Kump - 16 -Return to Freddy's Farm

Episode Date: April 29, 2019

Ray is joined by his long time friend Bill, for a discussion about a strange,  ill-fated educational children's show that they attempted to produce almost 20 years ago.

This episode is brought to you by Amazon Prime. From streaming to shopping, Prime helps you get more out of your passions. So whether you're a fan of true crime or prefer a nail-biting novel from time to time, with services like Prime Video, Amazon music, and fast-free delivery, Prime makes it easy to get more out of whatever you're into or getting into. Visit Amazon.com slash Prime to learn more. Hello, welcome to come. It's been kind of a rough week.

I don't know if some of you might have heard from the Tim Dillon's Going to Hell podcast. I was on it again this week. Reunion, it was a very nice episode. go check that out if you haven't yet you might have heard that uh i lost my phone uh previously in an uber pool and it was a stolen uh they just loses someone took it and uh was trying to you know basically steal my identity uh use my paypal to buy gift cards and scam and it was a real uh it was a rough thing you know i basically i tried to file you know objection of paypal They basically told me the fuck off.

I'm still fighting them on it. It's a long story. I don't get too much into it. But I just got a tweet from a guy. If you've been listening for a while, you might remember. This guy's been harassing me for a while. Cincinnati Benjamin. I guess he's a listener.

It was a menacing tweet. I'll read it to you. He first interacted with me, if you might remember. He had like, sent me available on Twitter. he was tweeted at me he thinks that like he was like i love the show and uh i think he's basically said something like i think you're you might have photographed my mother when you worked at the morgue which i don't even know like i i'm assuming his name's not cincinnati ben j me i don't i don't know names all right i don't remember who i photographed at the morgue uh at the time i mean i

felt bad because you know his mom might have died at the time i worked there i didn't want to but since that he's been harassing me uh sending me his aggressive tweets at one point he's threatened to steal my tax returns out of the garbage, which I even know what that me? Why would I put my tax returns in the garbage? I don't know. He might have just heard on Tim Dillon's podcast, you know, about the whole phone situation, which I talked about, and I was just making it up.

But he, let me bring up my Twitter. Hey, at Ray Kump, I'm the one who took your phone, you obese charlatan. You may have canceled your PayPal, but I still have these pictures of your pig dick. I'm going to send them to everyone on your contact list. Get ready to be disgraced. Also, where's the new episode of Kump? So I guess he's a fan. We are recording late in the day.

It'll be up, you know, we'll listen to it now, so you don't care. But this guy, he doesn't have my phone. I can't imagine. Well, most this guy is stalking me, which, you know, but I don't have pictures of my dick on my phone. So if you, I mean, most of you people listening aren't on my contacts or, You know, if somehow you get a picture from this guy, you know, that's not me. I'm going to say, I don't even know if I can file chart.

I'm a report on the Twitter. I don't know if they're going to do anything about it. They're probably sure. I mean, this guy seems like a troll. Maybe it's Tim Dillon. Who knows? I'm getting sick of this guy. It started out, you know, kind of fun, but he's just getting on my nerves.

Was it a little housekeeping moving on, because I'm going to dwell on this guy. But I want to thank all my Patreon patrons. you people are the true heroes not the troops you're the true heroes the troops they're whatever i don't you know i don't rate to me you guys are really the true americans the true patriots uh so thanks to you diane cage brit pound town michael ricardo richard hoffstetter jason duberville gary barbara ryan la rock keith veronis and eric frankle and last but not least julian assange so thanks all of you you can uh go my patreon page it's on my twitter and instagram you can check it out if you want i'm starting to start putting more video content up

there you can look at some of my uh i made some videos they're on instagram and twitter you can check those out for now i'm gonna you know be expanding soon but uh yeah there's gonna be premium content coming soon we're finally going to get the whole tier system going i'm going legit so thanks all you guys today's a special uh episode of cump i am joined by my good good friend my old friend bill all are hello how are you bill good to be here we've known each other for well was it 20 years about yeah he thinks so a long time since high school and uh in a previous incarnation of my life uh i used to do uh films uh none of them successful um but yeah i was a aspiring uh filmmaker making very odd um inaccessible weird films that didn't see the light of day

so but um they started that really we started making films at one point but we started out in a very odd way uh we were making a tell a show for kids a kids television show called freddie's farm oh yes i remember that pretty well um i was farmer freddie it was basically this was this was a concept um maybe you can elaborate if you remember what where the genesis of this of this idea was Because basically it was an educational show for kids. It actually predates you, but you came in right after. It was, well, what happened was Andrew myself, like friend Andrew, a childhood friend. We're obsessed with public television and really shitty kid shows.

Right, like, is that really Zoom? Well, first it was PBS. It was Zoom. It's a new Zoom. Oh, Zoom. Okay. Zoom, Z-O-O-O-M. Tell everyone what Zoom was like.

Well, apparently it was a classic Zoom in the 70s. I know nothing about. But then there was Zoom in, what was it, fucking 1999-ish, I guess. I met you in 99, so it's probably 98-99 to start happening. Yeah, because 98 to Prisager. So, and then we got hit him involved. And he wasn't involved. We just...

This is a bombshell. Are you trying to tell me there was another Freddie before me? No, this is the genesis to... Okay. So what happens is... I turn on PBS one day, and there's a bunch of these awful, talentless children who are doing these experiments and they're kind of

experiments It's like a What the hell did they do? I don't know I was laughing the whole time It was like a Mr. Wizard kind of thing Yes except Like there was no adult supervision

But they weren't like doing kids things Where you're cursing and like So it was Mr. Wizard But with no scientist No education Just a bunch of slobby kids Yeah awful children Were they actually trying

Like they have beakers And like test tube? No they weren't doing I don't remember like It was like nothing educational I think there was a fact name David. Here's how it's okay. You're flipping through the channels. There's cable vision.

The stolen shitty network. And I'm flipping to this fat, stupid kid. It looked like my brother at the time when he was chubby. It's this dumpy kid and then these other awful children. But this one kid, they were counting, they were doing something with money.

And they, he was counting the money wrong. It wasn't like edited out or anything. And the other kids were correcting him. We were just laughing at him. So wait, so, Just to paint a picture here, a fat kid named David, what was this set like?

Was it like a, was it like a school setting? It was like just a black, like a set, like a room, like a big room. Like a public access show. Yes. Okay. So you were a fat kid named David, and he's just counting money? That's the, I just distinctly remember him. Like, they were doing something where we were trying to teach something.

And he was like, he was getting all the amounts wrong. Like, whether like the red hit or the red hair girl and she was like doing this and that. and like, it's like, and David would be like, oh, that's $1.50. And she'd be like, no, it's actually $1.75. Wait, so this is like an unscripted show. I can't remember what they did otherwise. They must have been doing something that was accessible to kids. So presumably they're trying to teach kids about money.

So they guess one thing. It was like, I can't remember what the, it was like stick-stickly and Nickelodeon shit. But like, I was laughing. I was, I was like 16 at the time. And we became obsessed with the crappiness of it. So basically you have these. You can send them letters to them? I guess, like, they sang songs

and dance, I think. So you have a bunch of what sounds like just slobish improv kids, kids who were trying to be actors. And they're basically doing these rudiment, like, Mr. Wizard, if you ever watched the show, Mr. Wizard. Well, at least that. That show has some charms of it. No, I'm saying. Mr. Wizard was showing the

Galloian, where, like, an older scientist, presumably, or, you know, but he would have, like, dry ice and, like, fucking... You just, if you... You know, he had a lab, and he would, like, rub balloons on people. Mixing it, you know, bleach and Monia. It would be like, a bucket.

And watch you smell this kid. And, uh, but, you, I believe there was the, the patina of, uh, of science and experiments going on. But for some reason, on cable vision, they had just to show Zoom where there was a kid, like, they were trying to teach kids about money. So there's a, well, there's a one thing that I'm sure they try to teach us about, like, other things like, I'm actually trying to remember, like, what they held they did. Because it was a shittier show we eventually got on to.

But anyway, we'd send fake fan letters just talking about David and stuff. There was a kid named There was one, like, cool kid Who I obviously ran it named Jared And he had like a slick back hair And all that Or saw it like a parted air And apparently this kid I met

A kid who lived Summer kid who down the road from me I was We were obsessed with talking about this show And sending fake things we were doing For whatever dumb reasons I can't remember I don't remember what I used to think

And act like it's funny But you basically became obsessed With these like These incompetent children And so you wanted to The kid down the beach though He actually went to school with Jared And he was like

He's like, I know that kid Jared And that's that I'm like, tell him I'm a big fucking fans Oh fucking David's Like those Apparently he did

And then Jared goes These 16 year old guys are watching Zoom What are they? Yeah He was the fucking losers And then the next year I see Like in the next summer He's like how's the fuck's Jared doing

He said you're losing And the next summer It's like how's Jared doing Oh he died in a car car car Where the kid died in the car car car But Jared was Who was a more put together than David

He seemed like the leader of the kids. Okay. So that's, if I just write Zoom, their faces have to come up, PBS. Are you Googling the pictures of the Zoom kids? So basically, look,

the basic gist of this is that, you know, you witnessed this incompetent kids show. I think the moral is like there really was no education going on, right? It wasn't Mr. Wizard where it was interesting and like you actually learned something.

See, the problem is it was a much more famous version of Zoom in the 70s. And that's like, they tried to redo that. Is this David? Oh, here he is. This kid seems like a nice guy.

I mean, I have no ill will towards David. He seems like, you know, he's struggling to keep it together. I don't know why he's on camera. He doesn't seem, you know, he has a lot of trouble. Whatever. The point, we're getting mired. And the idea is, though, this was the genesis for an idea that you came up with, with Andrew, called Freddy's Farm. And what was your vision for Freddy's Farm?

Well, after, just quickly, I don't even remember. There was a show on Channel 25. There was another kid show, like, over and, like, you know wherever they shoot child 12 news and that had real poor production uh things i even forget what it's cool but so from that point we're like oh we can make a shitter show than this for kids and we'll just like hide stuff in it and make it like you know kind of the ways when you're a kid and you watch uh i'm trying to think maybe like muppet baby something but it had like clips of the three stooges and stuff but we were trying to hide like things that kids burned

maybe if they put a hand on an oven or whatever. Right, well, basically, so that's your vision. Basically, I met Bill in, you were a year behind me in school, and we hung on a couple times. We were kind of becoming friends, and you came up to me one day and said, hey, my buddy and I want to do a children's TV show with you as a star.

It's called Freddy's Farm. And I didn't know what to make of it. I found, you know, it was a little disturbing. You showed me, I think. I think I came over your house. I didn't show him in my house You put that weird Like sun hat on

It was vaguely like a farmer's hat You're like I should be a farmer I was apparently I found this hat And it was a farmer's hat I don't know why he was around your house I guess you know And yeah also we have big

Big like those rubber shitty boots You get at like Like waiting boots For like waiting in the river Not full waiters But yeah once they go to your knees So you didn't ever fit properly Right so we were in Catholic high school

So basically I came over to Andrew's house We dressed you up I guess Well we didn't dress me up If I remember correctly I was where I came over on a whim. You guys said you want me to be the star of a children's TV show and I came over to Andrew's house

after school one day. I guess your mom drove us or whatever and I was wearing my school uniform with a blue Columbia sweater I remember with a farmer. That's how literally I remember. I say I'm trying to like when we were before tape I was trying to remember a lot of this. I'm so many degrees away from

the way that person we were all sure. People we weren't at that but like but yeah you came on. I think there's when we were walk around and just film me in front of garbage in the street oh maybe well no i think that was a part for you here let me refresh your memory i guess please because basically i remember distinctly that i was wearing basically my school uniform with a farmer's hat and rubber waiters that's how little any of us seemed to give a shit about the choir well we were we had no idea how to make things i make shows i was and you basically were just filming me in your backyard i had some kind of a

like a rake and i was dancing we had a fake shotgun but it would look real because it was like a daisy right uh yeah we had a fake shotgun and i was basically just the the content of the show seemed to be that i were like we we did a thing where i was in the kitchen and we were doing what's hot what's not yeah and we were basically i think the point of the show was the misinformed children yes yes it was just petty we wanted to make a show that would get children hurt it sounds terrible now but like look we didn't expect any kids to watch this i did okay i mean the idea is that you know it was It was a subversive thing.

But, you know... But we were kids, too. We were young people. Bitter, spiteful, hurtful, vindictive people. Right. And... In the best way, the most fun way.

Sure. Not by today, say, but this is the 90s. Yeah, well, we'll get to the AIDS movie. Oh, okay, because I actually was a voice... I remember that a little bit more. Yeah, we can talk about that after this. A little teaser. The AIDS movie...

I would like to refresh myself on that movie before we should talk about... Refresh yourself, Well, look, we're going to find These things exist somewhere, I think And we're going to put them onto Maybe I'll put them onto the Patreon for instance Or Bill's shaking his head Oh yeah, maybe if I get that money

I'm not giving you your Patreon Okay I'm the one that had the content That's the last copies of some of these things Okay, well you're witnessing in real time A rights dispute between me and Bill apparently But we'll work that out We'll negotiate it

but uh no so i'm i'm we're in the kitchen and i'm uh i'm walking around we had like a what was that a rap man oh the cassio a cassio rapman a cassio rap man look up the commercial for that on google it's pretty interesting it was like a little mini keyboard that had like beats yeah yeah we still have it and uh i think we had previously used it to make a song about ralald regan yes you did or abraham lincoln right no you you you i'm you on your own and i was recording you and i think jay was here and one of the pre the one of the beats in it which was just like one of the 12 rap beats with 11 of them were not uh ice ice baby or something like did it or no a hammer time ripped off you had it going at a certain tempo and you were just riffing on reggae yeah let's not

we'll like figure that we'll we'll put that into somewhere maybe we put the end of the episode the reagan yeah i gave that you a second yeah so you know i should you at you You can play it on the computer? Yep. I have it. Oh, why don't you, can you load it up? Yes.

Yeah, so basically, while you're doing that, I'll set the scene, this is a prequel of phrase for him. This is one of these five. It's one of these five. Yeah, look for, I'll talk,

we'll only do that. Basically, I think this is where Bill got the idea to use me as talent. Oh, maybe that's true because that's the first time in my house. Right, because.

Or second time. One of the time. And like, you know, I don't know what the word. We were just, look, it was a good old days. You know,

This is before YouTube. This is before, you know, Instagram and Twitter. And you just make content to make it. We were just creative kids. We need it. I don't even think Napster was out then. No, I mean, there might have been, you know, weird, you know, torrent sites or Peter PeerPier Networks. But, no, and I don't know why we were talking about Ronald Reagan.

No, you did. You just went off on your own. Like, you started freestyle. You were freestyling. So, Bill gave me a beat. And I guess, look, I grew up in a household. Here it is. My father loved Ronald Reagan.

He came of age at the right time, came out of college of the CPA. And, oh, can you put the mic up to the speaker? Yeah, let me see the best way. We'll try to maybe put that in a more digestible form. How long is that clip? Altogether I'm sorry, new iTunes is garbage It's about five minutes

Five minutes five about Five minutes of that I think at one point You referenced Fort Sumter at some point Yeah, I remember it's Fort Sumter Which is the fort that The line I Abraham Lincoln

The first Republican motherfucker is a line I think I don't look I mean like I can't It's hard to unpack in my head While I was thinking of the time You were sitting in the middle of the room By yourself not facing anyone Singing into a mic

Like the guy from Tool Jay Lane and I were trying to get Because you had to drive You and Jay to battle So I was basically Like Maynard from Tool Singing into a rap man About about Ronald Reagan

Pacing a wall basically Yeah This is You'll want to hear It sounds insane Through the speakers So we'll put that And we'll put that in a decimal format

So we had this And that's where you got the seed To be like Oh let's let's let's Probably yeah Yeah because you did that And I believe we used the rap man also in the background

of Freddy's Farm. We didn't know how to edit things at the time. We were just basically, if we wanted music, we would just put the rap man on and then, you know, do what we were doing, which was me walking around a kitchen. I think Andrew was the voice of conscience. Oh, yeah. Which was, we had a weird little

Christmas ornament thing that would be on my shirt, a little green man and like, but Andrew would voice him off camera and he was like, hey, Freddy, I'm your conscience. And like, and he would tell me to, like, he would tell me to hurt people and to um was the kitchen before after we were

playing someone's garbage in further house and broad daylight it was like a refrigerator box and you just get in and you go I'm in a time machine I think that was episode two okay that was we took we took the show on the road after the first instance this is like 3 p.m. after school yeah look this was not like this was this wasn't a call sheet we didn't have none of us had any we didn't have a budget and a plan or script we basically got together and the the first

thing we did was have his thing like what's hot and what's not I think you were bungalow bill that was your character yeah I had a puppet and we were walking around a kitchen me in a fucking school you know I'm calling myself a farmer and I'm dressed in a fucking in slacks and like a tie in a shirt with a sweater

over it and I'm just like a shitty a shitty law like professor of a community college and I'm having a farmer's hat and I'm going and bungalow bill is my sidekick and I'm at he's asking me like hey Freddy what's What's hot? What's not?

I had a puppet on my hands, too. You didn't have some kind of puppet. I had, yeah. And we were basically, the whole thing was that, like, you know, we were pointing at thing, that's hot, like the, the stove or that's not. I don't remember. But the point, the thing ended with me saying to you, what's that? That's not.

And it was a stove. This is not, like, great a humor. This was, like, I'm not vouching for it now. But this is the general. None of it will hold up in any. No, we'll hold up. We're not pretending this is great stuff. But then you pretend to burn yourself.

No, you pretend to burn yourself. I thought you burned yourself. No, I think you, no, I'm pretty sure it was you. Let's not get mired than that. Oh, of course not. But, uh, and that was like that, that's, that's the kind of stuff, uh, but this was the kernel of, uh, you know, where, where, like, you know, my, eventually I did start to become, you know, we became film, like, you know, independent filmmakers, we tried to

successful, but, you know, we, we, that lit the spark in you. It let the spark. I mean, I think at the end of, like that camera off the eBay. Right, right, we'll get to that in a second. But, yeah, but like, um, because we, we basically. basically after that we went to an ice cream the ice cream truck came and we were basically harassing the ice cream truck guy

okay so the ice cream truck guy came and you started an interview was this day one or two the first I remember three times then and the third time the only where you were going into the fire department was a foot right but anyway said in the first day so you walk I remember what the ice cream truck is he came up

the guy you start talking about whatever and then he goes I'm what do you do for a actually do for a living the guy goes I'm working on my NBA and I'm like always get I'm like, here comes the joke. And you just start going off for something. No, it's like basketball. I'm so annoyed.

You never. You want me to make the pun about basketball with the end. This guy who's, blame me, whatever you said was so much less funny. We're bothering a night. We're bothering this guy. It's fun.

I don't think it was 40 probably. It's probably like 30. 25. But to a 16 year old, the 30 year old looks like the same. The funny thing to me looking back is that we were like kind of bothering this guy who's like, remember when the guy. Who was like driving an ice cream truck.

I don't think we look down on him, but he's like, but he's the way when you're a kid, he's the ice cream guy but he's like going to school for his fucking MBA so much more successful than me so much more like the devoted uh you know uh accomplished even at that stage of his life than i'll ever be and i'm looking back and these fucking this fat idiot and his fucking dumb friends are just bothering him i think uh you whatever so this was the gen it was it was not great but then we went our separate ways and then we got together you and ice going to go

separately what he's just saying? No, we went up. That was episode one. And then eventually we started, we did things. Then we started getting around the town, but I remember then the third time is actually around the entire town.

That was the, okay. Well, basically, yeah, we were going to the fire department. Which was funny. That was a funny one. Only because we walk into the fireman, we interview, yes. You start talking to the firemae showing

you the trucks. All I remember is, if I knew what you meant and I didn't realize until after, why he said what he said was wrong why happens if a guy with a fire hose is blowing flames everywhere but you might have a flame door if I said fire hose is blowing flames everywhere

You were trying to describe what you were thinking Like a guy Would you guys be called in if a guy was burning everything You know he has a hoosh It's just like What's funny again is just I have the dumb fat animal And like I'm going up these people

And I think I'm like I'm basically acting like I'm Tom Green But like they're not buying it They're not going for it If you remember, the actual, the only one joke that existed in that part was, because Jay was tagging along, and it was about 25 empty kegs laying around the bottom of fire department. He was in,

Jay goes one of those for an extra water. Yeah. He didn't even want to be there. Yeah. No, that was in the library. No, at that time, I wasn't the funny one, I think. I was, I was bizarre. Jay wasn't really part of the crew.

He was more of our captive. Sure, but, well, that doesn't make any sense. We say like that. I mean, like, he never wanted. We want to play astronauts, cool. Yeah, we forced to. him to kind of hang along in front of the roads. But, uh, no, but this was not, uh, me at my father.

This is me in the genesis. We wander into the library and then you're talking to a woman about Harry Potter and you go, is the Harry Parker's he pots plants? The best part is we go to Dairy Park and walk through the drive-thru. And you try to order something. The guys get the fuck out. He tried to attack you. Oh, he was so mad of us.

Yeah, he chased you down the street. Oh, yeah, he was like, he was violent towards me. Who was that? You know, oh, you know the guy, right? Yeah, I know he is now. Paint the picture of his town, Babylon. Like, you spent your youth in this town. It's like a kind of a small town in the island.

Yeah. And, like, a village. Everyone kind of knows each other. I wasn't a part of it. But, like, he knew. The Derry Park guy left his post. Yeah, like, like, Bill knew this guy from the neighborhood. I knew of you as an older kid.

Yeah, he's, when he's old. And as a sibling to other kids. And that, especially. But to me, I'm just being chased by some fucking sociopath because I wanted to do a skit. But whatever. But apparently he was just one of these older kids Who was a, I don't know There's a guy who was always at the bus stop

This guy was every day And he was where, always wear a tank top And he was like a mesh cut off shorts And he'd be dancing to himself With his headphones on He was like a staple there And you actually walked over to him start dancing with Obviously the guy's a mental problem

Yeah, I'm harassing the mentally ill Look, this is not the proudest time And then we talked to the post of it I remember this as I'm saying it The postman we just walk up Start talking to he's hiding his cigarette oh yeah he didn't want to be seen on camera smoking a cigarette and uh but he went with it yeah look people people treated uh look it's it kind of town it's not like new york city where

every idiot from NYU was going around trying to make a short film and like this oh we were better in those things no we weren't spiritually it maybe our kids are our age how little we tried i i don't think anyone listening right now hearing what we just described you're better than NYU film students Let's be a little fucking perspective here. I'm factoring in age and how little we tried. Sure. We didn't try, so therefore we're better.

How much we didn't care how embarrassing we were doing it? We were idiots, yes. We just didn't give you. At least Andrew and I were not embarrassed by any. Well, that's the thing. That's going to be a motif that runs through this whole story. Is that like I was under the impression that we were actually trying to do something. Oh, not at that point, eventually.

Well, look, I mean, but like, even though I didn't, it wasn't my idea. I walk into people's yards I think If I can cram myself with one thing I do have a willingness to like You know jump head first into projects And you said you want to make this children's TV show And what I realized in hindsight Was it was really more about you just putting me

Into weird situations For your own edification A kid's three or four years before that borrowed my game Postal the original version And we went to his house You knocked on the door Oh right We filmed you asked him for my game

He doesn't know who you are He's not wearing a shirt And I'm having the puppet out of the the shrubbery, like, because I just didn't care. I went to his, like, off to the side in his plants of his mother's house. Right, like, and this is like, this could not be interesting to anyone watching

except for you and Andrew, just making an ass out of me. And that's the motif. It was, it was not for the camera. It was for you guys, just, I don't know what. I know, I know we were friends, sort of, at the time. We're friends now. But at the time, I don't know what you guys, you guys seen were rascals. Yeah, first it was

going to be a public kid show, and it was just not surprising you. It just evolved into like you guys just like you know make trying to make me out to be some kind of weird scumbag in front of people um and i jumped and i went along with it because you know that's i don't have half measures you hear me every week you know i i jump it i'm not some guy who fucking you know half asses it so uh that was freddie's farm pretty much i mean we basically there was there was like you know small there was episodes where we found you know a refrigerator in the garbage and like we've jumped in like oh the time machine and like there was a

no and I think we were saying oh again Abraham Lincoln and like he was going to attack in us I just remember he spinning in the middle of the street around the trash going yeah I'm in the past and I remember being in Andrew's backyard and you're dancing the dog comes up and starts harassing you

and special you had a name for the dog and he's their special friend you could get to know people listening to this you would think that we were like describing ourselves at like in a fourth grade you know in a fifth grade

maybe no we were in high school at this point I don't know what the hell we were doing This was not like Well I realized There were kids who like Make like would make super eight films When they were in their fucking In grade school

And they were fucking You know like Spielberg was making these little films That weren't like It wasn't jaws But it was a lot better What we were doing I never saw those films We made in grade school

So I can't judge it yet I'm pretty sure they were more coherent than Freddy's farm Oh yeah Oh coherent yes But they did They did I did get the film Making bug

Because there was one episode the last thing we did where I I couldn't operate the camera because I was Freddie but I had a very specific vision of like the conscious character looking for Freddie

and I think Andrew I want you to go here and move the camera here I think so I don't know I want you to go here and I walk here and get this shot and I didn't know at the time but it was me

like formulating shots and I realized that you know and that oh I enjoy this I want to be a director so I got my own the shittiest camera you can fight I mean

the camera we were using for his farm was okay it was terrible but like i bought the cheapest fucking thing you could ever some monota it wasn't even vhc it was it was it was it was a millimeter which is that's better no it's it's kind of the same uh but it was like the iris will just close for no reason like it would just get dark for no reason all the irs broken there would be look you had this whole story there would be these common refrains of the iris is going and we'd have to like stop shooting because, you know, when we're making Back to Future Part 4,

it was just, the Irish would start. You don't remember that? No. We actually made Back to the Future Part 4 at one point. We'll get that in a minute. The first thing, so I buy this terrible camera, and then we go out one day to Argyle Park with Andrew. Oh, yeah, a cold day. He has a lamp

Coke. I used to work at CVS as a, in a photo developing thing. And, uh... I didn't even at the time I was there and you made that thing where I walk up to his house and he took, you stripped the music from Rushmore and stuck it. It was like I guess that was later. How do you not remember? That comes up. There was actually a

decently put together project we did. That was called 25 books. That was a whole different thing. We'll get to that later. I'll have you here to like illuminate this history. I'm remembering as we're going. And you remember none of it. I'm happy to have you. When it comes back to me, I got those little details.

Like you're going bored of me or the dog. You should get there. No. You had some weird name. I did call him some. weird days. You always gave like these weird Russian names of things. Yeah, I mean I look, I, you all know now listening, like, I love the Russians. I think

they're great. I remember I was trying to, when you were doing the Ronald Reagan day, I was trying to make a punk band and you were like, purple fusion mind monkey is the best name of a punk band. I said that. Yes, you did. Look, I don't know if I've made this point. Should we call total society? Should we call this? Purple fusion mind monkey.

I don't know if I've made this point on the podcast, but this is a very true thing. I look back as myself In sixth grade, an eighth grade, in high school. Everything up to, like, fucking, you know, a few years ago probably. If I could go back in, if I could get a time machine and go back in time with a knife, I would stab myself in the heart. I don't fucking vouch for any of this stuff, purple fuchsia mind. I never once liked that name.

I hate myself. I was always a little embarrassed when you said it. I kind of remember, and I'm so embarrassed. What is I? Well, Jay and I, Jay was here. So it was like, we were like, oh, we'll call total society. That's called Killslaw, Bloodsaber. Purple Fusion Mind Monkey.

I feel like nowadays I come up with a cool names for bands all the time. I'm in a band. Like, you know me. Oh, yeah, you're not pure. Yeah, but we were a purplefuton. Purple fusion mind monkey. Because you said it when we were waiting for my mom to pick us up at front of us, that's horrible school. And then you said again, like it was something.

So it was fixated on Purple Future Milo. Yeah, at week or whatever. Okay. Well, look, they're not all winners, folks. but uh we go we get this lab coat and we got like a fake gun or whatever and I again there was no real fest going on this thing

there was a festival going on and the only thing we were doing at first was we were filming Andrew walking around our girl park which is like a lake with a park around it and it was a festival going on like goose shit he's wearing a lot of goos shit he's wearing a lab coat I think I don't know if he was wearing a gun at that point under him he was

and he was chasing you and Jay and Jay and I were just became a like we were following the things around you two were doing and then it was us being filmed at some point I think well he was chasing you that was where we were staging we're staging a thing and we there was no script

I just had this very vague sense of and look this might sound like a boring thing but it gets a little interesting once we get to the second half of the day because we're just changing oh nine it was it was September 11 2002 or 2003 yeah I remember it was September 11th we filmed on two days

and one of them was the second or first anniversary okay well So basically the first half It's just Andrew in his lab coat We don't know what his thing I think at that point We were calling him a lab code assassin

And then's later I think we'll get the Jay Whatever you just running You two are just running through crowds of people Yeah And he's chasing you and Jay through the park I think eventually you'd film that No it was done that day Okay

Oh no it was done that day but So basically We shoot this thing It's idiotic There's no vision for it We go to Jay's house In his garage and I don't think I can even take credit for it

There's a scene where you and Jay are talking about Oh remember when that guy That lab coat guy was chasing us through the park And like and that's the direction I gave What's up with that guy? That's the vision I had you get what's up with that guy Remember you hit Andrew the bushes by him And had to sneak out like he's coming

It was so stupid But in a stroke of genius In a stroke of genius that dictated the flow of the day Jay ended that scene with an improvised line Saying hey, want to go shoot people with AIDS and we just left it in and then the whole movie became a movie about these two guys

shooting AIDS patients we set that scene up someone got a jar lemonade because lemonade was involved in that scene who goes you want some lemonade why are they hearing you were like why would we be hearing jasonates we got jar and lemonade so there was a reason to be there

so they were there to drink lemonade okay but the more important the more compelling thing is that we staged a movie at this point where these two guys were shooting people AIDS and Andrew was for some reason taking the map because he was the good guy apparently and then I do remember at one point he got Jay got AIDS in the thing this is before South Park did AIDS we were on the cutting edge is at least a year before that yeah we were no one was doing AIDS material back then yeah but like there was at that time also really we felt dicey about it also at the

perfect moment before when AIDS was very like kind of becoming corporate you know before before you You know, it was becoming like a... Where AIDS was becoming corporate? You want a lot of people? Where it was like, you know, you go to school, you have to wear a ribbon. It's like... We didn't have...

No one made you wear a ribbon, but like you're... They had that school. They tried to... I bet they pocketed all that money they collected too. I mean, look, it's very possible. We didn't like our Catholic high school.

And if you told me that the AIDS money they collected, which I don't remember them collecting AIDS money, but if they did, I wouldn't be surprised... Right into the mustache man's pocket. If it went in... That's... Yeah.

We can tell you. Another time we'll tell you stories about the school parrams. The real compelling thing here, I think. We're getting off the subject is that we're making a movie about AIDS patients being killed by these characters.

And I think we all felt pretty dicey about it at the time. I mean, this is the post-9-11, the budding years of post-9-11 where, you know, people are so sensitive in general. And we're just, I don't remember the movie, I remember the movie ends with Jay. So on Diverin, we're in his garage. We're just using props or shooting.

Yeah, I remember. Yeah, Jay has a, a scene where he... Contracts AIDS somehow. Even though he's shooting AIDS patients, he contracts AIDS. And he has a, what, a catharsis or something? Well, he's basically saying, like, I have AIDS. Oh, my mom's going to fucking disown me.

She's going to fucking disown me. Yeah, every moment he didn't walk off the thing to play action is call. We got him to finish the scene. What I think is Jay was like, didn't want to be there, but the only one was a decent actor of any of us, I think. And, but yeah, and it has a really emotional scene

where he's just fucking, and he shoots him, and then he, like, and then Andrew comes up, and we didn't even, like, We were so inept. We didn't even add a gunshot sound. You just heard the click of the shitty plastic rifle. No, we had caps, but it was so poor. I don't know who this was for.

We never showed anyone except for, like, maybe when we met someone new, like, years later, if we felt like they were, you know, kindred spirits, we'd show them the AIDS movie. And it was, uh, I mean, basically, it was cut together in a way. This is before, like, digital video was even a prevalent thing. And you basically were cutting, like, by, like, you know, editing with, uh, just VHS. Like, you know, so there was no quits. good cuts there was those weird like fading cuts and uh it was terrible

it was a really shitty movie i mean half it's dark because the iris in the camera was going um do we i don't know what we were doing this is a weird time and uh but this is look this this leads to other things we made we started to come up with more yeah we didn't just end there and like no this wasn't our like you know this wasn't our john hinkley esk or uh you know it wasn't our manifesto

we didn't it wasn't yeah it wasn't our uh yeah we But we ended up starting to come up with more They ended up being good things But they actually were tried Concrete ideas At one point We made a Back to the Future For film

If you want to call it that Is that when we found You played Doc and I played Marty I had that Oh is that when we found the shopping cart In the garbage Or go in a sump Yeah

I think at some point you like Push a shot You put me in a shopping cart And you like And again The whole point in this day I thought it was to have trying to make this movie, even though it was

inept, and we weren't good at it, but I was trying to make a movie. But I think that your entire goal of you and Andrew was to get me into a shopping car and it crashed me into like a cement blockade. Did we? I believe, I vaguely remember something. I don't remember because I guess we push you

and you just let go. I think you pushed me down a hill. You guys were like, it really was just kind of these weird, like you were gaslighting me basically. You were basically like It was like the good son. And we're all good having friends.

We were just having fun, ribbing and things. No, sure. But, I mean, over time, I did start to feel a little bit, like, abused. Oh, you were terrible, uh, set some, well, look, I look. At that point starting, you were demanding. So let me, let me pay a picture. You got pushed in a shopper to some bullers. Let me paint a picture.

I, uh, when I, when I bought the camera, I'll admit, I, I, you're bossy. Well, look, I, I got into my head, I'm going to. be a filmmaker. Like, even as early as the A's movie, that project. I'm going to start making movies, like, phrase form, whatever. But I got the bug now. I'm going to be a film. So I definitely became a much more controlling presence.

I don't think I warranted the abuse that ended up happening. But, you know, Andrew and Bill felt like I was being too controlling. And therefore, the mission became to just take Ray down a peg constantly through various. So these, these adventures, these days out in the Babylon, making films, from there, perspective was just to troll Ray and to abuse Ray. I'm not being a victim I'm not whining about it. It's all fun in the past. But at the time, it was a little

disheartening and a little frustrating because I would be like trying to get a shot. And look, if you're still on a shot, I was trying when we're still working together. It gets we all kind of become really contentious. What that? Oh, no. At some point. Yeah, well, this is our story. We're going to tell a story

in order, okay? Yeah, I'm trying to remember. I'm sorry. I'm remembering as we're going. This is the budding days of you guys, you know, harassing me and trying to ruin my vision. So... It went both ways. Apparently. I mean, I was bossy and they pushed me down the hill. We were jerks. You were bossy.

And you said you were applying your Eagle Scout of techniques to us or something. Well, I wasn't Eagle Scout. Eventually, you weren't at that point. But you were like, how you got the kids to make knots and stuff. Do I really say that? No, I've got to say it. So you, you're projecting

that you... When you were at the camp of Nagano, you when you had that you were the leader that's how you got people to do the thing like you applied that to us especially Jay and we were like, and we were just jerk so we were like you know

we were all terrible people yeah we were not a good one in the bunch we were terrible people yeah so one thing when we there was a guy in our high school who was like a real weird devout Catholic but he was also abusive we're not going to need

yeah I'm not like it first name sure okay uh and uh you know this guy was like he would always go around like you know basically talking about how women uh were dogs he didn't he do that he actually said he was in your great i knew his sister was okay he was a guy who was like a weirdly like he was like a fundamentalist christian almost yeah he had blonde hair or something he was like it was almost like he was like a christian isis guy he was talking about how yeah he was like talking about how don't like i'm I just remember now, how women were dogs, basically? Yeah, that's funny.

I got to read the debate with him. Because I wasn't the most beloved student there, especially not by the chaplain and the religious ecclesiastical people. But I had a good sense of, I remember at one point, kind of out of nowhere, harassing our chaplain and saying, I'm going to become a priest and reformed his church. Yeah, I'll take you down a notch. Yeah, and even though we thought he was a jerk,

I think he was right to be a little disturbed by me But my point is, but this guy The subject of this next film Was going around And like he thought he was an academic He thought he was an academic and he was I got to do a debate with him in the class once Because he was

Yeah Ecclesiastical Very small-minded Yeah he was and he was saying like Why I'm like why can't women be priest He's like you know would you make a dog a priest I'm like I wasn't there for that Because I only saw like

Why I was there I'm telling a story Yeah Yeah And he would always write When he would challenge him Because look, everything he was doing Like you could easily challenge in the Christian context Because like Jesus would never do this shit

But he would come back with I've read like 25 books on the subject So we made basically a satirical movie about this guy And we lambasted him I think you played this This actually wasn't a bad I mean it wasn't a good movie But like that was the first thing we did

It was actually like you know maybe And that also started at Argy. That's how I got confused before. Except it was cold out. Right. I played the homeless guy in the movie. Things were starting to take off. Yeah.

Yeah, but the main character is a follower. Yeah. No, you were, you. No, yeah. I'm the apostle. I'll answer this one. You were the guy. Yeah, no, I was him.

When you were the homeless guy, I'm remembering it now. Oh, you were the homeless guy. That was the whole gimmick. You played two characters, the homeless guy and the apostle. I think the home. No, I think it was both. I think, I think his, we made the whole thing that he was basically, you walk in off the crowd and you go, I'll answer this one. Oh, right, right.

Oh, right. Oh, my God said you for something. But I remember we also had the garbage. We were still carrying a garbage in a shopping cart. We were carrying, we were just carrying a shopping cart. The shopping cart was still with us because we used it as a stand on. So we are up above everything. Right.

Again, I guess I was what the back to the future for was there's the same shopping cart. So we were hiding garbage around the town to, to. use later because we don't brought the shopping cart home oh yeah we were just like taking the shopping cart and put it like behind some bar yeah no like this is this is our stomping grounds uh so be a but basically i ended up trying to this all in the the the part we had a parking lot to ourselves always where no one would bother us like for some reason like that area was our yeah like the parking lot was a big thing that was like our set our studio i mean right this all i mean look these are the kind of things we would do these none

these were good films. They were getting better as they went along. And then finally, I started working on what I thought at the time was my magnum opus, Operation C-wall, I think it was called. Which was... Wasn't that way late? I think it was... No, it wasn't way late. There was different versions of me trying to get it off

the ground. At some point, you started and then I started collaborating with you on, like, what... Do your characters and developing them? But you were obsessed with the Boffer Sword thing. Well, basically, let me give you a little rundown of this basic this idea of this movie was basically

that there was a disaffected youth who was named Steve who was upset that his favorite pizza place was closing oh yeah one in frontwood rode away and he this is a guy who's just frustrated I mean it's just a petulance

of a 17 year old Ray just like he were that old right in this amount I think it was 17 yeah and this guy who just frustrated with, like, telemarketers and, like, people who were environmentalists. He just, he was just, like, cranky guy in hindsight. I thought he was a real, it was the kind of thing where, like, you think he's a real, like, fucking rebel that a cause kind of thing. Like, a real, like, you know, oh, like, why is the world so crazy?

Really, really, this, it was just me projecting my duchiness into a character who was just mad at everyone. And, but, like, he wanted to protect his pizza place, but it was inexplicably. inexplicably there were guys with foam swords who were fighting over the pizza place oh yeah yeah it was a convoluted story it's actually important because this is when i came in or you telling me about i'm like i was helping create start creating that was our first time ever doing anything together like actually creatively because i keep arthur the character i vaguely remember this but was all written when i started getting involved okay yeah no that's a big point in our lives yeah no this is formative years and uh this

This was like, you know, I ended up, you know, we went through a bunch of full starts with this movie, different versions of it. I ended up, like, dumping, you know, credit card money on it a couple years later. I went to massive debt. Oh, yeah, that's what I was involved in. You know, at that point, we had split ways for a while. But no, but, like, but I remember we were scouting locations for this movie. And we went to a piece of place. So we were talking about the guy with the shoot with the jogging pants.

This was, this was, I think this is like kind of a good point. This is kind of a culmination of this phase of it. because we went to shoot some test footage at this pizza place and there was a guy there I'm trying to think how he was dressed he was wearing like a Hawaiian t-shirt that white button shirt he was wearing brown loafer or white loafers he was wearing penny loafers but yeah white and jogging pants and jogging pants not even track pants and we were like basically this is a piece of place that I was around the neighborhood I knew the guy he said we like you shoot in the back.

It's like probably 8.30 at night a weekday during the summer. And so there's one guy. There's one guy's the only guy in there. He's talking to the owner. And he comes over to us. He's a fat man. He comes over.

He's an older Italian guy. And he's saying to us like, hey, what are you guys making the movie? And we're like, yeah, you know, we're just shooting some footage for this movie. At that point, I'm like, what's going on with this? And I'm leaving you to talk to him.

So I'm already aware of this guy. Yeah, he's a little sketchy looking. He looks kind of like. You're being too. friendly enough that he's starting to get hovering on you sure because i'm i'm outgoing uh and uh i'm being a little boastful about me or we're ready this movie about pizza place and phone or whatever he doesn't seem to really give a shit at that he starts telling me oh i'm also a filmmaker i uh i'm he's just telling me this is a hundred percent i i i make these films

with uh you know women uh some people might call handicapped and uh you know i i i i i i get them to come over he's basically he starts describing to me how he basically it seems like was making porno films with like handicapped women mentally disabled women yeah it's something of a bombing places yeah but I get

I get in a sex dress up sexy and the and uh I think you and him were in a booth together and I was in a booths was yeah he'd come over to the booth so you two got a booth I'm in the next booth by back to you I'm hearing little bits I'm like right get away from this don't get I'm a I'm starting to get worried

that you're liking this guy then no well here's the thing I yeah I forgot about that because you guys thought like subsequently oh you why you would you like I was an idiot and I didn't know this guy was a problem because I knew he was a problem everything to prove that

I'm like what am I going to do be like hey mob creepy pornographer of disabled people get out of my no like I like I was a young guy I was intimidated I was trying to keep things on an even keel and so I'm talking this guy and he starts going on about hey you guys

on the Fulton Street fish market. I'm like, I don't know, maybe. I've heard of it maybe. Yeah, I have this script that I want to make about the Fulton Street fish market and like how my nephew's writing it for me and how something about the corruption and the cops. And then he offers up with like, I, apropos of nothing perhaps, you know, the police, they got a problem with me because, you know, I threatened to blow up the, I forget what, the 70 second precinct. Yeah, 15th Street precincts.

Yeah, which, look, at the time, like, we're still trying to. feel out what this guy is and I'm like I think he's making this up. In my mind I'm like Ray's probably impressed by this because my back to you in the other booth and I'm eating the pizza you got they gave you're like just the best pizza I've ever had in my life and I'm like this is okay. It's good pizza. That's not important. The point is

but he's only lied about the pizza and now he's making a new friend out. All right. He's going to drive. Look, the point is he's telling me this. I don't know if he's like, you know, this seems like far fetched. This seems like, all right, even if he is a shady creepy guy, I think he's just kind of talking out of his ass now. And then he

has a little satchel briefcase thing and he pulls out a goddamn police report and he shows it to me and it's like it's like it's like a document with like the letterhead of the police department and it says like the way you have a ticket

like a traffic ticket and they handwrite pencil or whatever it's like that or a carbon copy or whatever it's like he's showing it to me and I'm reading suspect was heard threatening to blow up the 59 street and in my head I'm going to read it's probably so impressed by that thing he's reading right now we gotta get out of here

Bill had a little opinion at the time I was fucking mortified I look it took 20 years we look here's it I think you guys know that you guys thought that I was like making a new friend I was trying to get out of there he kept like oh I he wanted me to shoot his porno films for him yeah he was saying

I want your phone number uh and your address I remember what phone number and address he gave jr well you don't don't well I'm about to We always, that's a running joke. Yeah, no, look, we don't see where you get, what town it was. We gave him Jay's address. We won't say what the address is. And look, I ended up subsequently feeling terrible because I don't know, look, nothing happened to Jay.

Jay's fine. But like, at that period, he would have deserved anything. That guy wouldn't do. Well, he was a little bit of a dick sometimes. Even to me. Yeah. But he didn't deserve to get, like, you know. A guy walking in his house.

And I couldn't care less if that guy did. Some fucking, like, you know, mentally disabled woman's pornographer, that's not a proper term, but whatever that is. That house is so full of nice, like, fucking restores and hardware stuff. Even if it wasn't. Even if it was a terrible place, we sent a mobster over there in our minds. So the second we get out that glass door, I go, Ray. No, this is, it's great.

Glass store, I go, Ray, I don't want, I don't want, I don't, I don't, I want nothing about it. You go, keep walking, walk faster. That's why I knew you weren't. Yeah, we did. I was like, I was like, Grant, I don't want him to walk him. faster don't turn around I look we got in that car I knew we were on the same page

this was a town I this wasn't Babel this is a different town I was over there all the time I spent like my entire past few summers hanging out my friends in that town I didn't go back there for years well that was between Babylon and the other in West Ice so that was what town was that

Bayshore right water it was like Bayshore Bayshore Bayshore yeah I think I look I'm about saying I wasn't a tough kid I should me I perhaps should not have been that intimidated by this weird fat blustering perhaps mafia guy. I don't know. But it was a strange time. Now that we went to the whole thing

I know it was a period. He starts trying to scare us out of there because we were buying the pizza man. But no, he had the he had the got papers on him. That was real. If we were there for a week and like, you know, and in day three he pulls it out, then you can maybe go, oh, maybe like he went on his computer and made that. I don't know. But like it was pretty prepped. He had, why would you be walking around

with, I don't look, I can't Look, here's the thing Even if you are a mobster I don't think in hindsight I don't think this guy If he was connected I don't think he was like Would you say he looked at Joey Butterfuka

I think they might have Later when he was fighting No he was older and fatter Here's the thing When I think about it now It's like it's almost cartoonish Because like I'm not saying The guy's a mafia genius

But they don't go around To like fucking high school kids And tell them that they're taking Disabled women And making pornography with them And then boasting about blowing a trying to blow up he was he was he wasn't like mentally ill in the way where he was like he was he had it together to an extent like he wasn't like some guy who was like

the jogging pants were the clue yeah i don't like but he was up to something weird uh the jogging pants i think right yeah the laziest version of jogging pants yeah uh these these are kind of characters you run into in long island they mean we there are actual mob guys around but they don't tend to like walk up to you and be like hey Hey, you know how the racketeering business I'm in? Like, hey, you want to come work for the mob? They don't really recruit you like that. Like, so this is a weird, I still don't know to this day what that guy was about.

But he had the goddamn police report, and it looked pretty legit. Good for him. Yeah, good for it. Look, I think it's great. I think, you know, he was probably laughing his ass off for whatever. I don't know what he got out of it. He did want my name and number, though. He did want me to, like, he wanted me to work for him.

He wanted me. He was just writing a number. We were just writing it down on his police report I think he was writing it down the back of his police report Yeah Bizar bizarre Of course the people worked there I think this is normal

They didn't seem to have any problem with this going on Well they were kind of like you know They were keeping to themselves And like so Okay One thing I think they just didn't give a shit They were trying to close up the shop But like at the time

At the time it seemed like Yo they were afraid of it Whatever This is the kind of a This is not like this is the kind of kind of thing we let a little relatively sheltered life i guess because this is not some people have like really dark heroin we went for the dairy burn guy to this is threatening us to this guy yeah uh i think it's a decent arc i kept making it's pretty good yeah i mean look at the end

the day we made that alive um you know and i ended up making we're i'll try and see if we can locate some of these weird films but um i have i don't have that stuff that you eventually did I do have, like, that trailer where you put that fuel song in it. Oh, no, a filter. Yeah, well, the guy, these foam sword guys, I was really obsessed of it. And I made a really slick trailer with a guy putting duct tape and foam on a piece of PVC pipe. That's the, and this is what I show. I try to get into purchase with these, these fucking things.

I may, we also made a thing. I remember the resolution wasn't, the image was in a, it was very digitizing. No, that's the funny thing about this. Purchase is a It's a pretty good film program Maybe it is maybe it isn't But it's pretty competitive Because they don't have a lot of slots open

In the film conservatory Those conservatories are bastard to get into apparently And I got into this whole film thing A little late in the game And I wanted to go to film school You showed him the AIDS movie Well no I don't know if I showed up

I don't know if I showed up I also made a film For a class Because we've A little Reagan film A film called Reagan Manor God Which was toning cheek, you know, I don't

like Reagan. Was it? Yeah, I didn't like Reagan. It was a tongue in cheek. Well, it was. I've seen it a few times I don't remember. I don't remember the content was, but I mean, that, the title itself, uh, I mean, we were basically mocking the class. Again, this is, this is the M.O. At a time

where people who were just like taking them. I just remember it was just kids and their uniforms and not even dressed up like them at all. Yeah, it was in a class. You got that red hair to the point. It was a class project and we treated it as such. And I was such a genius. I put that in my fucking directing. Oh, that was the one

you shouldn't have put in there. I don't think any of it would have gotten me into the film Conservatory, but especially not to a liberal arts university a film titled Reagan Manor God. Yep, that wasn't a good one.

Which, like, I don't know what was more offensive to them. The content of, of us supposedly, you know, trying to put over Reagan and how great he was, or just how incompetently

this fuck, I mean, just how, I, right after I, Right after I applied, I finally got a fucking digital camcorder and a computer that could edit. And I started like, but this is the time I was still, like, cutting with VCR tape. Did you tell this, the interviewer about Fray's Army, like, can we see that? And you're like, no.

Yeah, they wanted to see Fronies from them. So now you bring stuff up, you shouldn't, that you say no to his showing them. Yeah, like, this can't look good. I really thought like I was going to be, like some fucking, uh, Kubrick. Yeah, I thought it was going to be, I love Kubrick. at the time and this was just the most inept real you've ever seen your life

but I may not make him better stuff and I do have the film operations which isn't to become called the Fog of War which was the title of an Errol Morris film that came out the year I was filming mine originally from Stargate I got them from the game Stargate

these are all like codes for the Stargate game but that's not that you know again it lacked narrative cohesion it lacked a point I don't know what I was trying to I don't know what stamp I was trying to put on the world

with these films but like the thing I ended up doing when I dumped a bunch of money into and ruined my credit for years it's still ruined there's some there's some scenes and I'm not ashamed of them you were filming yeah

but it's years of time I release some of that I have those we got a lot of falling out different things well yeah we tried to make other films after that a lot of just basically

driving me nuts pretending to be a And you were taking pictures at the time So like you were doing that in between the stuff Like you were getting also in the photography Sure Yes, no look This didn't go to the waste

I ended up becoming a photographer We all know I worked with the morgue As a morgue photography. That's how I got that's this This is the genesis of my photography skills Was this filmmaking stuff You know, I ended up you know Learning these skills

And that's why I was able to you know Hold dead babies in my hands And like wipe the asses of corpses All the great things that I love to bring up all the time What was the thing we were filming at my house here? It was in the summer. It could have been any one of these projects. All I remember was, there was something you were being a jerk to Andrew and I.

And you went out to get someone. You came back. We were like, I had it shooting a car with BB since you came up to the road. No, look. And we filmed it. We're like, Kelly, here you come. I don't remember what. We were firing a pellet gun at your car.

Yeah, it could have been one of a number of projects where I was trying to stage a shot. And you were shooting me with a baby gun. You knew you were coming back down on the road because it's a one-way road. And so we were waiting at a hot addict. One's filming, one's snipering up. Like, Crystal, fire. He's here comes. I got a clear target.

We're fighting. Let's just proof of my house in your car. You come to driveway. Well, I'm glad you enjoyed it. To me, it was a little of a tormenting thing. Oh, come on. You were horrible. I was trying to get stuff done.

Let's not get mired in the muck here. I was trying to make some stuff. And you ran up and cut things out of your. car. Oh, you cut the antenna off my car. It's not even a prank anymore.

He's just not the full tentally if we threw it. Yeah, I don't know. This, I think we've had enough.

This, this, I think we've painted a picture. You're seeing it now. Now how gleeful Bill is as he's torn. He was trying to

pretend like he wasn't the case, how terrible I am. Meanwhile, you're the family all because I was a taskmaster. That car was a piece of

a car. Yeah, I had a junker car, whatever. But like, you know, it was a diesel. It was a diesel.

yes I bet I said It was good times Yeah it was good time So that's Bill It's been great catching up This is a good primer For people

To kind of Maybe Maybe you'll come back And we'll show Some of these things At some point So Bill Thanks for joining me

You're welcome Everyone Thanks for tuning in Make sure Look If you guys haven't yet Listen to My new podcast

Of Lucy Steiner Our Love is disgusting I've never been more proud Of anything We've done This I think It's a great show

I want all of you, if you like this show, you're going to love that show. Our love is disgusting. You can follow me on Twitter and Instagram at Bray Kump. Thanks for listening. Have a great week.