Kill James Bond! - S4E16.5: A Serious Man

Episode Date: June 20, 2025

This week we're joined by friend of the show, co-mayor, and all three hosts of this podcast Mattie Lubchansky (thats an S1E18 joke kids) to discuss the Coen Brothers' movie about a man faced with a lot of questions and seemingly no answers. ----- FREE PALESTINE Hey, Devon here. In our home, we talk a lot about how insane everything feels, and agonise constantly over what can be done to best help the Palestinians trapped in Gaza facing the full brunt of genocidal violence. My partner Rebecca has put together a list of four fundraisers you can contribute to- all of them are at work on the ground doing what they can. -Palestinian Communist Youth Union, which is doing a food and water effort, and is part of the official communist party of Palestine https://www.gofundme.com/f/to-preserve-whats-left-of-humanity-global-solidarity -Water is Life, a water distribution project in North Gaza affiliated with an Indigenous American organization and the Freedom Flotilla https://www.waterislifegaza.org/ -Vegetable Distribution Fund, which secured and delivers fresh veg, affiliated with Freedom Flotilla also https://www.instagram.com/linking/fundraiser?fundraiser_id=1102739514947848 -Thamra, which distributes herb and veg seedlings, repairs and maintains water infrastructure, and distributes food made with replanted veg patches https://www.gofundme.com/f/support-thamra-cultivating-resilience-in-gaza ----- WEB DESIGN ALERT Tom Allen is a friend of the show (and the designer behind our website). If you need web design help, reach out to him here:  https://www.tomallen.media/ Kill James Bond is hosted by November Kelly, Abigail Thorn, and Devon. You can find us at https://killjamesbond.com , as well as on our Bluesky and X.com the every app accounts

No one is playing the blame game now. I didn't say anyone was. Well, let's not play he said she said either. I wasn't. Hello and welcome to another bonus episode of Kill James Bond. I am November Kelly, I am joined as always by my friends Abigail, Thorne and Devon. Hello! It's the Summer of Love! It is!

That's what I've heard, at least. And we're joined not only by my friends Abigail, Thorne and Devon, but also by my friend, my No Gods No Mairs co-host and all three hosts of Kill James Bond, Mattie Lebczanski. Mattie, how's it going? It's great, I'm so glad to be back. Finally I chased you through multiple other podcasts while you were talking about this movie to find you here in your house to finally talk about this movie.

Thank you for breaking down the door to my house. No, there is genuinely no one I'd rather talk about this movie with because we are talking about Four Religion Season, which is now finally not just a byword for Catholic season, a movie I really like my second favorite Coen Brothers movie. We're talking about a serious man. Right. And you needed and you're and this is your words to me and I quote some Jew. Yep. I did. I did say that verbatim. I said it also in a very dismissive and racist tone, I think. Yeah.

Yeah, for sure. I mean, because the thing is, I originally considered converting just to both tick it off the completion chart, but also... You're really hedging your bets, religion has me. 100% Abrahamic religion. One of these is gonna be right, okay? Yeah. Yeah, but you've also gotta hope that none of them are jealous.

Which some of them say that they are. Oh, they're all very jealous. That is the thing. Yeah, yeah. The problem is I started with a very jealous one, so that really put me at a disadvantage. You can't be religiously polyamorous. I figured it would take too long to become Jewish in order to be allowed to make in-group jokes. In-group jokes?!

In-group jokes! In-group jokes about this movie! Was the Grinther? Was the Ski Dude there? Did he sell it on Grinted? Should I kill myself? What's a religiously acceptable method? Yeah, the number tried to convert, and the first rabbi did the first rejection of the

three rejections you're supposed to get, and then you felt too bad and just went home. You're like, ah, I'm gonna go home. What's a religiously acceptable method? Yeah, November tried to convert, and the first rabbi did the first rejection of the three rejections you're supposed to get, and then you felt too bad and just went home. You're like, I don't know. That does sound like something I would do, yeah. They're supposed to reject you three times? Is it like drama school? You gotta want it.

Yeah, you're supposed to- the rabbi is literally supposed to slam the door on your face twice. Really? Mm-hmm. Yeah, first time, I'm just like, I go home. But yeah, so, as I say, a dream. And we stopped doing Catholic season. Sort of. I've said many times about the Coen Brothers, that they're very Jewish and very Catholic

at the same time, so you can multiclass. This is my first Coen Brothers movie. Oh, well, I hope you enjoyed it. There's some good ones out there. I did! I really enjoyed it. Yeah. So, we begin with a little epigram, which instructs us to receive with simplicity everything that happens to you.

Cool. I'm hooting when that happens. And then we get a nice little prologue. I just want to note, I have the production notes open, and there's two things you need to know about Joel and Ethan Coen. One is that they say a lot of things about their movies, and some of them are not true. Some of them are lies. And so one of the things that they say about this bit is, oh, it just sets the tone but it doesn't have anything to do with the rest of the movie, this is a lie. This is

a flagrant lie. Yes. I get around this by never listening to anything a director says about their own work. Like, I'll leave it to me, pal. I'll watch the fucking movie and decide what you mean. I'm checking my big clipboard here and it says, you're dead, actually. Yeah. Yeah. But so, we're in the Shtetl, it's a snowy night, and a guy comes home, Velvel, comes

home to his wife Dora, with a funny where, you know, the wheel fell off the cart and I had to fix the cart, and as I was fixing the cart I ran into this other carriage with this guy who you know. Yeah, but I met this old guy. Yeah. Yeah, this old rabbi, Trito Groshkova. Reb Groshkova. Yeah.

And she goes, oh, you dickhead, you idiot. He helped me out, and then she's like, you're a fucking idiot. Dora, I love Dora so much. And he's like, why, why, why? He's like, he died three years ago. She is breaking up a big bucket of ice. It's winter, it's a snowy night outside, she's stabbing this bucket of ice, and when she hears the name, she stops, and she's like, God has cursed us.

Spooky. Spooky. He died three years ago, and he's like, what are you talking about, he can't have died three years ago, I just saw him. And then we get... And it's like, oh fuck, what the fuck is happening? There is another bit here where Velvo is like, he can recite any passage from the Mishnah, right? Like, he's... And so from the Mishnah, right? Like, he's, uh, and so immediately you get

this sense, right, evil is abroad in the land. Mm. I mean, absolutely, I've always said this. It takes on, like, familiar forms, it can quote scripture, but- But instead of abroad, it's actually an old man this time. Evil is an old man in the land. Yeah. Maybe, maybe. Because, because we get this knock on the door and then Velvo's just like, well, obviously I invited him back, it's a cold night, I invited him back for something to eat. And then the door opens and it's this guy, Treadle, and he's like, hey what up, he seems normal.

Mmhm. Charming. Very kind of glad-handing. And basically, the wife comes right out and is just like, are you a dybbuk? Which is some kind of a- It's a demon. Okay, cool. Of Yiddish folklore, specifically like Ashkenazi Jewish folklore, it was the guy that you'd

see in the shtetl that did this kind of thing to you. I should also say, all of these characters are speaking subtitled Yiddish. Yes, they are. And so Dora is like, this is a fucking dibbit. Yeah. It's like, go on then, eat something cunt, prove it. And he's like, oh I can't, I'm full. Yeah, Velvel basically paraphrases my favorite joke from Best in Show, which is, dibbit shmibbit, I said more ham.

He's like, come on. He describes himself as a rational man, right? As a rational man, he knows better. But really, we understand that what he's worried about is like, embarrassment here. This is an influential man, he's a rabbi, and then she's just being insulted. Uh, Reb is not a rabbinic title. Reb is like saying Shri in Hindi or something, it's like, you are a respected elder of the community, you are a knowledgeable man, you know the Hindi or something. It's like very like, it's like you are a respected elder of the community. You are a knowledgeable man. You know the mission or whatever. Yeah.

You can't accuse him of this. Like you'll ruin his career if you, if you, if you publish this. And it's a serious man. Yeah. His, his wife maintains this. She's like, look, he's got one shit. He died three years ago. I'm fucking telling you, look at him. He's got one shaved cheek. That's just like when, you know, they laid his body out, they shaved one cheek, and then they left the room, because somebody was at the door, and then that's why he's walking around now with one shaved cheek. And the guy's just like, I missed a spot when I was shaving this morning.

ALICE In Jewish tradition, you were supposed to watch the body for 24 hours until it is buried immediately. ZOE Yeah, otherwise it gets diverted, yeah. RILEY That's reasonable, you know, it's good to keep an eye on that. ALICE This is again, it's themes, right, you have to carry on these observances, because if you don't, like, demons will get in, right, and it's not just about observance in the sense of like, doing something, it's about vigilance, right?

And so finally his wife just takes the ice pick and just stabs him in the chest with it. Just puts it in him, is it? There you go. Yeah. I love the rest of the scene, first of all, the guy starts laughing. What a laugh. What a laugh on this dude.

She's like, I fucking told you he's a fucking dick. Yeah, there's so many glances between the couple to be like. She's like, I fucking told you he's a dick. But then he starts bleeding. And he, he tries to leave and the way in which he leaves it like spoilers listeners, the theme of this film, one of the themes of the film is like ambiguity and how you can't always tell what's going on. And I love that, like the scene doesn't tell us either way, whether this guy is a dipwirk

because this could be the reaction of a dipwirk who's been caught is trying to style it out. Well, this could be a reaction of an old man who's just been stabbed and is in shock because he just kind of goes, that's damn, that's crazy, and leaves. He's like, ah, you know you're not wanted. Yeah, that's one of my favourite things to see is a man who has just been stabbed getting up and being like, no, I know and I'm not wanted, that's fine, that's fine, I'll leave. And so, Velvol, the rational man, is like, you know, you've doomed us, and Dora just goes-

They're gonna find his body in the morning, he's just gone out into the snow. Nonsense. Blessed be the Lord slams the door. Here's the thing, right. For me, and I'm gonna lay my cards down early on this, Dora is the only clear heroine of the movie. 100%. 100.

Because, right, she observes evil and she acts. And the movie primes us to go, when that happens, you don't get consequences, you don't know what the consequences are. That when supernatural powers are at work, and you do something, you don't get a reward in that moment, or a punishment in that moment necessarily, you have to live with not knowing, and that requires a certain amount of inner strength before things are made very very clear to you. Remember that for the rest of the movie. Yes, genuinely.

But then also she may have just committed murder. Well sure. Yeah, okay, if my wife kills someone, guess what? I'm going on the run. That's fine. No worries, queen. I just call women's wrongs. I believe evil women, and they should be doing whatever they want.

Yeah, 100%. And if it was a mistake, great. That's why I'm on your side, babe. Us against the world. That is standing behind Dev's webcam with a gun. Devan, the way you just looked into the camera when you said that, I was like, should I marry Devan? It's tradition versus reason, right? And so, we go into the opening titles with...

Somebody to love. Alright, you know the drill. If you wanna hear the rest of this bonus episode of Kill James Bond, you have to go to Patreon.com slash Kill James Bond, all one word, and sign up today for at least £5 a month to get access to our entire backlog as well, as this bonus episode episode and any coming ones, any coming ones as well. It's like a subscription you kind of get the ones that come out. Should you be writing this down? Or one word?