none better than this one right now.

Because aside from Drew Brees himself or Colin Kaepernick himself, I feel like Nate Boyer is the only other dude to listen to right now. So we'll have that at 2.30. Rocket, I just saw your tweet from Jack Flaherty, who said, like, we're not even going to be giving a counter proposal. So I'm getting more and more confident as the days go on that my guess of no baseball this year is going to come true. But I don't know. But like you said, what your previous tweet said. Yeah, your previous tweet said, you know, nobody knows what the fuck's happening. You're hearing good things, bad things, optimism, pessimism, pessimism, you know, lying leverage. It's a dirty,

dirty game. And anybody believing anything they read right now is, is a fool. Joel Sherman tweeted yesterday. I've heard greater pessimism today from folks on both sides, but I will be launching a season that at then at any point. And then Heyman says today, hearing great confidence that there will be baseball this year,

even after players and owners has still been toxic. So I will be honest. If, even after players in order since tailmeat and talks yesterday. Now, I will be honest, if we're picking sides there, that dummy John Heyman has never been right on social media. Plus, he's a Scott Boris puppet, so whatever he's saying is going to be whatever Scott Boris is feeding him. Right. And yeah, there's a lot of posturing going on on both sides. I blogged blogged about it a little bit today, just being like, I, I cited like the Sherman

tweet being pessimism, the Heyman tweet being optimism. And then I was like, well, in the past week or so, I mean, basically the entire quarantine, but more so in the past week, I've talked to players, I've talked to agents and I've talked to baseball executives that are close to owners and nobody is saying the same thing. So, I mean, in terms of like reporters, like what makes you think that a reporter has more information than the players, the, the executives that are close to the owners and then the agents that are working with both sides, like reporters don't know shit. And because everyone is saying something different, all that says to me is that like i'm not gonna

i'm not gonna say that like oh there's there's definitely gonna be no baseball season or wow i'm feeling great about there being a baseball like no one fucking knows like right now nobody knows i was just i was just mixing it up on twitter with laura well not with her but about laura ingraham from fox news and i think we all need to get to the point where we as a collective need to realize that news anchors beat reporters uh writers bloggers like nobody is out here being like unbiased or doing it for you know everybody's become an entertainer everybody is in the clout game everyone's doing it for the followers they're all in the rat race like so the clip has their guy though like like like woes in the nba like woes isn't out there putting shit out there being

like oh this like john hayman tweets every single day and just rewords his tweets and like they may be wrong they may be right and he's just saying the same thing over and over again it's just like baseball has ken rosenthal and jeff pass And then there's a bunch of other fucking people that don't really, that don't really know what they're talking about. The NBA has Woj and it's like everyone else is there. They're looking for a clickbaity headline shit for sure. And you're right that like, it's not,

I would say it's like literally one or two people per sport, per field, per whatever, where you can like count on them. And everybody else is, is in it for for the entertainment for the retweets for the viral videos like whatever like the laura ingraham clip that's going viral of when lebron james spoke up she said just shut up and dribble now drew breeze the clip of her is saying well he deserves to speak his mind and he's a great man and it's

obviously horrendously hypocritical and ignorant and short-sighted and all that. But Laura Ingraham makes 70. She's worth $70 million. She makes $15 million a year. Fox News is going to put whatever the fuck in front of her, and she's going to fucking say it. Because guess what? She's not like a newswoman, journalist, unbiased reporter like my friend Jericho Robinson when it comes to baseball. She is as biased, or i guess maybe not even biased she's just like i don't know do my hair

my makeup press record on the camera and i'll say what the fuck you want the same way that you shouldn't like kirk minahan has his opinions about the freedom fund ellie has her opinions about it no one is is taking anything we say or any of any of the other internet characters or media characters and saying that needs to be 100% gospel. This needs to be true. This needs to be real. This needs to be honest. Like you're going to get opinions from people like us. You're going to get opinions from people on the internet. And even those jobs that we used to think were unbiased and were, you know, all about the truth and what's right and all that shit. They're not. It used to be like, all right, I see you on TV.

Well, you must have been like credible and you must have done your research and I'm going to listen to what you say. Oh, you write for a newspaper. Well, you know, you're more informed than than the average person. I think what we're realizing now with the advent of all this on the Internet, digital, social media, where all the barrier of entries are gone, you're realizing that these people are no more informed or smart or reliable than the average fucking Twitter account. So it's not that I think what Laura Ingraham was saying is good.

It's not that I hate the fact that John Heyman can't be trusted and these guys are all just spouting off whatever they've heard to get their own traction on the internet. But why are we even holding them to that standard anymore? Just realize that everybody's out here. Nobody knows what the fuck they're talking about. Everybody's just trying to grow bigger, larger, more successful, make more money. And with a very rare exception of a very few people, I don't think you can count on any of these people. So stop being outraged when they're hypocritical or they're saying something you don't think you can count on any of these people so stop being outraged when

they're hypocritical or they're saying something you don't like because guess what that's the fucking game man yeah i'm just waiting for reporters to like i was just gonna say like i'm waiting for reporters to report on the actual negotiations like tell me what's actually being said don't speculate on what you think is happening and like the pessimism and the optimism on whatever side, it's like, dude, just fucking give me the facts. I don't care about your opinion because it doesn't really mean anything. Right. But Kevin, with her, it's just so tough. And I mean, I agree with you, but it's like they're entertainers and, you know, you're not going to like tune in, always get the truth on either side of it, whether it's Fox, CNN or anything in between. The hard thing with me with this specific one is that it is a direct

comparison to a black athlete and a white athlete. That's the hard thing. And it's like, whether you agree with it or disagree with it or whatever it is, it's like very difficult when you can literally just put two different clips of the exact same situation, just two different races, and then be like, well, she literally is just being hypocritical because she disagrees with one whether she does or not it's just hard to no i mean swallow absolutely laura ingraham's a shut up fucking asshole don't get me wrong shut up and dribble thing and then all that yeah well he he's a human he has a right to an opinion it's like well yeah it's a shut up and pass true like whichever side you fall on like she should probably keep it consistent with athletes being able to speak out on social justice

issues. For sure. I mean, shut up and dribble is probably just the most condescending and veiled, racist, hateful bullshit you can ever say. That's like when people say boy. Okay, boy. That has a deep racial connotation. Telling another

grown adult to be like, shut up and dribble. Just shut the shut up and dribble just shut the fuck up and do what i say it's like that's you know i'm sure i'm sure people like that have heard that from many different generations if you know what i'm saying but what but my point is we can't or i'm not going to you can do whatever the fuck you want i cannot sit here and get outraged every time you show me a fox News person being hypocritical or contradictory. I cannot sit here when Cuomo on CNN is is making it like into like, look at me. I'm the star bullshit and be like outraged and upset that these became mainstream is the day that you lost any ability.

Again, very, very vast majority lost any ability to keep it real or to keep it unbiased or to keep it to speak like what you've always felt or whatever. It's like people just go with which way the wind. Tommy Lahren was a fucking. I was literally about to say that, you know, a liberal, a liberal website. Right.

And now she's, you know, on the blaze and then Fox news and whatever the fuck she does now being, um, you know, miss, miss conservative. It's like,

who's going to line my pockets the most, who's going to, uh, you know, give me the most attention. What's going to get my career the furthest. I'll just do that. And I fully recognize that.

and like i think here at barstool we all we keep it much more real i don't think you'll see uh like like like people are these these tweets of like this you have been floating around people speak out for the cause and then someone digs up an old tweet and says is this you and it's like contradictory like you can this you the shit out of me if you want to look up prejudice jokes and Al Jazeera jokes and all that kind of shit. Like, yeah, there's going to be definitely times that I was fucking around, that I was being humorous, that I was being edgy because that was one. That's one element of the job we do when shit goes down like this. And it's time to kind of like stop being humorous and stop being sticky and stop being comedic and talk for real.

Well, it's going to sound different. So if you want to come at me and be like, this is contradictory, like, yeah, fine, man, I'm just a blogger. But why are we all of a sudden holding Laura Ingraham to some standard? My point is not that she's like, what she's said is fine. It's absolutely the opposite of that, that she's a trash bag for it. But I'm also not going to sit here and be like, can you believe it? Because guess what?

I can absolutely believe it, whether it's him, whether it's her on Fox News or Cuomo or Cooper or Don Lemon or whoever else on CNN, anybody from those two news sites, if you're trusting them or you're shocked when you can't trust them, you're being a fucking idiot. Yeah, the outrage is definitely something that it's like, well, you know, this was coming like when she said that about LeBron, however many years ago that was, it was like, well, that I I mean, that was shocking at the time. Cause again, shut up and dribble was just so in your face and just so offensive. But you, Tommy Lahren is a perfect example. Like when I see people still getting like outraged with her on Twitter every single time, and she's been doing this for fucking years now, it's like, she's not going to change. She's making millions of dollars

again, whether you think she's sold out or not,'s your own opinion but at the same time it's like that's what she's going to do so don't be outraged you don't have to agree with it and you can obviously have your opinion but why are we acting like it's a surprise that these people are doing on either side it's fox or cnn like that's just the way that it's going to be it's just with laura it's just a little bit tougher because it's a back-to-back clip of the exact same thing i'm not gonna get outraged about it but it's like damn like that's an old takes exposed so fast because it's the exact comparison just completely different races who does uh tommy larren work for now fox she works for fox okay i i remember i i went on the blaze one time with her and she called me Jason you went on the blaze? what?

when did this happen? that would have been what 2016? it was after the Rugnetto-Dore-Jose-Batista fight and they wanted Dave called me and he's like hey

there's this show with this girl that they want it like Dave. Dave called me and he's like, hey, he's like, there's this show with this girl that they want like a baseball person and they asked for us. So do you want to do it? And I was like, yeah, sure. And then I had to like I was I was in the I was in this room. I was in the office at my parents house. And like I had to like call ahead. And like these people like had me rearrange my entire office that I like looked good in the background. And then and then uh and

then she she's like all right jason what's going on um she's like what's what happened in this fight like what's the backstory do you think it's good for baseball and i was like it's jared and uh yeah it was awesome that is so funny on so many levels knowing that like she is not capable of breaking down a baseball feud and you are are on on the blaze makes no fucking sense jason caravans what a yeah that i had like fucking 30 lamps set up in this room they were like having me angle the lights all like a different certain way and like put a blanket over the fucking blinds and do this and that all just jason and just like super boston jared phase too like you would shave ted what were you wearing i need to know what the fuck did you wear

on the blaze probably like gym shorts and like a fucking uh like a tank top no you didn't did you try to wear like you had to throw on boston yeah you had to throw on like a polo or something right uh no i don't think so i don't know i don't remember what i wore but i know i definitely You had to throw on a polo or something, right? No, I don't think so. I don't remember what I wore, but I know I definitely didn't try to dress like I was on fucking CNN. Well, that's a real moment. I didn't even know what the blaze was. Is it a big deal?

Well, I think she kind of made it a big deal, right? Yeah, I think it probably sounds like you got you were on her show before she became like a monster. Like she blew the fuck up, you know? And I mean, yeah, I had no idea who she was when I went on. But that girl so much money. Are we on air still? I don't know. Can anybody hear me? Did we lose Kevin?

I guess we lost Kevin. Yeah, I can hear you guys. This is just so Barstool. Even in the middle of all this shit going on in the world, we still can't keep a radio show on air. It's still Barstool. Love that. I had no idea who she was at the time.

I think we lost Kevin. It's okay. I have no idea who that was. We have. we have done that this is such a shit show shit show I don't know what the hell happened to Kevin he died, Kevin just died

just now on air RIP Kevin the fact that you were on the blaze at any point with Tommy Lahren is very funny question because I genuinely do not know is is the blaze like a political show I'm gonna be honest I I would say yes because the only time I ever saw anything on the blaze was because her she had like this thing it was like final thoughts or afterthought thoughts or something where she ranted about conservative politics and that's kind of what got her on the map and like i said like fox

paid her a fucking bag to go over there so i think it is but i don't know like i i'm not a blaze person the only reason i know what that that whole network is or whatever the fuck it is is because of her yeah i i don't know what happened with her baseball on that like that i have no sense to me that that means i don't know what the blaze is because like when you said that you went on there i was like did they have you come on and like talk about like racial slurs at finway or something like what the hell were you on the blaze that was that was the year after i think and then uh but yeah like they had me come on and talk about that. But I don't know. When I went on to talk with her, I don't recall her being that big of a deal. And then now on Twitter, anytime she tweets something, it goes super viral.

And there's a million replies. And everyone's pissed off at what she says. So I don't know how she just flipped that switch from being a virtual unknown to one of the most polarizing figures on the internet like i don't know how you say outlandish shit that's what you do i mean like people say outlandish shit all the time and it doesn't go super viral like why do people care what she has to say i don't get it i mean it's i think it's the the mixture of she's young in comparison i mean i i don't know how old like all the anchors are on those major news networks. Like she's very young in comparison. I think she's a little bit younger than us, if not our age.

She's also like an attractive blonde. So that's going to get more attention right away. But I think that when you go that polarizing and you start catching steam, like that's going to get you engagement either way. And like Clay Travis is a perfect example of that. Like when I met Clay, he was working for NBC Sports Radio. He was blogging about the SEC on OutKick, had written a couple books about college football and was having a very successful career just kind of covering football. And I know you wrote a book,

Jared. Congratulations. Maybe I should write a book so I can brag about it, too. But then all of a sudden, you know, he goes to Fox and he takes the stand on Twitter that's more conservative, more right wing. And he sticks by that. And now he gets way more attention for his political views than when he was just covering football. Like people like when people talk about Clay Travis now, obviously in the Barstool world, it's like, well, Dave versus Clay. And I mean, that's kind of a non starter at this point anyways, because I feel like that feud is kind of dead because Dave's just so much bigger at this point. But once he started talking about politics and really sticking to that right wing version of it on Twitter, he blew up too, just in a different way. So it's like, if you go outlandish with anything, I mean, look at Alex

Cooper. Like you go outlandish on whatever you're talking about and you go to that far, far extreme on whatever subject you have, you're going to get attention for it. Are we off air again? Is Jared still there or am i by myself yeah my my audio cut out this is what a disaster my god i was like am i about to have to do like some sort of soliloquy like and i can do it i mean everybody knows i can fucking talk but what is going on we need kevin back for Nate Boyer, by the way. For sure. I mean, we can do it. But I mean, what's wrong with Kevin? Should somebody call him and check on him?

Yeah, I think Kevin just disappeared. I think he quit the show live on the air. He's like, I'm done with this shit. I'm over with. That's all right. Whatever. Like I said, you and I have done plenty of radio. I think you and I, the first time I was ever on radio at barstool it was just me and you right yeah we randomly had uh

big casts on as a guest that one time no yeah that was that was later on but i feel like whenever uh before i was on radio at all dan would be like hey can you host you know guest host the yak and then it would just be like me and you half the time and i fucking hate you half the time so it didn't go we can't have that you two can't be alone you guys are like those japanese fighting fish kevin we thought you died i i don't know what happened my whole house like just reset my tv my computer my internet everything just turned on and off so well if it makes you feel any better at one point like jared and i were having a nice conversation about to Lahren.

We started talking about Clay Travis, and all of a sudden, Jared died, too. So I was just like, wait. Oh, shit. Am I the only one on air right now? What's happening? No, they were just silent because I thought I had been cut off. It's been a nice little shit show. What's that clown, Clay Travis, what's he been saying about all this?

I'm sure he's just having a fucking field day. Well, what i was telling because jared was wondering like how tommy larin became so big because and i said well once you flip that switch where you go extreme on anything that you're covering let alone politics like whichever extreme you go to you're going to garner attention for it because it's usually pretty outlandish from like just like a regular down the middle view and he is i mean he's obviously been a big time coronavirus guy that it's not that big of a deal the whole time. I know he and like Hank got into it, but right now it's exactly

what you think. It's more of the right wing side. It's talking about, you know, that police kill more white people. It's, I mean, it's the same narrative that you've been seeing from him, but the whole, my whole point of bringing him up was like, he used to just cover sports. He used to write books about the sec and talk about sports on NBC Sports Radio, which is when I met him. And then all of a sudden you start talking about politics and you mix that in and you do blow up in a different facet. So he's now more known as a politics guy because he took that stand. And he's making more money and more popular. So he's like, do I want to go back to just talking about like, you know, the new defensive scheme Nick Saban's running?

Or do I want to just fucking make money and blow up bigger than ever i i mean i get it i i also think that what happened is when the internet became so interconnected like if you were just a newspaper writer you worked in you know the newspaper department at your local newspaper or whatever the fuck and you were around all those people all day and you wrote your articles and like that was it. And to some extent, you can control your social media. Like I'm just going to follow sports people or music people or whatever. But, you know, through retweets and the way that shit goes viral, all of a sudden you see something political. You see something social. You see something controversial.

And you don't want to like, you know, after how many years of writing football, once you've had like you've scratched that itch, you're like, all right, I want to talk about something new. And, you know, this is what I'm seeing is popular or controversial at the moment. So let me comment on this. And then you get like way more interaction than ever. And you comment on it again and then you write a blog and it's your most read blog ever. And, you know, all of a sudden it's like, well, this this is what people this is the new, you know, it's like porn for these people. So I get what is your most red blog ever, Kevin? Oh, probably all just like shit where I had to address all my personal nonsense, which is another point.

It's like, you know, like the deep, the deep gossip is like, there's a reason why people love all the behind the scenes stuff of Barstool. There's a reason why people want to know all about my drama. There's, you know, everybody likes the content but what really gets them going is when there's inter-barstool drama right and that's like you know that's that's our version of politics and our version of gossip and when you can do it on a national scale people are going to engage in that and they're going to fucking love it i find it i find it exhausting like this week or what are we at like 10 days now i don't want to do this anymore

like especially you go from radio to rundown to podcast to other podcasts to write a blog and it's like i'm talking about nothing but like a heavy heavy deep controversial issues walking on eggshells and i'm like god damn this sucks but then i think about you know what sucks more than having to talk about this, having to fucking live it. So I'm going to stop complaining about how it's hard for me to navigate difficult conversations because I don't ever have to navigate

the difficult realities of those conversations. I just have to deal with talking about it. But it's way worse to have to live it. But I mean, you know, my most read blog, aside from that, would, I mean, my most read blog aside from that would, I mean, I know people's favorite blogs of mine, but most read was probably, if I had to guess, like the Jamie O'Grady Al Jazeera Al Qaeda Cauldron response blog when I applied to that hit piece. That had to be anything. Again, anything that's not personal related to me that I was writing

just about other topics would probably have to be that or at least some other hit piece response type of thing. Again, that's what people... People love the fighting. They love the drama. I think my most read blog was one sentence. It was just like there was some smoke show behind home plate at an astros game and i did like a send out the smoke patrol

blog and then like posted pictures from her instagram and it was literally one sentence and it got like a that'll do it hundreds of thousands of views yeah yeah i'll do it i i would have to guess three thousand words on several blogs. Right, and nobody gives a fuck. That is something that when you first start working at Barstool, and I mean, especially because I had never really blogged before, and I'm sitting there like, okay, I'm going to start blogging here and there, and it's like I'm going to write about sports stories, and then very quickly found out, that's not people.

Some people will read it. Some people will dive into it. They want to hear, I mean, when I write about Paige Brannick, that pops the fuck off. They want to that my most read blog at least that i think from what keith has told me it was when i turned 30 and i dived into like my life and like why i fell in love with boston and like my struggles you know as a as a girl in her 20s and i was like oh people actually like want to relate to us in different ways and also look at hot chicks so it makes sense well i i feel like it's one feel like it's either like the most simplistic blog or the most complex

blog is what's going to get the people going. And it's the hard work in between that, like nobody gives a fuck about, which is funny. It's like, I either just posted like a picture of this girl's ass or I poured my heart out and like explained every decision I've ever made to you. But you know,

everything I've ever said about the Mets, everything I've ever said about stand-up comedy or my favorite TV shows, people are just like, save it. I think I'm just going to start a new blog series called Daily Titties. Probably not the best thing to do at this current moment, but maybe wait for a little bit. It is interesting to think

about how much the game has changed, even in just my short... It's not short but like 10 years also isn't like a a generation's worth of of like experience but you know i i used to have just like zero care zero concern for backlash for response and and i still really I don't have like a concern for it, but I definitely have the logic of like, if I do this, if I press publish on this, there goes like the next 48 hours for me. You know, it's like, it's going to be a shit show

and it's going to be, I got to defend it and explain it. And you know what? I'm just not into it this time. So I don't do it. Where back in the day, maybe it was because of how big we were. I think it was like the perfect storm of getting larger and being on like a national scale at the same point that you know shit just popped off socially economically politically whatever but man the glory days

used to just be like say what i want post what i want you could do tits you could do controversy you could do racist jokes you could do prejudice jokes you could make fun of yourself you could make fun of it doesn't you know and it was just like people are just gonna laugh or not laugh but not say anything and now you know daily titties.com by jason caravas is probably gonna get ripped to fucking shreds you know well subscribe to my newsletters jason.caravas.gmail.com daily titties let's go but we talked about this on Tuesday with like the Blackout Tuesday thing. It was like when people were posting like normal ass things. Like that's not like that.

It's like you can't for a while. It's like you can't blog certain things. Like things have changed. And now, and I'm sure you guys are feeling it. And it will go back to normal because social media go back to normal. But like I created for the first time ever a close friends list on Instagram because I wanted to post something that like I'm doing in my normal ass life. And I was like, I don't feel, I feel completely insensitive posting something on Instagram to like all of my followers when they're like all this shit's going on, like life is still going on elsewhere. So it's like, now we're having to kind of straddle the

line of like, well, do we share our content? Do we not share our content? Like if you post something that's not about what's going on in the country, are you being insensitive or, you know, it's just a line that I don't think anybody really has that answer. Yeah, I think it's it's a very tough line to, you know, for yourself to say, I don't want to be insensitive, but also to be like, I don't want to get, you know, roasted and like. Right. Based for just posting like a picture with me and my family. But then I understand the other side where people are saying, you know, you just saying I'm going to escape, quote unquote, escape, or I'm going to choose to, you know, whatever, like stay out of things like that's also when everybody does that. That's when the problem is, you know, exactly. That's what I think. There's there's like a

middle ground on that, too. So for like we put out a new episode of Unnecessary Roughness today and Brandon, you know, I know he was on the rundown with you guys talking about his feelings he's obviously been on the yak with dan i've been on here i've vlogged about it and he just said hey listen we know that shit is crazy right now and it's a horrible time in the country but for the next hour like we're just going to kick back and we're going to talk about college football and if you want to go hear our thoughts like they're they're on air they're on the blog they're on the rundown but like just for a little bit, like let's escape it. And I completely agreed with it. And then afterwards, like that little tiny part of my brain was like, shit, is that going to

catch some backlash? And then you see people on Twitter today that are responding to us like, thank you. Like just for an hour, it was nice to quote escape. You're not ignoring it when you escape. If you do try to ignore it, that's the problem. But there is like an element out there where it's like you said, like everything is so so heavy, and we're still putting out content that people want to consume without being depressed every single second that they listen to it. It's a fine-ass line. It's a fine line. You don't want to ignore it at all, but you also don't want to spend – I don't know. I don't know the answer.

Yeah, yeah. To sum up here before we hit our break nobody knows fucking anything the only thing that i do know for a fact is that nate nate boyer green beret can tell you what you're allowed to do and what you're not allowed to do when it comes to the flag and the country so after the break we're going to talk to him about the kaepernick situation the drew brees situation i can't believe we're doing colin kaepernick drama again it's crazy let's hit a break we'll be back father's is almost here. Don't get your dad a shitty gift. Don't get him power tool. Don't get him something that he has to do more work with. Just get him some comfortable

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It's Grammarly.com slash KFC. All right, we're back. It's me, Jared and Casey. And we are now joined by American Green Beret, Nate Boyer, who has been a huge part of trying to explain this whole process to people who seemingly can't wrap their minds around it. So any color you can paint for us here, we appreciate. Thanks for joining us, Nate. Yeah, of course. Thanks for having me.

So I feel it's kind of crazy that we're stirring this all back up again. Obviously, Drew Brees, I think, probably regrets a couple comments he made. But I think my question for you, whether it's now or then, what do you think is the general problem where people are saying it's disrespect for the flag? When someone like yourself, who is like the most qualified guy to talk on this, is saying like, no, you know what? I talked to him. We wrote the letter. We hung out. And I explained my side. He explained his side. And this is the like, no, you know what? I talked to him. We wrote the letter, we hung out and I explained my side. He explained his side and this is the right way to do it. Why can't people understand that?

Well, I mean, it comes down to intent and perception, you know, and, and everybody has the right to, you know, to, to their perception. Why the way that they perceive things, you know, no matter how, no matter what Colin's intent, uh doesn't get to choose how people perceive things. He doesn't. We all perceive things a different way. And so I understand why some people may see that as disrespectful. They have every right to feel that way.

But someone like Drew's position, I think he knows that now. He's written the apology and like, he knows the last thing he was doing was fracture the team, the city of New Orleans. I mean, he's done so much. He's such a good guy. He's done so much for the community post Katrina.

He's got, he's done a lot in the activism space. I mean, he helped secure voting rights for formerly incarcerated people in Louisiana. It's a huge deal. And so, um, I, the problem with it is

that that is not, you know, Colin Kaepernick or anybody else that's dealing with, to my knowledge, their intent was not to show disrespect to the flag or the country or the military in any way. And, you know, when I met with Colin and spoke with him, uh, back in 2016, initially he was sitting on the bench protesting. And to me, that wasn't the most inspiring thing in the world because it didn't look like, he looked like he was kind of sitting things out. I understand what it was, but it just didn't seem. So, you know, he read my open letter to him and he hit me up and he wanted to meet. And we sat down and talked and through our conversation,

you know, I suggested if he wasn't going to stand, that maybe kneeling, um, would be, uh, more powerful and maybe more of a sign of respect that you're actually there and you listen. And, and he took that and, and he agreed and he ended up kneeling, you know, which was a form of like a middle ground almost. Um, so I think that that's important to understand, you know, from Collins's perspective, whether you agree with him or not, there's plenty of things he said and done that I don't agree with. But I respect his right. That's the right I fought for, freedom to express yourself and the freedom of speech, the First Amendment, the Constitution.

That's the oath I took to defend all that. Now, when you say you and I totally understand what you're saying, that like sitting kind of looks like you're just not paying attention and it's lazy versus like, no, I acknowledge what's happening. I'm just choosing to make my own statement. Was that like your own idea or is that like, is there some sort of protocol or you just kind of came up with a feeling on your own? Yeah, not, not a, not a protocol. Um, just a, a thought that I had and I don't speak for the obvious, clearly I don't speak for the military or speak for the veteran community or speak for anybody except for myself. That was just, he asked me what I thought and I told him, this is how I feel.

This is what I think. I didn't say in any way, and I never would that like, oh no, in the military kneeling during the anthem or kneeling at any time is a sign of respect. I just don't think it's a sign of disrespect. Right. Okay. And so when I think of kneeling as a gesture in general, people take a knee to pray, to propose to their wives. Right. And in the middle, and you know, if we go to Arlington, it's respectful to take a knee in front of a fallen soldier's grave to pay respects, you know, but I, but I, but I understand why people sometimes come to fulfill. It's a blatant disrespect for the country. Uh, when he does that, that's, they're entitled to that feeling. They just have to understand that's not what his intent is.

Of course, you're right when you say that. Everybody, they have their own perception, you have your own thoughts. But also part of me is like, when there's a guy like you who knows this shit and is probably more qualified to speak on it and probably writes when you're wrong, don't you think that they're not... Part of me feels like they're not entitled to do or to think that when someone like yourself who is qualified to speak on it is saying the opposite of that. Well, there's plenty, I will say this, there's plenty of people that wear the same uniform as I do that feel differently than I do. Got it.

You know what I mean? Yeah. So I got to respect that too. I mean, and there's people that sacrifice a lot more than me and when I think of a family too you know when when a guy comes back in a wooden box draping an American flag dude it it hits you in a different way so when I go back and watch what Drew said and I listen to it and I hear him say the emotions and the feeling he has when the anthem is played I feel all those same things so I I get that. I totally get that. But that's just because him and I both feel that and many others do too. It doesn't mean it's the only feeling that,

that everybody should just have that feeling when they hear the song or see the, you know, see the slide go up. Not everybody has that connection, whether you're military or not. There's people, there's people in the military that served. I don't feel like that. They don't feel like it represents them in the way it should. So, you know, got to take all those experiences into account when we think about this. Right.

We had Arian Foster on a different one of our podcasts on the network, and he said, you know, when you look at the flag and you have that wave of emotion and pride and all that for America, like, I don't. That's not what I feel about this country. And that's, I think, where the disconnect is. I guess I was interested to know how many people, or like the general, if you're generalizing, the rest of your military friends and colleagues or whatever, do you think it's more support, or do they believe it's disrespect?

True. That's a tough one. I don't think more of them believe it's disrespect? That's a tough one. I don't think more of them believe it's disrespect necessarily, but it doesn't mean all of them agree that that's the best way. There's a lot of people, a big percentage, and I don't know what numbers are, but a big percentage in my experience

are people that I served with that say, I don't agree with that method, but I respect it. It is right. You know what I mean? And they don't agree with that method, but I respect it. It's his right. You know what I mean? And so it's like, and they don't necessarily feel disrespected. They just feel like maybe he could do something a different way. And that's their choice and that's their feeling. And I get it.

And like, and I felt that too. It's not that I don't, now that I'm just like all in on like, you know, if you don't feel a certain way about the, you know, the, the, the country and how the flag and anthem maybe represents who we are. I don't, I'm not saying that you should kneel. You know what I'm saying? I'm not saying that because what's more important than all this crap is the actions taken and what's being done.

That's the most important thing. Right. So, so to me, you know, I mean, it's, it's like we, we, we, we get hung up a bit on the, on the gestures and they're powerful gestures, you know. But what's more important is the narrative behind it, why he was doing it in the first place. He was protesting social injustice, racial inequality, and, you know, police brutality, not holding ourselves accountable when things happen. And we're starting to see that, you know, just this week, we're seeing it have its effect and things being turned around and cases being reexamined. That was his intent. That was his purpose all along.

Right. I feel like I was kind of encouraged this time around, at least for what I see on the Internet, which I know is sometimes you follow like-minded people and things kind of become an echo chamber of similar thoughts. But I feel like this time around, the reaction was more like a lot of people were saying, dude, he didn't mean it as disrespect. And I think like a lot more people got it this time around as, as far as like, even if you don't like it, that he was not trying to be a dick. He was not trying to disrespect your father or grandfather who fought.

And I thought that was like somewhat encouraging that at least this time around people cut right to the chase. You know, this is what he was doing. Well, also, you know, in context, when people are looking at what's been happening over this last week and, you know, the majority of peaceful protests and people coming together and even cops, you know, taking the knee out of respect for nine, you know, nine plus minutes in honor of, uh, of George Floyd. Right. And, uh, and, you know, and then looking at the, the kind of bizarreness of the fact that the only disrespectful knee I've maybe ever seen is the one that was taken on George Floyd's neck. Well said. And then, you know, and then we, at, you know, we look at when people are looking at in context of like, you know, the bullshit, man, the looting and the, you know, some of

the violent stuff that's gone on, like that's awful. But then they also are seeing, a lot of people are seeing, you know, the violence from law enforcement during these, during the peaceful protests, even like that's not okay. With all that in context, and now they look back at colin and that mean they're like oh yeah that's that's pretty uh that's pretty that's a pretty mellow response that's a pretty peaceful way to you know to say yeah i i think i want you to do better it's almost like uh we needed to be shown how bad things can get from like the wrong form of protest to retroactively say, well,

shit, what Colin doing was doing isn't too bad. Like, I wish we could go back to that, but I think it was, it's almost like when, when times are good and you know, you got champagne problems,

like we're talking about, uh, the flag and not, you know, not to say it's, it's not a, uh, important issue to respect the flag and the country.

But when we're talking about, you know, songs before a football game and, and like a piece of cloth versus like what was going on now and life and death and rioting and protesting, I think that maybe this time around you get some perspective on why it was the right way to do things, why he was actually right all along is because you see the people who are doing

it very wrong now and how much more detrimental that can be. Right. And I don't want to get into a, you know, I don't want it to be turned into a right and wrong thing because that's that to me, that's that's one of our biggest issues as a society is that we're very we're very binary right now, you know, and it's not it's not that it's right to me. It's not that it's right or wrong. It's just that we've got to respect differences. You have to agree with them. We have to respect them if they're done peacefully and if they're, and if the intent behind them is ultimately a good thing, you know,

I would say that the, when I'm speaking about right or wrong, I mean more of the extremes of the situation, the way that the cops, the violent cops are handling it, the way the violent protesters are handling that we can definitely say is right or wrong. So just to go back to when— I do want to say this real quick, too, as it pertains to the— because I do understand that statement as well, like when we talk about a piece of cloth. But it is definitely more than that.

No, of course. I don't want to come across disrespectful at all. Yeah, I know. I know. I'm not trying to call you out, man. I just want to clear things up because there's a lot of people that there's a lot of people that, that kind of feel that way. And I see that, I see that used a lot in, in argument and I, and it's kind of a tough, it's sometimes it's tough for me to weigh in on that. Cause I don't want to like, I'm not trying to minimize, um, you know, the protest, minimize what people are doing, um, that they feel convicted in. But like, also like, there's gotta be that mutual understanding of like, you know, to a lot of people taking that mean means a lot to a lot of people.

It's not, it's so much more than a piece of cloth, you know, especially if it's been, if it's been folded up and handed to you because you've lost a loved one, you know, that's course. I think that what, what always kind of like sat well with me was when you heard Colin Kaepernick talk about it, you could tell he wasn't just like willy nilly doing it. You know, he was very well versed on this and very well informed from not only the police brutality down to speaking to you and learning how to do it right. You know, if I got the feeling that it was just like an asshole athlete who's just like stirring the pot, you know, fuck that. But when it's done the right way and done, you know, with the right intent, like you

said, everybody should kind of understand those things. When it first happened, were you surprised by like just how big it got? Obviously, it was going to be controversial. Of course, something like this from an athlete of his caliber. But when it took on like this insane life of its own where it was part of you like holy shit what is what have i gotten myself into here yeah i was definitely surprised but now when i look back at it you know almost four years later absolutely not surprised at all i knew we were in a lot of ways we were already you know pretty divided getting pulled apart at the scenes which

is frustrated for a lot of us that served in the military because we want our country to be united. You know, we want, we want peace. We want to come back from war and feel like, uh, not only like our services appreciated. And I know that that is, I know that people say that to me all the time and a lot of us all the time, but also like it's reflected in our country and the way that we treat each other. Right.

That's, you know, that's disheartening to a lot of us, no matter where you stand politically, you know, that stuff. And it was like, it was also this time, you know, back then, I think to speak on Colin and I don't know Colin super well, man, we, we've, we, we kept in touch for, you know, for a good year after the fact and all that, but there was plenty of things that he did and said that I, I don't agree with, you know, I don't, I don't think that, uh, or things that he wore, you know, or saying like,

um, you know, I don't want to, I'm not going to vote and here's why, because, you know, in my opinion, there's, you know, that is a, that is a number one way that you really do change things. You know what I mean? As you organize in that way. Um, so there's plenty, there's plenty out there that, that we don't, that we don't see eye to eye. And I'm sure he's got plenty of things I've said and done, uh, or that I stand for the way that I represent that, that he wishes I would say it differently or, or think about it differently. And, uh, but that's just who we are. I mean, we're all different.

We don't have to all align on those things. We just gotta, gotta be more respectful. Right. Respect is the number one thing here. Have you talked to Drew at all? Or do you plan on talking to Drew at all? No, I haven't. And I totally would, man.

Because like I said, Drew is a really good dude. And I genuinely believe he does regret saying that. He doesn't regret what he does when the anthem is played. And I don't regret that either. No one should ever apologize for being patriotic. It's not a bad thing, but it's just an understanding that what Colin did to a lot of people

is patriotic as well. You know what I mean? I think Drew knew that. I'd love to talk to him. He's a solid dude. He does so much. I think what hurts is he is a good dude, and he is active, and in a lot of ways embodies what's right. But I think people feel like, damn, even this dude is saying something that feels so undermining to the point we're trying to make right now. And it's like, we know your grandfather fought, and Colin, that's not what the fuck he's talking about and also by the

way right now what's going on it's it's it's like your message even though you don't intend it to sound this way it's coming across as undermining like what we're trying to do right now and i feel like that's got to be where he woke up this morning it was kind of like oh shit i've you know i i don't think he feels he's the reaction was so overwhelming from a lot of people that are big, big supporters of Drew's and fans of him, you know, and teammates. And like, you know, that had to have an impact, you know. I know if he could do it again, he'd change it. And that's all that matters to me at this point. Like, you can't go back and change the past.

It's not like he was saying or doing anything overtly racist because he's not that type of person, as far as my knowledge goes. You know, it just was it was insensitive at the time. And, you know, hopefully we can just move forward with this and it'll bring us even more together, bring that team more together. Well, right. The last question before I let you go, because you've already given us a lot of great stuff from a football point of view and even, you know, from an army point of view where you're talking about brotherhood,nity locker rooms is this something that you feel is like going to be a problem for the saints and and drew with his black teammates or is this something that you think you know everybody can kind of get on the same page quickly on of any nfl city an nfl team i'd say the saints are the most resilient

you know and uh and sean payton's great coach he's a great guy and he you know, and, uh, and Sean Payton is a great coach. He's a great guy. And he, you know, speaking of veterans and athletes, he's been a part of our, our charity MVP, uh, merging vets and players, bringing together former professional athletes and combat vets and helping them find purpose together and unity and all this. I just know like with the way that community is, um, I'm confident if that were to happen to any place for them to rally around this and find more of a common ground and more unity and get closer through all this, it's that place. And so I have confidence in that. You know, I really do. I mean, Drew started from such a great place.

It's not like he's just some young rookie flapping his gums and doesn't really have a leg to stand on here. Right. Well, which is why, hopefully, as continues here, he'll issue the apology. But I think as he talks more, hopefully being like one of the leaders of the league, it'll kind of carry some more weight and some quality discussion. And like you said, hopefully we all come out of it a little bit better and a little more respectful. Nate, thank you so, so much.

This is really great stuff and well-spoken and great insight as always. And thank you for your service and thank you for your time. Awesome. Thank you, brother. Have a good one. That is Nate Boyer, American Green Beret, former NFL player. I feel like that quote in the middle there, the only disrespectful knee I've ever seen is on George Floyd's neck, sums it up. Although I will say, I don't think I realized that

that was kind of just Nate Boyer's, like, idea. I thought it was a little more like, here's what you do when you're trying to, like, here's some certain things you do during the anthem. And so I can understand a little more now than I did prior to that interview why there are still people who are like, well, that's not what I feel.

Because that was just a feeling of Nate Boyer's. I thought it was more like, this is, you know, our Army protocol or what you're supposed to do. So it's interesting to shed, you know, everybody knows where I stand on this issue, but to shed light on the other side, I kind of get why there's other veterans, other active servicemen and women and other just, you know, people who feel like, well, I disagree with that. Yeah, I mean, he said it perfectly, like in the first answer that he gave you was that he's not speaking for all veterans. He's not speaking for all people in his position. He's saying for him and knowing Colin Kaepernick's intent for what he was doing, that he was okay with it. And that's why that conversation even happened. And I feel like that's kind of the struggle with, you know,

when the first time that the Colin Kaepernick stuff even came up and all the arguments are happening on radio and TV, it was like you had to have one stance or the other. It was either you didn't think it was disrespectful or you did think it was. And there wasn't really anywhere in between for conversation. But the fact that he said it's the intent behind it. And that's, I think, what is so tough for people right now to sit back and be like, oh, well, if he didn't intend to be disrespectful towards the military, then can I open my mind up a little bit more to why he did it? And Nate Boyer is also saying there are a lot of people that aren't going to. I mean, my grandmother still sleeps with my grandfather's flag that was on his coffin because he was he's a veteran, you know, like she still sleeps with it on his pillow every single day since he's passed away. So there's obviously going to be people who see it differently. But again, it comes down to intent. And if Nate Boyer believed Colin Kaepernick wasn't being intently disrespectful to the military, then that's why he agrees with it.

You know what I think is so fascinating about a guy like that real quick, Jared, is like, I think anybody from Nate to Brandon Newman to anybody I've talked to on this matter, it's always the level headed, rational people who say something like, I'm not speaking for all whatever. I'm not speaking for all black people. I'm not speaking for all veterans. I'm not speaking for all anything. And, like, that, you can almost tell, like, okay, you're going to be a reasonable person if you know that. Because it's everybody else who feels like they're right, they're the authority, and what they're saying is the only thing that matters matters that it's almost undoubtedly going to be those people whose opinions are stupid.

Yeah, I was going to say, like, I kind of go back now and look at the the Colin Kaepernick videos of him just explaining why he was doing what he was doing. And I almost cringe because, like, just the the negative connotation that was around it. But then when you just listen to him speak about like hey this is why i'm doing what i'm doing and it's like it makes it clear as day it's so simple it makes so much sense and then like they were people were putting words in his mouth like people were just straight up putting words in his mouth and that's right doing what he was i think that's where the racial shit starts to happen like if a white guy did that i think there'd be a lot of white america who's just like all right i'm willing to listen to this guy.

And there were people who made up their mind and looked at the image. That's why the bill thing was so perfect. Yes. Yes. And you know, bill, bill, bill Burr,

the clip he's talking about where, you know, people are screaming and yelling and he's saying, yeah, but that's not what he was talking about. And it's crazy that just listening to a very simple explanation is what people aren't willing to do. and, and this is where I almost got, I got, I almost got myself in trouble and got very scared when Nate Boyer was Just listening to a very simple explanation is what people aren't willing to do.

And this is where I almost got myself in trouble and got very scared when Nate Boyer was correcting me about the flag being a cloth. I was like, oh, boy, I've stepped in it again. But what I was saying was there are people who I don't think are thinking about what's behind it and what the cause and the meaning behind it. And to them, they're just like, this is a flag. This is what you're supposed to do to it. That's all that matters. It's a symbol. When that cloth is up, you do this. And it's like, no, I'm thinking critically about this. Why can't you? Well, and Nate did allude to this. You know, he said he didn't agree with every single thing that Kaepernick did. So like when we're talking

about him just taking a knee for the anthem, you know, that's one thing. And like, that makes sense why he was doing that. But there were other things that, you know, people have problems with, like when he wore the socks that had like the pig cops on it. And there are more things that came after it. So it's like you take just the kneeling in front of the anthem and you hear what Nate Boyer is saying in those conversations. And yes, but I do think that there were people that were looking at the other things that he was doing, which he obviously has the right to express his opinion peacefully, which is what he was doing. And then that's when they kind of draw the line and be like, OK, he feels this way about cops then this is why he's kneeling in front of the

flag and that's where the intent kind of gets lost and i feel like that conversation is going to go on forever and ever because here we are in 2020 still talking never it'll never end and i love to by the way as we wrap up here he kind of touched upon it but there definitely had to be a vibe when like a weekend and this thing was like a national fiasco that Nate Boyer was like, oh, fuck. Like, you know, his friends and family was like, you had to go write that guy a letter, didn't you? You had to be insert yourself into the biggest goddamn controversy in the world. But that's why he's who he is. That's why he's a Green Beret.

And that's why he's better than most of us, because he's willing to do that kind of stuff for the right cause. That's it for us. Chicago's up next. Stay home, stay hot. See you tomorrow.