Killer Stories with Harvey Guillén - "The Route 40 Killer" Steven Brian Pennell Pt. 2

Episode Date: April 6, 2023

By early July 1988, he had already tortured, mutilated, and killed two women. Police were stumped until they sent in one of their own undercover. And while his wife and children slept, 30-year-old Steven Brian Pennell took the bait. Learn more about your ad choices. Visit podcastchoices.com/adchoices

Due to the graphic nature of this episode, listener discretion is advised. This episode includes discussions of abuse, torture, sexual situations, and murder. Consider this when deciding how and when you'll listen. On September 18, 1988, 22-year-old Michelle Gordon sat in the passenger seat of a blue van, speeding down Delaware's Route 40. She didn't know the driver, but she didn't mind. He had a six-pack of beer. As far as she was concerned, he was going. good company. After all, she was used to adventure, and this was no exception. Or so she thought.

When the man at the wheel finally stopped the van, LePair got into the back. Within seconds, he was pinning her down, a blade in his hands. Michelle tried to thrash away from her abductor, but her cheek pressed against the van's blue carpeting. Then, slowly, gentle as a kiss, The man pressed the knife into Michelle's skin. She screamed under her duct tape, while he drew a thick, bloody line from the top of her thigh to her knee, to her ankle. Michelle sobbed, likely praying for mercy or death whichever came first, but the worst was yet to come, starting with her other leg.

Hi, I'm Greg Paulson. This is Serial Killers, a Spotify original from Power. Every episode, we dive into the minds and madness of serial killers. Today, we're exploring the terrifying murders of Stephen Brian Pennell, Delaware's first confirmed serial killer. I'm here with my co-host, Vanessa Richardson. Hi, everyone. You can find episodes of serial killers and all other Spotify originals from Parcast for free on Spotify on Monday and Thursday. Last time, we discussed Stephen's upbringing and his fear of failure. We explored his maladaptive behaviors. from midnight drives to violent pornography.

And finally, we uncovered Stephen's favorite release, mutilation and murder. Today, we'll follow a one-of-a-kind investigation to catch the Route 40 killer, and we'll meet an undercover cop who lures Stephen into a trap. Finally, we'll see how the task force formed an unusual relationship with Stephen's family, hoping to find the perfect evidence to stop him.

We've got all that and more. coming up. Stay with us. This episode is brought to you by Shopify. Bonnie and Clyde, the lonely hearts killers, Butch Cassidy and the Sundance Kid. These are infamous criminal duels. But you don't need to break any laws to find your perfect business partner

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And now you can try it for free at ZipRecruiter.com slash killers. That's ZipRecruiter.com slash killers. Meet your match on ZipRecruiter. This episode is brought to you by Prime. Obsession is in session. And this summer, Prime Originals have everything you want. Steamy romances, irresistible love stories, and the book to screen favorites you've already read twice.

Off campus, L, every year after, the love hypothesis, Sterling Point, and more. Slow burns, second chances, chemistry you can feel through the screen. Your next obsession is waiting. Watch only on Prime. By early July, 1988, 30-year-old Stephen Brian Pennell had graduated from watching porn

to bringing his sadistic fantasies to life. His wife, children and neighbors, had no idea the local, gentle giant had tortured, mutilated, and murdered two women. However, Newcastle County Detective Sergeant Jim Hedrick and Delaware State Detective Joe Swinsky were a step ahead. The two officers had already connected the deaths of Shirley, Ellis and Kathy A. DeMorrow. They had a hunch. One person was responsible for both kills. After all,

it wasn't usual for a murderer to slice his victim's nipples, especially not in Delaware, where there'd never been a confirmed serial killer. Looking for guidance, the detectives presented their case to a group of FBI behavioral science experts at Quantico. After reviewing crime scene photos, evaluating the victims, and analyzing the area where they vanished, the agent's determined the young detectives were likely correct. A serial killer was using Route 40 as his hunting grounds. The behavioral experts developed a profile of the murderer. Hendrick and Swiskie should look for a white male, around 25 to 35 years old,

who worked or lived within a five-mile radius of where the bodies were dumped. The man likely drove a truck or a van as he appeared to kidnap and kill his victims in his vehicle. And based on the mutilation, which involved side cutters and hammers, He knew his way around the toolbox. So perhaps he was a carpenter or electrician. So far, the analysis was spot on. The experts even had insight into Stephen's personal life. They determined that if he was in a relationship,

he was abusive or otherwise problematic. Vera's broken arm, which she'd never reported to authorities, proved them right. The profile was accurate, but Swisky and Hedrick weren't going to have an easy time tracking him down. The FBI warned the Delaware police, This guy is going to look like your average Joe. You're looking for a needle in a haystack. So the Delaware detectives hatched a plan to use an undercover female cop as a trap. The officer could pose as a sex worker along Route 40 and slightly interrogate suspicious men who fit the profile. The Bureau also gave one final warning. They said the man's confidence was growing and he wouldn't stop until he was in custody.

So Swisky and Hedrick had no time to waste. Back in Delaware, they began interviewing officers who were women, looking for someone brave enough to draw out the killer. Unsurprisingly, there weren't many volunteers. Bate was not an appealing job title. Eventually, 23-year-old Renee Lano stepped up to the challenge. She was only a rookie cop, but she was driven and fearless. In early July, she agreed to tuck her blonde hair into a brown wig and pose a woman. and pose as a sex worker along Route 40.

While Renee hit the streets, Swisky, Hedrick, and a few other officers followed and surveilled. But the authorities didn't count on Stevens' adaptability. He had established patterns, but this didn't mean he was stuck in his ways. Vanessa's going to take over on the psychology here and throughout the episode. Please note, Vanessa is not a licensed psychologist or psychiatrist, but we have done a lot of research for this show. Thanks, Greg. According to a 2004 study in a... aggression and violent behavior, sexual killers can rapidly vary their MO because they learn better

ways to murder without detection. Though Stephen needed his rituals for psychological satisfaction, he was free to change other aspects of his murders, like his hunting grounds, dumping locations, and timing. So, while Renee and the other detectives waited around Route 40, Stephen had moved on to an entirely different highway. On August 22, 1988, 27-year-old Margaret Lynn Finner took her kids to a Monday dinner at showbiz pizza. After the cheesy meal, the family went home to watch Disney movies. As the night wound down, the mother tucked the boys into bed and told her stepfather she was heading out. Margaret was a recovering drug addict, and her parents thought she'd left her sex work days behind her. They didn't know she struggled

to pay the bills even with her supermarket job, or that she'd secretly started working the streets again to make a good life for her children. After leaving home that evening, she waited for clients off Route 13 outside the General Wayne Inn, only five miles away from where Shirley and Kathy disappeared. Late that night, a blue Ford van with roundhead lights pulled up.

After a quick chat, Margaret got into the car. It may have seemed like a typical deal. Margaret drove off with her client, maybe content that she'd be able to pay for the next pizza night. She probably didn't consider that she'd never see her children again. The next morning, Margaret's stepdad woke up and noticed her neatly made bed had not been slept in.

It seemed odd. Then, later that day, he got a call from one of her friends, who said she saw Margaret get into a blue van the night before. Margaret's family called the police and alerted Detective Jim Hedrick to her disappearance. However, no one knew where she'd gone since she got into the van. We don't have a ton of info on the investigation, but Hedrick may have wondered if his serial killer had taken yet another victim. Perhaps he hoped the undercover operation would pick him up soon. But Reney wasn't having much luck there either. It was a tough job.

After a full day of work, Renee would dress up, conceal a microphone, and spend all night talking to clients. Swisky and Hedrick sat in cars nearby, smoking cigarettes to pass the time. Like chimneys, both of us. Swisky once said. Over two months, Renee spoke to more than 100 men. Only a few stood out, including a schoolteacher who drove a blue van. But after an investigation, police ruled him out as a suspect. By September, the lack of progress likely weighed on the group.

Defeated and tired, perhaps Renee wondered whether she'd even be able to tell if she was talking to a killer. She wouldn't have to wait long to find out. Coming up, Renee has the most... terrifying conversation of her life. Listeners, we want to take a moment to tell you about something very special happening at Parcast. It's a month-long event called Dark Green, Earth Crimes and Conspiracies, commemorating the Earth Day

celebration and featuring new episodes across the entire network. Like on Unsolved Murders, Explore the Life, Career, and Shocking Murder of Primatologist Diane Fosse. Or Unsolved Murders, Discover a pair of tragedies where the good intentions of environmentalists also turned them into targets. And coming up on serial killers, two men whose love of the outdoors was outmatched by their desires to kill. Starting next week,

catch these episodes and more all month long. Just look for the dark green, Earth Crimes and Conspiracies artwork and listen for free. Only on Spotify. Transport your senses with Sol Dijanado's limited edition perfume mist collection. At Sephora,

spritz on lush notes of rainforest orchid and crisp sea breeze with hafresco paraizzo. Embrace a floral and fruity scent inspired by Rio's nude beach with chiqui bikini or capture sun-kissed bliss with limonada gelada, where zesty Brazilian lemonade accord meets coconut milk and golden brown sugar. Don't miss Sol de Janeiro's limited edition perfume mist collection only at Sephora. Now back to the story. In September 1988, Stephen Brian Pinell acted like a good-natured family man, living up

to the values he was taught as a kid. He did favors for neighbors, spent time with his children, and took electrical work whenever he could. But he still had his bad habits. He skipped work, fought with his wife Vera, and spent entire nights driving alone

on the Delaware highways. There was little threatening about the bright blue van with a giant rainbow on the license plate. Nobody would have guessed that in that same vehicle, Stephen had taken at least two lives. And it seemed he still wasn't satisfied.

On September 10th, a warm Saturday night, Stephen likely got into his treasured blue Ford and started driving. It's possible that at some point that night, he spotted a young woman with a bloody nose and shoulder-length hair, walking along Route 40. 26-year-old Kathleen Ann Meyer had gotten into a fight with her boyfriend that evening. In the heat of the argument, he hit her. As a stunned Kathleen felt blood drip from her nose, she stormed out of the house. She set out from her home in Brookmont Farms, the same neighborhood where Stephen's first victim, Shirley Ellis, lived. Soon, she was marching along Route 40. A blue van pulled over.

Kathleen hurt and angry climbed in. Perhaps the driver offered to give her a ride somewhere. She didn't know if his compassion was motivated by something sinister. According to a 2008 study in serial murder and the psychology of violent crimes, people tend to associate serial killers with psychopathy and sociopathy, disorders which make empathy difficult. However, this study focused on a behavior every person is capable of, compartmentalization. When Stephen met people, he may have organized them into two compartments, those he cared about versus those he didn't.

The former included family and friends, the latter strangers. When he met Kathleen on the side of the road, he placed her in the second category so he could dehumanize her. He saw her as something to destroy without a second thought. At the exact moment Kathleen got into the car, an off-duty cop noticed the woman's bloody nose, which told him something was wrong. Just in case, they wrote down the license plate number, RV 2059. Stephen Pinell's tag. Later, the officer must have second guessed their instigued. because they didn't report the incident or the license plate,

not even when Kathleen's boyfriend called 24 hours later and reported her missing. It was a missed opportunity that would have led authorities directly to Stephen, but it wasn't their only shot to catch him. On September 14th, four days after Kathleen disappeared, Stephen was driving along Route 40 when he passed a young woman with brown hair standing on the side of the road. Out of curiosity, he pulled a U-turn and headed back for another look. He wanted to stop, but she was in a well-lit area by a shopping center. It was way too public.

Still, he couldn't resist. He drove by the woman six more times in 20 minutes, perhaps debating whether or not he should pick her up. Stephen didn't know the young woman was undercover cop Renee Lano, or that Detective Hedrick waited nearby in an unmarked vehicle. Renee had already clocked the van's odd behavior. Something about the vehicle gave her goosebumps, so she told Hedric about it with her hidden microphone. Together, the duo decided to move somewhere darker and more private, where the driver

might be more compelled to stop. Around 1130, Renee stood alone at a dimmer spot along Route 40. That's when she saw the same blue van creep by. Perhaps, now that she was in a more secluded area, it would stop. Just as she and Hedric had hoped, the brake lights glowed bright red. The driver slowed, then eventually halted right beside her. It was time to put on a show. Renee moved toward the passenger side window, already memorizing the license plate,

RV 2059. She tried to keep her demeanor casual and clergy, but she was nervous. Renee got a good look at the driver's face. He was tall, burly, and had a beard. More importantly, he matched the FBI's description of the serial killer, a white 25 to 35-year-old driving a van. Stephen asked her to get in, but Renee knew better than that. She asked what he was up to that night, and he said he'd fought with his wife.

As they made small talk, Renee tried to stop herself from trembling. It wasn't just because he said he was an electrician, another detail from the FBI profile. It was also because Stephen looked at her sullen and quiet with... Dead eyes. At one point, Renee complimented Stevens' van. She suggested he'd turn on the lights so she could see the inside. As soon as the yellow lights clicked on, Renee went cold. The interior was covered in blue carpet,

exactly like the fibers found on Kathy DeMorrow's body. Trying to maintain a flirtatious tone, Renee gushed over the carpeting. She ran her hands along the inside of the door, saying what a neat idea it was. It was a sly move. Unnoticed by Stephen, she tugged out a pinch of fibers and snuck the blue fuzz into her purse. For a while, the two haggled over the price of oral sex, but Stephen became impatient.

Renee didn't want to push her luck, so she said she was too high and wasn't interested. Frustrated, Stephen drove off. He circled Route 40 and 13 for 120 miles. For hours, the electrician drove up and down the street. same roads, perhaps picturing what he would have done if Renee did get into his car. He didn't remotely consider that she wasn't a victim at all, but his greatest foe. Hedrick and Renee sent the carpet fibers to the FBI's crime lab for microscopic testing. They'd see if they matched the material found on Kathy's body. While waiting for results, they learned the van's tag number, RV 2059, belonged to a man named

Stephen Brian Pinell. He lived with his family in Glasgow Pines Trailer Park, close to where the bodies were found. What's more, one officer recognized the license plate number, the one who saw Kathleen Meyer get into the blue van. The police now had a suspect as well as another potential victim. They didn't have the resources to watch Stephen 24-7, but Swisky and Hedrick followed him around anyway. They tailed him to his job sites, and more often than not, surveilled his meandering drives. On September 18th, four days after Renee's close encounter, an undercover car followed Stephen while he cruised Route 40 and 13.

Late that night, they watched him head home, turn off the vehicle, and trudge inside. After a while, the lights went out. Satisfied that Stephen had gone to bed and Route 40 was safe. The officers completed their report and went home. But they called it just a bit too early. Stephen couldn't sleep that night. Perhaps he got into another fight with Vera. Maybe he was just hungry for another victim. Whatever his reason, he slipped out of the house, got into his car, and hit the road. That same night, 22-year-old Michelle Gordon stormed out of a tavern after the bartender refused to

serve her. She stumbled into the darkness, perhaps heading toward DeVille Motel, a place she sometimes stayed near the Route 13 and 40 split. Michelle's younger brother always said she was too trusting. The petite brunette sex worker never suspected anyone of having bad intentions. That may be why a friend spotted her accepting a six-pack of beer from an unidentified man that night. Then later, she got into a blue van. It's impossible to say exactly what happened to Michelle once she sat down in the vehicle.

Someone likely took her somewhere, dark and eye. isolated, where they easily could have overpowered her. Michelle, five foot three inches and intoxicated, likely didn't stand a chance against her attacker. Her abductor restrained her by tying her wrists and ankles. And as Michelle thrashed in terror, the attacker drew a knife. He slid the blade down the entire length of her leg, then drew the same bloody line on her other.

Soon the attacker decided to switch methods. He traded the knife for a hammer and used the tool to beat her on the a buttock. It was the same method Stephen had used on his other two victims. Michelle couldn't tolerate the torture, especially because she had cocaine in her system. At some point, her heart likely gave out. The killer didn't seem to mind that his victim had died in the middle of his fun because he still cut her left nipple. Satisfied, he dumped her body into the Chesapeake and Delaware canal. Two days later, a dump truck operator found Michelle's naked and brutalized body,

on the south bank of the canal near Summit Bridge. He called the police who rushed to the scene. There were many similarities between Michelle and the other victims, but from the state of her body, it seemed her torture was much harsher than the previous ones. Apparently, the FBI was right again. The Route 40 killer was getting more sadistic. The Newcastle County police were frustrated they'd left Stephen at home, only for him to possibly go hunting after they left.

They needed to dial up the heat. On September 20th, the same day Michelle's body was found, Hedrick followed him to a pep boy's auto shop. There, the mechanics revealed Stephen had installed new tires. His old ones were still at the store, thrown into a pile of 30 other discarded tires. Hedric hit the jackpot. He sent every single tire to the FBI lab. If any of them matched the tracks from Kathy's crime scene, it would be another piece of evidence against Stephen. Four days later, Hedrick and Swisky got a call from the FBI lab. It seemed two of the 30 tires matched the tracks.

Not only that, but technicians were finally able to say, with absolute certainty, the fibers Renee Lano took from Stevens' truck, matched the blue material on Kathy's body. It wasn't enough for an arrest. Just because Kathy was in Stevens' car didn't mean he killed her. The cops couldn't risk charging him with such flimsy evidence. If they wanted to nab their prime suspect, they'd need to get creative. Coming up, the cops become friendly with Stevens family. Want to support your gut health?

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Now back to the story. After discovering three mutilated bodies in less than a year, the Newcastle County Police Department finally had a prime suspect, 30-year-old Stephen Brian Pinell. But they knew they'd need more resources if they wanted to put the brakes on the Route 40 killer. So they created a joint task force with the state. State Police Department.

For months, Hedrick and Swiskie had practically worked alone. Now they had a 50-person team, and Delaware Governor Mike Castle granted them unlimited funding. The state's checkbook was wide open. The team could easily follow Stephen 24 hours a day. A squad of undercover cars would tail him at a distance until he reached Route 40. Then, to avoid being spotted, an air unit would take over. Two helicopters and a light plane tracked Stephen from the. skies all night. With all this spending, the hunt for Stephen Pennell quickly became the most expensive

investigation in Delaware history. The efforts cost $35,000 a week, and they put every tool to use, including light subterfuge. On September 30, 1988, two officers pulled Stephen over for committing a traffic violation. One cop took him to Justice of the Peace Court, while the other seized the real prize. He drove Stephen's van to a parking lot. There, technicians ran to the vehicle. They'd trained for this moment. They searched the entire car, taking carpet samples and fabric swatches. They also planted a hidden microphone so that they could listen in on Stephen,

whenever he was in his blue ford. As they snapped photos of every inch, they spotted an old newspaper clipping, one on the murders of Shirley and Kathy. It seemed their killer was interested in seeing his crimes in print. They were in and out of the vehicle in no time at all and left no trace behind. Then for the next month, they tracked Stephen's movements. They watched as he left his home every morning, pretending to go to work. For hours, he either visited adult bookstores, drove around, or simply sat in his parked car.

In the evening, he'd hang out with his family, then leave for a cruise, and one day he realized something was up. On October 23rd, the murderer noticed a car behind him was making all the same turns he was. He got a strange feeling. Stephen drove home and began cleaning out his van. He likely didn't even know what he was looking for. When his daughter asked what he was doing, he just said he was exploring. That's when he spotted the microphone. He ripped the wires out, cutting the recording immediately.

From a nearby unmarked car, the officers watched Stephen in dismay. They'd been made. The suspect would now be more careful, or maybe even stop killing altogether. The chance of catching him red-handed had plummeted in an instant. But they could still act before Stephen had a chance to destroy any evidence. Their team soon raided his home in Glasgow Pines' trailer park. They searched every inch of the property and van, seizing anything that could be useful. This included tools, zip ties, and stained foam padding from under the vehicle's car.

carpet. They also found Stephen's beloved porn tape, The Taming of Rebecca. This still wouldn't be enough to convict Stephen. So while their technicians examined the evidence, other officers continued to tail him and camp outside his house. By now, they weren't even trying to hide. On the contrary, the electrician and his family developed a unique relationship with the task force. In the mornings, Stephen would walk outside and voluntarily share his schedule with the officers, even though nobody asked him. to. It was like he still wanted to be helpful, especially to police. After all, he'd looked up to law enforcement officers since he was a child. His children greeted the team outside the house

and even tried to sell them cookies for a school fun drive. They saw Renee Lano like a neighbor or friend. They sometimes bounded up to her unmarked car to tell her about their day or share project they'd made in school. One day, Stephen gave the team their hidden microphone back. Here, he said, I thought you guys would be looking for this. But no matter how kind or virtuous Stephen acted, nobody could forget the extreme torture Shirley, Kathy, and Michelle had suffered. And if they did, they received a terrible reminder

on November 12th. While hunting along the south banks of the Chesapeake and Delaware Canal, a man saw something strange tangled in the marsh reeds. He took a step closer, unsure what it was. Then he realized it was a huge, human corpse. Authorities came to recover the decomposed body, but the remains were mostly skeletal. There appeared to be signs of mutilation, but little evidence for a more definite ruling.

An autopsy revealed the body belonged to 27-year-old Margaret Lynn Finner, the mother spotted getting into a blue Ford in August. Six days later, the task force officially suspended the search for Kathleen Meyer, the woman with the bloody nose who disappeared in September. If she'd been dumped in the canal like thinner, her body had likely washed out into the Delaware Bay. From there, it would have gotten lost in the Atlantic Ocean. While the investigators might never connect Stephen to Kathleen, they did get a new break. They received the results of the lab tests on the evidence they'd seized from his car and home.

The duct tape matched the tape on Shirley and Kathy's bodies. Stephen's tools perfectly aligned with their wounds. Experts found blood on the stained foam padding in Stephen's van, likely Kathy DeMorrow's blood, and a long brown hair that belonged to Michelle Gordon. The task force finally had enough evidence to tie Stephen to Kathy's death. Surely a Michelle were less certain, and Kathleen would be nearly impossible to prove without her body. Still, it was enough for the task force to consult with the FBI, then obtain a superior court warrant. On November 29, 1988, exactly one year after the murder of Shirley Ellis, officers arrested Stephen at his home.

The now 31-year-old looked at the arresting officer and said, I guess it is time. When the cop verbally agreed, the suspect merely seemed resigned. He said, I thought so. Over the next year, the trial of Stephen Brian Pinell progressed quickly. The electrician maintained his innocence. But when he talked about the dead women, his eyes and voice remained flat, completely unemotional. It came across as cold and aloof. After an eight-week trial, the jury found Stephen guilty for the first-degree murder of Shirley Ellis and Kathy DeMorrow.

Since they couldn't reach a verdict for Michelle Gordon, the third charge was declared a mistrial. Stephen received two consecutive life sentences, but the proceedings were far from over. In 1989, another DNA test revealed the bloodstains in Stephen's car matched Kathleen Meyer, the woman who was never found. The state indicted Stephen for Kathleen's murder and re-indicted him in Michelle Gordon's case. On August 13, 1991, Stephen told his lawyers and a judge he'd plead no contest to the murders, but only under one condition. He wanted the death penalty. Stephen's request shocked everyone from the judge to his family.

This was especially flabbergasting as he still insisted he hadn't killed anyone. He claimed he wanted to spare his wife and kids any further heartache. He'd be a martyr. But perhaps the truth was more complicated. Remember the 2008 study we mentioned earlier? It said some serial killers have to compartmentalize so they can see their victims as non-human and murder them without remorse. But this mindset isn't usually permanent.

After being caught, the perpetrators must confront the reality that they killed human beings. The compartments in their minds disintegrate and the victims are re-humanized. This can overwhelm the murderer with guilt. Perhaps he finally felt the weight of his deeds and craved punishment for his sins. When he made his death penalty case to a judge on Halloween 1991, he cited Genesis chapter 9, He said, Whoever sheds man's blood by man, his blood shall be shed. This court has found me guilty on testimony of witnesses,

so I ask that the sentence be death, as said by the state laws and God's laws. The court granted his wish, and on March 14, 1992, officials prepared 34-year-old Stephen Brian Pinell for Delaware's first execution in 46 years, Dressed in a blue prison jumpsuit and a rosary, Stephen laid on a vinyl table and allowed himself to be strapped down. Several members of the task force showed up in the hope Stephen would tell them where they could find Kathleen Meyer's body. An official asked Stephen if he had any last words.

Those outside the windows held their breath. Instead, Stephen shook his head. The truth, in all its horrific glory, would die with him. And at 9.49 a.m., Stephen Brian Pinell was pronounced dead. In life, Stephen was unable to risk failure or getting close to anyone. Out of fear of letting loved ones down, he confessed his sins to the open road and fantasized about tormented porn stars. He hid behind his coping mechanisms.

In death, Stephen was just the same. Though everyone yearned for the truth, he refused to give it. terrified of being recognized as a monster, he avoided his problems yet again. He went for one last endless drive, the final escape. Thanks again for tuning in to serial killers. We'll be back with a new episode. You can find all episodes of serial killers and all other Spotify originals from Parcast for free on Spotify on Monday and Thursday. We'll see you next time. Stay safe out there. Serial Killers is a Spotify original from Parcast. Our head of programming is Julian Borrow.

Our supervising sound designer is Russell Nash, with Nick Johnson as our head of production, and Quality Control by Spencer Howard. Stacey Nemick is our supervising editor, and Derek Jennings is our writing lead. This episode of Serial Killers was written by Kit Fitzgerald, edited by Ben Carrow and Angela Jorgensen, fact-checked by Catherine Barner,

researched by Brian Petrus, and Chelsea Wood, produced by Bruce Kitovich and sound designed by Carrie Murphy. Our hosts are Greg Polson and me, Vanessa Richardson. Yamava Resort and Casino at San Manuel is California's number one entertainment destination for today's superstars. Catch the Jonas Brothers return to the Yamava Theater stage on April 30th, the powerful vocals of Demi Lovato on May 17th, and the signature Southern Country Rock of Eric Church on July 19th. Tickets on sale now at Yamavaheater.com.

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