Upstream - Episode 28: The Bourne Identity

Episode Date: March 16, 2022

So we're only one episode away from finally killing James Bond- permit us to savour it. In order to make sure we can do No Time To Die as a live show we decided to take a quick Sojourn to kill Jason Bourne. The Bourne identity introduces us to a man raised by fishermen, a man with no memory of his past but in possession of a set of incredible skills.... Join us as we unravel the mystery of just who this man is- oh hold on the third scene in the movie is a cutaway scene to the CIA where they explain exactly who he is in no uncertain terms. Ah, Find bonus episodes at our reasonably-priced patreon! https://www.patreon.com/killjamesbond   MERCH ALERT Pre-orders are open until midnight on the 15th of March for the KJB The Movie poster and t-shirt, both designed by https://twitter.com/MiaCain2001! You can get the Poster here: https://killjamesbond.com/store/p/kjb-movie-poster… The Shirt here: https://killjamesbond.com/store/p/kjb-movie-shirt… Or save five quid by grabbing the pre-order exclusive bundle here! https://killjamesbond.com/store/p/kjb-movie-bundle *WEB DESIGN ALERT*  Tom Allen is a friend of the show (and the designer behind our website). If you need web design help, reach out to him here:  https://www.tomallen.media/   Find us at https://killjamesbond.com and https://twitter.com/killjamesbond

Wait a bloody second. If you are listening to this on the day of release, that means you have less than 24 hours to pre-order, the shirt, or the poster, or the shirt and poster combo. Let's you save for five. We're going to mention in the episode, the live show a couple of times, I think it's already sold out by this point. My deepest apologies, we underestimated demand and the venue we booked was simply too small to allow everyone who wanted to attend. So those are sold out, I'm ever so sorry, but you can absolutely

still buy a shirt. I will be ordering them on the 17th, so you have to get those orders in before midnight GMT on the 16th of March All right enjoy the fucking hot Jesus Christ it's Jason born Hello and welcome to another episode of Kill Jason Born. I guess we're in a transitional phase in this podcast. Because we are, baby. We're on the cusp, we're on the cusp of killing the coward James Bond and doing something new and emerging from our sort of bond chrysalis. But in the meantime, until the live show, when we can finally do that, we're going to have to do something else.

And I thought, what's a useful counterpoint to James Bond, other than the 2000s, slightly grittier, slightly thinkier series, Jason Bond, beginning at fours. Yeah, we're on our little mid season break, you know, we're on a little soldier, a little soj born, absolutely, a soj born. And we begin. And we should put the live show again, like now, because I guarantee that there will be a lot of people who didn't listen all the way through the podcast

last time. No, it would be a sold out. Eighth of April, but some time of size. On the eighth of April. On the eighth of April. On the eighth of April. By the time this is out. It's sold out, sorry.

There will be a live show. All of us will be at it. We will kill James Bondan. You can help. Yeah, no, I still sold out. Yeah, I mentioned it on TV while ago. And everyone was like, what? Because you can't listen to the whole podcast. You've got to listen to all of it. You have to. The end master is not just admin. But we begin with the so-ge-born identity. The first one of these came out 2002. They made this, well they were in the process of

making this pre-911, the original release that was 7th of September. And then for reasons, they pushed it back a bit to the point where I came out in 2002. So this is like technically a post-911 movie, but spiritually a pre-911 movie. And this is going to like explain a few things about it I think. But we begin with very little fanfare. You don't even get like the noise over the studio logos. We begin in the Mediterranean south of Marseille where a few guys, some fishermen are doing... I want to do it. Yeah, they're doing the ultimate fisherman activity, which is getting absolutely filthy and playing cards with your boys in like a heaving sea. And one of them goes out for, I guess, to maybe do some fishing. He's remembered what his job is. And he sees like what he thinks is a dead body floating

in the sea with a little like flashing strobe marker on it. So they haul that guy aboard and it's none other than wet Matt Damon. A very young Matt Damon. He looks very, very boyish. A very, very baby. Yeah. A little infant, the infant Matt Damon is delivered onto a fishing boat. Yeah. Absolutely.

He says cute can guy. And they love all Matt Damon. So what they do with wet Damon is they don't like call the coast guard or anything. They just sort of want a table. What, wet Damon? No, they should have called somebody. I'm surprised they didn't know you've said that. I'm like, why didn't they do that? Yeah, I've identified, this is the problem with some of these.

You can identify plot holes in it very easily and like pick it apart. I don't really want to do that, but you can't help it sometimes. Fishiman very much have the sort of wolf instinct where if they find an abandoned boy, they will just adopt him. Yeah, he was raised by fishermen. It's my fishermen. It's what the ways of the sea. He really is, because they nurse him back to health and they teach him their ways.

Because they think he's dead. He twitches a bit and they realize he's not. And there, I guess 19th century ships doctor decides to do some surgery on him. Takes two bullets out of his back. And then a little like canister out of his hip. Yeah, he's got got a little capsule thing. And the fisherman surgeon presses a button on this capsule and it projects an address in Zurich and a numbered bank account, which is like straight away insanely cool. Yeah, it's a great concy.

It's fucking sick. Yeah, it's so good. Also, I will point out the second thing that he does with this, having realized that it shines a little laser light is to shine it directly into his own eye. Nice. He sees when it lights up, points it straight into his own eye and goes, oh, fuck.

And then puts it and shines it on the wall. So yeah, and then attacks. Where Damon attacks him, he like attacks him. He wants to know who he is, where he is. He doesn't have any memory. Because this is his name. No, he has amnesia and he's just been found like this. And so what happens is that they do just raise him as their own. They give him the fishermen ensemble of like extremely gross cable net sweater and like big, big, worst-proof pants. And he just fishes for a bit until they get back into, I'm not even sure whether it's sweater, and like, oh yeah, very, very, very, this proof pants. And then he just, he just fishes for a bit

until they get back into, I'm not even sure whether it's Italy or France, but like Europe generally. Sadly, however, before they get back, the film immediately like ruins the most interesting thing about it. Because this is like a great set up for a mystery is like this guy has to go on and discover who he is. And like, it would be a very,

very interesting mystery. We're not for the fact that as soon as he passes out again having had the bullets taken out, we cut to CIA headquarters in Langley. And somebody goes, somebody reports into that. I have the drop mission failed. Yeah. So immediately, what's this interesting question of like, oh, who is this guy? Then it's immediately answered by aries, C.I. He's a C.I. guy. He should have left that out. Jason Bourne. Yeah, absolutely. Also, more like the CRT given all the fucking monitors they have.

Yeah, I made a note on monitors. Nice, very cool. It's so, so dated. It's weird, right? Because a lot of this, this movie is like meant to seem modern. And it's 20 years ago. And a lot of this shit doesn't exist anymore and it just made me feel very old. But the guy who who hears that the mission has failed is gonna be our kind of

villain. One of the villains for this show. He's he's not named in the thing. He's named in the credits as Conklin. He's Chris Cooper. And if you know the actor Chris Cooper, you know that he loves this kind of role. Yeah, he's the American Alan Rickman. He's exactly, exactly. I don't play villains, I play very interesting people. Um, so yeah, the guy who's wet daemon gets into, I guess, Italy, I guess. Yeah. And the fisherman who have raised him, his fish parents, have had a whip round to give him enough money to get to Switzerland so that he can investigate what's in this game.

So nice. So nice. So nice. Yeah. So nice. Yeah. So nice. Yeah. So nice.

Yeah. So nice. Yeah. So nice. Yeah. So nice. Yeah. So nice. Yeah. So nice. Yeah. So nice. Yeah. fishing boat and they're like you you you awesome go to the world and always represent the values

of the SS mermaid that we're what we don't even remember. Always represent the values of the SS. So remember the ways of the fish. So he so he immediately forgets the ways of the fishermen and gets on a TGV to Zurich. He's using the power of editing because we see that he has retained some skills like he speaks French and German and he knows how to tie knots But he doesn't know his name or his backstory and he also has gained the superpower of disappearing using a white edit So this is something he does so much. Yes, something goes across the camera and then Jason born disappears behind it and like, ah, yes That's editing. I count four instances of this. And it's meant to be like, he's like a ghost, he's invisible at it's like.

Just looks like a bad cut. Yeah, it looks like a bad cut. All you imagine that the thing moving in front of the screen is like he's just sprinting behind it to stay out of the crouching behind it. I thought it was in the steak the first time. It's like, fuck. So he gets on a TV. He always knew, like, oh fuck, I've got a lot of fun in there. I've got to be honest in the steak the first time. I was like, what the fuck? So he gets on a TV.

He always would be like, oh fuck, we've lost it. They ain't. So he gets on a TGV to Zurich where he sleeps on a park bench. And because I guess the fish money didn't stretch to like, a hostel or anything. And the two most comically accented Swiss cops come and try to give him a hard time over it. They like try to move him on. They ask him for his ID. He doesn't have any ID. He's got amnesia.

So at this point, they try to arrest him. And I mentioned in the text of the episode of a mode. Yeah. A guy kicking people's asses and not knowing how he's doing it and looking horrified is always fun to me. And this is a prime example of that because he just grabs both of them and puts them in the hospital very efficiently. He just fucking dismantles these two guys. He said it looks so, he ends it like holding a gun and you can see him look down at the gun go, oh the fuck, oh, oh, yeah, and then he puts the gun in the bin, which is a nice touch. He's like, I don't know. He doesn't put this one in the bin.

This is the first of two guns that he throws away. This one, he drops it. He perfectly, he perfectly field strips. He takes the slide off the top and then just leaves it. And it's good, that's an efficient way of being like, oh, this guy is like somehow very familiar with firearms, but he's also horrified at them. Yeah, a very interesting question

that would be quite intriguing, where it's not for the fact that we once again cut back to the CIA. So we find out that there's this guy called Wombosey, who is a former African dictator of we don't know where, but he is demanding that the CIA help put him back in power, or he's threatening to expose. I have the likes about this. Yes, so. He's writing a book about the agency's history in Africa. He's going to name names.

It's basically a shakedown. It's basically a shakedown because you couldn't just have the CIA want to kill him for that. It has to be that he's extorting them. He's blackmailing them with the demand to be put back in power. And I have a lot of thoughts about the character of Nekwana Wimbosu, right? He's an exile in France, which is sort of a like Jean-Bidel Bukhassa thing. The script says, idiomine crossed with Mabutu, right? But there's something about the way in which he's played, even the way in which he's dressed,

like the glasses, a pure Patrice Lemunber to me, right? And there's something there, which I think I'll get into later. Well, also, like, the way he's played is not, he's not played necessarily as like massively evil. I think I quite like the way that one burst. He is depicted. Yeah, yeah, he's very good. Yeah, he was in leveraged. He wasn't in leveraged.

He wasn't fucking. I hate to say that. He was in a leveraged. He was in suicide squad, actually, a play killer crock. Really? Which is probably the worst credit I could possibly give him. But he, no, he's a fantastic actor. I'm not going to try to pronounce his surname, but it's out of all. I I could possibly give him. No, he's a fantastic actor. I'm not going to try to pronounce his surname, but it's Adoale.

I'll give it to him. Yeah, Adoale, I can know you, Agbaji. I'm sorry if I get that wrong, but I did do my best. It would have been very easy to have this role be quite offensive, but I think he does. Yeah, I think so. He does a really good job. One of the things that he's accusing the CIA of is he says two weeks ago There was an assassination attempt on me

And we see the CIA boss go well, I this hasn't happened right nobody knows anything about this In all the dumb in the room including Brian Cox is like no no idea Nope no Clarks another one of these actors who loves to play this type of guy. Yeah And he loves it, man. He's just walked in from like creating Wolverine. Yeah, he did. He did that.

That's true for his friend. Ryan Clocks, he's to be in. I think he did the exact, it didn't abandon D-Rim. He did the same one in that Leonardo DiCaprio spy movie we watched a Trashiee Cheers. He did. He did basically the same role. Yeah, he loves to be a conniving sort of upper to middle management spy piece of shit.

He loves it. Oh yeah, absolutely. I don't know if you suit it. Yeah, he's completely typecast for it but he's really fucking good. So. So this is also something that I want to talk about, Roach, there's two kinds of

appropriate allowable ways to do a movie in which a Western intelligence service is the bad guy. We saw one of them in Inspector, which is you just do a fictional spy agency. That's not the CIA. It's the SIA. It's MI7. It's the SIA, it's MI7. CSA, from CDA. Exactly, yeah. Exactly. And like the other way to do it is it's a rogue unit within the otherwise morally upstanding CIA. And that's what's happening here.

Brian Cox has given Chris Cooper the green light to do a secret project, a secret kill team within the CIA. And he's concealed this from everybody else. And so therefore, they have to clean up their own mess. The guy who tried to kill Wombosi is obviously wet damas. Oh, it's a wet dam. And therefore, they have to find him. And I guess bring him back in, right?

That's the goal. Again, it would have been a lot better if we'd find this out later and just stayed with Wet Damon. Is he like, Grudge? Because there's a really nice scene where he goes to the Swiss bank and retrieves the deposit box. And it has a whole bunch of passports in it. Oh, this is perfect.

Passions are really wonderful. And it's a gun. It's a great concept. You go to a safety deposit box that's in that you have access to. It's a numbered account, in there you find a shitload of identical passports of you from different countries I've gone, an admittedly awful tarcoyle watch and like fucking contact lenses for changing your eye color, shit like this. The one thing I don't like about this scene, right? And we're moving out of the realm of intelligence,

of which I have like no personal experience into the realm of Swiss banks, of which I have some personal experience. I think you have a lot of experience of intelligence at this. Oh, thank you. Um. That laugh was, but it was funny. That wasn't, uh, that wasn't.

Oh, sure. Whatever. But like, the point is, he goes to this Swiss bank in his filthy stinking fisherman attire. And everyone's like, oh, you are horrible piece of shit. We call it as a police immediately. Fuck you, fuck you, fuck you. And it's like, no, no, no, Swiss banks are nice to you. They're just nice to you in this really kind of

restrained security as two paces behind you kind of way. So like even if you look poor and weird, like there's a lot of very rich people who look poor and weird. Going into your Swiss bank and your stinking fisherman entire is not the weirdest thing a rich person has ever done. And it's absolutely the kind of thing that you just like brush off. But yeah, no, so he gets his safety deposit box. And he literally rich person that has like a sort of fetishization of looking.

Oh, yeah, yeah. Any of Kanye's fucking clothing line. Like, absolutely. This is also like a very cool. I get the appeal of this film like almost not quite as a power fantasy, but as like a, what if you woke up one day and like, you didn't have your memory, so you had no responsibilities and no ties, and you found out that actually you're like,

cool, and there's like a mystery in your life, you dissolve. And what if you woke up and you had a completely different identity and like, you had a passport and stuff, and you're free to fill in your own jokes. Yeah, that's right. I mean, I mean, it's like, it's that, or North Finals West, or something like that, where it's like, it's that or north by north west or something like that where it's mistaken identity, right?

Where you go, actually, I'm not this super cool spy. And everyone's like, yes, you are. And you're trying to, you're trying to form it and you like rise to the occasion. I kind of like this. Yeah, I'll cast two. Yeah, I'll cast two. Oh, cast two. Also, it's a truly, a truly stupid thing of meeting though, but he has all of these passports like Brazil

and Canada, one that says John Michael Cain, which is really important later. He also has a Russian one, the name of Phoma Kinyaev. And Zibondov. This has the worst fucking example of Cyrillic just used for aesthetics in a movie I've ever seen, because the Cyrillic on this passport, his name is Luschef Semester. Really? That's it. Really? But he does find the top passport, the top American passport is Jason Bourne.

He's like, okay, that's my name. I'm gonna be known as Jason Bourne from now on, that I'm not wet Damon anymore. They call the cops on him, like quietly, like this triggers some kind of alert on his way out, the Swiss bank called the cops on him. And what follows is I think my favorite scene in the movie, where he's walking through Zurich, all of the streets are covered in snow. He gets to disappear through another white transition by running in front of a tram, but because he's beaten up these two cops, the cops are looking for him.

And one thing this movie does very well is the sort of terror of someone talking about you on a radio. So he walks past a couple of cops, trying to like play it cool, and they just like immediately like two paces rounded, like talking to the radios and start following him. There's other cop cars coming up and he's like, Hanukt, but everyone's staying at walking pace. This is a really good scene. Error of like danger and menace, but like everyone's just sort of like waiting for it to turn into a chase. There's also a really nice moment where also in the boxes, they're an address in Paris registered

to him. So he calls that number for his address in Paris. And he hears an answer of answer phone message in his own voice and like doesn't recognize it. And yeah, I love this little moment where like he's obviously very scared. And the version of himself on the other side of the line is like very assertive and is like, hello, this is Paris, you leave me a message. And he's like, oh fuck, like, it's just a really creepy cool bit. Hmm. So by chance, he happens to see, I'm not sure if we went to think that this is like something he's done instinctually or a lot, but like he sees that he's outside

the US Embassy or the US consulate rather in Zurich. And so he just ducks in before the police can can get to him. And of course they can't come in because it's US territory. And like a sort of a more cowardly film would give you a moment of respite here, but instead what they do is they turn up the big tension dial and the big like only gets worse. You know, this security camera is pointed at you. There is a guy with an earpiece who is looking directly into your eye is kind of fife. That's now more intense because there's like the, I guess, the marine guards, there's a guy in a suit who's like watching the queue. And meanwhile, up front, there is Franca Potente, I'll lead actress in this.

She's at the counter and she's like, yeah, I know it says, I have the certificate to change it here. I know the name doesn't match. Listen. Listen, listen. Little fuck it here. Absolutely, absolutely.

Unnormal. Maybe no way. With that chin, that chin. No, no, come on. No. I think she looks great. The nose is fish. And I'm not Damon says as much because he's like, I was raised by a fish, but I know fish when I see it. So she's trying to get a student visa for the US and they're not helping her at all. She's kind of like put upon, she's got like all these documents and shit. And they're like about to kick her out. He just kind of like notices this. Like, this woman will be important later. But he realizes that it's getting a bit dangerous for him. And he goes to leave.

And one of the security guys tries to stop him because I guess the Swiss police have just like phoned through and like stopped that guy. And he does the thing again. He is about to get arrested. He disarms the guy, takes his gun, runs, alarms going off, the Marines are like arming themselves. He puts the gun in a bin. And he puts the gun in a bin, which I like. I like this a lot. It's also a very funny moment where I'm security, he's running up some stairs and his security guard comes

around the corner at the top. And he just absolutely suck approaches him and then that's a good. It's a great that guy's entire dick and balls. He like skids on his back down like a flight of stairs afterwards. And it's just like I'm sure you can into a nut sack of this guy He takes him down also like every army guy in there probably is just what army guys look like

But they've got the funniest hats I've ever seen Yeah, that's so sweet. Oh the marine utility cover. Yeah, no, that's real. That I ran real stupid Yeah, and and so he is. The and real stupid. Yeah. And and so he is immediately being chased like in the end of the Blues Brothers. If you've seen that, there are 5,000 Marines in this Consulate and Zurich and all of them want Jason Bourne's blood. Yep.

So he uses the wily technique of the fish. Yes. Parkour. He escapes out onto a balcony. And I like this. I like the way the Marines move that rings. Like that's good to me. All of the offices shutting off and stuff.

It's nice, it's good. There's like a really tense bit where he's like hanging onto the side of a building by his fingernails. It's really, really's good. There's like a really tense bit where he's like hanging onto the side of a building by his fingernails. It's really, really well shot as he climbs down the outside of the building. It's so good. Yeah, he climbs down into the snow and like very like, perilously and sees none other than Frank R. Potente, again, outside in her shissi little car, a mismatched body panels mini Cooper, which I really love. I love a silly little car. This is perfect. This is just me. And he's like, I will give you $20,000 to take me to Paris because that's

what I think I live. And she is, of course, immediately terrified, confused, but she needs the money, right? Yeah. And yes, there's no time. She's like, no, this is way too dangerous for me. I don't want to do that. She's like, he goes, okay, can I have my money back, please? I don't really do like.

Yeah. And they're just in the car in the next shot. Meanwhile, back at Langleyley back at the mystery ranch We've seen that Chris Cooper has sort of activated his war room, right? And this is where he'll be for like most of the rest of the movie is Jason Bourne will be trying to escape and We'll cut back to Chris Cooper doing the sort of like Tommy Lee Jones and the fugitive thing There's one point where he just like gets angry enough that he just starts saying verbs.

Like he just goes, those are the targets. Big, borrow, pack, tap, black, past. I don't care what you do. A dip. It's okay. Pack, tap, bypass, dance, heal, turn, question. John, let's go girls.

And what he does make explicit at this point that like, okay, what we're trying to do is kill Jason Bourne. We can't have any loose ends. And it just kind of begs the question of like, why? Like he's, he's not really fucking it. Like, he doesn't know who he is. They don't know that he's lost his memory. They just think that he's gone rogue, but they're not even like, okay, we'll like arrest him and debrief him and then have him quietly killed. No, it's just like, oh, this he he must be killed immediately. It's just like activate death squad. Yeah. And they sent out the text message that says it's time to start the killing. Yeah, ellipsis. So basically, the way this works is Jason born is part of sort of Europe at least wide secrets, CIA death squad. And it's very inefficiently distributed,

right? Because he's Paris. Barcelona has a guy. Dublin has a guy. Glasgow has a guy. It's how many people need to be killed in Glasgow? Well, I mean, if you ask me, I don't. Stuttgart has a guy, but he was killed by James Bond. What's really funny is the Barcelona guy is Clive Owen, who is also appearing in this movie and gets one line. Oh, it's fucking Clive Owen. Yeah, it's Clive Owen. I just read it.

He's... I just read it down and it was Mark Strong. I'll be honest with you. I had double checked. He's called the professor, but as we're scrolling down this big list on the screen, we see that each one of them has a little code name too. There's an agent. Upstrong code.

There's an agent. Well, the professor is his code name, but they get texted a word to activate them. Yeah, there is an agent brick, by the way, and since there's one in Glasgow, I'm assuming this is just me and I'm waiting for the text. You won't remember until he comes.

Yeah, exactly, exactly. But his is chimp. It says on the screen, Professor Simnumbers Chimp. So I will be calling him Professor Chimp for the rest of the movie. Yeah, really? I was like, again, I keep imagining a version of this film into which we hadn't met Chris Cooper

or seen the CIA and Professor Chimp just like showed up and started hunting Jason Bourne. Absolutely. That would have been so much better. Yeah. The like terror that like absolutely anyone could be waiting to be secretly activated by text message is great. He's got a cool rimless glasses on and he never says anything. Yeah, absolutely.

They do that at the end of John Wick, too. Yeah, John Wick, just better moving anything. Yeah, absolutely. That the end of John Wick too. Yeah, John we want to just best and goes time starts killing. I'm just start killing. Yeah, and also the fact that we have this entire CIA desk and Chris Cooper makes a big deal out of send everyone. Everyone, everyone and everyone is like three guys. Glasgow was not activated for this. I don't know why. Maybe I was busy. But what they get is they get the professor. I'm just gonna start texting you the word break now.

Oh, it's just harassment. That's not. Yeah. I've been doing that from a burner phone for the last two years. I've been doing that from a burner phone for the last three years. There's the professor, there's a guy called Castell, who has like a shitty like blonde dye job. And there's another weird German guy. We'll get to fucking Castell. Lucky love Castell. So good.

Yeah. So we see the born and Marie is her name. They have some quite nice chemistry in the car. I like these. I like the more downbeat scenes. I like the points of her. These are the points of her as a character. She's kind of like Euro trash in a way that doesn't, I don't think really exists anymore.

Like a lot of this, a lot of the Europe of this movie is now of a bygone age, but she's sort of of the sort of mold of like, yeah me and my friends set up a squat in Amsterdam for like six weeks and then the police rated it. So then we were in Beerits for a while and then, and it's like, okay, sure, but like that's a very 2000 sort of like shangan type of like youth.

This is what Donna from Mama Mia too would have been in real life. Yes, absolutely. And so she's just talking and talking and talking to Phil Space and he's just listening. And she gets a little bit unnerved by this. And he's like, no, please keep talking. And you're like the only person I've spoken to who hasn't been a fish guy in weeks. And they have this really fun.

I've spoken to him a lot of times. Ever as far as I know. She's talking about hearts of iron for like 60 kilometers. She's like, okay, so you want a division of this combat with and he's just like, mm-hmm, sure, yep. And he tells her, he's like, fuck it. And he tells her, like, I can't remember anything. I've got all these skills.

I've got these passports. All I know is the ways of the fisherman and that's a disarmament for the placement. Absolutely. And I don't know why I know this. And he's weirdly charming. He's weirdly self-effacing. It's kind of an anti-bond vibe.

He really helps that Matt Damon is quite young looking in there. So young. And also that he's not like, he's not absolutely jacked and like, like Daniel Craig is, he's not like too physically imposing, we see that he like does pull up some stuff, but he's not like absolutely fucking bursting out of that shirt. And when he does take a shirt, if we see that he's jacked, but like, he's not played as being like physically foreboding. No, and it's like, this is, it's a very unswarmly film. Like if we were using the scum system, this would be into negative number territory

because it's so legitimately just charming. Yeah, absolutely. He's like not sure what to do and he like kind of confides in her a bit. And then they get to Paris. He's like, okay, here's your money. You can go and she like doesn't really want to go. And she's like, well, do you want me to come with you

into the flat or like see if there's anyone there? Yeah. And it's not like, oh, do you like come with me? So the flat. It's like, did you want to maybe, I mean, like come up? And like it's not quite huge, like kind of levels of family waiting for you., do you have like a family waiting for you? And he's like, I don't know.

Yeah. But before this, we do get one little scene, right, where we learn some more about Jason Bourne's super tactical thought process, where they stop for petrol at a petrol station. And essentially, what happens is that he explains to her, okay, I have an anxiety disorder. He is like me at the live show because he comes into this place and he's like, I come in here and the first thing I'm doing is I'm catching the sight lines and looking for an exit. And she's like, okay, we'll listen, anybody can do that. That's not weird.

And then I see the exit sign too, man. Yeah, and he goes, no, you don't get it. I don't just have an anxiety disorder. I have an anxiety disorder and autism. Let me prove this to you. I can tell you the license plate numbers of all six cars outside. And he knows that the waitress is left-handed. He knows that he, what I think,

he knows the most likely place to find a gun. He's constantly, instinctually assessing stuff tactically. And he doesn't know what this means and he's scared. And it's like, he really knows a lot about trains. Yeah, yeah, yeah, exactly. And we'll come back to this question. The movie does have something fun and useful to say about this kind of mental connection.

Yeah, yeah. Right. But in the meantime, they get to Paris. She buys a Microsoft. They go to his apartment, which does the fucking spectre thing of this guy's life is empty. So he lives in an empty apartment better than Spectre does. He's really good.

It's just a total void. He stands in his kitchen and he's like, this is my kitchen and you don't believe anyone has ever cooked anything here. It's like, yeah, no, this is perfect. She goes to take a bath, I guess because I mean you have to imagine this lady She's been living like in and out of squats and stuff she goes more crazy I've been driving for you know really long. Yeah, exactly. So he six hours Hmm six hours to get from Zurich to Paris

I want to keep that in mind because like their relationship progresses so fast Yeah, it's a ride or die for this guy. I wish spent one six hour car journey with and I love it I respect absolutely absolutely. I can't know how he figures out to call the hotel He he calls he calls the The hotel because he finds like a receipt from what I think Yeah, he calls and asks hey, have you ever heard of Jason Bourne and are like no Have you ever heard of John Michael Cain, the name on my previous passport? And they go, oh, Mr. Cain is dead.

He was killed instantly in a horrible accident, and his brother came and took all of his things. And he's like, okay, thanks, hangs up on them as immediately like, yeah, someone's going to try and kill me right now. Grabbs a knife from the kitchen, and there's like walk around with this. And then what happens is that, if you recall my man Castell, the man with a shitty die job from Barcelona.

I love him. Oh my God. Yeah, Castell. He enters the fucking scene. What he does is he having absailed from the apartment above, Iranian Embassy style kicks in a glass door with a submachine gun and tries to kill Jason Bourne.

Just opening fire as he comes through the window. Like absolutely. There's no background music or anything. The scene like Jason Bourne is just walking around his house being like, all right, someone is gonna try to kill me. And then a man repels in through the window firing a submachine gun. And I point to the screen when Galfam star. Yeah, absolutely. Because what's also quite funny is that we see when Bourne at the end of this scene, like,

runs downstairs. We see that somebody has very quietly assassinated his landlady, who'd let him in. So that means that Castell went in through the ground floor, assassinated the landlady silently, like, went up and sat down with a gun. What did you do, sir? What happened? Get in some practice of going silent and then just go and loud as fucking physically boss. So now I've already got the achievement for silent. I want to So a really bizarre hitman play. Yeah, absolutely

So they fight right that's so funny the fight the fight choreography is pretty good I feel like it's badly undercut by the by the sound ever seen Yeah, we it's got like the watch punch noises. Yeah. Yeah. Yeah, we had it's got like the watch punch noises. Yeah, yeah, yeah, it's got like man from Hong Kong level punches. It sounds like just like every time. And it's like kind of killing it. And I see why this fell by the wayside. And why we sort of went for slightly more sort of cinema

vera say kind of mixing after this. But yeah, no, born like is off guard, he fights back with like an improvised weapon, he grabs a biro off the desk and stabs the guy in the hand. Yeah, I saw this movie when I was really young, I always wondered whether stabbing someone with a biro actually works, but like, it's not like I get a lot of opportunities to find out. So Biro actually works, but like, it's only gonna get a lot of opportunities to find out. So that's just one of those like- Yeah, like text. Yeah, exactly.

Until I get that text saying brick for the first time in a day and then I'm just like- Get a snap. It's Biro time. Yeah. It's time. So yeah. But then what I have is that Jason Baud, he's the shit out of this guy. Yeah.

It turns out he has a picture of Jason born and Marie like on a flyer like a wanted poster. She's sort of going into shock here. He he took he does torture him, but he taught us him in a almost now comically tame way, where he like lies on top of him as he's on the floor. He goes, who am I? He doesn't answer. He just bonks his head on the ground, kind of lightly. Like who am I? Hey, doesn't answer you just bonks his head on the ground kind of lightly like who am I bonk? Who am I bonk? Like bonk It's like like

No, it's a then Castell stands up Yeah turns a hundred negative degrees around yes he does He does through the winter Exit! He's fucking hits the brisk. He tries to do the specter secret meeting maneuver, and instead, what he does is just pitches perfectly over the balcony and dies. This shot is so funny.

It's so fucking funny, because they should have cut away from that shot. I'd before he went over the braille and cut to Marie's face or something. But because they have the legs coming out of it. The time they hold on it and the fact that you see his ankles go, what about the time? It's so funny.

The full breakdown right. So, he's on the ground. Jason Bourne is going, who am I? What do I work for? Which is a delightful inversion. Marie is like, why do you have my photo? And she runs Oduham and Jason, like, push, like, gets up and he holds her bag and he's like,

listen, let me do this. And then we turn around to see that he has stood up and runs directly out of the plate glass door over the balcony. And it's perfect. Perfect. Perfect. Oh, it's phenomenal. And they both treat it like they've just seen

someone like Ernest Lee take their own life. The rich are so solidly hit. Fuck. Yeah, absolutely. So, they're like, we have to... We have to leave this apartment immediately, right? One thing I like about this is Marie, she's going into shock and this is like,

well, act reasonable. She's like, he's having to half carry her out of the apartment. She like throws up in the lobby. And then in a truly me move, they go past the body outside and he's like, okay, don't look at it. She immediately looks at it to see Castel who's just exited like basically. Just like, don't let the child in the shot.

The location, the film, this mortal coil, he's just exited everything that. I'm still sort of cut up on like interrogating a guy by being like, who do I work for? Bunk. Who am I? Bunk. And it's like, so at this point, who's Jersey Bond of? So at this point Matt, Matt, Matt, what kind of line would you use to catch a place So bought like super spy analysis I

Immediately know what kind of fish these guys are gonna be serving It's my great to re-read I I know whether you're this net caught or trolled. So he takes them to a train, so I think it's like Gardela. And puts his bank bag full of passports and money in a left luggage locker. And then he asks Marie to wait for him. Each of them think the other one is gonna ditch them, which I like a lot. But no, she stays, although having gone to get a drink

because she is not suited for this spice shit at all. And you see that once again, we do a sort of less intense version of the cops quietly pulling up on them. shit at all. And you see that once again we do a sort of less intense version of like the cops quietly pulling up on them. And he's like, okay, we'll listen, you can go to the cops and tell them everything about me because you know, and not do this. Or you can come with me and do some Jason Bourn shit. But you have to decide now. And she decides in his favor and this leads to a perfect silly little car chase. Oh, wonderful car chase and may I just say, that's an amazing soundtrack. That's true.

It's got the fucking like mismatched panels, mini. He's like, do you say caribou's car and she's like, no. I don't know if you catch the fact that the music used here is the same as was used in the chase at the end of Alex ride. Huh, I didn't catch that. When he's doing the stupid horse chase shit that we did on the bonus feed. Oh, fuck, you're not so funny. That's why it's so interesting. Yeah, that's why it's so interesting.

Yeah. In London, a child is riding horse in Paris, Jason Bourne is driving a mini. There's also features like the best French cop car era of just like a shitty white citron with like body rust yellow lights and a like, derisery two-tone siren. And so they just get chased down a shitload of alleys by these guys. He loses some of them by going down the stairs and then what happens is they're chased by a kind of French motorcycle cop mini bus. Who is just like, it's really good. I will make it my mission in life to catch this guy. And they're unable to shake him off. So what Jason has been. What's the deal that always on the case? Yeah, absolutely. And so what Jason has to do, he has to deploy his superpower of wipe transition teleportation where they drive alongside in separate lanes, you like break suddenly disappears into a wipe

in the car. You can do that over the hours. Yeah, absolutely. Training is in turn, it's fun. Oh, yeah, absolutely. I think this should have been the moment when we did the CIA reveal. Because we're halfway through the film,

and this is the point where we should have got the twist. But I don't know what I'm going to do because we see one Bo C, who has been told that Cain is dead and goes to the morgue to see Cain's body, and he's like, this isn't the guy who tried to assassinate me. He has a whole entourage, and there's a fantastically active little thing that I love where he goes to look at the guy, and he tosses his coat back over his shoulder,

like in the expectation that someone will catch it. The guy behind him misses it, and you just see his hands, and he just goes kind of like, oh, fuck, sake. It's just like, like, really, really, you I'm gonna dig with this. I didn't, I didn't spot that, that's pretty good.

This is great. Really good. Yeah, absolutely. And it's like, C-A trying to bullshit him basically. Yeah, with a fake body. And he's like, this isn't the guy I don't believe you. Meanwhile, Jason and Marie go to a shissie little hotel,

the hotel de la paix. Again, this, this is a part of Paris that like, doesn't really like exist in this way anymore and it's like, certainly doesn't like, it's always never shot this way anymore. It's probably like an Airbnb now, but they're in their little safe house. He dies a hair, he cuts a hair, and then... Then she... I need to activate Devon mode. Please. Because we have... We need to activate Devon mode. And please because we have a slur to say we haven't. Oh, yeah, just texting it. We have an early 2000s sex scene now on the bonus

feed listeners, I have talked when we did the Thomas Crown of her about the 90s sex scene. And it's really quite well done, because like they're both in like tank tops because they're doing stuff over the sink cutting her hair. She initiates and he's initially like, wait what? And then she comes, he's like, oh, this is a sex thing. Yeah. And we also see that she is quite tender when she finds the bullet wounds on his back and she's like concerned about this. So we're like learning something about the characters. Then what happens is like we pull back and she's concerned about this. We're learning something about the characters. Then what happens is we pull back and we do a shot that travels back through the apartment and it's implied that they're having sex.

This scene is interesting to me because in a 90s movie, we would then have had 20 to 30 seconds of them having sex. We could have done more. It's like, I welcome the sex scene, but I call the actor to go for it. But still, it stands out as compared to a modern film where they would have kissed and we would have cut and that would have been it and we wouldn't have seen anything. So I think that somebody should do a video,

I say about sex scenes in film, because you can see the direction things are heading in. And we're now at a point in cinema where everyone is beautiful, but nobody is horny and nobody ever fucks. We're back to two cigarettes in an ash tray. Yeah, and like Chris Hemsworth is there with a shirt off a Natalie Portman, like you know, might make a comment and like look him up and down, but like nothing happens, right? And in this, you can see us getting that way. And I think we've lost something. Rejects, modernity, embrace, it's shadowing. It does have quite a depth touch for the sort of like sensual, I think. Just the little like movements when they're about to kiss.

I like them a lot. So lost out. Meanwhile, Clive Owen is still not, he has one line at this movie and it's still not time for it. We got another hour before it. He's still silently advancing towards plot. Which in this case is, when both of these in exile in in a chateau in central Paris, he walks past a window, fatal mistake, because outside that window across the street is is Clive on with a beautiful Swiss sniper rifle. And that's Feech's 50.

And Professor Chimp fucking takes him off the board, like shoots him something like three or four times and then just leaves. And you're like, oh, that's what Jason Bourne has meant to have been doing. And that's why the CIA like after him is because he's like a danger is a sassan okay. So, Born and Marie have to try and go to this hotel where Cain, John Michael Cain had stayed and get the hotel bill

because it would tell them something. And he might tell him who he's been calling. Yeah, yeah, yeah, And he gives her the like, I can tell you the license plate numbers of all six cars outside. Kind of speech. He's like, you have to, once you get in there, you have to count the number of steps until you get to a neutral point in the lobby,

you have to count the number of security, count everybody else. You have to do all of this shit at once at the same time. And she just goes in, asks the guy and gets a photo copy, which I really like this scene. I think this is kind of an important scene for what this movie wants to say, that all of his like twitchy, hyper-vigilant spy craft is kind of useless because she can just like establish reports. She's like, the guy smiled at me, so I just asked them. And I like to say that I was his personal assistant

and asked for a photocopy and he gave it to me. Yeah, yeah, yeah. I used a police technique called lying. But like this is all like true, I guess. Like people do train themselves to think and like I am in condition yellow all of the time. And it's like, oh, this is, yeah, exactly. And I think this movie correctly identifies this as a kind of like mental prison that stops

you from acting normal. And you can get a lot of shit just by acting normal. He's quite cute about it though. And she's like, I just asked him and he's like, oh, I was thinking, he's just, I mean, that was smart. Like, he's not as to her about it. He's not like, I agree. No, oh, I was, I think he said something like that was smart. Like he's nice to her about it. He's not like hungry. No, no, no.

So they figure out that where he says, you're pretty good at this. Like it's quite sweet. They figure out what John Michael Cain's body is. And then they bribe the most abrived pathologists in all of France. Because one of those he's already been through to look at the body. And that is a person. He's like a like a rumbling in this guy's palm. Let me look at the body and the body is gone because I guess the CIA don't need it anymore to try and to see if one bossy. There is a fun thing with the pathologist to boss comes in who's like you can't just be letting

people in here. You need to like sign in and out And he kind of like bullies his way back out. It's like, yeah, fuck you. I'll sign out. Is this the book where you sign out? Rips the entire content of it out so you can, so you can look at it later and leaves, which I like a lot. They're trying to go and see one bossy, but they, they find that he's dead. And from this and the phone bill from the hotel and the newspapers, reporting Wombose's claim that somebody tried to assassinate him. Born figures out that he was the assassin on Wombose's yacht and that he must have like something went wrong and he fell off the boat and he's like, oh god, I'm a CIA assassin. He's horrified.

He really is. And this is where the movie, like, kind is straining against itself because it's really nice that he's like, oh God, like I'm a murderer. Like, that's what I do. It feels bad about it. But the movie keeps telling us that this is like cool and sick and like, it's what, it's exciting. And I'm like, oh, you're kind of trying to have it

the other way, so you can't try to do the James Bond on your Craig thing. It's like, oh, it's so, it sucks so bad being really cool. He has to like, oh, I hate how cool I have to be over time. Reject it in a way that actually makes him better at all the stuff you need in order to do it, which is, yeah, just as you say. But Marie is also horrified. And they're coming back to their safehouse, and the safehouse is blown. The French police are all over it as Christopher says,

what's the French word for stakeout, which I like? And she wants to leave. And he's like, no, you cannot leave because if you leave here, we'll die. And this is like, compare this to a lot of the crag stuff where he's like manhandling women. It's positively reasonable because he's like, I will give you all of my money.

I'll take you wherever you want to go and leave you there, but we can't do this in Paris. And that's like, I mean, she accepts that. But like it's- You just wanna handle her a little bit, but yeah, you're right, but certainly a little bit of it could have been. Absolutely.

It's like, I don't know, it feels more like sort of grabbing a kid's hand when they're about to run into the street more than it feels like sort of Craig pushing someone up against a mirror. Yes, very true. Yeah. So, they go to one of her ex's places in, in, in Never on Central France, where her ex Eman has a farmhouse where they think he'll be out and will just breaks in only to find that he is not out

Instead he his two kids his labrador his fucking like jeep grand Cherokee sort of middle class lifestyle who just returned And they have to play it off and we get some I like the way his treats Marie because He gets over the car. He like looks at busted front door, looks at her, looks at him. And then to Jason Bourne, who has been driving all this and goes, does she get you into this? I really respect how she is treated and that this movie actually, I really enjoy. She has the kind of person who would do a squat. She's kind of a fuck up and just kind of of a disaster and she has like a past and stuff.

And I like that. I think it's well done actually. And I hope those kinds of people still exist. It's maybe strange to say, but like this is 20 years ago and I feel so old. I reckon so. We also get a nice moment where we see born, like Eamon's kids are on the swings outside and

Bourne is like awkwardly standing there, it doesn't really know what to do. And then she finds him in the middle of the night, like, in their bedroom. Staring at that. She'll work for it. We stood in that bedroom. Yeah, kind of slimy, slimy, odd. But he says, like, I don't want to know who I was anymore. Like, I hurt people that don't like that. It's really quite sort of touching.

Yeah, I want to be a nice person instead of whatever I was doing before, not being a nice person. And yeah, I'm staring at children. So they come down to breakfast in the morning and the guy even is like, I can't find the dog. And Jason Boy is immediately like, fuck shit. All right, everybody get in the basement. I'm gonna have to get into a gun fight with a guy right now.

We never find out what happened to the dog, but the fact that the dog is gone, we're just like, oh, this is not the foreigner. I do not think the dog is fine. I think. Of a dog's dad is how? The dog is absolutely compromised. That dog got chimp compromised.

Yeah, because outside is professor Chimp with his sniper right. Every time he does a kill he says out loud you just got chimp. Look straight into the camera. They're like, Mark, you need to stop doing it's not Mark's strong. So it's not Mark's strong. My name is Clark. I'm really sorry. I don't know why I've got face liners for these two men's specifics. My name is Clive. I'm really sorry.

I don't know why I've got face liners for these two men specifically. So Jason Borton uses his gun locating powers to locate a shotgun and some ammunition. And his opening move is to blow up a petrol tank because I guess he is like perfectly interior to where the guy is most likely to be and therefore where to create a smoke screen Well, wherever he is, it's gonna be a loud bang and that's true. That's true. Absolutely And also I guess get the I have to get that anyway, so the professor chimp flees into a field of tall grass And he's like hiding out there and they have this very tense, sort of like, not quite gunfights.

And because Jason Bourne was raised by Fisherman, he's one with nature. And he fires the shotgun that causes a cloud of birds to explode up and this kind of throws Professor Chim bar. And then he shoots Professor Chim with a shotgun. Yeah, I'm not sure whether the like shooting to drive the birds away is like intended to just to be distracting, which it is, or if there's a thing there about like, you know, maybe the

birds don't come back to where there's a guy because they've all been startled, so he's going to like locate him that way. Exactly, exactly. Yeah yeah, he shoots him in both arms with a shotgun. And so he's just lying there, torso completely shredded. And he gets his one line where he looks at himself and he's like, look at this. Look at what I'm going to give. That's sort of, there's your themes, I guess, is that like... Yeah, because Jason is like, Jason like gets him down. He's not asking who he is anymore because he's picked out and he's like, who else is serious? Or anyone else to which like... Clive... To which life's the truth.

So, I'm a lone, we're always alone. Yeah, we always work alone. You know this. You get such a genuine moment, like because he refers to the headaches that are born offhandedly mentioned that he was having. It's like, do you still get the headaches? Yeah. Like, you get a real like, the shit sucks moment between them.

He says, he says to Jason Bourne, he says, you're your treadstone, which is a word that we've heard a few times. It's the name of the secret project. And he's like, yeah, so am I. Like, do you still get headaches? Like, yeah, it sucks, doesn't it? And he dies, and it's quite sad. Yeah, absolutely.

I think in some ways it packs in some more things about like being a spy is bad for you. Then a lot of the Craig stuff managed to in hours and hours of film. Do you know what it reminds me of? It reminds me of Ronin, which I've been doing this better a few years earlier. Yes, you're so right. Because Ronin didn't have this struggle of like, oh, but also it's really cool. Yeah, that's true.

And also, Sam, Robert's an era on Roninin, is my high watermark for how to write a convincing spy. And there's a difference there and that he doesn't ever really do the... I can tell you the license plate numbers of all six cars outside. Thing, right. It's not like a kind of a thing that he's constantly doing. Instead, it's like this kind of weary, plotting, instinctual thing that he looks at where the exits are and he like goes in places a gun outside one of them Maybe but he's not like Hyper-vigilent

Super power. It's more of an obligation He wants to hear our thoughts on Ronan listeners than he should subscribe to the girl James Bond Patreon Absolutely. It's a great movie. I don't ever I found a month you get an entire backlog which is like 27 movies at this point. That's an hour of content. So he puts Marie and even in the kids, not the dog, because the dog is dead in the car. The dog is so dead.

Tell us them to run. Um, Marie doesn't want to, because again, she is right or die for a six hour car rides. Yes, she is so fucking right. She's like, he listened to me talk about Hartzovian for six hours. I must marry this man. But he like forces her to go and then goes through Professor Chimp's things in which he finds a flip phone. And he just like, the CIA just not have fucking

re-dial turned off. So he just like re-dial was them. He literally re-dialed them like, hello, this is the cops, this is CIA headquarters. He's like, everyone's on the line. Fuck you doing it. I feel love. Yeah, he does some misdirection where he like,

he realizes that he's meant to be this assassin. So he tries to take the heat off Marie by being like, oh, she's dead. I killed her. She was slowing me down. It's like cool. Which is going to work as well. Yeah, absolutely. I like this. They believe him. I like it. I need to meet with the guy in charge of

you. Come to Pond Nuth in Paris. Come alone. Take off your jacket, face east in the middle of the bridge, and I'll call you back. And then hangs up on them. And of course they try and betray him. They can't not, that's just in there. So of course he has a team with him. Yeah, the most fucking guy from the start of Casino Royale who puts his finger to his ear as Guy Ever, this guy walks past someone on the bridge who is wearing like his beanie with a massive wire from like the ear into his lapel. Yeah. As he passes him, like lifts his shirt up and talks straight into it. Yeah.

The worst part is, since we see them in the van from the airport, we know that Chris Cooper, the beanie guy and all the other guys all drove there and presumably got out of the same van, which is marked up like fucking CIA flower services, let me see it or whatever. Flows. So yeah, flowers by O-ring. So so so,

Born is watching correctly realizes that like, this is a a trap. It's like I told you to come alone Deals off plants a tracking device which I guess professor chimped they never Yeah, because he's still in all the professor chimped stuff Including this little like mono lens non-spanoculars. I yeah, I'm a non-killer is so funny It's it's like it's cool. I guess yeah, so he he non-killer. It's so funny. It's like, it's cool, I guess. Yeah, so he plants the tracker on the van. And then the deal having been off, Chris Cooper and his guys are like,

okay, time to go back to the CIA safe house where we've been running all of this shit. There's, I mean, we've seen this a couple of times as fucking, what a name. Julius Stiles. Nicolette, I think, is's fucking what a name. Julia Stiles. Nicolette I think is the name of character. Julia Stiles who's been like doing sort of like coordination stuff there. She's like, I think I look.

He's been texted the word, break five times a day. She's smoking hot in this film. I mean gorgeous. I mean, she's me and American. Those are the two criteria. today. She's smoking hot in this film. Like gorgeous. What do you think? She's blonde and American. Those are the two criteria. I don't I don't. She says a word. I don't know how you can tell. She's a America. She's like, see, I, that's true. I think she's hot. Anyway, Chris Cooper is like, okay, I got that bit where I sounded like a dipshit night. Thanks. Yeah. Chris Cooper's like, okay, well, this is gone, tits up.

We're going to shut down Tredstone in Paris, shred everything, delete all the hard drives, pay a settlement to that woman who accused Prince Andrew of stuff, and we'll just, we'll get the fuck out of here because the fisherman's coming. And so then... We didn't know this guy's been raised by fishermen. He's way above, right now. And the fisherman fisherman come with and he uses another one of his powers, which is to trigger every car alarm along the street as a distraction. Yeah, no question how I did that.

So we're talking Aden Pierce's iconic cap, I guess. I love how shit the CIA are in this, right? They're trying to catch an ultra spy and their gambit is all of them go in the same car And then as soon as it's revealed that it's rumble they all get back in the same car and go to their safe Like drive around a bit So Jason are somewhere else Jason born climbs up a drain pipe breaks in Easily disarms and interrogates Chris Cooper. He's like, who am I?

What have I been doing for you? I don't want to do this anymore. And another pivotal line, right? He goes, I don't want to do this anymore. I don't think that's a decision you can make. Which I like. I like this idea of like, no one's ever really confronted Bond with this, by the way.

Every time Bond's wanted to leave, he just hits the bricks, he goes rogue, where he quits or whatever. No one's ever been like, actually, we're kind of like into you for several million quids worth of training and equipment. You're not fucking going anywhere. You think this is like a resigning type of organization,

we waterboard people. Like, that's an interesting thing to do, and Bond has never done it, which is curious. And he also remembers why he failed to kill one bossy on the yacht, because he has a little bit of a flashback where he hides out on one bossy's yacht for five days, and then comes up behind him when he's resting at night, and puts a gun to his head and is about to kill him and sees that one boss he's children

are in the room and has to. You can't do it. The spectre of family, specifically that it's black family too, is like, I don't know, that's quite subversive and then it's basically kind of like holy and liberal way, but yeah, absolutely. He's like, wait a second, I can't fucking do this. I'm a monster. and then, and then, and then, and then, and then, and then, and then, and then, and then, and then, and then, and then, and then, and then, and then, and then, and then, and then, and then, and then, and then, and then, and then, and then, and then, and then, and then, and then, and then, and then, and then, and then, and then, and then, and then, and then, and then, and then, and then, and then, and then, and then, and then, and then, and then, and then, and then, and then, and then, and then, and then, and then, and then, and then, and then, and then, and then, and then, and then, and then, and then, and then, and then, and then, and then, and then, and then, and then, and then, and then, and then, and then, and then, and then, and then, and then, and then, and then, and then, and then, and then, and then, and then, and then, and then, and then, and then, and then, and then, and then, and then, and then, and then, and then, and then, and then, and then, and then, and then, and then, and then, and then, and then, and then, and then, and then, and then, and then, and then, and then, and then, and then, and then, and then, and then, and then, and then, and then, and then, and then, and then, and then, and then, and then, and then, and then, and then, and then, and then, and then, and then, and then, and then, and then, and then, and then, and then, and then, and then, and then, and then, and then, and then, and then, and then, and then, and then, and then, But really, it would have been very tempting to have a scene just before this where we realized that one boss he was just misunderstood, like he was a good guy all along and that's why it's also about to kill him. But instead, we don't really get that.

He's not portrayed as being super evil, like he's a former dictator, but we are left to assume that his life has value and so do the lives of his children just because they're human. And I quite like that actually. Absolutely, absolutely. And he's also sort of portrayed a sort of like quite brave in that like when Jason Bourne puts the gun to his head, he doesn't like beg for his life or anything.

He just sits there with his kid like, okay, well, go on then. And it's like, I can't, maybe I miss him, I think maybe he like pushes his child away a little bit. I don't remember. Yeah. Yeah. And I mean, this is one of the things where it's like totally a pre-911-ass movie is like after after 911, despite this haven't come out in 2002, like Americans went full-bore in favor of that kind of brutality. Like, I remember a torture scene from Cats and Dogs 2. of brutality. Like, I remember a torture scene from Katzen Dogs 2. Yes, yeah, I'm fucking insane thing to be on at some point. At some point we'll have to do zero dark-thirsty and I'll talk about the sort of like legitimization of choosing people in front of

that kids. Or be it to bad people. Yeah, no, he refuses that kind of masculinity. He becomes transgender. He kills the James Bond in his head because he's like, no, I don't want to be this person anymore. This is toxic. This is rough. He remembers what Ma'an par can't fishermen. Because fishermen take pictures. You've got to be one or where we want to be when they turn.

We take fish, but we also, we let the ones we don't need go. And meanwhile, turf conlan is like, no, one or whatever you want when they turn, you know, we take fish, but we also we let the ones we don't need go and meanwhile turf Conflict is like no you you you were assigned spy at birth you have to do this forever There's yeah Absolutely, but spies cannot become not spies You get to quit motherfucker. We owe you. What do you mean? Absolutely and then he goes I would like to, and they go, I don't know, all right.

He goes to my malfunctioning $30 million weapon. Yeah. But like, the thing is, right, this movie was sort of a tug of war between the director, Doug Lyman, and the studio. Doug Lyman has made sort of a niche for himself and making kind of like marketable action movies that like think a little bit like he did Edge of Tomorrow if you want the kind of like context for this. And so he wanted the last action beat in this to be Jason

Bond Kill's Clive Owen and they didn't let him do that. Instead they were like no you have to have more action after this and I think think that really ruins the ending of this movie. It would have been better if he had just left the flat. Yeah, what happens here is that Jason Bourne offers him a pretty compelling deal, which is leave me alone forever or I'll kill you. Also, I'm not going to like harm you or the CIA in any way. I'm just going to leave, and that's it. That's also, it depends on you towards the audience.

Yeah, it's right, maybe. I'm just going to leave and that's it. That's also happens that's to you towards the audience. Yeah, if you ever come near me, I'm going to murder every single one of you, but you don't have to do the word chip. Yeah, exactly. I'm just just, if I can leave me a lot. Look at a list of code names and see if that's what I want to be. And like it's very stupid not to like take that deal, but of course, because we need to have an action scene, Chris Cooper has pressed the panic button and the two goons from outside, three goons from outside are on their way. And what we have to have is the silliest action scene in the whole movie. It really sucks. It kind of comes out of nowhere and is a bit pointless, but shit.

He likes shoes to gun side by side. One of them is upside down. He's pulling the trigger with his pinky. He likes to... Yeah, it's a bit shit. Kick kicks a body over a thing and rides it down to the floor, shooting a guy perfectly on the way down. Yeah, it's kind of silly.

Doesn't belong, really. Yeah. But they would really... Yeah, it doesn't really fit. They wanted to rewrite and rewrite and rewrite the ending. And this is the one that we got, which I think is kind of weak. And then we see that we have, of course, one threadstone guy remaining, the weird looking German guy. Yeah, his name is Zorn, like his character's name is what I don't know.

Where is he? Is he called Zorn, which is very funny to me, like Jason's or. Yeah, but he's he's he's been. Well, I'm he's been waiting. You think he's like a professor for insect medicine. Yeah, you think he's there to kill Jason Boughton because you see Boughton limping out of the safehouse and him waiting in a car with with a silence pistol for him. But instead, he is there to kill Chris Cooper to kill Conklin as like tidying up after himself.

Brian Cox has had him killed using his own death squad. And that at least I like, it's very like a perfunctory. There's no, he doesn't say anything or anything. He just shoots some three times and leaves. And then we... It would be made worse if there was like a line, right? Yeah, absolutely. If there was a line out, it's in it. Ronin does this a lot as well, where he's killed him because he needed to be killed.

There's no reason to be like, here is my line, here's my exposition about why this had to happen. What would be the lesson to put it together yourself? Then we see back in DC that Brian Cox is testifying to an oversight committee. And the thing that I like is that Fred Stone, he goes, oh, yeah, that's, that's wound down already. It's, it's kind of a non-issue. And they just go, okay, fine.

It's like one line item. And you get the sense he has like dozens and dozens and dozens of them. And I like that a lot. This is really good. Yeah. Yeah. And we just, it's just good. We got, we got a fucking happy ending because Jason Bourne goes to Meaconus where, in Greece, where Marie has set up a scooter shop.

She's using the like bank bag that he had all of his money in as a planter to, which I really like. Just as nice a little detail. And they reunite in my personal, it's a happy ending. This is a great ending. I finished this movie and I was like, fantastic. And then I was like, if... Well, what happened in the first 10 minutes of the next movie?

Anyone was to ever come up to me post this movie and be like, yeah, I'm making a sequel to the born identity. I would very sadly, throttled them with anything I had on hand because this is a perfect ending. Leave it. Leave it. They want you to know more. Yeah, and you try and think of a better way of starting a sequel than just killing Marie

out, right? Really? She is fucking Donzo. I don't know what they do. I haven't watched the fucking thing. She's up there with a total of the lifespan. Oh, I like that. Terrible.

Well, I mean, we'll get into that because the plan is. I'm not really too interested in the adventures of Jason Bourne or to stick to. Wow, this is a dictatorship. And as such, I'm forcing both of you to follow me through Jason Borden's fish adventures. Let's keep that bit going.

I really like your race by fishermen so far. Yeah, his fish battles. Well, I think that was a good movie, but we have a more objective measure than that. We're testing out a new scientific measure because the Scump system, that's for James Bond. We can't judge Jason Bond by James Bond's standards. Instead, what we have is the girth system. Yeah, you never remember this from our The Rock episode with Under Law. So the girth system, we're intending to figure out how obsessed this movie is with glory, intellectualism, respecting the troops,

and heterosexuality. Out of 007. Out of 007. I forget our roots. For glory, I think this movie is positively anti-glory. I think it is too. I think it's going to be a low one. The only problem with this is that it does want you to be able to still do all of the cool things. It wants you to still have the white transition power, so want you to have the the autism powers. And you have to actually be better at them than all of the people who want to do it. Yeah, it's a movie that's fighting against its main character. Its framing is completely different to how its main character actually feels about what's happening. Definitely. It doesn't want to do this, but it's just like,

isn't it cool that he's doing this? I could know. Not really. I could still do a very low, something like a one out of seven. I think I agree there. Right. Yeah, I mean, I'm happy for this movie to be quite low, because I'll give an interesting narrative when we're talking about the next few. Now, intellectualism. What do we think this movie's attitude to intellectualism is? Well, we originally kind of developed this part of the spectrum because there are some movies about masculinity that are very much like, ah, shut up nerds, like being clever is like being shoved in a locker and stuff. I feel like this movie again, it's going to be pretty low.

Clever is like being shoved in a locker and stuff. I feel like this movie again. It's gonna be pretty low. I think so I think so like Jason Bourne is not portrayed as like an anti-intellectual. He doesn't if anything he thinks about stuff too much The other guys code name is the professor like yeah, absolutely I It in fact I would come back to the scene where she's just like, have you tried being or more and just asking people for things? To which he reveals, no. Absolutely. Consider doing that actually. I think this might be a one as well.

One again, yeah. Yeah, one again. Now, respecting the troops, this is pre-9-11 spiritually. It respect the CIA only enough to give them convenient out in the form of like, one-bosie is like shaking respect the CIA only enough to give them convenient out in the form of like one bosey is like shaking down the CIA or this is a rogue CIA operation. Also the CIA aren't really portrayed as troops in a way that they would be in a lot of later movies. They're not like interchangeable with the military. I I don't to know two. It could be a lot of this.

I think this could be a two. Yeah, absolutely. Um, and then heterosexuality, well, there is heterosexuality in this. Um, that no one is gay. That's why we cannot recommend it. That's true. I don't need to see that shaman. It's fine. I just don't know.

I'm just going to get down after it. Yeah, absolutely. Um, just just keep it away from like, I shouldn't be taught in schools. I don't think this movie has a lot to say, but other than that, like, what works for Jason Born in terms of his charm is his earnestness. Yeah, definitely. And not being a massive fucking creep.

And I think that kind of, like, I don't know, that's quite nice. So I think I think it could of like, I don't know, that's quite nice. So I think I think you could go like, low her, I could go like, two, three. I could go two as well. I think that like part of him getting away and having a normal life is having this kind of like, he gets, so like, have a girl in his life, you know?

That's kind of part of like, hey, actually being a normal guy is like having a relationship with a woman. Yeah, what I want is a woman. Yeah, well, say for it is that like a lot of movies, hey, actually being a normal guy is like having a relationship with a woman. Yeah, what I want is a really important thing. Well, say for it is that like a lot of movies like this, it's not like she's taming the monster or anything, right? Like, he just wakes up and he just gets better. I mean, it's sort of, you've got a spectrum, right?

Of waking up and being like, oh shit, I don't remember anything that's helped me beforehand. I need to piece together what's going on. And one side is this movie where he's like, oh, I'm really cool, but like I don't remember anything that's helped me beforehand. I need to piece together what's going on. And one side is this movie where he's like, oh, I'm really cool, but like I don't actually want to be this shit sucks. I don't want to be, I want to be normal. And on the other side is the video game Disco Elysium. You wake up and are like, oh, I'm the world's biggest fuck up.

Yeah, absolutely. It would have been quite funny if like, if when she kissed him, he was like, I don't know if if when she kissed him, he was like, I don't know if she'd know if I'm straight. Like, he's not. He's not. Thorce initiated. I've never had to think about this one.

Yeah. No, I... I mean, he does kind of get, like, sex in a relationship as a reward at the end of the movie, but, like, it's portrayed, I think, relatively, I guess, deftly. So I'm happy with the two here. Yeah.

And that gives it a total of one, two, three, four, five, six, which I don't know whether that's good. I don't know whether it's lower than the rock. And well, we can't compare it to Scum, right? But six is our starting point for Jason Bourne, so well done. Let's see how the sequel's handled this. And of course, we do still have to award a Kaufman star to my man Castell Just my god, what a king he enters he fuck shit up

He leaves and boy does he ever leave Vaney want to see when he changes our lives. How do you say like Vaney Vitty Vichy? There's just like I came I lost VDVG, there's just like, I came, I lost it left. Yeah, absolutely. Do you have a cronstein or a good night? I, for this, I do. I do. I don't for this. I feel like, um, because the cronstein is, is usually for bad guys who go above and beyond

in killing James Bond, which I feel like, that's just Castell again, really. Yeah, exactly. Maybe we should fuse the cronstein and the Calfman into one. I'm happy with like a double award of both Castell here. The good like cross here, I don't know. Maybe we can organically mint our own new rewards as we go forward. Absolutely, absolutely.

The special accommodation of some kind to Castell for that shot. Go and look at that shot on YouTube. Absolutely. How we could do, we could do like a Castell award for a special comedy. No, that's a compliment. He's even German. Like what are you gonna do about it? Well, we'll see. We'll see. We'll see how it plays out. Defenders race myself. What guards? Well Well thank you very much,

listen, don't forget to get live show tickets when they're available. That's right. That's right. That's right. I'll be available by the time this is out. It's been useful for me. But still be a tomorrow. Excited. So we're excited to see all of you. You can also buy shirts you can buy posters. Yeah, you can get great point great fucking when this, come out, hang on. It comes out on Tuesday, the 15th.

Okay, until it might actually be over now. You may or may not be able to buy shirts or posters. You know, yeah, okay, until the end of the day on Wednesday the 16th, like GMT, you can still pre-order the shirts. I'll keep it going for one extra day. Perfect. In case. Our next mainline episode of I guess kill Jason Bourne is going to be the Bourne supremacy. One of the funniest posters I've ever seen. Look at the poster for this. It's so good. He's holding a sniper rifle, but he's looking like

the sniper I was pointing off the screen. He's looking straight sniper rifle, but he's looking like the sniper rifle is pointing off the screen. He's looking straight towards the camera and he's got one eyebrow raise like, oh, great perfect. That's that's going to be the episode out for the next one. The episode out for this one might be if we can fit it into a square image Castell going perfectly over the balcony. If not, see what I could do. Yeah, okay. This has been Kill Jason Bourne. I'm going to say this with the same questioning intonation until I finally get into it.

This is a mid-season break. Absolutely, yeah. Absolutely, and we'll see you next time. Thanks for listening. Wow. Thank you for listening to yet another episode of Kill James Bond. I've said it over start, but I'm going to say it again here. You have exactly one day if you're listening to this the instant that I have released it to pre-order the shirt or the poster or the combo of both weight-savour

fiber. You have to go to killjamesborne.com slash store and chuck that in. I am ordering all of them, I'll be ordering them during the day on like the 17th so if you want some then that would probably be the thing to do. Keltin's one will return in two weeks time for the next born film, which I know I just said on recording, but it's been like two weeks and I don't remember what the next born film is. But if two weeks is simply too long for you to wait, what you could do is head on over to a Patreon. And next week our bonus episode is continue. Something of a theme we've got going. Police Story, number one, Zarynk Jackie Chan. Speaking of course of our wonderful patrons, special thanks to our 15 pounds above patrons and those are Christine Fox, Fox Winchester,

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